October 30, 2024 • 35 mins
Get in touch! Drop Benji and Brad a text message by clicking on this link.
Ever tried to keep up with a drag queen during Pride weekend? Benji did, and let's just say he had to sneak in soda water breaks amidst the kaleidoscope of London's bustling LGBTQ+ scene. Join us as we laugh at Benji's misadventures, from frigid encounters with Britain's notorious weather to humorous swipes at our own dating profiles. Our latest escapades take a Broadway twist as we ponder the cultural phenomena like the West End's "Frozen," setting the stage for a chat as lively as a Clapham night out.
On the journey from vibrant city life to the more serene family-friendly locales, we've got a tale that could give rom-com writers a run for their money. Imagine meeting your future spouse during a pandemic quiz night, only to find yourself in a Vegas wedding whirlwind post-birthday celebration. Add the amusing mix-up of dating two best friends simultaneously and sprinkle some heartfelt lessons on respectful communication, and you've got a love story that’s as unpredictable as it is charming. Our special guest joins us to share their unique insights into the world of same-gendered family building, adding depth and warmth to our conversation.
Navigating surrogacy and sperm donation is anything but straightforward, and we take you through the highs and lows of the process. With our guest sharing their personal journey, we explore the legal, emotional, and sometimes awkward paths of surrogacy in England, where commercial surrogacy remains a taboo. From selecting egg donors to the logistical hurdles across countries, each step brings its own set of challenges and joys. As the excitement builds towards the anticipation of twins, we celebrate the resilience and love that define the path to family-building for LGBTQ+ couples.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Hello and welcome to my big gay podcast with me,
Benji.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Brad, giving you the life, the loves and lols of
living in London.
Two gays, one city.
What could possibly go wrong?
Now, I might be going a bitwrong today because you look a
bit stressed, Benji.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
You're a horrible, horrible human.
There was me thinking I thinkI've pulled this off today with
the concealer, but no, I do feelrough.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
The bags are real.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
The baggage is real.
One's under my eyes, theemotional baggage, all of it.
It's real.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
What's going on?
Speaker 1 (00:50):
Just a really heavy weekend.
I've just come back from doinganother Pride and I tell you
what drag queens don't sleep.
I don't know how they do it.
It is constant with the alcohol.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Next club, another, literally the whole, the whole
shabam.
But um, and were you trying tokeep up because we know you're a
lightweight?
So why are you doing that toyourself?
I?
Speaker 1 (01:08):
was literally the one at the back, like skip hopping,
trying to catch up with him.
Yes, that was me.
Um, I just can't do it.
It even got to the point whereI was like don't worry, I'll get
these drinks, and I was sneakyordering myself just soda water
oh, clever yeah, I mean, I didget caught out once, but it was
fine fine.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
How do drag queens do that?
Speaker 1 (01:23):
I don't know.
I feel like they're completelynocturnal by this point.
Yeah, so that is their timeclock, and they are just 80%
alcohol.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
That's goals.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
That's goals 80% alcohol, 20% Botox.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Definitely goals, definitely goals.
You can't afford that, honey,and I see you've got a little
suitcase in the studio with youtoday.
You leaving again.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
I am.
I've had enough.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
I'm off just the end of the podcast it's the end of
the podcast.
Thank, you so much forlistening.
Like I said, that's all.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
We've got time from here no, I'm off, but not for
too long, don't worry.
I'll be back in a week or so.
But yeah, back off the jerseyfor a bit another gig, another
club, another two games, nosleep, no sleep.
Wow, yeah, same drag queens aswell they're all.
They're all sprightly and readyfor it.
I'm like you know what.
I could postpone it a week andI'll be all right with that, but
no.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
God, you're getting old.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Right, you are older than me.
Wash your mouth out.
I'm already feeling delicate,all right.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Well, also, I just want to say it is turning so
cold in the UK and, I'll behonest, I'm not that mad about
it.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
About it's cold, but I am as you know.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I don't mind the cold well, you love it so cold in
the studio.
The aircon is always on to thehighest cold degree, whatever it
is I know where you're going.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
You want to make a joke about my cold heart, don't
you?
Speaker 2 (02:41):
you have a cold heart , yeah yeah, there we go.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Yeah, I know, I get it.
I get it, I don't really mind,literally like if I have people
come to stay like after nightout, whatever I'm like.
Just to let you know, my roomis bolted because I've got
aircon on.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
All year round it is 16 degrees constant so if you're
staying for a night at benji's,pack your thermals, pack your
onesie, pack your hot waterbottle, because it's gonna get
cold, really cold.
It's not getting hot in thatbedroom.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Like I said, that's all we've got time for on this
episode of Big Game Podcast.
You're a bitch, you're a bitch,but yeah, I don't mind the cold
.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Cold never bothered you anyway.
The cold never bothered meanyway.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Oh not, this Couldn't help it.
That just closed, did you see?
Speaker 2 (03:20):
In West End.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Well, where else is it going to?
Speaker 2 (03:22):
I don't know you just caught me off guard there.
I was like where has it been on?
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Yes, it's been on the West End, no on the Norwegian
Cruise Lines in the middle ofthe Bahamas, did you notice?
Yes, of course, in the West Endit's gone.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Did you miss it?
Speaker 1 (03:30):
No.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Did you like it Frozen.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
I don't amazing, but it's just, it's a bit too much
for me.
It's it's visual overload toostimulating to put it politely,
it is too stimulating for mybrain.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
It's just a bit like ah wow, you're really setting
yourself for potential bachelors.
You know um, you getoverstimulated and you don't
like it, and your bedroom'sfreezing.
You don't like it hot in thebedroom, so, wow, yes and you're
still single because you'vebeen reading my tinder profile.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Not again, not again is that what?
Speaker 2 (04:10):
we matched on.
Was it tinder?
It was tinder.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
What was it?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
oh, don't bring up the trauma.
I don't want to go through thatagain.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Sorry, sorry so I'm not going anywhere this time,
don't worry.
Don't worry, right, we've got areally exciting episode coming
up this week you might haveheard a couple of giggles
already in the podcast studio.
That's because there is aspecial guest with us today yeah
, we wanted to bring somebody onthe podcast to sort of educate
everyone.
We had a chat not that long agolike listen, when we finally
get into secure relationships,would we ever want children, etc
(04:37):
.
And it sort of developed intothis long conversation about if
we did and how we would go aboutthat.
And actually there are lots ofdifferent options and they are
ones that people don't really, Idon't think, talk about and
certainly don't get taught aboutat school.
So we're very excited to haveour guest on today who's
actually going through thesurrogacy option whilst being in
a same gendered relationship.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Yeah, so strap yourselves in, because this is
going to be an educationalpodcast this week.
We're going to learn so much.
I've got so many questions.
I'm sure you've got so manyquestions.
I hope we don't overstimulateyou today, benji, because I know
you don't like it I hope we do.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
I hope we do.
But yeah, we're gonna take alittle little break and then we
will have a real life Daddy inthe studio with us.
So yes, on this week's episode,we're very excited to be joined
by well, actually, we canproperly introduce him, because
we've mentioned this Daddy a fewtimes, because he was a huge
(05:32):
support for us right at thebeginning of starting my Big Gay
podcast.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yeah, can you remember us back in season one?
Gosh In our bedrooms.
Gosh Not knowing how to do apodcast and giving it a go Speak
for yourself.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
But yeah, we mentioned that we were very
fortunate to have our very ownfairy godfather, and now we can
reveal that his name is Jonjoand he is our guest in the
studio today.
Yeah, so Jonjo supported usright at the very, very
beginning, and what's funny iswe called him our fairy
godfather and now he's literallyabout to become a father, yeah,
(06:03):
full circle, full circle moment.
It's almost like we knew yes,and john joe, in a same gender
relationship, is just about togo through surrogacy.
So please put your handstogether and make a big, warm
welcome for john joe thank youvery much for having me, guys
welcome to my big gay podcastand our lovely little studio
that we now record in.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
It is freezing.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
If you do get too warm, do let me know.
But the aircon doesn't go anycolder than it's on right now.
Love it.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
So, jonjo, just sort of going right back at the
beginning, you used to be aClapham Gay like myself and I
remember when I moved to claphama few years ago and, uh, you
were basically down the road, wewere neighbors yeah, yeah,
lived just about an eight minutewalk from brewers to brewers
and clapham.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Wow yeah they've done that to death, I think.
I love it still, obviously, butuh-huh, every friday, every sat
, regular.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Every weekend.
It does me to death.
So I think it's about time theyfelt how I feel every morning
after.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
But you've recently moved away from Clapham.
Yes, I have.
Are you a bit more in thecountryside now, out in the
sticks?
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Nice.
It's a suburbanite these days.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Now, was that a conscious move because you knew
you wanted to start a family, orwere you always going to move
out of london?
Speaker 3 (07:20):
absolutely, yeah, definitely wanted to move out.
Um, I just knew that I neededmore space, essentially, and I
wanted to grow my family.
Uh, it was just me and myhusband recent husband, that
sounds like I've had a few it'smy first one and the two dogs I
can't even get one exactly.
You're doing well but yeah, itwas just.
Uh, I think things outside oflondon a lot more family
(07:42):
friendly for sure.
Just the craziness of claphamas well.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Yeah it does have a bit of a crazy edge to it.
I mean, I love it, but Iimagine if I got to that stage
where I might want to start afamily, then, um yeah, I
probably would do the same butI'm pretty sure you have to do
some sort of iq test to become afather, I think honestly, I
think that's coming in it.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Is that actually?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
true?
I think so.
It's definitely not true.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
It's not the worst idea.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
Sometimes I really feel like you should have to
pass a test.
Goodness you with children?
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I think I'd make a good daddy actually, so next
question.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Absolute silence.
No, I'm team Brad today.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Thank you, john, joe, it's payback.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Fuck my drag.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
So you lived in Clapham, you moved away and you
recently got married.
So congratulations for that.
Thank you very much.
Wow, how long were you datingbefore you got married?
Speaker 3 (08:37):
So it's been a bit of a whirlwind.
We've been dating for aboutfour, four and a bit years.
Yeah.
So, um, we got married a littleearlier than we thought we were
going to originally, uh,because we started the secrecy
process and we wanted to bemarried for that, which I'll
come to later and it allhappened a lot faster than I
thought it was going to happen.
Yeah, so we were fortunateenough to get married in June,
(09:01):
on the 18th, the day after mynow husband's 40th birthday, so
went and shot over to Vegas, gotit done and came back.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Vegas wedding as well .
I mean, that is goals.
Would love to do that.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
I had to say the pictures looked absolutely
stunning.
Oh, thank you Like so gorgeous.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Really, really cute.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
But before we carry on with the rest of the podcast,
we haven't even offered you adrink.
We're so rude, I'm so sorry.
Now, obviously, because you'repregnant, we've gone for soft
drinks.
Is there any of these delicioussoft drinks that you would like
?
We've got Diet Coke.
It's literally like achildren's tuck shop in here it
is, we have.
Rio Tropical.
Other fizzy drinks areavailable.
We've got Cherry Coke, Fanta.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
And what coke fanta.
And what was that wild one barcream soda wow, rogue, wow, got
it all.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Which one, if any, would you like?
Speaker 3 (09:45):
um, I would love a fanta.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Please a fanta it's my favorite everything thank you
, here you go, john joe rightbrad, which one would you like?
I'm slightly tempted by thecream soda, just because I've
never had it in my life, I thinkyou'll like it.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
All right, I'm going for the cream soda I'm diving in
I'm gonna be basic.
I just going to go for the coke.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Benji on the coke.
That's not like you.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Get the bag, get the bag Right.
Cheers, boys, cheers.
I know that segment Came out ofabsolutely nowhere, but I was
dying Of thirst so I was likeI'm just going to interrupt To
make us open some drinks.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
So you got married this year, and where did you
meet?
You got married this year andwhere did you meet?
We?
Speaker 3 (10:20):
actually met at oh quiz night, the gay quiz.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Oh, my goodness.
Benji you've been to a few ofthose quiz nights right, I've
been to one.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
You, shady shady bitch.
I've been to one of them andI'll be honest, I found it so
nerve wracking that I spent thewhole time going to the toilet.
I think people probably thoughtI was quite unwell however,
every time I went to the toilet,there were these same two boys
going up to no good on thetoilets was it me it wasn't that
you um but yeah, so I justassumed it was less of a sort of
(10:53):
a dating night and more of likegrind alive they do the quizzes
and the speed dating.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Oh sorry, you said you went to the quiz.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
I went to the quiz oh , I was talking about the, the
speed dating.
Speed dating, that would makesense yeah also the, the quiz
night I've actually never beento oh, it's good fun.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
It's good fun, yeah have you ever won?
This is really embarrassing.
I've been twice and both timesmy team came last how
embarrassing was that the one?
Speaker 3 (11:17):
they did like a musical theater one.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, we would rock with that yeah, you would
absolutely and we still lost sosorry, we interrupted, so you
met um so, yeah, we met.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
We met at that, but it was sort of just as just when
you're allowed to do thingsduring covid, um.
So he saw me and then he addedme on Grindr.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Instagram, and then we.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
I actually completely ignored his request, and then
we matched on Hinge.
Come on, play hard to get and Ihad to go look after my mum for
a reason for a little while andI was talking to two guys for
about a month before I knew Iwas coming back to London, and
my now husband was one of themand the other, unbeknownst to me
at the time, was his bestfriend that lived about four
(12:07):
minutes down the road.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That's a movie that is.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
That is a movie, yeah .
Speaker 3 (12:12):
So they both knew I was coming back and they
suggested the idea of a date.
And they both sent me the samemessage.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
So they were in cahoots.
They knew that, oh wow, only Ithink that day.
But yeah, they uh.
They both asked me on the day,but I sent me the same message
and I said, oh, so sorry, I'llstep back.
You know, I don't want to comebetween really good friends like
you guys, etc.
And um.
And then they both messagedseparately saying, well, okay,
that's really respectful, etc.
But should we go on a datestill, which I thought was you
know, backstabby.
But here we are, uh, and theother guy was busy, so I married
(12:43):
the other one.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Just to go back on what you said before.
John joe, if you want to comebetween the two of us, that is
so fine absolutely, we're good,we're good, we're good um, wow,
okay, so you just went on thedate with now robbie, yep, my,
my now husband um no, I, I didobviously choose robbie um over
the two of them.
Are they still besties?
They're really good friends.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Oh good, yeah, yeah, yeah, nice and I met his friend
and within five minutes we wereboth like oh my God, that would
have been an absolute nosediveof a relationship.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Oh really.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
Yeah, so we both agreed it was probably for the
best.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Oh, that's cute and and then.
So sort of going into thesurrogacy process.
Was having kids something thatyou always wanted?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Yes, it really was, and I found that that was quite
a big thing when I was gettinginto relationships and stuff
with different guys, whetherthey wanted a family or not and
I respect both ways of you knowwhat you want to do with your
life, but I just really reallywanted children.
I saw the joy it brought to myfamily.
I have a lot of love to give.
You know, I've already got twodogs and I'm still still needing
(13:45):
to grow my my circle and sharethe love, so it was definitely
really important to me for sureso alone, so alone, um, okay, so
we obviously we've establishedthat you went down the surrogacy
.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
Did you ever consider any other routes?
Speaker 3 (14:01):
yes, so, so I looked at them all.
So you know you've got adoption.
I just can't think of any moreright on the spot right now
Fostering, fostering, there wego, and surrogacy was always at
the top.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Just personally for me and that wasn't to rule out
the others, it was more to seehow I get on with surrogacy and
then perhaps look into the otherroutes if it doesn't prove
fruitful so I've got a questionfor you both if you're dating
someone and it's starting to getmaybe a little bit more serious
, when is the point to say aboutthe kids situation or even
(14:32):
marriage, right, because they'retwo sort of big milestones in a
relationship and some peoplemight not want either.
So when's a good point to maybebring that up that isn't too
like overwhelming and a bit, youknow, pinned downy should you
have me, because I'm gonna dragyou or should you have that
conversation early?
because, um, imagine if you datefor like a year and then you're
like I don't know what, I'vealways wanted kids and the other
person says, well, I never havewanted that well, I have
(14:54):
noticed now on like hinge youcan put.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
If you want kids, don't want kids or you're
undecided, you can put that now,so maybe that's early in the
bag yeah, I mean on a first dayI have been asked if I want kids
.
Yeah is that too early itreally depends on the vibe, no
other things, I think.
If we're talking about like,like, do you have brothers and
sisters?
Where are your family from?
Do you have any dogs?
Do you think you'll want kidsone day?
I think that's okay for me.
I wouldn't find that like, oh,oh, god get me out of here.
(15:20):
But yeah, if they were a bitmore timid, maybe I would save
it for date two or three.
If I ever got to date two orthree, oh no, not with you.
Sorry, not with you.
I'm a strong, independent woman.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
What about you, Jonjoe, when you were on dates?
Was that something that youwanted to talk about quite early
on?
Speaker 3 (15:42):
Because it's a really good question.
I think I um I did talk aboutit quite early on, uh, generally
because it was important to me,but also, um, that naming names
.
Obviously I've got peoplearound me that it turns out that
one of the partners didn't wantchildren and you know that's
ended some exceptionally longrelationships, uh, which is
really sad.
So, yeah, kind of got it.
I mean, robbie, my now husband,is pretty useless at hiding his
emotions and he told me heloved me on day three or
(16:02):
something like that.
I was like whoa, how do I getout of here?
Yeah, it was really funny,really awkward at the same time,
and all my friends were likedid tim.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
I was like uh, did you say it back?
Did you know?
Speaker 3 (16:16):
I love spending time with you too I said thank you
and turned it back over,slightly aroused.
I'm with you too.
I said thank you and turned itback over Slightly aroused.
Now, actually Going back toyour question, I think it is
important to you know.
Get those facts out on thetable from day one At least.
Then you know where you're.
Some people they've made uptheir minds from being when they
(16:38):
were a child.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
That's true, they don't want children.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Yeah, it's really important.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
I mean, I have often thought about it.
I think I've always said, likeif I end up with the right, it's
not the be all end all for me,because I've got nephews and
nieces which is almost enoughfor me, but I feel like if I
ended up with the right person,I would for sure.
I'm definitely much it is whatit is.
(17:10):
If it feels safe, it feelsright financially.
If it's okay because it's soexpensive.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
I am living in London and thinking about starting a
family poor.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
I think I felt like you actually until sort of 36,
37, and then all of a suddenhormones, I think, kicked in and
I really wanted a family all ofa sudden I've got 10 years then
here we go.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
so going back to surrogacy, and forgive me if I
come across totally um or askthe wrong questions because I
have zero, I kind of knowledgeabout it all.
Really Ignorant, stupid, dumbAll of that.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
I will happily take that.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
But my kind of knowledge really of surrogacy is
through Friends, the TV showwhich I know, benji, you're a
big fan of.
But they had two surrogacystorylines.
Do you remember?
Phoebe was a surrogacy for herbrother, is that right?
And then Monica and Chandleralso then had surrogacy as well.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
There's brother, is that right?
And then monica and chandleralso then had surrogacy as well.
There's an adoption, oh right,one surrogacy storyline.
Speaker 3 (18:05):
And one adoption one did phoebe have triplets?
Speaker 1 (18:07):
phoebe had triplets for her brother, yeah and monica
and chandler adopted twins yes,but the mother was already
pregnant when they went throughthe adoption.
And then ross's son ben, thenhad two lesbian mums.
Yes, there was quite a quite alot of.
They were doing what theythought was good work.
Yeah, but they didn't quite doit.
I don't think they did it verywell.
(18:27):
I do love Friends and I knowpeople at home will be like no.
Friends is awful.
It has aged badly.
It really has.
Speaker 3 (18:33):
It was quite progressive at the time, wasn't
it Right?
Speaker 1 (18:35):
yeah, I was going to say it started movements but
actually if you really watch itback and you look at how they
over-sexualize lesbians and howthey feminize gay people, it's
not done very well for itself.
But yeah, they did.
They started the movement, forsure on TV.
I feel like they had one of thefirst lesbian kisses as well
which was Rachel Gere and an oldschool friend.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Oh, I remember that episode.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, if you remember, the network nearly
cancelled them for it becauseJennifer Anderson was such a
huge time, like it waseverywhere, everywhere, and I
remember even people at homewere like oh, this is disgusting
, look at this.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
So there was a lot going on, a lot going on.
There was a lot going on there.
But that was my kind of firstintroduction to surrogacy, um,
so I guess my question to you,uh, john joe, is how do you
select someone to be like, Iguess, the oven?
Would you call it the oven?
Yes, what are the terms?
Speaker 3 (19:22):
there's so many.
I was completely naive tosurrogacy when I first started
looking into it.
And um, just go back straightto your first question.
Uh, my favorite phrase for mysurrogate is the tummy mummy
which I really enjoy.
Um, I'm really really fortunate.
My finding a surrogate is hardin eng, which I really enjoy.
Um, I'm really really fortunate.
My finding a surrogate is hardin england it's.
It's not commercial, you can'tpay for it and in fact, if you
(19:43):
do, it's illegal.
Um is it.
Yeah, completely illegal.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Yes, um do you have to find someone to volunteer?
Speaker 3 (19:50):
you do, and there are agencies out there that can
help you in the governmentrecommended agencies that can
help you as well, one of whichthere are a few, but one of
which I remember at the minuteis surrogacyukorg, and they
match not really match make, butthey have events and things
that you can go to and learnabout and meet other surrogates
and and if you get a link out ofthat, then then great, and
there's a there's an awful lotof law, uh, surrounding it and
(20:13):
there's a lot of law changesthat they're looking to make
hopefully, fingers crossed whichwill make it easier for
same-gendered couples to havechildren.
Um, but I'm really, reallyfortunate my, my sister-in-law,
stephanie, she, she offered tobe our surrogate.
Wow, yeah, we, we didn'tapproach her about it.
We, we left our dogs with mymother-in-law and my
(20:33):
sister-in-law was there, and wewent off on our holiday last
year and, uh, when we came back,she said no, I'm doing it for
you, you don't need to worry, um, and we said look, can we just
have a week to think about it,because there's a huge toll on
her body.
You know, she's 40, 41 now.
Um, I don't think she'll mindme saying that, um, and she's,
she's completed her own familyalready, which is quite a big,
important step that you gothrough.
(20:55):
So.
So she's got an 18-year-old anda 12 13-year-old and she asked
their permission first beforeshe came to us and I thought it
was really lovely and the rightway to do it.
I was very lucky, but yeah, soTummy, mummy is part of it.
People come up with alldifferent names.
It's whatever you feelcomfortable with, generally
speaking.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
So a question so the surrogate, it's just their oven,
right?
You don't use their egg?
Speaker 3 (21:18):
So that's the thing.
There's the two ways you canuse their egg if they're happy
to donate eggs, and they've gottwo titles which I've forgotten
at the minute.
I think it's gestationalsurrogacy and straight surrogacy
so it can be their DNA and yourDNA.
Or you can use donated eggs andthere's a couple of ways you
can find those.
You, uh, for example, for me Iwent to two different clinics in
(21:41):
london.
One was not very, very helpful.
Um, they didn't keep eggsfrozen.
And there's another rule thatwe learned about at the time is
the eggs have to be donated bythe women and it, you know, it
takes months for them to do it.
They have to stimulate alltheir ovaries to overproduce
eggs, etc.
And then they have to storethem for three months to make
sure.
Um, different sti checks andall the rest of it.
(22:02):
And then I went to a secondclinic, the london women's
clinic, and they had hundreds ofeggs already frozen ready to go
, and it was a bit like goingthrough a facebook grinder kind
of not grinder, facebook kind ofyou know, myspace, the olden
days kind of profiles of lookingat.
Obviously, they can't tell youtheir name, but they can tell
you their educational level,they can tell you their skin,
(22:23):
eye color, hair color, weight,height, languages, degree level
and a few other different pieces.
So you know, we spent ages justlooking through and looking
through, and then new donorswould come along, and then the
donor you wanted got bought theday before, because you have to
buy the eggs, obviously.
And then you get other questions.
If you're having only one childand there's 10 eggs there, I
(22:47):
think you can create.
I'm going to totally get thisstat wrong but you can only
create so many families from thesame donor.
I think it's three families.
So that would mean that yourchildren would have half
brothers and half sisters aroundthe world and you don't know
where, just depends where, wherethe other eggs were used.
So do you buy them all?
Do you buy?
You know however many there are.
So just just question afterdecision, after scary thought
(23:09):
after another, and you just haveto take one step at a time and
I suppose they do that for onlyhaving three families, because
generation down the linethere'll be a massive crossover
with genes, which obviouslywould not be not be okay.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
So just to clarify, it's your sister-in-law
sister-in-law carrying andyou've, but you bought somebody
else's yes, exactly that got itand this may sound like a really
dumb question, probably, butsay me and benji won't have a
baby jesus?
Oh my gosh, just for now, justin case, I wonder, to the world
(23:44):
famous?
Speaker 2 (23:45):
maybe famously bullied wrong reasons?
No, it'd be wonderful um butlet's say we decided to have our
own.
Could we mix all our sperm inone big pot and then that just
gets delivered to the egg andthen we don't know whose sperm
it is, or does it have to bejust from one donor?
Yeah, how does that work?
Speaker 3 (24:06):
okay.
So it's an amazing question isexactly the first question that
I wondered when I I went tostart looking into surrogacy and
it's a really strange.
So they used to do that, theyused to do that and they they
obviously very closely test thesuccess rates of everything they
do.
Because when you go todifferent clinics, the first
question you want to know is howsuccessful is it going to be?
And the same with IVF, becausethere's a lot of IVF involved if
(24:28):
you go down that route and it'squite a funny answer so if you
mix two guys sperm together,they have a a job, and the one
job is go to the egg andimpregnate the egg.
However, if it doesn't sum upwhat is wrong with you know all
of man and men, mankind, theywill not go for the egg, they
will fight each other to thedeath instead.
(24:51):
So if you mix your sperm, yeah,they, they won't get the job
done.
They will.
Nine times out of ten, they'll,they'll, uh, they'll just fight
each other and and just wriggleinto death instead oh, that is
I mean it makes sense, right?
Speaker 1 (25:04):
yeah, just look at mankind I'm trying to think of
jokes about us fighting eachother, but it just can't figure
anything out.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
But the thing is say we did mix our sperm and then it
comes out ginger and love inthe cold.
I'm like, okay, well, that'sclearly benji sperm that made
the final car.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Enough about your first date okay also of all my
personality traits you've comeup with ginger and loves the
cold.
Thanks, mate you're welcome sothen, going on from that, is
that a conversation you had withyour husband, like who should
we use?
Because I think and this is notme saying you, john job, I
think if I was having was usinga surrogate with my significant
(25:38):
other?
And just to stop me feelingqueasy, let's not use Brad as an
example.
There's something what's theword?
I don't want to saynarcissistic, but there's
something in me that would wantto use mine so I can see a baby
version of me.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
Exactly, and we're designed that way.
That's the future of evolution.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
My partner would probably feel the same way.
So is that a conversation thatyou two had, or did you sort of
just leave it up to yeah?
Speaker 3 (26:01):
so, um, we both um donated.
We let the doctor decide for us, but actually in doing that
process, um, it's crazy how muchyou find out about yourself.
So, um, a lot of my friends, um, male and female, are now doing
tests to to try and havechildren and finding out they
can't do it.
I think it's something like onein three people are infertile
(26:24):
or have a low sperm count andour lifestyles really don't lend
themselves.
So, you know, when we were bothdonating, I had to spend a
really good six months at leastno drink, no going out, lots of
walnuts um cold ice packs in mypants.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yeah, you have to keep your testes cold not cold,
but well, you're welcome thestudio today, the perfect
environment benji is currentlycooking at the moment.
Speaker 3 (26:49):
Yeah, so it is.
It is honestly crazy.
You need something like uh, Ithink it's 18 million sperm per
milliliter to um get pregnantnaturally, but it can be as high
as 124, 140 million and it canbe as low as zero or one or two
or three.
So it's, it's mental, the therange, and men are lucky they
(27:10):
can do nine times out of ten.
They can do something about it,they can change it through diet
and exercise and not going tobrewers all the time um, and
women can't?
they already have their eggs.
So if there's an issue, that'sit.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
They're stuck and stop donating at home actually
uh, you have to donate, shall wesay?
Speaker 3 (27:31):
uh, quite a lot.
Um, yeah, on doctor's orders,uh, I was informed every, at
least every three days, I had toprovide my what are we going to
call it, which is magic sauceoh, let's brainstorm some ideas
daddy's DNA daddy's sauce oh,that's already a thing, daddy's
sauce.
Yeah, I love that that's notgot done for infringement of
(27:52):
copyright we'll spell daddydifferently.
Speaker 1 (27:56):
I called it secret potion oh yeah, I don't know
what I like daddy sauce.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
That's my fave because if you are going to go
down this route, from mypersonal experience of speaking
to my mother-in-law and herasking me daily also how is your
um uh, how is your uh?
Daddy sauce and just expectingme to fill in the blank, and
this bunk really didn't go downvery well oh yeah, I guess
what's the nice plate dna, dna,I like that.
Speaker 1 (28:22):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
Sperm and gamete.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
Gametes are the uh, and just to clarify, when you
said you had to donate everythree days, are we still talking
about the home office or in lab?
Speaker 3 (28:33):
no, you, you can do it in the home office.
That's fine, um, but you dotest to make sure to see when
you're at your well, sort ofpeak, etc.
When I actually had to give, uh, my special dna potion, uh, it
was quite literally the mostawkward moment in my life.
I was in the clinic, uh, it wasin farringdon.
Um, I'll leave it at that, butit was one of those old london
(28:53):
buildings that has like spiralstaircase in the middle and it
was just a room off that, offthe spiral staircase.
And this building was used formany different reasons, you know
, botox and plastic surgery andall the rest of it and whatever.
So I'm just off the spiralstaircase with an old wooden
door that doesn't quite fit, theseams don't quite touch around
the corners, a TV and a leathersofa, and just my imagination
(29:16):
and my right hand A magazine,nothing.
No, there was a TV that I didn'tdare turn on because I was
worried.
Turn it off, turn it off.
But then of course you have to.
You know you're not allowed todo it for a few days before all
that sort of stuff.
But also there's a little doorbehind you, in the wall, where
you have to leave it.
You open it, it's like on alittle latch, and you leave it
on the uh on the side, and thenthere's a science lab on the
(29:38):
other side of that door wherethey take it from you and
obviously freeze it and all therest of it.
Um, so it's not very sexy, it'snot very sexy at all.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
I mean, I've done it in less sexy places that is true
.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
This is actually a step up from where you usually
do it yeah, I thought I saw yourname at the back of the road,
just next to that church, on thewall.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
I've heard stories about that church oh yeah, yeah,
not about me, okay Storieswhich I won't share right now,
but apparently things do happenthere.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Oh wow, oh, they were wonderful.
During lockdown, though, theylet brewers use their outdoor
space.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Yeah, that was quite nice.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Their outdoor space was used.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Let's just leave it at that.
We'll try and end it at thatone.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Okay, so you could donate at home and you could
test at home, did you say?
Speaker 3 (30:17):
You can test at home.
You can super drug to a testfor £200, I think it is and they
have to come and collect itwithin two hours of you doing it
, because sperm die very quickly.
When they put the solution onit, it keeps it alive for a bit
longer.
But I was so embarrassed thatwhen the guy turned up on the
motorbike to come and collectthe sperm, I had to send my
husband down to go give it tohim because I just couldn't face
(30:38):
the idea of being like here'smy magic potion.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Still sort of red in the face.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
Wearing it with nothing but a smile.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
I've also heard, just from other people that have
mentioned surrogacy, thatactually, when it comes to the
donating process, you can't haveany help.
Is that true?
Speaker 3 (30:58):
What do you mean by help?
Speaker 2 (30:59):
well you can't have other.
Um no, no bodily, yes,including saliva no, absolutely
it has to be a very strictdonation yeah so was it?
Speaker 1 (31:06):
did you donate at the same time?
Did you just one at a time?
Speaker 3 (31:09):
uh, same time?
Um, obviously not in the sameroom.
And all I remember thinking, tobe perfectly honest, is oh my
god, is that it after all thistime waiting I've been you know
very.
I haven't done anything in along time and that's all I've
managed to produce Jesus, butapparently it was brilliant.
Yeah, they said, I've got eightvials left so can you sell that
(31:30):
on?
I used to get paid for it notanymore, unfortunately I'm too
old.
But joke, benji, you're lookingthirsty, all of a sudden you're
right, very aroused.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
I used to get paid for it.
Not anymore, unfortunately.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I'm too old.
Oh, my Joke, benji, you'relooking thirsty all of a sudden.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
You're right Very aroused, but you have to freeze
it.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
It has to be frozen for three months.
You have to do tests at thebeginning, and then after three
months you have to do anothertest.
They quarantine it so you can'teven use it.
Yeah, it's not like oh, today Iwant a baby, let's go find some
eggs and do it tomorrow.
It probably takes you sixmonths to get to that point.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Wow.
So just before we take a veryquick break from the moment you
and your husband said you knowwhat we're going to do surrogacy
to the moment that you got thecall saying I'm pregnant how
long was that?
Speaker 3 (32:08):
So we were lucky, like I said, we had a surrogate,
been two and five years um andwe're our children are due, uh,
because we're having twins oh,congratulations.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Thank you very much um.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
Our children are due november, the 17th um, and we
started jan 23, so it's comingup to the two-year mark okay,
and that's um sort of on thequicker end of the process.
Absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah Imean you can go abroad and do it
quicker because it iscommercial in certain other
countries, um, and then othercountries you can't do it
anymore, um, italy, for example,I think.
(32:44):
Now I think I read um, thereare children already there that
have two mums, two dads, and thegovernment are taking off the
non-biological parent, yeah, andif you try to do so, we say
over there you can have a Ithink it was a two million euro
fine, something along thoselines, or a prison sentence, and
if you try and do it abroad andbring them back, they won't
(33:04):
recognize it.
So countries are going forwardleaps and bounds.
Some countries are england is,isn't a, it's not as far
advanced as, say, america, butit's, it's in a good space and
women are very well protected,which I I think is really
important.
And then other countries aregoing backwards.
So you've got to be reallycareful.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
All right.
Well, that is a lot to process.
I think let's take a very quickbreak and then I have many more
questions to come back withJonjo.
I hope that's all right.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Oh, podcasters, that noise, as you know, means that's
all we have time for on thisweek's episode, big Gay Podcast.
But do not panic, jonjo will bewith us in the studio next week
answering all your questions.
So let us know has this madeyou feel broody?
Has this opened your eyes?
Do you have any questions forJonjo?
How does it make you feel?
We'd obviously love to hearfrom you, and to do that, you
can write in to us on our socialmedia platforms, at Big Gay
(33:49):
Podcast, or head over to ourwebsite, which is
wwwmybiggaypodcastcom.
But, like I said, that's all wehave time for until next week
see you next wednesday.
Hello and welcome to my big gay podcast with me,
Benji.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Brad, giving you the life, the loves and lols of
living in London.
Two gays, one city.
What could possibly go wrong?
Now, I might be going a bitwrong today because you look a
bit stressed, Benji.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
You're a horrible, horrible human.
There was me thinking I thinkI've pulled this off today with
the concealer, but no, I do feelrough.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
The bags are real.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
The baggage is real.
One's under my eyes, theemotional baggage, all of it.
It's real.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
What's going on?
Speaker 1 (00:50):
Just a really heavy weekend.
I've just come back from doinganother Pride and I tell you
what drag queens don't sleep.
I don't know how they do it.
It is constant with the alcohol.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Next club, another, literally the whole, the whole
shabam.
But um, and were you trying tokeep up because we know you're a
lightweight?
So why are you doing that toyourself?
I?
Speaker 1 (01:08):
was literally the one at the back, like skip hopping,
trying to catch up with him.
Yes, that was me.
Um, I just can't do it.
It even got to the point whereI was like don't worry, I'll get
these drinks, and I was sneakyordering myself just soda water
oh, clever yeah, I mean, I didget caught out once, but it was
fine fine.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
How do drag queens do that?
Speaker 1 (01:23):
I don't know.
I feel like they're completelynocturnal by this point.
Yeah, so that is their timeclock, and they are just 80%
alcohol.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
That's goals.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
That's goals 80% alcohol, 20% Botox.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Definitely goals, definitely goals.
You can't afford that, honey,and I see you've got a little
suitcase in the studio with youtoday.
You leaving again.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
I am.
I've had enough.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
I'm off just the end of the podcast it's the end of
the podcast.
Thank, you so much forlistening.
Like I said, that's all.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
We've got time from here no, I'm off, but not for
too long, don't worry.
I'll be back in a week or so.
But yeah, back off the jerseyfor a bit another gig, another
club, another two games, nosleep, no sleep.
Wow, yeah, same drag queens aswell they're all.
They're all sprightly and readyfor it.
I'm like you know what.
I could postpone it a week andI'll be all right with that, but
no.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
God, you're getting old.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Right, you are older than me.
Wash your mouth out.
I'm already feeling delicate,all right.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Well, also, I just want to say it is turning so
cold in the UK and, I'll behonest, I'm not that mad about
it.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
About it's cold, but I am as you know.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I don't mind the cold well, you love it so cold in
the studio.
The aircon is always on to thehighest cold degree, whatever it
is I know where you're going.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
You want to make a joke about my cold heart, don't
you?
Speaker 2 (02:41):
you have a cold heart , yeah yeah, there we go.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Yeah, I know, I get it.
I get it, I don't really mind,literally like if I have people
come to stay like after nightout, whatever I'm like.
Just to let you know, my roomis bolted because I've got
aircon on.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
All year round it is 16 degrees constant so if you're
staying for a night at benji's,pack your thermals, pack your
onesie, pack your hot waterbottle, because it's gonna get
cold, really cold.
It's not getting hot in thatbedroom.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Like I said, that's all we've got time for on this
episode of Big Game Podcast.
You're a bitch, you're a bitch,but yeah, I don't mind the cold
.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Cold never bothered you anyway.
The cold never bothered meanyway.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Oh not, this Couldn't help it.
That just closed, did you see?
Speaker 2 (03:20):
In West End.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Well, where else is it going to?
Speaker 2 (03:22):
I don't know you just caught me off guard there.
I was like where has it been on?
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Yes, it's been on the West End, no on the Norwegian
Cruise Lines in the middle ofthe Bahamas, did you notice?
Yes, of course, in the West Endit's gone.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Did you miss it?
Speaker 1 (03:30):
No.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Did you like it Frozen.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
I don't amazing, but it's just, it's a bit too much
for me.
It's it's visual overload toostimulating to put it politely,
it is too stimulating for mybrain.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
It's just a bit like ah wow, you're really setting
yourself for potential bachelors.
You know um, you getoverstimulated and you don't
like it, and your bedroom'sfreezing.
You don't like it hot in thebedroom, so, wow, yes and you're
still single because you'vebeen reading my tinder profile.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Not again, not again is that what?
Speaker 2 (04:10):
we matched on.
Was it tinder?
It was tinder.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
What was it?
Speaker 2 (04:13):
oh, don't bring up the trauma.
I don't want to go through thatagain.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Sorry, sorry so I'm not going anywhere this time,
don't worry.
Don't worry, right, we've got areally exciting episode coming
up this week you might haveheard a couple of giggles
already in the podcast studio.
That's because there is aspecial guest with us today yeah
, we wanted to bring somebody onthe podcast to sort of educate
everyone.
We had a chat not that long agolike listen, when we finally
get into secure relationships,would we ever want children, etc
(04:37):
.
And it sort of developed intothis long conversation about if
we did and how we would go aboutthat.
And actually there are lots ofdifferent options and they are
ones that people don't really, Idon't think, talk about and
certainly don't get taught aboutat school.
So we're very excited to haveour guest on today who's
actually going through thesurrogacy option whilst being in
a same gendered relationship.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Yeah, so strap yourselves in, because this is
going to be an educationalpodcast this week.
We're going to learn so much.
I've got so many questions.
I'm sure you've got so manyquestions.
I hope we don't overstimulateyou today, benji, because I know
you don't like it I hope we do.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
I hope we do.
But yeah, we're gonna take alittle little break and then we
will have a real life Daddy inthe studio with us.
So yes, on this week's episode,we're very excited to be joined
by well, actually, we canproperly introduce him, because
we've mentioned this Daddy a fewtimes, because he was a huge
(05:32):
support for us right at thebeginning of starting my Big Gay
podcast.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Yeah, can you remember us back in season one?
Gosh In our bedrooms.
Gosh Not knowing how to do apodcast and giving it a go Speak
for yourself.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
But yeah, we mentioned that we were very
fortunate to have our very ownfairy godfather, and now we can
reveal that his name is Jonjoand he is our guest in the
studio today.
Yeah, so Jonjo supported usright at the very, very
beginning, and what's funny iswe called him our fairy
godfather and now he's literallyabout to become a father, yeah,
(06:03):
full circle, full circle moment.
It's almost like we knew yes,and john joe, in a same gender
relationship, is just about togo through surrogacy.
So please put your handstogether and make a big, warm
welcome for john joe thank youvery much for having me, guys
welcome to my big gay podcastand our lovely little studio
that we now record in.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
It is freezing.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
If you do get too warm, do let me know.
But the aircon doesn't go anycolder than it's on right now.
Love it.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
So, jonjo, just sort of going right back at the
beginning, you used to be aClapham Gay like myself and I
remember when I moved to claphama few years ago and, uh, you
were basically down the road, wewere neighbors yeah, yeah,
lived just about an eight minutewalk from brewers to brewers
and clapham.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Wow yeah they've done that to death, I think.
I love it still, obviously, butuh-huh, every friday, every sat
, regular.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Every weekend.
It does me to death.
So I think it's about time theyfelt how I feel every morning
after.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
But you've recently moved away from Clapham.
Yes, I have.
Are you a bit more in thecountryside now, out in the
sticks?
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Nice.
It's a suburbanite these days.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Now, was that a conscious move because you knew
you wanted to start a family, orwere you always going to move
out of london?
Speaker 3 (07:20):
absolutely, yeah, definitely wanted to move out.
Um, I just knew that I neededmore space, essentially, and I
wanted to grow my family.
Uh, it was just me and myhusband recent husband, that
sounds like I've had a few it'smy first one and the two dogs I
can't even get one exactly.
You're doing well but yeah, itwas just.
Uh, I think things outside oflondon a lot more family
(07:42):
friendly for sure.
Just the craziness of claphamas well.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Yeah it does have a bit of a crazy edge to it.
I mean, I love it, but Iimagine if I got to that stage
where I might want to start afamily, then, um yeah, I
probably would do the same butI'm pretty sure you have to do
some sort of iq test to become afather, I think honestly, I
think that's coming in it.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Is that actually?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
true?
I think so.
It's definitely not true.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
It's not the worst idea.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
Sometimes I really feel like you should have to
pass a test.
Goodness you with children?
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I think I'd make a good daddy actually, so next
question.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Absolute silence.
No, I'm team Brad today.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Thank you, john, joe, it's payback.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Fuck my drag.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
So you lived in Clapham, you moved away and you
recently got married.
So congratulations for that.
Thank you very much.
Wow, how long were you datingbefore you got married?
Speaker 3 (08:37):
So it's been a bit of a whirlwind.
We've been dating for aboutfour, four and a bit years.
Yeah.
So, um, we got married a littleearlier than we thought we were
going to originally, uh,because we started the secrecy
process and we wanted to bemarried for that, which I'll
come to later and it allhappened a lot faster than I
thought it was going to happen.
Yeah, so we were fortunateenough to get married in June,
(09:01):
on the 18th, the day after mynow husband's 40th birthday, so
went and shot over to Vegas, gotit done and came back.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Vegas wedding as well .
I mean, that is goals.
Would love to do that.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
I had to say the pictures looked absolutely
stunning.
Oh, thank you Like so gorgeous.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Really, really cute.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
But before we carry on with the rest of the podcast,
we haven't even offered you adrink.
We're so rude, I'm so sorry.
Now, obviously, because you'repregnant, we've gone for soft
drinks.
Is there any of these delicioussoft drinks that you would like
?
We've got Diet Coke.
It's literally like achildren's tuck shop in here it
is, we have.
Rio Tropical.
Other fizzy drinks areavailable.
We've got Cherry Coke, Fanta.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
And what coke fanta.
And what was that wild one barcream soda wow, rogue, wow, got
it all.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Which one, if any, would you like?
Speaker 3 (09:45):
um, I would love a fanta.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Please a fanta it's my favorite everything thank you
, here you go, john joe rightbrad, which one would you like?
I'm slightly tempted by thecream soda, just because I've
never had it in my life, I thinkyou'll like it.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
All right, I'm going for the cream soda I'm diving in
I'm gonna be basic.
I just going to go for the coke.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Benji on the coke.
That's not like you.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Get the bag, get the bag Right.
Cheers, boys, cheers.
I know that segment Came out ofabsolutely nowhere, but I was
dying Of thirst so I was likeI'm just going to interrupt To
make us open some drinks.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
So you got married this year, and where did you
meet?
You got married this year andwhere did you meet?
We?
Speaker 3 (10:20):
actually met at oh quiz night, the gay quiz.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Oh, my goodness.
Benji you've been to a few ofthose quiz nights right, I've
been to one.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
You, shady shady bitch.
I've been to one of them andI'll be honest, I found it so
nerve wracking that I spent thewhole time going to the toilet.
I think people probably thoughtI was quite unwell however,
every time I went to the toilet,there were these same two boys
going up to no good on thetoilets was it me it wasn't that
you um but yeah, so I justassumed it was less of a sort of
(10:53):
a dating night and more of likegrind alive they do the quizzes
and the speed dating.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Oh sorry, you said you went to the quiz.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
I went to the quiz oh , I was talking about the, the
speed dating.
Speed dating, that would makesense yeah also the, the quiz
night I've actually never beento oh, it's good fun.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
It's good fun, yeah have you ever won?
This is really embarrassing.
I've been twice and both timesmy team came last how
embarrassing was that the one?
Speaker 3 (11:17):
they did like a musical theater one.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, we would rock with that yeah, you would
absolutely and we still lost sosorry, we interrupted, so you
met um so, yeah, we met.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
We met at that, but it was sort of just as just when
you're allowed to do thingsduring covid, um.
So he saw me and then he addedme on Grindr.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Instagram, and then we.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
I actually completely ignored his request, and then
we matched on Hinge.
Come on, play hard to get and Ihad to go look after my mum for
a reason for a little while andI was talking to two guys for
about a month before I knew Iwas coming back to London, and
my now husband was one of themand the other, unbeknownst to me
at the time, was his bestfriend that lived about four
(12:07):
minutes down the road.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
That's a movie that is.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
That is a movie, yeah .
Speaker 3 (12:12):
So they both knew I was coming back and they
suggested the idea of a date.
And they both sent me the samemessage.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
So they were in cahoots.
They knew that, oh wow, only Ithink that day.
But yeah, they uh.
They both asked me on the day,but I sent me the same message
and I said, oh, so sorry, I'llstep back.
You know, I don't want to comebetween really good friends like
you guys, etc.
And um.
And then they both messagedseparately saying, well, okay,
that's really respectful, etc.
But should we go on a datestill, which I thought was you
know, backstabby.
But here we are, uh, and theother guy was busy, so I married
(12:43):
the other one.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Just to go back on what you said before.
John joe, if you want to comebetween the two of us, that is
so fine absolutely, we're good,we're good, we're good um, wow,
okay, so you just went on thedate with now robbie, yep, my,
my now husband um no, I, I didobviously choose robbie um over
the two of them.
Are they still besties?
They're really good friends.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Oh good, yeah, yeah, yeah, nice and I met his friend
and within five minutes we wereboth like oh my God, that would
have been an absolute nosediveof a relationship.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Oh really.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
Yeah, so we both agreed it was probably for the
best.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Oh, that's cute and and then.
So sort of going into thesurrogacy process.
Was having kids something thatyou always wanted?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Yes, it really was, and I found that that was quite
a big thing when I was gettinginto relationships and stuff
with different guys, whetherthey wanted a family or not and
I respect both ways of you knowwhat you want to do with your
life, but I just really reallywanted children.
I saw the joy it brought to myfamily.
I have a lot of love to give.
You know, I've already got twodogs and I'm still still needing
(13:45):
to grow my my circle and sharethe love, so it was definitely
really important to me for sureso alone, so alone, um, okay, so
we obviously we've establishedthat you went down the surrogacy
.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
Did you ever consider any other routes?
Speaker 3 (14:01):
yes, so, so I looked at them all.
So you know you've got adoption.
I just can't think of any moreright on the spot right now
Fostering, fostering, there wego, and surrogacy was always at
the top.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Just personally for me and that wasn't to rule out
the others, it was more to seehow I get on with surrogacy and
then perhaps look into the otherroutes if it doesn't prove
fruitful so I've got a questionfor you both if you're dating
someone and it's starting to getmaybe a little bit more serious
, when is the point to say aboutthe kids situation or even
(14:32):
marriage, right, because they'retwo sort of big milestones in a
relationship and some peoplemight not want either.
So when's a good point to maybebring that up that isn't too
like overwhelming and a bit, youknow, pinned downy should you
have me, because I'm gonna dragyou or should you have that
conversation early?
because, um, imagine if you datefor like a year and then you're
like I don't know what, I'vealways wanted kids and the other
person says, well, I never havewanted that well, I have
(14:54):
noticed now on like hinge youcan put.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
If you want kids, don't want kids or you're
undecided, you can put that now,so maybe that's early in the
bag yeah, I mean on a first dayI have been asked if I want kids
.
Yeah is that too early itreally depends on the vibe, no
other things, I think.
If we're talking about like,like, do you have brothers and
sisters?
Where are your family from?
Do you have any dogs?
Do you think you'll want kidsone day?
I think that's okay for me.
I wouldn't find that like, oh,oh, god get me out of here.
(15:20):
But yeah, if they were a bitmore timid, maybe I would save
it for date two or three.
If I ever got to date two orthree, oh no, not with you.
Sorry, not with you.
I'm a strong, independent woman.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
What about you, Jonjoe, when you were on dates?
Was that something that youwanted to talk about quite early
on?
Speaker 3 (15:42):
Because it's a really good question.
I think I um I did talk aboutit quite early on, uh, generally
because it was important to me,but also, um, that naming names
.
Obviously I've got peoplearound me that it turns out that
one of the partners didn't wantchildren and you know that's
ended some exceptionally longrelationships, uh, which is
really sad.
So, yeah, kind of got it.
I mean, robbie, my now husband,is pretty useless at hiding his
emotions and he told me heloved me on day three or
(16:02):
something like that.
I was like whoa, how do I getout of here?
Yeah, it was really funny,really awkward at the same time,
and all my friends were likedid tim.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
I was like uh, did you say it back?
Did you know?
Speaker 3 (16:16):
I love spending time with you too I said thank you
and turned it back over,slightly aroused.
I'm with you too.
I said thank you and turned itback over Slightly aroused.
Now, actually Going back toyour question, I think it is
important to you know.
Get those facts out on thetable from day one At least.
Then you know where you're.
Some people they've made uptheir minds from being when they
(16:38):
were a child.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
That's true, they don't want children.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Yeah, it's really important.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
I mean, I have often thought about it.
I think I've always said, likeif I end up with the right, it's
not the be all end all for me,because I've got nephews and
nieces which is almost enoughfor me, but I feel like if I
ended up with the right person,I would for sure.
I'm definitely much it is whatit is.
(17:10):
If it feels safe, it feelsright financially.
If it's okay because it's soexpensive.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
I am living in London and thinking about starting a
family poor.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
I think I felt like you actually until sort of 36,
37, and then all of a suddenhormones, I think, kicked in and
I really wanted a family all ofa sudden I've got 10 years then
here we go.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
so going back to surrogacy, and forgive me if I
come across totally um or askthe wrong questions because I
have zero, I kind of knowledgeabout it all.
Really Ignorant, stupid, dumbAll of that.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
I will happily take that.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
But my kind of knowledge really of surrogacy is
through Friends, the TV showwhich I know, benji, you're a
big fan of.
But they had two surrogacystorylines.
Do you remember?
Phoebe was a surrogacy for herbrother, is that right?
And then Monica and Chandleralso then had surrogacy as well.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
There's brother, is that right?
And then monica and chandleralso then had surrogacy as well.
There's an adoption, oh right,one surrogacy storyline.
Speaker 3 (18:05):
And one adoption one did phoebe have triplets?
Speaker 1 (18:07):
phoebe had triplets for her brother, yeah and monica
and chandler adopted twins yes,but the mother was already
pregnant when they went throughthe adoption.
And then ross's son ben, thenhad two lesbian mums.
Yes, there was quite a quite alot of.
They were doing what theythought was good work.
Yeah, but they didn't quite doit.
I don't think they did it verywell.
(18:27):
I do love Friends and I knowpeople at home will be like no.
Friends is awful.
It has aged badly.
It really has.
Speaker 3 (18:33):
It was quite progressive at the time, wasn't
it Right?
Speaker 1 (18:35):
yeah, I was going to say it started movements but
actually if you really watch itback and you look at how they
over-sexualize lesbians and howthey feminize gay people, it's
not done very well for itself.
But yeah, they did.
They started the movement, forsure on TV.
I feel like they had one of thefirst lesbian kisses as well
which was Rachel Gere and an oldschool friend.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Oh, I remember that episode.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, if you remember, the network nearly
cancelled them for it becauseJennifer Anderson was such a
huge time, like it waseverywhere, everywhere, and I
remember even people at homewere like oh, this is disgusting
, look at this.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
So there was a lot going on, a lot going on.
There was a lot going on there.
But that was my kind of firstintroduction to surrogacy, um,
so I guess my question to you,uh, john joe, is how do you
select someone to be like, Iguess, the oven?
Would you call it the oven?
Yes, what are the terms?
Speaker 3 (19:22):
there's so many.
I was completely naive tosurrogacy when I first started
looking into it.
And um, just go back straightto your first question.
Uh, my favorite phrase for mysurrogate is the tummy mummy
which I really enjoy.
Um, I'm really really fortunate.
My finding a surrogate is hardin eng, which I really enjoy.
Um, I'm really really fortunate.
My finding a surrogate is hardin england it's.
It's not commercial, you can'tpay for it and in fact, if you
(19:43):
do, it's illegal.
Um is it.
Yeah, completely illegal.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Yes, um do you have to find someone to volunteer?
Speaker 3 (19:50):
you do, and there are agencies out there that can
help you in the governmentrecommended agencies that can
help you as well, one of whichthere are a few, but one of
which I remember at the minuteis surrogacyukorg, and they
match not really match make, butthey have events and things
that you can go to and learnabout and meet other surrogates
and and if you get a link out ofthat, then then great, and
there's a there's an awful lotof law, uh, surrounding it and
(20:13):
there's a lot of law changesthat they're looking to make
hopefully, fingers crossed whichwill make it easier for
same-gendered couples to havechildren.
Um, but I'm really, reallyfortunate my, my sister-in-law,
stephanie, she, she offered tobe our surrogate.
Wow, yeah, we, we didn'tapproach her about it.
We, we left our dogs with mymother-in-law and my
(20:33):
sister-in-law was there, and wewent off on our holiday last
year and, uh, when we came back,she said no, I'm doing it for
you, you don't need to worry, um, and we said look, can we just
have a week to think about it,because there's a huge toll on
her body.
You know, she's 40, 41 now.
Um, I don't think she'll mindme saying that, um, and she's,
she's completed her own familyalready, which is quite a big,
important step that you gothrough.
(20:55):
So.
So she's got an 18-year-old anda 12 13-year-old and she asked
their permission first beforeshe came to us and I thought it
was really lovely and the rightway to do it.
I was very lucky, but yeah, soTummy, mummy is part of it.
People come up with alldifferent names.
It's whatever you feelcomfortable with, generally
speaking.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
So a question so the surrogate, it's just their oven,
right?
You don't use their egg?
Speaker 3 (21:18):
So that's the thing.
There's the two ways you canuse their egg if they're happy
to donate eggs, and they've gottwo titles which I've forgotten
at the minute.
I think it's gestationalsurrogacy and straight surrogacy
so it can be their DNA and yourDNA.
Or you can use donated eggs andthere's a couple of ways you
can find those.
You, uh, for example, for me Iwent to two different clinics in
(21:41):
london.
One was not very, very helpful.
Um, they didn't keep eggsfrozen.
And there's another rule thatwe learned about at the time is
the eggs have to be donated bythe women and it, you know, it
takes months for them to do it.
They have to stimulate alltheir ovaries to overproduce
eggs, etc.
And then they have to storethem for three months to make
sure.
Um, different sti checks andall the rest of it.
(22:02):
And then I went to a secondclinic, the london women's
clinic, and they had hundreds ofeggs already frozen ready to go
, and it was a bit like goingthrough a facebook grinder kind
of not grinder, facebook kind ofyou know, myspace, the olden
days kind of profiles of lookingat.
Obviously, they can't tell youtheir name, but they can tell
you their educational level,they can tell you their skin,
(22:23):
eye color, hair color, weight,height, languages, degree level
and a few other different pieces.
So you know, we spent ages justlooking through and looking
through, and then new donorswould come along, and then the
donor you wanted got bought theday before, because you have to
buy the eggs, obviously.
And then you get other questions.
If you're having only one childand there's 10 eggs there, I
(22:47):
think you can create.
I'm going to totally get thisstat wrong but you can only
create so many families from thesame donor.
I think it's three families.
So that would mean that yourchildren would have half
brothers and half sisters aroundthe world and you don't know
where, just depends where, wherethe other eggs were used.
So do you buy them all?
Do you buy?
You know however many there are.
So just just question afterdecision, after scary thought
(23:09):
after another, and you just haveto take one step at a time and
I suppose they do that for onlyhaving three families, because
generation down the linethere'll be a massive crossover
with genes, which obviouslywould not be not be okay.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
So just to clarify, it's your sister-in-law
sister-in-law carrying andyou've, but you bought somebody
else's yes, exactly that got itand this may sound like a really
dumb question, probably, butsay me and benji won't have a
baby jesus?
Oh my gosh, just for now, justin case, I wonder, to the world
(23:44):
famous?
Speaker 2 (23:45):
maybe famously bullied wrong reasons?
No, it'd be wonderful um butlet's say we decided to have our
own.
Could we mix all our sperm inone big pot and then that just
gets delivered to the egg andthen we don't know whose sperm
it is, or does it have to bejust from one donor?
Yeah, how does that work?
Speaker 3 (24:06):
okay.
So it's an amazing question isexactly the first question that
I wondered when I I went tostart looking into surrogacy and
it's a really strange.
So they used to do that, theyused to do that and they they
obviously very closely test thesuccess rates of everything they
do.
Because when you go todifferent clinics, the first
question you want to know is howsuccessful is it going to be?
And the same with IVF, becausethere's a lot of IVF involved if
(24:28):
you go down that route and it'squite a funny answer so if you
mix two guys sperm together,they have a a job, and the one
job is go to the egg andimpregnate the egg.
However, if it doesn't sum upwhat is wrong with you know all
of man and men, mankind, theywill not go for the egg, they
will fight each other to thedeath instead.
(24:51):
So if you mix your sperm, yeah,they, they won't get the job
done.
They will.
Nine times out of ten, they'll,they'll, uh, they'll just fight
each other and and just wriggleinto death instead oh, that is
I mean it makes sense, right?
Speaker 1 (25:04):
yeah, just look at mankind I'm trying to think of
jokes about us fighting eachother, but it just can't figure
anything out.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
But the thing is say we did mix our sperm and then it
comes out ginger and love inthe cold.
I'm like, okay, well, that'sclearly benji sperm that made
the final car.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Enough about your first date okay also of all my
personality traits you've comeup with ginger and loves the
cold.
Thanks, mate you're welcome sothen, going on from that, is
that a conversation you had withyour husband, like who should
we use?
Because I think and this is notme saying you, john job, I
think if I was having was usinga surrogate with my significant
(25:38):
other?
And just to stop me feelingqueasy, let's not use Brad as an
example.
There's something what's theword?
I don't want to saynarcissistic, but there's
something in me that would wantto use mine so I can see a baby
version of me.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
Exactly, and we're designed that way.
That's the future of evolution.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
My partner would probably feel the same way.
So is that a conversation thatyou two had, or did you sort of
just leave it up to yeah?
Speaker 3 (26:01):
so, um, we both um donated.
We let the doctor decide for us, but actually in doing that
process, um, it's crazy how muchyou find out about yourself.
So, um, a lot of my friends, um, male and female, are now doing
tests to to try and havechildren and finding out they
can't do it.
I think it's something like onein three people are infertile
(26:24):
or have a low sperm count andour lifestyles really don't lend
themselves.
So, you know, when we were bothdonating, I had to spend a
really good six months at leastno drink, no going out, lots of
walnuts um cold ice packs in mypants.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yeah, you have to keep your testes cold not cold,
but well, you're welcome thestudio today, the perfect
environment benji is currentlycooking at the moment.
Speaker 3 (26:49):
Yeah, so it is.
It is honestly crazy.
You need something like uh, Ithink it's 18 million sperm per
milliliter to um get pregnantnaturally, but it can be as high
as 124, 140 million and it canbe as low as zero or one or two
or three.
So it's, it's mental, the therange, and men are lucky they
(27:10):
can do nine times out of ten.
They can do something about it,they can change it through diet
and exercise and not going tobrewers all the time um, and
women can't?
they already have their eggs.
So if there's an issue, that'sit.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
They're stuck and stop donating at home actually
uh, you have to donate, shall wesay?
Speaker 3 (27:31):
uh, quite a lot.
Um, yeah, on doctor's orders,uh, I was informed every, at
least every three days, I had toprovide my what are we going to
call it, which is magic sauceoh, let's brainstorm some ideas
daddy's DNA daddy's sauce oh,that's already a thing, daddy's
sauce.
Yeah, I love that that's notgot done for infringement of
(27:52):
copyright we'll spell daddydifferently.
Speaker 1 (27:56):
I called it secret potion oh yeah, I don't know
what I like daddy sauce.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
That's my fave because if you are going to go
down this route, from mypersonal experience of speaking
to my mother-in-law and herasking me daily also how is your
um uh, how is your uh?
Daddy sauce and just expectingme to fill in the blank, and
this bunk really didn't go downvery well oh yeah, I guess
what's the nice plate dna, dna,I like that.
Speaker 1 (28:22):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
Sperm and gamete.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
Gametes are the uh, and just to clarify, when you
said you had to donate everythree days, are we still talking
about the home office or in lab?
Speaker 3 (28:33):
no, you, you can do it in the home office.
That's fine, um, but you dotest to make sure to see when
you're at your well, sort ofpeak, etc.
When I actually had to give, uh, my special dna potion, uh, it
was quite literally the mostawkward moment in my life.
I was in the clinic, uh, it wasin farringdon.
Um, I'll leave it at that, butit was one of those old london
(28:53):
buildings that has like spiralstaircase in the middle and it
was just a room off that, offthe spiral staircase.
And this building was used formany different reasons, you know
, botox and plastic surgery andall the rest of it and whatever.
So I'm just off the spiralstaircase with an old wooden
door that doesn't quite fit, theseams don't quite touch around
the corners, a TV and a leathersofa, and just my imagination
(29:16):
and my right hand A magazine,nothing.
No, there was a TV that I didn'tdare turn on because I was
worried.
Turn it off, turn it off.
But then of course you have to.
You know you're not allowed todo it for a few days before all
that sort of stuff.
But also there's a little doorbehind you, in the wall, where
you have to leave it.
You open it, it's like on alittle latch, and you leave it
on the uh on the side, and thenthere's a science lab on the
(29:38):
other side of that door wherethey take it from you and
obviously freeze it and all therest of it.
Um, so it's not very sexy, it'snot very sexy at all.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
I mean, I've done it in less sexy places that is true
.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
This is actually a step up from where you usually
do it yeah, I thought I saw yourname at the back of the road,
just next to that church, on thewall.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
I've heard stories about that church oh yeah, yeah,
not about me, okay Storieswhich I won't share right now,
but apparently things do happenthere.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Oh wow, oh, they were wonderful.
During lockdown, though, theylet brewers use their outdoor
space.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Yeah, that was quite nice.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Their outdoor space was used.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Let's just leave it at that.
We'll try and end it at thatone.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Okay, so you could donate at home and you could
test at home, did you say?
Speaker 3 (30:17):
You can test at home.
You can super drug to a testfor £200, I think it is and they
have to come and collect itwithin two hours of you doing it
, because sperm die very quickly.
When they put the solution onit, it keeps it alive for a bit
longer.
But I was so embarrassed thatwhen the guy turned up on the
motorbike to come and collectthe sperm, I had to send my
husband down to go give it tohim because I just couldn't face
(30:38):
the idea of being like here'smy magic potion.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Still sort of red in the face.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
Wearing it with nothing but a smile.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
I've also heard, just from other people that have
mentioned surrogacy, thatactually, when it comes to the
donating process, you can't haveany help.
Is that true?
Speaker 3 (30:58):
What do you mean by help?
Speaker 2 (30:59):
well you can't have other.
Um no, no bodily, yes,including saliva no, absolutely
it has to be a very strictdonation yeah so was it?
Speaker 1 (31:06):
did you donate at the same time?
Did you just one at a time?
Speaker 3 (31:09):
uh, same time?
Um, obviously not in the sameroom.
And all I remember thinking, tobe perfectly honest, is oh my
god, is that it after all thistime waiting I've been you know
very.
I haven't done anything in along time and that's all I've
managed to produce Jesus, butapparently it was brilliant.
Yeah, they said, I've got eightvials left so can you sell that
(31:30):
on?
I used to get paid for it notanymore, unfortunately I'm too
old.
But joke, benji, you're lookingthirsty, all of a sudden you're
right, very aroused.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
I used to get paid for it.
Not anymore, unfortunately.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I'm too old.
Oh, my Joke, benji, you'relooking thirsty all of a sudden.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
You're right Very aroused, but you have to freeze
it.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
It has to be frozen for three months.
You have to do tests at thebeginning, and then after three
months you have to do anothertest.
They quarantine it so you can'teven use it.
Yeah, it's not like oh, today Iwant a baby, let's go find some
eggs and do it tomorrow.
It probably takes you sixmonths to get to that point.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Wow.
So just before we take a veryquick break from the moment you
and your husband said you knowwhat we're going to do surrogacy
to the moment that you got thecall saying I'm pregnant how
long was that?
Speaker 3 (32:08):
So we were lucky, like I said, we had a surrogate,
been two and five years um andwe're our children are due, uh,
because we're having twins oh,congratulations.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Thank you very much um.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
Our children are due november, the 17th um, and we
started jan 23, so it's comingup to the two-year mark okay,
and that's um sort of on thequicker end of the process.
Absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah Imean you can go abroad and do it
quicker because it iscommercial in certain other
countries, um, and then othercountries you can't do it
anymore, um, italy, for example,I think.
(32:44):
Now I think I read um, thereare children already there that
have two mums, two dads, and thegovernment are taking off the
non-biological parent, yeah, andif you try to do so, we say
over there you can have a Ithink it was a two million euro
fine, something along thoselines, or a prison sentence, and
if you try and do it abroad andbring them back, they won't
(33:04):
recognize it.
So countries are going forwardleaps and bounds.
Some countries are england is,isn't a, it's not as far
advanced as, say, america, butit's, it's in a good space and
women are very well protected,which I I think is really
important.
And then other countries aregoing backwards.
So you've got to be reallycareful.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
All right.
Well, that is a lot to process.
I think let's take a very quickbreak and then I have many more
questions to come back withJonjo.
I hope that's all right.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Oh, podcasters, that noise, as you know, means that's
all we have time for on thisweek's episode, big Gay Podcast.
But do not panic, jonjo will bewith us in the studio next week
answering all your questions.
So let us know has this madeyou feel broody?
Has this opened your eyes?
Do you have any questions forJonjo?
How does it make you feel?
We'd obviously love to hearfrom you, and to do that, you
can write in to us on our socialmedia platforms, at Big Gay
(33:49):
Podcast, or head over to ourwebsite, which is
wwwmybiggaypodcastcom.
But, like I said, that's all wehave time for until next week
see you next wednesday.
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