Sandhya Balakrishnan ~ Yoga's Ancient Wisdom: How Yama and Niyama Can Transform Your Life

Episode Transcript
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(00:33):
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast,so happy you are here. My goal
with this channel is to bringinspirational speakers to the
mic in the field of yoga,massage, body work and beyond.
Follow us at @nativeyoga andcheck us out at
nativeyogacenter.com.

(00:56):
All right, let's begin.
Hello, I am so happy you'rehere. Welcome to Native
YogaToddcast. My name is ToddMcLaughlin. I have a very
special guest today for episodenumber 200. Yeah! Her name is

(01:19):
Sandhya Balakrishnan. HerInstagram handle is at
@the.yogini.project, and you canfind her also on YouTube under
the same name, and she is inBangalore, India. She is a yoga
teacher and really down toearth. And I can't wait for you
to hear her perspective on yoga.
It's just so honest and real. Ohmy gosh, Sandhya, thank you so

(01:43):
much. What a pleasure it was.
I'm so inspired right now, and Ican't wait for you to hear this
episode, and for your support tohit episode number 200 it's been
a little over four years now.
I'm just excited to celebratehere with you and Sandhya, let's
begin. I'm so happy to have thisopportunity to meet Sandhya.

(02:04):
Balakrishnan, Sandhya, thank youso much for taking the time out
of your busy schedule to be aguest on the show. How are you
feeling today?
Todd, first of all, thank you somuch for having me on your
podcast. And as we were speakingearlier, this is episode number
200 for you. And congratulationson that. I feel really lucky to

(02:29):
be a part of the podcast seriesthat you're doing, and I'm happy
to be number 200 for thisepisode. Thank you so much.
Yeah, doing really well, and I'mreally glad that we were able to
meet through Instagram. And it'sreally incredible how we are on

(02:50):
two different sides of theplanet, literally with two very
different time zones, andsomehow the algorithm matched
us, and we were able to come tothis conversation today and
share our thoughts about yoga,movement and all things related
to these disciplines. Very happyto be here.
Oh, thank you. I It is quiteamazing that we can connect this

(03:12):
way. I am a fan of technology,and I agree with you. What an
amazing chance to be able tomeet people on the other side of
the planet. This would never,ha, would have happened. Well,
gosh, not even that long ago.
Like, what? 30 years, 20 yearswouldn't have happened. Maybe,
yeah, yeah. Well, on that note,Sanjaya, I'm so curious. You
know, how did you first getinvolved in yoga practice? You,

(03:33):
you're, you were born and raisedin India? Yes,
yeah, that's right. So Todd, Ihave spent my entire life in
India, but I have had the chanceto visit a few countries outside
of here, and I've had the chanceto be exposed to multiple
cultures outside of India, andthose are experiences that I

(03:58):
really value, but theexperiences that really shaped
me to the person I am today camefrom my upbringing in various
parts of the country, mostlytowards the western parts of the
country. I've also lived in thenorthern part of the country for
a bit, and currently I'm settledin a city called Bangalore,

(04:18):
which is in southern India. Andmy first introduction to yoga
was around the age of 10, if Iremember correctly. So as a
child, I was suffering fromchronic asthma. I used to have
several episodes in a year whereI would be out of breath, I
would be in a lot of pain anddiscomfort and medical wisdom at

(04:42):
that time, which was say two,two and a half decades earlier,
did not really warrant the useof inhalers as frequently for
children. And I know thisbecause asthma, bronchitis and
other respiratory issues.
Because they typically tend torun in the families. And my
daughter, she also has her fairshare of issues with, you know,

(05:06):
bronchitis because it comes fromthe family. Yes. Now, until the
age of 10, I went through, youknow, several episodes a year,
suffering and being extremelyuncomfortable, not being able to
play much, not being able toenjoy sports as much, until my
pediatrician once recommended tomy parents that I should perhaps

(05:30):
try yoga. And we were in a citycalled Pune at the time, which
is in the western part of thecountry, and this is also the
city where Sri BKs Iyengar has ahuge institution. Of course, I
didn't have the chance to studyin that institution at that

(05:51):
early in age, but there was asmaller studio that was run by a
really wonderful lady who hadlearnt under Sri ayangarh
himself, and she was the one whofirst introduced me to some of
the basics in terms of asanapractice and a very brief
introduction to pranayama aswell. And there were two things

(06:14):
that really struck me from myfirst exposure to yoga at the
age of 10, the first one beingthat after every class, I would
somehow end up feeling thisprofound sense of peace and
calm, which I couldn't explainat the time. It was a very, very
beautiful feeling of absoluteclarity and peace. And it was

(06:36):
wonderful as a 10 year old to beable to feel something like
that. Of course, I didn't havethe words to articulate it back
then, and the second feeling wasa gradual improvement in my
condition, in fact, over theyears. So I ended up practicing
with that studio only for abouta year, and then we had to move

(06:57):
cities and so on. But throughthat brief exposure to asana
practice and some basics ofpranayama practice, I found that
actually my conditiondramatically improved, and I
went from having severalepisodes of asthma in a year to
perhaps one one in, say, twoyears, and those episodes were

(07:19):
manageable. So I think, inessence, what the practice led
to was strengthening of mylungs, improvement of my
cardiovascular endurance, in asense, and definitely the
ability to be able to regulatemy breathing better. So that was
my very first exposure to yogaat a very age.
Amazing. Yeah, you know, mydaughter, my daughter is 11, and

(07:44):
she has asthma, and so it'sreally interesting to hear your
perspective from from that ageand what that's like. I'm
curious. Do you, do you have anybouts of it now? Or is it
something that was likechildhood and you grew out of
it?
You know, I'm really going tosay touch wood on this one,

(08:04):
because I can't honestlyremember the last time I had an
episode. Very cool. It's beenreally long time. I think it was
about four or five years ago,perhaps, yeah, it's been a very,
very long time.
Amazing. Are you able? Are youable to teach your daughter any
methods or techniques that youfound is helping her? Currently,

(08:29):
I have taught her myself. Infact, she is very happy to
sometimes come along when I'mconducting a yoga class in this
very room, and she's able to dosurya namaskar on her own. And
I'm very happy that her schoolalso has yoga as part of their
curriculum. It's part of the theacademic you know, the syllabus

(08:52):
that they have. And hercondition has improved
dramatically from when she was achild, and I'm expecting further
improvement as she grows alittle older. So she's eight
now, and I'm assuming by thetime she's 1112, ish, there will
be a little more improvement inthe condition as she ages. Nice.

(09:15):
What, uh, what types of yogaHave you learned over the years?
It sounds like you add exposureto a younger method, have you?
And you've traveled extensively,obviously around India, and you
said, also globally, what typeof yoga practices have you been
attracted to?

(09:35):
Well, that's a reallyinteresting question, because
after my first exposure to yogaaround the age of 10, my second
exposure came around the time Iwas 16, I think 16 or 17 years
old, and this was towards theend of what we in India refer to

(09:55):
as class 12, or grade 12. Andit's, it's a sort. Of the last
point before we enter college.
So post grade 12 is when we thenenter college for further
education. And that examinationis really critical because of
the intensely competitiveenvironment in the country. And

(10:15):
you know, I was very keen to dowell in that exam so that I
would have brighter chances ofgoing to a really, you know,
good college, yes. And whatended up happening was I spent
that entire year studying,sitting and studying being very
sedentary, not being verymindful about the food that I

(10:36):
ate. And as a result, I ended upputting on a considerable amount
of weight. And at that time, youknow, I was keen to explore yoga
again, to see if there would beany improvement in my current
state with yoga. And I wasexposed to a studio which was
run by teachers who had learnedfrom Kaivalya Dham. And Kaivalya

(10:59):
Dham is another very, very wellknown institution in the western
part of the country, and theirstyle is more Hatta. So their
style is more longer Asanaholds, you know, go at your own
pace. There's no vinyasa flow,really, but it's more about
exploring each Asana on its own.

(11:23):
Go at your own pace. Very longholes followed by nice, long
shavasanas. You know, yes,relatively more peaceful
environment, yeah. And that wasthe style I think that I got
most drawn towards, because atthat time, all I needed was a
reconnection back to my own selfand a reconnection back to

(11:46):
mindful eating habits, mindfulmovement habits, and that
practice enabled me to becomereally, really aware of all of
the habits that I needed tochange in terms of my own
nutrition And in terms ofmovement, and I say this to in
fact, there is some content I'veput out on Instagram on this

(12:06):
very topic, but I will alsomention this right here, please.
Over the last 2025, years, Ihave pretty much eaten in the
same way, or rather the amountof food that I have consumed on
a daily basis has pretty muchremained the same, and my weight

(12:27):
has, you know, rarely fluctuatedover two or three kilos plus
minus, barring the phase where Iwas pregnant with my daughter,
and even then, I had put on onlythe requisite amount of weight.
So my weight was always in checkbecause of these mindful eating
habits that I was able todevelop at that young and age,

(12:50):
through exposure, through to theheart of style of yoga. And my
my blood markers are great. Youknow, I keep getting my health
checkups done once every year,and my blood markers come out
great and as a woman, anothergreat indicator of overall
health is the regularity of ourcycles. And my cycles have been

(13:13):
more reliable than any clock orcalendar in the house. So my
cycles have always been veryreliable, and I credit all of
this to the principles of hathayoga. And it's not so much the
asana practice that's important.
It's the practice of it'sliterally the essence of the

(13:35):
word yoga. Yoga, you know, as weall know, comes from the
Sanskrit root word huge, whichmeans union. And this is not so
much union with the Divine Self.
You know, the divine self comesmuch later. Whether there is a
divine power up there or not. Weare, we are all exploring. I

(13:57):
don't think any of us has clearanswers on that, yeah, but at
least to be able to connectdeeply with your own self, to be
able to listen to your body'ssignals, to eat only when you're
hungry, to stop when you'refull, to eat what works best for
your body? I think that is oneof the biggest learnings that

(14:21):
I've had from my exposure toHatha Yoga back then. And Hatha
is something that I always treatas the foundation of everything
that I do, not just from a froma student perspective, but also
from a teacher's perspective. Soit's literally at the foundation
of whatever I do. And in today'sworld, I think a lot of people

(14:44):
do face similar issues wherethey are not able to understand
how to listen to their ownbodies, how to honor their own
needs, both from a physical anda mental perspective. And my
endeavor as a teacher is to tryand help them. To reach a point
where they're able to take astep back and listen to what

(15:05):
their body is telling them, orwhat their mind is telling them,
slow down a little bit, and thenmake whatever changes they need
to so as to achieve a balancedstate in life. So I hope that
answers your question that'sslightly longer, but
please, please. I like the longanswers. Thank you, Sandhya,
that's really amazing. I thinkyou're right. That their

(15:25):
relationship to food and ourability to to actually listen to
the body seems like a reallyimportant part. Do you do you
feel like there's a slight overemphasis on the asana component?
Or do you think that the overemphasis on the asana eventually
will lead one to having thissort of self regulation and or

(15:48):
insight to learn that. Do youfeel like eventually that would
come?
You know, this is by far one ofthe the most interesting things
that I like to talk about inyoga. You open your phone and
you look at any social media apptoday, you'll most likely be

(16:14):
bombarded with images of peopleperforming very complex postures
with their bodies, and claimingit to be yoga, and somehow
implying that that is theessence of yoga, or that is what
yoga is. And then you will finda lot of people arguing and

(16:34):
debating about which style ofasana practice is better. There
will be some folks who are wholean more towards one style of
practice, and then they tend todevelop a sense of superiority
or supremacy about thatpractice. They tend to develop a
sense of attachment towards thatpractice, which then leads them

(16:55):
to discredit what others aredoing, which you know, sometimes
leads them to behave in waysthat makes other folks feel like
they're not included, or thatthey're not enough well, sir and
all of this. So for example, youknow folks who have a certain

(17:16):
type of anatomy or a certaintype of history in in say dance
or gymnastics or athletics, arenaturally able to perform some
of the Yoga Asanas much betterthan others. But then that
really leaves out the majorityof the people out there who may

(17:38):
not have had the exposure tosay, dance or gymnastics or
athletics, or who may not benaturally blessed with
hypermobile joints or naturallyflexible spines. And when people
like that look at images offolks doing asana and then

(18:00):
calling it yoga. It's a verylimiting view of yoga. In my
opinion, there's so much more toyoga than the asana practice. In
fact, Asana, and I'm sure youknow this from your own rich
experience of teaching andlearning, right when we speak of

(18:22):
the eight limbs of yoga, thefirst two are the ones that
people have sort of stoppedtalking about, the Yama and the
Niyama.
Good point. They stopped talkingabout it's a good point. They've
stoppedtalking about it. There is no
Niyama, right? And it's reallyunfortunate, they quickly jump

(18:42):
on to Asana, which is limbnumber three. It's not even one
or two, it's limb number three.
And then there's more afterthat, right? And currently,
Asana is glorified as the singlesolution to all problems in

(19:02):
life. But take a moment. Let'sconsider the Yama and the
Niyama, right? So you have oneof the the Yamas as as
aparigraha or non hoarding. Ihope I'm remembering it right.
So non hoarding, right? Nonaccumulation, non excess

(19:24):
accumulation of possessions,okay, but look around you and
see what's happening. People areexcessively accumulating things,
objects, great point. They'reexcessively accumulating
clothes, shoes, bags, you know,jewelry, excessive consumption

(19:46):
of content on OTT media onsocial media, excessive
consumption of food in general,and excessive consumption of
junk food in general. Right?
A great group, yes,and here, there are certain
schools of yoga that are tryingto solve these problems with a

(20:08):
limited asana practice. Do youreally think Asana is the
solution to solving a problemthat actually exists somewhere
else? How do you stop yourself?
How do you even recognize thatyou're actually hoarding things?

(20:28):
Okay, that's one example.
Another example is that'sa good one. I love that. I love
that I gotta stop you for onesecond, because every time I've
heard of a pada Graha inrelation to like, non hoarding,
non greed or accumulation. Ilike that you've made the
connection point to accumulationof even consumption, of social
media consumption, and then evenmaking the connection with food

(20:52):
too. Because often, like you, wethink like, oh, I should, if I'm
not going to be greedy. Andthey're like, Okay, I'm not
going to try to get the new caror the bigger house or the
whatever else, but making thatextra jump over toward
accumulation in relation toevery little bit of energy that
comes in, whether it's food orvisual or audio or what our
senses are. So that's that'sreally cool, Sanja, but I don't

(21:13):
want to interrupt you, but keepplease, keep going. That's
great.
No, I'm glad you like this wayof thinking, because this is
exactly how I think about yoga,right? And I'll just take one
other example from the from theYama Niyama. There's something
known as shout or cleanliness,okay? Now, the traditional

(21:37):
interpretation of cleanliness iscleanliness of the surroundings,
but you could extend it to meancleanliness of your own body.
What what you put inside? Okay,so if you put junk inside, if
you're going to put uncleanstuff into your body time and
time again, it kind of violatesthe the principle of church or

(22:02):
cleanliness, correct? Yes, andthese are things which cannot be
solved with Asana alone. Now.
But having said that, Asana is agreat introduction to the
practice, it's a greatintroduction to yoga, or a yogic
way of living. But what we needare teachers who are able to

(22:24):
extend yoga beyond asanas. Youknow? What we need are teachers
who are able to actually bringthese perspectives to their
students. Yes, because otherwiseit's there's a lot of
disconnect, you know. And evenwhen we speak of asanas, there's
a certain belief that certainasanas are advanced, or certain

(22:49):
asanas are beginner asanas. Letme give you a few, you know,
examples here. So today, in oneof my classes, in the morning, I
was helping my students do theshirishasana, or the headstand.
Right? It's a fairlycomplicated, very layered

(23:12):
posture to achieve, with its owninherent set of risks, and it's
also very difficult to, youknow, help people do it in an
online environment, in a veryinclusive way. But when I
approached it, I was very clearin telling my students that, you
know what, there's a generalbelief that this is supposed to

(23:32):
be the quote, unquote, king ofasanas, but that is at the risk
of sounding arrogant, that isridiculous. That is ridiculous.
Why would you call a certainposture as the king of asanas
and give it that you know, putit up on a pedestal like that.

(23:53):
Yeah,it makes no sense. If great
points a studentof mine is unable to do the
headstand, but she is able to bea kind and compassionate and a
generous person in her day today life, if she is able to
perform her Dharma with theutmost sincerity, if she is able

(24:13):
to do her you know, if she isable to Be mindful of her
surroundings, mindful of peoplearound her, and just because
she's not able to perform theShirish Asana, does that make
her a bad yogi? I mean, ofcourse not. So I told them very
clearly that there are all thesenames that are given to asanas.

(24:36):
There are all these labels thatare given to asanas, which are
which are unfortunate, andthey're very limiting and
they're ridiculous. You cannotcall a certain posture as the
king of asanas, because ifsomeone's not able to do it,
then that person ends up feelinginadequate, insecure. You. Uh,
non validated. And is that whatyou want people to feel at the

(25:04):
end of a yoga class? Absolutelynot. I definitely don't want my
students feeling inadequateabout their capability of
performing a certain physicalposture. You know, I want them
to feel like they tried. I wantand the word Hata itself means
effort. Hata means effort. Iwant them to feel like they put

(25:25):
in the best efforts that theycould, and that they gave it
their best shot during thatclass, and hopefully, you know,
in the next class, or wheneverwe do it next day, be able to
understand it better. Maybe getbetter at it. Maybe not get
better at it. It's okay. Allthat matters is effort. Yes, you

(25:46):
know, yes. And when we speak ofAsana, also the stuff that we
see on social media, let's takeanother example of yoga,
nidrasana, the leg behind thehead posture I fail to
understand how in today's worldwhere so many people are stuck
in sedentary jobs, where theyare sitting on their chairs for

(26:11):
more than 1012, hours a day, andthese are people who cannot
perform A regular, simple, deepsquat. They can't squat down.
Their hips are not strongenough. Their legs are not
strong enough. The knee jointsare not capable enough of
holding a deep squat position.
And then you're showing them.
You're bombarding them withimages of these, these people

(26:33):
with dance backgrounds,gymnastics backgrounds, you
know, and people coming fromcertain lineages of schools and
effortlessly doing the yoganidrasana and and implying that
it is, it's something to beachieved. I'm sorry,
yoganadrasana has no functionalbenefit in day to day life. Let
me be very honest about it.

(26:57):
There's no functional benefit ofthe yoga asana in day to day
life, yes, but there is a lot offunctional benefit of a simple
Malasana or a deep squat. Sowhen people are entering yoga,
do you want them to enterthinking that, Oh, my God,
someday I want to be able to dothe yoga nidrasana, and perhaps

(27:19):
they might never be able to dothe yoganadrasana, and then they
end up feeling really inadequateat the end of their lives. I'm
sorry that is not the way I lookat asana practice. So therefore,
to the I mean the long answer toyour question is asana practice
is very limiting. We need to bespeaking more about the Yamas,
the niyamas, and the other limbsthat follow Asana. So your

(27:42):
pratyahara withdrawal of thesenses, you know, dharana,
dhyana, I think we are, we aretalking very less of this and a
lot about Asana without lookingat, you know, ethics and social
conduct, Ahimsa, asteya, eventhe whole principle of Ahimsa or
non violence, is not just aboutnot killing. You know things or

(28:08):
you know living beings. It'snot, it's it doesn't relate to
killing, really. It relates toviolence of any form. And when
you are forcing your body to doa Shirish Asana or a yoga nidra
Sana, at a time when you are notphysically or emotionally
capable of doing it, you'resubjecting yourself to violence,

(28:31):
and there's no need to do it.
The founding principles neverreally spoke about this kind of
violence. It's always thiramsukhama sanam, right? In order
to enter a meditative state, anyposture is is fine wherever
you're sitting in a stable andhappy state. Patanjali said
this, right? Stiram, sukhamAsana. Asana is any posture
where you're I could be sittingright here on this chair, and

(28:54):
I'm comfortable, and I'm able toclose my eyes, I'm able to
concentrate on a certain point,and I'm able to achieve a brief
but blissful state. And I maynot be in padmasana, but
that's okay, you know, yes, sothat's, that's my view on Asana.

(29:15):
I'm sothank you, thankful that you're
bringing this to the forefront,because I think it's really
important today to hear thismessage Sandhya, because there's
so much going on. And just inrelation to the yoga world, it
is like we're seeing this reallycome to light now, especially as
I'm getting older and the moreI'm speaking with practitioners

(29:40):
that have been with yoga for 20,3040, years, and and starting to
understand that it's not justabout the body and all these
positions and even looking atlike, Well, I've been doing yoga
nidrasana for 20 years, and nowI can't walk or my back is
messed up. Right? And you kindof look back and go, Wow, here

(30:00):
all this time. I just thoughtthat if I was doing yoga,
everything would just work outjust perfectly. I wasn't really
listening to my body at thetime. It hurt like crazy. But I
just thought that if I keptdoing it, this is what I was
supposed to be doing, andthere's a little bit of a
disconnect. There's not thatreal deep connection like what
you're speaking of. So I thinkthis is a really important

(30:20):
conversation to have, and I'mreally glad you're bringing it
to this point. And I can I askyou a little then, because, in
relation to the fourth Yama,Brahmacharya, Brahmacharya, can
you explain a little bit fromyour perspective, from, you
know, the cultural aspect inIndia. And because a lot of
times I feel like Westernershave a hard time grappling with

(30:43):
this one. And I know, from whatI understand, if we break the
words down, like Brahma,referencing the god or deity of
this is creation correct? Andthen Acharya is like a chariot
or a vehicle, so maybe thevehicle of Brahma. And then,
from what I understand, inrelation to, like, a lot of

(31:03):
times in the West, we'll hearcelibacy, you know, and then,
and I understand, like in inIndian culture, there's, please
correct me, because I want tounderstand Indian culture, is
that, like, obviously, from ageszero to 13, or from the time
that we are married, or perhapsbecoming a householder or a
parent, we should be celibate.

(31:27):
And I think that's absolutelytrue. And I think this is a
perfect thing in relation topeople where they, you know, are
wondering, like, how should wehave conduct with children and
adults? Well, yeah, it's veryclear, you as a child, that's
special, and you don't, youdon't violate that, right? So I
guess I'd just love to hear yourtake on how that has evolved for

(31:48):
you in your life, and yourunderstanding of it, especially
being a mom too.
Okay, great, that's reallyinteresting question, and I'll
try and give my perspective onit. So Brahmacharya means
abstinence or celibacy, okay,but both terms, if viewed

(32:08):
independently, have differentdegrees of control. So
abstinence is is a little morecontrol. Celibacy is a complete
stop to sexual activities, youknow, at at the inappropriate
time. Now, in the Indiantradition, there are, there are

(32:31):
certain aspects of spiritualitythat are talked about in
connection to preservation ofsexual energy. Alright? So it is
believed in certain sections ofthe Indian culture that if you
abstain from sexual activity forlong enough, you will end up

(32:53):
preserving your sexual energy,which will then perhaps help you
to attain greater heights ofspirituality much faster. So
there is this certain beliefthat exists in certain sections
of the society. But having saidthat, not all of us need to do

(33:14):
it, not all of us have the infact, I would say not all of us
are destined for that spiritualpath. You know, not all of us
are destined to reachspirituality, or, you know, the
higher forms of peace, etc, fromthat part. So not all of us are

(33:35):
meant to do it that way. Formost of us, we are meant to go
through life. We go meant to gothrough the motions of life, and
we are meant to perform ourduties in the marital
environment. We are meant toperform our duties in the
parental environment, and that'swhere Brahmacharya takes a very

(33:57):
unique role. So essentially, itmeans that you know you
understand sexuality well inyour teenage years, and you
understand how to regulate yoururges and how to be mindful
about engaging in sexualactivity in your in your youth,
before you get married, you bevery mindful and respectful

(34:20):
about it. But when you do enterthe institution of marriage, you
must be very, very, very, veryaware of your role as a spouse
and of your role as a parent.
Eventually, if you choose tobecome a parent and there your
abstinence will only be inrelation to being faithful to

(34:45):
your partner, you know, to notexploring your sexuality outside
of the realm of the maritalinstitution that you have
entered. And I think there'smerit in. Understanding
celibacy, understandingabstinence, like this, because,
you know, for a household tofunction peacefully and for a

(35:07):
household to thrive, there hasto be a great degree of mutual
respect between both partners,correct? And a lot of that, a
lot of that respect also has todo in terms of, you know, the
kind of sexual activities or thesexual urges that the partners
may experience from time totime, and often, there might be

(35:29):
a an imbalance in the frequencyor the intensity of urges of the
partners, but as long as thepartners have respect for each
other and they are able to staycommitted only to each other and
to not explore these urgesoutside of the institution of
marriage, it leads to a stablefamily, a peaceful environment

(35:50):
and a great place for childrento grow up and thrive with the
right values in place. So that'sthe way I look at Brahmacharya.
Yeah? Well said, Yeah, anabsolute celibacy. I think, you
know, the people who choose tobecome monks or priests are

(36:10):
expected to take on vows ofcelibacy because they've chosen
a certain very rigorous path ofspiritual enlightenment. And I
think those people have a have afar more strict set of
regulations to follow, but forthe rest of us, I think we are

(36:33):
all still yogis if we are ableto be if we are able to abstain
within the realms and thelimitations of the institution
of marriage that we enter, yeah,should we choose to enter
marriage? So that's raw materialform.
Yeah, that's a really goodanswer. Thank you for because I

(36:54):
feel like it's a subject thatsometimes people get a little
squeamish about. But I feel likeif we just address and talk
about it, in an adult likefashion, it makes a lot of
sense. Yeah, and family valuesare so important, you know,
good, strong family values andholding the family together like
this, oh my gosh. I agree withyou 100% Yeah, you know you are,

(37:14):
from what I understand fromfollowing you. You had a career
in, you know, like a verydemanding career path, and then
you became, or chose to become,a yoga teacher. Can you speak a
little bit about your journeyfrom the corporate environment
to to the to the current rolethat you play as a professional

(37:37):
yoga teacher?
Sure, I I think that's that's aninteresting question, because I
do get a lot of people around measking me about how and why I
made the switch, and I'll tryand answer both aspects of it.
So while I was growing up, I wasled to believe that the only way

(38:02):
to be financially independentwas to study really well and get
a great job in a in a reputedcorporate organization. And this
is the belief system that a lotof my my friends and peers and
contemporaries also grew up withbecause we all belonged to a

(38:23):
generation where we were beingbrought up in an environment
where there was extremecompetition. Resources were
scarce, and we were told thatthe only way to be financially
secure and to build a goodfinancial foundation for your
future generation, was to dothis. And so a lot of us ended

(38:45):
up doing this. A lot of us endedup studying really well, working
really hard. And honestly, I'mvery grateful that I grew up
like this, because a strongacademic foundation is timeless.
You know, there's nothing thatbeats a strong academic
foundation, the ability to thinkcritically, the ability to to

(39:08):
explore different subjects inschool and college. So I think
my my parents did a fantasticjob in raising me in a way to be
academically sound, academicallycurious, and I took on a
corporate job at a very earlyage, right out of college, and I

(39:28):
worked for a total of 15 yearsacross various organizations.
And these were all really,really great names in the world
of consumer products, retail,media and E commerce, and these
were really great organizedthese are really great
organizations that are doingsome really good work in their

(39:49):
respective fields. And I'mreally, really grateful because
for those 15 years, I developedskill sets, which I. Otherwise
never would have, andspecifically skill sets
pertaining to the sales andmarketing arenas. Because I now

(40:10):
realize, as a yoga professional,you know, as a teacher and as an
entrepreneur trying to build aname in this field, that one
does need to have a little bitof background in sales and
marketing to be able to navigatethis new age world of yoga,
right? Yes, I'm very gratefulthat for those 15 years, I ended

(40:31):
up developing the skill sets insales and the skill sets in
marketing, and I made the switchhow? Because, or rather, I made
the switch. Why? Because I wasfeeling like my jobs lacked a
sense of deeper meaning andpurpose. You know, while it was,

(40:54):
you know, while it was greatthat they exposed me to, you
know, all of these new skillsets they granted me the
privilege of developing somereally good professional
networks. And I'm really, reallygrateful to be able to have some
very, very senior people in myprofessional network, even
today, who I can just pick upthe phone on and ask for help if

(41:17):
I need to. I'm very, veryprivileged to be in that
position, but at the end of theday, I felt like I needed to be
doing something more meaningfuland tangible to people around
me, and that was the why behindthe switch that I made, and now
the how is more important. Yeah,a lot of people you know, in my

(41:41):
circles and in generalconversation, seem to be very
unhappy with their jobs. Youknow, there's a general sense of
discontentment with corporatejobs. Okay, I'm not sure if this
is your experience, but at leastfrom Yes, from my own
experience, you've come acrosspeople who are generally
discontented with Yeah. Allwe hear yeah, there's Yes, yes,

(42:04):
corporate America, corporatework, or corporate world, is
constantly we're hearing thatthat's a huge subject.
Absolutely, I think, yeah. Ifeel like there's probably a few
people, I mean, I meet a fewpeople that are in corporate
life that really love it, likethey they're at the top of their
game, yeah, and they're engaged,and they absolutely love it. But

(42:26):
I would say a much largerproportion of people I hear and
I speak with are more just like,I'm just going through the
motions, I'm just showing upevery day, and and, and a lot of
like, there's a lot of jobinsecurity in the corporate
world. From what I'm gatheringfrom everybody, like it seemed
initially like this was the onepath, the golden path. I'm just
going to become a corporate Pro.

(42:50):
And now there's a lot of shake.
There's a lot of ShakeDown goingon, from what I understand
speaking with folks so I hear,yeah, this is not just the end.
I think there's a globalelement, the
global thing. Yeah, so. So whenyou have a large chunk of people
who are generally unhappy withthe work that they're doing, the
first instinct is for them toquit and do something else. So

(43:16):
they either jump ship from oneorganization to another, or they
will quit and try to figure outsomething in the non corporate
environment. And in bothinstances, the chances of
success are limited. So ifyou're if you don't have a plan

(43:37):
in place, if you don't know whyyou're quitting your corporate
job, and if you don't have a sixmonth horizon or a one year
horizon in place, it gets reallyhard, and then you're forced to
jump back to a job that youreally don't like to do. Now, in
my case, I knew I had to moveon, but I didn't have a plan in

(44:01):
place for a very long time. Soseveral years, I went to work, I
did my job the best I could, andI made sure I, you know, gave my
100% to whatever was asked ofme, and until I found my reason

(44:21):
for quitting. I didn't quit, youknow, I hung on and I tried to
make the best of the situationthat I had on hand, because it's
work at the end of the day,it's, it's karma, right? And if
you've been asked to do acertain job, you're, you might
as well just go and do it thebest you can, right? And then

(44:43):
once you've logged off fromwork, then you can spend your
time at home thinking about whatit is that you would like to do
if it was not this job. And so Ispent several years doing that,
and finally, in 2020 justbefore. The pandemic hit us, I
did my teachers training course,and I did that with no clear

(45:09):
agenda in mind. I just did itbecause I thought it would be a
great certification to have, andto be very honest, I was
approaching it as a CV pointitem, you know, something I can
speak about in interviews,future job interviews, but when
I actually did the TTC is when Irealized that this was something

(45:33):
that was far bigger than what itseemed at that point. It seemed
so strong to me. I felt like Ihad to do something in that
space. But even after that, Ididn't quit my job. I continued
working for another 18 months,18 to 20 months after my TTC,
and during that time, I wastrying very hard to assess my

(45:58):
financial situation, to assesswhether we would be good to go,
you know, with a certaindisparity of incomes in the
family, and whether we would begood with the sudden career
switch and the new demands of mywork. So my husband and I had

(46:18):
several conversations about it.
I had several conversations withmy friends about it. I ran
multiple spreadsheets on my own.
I made sure that I wasfinancially sound, you know, I
made sure that I wouldn't beleft with nothing to hold on to.
Yes, and it's only then that Icommunicated to the organization

(46:41):
that you know I'd really like tomove on, because I feel like
this is something I need to do.
But if I had to go back in timeand revisit that decision, would
I make a different decision?
Absolutely not. Yay. Very glad Idid what I did. Yes, I'm very
glad. I'm so happy.
Yeah, that's amazing. Sandia, Ivery cool, very cool. And that

(47:06):
was going to be my nextquestion. So thank you for just
like jumping right to it,because after you have a little
bit of time after yourcrossover. So this was 15 years
ago that you embarked on thisjourney.
No, so I quit my job three yearsago. You said
2020, and so I went back. Iheard you say 50. Understood,

(47:28):
so,and I worked for 15 years, so
I've been working.
Yeah, got it six, 202,021 Yeah.
So are you teaching primarily onZoom or a combo? I saw some of
your Instagram is showing thatyou're conducting zoom classes.
And then I noticed that you wereteaching in a studio. What
really cool photo I saw. Astudent looked like they were

(47:49):
going for like, upli tihi, theyhad padmasana and maybe pushing
down like you kind of had thatjoy of a yoga teacher, like a
happy moment of like, how coolto be here with these folks and
seeing them work so hard andwow, a very rewarding
experience. So then what I canalso gather, though, too, is
that I'm seeing and I like thefact that you're coaching people

(48:10):
and the reality of this, and notjust kind of doing a dweepass
your shots, a leg behind thehead, corporate shift persona of
like, Hey, look at me, you guys.
I was a corporate person. I justswitched over to yoga, and it's
so much better and easier, andeverything's great. You're being
very honest and real andactually saying to people, whoa,
whoa, whoa, if this is somethingyou're serious about, you have

(48:31):
to really take yoga seriously.
And there's got to be like, adedicated commitment before just
jumping ship from corporate overto the dream, like we have a
dream, and then we realize,well, the dream is a little
more, a little more involvingthan I had planned for so I love
hearing about your ability tokind of really strategize. I
also agree and appreciate likeyou're utilizing the skills you

(48:56):
were able to learn through yourcorporate life, and now that is
playing a big part in yoursuccess as a independent yoga
teacher profession. So that'sthat's super inspirational. Can
you give another little I knowwe're getting close to our I
know we scheduled an hour, andI'm already like, Oh my gosh. I

(49:17):
have so many questions for you.
How am I gonna squeeze them off?
But I know we don't have tohurry, and we could pretend.
Potentiallydo it. I'm sorry if my answers
were really no. Are youkidding? And these are amazing.
Oh, thank you so much, Sandia.
So I mean, then I guess if youhad to pick one nugget or tidbit

(49:38):
or takeaway for advice, forthose of us that are either
thinking about doing what youdid, making the jump, or those
of us that are new in the gameand going, how in the world am I
going to pull this off, anylittle tidbit of advice?

(49:58):
Well, I'm, yeah. Any new to thefield myself, and I don't want
to sound, you know, like I knowtoo much, but I'll share
whatever little I learned overthe last three years or so. For
those, for those of us who arethinking of making the switch
from corporate to yoga, inparticular, I think you have to

(50:21):
be very, very strongly called toit, and that experience is is
unmatched. So unless you feel avery strong calling to it,
something that it doesn't seemforced. You know, it's a natural
calling until that comes, Iwould say, not the best idea to

(50:45):
come to yoga, simply because thedemands of this profession are
huge. So it is a very energyintensive profession. You know,
on a day to day basis, when weare teaching our students, there
is a there is a massive energyexchange that happens, right?
And the more invested you are inyour students growth and in

(51:08):
their health and fitness, themore energy you're putting into
the job. And you'll realize thatyou may sometimes not have
adequate time for your ownhealth goals, your fitness, and
there's a lot of other thingsyou will have to adjust in your
day to day life. Also, it takestime and patience to build a

(51:34):
community of students thatunderstand your style of
teaching, that resonate with youas a person, and you need to be
very, very mature when you'redealing with different kinds of
people from differentbackgrounds. You need to have an
inherent sense of being open tomeeting new people, whether it's

(51:54):
in a digital environment likezoom or whether it's in person,
and if you're somebody who's notvery comfortable with
interacting with people, thenthis profession becomes very
difficult, because people are atthe core of it. And if you're in
it, to make a difference topeople's lives, you have to be

(52:17):
open to meeting people from allkinds of backgrounds with all
kinds of medical histories,personal histories, you know? So
yes, you need to be, yeah, youneed to be prepared for all of
that. It's not, it's not a gigwhere you can sit behind a
computer and do some coding ormake a few presentations, and

(52:41):
that's the end of it. It's avery hands on job. It's a very
hands on job. And by hands on, Iobviously don't mean hands on in
terms of assists. I mean, I meanhands on in terms of, you've got
to really get into the nittygritty of teaching. You've got

(53:02):
to understand how to deal withpeople, how to understand
everyone's unique anatomy, howto structure a class in a way
that everyone feels inclusive.
You need to understand yourniche. So over the last three
years, I've I've kind ofunderstood that my niche leans
towards strength and endurance,more than you know, a slower Yin
based class. I realized that myniche lies in strength and

(53:27):
endurance, and I try and make myclasses very relevant and
engaging. So all of thisrequires a certain level of
preparedness. So if you notprepared to do all of this, and
of course, if you're notprepared for the wild
fluctuations in revenue that canhappen from month to month,
because this is not a gig that'sgoing to guarantee a fixed

(53:48):
revenue every month, yourrevenue will go up and down
depending on, you know, thenumber of students you're
serving, the kind of studio thatyou're Working with, if at all,
or if you're freelancing, thenature of your freelancing gigs,
so if you're prepared for all ofthat, then make the switch
otherwise, and go to your job,do your job the best you can,

(54:11):
and then wait when the daycomes, those of us starting out
new I Think similar advice wouldhold true, but the one thing I
would really want to tell thenew folks to yoga is just teach
as much as you can. Yeah, justteach. You know, there is so

(54:32):
much you can learn from teachingthat books will not tell you,
Okay, you can you can read allthe books you want, you can
watch all the YouTube videos youwant. But nothing replicates the
experience of teaching. Believeme, I've learned so much about,
say, for instance, doing asimple a cat, cow, a. A posture

(54:57):
in the class, you know, a catcow demonstration. I've had
several instances where peoplehave, you know, have been unable
to do it because of certainanatomical limitations, people
of different age groups, peopleof different medical conditions,

(55:18):
and I've had to modify on thespot for people, okay? And that
learning you will not get frombooks, and you may perhaps not
even get from your own teachers.
Great. It's just something youhave to go out there and do if
you want to teach, if you wantto become a teacher, you have to
teach as much as you can. Youknow, that's the only thing I

(55:41):
would tell people who arestarting out in this field new
they just go ahead and teach nomatter what the teaching gig is,
even if there is only one personin the class, make those 60
minutes or 90 minutes count forthat one person? Yes, yes. Okay,
never, ever think about thenumber of people in a class. I

(56:01):
know it feels a little upsettingwhen you know the room is large,
but you have only one student toteach. I know it can be
upsetting at times, especiallyfor the newcomers, but think
about it this way, that oneperson has walked into that
space or has come into your zoomclass, keeping aside all of his

(56:24):
or her other commitments thatperson's chosen to dedicate
those 60 minutes to you. So it'syour responsibility to make sure
that that person has the best 16minutes, and that that person
walks out feeling amazing after60 minutes. I mean, even if you
put that person through avigorous like a Vinyasa sequence

(56:46):
or a power sequence, it doesn'tmatter. At the end of the 60
minutes, the person should feellike, you know what this is, the
60 or 90 minutes was worth it.
So that's your responsibility asa teacher, is what I would say.
I think you hit the nail on thehead there. Sons, yeah, I really
do, yeah, yeah. It's soimportant. I noticed it's so
classic, like you said, with thelarge group versus the one, and

(57:08):
even the elements say the catcow. I think, personally, why I
love teaching so much is, like,you just think, like, this is
gonna be really easy. I'm justgonna show somebody how to do a
cat cow. And you look over andthey're not able to do it. And
then there's maybe that firstlittle bit of like, well, wait,
how come they can't do it? Butthen you actually, well, how can
I figure out a way to get themto connect, to actually be able

(57:29):
to do what I'm saying? And thencan I see the nuances of the
maybe, if they can't really movetheir spine, but I can just try
to get them to lift their head alittle bit and then redirect
what words I'm using to try toconvey that is so much fun. It
is so much fun. I mean, itreally is. It is so enjoyable.
And I mean those little sparksthat happen in that moment. I

(57:53):
mean, that's why, like, Isometimes look at my schedule,
it'll be busy, and I'll go, ohboy, this is gonna be a big day,
but soon as I start in themorning, and then it goes by so
fast because, like, you'reinteracting with people, it is
so much fun. Yeah, and I reallylike that you're bringing I love
everything. I really thank youso much, Sandhya. I love your

(58:14):
perspective. You're doing anincredible job, and really well
thought out. I have to really,also, I want to compliment your
English is amazing. I lovelistening to you. You have a
very you sound great. How manylanguages do you speak? Because
that's one thing I love aboutIndia, is I'm so fascinated.
When I've been in India, theamount of languages the people I
meet, and the amount oflanguages that people engage

(58:36):
with is to me, baffling. And Ijust, I just love that aspect of
of your country and culture. Howmany other languages?
Yeah, I can speak a total offour languages. Wow, Hindi,
English and Marathi. Wow. Figuremy way out in the southern part

(58:57):
of the country, the westernpart, most of the North and the
eastern parts so incredible. I'mgood to go in most parts of the
country because of the languagesthat I speak.
Yeah, yeah, amazing. Well, Imean another thing I know, we're
really close on our time here,we're coming really close to our
hour. I guess, instead of takingyou down a whole nother track,

(59:21):
let's move in the direction ofof concluding our conversation,
yeah, because I feel like, if Iask you another question, we're
gonna it's gonna keep going fora two hour podcast, which
I want to do, long winded. No,don't apologize. Sandhya, it's a
perfect it's so great. Um, youknow, I guess a topic of

(59:41):
conversation that here, I justsaid I wasn't gonna do this, but
I have to a topic ofconversation here is, I guess, I
don't know that a lot of peoplehere in the West really honor
and acknowledge the birth. Placeof yoga. And so I have a lot of
respect for the lineage in like,the amount of years that we

(01:00:05):
like. I sometimes always thinkto myself, like, how in the
world am I involved in yoga? Andthen I have this appreciation
for this tradition that's atleast going back 5000 years,
very likely, but quite possiblyeven much longer than that, and
here somehow today, like, howdid that continue all the way

(01:00:25):
along? And I and then peoplesometimes come here and say, Oh,
yoga is going out of fashion.
Now it's Pilates. Now it's hit,you know, hit classes or this or
that. And I always think tomyself, yoga is never going to
go away. Because if yoga is herenow and it lasted this long.
It's definitely it's got such asolid bedrock that no matter

(01:00:46):
what weather comes, no matterwhat difficult situations we
face, pandemics, wars, yoga isgoing to continue to endure. I
really believe this can can youspeak, though, or and maybe in
closing, just share your ownpersonal like appreciation for
this history.

(01:01:09):
Well, you know, you're right.
Yoga is never going to, quote,unquote, go out of fashion, but
it depends on how you look atyoga, okay? And like I mentioned
in the earlier parts of theconversation, as long as the
perspective about yoga is, youknow, kept to more than asanas,

(01:01:33):
as long as we're able toapproach yoga as a way of life.
It's never going to go out offashion, because the way people
perceive yoga today, they onlyperceive it in the in the light
of asanas. And like I mentioned,asanas are very limiting. You

(01:01:55):
know, they're just a drop in theocean, and it's a complex world,
and there's always room to andthere's always a risk of making
people feel excluded becausethey're not able to do asanas.
And I suspect that thepopularity of other forms of
physical exercise is alsobecause a lot of people started

(01:02:17):
to feel excluded because theywere not able to perform some of
these complex postures, youknow, with very questionable
functional benefits, if you askme. And so I feel like a lot of
them did want to move theirbodies. Did want to feel like,
you know, there was scope toexplore the limits of their

(01:02:39):
physical capabilities, but theyfelt like yoga was was perhaps
very hard for them to reach. Sothey had to perhaps go or invent
or devise other forms ofmovement which borrowed from
yoga, a little bit borrowed fromthe gym world, a little bit from
other disciplines, a little bit,and it's okay, as long as people

(01:03:01):
find joy in movement, you know,as long as people find joy in
doing what they're doing, thefoundation, then always goes
back to yoga. And I'll give youa very and I'll close with a
very interesting perspective onthis. Okay, it might seem

(01:03:25):
controversial, but here's whatit is. Now, I enjoy weight
lifting quite a lot. Okay, Idiscovered weight lifting about
two years ago, and I had a bunchof great coaches who taught me
how to lift weights correctlyand safely without putting
myself at any risk of injury,and I have grown to fall in love

(01:03:46):
with it all right? And does thatmake me a bad yogi? I doubt it.
Why? Because let's take theexample of a dead lift. You
know, a movement where you'veloaded some pretty heavy weights
onto a barbell, and you've gotto execute a movement where

(01:04:08):
you're lifting that bubble upwith some pretty heavy weights
on both sides. Now, when Iexecute that movement, I am
completely aware of each andevery part of my body. I am
completely in focus. I can'thear anything around me. I can't

(01:04:28):
see anything around me. I'm in astate of absolute concentration
when I'm executing thatmovement. So in a sense, I'm in
a state of perfect Dhyana whenI'm in that movement, right when
I'm executing it, and I'm incomplete connection with my
body. So yoga I'm in I'm incomplete yoga with my body. I'm

(01:04:51):
in complete union with mymuscles, my my form, my
technique. Everything is onpoint. Is all coming together.
And then when I do execute thatlift, and it happens well, for
me, okay, I end up feeling abrief moment of joy, okay,
which, which is almostmeditative, of sorts, and then I

(01:05:14):
release the bubble, or I drop iton the floor. So isn't that a
way of approaching movement, butfrom a yogic lens, it's a way of
approaching anything andeverything that you do in day to
day life, keeping the principlesof yoga intact, and as long as
you're able to do that, Yogawill never go out of fashion. It

(01:05:36):
is not just about the asana, itis not just about the belts and
the blocks and the leggings andthe sports. Those things will
come and go, and it's important.
You've got to commercializecertain aspects of things,
because it benefits a lot ofpeople. But at the core of it,

(01:05:58):
if you look at yoga as a way toconnect with yourself, to truly
understand your true nature, tobecome aware of who you are,
what your shortcomings are, whatyour strengths are. How do you
self regulate? Okay, how do youapproach moments of good,
moments of bad? How are you ableto maintain calmness in the face

(01:06:22):
of chaos. How are you able tomaintain a sense of balance in
your life, as long as youapproach every single thing you
do in life with this lens? Thislens is yoga, yes, and I'd like
to close with that.
Thank you so much. Sandhya, Ilove it. Great job. I really
appreciate your insights, and Iso thankful for you to share

(01:06:47):
your love and passion for yogawith us. I think it's
inspirational, motivational fromthe realm of being able to make
a living as a yoga teacher, aswell as like, really falling in
love with yoga and the passionfor sharing it with others is
really inspirational. So thishas been a true treat. And thank
you for joining me from theother side of the world. You

(01:07:08):
know, I keep having thisthought, like, I I'm said, like,
over here in the west and overthere in India, I feel like
maybe the east and the westeventually it's not going to
really exist anymore. Like we'reall going to be kind of one.
It's going to come it'scombining. We're connecting and
combining. And it's like, so I,I'm glad we're in that part of
that, that phase, this phase of,like, the evolution of humanity,

(01:07:30):
yeah, yeah, I know. And I'm veryglad that you, you're aware of
some of the deeper aspects aboutour culture and traditions. I'm
very glad that you're able tosay some of the Sanskrit names
of asanas. So, so well. Andit's, it's very humbling to see
that, you know, our culture andtradition is getting the kind of

(01:07:51):
respect and love that itdeserves from across the world.
And you know, I would be veryhappy to meet you if you're in
India. Thank you. Soon, I wouldbe very happy to, you know, show
you around. I would be happy tointroduce you to some of the the
amazing food that we have, theamazing music that we have, all

(01:08:12):
of that. So next time India do,let me know. I'd be very happy
to, oh, that'sso good. Kind of you. Thank you.
Sanja, I love India. I have beento Bangalore. And last time we
went to India, my wife and myson, we went to Goa and spent a
month and but I would love tocome back to Bangalore or South
India, and have a tour guide whoand take us to the best places

(01:08:35):
to eat and oh my gosh, and havea and have a translator who can
explain to me everything that'sgoing on. Oh my gosh. Well,
thank you. Well, what a treat.
Thank you Sandhya. I can't waitto come to come visit you. I
really appreciate it.
Thank you. Thank you Todd forthis lovely conversation. I

(01:08:56):
really enjoyed the time spenthere. I wish we had time to
speak more. And you know, I'msharing my perspectives as
someone who's just entered thefield, and I'm sure my
perspectives will change over aperiod of time, but as long as
the foundation is clear and thethe reason for existence is

(01:09:17):
clear, I think it's all good togo, but I'm really, really glad
you reached out to me. I'mreally glad we had this
conversation. Really appreciateit. Thank you. All right. Have a
great day ahead. You too. Yeah.

(01:09:41):
Native yoga Todd cast isproduced by myself. The theme
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(01:10:02):
or topics, please send us yourthoughts to info at Native yoga
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