AI and the Neurodivergent Brain: A Game-Changer for Focus and Productivity - Craig Smith - Neurodivergent Mates

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to NeuroDivergent Mates.
Hello and welcome to anotherepisode of Neurodivergent Mates.

(00:25):
I'm your host, will Wheeler,and today I'm joined with my
good friend Craig Smith.
Craig, what's going on, myfriend?

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yeah, it's great to be here, Will.
Thanks for having me on.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
No, no problem.
No problem Now for everyonewho's listening.
Today, what we're going to becovering is AI and the
neurodivergent brain, a gamechanger for focus and
productivity.
And you know, when I thoughtabout this, I'm like man, I got
to get Craig Smith on here.
He is killing it with all thisstuff and I really enjoy what

(00:56):
you're talking about all that.
But look, before we do get intothat, I might just do a little
bit of housekeeping for anyonewho might be new to the podcast
or that.
Now, if you haven't already doneso, please subscribe, like and
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(01:19):
Whatever you do.
Wherever you listen to yourpodcast, please check us out.
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Like it, comment whatever youcan do to help with our
algorithm.
It really does help.
Now, another big shout out toNeurodiversity Academy.
Please go toneurodiversityacademycom, check

(01:39):
out all the work that we'redoing.
There Got some really coolstuff coming out in the next
couple of months, so please goand check out what we're doing.
There Got some really coolstuff coming out in the next
couple of months, so please goand check out what we're doing
there.
It would really help.
Now also, too, you know, I'mnot sure if some of the
discussions will be triggeringtoday they could be but if you
do need help, please reach outto a loved one or call emergency

(02:00):
services.
We're not doctors.
This is a space for sharingexperiences and strategies.
Craig, you're not a doctor, areyou, mate?
I'm not a doctor.
Okay, good, okay, at least Igot it, because I've had people
on before who are doctors.
So it's like, well, actually,this person is a doctor.
But also, too, if you've gotsome questions and you're

(02:20):
listening to this live, pleaseput them into the chat in
whatever platform you'relistening to.
It's always great when we'vegot people listening back and
interacting with the podcast andgoing with that there.
But, craig, you ready to rockand roll, my friend?
Yeah, let's do it Will, niceman.
Now, look, I'll start with thenormal one.

(02:43):
Look, tell us a little bitabout yourself, and I think you
know before we jumped on you'reinto music, correct?

Speaker 2 (02:52):
Well, I am.
I love my music and actuallythat's what I was going to do
before anything else with mycareer.
I used to be a pipe organistback in the day.
So I used to play a pipe organhere in Newcastle at the
Conservatorium and I thought I'mgoing to be an organist, but
the economic climate fororganists was not great, so I

(03:15):
thought what can I do Instead?
I might try music teaching andthen I got into.
Yeah, I'm a school teacher nowby trade.
I've been teaching for 20 yearsand I've spent most of that
time in neurodivergent education, so I've taught in schools for
autistic students for thatentire time.

(03:36):
These days I work for a projectcalled Positive Partnerships.
We're a federally fundedproject who run uh workshops,
free workshops for families, foreducators, and the focus is on,
I guess, that home schoolpartnership to to support or to
support autistic students andneurodivergent students at

(03:58):
school.
So that's uh, that's what I doduring during the yeah, cool,
cool, cool.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, man, what a jump from going from an.
Did you say an organist Is?

Speaker 2 (04:11):
that it, yeah, yeah, the big pipe organ.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
So you've got your Like, what you see in a church,
exactly.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
Oh, really, my first ever job like was playing at
weddings when I was in year fiveat school, so I was about 10,
and I'd play the organ in alittle church for weddings and
they'd give me an envelope witha with a 20 bucks in it and then
, um, wow, moved on to meplaying big organs.

(04:41):
I guess over time, over timeand yeah.
So I've always loved that, andjust music in general.
So yeah, that's where I started, yeah, cool.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
And then teaching.
So you know, how did you getinto teaching from that?
Out of curiosity, were youalways like curious?
Like man, I want to be ateacher.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
I think I wanted to.
I thought it might be good toteach music.
You know, I thought this mightbe cool and I looked at high
school music teaching and then II don't know I tried a few
different things with teaching,but the real spark for me was
when I got an opportunity toteach in a more like a special

(05:23):
needs sort of environment, whichat the time was like a special
school for children withphysical needs and like a lot of
different kids in one school,and I just sort of thought to
myself hang on, this is supercool because like I'm actually
teaching functional ways to liveand ways to do things and ways

(05:44):
to communicate and ways to liveand ways to do things and ways
to communicate and ways to beindependent, and that to me felt
much more exciting thanprobably just pure academics I
was teaching that maybe was abit more real, so that really
spoke to me and I always wantedto stay in part of inclusive
education and diverse education.

(06:04):
So that's sort of the path Itook.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah, so did you ever find with some of your pupils?
Maybe you know, especiallysince you were working in a
special school and all of that,you know, communication might
have been difficult for some ofthese people, but when they were
playing music was it like theywere able to communicate in that

(06:29):
type of way?

Speaker 2 (06:30):
Oh, absolutely.
And like, some of my bestmemories from the early days
were students who loved music asmuch as I did, you know, and
really connected with it, and itwas my first taste of how
strengths-based teaching canreally be such a positive force
for kids.
You know, like, if you're like,okay, this kid is really good at

(06:53):
music, they love music, so howare we going to utilize that as
part of their, their schooljourney, you know, and and uh,
so I I had some reallytremendous experiences with that
and with kids who were reallycommitted to doing that with me,
and some of those kids now havegone on to get careers in music

(07:15):
and I think, like how nice itis to think they had the
opportunity as a kid that,rather than the teacher saying,
leave your music at home, youknow we're here to do a spelling
, yeah, something else.
Instead we were always like,bring more of it in, like, bring
in, bring in your records andbring in your instruments and

(07:37):
let's make that part of it, andI think that's nice, like that's
again, that's something thatfelt to me a really nice way of
teaching to be able to say yesto what kids liked doing rather
than saying no.

Speaker 1 (07:51):
This is a place of very particular learning you
know, yeah, yeah, no, no, thatwould have been a really great
experience.
I think it would have beenmind-blowing as well, because
you probably and and you know,society probably rides off some
of these people.
I know I was written off a lotof the time like look, will's
never going to be able to dothis or that or whatever, like

(08:12):
that.
But then once you get them intoa room and I don't know if
they're playing instruments orwhatever, and you're like what
Like this?
next level that would have justlike I'm assuming goosebumps
would have been going down yourbody, man oh, absolutely, and I
think it.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
I think too it really led me to.
I mean, I've always likemusic's been one.
We've always made movies.
Any class I've taught, we'vemade a big movie.
Um, so you teach kidsfilmmaking skills and all of the
good stuff.
It was often like sort of techbased.
So I've always been interestedin technology and you know when,

(08:50):
when the iPad first came out,which was when I was probably
five or six years into teaching,is when the iPad came out and
mobile technology started toreally come into its own.
That really changed things forus too, because suddenly, you
know, you didn't just have tosay let's go to the computer lab
and sit down and learn how towrite a song on the computer.

(09:12):
It's like let's take this ipadoutside and record the birds and
then let's sample that and turnthat into some sort of beat,
and it was like that is coolsomeone else has the ipad and
they're filming a film clip andit's like we can start to do
some really cool stuff.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
So that is cool, yeah , yeah, and like that wouldn't.
Like.
It sort of brings back memoriesfrom school not having that and
going to the computer lab andum, you know, I think, and even
when I, if I remember, back toprimary school, I remember it'd
be like, okay, such and such andsuch and such, you're next on

(09:52):
the computer.
So you would then have to taketurns going on this huge box and
yeah, man, but yeah, it wouldbe so.
And you know what, right, likeI often think about this, like
if I was back in school now, andprobably at a really good
school, I'd admit that theschool I was at wasn't very

(10:14):
supportive in regards tounderstanding who like my
struggles.
I'd hate to think where I couldpotentially have ended up.

Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, yeah it does.
It makes you wonder.
I mean, you know like I had avery different sort of school
experience, I'm sure, but Istill think like I loved a lot
of things that I would haveloved teachers to have been more
embracing of, and to think,come on, let's see where you can
take this, Craig.
Instead, it was stuff that youhad to learn yourself, you know,

(10:45):
in the few minutes of sparetime you had during the day or
the night, and you tinker withstuff.
But you know, you just, yeah,you do.
I mean that's the hope for thefuture is that we crack the code
of like getting schools to bestrengths-based and
interest-based and let kidsflourish instead of saying leave
it at home?

Speaker 1 (11:05):
Yeah, totally, and I think, look, I think we're
starting to see schools poppingup like that, like really unique
.
I've been speaking to a fewpeople recently, but I think
that flows well into you know.
This next question Tell us alittle bit about the work that
you're doing.
You know, I think you knowwe're definitely here to speak

(11:25):
about the new technology comingout and I think, like you were
saying before, we're at with AI.
It is at the worst pointpossible right now and it's
still pretty kick-ass, you know.
So please share us a little bitabout that.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
No, I think that phrase is really.
It always blows my mind thisidea that the AI that we've got
today is the worst version ofthe software that's probably
ever going to exist, becauseit's just going to get better.
And yet, like you said, youjust think about what we've got
now and you're like but this isinsanely interesting and can do

(12:06):
all these things.
So that's its own sort ofjourney, I guess, thinking about
where that stuff can go.
But yeah, will, I guess.
Even going back to what we weresaying about iPads in schools,
I started to then think backthen, like how can this
technology support everydayliving, you know?
Like what can it do to make alldifferent parts of life a bit

(12:29):
easier?
And it's hard to sometimesthrow your mind back like 10, 15
years where we didn't all havea smartphone in our pocket, you
know, and you didn't all haveyour Google drives, your
calendars all synced up andstuff, like we were all that
wasn't part of our daily life.

Speaker 1 (12:49):
It was like we were winging it.

Speaker 2 (12:51):
We were.
We were winging it right.
We were, that's right, and youknow you go to the shops and you
take a to-do list of yourshopping list and you've got
maybe a calendar book with phonenumbers to ring and like all
stuff.
That now just feels soprehistoric, but 10-15 years ago
that was pretty standard.

(13:12):
But when smartphones came outand you started to be able to
set reminders and you started tobe able to have notes full of
shopping lists and yourcalendars were there, it felt to
me like that stuff was also thesort of stuff that I used to
try to teach my students inschool how to do Like let's use
different apps to you know, toput together a visual timetable

(13:37):
of what we're going to do forthe day.
You know, and we'll puttogether a timetable, a shopping
list.
It felt to me like all thosedigital tools started to come
together in a way that was verynatural and that you could just
everyone was starting to useshopping lists and to-do lists,
and that in really natural ways.
Anyway, I feel like that, then,has led into what I'm

(14:01):
interested about with AI, whichis like all right, we all know
you can barely go on LinkedInand refresh the page and not see
something about AI.
At the moment, you know, ai isgoing to erase all university
courses because students arejust going to cheat or lecturers

(14:21):
are going to be virtual, orlike it's just all.
It's either like reallyoptimistic or really scary.
I'm sort of like I don't evenwant to be part of that
conversation.
No, me neither.
My interest in AI is about whatcan we do to help improve our
lives every day.

(14:41):
You know, like particularlyexecutive functioning stuff and
the work I've done withcolleagues and friends who are
neurodivergent to say, well,what's the impact Like what's
the lived experience.
So the main thing that I'vereally been interested in
probably has been like walkingand talking with AI, because

(15:06):
that's, I walk and talk with AIevery single day.
I get up in the morning, I putmy dog on his leash and I put my
headphones on and for an hourI'll load up chat, gpt, I'll do
the voice mode and I'll just saygood morning, I've got a whole

(15:26):
bunch of things in my head thatI want to just put out there and
AI listens to it all and then Isay help me organise my day,
let's plan things, let's braindump and let's sort stuff out,
and by the time I've done myhours walk and come back home
I'm like, all right, I'm set sothat to me that sort of thing is

(15:47):
really interesting to thinkabout.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
Because could I ask like do you have problems like?
They've got so many thingsgoing on up there?
Is it?
Do you find like because whenyou can't get that out or get it
onto something or somethinglike that, that causes it onto
something or something like thatthat causes, like, maybe,
anxiety or something like it hasin the past?

Speaker 2 (16:09):
oh for sure, I, I absolutely like I.
I mean I.
I wake up and know that I'vegot a whole bunch of things.
I didn't finish the previousday, you know, and so you think
you go to sleep, you wake, wakeup and I'm optimistic about the
day, but I've still got a lot ofthings from yesterday that

(16:30):
suddenly start to flood back inand then things that I know I've
got to do across the day tocome, plus just emotions and
thoughts and like memories andstuff that bubble away.
And I think you either tellsomeone in your life about this,
but it's a pretty heavy load toput onto someone to say can I

(16:53):
just tell you everything that'sin my head for the next 30
minutes?
Like that's so.
And some people journal, youknow, and some people have other
ways of getting it out of theirhead.
I've always loved writing.
I love to write and that's areally big source of interest.
But when I get up in themorning I just want to go for a
walk, and now that I can talkaloud and have a conversation

(17:19):
with an AI chat companion whoover time now has gotten to know
me very well because it's got amemory bank of previous
conversations we've had.
So it's not like groundhog day.
You know where I'm waking up andit's like it's all the same
like yeah, it's like, but it's,it's, it's like oh, craig, of

(17:39):
course you were working on thisproject the other day and how
did that, uh, how did that nightout go with your mate the other
night?
It remembers and it talks aboutit and it's like this is really
useful for me, you know, and Ithink it's good that it would
get.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
It would suck if it started getting to a point where
it's like, oh, come on, man,can you at least give me a break
?
You know, tell you the truth.
It would probably be funny ifit did that.
Do you know what I mean?
Because you'd be like, oh myGod, what's going on?

Speaker 2 (18:11):
It would be more natural, for sure, but for me it
feels like and actually it'sinteresting, will, I was
chatting to someone the otherday who's autistic and has ADHD
and they were talking about howsocially drained they get when
they have to talk to people andthey mask a lot and they're just

(18:33):
like their social batteries runout very quickly when they're
having to have a chat withsomeone at work or at the
supermarket.
But they talk to AI as well,like I do every day, and they
were like I don't get drainedwhen I talk to ai as well, like
I do every day.
And they were like I don't getdrained when I talk to ai
because I'm not worrying thatI'm boring it, I'm not worrying

(18:54):
that have I been talking toolong about something that I
really love and the otherperson's just being polite and
it's kind of like.
It's almost like talking to apet, you know, like if you've
got a dog or a cat and you'rejust chatting away, it's like
that doesn't drain your socialbatteries because they're just,

(19:15):
they just like everything you'redoing.
So it's like ai is that easycompanion that I mean?
I'm saying companion, itdoesn't.
It can be whatever you want itto be.
For me it's almost like apersonal assistant that puts my
to-do list in order and thatkind of thing.
But I think it's for lots of usit's just a very low pressure

(19:40):
dialogue that it's alwayspositive.
It doesn't get bored.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
And I think as well that, like it would be when
you're interacting with it, it'sprobably one less thing you
have to worry about.
And when I mean one less thingand I'm not autistic, but I know
for myself, let's say, beingdyslexic and reading, right I'm
having to focus, I'm having totake in what that information is

(20:08):
.
I'm trying to make sure thatI'm staying in within the lines.
Does this?
There's a lot of things goingon in my head which sort of
clouds me from taking in theinformation I'm reading.
So it's just like words at theend of the day, right.
But then if, then, if I'm using, say, text-to-speech type of
thing, right, I don't have toworry about that.

(20:30):
I can sit back, I can takeinformation and it's one less
thing that my mind has to do andI'm not feeling so exhausted by
it.
I'm assuming maybe it'ssomething similar, because
you're able to just brain dumpand you're not having to worry
about all this other stuff goingon.

Speaker 2 (20:50):
I think that's a great example, will it is?
It takes away some of thatanxiety and some of that worry
about am I, yeah, is somethinggoing on here that shouldn't be
going on or that I should bemore self-conscious about?
I think it takes that away.
But even to your point abouttext to speech and that kind of
thing, like I've even becauseI'm the same, like I mean I love

(21:12):
to read, but I'll still, youknow, when you're tired or when
you've got something new that'sbeen given to you, like a
research report or somethingthat has been sent, and I'll
look at it and read the firstpage and then I'll have learned
nothing.
So I read it again and thenI'll like read it four times and
I'm like I still don't know,because my mind keeps wandering,

(21:34):
you know what I do now.
I'll get again like chat GPTwith the voice mode.
You can have a feature nowwhere you turn on the camera and
it can see whatever you show.
The camera, you know, so youcan show it anything in the
world.
But I I can say, hey, I've beenreading this page for 10

(21:55):
minutes and I still don't getwhat it's about I'm going to
show you.
Can you give me a summary ofwhat it is that I'm meant to
know here?
And through the camera it seesthe text, it reads it instantly
and it'll say, oh yeah, this isabout.
You know A, b and C.
It tells you what it's aboutand I'm like, oh yeah, okay,
that makes sense.

(22:15):
Now I can keep reading.
But knowing that I've got thispersonal assistant who I can
pull out any time and say Idon't get any of this, can you
help explain to me what's goingon?
That takes away a level ofanxiety for me of thinking how
long am I going to have to sitand read this thing for because

(22:35):
I don't get it Like it's nice toknow you've got support there
at any time of the day or night.

Speaker 1 (22:41):
And you know what else.
What I find is that let's say,for example, let's say we're in
the workplace, for example,right, you know, sometimes
someone would show me somethingand I'm like man, I do not get
that.
Or I'm like man, I do not getthat.
Or I'm like I've got to go askthem for like the fifth time.
Sorry, I need you to show methis again.
When I've got these tools thatI'm able to utilise, right, I'm

(23:08):
able to go.
I feel more independent becauseI'm not having to rely, and I'm
like okay, great, I'm on track,I can do this now.
Like, for example, I had afriend of mine who's autistic
and like, he sent me this hugeemail because he's just trying
to like get out what's in hishead and all of that and it was
huge, right, like my businesspartner read it and he goes man,

(23:28):
that was a long email.
And I said, look, don't stress.
And I just put it straight intoChatGPT.
I said, look, can you breakthis down so it's easier to read
for me?
Easy done.
And I'm like easy.
And I said to my friend whosent it I said, man, that was a
long email.
He goes oh, I'm so sorry.

(23:49):
I said no, don't.
I said keep doing that becausethat's what works for you.
You get everything out and thenI'll just use the stuff on my
end to um to work with it.

Speaker 2 (24:01):
So don't stress at all yeah, yeah, and that's a
really good point, will it?
Lets people work how they wantto work.
You're not restricting them.
You know, with the email thatthey're sending you, you know
you've got tools to personalizeit to what you need for access
and then you can I.
I do the same, like I.
I was only using it.

(24:21):
Um, earlier this afternoon I waspretty tired and I'm looking at
this email that's come throughand someone had like all these
things they wanted me to do, youknow, and there's like five
different parts to it and I justcouldn't quite work out exactly
.
What they were asking of me waslike if it had been nine, nine
o'clock in the morning, Iprobably would have got it, but

(24:42):
at 330 in the afternoon I'm justlike what do you want?
So I put it in chat, gpt, andsaid I've been sent this email.
I don't really know what I'mmeant to do.
Can you explain it to me?
And instantly it's like yeah,you need to do this, this and
this.
I'm like, oh well, that's fine,you know I can do that, and
that was again.
I don't have to ring someone,go to someone and say, you know,

(25:05):
for the seventh time thisafternoon I don't know what to
do.
It makes you be moreindependent.

Speaker 1 (25:10):
It's good it, does it , does it, does it, does, um.
So we've got cindy, who's justactually connected with me today
.
Uh, thank you so much, uh,cindy, for coming out.
It was actually interestingbecause she messaged me and
she's like, oh my god, ai haschanged my life.
I said, man, you should checkout this.
I should, you should check outthe podcast we're doing today.

(25:30):
And, um, you know, great forproblem solving.
Yeah, totally, I love it.
It's.
It's honestly changed my life.
But look, you know, moving onfrom that, like, how do
neurodivergent individuals useai to support executive
functioning challenges likeorganization, time management
and focus?
Now, before we do get into thatand I don't know if this is

(25:54):
right or not, because I was onlylistening I was listening to
this autistic guy talking aboutAI and he's right into it
something.

(26:14):
But what you can do, and maybeyou wear headphones or something
I don't know where you've gotlike an earpiece in or something
, but apparently, like you cango into, say, like a room where
there's a lot of sensoryoverload type of stuff, and the
ai can actually like I don'tknow if it deadens the stuff or
something like that.
So it's, it's, or so I have noidea.
Does that sound familiar to?

Speaker 2 (26:36):
you gosh, you've got me thinking uh, do you know it?
It doesn't.
At the moment I can't think ofwhat that would be, but it does
sound like it would be some sortof almost I should connect you
with you, this guy I'll try I'llconnect you with him.
Yeah, you might have a good chatyeah, I'd like to learn more
because that, like I'vedefinitely seen stuff in the
past where it's headphone-basedit tries to get a sense of the

(26:59):
room, you know what's thesensory environment, what's the
size, and it tries to like,adjust noise cancelling stuff to
you know, make it a bit smarterwith its filtering than just on
or off, you know.
But, yeah, do connect me well,I'd like to learn more.

Speaker 1 (27:16):
I just thought I'll throw it to you, and if you
don't know, I don't know.
But when I heard it I was like,oh my God, that's like a life
changer, because think of howmany people, especially who are
maybe an older generation thanyou and I, who went through the
workforce not even knowingthey're autistic or even just

(27:36):
neurodivergent in themselves and, um, having to deal with all
this stuff and not realizingthat this was the case.
Now, um, they understand it alot better.

Speaker 2 (27:48):
And there's all this technology they're able to
utilize as well I mean, I I'mlike, without getting too
science fiction about it, allthat stuff to me is going to be
super fascinating to watch overthe next five to ten years,
because I was really interestedin augmented reality, like when
it started to come in to playGoogle Glasses were a tool.

(28:12):
Did you remember Google Glasses?
Well, they were.
Well.
I don't know if I rememberGoogle Glasses were a tool.
Did you remember Google?

Speaker 1 (28:14):
Glasses?
Well they were.
Oh well, I don't know if Iremember Google Glasses, but
didn't Meta bring out glasses orthe Ray-Bans I've got some now,
that's right.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
the Ray-Bans, and really they started with.
Google about 12, 13 years agohad this experimental reading
glasses and it had a littlething, a little screen in the
corner that would project ontoyour eye and you could look
around you, but it would overlaythings onto your eyes, you know

(28:44):
.
So you might say how do I getto the local McDonald's?
And it would like show youarrows in front of your eyes.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
Oh, really oh my God.
Yeah, because some peoplestruggle to follow maps on
Google Maps.
So if they had that, it wouldbe like oh yeah, I just seem to
go that way and I know Isometimes do.
I'm like, am I going the rightway?
And then I'm trying to look atlike certain shapes of buildings

(29:14):
.
Oh my God.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
So that stuff is super interesting when you think
about the potential of AI inthat space because, like you
were saying about you know,maybe sound cancelling or
sensory regulation based on youknow, knowing the environment.
But what if it could?
Also, if you were like in asocial situation and you were

(29:36):
like I don't quite know what'shappening here, what's the tone,
what are people's faces doing,and whether that augmented
reality could be like hey,there's an 80% chance that
person's pretty cranky, like,just to give you a bit of a.
I don't know like it sounds likefiction, but I can see that
stuff happening.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
It could be yeah, yeah interesting.
So maybe from what we're justthought, how do NeuroDay
individuals use AI to supportexecutive function?
So you've sort of touched baseon a little bit of this,
wouldn't you say?

Speaker 2 (30:08):
Yeah, I think for me, like and I sometimes use the
example with executivefunctioning like know, I mean, I
know people probably know whoare tuning into a podcast, but
it's almost to me it's theadministration team in the brain
that just organizes and plans.
And I say like it doesn'tmatter how brilliant other

(30:29):
departments of your business are, like you might be great at
music, you might be great atmaths, but if the admin team is
not keeping things coordinated,like, that's where things start
to fall down.
And so for me I'm always likewell, where can AI support that
administration team?
So it is things like it'splanning, you know, it's time

(30:50):
management.
It's the sort of stuff that Iwas saying earlier about like
taking a morning walk and justsaying I've got six things that
I know I need to get done acrossthe the day, and then saying to
ai, can you help me prioritizethese?
And like what sort of ordershould I do them in and how long

(31:10):
should each of those thingstake?
Because I might be like think,oh, I can get that done in 10
minutes and I'll get this donein five.
And then AI is like no, youneed to set aside an hour and a
half to get that done.
And maybe you should do thatwhile your mind is fresh in the
morning and then do this secondthing after morning tea and,

(31:31):
like I think and again, the morethat the systems get to know
you, they help you to know howyou work, know what you're good
at at certain times of day andhelp you prioritize, and you
know that that stuff is reallyinteresting to me.
I also I got an email will theother day from someone who, uh,

(31:52):
they, um, they're neurodivergent, they're autistic and ADHD and
they said one of their bigchallenges is procrastination.
You know like they want tostart something, they know they
want to do something but theyjust can't make themselves do it
.
So they've been saying to ai,help me role play, like help me

(32:15):
create a fantasy where I'mactually motivated to do stuff.
And so now their ai, or theirchat gpt, says to them all right
, you're a secret, like privateinvestigator, and you need to
find a secret dossier in youremail inbox.
You've got two minutes beforeit like blows up, go now.

(32:38):
And they're like all right, sothey're in private investigator
mode, find the email.
I found it.
And then AI's like good job,now you've got to.
So it turns it into a role playthat is.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
I've never heard of that and that is so like if you
could.

Speaker 2 (32:56):
That is awesome, it's playful, isn't it like it's
just and that could be good forkids too, right?
Yeah, that's, that's exactlyright and and like.
One of the first things that Ireally liked with ai and this
sort of chat gpt stuff was I'vegot a friend who's got a
daughter, who's um, who's got ad, adhd and she's just like
really finds it difficult tokeep her room tidy.

(33:17):
You know which I struggle with.
I'm sure we all have challengeswith that, but her room was
just constant chaos and itwasn't that she was like lazy,
she wasn't.
She just couldn't work out howto get her room sorted out.
So I made a little applicationwith ChatGPT called the Room

(33:38):
Tidy Organiser or whatever, theRoom Tidy Assistant, and she'd
take a photo of her room andChatGPT would say okay, I see
what we're working with here.
I'm going to help you step bystep.
So, first things, first, let'sget the clothes off the floor
and put them in the clothesbasket.
Then I want you to take anotherphoto and we'll work on the

(34:01):
next step.
So it would guide her throughbecause it would see the room
and it wasn't her parents sayingyour room's a mess, you've got
to tidy up, like she hated thatand it wasn't motivating.
But when she had this app andshe could say to the app because

(34:21):
she loved things like harrypotter, she'd be like can you
talk to me in like a characterfrom harry potter?
So it's like you know harrypotter style dialogue, telling
her how to tidy up the bedroomand she would get it done and
I'm like that's really cool, youknow.

Speaker 1 (34:35):
That is awesome, and you know what I was thinking
when you were talking about that.
I think a big thing that Iremember and I still see it
happening now is that,especially as a neurodivergent
kid growing up, you know, and myparents were awesome, but I
think they did a little bit toomuch for me, so it took me a lot

(34:58):
longer to really, I suppose, dothings on my own or feel
comfortable to do that type ofstuff.
I'm assuming this couldprobably be really good,
especially, let's say, you'vegot a senior student in high
school and then next yearthey're going to be going to
university or what, or the orthey're going man, I'm going to
go travel the world or whatever.

(35:19):
Right, um, I think it.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
That could be really great for them to, even probably
before they finish um, highschool, to really start getting
into, you know, doing certainthings like I think it's a
really critical component Willexactly what you've said of
someone in that young person'slife, an adult, a teacher,

(35:43):
having the coaching skills tosay let's look at what sort of
tech tools you want to put inyour backpack.
You know what sort of AI tools,tools, what sort of other tools
are you going to use to takeinto the future with you to help
with independence, to help dothese things?
Because I think we both knowlike there's so much, there's so

(36:05):
much noise out there,particularly with ai, and if you
are a young person in highschool, you're're probably, you
know, wondering, well, is it alljust junk or is it all just
like?
What's it going to be?
What do I use?
What do I use Exactly?
Because every other weekthere's a new, you know, latest

(36:25):
and best thing coming out.
But I think this is where somesupport for young people to say
this is how to use it, this is areally safe way of engaging
with it, and I think this couldbe really useful for you going
to a job, you know, or movingout of home, you know, and doing
stuff like that.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, because I think the biggest
thing for me, what really likechanged my life, was I broke up
with my ex-girlfriend that thatwas probably a good part as well
, but I'm actually going andtraveling overseas, so I didn't
have my parents around.
Now, don't get me wrong, Istill was struggling with a lot

(37:06):
of stuff, but I had to think onmy own two feet right, um.
But I probably could have, andthat's what really changed me.
But I probably, if I had hadthese types of tools, I probably
would have been at that level alot earlier.

Speaker 2 (37:25):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I mean, I think so too, and Iknow some people will push back
and say, oh, we're going to justraise a generation of people
who are reliant upon technology,and what if chat, jpt
disappears one day and you'vemade them reliant upon this tool
?
But for me, I find that veryhard.
I mean, I think it's alwaysimportant.

(37:47):
We, we don't always want to besuper connected to tech for
every single part of our life,but we I think we all know we do
have our phones, we have ourlaptops, we have our computers.
We don't pretend they don'texist.
We want to use them as well aswe can for the things that we
need to do.

(38:07):
Now that we've got AI, let'suse it as well to try and
maximise our capacity withoutworrying.
Well, what if it disappears?
I mean, what if everythingdisappears?
You know, like to me, I don'tthink that should stop you from
using good tools to do goodstuff.

Speaker 1 (38:25):
Well, you know what, when you think about it, if you
go right back, right, a clockwas new technology at one point.
Yeah, the wheel was technologyat one point.
The wheel was technology at onepoint.
A horse and cart was technologyat one point, and then it went
into a car, you know.
So they become everyday toolsand I don't know if that would,

(38:48):
it could disappear, who knows.
But I think you do pick up somepretty good skills anyway, you
know.

Speaker 2 (38:56):
I'd much rather think that someone you know got a lot
of benefit out of something andit guided them into new avenues
to develop different parts oftheir life, rather than saying I
don't know about this AI stuff,let's not worry, you know.
Yeah totally yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:13):
Yeah, especially when the world is evolving, and if
you go well, no, I'm not goingto use that and it was really
interesting because I see people.
I remember when I was in highschool there'd be certain people
in high school who'd be like,oh man, I'm not doing that.
And there'd be new technologyand I think about them now and
I'm like man, these peoplearen't even on like social media

(39:35):
or anything like that.
I'm like they're probably stuckin this old school way of
things where I'm like man, giveit to me, give it to me.
So I think someone let's seewhat happens.
Oh, jennifer's come through, solove listening.
What a great collab.
Oh, hang on, I'll put it up onthe screen.
Oh, hang on, I'll put it up onthe screen.

(39:55):
Also, the admin team forexecutive functioning so clever,
so awesome to see you, jennifer.
But sorry, which question werewe up to?
I think it was this one here.
Now, what are some real-worldexamples of neurodivergent
people leveraging AI tools intheir personal and professional

(40:17):
lives?
So we sort of covered a littlebit of that there, but did you
want to elaborate on that?
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
I'll give you another one, because this is from a
friend of mine who she yeah soshe's neurodivergent and she
works in Newcastle here, and shealways gives me permission to
share this example, because shewas going through a few months
where she just couldn't, likeshe couldn't get a life in a

(40:45):
good routine.
She was staying up way too lateevery night.
She'd be like up until two inthe morning on youtube, you know
, and watching stuff, and thenshe'd be exhausted the next
morning and she'd like needenergy drinks to get started and
like she was just out of sick,you know which.
I've been there too, but shewas just, and so, anyway, like

(41:05):
her partner couldn't crack thecode, he's like just go to bed
earlier.
She's like no, it's not working.
And colleagues were like youknow, can we do anything to help
?
And no one could.
So what she did?
She went to ChatJPT and shesaid I'm going to give you
everything that's in my calendarand all sort of a few emails.

(41:28):
She essentially was like I'mjust going to scoop up all the
data from my life at the moment.
I'm going to give it to you.
Can you analyze what's going onin my head, you know, and
what's going on in my day.
And so chat GPT looked at hercalendar, looked at her emails,
looked at you know, she's alwaystaking notes and stuff and read

(41:48):
all of that and said listen,here's what's going on.
You're like you've got no timeof a day to get your work done
because you've got meeting aftermeeting after meeting.
Your whole day is meetings.
You then take your work homewith you when you should be
resting.
You work, you have your dinner,you're still working, you're

(42:10):
still sending emails at 8.30 atnight and then finally you say
to yourself I'm going to relax,but then it's like 11 o'clock
and you stay up and watch amovie until two o'clock in the
morning and then you're likeit's off to the next day.
So ChatGPT was like what youneed to do is make more time
during the work day to get yourwork done at work and not bring

(42:34):
it home with you.
And it said can I help youwrite an email to some of these
colleagues who are just bookingso many meetings to say can we
push back on how many meetingswe're booking?
I need to get stuff done.
She did that, she took thatadvice and she straightened out

(43:00):
her days so she was able to gohome and relax at like 5.30, 6
o'clock and she started to sleepbetter and so she got control
of her life again and her dailyroutines through allowing chat
GPT to analyze her life, throughallowing chat jpt to analyze
her life, and I think that'sextraordinary.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
um, you know, to that she got control back and you
know that that, to me, is areally interesting example of
the personal impact of of thesetools yeah, I never really
thought about putting all myemails in there because, like
you know, especially for me, I'mrunning a business, I'm working
while running the business, I'mdoing like a podcast, all of
that, and sometimes, and then Iwill, you know, every afternoon

(43:35):
I'll go for a bike ride.
But, to tell you the truth, Iam getting a pretty good sleep
these days.
I think I'm just exhausted bythe time I do go to bed.
Um, but um, yeah, no, it wouldbe.
I would like to probably lookat it and make it even easier,
you know, because at the momentit sometimes feels like I'm just
winging it still, where Iprobably could be utilizing

(43:58):
technology a hell of a lotbetter I think some, some people
will, and I'm sure you can takethis too far, but some people
just love data about how they'regoing.

Speaker 2 (44:10):
They're like you know , my smartwatch is telling me my
heart rate, how long am Isleeping, when am I eating, what
are my blood sugars Like.
Some people want a lot of dataabout themselves and they want
to put it into AI and to have itanalysed and give them guidance
, and for some people, it'sreally useful.
I think probably it's alsohealthy to you know, know, know

(44:33):
your limits and know when youdon't need to give chat gpt
every single part of your life.
Yeah, true, true true, yeah,totally.

Speaker 1 (44:43):
So, moving on from that, are there any any AI tools
or technologies specificallydesigned with neurodivergent in
mind, or are we adapting generalAI tools to fit our needs?

Speaker 2 (45:11):
say that the mainstream tools like chat, jpts
and other software like that.
When you listen to theengineers, um, who make this
stuff, and even you know the ceoof of open ai, sam altman,
they're very open about theirneurodivergent minds themselves
and like these are themainstream tools.
So, like I remember readingonce someone was saying AI is
quite biased and not inclusiveand not sort of friendly to

(45:36):
neurodivergent minds becauseit's built on, you know, very
generic neurotypical sort ofcontent and I thought, all right
, I think there's probablyexamples of that.
But these tools, you know, andnot to stereotype the link
between like tech andneurodivergent minds, but a lot

(45:56):
of these people in these techcompanies, like I said, are very
open about their neurodivergentstatus and they are the ones
building these tools and I thinkto me that is a sign that
there's probably a lot ofresonance and a lot of links
between why ai is reallyinteresting to people with

(46:19):
neurodivergent minds, because Ithink it already is quite
inclusive of that space.
You know.
I mean there there are toolsout there.
I mean one of the first onesthat I saw was a website called
Goblin Tools and Goblin Toolswas one of the first web-based

(46:41):
like to-do list websites that Ifound that you could put a to-do
list in and then it would breakthat.
I found that you could put ato-do list in and then you and
it would break down the stepsthat you needed to take to get
those things done.
You know, so you might say onmy to-do list, I need to, I need
to to fill the car up withpetrol, and it would say, all

(47:04):
right, here's the steps involvedin that.
Step one make time to go andget your car.
Step two find a good servicestation with affordable fuel.
Step three fill up the.
So it was like an AI tool thatwas breaking things down into
chunks and that was really takenup quickly by a lot of people
in the ADHD community and theneurodivergent community who

(47:28):
were like this is AI for good,like this is AI for
neurodivergent minds.
I've got a web platform Willcalled the Universal Sandpit,
and it's a web platform.
It's all free and it's justtools that I've made using chat,

(47:48):
jpt, and the intention is tosolve, like everyday inclusive
education needs with a quick fixlike ai tool.
Um, and I started out with justa couple of tools and then
teachers would write to me andsay can you make a tool that

(48:09):
does this.
You know, can you make a toolthat takes an assignment and
scaffolds it out to all thedifferent things that kids need
to do?
And I was like, yeah, yeah,I'll build that.
And so now I've got ninedifferent tools and we're
getting, like you know, 5,000 to10,000 viewers a month who are

(48:30):
coming in and clicking on thesetools and it's like, well,
that's again, it's interesting,there's a real appetite for that
.
It seems cool.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
So what I'm just doing, I'm just putting it into
the chat here.
So if people are, you know,listening to it, I've just put
your link into your websitethere so people can go check it
out.
But if you do want to check itout, if you're listening to this
, go to theuniversalsandpitorg.

(48:58):
So O-R-G.
Okay, if you want to check thatout.
But someone did share the blindcommunity is credibly
resourceful and often comes upwith innovative solutions to
overcome challenges.

Speaker 2 (49:13):
Yeah, absolutely Cindy.
And I've got a good mate who ispart of the blind community and
has been doing some spectacularthings with AI.
I'll tell you the thing thatblew my mind because I thought
this was so interesting.
So I've got he's actually he'son LinkedIn, his name's David
Woodbridge and what David's beendoing.

(49:36):
He's got a device that isBraille, but it's like it's
essentially like, whereas aBraille book is like printed you
know with Braille that youtouch and read this device
brings up Braille in like atactile platform that is
responsive to whatever you loadinto it.

(49:58):
So you could load in a book andthe little dots come up to make
the words of the book, or youcould load in a picture and you
could feel the outline of thepicture, for example.
So it's, it's that type ofthing.
Anyway, david gets chat gpt andhe'll say, hey, I want you to
create a model of the sydneyopera house and send and make

(50:22):
this model and then send it tomy braille device and then chat
jpt draws the sydney harbourbridge, that draws the opera
house, sends it to his brailledevice and then david feels the
the sydney opera house on hisbraille.
He's like, oh, that's what itlooks like and chat.
Jpt has drawn it, rendered it,sent it to his Braille device to

(50:46):
get a sense of what it is.
So, exactly as our guest therejust said, the blind community
are doing amazing things and Ithink probably a lot of
different accessibility spacesare really going hard at
innovation here because it's sointeresting what's possible.

Speaker 1 (51:03):
Do you know what I saw the other day?
That someone or some I don'tknow who it is, probably someone
with lots of money is creatinglike.
I don't know what it is like ifit's like a contact lens or
something that will actuallyhelp blind people to see.
Yeah, right Do you know, what Imean.

(51:23):
Like that is crazy.

Speaker 2 (51:25):
Yeah, oh yeah.
That whole space, the sort ofbiotech and what they're going
to do there, it's mind-blowing.

Speaker 1 (51:33):
It's going to be so interesting to see what happens
and like from what I've seenwith some of that technology
that they're working on, thereare some blind people who
they've.
I don't know what they've done,but they've got it.
I don't know what they've done,but they've got it.
I don't know if it's somethingin the brain or something where
they're actually able to pick upshapes.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
Now you know they can't see clearly, but that's a
hell of a step from seeingnothing to seeing shapes and all
of that.

Speaker 1 (52:01):
So you know, like you said before, like with
technology, we're going aroundso fast now that it could be
Even thinking about the stuffwith Neuralink and stuff like
that where people who can't walkwill be able to walk again one

(52:23):
day.
That is crazy, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:26):
No, it's massive, yeah, yeah, yeah, no, it's
massive and it's reallyinteresting.
And, yeah, we'll have to seewhere it all goes.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
Totally, and I think that actually goes into the next
question really well, so whatare the ethical concerns or
risks around AI when it comes toneurodivergence, such as
over-reliance, privacy oraccessibility?
Now, you touched a little biton that before, but what are
your thoughts anyway?

Speaker 2 (52:52):
Yeah, yeah, no, you're right, we did talk about
it.
I think that the thing thatcomes to mind for me, probably
more than anything, is I dowonder and slightly worry about,
like, particularly people inthe neurodivergent community who
I'm thinking of, like youngpeople that I've worked with in
the past will, who might be alittle bit socially isolated and

(53:16):
might find it difficult toconnect, and they want to have
friendships, they want to get apartner, they want to be part of
that space.
Part of me worries that if they, you know, were to get so much
into ai and to create an aipartner or ai friends and
they're having a lot of thoseconversations at home that I

(53:39):
wouldn't like to think that thatreplaced the opportunity to
actually go out and do otherstuff.
You know, because I can see therabbit hole where you could fall
into.
I mean, even me.
I'm talking every day to an AIpersonal assistant.
It's amazing and I get a lot ofuse out of it.
But I've also got a reallyhealthy.

(54:01):
You know, I've got friends,I've got family, I've got
colleagues.
It's not the only person I'mtalking to.
I guess it's not even a person.
You know it's software yeah yeah, If you were chatting to
someone to that software andother chatbots all day and night
.
That makes me worry.

(54:21):
I think there should be peoplewho can coach and guide and
support young people who aremaybe at risk of falling into
that rabbit hole to say thistechnology can be super useful
and we want you to use it well.

Speaker 1 (54:35):
Just don't rely on it being your social contact for
everything yeah, no, that'sactually a really good point
because, um, and I think this isthe thing we should try and
utilise it to be more social,and I mean by be more social
with actual, real people, not AIas such and so forth there.

(54:59):
So, yeah, totally, totallyagree on that one.
But look, moving forward.
We are getting close to the endof the podcast, but what does
the future of AI andneurodiversity look like?
How can we advocate for moreinclusive AI development, do you
think?

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Yeah, I think that the more that we get you know
authentic neurodivergent voicesin this space and using the
technology, sharing examplesLike when I first started to get
interested in it, I didn't havea lot of real-world experience
or others coming forward toshare their stories, I was just

(55:37):
I thought I hope this is useful.
You know, I hope this stuff goeswell and I've been really
thrilled that over the past yearand a bit of doing this stuff,
um, so many people reach out allthe time and say I'm using it
for this or I'm going to startdoing this, and now their voices
are becoming part of this spaceand I think the technology,

(55:57):
like is, is adapting to to that.
Like, I spend quite a bit oftime on the forums on reddit,
you know, the, the chat, jptforums, the AI forums.
There are so manyneurodivergent folk on there who
share their stories about whatthey would like the technology
to do and then it feels like acouple of months later it comes

(56:18):
true, you know.
So I think the more that peopleshare what they want and get
value from the technology doesgo that way and then suddenly it
becomes very inclusive and veryneurodivergent friendly.
So I think the more sharing ofexamples, sharing what you want.
I think that's going to beinteresting to see where it all

(56:39):
goes.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
And I think you know, especially from a workplace
point of view and you know,education point of view, and I'm
even talking about tertiaryeducation, all of that I think
these places do need to startlooking into how can we use this
.
You know, I'm working at someplaces at the moment and it's

(57:03):
like, oh no, we're not allowedto use AI here, because the CTO
has said that.
It's like, oh no, we're notallowed to use AI here because
the CTO has said that it's asecurity threat, all of that.
And it's like, well, you needto get your crap together
because the rest of the world isadapting to this.
If you're going to live in thisprehistoric ice age, almost

(57:26):
you'll get left behind.

Speaker 2 (57:28):
And to me Will.
That line just doesn't existanymore, because I get it too.
I have people say you're notallowed to use AI for this or
for that.
And I'm like man, my phone hasApple intelligence.
Now Every email, every note,every text message is being AI
summarised.
And you know, guiding me, whatI might say next it's like

(57:52):
there's no line in the sand thatI'm walking in either no AI or
AI.
It's all just a blend.
Now.
So for universities, forworkplaces to be like you know
we're not going to do AI.
It's like I'm sorry that timehas passed, like it's all here
now.
What you need to do is beresponsive and actually give

(58:15):
people good ways to use thisstuff to improve the way they
work, the way they live, insteadof pretending like it doesn't
exist.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
And I think as well that that could even be why
people go work for some of theseworkplaces or even go study at
an institution, because you knowthat's there, compared to, say,
this one who's like well,things, they're going to have to
step it up because the world isevolving.
You need to start stepping itup and finding out what you can

(58:53):
put into place for that.

Speaker 2 (58:55):
Totally agree.
Yeah, that's got to be.
It shouldn't restrict whatpeople can get out of it the IT
groups or the companies or theCTO.
They've got to meet peoplewhere they're at and make it
work for them totally, totally,totally.

Speaker 1 (59:09):
Hey, craig, um awesome having you on today.
Now, if people want to connectwith you or find out more about
your work, where's the bestplace to go find you?

Speaker 2 (59:19):
yeah, I'd go to the universal sandpitorg, like you
shared earlier.
Will that's really my ai?
Like you shared earlier?
Will that's really my AI base?
These days I keep addingresources up there.
My contact details are there,so that's where I'll keep adding
stuff in the months to come.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
Yeah, cool, cool Craig, awesome chat today.
It really opened my mind to ahell of a lot of stuff and look,
anyone listening.
Please connect with Craig.
He's got some awesome thingshappening, hopefully, if I, I've
been wanting to get up toNewcastle.
To tell you the truth, I know afew neurodivergent people up in

(59:56):
Newcastle now, so I should makemy way up there one day.

Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
Yeah, take a road trip and we'll head out and have
some lunch.
That sounds great.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it would actually be cool to maybe
check out some.
Where can I check your musicout by?

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
the way.
Oh yeah, so I go under the nameRenesmere, which is spelt
W-R-E-N.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
Hang on Slow down, mate.
I'm dyslexic.
Say W, is it W-R?

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
W-R.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
And then E-N, e-n, yep, a-s.

Speaker 1 (01:00:32):
A-S yep.

Speaker 2 (01:00:34):
M-I-R.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
M-I-R man, don't ask me to pronounce that Bloody hell
mate.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
I'm used to talking to my AI assistant.
Will I just yeah, yeah yeah,yeah, totally, totally, totally.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
But look, craig, thank you so much for coming on
today.
It was a pleasure.
It definitely opened up my mindto a lot of things that I
didn't actually realise that AIcould actually do.
Not that I didn't think itcould do it.
I just didn't really thinkabout, you know, things like
putting my emails all throughthere and structuring my day
differently.

(01:01:09):
I would definitely love to havestuff like that.
You know, personally, sometimesI still use like my to-do list,
you know, so I could probablybe looking at so many other
things, especially, you know, asan entrepreneur in business.
It could probably streamline ahell of a lot of stuff that I do
.
But, craig, thank you so muchfor your work.
Entrepreneurial business itcould probably streamline a hell
of a lot of stuff that I do.
But, craig, thank you so muchfor your work and, um, yeah,

(01:01:31):
thanks very much for coming on.
yeah thanks for your work too,will I love watching what you're
doing with this space andthanks for having me on no
problem, and look for all therest of our listeners there, or,
if you haven't already done so,please subscribe, like and
follow to all of our socialmedia platforms or like us do
whatever on our um ourpodcasting platforms.
My name's will wheeler and thisis neurodivergent mates.

(01:01:54):
Till next time, go, go, go, go,go Go.

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AI and the Neurodivergent Brain: A Game-Changer for Focus and Productivity - Craig Smith

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}AI and the Neurodivergent Brain: A Game-Changer for Focus and Productivity - Craig Smith