Unveiling the Journey: Frank Burton Jr., From FBI Agent to Apostle

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Music.

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All right, y'all, get ready for another edition of News and Trends with your host, Dave and Lynn.
Welcome.
Welcome, welcome to News and Trends with Dave and Lynn. I'm one of your hosts,

(00:33):
Mr. David Coker, proprietor of Dave Mark, Inc., promoter, event planner, all around good guy.
And I'm hanging out with my partner, Mr. Leonard Young. What's happening, brother?
Hey, Dave, everything is good. This is Leonard Young, CEO of National Black
Guide, DelawareBlack.com, black media expert and all-around good guy. How it goes, Dave?

(00:56):
I'm all right, man. I can't complain. I'm just, you know, I'm getting a little sad,
you know, because you could tell the season's changing, you know,
and, you know, the summer is about to
end even though fall was always one of my favorite
time of the years same here you know you could yeah but
you could always you could see the time is you know it's getting dark earlier

(01:17):
and all that kind of stuff is happening you know so but you know all in all
you know i'm glad to still be here to be able to witness all of that stuff you
know what i mean yeah no i'm saying,
Well, Dave, on the flip side, I'm starting to get excited because these kids
are about to start going back to school.

(01:40):
My daughter starts this week. My son starts next week. So my middays are now going to be free.
You know, mornings and evenings are a little bit different, but the midday is
going to be free. I was going to say, don't you get busier when school starts?
Yeah, I do. But, you know, at least morning they catch the bus. So that's easy.

(02:02):
In the evening practices, you know, you can kind of control.
But, you know, having these sports practices that end at 11 a.m.,
1 p.m., 3 p.m., my daughter got to be at school at 2 p.m.
You know, you talk about a monkey wrench.
And that's crazy that they do that now, because, you know, I was coming up,

(02:23):
man, we never we never had them kind of practices where you had to go through all of that.
And especially talking about inconvenience and your parents at that point,
you know, you know, it was crazy.
And you want to tell me what the worst thing about it is now, too?
You know, at least back in the day, the schools had, you know,
the buses were kind of like they covered the neighborhoods and vicinity of the schools.

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You know, now that everyone's choicing and charter schools, you know,
like there's no bus for these after school programs or these.
So, you know, so it's like you have to take them, you know, darn near all the time.
Wow. Yeah. I didn't even think about that, but yeah, that's right.
Yeah, I guess you do. You got to take them and then pick them up afterwards.

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And boy, you're talking about messing up your schedule. Boy, let me tell you.
Well, you know, hopefully it'll pay off for you.
Maybe one of your kids will become a superstar in something and take care of you, you know? Right.
Yeah, there you go. There you go. But other than that, everything else is okay.

(03:29):
Care yeah day i mean other than that carly talked about
you know i think we just getting ready for end of summer of course you
know labor you have any plans labor day weekend not really
i know now i know you got something going on this
weekend that you probably should talk about yes i did forget it so at g and
r camp how do you forget that man how do you forget that man they well dave

(03:50):
i like i already told you i work on the plantation so you know i i just work
day to day I just work day to day. But you work on the plantation that you own.
So don't even try it. OK, but Dave, if I'm still picking cotton,
does it make it any better?
Well, yeah, because you don't have to do it if you don't want to.
Well, no, trust me, I got to do it.

(04:13):
Go ahead and tell people what you got going on at your plantation this weekend. OK, sure.
So as Dave said, this weekend, this Saturday, G&R Campground in Houston,
Delaware, which is in Kent County, Delaware,
we're doing an all you can eat seafood fest, which is going to be crab,
shrimp, clams, many more seafood items, as well as traditional items such as

(04:38):
fried chicken, macaroni and cheese, baked beans.
So that's coming this Saturday. Tickets are $50 per person. And we're looking to have a good time.
OK, well, hey, that's not a bad price, too, because, you know,
you can spend more than that.
You can spend more than that easily just on getting crabs or something like that.
You know, so, you know, so you usually have a good turnout when you do this.

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Well, so this is only our second one. Last year we sold out at about 80 people.
This year we have a few more tickets left.
So, I mean, you know, we're hoping to do the same.
Okay. All right. All right. That sounded like a plan, man. That sounded like a plan.
So, y'all, if you guys are listening, if you're looking for something to do this weekend,

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you know, you want to get in touch with Leonard in the DNR campground so you
can go down there and hang out with him and maybe steal some stuff off his plate.
You know what I mean? So, okay.
Dave, you said you're coming down, right? You coming? No, but look,
I ain't going to let anybody take anything.
No, I ain't going to let nobody take nothing from me. That's what I'm saying.

(05:44):
I'm talking about taking it off of your plate. Well, Dave, are you coming down?
You get your ticket yet? I don't know. I haven't heard free yet. But anyway, we'll talk.
We'll talk. We'll talk. But anyway, but guys, that sounds like a good deal.
So, you know, and usually for you guys that have not been down to the campground,

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it's definitely definitely something to go down and check out.
And it is black owned. Just keep that in mind.
You know, one of the I mean, I mean, how many campgrounds are black owned that,
you know, have been the whole United States?
So they actually have a lot more than I would have thought. So,
I mean, they're probably between 30 and 50. I probably say at least. OK.

(06:27):
That's still not a lot, considering how many. Yeah, that's true.
Yeah. Like especially Georgia, Texas.
They have a lot in those two states.
OK. All right. OK. Well, we know it ain't many. We know. Look up here. What is one?
Right. So.
All right. OK. Well, we've been blessed enough to be able to have someone come

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on our show tonight. night. So we have a guest tonight.
And Leonard, why don't you kind of fill everybody in on who we got with us tonight?
Sure. So tonight we have Frank Burton Jr.
And, you know, it's so funny, Frank, I was watching your interview of Stan Waterman
yesterday and I and, you know, you did something genius.
And if you don't mind, I'm going to steal it from you, if that's OK.

(07:15):
Yeah, that's fine. So, you know, I agree with Frank. I don't like all the boring
intro where I read people's bios and all this.
So Frank, I'm going to give you two or three minutes and I'm going to let you
introduce yourselves to our audience.
Thank you. I appreciate that because I don't like those mom entrances.
My name is Frank Burton, Jr. I am a pastor of Perfect Will Ministries in Newcastle,

(07:40):
Delaware, along with my wife, who is the assistant pastor, Apostle Tacey Burton.
We are both from, well, I grew up in Wilmington. She's from Wilmington.
I'm from Chester, to Pennsylvania.
Went to P.S. DuPont right before busing, then got shipped out to Brandywine,
ended up getting a scholarship, going to Del State, and ended up going to the
FBI and just love God, love God's people and still serving the youth.

(08:05):
That's it. Okay. Now, now. Wait, hold on, wait, hold on.
You heard what high school that he started out at. You heard that, right? Yes, sir.
Okay. I'm just letting you know, just in case you hadn't heard that school before.
He knows all about it. I'm just reminding them. Anyway, go back.

(08:27):
Frank, let me ask you this. No, no, no. Stay focused. Stay focused.
That's my portion of the show. Remember? All right.
There you go. All right. So, Frank, first of all, with the FBI,
which of course Federal Bureau of Investigation, for anybody who don't know.

(08:48):
Now, how did you get into that? And the reason I ask is like I tell you so funny
in college, one of my friends and he was always a secretive person and he ended up going to the CIA.
And it was just so funny because like when he told me he was going to CIA,
it kind of fit perfectly.
But, you know, how did you hear about the FBI opportunity and how did you make

(09:12):
that transition from Delaware State University?
So my pathway to the FBI is kind of a funny story.
I wrote about it. I wrote a book called From FBI Agent to an Apostle,
Saga of a Spiritual Sniper.
So the goal was from Chester, my parents moved us out because they wanted a
better life for us, me and my sister.
So we moved to Wilmington, Northside. And my goal was, my parents' goal,

(09:36):
my dad's goal was to play sports.
I was pretty good in sports. And that was to get a scholarship.
What Dave just said about your kids, it was funny you said what you said,
because at one point, we had three kids within four years of each other.
So they all played different sports. So we were everywhere.
And so the goal was to get a scholarship just to make things a lot better.

(09:58):
So all my life from six years old in Delaware, all the way up to college,
I never had a job, football, basketball, baseball. That's all I ever did.
Football, basketball, and baseball, football and basketball and baseball in high school.
And I finally got a scholarship to Delaware State.
I was actually looked at a couple of other colleges, Syracuse and some other

(10:19):
colleges, but I ended up going to Delaware State University because they allowed me to play baseball.
Now, mind you, Dave, you remember this because you were right around that time as well.
This was before Bo Jackson. This was before Deion Sanders, and it wasn't common to play two sports.
Ah, okay. I was being looked at by Cincinnati Reds, the Phillies, and the Pirates.

(10:41):
So the coach let me play two sports. So I ended up going to Dell State,
playing football and baseball. Did really well in both.
Actually was the captain of the baseball team all my years I was there.
Finished ninth in the nation in stolen bases. So I was set.
I was rolling. But in my junior year, ended up having a baby,
going into my senior year.

(11:02):
And my dad was like, around here, what we do is we take care of ours. So that dream was shot.
I graduated. I ended up going, getting a job in the bank. Here's the funny part.
So growing up, I never was in trouble. I was a star quarterback for Brandywine.
Everybody knew me as an athlete. Never got in trouble. But whether I was in

(11:22):
Wilmington, if I was in Chester, if I was in Philadelphia, Dave and Lynn,
I always found myself at the end. You're talking about George Floyd.
I've always found myself at the end of somebody's gun on the ground. Oh, wow.
Talking about you look like somebody just robbed XYZ.
I never forget, let's say our senior year, we were walking down Van Buren Street, north side.

(11:46):
So I'm walking, we're walking down Van Buren Street, going to Slazian for a football game.
It's about eight of us, all of us are athletes.
We get to Concord Avenue, all of a sudden, like 20 vice cars,
just, oh, I'm on the ground.
My face is literally on the ground, right on Concord Avenue.
There are people driving by who know me, who see me, who ended up going to tell

(12:07):
my parents, which was crazy.
So I had a disdain for law enforcement. I had a disdain for military.
I didn't want any parts of that.
But just so happened, my man Woody Allen said, if you want to make God laugh,
all you got to do is tell him, tell him your story. Right. Tell him what you want. Right.
And so I ended up working at this bank. And there's one guy,

(12:28):
my boss was an ex-secret service agent.
And I ended up working with two cops. One guy, Bill Osowski,
which was an ex-Wilmington cop, and Mike Rogers, an ex-county cop.
Bill Redonda was the Secret Service guy. His son is a big-time attorney right now.
So one day, Redonda walked over to me after working for quite some time.
He walked over. He said, Frank, you're very articulate.

(12:50):
You pay close attention to detail. He said, have you ever thought about going
into the Secret Service? I said, what'd you just say, Bill?
I said, dude, I'm from the hood. Only thing I know about the Secret Service
is you're the land, you're the president.
And all of a sudden somebody starts shooting and you go, I said, no, I don't know.
No, I don't want to do that. And he said, no, he said, think about it.

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He said, it doesn't have to be the Secret Service. There are so many different
governmental agencies, FBI, ATF, DEA, start naming all these organizations.
But he said something that changed the whole trajectory of my life.
My daddy was a blue collar worker my mom was a blue collar worker she worked
at Scott Peeper which is now Kimberly Clark my dad worked at Phoenix Steel and

(13:33):
all my life growing up all I ever heard my parents say is I can't wait until
I'm 65 years old to retire,
this man said you can work for one of these governmental agencies for 20 years
and when you turn 50 you can retire I said hold on say that again.
And so that's how I got into the FBI. At 50 years old, I left.

(13:57):
I've been retired for 11 years.
I walked out the door at 50, just like he said, had done everything I could
do in the FBI and I was done.
So that was my inspiration and going to the FBI.
I never I didn't I never dreamed about going into the FBI.
Now, are you able to talk about your position at the FBI or,
you know, what your real role was?

(14:20):
Absolutely. Absolutely. So that's all in the book. And it's been cleared.
I have a lot of different, I've worked on a lot of different major cases.
1996 Olympics. I was in the park the night the bomb went off.
I actually was, my team was the first team to go on the then subject, Richard Jewell.
So if anybody's seen the movie Richard Jewell and you see those guys,
that's my team. That's my guys.

(14:42):
Even though it's all wrong, but those are my guys. Yeah. 9-11,
I was there, rescue and recovery.
2002, I worked the six world terrorists from Yemen, arrested those guys.
But at the FBI, I ended up working a whole bunch of different squads,
but I ended up being a hostage negotiator for 14 years, which I love.
I was a national recruiter, which actually in 1995 was the first poster guy

(15:07):
for the Bureau that did magazine advertisements And Ebony Essence,
Black Enterprise, all that kind of stuff.
But at the very end, I was the media rep for Philadelphia.
Wow. So I'm sure over those 20 so years, you probably have a lot of a lot of
interesting stories, probably some that you cannot tell.

(15:27):
Are there any that you can tell that may amaze or surprise us?
I don't know about amaze or surprise, but probably out of all the things that
I've done with the bureau and I actually have an interview coming out tomorrow
with one of my hate crime cases across another podcast, which is kind of big.
But probably my most rewarding case was a kidnapping that we had from out of Florida.

(15:52):
There was a young man and this young woman who were not married and they didn't
make it. So he snatched the baby and he brought him back to Philadelphia.
And he told the young lady, he said, if you notify the law enforcement of any
involvement, I will kill the baby.
And so naturally, I worked special operations as well. So I worked on the special
operations team that got the lead.

(16:12):
We heard about it. We had to go out on foot to kind of like scope the area out
to see if we could see this guy, see if we saw the baby, take the baby.
Long story short, we sat on this guy's house for maybe around eight or nine hours.
The description was a guy with red hair, earrings, and a beard, a red beard.
One guy came out. First of all, some old people came out, went to the market.

(16:33):
I followed him, and they bought some Similac. I had young kids around that age,
so I knew if you're buying Similac, it was in accordance with that baby.
So we knew there was a baby in the house.
So we went back, and a couple hours later, there's one white guy sitting in
the description, walked out the house, and went down to the store.
Store so i want to make a positive id so i go out
on foot walk right with him as he's coming out the store i

(16:55):
walk he walks by me and i look at him like yo what's up
what's up guys what's up and so he walks by red hair earrings the whole nine
i mean yeah earrings and the whole nine and but he didn't have a beard and there's
a scar that this guy had i said it looks just like him but that's not him so
he stayed waiting some more hours finally another guy comes out which is him

(17:16):
had the scar He had a twin,
which was notified to him.
Take down. We went into the house. When we went to the house,
we found the baby in the basement, in a back room, in a closet.
And probably the most rewarding thing was to call that mother and to tell the
mother that we had a baby. So that was fun.

(17:36):
Now, one of the things you just mentioned is that during this,
you know, you recognize a Simlack because you had kids.
Is, you know, how was it, I guess, being a father and a husband and an FBI agent,
did that ever, did your work ever take you away from, you know, family?
Was there times when, and I'm, and forgive me for my ignorance,

(18:00):
because, you know, a lot of stuff we see on the FBI, we see on TV because we
don't know people personally, especially of our color.
So were there ever like times when you had to do stuff, but you couldn't tell
your family what what you're doing or is it like that where you don't discuss
cases with your family, but you kind of have to, you know, do what you got to do for work?

(18:20):
Yeah. Great questions, Len. First of all, all the stuff that you see on television,
there's a lot of license.
Nobody solves any case in a half an hour, an hour.
Facial recognition, you just don't call it and get it right back.
DNA doesn't come right back.
All that kind of stuff that you do in an hour, that doesn't happen.
But the great question is, yeah, my job and the nature of my job,

(18:42):
special operations, I was just a negotiator. It took me away from home a lot.
And when I tell you that my wife held it down for a number of years with my
kids, because we small kids and I had one older kid, but she held it down.
There was probably in the first 12 years of my career, my kids couldn't tell
anybody what their dad did as a professional.

(19:04):
They would have to make something up or whatever. But fortunately,
within my 12th year, I went to the ministry, got ordained as an apostle,
and they could tell people that my daddy's a pastor. That's what they did.
There was, in 22 years, there was a lot of things that my family,
my wife, my kids never knew.

(19:25):
They could not, they didn't know, they couldn't know until I wrote the book.
Because all of the cases in my book had been court adjudicated.
You got to go to headquarters to make sure that you can write them in the book.
And when my book came out, they were just like, they didn't know.
There's a lot of stuff that I couldn't talk about during my career.
Now, you just spoke about briefly. How did the transition come from FBI agent to apostle?

(19:52):
Yeah. So our foundation, my family's foundation, we were always people of faith.
Ever since I can remember as a child, I grew up in church. I was always in church.
Even though we moved from Chester, our home church, St. Daniel's,
4th and Edward Street, and Chester, Pennsylvania, we always went to church.
And, you know, it was that old school.
Dave knows, man. We go to church Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday,

(20:14):
Thursday, being there all day, three, four services.
So I didn't like church when I was coming up because I grew up in a Methodist
church. It was very traditional.
A lot of older people, nobody my age, and it was boring. It was really boring.
But my mom laid down the foundation. My dad was the support.

(20:36):
So I never got away from it. The Bible says, train up a child in the way they
should go. When they're old, they won't depart.
So by the time I went to college, I looked at my mom and dad.
I said, I'm going to college, and you can't make me go to church.
And I ain't going to church. And I think I really did not.
But when I came out and I graduated, I just had this call to just get back to

(20:56):
church. And then when I got married, we started having kids.
I wanted my family to be raised just like I did. We started going to church.
And then probably, so it's in the book, in 1997, I worked a case,
the Oklahoma City bombing trial, which was in Denver.
And I'm not going to go all into it, But I had what they call a theophany experience.

(21:17):
That's called that's like a godlike experience. Like when Moses sees the burning
bush and is not being consumed, like God is speaking to me about some things. And I get the call.
I raise my hand. I accept the call. And then I go into ministry.
Well, I guess in your FBI experience as well, are there any skills or.

(21:41):
Let's say discernment that you take from your FBI career into the ministry.
Len, I'm telling you, man, you are on it. These questions are, listen, listen to me.
Listen, the questions that you're asking me are spot on.
So in the book, from FBI agent to an apostle, saga of a spiritual sniper,

(22:02):
the very first thing that I tell people is that I'm just an ordinary man man,
who God has chosen to have some extraordinary experiences.
And then I go on to detail all of these cases, even the one that I'm getting
interviewed on tomorrow night, all of these cases that God allowed me to solve
had nothing to do with what I learned at Quantico,

(22:25):
had nothing to do with FBI technique.
Because when you're on that street, you better know how to work the street, right?
So most of those cases that were solved, dude, you could have did it.
Dave could have did it. What it was, was the discernment of God.
I had, I had one case was a, was a two year cold case homicide involving some,

(22:47):
some serious dudes up in Philadelphia.
And like nobody was talking, but dude, I'm from the street. I know the street
code. I know what, I know what is snitches get snitches.
There's a $5,000 bounty on people's heads. But I went in with the discernment of God.
And he kept telling me, oh man, you can't talk to this person because they'll
up shoot you they just got out of prison and we got to be here i told them all

(23:08):
to leave the room it's in the book i said leave the room they said no no i said
leave get go i'll go outside,
and so i looked at this person and they was giving me land they was giving me all.
What you dr phil and all this and i and i just stopped and i looked at them
and i said can you do me a favor now watch this no fbi technique i said can

(23:29):
you do me what you want what you want,
I said, can you take your glasses off for one minute? And that's when he went,
what you, Dr. Phil, what you want? What you doing? I said, can you just take your glasses off?
And he took the glasses off, bloodshot red. You could tell they had been crying.
And I just looked at them and I said, do you understand that your eyes are the window to your soul?

(23:50):
I said, so I hear all this stuff you've given me. I said, but now I see you.
I said, and you're hurting. And that's something that you need to tell them.
And I got you. I carry you through it. And, yo, that person gave up the murder.
We solved a two-year cold case in two months, which was ridiculous.
And people are like, how you do it? It's just the discernment of God.

(24:12):
The discernment of God will keep you out there.
When I've had guns pulled on me from good guys, bad guys, all over the place.
You better know how to operate on that street, and you better operate under the protection of God.
You asked some good questions. I try. You know, somebody got to carry it through
because when you get to Dave,

(24:32):
it's going to be all about Dave. Oh, my God. Oh, my God.
But I have a couple more questions. I'll make it quick.
So backtracking a little bit. And this is something I always think about,
too. And we always hear with law enforcement and people of color during your

(24:57):
initial years in the FBI.
How was I would just say the treatment being a black man?
You know, I'm sure, you know, well, and without dating it.
What year did you start with the FBI?
1991. 91. OK, so I guess with that being said, you know, how was it being a

(25:18):
black man starting in the FBI?
Well, Dave, you got some big shoes to carry because I'm talking to Linus.
Yeah, he gets on the roll every now and then. Yeah. So first of all,
you got to understand this.
The FBI, right before I went in, was traditionally known as lawyers and accountants, all white guys.

(25:40):
FBI came up with 1991. It wasn't really until 1995 when we did the advertisements
that they realized that these lawyers and accountants can't go into Chester. They can't go to Camden.
They can't go into Compton because you'll get shot. They were I mean,
they were shooting jokers. Right.
And so when I went to the FBI, I think as minorities and especially blacks,

(26:01):
the FBI was at three percent, three percent.
So it was, it's 13,000. Hey, Frank, that right there sounds like University
of Delaware. But anyway, go ahead. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So there were just over a little, more than 13,000 FBI agents.
So it was really tough to get into.
So you go down there, you go to training school, there's no guarantee, you leave your job.

(26:24):
There's no guarantee. If you fail one test, you're gone.
If you can't shoot, you fail firearms. I had never held a gun in my life.
You're gone. So you had that pressure. Here's the problem.
In 1993, we had a black agents law suit, which was already in process before I got there.
In 1997, that was settled.

(26:44):
We won. And they gave these agents some reparations. They gave them some management jobs.
But by 2000, it went right back to the same thing. And so what happens is my
whole career and you talk about what what is it like to be a black person in
the FBI? B.I., let me tell you something.

(27:04):
It was so hard, Len and Dave, because you got to toe two lines.
On the one line, I'm not black enough for the brothers. But when I come home,
oh, man, you working for the feds. You working for the gov.
Oh, man, I ain't talking to you. So you got to deal with that.
On the other hand, every day that I go to work, I'm not blue enough for the back.

(27:25):
I'm doing everything that I'm supposed to do. I'm solving cases in two months.
God has allowed me to solve cases, set precedent, but I can't get promotions. emotions.
To get to even be the media rep,
it took me almost seven, eight years just to get a shot to be the guy.
I was cool as long as I was the alternate. So it was very difficult.

(27:50):
And I can tell you this, thank you for asking that question.
I can tell you this, and I tell Dave all the time, it's all about the give back.
So in 2002, there was a young black male who came out of West Point.
He came on my squad, special operations.
And I mentored him in the FBI.
I mentored him in the Word because he was a man of faith. And we spent a lot

(28:13):
of time together. That's 2002.
2013, I leave. I retire. Two years later, I get a call from this guy.
This is the give back link.
Two years later, I get a call from this guy and he says, Frank,
I just wanted to thank you, man.
I left Philly and promoted to New Haven, Connecticut.
I'm the special agent in charge. That's the head man of a city,

(28:34):
of a big city. So I said, man, thank you, God.
2021, 22, 2022, after my parents died, I got a call because I always stayed in touch with this guy.
Len and Dave, this guy calls me up and he says, Frank, I just want to thank you.
I said, well, what's up? What's up? He said, man, all the times that you mentioned

(28:55):
me, I got Got a couple more years under my belt.
All the times you set up and gave me the word, my grandmama and my mom,
we always talk about you. Watch this.
He said, I am now the deputy associate director of the FBI.
That's the third highest FBI agent in the world and the highest black official ever.

(29:16):
It had nothing to do with what I did.
That's God's plan. But I was a part of that.
Even though we struggle a lot going through that, I was able to help another
young brother come along to get to a level that we had never been.
Right now, he's a deputy.
His name is Brian Turner. If you look up, you'll see, you'll see.

(29:37):
OK, you know, speaking of that, and this leads into my second to last question.
So today in this time, 2024, do you believe that the FBI is still a good opportunity
for, let's say, black men coming out of college?
The FBI and or any governmental agency is a great opportunity.

(30:00):
It is what you make it, right?
One of the things in the FBI, so from Wilmington to P.S. DuPont to Brandywine,
that little pelota, that little baseball, that football allowed me to get the scholarship.
The scholarship allowed me to kind of travel around the country.

(30:20):
The fbi gave me a front row ticket
to the best show on earth
and despite all that stuff people talking about oh you were off and all this
i didn't do i would go to places because i i still am a motivational speaker
every time i went somewhere the question was oh man you went for the fed man

(30:41):
we ain't bringing them drugs we ain't bringing them gloves and i said you know what we not?
I get that. I'm not there for that.
I'm there for my family. In Chester, there were five of us in a little two bedroom apartment.
To this day, my thing was for my family. I want my family to have what I never had.
And God has blessed us to have a lot more than what I ever had growing up.

(31:05):
So I miss me with all that nonsense.
Because here go the other thing. Here go the other thing is,
and this is what I just told the young people at Dell State last week,
if you want to make impact, stop all this barbershop stuff.
We could do this all day right now. We could sit on a podcast,
go to the barbershop, talk about this, talk about that, talk about the election

(31:28):
and all the politics that's going on. I don't want to talk to you about that.
Get a seat at the table. When you get a seat at the table and you can affect
change and you can be a voice.
Right when Biden left to be president, they asked me to co-chair.
This was around Breonna Taylor, George Floyd, all of that.
And, you know, we had all this. They asked me to co-chair this law enforcement

(31:51):
accountability task force.
Now, all of these cats that was dismayed from Bell State Police and all this
kind of stuff. Now I was in charge of this council to try to make change.
But now, Len, Dave, I'm at the table.
And you can't just run anything by us. Because guess what? I've been on the
highest law enforcement agency in the land. Y'all talking all this yin-yang.

(32:13):
I don't want to hear that because I'm going to shut you down.
And so that's what I encourage our kids to do.
So, yeah, I think it depends on what your focus is.
And my focus was I want to make my family's life better.
Okay. And hopefully Dave don't mind one more quick question.
And then my last question. So the quick question is, have you seen the movie

(32:36):
The Negotiator with Samuel L. Jackson?
How watching that do you feel like that was more than accurate,
less than accurate or just a fairy tale, you know, fictional creation?
So let's go with The Negotiator.
And I'll throw another one in there for you. Training day.

(32:56):
OK. OK, right. So Negotiator, the movie Samuel, has a lot of what we've done
because you get people that were agents to help you do the role.
But Hollywood's going to put a lot of license. Right.
Denzel Training Day. Now, there's some license in there, but that was close.

(33:18):
That was close to what we undercover. That was really close.
Somebody was on the set with him taking them through. True.
But a lot of these shows and I watch them, the FBI, FBI International,
when Quantico was on, man, come on, man.
Again, miss me with all that, because you ain't going to be no training agent
in Quantico and they're going to send you to New York to work a case.

(33:41):
You know, you ain't leaving Quantico to work no case. You're not doing that. Right.
So it's a lot of license and they pretty the stuff up because Hollywood wants
to really dramatize all this, all this stuff about embellish all of this stuff about being an agent.
But I'm gonna tell you, this is what I will tell you what I tell all these young kids.
If this is what you want to do, you better know it. It's just like playing football.

(34:04):
If you want to get out there and play college football, high school football,
you better know you want to play. Because if you go out there half cocked and
unsure, you're going to get hurt.
Right. Right. You go into this job and I tell people all the time that you can look online.
You could see all these athletes. You could see all these cases that I work.
But what you won't see is my partner who got shot and killed 50 feet away from me.

(34:26):
Well you won't see you the time when i was undercover and these guys pull guns
and you better know that you want to do this because life and death every single day you won't see,
when we are running raids six o'clock in
the morning and i'm going strapped up and my wife's just looking at me with
this look in her eye like i'm praying that you get back you pray right you don't

(34:49):
you won't see any of that it's intense it's really intense okay no i definitely
agree and I think that's my final question so I'll go ahead and pass it to the Mr.
David Coker P.S. DuPont superstar the guru, the inimitable one the inimitable one there you go.

(35:09):
You know Leonard he asked a lot of questions that you know people I'm sure were
like wanting to know so I'm so glad that you so eloquently answered those questions
but I'm gonna come from a different direction But first thing first,
you mentioned your book a couple of times.
Yes, sir. So tell us what led to you writing a book about your time in the FBI and your life?

(35:39):
Because I know that all is intertwined.
What led you to doing that?
So one of the things is that, number one, I was coming out of Delaware State
University. I was an Englishman.
I love to write. I'm always writing. I've always written something.
And here's the thing is when I retired, you can go online, every,

(36:00):
not even FBI agent, every law enforcement officer who's worth their salt wants to write a book.
And so I started thinking I retired and I didn't, I didn't know what I was going
to do when I retired. I was going to do ministry full time.
And so I'm trying to think about what I'm going to do in 2014 is when I started writing the book.
But then I thought, Dave, I said, listen, I got a different story to tell.

(36:22):
There are a lot of people in the FBI that are in the ministry,
right, that are ministers and or even pastors.
But at that time, there weren't too many guys who started up a church,
who were the founders of a church and started up a church.
Plus my experience of special operations. And then I'm going to hold that whole

(36:46):
saga of a spiritual sniper to draw you in.
Now I married the two and now I'm
going to tell you something that you may have never heard before
and it's not the the book is a very easy
read it's not all these eloquent words and you'll read you'll pick up that book
you could be finished the book it's probably like 90 some pages you'll finish
the book in a day but I made it like that because I wanted it to be easy and

(37:10):
I wanted it to be what I said before to let you know that it ain't all about
oh I learned this in chronicle and I learned this technique to do it.
Nah, it's about just having discernment and going in and anybody can do it if
you want to. So that was my motivation for the book, writing the book.
Okay. All right. All right. I want to take it back.

(37:33):
You know, now Leonard's a younger guy. Leonard's a little younger than us.
But Leonard comes from a slightly different era.
And see, one thing that people who come from being raised during the late 60s, early 70s and whatever,
they have a whole different outlook on the way that their life started and the

(37:58):
path that it ended up on. I'm going to put it that way.
Because we all had You know We had those parents That really instilled in us
Okay This is what we want you to do.
You really didn't have any choice, really, because they didn't play, you know.

(38:20):
And then we had the teachers that really helped to follow whatever guidelines the parents set up.
The teachers made sure you followed those guidelines because they were the people
who handled you as you were coming up.
Yeah when you think about you played sports when you think about going to school

(38:42):
and everything you think about those those mentors and everything that you had that kind of set you,
on the path that you ended up you know a lot of you guys who who were athletes and so forth,
you know you had that hood you had that hood presence oh yeah but you also had
that other presence too.
You know what I mean? You had to have that. You had to be a dual person coming up.

(39:08):
So with all of that being said, I want you to talk about your mentors.
I want you to talk about who really set you and put you towards the path that you ended up on.
Right. And that's a great question, Dave, because it is a little different.
It's a lot different now.

(39:29):
There's a lot of people that are disconnected. Right. So, so let's start,
let's start back from the beginning high school. Right.
Even before high school was my mom and dad, they, they, my mom and dad were married for 61 years.
I had, I had a great outlook.
I had a great example from them. They, they showed me what real life was.

(39:50):
My dad was my number one mentor, my biggest cheerleader. Right.
But by the time I get to high school, we want to talk about mentors.
You got people like Mr. and Mrs. Carey, our math teachers, right,
at P.S. DuPont. And I'm talking about P.S. DuPont, right?
You have my coach, Wade Matthews. Come on, man. Yeah.

(40:10):
You got my – You have the depth, too. Go ahead. Listen. Listen,
Wade Matthews wasn't playing.
These kids right now would tell their coach a whole bunch of – man,
you say something to Wade, you would get punched in the mouth.
You would lead – Yeah, that's right. You would lead – Len, you would lead with
three teeth. You have one in your mouth by the time you got finished with these cats, right?

(40:31):
Let me interrupt you for a minute.
I was in the gym the day that Wade Matthews told our star basketball player,
you are off the team because you did not pass a class. Yes.
And he gave him all the chances in the world to pass this class.
I'm not going to call his name out, but he knows who he is. i

(40:54):
was in the gym at that particular time and
keep in mind this was the year leonard this
is the year that we ended up in the
state championship in basketball i remember and this guy was our starting center
and we were supposed to go against the number one team in the state who had

(41:18):
not lost they only lost one game in three years. Yeah.
Okay? And after just beating, we beat that Yuki Washington guy that's on TV.
That's my guy right there. We beat him, this basketball team,
to go to the championship game.
We wasn't supposed to beat them because they were loaded. We wasn't supposed

(41:39):
to beat them. And we beat them without this guy who we thought we could never win without.
So... It's crazy. That's how crazy this coach was. And I remember...
Our basketball the basketball player crying and pleading
with the coach tomorrow coach you got
it you got it and coach looked
at him he said i told you and he walked away yes i'll

(42:02):
never forget it man i was saying i'm standing right there i'll never forget
it yeah you know so so go ahead i'm i just wanted to tell you but that's so
you know i just wanted to say that but go ahead go ahead you had you had wayne
matthews as my basketball my football and basketball coach but then when When you came to baseball,
you had Mr. Howe and Mr.

(42:22):
Howe wasn't playing around either. But you had Mr. Howe. You had Mr.
Mike, who was in the band.
You had Bunny Miller, Mr. Miller, who has done everything of it.
So he was my principal at P.S.
And Burnett and at Brandywine. He came over to Brandywine.
You had people like Miss Somerville, Miss Corpening.

(42:44):
And these are all neighborhoods. These are people that lived in the neighborhood.
They own it So Lynn If you didn't do your work.
You didn't do your homework. These were educators. And I'm talking about educators,
but like our parents all knew each other.
Right. So you couldn't go from one and not do something.
So if you did, if you did something, you said something smart to them,

(43:05):
you get a whooping by them.
And by the time you get home, you get a whooping because your parents would know about it.
So the thing that I loved about our mentors, you take a Mr. Miller,
you take a Mr. Howe, you take a Wade Matthews.
These guys wasn't just preaching to us about working. they've
been there before they played semi-pro ball they knew what it took for us to

(43:27):
get out there so they laid down to us and i remember in the ninth grade they
laid down to me work ethic right i got this whole thing that i taught my sons
listen if you want you want to be good,
yeah that won't be good okay just keep doing what you're doing but if you want
to be great you get out on that PS DuPont track.

(43:48):
Y'all remember that hill where Bernadette is? When nobody else is out there,
while all your friends are home doing this, I'm out running. I'm out working out.
They out playing, but guess what? I get the scholarship.
My education is paid for. I have a master's degree. I have not had to pay a
dime for any of my education.

(44:10):
That's cool. That's exactly what I'm talking about. And you don't have that.
You really don't have that one-on-one contact like you used to have back then
with teachers and mentors and so forth.
We had all of that coming up. So that's what makes the time different.
I'm going to say this also. Now, because of the discernment that you have,

(44:32):
like, I also noticed that a lot of former athletes like yourself,
all seem, a lot of them have ended up in the ministry, which is kind of interesting,
you know, because even my pastor was an All-State basketball player in Delaware.
And, you know, and he's in the ministry now.

(44:55):
You know, you never know unless you know him and you talk to him about it,
he does not bring up basketball.
Yeah. But that was, you know, but he was well known for basketball coming up in the day, you know.
The only reason I knew about it because we've known each other since we were nine years old.
So that's the relationships that we had, you know, because we played ball together. Yeah.

(45:19):
When you look at it and you look at a lot of these guys, even talking with Stan,
I watch your interview, even talking with Stan.
I watched Stan. I've known Stan since he was a kid, you know,
so, you know, and just watching him come up and do the things that he's done.
All of them, everybody seems to have the discernment because there was a special

(45:40):
type of quality that you had to have in order to be able to do,
Especially the things that you've done as an athlete going into the FBI.
You were a state trooper too, right?
No, no. You went straight into the FBI.
I had no prior law enforcement or military background. I went straight to the

(46:01):
Bureau. Okay, so you went straight to the FBI.
Okay, so to do all of that, okay, and then still be able to maintain who you are.
Yeah. And to be able to to not lose yourself.
How did you do that? How were you able to to keep your sanity and to keep your

(46:21):
and especially the relationships?
Because, you know, you know, we all had our little things about cops.
Sure. Leonard has, you know, especially now because it's really crazy now with
the way of cops and the law enforcement thing is now, you know,
we all had our things about cops.
And of course, you know, you don't want to be, you know, we had a certain group

(46:41):
of cops that we came up with when we were coming up.
But then as things got, as those guys started retiring and started,
you know, going away, it was a whole different group came in.
And so you don't have the relationships now that you had before.
So how were you able to balance all of that and be able to be yourself,
be the family man, be a father and be able to walk without having all these

(47:06):
thoughts going on at once in your head?
Yeah. Well, the first thing to answer your question, Dave, is number one.
And I said in an interview last night with Stan and he confirmed it.
The first thing that you understand when you play these sports,
sports teaches you a lot about life. All the lessons that you learn in sport,
you can apply right to life, right?
And so when you start looking at these people in the ministry that were athletes,

(47:31):
some of my best friends, Darren and Devin Park, we played basketball together.
I know them very well. Listen, Devin is an apostle going all over this world, right? Yeah, I know.
Darren is in there. You got Pravi Pau. You know what I'm saying?
I know Pravi too. He was my next door neighbor.
Right? Right? He was my next door neighbor. So I know about him.

(47:51):
So you have a lot of those and it's a whole bunch of them.
But to answer the second part of your question, which was answered last night, too.
How do I maintain father, a pastor, a husband?
Same thing Stan said. I'd never try to be bigger than who I was.
Watch this. I'm going to put a statement here.

(48:14):
I was Frank, the FBI agent, but an FBI agent was not who I was.
The FBI agent didn't make me.
Right. So I didn't go out with a badge. When I went out, when I went out to go investigate,
to interrogate, just like Stan said last night, the guy you see right here is
a guy that you see as the father, is the guy that you see as the coach,

(48:38):
is the guy that you see as the pastor.
Now, again, without trying to sound all high and sadistic, when I was in middle
school, right, we played basketball at Harlem, P.S., Price's, Haynes Park.
What was the thing to do, Dave? You know, the thing to do was as soon as you
got up age, you was out with the old heads, you know, every other word,

(49:01):
fling, fling, fling. Yo, this one, fling, fling, fling.
And one day, I think I was probably about 14 years old.
And so you start doing that it becomes a party
one day i was about 14 years old
my dad was asking me a question and i was answering and
i said and we went over there and he said
what did you say you know i was like i was like oh oh and

(49:23):
from that point at 14 i
asked god listen to me yo i said
god whatever you do i don't i don't need that to
be bigger than anybody else i can communicate very well
i don't need that and i asked god
at 14 to take that away from me
foul language i don't think that i'm better than anybody if that's your thing

(49:45):
that's what you do but i it makes me cringe i hate foul language so frank the
pastor frank the agent frank the coach i was a great coach coach but you ain't
seen me cussing and fussing at kids i didn't have right Right, right.
Listen, watch this. In 19, after I left the bank in 1985, I went to the bank.

(50:08):
1988, I went to Glenn Mills because I wanted to work with athletes.
Oh, you going to that school for the bad boys? Oh.
My interview, I had a 12-panel interview. You had these dudes with scars and
all kind of stuff, and they asking me all these questions, and I'm hitting, bang, bang.
And then all of a sudden, one dude said, I'm going to ask you one question.

(50:28):
Cause he, he listened to me talk and he says, do you use foul language?
And I said, no, look, look, look. I said, no. He said, okay,
thank you. That's it. Goodbye. And I said, hold on. I said, hold on.
No, no. What you mean bye?
I said, hold up. I said, give a brother a chance.
Listen, they hired me in 1988. I got teacher of the year in 1990 and 1991.

(50:53):
I didn't have to cuss at them kids. You know why I didn't cuss at them kids?
Because them kids were used to being cussed at and talked down to.
I wanted to build them up.
I wanted to show them another way. And here's the thing. Here's the thing, David Lynn.
Ten years after I left Glenn Mills, I was in the FBI.
I was working a raid up in North Philly. And we took down a whole block.

(51:17):
And I had some of the kids come back who saw me.
And he's like, yo, Frank, you, you, you, you out. You know, and so they came
back and one of the greatest things that they told me, Glenn Mills,
just like coming out of Chester, you'd never be nothing.
These kids say, Frank, thank you for spending time with me. Watch this.

(51:38):
I'm now an obstetrician.
I'm now a gynecologist.
Are you playing with me? It was because I took the time to talk to them like men. in.
Now, if you, if you wild out, I'll let them know I'm from the street, just like you.
And I had some altercations with them, but I didn't have to have many because

(51:59):
once I set the standard, the other kids that came in, the other kids would say,
yo, don't mess with, no, yo, don't mess with him.
That, that dude right there, he for us. So to answer your question,
Dave, the same guy that you see, whether it's a coach, whether it's the pastor,
whether it's a husband, whether it's a father, you're not going to get all this
rah-rah because I don't got to beat my chest and go rah-rah to prove who I am. I am who I am.

(52:22):
Okay. All right. All right.
My last thing, and I want you to give a brief answer to what you would say to this person.
Young man straight out of college, or female, straight out of college,
comes up to you because they saw an opportunity that they wanted to do,

(52:47):
which was to get in into the FBI, but they were unsure and they needed that
last push to take them over the hump in order to fill out the application and to pursue that career.
What is it that you would say to them to help them to get over the hump?

(53:10):
The first thing that I would ask them is the same thing that I ask all these
kids that I'm mentoring down at Dell State right now, at Wilmington University.
What is your game plan for life? Not no three-year plan, not no five-year plan.
What is your game plan for life? Because as we sit here and talk right now,
Dave, and I'm looking at Len.
You've been out of school longer than I have. I've been out of I've been out

(53:31):
of high school, 45 some years.
And I tell them, OK, maybe like, oh, gee, you for real, man.
Now you ain't that old. I'd be like, yeah, I am that old.
You've got to have a game plan for life because it's going to go bad.
And you don't have time to try to do things on the fly. Now,
can God do anything? He can. He did it with me.
But how about this is what I would tell. This is the encouragement. me.

(53:53):
So Dave, if I'm going down Van Buren Street and I get to 29th Street and I turn
onto 29th Street and all of a sudden I hit a pothole and they tear my whole
rib up, my whole front is gone,
I'm going to tell you that when you're going down Van Buren,
don't turn on 29th Street.

(54:14):
I'm going to give you some advice. Don't run into the same pothole that,
take another way, Go to 27th, go to 31st street, go to 20, 27th street.
Don't go down the same path. You know why? Because I've been there before and
I don't want you to have to go.
I went through what I had to go through. So you wouldn't have to.
That's the same thing that I did in the FBI. And so I take time with these kids

(54:38):
to tell them to help them navigate, but I'm real with them.
I tell them, remember I told you it was at 3% when I first went in,
that's 1991, where we at 2024?
It's now five percent. It's now five percent. Wow.
So I'm going to help you navigate some potholes so you don't have to go through it on your own.

(54:59):
Because guess what? When I went to the bureau in my class, there were there
were classes every two weeks. Right. And Quantico.
So thirty two, thirty four people.
I was the only black in four different classes. I was the only black in my class.
Only black i didn't have an uncle i didn't have a cousin oh my grandfather was

(55:19):
an fbi my mom i didn't have none of that it was just me and god so that's what
i try to i try to help them and let them know that if you need anything during
the process i'm just the phone call away okay,
all right well folks there you have it you know that's the man himself talking
to you tell you about his life story and you know what advice he has for those

(55:45):
that want to follow in his footsteps or start their own path.
Frank, what do you have coming up or you want to give people your social media
pages in case anybody want to get in touch with you?
You know, why don't you go ahead and take a moment to do that at this time?
Well, so I want to just say thank you to you and Lynn for having me on this platform.

(56:07):
I've listened to a lot of podcasts that you guys do. It's very informative.
It keeps the community abreast of everything that's going on.
And I love what y'all can do next, the next few topics or whatever.
They are hilarious. I love them.
I have a big podcast interview coming up out tomorrow, as a matter of fact,
and it's on like 30 different podcast platforms, all the major platforms,

(56:31):
and I'll be posting it on my social media.
My social media Facebook is Apostle Frank Burton.
My Twitter is Apostle Frank Burton.
You can pretty much find me as Frank Burton on most of my social media sites.
I am the chaplain for Delaware State University doing some all athletics,
but dealing with the football team right now.

(56:52):
And when basketball comes, you saw last night with Stan and Jasmine.
But I got some big things coming up that you guys are going to need to be looking out for.
And I'm not going to tell you yet because I'm in the process of meeting some
people and doing some stuff that's going to marry these businesses with our
student athletes to be able not only to have internships, but eventually have jobs.

(57:16):
The last thing that I would say is, Lynn, I did some research on you, bro.
And that GNR campground is huge. I love the inspiration behind it from your mom.
And we need that because We take
our leadership On retreats and we gotta Go to Sandy Cove which they try to Be
blind Or everybody gotta go to Poconos We coming Come on down Yeah there you go Alright so.

(57:46):
This is what we're going to do. We're going to go into our little topic section right now.
And we've got a couple of things that we want to talk about right quick.
And get your input on them as well while we have you on. And let me see.
Our first story. And since we have a former FBI agent on, I figured I'd bring

(58:10):
this story up because it's been something that actually I think all of us have had.
Some type of familiarity with or even people trying to do this to us.
But this story is going to read a little bit of it, too.
It's called Beware of Phone Scams from the Frequently Targeted Area Codes.

(58:32):
And it says these days it seems as though spam likely calls pop up on your phone almost every day.
Not only is it incredibly annoying, but it can get in the way of work and life.
As somebody who takes a lot of calls from varying numbers.
While work might force you to pick up calls from unknown numbers and even call

(58:56):
them back, there are a few early signs like common scammer numbers,
and area codes that can help you confidently hit decline and to decline those pesky scammers.
So, they kind of gave a list here of different things to be wary of,

(59:17):
so I'm going to kind of go through this kind of quickly here.
These area codes, and these are domestic area codes, be wary of these seven area codes.
And, Frank, you can kind of fill us in if you're familiar with any of these.
216, 218, 332, 347, 646, 657, and 712.

(59:45):
Now, those are the area codes now.
216 is Cleveland, Ohio. 218 is northern Minnesota.
332 is New York City. 347 is New York City.
Yeah, 646 is New York as well.
And then you got 657, which is La Palma, California, and 712.

(01:00:08):
These are common area codes that will pop up.
And I've seen at least four of these on a regular basis up on my phone before. four.
I see six, four, six a lot. And I knew that was New York because I have friends
from New York that had that area code, but I had them locked in my phone.
So they're not coming up under their name. I don't answer, you know,

(01:00:30):
so three, three, two, I knew that was New York, but it's also a scammer number.
I know that for a fact, I've seen, I've seen that people get ripped off with
that. And 347 is another popular one.
So when you see these things come up, you know, of course, you want to be very wary of it.

(01:00:53):
But unfortunately, we have a lot of people that are 50, 60 and older who fall in.
To these scams. Okay. I just had a friend of mine get hit for $800 because somebody
was posing as the IRS using one of these numbers, matter of fact.
So Frank, did you have a lot of familiarity with these types of things?

(01:01:15):
Absolutely. So, so one of the things just to start off, first of all.
If you are unsure about anything, the FBI has a website called ic3.gov,
the letter I, the letter C, the letter three dot gov.
And that's called the Internet Crime Complaint Center.
So it will spell out all of those scams.

(01:01:37):
But after that, listen, you said it, Dave.
The most vulnerable are the elderly because they just are.
I hate scammers, but I love talking to them, though, because I'll take them all the way.
By the time they get finished with me, I'll have everything on them.
But don't answer the phone, y'all. We got these iPhones and all these different

(01:02:00):
phones and my iPhone is set up.
If I don't have you in my phone, you're not coming through because I don't feel
like I don't have time to be dealing with a lot of those different things.
You can set your phone so you won't have to deal. Not no block.
There's not no block that.
But the other thing, too, is for people like Lens H who know about this and

(01:02:22):
know about IC3 and know people in law enforcement.
Me because now link to call me and ask me anything you've got
to educate these elderly people because that
oh well the iris this is irs and you better
meet me down at the acme with uh a cashier check get out of here iris would
never call me to ask me right boom they don't call you for no money no no you

(01:02:45):
know and so we got to educate these older people because they're not tech savvy
and And I'm blessed that in between lens generation and old school.
So I know how to get down with all the stuff y'all do, but I know how to flow back to old school, too.
But we got to be smart. And listen, if if somebody listen, Dave,

(01:03:05):
you know, this is such and such.
And your nephew's here and he needs X, Y, Z and he's stuck in Ohio.
Yo, I call your nephew up and just verify.
Stop all that nonsense. message don't don't give
out personal information i don't give
out the internet got a lot of personal information anyway you give out personal
information every day but i'd be doggone if you're going to call me and start

(01:03:28):
asking me listen even even my banks and stuff they ask me i'll be like yo i'll
come in the bank and i'll be i'm not i'm not i don't know what you want.
Yeah we got a thing going on we got we got a thing going on right now i work
for I work for state, I work for social services.
And there's a big fraud thing going on with food benefit cards, right?

(01:03:51):
And card people information is being used all over the country.
You might have your card right in your hand and somebody's charging stuff in
New York or California or whatever, because what they did is they put these
scanners on the machines now where in the markets and so forth.
And they're collecting everybody's information.

(01:04:12):
The only one piece of information they need from you, believe it or not, is your PIN code.
And you don't believe how many people will give up their PIN number if somebody
calls them and ask them for it. Yeah.
And that's all they need is your PIN number. They're in order to charge all
over the country because what they're doing is charging, doing online charges

(01:04:34):
through places like Target and Walmart and those type of stores that you can do it online.
BJ's and some BJ's stuff too. So you just got to be careful, folks.
As an older person myself, believe me, I made it a point to be as versed as I can be online.
Leonard is a very tech-savvy person. And so if I don't know something,

(01:04:59):
if I have questions, I'll ask Leonard in a minute, do you know about this? Or something like that.
But as far as the fraud stuff and all that kind of stuff, I try to stay up on
all of of that stuff that's one of the reasons i wanted to talk about the story
real quick because real quick go ahead you just gave a another great example
we gotta slow down just slow down.

(01:05:21):
No seriously slow down because you talked about those
skimmers when you go to a gas station they
put them skimmers on there for the same reason why you said if you
go to a gas station to put your card in and something don't look
right or it's an extra piece of equipment or something
slow down just and this is what i
this is what i this is what i have told my family

(01:05:43):
my entire time working with the fbi and still today
we are so accustomed to this
fast-paced microwave society i
used to always tell my wife because i spent
a lot of time out in the way when you go shopping
with my babies are you alone in the
mall when you come out put that

(01:06:04):
little cell phone down stop all of this when you
walk out that door stop and look at
your surroundings right look at where
you're parked and i tell people this because i work human trafficking if you
see a big white van next to your car don't go to your car right wait if you're

(01:06:24):
driving home you see somebody making a three four turns go the other way we
have to we're a non this generation is so
non-observant, they never look up.
Yeah, that's true. They never look up. They don't. They don't be ready to pop at you in your head.
You know what I mean? So we got to slow down and we got to be more observant

(01:06:44):
because nine times out of ten, these scams, these robbers, these people that
are trying to hurt you, they're right in front of your face,
but you got to stop and look.
Yeah, Leonard and I have talked a couple of times.
I told Leonard, you know, a lot of people are carrying guns these days,
you know, and, you know, they have the, you know, the permits to carry guns.

(01:07:07):
And I've told Leonard many times and I told him it's happened a couple of times.
If I see somebody going in a store and they got a gun on there you know they
visibly have a gun on them I wait I don't go in the store with them I sit and
I wait till they come out because
you know it may it may look like right you know might be a cool situation but

(01:07:29):
I don't want to find out I'll wait till they come out and leave you know and
if they come running out I know it wasn't a cool situation it wasn't a situation,
That's the part of slowing down and being observant. There you go. There you go. That's me.
That's what I do. I don't care.
It might be a cop or it might be the... I see a cop. There's a cop walking his dog every day.

(01:07:51):
Somebody said something to me one day, because me and Leonard live basically
in the same neighborhood.
But I see this guy every morning. Well, Leonard lives in Hollywood Hills. No. I don't know.
But I I see this cop every morning and I had to look at him a couple of times
because he walks around with his gun on his hip every time I see him and he's walking his little dog.

(01:08:13):
And I just said, you know, you know, the white guy and so forth.
And I was saying, I wonder what would happen if I was walking my dog every day
with the gun on my hip like that.
Suspicious person to be in jail. Right.
Right. Yeah, that's that's what I'm saying. But anyway, I just wanted to bring
that story up and just so we can get people to slow down and pay attention.

(01:08:37):
And just use the smarts when it comes to these calls and talking to people over the phone and so forth.
So we're going to move on to our next story. Go ahead, Leonard, with that story.
Sure. So our next story, I just want to highlight. And I saw this on blacknews.com.
It says single moms become homeowners thanks to a gift from Warren Dunn.

(01:09:02):
And Dave, I brought this up because when I was in college, all we heard about
was Warren Dunn because he played for Florida State University,
which is in the same city as FAMU. So, you know, you know, at that time,
everybody was a Warwick Dunn fan.
And I believe he was also from Tampa.
And one of my best friends in my early years of college was from Tampa.

(01:09:24):
So, you know, we heard all the stories.
He was a hell of a football player. Oh, yeah, definitely.
But, you know, I brought this story up and, you know, I was reading it and made me think.
So what this story says is in Atlanta, he partnered with Habitat for Humanity
and via their partnership, they were able to provide the down payment assistance for two,

(01:09:48):
I believe, single mothers with children, of course, to purchase their first home.
And it goes on to talk about the article. And I remembered something I saw on
social media and I actually Googled it.
Back in, I'm trying to see what the year was, in 2023, I just want to be sure

(01:10:10):
I have the information correct.
So Warren Dunn had a fund prior, which he had challenged football players to
donate money for mothers to buy their first house. And of course,
that was inspired by his mother.
But it said that he had been able to help 217 single mothers purchase houses throughout his career.

(01:10:38):
And, you know, you know, of course, we hear about, you know,
Shaq accumulating all these wealth and riches and Steve Harvey, a lot of these athletes.
And, you know, a lot of times, you know, there's people who don't get credited,
but I didn't want to say because, you know, for him to be on a mission to help
single mothers, you know, purchase their first house, I think is very honorable.

(01:11:00):
So, you know, I just kind of wanted to speak about that.
I remember when my mother bought her first house and, you know,
I remember what a joyous occasion it was, you know, we thought we were moving
on up like the Jefferson.
So, you know, for him to do that, you know, I just think it's commendable, even still to this day.
I'm not sure how long he's been out to leave, but, you know,

(01:11:21):
it's definitely been a while.
I'm not sure, Dave or Frank, do you have any additional information regarding
work done or the purchasing of houses or?
First of all, one of the biggest things is if, like you said,
You knew him. A lot of us who grew up in that era watched him play.

(01:11:41):
One thing that was evident that you saw first is that he was an overachiever
because he was undersized.
Right. Right. Yeah. He was out there and he was out there doing his thing.
So he so he he was he was our hero.
One of the things that you talk about these houses is when you think about you got to go to the why.

(01:12:01):
Why are you doing this? You know, I was some people are philanthropists and
they do whatever never because they just want tax write-offs or whatever.
But Warwick's main focus was that his late mother, who's deceased now,
she was a single parent for years.
And it took her years, like you said, in 1997 to achieve her first home.

(01:12:22):
So that's his whole vision.
I want to help all these less than fortunate mothers to be able to do it.
So he took his mother's example and he just ran with it. Now he has means and
he's able to assist and help others and that's what he's doing.
So I think he's very honorable.
Yeah. He actually, if you ever, if you ever heard him talk or heard him speak, he was a very.

(01:12:49):
Easy to like person. He, he wasn't cocky.
He didn't have, you know, you could tell that anytime he was in the crowd or
something, there was always a lot of people around them because people just
flock to him because he had that type of personality.
And, and, you know, like I said, he wasn't a big guy, he, you know,
but he was very good at what he did.

(01:13:10):
And, and for him to do something like this was really great because you don't hear it.
You don't hear the stories like that from the
athletes of today you know because
these guys are making more money in baseball and
basketball and football than they ever did i'm
a wip listener um i listen to

(01:13:32):
sports radio a lot and one of
my favorite shows is a former eagle by the
name of ike reese my man yeah you
know about ike reese ike reese talked about it you
know he said man he said i'm so
mad at my parents because they they they procreated at the wrong time he said

(01:13:52):
man i need to be able to get some of this money these guys are making now you
know so he said i thought i was doing well back then but these guys he said
the scrubs are making you know millions and millions of dollars you know and And he said,
you know, so, but, but a lot of them aren't doing the things now.
LeBron, you know, LeBron is probably one of the biggest, he's right at the top,

(01:14:16):
you know, as far as the biggest stars in any sport right now, he does give back a lot.
He does do a lot of things, but, you know, but when you hear about somebody
doing something like this with the, you know, cause he doesn't have LeBron money,
you know what I'm saying?
Right. You know, LeBron sneezes money out, you know what I'm saying?

(01:14:36):
So, so that's really commendable. And I, I think it's a great story and hopefully
those people that he has helped definitely understand exactly what has happened.
And then the other thing to, to Dave's point is Warwick doesn't have that platform that LeBron has.

(01:14:58):
Right. However.
What he has, he doesn't even get the media. So this one came out. So this was good.
But whatever he has, he gives to.
And the main objective is that he wants to he wants single mothers to understand
that home ownership is achievable. Like I said, the platform.

(01:15:19):
So when you go and you look to do the research so far, he's had he has served
and helped over 225 family.
Now, that's not a whole lot according to whatever, but that's what he's done.
And so that's commendable. That's commendable. That's right.
That's right. That's right.
So our hats off to you, Mr. Ward.

(01:15:40):
Thank you for that. Thank you for that. Okay, our last story I'm going to go
back to a story that Leonard and I talked about A while back And I'm just giving
a little update on the story I'm not sure, Frank,
if you heard about this story But this was a story about this guy who worked
for Burger King Who was honored for his 27 years of perfect attendance.

(01:16:06):
And what they gave him was a bag of candy deep yeah do you remember did you
hear this story yeah yeah yeah i've heard okay okay okay okay so,
when lennon and i heard the story we went you know we went crazy about the story
we couldn't believe it and they gave him a lanyard and a movie ticket it was

(01:16:27):
crazy so but anyway i wanted to read this update because i saw the update on
and i just wanted to share this with people people.
Kevin Ford, a Las Vegas resident who went viral in 2022 for his 27-year perfect
attendance record at Burger King, gained widespread support after receiving
a goodie bag from the company.

(01:16:48):
Following a successful GoFundMe campaign started by his daughter,
Ford was able to purchase a house and recently announced his next big venture,
which was starting his own food truck business. this.
In a message to his supporters on the fundraiser page, Ford wrote, update everyone.

(01:17:09):
It's been a while. I miss y'all. He spelled y'all Y-A-W-L. I love it.
But I wanted you to be the first to know,
what you made possible for me to be able to do for my family.
Thanks to your love, kindness, and generosity, I was able to go all in on this

(01:17:34):
wonderful, adventurous, new chapter of my life, a food truck.
He added, you did this. Remember, we're doing big things.
I want to thank you for your continued love and support, For you have truly
saved me and continue to change my life, my life and the lives of my children

(01:17:54):
and grandchildren for the better every day.
In 2022, Ford was acknowledged by Burger King for 27 years of perfect attendance.
But the video of his celebration went viral for an unexpected reason.
Instead of a grand jester, he received a bag of candy, a movie ticket,
a lanyard, a Starbucks cup, two pens.

(01:18:16):
And key change in recognition of his service.
And Dave, why would they give him a Starbucks cup?
Who knows, man? Think about it. A Starbucks cup. I mean, come on now.
And then they said, people say that you can't, this is what the company said.
People say that you can't keep workers nowadays.

(01:18:37):
He even worked through, now they're bragging now. He even worked through early
COVID days, never missing a day of work.
This union guy's worked at Vegas airport for over 27 years.
He got nothing on his 25th anniversary date, but just look how grateful his

(01:18:58):
employer was on his 27th year.
Thank you everyone for all the love and support. Now, one thing about Mr.
Ford is he He was very humble.
Even through that experience, even in the video, you could tell he wanted to
say something, but he didn't. You know what I mean?
But the fact that he was able to...

(01:19:21):
To hang on and whatever and his daughter who was the
one that got really upset was the one that
started to go for me page they raised immediately raised over
400 000 wow and yeah it
was crazy immediately raised over for it because everybody was you know supporting
them and on you know i mean they should have did more than what they did for

(01:19:41):
him so um and and he remained humble throughout the whole thing he didn't get
upset he didn't well he didn't show it to anybody let's put it that way You know,
you know, we probably did get upset behind the scenes, but he handled it the right way.
And look at the reward. So I saw this and I just said, Oh, man,
we got to talk about we got to talk about everybody here.

(01:20:04):
And, you know, you could tell this guy came up, you know, he was well based.
And, you know, here's another one, we talked about our parents and the mentors
in our lives and so forth.
So he was where he was raised well, and he handled it well, because I know,
you know, So working can be thankful.
I'm thankless at times, especially if you're a person that goes to work every

(01:20:26):
day. I'm a person that goes to work every day.
I can tell you, I've never missed a day of work in my life.
I never called out or anything like that in my life. Okay.
If I, the only time I've ever missed any time is if I was sick or something
and, or, you know, and that happened once that I can think of.
So, and so I'm going to give you a bag of candy and some Starbucks tomorrow. Yeah.

(01:20:52):
No, well, no, but I got to choose the candy. I got to choose the candy.
So it doesn't matter. I'll take the bag.
Hey, Dave and a gift card to child. So, you know, you get a good meal.
It better be a two hundred dollar gift card. That's what I'm saying.
No, no, no. Five dollars. Five dollars.

(01:21:14):
Okay but but i just wanted to say good job and hopefully he does well with his
food truck and i just wanted to give an update to that particular story because
i saw it and i was like oh man we got to talk about him man we got to talk about
him so job well done well done,
okay so here we are to the favorite part this is by the way frank this is len's

(01:21:36):
favorite part So this is where we call it Dave's Corner.
You see him over there shaking his head. Why are you shaking your head? Stop.
Anyway, this is Dave's Corner. And this is where we always ask a philosophical
question or, you know, what do I want to say?
Hypothetical. You know, hypothetical. Yeah, a hypothetical situation.

(01:21:59):
So this is my question for today for the both of you. So I'm going to ask the
question and both of you will get a chance to answer.
But questions. All right. If you had the power to erase one historical event
from ever happening, which event would you choose and why?

(01:22:21):
Let's start with you, Leonard. I'm going to start.
A-F, Frank. Frank, did you know how he had to say my whole name?
Leonard. Leonard. Leonard.
See, he wasn't prepared for that. That's why I said that. I threw a little pass
to him. You see that? Did you check that out?
That's a fist. That was a fist right there. Okay, come on. Talk to me.

(01:22:44):
All right. So I think the event that I would erase from ever happening is would be slavery.
And it wouldn't be what slavery first started as.
And just to get my super quick background, this past February,

(01:23:05):
I had the chance to go to Africa and we went to Ghana.
And in Ghana, we went to a place that was called the Point of No Return,
which is once they boarded those boats Yeah, kind of across the ocean.
And one of the things they told us, and to be honest, in all my years,
this is the first time I ever heard this.
And I'll try to make it super quick. So they said that the Africans practice slavery,

(01:23:32):
but their slavery was more of indentured servants where people would work off
their, you know, what they owed.
And they said it wasn't until the Europeans came and they took slavery to a whole nother level.
They took it into ownership, into, you know, beating and raping and selling as if they own property.

(01:23:56):
So the indentured servants part, I understand because I think all nations at
that time had some form of indentured servant or slavery.
But I would take away the slavery that resulted in the beating,
killing, raping, plundering, you know, of mankind.
So that that's what I would take away.

(01:24:18):
How do you feel about that, David? That was pretty good, man.
You shocked me a little bit. But anyway. OK, how about you, Frank?
Man, I love that because that was the Africans had that whole slave thing going on with the Arabs.
You would travel across the desert for that thing.
And then it was the Europeans that came in, got where they were from.

(01:24:43):
Portuguese, it was the Portuguese that came in.
And that point where you were, they left from that point, but they had an island
that they would transfer from.
But they would transfer from this one place to that island and prepare them to go to the seas.
And that was horrible. I probably, for me, David, probably would be,

(01:25:04):
that whole civil rights era around the time when we were growing up in the 50s
and the 60s i just from the the children's boycott to the the beating on the
bridge down in montgomery to,
the the the officers of releasing dogs on people just when i see that it just it it pains my spirit,

(01:25:25):
that one race would treat another race like that and and and and i ain't even
gonna get i don't do politics too well but somebody said they want to make something
great again i don't want to go back.
And and and those are the
things i when you talk about ike was born in i don't know that i could have

(01:25:49):
lived in that generation because i i would i probably would have been dead real
quick so but i just don't like how one race would attempt to treat another race right you know like that,
It pains me every time I see footage on it.
And when I worked for the FBI, I was a civil rights coordinator,

(01:26:10):
so I had to work a lot of those cases.
That's a good one. That's definitely a good one. If it was...
Okay. What about you, David? If you had one power to erase from history,
from ever happening, what would it be and why?
For me, it would be 9-11. Hmm. Yeah, that was, I guess it's so vivid in my mind

(01:26:38):
that day, that whole day.
It's one of those things that I don't think would ever go away from any of us,
you know, because we kind of, it's one of the few days that we probably remember
everything we did that day. You know what I mean?
Because it affected us in a way that it was.

(01:26:58):
It was just like, yeah, it was like having an out-of-body experience watching
everything that unfolded, you know.
And I guess as an FBI agent, I guess it must have been really crazy for you. Right, Frank?
You know what's crazy about it, Dave, is I remember exactly where I was.

(01:27:19):
We were, I was working that morning. I was up in Bluebell up there in Pennsylvania.
We were working a bank robbery.
And we were waiting for him to come out. And we're sitting at the Blue Bell Mall.
And all of a sudden, I don't know, 9, 17, somewhere around there, first plane hit.
And back then, we didn't have televisions and cell phones and all that kind

(01:27:41):
of stuff like we have now.
But I had a little portable, small, little five-inch television that I had that
I would carry with me because I worked on the street in my car all the time.
And I've turned it on and I saw that. And we're like, man, somebody,
some kind of accident or something.
Them about 9 57 somewhere around there
the second plane hit and when the second plane hit

(01:28:01):
and this i remember this got a call special operations got a call to pull my
squad off go home pack your bags report to ground zero and the craziest thing
that i remember i live in there the craziest thing that
I remember is when I came home, they had sent my, my kids were in elementary.

(01:28:25):
One was in middle school and other two were in elementary. They had sent them home.
And I remember we did have cell phones. You, you couldn't get through any cell
phones. They were all gyms. Every line was, but the most, the most eerie thing for me was.
When I got home, my wife was here. My parents were here. Her parents were here.
My kids were here. And they were all staring at me. And I was like, I got to go.

(01:28:47):
And they're like, well, when you're coming back? I don't know. I don't know.
We got we got to go chase these terrorists. But I remember going out to my backyard
and we live. So you got Summit Airport.
Right. And then you got the Philadelphia Airport. So at any given time,
when I go outside, you can see a plane either going up or coming down.
There were no planes in the sky at all

(01:29:09):
everything stopped it was eerie and
i just remember going a hundred miles an hour up to
new york and it was crazy and when we got there the rest is history it was to
experience what we saw was crazy that was no i don't wish that on nobody so
i'm with you dave i don't i don't wish that on anybody yeah yeah that was uh

(01:29:30):
it's funny like i said it's It's easy to remember everything.
I actually was getting dressed for work, and I had a little portable radio in the bathroom.
Like I said, I listen to WIP. I've been listening to WIP over 30-plus years.
And so every morning, even to this day, my routine is I turn that radio station

(01:29:50):
on, and I get dressed and, you know, take my shower and everything, listen to sports.
Maria Hughes, who was one of the commentators on the morning show.
Announced i just saw the craziest thing she said i just saw a plane hit the you know hit the tower.
And so they got you know they started talking about it

(01:30:13):
and whatever and then she said this was
so crazy she says huh looks like
they're showing replay of what just happened and then
all of a sudden she said wait hold on no that's not
a replay that's a second play right great rain
and that was crazy and so that's when
everything just kind of changed and i'm like and i

(01:30:34):
was working for a security company at the time i've worked
for a company called security watch and they
were that company actually supplied
security cameras and all
types of security stuff for the federal
government and i worked for that company at that
time man i go into work we're all all

(01:30:57):
that and work we were gathered around the tv and
everybody's talking about this and that and then all of a sudden the phone started
going everybody's cell phone starts going over come get your kids because my
kid was in kindergarten at the time my youngest kid was in kindergarten at the
time and they were all sitting out on the curb outside their school when i picked them up,

(01:31:18):
It was it was just one of those days that you'll never forget.
And man, I'm just sorry that that happened. If I had a chance to change something
and erase something, that would be mine. Do you remember where you were?
Yeah, I was I was in college and I remember I showed up to one of my classes,

(01:31:41):
which I didn't want to be there anyway.
But when I walked into the class, there were only like three people in the classroom.
Classroom and i'm sitting there and literally you know the class was supposed
to be starting in like a minute or two and we were the only three in there and
somebody came into the classroom was like you know did you hear what happened

(01:32:01):
and we're like no you know we didn't hear what happened,
and they're like you know some planes just hit
you know one of the buildings in new york so i
go out into the hallway and I go to like like a little mini cafeteria area they
had some TVs and you know of course all they were doing was showing replays
over and over and over again and I think you know when we're there you know

(01:32:25):
even with the second plane hitting when that building,
tumbled down it was like wow like whoa and everyone you know kind of like you
said everyone just started calling trying to call their families you know calling
people everyone was talking about You know,
I went back to my apartment and literally,
you know, we just watched it on TV, you know, all day. I was down in Florida.

(01:32:49):
My family, of course, was here in Delaware. So, of course, there's a fear,
you know, is stuff going to be happening in Philadelphia?
You know, where else are they going to target?
So, you know, we didn't even talk about the third plane that went down.
Remember the plane that went down? Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, so, and that's what had everybody fearful, because of that blanket.

(01:33:12):
Yeah, Pittsburgh and the Pentagon, it was four.
Yeah, so, but, yeah, it's a day I don't think any of us will ever forget.
And, well, you know, so, but there you have it, folks.
That was our answers. I know you guys are probably thinking to yourself,
what would you, you know, what event you would like to erase from history?

(01:33:33):
So, you know, as always, go ahead and send us your thoughts,
let us know so, you know, we can read your thoughts and everything.
And, you know, if you want us to post them, we would definitely post them and
let people know what you had to say.
Frank, we're going to give you one last time to go ahead and give your contact
information and what you have coming up before we end the show.

(01:33:56):
This is your time to do so.
Yep. Frank Burton, Jr. You can reach me on social media. Apostle Frank Burton Jr., Frank Burton Jr.
I have a big podcast interview coming out tomorrow.
It'll be on all my social media about a hate crime that I was involved with in 2007.
It set a precedent, the first of its kind in the Eastern District of Pennsylvania,

(01:34:19):
and the 34th of its kind since 9-11.
And then I'm just working with these outstanding young people at Delaware State
University, as well as Wilmington University.
So you can find me out and about in the community. I'm there.
Yeah. All right. Well, Leonard and I both want to take this opportunity to thank you for coming on.

(01:34:39):
Thank you. Thank you. And giving us those great stories and letting us know
about your life and your book.
And hoping that, you know, this helps to inspire someone who may be listening
to go ahead and do something great, whatever that may be.
You know and especially you got

(01:34:59):
three black men sitting around talking about it you
know what I mean you know and that's to be inspiration
in itself we're not talking crazy we're not
talking about all kinds of craziness and cussing
and all that kind of stuff we're talking about positive stuff and hopefully
that will lead to positive results for a lot of people that maybe let's make

(01:35:21):
the best of the year so thank you once again for joining news and trends with
Dave and Lynn. You got anything you want to add before we turn off?
Nope. Frank, I just want to thank you for coming on. I think it was very informative
because some of those Secret Service agencies, we don't really understand them
because unfortunately, probably a lot of stuff you're not able to talk about.

(01:35:43):
But I thank you for opening our eyes. Like Dave said,
I hope this is almost like an open call for people who might have been considering
or might be interested that this may be a good opportunity for a young man or a woman.
Thank you, guys. Thank you, guys, for having me. All right. Okay.

(01:36:04):
Well, there you have it, folks. News and Trends with Dave and Len.
We will talk to you again next week.
Join us next week for another edition of News and Trends.
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