November 5, 2025 • 35 mins
We're revisiting a favorite episode from the archive to celebrate Next City's Winter Film Festival, this year's series: "Power and Place."
What happens when a Brooklyn neighborhood takes on deep-pocketed developers? In this episode, we talk to the directors of "Emergent City" and the organizers who fought to preserve Sunset Park’s future.
“Emergent City” (emergentcitydoc.com) documents the 10-year saga of how Brooklyn's Sunset Park community came together to fight a rezoning wanted by deep-pocketed developers. Against all odds, residents won. Filmmakers were there from the very beginning, when developers proposed transforming Industry City, a sprawling industrial site on the Brooklyn waterfront, into a high-end retail and office complex – or, as some residents put it, a “mall.” They were there when Sunset Park residents protested that the Industry City complex, if it won rezoning, would accelerate gentrification and displacement in a neighborhood where about 70% of households are renters. They were there for some 200 days of public meetings.
What happens when a Brooklyn neighborhood takes on deep-pocketed developers? In this episode, we talk to the directors of "Emergent City" and the organizers who fought to preserve Sunset Park’s future.
“Emergent City” (emergentcitydoc.com) documents the 10-year saga of how Brooklyn's Sunset Park community came together to fight a rezoning wanted by deep-pocketed developers. Against all odds, residents won. Filmmakers were there from the very beginning, when developers proposed transforming Industry City, a sprawling industrial site on the Brooklyn waterfront, into a high-end retail and office complex – or, as some residents put it, a “mall.” They were there when Sunset Park residents protested that the Industry City complex, if it won rezoning, would accelerate gentrification and displacement in a neighborhood where about 70% of households are renters. They were there for some 200 days of public meetings.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey everyone, it's Lucas from Next City. We're revisiting a
favorite episode of ours from the archive today because it
connects directly to something new that I'm really excited to
tell you about. Last year at this time, as part
of our effort to bring you more films, we featured
the documentary Emergent City. It captures the story of a
decade long fight against displacement in Brooklyn Sunset Park. Residents
(00:26):
got organized, resisted rezoning, and ultimately they won. So this
episode is our conversation with the filmmakers and the organizers
behind that fight. We're sharing it again now because Next
City just announced plans for our new winter film festival,
and we're going big with four incredible films to pick from.
Each documentary explores what home really means in America today,
(00:47):
from homelessness response systems to community land trusts to the
lingering fallout from the foreclosure crisis. We're calling the series
Power and Place, a film series on housing, power and
collective action, partnering with the film's directors to make these
amazing stories available to you starting in December. More good news,
we figured out how to scrap paid ticketing, so like
(01:07):
everything else, we do at Next City. The films will
be pay what you wish to access. After you sign up,
you'll have two weeks to stream them anytime on demand.
It's pay what you wish, so no one is prevented
from watching, but we do hope some of you are
able to contribute more. Every dollar helps keep Next Cities
journalism free and accessible. Our year end campaign just launched
and our goal is to rally readers, listeners and viewers
(01:30):
to raise thirty thousand dollars to fund Next Citi's work
in twenty twenty six. In addition to everything else we do,
we want to create a platform for filmmakers to reach
you with stories like these that reveal what's possible when
communities organize and refuse to accept displacement as inevitable. So
as you listen to this episode from last year, I
hope you get a sense of why we love documentary storytelling.
Go ahead and register now for this year's film series
(01:52):
at nexcity dot org. Slash events now Here's Emergent City.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Strawt Media.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Communities are wanting to be at the stable about the development,
and I think that you know this is a beautiful
story that unfold. That said that that is one hundred
percent possible, and that that's something that we should strive for.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
This is Lucas Grindley from Next City, a show about
change makers and their stories. Truth is, there are solutions
to the problems of pressing people in cities. If you're listening,
I hope it's because you want to spread good ideas
from one today to the next city. On today's episode,
the story of how one community actually stopped a developer.
It's a pretty incredible story about fighting displacement. But before
(02:52):
we get into this week's episode, we have something to celebrate.
This is our one hundredth episode. Where does the time go?
As I've been thinking about what I want to say
to you on our one hundredth episode, we are, unfortunately,
at this very same time, living through a terrible moment
(03:13):
in the history of our country, one that requires action.
And that's what the show has always been about. People
have always stood up for their neighbors and their communities.
Maybe we haven't heard about their work, maybe it gets overlooked,
but these stories exist and people are persisting regardless of
whether they thought anyone from the federal government was coming
to help. Probably they were sure no one would, so
(03:35):
Next City. Listeners, I don't say this lightly. You are
what this country needs right now, and I very sincerely
hope that one hundred episodes from now, I'll be talking
to one of you about what you did in this
moment to turn strangers into neighbors, to prioritize people over profits,
and to be in solidarity with each other, because it
will take all of us together if we want our
(03:56):
values to survive and to win. Probably not surprising, that's
exactly what today's story is about. We are lucky to
be among the very first people to see a new documentary, Emergencity,
which tells the story of Sunset Park in Brooklyn. Here
is a community that came together to fight a rezoning
which was wanted by deep pocketed developers, and against all odds,
(04:19):
they won. How did they do it? That is an
answer all of us are going to need in these
times when we're up against the rich and powerful. Even
outside of battles over redevelopment.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
All over the United States, community is looking to shut
down the industrial sector because it's killing them. Here in
Sunset Park, we've had to think about how do you
retain the working class character of the community, How do
you keep it a walk to work community and keep
it industrial, but not at the expense of our lives.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
That was a clip from Emergent City featuring Elizabeth Yempierre,
the executive director with Uprows. Elizabeth is in the middle
of giving us a bus.
Speaker 5 (04:56):
Tour and then to the luck You're going to see
Industry City, and you could see you could see gentrification
all over it, everything from the avocado tells that they
serve out to.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
The yoga met The filmmakers behind Emergent City were there
recording as a ten year saga unvolted beginning when developers
proposed transforming Industry City, a sprawling industrial site on the
Brooklyn waterfront, into a high end retail and office complex.
The opponent said that was just a fancy way of
describing what amounts to a mall.
Speaker 6 (05:28):
We started looking a couple years ago and Industry City,
there was so much space and they were willing to
build it out for us.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Here is another clip from the film, which includes a
much more sunny view from one of the office complex's
new tenants.
Speaker 6 (05:42):
It's not banal, it's not the mall. It's not cookie cutter.
You know, it has personality, It has character. People want
that they need that, that's what nurtures their soul. They're
creating it here, and I would not in an artificial way.
You know, the creatives want to be here. They're transforming
(06:07):
the neighborhood and they've to succeeded.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
It's always about the creatives, right, They want to be there,
so it must be a good thing. We started with
a clip from a tour led by the opponents. Here's
one led by Industry City. Someone on the tour is
asking a question of their guy.
Speaker 7 (06:24):
Walking down me on thirty sixth Street.
Speaker 8 (06:25):
I mean, it's really gritty.
Speaker 7 (06:27):
It still has a grittiness that Manhattan has lost.
Speaker 6 (06:30):
Yeah, we're going to talk about that a little bit.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
You're not going to see that as much inside, but
it's really an oasis amongst a working class community.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
For me, that was a pretty striking moment right at
the start of the documentary, that tour guide calls Industry
City an oasis amongst a working class community, as if
we need an escape from who exactly the working class.
It's no surprise then that the community members felt the
Industry City complex, if it won rezoning, would accelerate gentrification
(07:02):
and displacement in their neighborhood where nearly seventy percent of
households are renters. Their fight became about more than just
saying no. It was about who gets to craft a
vision for the future, the people who live there, or
developers hoping to woo creatives and tenants in tax revenue.
In a moment, we're going to hear from the co directors,
Kelly Anderson and j Arthur Sterenberg, who stuck with this
(07:24):
story so long that we're able to get a rare
window into what it is like to be part of
these fights over displacement. Their earliest footage, if you can
believe it, is from twenty thirteen. But we are also
lucky to be joined by two people who were enmeshed
in that messy process. Carlos Minchaka was the local city
council member who we watch as he makes a high
stakes decision about which way to vote, all the while
(07:47):
trying to negotiate with industry city developers while trying to
hold together this coalition of community leaders. Another of them
is Marcella Matteinis, a tenant organizer featured in the film. Today,
she is in New York State Assembly member, which goes
to show how these moments can identify our new generation
of leaders and call them into service. We're also joined
by Next City's senior Economic justice correspondent, Oscar Periobello, who
(08:11):
is the author of a new book, The Banks We Deserve,
about how communities can use the power of banking to
gain agency about their futures. If you're watching Emergencity, you're
going to see Oscar in public meetings in the film
with his notebook covering what's happening for Next City.
Speaker 9 (08:29):
My name is Kelly Anderson. This film Jay and I
have been working on for about seven years, and I
live in Sunset Park, so it was really on our doorstep.
Speaker 10 (08:38):
Hi, my name is Jay Arthur Stenberg, co director with
Kelly and also editor. And this is very much a
labor of love and kind of a dream come true
to get to work on a project like this sort
of in my community and try to highlight something over
a long period of time that's so obtuse and hard
to see and figure out a way to frame it
and make it hopefully engaging enough to really like call
(09:00):
an audience's attention and see through these these these processes
that are sort of intentionally hard to fathom.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
They are hard to fathom. All right, if you watch Emergency,
you're exhausted by the endless process of meetings which are
supposed to be how we engage in city decision making.
But you get the sense that, wow, if this is
how we make decisions, then the process is designed to
leave out people who don't have the time, so much
time to stay at the table, so to speak, and
(09:31):
even when you're there taking part in these meetings, it's
an unwelcoming process.
Speaker 8 (09:38):
We are not going to shut this meeting down tonight.
Speaker 7 (09:41):
That's not going to happen tonight. We have to vote,
and that's what's going to happen.
Speaker 4 (09:45):
To one second place, did you please someone who's ever
is sitting near a window open it up?
Speaker 7 (09:51):
Yes, Barbara, to shut out.
Speaker 9 (10:01):
We filmed i think, almost close to two hundred different
days of community meetings. So this is distilled from a
huge archive of you know, very long meetings, and so
we needed people to just you know film all of that.
So there was a lot of just you know, going
out and just whoever was available that night, you know,
(10:22):
film it.
Speaker 10 (10:23):
Yeah, I mean the public meetings were a big part
of it. All the community board process, which we could
go as community members and document Obviously, the other big
piece was wanting it was really important to us to
make sure that like the developers were part of it,
and that you know, the Industry City was part of it,
and so that that piece of it was for us
also what would make this film unique and not just
(10:45):
something that is about, you know, a community resisting something,
but something that's looking at it from all these different angles,
trying to be really open about the fact that like,
we're not this isn't We're not trying to make something
that's like an argument for or against a thing. We're
trying to like look at this process and watch it
as it unfolds, and I hope that we did justice
to all those different perspectives.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Here is Kelly Anderson again on how she pitched the
film to funders.
Speaker 9 (11:11):
We did talk about Industry City, you know, which has
a certain kind of magnetism to it because it's so
big and iconic and for New York. Some people had
been there and we're like, oh, yeah, that's weird. I
like it, but I'm not sure if I should like it,
And you know, there's a little bit of that, but
I think ultimately what sold ITVS On it was some
(11:34):
of the access that we had to the folks at
Industry City and also Carlos and Marcella. Like the fact
that we were able to be that fly on the
wall in those meetings, I think was part of what
people felt like they hadn't seen before that really observational
just be there and experience what's happening in this feeling
that we're sort of pulling the curtain back on a
(11:56):
process that you don't usually get to see that much.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Of the filmmakers say that they were a fly on
the wall, they mean they were in some truly incredible meetings.
Cameras were in the room even during negotiations with developers,
thanks to City council Member Carlos Manchaka, who knew the
filmmakers and trusted them.
Speaker 7 (12:19):
For me, what really.
Speaker 11 (12:22):
Rang true was the commitment from the film team, Jay
and Kelly. Knowing them from the community, and I'm like,
you can't tell the story without going in, and so
very early I thought I need to utilize my power
as a council member. In New York City, the council
member has deference, so everybody looks at the council member
(12:43):
and says, whatever you want you get, so I only
have veto power. So I went to the developers and
I said, you're going to let these documentarian teams come in,
these filmmakers come in and just document and tell the
story later. None of this be used in the middle
against you. It'll be later.
Speaker 7 (13:03):
And it was. But the second part.
Speaker 11 (13:05):
Was was taking this film and bringing it into the
community as an archive.
Speaker 7 (13:11):
So what we are.
Speaker 11 (13:12):
Looking to do soon is figure out how we build
an archive for folks to see the whole meeting, not
just the film masterful film, yeah, but to go in
and actually listen to the meeting. I think that the
concept of transparency is really important, So I think people
need to lean into transparency. This is this is radical transparency,
(13:33):
but I think transparency is one of those things that
creates the opportunity for discussion post.
Speaker 7 (13:38):
And in New York.
Speaker 11 (13:39):
Transparency is not an ideal that people hold up. This
is something that is behind closed doors. And especially when
you think about development or even like rule making and bills.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
I think when elected officials pull back and say no, we.
Speaker 11 (13:55):
Don't we don't want to do that. We we're the legislator.
You know, we're gonna We're gonna let just say ourselves,
we're gonna we're gonna figure this out, and I think
we need to push back on that as as as
a community. So for me, it's it's it's a lesson
that that this is what we get right, a fuller picture,
and so I will push that on anybody and everybody
from here and out.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Through this film's lens, we do get an unprecedented window
into democracy and action, complete with the tension, collaboration, and
clashing visions that come with deciding the fate of a neighborhood.
After the break, we'll talk about those hard moments, and
we'll talk to one of the organizers who fought for
her neighborhood during those contentious meetings. Welcome back today. Next
(14:47):
City listeners are among the first people to get a
peek at Emergent City, a new documentary that chronicles the
decade long fight over the development of Brooklyn's industry city.
It's a film about zoning, but it isn't just about zoning.
At its heart, Emergencity is about the process of democracy.
It's about how communities navigate competing visions.
Speaker 11 (15:08):
For their future.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Here is one of those moments in a clip from
the film.
Speaker 7 (15:16):
All Right, this is the seventh inning stretch. And I
will say, when my wife asked me earlier.
Speaker 8 (15:20):
Today, how do you feel this is a big light,
I said, I'm excited. This is like democracy in action,
right right, So.
Speaker 7 (15:29):
Yeah, exactly. I don't wipe out hey, hey, dead fifty
one board members. We're all here to service those folks
that are not in the room.
Speaker 5 (15:40):
I'm going to vote no because on this plan, I
see that one community.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Benefit they told about jobs, but they can't even guarantee
that those jobs are going to go to members of
this community.
Speaker 12 (15:53):
This community born I've been working on that waterfront for
twenty years. I Am not going to vote no because
I do want to see stuff down.
Speaker 13 (16:04):
Vote on it.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
To clarify, A yes vote is to disapprove, So yes
to disapprove.
Speaker 13 (16:12):
Lobo well S, Animon, Alexa Vilas Yes, Anita Bulan, Yes
to Alexaso No, David Estrada no, Anteinette Martinez Yes.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
The developers behind Industry City wanted their multi use complex,
but the people in the neighborhood wanted real industry with
real jobs, green jobs. Ideally, Ultimately they won. Here again
is Next City's Oscar Pariobello, followed by community organizer Marcella Bettinez.
Speaker 8 (16:49):
Let's talk about these conversations a little bit. So, what
was it like. We're having a film crew around for
so much of this, to many of these meetings, so
many of these kind of sensitive moments. You might say,
right where where you're kind of going through a really
hard tense conversation. It may not even be with someone
(17:10):
you're necessarily opposing. You might all just be community board members,
just community organizers in the room, but there's still a
sort of like tension there. And somehow You've got a
documentary film crew following you around for some of this.
What was that like? Was there a value that it
brought to your experience in this way?
Speaker 3 (17:28):
I think to Carlos's credit, I think the idea of
the film crew was really important in the sense that
it was clear to us that we didn't know what
we were doing. But that was the whole point of
documenting me and is to have some kind of record
to be able to look back at, right. So I
am incredibly thankful for Carlos with being able to do that.
(17:51):
And that being said, I think that you know, obviously
you're a little nervous and there's extra people around but
I think once we rolled up our sleagion really started working, we,
at least for me, I kind of almost forgot that
they were there. And then there were some intense moments
that I was like, oh my god, did you see that?
Did the camera pick it up? I was like, do
(18:11):
we get that on film? And then sometimes they're like, no,
we don't know what you're talking about and nothing. Oh
and other times it's just like, wow, that might make
it on the film, and then we'll see what plays back,
and then yeah, it was a little crazy.
Speaker 8 (18:27):
Marcella, I think you were the first sort of live
film person voice that comes up in the film.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
You were tenant organizer back then in twenty thirteen. Can
you tell us a little bit about what the neighborhood
is like today?
Speaker 3 (18:43):
The neighborhood is the same and at the same time
changing very rapidly. I think that the pandemic hit really
hard for the working class and they're still kind of
like struggling to get out of it. There is some
development that's coming down the pipeline. I think something that's
really exciting was this idea of wanting to preserve the
(19:05):
waterfront for what could possibly be a new green economy,
and so the swath of land across the street from
Industry City is now being developed for headquarters for equinor
who's going to be building offshore windmills, and so there's
also the creation of a factory and an assembly line
(19:27):
that's in the future also going to produce jobs. And
so despite these really amazing things that are coming, there's
still this need to kind of bring in the community
and have them understand what's happening around them but's being constructed,
and making sure that they understand the important role we're
about to play as a community within the larger nation
(19:50):
of being the first to kind of like create this.
And you know, the truth is, we are in uncertain
times with a new presidential administration coming in and possibly
creating all kinds of chaos and threats to an immigrant
community that has already faced that in the past, and
so I think a lot of what's happening now is
just folks are just trying to kind of come to
(20:11):
terms and understand where we're at. And for me, a
lot of it also just be checking in with people,
making sure that they're okay, and then figuring out how
we're going to come together as a community to kind
of try and you know, prepare for an uncertainty that
we know that that's coming.
Speaker 8 (20:29):
Carlos, you know when at the premiere of this film
that at the tribeck A Film Festival early this year,
afterwards you described asked how you were feeling after seeing
the film, and he said, you were tired, frustrated and proud.
How are you feeling now?
Speaker 11 (20:48):
I think for me, what just rings loudly is this
concept of democracy and what is democracy? I think we're
all asking that question. And here's a film that gives
you a very clear, in depth, insider view of what
it looks like when something happens in a community. It
(21:09):
just happens that it's zoning, and it's a pretty big
project that has big implications. You saw the heat from everyone,
community organizations, business folks. All the interests were alive and well.
And so democracy continues and it's hard and I am
tired and I get tired watching it sometimes because it
(21:30):
was it was something that started. Industry City started the
day that I got elected in twenty fourteen or twenty thirteen,
moving into twenty fourteen, and it was a conversation that
Andrew had with me. We're walking in the park in
Sunset Park in twenty fourteen, and he's like, there's gonna
be a rezoning and we don't know what it's gonna
look like, but we just want to open lines of communication.
(21:52):
And so very early I knew that this was going
to be a big thing and I needed to figure
this out. And here I am a freshman council member
and so lots of work. It's it's it's democracy is hard.
It's going to require us all to be in full form.
Speaker 8 (22:10):
It's hard. It's very tense, and I think it's a
familiar tense for some of us. I think a lot
of us.
Speaker 14 (22:15):
Really, you know, we've been to community board meetings in
New York or you know there's there's similar kind of
local kind of governance bodies in other cities, in other municipalities.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
And that somehow it still has to be a reminder
that that that's part of part of democracy.
Speaker 8 (22:38):
I guess it is.
Speaker 11 (22:40):
And you know what I'll say, and I think this
is part of what I think we're going to have
to think about moving forward, is is where are we
going to have the conversations. I think what you saw
this film where conversations that were happening in the community board,
beautiful little moments where where people were really struggling to
figure it out and having timelines that were so sure,
(23:01):
and not having all the resources. And I got to
say that that there was so much funding that came
in the community board, had a lawyer provided by the
council to really kind of go through this massive document
and that all those things are real, and and like,
are we going to have that in the future, and
who's providing that? And are we are our leaders doing
(23:23):
that today? These are all the.
Speaker 8 (23:25):
Questions, Marcella, I was going to ask you as well,
in terms of, you know, lessons for other communities to
take from this from this film.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
I think for me, it's a realization that the impossible
is only impossible until you make it possible, right. I
think that a lot of us really came together because
we were concerned community members, right. We We were at
a time where we had seeing what rezoning and overdevelopment
(24:03):
had done to other communities of color. We had seen
enough that we knew that it was bad, and we
were able to bring our neighbors together to create a resistance.
But I don't know that any of us really thought
that we were going to be able to bring it
to a complete stop or for this to have ended
the way that it did. But certainly we were all
committed enough to get into the fight to create a resistance.
Speaker 8 (24:26):
And it came out a little bit in the film
in terms of the community vision for the site, and
you mentioned the the using you now opening up opportunities
for offshore winds assembly and being part of that supply chain.
Is there a little more you could say around the
community vision.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Yeah, I mean the community had come together in the
path to create kind of like an outline of what
they wanted and what they did and wanted, and I
think community had decided that they wanted to preserve the
beautiful view that they had, They wanted to make sure
that there was no housing created a lot of the waterfronts,
and that they very much wanted to preserve, you know,
(25:08):
their manufacturing zoning an area. And so what we had
seen the city do with similar plots of land were
create a mix of luxury and affordable housing with some
trinkets to the community like a park. But there was
a larger discussion on hall how all these zonings were
(25:29):
going to be connected. And then you know, we were
talking about trying to preserve the last working waterfront in
New York City, and so to us, it was a
labor of love and wanting to make sure that we
preserve that. And then you know, the amazing work of
our community organization partners like upros who have been on
the frontlines of you know, environmental justice, to really be
(25:51):
able to help come up with an alternative of a grid,
to really be able to see into the future, to
really be part of green economy, and you know, to
really embolde in this community to say that we have
a right to decide what comes in. We have a
right to be able to also make sure that we're
(26:13):
preserving the livelihood of our community. And so I think
that that's something that is I guess new and innovative
in the sense that you know, communities are wanting to
be at the table about the development. And I think
that you know, this is a beautiful story that unfolded
said that that is one hundred percent possible, and that
that's something that we should strive for.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
After the break, what we can learn from watching this
community's fight to define its future and how those lessons
might guide other neighborhoods facing similar battles in this uncertain world.
Speaker 7 (26:54):
Welcome back.
Speaker 1 (26:54):
Since the recording of Emergent City, our national landscape has shifted.
Donald Trump now and his second term has intensified his
immigration policies, including mass deportation plans and targeting immigrant communities.
It's in this context the story of Sunset Park's fight
for self determination could serve as a reminder of the
impact our local communities can have. By engaging in local
(27:18):
democratic processes, residents can influence the future of their neighborhoods
even when national policies seem daunting. Here's Oscar Pariobello leading
the conversation on how these lessons remain relevant today.
Speaker 8 (27:34):
What message, if any, do you feel like this film
has for folks who might be frustrated with democracy right
now out there?
Speaker 3 (27:44):
I don't know.
Speaker 9 (27:45):
I mean, to me, this is really about democracy with
a very small D. And I think that all of us,
at least on this call we were talking earlier, I
think one of the only things that's making us feel
better in this past week is being able to be
in community with one another on a very long local level.
And so I think, to me, what the film's about
is sort of less about who was right and who
(28:07):
was wrong about how to move forward, but just the
fact that people just kept showing up and engaging and
staying in the room even when other people were annoying
them and they didn't see eye to eye. And I
think just like being willing to be together and not
necessarily agree, but still believe that there's like a larger
hole that we're committed to participating. And I can't bring
(28:30):
out any positive lesson about the future that we're facing
right now, but I think for me that I think
is what I felt when I just watched the film. Now,
it was just, you know, here's a bunch of people
trying really hard to show up and if they don't agree,
it's okay. They're all trying.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 10 (28:47):
I was thinking about just the smallness of this scope
of this watching my first time watching it, obviously in
this new reality, and thinking about how I just was
appreciating the simplicity of this was this one neighborhood and
this one sort of developer fight, And I think we're
going to have to choose where to put our energy
(29:08):
and like on what stage to show up and how
to how to plug in and participate. And I think
I think that I appreciate that this film is just
this like one story about this you know, one place
in time, and also helping to hopefully give a little
bit of context to how these kinds of development choices
(29:30):
get made. Like are the president now like he's a
developer who doesn't care about community input, you know, in
a in a very at a very massive scale, you know,
and so thinking about ways to infuse community and you know,
real participation, not necessarily in those federal processes where they're
(29:50):
absolutely not desired, but in these all sorts of small, small,
more localized ways to build power together.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
I think one of the things is also so just
like understanding what we're up against and this challenge of
power and this institution within we're working with, right and
then yet I am constantly being underestimated. I am constantly
being you know, told that I don't have any power.
You know, I work with immigrants. I was even told
that I wouldn't get elected because most of the folks
(30:19):
I work with were undocumented until they don't vote. So
just you know a glance of what we're constantly being
challenged with. But to me, you know, to me, the
film brings and continues to give us hope, right, And
that's the one thing that we have to hold on
to that no one can take away from us. It's
about understanding our individual power, and you know what happens
(30:43):
when we cultivate that power and when we you know,
we pull that power together and we wield it together.
To me, it's about you know what a real sense
of community is, right, like working with your neighbors to
ensure you know your safety and you know the safety
of the community, and you know whatever form that looks like.
So I hope that this movie and the documentary really
(31:05):
encourages people to take those bole steps. You know, the
impossible is only impossible until you make it possible. I
didn't get into this fight thinking that we would win.
I didn't get into this fight having a crystal ball
and saying that, you know, this was going to be the ending.
We all got into it because it was something greater
and more important that we were working towards together. And
(31:26):
I think that the outcome is very much a reflection
of the perseverance of the people in the community.
Speaker 11 (31:37):
I'm also in that same vein of like underestimated power
from community and those of us who represent black and brown,
queer Communities in power are often misunderstood. And we have power,
and so that's the other thing about this story is
(31:58):
that we have we have power and exercise that and
I think that that there's so much beauty, beauty in
that and that doesn't just happen because there's a lot
of work. And so democracy is hard. You gotta work
for it or else we don't get the benefits of democracy.
The power of fear. Fear infected so many on all sides,
(32:19):
the left, the right, the middle. Everybody was afraid, and
so that really just did not allow us to have
the conversations. And so I really I was really disappointed
that we couldn't have these discussions because they were shut
down by people who actually I agreed with, but they
were shut down. And so that's the death of democracy.
(32:39):
How do we change that? And I think if we
don't change that, we're gonna we're going to see a
lot more of what we're seeing today. And so that's
on us, as people who are organizing in our own
communities to listen to each other. There's some people who
were in this film who are now Trump supporters, and
I want to talk to them.
Speaker 7 (32:59):
I want to listen to them.
Speaker 11 (33:01):
I want to understand what they're meaning and feeling right now,
because that's what we need to do. And so this
is a precious little community and it's a beautiful community,
but it's a complex community that needs to be heard
and understood. And so I think the last thing I
want to say, though, is leadership matters. And so there's
going to be a new election soon for mayor, a
(33:21):
new city council will be elected, and so folks need
to get engaged and run for office. I think you
see Marcella myself as people who said we're going to
step in and do something, and we're just one person.
Speaker 7 (33:34):
We need more. So if you're out there in your community, wherever.
Speaker 11 (33:38):
You are in Nevada, Florida, wherever, think about running and
representing and reach out to us.
Speaker 7 (33:45):
Maybe I'll speak for Marcella if I can, but reach out.
Speaker 11 (33:48):
To us, we'll share with you what it is to
do it and how to do it, how to win,
and how to listen, and how to do this kind
of work.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
We hope you enjoyed this episode of Next City, a
show about change makers and their stories. Together we can
spread good ideas from one city to the next city.
Speaker 7 (34:18):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
For listening this week. If you want to find a
screening of Emergencity, visit emergentcitydoc dot com. Today's conversation was
part of our annual Solutions Fest, and if you want
to get your copy of the Solutions of the Year magazine,
visit Nextcity dot org slash twenty four solutions. That's Next
city dot org slash two four solutions. Thank you to
our guests Kelly Anderson and Jay Arthur Sternberg, co directors
(34:40):
of Emergencity, Carlos Munchaka, the former city council member at
the heart of the industry city fight, and Marcella Madanez,
a community organizer turned State assembly member representing Sunset Park.
And thank you to Oscar Pariobello, Next City Senior Economic
Justice correspondent for leading this conversation. Our audio producer is
Silvana Alcala, show producer is Maggie Bowles, our executive producer
(35:02):
is Ryan Tillotson, and I'm Lucas Grinley, executive director for
Next City. By the way, Next City is a news
organization with a nonprofit model. If you like what we're
doing here or you want to celebrate our one hundredth episode,
please consider pitching in to support our work. Visit nextcity
dot org slash membership to make a donation. We'd love
to hear any feedback from our listeners. Please feel free
(35:23):
to email us at info atnxcity dot org and if
you haven't already, subscribed to the show on Apple, Spotify,
Good Pods, or anywhere you listen to your podcasts.
Hey everyone, it's Lucas from Next City. We're revisiting a
favorite episode of ours from the archive today because it
connects directly to something new that I'm really excited to
tell you about. Last year at this time, as part
of our effort to bring you more films, we featured
the documentary Emergent City. It captures the story of a
decade long fight against displacement in Brooklyn Sunset Park. Residents
(00:26):
got organized, resisted rezoning, and ultimately they won. So this
episode is our conversation with the filmmakers and the organizers
behind that fight. We're sharing it again now because Next
City just announced plans for our new winter film festival,
and we're going big with four incredible films to pick from.
Each documentary explores what home really means in America today,
(00:47):
from homelessness response systems to community land trusts to the
lingering fallout from the foreclosure crisis. We're calling the series
Power and Place, a film series on housing, power and
collective action, partnering with the film's directors to make these
amazing stories available to you starting in December. More good news,
we figured out how to scrap paid ticketing, so like
(01:07):
everything else, we do at Next City. The films will
be pay what you wish to access. After you sign up,
you'll have two weeks to stream them anytime on demand.
It's pay what you wish, so no one is prevented
from watching, but we do hope some of you are
able to contribute more. Every dollar helps keep Next Cities
journalism free and accessible. Our year end campaign just launched
and our goal is to rally readers, listeners and viewers
(01:30):
to raise thirty thousand dollars to fund Next Citi's work
in twenty twenty six. In addition to everything else we do,
we want to create a platform for filmmakers to reach
you with stories like these that reveal what's possible when
communities organize and refuse to accept displacement as inevitable. So
as you listen to this episode from last year, I
hope you get a sense of why we love documentary storytelling.
Go ahead and register now for this year's film series
(01:52):
at nexcity dot org. Slash events now Here's Emergent City.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Strawt Media.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Communities are wanting to be at the stable about the development,
and I think that you know this is a beautiful
story that unfold. That said that that is one hundred
percent possible, and that that's something that we should strive for.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
This is Lucas Grindley from Next City, a show about
change makers and their stories. Truth is, there are solutions
to the problems of pressing people in cities. If you're listening,
I hope it's because you want to spread good ideas
from one today to the next city. On today's episode,
the story of how one community actually stopped a developer.
It's a pretty incredible story about fighting displacement. But before
(02:52):
we get into this week's episode, we have something to celebrate.
This is our one hundredth episode. Where does the time go?
As I've been thinking about what I want to say
to you on our one hundredth episode, we are, unfortunately,
at this very same time, living through a terrible moment
(03:13):
in the history of our country, one that requires action.
And that's what the show has always been about. People
have always stood up for their neighbors and their communities.
Maybe we haven't heard about their work, maybe it gets overlooked,
but these stories exist and people are persisting regardless of
whether they thought anyone from the federal government was coming
to help. Probably they were sure no one would, so
(03:35):
Next City. Listeners, I don't say this lightly. You are
what this country needs right now, and I very sincerely
hope that one hundred episodes from now, I'll be talking
to one of you about what you did in this
moment to turn strangers into neighbors, to prioritize people over profits,
and to be in solidarity with each other, because it
will take all of us together if we want our
(03:56):
values to survive and to win. Probably not surprising, that's
exactly what today's story is about. We are lucky to
be among the very first people to see a new documentary, Emergencity,
which tells the story of Sunset Park in Brooklyn. Here
is a community that came together to fight a rezoning
which was wanted by deep pocketed developers, and against all odds,
(04:19):
they won. How did they do it? That is an
answer all of us are going to need in these
times when we're up against the rich and powerful. Even
outside of battles over redevelopment.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
All over the United States, community is looking to shut
down the industrial sector because it's killing them. Here in
Sunset Park, we've had to think about how do you
retain the working class character of the community, How do
you keep it a walk to work community and keep
it industrial, but not at the expense of our lives.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
That was a clip from Emergent City featuring Elizabeth Yempierre,
the executive director with Uprows. Elizabeth is in the middle
of giving us a bus.
Speaker 5 (04:56):
Tour and then to the luck You're going to see
Industry City, and you could see you could see gentrification
all over it, everything from the avocado tells that they
serve out to.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
The yoga met The filmmakers behind Emergent City were there
recording as a ten year saga unvolted beginning when developers
proposed transforming Industry City, a sprawling industrial site on the
Brooklyn waterfront, into a high end retail and office complex.
The opponent said that was just a fancy way of
describing what amounts to a mall.
Speaker 6 (05:28):
We started looking a couple years ago and Industry City,
there was so much space and they were willing to
build it out for us.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Here is another clip from the film, which includes a
much more sunny view from one of the office complex's
new tenants.
Speaker 6 (05:42):
It's not banal, it's not the mall. It's not cookie cutter.
You know, it has personality, It has character. People want
that they need that, that's what nurtures their soul. They're
creating it here, and I would not in an artificial way.
You know, the creatives want to be here. They're transforming
(06:07):
the neighborhood and they've to succeeded.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
It's always about the creatives, right, They want to be there,
so it must be a good thing. We started with
a clip from a tour led by the opponents. Here's
one led by Industry City. Someone on the tour is
asking a question of their guy.
Speaker 7 (06:24):
Walking down me on thirty sixth Street.
Speaker 8 (06:25):
I mean, it's really gritty.
Speaker 7 (06:27):
It still has a grittiness that Manhattan has lost.
Speaker 6 (06:30):
Yeah, we're going to talk about that a little bit.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
You're not going to see that as much inside, but
it's really an oasis amongst a working class community.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
For me, that was a pretty striking moment right at
the start of the documentary, that tour guide calls Industry
City an oasis amongst a working class community, as if
we need an escape from who exactly the working class.
It's no surprise then that the community members felt the
Industry City complex, if it won rezoning, would accelerate gentrification
(07:02):
and displacement in their neighborhood where nearly seventy percent of
households are renters. Their fight became about more than just
saying no. It was about who gets to craft a
vision for the future, the people who live there, or
developers hoping to woo creatives and tenants in tax revenue.
In a moment, we're going to hear from the co directors,
Kelly Anderson and j Arthur Sterenberg, who stuck with this
(07:24):
story so long that we're able to get a rare
window into what it is like to be part of
these fights over displacement. Their earliest footage, if you can
believe it, is from twenty thirteen. But we are also
lucky to be joined by two people who were enmeshed
in that messy process. Carlos Minchaka was the local city
council member who we watch as he makes a high
stakes decision about which way to vote, all the while
(07:47):
trying to negotiate with industry city developers while trying to
hold together this coalition of community leaders. Another of them
is Marcella Matteinis, a tenant organizer featured in the film. Today,
she is in New York State Assembly member, which goes
to show how these moments can identify our new generation
of leaders and call them into service. We're also joined
by Next City's senior Economic justice correspondent, Oscar Periobello, who
(08:11):
is the author of a new book, The Banks We Deserve,
about how communities can use the power of banking to
gain agency about their futures. If you're watching Emergencity, you're
going to see Oscar in public meetings in the film
with his notebook covering what's happening for Next City.
Speaker 9 (08:29):
My name is Kelly Anderson. This film Jay and I
have been working on for about seven years, and I
live in Sunset Park, so it was really on our doorstep.
Speaker 10 (08:38):
Hi, my name is Jay Arthur Stenberg, co director with
Kelly and also editor. And this is very much a
labor of love and kind of a dream come true
to get to work on a project like this sort
of in my community and try to highlight something over
a long period of time that's so obtuse and hard
to see and figure out a way to frame it
and make it hopefully engaging enough to really like call
(09:00):
an audience's attention and see through these these these processes
that are sort of intentionally hard to fathom.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
They are hard to fathom. All right, if you watch Emergency,
you're exhausted by the endless process of meetings which are
supposed to be how we engage in city decision making.
But you get the sense that, wow, if this is
how we make decisions, then the process is designed to
leave out people who don't have the time, so much
time to stay at the table, so to speak, and
(09:31):
even when you're there taking part in these meetings, it's
an unwelcoming process.
Speaker 8 (09:38):
We are not going to shut this meeting down tonight.
Speaker 7 (09:41):
That's not going to happen tonight. We have to vote,
and that's what's going to happen.
Speaker 4 (09:45):
To one second place, did you please someone who's ever
is sitting near a window open it up?
Speaker 7 (09:51):
Yes, Barbara, to shut out.
Speaker 9 (10:01):
We filmed i think, almost close to two hundred different
days of community meetings. So this is distilled from a
huge archive of you know, very long meetings, and so
we needed people to just you know film all of that.
So there was a lot of just you know, going
out and just whoever was available that night, you know,
(10:22):
film it.
Speaker 10 (10:23):
Yeah, I mean the public meetings were a big part
of it. All the community board process, which we could
go as community members and document Obviously, the other big
piece was wanting it was really important to us to
make sure that like the developers were part of it,
and that you know, the Industry City was part of it,
and so that that piece of it was for us
also what would make this film unique and not just
(10:45):
something that is about, you know, a community resisting something,
but something that's looking at it from all these different angles,
trying to be really open about the fact that like,
we're not this isn't We're not trying to make something
that's like an argument for or against a thing. We're
trying to like look at this process and watch it
as it unfolds, and I hope that we did justice
to all those different perspectives.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Here is Kelly Anderson again on how she pitched the
film to funders.
Speaker 9 (11:11):
We did talk about Industry City, you know, which has
a certain kind of magnetism to it because it's so
big and iconic and for New York. Some people had
been there and we're like, oh, yeah, that's weird. I
like it, but I'm not sure if I should like it,
And you know, there's a little bit of that, but
I think ultimately what sold ITVS On it was some
(11:34):
of the access that we had to the folks at
Industry City and also Carlos and Marcella. Like the fact
that we were able to be that fly on the
wall in those meetings, I think was part of what
people felt like they hadn't seen before that really observational
just be there and experience what's happening in this feeling
that we're sort of pulling the curtain back on a
(11:56):
process that you don't usually get to see that much.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Of the filmmakers say that they were a fly on
the wall, they mean they were in some truly incredible meetings.
Cameras were in the room even during negotiations with developers,
thanks to City council Member Carlos Manchaka, who knew the
filmmakers and trusted them.
Speaker 7 (12:19):
For me, what really.
Speaker 11 (12:22):
Rang true was the commitment from the film team, Jay
and Kelly. Knowing them from the community, and I'm like,
you can't tell the story without going in, and so
very early I thought I need to utilize my power
as a council member. In New York City, the council
member has deference, so everybody looks at the council member
(12:43):
and says, whatever you want you get, so I only
have veto power. So I went to the developers and
I said, you're going to let these documentarian teams come in,
these filmmakers come in and just document and tell the
story later. None of this be used in the middle
against you. It'll be later.
Speaker 7 (13:03):
And it was. But the second part.
Speaker 11 (13:05):
Was was taking this film and bringing it into the
community as an archive.
Speaker 7 (13:11):
So what we are.
Speaker 11 (13:12):
Looking to do soon is figure out how we build
an archive for folks to see the whole meeting, not
just the film masterful film, yeah, but to go in
and actually listen to the meeting. I think that the
concept of transparency is really important, So I think people
need to lean into transparency. This is this is radical transparency,
(13:33):
but I think transparency is one of those things that
creates the opportunity for discussion post.
Speaker 7 (13:38):
And in New York.
Speaker 11 (13:39):
Transparency is not an ideal that people hold up. This
is something that is behind closed doors. And especially when
you think about development or even like rule making and bills.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
I think when elected officials pull back and say no, we.
Speaker 11 (13:55):
Don't we don't want to do that. We we're the legislator.
You know, we're gonna We're gonna let just say ourselves,
we're gonna we're gonna figure this out, and I think
we need to push back on that as as as
a community. So for me, it's it's it's a lesson
that that this is what we get right, a fuller picture,
and so I will push that on anybody and everybody
from here and out.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Through this film's lens, we do get an unprecedented window
into democracy and action, complete with the tension, collaboration, and
clashing visions that come with deciding the fate of a neighborhood.
After the break, we'll talk about those hard moments, and
we'll talk to one of the organizers who fought for
her neighborhood during those contentious meetings. Welcome back today. Next
(14:47):
City listeners are among the first people to get a
peek at Emergent City, a new documentary that chronicles the
decade long fight over the development of Brooklyn's industry city.
It's a film about zoning, but it isn't just about zoning.
At its heart, Emergencity is about the process of democracy.
It's about how communities navigate competing visions.
Speaker 11 (15:08):
For their future.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Here is one of those moments in a clip from
the film.
Speaker 7 (15:16):
All Right, this is the seventh inning stretch. And I
will say, when my wife asked me earlier.
Speaker 8 (15:20):
Today, how do you feel this is a big light,
I said, I'm excited. This is like democracy in action,
right right, So.
Speaker 7 (15:29):
Yeah, exactly. I don't wipe out hey, hey, dead fifty
one board members. We're all here to service those folks
that are not in the room.
Speaker 5 (15:40):
I'm going to vote no because on this plan, I
see that one community.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Benefit they told about jobs, but they can't even guarantee
that those jobs are going to go to members of
this community.
Speaker 12 (15:53):
This community born I've been working on that waterfront for
twenty years. I Am not going to vote no because
I do want to see stuff down.
Speaker 13 (16:04):
Vote on it.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
To clarify, A yes vote is to disapprove, So yes
to disapprove.
Speaker 13 (16:12):
Lobo well S, Animon, Alexa Vilas Yes, Anita Bulan, Yes
to Alexaso No, David Estrada no, Anteinette Martinez Yes.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
The developers behind Industry City wanted their multi use complex,
but the people in the neighborhood wanted real industry with
real jobs, green jobs. Ideally, Ultimately they won. Here again
is Next City's Oscar Pariobello, followed by community organizer Marcella Bettinez.
Speaker 8 (16:49):
Let's talk about these conversations a little bit. So, what
was it like. We're having a film crew around for
so much of this, to many of these meetings, so
many of these kind of sensitive moments. You might say,
right where where you're kind of going through a really
hard tense conversation. It may not even be with someone
(17:10):
you're necessarily opposing. You might all just be community board members,
just community organizers in the room, but there's still a
sort of like tension there. And somehow You've got a
documentary film crew following you around for some of this.
What was that like? Was there a value that it
brought to your experience in this way?
Speaker 3 (17:28):
I think to Carlos's credit, I think the idea of
the film crew was really important in the sense that
it was clear to us that we didn't know what
we were doing. But that was the whole point of
documenting me and is to have some kind of record
to be able to look back at, right. So I
am incredibly thankful for Carlos with being able to do that.
(17:51):
And that being said, I think that you know, obviously
you're a little nervous and there's extra people around but
I think once we rolled up our sleagion really started working, we,
at least for me, I kind of almost forgot that
they were there. And then there were some intense moments
that I was like, oh my god, did you see that?
Did the camera pick it up? I was like, do
(18:11):
we get that on film? And then sometimes they're like, no,
we don't know what you're talking about and nothing. Oh
and other times it's just like, wow, that might make
it on the film, and then we'll see what plays back,
and then yeah, it was a little crazy.
Speaker 8 (18:27):
Marcella, I think you were the first sort of live
film person voice that comes up in the film.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
You were tenant organizer back then in twenty thirteen. Can
you tell us a little bit about what the neighborhood
is like today?
Speaker 3 (18:43):
The neighborhood is the same and at the same time
changing very rapidly. I think that the pandemic hit really
hard for the working class and they're still kind of
like struggling to get out of it. There is some
development that's coming down the pipeline. I think something that's
really exciting was this idea of wanting to preserve the
(19:05):
waterfront for what could possibly be a new green economy,
and so the swath of land across the street from
Industry City is now being developed for headquarters for equinor
who's going to be building offshore windmills, and so there's
also the creation of a factory and an assembly line
(19:27):
that's in the future also going to produce jobs. And
so despite these really amazing things that are coming, there's
still this need to kind of bring in the community
and have them understand what's happening around them but's being constructed,
and making sure that they understand the important role we're
about to play as a community within the larger nation
(19:50):
of being the first to kind of like create this.
And you know, the truth is, we are in uncertain
times with a new presidential administration coming in and possibly
creating all kinds of chaos and threats to an immigrant
community that has already faced that in the past, and
so I think a lot of what's happening now is
just folks are just trying to kind of come to
(20:11):
terms and understand where we're at. And for me, a
lot of it also just be checking in with people,
making sure that they're okay, and then figuring out how
we're going to come together as a community to kind
of try and you know, prepare for an uncertainty that
we know that that's coming.
Speaker 8 (20:29):
Carlos, you know when at the premiere of this film
that at the tribeck A Film Festival early this year,
afterwards you described asked how you were feeling after seeing
the film, and he said, you were tired, frustrated and proud.
How are you feeling now?
Speaker 11 (20:48):
I think for me, what just rings loudly is this
concept of democracy and what is democracy? I think we're
all asking that question. And here's a film that gives
you a very clear, in depth, insider view of what
it looks like when something happens in a community. It
(21:09):
just happens that it's zoning, and it's a pretty big
project that has big implications. You saw the heat from everyone,
community organizations, business folks. All the interests were alive and well.
And so democracy continues and it's hard and I am
tired and I get tired watching it sometimes because it
(21:30):
was it was something that started. Industry City started the
day that I got elected in twenty fourteen or twenty thirteen,
moving into twenty fourteen, and it was a conversation that
Andrew had with me. We're walking in the park in
Sunset Park in twenty fourteen, and he's like, there's gonna
be a rezoning and we don't know what it's gonna
look like, but we just want to open lines of communication.
(21:52):
And so very early I knew that this was going
to be a big thing and I needed to figure
this out. And here I am a freshman council member
and so lots of work. It's it's it's democracy is hard.
It's going to require us all to be in full form.
Speaker 8 (22:10):
It's hard. It's very tense, and I think it's a
familiar tense for some of us. I think a lot
of us.
Speaker 14 (22:15):
Really, you know, we've been to community board meetings in
New York or you know there's there's similar kind of
local kind of governance bodies in other cities, in other municipalities.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
And that somehow it still has to be a reminder
that that that's part of part of democracy.
Speaker 8 (22:38):
I guess it is.
Speaker 11 (22:40):
And you know what I'll say, and I think this
is part of what I think we're going to have
to think about moving forward, is is where are we
going to have the conversations. I think what you saw
this film where conversations that were happening in the community board,
beautiful little moments where where people were really struggling to
figure it out and having timelines that were so sure,
(23:01):
and not having all the resources. And I got to
say that that there was so much funding that came
in the community board, had a lawyer provided by the
council to really kind of go through this massive document
and that all those things are real, and and like,
are we going to have that in the future, and
who's providing that? And are we are our leaders doing
(23:23):
that today? These are all the.
Speaker 8 (23:25):
Questions, Marcella, I was going to ask you as well,
in terms of, you know, lessons for other communities to
take from this from this film.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
I think for me, it's a realization that the impossible
is only impossible until you make it possible, right. I
think that a lot of us really came together because
we were concerned community members, right. We We were at
a time where we had seeing what rezoning and overdevelopment
(24:03):
had done to other communities of color. We had seen
enough that we knew that it was bad, and we
were able to bring our neighbors together to create a resistance.
But I don't know that any of us really thought
that we were going to be able to bring it
to a complete stop or for this to have ended
the way that it did. But certainly we were all
committed enough to get into the fight to create a resistance.
Speaker 8 (24:26):
And it came out a little bit in the film
in terms of the community vision for the site, and
you mentioned the the using you now opening up opportunities
for offshore winds assembly and being part of that supply chain.
Is there a little more you could say around the
community vision.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Yeah, I mean the community had come together in the
path to create kind of like an outline of what
they wanted and what they did and wanted, and I
think community had decided that they wanted to preserve the
beautiful view that they had, They wanted to make sure
that there was no housing created a lot of the waterfronts,
and that they very much wanted to preserve, you know,
(25:08):
their manufacturing zoning an area. And so what we had
seen the city do with similar plots of land were
create a mix of luxury and affordable housing with some
trinkets to the community like a park. But there was
a larger discussion on hall how all these zonings were
(25:29):
going to be connected. And then you know, we were
talking about trying to preserve the last working waterfront in
New York City, and so to us, it was a
labor of love and wanting to make sure that we
preserve that. And then you know, the amazing work of
our community organization partners like upros who have been on
the frontlines of you know, environmental justice, to really be
(25:51):
able to help come up with an alternative of a grid,
to really be able to see into the future, to
really be part of green economy, and you know, to
really embolde in this community to say that we have
a right to decide what comes in. We have a
right to be able to also make sure that we're
(26:13):
preserving the livelihood of our community. And so I think
that that's something that is I guess new and innovative
in the sense that you know, communities are wanting to
be at the table about the development. And I think
that you know, this is a beautiful story that unfolded
said that that is one hundred percent possible, and that
that's something that we should strive for.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
After the break, what we can learn from watching this
community's fight to define its future and how those lessons
might guide other neighborhoods facing similar battles in this uncertain world.
Speaker 7 (26:54):
Welcome back.
Speaker 1 (26:54):
Since the recording of Emergent City, our national landscape has shifted.
Donald Trump now and his second term has intensified his
immigration policies, including mass deportation plans and targeting immigrant communities.
It's in this context the story of Sunset Park's fight
for self determination could serve as a reminder of the
impact our local communities can have. By engaging in local
(27:18):
democratic processes, residents can influence the future of their neighborhoods
even when national policies seem daunting. Here's Oscar Pariobello leading
the conversation on how these lessons remain relevant today.
Speaker 8 (27:34):
What message, if any, do you feel like this film
has for folks who might be frustrated with democracy right
now out there?
Speaker 3 (27:44):
I don't know.
Speaker 9 (27:45):
I mean, to me, this is really about democracy with
a very small D. And I think that all of us,
at least on this call we were talking earlier, I
think one of the only things that's making us feel
better in this past week is being able to be
in community with one another on a very long local level.
And so I think, to me, what the film's about
is sort of less about who was right and who
(28:07):
was wrong about how to move forward, but just the
fact that people just kept showing up and engaging and
staying in the room even when other people were annoying
them and they didn't see eye to eye. And I
think just like being willing to be together and not
necessarily agree, but still believe that there's like a larger
hole that we're committed to participating. And I can't bring
(28:30):
out any positive lesson about the future that we're facing
right now, but I think for me that I think
is what I felt when I just watched the film. Now,
it was just, you know, here's a bunch of people
trying really hard to show up and if they don't agree,
it's okay. They're all trying.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 10 (28:47):
I was thinking about just the smallness of this scope
of this watching my first time watching it, obviously in
this new reality, and thinking about how I just was
appreciating the simplicity of this was this one neighborhood and
this one sort of developer fight, And I think we're
going to have to choose where to put our energy
(29:08):
and like on what stage to show up and how
to how to plug in and participate. And I think
I think that I appreciate that this film is just
this like one story about this you know, one place
in time, and also helping to hopefully give a little
bit of context to how these kinds of development choices
(29:30):
get made. Like are the president now like he's a
developer who doesn't care about community input, you know, in
a in a very at a very massive scale, you know,
and so thinking about ways to infuse community and you know,
real participation, not necessarily in those federal processes where they're
(29:50):
absolutely not desired, but in these all sorts of small, small,
more localized ways to build power together.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
I think one of the things is also so just
like understanding what we're up against and this challenge of
power and this institution within we're working with, right and
then yet I am constantly being underestimated. I am constantly
being you know, told that I don't have any power.
You know, I work with immigrants. I was even told
that I wouldn't get elected because most of the folks
(30:19):
I work with were undocumented until they don't vote. So
just you know a glance of what we're constantly being
challenged with. But to me, you know, to me, the
film brings and continues to give us hope, right, And
that's the one thing that we have to hold on
to that no one can take away from us. It's
about understanding our individual power, and you know what happens
(30:43):
when we cultivate that power and when we you know,
we pull that power together and we wield it together.
To me, it's about you know what a real sense
of community is, right, like working with your neighbors to
ensure you know your safety and you know the safety
of the community, and you know whatever form that looks like.
So I hope that this movie and the documentary really
(31:05):
encourages people to take those bole steps. You know, the
impossible is only impossible until you make it possible. I
didn't get into this fight thinking that we would win.
I didn't get into this fight having a crystal ball
and saying that, you know, this was going to be the ending.
We all got into it because it was something greater
and more important that we were working towards together. And
(31:26):
I think that the outcome is very much a reflection
of the perseverance of the people in the community.
Speaker 11 (31:37):
I'm also in that same vein of like underestimated power
from community and those of us who represent black and brown,
queer Communities in power are often misunderstood. And we have power,
and so that's the other thing about this story is
(31:58):
that we have we have power and exercise that and
I think that that there's so much beauty, beauty in
that and that doesn't just happen because there's a lot
of work. And so democracy is hard. You gotta work
for it or else we don't get the benefits of democracy.
The power of fear. Fear infected so many on all sides,
(32:19):
the left, the right, the middle. Everybody was afraid, and
so that really just did not allow us to have
the conversations. And so I really I was really disappointed
that we couldn't have these discussions because they were shut
down by people who actually I agreed with, but they
were shut down. And so that's the death of democracy.
(32:39):
How do we change that? And I think if we
don't change that, we're gonna we're going to see a
lot more of what we're seeing today. And so that's
on us, as people who are organizing in our own
communities to listen to each other. There's some people who
were in this film who are now Trump supporters, and
I want to talk to them.
Speaker 7 (32:59):
I want to listen to them.
Speaker 11 (33:01):
I want to understand what they're meaning and feeling right now,
because that's what we need to do. And so this
is a precious little community and it's a beautiful community,
but it's a complex community that needs to be heard
and understood. And so I think the last thing I
want to say, though, is leadership matters. And so there's
going to be a new election soon for mayor, a
(33:21):
new city council will be elected, and so folks need
to get engaged and run for office. I think you
see Marcella myself as people who said we're going to
step in and do something, and we're just one person.
Speaker 7 (33:34):
We need more. So if you're out there in your community, wherever.
Speaker 11 (33:38):
You are in Nevada, Florida, wherever, think about running and
representing and reach out to us.
Speaker 7 (33:45):
Maybe I'll speak for Marcella if I can, but reach out.
Speaker 11 (33:48):
To us, we'll share with you what it is to
do it and how to do it, how to win,
and how to listen, and how to do this kind
of work.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
We hope you enjoyed this episode of Next City, a
show about change makers and their stories. Together we can
spread good ideas from one city to the next city.
Speaker 7 (34:18):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
For listening this week. If you want to find a
screening of Emergencity, visit emergentcitydoc dot com. Today's conversation was
part of our annual Solutions Fest, and if you want
to get your copy of the Solutions of the Year magazine,
visit Nextcity dot org slash twenty four solutions. That's Next
city dot org slash two four solutions. Thank you to
our guests Kelly Anderson and Jay Arthur Sternberg, co directors
(34:40):
of Emergencity, Carlos Munchaka, the former city council member at
the heart of the industry city fight, and Marcella Madanez,
a community organizer turned State assembly member representing Sunset Park.
And thank you to Oscar Pariobello, Next City Senior Economic
Justice correspondent for leading this conversation. Our audio producer is
Silvana Alcala, show producer is Maggie Bowles, our executive producer
(35:02):
is Ryan Tillotson, and I'm Lucas Grinley, executive director for
Next City. By the way, Next City is a news
organization with a nonprofit model. If you like what we're
doing here or you want to celebrate our one hundredth episode,
please consider pitching in to support our work. Visit nextcity
dot org slash membership to make a donation. We'd love
to hear any feedback from our listeners. Please feel free
(35:23):
to email us at info atnxcity dot org and if
you haven't already, subscribed to the show on Apple, Spotify,
Good Pods, or anywhere you listen to your podcasts.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Ruthie's Table 4
For more than 30 years The River Cafe in London, has been the home-from-home of artists, architects, designers, actors, collectors, writers, activists, and politicians. Michael Caine, Glenn Close, JJ Abrams, Steve McQueen, Victoria and David Beckham, and Lily Allen, are just some of the people who love to call The River Cafe home. On River Cafe Table 4, Rogers sits down with her customers—who have become friends—to talk about food memories. Table 4 explores how food impacts every aspect of our lives. “Foods is politics, food is cultural, food is how you express love, food is about your heritage, it defines who you and who you want to be,” says Rogers. Each week, Rogers invites her guest to reminisce about family suppers and first dates, what they cook, how they eat when performing, the restaurants they choose, and what food they seek when they need comfort. And to punctuate each episode of Table 4, guests such as Ralph Fiennes, Emily Blunt, and Alfonso Cuarón, read their favourite recipe from one of the best-selling River Cafe cookbooks. Table 4 itself, is situated near The River Cafe’s open kitchen, close to the bright pink wood-fired oven and next to the glossy yellow pass, where Ruthie oversees the restaurant. You are invited to take a seat at this intimate table and join the conversation. For more information, recipes, and ingredients, go to https://shoptherivercafe.co.uk/ Web: https://rivercafe.co.uk/ Instagram: www.instagram.com/therivercafelondon/ Facebook: https://en-gb.facebook.com/therivercafelondon/ For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iheartradio app, apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.