May 8, 2025 • 54 mins
BeginBot takes us on a captivating journey through his eclectic world of collecting – from CryptoPunks to Pope memorabilia – while challenging conventional wisdom about what makes art valuable in the blockchain era.
As one of the early adopters in the crypto art scene, BeginBot shares how his programmer background and natural affinity for "weird subcultures" led him from CryptoKitties to BoardApe meetups, always following his intuitive sense of what resonated personally rather than chasing trends. His refreshing honesty cuts through typical crypto platitudes: "I love that people hate it," he admits about the contrarian nature of Web3 that continues to draw him in.
What makes this conversation exceptional is BeginBot's passionate defense of creative conflict. While many in the space avoid criticism to maintain harmony and value, he argues that the greatest art movements throughout history thrived on disagreement and provocative ideas. "No one wants to talk about the bad stuff," he laments, explaining how the lack of critical discourse ultimately weakens artistic evolution. His admiration for Death beef's entropy-based work – blockchain art that deliberately decays with each transaction – reveals his appreciation for conceptual depth over mere aesthetics.
Perhaps most fascinating is BeginBot's current exploration of AI-generated art that creates deeply personalized experiences. Rather than using technology to please everyone, he's interested in its potential to provoke powerful emotions specific to each viewer – even if that means discomfort. "I want to make them cry, scream," he explains, challenging the notion that art should primarily seek approval or financial gain.
Whether you're deep in the crypto art world or simply curious about collecting, this episode offers a thought-provoking perspective on finding meaning in what we choose to value. Subscribe now and join the conversation about what truly makes something worth collecting beyond its price tag.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
NorCal Guy (00:00):
Who is this?
Who is this guy?
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal and chill podcast.
Norcal and chill podcast.
(00:22):
What the sh, what the sh?
Norcal and chill podcast.
Norcal and Shill Podcast.
What the shill, what the shill?
Norcal and Shill Podcast.
So it's shill time.
Norcal and Shill Podcast whatthe shill, what the shill?
Hey, everyone, welcome back toanother episode of NorCal and
Shill.
Today we have a truly uniqueguest, beaconbot, joining us for
a dive into the fascinatingworld of crypto art and
(00:45):
collectibles.
Beganbot is a man of manypassions an early adopter of
CryptoPunks and CryptoKitties, acollector of McDonald's toys
and Rubik's Cubes.
He's known for his weeklymeetups that start with crypto
and often veer into other nicheinterests, always enjoying the
company of unconventionalthinkers.
In this episode, we exploreBeganBot's thoughts on the
(01:09):
cyclical nature of collectiblebubbles, his love for drama in
the Web3 community and theintriguing concept of blockchain
art that decays with each trade.
From his skepticism aboutpopular trends to his passion
for community building, veganbotshares his unique perspective
on not just collecting art butcreating pieces that challenge
(01:31):
and evoke strong emotionalreactions.
We'll learn about his peculiarand humorous purchases, his
favorite avant-garde films,veganbot's deep-seated interest
in storytelling, aesthetics andsociology of the art scene make
for an engaging conversationthat is sure to captivate you.
So sit back, relax and getready for a thought-provoking
(01:54):
journey with BeaconBot ontoday's episode of NorCal and
Shill.
Hey, beacon, welcome to thepodcast.
How are you doing today?
BeginBot (02:02):
Doing lovely, you know , just catching up on all the
fun you know, fun drama that'shappening on Twitter every day.
NorCal Guy (02:09):
Right, right.
I just barely see it and Ithink it's hilarious sometimes.
Today's is the punk thing.
I don't even remember what it'scalled the punk in residence
with Nina Chanel.
BeginBot (02:23):
The punk thing I don't even remember what it's called
the, the, the punk, in residencewith Nina Chanel.
NorCal Guy (02:27):
There it is, there it is.
I was like I, I don't mean, Idon't care what they're doing,
but whatever, um, but everyone'shating.
BeginBot (02:34):
Well, you don't, you don't, you don't have a punk
then I do have a punk.
Yeah, brand, we got to protectthem.
Okay, okay, sorry, I don't havea punk and I'm over here
reading nina chanel interviewsright now, trying to be like,
okay, is there something I'm notseeing in the traits?
NorCal Guy (02:52):
and, like you, you just that's the difference
between a punk owner and anon-punk owner well, well, I
guess you could say I'm not like, I never rep it, so it's just
sitting in the wallet.
That's all it's doing.
BeginBot (03:06):
So yeah, that's the drama, probably a smart move
right now, Kevin Crazy.
NorCal Guy (03:12):
So I guess, when did you get started?
BeginBot (03:20):
And what were your first thoughts when you heard
about this whole crypto artscene?
Yeah, so I'm always like I'm aninternet nerd.
I love weird subcultures, soI'm always anything.
I'm not even joking.
My interest things I'm not eveninterested in.
I will look at the collectingscene.
I know a ton about beaniebabies just because people talk
trash about them.
So I'm like, well, there's somethat are valuable.
I'm gonna figure out which ones.
I don't want to buy beaniebabies.
So, like, I'm always lookingfor, I don't know, just
(03:41):
interesting, weird niches,niches.
And so I saw CryptoPunks andCryptoKitties pretty early on
because I already had ETH.
I was a programmer, so you know.
Classic story of everyoneBitcoin it's this cool, badass
thing to buy drugs in the SilkRoad.
Very cool.
And that teaches you aboutcrypto.
And then someone says ETH isprogrammable money.
I was like I'm a programmer, Ilike programming, that's more
(04:02):
valuable.
And so I literally just gotinto ETH from that simple, dumb
way.
And so then I'm not, I don'treally care, I just bought some
and I didn't program anything.
I was working on other stuffand then I saw CryptoPunks and
CryptoKitties and I was like ohcool, little collectible things.
NorCal Guy (04:20):
I love collecting dumb things.
BeginBot (04:22):
I possibly imagine.
I've got Pope memorabilia.
I collect Pope memorabilia, soI collect dumb things that
people don't like.
And I was like, oh, this ispretty cool.
So I got some CryptoKittiesfrom 2017.
They're on a broken computerright now.
I'm just trying to get it open.
The seed phrase is saved in atext doc.
It's not working.
(04:42):
It's a very old MacBook.
And then I just watched punkskind of from afar and watched
them like do nothing and then goup and price some and get past
1,000.
And I was like, oh, this iscool, this is heating up here,
but they never bought anythingand just kept chilling, forgot
about them.
Then, randomly, I was workingat a startup that was pretty
(05:07):
much what Twitter Spaces is onlyin sports only and I honestly
don't like sports.
Don't tell anyone.
I'm learning how to like themnow.
And there was some roomstalking about Top Shot and I'm
like, what are they talkingabout?
Oh, virtual trading cards.
Oh, my dad's a baseball cardcollector.
I don't like sports, but let'slearn about that, yeah.
And so I was like following it.
I was really enjoying hearingpeople make money, hearing
people give hilariouspredictions Like people were
fighting, like no, you don'tunderstand.
It's going to be a generationof talent and this is going to
(05:28):
be like a Rook, a Michael Jordanrookie card and I was like, oh,
I love what they're talkingabout, uh, but I'm not going to
buy it because I know that I'mexit liquidity.
If I don't watch basketball,I'm guaranteed exit liquidity.
So, but I also had a a.
I had a feeling that I had, Ithought I had taste, you know,
because I I collect shoes andclothing for a long time.
(05:48):
Yeah, and all the shoes that Icollected when I was younger,
all these dunks that literallywhen I was around, like only
nerds cared about them.
It wasn't like this super, likefinancial thing.
If you were like jedi dunks,they're ugly actually.
I, I love them, but likethey're people like your shoes,
what are you wearing?
It looks terrible.
And those went up in value.
So I was like, okay, buy thingsyou like they go up.
(06:10):
I feel like that.
So I was like on the lookout andI was buying all sorts of silly
little nfts here and there.
I always shout out a franelations, if you.
If you know who he is.
He's a og in the sneakercommunity and then an og in the
crypto collectibles communityand he started posting on his
YouTube like, look, and I'mbuying random NFT projects,
projects that no one's heard ofnow.
But he was like showing how heevaluated him and whatnot, and I
(06:32):
was like, oh it's, it'ssneakers.
And so then from there I justhad like I was just into it.
I just loved following dropsand this and that and everything
else.
And then I'm one of thoseterrible people who, when the
board apes came out, I looked atthem.
I was like these are ugly.
I watched them mint out.
And then that first week Iswear to god, I couldn't stop
looking at him for whatever dumbreason.
I called a friend of mine and Isaid, hey, dude, you want to
(06:54):
get drunk and smoke weed tonightand look at all these monkey
photos and I'm gonna buy one.
And, uh, we did that.
I think I bought one for likefive hundred dollars, something
stupid like that.
And then over the next week Istarted buying more and more and
we watched those go up.
And then I happened to be inVenice, california, where the
first BoardAid meetup was.
So Bright Moments was here,first BoardAid meetup, and so
(07:15):
then I was able to meet somepeople a little earlier on than
others, and so I'm online fulltime.
Then I go and meet people inperson and it just, you know, it
took over life, you know.
So I just I got addicted to the.
There's a drop happening indiscord.
What's the fun?
I'm not even buying everything,it's just drop day and discord
is just hilarious and fun, and Ijust lost my life after all of
(07:37):
that.
You know what I mean.
NorCal Guy (07:38):
So kill you.
All right, that's awesome.
I, I love it.
Oh man, I love that.
So what are the best thingsabout Web3 today?
BeginBot (07:53):
So I always tell people like there's this
constant conversation.
Everyone's always saying likewe're going to onboard people,
everyone's going to be in this,everyone and like everything.
I like isn't like that.
I am an annoying like punkhardcore kid.
I'm like a metal head whereit's like oh my God, their new
album, people like it.
Actually, I don't like that, Iwant it to be.
I like you know, we like blackmetal where if the production is
(08:14):
the littlest bit clean, you'relike, hmm, posers, they sold out
.
A normal person might, and so Idon't want to be around too
many normal people.
I love cutting-edge stuff, Ilove weirdos, and you still got
that today.
You're still filled to the brimwith people that are like every
time I meet a friend who's deepinto crypto, I'm like what else
are you into?
And it's like wild music, wildart, wild something else.
(08:37):
I'm meeting people who are likeI collect antiquities, I'm very
deep into 16th century swords,and I'm very deep into 16th
century swords and I'm likeyou're my type of person.
NorCal Guy (08:44):
You're not trying to scale up the 16th century sword
market, right.
BeginBot (08:47):
So, like you still can meet, and since I do a weekly
meetup, I meet new people everyweek and it always starts with
crypto and then it goes to likeyou know any other weird niche
thing.
So it attracts niche people,similar to, I think, how you're
seeing it with AI some now, too,it's this hated thing, which I
love, that people hate it and soit attracts people who are like
(09:07):
okay with that and those are my, that's my tribe.
NorCal Guy (09:12):
The hated, I love it , I love it.
BeginBot (09:14):
The contrarians yeah, yeah, you know people tell me
I'm a contrarian.
But I will say on record I amnot a contrarian.
I never have been, I never willbe so that's just a dirty rumor
, but yeah, oh man.
NorCal Guy (09:27):
So where do you see this crypto art in five years
and do you have any concerns asit expands?
Because it sounds like youmight be leaving the space if it
comes too popular.
BeginBot (09:40):
Oh, if it gets popular I'm out of here.
I mean, it's like I have likedeep I guess.
I guess well, whatever, like Iguess, deep personal opinions on
some stuff, so like firstthere's art right, we can talk
about art and then there'scollectibles I definitely keep
them separate, right, when Icollect shoes, it's not art and
people can say this shoe is apiece of art, but I'm not of the
art.
Uh, I love, love, love art, likeyou know.
(10:02):
Remember, this is what drivesme crazy too about like the
crypto space.
People like, oh, this artist,it's controversial, it's this or
that, and I'm like, are you anart nerd at all?
Every single artist I likepissed off everyone.
It was like radical, you know.
That's why the art isremembered and was pushed on.
No one was like dude.
You know who's good?
Not picasso, but the guy whodid right after him super
(10:23):
similar, but he, but he justcleaned some lines up and his
pricing structure was way better.
They're not remembered.
I'm not interested in it.
So there's this crypto artworld.
Right, I do think that thereare artists that are going to.
You know their name's going tostand the test of time.
I'm like the biggest deafbeathmaxi in the world.
I think he's an artist who usedthe chain and the medium to
make art that is not onlyaesthetically beautiful and
(10:43):
interesting and it sounds great,like the technique was intense
and it uses the chain in aninteresting way.
So it's like this perfect meshof it that I think that'll last.
Right now, you could keeptrying to do death beef stuff
and you won't be rememberedbecause you got to keep moving
on and doing other stuff.
So there's, I mean, who's goingto be remembered after a
hundred years is what I'm oftenthinking about, and I think it's
.
It's not gonna be that manypeople truthfully, and that's
(11:05):
that's okay.
That's how art scenes work.
I love reading old art booksand you're like who are all
these people right?
And then you find out that theywere huge at the time.
So, whatever crypto art is,there's gonna be evolutions and
there's gonna be some peopleremembered and it's a fun place
to participate, but it's youknow this there's not that many
artists who will really becomeremembered over time.
Now, on the collectibles, we'rein a hilarious hype-cycle bubble
(11:27):
, like hype-cycle bubble thing.
That's really fun.
You know what I mean.
I've been in multiple differentbubbles for things.
You know there's you know whatis it Used video games just had
a bubble that popped and youknow, maybe it's going to come
back right.
There's coins that had bubbles.
Everything has these littlecollectible bubbles that go up
and down.
I mean, right, you know, ethanFTs died and then all of a
sudden, ordinals came out, right, and there was this whole
(11:49):
renewed interest in the playbookjust ran back.
I have friends that were inEthan FTs like dude innovation,
check it out.
They got this new thing.
They don't do any utility, it'sjust vibes and I'm like OK,
crypto, great, great.
Then another one came out andit's like no dude, they got a
brand new one.
What they're doing here it'sthis mysterious, mysterious
(12:10):
puzzle.
I'm like do you know how manypuzzles I did in eath that I got
, you know, scammed on because Ispent a week trying to solve
something and it was nothing.
So like the playbook can be runback again if there's some,
like you know, I don't know,core little new culture.
There needs to be new peoplefirst of all that are excited
about it and like I don, I don'tknow something to piss off
someone.
So I think we'll keep seeinglittle evolutions and
collectibles will keep moving indifferent ways.
But you know, and a couplethings will always stay Because,
(12:31):
remember, collecting is not.
We don't need everyone tocollect things.
If you actually look atcollectibles, the highest-end
stuff, it's not one millionpeople want it, two rich guys
fight over it and that's whatpushes the price up and that's
it.
And it's like a third rich guycomes in and it's like it's
going parabolic and it's like,no, a third rich guy just came
(12:53):
into it.
That's you know.
We don't need a trillion peoplecollecting niche things, so I
don't know.
For me, it's like you know, Ilike collecting stuff.
I am a collector at heart, I amhoarder.
I'm just looking around, I meanthe stupidest things you could
possibly imagine I collect,right, just because I'm like I
need them, and it's a littlelike tick in my brain that I
find other people have, but I'mnot trying to pretend that, oh
yes, I've unlocked.
(13:13):
All humans will think like this.
I think that's silly.
I think the fun thing you can dofor collecting, though, is just
ride through and watch all thedifferent trends and the
different waves, and you findout oh cool, this is what's
happening.
Oh interesting, am I interestedin this?
Do I want to collect this?
Oh, it's evolving over here.
Do I like that?
Just watching it move around?
The meta is what I'm interestedin, I guess.
(13:33):
So it's gonna keep moving andevolving, and I think one day, I
don't know what chains will bethe ones that we collect on.
You know what I mean.
So it's, who knows, I'm gonnakeep collecting, collecting kind
of everywhere.
I mean, I am of the opinion oflike, I prefer, like Ethan
Ordinals, if I'm like buying art, quote unquote.
You know, solana, any, any L2makes me feel a little nervous,
(13:54):
you know, right, right, they canbe shut down, so, but at the
same time I'm OK.
Buying things that aretemporary, I guess, because you
know that's the thing too islike people want to be like this
art's all forever and it's likeno, maybe not like, you know,
whatever.
I'm a computer programmer and,as you, if you talk through
disaster scenarios, right, likeyou know, amazon S3 is more
(14:16):
resilient than Solana.
Right, the likelihood of S3going down is more resilient,
probably, than Solana, like S3,they've said they've been able
to guarantee nine nines.
Right, solana's at no nines,you know.
So it's like.
But then we're like, oh my God,it's on AWS, it's ephemeral and
it's like what are you puttingit on right?
So, like, I think the debate ofwhat's permanent is, you know,
(14:40):
we're not fully having it, butit gets really nerdy and
technical, like insanely nerdyand technical and no one wants
to talk about it.
But if you collect sneakers, ifyou collect, you know, early
jordans, they're all crumbled inthe box.
You know who cares.
Right, if you collect paintings, they degrade over time.
Right, things get, things gowrong, things get lost, thing.
That's why death thief entropyis the greatest piece of art in
(15:02):
blockchain of all time, becauseas you trade it, it decays.
He's put it in the art as acomic.
I'm sorry, I don't have any.
All I have from death beep islike I have no entropy, I have
no synpoems.
All the things I want, I wantto own, they're too expensive,
so I'm not even pumped.
I've been pumping myself out ofthis bag forever just just to
know.
But I will keep.
I will keep shilling death beefbecause he just comes up 24-7
(15:24):
as you talk about these things.
Same with like the first.
It's the first, you know.
It comes up every week becausesomeone's like no, you guys
don't understand, this is goodart.
This is the first time onSolana we've done gen art that
has a PFP look right.
And the first one that time wedid it on Art Block.
NorCal Guy (15:40):
That was a rambly mess.
I don't know what's going on.
That was a rambly mess, I loveit.
I love it, I love it.
Do you have any?
Well, there's a couple ofthings we can go, but do you
have any concerns as as this, asthis expands this whole scene?
BeginBot (15:54):
Well, I mean, like the , the concern always is and I
always and everyone knows me,I'm I like to argue about stuff
and it's fun for me, I it's funfor me.
I don't look at it as like anegative thing when I get
together with my friends.
If we talk about metal I mean Idid it the other night just
randomly with some new friends,we're all crypto friends but
then we end up arguing aboutmetal for an hour, right, and
that's enjoyable.
That's what I like about beinginterested in something is the
(16:18):
deeper conversation and like ifyou're into anything, people are
so opinionated.
Talk to the top sneakerheads.
It's like every shoe is likedisgusting, whatever.
Ask a sneakerhead what theythink about a panda dunk it's a
black and white dunk.
They're like disgusting, neverlet that touch my feet.
And they think that becausethey love the world they're in.
And I think in crypto art wehave this big problem where, you
(16:39):
know, no one wants to talkabout the bad stuff.
No one wants to talk about thebad stuff, no one wants to
criticize each other, no onewants to bust balls.
And when people who like artcome over, I've had friends come
over who like are just artnerds and they're like you guys
are the worst you guys will.
Are so afraid to say anythingisn't the greatest art on earth.
You're, we're afraid to getopinions and it's all gonna die.
Because my personal opinion islike real scenes, like small
(17:02):
niche communities, is whatbuilds stuff, not a thousand
people giving some casual timein those, really like intense
lovers of something.
You know the fanatics right,they're critical, they're highly
critical.
So my fear always is just theecho chamber of like don't ever
insult anything it's gonna killeverything.
And then the artist will gosomewhere else, like I.
I think they'll all go to aiand then there'll be an ai art
(17:23):
for a little bit and they'll be.
Everyone will be like you'reruining the world and they'll be
fighting with each other.
And then it will get mainstreamand it goes guys, we're getting
, we're getting popular.
No one insult each other's aiart, we could all get rich.
And then that'll collapse andwe'll move on to I don't know
what you know fair, fair.
NorCal Guy (17:39):
So you kind of mentioned about like I don't
remember exactly what triggeredit, but are you a one ETH one
equals one ETH kind of guy orhow?
Oh you know what triggered itis collecting across all these
different chains, yeah, andwe're pricing in all these
different currencies, yeah.
BeginBot (17:58):
Yeah, I mean, it's just tough because, like you
know, are you going to sellsomething or not, right?
That's the question of whensomething becomes we are.
This is one of the weirdestmarkets, right, where, and you
see it?
I keep bringing it back tosneakers, but we've watched all
this stuff happen in sneakersbefore StockX came out and built
a little, you know, a real-timestock index, which they didn't
you know for sneaker pricing,and then everything got driven
(18:18):
down to the lowest price becauseeveryone was constantly
thinking about what, how muchdoes my shoe cost?
When things were more niche andcollectible, you don't know how
much you can get because you'renot out there selling it.
You've got to find a buyer, andif you have rare items, you've
got to find a buyer withsomething.
And so you're looking at a shoeor, you know, looking at a
piece of art you like on yourwall, and you're like, yeah,
okay, cool, I think it's good, Ithink the artist is going
somewhere, I think it's great.
(18:38):
You're not every day logging onand going.
Did it go up?
Did it go down?
That's like the dorkiest thingin the world.
If you buy a piece of art like,oh, my god, guys, my art is
worth slightly more now, oh,it's worth slightly less.
It's like no one did that foranything that they collected,
that they loved and went really,really up in price over time.
So I think that themicro-watching of any art does
(18:59):
like screw things up.
There is insane, like what doyou call it?
Unit bias.
It's wild, I know, I feel it.
I like literally in my head,solana, solana's free.
I don't know how much 10 Solanais right.
And then I look at ETH and I'mlike, oh, it's expensive.
And then I look at Bitcoin,there's so many zeros in front
of stuff.
I'm like it can't be that much.
And then I said, dude, I spent,I gambled how much in Solana
(19:22):
and like I bought that for what?
And then I take like ETH to mefeels a little more valuable.
Yeah, if that makes sense,that's just my own.
Like my dumb brain has pricedstuff a certain way, so I don't
know, I'm not a one e equals onee kind of guy.
However, there is a thing likeif, when e goes down and you
sell a piece for 40 eath, e goesback up and it's like that's a
(19:44):
40 eath sale and everyone's likenice job, you killed it.
Like I think the move is, ifany any dip you have as an
artist, you got to get out thereand get those high number sales
so they can repump.
You got to get out there andpound the pavement and get the.
You know that it might even begood.
It's actually good for thecollector too.
This is very bad, but good forthe collector because if the
collector is like, look at howmuch more I spent, right, if eat
(20:06):
that 5 000 versus eat that 3000, right, I want to make sure
I sell that piece, I'll pay alittle bit more.
If I think if I caught a dip,you know, because it we look
both better, oh, this is bad Ilike art, okay, not money, I
swear, oh man.
NorCal Guy (20:21):
Yeah, so good times, good times.
But yeah, I got that unitbinaries too well, when I was
doing some meme coins on solana,my problem was like I'm was
thinking in eth, but I'm on souland, like man, why am I like so
, so afraid to spend a couple ofSol where it's not even worth
(20:41):
it?
I'm thinking in ETH terms.
I'm like frick man.
I could have done better on BOM.
BeginBot (20:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Bom is such a beautiful,immaculate conception that will
never happen.
It's like the art of B boom isso great and I I mean, like you
know, I didn't do.
All I did is I put one soulinto boom, right, and that was
great, that worked out great forme.
I was very happy, right.
But I literally put it in and IDM some friends and I was like,
(21:10):
oh, it's dark farms, like, andI double trying to buy pieces
from him that he weren't forsale yet.
Right, he would post some.
And I'm like I want that onedark farm, so you sell to me.
It's not available.
And I'm like okay.
So when he first posted it, Iwas like is he hacked?
Is this the right one?
I clicked, I'm like, oh, it'sthe same guy who I'm dming with.
Like, I don't think he washacked.
And I was like worst casescenario I lose a soul.
(21:30):
Best case scenario I get someart, thinking no, else, you know
nothing else.
And like, a lot of my friendsthought that way, no one's ever
gonna think right, right, youknow what I mean, that that way
is dead.
So it's, you know, immaculateconception once in a lifetime.
Just bye, boom, that was fun,you know, even though you
couldn't hold it and do whatever.
But you know what I mean.
We're just not gonna seeanother like an artist puts out
(21:50):
a pre-sale and it hits a billionin a day like no um, all right.
NorCal Guy (21:55):
So what would you like to see more of in this
crypto art space?
BeginBot (22:02):
I mean so right now, when I think about like what is
interesting in art, I do thinkthere's a lot of things to
explore, like chain wise and theactual like the way we use the
chain and commentate on it, Ithink is very interesting, right
, so BOM even is part of that.
Right, like it's a it's acommentary on meme coins.
I don't really think it's veryinteresting, right, so BOM even
is part of that.
Right, like it's a commentaryon meme coins.
I don't really think it wasnecessarily that, but like using
people and what is happeninghere and commenting on it is
(22:23):
like interesting.
I think Stevie P's another goodexample of that.
I saw he put out a great tweettoday where his favorite killing
it right, I like, I love that,I love like die with the most
likes, like in martha, his likeuh show was just, it was a world
.
You stepped into it.
There's creed nickelbackplaying right, there's a table
(22:45):
full of various various thingsto trade.
You know it was like a worldwas built that was distinctly
his world and we get to likestep into it and it's like a
moment in time, that's.
You know, I'm always going toremember that show of you.
Know, people are trading dildosfor art.
People are trading you knowwhat I mean like people are
going to the gas station buyingthings like I gotta, I need a
piece of that with the mostlikes, let's get to the gas
(23:07):
station, okay, they gotsomething good there, and it's
like that mentality being ableto trigger that, I think, is
just a super fun memory thatpeople will have.
So I want to see people buildtheir their own worlds more and
not which I see.
It seems like a lot of art wesee is like we're all trying to
like.
We just want to keep gettingfancier and nicer and get into
MoMA and we want to make surethat we're moving the ladder up
correctly and I'm like I wantwild shit, I want crazy parties,
(23:29):
I want art that's shocking andscary and like is this a?
scam.
Is this not like, likesomething that I'm not going to
be like that?
That's the most perfectlyaesthetic thing and the mint
mechanics were perfect and Ithink this could go into the
memo one day.
You know which is like.
You know, I don't know, the,the, the MoMA, the.
You know the best pieces of artin the MoMA?
They're all, they're all old.
Okay, you know what I mean.
(23:53):
They like more dangerous, right, people go to Rafik and it's
like the ultimate Instagram shot, right, and it's why it's like
one of the most popular exhibits.
But it's just like, I don'tknow, it's not angering enough
people.
But this is the problem.
I have a problem.
I like things that anger people, that's.
I'm working through it with mytherapist, but then I read art
history and I read likearguments between the artists I
(24:14):
love and it's like they'refighting.
You know what I mean.
Like William de Kooning ispunch Jackson Pollock.
They're arguing about art.
You know that's where.
Yeah, I'm not trying to.
No, no violence, no violence.
NorCal Guy (24:25):
Okay, twitter punch, okay just the crypto boxing
scene.
BeginBot (24:29):
That's it, yeah, yeah yeah, I feel like that one.
It's already dying right nowafter someone's seeing like
Ansem did one and it was likewell, this was not good for the
brand.
We're not getting paid enough.
The big influencer is gettingenough.
This is, you know, I don't know.
I mean, I will say like, I'mvery interested in like, like
(24:49):
art, that is would be censoredand you can get on a chain and
have it and then you know peoplecan't censor it.
That's why Ordinals isinteresting this idea of like
bitcoin maxi's hating thatyou're inscribing stuff or on
there and then being like haha,you have to sync with art and
guess what the art you hate andit's offensive in this way to
you, for you know that I reallylove the idea of people be like
oh my god, I'm importing artinto my home that I don't want.
(25:11):
I'm trying to secure themonetary future.
I'm a libertarian, or whateverthey say.
That that's appealing to me.
Uh, you know, art that, like onETH, is using the mechanics in
a way that, like it forcespeople to learn what's happening
, but it exposes, like the, thedark side of it.
I think that's superinteresting.
I love when someone's like inthe art and it's like wait,
(25:31):
what's going?
Wait, this is how you know.
That's why I think it's notsaying I'm not saying fake,
scammy stuff.
I've been debating this myselfa bit.
I put a tweet out justyesterday that was talking about
AI scamming.
You want to teach someone aboutAI scamming and build a tool to
help them practice.
You're doing the same thing asbuilding something to scam
someone, right?
And there's this weird line incrypto art and I like that line
(25:53):
where it's like OK, so, okay, soit's, it's art, but it is
scammy.
But no, no, no.
The point is that we'recommentating on the scams.
I think that's a reallyinteresting world.
Please, don't get scammed,please, everyone.
I'm so sorry that I'mrecommending this style of art.
NorCal Guy (26:09):
You know, it's just exciting to talk about.
BeginBot (26:11):
Like I I'm not interested in like new
aesthetics.
Like I like I'm a very.
Um, I always Like I, like I'm avery.
I always tell people I'm likeI'm a stupid anti-intellectual
when it comes to art.
Like I got into art runningthrough the museums in DC
they're free, you can runthrough them and I literally
just ran, ran, ran, ran, ran.
I was like what do I like?
What do I like and done.
(26:38):
And then I was like super hypedon, like I'm like I don't know
man, they're making me feelsomething weird, these weird
little alien guys like how didhe see aliens?
And then from there it's like Ifind out, oh my, he's, you know
, selling these for 100 milliondollars.
I'm like, oh my god.
But like, if you, if youapproach it from the 100 million
right away, your brain isalways clouded, right.
(26:59):
So I want like things thatappeal like a base level
aesthetically and I feel likewe're really like a lot of you
know, whatever crypto art rightnow People are going after a
good aesthetic and like tryingto make something that people
will like versus like this issome twisted stuff for my brain.
I think I'm just ranting butlike hr geiger feels like
(27:21):
something's coming out of him.
You know what I mean.
You see that he wasn't like hmm, I think this would be really
the workshop, the aliens they'regonna like more and more, more
weird sex aliens.
It was like, dude, I gotsomething weird in my brain that
I just keep spitting out andthen people react to that.
So, like, I just feel like Idon't see a lot of artists do
that, I'm looking for it.
So there are aesthetics that Icould like.
(27:41):
I just feel like a lot ofpeople are too intellectualized.
They're too yeah, all right,fair, I like dumb, I like what
is it called?
I like what is it called.
I'll leave it happening.
NorCal Guy (28:10):
I'm shilling like I don't know man I look at them
and like there's something aboutthe way that he holds that hot
dog that feels like notintentional but intentionally,
you know.
Okay, sorry, I will nevermention a bag.
I have, don't worry what.
So what is the best?
BeginBot (28:19):
advice you've been given or do you have like a
mantra that you live by?
You know, yeah, I have like twothings.
I guess I'm pretty I think alot about Right.
So one is what is the primaryinformation you're taking in?
That's one of the biggestproblem thing we have in this
space is no one pulls in likenew everything.
Here's a tweet summary of athread of an artist.
I learned about the artist andthey never say, okay, stop,
let's look at the artist art,let's block some time off.
(28:40):
And I'm gonna go through eachpiece, write my feelings, ponder
, go to the next one, read theartist statement and like get my
own primary.
It's all layered on layers ofstuff.
And then the other is it'sreally it's the primary
information.
Is like, look for spaces thatother people aren't interested.
That like really tickles yourbrain.
When there's weird things thatI'm like dude, I can't stop
(29:01):
thinking about, I always this isa weird one.
But when I was a kid I sawplaids and I was like dude, what
the hell are these like?
I want to look at these all day, like wait, they mean things I
want.
And then everyone's like whatare you doing?
What's wrong with you?
Like, why do you care aboutthese, this, but this pattern so
much and I'm like like I don'tknow I it's a weird little tick
disease in my brain and so I'mgoing to follow that.
We have to like, be open to,like man, this subsection of the
(29:24):
world is really interesting me.
And then just go you know fullautist, and just say, okay,
great, but bust out thespreadsheets.
I'm a spreadsheet boy, bust outthe list, you know.
So yeah, but I always encouragepeople read books that are not
related to the current topicthat everyone's talking about.
It's insane.
Everyone's like.
You know, even today, like thepunks nina chanel thing, people
(29:45):
are going to go and like learnabout nina chanel.
That's awesome, that's great.
You know, cool about an artist.
But they're going to read likesummaries and this and that and
whatnot.
I'm going to be like, okay, whois she influenced by?
Okay, who's in that category?
All right, I'm gonna learnabout that random person.
There's gonna be a threat.
Everyone's gonna read the samestuff and they're gonna give me
the summary.
If we know the whole space isgonna focus on it.
I'm gonna go over here and belike did you know?
(30:05):
One of our influences did thisother cool thing and that's
actually a boom.
I've got something interestingto contribute to the
conversation instead of this,like you know, I don't know or a
boris of or a boris of twitterthread.
Summarizing Twitter thread.
Summarizing Twitter thread.
That's fair.
NorCal Guy (30:19):
That's fair so switching it up a little bit, if
you could live or move anywhere, where would you live and why?
BeginBot (30:28):
so I'm gonna hate.
I'm just people gonna hate this.
You know, I live in Venice,california.
Okay, it's the dream.
All right, I built the dream.
Okay, I'm two blocks away froma gorgeous studio.
The beach is a couple blocksaway.
Here, I've got friends livingaround me.
So, like right now I really likewhere I live and I've been to
other places in the world.
I mean, like I'm a fashion nerdand tokyo is like endlessly
fascinating for a trillionreasons.
(30:48):
And when you go there, I'm justlike I literally went there and
I was like oh great, everystore I've ever been in shopping
wise is terrible.
We have no care for detail.
We are lazy, lazy.
You go to New York and you'rejust like every store that they
have a Tokyo version is like whydon't we finish?
We didn't finish anything.
The light fixtures aren'tcustom, it doesn't smell a
certain way.
So I definitely like that.
(31:10):
But I've got a personal.
I've got many random pictures.
As you can probably tell, I'mobsessed with neighborhoods.
I'm obsessed with two types ofneighborhoods.
Right, you got a digitalneighborhood, you got a physical
neighborhood, and so I thinkthe most important thing is, can
you build a like a group ofpeople around you where it is
much more in-person high touch.
You know, yesterday we had anAI meetup.
(31:32):
It's very casual.
We go to a beautiful little spotin Venice, you're outside,
we're all trading someinformation.
There's some dogs there, youknow, we all build a little
things.
And then it's like cool, let'sall go to lunch, nice lunch
outside.
You might run into someonerandom over there.
Oh, cool, let's join the convo.
It's you need like to bewalking and moving around with
friends and meeting otherfriends and letting that
(31:52):
serendipity in person happen.
I think it's like superimportant.
So like, anywhere you can goand have that density is good,
but at the same time and I'mvery obsessed with this you got
to build that density.
You know what I mean.
I've done a meetup for twoyears here and I forced people
to move here.
I think there's actual peoplewho are like I came here for a
week and they've been here forsix months because they're like
well, there's so many coolpeople here.
(32:12):
I'm like you have to like plantyour flag and start like the
troops, you know what I meanLike, okay, we're meeting this
day, we're doing a lunch thisday, we're doing that, and then
you can build that world.
So I think I can go otherplaces I've been.
You know, I might go to NorthDakota and I'm going to become
friends with the three farmersin the two-mile radius with me
(32:33):
and we'll have to do some farmermeetup.
I think I could do that.
I sometimes dream of it.
I know it's going to be tougherand it won't be as many people,
but I don't know.
Well, even then, like we'regoing to talk about farming
stuff, who cares?
We're going to get whateverthey're into.
They're in a hunting.
I will, I got, I'll do ahunting meetup, right, and I
won't.
I won't probably go hunting.
Is that scary?
(32:53):
But so I don't know I right now.
But it's.
It's about where the people are, because who cares?
If you're, if you're, even whenI would go to tokyo, it's going
to take a minute.
I'm gonna have to build upfriends, build up a scene, build
up, like you know, a network,you know.
But and then the other side is,I will say, you can be somewhere
you know, like that's not sodense with people of the same
interest if you got a goodonline neighborhood and I think
(33:13):
a lot of times people don'trealize like we.
Twitter is not a neighborhood,right.
Twitter's new york city.
People are yelling fromeverywhere, blah, blah, blah.
Uh, a group chat couldtechnically be a neighborhood if
it's like small enough, right,but I've met with my uh discord
group of friends that were alllike first programmers, then it
added crypto people and thenit's expanded.
All these random people we'vemet every tuesday, I think three
(33:37):
years now, right, and it's likeat one point it was like hey,
let's, let's, let's make moneytogether.
They didn't turn like hey,we're playing games.
And then it's like hey, we'resharing our lives together.
And now it's like it's just afamily home thing you do every
week where I'm right, you knowI've not met these people all in
real life, like a bunch of them.
(33:58):
I have never met irl, but I'mlike literally like, like, like
how's the baby this week?
What's going?
on right you know it's becauseit's a online neighborhood as
well.
So if you are missing one, Ithink you can go get the other.
And I think the key is you haveto put this I'm pushing my own
you gotta have a schedule.
You gotta have.
I have one day a week thursday.
Every thursday.
(34:18):
Everyone knows you come tovenice.
We have nerds, crypto peopleall day.
We, if you come there at two,you will be there till two at
night and you will talk to athousand weirdos.
Just show up on thursdays.
And then for me, online, I dotuesdays every tuesday.
The people is like well, howlong is the call?
I'm like till we all pass out Idon't know you on and you never
know how long it'll go.
(34:39):
And sometimes you log back onin the morning Like you guys are
still on.
It's like we got into this andyou're like so just like
schedule it.
So you know I've been trying toencourage.
It's like bowling night.
You know everyone needs abowling night.
NorCal Guy (34:49):
That's good.
Do you have a favorite moviequote?
BeginBot (35:04):
Hmm.
So just famously, everyoneknows I'm a weirdo who likes to
do self-imposed bets, so I'mright now on a 10-year bet to
not watch a single movie.
So, as of right now, it's beenfive and a half years since I've
watched a movie.
NorCal Guy (35:20):
Um, I'm getting a lot of peer pressure right now a
lot of, a lot of, a lot of peerpressure.
BeginBot (35:25):
So, like I kind of movies are kind of out of my,
they're out of my.
I don't.
I can't think of any moviequotes right now and I'm a
famous movie hater because theonly good movies are you filming
with dog me 95.
I just gotta keep pushing well.
Well, one day, if you want tosee, I think that the only
movies worth watching okay aredog me 95.
(35:46):
It's you know, it's a 90s,avant-garde filmmaking, little
movement, like I think it's likedanish, right, but it's a
thousand rules that, like, thefilms can't be in color, the
director can't be credited, nogenre movies.
There's no fake violence, notemporal location.
Moving Music has to all be, Iwould say, diegetic, not non-die
.
It's, whatever I like, theworld's worst stuff.
Everyone hates it.
(36:07):
You put on the movies myfavorite movie.
Growing up I watched it onrepeat until my little brother
literally was like this is childabuse.
You are abusing me.
You can't have this on.
This is gonna affect my brainin a bad way.
I'm like no, no, no.
I like to come from from schooland put on gummo.
It makes me feel comforted andI don't know if you've seen the
(36:29):
movie, but it's.
There's no discernible goodquotes from it.
It's, it's a all right, I'minsufferable.
NorCal Guy (36:36):
All right, this going to be a good one.
What is the best thing and thesilliest thing you've spent
money on?
BeginBot (36:45):
Man, okay, I spend a lot of money on silly things.
Just what came to my houseright now is I have long green
screen gloves.
I have all the way to the hands.
I'm into green screen stuff.
I've got two robes, two fullwizard robes, right behind me
with green screen, green on theinside.
Oh man, it's not in this room,it's in the other room.
My prized possession is I playmusic and I like.
(37:08):
The worst music is I've got aKorg Miku guitar pedal.
I'm not familiar with Miku.
She's maybe the first ever likeum, she's not ai, but like
digital avatar singer.
Okay, very famous she.
She just played coachella.
It's a big deal.
You know, people were madbecause it was a screen, not a
hologram.
There's like over 3 000 guysthat have married her.
(37:28):
But korg made a very rareguitar pedal.
That was like way too muchmoney because it was like out of
print.
No one liked it and it makesyour guitar sound like a
japanese anime singer whichevery time you play it and you
start playing, people go.
What is going?
What is your?
What are your fingers doing?
It's the world's worst guitarplayer because it tracks
horribly.
So you have to like practice aton and then I I know that, like
(37:51):
I did, I think I spent like 700on it.
It was so much money and it'sjust for a joke.
Every six months I go guyslisten and they're like, okay,
good one vegan.
NorCal Guy (38:02):
Like you're just so stupid.
BeginBot (38:03):
I mean, yeah, I'll have to go into the other room
one day and pull out all theother weird stuff, but you know,
I'm an eBay boy, so I buy justdumb stuff on eBay too, like
anything Like.
I'm saying, like, if you, Idon't know, like I'm pretty
interested in McDonald's toysright now I don't know why,
vintage McDonald's toys.
(38:23):
When I was a child I figuredthis out.
Therapy there was at the library, which is that's the only place
my parents you know that wasour spot they built a system
that tricked us.
Where it was an Excelspreadsheet where you would earn
books by reading books, whereit was an Excel spreadsheet
where you would earn books byreading books.
And I was like, oh, I'm goingto win that and so I'm going to
read every book on earth, andnow I'm going to get more books,
and now I'm rich with books andthey're like you idiot, you're
(38:46):
just learning about stuff.
But yeah, it was a great trick.
But then I went to the library.
I got really into like thereference section eventually,
because you start going throughstuff, you read enough dragon
and sci-fi books, you're like,and there they had, it was a
reference book of everymcdonald's toy and just seeing
(39:07):
it in aggregate in the history.
It went deep into my brain oflike, collect these, collect
these and then like this is bad.
But kerwin frost, who's aninsane artist, he's the guy who
actually this is him.
This is so weird.
Look at, he did his own nuggetbuddy, brought the nugget
buddies back.
That's what he looks like.
He's got a pencil tattie.
That's that's identical to him.
He brought them back.
And then I was like, well, Igotta get some of these nugget
buddies because I used to havean interest in this.
Then I hit ebay and I'm likegod damn it, I really want that
(39:30):
spy set.
Oh man, I really want like anystitch.
I don't know why.
So so I'm pretty I'm deep inthat game.
I have other.
Well, I'm a Rubik's Cubecollector too.
I don't know what's wrong withme.
If you ever come to our studio,everyone gets a Rubik's Cube.
NorCal Guy (39:45):
I buy them in bulk and I get them out and I want
you know some other unusual ones.
BeginBot (39:50):
I love it.
I spent in my lifetime Iprobably spend At least $2,000
on Rubik's cubes to give out topeople you know.
So if you, if you worked at anyof the startups I work at and
you can ask, ask any of them, uh, at your desk, I would put a
Rubik's cube, you know, on everydesk and then I'd find it.
Oh, my kid's using it.
Okay, good, how many kids doyou have?
Three kids, fantastic.
(40:11):
One moment.
Your wife has she solved it yet?
Uh, one for you.
That's awesome.
I'm trying to push myobsessions on other people.
NorCal Guy (40:23):
I love it.
I love it.
I mean I can kind of get theMcDonald's toys.
I mean because that's nostalgic, huge nostalgic, yeah, totally,
because that was like damn, Iwant a Happy Meal.
Can we go get a Happy Meal?
BeginBot (40:40):
Exactly as a kid.
It's like the food is the bestever.
And then you get into this toy.
The Pope stuff is great becauseI now have people delivering me
Pope stuff, which I really love, and that started because, oh
my God, I'm an insane person.
So every day for a long time Iwould always start my day off by
reading the wikipedia articlefor the date and you start
(41:03):
learning like what happened thatday and what's the history.
But really once you've done thewhole year, you learn like it's
the meta of wikipedia.
I'm really into wikipedia um,banned from wikipedia currently,
for you know, so they don'tlike my edits, but I'm gonna get
back on, but I started readingit and you start finding like
what events trigger wikipedia,to put it on the date right,
like on the actual day, right,like every year has some world
(41:25):
war ii stuff.
Everyone has kings and queens,you know, presidents hit stuff,
but popes are always on there,right?
If a pope does anything, popenews always makes the wikipedia.
And so then me and a friendstarted getting way too into
reading actually about each ofthe popes, and then we started
finding out that popes are themost insane characters of all
time.
And then I got into.
(41:45):
I got to plug my website.
Well, zanus is the, is the realbuilder, maintainer.
But pope countcom is the onlywebsite that gives you a real
time update of how many popesthere are.
The only reason this exists isbecause we're trying to push
that.
There's actually another popewho died before he was
officially pope, but pope popestephen ii is a pope whatever.
(42:06):
Way too deep into popes and nowthat's moved into.
I just want to collect weirdstuff from the pope and there's
nothing better than peoplegiving me pope stuff.
Well, and garfield.
I get a lot of garfield pressand I'm pretty deep into
garfield too.
So a lot of of a lot of friendsgive me Garfield and Pope stuff
and it's funny when otherpeople don't know it and they're
just like Beacon.
What's going on?
Why are people?
Why are?
Why are they giving you Popeand Garfield things?
(42:27):
And you know I I keep them onme.
So if you see me in person,we'll just ask how much Pope and
Garfield stuff do you have onyour person?
All right, usually there's someso I love it.
NorCal Guy (42:38):
All right, this one's gonna be a good one.
If you could commission a pieceand have two artists collab on
it, which two artists would itbe?
BeginBot (42:49):
That's good, Okay.
So no matter what we're doing,death be first, obviously.
You've already heard that.
Okay that's my guy.
He's the yeah, just really loveeverything he's doing here.
Now, one thing I think that'slike I mean I got the answer
it's death beef and data bots.
That's it.
Oh, my god, I I need to putthat together, okay.
So, like I think data bots isthe absolute leader in ai music.
Like I'm so excited foreverything he's done, everything
(43:10):
he's gonna do death beef isalready done, music stuff, right
.
I think, like I got the deathbeef.
I did it the other night.
Uh, you know, I brought thedeath beef record in the living
room.
We had friends over.
I pop it on, one friend is likesick and the others are like
dude, turn this off, you'reruining the party.
It's like, okay, uh, sorryabout that.
I thought you guys were gonnalike this.
(43:31):
Um, I think they already have.
Like you know, there's someaesthetics that could go
together and I think if theyworked out something like that
was both aesthetics with the AI,plus already what Deathbeef's
done, programming like using Cand all that, it would be maybe
the greatest collection of alltime.
Okay, and if that happens and Idon't get a piece, oh, boy, I'm
(43:51):
pissed.
NorCal Guy (43:51):
Okay, I mean, you should get one just like an
honorary.
Like here you go, Air dropped.
BeginBot (43:56):
Yeah, I'm putting the collab out.
I'm messaging I don't, I'm notfriends with death beef, I'm
friends with databots.
Now, hey, what's up databots?
Uh, I'm gonna hit him up and belike, hey, you got more clout
to be hit up, death beef.
NorCal Guy (44:06):
Let's get this going so fair, fair all right, do you
have a hot take?
I mean, you've been spittingthem the whole time, but do you
have one that um stands out thatyou want to fight about?
BeginBot (44:22):
I mean, yeah, I mean my hot take is, I mean I've been
kind of pushing the one messageI always am pushing to people,
which is just that no one'sgoing to remember 99% of any of
this stuff here and the onlypeople that people are going to
remember is going to be basedoff of the storytelling around
it.
That storytelling could bebased off of money and you know,
monetary price going up andwildness here, but I think a lot
(44:43):
of it's going to be like howthey actually fight within the
art system and, as time goes on,like who are the people that
are involved?
Like even right now, like, uh,dimitri, uh, cherniak, you know,
in this with this, there's thisnick krueger drama, right, and
there's, you know, there's somethat helpsuder drama, right, and
there's, you know there's somethat helps Dimitri, right, that
helps Dimitri's.
Like long-term generative artstory.
(45:03):
Because when you're going tostart talking about gen art,
you're going to talk about oh,here's some of the top pieces,
here's some of the moreexpensive ones.
I'm going to tell the story ofthe goose.
And why is the goose soexpensive?
Well, maybe part of the priceis keychains being hidden around
marfa, and it's like what areyou talking about wait.
There's more he has drama withanother guy.
That story I can tell to anormie later on in history books
.
I can make a fun youtube video Ican have a pbs documentary
(45:26):
about it that will lead towardsit.
So, like it's, storytelling isall that matters, for I think
what art's going to be lastinglong term and the storytelling
doesn't need to be.
When I was a child I wasinspired by it's gonna be how it
interacts in the scene.
It's gonna be de kooning,punching pollock, you know like
that makes the art go on.
So I want people to not beafraid from conflict because,
(45:48):
like, all the best bands hatedeach other.
If you actually look at it,like, look at your favorite
bands, they hated all your otherfavorite bands.
All your favorite artists hatethe other artists.
I was reading, reading arauchenberg book and and I'm
like, oh, rauschenberg's thegreatest, he's the best ever,
right, boom, switch to theDonald Judd book and he's like
it's not trash like Rauschenberg.
I'm like, no Dude, I justthought we, who cares?
They're both big.
(46:09):
You know what I mean.
It all worked out right andit's like the good and bad of
like anything.
I do this in tech all the time.
It's like, oh, there's aframework we want to use or a
library I go.
Who hates it?
You hate it.
You got detailed reasons.
Tell me and they'll tell youall the reasons they hate it and
you will learn why you willwant to use it or not.
(46:30):
It tells you about criticism,tells you about the good things
of art at the same time, in away.
So you know just, everyoneneeds to be less afraid of
criticism and it's, it's allgood, it's gonna just have fun.
Be nerds and we're allowed toargue about stuff, right, you
know, on the timeline or not, Iknow it hurts our feelings a
little bit, but everyone's nicerin person, for sure.
(46:52):
You know what I mean.
Like everyone is like waycooler in person and they'll be
like dude, I didn't like thisart, you're mean about it.
I'm like you might talk alittle bit and go oh yeah, of
course you wouldn't like it.
You have the world's worsttaste in art.
You know what I mean.
Like I'll like I tell people Idon't like music.
You know some music and likewell, what do you like?
And I'm like oh, I like literalnoise, right, like I'm a, I
(47:13):
like purient, I like mersbo,right it.
You know I'm wearing a youngthug hat.
People listen to Young Thug andthey're like this is the
world's worst.
He's saying I can't hear a word.
He's saying I'm like, yes, it'spost-lyrical, it's actually,
you know it's.
He's being studied by Columbia.
So it's like we're allowed tohave taste and our taste is not
going to be unified right.
(47:42):
I love it.
Let's hear about any projectsyou have or anything you'd like
to plug.
Talk about that you're doing.
Yeah, so right now, I mean, soI do have.
Well, I don't know if I want totell you something.
Well, here I'll tell you myinterest.
Okay, I'll tell you my interestin what I'm working on.
Okay, so I am working on somepersonal art projects, but I'm
the world's worst human.
So actually I started doinggenerative art like 2015,.
Right, Because I was a coderand code's beautiful and I'm
living in code all day.
And so I started making, like,but there was no generative art
(48:03):
scene.
I'm just alone making, you know, programs calling them untitled
number one and like, working on, like, what do I like of the
aesthetics and stuff like that,and but I just never released
things right.
And then I was a musicianmaking, as you can probably
guess, very weird music that wasthen mixed with visuals.
So it's like these notes affectthese visuals on a screen and
(48:26):
I'm using Max MSP to link thetwo and stuff like that, but
never released anything.
So I've done a lot of digging oflike, okay, well, what is
actually very, very, veryinteresting right now?
What do we think is going to belast in art.
What is something meaty that Iwant to get into and this is
something I'm working on, but Iwant anyone else to do it too is
for AI stuff, and if you'veever watched my programming
streams, people will know whatthis means.
(48:49):
It's insane.
But real time input from peopleand how that can affect people
like emotionally, is the mostinteresting aspect of AI and
like we're exploring it like solittle meaning that I learned
about you, I heard, I heard arumor you're you're a sierra
nevada drinker is that.
True, that's my only beer.
Everyone knows me.
If they bring, I'm being 100, Ionly if you see me on stage I'm
trying to get a sponsorship.
They offer the kombucha.
I said no pale ale or bust.
(49:11):
Okay, I probably fucked up thatrelationship there.
Um, okay, but uh.
But see, I know that about you,yeah, right, and then all of a
sudden we, I'm trying to createsome art on the fly.
You come into a gallery and Iknow I show a, I don't know.
It's a dad sitting back in hischair.
Meant to be a Norman Rockwellpainting, but then it's a Sierra
Nevada.
It triggers a little.
It's a little deeper to you.
(49:32):
The next person walks in, it'sthe wine.
They drank.
NorCal Guy (49:36):
The next person walks in, it's their Manhattan.
BeginBot (49:39):
You can.
It's, it's, it's the wine theydrink.
The next person walks in, yeah,yeah that you can affect people
so much more emotionally if youmatch up towards them, which is
exactly what ai is doing rightnow with algorithms to give us
exactly what we like.
The tiktok algorithm is crazyto show people mine and they're
like dude, what are you into?
This is wild, right.
It's like the algorithm knowsit's finding true stuff, and so
I think that world of AI is likeendlessly fascinating.
(50:00):
So how do you make art that isreacting to the individual
person in real time or semi realtime, or you know, we could
talk about what real time meansand giving them that art
experience?
So I'm just I've been buildinga bunch of tools and stuff like
that and I did.
I did I've shown up, I'vewritten proposals and I'm
working on coding stuff.
And I did show I've shown up,I've written proposals and I'm
working on coding stuff.
(50:20):
And I did show a couple friends, a couple art friends, and they
said this is disturbing.
So I'm like I don't know if I'monto it.
They were like what are youtrying to do?
I'm not going to do this, and Iwas like someone's going to do
it, so it might all fall apart.
I'm going to get.
No one's going to want to gointo my tunnel, my chamber, and
see AI.
That is for them, because mygoal is what's the point of art
(50:42):
here?
I want to make them cry, screamIf someone breaks.
I would like, ideally, someoneto see the art and immediately
be like I have to rip this offthe walls.
Barnett Newman getting hispiece slashed with a knife.
We want to trigger that.
But to trigger that, I didn'tknow about you, I don't know and
give me just give me access toyour Twitter, give me access to
(51:03):
your.
You know your parents' voices Ifyou could give me access to
your pictures of your dog.
NorCal Guy (51:05):
It's like so yeah, do you remember that movie, the
game?
I think it was called the game.
No, no, what's with, likeMichael Doug?
Was it Kurt Michael?
I think Kurt Douglas, we loveMichael Douglas.
Anyways, he like filled outthis like huge questionnaire and
did it and then like went onthis like crazy journey and it
(51:26):
all ended up being like thisbirthday surprise, but it was
like hitting him on all sorts ofweird things and like
conquering his fears andeverything.
Because he filled out this weirdass survey that was like a
hundred pages and cause hisbrother like gave him this thing
.
I like that's crazy andeverything.
Because he filled out thisweird ass survey that was like
100 pages and because hisbrother like gave him this thing
.
BeginBot (51:41):
I like that's crazy the idea of like being, like,
like.
I have to conquer my fears.
It's like why.
It's like it was a birthdaypresent.
NorCal Guy (51:47):
I don't fully understand what happened, but it
was a good birthday, so thatsounds good to me, but yeah, no,
it's along those lines like soyou can get to know that person
and then you can be like reallymess with them or do good for
them or whatever, but yeah Ilike that.
I like that.
That sounds great.
BeginBot (52:01):
I mean, it sounds like you could do it I will say on
the, on the non-art side, I mean, uh, because you know, uh, you
know, I'm in venice.
We're doing shows like everysingle week and we're just
trying to like scale them up,make them more fun, make like, I
think, so much content.
If you go watch any panels,right, they're always, you know,
dry.
Let me talk about my life, likearguing in conflict and like
fun is like I do want to beintellectual too, like, but it's
(52:21):
like I look at it.
It's like more likeprofessional wrestling, right,
where it's the storytellingmixed with some you know, I
might change my opinions fromtime to time no big deal, uh,
and that's you can get deeper inconversations by two people
agreeing.
One person switches sides.
You can go further in it.
So we're trying to.
We do an ordinal show now, we doan art show, we do just kind of
a generic crypto show.
(52:41):
So just how can I just bringmore of those conversations
anywhere?
I'm hopefully gonna.
I started off doing this withprogramming.
All this was teaching peopleprogramming uh, okay, it's just
a little.
You know it's a little harder tomake interesting and fun.
However, I think now we we'regetting closer on it.
So, like anyone out there wholike, wants to, you know, create
fun content, that's a littlebit, not not more dangerous
(53:02):
isn't the word, but just likemore fast moving more exciting,
more confrontational.
Like hit me up, I want to help,just want to make as much of
that this.
NorCal Guy (53:09):
I love it well, beacon, I just want to say thank
you so much for coming on theshow and, man, I enjoyed this
conversation so much and, uh,dude, it was awesome and man I
enjoyed this conversation.
So much and dude.
It was awesome and, man, Ican't wait to when are you?
BeginBot (53:23):
coming down to Venice.
NorCal Guy (53:24):
That's what I'm saying.
I mean, I need to plan a dayand come down for a weekend or
something, 100% yeah, plan a day, anyway.
BeginBot (53:32):
No, no, actually, truthfully, it happens to
everyone, happens again, even OG, who was on our show this week.
He's like I fly out before Ileave and I'm like sure you do,
of course you fly out before thenext show, and then all of a
sudden the show.
Okay, I'm here a little bitlonger and boom, we had him on
the show and then I think he wasalready planning on it.
It wasn't because of us.
There's many reasons to move toLA, but I'm like that's how it
(53:55):
is.
I'm just saying like SoCal guyis not the world's worst rebrand
, you know what I mean.
It's kind of close, you know,fair fair.
Cool.
NorCal Guy (54:03):
Well thank you.
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Norcal guy, norcal guy, norcalguy, norcalguy.
Who is this?
Who is this guy?
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal guy.
Norcal and chill podcast.
Norcal and chill podcast.
(00:22):
What the sh, what the sh?
Norcal and chill podcast.
Norcal and Shill Podcast.
What the shill, what the shill?
Norcal and Shill Podcast.
So it's shill time.
Norcal and Shill Podcast whatthe shill, what the shill?
Hey, everyone, welcome back toanother episode of NorCal and
Shill.
Today we have a truly uniqueguest, beaconbot, joining us for
a dive into the fascinatingworld of crypto art and
(00:45):
collectibles.
Beganbot is a man of manypassions an early adopter of
CryptoPunks and CryptoKitties, acollector of McDonald's toys
and Rubik's Cubes.
He's known for his weeklymeetups that start with crypto
and often veer into other nicheinterests, always enjoying the
company of unconventionalthinkers.
In this episode, we exploreBeganBot's thoughts on the
(01:09):
cyclical nature of collectiblebubbles, his love for drama in
the Web3 community and theintriguing concept of blockchain
art that decays with each trade.
From his skepticism aboutpopular trends to his passion
for community building, veganbotshares his unique perspective
on not just collecting art butcreating pieces that challenge
(01:31):
and evoke strong emotionalreactions.
We'll learn about his peculiarand humorous purchases, his
favorite avant-garde films,veganbot's deep-seated interest
in storytelling, aesthetics andsociology of the art scene make
for an engaging conversationthat is sure to captivate you.
So sit back, relax and getready for a thought-provoking
(01:54):
journey with BeaconBot ontoday's episode of NorCal and
Shill.
Hey, beacon, welcome to thepodcast.
How are you doing today?
BeginBot (02:02):
Doing lovely, you know , just catching up on all the
fun you know, fun drama that'shappening on Twitter every day.
NorCal Guy (02:09):
Right, right.
I just barely see it and Ithink it's hilarious sometimes.
Today's is the punk thing.
I don't even remember what it'scalled the punk in residence
with Nina Chanel.
BeginBot (02:23):
The punk thing I don't even remember what it's called
the, the, the punk, in residencewith Nina Chanel.
NorCal Guy (02:27):
There it is, there it is.
I was like I, I don't mean, Idon't care what they're doing,
but whatever, um, but everyone'shating.
BeginBot (02:34):
Well, you don't, you don't, you don't have a punk
then I do have a punk.
Yeah, brand, we got to protectthem.
Okay, okay, sorry, I don't havea punk and I'm over here
reading nina chanel interviewsright now, trying to be like,
okay, is there something I'm notseeing in the traits?
NorCal Guy (02:52):
and, like you, you just that's the difference
between a punk owner and anon-punk owner well, well, I
guess you could say I'm not like, I never rep it, so it's just
sitting in the wallet.
That's all it's doing.
BeginBot (03:06):
So yeah, that's the drama, probably a smart move
right now, Kevin Crazy.
NorCal Guy (03:12):
So I guess, when did you get started?
BeginBot (03:20):
And what were your first thoughts when you heard
about this whole crypto artscene?
Yeah, so I'm always like I'm aninternet nerd.
I love weird subcultures, soI'm always anything.
I'm not even joking.
My interest things I'm not eveninterested in.
I will look at the collectingscene.
I know a ton about beaniebabies just because people talk
trash about them.
So I'm like, well, there's somethat are valuable.
I'm gonna figure out which ones.
I don't want to buy beaniebabies.
So, like, I'm always lookingfor, I don't know, just
(03:41):
interesting, weird niches,niches.
And so I saw CryptoPunks andCryptoKitties pretty early on
because I already had ETH.
I was a programmer, so you know.
Classic story of everyoneBitcoin it's this cool, badass
thing to buy drugs in the SilkRoad.
Very cool.
And that teaches you aboutcrypto.
And then someone says ETH isprogrammable money.
I was like I'm a programmer, Ilike programming, that's more
(04:02):
valuable.
And so I literally just gotinto ETH from that simple, dumb
way.
And so then I'm not, I don'treally care, I just bought some
and I didn't program anything.
I was working on other stuffand then I saw CryptoPunks and
CryptoKitties and I was like ohcool, little collectible things.
NorCal Guy (04:20):
I love collecting dumb things.
BeginBot (04:22):
I possibly imagine.
I've got Pope memorabilia.
I collect Pope memorabilia, soI collect dumb things that
people don't like.
And I was like, oh, this ispretty cool.
So I got some CryptoKittiesfrom 2017.
They're on a broken computerright now.
I'm just trying to get it open.
The seed phrase is saved in atext doc.
It's not working.
(04:42):
It's a very old MacBook.
And then I just watched punkskind of from afar and watched
them like do nothing and then goup and price some and get past
1,000.
And I was like, oh, this iscool, this is heating up here,
but they never bought anythingand just kept chilling, forgot
about them.
Then, randomly, I was workingat a startup that was pretty
(05:07):
much what Twitter Spaces is onlyin sports only and I honestly
don't like sports.
Don't tell anyone.
I'm learning how to like themnow.
And there was some roomstalking about Top Shot and I'm
like, what are they talkingabout?
Oh, virtual trading cards.
Oh, my dad's a baseball cardcollector.
I don't like sports, but let'slearn about that, yeah.
And so I was like following it.
I was really enjoying hearingpeople make money, hearing
people give hilariouspredictions Like people were
fighting, like no, you don'tunderstand.
It's going to be a generationof talent and this is going to
(05:28):
be like a Rook, a Michael Jordanrookie card and I was like, oh,
I love what they're talkingabout, uh, but I'm not going to
buy it because I know that I'mexit liquidity.
If I don't watch basketball,I'm guaranteed exit liquidity.
So, but I also had a a.
I had a feeling that I had, Ithought I had taste, you know,
because I I collect shoes andclothing for a long time.
(05:48):
Yeah, and all the shoes that Icollected when I was younger,
all these dunks that literallywhen I was around, like only
nerds cared about them.
It wasn't like this super, likefinancial thing.
If you were like jedi dunks,they're ugly actually.
I, I love them, but likethey're people like your shoes,
what are you wearing?
It looks terrible.
And those went up in value.
So I was like, okay, buy thingsyou like they go up.
(06:10):
I feel like that.
So I was like on the lookout andI was buying all sorts of silly
little nfts here and there.
I always shout out a franelations, if you.
If you know who he is.
He's a og in the sneakercommunity and then an og in the
crypto collectibles communityand he started posting on his
YouTube like, look, and I'mbuying random NFT projects,
projects that no one's heard ofnow.
But he was like showing how heevaluated him and whatnot, and I
(06:32):
was like, oh it's, it'ssneakers.
And so then from there I justhad like I was just into it.
I just loved following dropsand this and that and everything
else.
And then I'm one of thoseterrible people who, when the
board apes came out, I looked atthem.
I was like these are ugly.
I watched them mint out.
And then that first week Iswear to god, I couldn't stop
looking at him for whatever dumbreason.
I called a friend of mine and Isaid, hey, dude, you want to
(06:54):
get drunk and smoke weed tonightand look at all these monkey
photos and I'm gonna buy one.
And, uh, we did that.
I think I bought one for likefive hundred dollars, something
stupid like that.
And then over the next week Istarted buying more and more and
we watched those go up.
And then I happened to be inVenice, california, where the
first BoardAid meetup was.
So Bright Moments was here,first BoardAid meetup, and so
(07:15):
then I was able to meet somepeople a little earlier on than
others, and so I'm online fulltime.
Then I go and meet people inperson and it just, you know, it
took over life, you know.
So I just I got addicted to the.
There's a drop happening indiscord.
What's the fun?
I'm not even buying everything,it's just drop day and discord
is just hilarious and fun, and Ijust lost my life after all of
(07:37):
that.
You know what I mean.
NorCal Guy (07:38):
So kill you.
All right, that's awesome.
I, I love it.
Oh man, I love that.
So what are the best thingsabout Web3 today?
BeginBot (07:53):
So I always tell people like there's this
constant conversation.
Everyone's always saying likewe're going to onboard people,
everyone's going to be in this,everyone and like everything.
I like isn't like that.
I am an annoying like punkhardcore kid.
I'm like a metal head whereit's like oh my God, their new
album, people like it.
Actually, I don't like that, Iwant it to be.
I like you know, we like blackmetal where if the production is
(08:14):
the littlest bit clean, you'relike, hmm, posers, they sold out
.
A normal person might, and so Idon't want to be around too
many normal people.
I love cutting-edge stuff, Ilove weirdos, and you still got
that today.
You're still filled to the brimwith people that are like every
time I meet a friend who's deepinto crypto, I'm like what else
are you into?
And it's like wild music, wildart, wild something else.
(08:37):
I'm meeting people who are likeI collect antiquities, I'm very
deep into 16th century swords,and I'm very deep into 16th
century swords and I'm likeyou're my type of person.
NorCal Guy (08:44):
You're not trying to scale up the 16th century sword
market, right.
BeginBot (08:47):
So, like you still can meet, and since I do a weekly
meetup, I meet new people everyweek and it always starts with
crypto and then it goes to likeyou know any other weird niche
thing.
So it attracts niche people,similar to, I think, how you're
seeing it with AI some now, too,it's this hated thing, which I
love, that people hate it and soit attracts people who are like
(09:07):
okay with that and those are my, that's my tribe.
NorCal Guy (09:12):
The hated, I love it , I love it.
BeginBot (09:14):
The contrarians yeah, yeah, you know people tell me
I'm a contrarian.
But I will say on record I amnot a contrarian.
I never have been, I never willbe so that's just a dirty rumor
, but yeah, oh man.
NorCal Guy (09:27):
So where do you see this crypto art in five years
and do you have any concerns asit expands?
Because it sounds like youmight be leaving the space if it
comes too popular.
BeginBot (09:40):
Oh, if it gets popular I'm out of here.
I mean, it's like I have likedeep I guess.
I guess well, whatever, like Iguess, deep personal opinions on
some stuff, so like firstthere's art right, we can talk
about art and then there'scollectibles I definitely keep
them separate, right, when Icollect shoes, it's not art and
people can say this shoe is apiece of art, but I'm not of the
art.
Uh, I love, love, love art, likeyou know.
(10:02):
Remember, this is what drivesme crazy too about like the
crypto space.
People like, oh, this artist,it's controversial, it's this or
that, and I'm like, are you anart nerd at all?
Every single artist I likepissed off everyone.
It was like radical, you know.
That's why the art isremembered and was pushed on.
No one was like dude.
You know who's good?
Not picasso, but the guy whodid right after him super
(10:23):
similar, but he, but he justcleaned some lines up and his
pricing structure was way better.
They're not remembered.
I'm not interested in it.
So there's this crypto artworld.
Right, I do think that thereare artists that are going to.
You know their name's going tostand the test of time.
I'm like the biggest deafbeathmaxi in the world.
I think he's an artist who usedthe chain and the medium to
make art that is not onlyaesthetically beautiful and
(10:43):
interesting and it sounds great,like the technique was intense
and it uses the chain in aninteresting way.
So it's like this perfect meshof it that I think that'll last.
Right now, you could keeptrying to do death beef stuff
and you won't be rememberedbecause you got to keep moving
on and doing other stuff.
So there's, I mean, who's goingto be remembered after a
hundred years is what I'm oftenthinking about, and I think it's
.
It's not gonna be that manypeople truthfully, and that's
(11:05):
that's okay.
That's how art scenes work.
I love reading old art booksand you're like who are all
these people right?
And then you find out that theywere huge at the time.
So, whatever crypto art is,there's gonna be evolutions and
there's gonna be some peopleremembered and it's a fun place
to participate, but it's youknow this there's not that many
artists who will really becomeremembered over time.
Now, on the collectibles, we'rein a hilarious hype-cycle bubble
(11:27):
, like hype-cycle bubble thing.
That's really fun.
You know what I mean.
I've been in multiple differentbubbles for things.
You know there's you know whatis it Used video games just had
a bubble that popped and youknow, maybe it's going to come
back right.
There's coins that had bubbles.
Everything has these littlecollectible bubbles that go up
and down.
I mean, right, you know, ethanFTs died and then all of a
sudden, ordinals came out, right, and there was this whole
(11:49):
renewed interest in the playbookjust ran back.
I have friends that were inEthan FTs like dude innovation,
check it out.
They got this new thing.
They don't do any utility, it'sjust vibes and I'm like OK,
crypto, great, great.
Then another one came out andit's like no dude, they got a
brand new one.
What they're doing here it'sthis mysterious, mysterious
(12:10):
puzzle.
I'm like do you know how manypuzzles I did in eath that I got
, you know, scammed on because Ispent a week trying to solve
something and it was nothing.
So like the playbook can be runback again if there's some,
like you know, I don't know,core little new culture.
There needs to be new peoplefirst of all that are excited
about it and like I don, I don'tknow something to piss off
someone.
So I think we'll keep seeinglittle evolutions and
collectibles will keep moving indifferent ways.
But you know, and a couplethings will always stay Because,
(12:31):
remember, collecting is not.
We don't need everyone tocollect things.
If you actually look atcollectibles, the highest-end
stuff, it's not one millionpeople want it, two rich guys
fight over it and that's whatpushes the price up and that's
it.
And it's like a third rich guycomes in and it's like it's
going parabolic and it's like,no, a third rich guy just came
(12:53):
into it.
That's you know.
We don't need a trillion peoplecollecting niche things, so I
don't know.
For me, it's like you know, Ilike collecting stuff.
I am a collector at heart, I amhoarder.
I'm just looking around, I meanthe stupidest things you could
possibly imagine I collect,right, just because I'm like I
need them, and it's a littlelike tick in my brain that I
find other people have, but I'mnot trying to pretend that, oh
yes, I've unlocked.
(13:13):
All humans will think like this.
I think that's silly.
I think the fun thing you can dofor collecting, though, is just
ride through and watch all thedifferent trends and the
different waves, and you findout oh cool, this is what's
happening.
Oh interesting, am I interestedin this?
Do I want to collect this?
Oh, it's evolving over here.
Do I like that?
Just watching it move around?
The meta is what I'm interestedin, I guess.
(13:33):
So it's gonna keep moving andevolving, and I think one day, I
don't know what chains will bethe ones that we collect on.
You know what I mean.
So it's, who knows, I'm gonnakeep collecting, collecting kind
of everywhere.
I mean, I am of the opinion oflike, I prefer, like Ethan
Ordinals, if I'm like buying art, quote unquote.
You know, solana, any, any L2makes me feel a little nervous,
(13:54):
you know, right, right, they canbe shut down, so, but at the
same time I'm OK.
Buying things that aretemporary, I guess, because you
know that's the thing too islike people want to be like this
art's all forever and it's likeno, maybe not like, you know,
whatever.
I'm a computer programmer and,as you, if you talk through
disaster scenarios, right, likeyou know, amazon S3 is more
(14:16):
resilient than Solana.
Right, the likelihood of S3going down is more resilient,
probably, than Solana, like S3,they've said they've been able
to guarantee nine nines.
Right, solana's at no nines,you know.
So it's like.
But then we're like, oh my God,it's on AWS, it's ephemeral and
it's like what are you puttingit on right?
So, like, I think the debate ofwhat's permanent is, you know,
(14:40):
we're not fully having it, butit gets really nerdy and
technical, like insanely nerdyand technical and no one wants
to talk about it.
But if you collect sneakers, ifyou collect, you know, early
jordans, they're all crumbled inthe box.
You know who cares.
Right, if you collect paintings, they degrade over time.
Right, things get, things gowrong, things get lost, thing.
That's why death thief entropyis the greatest piece of art in
(15:02):
blockchain of all time, becauseas you trade it, it decays.
He's put it in the art as acomic.
I'm sorry, I don't have any.
All I have from death beep islike I have no entropy, I have
no synpoems.
All the things I want, I wantto own, they're too expensive,
so I'm not even pumped.
I've been pumping myself out ofthis bag forever just just to
know.
But I will keep.
I will keep shilling death beefbecause he just comes up 24-7
(15:24):
as you talk about these things.
Same with like the first.
It's the first, you know.
It comes up every week becausesomeone's like no, you guys
don't understand, this is goodart.
This is the first time onSolana we've done gen art that
has a PFP look right.
And the first one that time wedid it on Art Block.
NorCal Guy (15:40):
That was a rambly mess.
I don't know what's going on.
That was a rambly mess, I loveit.
I love it, I love it.
Do you have any?
Well, there's a couple ofthings we can go, but do you
have any concerns as as this, asthis expands this whole scene?
BeginBot (15:54):
Well, I mean, like the , the concern always is and I
always and everyone knows me,I'm I like to argue about stuff
and it's fun for me, I it's funfor me.
I don't look at it as like anegative thing when I get
together with my friends.
If we talk about metal I mean Idid it the other night just
randomly with some new friends,we're all crypto friends but
then we end up arguing aboutmetal for an hour, right, and
that's enjoyable.
That's what I like about beinginterested in something is the
(16:18):
deeper conversation and like ifyou're into anything, people are
so opinionated.
Talk to the top sneakerheads.
It's like every shoe is likedisgusting, whatever.
Ask a sneakerhead what theythink about a panda dunk it's a
black and white dunk.
They're like disgusting, neverlet that touch my feet.
And they think that becausethey love the world they're in.
And I think in crypto art wehave this big problem where, you
(16:39):
know, no one wants to talkabout the bad stuff.
No one wants to talk about thebad stuff, no one wants to
criticize each other, no onewants to bust balls.
And when people who like artcome over, I've had friends come
over who like are just artnerds and they're like you guys
are the worst you guys will.
Are so afraid to say anythingisn't the greatest art on earth.
You're, we're afraid to getopinions and it's all gonna die.
Because my personal opinion islike real scenes, like small
(17:02):
niche communities, is whatbuilds stuff, not a thousand
people giving some casual timein those, really like intense
lovers of something.
You know the fanatics right,they're critical, they're highly
critical.
So my fear always is just theecho chamber of like don't ever
insult anything it's gonna killeverything.
And then the artist will gosomewhere else, like I.
I think they'll all go to aiand then there'll be an ai art
(17:23):
for a little bit and they'll be.
Everyone will be like you'reruining the world and they'll be
fighting with each other.
And then it will get mainstreamand it goes guys, we're getting
, we're getting popular.
No one insult each other's aiart, we could all get rich.
And then that'll collapse andwe'll move on to I don't know
what you know fair, fair.
NorCal Guy (17:39):
So you kind of mentioned about like I don't
remember exactly what triggeredit, but are you a one ETH one
equals one ETH kind of guy orhow?
Oh you know what triggered itis collecting across all these
different chains, yeah, andwe're pricing in all these
different currencies, yeah.
BeginBot (17:58):
Yeah, I mean, it's just tough because, like you
know, are you going to sellsomething or not, right?
That's the question of whensomething becomes we are.
This is one of the weirdestmarkets, right, where, and you
see it?
I keep bringing it back tosneakers, but we've watched all
this stuff happen in sneakersbefore StockX came out and built
a little, you know, a real-timestock index, which they didn't
you know for sneaker pricing,and then everything got driven
(18:18):
down to the lowest price becauseeveryone was constantly
thinking about what, how muchdoes my shoe cost?
When things were more niche andcollectible, you don't know how
much you can get because you'renot out there selling it.
You've got to find a buyer, andif you have rare items, you've
got to find a buyer withsomething.
And so you're looking at a shoeor, you know, looking at a
piece of art you like on yourwall, and you're like, yeah,
okay, cool, I think it's good, Ithink the artist is going
somewhere, I think it's great.
(18:38):
You're not every day logging onand going.
Did it go up?
Did it go down?
That's like the dorkiest thingin the world.
If you buy a piece of art like,oh, my god, guys, my art is
worth slightly more now, oh,it's worth slightly less.
It's like no one did that foranything that they collected,
that they loved and went really,really up in price over time.
So I think that themicro-watching of any art does
(18:59):
like screw things up.
There is insane, like what doyou call it?
Unit bias.
It's wild, I know, I feel it.
I like literally in my head,solana, solana's free.
I don't know how much 10 Solanais right.
And then I look at ETH and I'mlike, oh, it's expensive.
And then I look at Bitcoin,there's so many zeros in front
of stuff.
I'm like it can't be that much.
And then I said, dude, I spent,I gambled how much in Solana
(19:22):
and like I bought that for what?
And then I take like ETH to mefeels a little more valuable.
Yeah, if that makes sense,that's just my own.
Like my dumb brain has pricedstuff a certain way, so I don't
know, I'm not a one e equals onee kind of guy.
However, there is a thing likeif, when e goes down and you
sell a piece for 40 eath, e goesback up and it's like that's a
(19:44):
40 eath sale and everyone's likenice job, you killed it.
Like I think the move is, ifany any dip you have as an
artist, you got to get out thereand get those high number sales
so they can repump.
You got to get out there andpound the pavement and get the.
You know that it might even begood.
It's actually good for thecollector too.
This is very bad, but good forthe collector because if the
collector is like, look at howmuch more I spent, right, if eat
(20:06):
that 5 000 versus eat that 3000, right, I want to make sure
I sell that piece, I'll pay alittle bit more.
If I think if I caught a dip,you know, because it we look
both better, oh, this is bad Ilike art, okay, not money, I
swear, oh man.
NorCal Guy (20:21):
Yeah, so good times, good times.
But yeah, I got that unitbinaries too well, when I was
doing some meme coins on solana,my problem was like I'm was
thinking in eth, but I'm on souland, like man, why am I like so
, so afraid to spend a couple ofSol where it's not even worth
(20:41):
it?
I'm thinking in ETH terms.
I'm like frick man.
I could have done better on BOM.
BeginBot (20:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Bom is such a beautiful,immaculate conception that will
never happen.
It's like the art of B boom isso great and I I mean, like you
know, I didn't do.
All I did is I put one soulinto boom, right, and that was
great, that worked out great forme.
I was very happy, right.
But I literally put it in and IDM some friends and I was like,
(21:10):
oh, it's dark farms, like, andI double trying to buy pieces
from him that he weren't forsale yet.
Right, he would post some.
And I'm like I want that onedark farm, so you sell to me.
It's not available.
And I'm like okay.
So when he first posted it, Iwas like is he hacked?
Is this the right one?
I clicked, I'm like, oh, it'sthe same guy who I'm dming with.
Like, I don't think he washacked.
And I was like worst casescenario I lose a soul.
(21:30):
Best case scenario I get someart, thinking no, else, you know
nothing else.
And like, a lot of my friendsthought that way, no one's ever
gonna think right, right, youknow what I mean, that that way
is dead.
So it's, you know, immaculateconception once in a lifetime.
Just bye, boom, that was fun,you know, even though you
couldn't hold it and do whatever.
But you know what I mean.
We're just not gonna seeanother like an artist puts out
(21:50):
a pre-sale and it hits a billionin a day like no um, all right.
NorCal Guy (21:55):
So what would you like to see more of in this
crypto art space?
BeginBot (22:02):
I mean so right now, when I think about like what is
interesting in art, I do thinkthere's a lot of things to
explore, like chain wise and theactual like the way we use the
chain and commentate on it, Ithink is very interesting, right
, so BOM even is part of that.
Right, like it's a it's acommentary on meme coins.
I don't really think it's veryinteresting, right, so BOM even
is part of that.
Right, like it's a commentaryon meme coins.
I don't really think it wasnecessarily that, but like using
people and what is happeninghere and commenting on it is
(22:23):
like interesting.
I think Stevie P's another goodexample of that.
I saw he put out a great tweettoday where his favorite killing
it right, I like, I love that,I love like die with the most
likes, like in martha, his likeuh show was just, it was a world
.
You stepped into it.
There's creed nickelbackplaying right, there's a table
(22:45):
full of various various thingsto trade.
You know it was like a worldwas built that was distinctly
his world and we get to likestep into it and it's like a
moment in time, that's.
You know, I'm always going toremember that show of you.
Know, people are trading dildosfor art.
People are trading you knowwhat I mean like people are
going to the gas station buyingthings like I gotta, I need a
piece of that with the mostlikes, let's get to the gas
(23:07):
station, okay, they gotsomething good there, and it's
like that mentality being ableto trigger that, I think, is
just a super fun memory thatpeople will have.
So I want to see people buildtheir their own worlds more and
not which I see.
It seems like a lot of art wesee is like we're all trying to
like.
We just want to keep gettingfancier and nicer and get into
MoMA and we want to make surethat we're moving the ladder up
correctly and I'm like I wantwild shit, I want crazy parties,
(23:29):
I want art that's shocking andscary and like is this a?
scam.
Is this not like, likesomething that I'm not going to
be like that?
That's the most perfectlyaesthetic thing and the mint
mechanics were perfect and Ithink this could go into the
memo one day.
You know which is like.
You know, I don't know, the,the, the MoMA, the.
You know the best pieces of artin the MoMA?
They're all, they're all old.
Okay, you know what I mean.
(23:53):
They like more dangerous, right, people go to Rafik and it's
like the ultimate Instagram shot, right, and it's why it's like
one of the most popular exhibits.
But it's just like, I don'tknow, it's not angering enough
people.
But this is the problem.
I have a problem.
I like things that anger people, that's.
I'm working through it with mytherapist, but then I read art
history and I read likearguments between the artists I
(24:14):
love and it's like they'refighting.
You know what I mean.
Like William de Kooning ispunch Jackson Pollock.
They're arguing about art.
You know that's where.
Yeah, I'm not trying to.
No, no violence, no violence.
NorCal Guy (24:25):
Okay, twitter punch, okay just the crypto boxing
scene.
BeginBot (24:29):
That's it, yeah, yeah yeah, I feel like that one.
It's already dying right nowafter someone's seeing like
Ansem did one and it was likewell, this was not good for the
brand.
We're not getting paid enough.
The big influencer is gettingenough.
This is, you know, I don't know.
I mean, I will say like, I'mvery interested in like, like
(24:49):
art, that is would be censoredand you can get on a chain and
have it and then you know peoplecan't censor it.
That's why Ordinals isinteresting this idea of like
bitcoin maxi's hating thatyou're inscribing stuff or on
there and then being like haha,you have to sync with art and
guess what the art you hate andit's offensive in this way to
you, for you know that I reallylove the idea of people be like
oh my god, I'm importing artinto my home that I don't want.
(25:11):
I'm trying to secure themonetary future.
I'm a libertarian, or whateverthey say.
That that's appealing to me.
Uh, you know, art that, like onETH, is using the mechanics in
a way that, like it forcespeople to learn what's happening
, but it exposes, like the, thedark side of it.
I think that's superinteresting.
I love when someone's like inthe art and it's like wait,
(25:31):
what's going?
Wait, this is how you know.
That's why I think it's notsaying I'm not saying fake,
scammy stuff.
I've been debating this myselfa bit.
I put a tweet out justyesterday that was talking about
AI scamming.
You want to teach someone aboutAI scamming and build a tool to
help them practice.
You're doing the same thing asbuilding something to scam
someone, right?
And there's this weird line incrypto art and I like that line
(25:53):
where it's like OK, so, okay, soit's, it's art, but it is
scammy.
But no, no, no.
The point is that we'recommentating on the scams.
I think that's a reallyinteresting world.
Please, don't get scammed,please, everyone.
I'm so sorry that I'mrecommending this style of art.
NorCal Guy (26:09):
You know, it's just exciting to talk about.
BeginBot (26:11):
Like I I'm not interested in like new
aesthetics.
Like I like I'm a very.
Um, I always Like I, like I'm avery.
I always tell people I'm likeI'm a stupid anti-intellectual
when it comes to art.
Like I got into art runningthrough the museums in DC
they're free, you can runthrough them and I literally
just ran, ran, ran, ran, ran.
I was like what do I like?
What do I like and done.
(26:38):
And then I was like super hypedon, like I'm like I don't know
man, they're making me feelsomething weird, these weird
little alien guys like how didhe see aliens?
And then from there it's like Ifind out, oh my, he's, you know
, selling these for 100 milliondollars.
I'm like, oh my god.
But like, if you, if youapproach it from the 100 million
right away, your brain isalways clouded, right.
(26:59):
So I want like things thatappeal like a base level
aesthetically and I feel likewe're really like a lot of you
know, whatever crypto art rightnow People are going after a
good aesthetic and like tryingto make something that people
will like versus like this issome twisted stuff for my brain.
I think I'm just ranting butlike hr geiger feels like
(27:21):
something's coming out of him.
You know what I mean.
You see that he wasn't like hmm, I think this would be really
the workshop, the aliens they'regonna like more and more, more
weird sex aliens.
It was like, dude, I gotsomething weird in my brain that
I just keep spitting out andthen people react to that.
So, like, I just feel like Idon't see a lot of artists do
that, I'm looking for it.
So there are aesthetics that Icould like.
(27:41):
I just feel like a lot ofpeople are too intellectualized.
They're too yeah, all right,fair, I like dumb, I like what
is it called?
I like what is it called.
I'll leave it happening.
NorCal Guy (28:10):
I'm shilling like I don't know man I look at them
and like there's something aboutthe way that he holds that hot
dog that feels like notintentional but intentionally,
you know.
Okay, sorry, I will nevermention a bag.
I have, don't worry what.
So what is the best?
BeginBot (28:19):
advice you've been given or do you have like a
mantra that you live by?
You know, yeah, I have like twothings.
I guess I'm pretty I think alot about Right.
So one is what is the primaryinformation you're taking in?
That's one of the biggestproblem thing we have in this
space is no one pulls in likenew everything.
Here's a tweet summary of athread of an artist.
I learned about the artist andthey never say, okay, stop,
let's look at the artist art,let's block some time off.
(28:40):
And I'm gonna go through eachpiece, write my feelings, ponder
, go to the next one, read theartist statement and like get my
own primary.
It's all layered on layers ofstuff.
And then the other is it'sreally it's the primary
information.
Is like, look for spaces thatother people aren't interested.
That like really tickles yourbrain.
When there's weird things thatI'm like dude, I can't stop
(29:01):
thinking about, I always this isa weird one.
But when I was a kid I sawplaids and I was like dude, what
the hell are these like?
I want to look at these all day, like wait, they mean things I
want.
And then everyone's like whatare you doing?
What's wrong with you?
Like, why do you care aboutthese, this, but this pattern so
much and I'm like like I don'tknow I it's a weird little tick
disease in my brain and so I'mgoing to follow that.
We have to like, be open to,like man, this subsection of the
(29:24):
world is really interesting me.
And then just go you know fullautist, and just say, okay,
great, but bust out thespreadsheets.
I'm a spreadsheet boy, bust outthe list, you know.
So yeah, but I always encouragepeople read books that are not
related to the current topicthat everyone's talking about.
It's insane.
Everyone's like.
You know, even today, like thepunks nina chanel thing, people
(29:45):
are going to go and like learnabout nina chanel.
That's awesome, that's great.
You know, cool about an artist.
But they're going to read likesummaries and this and that and
whatnot.
I'm going to be like, okay, whois she influenced by?
Okay, who's in that category?
All right, I'm gonna learnabout that random person.
There's gonna be a threat.
Everyone's gonna read the samestuff and they're gonna give me
the summary.
If we know the whole space isgonna focus on it.
I'm gonna go over here and belike did you know?
(30:05):
One of our influences did thisother cool thing and that's
actually a boom.
I've got something interestingto contribute to the
conversation instead of this,like you know, I don't know or a
boris of or a boris of twitterthread.
Summarizing Twitter thread.
Summarizing Twitter thread.
That's fair.
NorCal Guy (30:19):
That's fair so switching it up a little bit, if
you could live or move anywhere, where would you live and why?
BeginBot (30:28):
so I'm gonna hate.
I'm just people gonna hate this.
You know, I live in Venice,california.
Okay, it's the dream.
All right, I built the dream.
Okay, I'm two blocks away froma gorgeous studio.
The beach is a couple blocksaway.
Here, I've got friends livingaround me.
So, like right now I really likewhere I live and I've been to
other places in the world.
I mean, like I'm a fashion nerdand tokyo is like endlessly
fascinating for a trillionreasons.
(30:48):
And when you go there, I'm justlike I literally went there and
I was like oh great, everystore I've ever been in shopping
wise is terrible.
We have no care for detail.
We are lazy, lazy.
You go to New York and you'rejust like every store that they
have a Tokyo version is like whydon't we finish?
We didn't finish anything.
The light fixtures aren'tcustom, it doesn't smell a
certain way.
So I definitely like that.
(31:10):
But I've got a personal.
I've got many random pictures.
As you can probably tell, I'mobsessed with neighborhoods.
I'm obsessed with two types ofneighborhoods.
Right, you got a digitalneighborhood, you got a physical
neighborhood, and so I thinkthe most important thing is, can
you build a like a group ofpeople around you where it is
much more in-person high touch.
You know, yesterday we had anAI meetup.
(31:32):
It's very casual.
We go to a beautiful little spotin Venice, you're outside,
we're all trading someinformation.
There's some dogs there, youknow, we all build a little
things.
And then it's like cool, let'sall go to lunch, nice lunch
outside.
You might run into someonerandom over there.
Oh, cool, let's join the convo.
It's you need like to bewalking and moving around with
friends and meeting otherfriends and letting that
(31:52):
serendipity in person happen.
I think it's like superimportant.
So like, anywhere you can goand have that density is good,
but at the same time and I'mvery obsessed with this you got
to build that density.
You know what I mean.
I've done a meetup for twoyears here and I forced people
to move here.
I think there's actual peoplewho are like I came here for a
week and they've been here forsix months because they're like
well, there's so many coolpeople here.
(32:12):
I'm like you have to like plantyour flag and start like the
troops, you know what I meanLike, okay, we're meeting this
day, we're doing a lunch thisday, we're doing that, and then
you can build that world.
So I think I can go otherplaces I've been.
You know, I might go to NorthDakota and I'm going to become
friends with the three farmersin the two-mile radius with me
(32:33):
and we'll have to do some farmermeetup.
I think I could do that.
I sometimes dream of it.
I know it's going to be tougherand it won't be as many people,
but I don't know.
Well, even then, like we'regoing to talk about farming
stuff, who cares?
We're going to get whateverthey're into.
They're in a hunting.
I will, I got, I'll do ahunting meetup, right, and I
won't.
I won't probably go hunting.
Is that scary?
(32:53):
But so I don't know I right now.
But it's.
It's about where the people are, because who cares?
If you're, if you're, even whenI would go to tokyo, it's going
to take a minute.
I'm gonna have to build upfriends, build up a scene, build
up, like you know, a network,you know.
But and then the other side is,I will say, you can be somewhere
you know, like that's not sodense with people of the same
interest if you got a goodonline neighborhood and I think
(33:13):
a lot of times people don'trealize like we.
Twitter is not a neighborhood,right.
Twitter's new york city.
People are yelling fromeverywhere, blah, blah, blah.
Uh, a group chat couldtechnically be a neighborhood if
it's like small enough, right,but I've met with my uh discord
group of friends that were alllike first programmers, then it
added crypto people and thenit's expanded.
All these random people we'vemet every tuesday, I think three
(33:37):
years now, right, and it's likeat one point it was like hey,
let's, let's, let's make moneytogether.
They didn't turn like hey,we're playing games.
And then it's like hey, we'resharing our lives together.
And now it's like it's just afamily home thing you do every
week where I'm right, you knowI've not met these people all in
real life, like a bunch of them.
(33:58):
I have never met irl, but I'mlike literally like, like, like
how's the baby this week?
What's going?
on right you know it's becauseit's a online neighborhood as
well.
So if you are missing one, Ithink you can go get the other.
And I think the key is you haveto put this I'm pushing my own
you gotta have a schedule.
You gotta have.
I have one day a week thursday.
Every thursday.
(34:18):
Everyone knows you come tovenice.
We have nerds, crypto peopleall day.
We, if you come there at two,you will be there till two at
night and you will talk to athousand weirdos.
Just show up on thursdays.
And then for me, online, I dotuesdays every tuesday.
The people is like well, howlong is the call?
I'm like till we all pass out Idon't know you on and you never
know how long it'll go.
(34:39):
And sometimes you log back onin the morning Like you guys are
still on.
It's like we got into this andyou're like so just like
schedule it.
So you know I've been trying toencourage.
It's like bowling night.
You know everyone needs abowling night.
NorCal Guy (34:49):
That's good.
Do you have a favorite moviequote?
BeginBot (35:04):
Hmm.
So just famously, everyoneknows I'm a weirdo who likes to
do self-imposed bets, so I'mright now on a 10-year bet to
not watch a single movie.
So, as of right now, it's beenfive and a half years since I've
watched a movie.
NorCal Guy (35:20):
Um, I'm getting a lot of peer pressure right now a
lot of, a lot of, a lot of peerpressure.
BeginBot (35:25):
So, like I kind of movies are kind of out of my,
they're out of my.
I don't.
I can't think of any moviequotes right now and I'm a
famous movie hater because theonly good movies are you filming
with dog me 95.
I just gotta keep pushing well.
Well, one day, if you want tosee, I think that the only
movies worth watching okay aredog me 95.
(35:46):
It's you know, it's a 90s,avant-garde filmmaking, little
movement, like I think it's likedanish, right, but it's a
thousand rules that, like, thefilms can't be in color, the
director can't be credited, nogenre movies.
There's no fake violence, notemporal location.
Moving Music has to all be, Iwould say, diegetic, not non-die
.
It's, whatever I like, theworld's worst stuff.
Everyone hates it.
(36:07):
You put on the movies myfavorite movie.
Growing up I watched it onrepeat until my little brother
literally was like this is childabuse.
You are abusing me.
You can't have this on.
This is gonna affect my brainin a bad way.
I'm like no, no, no.
I like to come from from schooland put on gummo.
It makes me feel comforted andI don't know if you've seen the
(36:29):
movie, but it's.
There's no discernible goodquotes from it.
It's, it's a all right, I'minsufferable.
NorCal Guy (36:36):
All right, this going to be a good one.
What is the best thing and thesilliest thing you've spent
money on?
BeginBot (36:45):
Man, okay, I spend a lot of money on silly things.
Just what came to my houseright now is I have long green
screen gloves.
I have all the way to the hands.
I'm into green screen stuff.
I've got two robes, two fullwizard robes, right behind me
with green screen, green on theinside.
Oh man, it's not in this room,it's in the other room.
My prized possession is I playmusic and I like.
(37:08):
The worst music is I've got aKorg Miku guitar pedal.
I'm not familiar with Miku.
She's maybe the first ever likeum, she's not ai, but like
digital avatar singer.
Okay, very famous she.
She just played coachella.
It's a big deal.
You know, people were madbecause it was a screen, not a
hologram.
There's like over 3 000 guysthat have married her.
(37:28):
But korg made a very rareguitar pedal.
That was like way too muchmoney because it was like out of
print.
No one liked it and it makesyour guitar sound like a
japanese anime singer whichevery time you play it and you
start playing, people go.
What is going?
What is your?
What are your fingers doing?
It's the world's worst guitarplayer because it tracks
horribly.
So you have to like practice aton and then I I know that, like
(37:51):
I did, I think I spent like 700on it.
It was so much money and it'sjust for a joke.
Every six months I go guyslisten and they're like, okay,
good one vegan.
NorCal Guy (38:02):
Like you're just so stupid.
BeginBot (38:03):
I mean, yeah, I'll have to go into the other room
one day and pull out all theother weird stuff, but you know,
I'm an eBay boy, so I buy justdumb stuff on eBay too, like
anything Like.
I'm saying, like, if you, Idon't know, like I'm pretty
interested in McDonald's toysright now I don't know why,
vintage McDonald's toys.
(38:23):
When I was a child I figuredthis out.
Therapy there was at the library, which is that's the only place
my parents you know that wasour spot they built a system
that tricked us.
Where it was an Excelspreadsheet where you would earn
books by reading books, whereit was an Excel spreadsheet
where you would earn books byreading books.
And I was like, oh, I'm goingto win that and so I'm going to
read every book on earth, andnow I'm going to get more books,
and now I'm rich with books andthey're like you idiot, you're
(38:46):
just learning about stuff.
But yeah, it was a great trick.
But then I went to the library.
I got really into like thereference section eventually,
because you start going throughstuff, you read enough dragon
and sci-fi books, you're like,and there they had, it was a
reference book of everymcdonald's toy and just seeing
(39:07):
it in aggregate in the history.
It went deep into my brain oflike, collect these, collect
these and then like this is bad.
But kerwin frost, who's aninsane artist, he's the guy who
actually this is him.
This is so weird.
Look at, he did his own nuggetbuddy, brought the nugget
buddies back.
That's what he looks like.
He's got a pencil tattie.
That's that's identical to him.
He brought them back.
And then I was like, well, Igotta get some of these nugget
buddies because I used to havean interest in this.
Then I hit ebay and I'm likegod damn it, I really want that
(39:30):
spy set.
Oh man, I really want like anystitch.
I don't know why.
So so I'm pretty I'm deep inthat game.
I have other.
Well, I'm a Rubik's Cubecollector too.
I don't know what's wrong withme.
If you ever come to our studio,everyone gets a Rubik's Cube.
NorCal Guy (39:45):
I buy them in bulk and I get them out and I want
you know some other unusual ones.
BeginBot (39:50):
I love it.
I spent in my lifetime Iprobably spend At least $2,000
on Rubik's cubes to give out topeople you know.
So if you, if you worked at anyof the startups I work at and
you can ask, ask any of them, uh, at your desk, I would put a
Rubik's cube, you know, on everydesk and then I'd find it.
Oh, my kid's using it.
Okay, good, how many kids doyou have?
Three kids, fantastic.
(40:11):
One moment.
Your wife has she solved it yet?
Uh, one for you.
That's awesome.
I'm trying to push myobsessions on other people.
NorCal Guy (40:23):
I love it.
I love it.
I mean I can kind of get theMcDonald's toys.
I mean because that's nostalgic, huge nostalgic, yeah, totally,
because that was like damn, Iwant a Happy Meal.
Can we go get a Happy Meal?
BeginBot (40:40):
Exactly as a kid.
It's like the food is the bestever.
And then you get into this toy.
The Pope stuff is great becauseI now have people delivering me
Pope stuff, which I really love, and that started because, oh
my God, I'm an insane person.
So every day for a long time Iwould always start my day off by
reading the wikipedia articlefor the date and you start
(41:03):
learning like what happened thatday and what's the history.
But really once you've done thewhole year, you learn like it's
the meta of wikipedia.
I'm really into wikipedia um,banned from wikipedia currently,
for you know, so they don'tlike my edits, but I'm gonna get
back on, but I started readingit and you start finding like
what events trigger wikipedia,to put it on the date right,
like on the actual day, right,like every year has some world
(41:25):
war ii stuff.
Everyone has kings and queens,you know, presidents hit stuff,
but popes are always on there,right?
If a pope does anything, popenews always makes the wikipedia.
And so then me and a friendstarted getting way too into
reading actually about each ofthe popes, and then we started
finding out that popes are themost insane characters of all
time.
And then I got into.
(41:45):
I got to plug my website.
Well, zanus is the, is the realbuilder, maintainer.
But pope countcom is the onlywebsite that gives you a real
time update of how many popesthere are.
The only reason this exists isbecause we're trying to push
that.
There's actually another popewho died before he was
officially pope, but pope popestephen ii is a pope whatever.
(42:06):
Way too deep into popes and nowthat's moved into.
I just want to collect weirdstuff from the pope and there's
nothing better than peoplegiving me pope stuff.
Well, and garfield.
I get a lot of garfield pressand I'm pretty deep into
garfield too.
So a lot of of a lot of friendsgive me Garfield and Pope stuff
and it's funny when otherpeople don't know it and they're
just like Beacon.
What's going on?
Why are people?
Why are?
Why are they giving you Popeand Garfield things?
(42:27):
And you know I I keep them onme.
So if you see me in person,we'll just ask how much Pope and
Garfield stuff do you have onyour person?
All right, usually there's someso I love it.
NorCal Guy (42:38):
All right, this one's gonna be a good one.
If you could commission a pieceand have two artists collab on
it, which two artists would itbe?
BeginBot (42:49):
That's good, Okay.
So no matter what we're doing,death be first, obviously.
You've already heard that.
Okay that's my guy.
He's the yeah, just really loveeverything he's doing here.
Now, one thing I think that'slike I mean I got the answer
it's death beef and data bots.
That's it.
Oh, my god, I I need to putthat together, okay.
So, like I think data bots isthe absolute leader in ai music.
Like I'm so excited foreverything he's done, everything
(43:10):
he's gonna do death beef isalready done, music stuff, right
.
I think, like I got the deathbeef.
I did it the other night.
Uh, you know, I brought thedeath beef record in the living
room.
We had friends over.
I pop it on, one friend is likesick and the others are like
dude, turn this off, you'reruining the party.
It's like, okay, uh, sorryabout that.
I thought you guys were gonnalike this.
(43:31):
Um, I think they already have.
Like you know, there's someaesthetics that could go
together and I think if theyworked out something like that
was both aesthetics with the AI,plus already what Deathbeef's
done, programming like using Cand all that, it would be maybe
the greatest collection of alltime.
Okay, and if that happens and Idon't get a piece, oh, boy, I'm
(43:51):
pissed.
NorCal Guy (43:51):
Okay, I mean, you should get one just like an
honorary.
Like here you go, Air dropped.
BeginBot (43:56):
Yeah, I'm putting the collab out.
I'm messaging I don't, I'm notfriends with death beef, I'm
friends with databots.
Now, hey, what's up databots?
Uh, I'm gonna hit him up and belike, hey, you got more clout
to be hit up, death beef.
NorCal Guy (44:06):
Let's get this going so fair, fair all right, do you
have a hot take?
I mean, you've been spittingthem the whole time, but do you
have one that um stands out thatyou want to fight about?
BeginBot (44:22):
I mean, yeah, I mean my hot take is, I mean I've been
kind of pushing the one messageI always am pushing to people,
which is just that no one'sgoing to remember 99% of any of
this stuff here and the onlypeople that people are going to
remember is going to be basedoff of the storytelling around
it.
That storytelling could bebased off of money and you know,
monetary price going up andwildness here, but I think a lot
(44:43):
of it's going to be like howthey actually fight within the
art system and, as time goes on,like who are the people that
are involved?
Like even right now, like, uh,dimitri, uh, cherniak, you know,
in this with this, there's thisnick krueger drama, right, and
there's, you know, there's somethat helpsuder drama, right, and
there's, you know there's somethat helps Dimitri, right, that
helps Dimitri's.
Like long-term generative artstory.
(45:03):
Because when you're going tostart talking about gen art,
you're going to talk about oh,here's some of the top pieces,
here's some of the moreexpensive ones.
I'm going to tell the story ofthe goose.
And why is the goose soexpensive?
Well, maybe part of the priceis keychains being hidden around
marfa, and it's like what areyou talking about wait.
There's more he has drama withanother guy.
That story I can tell to anormie later on in history books
.
I can make a fun youtube video Ican have a pbs documentary
(45:26):
about it that will lead towardsit.
So, like it's, storytelling isall that matters, for I think
what art's going to be lastinglong term and the storytelling
doesn't need to be.
When I was a child I wasinspired by it's gonna be how it
interacts in the scene.
It's gonna be de kooning,punching pollock, you know like
that makes the art go on.
So I want people to not beafraid from conflict because,
(45:48):
like, all the best bands hatedeach other.
If you actually look at it,like, look at your favorite
bands, they hated all your otherfavorite bands.
All your favorite artists hatethe other artists.
I was reading, reading arauchenberg book and and I'm
like, oh, rauschenberg's thegreatest, he's the best ever,
right, boom, switch to theDonald Judd book and he's like
it's not trash like Rauschenberg.
I'm like, no Dude, I justthought we, who cares?
They're both big.
(46:09):
You know what I mean.
It all worked out right andit's like the good and bad of
like anything.
I do this in tech all the time.
It's like, oh, there's aframework we want to use or a
library I go.
Who hates it?
You hate it.
You got detailed reasons.
Tell me and they'll tell youall the reasons they hate it and
you will learn why you willwant to use it or not.
(46:30):
It tells you about criticism,tells you about the good things
of art at the same time, in away.
So you know just, everyoneneeds to be less afraid of
criticism and it's, it's allgood, it's gonna just have fun.
Be nerds and we're allowed toargue about stuff, right, you
know, on the timeline or not, Iknow it hurts our feelings a
little bit, but everyone's nicerin person, for sure.
(46:52):
You know what I mean.
Like everyone is like waycooler in person and they'll be
like dude, I didn't like thisart, you're mean about it.
I'm like you might talk alittle bit and go oh yeah, of
course you wouldn't like it.
You have the world's worsttaste in art.
You know what I mean.
Like I'll like I tell people Idon't like music.
You know some music and likewell, what do you like?
And I'm like oh, I like literalnoise, right, like I'm a, I
(47:13):
like purient, I like mersbo,right it.
You know I'm wearing a youngthug hat.
People listen to Young Thug andthey're like this is the
world's worst.
He's saying I can't hear a word.
He's saying I'm like, yes, it'spost-lyrical, it's actually,
you know it's.
He's being studied by Columbia.
So it's like we're allowed tohave taste and our taste is not
going to be unified right.
(47:42):
I love it.
Let's hear about any projectsyou have or anything you'd like
to plug.
Talk about that you're doing.
Yeah, so right now, I mean, soI do have.
Well, I don't know if I want totell you something.
Well, here I'll tell you myinterest.
Okay, I'll tell you my interestin what I'm working on.
Okay, so I am working on somepersonal art projects, but I'm
the world's worst human.
So actually I started doinggenerative art like 2015,.
Right, Because I was a coderand code's beautiful and I'm
living in code all day.
And so I started making, like,but there was no generative art
(48:03):
scene.
I'm just alone making, you know, programs calling them untitled
number one and like, working on, like, what do I like of the
aesthetics and stuff like that,and but I just never released
things right.
And then I was a musicianmaking, as you can probably
guess, very weird music that wasthen mixed with visuals.
So it's like these notes affectthese visuals on a screen and
(48:26):
I'm using Max MSP to link thetwo and stuff like that, but
never released anything.
So I've done a lot of digging oflike, okay, well, what is
actually very, very, veryinteresting right now?
What do we think is going to belast in art.
What is something meaty that Iwant to get into and this is
something I'm working on, but Iwant anyone else to do it too is
for AI stuff, and if you'veever watched my programming
streams, people will know whatthis means.
(48:49):
It's insane.
But real time input from peopleand how that can affect people
like emotionally, is the mostinteresting aspect of AI and
like we're exploring it like solittle meaning that I learned
about you, I heard, I heard arumor you're you're a sierra
nevada drinker is that.
True, that's my only beer.
Everyone knows me.
If they bring, I'm being 100, Ionly if you see me on stage I'm
trying to get a sponsorship.
They offer the kombucha.
I said no pale ale or bust.
(49:11):
Okay, I probably fucked up thatrelationship there.
Um, okay, but uh.
But see, I know that about you,yeah, right, and then all of a
sudden we, I'm trying to createsome art on the fly.
You come into a gallery and Iknow I show a, I don't know.
It's a dad sitting back in hischair.
Meant to be a Norman Rockwellpainting, but then it's a Sierra
Nevada.
It triggers a little.
It's a little deeper to you.
(49:32):
The next person walks in, it'sthe wine.
They drank.
NorCal Guy (49:36):
The next person walks in, it's their Manhattan.
BeginBot (49:39):
You can.
It's, it's, it's the wine theydrink.
The next person walks in, yeah,yeah that you can affect people
so much more emotionally if youmatch up towards them, which is
exactly what ai is doing rightnow with algorithms to give us
exactly what we like.
The tiktok algorithm is crazyto show people mine and they're
like dude, what are you into?
This is wild, right.
It's like the algorithm knowsit's finding true stuff, and so
I think that world of AI is likeendlessly fascinating.
(50:00):
So how do you make art that isreacting to the individual
person in real time or semi realtime, or you know, we could
talk about what real time meansand giving them that art
experience?
So I'm just I've been buildinga bunch of tools and stuff like
that and I did.
I did I've shown up, I'vewritten proposals and I'm
working on coding stuff.
And I did show I've shown up,I've written proposals and I'm
working on coding stuff.
(50:20):
And I did show a couple friends, a couple art friends, and they
said this is disturbing.
So I'm like I don't know if I'monto it.
They were like what are youtrying to do?
I'm not going to do this, and Iwas like someone's going to do
it, so it might all fall apart.
I'm going to get.
No one's going to want to gointo my tunnel, my chamber, and
see AI.
That is for them, because mygoal is what's the point of art
(50:42):
here?
I want to make them cry, screamIf someone breaks.
I would like, ideally, someoneto see the art and immediately
be like I have to rip this offthe walls.
Barnett Newman getting hispiece slashed with a knife.
We want to trigger that.
But to trigger that, I didn'tknow about you, I don't know and
give me just give me access toyour Twitter, give me access to
(51:03):
your.
You know your parents' voices Ifyou could give me access to
your pictures of your dog.
NorCal Guy (51:05):
It's like so yeah, do you remember that movie, the
game?
I think it was called the game.
No, no, what's with, likeMichael Doug?
Was it Kurt Michael?
I think Kurt Douglas, we loveMichael Douglas.
Anyways, he like filled outthis like huge questionnaire and
did it and then like went onthis like crazy journey and it
(51:26):
all ended up being like thisbirthday surprise, but it was
like hitting him on all sorts ofweird things and like
conquering his fears andeverything.
Because he filled out this weirdass survey that was like a
hundred pages and cause hisbrother like gave him this thing
.
I like that's crazy andeverything.
Because he filled out thisweird ass survey that was like
100 pages and because hisbrother like gave him this thing
.
BeginBot (51:41):
I like that's crazy the idea of like being, like,
like.
I have to conquer my fears.
It's like why.
It's like it was a birthdaypresent.
NorCal Guy (51:47):
I don't fully understand what happened, but it
was a good birthday, so thatsounds good to me, but yeah, no,
it's along those lines like soyou can get to know that person
and then you can be like reallymess with them or do good for
them or whatever, but yeah Ilike that.
I like that.
That sounds great.
BeginBot (52:01):
I mean, it sounds like you could do it I will say on
the, on the non-art side, I mean, uh, because you know, uh, you
know, I'm in venice.
We're doing shows like everysingle week and we're just
trying to like scale them up,make them more fun, make like, I
think, so much content.
If you go watch any panels,right, they're always, you know,
dry.
Let me talk about my life, likearguing in conflict and like
fun is like I do want to beintellectual too, like, but it's
(52:21):
like I look at it.
It's like more likeprofessional wrestling, right,
where it's the storytellingmixed with some you know, I
might change my opinions fromtime to time no big deal, uh,
and that's you can get deeper inconversations by two people
agreeing.
One person switches sides.
You can go further in it.
So we're trying to.
We do an ordinal show now, we doan art show, we do just kind of
a generic crypto show.
(52:41):
So just how can I just bringmore of those conversations
anywhere?
I'm hopefully gonna.
I started off doing this withprogramming.
All this was teaching peopleprogramming uh, okay, it's just
a little.
You know it's a little harder tomake interesting and fun.
However, I think now we we'regetting closer on it.
So, like anyone out there wholike, wants to, you know, create
fun content, that's a littlebit, not not more dangerous
(53:02):
isn't the word, but just likemore fast moving more exciting,
more confrontational.
Like hit me up, I want to help,just want to make as much of
that this.
NorCal Guy (53:09):
I love it well, beacon, I just want to say thank
you so much for coming on theshow and, man, I enjoyed this
conversation so much and, uh,dude, it was awesome and man I
enjoyed this conversation.
So much and dude.
It was awesome and, man, Ican't wait to when are you?
BeginBot (53:23):
coming down to Venice.
NorCal Guy (53:24):
That's what I'm saying.
I mean, I need to plan a dayand come down for a weekend or
something, 100% yeah, plan a day, anyway.
BeginBot (53:32):
No, no, actually, truthfully, it happens to
everyone, happens again, even OG, who was on our show this week.
He's like I fly out before Ileave and I'm like sure you do,
of course you fly out before thenext show, and then all of a
sudden the show.
Okay, I'm here a little bitlonger and boom, we had him on
the show and then I think he wasalready planning on it.
It wasn't because of us.
There's many reasons to move toLA, but I'm like that's how it
(53:55):
is.
I'm just saying like SoCal guyis not the world's worst rebrand
, you know what I mean.
It's kind of close, you know,fair fair.
Cool.
NorCal Guy (54:03):
Well thank you.
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Who is this guy?
Norcal guy, norcal guy, norcalguy, norcalguy.
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