Inside Hollywood’s Secretive Controlling Cult- Ishmael Bey & Sheik El

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_04 (00:10):
What is going on, everybody out there?
It's Ron Brown LMT, the People'sFitness Professional, along with
the brother Shaik Denim L today,this evening.
We're gonna build, we're gonnabuild about the uh inside the
secret, inside of Hollywoodsecret controlling cult.
This is really all about umScientology.

(00:33):
I should have put Scientology upthere, but I relied a little bit
on um SEO and all this stuff I'mtrying to figure out.
Uh and and and uh but this isall about Scientology.
Before we go into it, I gottarun this commercial.
Hold on one second.

SPEAKER_00 (00:48):
Peace family, welcome to NYP Talk Show.
This is more than a podcast,it's a conscious platform rooted
in truth and culture from the 5%nation, nation of Islam, Moorish
movement, and was the group.
Our mission is to reclaim ournarrative and uplift the African
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(01:12):
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(01:32):
movement.
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SPEAKER_04 (01:37):
Yo, back to it, back to it.
That was that's the commercial,man.
I'm gonna harass you guys aboutsuper chatting and you know
donating to the brand.
We're trying to grow this brand.
Uh, we are not the ones to belike asking people, come on,
donate, donate, donate.
We're not those types of people.
However, this is the businesswe're in, so we gotta do that.

(01:59):
You know what I mean?
So um uh thanks to uh SheikhDenham L to come uh for coming
in this evening.
Ishmael Bay is in the building.
Uh, we're just waiting for hismic to Mike camera to cut on.
Um thank you, brothers, forcoming here.
You brothers have been friendsfrom since knee high, right?
So so when I when I got you bothon, man, I'm looking at it like

(02:22):
you know, y'all brothers isfamily and all that.
It's it's it's it's it's like tome, it's like um it's like
history.
It's like history, it's history.
So 20 years from now, I can lookback and say, yo, the guys were
on the podcast.
This they were talking about,you know what I'm saying?
So um I really appreciate y'allboth coming on the platform and

(02:44):
uh rocking with the brand.

SPEAKER_05 (02:46):
Thank you for looking, you know, thank you for
having us here, man.

SPEAKER_04 (02:49):
Indeed, indeed.

SPEAKER_03 (02:50):
Absolutely.
You know, yeah, your your inviteinvitation is definitely, you
know, I mean, something that wehold in high honor.
So thank you.
You're welcome, you're welcome.

SPEAKER_04 (02:59):
Oh, I got the God in the building.
Peace, God, peace, God.
You know how that is, brotherMcDebo.
Exactly.
What's going on, Debo?
My man right there, man.
Word, word.
What's up, Madebo?
Yeah, uh, so now we're we'retalking about um, you know, the
title says inside Hollywood'ssecret, secretive controlling
cult.

(03:19):
Um, like I said, I should haveworded it and put Scientology in
there.
However, you know, I was tryingsomething different.
Um, um, but uh this is basicallywhat this is about, right?
So let's let's talk about it.
Kevin I Ali and I, we had a uh,you know, we were talking about
um uh the equipment that theyuse in Scientology.

(03:45):
Can you break that down andexplain the equipment that uh
they use in Scientology that theNation of Islam uh adopted?

SPEAKER_05 (03:54):
So the e-meter and all that type of stuff?
Yeah.
The e-meter and auditing, yeah.
Um but before we get into that,I just want to say when I got
this initial um invite, Ithought you were gonna be
actually talking about MK Ultraand some other things, but this
is this is just as great.
Okay.
So yeah, the um the e-meter is atool that they use um for

(04:18):
auditing and to do other things.
Um I mean, you know, uh goahead, man.
Go go ahead, man.
Go ahead, go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 (04:34):
First and foremost, brother Sheikh Denim L.
Um, it is today your birthday.

SPEAKER_04 (04:42):
Yes, happy birthday, happy birthday to the Sheikh
Denim L.
My brother birthday.
Happy birthday.

SPEAKER_03 (04:48):
That's the brother that I know is a brother that
that would spend such animportant day on behalf of the
people.
Right, always been that way,bro.
Me knowing you since the 70s,you've always been that way.
Fact.
You don't, you don't you youryour duty and your your your
love and devotion to others issecond to none, bro.

(05:12):
So for you to share such aspecial day with us, I would be
remiss without letting you know.
Happy birthday.
Very, very happy birthday toyou, bro.

SPEAKER_05 (05:21):
Thank you, brother.
I appreciate you, man.
You know, I love you, brother.
You know, we've been through alot, man.
You know what I'm saying?
You know, we family, man.
We've been through a lot.
I wish I wish JB was still herewith us, man.
I miss him, right?

SPEAKER_03 (05:30):
Right, right.
Third amigo.
That's right, that's right.

SPEAKER_05 (05:33):
I miss him a lot, man.
Um for sure.

SPEAKER_03 (05:36):
Um go ahead, go ahead, go ahead.

SPEAKER_05 (05:38):
I was gonna just say, you know, when he asked
about the the tools ofScientology, I just gotta laugh,
man, because you know, we'vebeen through it deeply, you know
what I'm saying?
So I'm gonna let you can goahead and explain to him, man,
because you know, you've takenthe you've taken the helm and
you ran with it.
You you've taken it to anotherlevel.
To me, you are the expert.

(05:58):
Now you're the expert onScientology.
You know, I'm learning from you.
So, you know, we sat down, wedid, we did an amazing thing
back in 2010 with that wholeexposing the whole, you know,
the whole situation.
And then from there, I justdropped it.
You just kept going.
And I'm proud of you, you'vebeen a lot of places with that,
man.
And you know what I'm saying?

(06:18):
So I'm here, I'm here for you.
I mean, share it.
Let me know about them funny asstools, man.

SPEAKER_03 (06:29):
For sure, for sure.
And and I would let anyone knowin the public realm.
I always defer to those who havemore knowledge in depth than I
do, and you're always at the topof that list.
So I don't mind humbling myselfto let people know what the real
deal is.
Oh, man, you know how we domany.
You've written books aboutcults, literally.

(06:49):
Yeah, you have gone through thechurch of Scientology, right?
And was able to give in-depthinformation and made my job so
much easier in order for me todo what I do.
So I do defer to you in thatparticular realm.
Praise God.
Thank you, brother.
Absolutely, I don't mind lettingthe world know that for sure.
Um, the e-meter is a low-gradelie detector, right?

(07:15):
So it's a tool that's used inScientology in order to register
in their mind if someone istelling the truth or not.
Now, a couple of disclaimerswith this.
One is on every single e-meter,if you flip it over on the back,

(07:35):
is a warning from the food andtobacco that this is not
legitimate.
Basically, it's a toy, don'ttake this seriously.
It's a disclaimer.
They went to court and wasforced to put that on every
e-meter.
That this is not really aspiritual tool that you're
trying to make it to be, right?
So, so they lost the court case,they had to put it on every

(07:58):
single e-meter, and you'll beable to see that disclaimer.
Also, you can kind of fool itbecause if you have an e-meter
in your hands and you physicallygrip it a little bit harder,
it'll move the needle, right?

SPEAKER_04 (08:12):
You know what?
I tried that one day.
I did that.
Years ago, years ago, years ago,years ago.
I just touched it.
It was looks like so flimsy.
I was like, uh, this ain't uh,and I just passed on it, I just
left it there.
I didn't even I just left italone.

SPEAKER_03 (08:30):
It's a tool to get you in because you might be
walking down the street, or youknow, they'll come in and just
do a personality test, right?
Coming in, brother, you know, doa personality test and right
here on the street, and you'lldo it, and like, oh, I like
that, right?
They'll start working you youknow into it by inviting you to
try this.
Now, what they're measuring iswhat we talked about before,

(08:52):
which was thetans.
And if Shik Denim L can kind ofgo over what thetans are, just
to kind of give us the reason ofwhy they use this tool.
What is a thetan, brother?

SPEAKER_05 (09:03):
A thetan, okay, in in the church of Scientology,
the Thetans are what we wouldcall the secret society in a
sense of Scientology.
They are the ones, they're likean order, they're like a
fraternal order within theorder, right?
And a thetan is a person whobasically has a higher
connection to the to theindivisible deity that they call

(09:26):
theta.
It's but it's actually aninfinity, it's an infinity
symbol.
And within the thetans, theycall them OTs, operating
thetans, and they have levels ofthetans.
They have OT1, OT2, OT3, so onand so forth.
And when these within theselevels are lessons, and these
lessons cost a lot of money.
And a lot of times many peoplego in depth, but they use the

(09:48):
e-meter and the other things toscam you in.
Because see, right after that,right after you they give you
the e-meter situation, and andyou fought, if you fought for
the Okie doke, you're gonna besitting in there taking tests.
You're gonna be you're gonna goin the building and they're
gonna sit you down, you're gonnastart doing these these
different types of tests.
Like it's all measuring.
The test isn't it, they'rethey're not looking for

(10:09):
intelligence, they're lookingfor a fool.
I'm just gonna be playing,they're looking for foolish
people that they can manipulateand operate.
A person who does a person wholacks confidence in certain
other certain other types of uhcharacter, they they can see
that they test for those things.

(10:29):
Can you give me an example ofthe of the type of test that
they would, you know, yeah,they'll they'll give you they'll
give you thought to they'll giveyou thought tests, they'll
they'll give you situationtests.
Like I said, they'll sit you ina roll, they'll bring you in
this room and they'll get and totest our time.
It's like you got 30 minutes toanswer these questions, you got
20 minutes to answer this part,and so on and so forth.
And that's how it went.

(10:50):
I got in, I went into the churchof Scientology specifically to
get my daughters out becausetheir mother had taken them in
and she was dating a Thetan, aOT3.
Now, mind you, I hadn't had anyknowledge of actually of what
Scientology was.
So I'm in South Africa.
South Africa has the biggest,one of the biggest, if I think

(11:12):
the biggest, Scientology umoperating, you know,
jurisdiction is in South Africa.
It's in Africa, right?
So I go in there and um I'mtalking to people and they ask
me if I'm an OT.

(11:32):
They ask me if I'm a thing.
They ask me, Are you are you aOT?
And I'm like, what is an OT?
Like, if you don't know, thenyou you're not one, but you
sound like one.
The way you're talking, thethings you're saying, it sounds
like theater work.
And I'm saying to myself, bro,I'm dressed up like a Sufi, man.
I got all white on, I got awhite turban on and everything.
I'm like, I'm a this is this isSufi talk.

(11:55):
At that moment, I realized whatI was dealing with.
I said, okay, so now I see wherenow I know where Ron L.
Ron Hubbard has drawn thesethings from.
14th, 15th century, Middle East,so on and so forth.
You know, uh Sufismspecifically, mystics, oriental
mystics, blah, blah, blah.

(12:16):
The rest is history.
The rest is history.
I got in there, I I learned theinformation, then I went and
used it against them.
And I was already at death.
So it just took me a couplemonths, and I was in and I was
tearing them apart, man.
And when I came home, andBrother Ishmael showed me a
picture and asked me what itwas, and I said, Man, that's
funny, man.

(12:36):
You asked me about this becauseI just left.
You know, I just came home fromAfrica, and this is what I was
up against.
That's the Church ofScientology.
It was in the laborers' meeting.
They had CO and they had chairsreserved for the Church of
Scientology in a laborers'meeting.
That's right.
So the operating Phaetons arethe ones who actually they put

(12:59):
out when they get to a certainlevel, they become what you will
call, they become handlers.
They also become recruits, theybecome recruiters, but they
mostly become handlers becausewhen they recruit, they'll
handle you.
It's just like the same thing inHollywood, like with Tom Cruise
and all of them, the ones whoare part of Scientist, Dougie
Fresh, Tom Cruise, Badu.
Dougie Fresh?
Yeah, Dougie Fresh was a part ofScientology at one point.

(13:21):
I don't know if he's still amember, but at one point in time
he was active.

SPEAKER_03 (13:25):
He still is, yeah.
MC Light.

unknown (13:27):
Wow.

SPEAKER_04 (13:28):
MC M C so his dad is Hamarambi, how Hamarambi J.

SPEAKER_05 (13:33):
Right, right, right.
Right, right.
But that's either here, here youknow, neither here nor there.
But so they have a strong tie ondealing with wordplay.
They're very good with wordplay.
And what's the strongest playthat they play on people is the
mind, analytical and reactive.

(13:55):
They work this, they work yourmind.
And they they'll you know whatI'm saying, they talk about it,
they'll tell you you you have areactive mind.
Your mind judges, and and youopen, you say, Yeah, you're
you're right, you're right,you're right.
You'll you'll fall into the gameif you're not if you're not
aware of what's happening.
You're being hustled from everysingle angle.

(14:17):
If you think they're sincere,you're gonna get taken.

SPEAKER_03 (14:21):
And then what happens is it becomes a um a
slow hypnosis taking place.
Because initially, if thischurch of Scientology identifies
you and invites you to come in,that's what they call the
techniques called love bombing.
They'll love bomb you.
You want to come into thisbuilding?
It's a beautiful building.

(14:41):
You can start getting access tothe technology.
You want to do weekly meetingshere?
You can have weekly meetingshere.
You don't have to pay us athing.
No, this is charity.
Come on in, bring your friendsin.
Y'all can all come in and useour big screen TVs and and do
presentations because we're herefor the community, we're here to
help you, brother.
See how smooth that is now.
You're coming into a brand newbuilding, just like in Los

(15:05):
Angeles, the Nation of Islam hastheir full-time.
We pull that up here on theshow.
It was full-time at the Churchof Scientology.
So you invite people into thesebrand new edifices, right?
And they're able to enjoy theamenities.
And before you know it, you'rebeing love-bombed and brought
in.
Celebrities are coming in to rubshoulders with you, they're

(15:25):
giving you food.
Would you like to have food beserved at your event?
Right?
All this stuff is coming in, butthere's a price attached to
this, facts, right?
And that price is your soul,facts, ultimately.
I'm sorry, please continue,brother.

SPEAKER_04 (15:42):
Um, so the brother uh Kevin Ali asked um asked
Brother Ishmael to look at theCIA People's Temple, Jim Jones,
and Scientology symbols, andcomment on the PSYOP connection.

SPEAKER_05 (15:57):
I was just looking at that a couple of days early.
No, it's funny he said thatbecause I was just looking at
the connection betweenScientology, MK MK Ultra, and
and the CIA.
And and there's a there'sthere's a tie between all of
those things.
L.
Ryan Hubbard was tied into a lotof different, he knew a lot of
different people.
There's no actual hardcoreinformation that the CIA and MK

(16:17):
Ultra linked and merged, butwhen you when you there's six
degrees of separation ofeverything and there's a
connection and tie.
You just have to see it.
But that that ties into whyScientology is in Hollywood
along with MK Ultra, whichcontrols Hollywood as well.
Um, so you know, and MK Ultradeals with torture, it deals
with splitting the personality.

(16:38):
It splits the personality of theentertainer.
Yeah, I mean, you would Beyoncehas Sasha Fierce, right?
Um Nicki Minaj had Roman, andyou know, you know, so that when
I go on stage, I become somebodyelse.
Like all so there's a wholescience behind all of that
stuff, and they have handlers inHollywood as well.
Handlers.
And if you get out of hand, theyget rid of you.

(17:01):
You get lost.
Scientology does the same thing.
People come up missing inScientology.
People come up missing.
Am I right?
Do people come up missing?

SPEAKER_02 (17:15):
Absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 (17:17):
Your mic, I think your mic went off.

SPEAKER_04 (17:19):
Your mic went off.

SPEAKER_03 (17:21):
Absolutely, is what I was saying.
Absolutely correct.
Yeah, they come up missing, man.

SPEAKER_04 (17:27):
So you say they split your mind, right?

SPEAKER_05 (17:30):
That's MK Ultra.
They also do that with they alsodo that with with um
Scientology, too.

SPEAKER_04 (17:36):
Now, can you give me any examples of how that's done?

SPEAKER_05 (17:39):
It's done by no sleep, sleep deprivation,
putting you under all types ofstrenuous testing and sleep
deprivation and so on and soforth, man.
There are people in Scientologywho don't sleep for days, for
days, because they're doing newtechnology, they're working a
technology, they're getting Ishmentioned earlier about the

(18:03):
hypnosis.
You're slowly being pulled in,you know what I'm saying?
You're slowly being pulled in,and when they take away your
your senses, it's easy to putyou or to cut you in half to
separate personality.
That's what the handler is for.

SPEAKER_03 (18:20):
Also, also in Scientology, they they do what's
called set checks.
Sec checks is short.
That's right.
When they do security checks,they're probing your mind to
find out what are the thingsthat you're thinking about for
set checks.
Have you ever had an impurethought about L.
Ron Hubbard?
No, I haven't.
It can tell if you're lying,right?

(18:41):
Because if you're lying, you'regonna be triggering certain
things.
Have you ever thought about X,Y, and Z, this type of sexual
lifestyle?
Things like that.
These are set checks that theydo in order to curve you or
direct you into a certain way ofthinking.

SPEAKER_05 (18:56):
See, okay as all cults do.

SPEAKER_04 (18:59):
Wow, so so yeah, you go ahead.

SPEAKER_05 (19:02):
I was gonna say, as all cults do.

SPEAKER_04 (19:05):
So the sec checks, right?
So when you said the the uh thattool they use is a low-grade lie
detector test.
So if it's a low-grade liedetector test, how is it able to
pick up things if it's if it'ssuch low grade?

SPEAKER_05 (19:23):
It picks up, it just picks up move, it just picks, it
pick, it just it just operatesoff of it's not picking up your
nervous system or anything likethat.
It's just picking when you touchit and you squeeze it or
whatever, it's it's it'soperating from strength and
other things.
It's not operating because it'sactually picking up your nerve
system and all that type ofstuff.
You gotta remember you'redealing with a hustle.
You gotta remember L.

(19:43):
Ron Hubbard was a hustler, man.
He wrote, he wrote, he wrotescience fiction stories.
He wrote books, science fictionstories.
So he took a science fictionstory and turned it into real
life.
Indeed, somebody said BabylonianSumerian culture is huge in
Hollywood circles.
Of course it is.
They have deities in Hollywood.
You have you have you haveMoloch, you know what I'm
saying?
You have the deity Moloch, youhave the the the the Baal deity,

(20:07):
you have the Baphomet deity.
Hollywood got Hollywood gotgods, just like Scientology.
Scientology got gods.

SPEAKER_04 (20:17):
Now, now to take it back to the that equipment, um
what what is it called again?
The e-meter.
The e-meter.
So the e-meter, uh, it you saidthat you know anything can
influence the e-meter, right?
Like subtle, maybe subtlemovement, uh, a little bit of
shaking.
So it's not really a liedetector test, it's more of like

(20:39):
bro, it's a toy, brother.

SPEAKER_05 (20:40):
It tells you right on the thing, it's a toy.
Correct.
It's a toy, but people don'tunderstand.

SPEAKER_04 (20:50):
No mean to cut your wisdom.
No, you good.
So so it's like, oh, you'reshaking.
Okay, so it's like it's fake,right?
So they can take your mindwherever they want you to,
whatever because you'regullible, because you're
gullible, right?
Oh, you do that thing moved overhere, so that means your mind is
looked like this.
Oh, you know what?

(21:11):
I never thought of it that way,yes, sir.

SPEAKER_03 (21:14):
Yeah, and simultaneously, say they're
sitting there trying to tell youto make this chapstick move.
If you look at it and it don'tmove, it's something wrong with
you.
You're not quote unquote workingthe tech.
See, so it makes it your fault,even if they give you a command

(21:36):
and you're unable to do it.
So it's a no-win situation.
You need to pay more moneybecause you're not in the right
tune.

SPEAKER_05 (21:44):
You are you have to get back on on course, see, and
because you can't make thatchapstick move, you know what
we're gonna do?
We're gonna sit you in a roomand set an ashtray in front of
you, and we're gonna make youtalk to that ashtray till it
moves.
This is real.

SPEAKER_03 (22:01):
This this is what they do.

SPEAKER_04 (22:06):
What okay?
So now the ashtray.
Okay, so let's go into once theyhave to after they manipulate
you right with the e-meter,what's the next step?

SPEAKER_05 (22:19):
Is the testing is to get you inside the building.
Once they got you in thebuilding, that's it.
Everything else we're tellingyou is just the extras.
The game, the the games theyplay, the e-meter using it to
open up to open you up to theirsuggestion, they use a lot of
suggestion.

SPEAKER_03 (22:36):
And what Sheikh Danimel was saying was remember
when he just said a few minutesago that um his wife was dealing
with an an e uh operate OT3.
So you go up what's called thebridge and you go up to higher
levels, right?
So once you go to certain levelsup this quote unquote bridge,

(22:57):
that's when you start to get thereality of who they see is their
higher power, right?
Their most higher power or theirgalactic overlord name is Zenu.
Zenu is this person thatcontrols everything in this
existence.
This is their being who is analien that lives in outer space.

SPEAKER_05 (23:21):
Yeah, yeah.
His name is spelled Z E N U.
Put it in reverse.
You next, yeah, you next.
Yep, your ass is next.
Yep.

SPEAKER_04 (23:36):
They flipped it on you, I mean, it's the brother
said, What is what isFarrakhan's cult connections?

SPEAKER_03 (23:46):
Everybody knew that, bro.
Um, there seems to be a constantaffection between Farrakhan and
Colts, right?

SPEAKER_05 (23:56):
If we were Sun Young Moon, I remember Sun Young Moon.

SPEAKER_03 (24:00):
Yeah, he was with right the the Moonies, right?
The Moonies is a is a uh a cultout of Korea, yeah.
Jim Jones, he had relations withthem.
Um Jim Jones, exactly.
The people's temple is a cult,he had a relationship with them,
right?
So there's been a track record,and again, minister Farrakhan

(24:21):
was eyeing this relationshipwith Scientology for over 30
years, although the publicdidn't know about it.
He was brought on by a ministerUlysses, who told him he left
the nation of Islam and became amember of the Church of
Scientology, and then toldFarrakhan about it, and then
Farrakhan always wanted to mergethis relationship, and like I

(24:41):
said, it cooked for about 30years before he decided to make
his move.

SPEAKER_05 (24:45):
And he prepared y'all for it, and he prepares
you, brother Ron.
He prepared you if you go backand listen to his speeches.
He told you one day a new bookis gonna come.
There will be a new book.
He told you this 30 yearsearlier.
There will be a new book that'sgonna come, and that book was
Dianetics.
There sure was a new book, andit's called Dianetics.

(25:08):
So he was like he said, he wassimmering this for 30 years,
man.
He was interested.
Matter of fact, you know what?
Warve Dean, I think Warveanintroduced him to Scientology in
70 in 70 something.
I think it was Warve Dean.
If I'm not mistaken, I thinkWarve Dean had a connection to
Scientology as well.
Okay, because remember whenWarve Dean started teaching, he

(25:30):
started doing a whole series onthe mind.
If you go back and look at WarveDean, you would you go back and
look, you you would see he wasdoing a whole thing on the mind.
I think he had a connectionsomewhere somewhere as well, or
some something.
But I know that uh Farrakhan hada connection directly for over
30-something years.

SPEAKER_04 (25:53):
Okay, so I want to ask a question.
What happens inside scienceScientology when a member can't
afford the next level?

SPEAKER_05 (26:00):
They go crazy.

SPEAKER_03 (26:09):
Yeah, there's a couple things you can do.
You can actually sign your lifeover to Scientology.

SPEAKER_05 (26:15):
Listen, yeah, listen.

SPEAKER_03 (26:17):
I was gonna bring that up.
Yep, you can sign your life overto Scientology and become a
full-time Scientologist.
You can join what's called the Corg.
And if you join the C org,they'll pay you about$50 a week.
You can get your lessons,unlimited lessons, and it pays

(26:37):
for your Scientology.
Now, you find examples ofmembers who are in the C org.
You'll find there was a realitystar.
Her name was her name is uh MimiFalse.

SPEAKER_04 (26:51):
Oh, yeah, surgery and all that.
Love and hip hop, yes, love andhip hop face like 10 times.
This is crazy because yo, Ialways said, What is going on
with this woman?
Like her mind is just now.
You know, now you know you sawScientology, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 (27:12):
Yeah, well, I'm gonna make knowledge born, and
we'll be able to pull this up ifyou'd like to.
Mimi was kicked out of thechurch of Scientology at the age
of 13.
She was kicked out on thestreet.
Her mother was in this part ofthe Scientology that we just
talked about, the C org.

(27:33):
Her mother was a member of the Corg, and they wanted Mimi to
sign a billion-year contract,sign her life over to
Scientology, and she refused todo that.
She didn't feel comfortablesigning her life over to an
organization.
So her mother said, either signthis contract or you're out on

(27:55):
the street, and she was kickedout in Hollywood, California.
There's a big blue building.
She was kicked out to go live onher own at the age of 13.
So imagine the damage that wasbeing done when you're 13,
kicked out on the street by yourown mother who's in this cult,
and now you have to fend foryourself.

SPEAKER_05 (28:14):
Right.

SPEAKER_03 (28:16):
Crazy, man.
Crazy.
So I just want to let you knowthat this is something that they
do offer if you're unable topay, quote unquote, for the
lessons.

SPEAKER_04 (28:25):
So, what's the real reason behind the aggressive
fundraising and expensivecourses?
Get wealthy.
So, who's at the top of all ofthis?

SPEAKER_05 (28:35):
Is Michabich still around?
Him.
The little the little the littlethe little the little leprechaun
cat.
Miskovich, whatever his name is.
David, David Miscavige.
Yep.

SPEAKER_03 (28:48):
That sounds Jewish.
Yeah, I'm sure.
I'm sure.
Yeah, he's the person at the topof Scientology.

SPEAKER_04 (28:58):
David Miskavitch.

SPEAKER_03 (28:59):
Yeah, he's the rich guy.
Because nobody else is rich.
And Scientology is a pay as yougo religion.
So as you get up, they expectfor you to dig deeper.
If you don't have it, they haveexperts that can go maximize
your credit card, havetechniques to where you can go

(29:20):
past your max, where they'llfront you more money so that you
can pay for more lessons.

SPEAKER_05 (29:24):
So, what are in these lessons?
Nothing.
Some straight bullshit.
If you read the book ofdiagnetics, that's all it is.
It's all of that.
I mean, L.
Ron Hubbard wrote a lot ofbooks.
He wrote a lot of technology,but it's all BS.
I read a couple of.
I've read like maybe 10 or 11,like 10 or 11 of them.
And it's all it's all nonsense.

(29:46):
I'm I'm laughing at it.
I'm like, yo, this guy reallylike the people are people are
dumb.
People really are very gullible,man.
Especially when you and he andsee, he chose a particular
people.
Particular demographics ofpeople to come to and to deal
with.
Because see, when he when hecreated Scientology, he created

(30:08):
Scientology in the 50s and heput it right in Hollywood.
It wasn't meant for poor peopleanyway.
You understand what I'm saying?
It wasn't meant for the commonpeople, it was meant for exactly
where it was at for Hollywoodand all those people engrouped
and so on and so forth.

(30:28):

SPEAKER_03 (30:29):
So yeah, and what we've been describing, we've
been describing their deity isan alien in outer space.
L.
Ron Hubbard was a sciencefiction writer.
So this is all things that'sgoing on in his mind.
When he wrote this book,Dianetics, this is one of the
earlier versions of it.

(30:49):
You can tell by thetatteredness.
But when he wrote this in 1950,he's using his creativity as a
science fiction writer.
So there is no end game, right?
He's telling you that in outerspace, because this is at that
time, they have identical B-52sflying in outer space.

(31:10):
He's taking them on a fantasyride.
There is no end game.

unknown (31:14):
Right?

SPEAKER_05 (31:19):
And it hasn't been medically or scientifically um
proven to be right and exact.
In any form, in any form, it'sbeen vetted, it's been vetted
that way.
It's not scientifically valid,it's not medically valid valid.

SPEAKER_03 (31:35):
So and people were challenging his claims in real
time.
Back in the 50s, once you get toa certain level, it's called
clear.
Once you become a clear, right?
Right.
Go ahead, go ahead, bro.
Go ahead, go ahead.
Talk to me.

SPEAKER_04 (31:51):
So the first time I heard about a clear was whenever
me and Kevin Ali did thatpodcast.
I believe that was whatWednesday?
I think that was Wednesday,Kevin Ali.
If you're still on, I learnedabout what a clear was on that
podcast.
So a clear, explain what theclear is, and um what is the uh

(32:11):
what are the requirements tobecome a clear?

SPEAKER_05 (32:21):
Well, well, you know, a clear is a person who no
longer have any types of vicesor any types of sicknesses or
any type of health issues orwhatever, because the technology
is totally held as person.
So if you wear glasses, youdon't have to wear glasses no
more, he can fully see.
If he was deaf, he can hear now.
If he couldn't smell, he cansmell.
If he couldn't walk, if he if hewas crippled, if he was

(32:42):
paraplegic, now he can walk.

SPEAKER_02 (32:47):
Okay.
All right.

SPEAKER_04 (32:51):
So have you met any clears before?

SPEAKER_05 (32:55):
Neither were you.
I've met people who claim to beclears.

SPEAKER_04 (33:01):
Okay.
And then then so what were theylike?
Were they like there was werethey clear?

SPEAKER_05 (33:10):
No, they wasn't clear, they weren't clear.
How you how you coughing and youhow you coughing and and and
doing all types of stuff andyou're supposed to be clear?
You guys and you got sickness.
But you're telling me you clear,but you got pink eye.
Or you telling me you clear andyou limping.

(33:30):
Your knees, your knees is messedup, or so you know like nobody
is clear, brother.
That's a game.
That's a game to sell thetechnology.

SPEAKER_04 (33:40):
I just saw a brother from the nation of Islam post
somebody saying that they theyhave a certificate.
How did the nation how is thenation of Islam, or from what I
know now, aka the final call,are buying into this.
Is it a money game?

(34:01):
Do you think you brothers thinkit's a money thing?

SPEAKER_05 (34:04):
Brother, they have a leader.
Their leader bought into it andand put them in it.
He gets a cut of everything thathappens.
He's a film, he's a Philrepresentative.
Very kind is making money off ofthat, man.
Tony Muhammad making money offof it, they're making money.

(34:26):
They're making money, man.
But the followers are but thefollowers ain't making no money.
They're getting bombarded.
And since when is the supremewisdom not enough?

SPEAKER_03 (34:48):
It was looking all the three.
Yeah, indeed, go ahead.
OJ Simpson.
Let's see what OJ has to say,shall we?

SPEAKER_01 (35:06):
At one point I I felt I had reached the state of
clear, right?

SPEAKER_02 (35:10):
Which is what?

SPEAKER_01 (35:11):
Which is a in in Scientology, I guess, is an area
where you kind of you're onewith all, see all, know all.
At least that's the way Iinterpreted it.
You got to that state?
I thought I had.
Or had from time to time reachedthat state, especially as an
athlete.
Sometimes you just feel thatyou're in total control of your
surroundings and candeliberately wheat around you to

(35:34):
happen.
And uh, and I call, you know,another Scientology place, the
local place where I was firsthere in LA.
Uh I even tried to get hold ofMr.
Hubbard at one point years ago.
And uh then I learned there wasnowhere to go from Claire.

SPEAKER_02 (35:50):
But at the same time, at the same time, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (35:53):
So, what happens after Claire?
Essentially, what I found out isthat there's nothing.

SPEAKER_03 (35:59):
There's no did that answer the question.

SPEAKER_04 (36:05):
Got you.
So there's absolutely nothingafter Claire, so there's no
perks or anything like that.
There's no heaven, brother.
There's no heaven.
Wow, okay.
So now explain to me the Thetan,the Thetan thing.
Like, how do you climb theranks?

SPEAKER_05 (36:26):
You have to go, you have to become a Thetan, and you
become a Thaetan by bycompleting a certain amount of
technology, a certain amount oftechnology, and have the have
the money basically to transferinto the Thaetan studies, pretty
much.
It's all money.

SPEAKER_04 (36:44):
This is some 10%.
This very 10%.
This is next level 10%.

SPEAKER_03 (36:50):
Absolutely, absolutely, yeah, very 10%.
And with the with the Thetans,the purpose of you even
connecting yourself to thatmachine we talked about is to
get the alien beings off yourbody, right?
Right, yeah, you said that theengrams, the engrams exactly
with these engrams that stick toyour body, the engram gets them
off.

(37:10):
That's what auditing is supposedto do, get these engrams off of
your body, right?
Because these these are thethings that are dragging you
down, right?
Right.
Can you explain that part of it?

SPEAKER_05 (37:23):
Yeah, the engrams, the engrams are the things that
you were born with, pretty much.
Not born with, but like this,the story of Zeno is Zenu blew
up, he blew up um some otheraliens or something.
He put them around a volcano andblew them all up, and those
spirits, the spirits, thingsthat he blew up, the spirits

(37:44):
inhabited the earth, and it'sthese very spirits that has
attached themselves to the humanbeings.
And the human beings haveengrams, and they have a thing
called just engrams canre-stimulate you.
It's called stimulation orre-stimulation.
You get an engram and it'llre-stimulate you out of your
character, or you know, you maybug out, have a you know, have a

(38:05):
have a situation happen whereyou may, you know, you may snap
and get angry or something, andyou'll blame it on an engram.
That they'll blame it on anengram, or you have you have in
grams, you got to go back to theorigin of your engrams and so
on, and they use auditing to doit.
So they'll tell you what's themost worst thing that's happened
to you.
So, what you're doing is you'regiving up all your secrets,
right?

(38:26):
Things that happen to you, allyou these different types of
little secrets, because youtrust the organization.
But what happens is if you giveup too much of your secrets,
those secrets are used toblackmail you later on.
You'll be blackmailed becauseblackmail is a part of
Scientology, too.

SPEAKER_04 (38:41):
So that's why they're able to maintain
financial control over themembers.

SPEAKER_05 (38:46):
Something like that.
Same thing with Hollywood, samething with Hollywood.
Once they catch you on film,they they got that's what that's
what Puff was doing, right?
That's how Puff was doingcertain things, and people
before him was doing things thesame way.
Okay, brother Alma Lake, what'sgoing on, brother?
Peace.

SPEAKER_04 (39:06):
Now, um what are the biggest accusations from former
members?
Uh uh, what what are the biggestaccusations former members make
about Scientology's disciplinarysystem?

SPEAKER_03 (39:20):
Ish well they've done some they have um
compounds, you know, where theyactually go through forms of
torture, right?
You heard the sheikh talkingabout sleep deprivation, or
they'll put a pole in the middleof this room and have you march
around this pole.
Try doing that for one hour, twohours, five hours, ten hours in

(39:45):
a day, just marching around incircles, or you'll be able to
see drones that fly over theseplaces and get pictures of them
outside doing rigorous labor,right?
Almost slave-like, or they'llput you in rooms naked or just
down to your skivmies, right?
So they have these things, theseforms of torture or punishments

(40:07):
if you get out of line.
These aren't just regularlow-level Scientologists we're
talking about the higherexecutives that get dragged and
put into these facilities, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (40:19):
Straight up, they don't discriminate.

SPEAKER_03 (40:21):
No, not at all.
You have reports of of DavidMeskevich himself slapping
people up, right?
You know, so yeah, these arethings that take place.
Forced abortions, women who mayget pregnant and forced to give
abortions.
You have um Masterson right nowin Hollywood fighting charges of

(40:43):
forced uh fast assault sa onwomen, right?
Yeah, so this, yeah, this isnothing to play with, and these
are all forms of control,brother, to answer your
question.

SPEAKER_04 (40:55):
Okay, um, what role do ethics officers play in
monitoring controlling members?

SPEAKER_05 (41:05):
Ethics, ethics officers.
You you you heard you just heardeverything we said, right?
Yeah.
Do it sound ethical?
No.
Okay.
You just answered your ownquestion, man.

SPEAKER_04 (41:19):
Well, I mean, the ethic officers, I mean, so I'm
assuming there's somethingcalled ethic officers within the
uh uh uh organizational cult.
So are are they you know it'slike the military, right?

SPEAKER_05 (41:36):
Right.
The ethics officers exist, butthey exist only as bookwork.
There is no ethics once you'rein, it's control, it's pure
control.
There's no ethics involved.

SPEAKER_03 (41:55):
And just keep in mind the last time I was here, I
played an audio of L.
Ron Hubbard saying the only waythat you can control people are
is to lie to them.
You remember that audio when Idropped that?
If not, I do have it on standby.

SPEAKER_04 (42:09):
Yeah, you did, you did.
Yeah, yeah, I think that was thefirst podcast we did.

SPEAKER_03 (42:14):
It was the first podcast we did, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Think about that quote.
The only way you can controlpeople is to lie to them.
Is that ethical?
That's the founder, right?
That's the founder of the quoteunquote religion, right?
So it becomes a form of controlto lie to people because that's

(42:36):
a command given by theoriginator.

SPEAKER_04 (42:43):
Okay, uh, what is the C org?

SPEAKER_05 (42:46):
And you just mentioned that the C org,
remember about 10,000 years ofgiving your life?
The C org, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 (42:54):
Yeah, that's what Mimi's mother was.
She was the C org member that wejust discussed, right?

SPEAKER_04 (42:59):
Right, right, right, right.

SPEAKER_03 (43:00):
Very good question.

SPEAKER_04 (43:02):
Uh, and why now and why do former members call it a
paramilitary organization?
Do you know anything about that?

SPEAKER_05 (43:12):
Yeah, I mean, because it's it's ships, and the
way it's designed, it's designedfrom a from a paramilitary type
of um condition.
It's the sea org.
They have uh a I'm not gonnacall it a military, but you know
what I'm saying?

(43:32):
It's designed in a militaristicprocess.
Like they got captains,lieutenants, and all that type
of stuff, but it's notnecessarily a military, like the
army.

SPEAKER_03 (43:47):
And he used to walk around even in Scientology,
he'll walk around looking like afat Captain Crunch looking ass
nigga.
So he would walk around and havethis kind of military bearing
instruction within Scientology,right?

SPEAKER_05 (44:00):
Right.
And we don't even we don't evenreally know if he was really in
the Navy.
We don't really even know.
That's what he said.
We can't, I can't find therecords.
I couldn't find him back in thedays.
I look to see if his name was inany any naval records or
anything like that.
I think he was lying, man.
I think the niggas was, I thinkhe's still, I think it was
stolen valid.

(44:20):
I would not be surprised, yeah.
He knows because we damn we damnshows on ships.
We we was on ships, right now.

SPEAKER_04 (44:32):
Um, why do some ex-members claim they signed a
billionaire uh a billion-yearcontract?

SPEAKER_03 (44:39):
You did already explain that's the org the c
org, all right and just just toput it in perspective, that's a
prerequisite of that part ofScientology, so it's separate
parts, separate pockets ofScientology.
That C org is the one where yousigned the billion-year
contract, right?
And they get the unlimitedlessons for free, they're the

(45:01):
ones that get paid the$50 aweek.
That's the that's the C orgorganization.

SPEAKER_04 (45:07):
So I sell my my life away for for billion years,
whatever, right?
And I get$50 a week andunlimited and unlimited lessons,
which have not much value.

SPEAKER_05 (45:20):
So you get them and you get them for and you get
them and you get them forlifetimes, brother.
What they're talking isincarnations and reincarnation.
They're talking about incarnate.
So you're gonna your soul whenit incarnates, is gonna belong
to them.
Every time it incarnates for thenext 10,000 years, you're gonna
be on this, you're gonna be inthe sea org.

SPEAKER_03 (45:38):
And we just showed you an example of you willing to
throw away your own child rightfor the sea org.
We gave you an example in realtime, right?

SPEAKER_04 (45:49):
Now, uh, can the brothers explain if there's any
difference between Scientologyand Dianetics?
People in the final call triedto make this distinction uh
justified being okay for them todo it.

SPEAKER_05 (46:03):
No, there isn't any difference, it's all the same.
Dianetics comes fromScientology.
Scientology is dianetics, it'sall it's there is no difference,
bro.

SPEAKER_02 (46:14):
I didn't see a difference.

SPEAKER_03 (46:16):
You see a difference, no, there's there's
no difference at all, and let'sjust put put it on the table of
why it seemed this way.
Originally, it was calledDianetics, and then L.
Ron Hubbard lost the copyright.
Yeah, so when he lost thetrademark in 1952, he started

(46:40):
Scientology because he lost thetrademark to Dianetics, he then
brought back the rights toDianetics once it was available,
and that's how you were able toget both entities.
Okay, so it's the same thing.

unknown (47:01):
Wow.

SPEAKER_03 (47:01):
Now, the Nation of Islam final call version lie and
say that they only deal withdianetics and not Scientology.
But I showed you in real timewhen I was on here, if you go
and anyone can go right now,pull up black Scientologists on
Facebook, and you'll find awhole shipload of Nation of

(47:24):
Islam members.
If you just pull up BlackScientologists group on
Facebook, and you can see it foryourself right now.

SPEAKER_04 (47:34):
Interesting.
Okay, let's go into uh what isthe exact what exactly is
disconnection and why arefamilies torn apart over it?
You ever heard of that?

SPEAKER_03 (47:49):
The disconnection is what we were just talking about
in Mimi's situation.
She was forced to disconnectbecause you have to make a
choice.
If you what's called an SP orsuppressive person, you cannot
be in the fold of Scientology.
So you're forced to break awayfrom your family, all of your

(48:12):
friends, anyone that's dealingwith Scientology, you're
commanded to break away.
Okay, that's what disconnectionis.

SPEAKER_04 (48:20):
Are members pressured or coerced to into
discon disconnecting fromcritics?

SPEAKER_05 (48:26):
Yes, definitely.
That's the thing.
They don't want criticism.
They don't want any type ofcritiquing or criticism at all.

SPEAKER_03 (48:37):
That's dangerous for them.
And Farrakhan has useddisconnection with how he set up
his structure of the nation ofIslam.
You cannot be a laborer in thenation of Islam final call
version, unless you submit toDianetics, aka Scientology.
It is a prerequisite, it is aprerequisite.

(49:01):
Did I finally get a bomb?
Did I get a bomb drop?
You can get a couple bombs,you're gonna get a couple bombs
in the show, brother.
Yeah, so that's whatdisconnection is.
It's a form of control and it'sa command giving within
Scientology.

SPEAKER_05 (49:17):
Whoa, and with and also, brother, within
Farrakhan's ranks, there is ahandler order as well.
There's brothers handling otherbrothers and sisters who can't
get right with the Scientology.

SPEAKER_02 (49:35):
Oh man.
All right.
Uh, you you want me to share thescreen?

SPEAKER_04 (49:40):
Ish?

SPEAKER_03 (49:43):
No, but I I didn't have uh anything else else to
share unless I mean I I got mymy PowerPoint on standby, but
no, I'm I'm I'm good.
Whatever you want to go through.
I'm good.

SPEAKER_04 (49:51):
No, no, no, correct.
Uh so well, this is uh basicallyself-explanatory, but uh why
does Scientology prior priorprioritize celebrity recruitment
for the money, basically, right?

SPEAKER_05 (50:03):
And it was the foundation of Scientology's
beginnings, it was Hollywood.
He put the first Scientologyoperation in the hills of
Hollywood in the early 50s atthe same time, Hollywood, Walt
Disney, and Werner Von Braun wasgetting together to push their

(50:24):
rocket ship shit and theyscience stories through Walt
Disney World because you know,later on in the 60s, we went to
the moon.
But that was all a preparationfrom the 50s, you know what I'm
saying?
From from Werner from Werner VonBraun in the scientific show in
Walt Disney.
They said all of that, all ofthat shit was set.
Like it's a just a bigconnection here.
Like it's a lot of stuff goingon with all of this stuff, man.

(50:45):
And L.
Ron Hubbard was in the mix.

SPEAKER_03 (50:50):
Yeah, and that's that's the proper bait.
You just heard OJ Simpsontalking about in his circles,
right?
He was going through it's kindof like the in-crowd, right?
If you want to bring people in,you have celebrities endorse
whatever it is that you want tosell.
It's no different, right?
Oh, is that person wear Nike?
I'm gonna wear Nike.
That person does same thing withwith quote-unquote Scientology.

SPEAKER_04 (51:11):
Facts, yep.
Okay, what benefits do celebritymembers receive that ordinary
members do not?

SPEAKER_03 (51:21):
You have an aspect of Scientology.
If you are a celebrity, you getaccess to what's called the
celebrity center.
When you get access to thecelebrity center, you get
catered to more, people treatyou differently, they have
swanky parties, you know, theythey they love bomb you more if
you're quote unquote in thecelebrity circles, right?

(51:43):
So that's what the differenceis.
Okay, and they pay more.

SPEAKER_04 (51:47):
Yeah.
How does the how do how does theorganization use celebrities to
influence oh well?
How does the how do how does theorganization use celebrity
influence to deflect criticism?

SPEAKER_05 (52:04):
Well, you know, if you if you've been watching the
whole history, it's a lot ofit's now it's a lot of
celebrities that are critiquingScientology itself as former
members.
They're coming out and makingstatements.
So eventually it can't it can'tstand the water.
So it's gonna, it's gonna, theholes are already being put in
it, it's gonna sink sooner orlater.

(52:26):
But the people who are a part ofit themselves are coming forward
and talking about it, man.

SPEAKER_03 (52:32):
And and if you notice, something is dead when
there's no motion, right?
If you look at a Scientologybuilding, they're beautiful
buildings, they buy greatarchitecture, they create and
make beautiful architecture,they have real estate
portfolios, and the buildingsare empty.
The buildings are empty becauseit's the real estate is where

(52:55):
they're making their money at.
There's nobody in there becausepeople realize it's a hustle.
So you have a very select fewpeople, maybe about four or five
people on staff in this wholebig old building, and ain't
nobody walking in, and ain'tnobody walking out because it's
dead, right?
So that's gonna be anindication.
If it was really popping, theplace would be jumping.

(53:17):
The places are beautiful, butthey're empty, so it's nothing
but a museum, bro.
It's nothing but a museum.
That's it.
This room with a room dedicatedto Ron Hubbard.

SPEAKER_04 (53:29):
Eyes Wide Shut, highly recommended.
Uh highly recommend that's themovie.

SPEAKER_05 (53:34):
Eyes Wide Shut is the movie.
That was a movie with Tom Hankwith Tom Cruise and uh what's
her name in it, man?
It was basically aboutHollywood, Hollywood, the
Illuminati rituals.
You know, they cut 24 seconds ofthat movie, man.
There was a 24-second cut fromthat movie that they didn't put
on the mainstream theaterbecause it was a child
sacrifice.

SPEAKER_04 (53:54):
Okay, okay.
All right, I gotta find thatmovie.
Where's where is that on onNetflix?
Yeah, you can find it anywhere.

SPEAKER_03 (54:02):
And that, yeah, that's that's when he was
married to um Nicole Kibben washer name.

SPEAKER_05 (54:07):
Yeah, Nicole Kippen.
And you gotta check her family,you gotta check her family's her
family's history, right?

SPEAKER_03 (54:14):
Right.
She broke away from all of that.

SPEAKER_04 (54:16):
Yo, uh uh, Ben, you didn't miss this.
You didn't miss this.
All you gotta do is rewind,brother.
All you gotta do is rewind.
All right.
Um, let me go into this nextone.
Why uh uh, so any lawsuits, anylawsuits behind this this group?

SPEAKER_05 (54:34):
Of course there are.
I don't know.
I I don't know, I don't know howmany went public, but there's
tons of lawsuits.

SPEAKER_03 (54:41):
I I'm sure of that.
Absolutely, plenty, plenty oflawsuits.
Again, you can pull up theMasterson case, the actor
Masterson.
I can see what he's facing rightnow.
He's facing those charges.
So, yeah, there's plenty oflawsuits, and even the ones that
that go away, they pay a bighefty sum to try to keep the
damage control.

(55:02):
But yeah, lots of lawsuits.

SPEAKER_04 (55:04):
Now, well, what is this?
Uh uh, you know, I'm likeGoogling this um uh group and uh
it's uh talking about likesurveillance using intimidation.

SPEAKER_05 (55:15):
Scientology, they'll do that to you, they'll they'll
they'll do that to you.
They'll try to if you'recritique.
If you're if you're somebodywho's critiqued them and they
get a drop on you, and they andthey do the they do their little
history and they little studiesand find out that you just just
somebody on your own, you knowwhat I mean?
Just you know what I mean?
They're gonna come for you.
If you got a little crew withyou, it might be a little more
difficult, but they will theywill hunt you down, they'll
start intimidating you, they'llyou know your money may come up

(55:39):
messed up, things may be comingout messing out your mailbox,
any any a lot of people.

SPEAKER_03 (55:42):
I've been in my trash cans before.
They've they've been they try toget your license plates and all
that, they've done all thatstuff.
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 (55:48):
I'm sure it's been through it, definitely.
I know he's been doing it.

SPEAKER_04 (55:52):
And nobody put the beats on them though, bro.
I ain't worried about nothing.
Let me catch you in my in mytrash.

SPEAKER_05 (56:02):
You won't catch bro, you won't catch them in your
trash.
You won't catch them in yourtrash, you won't, but they'll be
in your trash, they'll go inyour trash, but you won't catch
them.
They yo, they good with theirlittle surveillance shit.
They go with that, you know.
They'll come sit in front ofyour house for hours without
you, you know what I mean, justso they can go and pick through
your garbage for sure.

SPEAKER_04 (56:24):
Wow, wow, nobody okay, nobody catches that.
All right, let me see something.
Um, yeah.
Oh, so uh, how does the churchrespond to journalists or
investigators who askuncomfortable questions?

SPEAKER_03 (56:44):
Sheikh Denim L, can you explain how the church of
Scientology became tax-free?

SPEAKER_05 (56:53):
Oh man, damn.
How did they become tax-free?
Um, I remember I gotta thinkback a little bit.
That's all right.
I can explain it.
You can just bear the channel.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, drop the bottom because II I'm thinking back.

SPEAKER_03 (57:05):
Um the church of Scientology have been they were
trying to get tax-free to berecognized as a church, right?
Churches are tax-free, right?
They couldn't get the approval.
So if you remember in CNN, theyused to have this female
reporter named Greta VanSestrich.

SPEAKER_05 (57:22):
Ah, yes, go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 (57:25):
The Church of Scientology, you gotta give them
credit for this.
They broke into the IRS.
What I know, I know, I know thiscut.
This is really, really real.
They broke into the IRS buildingand got files IRS agents, got

(57:51):
the information on the IRSagents, and started blackmailing
the IRS.
I know who you're sleeping with,I know this side chick, I know
this little boy you've beentouching.
They went through all the IRSfiles, bullied them into getting
approval for the taxes.
Now, if you're bold enough to beable to break into government

(58:11):
buildings and get their filesand blackmail them, you are
committed.
You are committed.
I totally forgot about that.
I totally forgot about that.
Absolutely, yeah.
Broke into the governmentbuildings and blackmailed the

(58:32):
IRS agents.

SPEAKER_05 (58:33):
Totally forgot about that one.

SPEAKER_04 (58:35):
So, what happens after a person's leaving sound
Scientology?
You saw you figure all thisstuff is is crap, so now I'm
leaving.
How does that work?

SPEAKER_05 (58:45):
It depends on it depends on where you with the
states you're in.
It depends on if you are awealthy person, it depends on if
you got a little bit of money.
Because if you if you if you ifyou ain't got money and you owe,
you're not leaving, they'll sueyou.
They will fuck with you.
Pardon my language, excuse me.
They will bother you.

SPEAKER_03 (59:06):
They will bother you in order to get money because
again, it's a pay as you goreligion.
You're not gonna get thisinformation and go leave
somewhere else.
And if you got enough money,they'll come and sue you.
You owe us$300,000 or whatever.
Yo, they get your scientists,they're gangsters, b.
This is a signing documentssaying that you're gonna pay

(59:28):
them back.
Or this is an agreement.

SPEAKER_05 (59:35):
Wow, wow.
Why you think about you thinkabout um going going to
Scientology route, brotherBrown?

SPEAKER_04 (59:41):
Come on, bro.
Come on, bro.
You know, I I've been around it,meaning like I saw them in the
hood like a few times when I wasliving in the city and all that,
but uh, I was just I mean, Iwould suggest for your own
understanding.

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:00):
Understanding because you know a man knows not
by being told a man is exactlywhat he knows.
I would suggest for your ownunderstanding, go to one of
those places and go in.
I did.

SPEAKER_04 (01:00:10):
I went in and okay and I messed around with that
thing or whatever.
Um, but that was that was as faras I'm gonna go with that.
It's just not my vibe, period.
It's just not those not the typeof the no disrespect to anybody,
but the type of people that arein those buildings and a part of
that, I couldn't even, they'renot my type of people.

(01:00:33):
Don't they look like robots?

SPEAKER_05 (01:00:35):
They look like robots and they right ask
yourself why they look why whythey move like that and and and
and operate that way.
You understand what I'm saying?
Because they're under a control.
I wouldn't be surprised.
I wouldn't be surprised if he ifthey use some type of some type
of um drug like to further keepthem in a you know some type of

(01:00:58):
you know psychological pill orsome shit, you know, trolazine
or something.

SPEAKER_03 (01:01:03):
It's in the middle.
Just look at the environment.
You're in New York City, and thebuildings will basically be
empty.
You would think that if it wasreally something legitimate,
it'd be an overabundance ofpeople, a bumper crop of people
that go through New York City,the place should be completely
packed, right?

SPEAKER_04 (01:01:21):
Right.
They opened up a spot right nextto National Black Theater when
the National Black Theater wasthere.

SPEAKER_03 (01:01:26):
They did right in Harlem.
They did.

SPEAKER_04 (01:01:28):
Yeah, but I don't know if they still if they still
there though.

SPEAKER_03 (01:01:31):
They moved to a building that was further down
the street.
But I remember when they openedthat right next to the National
Black Theater, exactly.
But then they moved further downthe street, still in Harlem, but
now they have a freestandingbuilding um down the down the
street.

SPEAKER_04 (01:01:45):
Oh oh oh wow.
So they opened up a biggerplace.
They did, uh-huh.

SPEAKER_03 (01:01:49):
Right on 125 going down.

SPEAKER_04 (01:01:52):
Yeah, that's total disrespect.
Interesting, interesting.
So how hard is it emotionally,financially, and mentally to
walk away?
I mean, I mean, you guysexplained enough with that.

SPEAKER_03 (01:02:05):
Yeah, and it depends how you leave, right?
If there's some people who whoescape, there's some people who
literally get in trunks of theircar and drive, you know, and
escape.
There's other people who walkaway nice and clear, don't they
don't bother with you?
There's other people who you'rerunning your mouth too much and
you still owe us money.
We coming to get that Debostyle.

SPEAKER_04 (01:02:25):
Straight up.
All right.

Last question (01:02:28):
what support systems exist for
ex-scientology, Scientologistswho feel traumatized or
isolated?
Is any support out there forthem?

SPEAKER_05 (01:02:39):
Ishno knows if they're if they exist, I know
Ishmael knows.

SPEAKER_03 (01:02:43):
Yeah, there's there's certain groups and
organizations that just dealwith Scientologists who are
coming out because there's gonnabe a transition.
There's a brainwashing that youhave to be reconditioned from.
Right.
There might be some money thatyou may need to land back on
your feet.
Maybe you have to get anapartment for a month or two to
get back on your feet, get backre-acclimated to society.

(01:03:04):
So they have organizations youcan, you know, you can um reach
out to organizations like umestablished by Leah Remini,
that's established by um AaronSmith Levin.
Um, there's people who put thosethose in place.
Now, also you get access toliterature.

(01:03:25):
Sheikh Denham L is being veryhumble, but if you look at his
book, The Red Pill Diaries, it'sgiving you the ability to
identify cults and identifyingthe programming and
deprogramming what's going on inyour head, the things that are
affecting you.
So he was he took his skill andput it in motion so that he can

(01:03:48):
help people, and we shouldalways remember that.

SPEAKER_05 (01:03:52):
So the red pill that's a book not too many
people read, too.

SPEAKER_04 (01:03:55):
The red pill diary, yeah.
Okay, that's this is all onAmazon.
Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:03):
Just put my name in it.
When you type in the Red PillDiary, just put my name under it
because I think there's someother Red Pill diaries as well.

SPEAKER_04 (01:04:10):
Yeah, brother, you too humble, man.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:11):
You gotta plug your plug your stuff, man.
I just I'm from that era, man.
I don't know this social mediastuff well.
I just come and talk, and youknow, advertising, marketing, I
don't I don't know nothing aboutthat.

SPEAKER_03 (01:04:23):
See, that's on me.
I don't mind big upping mybrother.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:27):
He's a good teacher.
He's a good teacher.
I appreciate it, man.
Yeah, I appreciate you, guys.
Indeed.
You know, we've always we'vealways done that to each other.

SPEAKER_04 (01:04:34):
Okay, the handbook of Moore's Degrees and
Mysteries.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:38):
That's another one.
Yeah, that's another one.

SPEAKER_04 (01:04:40):
Okay, you're on there.

SPEAKER_05 (01:04:44):
Just a couple of them.
That's one, that's one, but thatain't the one he's talking
about, but that's one.
The one he's talking about iscalled the Red Pill Diary, and
then there's Jesus was a Moslem,and then there's a couple other
ones.

unknown (01:04:58):
All right.

SPEAKER_04 (01:04:59):
So before we the before we go, do you brothers
want to uh leave some last wordsand also uh plug whatever you
got going on as far as books andprograms, etc.
Social media is everything.

SPEAKER_05 (01:05:15):
Well, I say I'm honored, man.
Thank you for allowing me to behere with you again, brother.
It's good to see you.
Good to see you.
Always a pleasure to be on yourpodcast, man.
Um I don't have much to plug.
Um, I just like he's I mean, heI wrote some books.
Uh you can find me on Facebook.
You can find me as L Sheik onFacebook, Sheik L.
You can find me on Instagram asLH 007.

(01:05:38):
You can find me on lulu.com asBilly Dinamel, author Billy
Dinamel.
Also, one of my my firstoriginal book was written under
the pseudonym of Professor ISouth.
It was written in South Africain 2009.
It's called Messages from theDiaspora.
So, you know, but every otherbook I've written is written
under the name of Denimel.
So if you can look up the booksand, you know, please feel free

(01:06:00):
to read them and get them.
Thank you, brother.
And brother Ish is always, youknow, that's my brother, it's
always a pleasure to see thebrother, man.
You know, I love that brother,man.
We came up, we still coming out,we still together.
And it's been damn near, what,over almost 40 years now, right?
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Yeah, about 40 years.
And we still here, man.

(01:06:21):
And we still doing what we do.
This is what we've all this isall we've ever done.
This is what we know.
Even from chunk from children,we was all we were always
engulfed around somethingcultural.
It was just a part of our it wasa part of our the way we was
raised.
We just happened to be raisedaround a lot of consciousness,
man.

SPEAKER_04 (01:06:40):
I would say, I would say, I would say lucky if we
want to use that word for sure.
Because uh, brother Ish, man,you got some history with Dr.
Khalid and all that.
I want to get into that one ofthese days and really build some
history, man.
Yeah, he got, yeah.
So I want to really build onthat, and I like that hoodie.
That's polo.

SPEAKER_03 (01:06:59):
Oh, yeah, yeah.
You see the little camouflagepolos all over it.
That's fire.
That's fire.

SPEAKER_04 (01:07:04):
That's that's why that's New York go way back.
Yeah, so Ish, do you want toplug books or anything you got
going on?

SPEAKER_03 (01:07:16):
Programs, yeah, absolutely.
Um, please feel free to join umScientology Invasion of the
Black Community on Facebook.
There's thousands of membersthat are on there.
Um, I want to shout out umbrother Kevin Ali and uh the
Nation of Islam factions thatare holding the line, doing a

(01:07:36):
wonderful job, full support.
Um, Minister Eric.
Um, just always good to see thebrothers and the sisters, you
know, doing their thing.
Um, I also haveFirstTribeNation.com.
There's a lot of current eventsand things from an indigenous
perspective.
Um, please feel free to againjoin the forum.

(01:07:57):
And I want to thank you again,Brother Ron.
You always avail yourself to theplatform to allow us to have a
voice in different varioustopics.
You never are everdisrespectful.
Even the brothers and thesisters that come in from all
the factions of the nation ofIslam, always professional and
fair.
So thank you for being able todeal with a lot of different

(01:08:20):
topics.
There's nothing wrong for all ofus being able to come to quote
unquote the watering hole sothat we can all get knowledge
and information.
That's right.
It's not biased, it's notmalicious, it's all about the
information.
I'm an indication of yourbeautiful mind and your
character as a man, and I saluteyou for that.

(01:08:41):
But no, thank you for having uson here, and we certainly do,
you know, um, you know, we honorthat.

SPEAKER_04 (01:08:46):
Thank you, sir.
On that note, thank you,brothers, for coming out this
evening.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you.
The for the viewers and thepeople who are sticking with
this uh platform, I reallyappreciate you.
This is not easy to do, justjust to let you know, but I'm
here, I'm I'm I'm working, I'mworking, y'all.
And uh indeed, and I'm not I'mnot begging, but I have to beg.

(01:09:12):
I don't like to beg, but I gotthis is the this is the nature
of the business, right?
So don't forget to like,comment, share, subscribe, all
that good stuff.
I'm gonna throw the commercialup and we are out of here.

SPEAKER_00 (01:09:31):
This is more than a podcast, it's a content platform
rooted in truth and culture fromthe 5% nation, the nation of
Islam, our forest movement, andbased in group.
Our mission is to reclaim ournarrative and uplift the African
diaspora with real stories andreal conversations.

(01:09:51):
Support us through SuperChatduring live shows, donations on
FlashCat, GoFundMe, Patreon, orBug Sprout.
And by reference our officialmerch, available on our website
and right here on YouTube'smerch show.
Every dollar, every super chat,every hoodie builds the

(01:10:11):
movement.
This is NYP Talk Show.

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