February 12, 2025 • 42 mins
Can you imagine navigating the fast-paced world of transportation marketing with insights from someone who grew up in a customs brokerage environment? Join us as Scott Case, founder and chief storyteller at Position : Global, unpacks his journey and offers a wealth of knowledge on helping small to medium-sized companies compete against industry giants. We promise you'll gain valuable insights into creating competitive marketing strategies that are both tailored and impactful.
Check out the Transportation Sales and Marketing Association (TMSA) website or engage with us on LinkedIn.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Hello everybody, welcome to On the Move, a show
where we share transportation,sales and marketing success
stories.
I am Jennifer Karpis-Romain,the Executive Director at the
Transportation Marketing andSales Association, which is a
trade nonprofit educating andconnecting marketing and sales
professionals insidetransportation and logistics.
And today on the show I haveScott Case, who is the founder
(00:42):
and chief story officer atPosition Global and really
excited to have you here today,and we're going to talk about a
lot of things that are going onin the world and affecting the
market, and so normally I don'tdo disclaimers when we are on
the move, but I feel like,because we're diving into that,
I do want to give a little bitof one today, and the reason why
(01:04):
is because to me, it doesn'tmatter where you fall
politically.
It is really important tofollow what is going on in the
world, and especially at thefast pace it is moving right now
, and understand how things canaffect our businesses and the
supply chain overall, and todaywe're going to discuss some of
those things to be on thelookout for.
I will say this episode willdebut on Wednesday, february
(01:25):
12th, but we are recording onFriday February 7th, so you know
things might happen in the nextfour days as well.
But it's important, especiallyfor sales and marketers, to
follow these trends, know how tofollow them and also be able to
relay information to yourpartners and your customers, to
showcase your ability to stayahead of the trends and be able
(01:45):
to actually relay what is goingon and how it could affect your
teams and your customers.
So, with that, welcome to theshow, scott, excited to have you
here.
How are you today?
Speaker 2 (01:57):
I am doing very well, jennifer, thank you.
Thank you so much for having mefor this episode.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
It's going to be an interesting one for sure, and
you do have such a vastexperience in the supply chain.
So can you shed some light onyour background and why you are
so passionate about?
You know, position global doesposition yourself globally to
pay attention to all of thesethings and to help your clients
there.
So can you give us somebackground on yourself?
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Absolutely so.
I mean literally.
I was born into the business.
Before I was born, my fatherworked for a messenger service
here in the Chicago area andthen also worked for a major
Japanese freight forwarder.
He traveled all around theworld.
They kept trying to get him torelocate to a number of those
cities and then it ultimatelyculminated with them offering
him a position in Tokyo.
(02:39):
I was young, my sister was justborn and they didn't want to
make the move.
So he actually started acustoms brokerage and freight
forwarding company here inChicago.
As a kid I would go with himbecause he did work for one of
the major Japanese automanufacturers who brought EPA
test cars in that would fly intoChicago and then be driven to a
lab in Ann Arbor, michigan, forEPA testing.
(03:01):
So I remember being sent to theairport with him to do overtime
clearances on Saturday nightwhen Flying Tigers would bring
these things in.
So I would go with them.
I'm eight or nine years old atthe time.
I would get a cup of hotchocolate in one of those little
poker cups that has the wholecup on the bottom.
I'd watch them doing theweights and balances for the
aircraft on really big desktablets of paper.
(03:21):
So, in other words, whatpallets go where to make sure
the aircraft is properlybalanced, fuel loads?
And then they'd say hey, kid,do you wanna go out to the
flight line?
So, as a young kid, getting togo out and sniff Jet A and stand
inside of a 747 all by yourselfwas a pretty cool thing
actually.
Fast forward to college.
I nearly went into customs law.
That unfortunately didn'tmaterialize, but after
(03:43):
graduating, I went into customslaw.
That unfortunately didn'tmaterialize, but after
graduating I went into thefamily business.
I became a licensed customsbroker, served for a number of
years on the National CustomBrokers and Forwarders
Association's board of directors, was their air freight chair
for about seven years and then,in the early 2010s, decided to
start Position Global.
And the thing that drove thatfor me was that, while I had
done everything operationallyimport, export, break, bulk,
(04:06):
domestic I looked around atcompanies the small to
medium-sized companies and Isaid you know what?
They have to be able to competeagainst larger, either national
or multinational companies thathave these marketing
departments.
I was fortunate to be able towrite.
I'm fortunate to have a senseof design.
Professional social media, asit was, was just very nascent
back then.
(04:26):
So I started the businessactually as a white label
content shop with an eye tobeing able to help these
companies not just talk toshippers about the important
things that were going on.
But a lot of these companiesalso relied on an agent partner
in another city in the UnitedStates or in another country
around the world.
And if they were in anindependent forwarder network,
as a lot of probably youraudiences, they understand
(04:47):
having to compete for theattention of those other global
partners.
So how could I help them standout from other people doing
business in their market, and alot of that's about marketing.
So it really was understandingthe differences between
marketing wholesale to agentpartners and vendors and
marketing retail to the shippersand the cargo owners, how the
issues were essentially the same, but what you needed to say to
(05:11):
those different companies wasjust slightly varied, and we've
been fortunate enough in our12th, almost 13th year now to be
able to become a full serviceagency that does everything that
you would ask of an agency forforwarders as well as, in some
cases, for shippers too.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
That is quite the journey and the story as a mom
to an almost eight-year-old.
He would love everything aboutyour early, including the hot
chocolate.
He would do most anything andloves all things transportation.
He will actually be coming toTMSA Elevate again this year.
He missed last year in NewOrleans, but he's been to the
past couple ones and he justloves all of that, so he would
(05:51):
think that was really cool.
So I'm going to remember totell him that later.
But just hearing how youdeveloped and how you came into
taking on Position Global andreally being there for your
clients and helping them developthat content is really awesome
here, and part of what you guysdo is really follow those trends
, making what's going ondigestible so that they are able
(06:12):
to let their customers know.
So, as a starting point to this, I really was curious if you
had some tips for being able tofollow the news, especially
moments like this where there isa lot of movement and noise
happening.
Like how do you actuallydecipher what is going on?
Speaker 2 (06:30):
That's a great challenge because the news has
become so splintered and sofractured that it's very
difficult to kind of keep trackof everything as it pertains to
supply chain, whether you'redoing this domestically or
you're doing thisinternationally.
You have to realize thatthere's a couple of different
facets or a couple of differentareas in which this news falls
into buckets.
You're going to have theregulatory change bucket what
(06:53):
are the agencies doing herewithin the US?
What are other customs agenciesdoing around the world?
There's going to be sort of thetrade and the economic market
condition buckets what'shappening, employment,
manufacturing, manufacturing andthen there's also just going to
be the market conditions bucket.
What are carriers doing air,ocean, rail, truck, what are
they doing?
Are there blank sailings?
(07:13):
Are there a lot of ship orders?
What's happening with with thetrade imbalances, surpluses and
and deficits?
And knowing where to go to lookfor all that and to just be able
to do a signal to noise, tofigure out what it is, starts
with really understanding whatyour audience needs to know.
You have to realize that yourcustomers, their job, is to do
(07:34):
everything that they have to do.
So if you're a logisticsmanager, you're buying, you're
planning, you're inventorymanaging.
You're not necessarily going toget to the nitty gritty of the
things that are going to matterto us, the things that, for a
logistics company, are going toimpact how they do their
business.
What do they need to talk to?
Do they need to be justadvising or making changes to
their operations?
So if you can gather a reallygood list and a really good
(07:58):
source, a list of sources to beable to follow that information
from, it's going to make a hugedifference.
What does that source listinclude For our organization?
We watch and read everythingglobally because we have to, but
there's a lot.
There's a number of keypublications.
We read the Journal of Commerce, freight Waves, ajot, splash
24-7, g-captain, and we havesubscriptions to these too.
(08:21):
We also subscribe to Reuters,bloomberg, the Wall Street
Journal, places that really havereporting and sourcing to be
able to go to and look at.
For this, the thing that I willsay is that, while a lot of
this you may be able to use andconsume internally, realize that
things that you may wanna sharewith your customer base.
You may have a subscription tosomething, but they will not.
(08:42):
So when you're thinking aboutwhat to source from, what to
talk about for people or what totalk about with people and what
to share.
Think about whether or not thatinformation is paywalled, and
also be attuned to the fact thatyou cannot just regurgitate it
without running into a copyrightrisk those are really really
good points.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Um, that, like, because a lot of people are like
, okay, you're this, but now Iwant to go to the source, and if
they can't actually see thesource, then they can feel like
that's incomplete information,and so I love that point for
sure.
And yes, you don't want to justregurgitate, you're trying to
educate, and I spent the firstpart of my career as a
(09:21):
journalist, so, like I gettinginformation, I always wrote in
industry too, and that's kind ofwhere I ended up here and ended
up.
It's a very like weedy coursegetting here to TMSA, but I do
think it is important becauseyou want to make sure that
you're presenting facts andeducation and the information at
(09:41):
hand and making them be able tothen read more or access
information that they're lookingfor too.
So I think those are reallyreally great points and you're
never going to be able to thenread more or access information
that they're looking for too.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
So I think those are really really great points, and
you're never going to be able tomove at the speed of somebody
that has a desk, that has aneditorial team, that has a
broadcast outlet chain.
But what you do want to do isyou want to realize that there's
a difference between news andeditorial so the news is what
that outlet that you're going tobe finding that information
from is going to provide you.
it's going to give you theundergirdings, the underpinnings
.
And don't forget as well, Ineglected to mention direct
(10:10):
sources, including governmentsthemselves.
So, whether it be a White Houseexecutive order or, in this
case, willie, we're recommendingpeople watch for it to be
published in the FederalRegister, first Foreign
governments posting things totheir own websites.
You want to make sure thatyou've got a place to be able to
go back to and point to.
But, circling back, there'snews and then there's editorial.
So the news is the actual story.
(10:30):
The editorial is you as amarketer, looking at it for your
company's audience and sayinghow is this relevant to them,
what do they need to do, what dowe need to do for them and how
is this going to impact themdirectly?
So a simple regurgitation of itis not going to win the day.
Being able to apply analysis toit and make recommendations,
that's going to increase thatglue that, along with a good
(10:54):
operations team, keeps thecustomer a customer or gives you
the opportunity to bring one infrom one of your competitors.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
I think that's so important and I think, too,
thinking through that piece andgiving quality information is so
important.
One of my editors back in myjournalism days he said to me it
can take you years or decadesto build your reputation and one
mistake can ruin it.
And so, because I always wantedto move fast, I was like we got
(11:22):
to get the story out and he'slike we need to make sure it's
correct and that we have all theinformation.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Which is why there's entire legal departments
dedicated to keeping them out ofdefamation trouble.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
And so.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
But I do think about that a lot because, yeah, like
you want to be like, ok, this ishow this is applicable to you,
but you want to make sure thatyou're not moving too fast,
you're, you know, having thesource information, you're able
to really tell that completestory and still be able to
educate, do what you need to doso I mean just just this week
alone, as we record two, I meanthere's there's the tariff story
(11:55):
, which I know we'll talk abouta little bit later, which is
which has certainly been key,but just really in the span of
12 hours, conditions changedbetween news breaking that the
us postal service was going tostop taking packages through the
mail from, from china and hongkong which are subject to de
minimis, and less than 12 hourslater the post office is back
from that.
So marketers as well as justindustry people, the consultants
(12:17):
and finding themselves in aposition that the moment
something happens, everyone'srunning to yell at it out a
megaphone and then just a blinkof an eye later it could be
rescinded.
So we are in sort of a veryrapid response type of thing,
but it's only because, at leastfor the moment, things are very
quickly changing To your point.
You've got to be able to stop,step back and say is this going
(12:37):
to stick and why?
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And even just giving that information.
Okay, like this is the orderthat came out, and then let's
follow this.
And that's kind of where me andmy editor had met in the past
where I'd be like, okay, well,can I say this is a breaking
news item.
Stay tuned for more information.
So, I still wanted to make surethat, because part of it is like
I wanted.
As a journalist, I wantedpeople to know like this is
(13:01):
something that we were followingand paying attention to.
But even as a marketer, as acompany, you know you want to
show that you are payingattention to trends, this is
something that you're able tohelp your customers or your
prospects with, and so you alsodon't have to put all of the
information out.
If you don't have it, you canput hey, this is what's going on
.
This is a developing situation.
(13:21):
We don't know for sure howit'll play out, but this is,
this is the building blocks thatwe're building for you and this
is what we're paying attentionto.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
And if you've built a good network not just sort of
like of source material if youknow some of the journalists
that apply their trade in thisspace.
There are a lot of very amazingcareer journalists who are in
the logistics space that coverthese things across modalities.
But also, don't discount theinformation that you're getting
from your partners.
So you may be a freight broker,you may be a freight broker,
(13:49):
you may be a freight forwarderand you may not own assets.
Well, you know what?
If you need to know what'shappening in the trucking space,
your trucking partner who'sregulated by FMCSA, by DOT, is
really living those regulations.
It could be a great source foryou.
The same way, if somethingchanges overseas, if you hear
about oh my gosh, this port isconstrained, there is a closure
here, there's not cargo movingthrough, it's monsoon season,
(14:10):
containers or airframe aren'tgetting through.
You know what.
Reach out to your partner inthat country, in that market,
and go hey, this is what I'mreading.
Are you seeing and experiencingthis?
And now you've actually gotsort of your own firsthand
network of sources that arereputable, that are firsthand,
that you can use in thecommunication that you're making
to your audience.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
And, with all that, I love that piece.
Like you know, you do have anetwork.
There are people that you workwith.
Lean into that to get thatinformation.
What are some other kind ofbest practices companies can
have to transparentlycommunicate with customers and
prospects about these trends,challenges, opportunities,
things that are happening withcustomers and prospects?
Speaker 2 (14:49):
about these trends, challenges, opportunities,
things that are happening.
I think the most importantthing that you want to be able
to do is you want to be able tohave a source to back it up.
Conjecture is one of thoseplaces that get you in a lot of
trouble.
We've certainly discovered justover the past week and then
even precedingly, that there'sthings that could just sort of
like be said and then there'sthings where there's actually
action taken.
So you want to wait for thingsto be published in the Federal
(15:11):
Register from from atransparency point of view.
Like you said, with thedisclaimer at the top of this,
this is not meant to bepolitical.
Things are moving very quicklyand decisions are being made
that will impact people'sbusiness.
I mean just to.
I feel like it's going to besort of the trigger to call back
to you.
(15:38):
But, like this week, we reallythought that that 25 percent
duty was coming from Canada andMexico to very close, very
reliable allies and tradepartners in the United States
and have been slightlyaccelerated with the Monday
announcement is the fact thatimporters who are used to having
to have a certain amount ofworking capital now needed to
say, oh my gosh, I have an extraseven and a half, 12, and it
had it gone through on Monday,an extra 25% in cost.
(16:01):
You've built a business modelwhere you assume that you're
going to need capital for thecost of the goods, the cost of
your transportation and theother things you didn't plan to
all of a sudden have to find anadditional.
If you ordered $10,000 worth oftomatoes, you didn't ask
yourself where am I going tocome up with another $2,500 in
duty on those tomatoes that arecoming in?
And how am I going to go to mycustomer and say, hey, guess
(16:23):
what?
I'm going to have to increasemy price to you by X, even
though we may have a contract,we may have an agreement.
And then on top of that, from acustoms point of view, there's
what's called bond sufficiencyand your custom broker clients,
or your custom broker audience,will know this where they had to
go to importers who had to getlarger bonds essentially larger
insurance policies for theirduty exposure with customs, and
(16:44):
the higher that those bondamounts got, the surety
companies were requestingcollateral or financial
instruments.
So now you have an additionaldemand for the goods that you
have to bring in.
You have an additional capitalthat you would have to set aside
to be able to make sure thatyou covered all this, and these
are all things that, when youwoke up, on whatever day it was,
you weren't planning to have todeal with.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
With that we talked about the tariffs.
That's a huge question mark ofhow it will play out.
But beyond that, what are someof the other important movements
that are happening right nowthat you think will affect the
supply chain in the short termand then potentially the long
term?
Speaker 2 (17:26):
I think the things that we're going to have to
watch.
Certainly the tariffs are there, not just from a cost point of
view, but what that's probablygoing to mean for trading
patterns.
So we have establishedbilateral and multilateral
agreements with a number ofcountries.
The question becomes if itbecomes too expensive to come
into the US and consumers don'twant to buy it, are there
opportunities for shippers tosay, redirect those goods to a
(17:48):
third country?
Hey, maybe you didn't thinkabout selling into Latin America
, but now's an opportunity tothink about and to avail
yourself of that.
You're going to want to watchas well to see whether or not
there are any changes to theregulatory regimes in which you
operate, either at a state or afederal level.
For instance, in California,the California Air Resources
(18:09):
Board withdrew the waiver thatthey had before the EPA that was
mandating a certain percentageof cleaner, non-emissions
generating trucks.
So is that going to change thecalculus for people who want to
do that?
There's been talk at the federallevel about DEI initiatives,
which is certainly somethingthat is very important to the
TMSA.
What is that going to mean foryour company from an employment
(18:30):
law?
Moving outside of that and I'msure that could be a topic that
comes up this summer at theconference as well, but just
really sort of being aware ofwhat's going to impact you from
customs with regulations.
It could be with TSA, it couldbe FMCSA, hours of service
changes.
We could see investments thathave been made or promised
(18:51):
through the infrastructure actthat was passed under the Biden
administration.
There's a lot of plans out thereat city and state levels to do
bridge projects, to do highwayprojects, things that could
really reduce the wear and tearon vehicles that are going
through it or open up new lanesof transportation.
If those dollars go away, dothose projects go away?
(19:11):
And does now all of a suddenthat means sort of changes for
fleet refreshes because of,again, wear and tear on vehicles
.
It's a really sort ofmultifaceted thing that we're
all just really in the earlydays of trying to ascertain
what's going to happen.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Absolutely Tons.
There's tons to unpack there.
I don't even know where tostart sometimes, but I think
that that's part of thechallenge of it is especially
right now.
There's just a lot going on,and I like that you brought up
the local and state level too,because there's a lot going on
at the federal level, butthere's still trends to be
(19:47):
paying attention to.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
It's grant money.
I mean that's the thing too.
I mean the federal governmentprovides grant money.
I mean here at O'Hare we're inChicago.
I mean they've been trying torebuild the passenger side of
the house for decades now andthey're finally on the road for
it.
What happens to dollars thatmay have been allocated by the
FAA or the federal governmentfor that, if there are costs
that go up there already were.
(20:09):
I mean the project was alreadybeing talked about pre-COVID and
now that we're actually gettingto the break ground and start
to source things, if we'relooking at steel and aluminum
tariffs going up, if we'relooking for additional costs
going up now, what kind of costoverruns Do you have to scale
the project back?
I mean there are real worldconsiderations that come around
the decisions that are beingmade to people that will impact
(20:29):
them every day.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Yeah, there's a lot to kind of put together.
Do you have, like, differentpeople on your team that follow
specific trends?
How do you kind of maximizeyour team to be able to handle
everything that's going on andthen be able to, like, educate?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
It's a great question .
We've got people in sort of indifferent positions, on
different beats, if you will,because we have to obviously
straddle both watching marketingtrends because we're talking
about marketing to our customersand being aware of it and
making recommendations to thembut also having to watch what's
happening in the world.
The joke I use with people isthat we're logistics adjacent,
(21:10):
all of the necessary awarenessand knowledge.
None of the exposure to myshipment is late, my shipment is
detained, customs impounded myshipment.
So we've sort of settled intobeats, if you will, internally.
So I have somebody who's got asignificant amount of B2B
marketing experience, so he'llwatch the things that are
brand-related, marketingtrends-related.
I have somebody else who's got asignificant amount of B2B
marketing experience, so he'llwatch the things that are brand
related, marketing trendsrelated.
I have somebody else who's ananalytics specialist who will
(21:32):
watch and see what's happeningwith Google analytics, seo,
how's AI going to impact that?
I watch logistics I have tosort of watch it all as the head
of the company but I will trendtowards logistics and trying to
get more into the marketingstuff.
Having been a logisticsoperator and a newfound marketer
, it's kind of fun to sort offigure all that out, and then my
(21:55):
managing editor just watchesand keeps an eye on everything.
So we're having to bemultifaceted, and it's not just
by mode, it's by country, it'sby topic, it's by regulation.
So, yeah, we sort of havedifferent specialties and beats
and, with me still being alicensed customs broker, I'll
personally stick my nose into alot of the important regulatory
related things, because I've gota place to speak from about
(22:18):
that.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Great, that's a really good breakdown of how to
kind of handle the differentthings going on.
I'm curious what is some of thefeedback that you've seen from
prospects, from customers, whensupply chain companies then are
putting out content, informationon these trends, what do people
resonate with?
What do they not want from apartner or from somebody?
(22:40):
How do you kind of create thecontent that they're looking for
?
Speaker 2 (22:44):
I think the challenge in B2B communications now is
that we're all so inundated witheverything from every place.
The example that I like to useis you start to get around the
holiday season If you've signedup for anybody's email lists or,
obviously, you've got cookiesplanted on any of the devices
that you use.
How many times do you see orhear from people I will never
(23:04):
forget and I love it as a brand.
But God, why am I suddenlyWorld Market?
I don't know why I blanked onthat, but it's like for a while
it was like I wouldn't just getemail correspondence every day
from World Market, It'd be liketwice a day.
So they tell me about thepfefferness in the morning and
all of a sudden there's a flashsale on ornaments and I'm like I
don't need to hear from youtwice a day.
I know what you have, I knowChristmas is coming, I know what
(23:25):
to get, what I need.
Please stop.
This is not inciting me to comein, Because, again, I think
that what happens is you sort ofbecome ear blind or audience
blind or nose blind to things.
I think that you have to sort ofjudiciously figure out the best
way to do this, and we asmarketers, we talk about
segmentation.
I mean the engagement comeswith the things that are most
relevant to people.
(23:45):
And if you know who youraudience is and either within
your customer or within yourprospects, and you take a look
at the news and you sift it intothe appropriate buckets and
you're making sure that you'rehitting people with the general
stuff that they have to knowabout, sort of where it's at
right now, but then also hittingthem frequently enough with
things that are relevant andpersonal and resonates to them
(24:06):
in their department and whatthey're doing that are relevant
and personal and resonates tothem in their department and
what they're doing, then I thinkit sort of keeps that
engagement thing there.
I mean, we we always were weall do the same for a living.
We've all heard it.
You're on on the other end ofthe phone or the end of the
other end of the email.
My other broker said this, myother forwarder said that and
it's like you just you just makethat sort of exasperated noise
so like, could I have saidsomething faster?
(24:27):
It's no-transcript, but I thinkthat some folks are okay if you
just cut, copy paste andregurgitate.
But, like I said earlier in ourinterview, there's the news and
there's the editorial.
Somebody else may be on thatlawyer's list, somebody else may
be on that media outlet's list.
What does it mean to them?
Don't just give them theawareness, give them an action
(24:47):
item that they need to be awareof it, that they might need to
prepare for, and I think that'swhere the value add comes in in
what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
And what type of ways are they consuming that content
?
So, is it in like a email sendor a phone call or a podcast?
Listen.
How are people absorbinginformation the best way right
now?
Speaker 2 (25:08):
It's really across the spectrum.
I mean, if you think about yourcable or your streaming system
having 200 channels, there issomething for people who like to
watch, I don't know, like nakedlumberjackery.
It's like, hey, there's likeseven people, so we have to have
the naked lumberjack channel.
God, we may need to cut this,but it has become so segmented
(25:29):
that you have to really be in alot of different places.
I mean, if you were to go backand look at somebody's LinkedIn
or social media feed and youjust looked at that company's
and you go back like three, fouror five weeks and you see the
same story appear like four orfive or six times, you may feel
like it's overkill doing that,but you have to realize that the
audiences come and go so fast.
(25:49):
I mean the the.
The line that I like to use isit's not unlike fishing.
So you're off in a cab and yousay I'm going to go fishing.
You grab the beverage of yourchoice, you wander down to the
river or the lake, you throwsomething in, you fish for 15 or
20 minutes, you look and you go.
My drink is empty.
If you're fishing, you broughta cooler.
If you're like me, you forgetabout that and you just go up to
get another one.
But by the time you come backdown to that river, there's been
(26:11):
tens or hundreds of thousandsof gallons of water that have
moved through and you might geta new cluster full of fish.
The same thing happens right now.
People are pulled in so manydifferent directions to try and
ingest and see and what they'reexposed to that you almost you
don't almost.
You have to be in differentplaces multiple times with the
same message.
But don't worry about itlooking like you're repeating
(26:34):
the message.
Just realize that that audienceis going to be there when
they're there, not always,necessarily when you want them
to be there.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I think that's really good advice and I would also
add to that and remember kind ofbest practices of the different
platforms that you're on.
So even like so this is aweekly podcast.
You were like how long do yourun?
I don't really go over 35.
I think the longest interviewwe've ever done is 40 minutes,
because I don't think thatpeople are going to sit here,
even though they can come backto it.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
You want to leave it long enough to be just a workout
or a commute, anything longerthan that.
When they get to theirdestination or they get home,
they're not going to pick itback up.
So to your point if we couldfit it into a workout or a
commute, then people get it,they digest it, boom, they're
done.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
And so I think that understanding the best ways to
engage in the different avenuesthat you're supporting is really
important too.
You can have the same messagein the different platforms in
the different ways, but go tothe best practices of what those
are.
So like in social media is awhole different beast and each
different platform is a littlebit different.
(27:41):
But, like knowing how to playthat game can help too, because
you want to reach people wherethey are and when they're there,
but in the best format for that.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
And the challenge in this particular environment
because things are moving sofast is you and I both know that
people love to have automationsas part of the marketing or the
sales process.
It's really great to haveautomations and those
automations are great for themessaging that you're doing
internally.
We've seen a lot of clients whohave had a good evergreen
strategy and a good breakingnews strategy have to tilt it
(28:11):
one way or the other.
Really, strategy and a goodbreaking news strategy have to
tilt it one way or the other,really just based on where
things are at.
So you may have a content or adrip strategy plan for somebody
and the plan it may take yousomeplace else.
So you're going to have to beflexible enough to interrupt
that drip plan, to interruptthat campaign plan that you have
for somebody, and be able tointerject that thing and add
that value and then pick it backup again as well.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
That's great advice and a really good point and one
thing I would suggest to you.
So when I have like an automatedcampaign, I have space in that
where it'll be like email thisperson or LinkedIn message them.
And it's an internal note to meto then make sure that it's not
I'm not just leaving it to theautomated emails to reach the
person.
(28:52):
I, I am actually reaching outand you can build that in,
because then in those emailsyou're reminding yourself okay,
have like a real human touchpoint with this person.
And then you can be like whatis going on today and how can I
address them and talk to them?
Or like making sure that you'reconnecting in a different space
.
Or if you're going like nextweek, I'm prepping to get to
manifest and so are you going tobe seeing those people there
and how can you engage?
(29:13):
And so I think it's importantto even if you're busy and you
rely on your automations and allof that to build in your
process you, of course, need topivot, need to be able to pivot,
but you can also build some ofthat stuff stuff in to nudge you
to do it nudge you to do it.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
The other thing, too, that I think that everybody I
mean, if you've ever hadsomething go out after something
happens and you go oh, I wish Ididn't send that because of
what's happening A real goodthing to remember and underscore
is if you're giving the keys toa more junior person, a senior
person has to be able to get tothat in case of emergency break
glass to just stop things.
Just cold turkey.
Sometimes things happen in theworld that you may have that
(29:56):
campaign schedule to go and it'sjust not going to ring right
based on what's happened eithernearby or in the world, and just
be ready to say to yourself youknow what, we have to stop this
thing.
I don't want to have to.
I don't want, I don't wantsomebody to come to my door and
go how come this didn't go out?
You have to be able to and Isay this all the time read the
room.
You have to be able to read theroom and know when you should
(30:18):
probably just pause it and letthe world reset and then pick it
back up again.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
And I would even say that like that's when people are
like, oh, we have an intern,they're going to be managing our
social media.
But I'm like, are you sure?
Like, are you sure that's thebest practice?
Like they can be the personwho's actively posting and stuff
, but like one, if you have anintern, you're supposed to be
teaching them things.
You're not supposed to beletting them out into the wild.
They are interning to learn andto grow.
(30:44):
Professional development isimportant.
Two, they are the social mediais part of your voice, like part
of your brand, and so if you'rejust letting somebody who
doesn't really know your brandor know that much about what's
going on be the voice of that,you're missing a lot, and then
you'll run into a lot more ofthose situations where you're
like, oh, I even have that.
So at TMSA we have a lot ofvolunteers that help with our
(31:06):
marketing and I go in and Icheck and I say, like the big
role is somebody else has tolook at it.
Everyone's like a professionalmarketer here, and I still say
that there has to be a secondpair of eyes in every single
thing that we put out, andthere's some things that I'm
like and they have to.
That has to be my eyes beforeit goes, and just knowing you
know the balance of that isreally important and because you
(31:28):
have to know what's going onand what's getting sent out.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
There is also I mean, having worked in journalism
there are editors to makeeditorial judgment calls.
Your nightly news has 30minutes Well, I mean 21, by the
time you take all thecommercials on the sports and
weather.
So there's editorial decisionsmade as well for what's going to
go to the A, the B, the C block.
So there's considerationsaround that.
The trick that I think andcircling back to the disclaimer
(31:52):
that you gave at the top of thisthing is, while you may want to
tiptoe and not touch a thirdrail, politically, you also
shouldn't be afraid to callsomething out when it is
patently bad, either for you orfor your industry or for your
customers.
So I mean, if there's somethingthat's going to adversely
impact it I think we see a lotof sort of like the both
sides-ism is a good way tophrase it we want to make sure
(32:14):
to say you know what?
If this is going to causesomebody a lot of heartburn, be
honest with them about it.
Don't necessarily sugarcoat it.
Because I think, then, to whatyou said about being honest or
being disingenuous to somebody.
If something's going to happenthat's going to impact their
bottom line, be straightforwardabout it and also remind people
(32:37):
that they're empowered to dothis.
A lot of times we think aboutactivism at an individual level.
There is an opportunity to beactive as a business level.
If you do business in a city,in a state, in a country and
something's going to impact, yousay something about it, weigh
in on it.
I mean, prior to the changeoveradministrations, the Biden
administration put forth twoproposals on de minimis just to
close the loophole and do somethings.
They publish it for the noticeof comment.
(32:58):
So the whole idea is that,whether you're a person or
you're a business, you can tellthe government what you think
about what they want to do, andthose comments are received and
they're adjudicated.
You may get what you want, youmay not get what you want, but
the point is that you have anopportunity to use your voice to
let somebody know I'm anadvocate for this, I'm not an
advocate for this, and why?
(33:19):
Don't be afraid to do that ortake a stand on it.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Yeah, I think it's a hard balance and it's a tricky
one, but it's important to knowwhen to do that and when not to
do that.
And I think you are speaking asa business One.
I do think it's important forleaders to have training for
their teams on things like this,because there is a difference
between speaking for yourcompany and speaking for
(33:45):
yourself.
Yes, and knowing those rules,and I think a lot of times we
forget and I've seen a lot ofbusiness owners been like, oh, I
don't want my team to be onsocial media at all, but it's
like that's their private lives.
You can't always control that,but if you give training and
engagement on what's appropriateto say, what's not, and so then
they have some training.
Sometimes we just don't trainour teams at all and then we're
(34:07):
shocked at what can happen, andso I think those things are
really important but making surethat, if you are taking a stand
as a company or saying onething or the other, that
everyone at the company knowsand understands and that we're
relaying that, because it's notalways about just relaying to
your partners or your customers.
Making sure your team isinvolved in that and knows
what's going on as well isincredibly important.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
And I think a lot of times they're the ones who are
the last to know, and then theycan leave a really sour taste in
their mouths I mean if, if youwere somebody who, if you were
somebody who worked in across-border trucking company,
in a cross-border freightforwarder or customs brokerage,
and that tariff goes through at25 and traffic stops crossing
the border, if you're a truckerand you don't have those loads
to carry, that's, that's aproblem for you and your
(34:49):
livelihood.
If you're part of an entrydepartment at a customs broker
that anticipates tens ofthousands of transactions a
month and that is cut by adouble digit number, that's
going to have a real worldimplication on the people that
you're employing, the peoplethat you as a business are
trying to support and lift upand train and bring you to sort
of your next level and identifyfuture potential senior leaders,
(35:09):
and maybe you lose some ofthose people if you have to make
a tough staffing decision.
So these things do have realworld implications, not just
sort of for the consumer levelthings that we hear and see on
social media or on local news orin other outlets but to people
in their businesses as well.
Speaker 1 (35:26):
Absolutely, and so always good to kind of sift
through everything, and that'swhy I always advise to take that
moment, think through it, thinkhow, okay, how can this affect
my business?
Sometimes it is okay, let'swait to see what actually gets
enacted with this piece ofinformation.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
It's your email campaign software going.
Are you really sure you want tosend this off now?
Speaker 1 (35:55):
Yes, yes, and and to do that and I do think I like
that you talked about theautomations and the workflows,
because I do think that, asmarketers and salespeople, like
that's something that we shouldbe checking into right now is,
like what we have.
I even one of my questions foryou was, like, are there any
pitfalls to be aware of asyou're building campaigns and
initiatives?
Like, I definitely think,checking in, making sure, and
(36:17):
even like, what is the company'scapacity right now and are we
selling the things that we cando and are we marketing to match
that?
I think that's something thatwe should be checking in all the
time, but especially right now.
There might be parts of yourbusiness that we want to market
to more versus other things, andjust, is everyone aligned in
that and making sure that thoseteams are coming together to
(36:37):
have those conversations too?
Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1 (36:42):
Awesome.
Well, that takes me to the lastquestion that I ask everybody
on the show.
So get ready.
If you could go back in timeand advise a younger Scott and
this could be personally orprofessionally when would you go
back to and what would you tellhim?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
That's a good question.
I would say get experience.
I have been very fortunate tohave had two jobs in my adult
life one working in the familybusiness and then one having
started my own.
I had great opportunities.
I met with and worked withgreat people.
They're both small to mediumsized businesses, which is
(37:20):
tremendous, and I would say thatfor people that are doing this,
always look for opportunitiesto learn from other people.
I mean there's a weird sort ofpeer.
I think that the term I've usedonce when I was on the
transactional side of things wasfrenemy.
I mean, just don't be afraid totalk to people and ask and
learn, participate I mean thatwas something that I found very
(37:42):
valuable growing upprofessionally through the
National Brokers AssociationFind industry things to
participate in, become part of aproject that delivers something
larger.
So it gives you exposure intodoing that.
And be sure, I've been veryfortunate to build out my
professional network.
I am 53 years old and I washaving the Journal of Commerce
(38:05):
delivered in paper to my collegedorm.
So I probably need anintervention and if I haven't
had one yet, I'm long overdue.
But the thing that I would sayis that at some point your
network is what you're going torely on in this.
I mean the ability to problemsolve, and we see a lot about
technology automation.
Oh, technology is going to doaway with this.
Technology is going to do awaywith that.
(38:25):
At some point.
Qualified people are going toneed to be able to get in,
remediate problem solve andyou're going to need to find
somebody to help you get to thebottom of something and building
out that network.
Attending events like the TMSAthings, attending industry
events, really helps build thatnetwork out to be able to be in
(38:47):
that position so that when ifthis is something that you
decided to make a lifelongcareer and logistics is not
going away, it's just evolvingat varying speeds having that
network of people to rely on isgoing to be invaluable for you.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
I love that.
I do think experience is great.
I have been the opposite, whereI have worked in different
industries and different roles,from journalism to marketing to
all kinds of things, and I feellike I at TMSA.
It has culminated in all of the, all the lessons and everything
(39:22):
I've learned including thispodcast like I miss journalism.
I love interviewing people.
It's one of my favorite things.
So I'm like, yes, please, let'sstart a podcast where we can
shine a light on all of thesmart people we have in tmsa,
but also then I need to just sitand interview people and talk
to people once a week.
So big fan of that it.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
I think it's part of the reason why I've been
fortunate enough to be able tobuild a lot of positive
relationships with reportersthrough the industry.
I actually did a little bit ofnews writing when I was at
northwestern.
I remember having a professorprofessor where basically every
class was.
He would pretend to be a publicinformation officer for the
Chicago Fire Department and theclass was responsible for asking
questions about the fire thathad happened and he wouldn't
(40:01):
volunteer any more than what thequestion was that was asked and
then we had to go back andwrite that story.
Aside from that and just sortof the ethical things around
journalism and protectingsources and getting things right
, I've been very blessed thatwhenever I have that
conversation with somebody who'sin the reporting space, I feel
like I can have a deeper, moremeaningful and more more
impactful conversation and learnfrom them because, while I'm
(40:22):
not in and of their craft, theyknow that, that I respect it and
I and I honor it and it givesus the ability to to really to,
I think, make inroads in placeswhere other people may not.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
Well, I love journalism and respect it as
well, so that's a great way toend our show today.
Thank you so much for coming onand talking about all of the
very heavy things that are goingon right now.
And if you are watching todayand you want to catch us next
week, we will be talking tochris zapowski, and I hope I
(40:55):
pronounce his name right,because I pronounced it wrong.
Almost every time I talk abouthim publicly, but he will be
here.
Um, he's with bennett and weare talking about all things
about his career growth and hisum youtube series playing with
trucks, which is really fun andentertaining if you haven't
watched it.
But you can catch us here nextweek.
And then I do also want toannounce that we have both
(41:17):
Elevate and TMSA ExecutiveSummit registration open.
So if you want to go toExecutive Summit, you can scan
here and then I'm going to popup Elevate down here.
Get us going both places.
So Executive Summit this yearwill be in Chicago.
So Scott has talked aboutChicago on and off this whole
interview.
So if you want to do that,that'll be October 22nd through
(41:38):
the 23rd, and elevate is June8th through 10th in Austin,
texas.
On both of those payment linksyou can actually bundle if you
plan on going to both and youget a deal.
So very exciting, all excitingthings going on at TMSA.
And oh, I didn't even mean topop that up, but, yes, if you
have not applied for any of yourTrailblazer, rising Star or
(41:58):
Purpose awards, please do.
Submissions end at the end ofMarch.
And so, yeah, perfect productplacement, fantastic.
But it was great to talk to youtoday and I appreciate you
coming on the show.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
Absolutely, Jennifer.
Have a great one.
Look forward to seeing you inperson soon.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
Thanks, you too.
Bye.
Hello everybody, welcome to On the Move, a show
where we share transportation,sales and marketing success
stories.
I am Jennifer Karpis-Romain,the Executive Director at the
Transportation Marketing andSales Association, which is a
trade nonprofit educating andconnecting marketing and sales
professionals insidetransportation and logistics.
And today on the show I haveScott Case, who is the founder
(00:42):
and chief story officer atPosition Global and really
excited to have you here today,and we're going to talk about a
lot of things that are going onin the world and affecting the
market, and so normally I don'tdo disclaimers when we are on
the move, but I feel like,because we're diving into that,
I do want to give a little bitof one today, and the reason why
(01:04):
is because to me, it doesn'tmatter where you fall
politically.
It is really important tofollow what is going on in the
world, and especially at thefast pace it is moving right now
, and understand how things canaffect our businesses and the
supply chain overall, and todaywe're going to discuss some of
those things to be on thelookout for.
I will say this episode willdebut on Wednesday, february
(01:25):
12th, but we are recording onFriday February 7th, so you know
things might happen in the nextfour days as well.
But it's important, especiallyfor sales and marketers, to
follow these trends, know how tofollow them and also be able to
relay information to yourpartners and your customers, to
showcase your ability to stayahead of the trends and be able
(01:45):
to actually relay what is goingon and how it could affect your
teams and your customers.
So, with that, welcome to theshow, scott, excited to have you
here.
How are you today?
Speaker 2 (01:57):
I am doing very well, jennifer, thank you.
Thank you so much for having mefor this episode.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
It's going to be an interesting one for sure, and
you do have such a vastexperience in the supply chain.
So can you shed some light onyour background and why you are
so passionate about?
You know, position global doesposition yourself globally to
pay attention to all of thesethings and to help your clients
there.
So can you give us somebackground on yourself?
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Absolutely so.
I mean literally.
I was born into the business.
Before I was born, my fatherworked for a messenger service
here in the Chicago area andthen also worked for a major
Japanese freight forwarder.
He traveled all around theworld.
They kept trying to get him torelocate to a number of those
cities and then it ultimatelyculminated with them offering
him a position in Tokyo.
(02:39):
I was young, my sister was justborn and they didn't want to
make the move.
So he actually started acustoms brokerage and freight
forwarding company here inChicago.
As a kid I would go with himbecause he did work for one of
the major Japanese automanufacturers who brought EPA
test cars in that would fly intoChicago and then be driven to a
lab in Ann Arbor, michigan, forEPA testing.
(03:01):
So I remember being sent to theairport with him to do overtime
clearances on Saturday nightwhen Flying Tigers would bring
these things in.
So I would go with them.
I'm eight or nine years old atthe time.
I would get a cup of hotchocolate in one of those little
poker cups that has the wholecup on the bottom.
I'd watch them doing theweights and balances for the
aircraft on really big desktablets of paper.
(03:21):
So, in other words, whatpallets go where to make sure
the aircraft is properlybalanced, fuel loads?
And then they'd say hey, kid,do you wanna go out to the
flight line?
So, as a young kid, getting togo out and sniff Jet A and stand
inside of a 747 all by yourselfwas a pretty cool thing
actually.
Fast forward to college.
I nearly went into customs law.
That unfortunately didn'tmaterialize, but after
(03:43):
graduating, I went into customslaw.
That unfortunately didn'tmaterialize, but after
graduating I went into thefamily business.
I became a licensed customsbroker, served for a number of
years on the National CustomBrokers and Forwarders
Association's board of directors, was their air freight chair
for about seven years and then,in the early 2010s, decided to
start Position Global.
And the thing that drove thatfor me was that, while I had
done everything operationallyimport, export, break, bulk,
(04:06):
domestic I looked around atcompanies the small to
medium-sized companies and Isaid you know what?
They have to be able to competeagainst larger, either national
or multinational companies thathave these marketing
departments.
I was fortunate to be able towrite.
I'm fortunate to have a senseof design.
Professional social media, asit was, was just very nascent
back then.
(04:26):
So I started the businessactually as a white label
content shop with an eye tobeing able to help these
companies not just talk toshippers about the important
things that were going on.
But a lot of these companiesalso relied on an agent partner
in another city in the UnitedStates or in another country
around the world.
And if they were in anindependent forwarder network,
as a lot of probably youraudiences, they understand
(04:47):
having to compete for theattention of those other global
partners.
So how could I help them standout from other people doing
business in their market, and alot of that's about marketing.
So it really was understandingthe differences between
marketing wholesale to agentpartners and vendors and
marketing retail to the shippersand the cargo owners, how the
issues were essentially the same, but what you needed to say to
(05:11):
those different companies wasjust slightly varied, and we've
been fortunate enough in our12th, almost 13th year now to be
able to become a full serviceagency that does everything that
you would ask of an agency forforwarders as well as, in some
cases, for shippers too.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
That is quite the journey and the story as a mom
to an almost eight-year-old.
He would love everything aboutyour early, including the hot
chocolate.
He would do most anything andloves all things transportation.
He will actually be coming toTMSA Elevate again this year.
He missed last year in NewOrleans, but he's been to the
past couple ones and he justloves all of that, so he would
(05:51):
think that was really cool.
So I'm going to remember totell him that later.
But just hearing how youdeveloped and how you came into
taking on Position Global andreally being there for your
clients and helping them developthat content is really awesome
here, and part of what you guysdo is really follow those trends
, making what's going ondigestible so that they are able
(06:12):
to let their customers know.
So, as a starting point to this, I really was curious if you
had some tips for being able tofollow the news, especially
moments like this where there isa lot of movement and noise
happening.
Like how do you actuallydecipher what is going on?
Speaker 2 (06:30):
That's a great challenge because the news has
become so splintered and sofractured that it's very
difficult to kind of keep trackof everything as it pertains to
supply chain, whether you'redoing this domestically or
you're doing thisinternationally.
You have to realize thatthere's a couple of different
facets or a couple of differentareas in which this news falls
into buckets.
You're going to have theregulatory change bucket what
(06:53):
are the agencies doing herewithin the US?
What are other customs agenciesdoing around the world?
There's going to be sort of thetrade and the economic market
condition buckets what'shappening, employment,
manufacturing, manufacturing andthen there's also just going to
be the market conditions bucket.
What are carriers doing air,ocean, rail, truck, what are
they doing?
Are there blank sailings?
(07:13):
Are there a lot of ship orders?
What's happening with with thetrade imbalances, surpluses and
and deficits?
And knowing where to go to lookfor all that and to just be able
to do a signal to noise, tofigure out what it is, starts
with really understanding whatyour audience needs to know.
You have to realize that yourcustomers, their job, is to do
(07:34):
everything that they have to do.
So if you're a logisticsmanager, you're buying, you're
planning, you're inventorymanaging.
You're not necessarily going toget to the nitty gritty of the
things that are going to matterto us, the things that, for a
logistics company, are going toimpact how they do their
business.
What do they need to talk to?
Do they need to be justadvising or making changes to
their operations?
So if you can gather a reallygood list and a really good
(07:58):
source, a list of sources to beable to follow that information
from, it's going to make a hugedifference.
What does that source listinclude For our organization?
We watch and read everythingglobally because we have to, but
there's a lot.
There's a number of keypublications.
We read the Journal of Commerce, freight Waves, ajot, splash
24-7, g-captain, and we havesubscriptions to these too.
(08:21):
We also subscribe to Reuters,bloomberg, the Wall Street
Journal, places that really havereporting and sourcing to be
able to go to and look at.
For this, the thing that I willsay is that, while a lot of
this you may be able to use andconsume internally, realize that
things that you may wanna sharewith your customer base.
You may have a subscription tosomething, but they will not.
(08:42):
So when you're thinking aboutwhat to source from, what to
talk about for people or what totalk about with people and what
to share.
Think about whether or not thatinformation is paywalled, and
also be attuned to the fact thatyou cannot just regurgitate it
without running into a copyrightrisk those are really really
good points.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Um, that, like, because a lot of people are like
, okay, you're this, but now Iwant to go to the source, and if
they can't actually see thesource, then they can feel like
that's incomplete information,and so I love that point for
sure.
And yes, you don't want to justregurgitate, you're trying to
educate, and I spent the firstpart of my career as a
(09:21):
journalist, so, like I gettinginformation, I always wrote in
industry too, and that's kind ofwhere I ended up here and ended
up.
It's a very like weedy coursegetting here to TMSA, but I do
think it is important becauseyou want to make sure that
you're presenting facts andeducation and the information at
(09:41):
hand and making them be able tothen read more or access
information that they're lookingfor too.
So I think those are reallyreally great points and you're
never going to be able to thenread more or access information
that they're looking for too.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
So I think those are really really great points, and
you're never going to be able tomove at the speed of somebody
that has a desk, that has aneditorial team, that has a
broadcast outlet chain.
But what you do want to do isyou want to realize that there's
a difference between news andeditorial so the news is what
that outlet that you're going tobe finding that information
from is going to provide you.
it's going to give you theundergirdings, the underpinnings
.
And don't forget as well, Ineglected to mention direct
(10:10):
sources, including governmentsthemselves.
So, whether it be a White Houseexecutive order or, in this
case, willie, we're recommendingpeople watch for it to be
published in the FederalRegister, first Foreign
governments posting things totheir own websites.
You want to make sure thatyou've got a place to be able to
go back to and point to.
But, circling back, there'snews and then there's editorial.
So the news is the actual story.
(10:30):
The editorial is you as amarketer, looking at it for your
company's audience and sayinghow is this relevant to them,
what do they need to do, what dowe need to do for them and how
is this going to impact themdirectly?
So a simple regurgitation of itis not going to win the day.
Being able to apply analysis toit and make recommendations,
that's going to increase thatglue that, along with a good
(10:54):
operations team, keeps thecustomer a customer or gives you
the opportunity to bring one infrom one of your competitors.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
I think that's so important and I think, too,
thinking through that piece andgiving quality information is so
important.
One of my editors back in myjournalism days he said to me it
can take you years or decadesto build your reputation and one
mistake can ruin it.
And so, because I always wantedto move fast, I was like we got
(11:22):
to get the story out and he'slike we need to make sure it's
correct and that we have all theinformation.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Which is why there's entire legal departments
dedicated to keeping them out ofdefamation trouble.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
And so.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
But I do think about that a lot because, yeah, like
you want to be like, ok, this ishow this is applicable to you,
but you want to make sure thatyou're not moving too fast,
you're, you know, having thesource information, you're able
to really tell that completestory and still be able to
educate, do what you need to doso I mean just just this week
alone, as we record two, I meanthere's there's the tariff story
(11:55):
, which I know we'll talk abouta little bit later, which is
which has certainly been key,but just really in the span of
12 hours, conditions changedbetween news breaking that the
us postal service was going tostop taking packages through the
mail from, from china and hongkong which are subject to de
minimis, and less than 12 hourslater the post office is back
from that.
So marketers as well as justindustry people, the consultants
(12:17):
and finding themselves in aposition that the moment
something happens, everyone'srunning to yell at it out a
megaphone and then just a blinkof an eye later it could be
rescinded.
So we are in sort of a veryrapid response type of thing,
but it's only because, at leastfor the moment, things are very
quickly changing To your point.
You've got to be able to stop,step back and say is this going
(12:37):
to stick and why?
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And even just giving that information.
Okay, like this is the orderthat came out, and then let's
follow this.
And that's kind of where me andmy editor had met in the past
where I'd be like, okay, well,can I say this is a breaking
news item.
Stay tuned for more information.
So, I still wanted to make surethat, because part of it is like
I wanted.
As a journalist, I wantedpeople to know like this is
(13:01):
something that we were followingand paying attention to.
But even as a marketer, as acompany, you know you want to
show that you are payingattention to trends, this is
something that you're able tohelp your customers or your
prospects with, and so you alsodon't have to put all of the
information out.
If you don't have it, you canput hey, this is what's going on
.
This is a developing situation.
(13:21):
We don't know for sure howit'll play out, but this is,
this is the building blocks thatwe're building for you and this
is what we're paying attentionto.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
And if you've built a good network not just sort of
like of source material if youknow some of the journalists
that apply their trade in thisspace.
There are a lot of very amazingcareer journalists who are in
the logistics space that coverthese things across modalities.
But also, don't discount theinformation that you're getting
from your partners.
So you may be a freight broker,you may be a freight broker,
(13:49):
you may be a freight forwarderand you may not own assets.
Well, you know what?
If you need to know what'shappening in the trucking space,
your trucking partner who'sregulated by FMCSA, by DOT, is
really living those regulations.
It could be a great source foryou.
The same way, if somethingchanges overseas, if you hear
about oh my gosh, this port isconstrained, there is a closure
here, there's not cargo movingthrough, it's monsoon season,
(14:10):
containers or airframe aren'tgetting through.
You know what.
Reach out to your partner inthat country, in that market,
and go hey, this is what I'mreading.
Are you seeing and experiencingthis?
And now you've actually gotsort of your own firsthand
network of sources that arereputable, that are firsthand,
that you can use in thecommunication that you're making
to your audience.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
And, with all that, I love that piece.
Like you know, you do have anetwork.
There are people that you workwith.
Lean into that to get thatinformation.
What are some other kind ofbest practices companies can
have to transparentlycommunicate with customers and
prospects about these trends,challenges, opportunities,
things that are happening withcustomers and prospects?
Speaker 2 (14:49):
about these trends, challenges, opportunities,
things that are happening.
I think the most importantthing that you want to be able
to do is you want to be able tohave a source to back it up.
Conjecture is one of thoseplaces that get you in a lot of
trouble.
We've certainly discovered justover the past week and then
even precedingly, that there'sthings that could just sort of
like be said and then there'sthings where there's actually
action taken.
So you want to wait for thingsto be published in the Federal
(15:11):
Register from from atransparency point of view.
Like you said, with thedisclaimer at the top of this,
this is not meant to bepolitical.
Things are moving very quicklyand decisions are being made
that will impact people'sbusiness.
I mean just to.
I feel like it's going to besort of the trigger to call back
to you.
(15:38):
But, like this week, we reallythought that that 25 percent
duty was coming from Canada andMexico to very close, very
reliable allies and tradepartners in the United States
and have been slightlyaccelerated with the Monday
announcement is the fact thatimporters who are used to having
to have a certain amount ofworking capital now needed to
say, oh my gosh, I have an extraseven and a half, 12, and it
had it gone through on Monday,an extra 25% in cost.
(16:01):
You've built a business modelwhere you assume that you're
going to need capital for thecost of the goods, the cost of
your transportation and theother things you didn't plan to
all of a sudden have to find anadditional.
If you ordered $10,000 worth oftomatoes, you didn't ask
yourself where am I going tocome up with another $2,500 in
duty on those tomatoes that arecoming in?
And how am I going to go to mycustomer and say, hey, guess
(16:23):
what?
I'm going to have to increasemy price to you by X, even
though we may have a contract,we may have an agreement.
And then on top of that, from acustoms point of view, there's
what's called bond sufficiencyand your custom broker clients,
or your custom broker audience,will know this where they had to
go to importers who had to getlarger bonds essentially larger
insurance policies for theirduty exposure with customs, and
(16:44):
the higher that those bondamounts got, the surety
companies were requestingcollateral or financial
instruments.
So now you have an additionaldemand for the goods that you
have to bring in.
You have an additional capitalthat you would have to set aside
to be able to make sure thatyou covered all this, and these
are all things that, when youwoke up, on whatever day it was,
you weren't planning to have todeal with.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
With that we talked about the tariffs.
That's a huge question mark ofhow it will play out.
But beyond that, what are someof the other important movements
that are happening right nowthat you think will affect the
supply chain in the short termand then potentially the long
term?
Speaker 2 (17:26):
I think the things that we're going to have to
watch.
Certainly the tariffs are there, not just from a cost point of
view, but what that's probablygoing to mean for trading
patterns.
So we have establishedbilateral and multilateral
agreements with a number ofcountries.
The question becomes if itbecomes too expensive to come
into the US and consumers don'twant to buy it, are there
opportunities for shippers tosay, redirect those goods to a
(17:48):
third country?
Hey, maybe you didn't thinkabout selling into Latin America
, but now's an opportunity tothink about and to avail
yourself of that.
You're going to want to watchas well to see whether or not
there are any changes to theregulatory regimes in which you
operate, either at a state or afederal level.
For instance, in California,the California Air Resources
(18:09):
Board withdrew the waiver thatthey had before the EPA that was
mandating a certain percentageof cleaner, non-emissions
generating trucks.
So is that going to change thecalculus for people who want to
do that?
There's been talk at the federallevel about DEI initiatives,
which is certainly somethingthat is very important to the
TMSA.
What is that going to mean foryour company from an employment
(18:30):
law?
Moving outside of that and I'msure that could be a topic that
comes up this summer at theconference as well, but just
really sort of being aware ofwhat's going to impact you from
customs with regulations.
It could be with TSA, it couldbe FMCSA, hours of service
changes.
We could see investments thathave been made or promised
(18:51):
through the infrastructure actthat was passed under the Biden
administration.
There's a lot of plans out thereat city and state levels to do
bridge projects, to do highwayprojects, things that could
really reduce the wear and tearon vehicles that are going
through it or open up new lanesof transportation.
If those dollars go away, dothose projects go away?
(19:11):
And does now all of a suddenthat means sort of changes for
fleet refreshes because of,again, wear and tear on vehicles
.
It's a really sort ofmultifaceted thing that we're
all just really in the earlydays of trying to ascertain
what's going to happen.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Absolutely Tons.
There's tons to unpack there.
I don't even know where tostart sometimes, but I think
that that's part of thechallenge of it is especially
right now.
There's just a lot going on,and I like that you brought up
the local and state level too,because there's a lot going on
at the federal level, butthere's still trends to be
(19:47):
paying attention to.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
It's grant money.
I mean that's the thing too.
I mean the federal governmentprovides grant money.
I mean here at O'Hare we're inChicago.
I mean they've been trying torebuild the passenger side of
the house for decades now andthey're finally on the road for
it.
What happens to dollars thatmay have been allocated by the
FAA or the federal governmentfor that, if there are costs
that go up there already were.
(20:09):
I mean the project was alreadybeing talked about pre-COVID and
now that we're actually gettingto the break ground and start
to source things, if we'relooking at steel and aluminum
tariffs going up, if we'relooking for additional costs
going up now, what kind of costoverruns Do you have to scale
the project back?
I mean there are real worldconsiderations that come around
the decisions that are beingmade to people that will impact
(20:29):
them every day.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Yeah, there's a lot to kind of put together.
Do you have, like, differentpeople on your team that follow
specific trends?
How do you kind of maximizeyour team to be able to handle
everything that's going on andthen be able to, like, educate?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
It's a great question .
We've got people in sort of indifferent positions, on
different beats, if you will,because we have to obviously
straddle both watching marketingtrends because we're talking
about marketing to our customersand being aware of it and
making recommendations to thembut also having to watch what's
happening in the world.
The joke I use with people isthat we're logistics adjacent,
(21:10):
all of the necessary awarenessand knowledge.
None of the exposure to myshipment is late, my shipment is
detained, customs impounded myshipment.
So we've sort of settled intobeats, if you will, internally.
So I have somebody who's got asignificant amount of B2B
marketing experience, so he'llwatch the things that are
brand-related, marketingtrends-related.
I have somebody else who's got asignificant amount of B2B
marketing experience, so he'llwatch the things that are brand
related, marketing trendsrelated.
I have somebody else who's ananalytics specialist who will
(21:32):
watch and see what's happeningwith Google analytics, seo,
how's AI going to impact that?
I watch logistics I have tosort of watch it all as the head
of the company but I will trendtowards logistics and trying to
get more into the marketingstuff.
Having been a logisticsoperator and a newfound marketer
, it's kind of fun to sort offigure all that out, and then my
(21:55):
managing editor just watchesand keeps an eye on everything.
So we're having to bemultifaceted, and it's not just
by mode, it's by country, it'sby topic, it's by regulation.
So, yeah, we sort of havedifferent specialties and beats
and, with me still being alicensed customs broker, I'll
personally stick my nose into alot of the important regulatory
related things, because I've gota place to speak from about
(22:18):
that.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Great, that's a really good breakdown of how to
kind of handle the differentthings going on.
I'm curious what is some of thefeedback that you've seen from
prospects, from customers, whensupply chain companies then are
putting out content, informationon these trends, what do people
resonate with?
What do they not want from apartner or from somebody?
(22:40):
How do you kind of create thecontent that they're looking for
?
Speaker 2 (22:44):
I think the challenge in B2B communications now is
that we're all so inundated witheverything from every place.
The example that I like to useis you start to get around the
holiday season If you've signedup for anybody's email lists or,
obviously, you've got cookiesplanted on any of the devices
that you use.
How many times do you see orhear from people I will never
(23:04):
forget and I love it as a brand.
But God, why am I suddenlyWorld Market?
I don't know why I blanked onthat, but it's like for a while
it was like I wouldn't just getemail correspondence every day
from World Market, It'd be liketwice a day.
So they tell me about thepfefferness in the morning and
all of a sudden there's a flashsale on ornaments and I'm like I
don't need to hear from youtwice a day.
I know what you have, I knowChristmas is coming, I know what
(23:25):
to get, what I need.
Please stop.
This is not inciting me to comein, Because, again, I think
that what happens is you sort ofbecome ear blind or audience
blind or nose blind to things.
I think that you have to sort ofjudiciously figure out the best
way to do this, and we asmarketers, we talk about
segmentation.
I mean the engagement comeswith the things that are most
relevant to people.
(23:45):
And if you know who youraudience is and either within
your customer or within yourprospects, and you take a look
at the news and you sift it intothe appropriate buckets and
you're making sure that you'rehitting people with the general
stuff that they have to knowabout, sort of where it's at
right now, but then also hittingthem frequently enough with
things that are relevant andpersonal and resonates to them
(24:06):
in their department and whatthey're doing that are relevant
and personal and resonates tothem in their department and
what they're doing, then I thinkit sort of keeps that
engagement thing there.
I mean, we we always were weall do the same for a living.
We've all heard it.
You're on on the other end ofthe phone or the end of the
other end of the email.
My other broker said this, myother forwarder said that and
it's like you just you just makethat sort of exasperated noise
so like, could I have saidsomething faster?
(24:27):
It's no-transcript, but I thinkthat some folks are okay if you
just cut, copy paste andregurgitate.
But, like I said earlier in ourinterview, there's the news and
there's the editorial.
Somebody else may be on thatlawyer's list, somebody else may
be on that media outlet's list.
What does it mean to them?
Don't just give them theawareness, give them an action
(24:47):
item that they need to be awareof it, that they might need to
prepare for, and I think that'swhere the value add comes in in
what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
And what type of ways are they consuming that content
?
So, is it in like a email sendor a phone call or a podcast?
Listen.
How are people absorbinginformation the best way right
now?
Speaker 2 (25:08):
It's really across the spectrum.
I mean, if you think about yourcable or your streaming system
having 200 channels, there issomething for people who like to
watch, I don't know, like nakedlumberjackery.
It's like, hey, there's likeseven people, so we have to have
the naked lumberjack channel.
God, we may need to cut this,but it has become so segmented
(25:29):
that you have to really be in alot of different places.
I mean, if you were to go backand look at somebody's LinkedIn
or social media feed and youjust looked at that company's
and you go back like three, fouror five weeks and you see the
same story appear like four orfive or six times, you may feel
like it's overkill doing that,but you have to realize that the
audiences come and go so fast.
(25:49):
I mean the the.
The line that I like to use isit's not unlike fishing.
So you're off in a cab and yousay I'm going to go fishing.
You grab the beverage of yourchoice, you wander down to the
river or the lake, you throwsomething in, you fish for 15 or
20 minutes, you look and you go.
My drink is empty.
If you're fishing, you broughta cooler.
If you're like me, you forgetabout that and you just go up to
get another one.
But by the time you come backdown to that river, there's been
(26:11):
tens or hundreds of thousandsof gallons of water that have
moved through and you might geta new cluster full of fish.
The same thing happens right now.
People are pulled in so manydifferent directions to try and
ingest and see and what they'reexposed to that you almost you
don't almost.
You have to be in differentplaces multiple times with the
same message.
But don't worry about itlooking like you're repeating
(26:34):
the message.
Just realize that that audienceis going to be there when
they're there, not always,necessarily when you want them
to be there.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I think that's really good advice and I would also
add to that and remember kind ofbest practices of the different
platforms that you're on.
So even like so this is aweekly podcast.
You were like how long do yourun?
I don't really go over 35.
I think the longest interviewwe've ever done is 40 minutes,
because I don't think thatpeople are going to sit here,
even though they can come backto it.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
You want to leave it long enough to be just a workout
or a commute, anything longerthan that.
When they get to theirdestination or they get home,
they're not going to pick itback up.
So to your point if we couldfit it into a workout or a
commute, then people get it,they digest it, boom, they're
done.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
And so I think that understanding the best ways to
engage in the different avenuesthat you're supporting is really
important too.
You can have the same messagein the different platforms in
the different ways, but go tothe best practices of what those
are.
So like in social media is awhole different beast and each
different platform is a littlebit different.
(27:41):
But, like knowing how to playthat game can help too, because
you want to reach people wherethey are and when they're there,
but in the best format for that.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
And the challenge in this particular environment
because things are moving sofast is you and I both know that
people love to have automationsas part of the marketing or the
sales process.
It's really great to haveautomations and those
automations are great for themessaging that you're doing
internally.
We've seen a lot of clients whohave had a good evergreen
strategy and a good breakingnews strategy have to tilt it
(28:11):
one way or the other.
Really, strategy and a goodbreaking news strategy have to
tilt it one way or the other,really just based on where
things are at.
So you may have a content or adrip strategy plan for somebody
and the plan it may take yousomeplace else.
So you're going to have to beflexible enough to interrupt
that drip plan, to interruptthat campaign plan that you have
for somebody, and be able tointerject that thing and add
that value and then pick it backup again as well.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
That's great advice and a really good point and one
thing I would suggest to you.
So when I have like an automatedcampaign, I have space in that
where it'll be like email thisperson or LinkedIn message them.
And it's an internal note to meto then make sure that it's not
I'm not just leaving it to theautomated emails to reach the
person.
(28:52):
I, I am actually reaching outand you can build that in,
because then in those emailsyou're reminding yourself okay,
have like a real human touchpoint with this person.
And then you can be like whatis going on today and how can I
address them and talk to them?
Or like making sure that you'reconnecting in a different space
.
Or if you're going like nextweek, I'm prepping to get to
manifest and so are you going tobe seeing those people there
and how can you engage?
(29:13):
And so I think it's importantto even if you're busy and you
rely on your automations and allof that to build in your
process you, of course, need topivot, need to be able to pivot,
but you can also build some ofthat stuff stuff in to nudge you
to do it nudge you to do it.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
The other thing, too, that I think that everybody I
mean, if you've ever hadsomething go out after something
happens and you go oh, I wish Ididn't send that because of
what's happening A real goodthing to remember and underscore
is if you're giving the keys toa more junior person, a senior
person has to be able to get tothat in case of emergency break
glass to just stop things.
Just cold turkey.
Sometimes things happen in theworld that you may have that
(29:56):
campaign schedule to go and it'sjust not going to ring right
based on what's happened eithernearby or in the world, and just
be ready to say to yourself youknow what, we have to stop this
thing.
I don't want to have to.
I don't want, I don't wantsomebody to come to my door and
go how come this didn't go out?
You have to be able to and Isay this all the time read the
room.
You have to be able to read theroom and know when you should
(30:18):
probably just pause it and letthe world reset and then pick it
back up again.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
And I would even say that like that's when people are
like, oh, we have an intern,they're going to be managing our
social media.
But I'm like, are you sure?
Like, are you sure that's thebest practice?
Like they can be the personwho's actively posting and stuff
, but like one, if you have anintern, you're supposed to be
teaching them things.
You're not supposed to beletting them out into the wild.
They are interning to learn andto grow.
(30:44):
Professional development isimportant.
Two, they are the social mediais part of your voice, like part
of your brand, and so if you'rejust letting somebody who
doesn't really know your brandor know that much about what's
going on be the voice of that,you're missing a lot, and then
you'll run into a lot more ofthose situations where you're
like, oh, I even have that.
So at TMSA we have a lot ofvolunteers that help with our
(31:06):
marketing and I go in and Icheck and I say, like the big
role is somebody else has tolook at it.
Everyone's like a professionalmarketer here, and I still say
that there has to be a secondpair of eyes in every single
thing that we put out, andthere's some things that I'm
like and they have to.
That has to be my eyes beforeit goes, and just knowing you
know the balance of that isreally important and because you
(31:28):
have to know what's going onand what's getting sent out.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
There is also I mean, having worked in journalism
there are editors to makeeditorial judgment calls.
Your nightly news has 30minutes Well, I mean 21, by the
time you take all thecommercials on the sports and
weather.
So there's editorial decisionsmade as well for what's going to
go to the A, the B, the C block.
So there's considerationsaround that.
The trick that I think andcircling back to the disclaimer
(31:52):
that you gave at the top of thisthing is, while you may want to
tiptoe and not touch a thirdrail, politically, you also
shouldn't be afraid to callsomething out when it is
patently bad, either for you orfor your industry or for your
customers.
So I mean, if there's somethingthat's going to adversely
impact it I think we see a lotof sort of like the both
sides-ism is a good way tophrase it we want to make sure
(32:14):
to say you know what?
If this is going to causesomebody a lot of heartburn, be
honest with them about it.
Don't necessarily sugarcoat it.
Because I think, then, to whatyou said about being honest or
being disingenuous to somebody.
If something's going to happenthat's going to impact their
bottom line, be straightforwardabout it and also remind people
(32:37):
that they're empowered to dothis.
A lot of times we think aboutactivism at an individual level.
There is an opportunity to beactive as a business level.
If you do business in a city,in a state, in a country and
something's going to impact, yousay something about it, weigh
in on it.
I mean, prior to the changeoveradministrations, the Biden
administration put forth twoproposals on de minimis just to
close the loophole and do somethings.
They publish it for the noticeof comment.
(32:58):
So the whole idea is that,whether you're a person or
you're a business, you can tellthe government what you think
about what they want to do, andthose comments are received and
they're adjudicated.
You may get what you want, youmay not get what you want, but
the point is that you have anopportunity to use your voice to
let somebody know I'm anadvocate for this, I'm not an
advocate for this, and why?
(33:19):
Don't be afraid to do that ortake a stand on it.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Yeah, I think it's a hard balance and it's a tricky
one, but it's important to knowwhen to do that and when not to
do that.
And I think you are speaking asa business One.
I do think it's important forleaders to have training for
their teams on things like this,because there is a difference
between speaking for yourcompany and speaking for
(33:45):
yourself.
Yes, and knowing those rules,and I think a lot of times we
forget and I've seen a lot ofbusiness owners been like, oh, I
don't want my team to be onsocial media at all, but it's
like that's their private lives.
You can't always control that,but if you give training and
engagement on what's appropriateto say, what's not, and so then
they have some training.
Sometimes we just don't trainour teams at all and then we're
(34:07):
shocked at what can happen, andso I think those things are
really important but making surethat, if you are taking a stand
as a company or saying onething or the other, that
everyone at the company knowsand understands and that we're
relaying that, because it's notalways about just relaying to
your partners or your customers.
Making sure your team isinvolved in that and knows
what's going on as well isincredibly important.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
And I think a lot of times they're the ones who are
the last to know, and then theycan leave a really sour taste in
their mouths I mean if, if youwere somebody who, if you were
somebody who worked in across-border trucking company,
in a cross-border freightforwarder or customs brokerage,
and that tariff goes through at25 and traffic stops crossing
the border, if you're a truckerand you don't have those loads
to carry, that's, that's aproblem for you and your
(34:49):
livelihood.
If you're part of an entrydepartment at a customs broker
that anticipates tens ofthousands of transactions a
month and that is cut by adouble digit number, that's
going to have a real worldimplication on the people that
you're employing, the peoplethat you as a business are
trying to support and lift upand train and bring you to sort
of your next level and identifyfuture potential senior leaders,
(35:09):
and maybe you lose some ofthose people if you have to make
a tough staffing decision.
So these things do have realworld implications, not just
sort of for the consumer levelthings that we hear and see on
social media or on local news orin other outlets but to people
in their businesses as well.
Speaker 1 (35:26):
Absolutely, and so always good to kind of sift
through everything, and that'swhy I always advise to take that
moment, think through it, thinkhow, okay, how can this affect
my business?
Sometimes it is okay, let'swait to see what actually gets
enacted with this piece ofinformation.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
It's your email campaign software going.
Are you really sure you want tosend this off now?
Speaker 1 (35:55):
Yes, yes, and and to do that and I do think I like
that you talked about theautomations and the workflows,
because I do think that, asmarketers and salespeople, like
that's something that we shouldbe checking into right now is,
like what we have.
I even one of my questions foryou was, like, are there any
pitfalls to be aware of asyou're building campaigns and
initiatives?
Like, I definitely think,checking in, making sure, and
(36:17):
even like, what is the company'scapacity right now and are we
selling the things that we cando and are we marketing to match
that?
I think that's something thatwe should be checking in all the
time, but especially right now.
There might be parts of yourbusiness that we want to market
to more versus other things, andjust, is everyone aligned in
that and making sure that thoseteams are coming together to
(36:37):
have those conversations too?
Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1 (36:42):
Awesome.
Well, that takes me to the lastquestion that I ask everybody
on the show.
So get ready.
If you could go back in timeand advise a younger Scott and
this could be personally orprofessionally when would you go
back to and what would you tellhim?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
That's a good question.
I would say get experience.
I have been very fortunate tohave had two jobs in my adult
life one working in the familybusiness and then one having
started my own.
I had great opportunities.
I met with and worked withgreat people.
They're both small to mediumsized businesses, which is
(37:20):
tremendous, and I would say thatfor people that are doing this,
always look for opportunitiesto learn from other people.
I mean there's a weird sort ofpeer.
I think that the term I've usedonce when I was on the
transactional side of things wasfrenemy.
I mean, just don't be afraid totalk to people and ask and
learn, participate I mean thatwas something that I found very
(37:42):
valuable growing upprofessionally through the
National Brokers AssociationFind industry things to
participate in, become part of aproject that delivers something
larger.
So it gives you exposure intodoing that.
And be sure, I've been veryfortunate to build out my
professional network.
I am 53 years old and I washaving the Journal of Commerce
(38:05):
delivered in paper to my collegedorm.
So I probably need anintervention and if I haven't
had one yet, I'm long overdue.
But the thing that I would sayis that at some point your
network is what you're going torely on in this.
I mean the ability to problemsolve, and we see a lot about
technology automation.
Oh, technology is going to doaway with this.
Technology is going to do awaywith that.
(38:25):
At some point.
Qualified people are going toneed to be able to get in,
remediate problem solve andyou're going to need to find
somebody to help you get to thebottom of something and building
out that network.
Attending events like the TMSAthings, attending industry
events, really helps build thatnetwork out to be able to be in
(38:47):
that position so that when ifthis is something that you
decided to make a lifelongcareer and logistics is not
going away, it's just evolvingat varying speeds having that
network of people to rely on isgoing to be invaluable for you.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
I love that.
I do think experience is great.
I have been the opposite, whereI have worked in different
industries and different roles,from journalism to marketing to
all kinds of things, and I feellike I at TMSA.
It has culminated in all of the, all the lessons and everything
(39:22):
I've learned including thispodcast like I miss journalism.
I love interviewing people.
It's one of my favorite things.
So I'm like, yes, please, let'sstart a podcast where we can
shine a light on all of thesmart people we have in tmsa,
but also then I need to just sitand interview people and talk
to people once a week.
So big fan of that it.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
I think it's part of the reason why I've been
fortunate enough to be able tobuild a lot of positive
relationships with reportersthrough the industry.
I actually did a little bit ofnews writing when I was at
northwestern.
I remember having a professorprofessor where basically every
class was.
He would pretend to be a publicinformation officer for the
Chicago Fire Department and theclass was responsible for asking
questions about the fire thathad happened and he wouldn't
(40:01):
volunteer any more than what thequestion was that was asked and
then we had to go back andwrite that story.
Aside from that and just sortof the ethical things around
journalism and protectingsources and getting things right
, I've been very blessed thatwhenever I have that
conversation with somebody who'sin the reporting space, I feel
like I can have a deeper, moremeaningful and more more
impactful conversation and learnfrom them because, while I'm
(40:22):
not in and of their craft, theyknow that, that I respect it and
I and I honor it and it givesus the ability to to really to,
I think, make inroads in placeswhere other people may not.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
Well, I love journalism and respect it as
well, so that's a great way toend our show today.
Thank you so much for coming onand talking about all of the
very heavy things that are goingon right now.
And if you are watching todayand you want to catch us next
week, we will be talking tochris zapowski, and I hope I
(40:55):
pronounce his name right,because I pronounced it wrong.
Almost every time I talk abouthim publicly, but he will be
here.
Um, he's with bennett and weare talking about all things
about his career growth and hisum youtube series playing with
trucks, which is really fun andentertaining if you haven't
watched it.
But you can catch us here nextweek.
And then I do also want toannounce that we have both
(41:17):
Elevate and TMSA ExecutiveSummit registration open.
So if you want to go toExecutive Summit, you can scan
here and then I'm going to popup Elevate down here.
Get us going both places.
So Executive Summit this yearwill be in Chicago.
So Scott has talked aboutChicago on and off this whole
interview.
So if you want to do that,that'll be October 22nd through
(41:38):
the 23rd, and elevate is June8th through 10th in Austin,
texas.
On both of those payment linksyou can actually bundle if you
plan on going to both and youget a deal.
So very exciting, all excitingthings going on at TMSA.
And oh, I didn't even mean topop that up, but, yes, if you
have not applied for any of yourTrailblazer, rising Star or
(41:58):
Purpose awards, please do.
Submissions end at the end ofMarch.
And so, yeah, perfect productplacement, fantastic.
But it was great to talk to youtoday and I appreciate you
coming on the show.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
Absolutely, Jennifer.
Have a great one.
Look forward to seeing you inperson soon.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
Thanks, you too.
Bye.
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