July 30, 2025 • 55 mins
What if success wasn’t wealth, but human connection? And what if the systems we live by: education, healthcare, justice aren’t broken… but functioning exactly as designed? Success, as we explore in this discourse, may not be epitomized by wealth but rather by the depth of human connection.
In our conversation with Alex Kain, a distinguished entrepreneur and systems thinker, we delve into the provocative inquiry of whether our societal systems—education, healthcare, and justice—are indeed broken or merely functioning as they were designed. Kain presents a compelling manifesto that challenges the conventional paradigms of success, urging us to reconsider the fundamental definitions of value and impact in our lives. Drawing inspiration from notable works such as Doughnut Economics and Utopia for Realists, he offers a blueprint for cultivating a more equitable, interconnected, and purpose-driven society. This dialogue transcends mere critique of existing structures; it serves as a clarion call for a collective reclamation of what is sacred in our human experience.
Takeaways:
- This episode challenges the conventional notion of success, proposing that true success stems from meaningful human connections rather than mere accumulation of wealth.
- Alex Kain advocates for a radical rethinking of societal systems such as education and healthcare, suggesting they are functioning as intended rather than being fundamentally broken.
- The philosophy encourages individuals to reflect on their personal definitions of success and to prioritize contribution and fulfillment over material gain.
- A transformative education system that instills values of empathy and respect is essential for nurturing a more humane society, according to Alex Kain.
- The conversation emphasizes the importance of community and grassroots connections as a means to foster social change and collective responsibility.
- Ultimately, the episode serves as a call to action for listeners to question inherited societal norms and to envision a new framework for success that prioritizes human connection.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hey, one more Thing before yougo. What if success wasn't wealth
but human connection? And whatif the systems we live by, education,
healthcare, justice, aren'tbroken but function exactly as we
designed? In this week'sepisode of One more thing before
you go, I sit down with AlexKane. He's an entrepreneur, systems
thinker and author of thephilosophy A Critical Upgrade for
(00:22):
Humanity. After years ofoptimizing business processes, Alex
turned his lens towardssociety itself, asking the most human
question, what's the point?His answer? A bold manifesto that
challenges the status quo andinvites us to radically rethink how
we define success, value andimpact. Drawing inspiration from
(00:42):
donut Economics, Utopia forRealists and empowering spirit of
the secret, Alex offers ablueprint for a more just connected
and purpose driven world. Thisisn't just a conversation about what's
broken, it's a reckoning, aremembering, a call to reclaim what's
sacred. I'm your host, MichaelErnst. Welcome to one more thing
(01:04):
before you go. My guest, AlexKane is an Australian based entrepreneur,
systems thinker and founder ofthe Philosophy. It's a social movement
encouraging a new way ofthinking about success, happiness
(01:27):
and collective responsibility.Alex has spent years assisting businesses
to run more efficientlythrough an analysis of their systems
and processes. More recentlyhe turned his attention to society
itself, applying his expertisein system optimization to a deeper
understanding facing humanity.Through the philosophy, Alex is inspiring
(01:49):
business leaders, changemakers and everyday people to find
our way to the North Star. AndI'm excited to talk about this. Welcome
to the show, Alex.
Thanks Michael for having me.
What a journey that you'vebeen on in life.
Yeah, well it's, you know,everyone has their own story. Mine,
(02:12):
mine has been a journey of, Iguess, self discovery through life
experience like everyone else,you know, I began life doing lots
of different jobs and I was aprivate investigator, I worked in
a dating agency, I was a standup comedian and you know, just trying
to find my little pathway andI guess that led me to discover technology
(02:38):
and the Internet and I set upInternet businesses and, and software
businesses and, and I guess asI was finding a level of success,
I started to question whatsuccess actually meant. You know,
it felt a little bit hollow tome in some respects and, and hence
(02:59):
the ideas of the philosophywas born from that.
Well, that's amazing and Ican't wait to get into that. I think
from what I've learned so far,I think it's an amazing opportunity
for us as a human being, as asociety and us as a culture to reflect
upon what needs to be changedand what can be changed and how we
have the possibility changingit. But I do like to start at the
(03:21):
beginning. Where'd you grow up?
Well, I'm in and was born inMelbourne, Australia, and middle
class. Nothing spectacularabout my upbringing. Mother and father.
Dad worked his whole life. Mumlooked after the home and myself
(03:45):
and my two sisters, you know,we grew up quite, quite average.
Nothing special there. But Idid see my father go to work every
day and, you know, struggledto put food on the table and. And
I guess that's in some waycontributed to the philosophy. My
idea of, you know, what's thepoint of life? Is it to work? Is
(04:09):
it just to survive? Yeah, forme, that's where it all came from.
And in fact, I dedicate thebook to my father at the beginning.
And it's his amazing view onthe world and life that I take a
lot of my. My perspective from.
(04:32):
Do you think that inspired youto write the philosophy? I mean,
was there any other, like apersonal experience that led you
to this as well? Or, or. Imean, look, I grew up, as you can
see, I'm a little older. Justlike a lot of many, many of us, I
grew up in the 60s and the 70sand the 80s, watching my father go
(04:54):
to work every day, watching mymother go to work every day once
my father was gone. And it wasa grind, it was like, you know, it
was tough watching thatbecause they struggled constantly.
They were always tired, alwayssame old thing. Monday through Friday,
Saturday, sleep in, Sunday, goto church, started again on Monday.
(05:18):
Yeah, and if you were lucky,that pattern continued all year,
except maybe for a couple ofweeks, you might get a little break
and go somewhere and that wasthe payoff for the whole year's work.
And again, to me, that justseems wrong. It just seems that we're
stuck in that rut, that that'swhat's expected of us and that's
(05:41):
what we need to do. And, youknow, I. I talk about the phrase
earn a living, you know, thefact that we have to earn our life.
You know, we're brought intothis world through no choice of our
own. But now we're lumberedwith the need to go to work, to get
food and a roof over our headfor the rest of our lives to be able
(06:04):
to survive. So that earning ofa life for me seems like it should
just be a given. Everyone hasthe right to just survive now. From
there you should be able tothrive and level up and do other
things. But I believe it is ahuman right. Just to have that basic
(06:24):
need met.
I think that goes back to yourquestion. Is this all there is? Because
if you look at life like fromthat perspective in which all of
us, 90% of us grew up as itkind of is, is this all there is
to life? There's got to besomething more than this grind that
(06:45):
you just mentioned.
Well, I guess, you know, wesee success modeled to us on TV and
in the media and we aspire toaccumulate wealth so that we can
have that level of success.That's the gold stand standard we're
trying to get to. Right.That's what we're told we need to
achieve, to have a good life.But I guess what are we giving up
(07:11):
to get that, to get there?What's the opportunity cost of the
other things that we'reforsaking in terms of time spent
with family, our ability tofollow our passions and joys, our
ability to be more humane andyou know, explore that part of ourselves?
(07:34):
We, we really are forced tocompete in the world just to survive.
And you know, within acapitalist society, that's kind of
the goal, is that you, he whodies with the most toys wins. Right.
It's kind of modeled to us.And as I was climbing that ladder,
(07:56):
you know, I, I was lookingaround me and feeling this isn't
success if there are so manyother people doing it so tough. I
can't feel successful if I'vejust got to the top of my own little
mountain, you know, and that'sthe COVID of my book. It's pretty
much a Maslow's hierarchy, youknow, that we're all in a rush to
get to the top, to selfactualize, but you know, without
(08:19):
the social responsibilityaspect of I don't think we're actually
being successful.
I agree. And I think, did youcome to that analysis? I mean, you've
got a business optimizationbackground within yourself. I mean
you kind of, from what I canunderstand, you kind of took that
skill set to analyze societalsystems kind of in the same way and
(08:43):
how we should be, should bekind of operating as a, as a human
being, as a society.
Yeah, exactly. I mean my, mybusiness was a software development
business. I go into companiesand look at their systems, processes,
how they do things and see ifthere's room for efficiencies and
optimization. And I guess whenyou, you think like that day in,
(09:06):
day out, it's very hard tojust see what's around us every day
with our systems and processesin society and not question those.
And so, you know, it led me toJust go, hang on a minute, does this
even make sense anymore? Arethese systems and processes serving
us or are we now serving them?And are we just doing it? Because
(09:29):
that's the way we've alwaysdone it. And so, you know, there's
a chapter in the book calledQuestion Everything because I think
we've just got so used toaccepting that certain things just
are and that they'reimmovable. But you know, I talk about
many man made constructs inthe book. You know, money is a man
(09:50):
made construct. A piece ofpaper or plastic holds no value intrinsically.
But we, we assign a value toit all by consensus and agreement.
But if we all woke up tomorrowand said money holds no value, what
would happen? And you know,the same with country borders. They're
man made, we created them, itdivides us. But the life of someone
(10:17):
living on one side of a bordercompared to on the other side of
a border, only feet away fromeach other, can be completely different.
And yet these man madeconstructs are seemingly permanent
in our minds. And that's justhow it is. And so we pivot everything
else around them. You know,rather than looking at the humanity
(10:39):
aspect, we just go, well no,that's the border, that's where it
ends. And that's all you get.And I just think we've got to be
a little bit more humane, Iguess, in that respect.
Humane and compassionate andunderstanding. And they were all
human beings. No matter whatborder you live on or other side
of the border you live on, nomatter what color, race, creed, religion,
(11:04):
we're all still human beingsand part of community. I mean, that's
just the way that I look atit. I've seen, look as a cop, I've
seen the worst in people andin conditions and I've seen the best
people at their worst. And youknow, it kind of changes the perspective
on society as a whole when youstart looking at that because you,
(11:27):
you see the line, but you alsosee everything. There's so more similarities
in there than they want toadmit to. Even on like a, an upper
class and a lower class and apoverty level. There's so many that
still overlap.
Well, we're so much more thesame than we are different. And unfortunately
(11:50):
those differences are used todivide us rather than for us to celebrate
those differences anduniqueness. You know, I, I often
talk about having a look atsome images of some embryos and you
tell me which one is the, theJew, the Muslim, the Christian, the
left voter, right voter, we'reall the same, you know, everything
(12:13):
Else is just layers on top ofthat, and we shouldn't be using them
to divide us, but we do. And,you know, is that a fear thing? Is
it a tribal thing? You know,we can change that.
We have a. We have to make achoice. You challenge the idea that
poverty and homelessness areinevitable. What's the one thing
(12:33):
that you believe could solvethese issues? I've seen a lot of
homelessness. I've beenhomeless. My family, we've come home
to a locked apartment becauseboth my parents, I was very dysfunctional
family when we grew up, camehome to lock doors on our house.
So I've seen that. I'veexperienced it. I've worked it as
(12:55):
a cop. How do you think we asa society have the ability to change
these issues? Because even inthat respect, you still see a divide
or a perception. When you seethe homeless people on the street,
you see somebody on the cornerwith a sign, you see somebody that's
walking around in dirtyclothes and doesn't have much food
(13:16):
or asking for food. And Ithink that we as society need to
recognize that and maybe helpunderstand how to solve it.
Yeah, look, there are a numberof issues in society today that in
my mind stem from a singlecause. Now, there's complexity around
(13:40):
all of these, but I do believeall of these come from a lack of
respect that we have betweeneach other and to the planet. Now,
you know, here, where I livein Melbourne, we have an issue with
youth gangs running aroundwith machetes and breaking into houses
(14:01):
and just ransacking businessesand that sort of thing. So you look
at how does a baby that'seffectively a blank slate go from
that to at the age of 12 yearsold running around in a gang with
machete terrorizing people?Something is wrong there. Now, we
(14:23):
often talk about, well, youknow, maybe they didn't get a good
upbringing. There were valuestaught to them by their parents.
And look, the. The reality iswe don't know what gets taught in
the home. Right. Every parenthas their background, their way of
educating their kids. There'sno real consistency in how that happens.
(14:46):
So something's going wrongbetween birth and that. And for me,
it's a lack of respect. Now,how do we change that? For me, the
solution is a completelyoverhauled education system. And
we can get into the specificsof that, but that is effectively
(15:07):
changing the education systemfrom just being, you know, schools
from being institutions forlearning subject matter into actually
becoming incubators fornurturing great human beings. And
I think once we do that,rather than trying to treat homelessness
or poverty or domesticviolence. You actually knock out
(15:30):
a whole lot of those at theiractual core before they even happen.
Because it's very difficult tosee someone that's been brought up
through their whole schoollife learning about respect, empathy
and gratitude actually comingout at the end of that and committing
crimes. It doesn't necessarilyeradicate it. And you've obviously
got, you know, psychopaths andpeople who that's not going to apply
(15:54):
to. But basically, if we canshift the way people think at the
outset, we no longer need totreat the symptoms anymore. We nip
it in the budget by solving itat the cause of those issues. And
to get back to your originalquestion about homelessness, for
me, homelessness is not ahousing issue. It's a people issue.
(16:15):
And by people, I mean us, thedecision makers. Where is the will
to solve this? Because in acompassionate world where humanity
respects each other, youwouldn't allow this to happen to
people. Now, there's somepeople who. That's their chosen way
of living. Fine. But for most,I think we allow it to happen because
(16:41):
we put our prioritieselsewhere. And that to me is because
we just don't respect eachother enough to care.
I agree with that. And, andseeing that firsthand, I think that,
that these, we as a societyneed to take a more proactive approach
in regard to being humane andcompassionate with where the circumstances
(17:03):
that put people in thosespots. Because it isn't always a
choice when that happens. So Iagree with that. If I can touch back
on. It was interesting whenyou brought up the education portion
of it. I know that we, youknow, as a parent, I'm a parent,
I've got two daughters and Imean, they're adults now. But we
(17:23):
took a very proactive approachwith our kids when in growing up
and trying to, I believe inintergenerational trauma, I think
we bring forward fromgenerations of what our ancestors
have put forth on their kids.And it compounds up to a particular
point where we have to say toourselves, I'm not going to do that.
(17:48):
I'm stopping that here and nowand in how I raise my kids. But I
think that the educationsystem in itself maybe needs to be
rehabbed. How do you seeeducation? Do you see it as a missed
opportunity to level uphumanity completely, maybe change
the curriculum?
Well, yeah. I mean, theeducation system, as I say, is traditionally
(18:11):
it's, it's a throwback fromthe industrial revolution. Right.
What we're doing is massproducing our workforce to increase
gdp. Right. That's what it is,it's an economic mandate and we haven't
changed it since then. Where,you know, we don't really nurture
or look at the individual asmuch as we should. And we're certainly
(18:34):
not teaching the values atschool. We, you know, we hope that
they might infer some of thevalues from text that they read or,
you know, they might go on anexcursion to a, a museum or a cultural
location. But we're, we'redoing that almost as a, by the way,
(18:55):
kind of learning where I'msaying it should actually be part
of a co curriculum alongsidetraditional subject matter. And I
think we just haven't given itthat importance. Now. It's a big,
it's a big thing to change,you know, the curriculum. And I'm,
I'm saying we need to do thisglobally. There's no point changing
it, you know, in one part ofthe world and, and not everywhere,
(19:18):
because, you know, we are a,an international, small, smaller,
shrinking globe. We're allinterconnected. So I, I see the opportunity
here for humanity to level upis to actually create a curriculum
that exists alongside thetraditional subject matter, but is
(19:40):
at its core teaching values ofrespect, empathy, gratitude, life
skills, a whole lot of thingsthat aren't really taught now in
a direct way. And they shouldbe taught in an age and culturally
sensitive, appropriate wayfrom preschool right through schooling.
And they just keep learningand advancing more as they go through.
(20:03):
And by the time they comethrough at the end, we would hope
that they would be verydifferent people than the kids today
who are learning math,science, geography. And that's, you
know, mostly. And I'm notsaying that's a very big generalization
I'm making, right. And thereare lots of schools that do other
things. They learnmindfulness, and there are lots of
(20:26):
other things. But I'm sayingit's not consistent. It's not, it's
not what we would call part ofthe formal learning. So there's no
way to know who's getting it,who's not getting it. And I see that
if we can do that, it's not anovernight fix by any means. It is
a multi generational approach.But we need to start, we need to
(20:49):
start now. And it just meansthat if the kids today started in
that curriculum, you know, atthe age of three or whatever, in
15 years time, they come outmaybe another five, ten years after
that, they become the parentsof the next generation who are going
through school life. All of asudden you've got a greater population
(21:11):
who are now exposed to thatway of thinking. And we would see
society transform over thenext 50 years just through that.
I agree with that. I thinkthat it would create, it kind of
would be an inner shift withinourselves and society in general.
You know, when I went to highschool, we had, we had home economics,
(21:33):
but it was a, it was a, anoption to take. It wasn't a mandatory
thing to take to understandhow a kitchen works and how to cook
and how to cook for yourselfor how to clean and this kind of
thing, just like wood shopwas, auto mechanics was. And when
you realize, you get out intothe world. You know, I made sure
(21:54):
that our daughters, they knewhow to cook. They know how to sew
their own stuff if they neededto. They know how to change the oil
in the car, they know how tochange a tire.
And where have they learned that?
They learned it from me and mywife, you know, which.
But not every family's goingto have that opportunity.
Every family has thatopportunity. Exactly. So, yes, I
(22:17):
agree with you. I think thatthere does need to be a change and
I think an inner shift withinus all and within society itself
to allow us to kind ofredefine ourselves and what we want
to see our children grow upinto and contribute to society in
that kind of a way. You talkabout redefining success. You know,
(22:42):
how do you personally definethat? If I can ask that question?
I mean, we mentioned earlieras we were introing, and here I just
made a quick note, is thatwhen I grew up and when you grew
up, you watched your father goto work, supposed to have a picket
fence, you know, a dog and acat, two and a half kids, you know,
(23:04):
Monday through Friday, 8:00amto work, noon lunch, one o', clock,
you're done, get off at five,get up, do the same thing. But how
do, maybe. How do you redefine success?
I think the way I see success.Yeah. Is less about, you know, earning
(23:25):
money and more aboutcontribution and meaning and purpose.
My idea of success foreveryone is that we're doing something
that's meaningful and gives uspurpose and, you know, hopefully
joy out of it too, so that noone is forced to. To go to work and
(23:46):
do something just to earnmoney to survive. I mean, that's
for me. To spend your wholelife doing that, just to be able
to eke out a living. Seemscompletely that we've missed the
point. I understand. That isthe reality for so many people today
that, you know, you don't havea choice. And often it means taking
(24:08):
on several jobs just to Keep aroof over your head. But I'm questioning
that and saying, why do weallow a system to enable that to
be the normal thing to do? Youknow, my opening line in the book
is, what's the point? What'sthe point of life as we know it?
(24:29):
Because if we expect thatpeople are going to spend their life
doing that and, you know, itkeeps them on the treadmill, keeps
them out of mischief, they'rebusy, but it. This, there may not
be any meaning in that. Andso, you know, again, like we said
to, to work, just to be ableto provide and then maybe get a holiday
(24:50):
for a week at the end of theyear, it just seems wrong. Now there
are plenty of people who aredoing just okay and plenty of people
are doing very nicely, thankyou. For them, their reality is very
different. But I'm saying thatfor everyone else, there needs to
(25:11):
be a minimum level of qualityof life that everyone has access
to. You know, in the book Italk about a universal basic income
as one of those ways to solveit, that everyone just receives a
basic income every month to beable to cover basic needs. Roof over
your head and food. Now, ifyou want to write music or poetry
(25:35):
or paint all day and that'swhat gives you joy, then maybe you,
that's what you do. And you,you live off the basic income. But
do that for others who want tomaybe improve their life circumstances,
then they can choose to gointo business or do other things.
(25:56):
And it may mean instead ofworking five, six days a week, you
can just work part time then.So it's giving everyone that opportunity
to find meaning forthemselves. That's what success looks
like to me.
I agree with that. I think,you know, that it's a cliche that
(26:18):
some of us are saying, youknow, we work, we spend 25 or 30
years at a business or acompany or a government agency or
whatever the case may be. Andthen when we reach that pinnacle,
we get to retire. Then we geta retirement, Social Security retirement
or a retirement from thecompany or the business or the government.
(26:40):
And it allows us to kind ofreflect. It would be nice if we could
flip that. You're kind ofsaying, flip that. Give it to me
now so that we can enjoy life.Because I think, and correct me if
I'm wrong, but I think the waywe're doing it now kind of contributes
to the depression and theanxiety and the. All the mental health
(27:05):
challenges that we'reexperiencing. A good portion of them.
I think that. Do you thinkthat contributes to those, by the
way, we're doing society atthe moment, by the way. We're put
into this almost like anassembly line. You go, absolutely.
You go to school, you learnthis, you get out, you could do a
(27:26):
job and then you go out, yougo to work and you do it for 25 years.
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it,for many, it just seems hopeless.
There's no way out of thatcycle, you know. And even when you
retire, what does retirementlook like? And these days we're living
longer, you know, how can you.I mean, you have what, a 401k? Is
(27:50):
that it there?
Yeah, yeah, 401k. And thenSocial Security. If, if, when you
reach 65. Well, now thatthey're upping it, so they're changing
the time that you can retirenow, it used to be 65 to 67. Now
they're trying to up it to 70.But, but yeah, you get, you get one
or the other or sometimes both.
(28:12):
Yeah, and we've got thesimilar thing here. And you know,
you, you, you put aside moneyevery, every month and hope that
that's going to be enough tolast you when you stop working. And
often it's not. You know, Imean, what quality of life can you
live, you know, from, from thepension or, you know, that sort of
(28:32):
thing. So, you know, it'sreally about. I mean, I like, I like
your way of framing it that,you know, maybe we should bring it
forward rather than getting itall at the end. The way I see it
is that, and there's a wholebig discussion around a universal
basic income. You know, whatdoes it look like, who's going to
pay for it, how much does itpeople get for it and does it lead
(28:56):
to nobody working? So who'sgoing to provide services? There's
a lot of great questions andthere are answers to those questions.
But imagine that everyone hadthe dignity of just having their
basic needs met. And if youchose to follow creative pursuits,
you could, if you wanted tovolunteer and still know that you
(29:21):
could have your basic needsmet, but you could do good for others
without expecting it tonecessarily be a commercial decision.
You could. So it's opening upthose other options for people to
find meaning. And that's whatI get back to. If you can find meaning
for you, then go do that.That's what life should be. You know,
(29:44):
it shouldn't be that some getto, you know, live in extreme wealth
and others are barelysurviving. There's something wrong
with that model. But we allowit to propagate. We are enabling
that to be the system youknow, he who dies with the most toys
wins. That's, that's life. Andit's, there's something wrong with
(30:06):
that.
Well, and that brings me to.We were talking earlier about justice
and what justice looks like inthis world. I spent my career in
the justice system. My wife iscurrently in the justice system working.
And what we're seeing intoday's day and age, especially here
(30:27):
in America, is a miscarriageof justice in so many ways. We as
human beings, it's hard tolive in alignment with respect and
empathy and gratitude when westart kind of observing or experiencing
the miscarriage of justice,how it's played out, how it's delved
(30:49):
out in how they're doingthings. What kind of advice do you
think help us understand whatcan we do to still live in alignment
with respect, empathy andgratitude in spite of some of those
injustices?
I don't believe we actuallyhave a justice system. I believe
(31:09):
we have a legal system. Idon't think we have a justice system.
You know, and the whole pointof re educating society is to get
people who get to those pointsof power in 20, 30 years to actually
have that compassionate,empathetic view. So there is that
(31:29):
gap between now and then andhow do we deal with that? For me,
in the scheme of things,that's a very small bit of time in
the overall scheme of thingsto address. I talk in the book about
four relationships, right,that underpin the philosophy. There's
our relationship to theuniverse, you know, the amazing awe
(31:53):
and wonder that each of us area miracle just to even be here. That
you know, that the planet evenexists in the way it does, that our
human bodies exist. So that'sthe first thing. If we have awe and
wonder and respect for nature,then that's the start, right? When
you do that, it's very hard togo and you know, king hit someone
(32:17):
when you think of them as anindividual living miracle. The second
relationship is ourrelationship with ourselves. So understanding
our triggers, our filters, ourpatterns, the way that we see the
world and how it impacts onour actions. And that the idea that
(32:38):
reality is not an objectivereality, it's only our reality. And
so it's being more self awareof that. When you learn that, you
start to see thingsdifferently as well. You can catch
yourself in the middle of anautopilot thought. The third relationship
(32:59):
is that of inner circle. Andthat's what I mean by that, is our
relationship with our friends,family and people that we deal with
in the community regularly.You know, do we treat them how they
deserve to be treated, or dowe treat them based on our filters
or even just how we feel onthe day? And then finally, the relationship
(33:19):
with community. Now that maybe someone at the end of your street,
or it could be someone on theother side of the world, someone
who you may never have met,but you're still connected to them
through that invisible threadcalled humanity. And it's those four
relationships. When you startto learn those, you start to have
(33:40):
a very different view of theworld. So in answer to your question,
it's very hard to solveinjustice today, but when you have
these kids coming through in,you know, decades to come, hopefully
they start to see the world ina different light and the relationship
(34:01):
between all of us together. Sothat's how I see the longer term
view. In the short term, it'sa hard one. I don't know how we solve
it right now because you'vegot, you know, lots of narcissists,
sociopaths, people inpositions of power who are making
(34:23):
decisions often for their ownego, often for their own agendas.
And it's hard to change thatbecause a lot of the world still
just lets that exist. And I'msaying with a vacuum there, it's
very hard to challenge it. Andthat's why we need to reprogram society
(34:46):
to think differently.
I agree with you. I know thatin some of the notes that I have
prior to starting this. How doyou think the Secret plays into this?
I mean, we've heard about theSecret. I've had conversations about
the Secret with regard to theuniverse and us being able to manifest
(35:08):
what we want or what we needand how to achieve those kind of
goals? Do you think thatthat's, that's a methodology that
we can guide thosephilosophies that you just talked
about for, for ourselves inregard to living and changing and
helping others change around us?
Well, yeah, manifestation is avery powerful force. And you know,
(35:33):
I've been often asked, is whatyou're talking about just utopia?
Is it unrealistic? And I saythis, you've got to put a destination
in your GPS to even get closeto getting there, right? So I'm saying
that in our GPS for society,we don't want to put a mediocre goal
(35:56):
and aim to get to that. I'msaying we set up these big, hairy,
audacious goals that we wantto overhaul society. We want equality,
we want justice, we want abetter life for everyone. Not just
for some, but for everyone.That's the, that's the destination
in our gps. Now we've gotsomewhere to head. So we start driving.
(36:19):
We'll. We'll find obstacles.We'll have to get rerouted. You know,
things will happen. And evenif we don't get all the way there,
well, maybe we can drive asclose as we can and walk the rest
of the way. I'm suggestingthat that manifestation is critical
for us to actually think,firstly, and that's why I called
(36:40):
it the philosophy, because youcan't change anything until you first
have the thoughts aboutwanting to change it. Manifestation
isn't going to happen justfrom thinking about it. We need to
go further. But that is thefirst step.
And I can admire that andappreciate that, because I think
(37:02):
we all in life have a choice,and sometimes we don't understand
the choice unless we have thetools to be able to understand that
choice. And I think the book,the philosophy and the organization
helps us to have the toolsavailable for us to understand how
we can begin living withpurpose, collectively and responsibly,
(37:25):
as a society, as a human beingand as society.
I actually have a chapter inthe book called the Magic Glasses,
and it talks about. Have youever tried augmented reality glasses,
Michael?
I do. Well, I mean, I've gotan Oculus Meta Quest. Oculus?
(37:45):
Yeah.
Would that be the same thing?I'm guessing, yeah.
Yeah. So I guess thedifference is that's virtual reality.
Augmented reality is where youcan see things, but you can still
see in the space that you'rein as well.
Oh, I can do that on my. I cando that on this. I'm pointing to
it like you can see me. Likeyou can see it. It's laying right
(38:09):
over there.
Gila stood. They're fantastic.But what I talk about there is, for
anyone else who's not wearingthe glasses, they don't see what
you're seeing. Right. Theyonly see what the reality is to them.
But when you start to learnthe tools of the philosophy, all
of a sudden you see thingsthat weren't there. And in fact,
(38:31):
I talk about, you know, themovie Sliding Doors with Gwyneth
Paltrow. It's one where if yougo this way or you go that way, and
the only way with thesechoices becoming apparent is to have
the awareness that you evenhave the tools available to you.
(38:52):
So, you know, when you dothat, all of a sudden options start
to appear that weren't therebefore. And, you know, to your point,
when you learn the tools andyou learn that awareness, that self
awareness and the awareness ofnature, the universe, and everything
Else all of a sudden thingslook different. And it's very powerful,
(39:15):
very powerful. But for a lotof people, it's like I'm so busy
with my life, I don't havetime for this mumbo jumbo. I'm just,
you know, got to get my livingand I've got to do this. And I'm
just busy, busy, busy, busy,busy. And they stay on the treadmill,
you.
Know, I agree with that. Youknow, it's interesting because I've
always said, and I've said itbefore in this program, you know,
(39:37):
Covid is a double edged swordbecause here the state shut down
and my wife got to work fromhome for two years, basically recovering
from that. And what that didwas give us a different perspective
on our day. Because before wewere getting up at 3 in the morning,
(39:58):
3:30 in the morning, she wasgetting ready for work. She's spending
an hour, hour and 15 minutesin horrific traffic. And me watching
the news while she's on theway to work and hearing about all
these accidents andeverything. Tense, you know, makes
you tense. And then spendingeight hours, eight and a half hours
(40:19):
at a cubicle and then spendingan hour, hour and 15 minutes on the
way home, shoving down dinner,falling asleep on the couch, and
then getting up, going to bedand do it all over again. It gave
us a pause and it allowed usto kind of. We got up at a decent
time. There was a commute tothe back patio. We did what you mentioned
(40:42):
earlier. We went out, we had acup of tea, we watched the sunrise,
we watched the birds and thebees, you know, go around our plants
and the hummingbirds and wewatched the sun come up on our face.
And it was more of anappreciation and we got to relax.
It's a 30 second commute tothe computer. And then we stop and
(41:04):
had lunch together. We haddone that for ages. And then she
32nd back to work. When shewas done, we went back out on the
patio and it was great. Ithink what we learned from that and
what we were able to take awayfrom that is society put on us. This
(41:25):
is what you do. You go towork, you spend an hour and 15 minutes
in traffic on the way. You doa job all day long in a little tiny
cubicle. You're locked in,can't look out the window, can't
do this, can't do that, we'lllet you out for lunch, but you got
to come back. And then youspend an hour and 15 minutes in crappy
traffic all the way home. Youcome home In a bad mood, you eat
(41:48):
dinner, you watch an hour'sworth of tv, you go to bed. That's
what you're supposed to do. Werealized that there's more to life
than that and we got to enjoylife a little bit and get a work
life balance. And so now sheworks a hybrid schedule. And it's
amazing the difference. And itgoes back to the manifestation that
(42:09):
you were talking about just tovalidate what you're saying. We wanted
this to stick. Well, it stuckto a point because she's on a hybrid
situation, which gives usSaturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday,
it's that normal. And thenWednesday, Thursday, Friday.
Resistance, right? A lot ofresistance. Oh, yeah, there's a lot
(42:30):
of resistance about, you know,working from home and continuing
that because there is so muchpressure to get back to the old way
of how it was. And that's thepressure of what we're used to, because
that's the way we've alwaysdone it. So, you know, but we experience
what it was like to have thatpause to realign what's really important
(42:53):
in life. And yet the forcessaid, no, go back to how you were.
You know, it's the same herein the, in the cbd, like where I'm
from, in Melbourne, inVictoria, the state of Victoria,
we were the most locked downcity in the whole world. We were
locked down for the mostnumber of days out of anyone. And
(43:14):
it was just a crazy time. Andyet when it all came to an end, there
was a rush. Everyone come backand work in the towers in the city
again, get back in. Why?Because we've got to support the
cafes and the businesses inthe city. And for me, that was a
missed opportunity again forus to rethink what is the purpose
(43:37):
of our cbd. What could we dowith it? How could we do things differently?
But no, it was like, no, let'sget back as quickly as possible to
the old ways of doing things.
And I think that puts you goback to what you said earlier in
this conversation in regardto, you know, society has a particular
control over us as a humanbeing. And they say, this is the
(43:58):
way you're supposed to do it.We're not going to deviate from that.
It works for us. Andpersonally, I think it reflects back
on the capitalism. You know,I'm not afraid to make money, I'm
not afraid to work for one ofGod. But it goes back to capitalism.
They control us to a pointthat is difficult for us to step
(44:20):
outside of that arena. But Ithink, I think you have a blueprint
in the philosophy for changeand for change makers to kind of
take an understanding andmaybe create the kind of world that
we hope to choose from and togo, to go forward. How can we. How
can we implement that? How canwe help our leaders, our community
(44:43):
and those around us understandthat there is a different perspective
we need to take a look at?
Look, the first thing I wouldsay is, you know, we live in the
most connected time ever, andyet we are the most disconnected
we've ever been. And, youknow, we. We go to work, we come
home, we drive into ourgarage, we lock the doors, we turn
(45:07):
on our security cameras, closethe blinds, and hey, now we're. We're
safe. For me, we've lost thatconnection with those around us.
You know, our. Our villagethat used to be the people we lived
around and with has nowmigrated online and we've lost that
connection. So a very simplething people can do is just go and
(45:30):
reconnect with your neighbors,connect with people you haven't met.
And it might be challenging toa lot of people that, you know, I'm.
They're not like me or I'mdifferent or I'm scared. What if
someone takes advantage of meor harms me or something? And it's
that closed view that we haveof others that creates the divisions.
(45:51):
It's those divisions that wesee perpetuated through society.
So if we can just change thatat the grassroots level, just talk
to your neighbors, and ifeveryone did that, we could then
see a ripple out. So that's avery simple thing that anyone can
do today. You know, and infact, there is a National Neighbor
(46:13):
Day in the US there's one hereas well. And in. As there are in
most parts of the world whereyou take the opportunity to get to
know your neighbors, there'slots of events that happen. And,
you know, I encourage peopleto go and look that up in their area
and see how they canparticipate. So that's the first
thing. Another thing thatpeople can do is come and read the
(46:38):
philosophy, come and connectmore. Because we have actually on
the website, which I knowyou've got on the screen, the philosophy.net
there is a community platformthere for people to join and get
involved in some of thesediscussions. At the end of the day,
this isn't a book. This is amovement. And it means we want people
(47:00):
to understand it, talk toother people about it, share it with
other people, and start to getthat movement going in their areas.
Because if people startthinking locally in their neighborhoods,
and in their local communitiesand with their local educators, then
we can start to make thingshappen. You know, it's really about
(47:23):
awareness. Can ourpoliticians, can our decision makers,
can our educators look intothis and start to think a little
bit differently? Because it'snot. We're not trying to challenge,
to disempower them. In fact,what we're trying to do is empower
everyone to be successful. Youknow, because if, let's say, I've
(47:45):
got all the wealth in theworld and there are people around
me doing it so tough, there'severy chance someone might break
into my home and cause harm tome because they're struggling to
get by. But I'm in my littleivory tower thinking I'm fine. And
yet it is selfishly good forus to make sure everyone else is
(48:09):
doing well too. And that'swhat we need to understand. It's
not. You're right. Capitalismdoes breed a competitive nature.
Right. We all compete for ajob, we compete for housing, we compete
for everything. And that's areal shame. And we need, you know,
I'm not against capitalism,but there are certainly some things
(48:29):
that capitalism needs toanswer for. Right. You know, the,
the toll it takes on, onpeople, on customers, staff, you
know, to run a business in acapitalist society. The definition
of success currently is growth.
Yeah, right.
You have to grow. If you don'tmake more this year than you made
(48:50):
last year, then you haven'tgrown. If you haven't grown, you'll
get reprimanded by yourshareholders. So, you know, at what
cost, what cost is it takingfrom you to continually keep growing?
Right. You know, that's what,how we're driven and businesses will
do whatever it takes, whetherit's increase your productivity,
(49:13):
cut costs, get rid of staff,do this, do you know, make it harder.
Because in the name of growth.
Unfortunately. I sayunfortunately because in reality,
I think that we. Again, even Ihave a business degree as well, so.
A business management degree,actually. And, you know, in that
(49:34):
in itself, I understand theconcept of it, but I also understand
when I was a cop, I had ateam, a team of 13 guys, and we worked
very cohesively together. Wedid it because we have mutual respect
for each other. And, you know,we had one goal collectively that
we were trying to reach orobtain. So even from a management
(49:57):
position, in regard to that,you know, we have to think about
our employees and who we'reworking for and who got us here and
who's making the money for us.It's not just the person sitting
behind the big desk, it's thepeople on the street doing. Doing
the work. How can somebody geta hold of you and find on and find
out more about the movementand find more about how to get the
(50:19):
book and how they can get involved?
Yeah. So the website is thephilosophy.net. you'll find information
about the book there. There'slinks there to purchase it. It's
available at Amazon and manyother sites as well. It's available
in paperback, Kindle andaudiobook formats. And as I said,
(50:44):
we also have an onlineplatform there where people can join
and get involved in those conversations.
And I'll make sure that's inthe show notes so that everybody
has an easy way just to clickand find you. This time went by so
fast, Alex.
Yeah, there's. There's so muchto talk. I mean, I, you know, we
could go on for hours. Wecould do season two, season three.
(51:08):
Exactly. But effectively itis. There's so much here that needs
to change in the world. That'sreally what it boils down to. And,
you know, I tackle a lot ofthings in this book. You know, the
first half is talking aboutthe concept of the philosophy. The
second half addressesdifferent sectors, you know, politics,
the economy, all those sortsof things. So there's a lot to get
(51:30):
through and we know there's alot wrong. I don't want to sound
hopeless. I guess that's whyI've created what I consider is a
manifesto, a pathway or ablueprint, as you put it, to change
things rather than just feelhopeless, that nothing is changeable.
So if we all work together,anything is possible. Remember, there's
(51:52):
no utopia without you.
I love.
It's just topia.
Exactly. It's just topia. Thenyou think about toes and then that
goes south from there.
Yeah.
Well, look, I would love tohave you back on and we could continue
this conversation down theroad. I think that we have a lot
(52:14):
more to discuss, a lot more tosay, and I wish this segment was
a little bit longer. So Iwould love to have you back if we
can do that. We can arrangethat if you'd like.
Thanks, Michael. I would loveto come back.
In the meantime, this is onemore thing before you go. So if someone
always asks for words ofwisdom, if someone is listening right
(52:36):
now and they're quietlydissatisfied or they want to change,
or they want to know how tochange, what's some words of wisdom
or first question they shouldask themselves?
Ask yourself the firstquestion in the book. What's the
point? What's the point oflife for you. What does it mean for
(52:56):
you? And you know, everyone'sgot to define it for themselves.
What it means for some, it's,you know, having grandkids, you know,
for some, it's being creative.What is it for you? And then find
a way for that true north tonot get diverted. Stick to that true
north of who you are and whatit means for you.
(53:20):
Brilliant words of wisdom. Ithink that we all should take that
opportunity and grasp it tohelp us all move forward. Alex, thank
you very much for being on theshow. I really appreciate you. What
you bring to the world. Ithink that you've reminded us that
the systems we live in aren'tjust flawed, they're inherited. And
if we have the courage toquestion them, we also have the power
(53:41):
to change them. Thisphilosophy isn't just a book. It's
a mirror, a map, and amovement. It asks us to stop chasing
what we're told to want andstart building what we truly need
as a community. Becausesometimes the most radical shift
begins with just one morething before you go.
Thanks, Michael.
That's a wrap. I hope youfound inspirational motivation, motivational
(54:04):
and a few new perspectives totake with you. If you enjoyed this
conversation, be sure to likesubscribe and follow us. It really
helps us continue bringing youincredible stories and insights like
the one today. And if you wantto watch this episode, head over
to YouTube, catch the fullvideo version. We also love to hear
from you. If you have anyquestions or show ideas or think
you make a great guest or wantto contribute to this episode, reach
(54:25):
out. Let's connect. This showthrives because of an amazing community
and I appreciate each andevery one of you. So until next time,
have a great day and evenbetter week. And remember, keep growing.
Keep thriving. One more thingbefore you go. Have a great day,
have a great week and thankyou for being here. Thanks for listening
to this episode of One MoreThing before you go. Check out our
(54:48):
website@beforeyougopodcast.comyou can find us as well as subscribe
to the program and rate us onyour favorite podcast listening platform.
Hey, one more Thing before yougo. What if success wasn't wealth
but human connection? And whatif the systems we live by, education,
healthcare, justice, aren'tbroken but function exactly as we
designed? In this week'sepisode of One more thing before
you go, I sit down with AlexKane. He's an entrepreneur, systems
thinker and author of thephilosophy A Critical Upgrade for
(00:22):
Humanity. After years ofoptimizing business processes, Alex
turned his lens towardssociety itself, asking the most human
question, what's the point?His answer? A bold manifesto that
challenges the status quo andinvites us to radically rethink how
we define success, value andimpact. Drawing inspiration from
(00:42):
donut Economics, Utopia forRealists and empowering spirit of
the secret, Alex offers ablueprint for a more just connected
and purpose driven world. Thisisn't just a conversation about what's
broken, it's a reckoning, aremembering, a call to reclaim what's
sacred. I'm your host, MichaelErnst. Welcome to one more thing
(01:04):
before you go. My guest, AlexKane is an Australian based entrepreneur,
systems thinker and founder ofthe Philosophy. It's a social movement
encouraging a new way ofthinking about success, happiness
(01:27):
and collective responsibility.Alex has spent years assisting businesses
to run more efficientlythrough an analysis of their systems
and processes. More recentlyhe turned his attention to society
itself, applying his expertisein system optimization to a deeper
understanding facing humanity.Through the philosophy, Alex is inspiring
(01:49):
business leaders, changemakers and everyday people to find
our way to the North Star. AndI'm excited to talk about this. Welcome
to the show, Alex.
Thanks Michael for having me.
What a journey that you'vebeen on in life.
Yeah, well it's, you know,everyone has their own story. Mine,
(02:12):
mine has been a journey of, Iguess, self discovery through life
experience like everyone else,you know, I began life doing lots
of different jobs and I was aprivate investigator, I worked in
a dating agency, I was a standup comedian and you know, just trying
to find my little pathway andI guess that led me to discover technology
(02:38):
and the Internet and I set upInternet businesses and, and software
businesses and, and I guess asI was finding a level of success,
I started to question whatsuccess actually meant. You know,
it felt a little bit hollow tome in some respects and, and hence
(02:59):
the ideas of the philosophywas born from that.
Well, that's amazing and Ican't wait to get into that. I think
from what I've learned so far,I think it's an amazing opportunity
for us as a human being, as asociety and us as a culture to reflect
upon what needs to be changedand what can be changed and how we
have the possibility changingit. But I do like to start at the
(03:21):
beginning. Where'd you grow up?
Well, I'm in and was born inMelbourne, Australia, and middle
class. Nothing spectacularabout my upbringing. Mother and father.
Dad worked his whole life. Mumlooked after the home and myself
(03:45):
and my two sisters, you know,we grew up quite, quite average.
Nothing special there. But Idid see my father go to work every
day and, you know, struggledto put food on the table and. And
I guess that's in some waycontributed to the philosophy. My
idea of, you know, what's thepoint of life? Is it to work? Is
(04:09):
it just to survive? Yeah, forme, that's where it all came from.
And in fact, I dedicate thebook to my father at the beginning.
And it's his amazing view onthe world and life that I take a
lot of my. My perspective from.
(04:32):
Do you think that inspired youto write the philosophy? I mean,
was there any other, like apersonal experience that led you
to this as well? Or, or. Imean, look, I grew up, as you can
see, I'm a little older. Justlike a lot of many, many of us, I
grew up in the 60s and the 70sand the 80s, watching my father go
(04:54):
to work every day, watching mymother go to work every day once
my father was gone. And it wasa grind, it was like, you know, it
was tough watching thatbecause they struggled constantly.
They were always tired, alwayssame old thing. Monday through Friday,
Saturday, sleep in, Sunday, goto church, started again on Monday.
(05:18):
Yeah, and if you were lucky,that pattern continued all year,
except maybe for a couple ofweeks, you might get a little break
and go somewhere and that wasthe payoff for the whole year's work.
And again, to me, that justseems wrong. It just seems that we're
stuck in that rut, that that'swhat's expected of us and that's
(05:41):
what we need to do. And, youknow, I. I talk about the phrase
earn a living, you know, thefact that we have to earn our life.
You know, we're brought intothis world through no choice of our
own. But now we're lumberedwith the need to go to work, to get
food and a roof over our headfor the rest of our lives to be able
(06:04):
to survive. So that earning ofa life for me seems like it should
just be a given. Everyone hasthe right to just survive now. From
there you should be able tothrive and level up and do other
things. But I believe it is ahuman right. Just to have that basic
(06:24):
need met.
I think that goes back to yourquestion. Is this all there is? Because
if you look at life like fromthat perspective in which all of
us, 90% of us grew up as itkind of is, is this all there is
to life? There's got to besomething more than this grind that
(06:45):
you just mentioned.
Well, I guess, you know, wesee success modeled to us on TV and
in the media and we aspire toaccumulate wealth so that we can
have that level of success.That's the gold stand standard we're
trying to get to. Right.That's what we're told we need to
achieve, to have a good life.But I guess what are we giving up
(07:11):
to get that, to get there?What's the opportunity cost of the
other things that we'reforsaking in terms of time spent
with family, our ability tofollow our passions and joys, our
ability to be more humane andyou know, explore that part of ourselves?
(07:34):
We, we really are forced tocompete in the world just to survive.
And you know, within acapitalist society, that's kind of
the goal, is that you, he whodies with the most toys wins. Right.
It's kind of modeled to us.And as I was climbing that ladder,
(07:56):
you know, I, I was lookingaround me and feeling this isn't
success if there are so manyother people doing it so tough. I
can't feel successful if I'vejust got to the top of my own little
mountain, you know, and that'sthe COVID of my book. It's pretty
much a Maslow's hierarchy, youknow, that we're all in a rush to
get to the top, to selfactualize, but you know, without
(08:19):
the social responsibilityaspect of I don't think we're actually
being successful.
I agree. And I think, did youcome to that analysis? I mean, you've
got a business optimizationbackground within yourself. I mean
you kind of, from what I canunderstand, you kind of took that
skill set to analyze societalsystems kind of in the same way and
(08:43):
how we should be, should bekind of operating as a, as a human
being, as a society.
Yeah, exactly. I mean my, mybusiness was a software development
business. I go into companiesand look at their systems, processes,
how they do things and see ifthere's room for efficiencies and
optimization. And I guess whenyou, you think like that day in,
(09:06):
day out, it's very hard tojust see what's around us every day
with our systems and processesin society and not question those.
And so, you know, it led me toJust go, hang on a minute, does this
even make sense anymore? Arethese systems and processes serving
us or are we now serving them?And are we just doing it? Because
(09:29):
that's the way we've alwaysdone it. And so, you know, there's
a chapter in the book calledQuestion Everything because I think
we've just got so used toaccepting that certain things just
are and that they'reimmovable. But you know, I talk about
many man made constructs inthe book. You know, money is a man
(09:50):
made construct. A piece ofpaper or plastic holds no value intrinsically.
But we, we assign a value toit all by consensus and agreement.
But if we all woke up tomorrowand said money holds no value, what
would happen? And you know,the same with country borders. They're
man made, we created them, itdivides us. But the life of someone
(10:17):
living on one side of a bordercompared to on the other side of
a border, only feet away fromeach other, can be completely different.
And yet these man madeconstructs are seemingly permanent
in our minds. And that's justhow it is. And so we pivot everything
else around them. You know,rather than looking at the humanity
(10:39):
aspect, we just go, well no,that's the border, that's where it
ends. And that's all you get.And I just think we've got to be
a little bit more humane, Iguess, in that respect.
Humane and compassionate andunderstanding. And they were all
human beings. No matter whatborder you live on or other side
of the border you live on, nomatter what color, race, creed, religion,
(11:04):
we're all still human beingsand part of community. I mean, that's
just the way that I look atit. I've seen, look as a cop, I've
seen the worst in people andin conditions and I've seen the best
people at their worst. And youknow, it kind of changes the perspective
on society as a whole when youstart looking at that because you,
(11:27):
you see the line, but you alsosee everything. There's so more similarities
in there than they want toadmit to. Even on like a, an upper
class and a lower class and apoverty level. There's so many that
still overlap.
Well, we're so much more thesame than we are different. And unfortunately
(11:50):
those differences are used todivide us rather than for us to celebrate
those differences anduniqueness. You know, I, I often
talk about having a look atsome images of some embryos and you
tell me which one is the, theJew, the Muslim, the Christian, the
left voter, right voter, we'reall the same, you know, everything
(12:13):
Else is just layers on top ofthat, and we shouldn't be using them
to divide us, but we do. And,you know, is that a fear thing? Is
it a tribal thing? You know,we can change that.
We have a. We have to make achoice. You challenge the idea that
poverty and homelessness areinevitable. What's the one thing
(12:33):
that you believe could solvethese issues? I've seen a lot of
homelessness. I've beenhomeless. My family, we've come home
to a locked apartment becauseboth my parents, I was very dysfunctional
family when we grew up, camehome to lock doors on our house.
So I've seen that. I'veexperienced it. I've worked it as
(12:55):
a cop. How do you think we asa society have the ability to change
these issues? Because even inthat respect, you still see a divide
or a perception. When you seethe homeless people on the street,
you see somebody on the cornerwith a sign, you see somebody that's
walking around in dirtyclothes and doesn't have much food
(13:16):
or asking for food. And Ithink that we as society need to
recognize that and maybe helpunderstand how to solve it.
Yeah, look, there are a numberof issues in society today that in
my mind stem from a singlecause. Now, there's complexity around
(13:40):
all of these, but I do believeall of these come from a lack of
respect that we have betweeneach other and to the planet. Now,
you know, here, where I livein Melbourne, we have an issue with
youth gangs running aroundwith machetes and breaking into houses
(14:01):
and just ransacking businessesand that sort of thing. So you look
at how does a baby that'seffectively a blank slate go from
that to at the age of 12 yearsold running around in a gang with
machete terrorizing people?Something is wrong there. Now, we
(14:23):
often talk about, well, youknow, maybe they didn't get a good
upbringing. There were valuestaught to them by their parents.
And look, the. The reality iswe don't know what gets taught in
the home. Right. Every parenthas their background, their way of
educating their kids. There'sno real consistency in how that happens.
(14:46):
So something's going wrongbetween birth and that. And for me,
it's a lack of respect. Now,how do we change that? For me, the
solution is a completelyoverhauled education system. And
we can get into the specificsof that, but that is effectively
(15:07):
changing the education systemfrom just being, you know, schools
from being institutions forlearning subject matter into actually
becoming incubators fornurturing great human beings. And
I think once we do that,rather than trying to treat homelessness
or poverty or domesticviolence. You actually knock out
(15:30):
a whole lot of those at theiractual core before they even happen.
Because it's very difficult tosee someone that's been brought up
through their whole schoollife learning about respect, empathy
and gratitude actually comingout at the end of that and committing
crimes. It doesn't necessarilyeradicate it. And you've obviously
got, you know, psychopaths andpeople who that's not going to apply
(15:54):
to. But basically, if we canshift the way people think at the
outset, we no longer need totreat the symptoms anymore. We nip
it in the budget by solving itat the cause of those issues. And
to get back to your originalquestion about homelessness, for
me, homelessness is not ahousing issue. It's a people issue.
(16:15):
And by people, I mean us, thedecision makers. Where is the will
to solve this? Because in acompassionate world where humanity
respects each other, youwouldn't allow this to happen to
people. Now, there's somepeople who. That's their chosen way
of living. Fine. But for most,I think we allow it to happen because
(16:41):
we put our prioritieselsewhere. And that to me is because
we just don't respect eachother enough to care.
I agree with that. And, andseeing that firsthand, I think that,
that these, we as a societyneed to take a more proactive approach
in regard to being humane andcompassionate with where the circumstances
(17:03):
that put people in thosespots. Because it isn't always a
choice when that happens. So Iagree with that. If I can touch back
on. It was interesting whenyou brought up the education portion
of it. I know that we, youknow, as a parent, I'm a parent,
I've got two daughters and Imean, they're adults now. But we
(17:23):
took a very proactive approachwith our kids when in growing up
and trying to, I believe inintergenerational trauma, I think
we bring forward fromgenerations of what our ancestors
have put forth on their kids.And it compounds up to a particular
point where we have to say toourselves, I'm not going to do that.
(17:48):
I'm stopping that here and nowand in how I raise my kids. But I
think that the educationsystem in itself maybe needs to be
rehabbed. How do you seeeducation? Do you see it as a missed
opportunity to level uphumanity completely, maybe change
the curriculum?
Well, yeah. I mean, theeducation system, as I say, is traditionally
(18:11):
it's, it's a throwback fromthe industrial revolution. Right.
What we're doing is massproducing our workforce to increase
gdp. Right. That's what it is,it's an economic mandate and we haven't
changed it since then. Where,you know, we don't really nurture
or look at the individual asmuch as we should. And we're certainly
(18:34):
not teaching the values atschool. We, you know, we hope that
they might infer some of thevalues from text that they read or,
you know, they might go on anexcursion to a, a museum or a cultural
location. But we're, we'redoing that almost as a, by the way,
(18:55):
kind of learning where I'msaying it should actually be part
of a co curriculum alongsidetraditional subject matter. And I
think we just haven't given itthat importance. Now. It's a big,
it's a big thing to change,you know, the curriculum. And I'm,
I'm saying we need to do thisglobally. There's no point changing
it, you know, in one part ofthe world and, and not everywhere,
(19:18):
because, you know, we are a,an international, small, smaller,
shrinking globe. We're allinterconnected. So I, I see the opportunity
here for humanity to level upis to actually create a curriculum
that exists alongside thetraditional subject matter, but is
(19:40):
at its core teaching values ofrespect, empathy, gratitude, life
skills, a whole lot of thingsthat aren't really taught now in
a direct way. And they shouldbe taught in an age and culturally
sensitive, appropriate wayfrom preschool right through schooling.
And they just keep learningand advancing more as they go through.
(20:03):
And by the time they comethrough at the end, we would hope
that they would be verydifferent people than the kids today
who are learning math,science, geography. And that's, you
know, mostly. And I'm notsaying that's a very big generalization
I'm making, right. And thereare lots of schools that do other
things. They learnmindfulness, and there are lots of
(20:26):
other things. But I'm sayingit's not consistent. It's not, it's
not what we would call part ofthe formal learning. So there's no
way to know who's getting it,who's not getting it. And I see that
if we can do that, it's not anovernight fix by any means. It is
a multi generational approach.But we need to start, we need to
(20:49):
start now. And it just meansthat if the kids today started in
that curriculum, you know, atthe age of three or whatever, in
15 years time, they come outmaybe another five, ten years after
that, they become the parentsof the next generation who are going
through school life. All of asudden you've got a greater population
(21:11):
who are now exposed to thatway of thinking. And we would see
society transform over thenext 50 years just through that.
I agree with that. I thinkthat it would create, it kind of
would be an inner shift withinourselves and society in general.
You know, when I went to highschool, we had, we had home economics,
(21:33):
but it was a, it was a, anoption to take. It wasn't a mandatory
thing to take to understandhow a kitchen works and how to cook
and how to cook for yourselfor how to clean and this kind of
thing, just like wood shopwas, auto mechanics was. And when
you realize, you get out intothe world. You know, I made sure
(21:54):
that our daughters, they knewhow to cook. They know how to sew
their own stuff if they neededto. They know how to change the oil
in the car, they know how tochange a tire.
And where have they learned that?
They learned it from me and mywife, you know, which.
But not every family's goingto have that opportunity.
Every family has thatopportunity. Exactly. So, yes, I
(22:17):
agree with you. I think thatthere does need to be a change and
I think an inner shift withinus all and within society itself
to allow us to kind ofredefine ourselves and what we want
to see our children grow upinto and contribute to society in
that kind of a way. You talkabout redefining success. You know,
(22:42):
how do you personally definethat? If I can ask that question?
I mean, we mentioned earlieras we were introing, and here I just
made a quick note, is thatwhen I grew up and when you grew
up, you watched your father goto work, supposed to have a picket
fence, you know, a dog and acat, two and a half kids, you know,
(23:04):
Monday through Friday, 8:00amto work, noon lunch, one o', clock,
you're done, get off at five,get up, do the same thing. But how
do, maybe. How do you redefine success?
I think the way I see success.Yeah. Is less about, you know, earning
(23:25):
money and more aboutcontribution and meaning and purpose.
My idea of success foreveryone is that we're doing something
that's meaningful and gives uspurpose and, you know, hopefully
joy out of it too, so that noone is forced to. To go to work and
(23:46):
do something just to earnmoney to survive. I mean, that's
for me. To spend your wholelife doing that, just to be able
to eke out a living. Seemscompletely that we've missed the
point. I understand. That isthe reality for so many people today
that, you know, you don't havea choice. And often it means taking
(24:08):
on several jobs just to Keep aroof over your head. But I'm questioning
that and saying, why do weallow a system to enable that to
be the normal thing to do? Youknow, my opening line in the book
is, what's the point? What'sthe point of life as we know it?
(24:29):
Because if we expect thatpeople are going to spend their life
doing that and, you know, itkeeps them on the treadmill, keeps
them out of mischief, they'rebusy, but it. This, there may not
be any meaning in that. Andso, you know, again, like we said
to, to work, just to be ableto provide and then maybe get a holiday
(24:50):
for a week at the end of theyear, it just seems wrong. Now there
are plenty of people who aredoing just okay and plenty of people
are doing very nicely, thankyou. For them, their reality is very
different. But I'm saying thatfor everyone else, there needs to
(25:11):
be a minimum level of qualityof life that everyone has access
to. You know, in the book Italk about a universal basic income
as one of those ways to solveit, that everyone just receives a
basic income every month to beable to cover basic needs. Roof over
your head and food. Now, ifyou want to write music or poetry
(25:35):
or paint all day and that'swhat gives you joy, then maybe you,
that's what you do. And you,you live off the basic income. But
do that for others who want tomaybe improve their life circumstances,
then they can choose to gointo business or do other things.
(25:56):
And it may mean instead ofworking five, six days a week, you
can just work part time then.So it's giving everyone that opportunity
to find meaning forthemselves. That's what success looks
like to me.
I agree with that. I think,you know, that it's a cliche that
(26:18):
some of us are saying, youknow, we work, we spend 25 or 30
years at a business or acompany or a government agency or
whatever the case may be. Andthen when we reach that pinnacle,
we get to retire. Then we geta retirement, Social Security retirement
or a retirement from thecompany or the business or the government.
(26:40):
And it allows us to kind ofreflect. It would be nice if we could
flip that. You're kind ofsaying, flip that. Give it to me
now so that we can enjoy life.Because I think, and correct me if
I'm wrong, but I think the waywe're doing it now kind of contributes
to the depression and theanxiety and the. All the mental health
(27:05):
challenges that we'reexperiencing. A good portion of them.
I think that. Do you thinkthat contributes to those, by the
way, we're doing society atthe moment, by the way. We're put
into this almost like anassembly line. You go, absolutely.
You go to school, you learnthis, you get out, you could do a
(27:26):
job and then you go out, yougo to work and you do it for 25 years.
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it,for many, it just seems hopeless.
There's no way out of thatcycle, you know. And even when you
retire, what does retirementlook like? And these days we're living
longer, you know, how can you.I mean, you have what, a 401k? Is
(27:50):
that it there?
Yeah, yeah, 401k. And thenSocial Security. If, if, when you
reach 65. Well, now thatthey're upping it, so they're changing
the time that you can retirenow, it used to be 65 to 67. Now
they're trying to up it to 70.But, but yeah, you get, you get one
or the other or sometimes both.
(28:12):
Yeah, and we've got thesimilar thing here. And you know,
you, you, you put aside moneyevery, every month and hope that
that's going to be enough tolast you when you stop working. And
often it's not. You know, Imean, what quality of life can you
live, you know, from, from thepension or, you know, that sort of
(28:32):
thing. So, you know, it'sreally about. I mean, I like, I like
your way of framing it that,you know, maybe we should bring it
forward rather than getting itall at the end. The way I see it
is that, and there's a wholebig discussion around a universal
basic income. You know, whatdoes it look like, who's going to
pay for it, how much does itpeople get for it and does it lead
(28:56):
to nobody working? So who'sgoing to provide services? There's
a lot of great questions andthere are answers to those questions.
But imagine that everyone hadthe dignity of just having their
basic needs met. And if youchose to follow creative pursuits,
you could, if you wanted tovolunteer and still know that you
(29:21):
could have your basic needsmet, but you could do good for others
without expecting it tonecessarily be a commercial decision.
You could. So it's opening upthose other options for people to
find meaning. And that's whatI get back to. If you can find meaning
for you, then go do that.That's what life should be. You know,
(29:44):
it shouldn't be that some getto, you know, live in extreme wealth
and others are barelysurviving. There's something wrong
with that model. But we allowit to propagate. We are enabling
that to be the system youknow, he who dies with the most toys
wins. That's, that's life. Andit's, there's something wrong with
(30:06):
that.
Well, and that brings me to.We were talking earlier about justice
and what justice looks like inthis world. I spent my career in
the justice system. My wife iscurrently in the justice system working.
And what we're seeing intoday's day and age, especially here
(30:27):
in America, is a miscarriageof justice in so many ways. We as
human beings, it's hard tolive in alignment with respect and
empathy and gratitude when westart kind of observing or experiencing
the miscarriage of justice,how it's played out, how it's delved
(30:49):
out in how they're doingthings. What kind of advice do you
think help us understand whatcan we do to still live in alignment
with respect, empathy andgratitude in spite of some of those
injustices?
I don't believe we actuallyhave a justice system. I believe
(31:09):
we have a legal system. Idon't think we have a justice system.
You know, and the whole pointof re educating society is to get
people who get to those pointsof power in 20, 30 years to actually
have that compassionate,empathetic view. So there is that
(31:29):
gap between now and then andhow do we deal with that? For me,
in the scheme of things,that's a very small bit of time in
the overall scheme of thingsto address. I talk in the book about
four relationships, right,that underpin the philosophy. There's
our relationship to theuniverse, you know, the amazing awe
(31:53):
and wonder that each of us area miracle just to even be here. That
you know, that the planet evenexists in the way it does, that our
human bodies exist. So that'sthe first thing. If we have awe and
wonder and respect for nature,then that's the start, right? When
you do that, it's very hard togo and you know, king hit someone
(32:17):
when you think of them as anindividual living miracle. The second
relationship is ourrelationship with ourselves. So understanding
our triggers, our filters, ourpatterns, the way that we see the
world and how it impacts onour actions. And that the idea that
(32:38):
reality is not an objectivereality, it's only our reality. And
so it's being more self awareof that. When you learn that, you
start to see thingsdifferently as well. You can catch
yourself in the middle of anautopilot thought. The third relationship
(32:59):
is that of inner circle. Andthat's what I mean by that, is our
relationship with our friends,family and people that we deal with
in the community regularly.You know, do we treat them how they
deserve to be treated, or dowe treat them based on our filters
or even just how we feel onthe day? And then finally, the relationship
(33:19):
with community. Now that maybe someone at the end of your street,
or it could be someone on theother side of the world, someone
who you may never have met,but you're still connected to them
through that invisible threadcalled humanity. And it's those four
relationships. When you startto learn those, you start to have
(33:40):
a very different view of theworld. So in answer to your question,
it's very hard to solveinjustice today, but when you have
these kids coming through in,you know, decades to come, hopefully
they start to see the world ina different light and the relationship
(34:01):
between all of us together. Sothat's how I see the longer term
view. In the short term, it'sa hard one. I don't know how we solve
it right now because you'vegot, you know, lots of narcissists,
sociopaths, people inpositions of power who are making
(34:23):
decisions often for their ownego, often for their own agendas.
And it's hard to change thatbecause a lot of the world still
just lets that exist. And I'msaying with a vacuum there, it's
very hard to challenge it. Andthat's why we need to reprogram society
(34:46):
to think differently.
I agree with you. I know thatin some of the notes that I have
prior to starting this. How doyou think the Secret plays into this?
I mean, we've heard about theSecret. I've had conversations about
the Secret with regard to theuniverse and us being able to manifest
(35:08):
what we want or what we needand how to achieve those kind of
goals? Do you think thatthat's, that's a methodology that
we can guide thosephilosophies that you just talked
about for, for ourselves inregard to living and changing and
helping others change around us?
Well, yeah, manifestation is avery powerful force. And you know,
(35:33):
I've been often asked, is whatyou're talking about just utopia?
Is it unrealistic? And I saythis, you've got to put a destination
in your GPS to even get closeto getting there, right? So I'm saying
that in our GPS for society,we don't want to put a mediocre goal
(35:56):
and aim to get to that. I'msaying we set up these big, hairy,
audacious goals that we wantto overhaul society. We want equality,
we want justice, we want abetter life for everyone. Not just
for some, but for everyone.That's the, that's the destination
in our gps. Now we've gotsomewhere to head. So we start driving.
(36:19):
We'll. We'll find obstacles.We'll have to get rerouted. You know,
things will happen. And evenif we don't get all the way there,
well, maybe we can drive asclose as we can and walk the rest
of the way. I'm suggestingthat that manifestation is critical
for us to actually think,firstly, and that's why I called
(36:40):
it the philosophy, because youcan't change anything until you first
have the thoughts aboutwanting to change it. Manifestation
isn't going to happen justfrom thinking about it. We need to
go further. But that is thefirst step.
And I can admire that andappreciate that, because I think
(37:02):
we all in life have a choice,and sometimes we don't understand
the choice unless we have thetools to be able to understand that
choice. And I think the book,the philosophy and the organization
helps us to have the toolsavailable for us to understand how
we can begin living withpurpose, collectively and responsibly,
(37:25):
as a society, as a human beingand as society.
I actually have a chapter inthe book called the Magic Glasses,
and it talks about. Have youever tried augmented reality glasses,
Michael?
I do. Well, I mean, I've gotan Oculus Meta Quest. Oculus?
(37:45):
Yeah.
Would that be the same thing?I'm guessing, yeah.
Yeah. So I guess thedifference is that's virtual reality.
Augmented reality is where youcan see things, but you can still
see in the space that you'rein as well.
Oh, I can do that on my. I cando that on this. I'm pointing to
it like you can see me. Likeyou can see it. It's laying right
(38:09):
over there.
Gila stood. They're fantastic.But what I talk about there is, for
anyone else who's not wearingthe glasses, they don't see what
you're seeing. Right. Theyonly see what the reality is to them.
But when you start to learnthe tools of the philosophy, all
of a sudden you see thingsthat weren't there. And in fact,
(38:31):
I talk about, you know, themovie Sliding Doors with Gwyneth
Paltrow. It's one where if yougo this way or you go that way, and
the only way with thesechoices becoming apparent is to have
the awareness that you evenhave the tools available to you.
(38:52):
So, you know, when you dothat, all of a sudden options start
to appear that weren't therebefore. And, you know, to your point,
when you learn the tools andyou learn that awareness, that self
awareness and the awareness ofnature, the universe, and everything
Else all of a sudden thingslook different. And it's very powerful,
(39:15):
very powerful. But for a lotof people, it's like I'm so busy
with my life, I don't havetime for this mumbo jumbo. I'm just,
you know, got to get my livingand I've got to do this. And I'm
just busy, busy, busy, busy,busy. And they stay on the treadmill,
you.
Know, I agree with that. Youknow, it's interesting because I've
always said, and I've said itbefore in this program, you know,
(39:37):
Covid is a double edged swordbecause here the state shut down
and my wife got to work fromhome for two years, basically recovering
from that. And what that didwas give us a different perspective
on our day. Because before wewere getting up at 3 in the morning,
(39:58):
3:30 in the morning, she wasgetting ready for work. She's spending
an hour, hour and 15 minutesin horrific traffic. And me watching
the news while she's on theway to work and hearing about all
these accidents andeverything. Tense, you know, makes
you tense. And then spendingeight hours, eight and a half hours
(40:19):
at a cubicle and then spendingan hour, hour and 15 minutes on the
way home, shoving down dinner,falling asleep on the couch, and
then getting up, going to bedand do it all over again. It gave
us a pause and it allowed usto kind of. We got up at a decent
time. There was a commute tothe back patio. We did what you mentioned
(40:42):
earlier. We went out, we had acup of tea, we watched the sunrise,
we watched the birds and thebees, you know, go around our plants
and the hummingbirds and wewatched the sun come up on our face.
And it was more of anappreciation and we got to relax.
It's a 30 second commute tothe computer. And then we stop and
(41:04):
had lunch together. We haddone that for ages. And then she
32nd back to work. When shewas done, we went back out on the
patio and it was great. Ithink what we learned from that and
what we were able to take awayfrom that is society put on us. This
(41:25):
is what you do. You go towork, you spend an hour and 15 minutes
in traffic on the way. You doa job all day long in a little tiny
cubicle. You're locked in,can't look out the window, can't
do this, can't do that, we'lllet you out for lunch, but you got
to come back. And then youspend an hour and 15 minutes in crappy
traffic all the way home. Youcome home In a bad mood, you eat
(41:48):
dinner, you watch an hour'sworth of tv, you go to bed. That's
what you're supposed to do. Werealized that there's more to life
than that and we got to enjoylife a little bit and get a work
life balance. And so now sheworks a hybrid schedule. And it's
amazing the difference. And itgoes back to the manifestation that
(42:09):
you were talking about just tovalidate what you're saying. We wanted
this to stick. Well, it stuckto a point because she's on a hybrid
situation, which gives usSaturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday,
it's that normal. And thenWednesday, Thursday, Friday.
Resistance, right? A lot ofresistance. Oh, yeah, there's a lot
(42:30):
of resistance about, you know,working from home and continuing
that because there is so muchpressure to get back to the old way
of how it was. And that's thepressure of what we're used to, because
that's the way we've alwaysdone it. So, you know, but we experience
what it was like to have thatpause to realign what's really important
(42:53):
in life. And yet the forcessaid, no, go back to how you were.
You know, it's the same herein the, in the cbd, like where I'm
from, in Melbourne, inVictoria, the state of Victoria,
we were the most locked downcity in the whole world. We were
locked down for the mostnumber of days out of anyone. And
(43:14):
it was just a crazy time. Andyet when it all came to an end, there
was a rush. Everyone come backand work in the towers in the city
again, get back in. Why?Because we've got to support the
cafes and the businesses inthe city. And for me, that was a
missed opportunity again forus to rethink what is the purpose
(43:37):
of our cbd. What could we dowith it? How could we do things differently?
But no, it was like, no, let'sget back as quickly as possible to
the old ways of doing things.
And I think that puts you goback to what you said earlier in
this conversation in regardto, you know, society has a particular
control over us as a humanbeing. And they say, this is the
(43:58):
way you're supposed to do it.We're not going to deviate from that.
It works for us. Andpersonally, I think it reflects back
on the capitalism. You know,I'm not afraid to make money, I'm
not afraid to work for one ofGod. But it goes back to capitalism.
They control us to a pointthat is difficult for us to step
(44:20):
outside of that arena. But Ithink, I think you have a blueprint
in the philosophy for changeand for change makers to kind of
take an understanding andmaybe create the kind of world that
we hope to choose from and togo, to go forward. How can we. How
can we implement that? How canwe help our leaders, our community
(44:43):
and those around us understandthat there is a different perspective
we need to take a look at?
Look, the first thing I wouldsay is, you know, we live in the
most connected time ever, andyet we are the most disconnected
we've ever been. And, youknow, we. We go to work, we come
home, we drive into ourgarage, we lock the doors, we turn
(45:07):
on our security cameras, closethe blinds, and hey, now we're. We're
safe. For me, we've lost thatconnection with those around us.
You know, our. Our villagethat used to be the people we lived
around and with has nowmigrated online and we've lost that
connection. So a very simplething people can do is just go and
(45:30):
reconnect with your neighbors,connect with people you haven't met.
And it might be challenging toa lot of people that, you know, I'm.
They're not like me or I'mdifferent or I'm scared. What if
someone takes advantage of meor harms me or something? And it's
that closed view that we haveof others that creates the divisions.
(45:51):
It's those divisions that wesee perpetuated through society.
So if we can just change thatat the grassroots level, just talk
to your neighbors, and ifeveryone did that, we could then
see a ripple out. So that's avery simple thing that anyone can
do today. You know, and infact, there is a National Neighbor
(46:13):
Day in the US there's one hereas well. And in. As there are in
most parts of the world whereyou take the opportunity to get to
know your neighbors, there'slots of events that happen. And,
you know, I encourage peopleto go and look that up in their area
and see how they canparticipate. So that's the first
thing. Another thing thatpeople can do is come and read the
(46:38):
philosophy, come and connectmore. Because we have actually on
the website, which I knowyou've got on the screen, the philosophy.net
there is a community platformthere for people to join and get
involved in some of thesediscussions. At the end of the day,
this isn't a book. This is amovement. And it means we want people
(47:00):
to understand it, talk toother people about it, share it with
other people, and start to getthat movement going in their areas.
Because if people startthinking locally in their neighborhoods,
and in their local communitiesand with their local educators, then
we can start to make thingshappen. You know, it's really about
(47:23):
awareness. Can ourpoliticians, can our decision makers,
can our educators look intothis and start to think a little
bit differently? Because it'snot. We're not trying to challenge,
to disempower them. In fact,what we're trying to do is empower
everyone to be successful. Youknow, because if, let's say, I've
(47:45):
got all the wealth in theworld and there are people around
me doing it so tough, there'severy chance someone might break
into my home and cause harm tome because they're struggling to
get by. But I'm in my littleivory tower thinking I'm fine. And
yet it is selfishly good forus to make sure everyone else is
(48:09):
doing well too. And that'swhat we need to understand. It's
not. You're right. Capitalismdoes breed a competitive nature.
Right. We all compete for ajob, we compete for housing, we compete
for everything. And that's areal shame. And we need, you know,
I'm not against capitalism,but there are certainly some things
(48:29):
that capitalism needs toanswer for. Right. You know, the,
the toll it takes on, onpeople, on customers, staff, you
know, to run a business in acapitalist society. The definition
of success currently is growth.
Yeah, right.
You have to grow. If you don'tmake more this year than you made
(48:50):
last year, then you haven'tgrown. If you haven't grown, you'll
get reprimanded by yourshareholders. So, you know, at what
cost, what cost is it takingfrom you to continually keep growing?
Right. You know, that's what,how we're driven and businesses will
do whatever it takes, whetherit's increase your productivity,
(49:13):
cut costs, get rid of staff,do this, do you know, make it harder.
Because in the name of growth.
Unfortunately. I sayunfortunately because in reality,
I think that we. Again, even Ihave a business degree as well, so.
A business management degree,actually. And, you know, in that
(49:34):
in itself, I understand theconcept of it, but I also understand
when I was a cop, I had ateam, a team of 13 guys, and we worked
very cohesively together. Wedid it because we have mutual respect
for each other. And, you know,we had one goal collectively that
we were trying to reach orobtain. So even from a management
(49:57):
position, in regard to that,you know, we have to think about
our employees and who we'reworking for and who got us here and
who's making the money for us.It's not just the person sitting
behind the big desk, it's thepeople on the street doing. Doing
the work. How can somebody geta hold of you and find on and find
out more about the movementand find more about how to get the
(50:19):
book and how they can get involved?
Yeah. So the website is thephilosophy.net. you'll find information
about the book there. There'slinks there to purchase it. It's
available at Amazon and manyother sites as well. It's available
in paperback, Kindle andaudiobook formats. And as I said,
(50:44):
we also have an onlineplatform there where people can join
and get involved in those conversations.
And I'll make sure that's inthe show notes so that everybody
has an easy way just to clickand find you. This time went by so
fast, Alex.
Yeah, there's. There's so muchto talk. I mean, I, you know, we
could go on for hours. Wecould do season two, season three.
(51:08):
Exactly. But effectively itis. There's so much here that needs
to change in the world. That'sreally what it boils down to. And,
you know, I tackle a lot ofthings in this book. You know, the
first half is talking aboutthe concept of the philosophy. The
second half addressesdifferent sectors, you know, politics,
the economy, all those sortsof things. So there's a lot to get
(51:30):
through and we know there's alot wrong. I don't want to sound
hopeless. I guess that's whyI've created what I consider is a
manifesto, a pathway or ablueprint, as you put it, to change
things rather than just feelhopeless, that nothing is changeable.
So if we all work together,anything is possible. Remember, there's
(51:52):
no utopia without you.
I love.
It's just topia.
Exactly. It's just topia. Thenyou think about toes and then that
goes south from there.
Yeah.
Well, look, I would love tohave you back on and we could continue
this conversation down theroad. I think that we have a lot
(52:14):
more to discuss, a lot more tosay, and I wish this segment was
a little bit longer. So Iwould love to have you back if we
can do that. We can arrangethat if you'd like.
Thanks, Michael. I would loveto come back.
In the meantime, this is onemore thing before you go. So if someone
always asks for words ofwisdom, if someone is listening right
(52:36):
now and they're quietlydissatisfied or they want to change,
or they want to know how tochange, what's some words of wisdom
or first question they shouldask themselves?
Ask yourself the firstquestion in the book. What's the
point? What's the point oflife for you. What does it mean for
(52:56):
you? And you know, everyone'sgot to define it for themselves.
What it means for some, it's,you know, having grandkids, you know,
for some, it's being creative.What is it for you? And then find
a way for that true north tonot get diverted. Stick to that true
north of who you are and whatit means for you.
(53:20):
Brilliant words of wisdom. Ithink that we all should take that
opportunity and grasp it tohelp us all move forward. Alex, thank
you very much for being on theshow. I really appreciate you. What
you bring to the world. Ithink that you've reminded us that
the systems we live in aren'tjust flawed, they're inherited. And
if we have the courage toquestion them, we also have the power
(53:41):
to change them. Thisphilosophy isn't just a book. It's
a mirror, a map, and amovement. It asks us to stop chasing
what we're told to want andstart building what we truly need
as a community. Becausesometimes the most radical shift
begins with just one morething before you go.
Thanks, Michael.
That's a wrap. I hope youfound inspirational motivation, motivational
(54:04):
and a few new perspectives totake with you. If you enjoyed this
conversation, be sure to likesubscribe and follow us. It really
helps us continue bringing youincredible stories and insights like
the one today. And if you wantto watch this episode, head over
to YouTube, catch the fullvideo version. We also love to hear
from you. If you have anyquestions or show ideas or think
you make a great guest or wantto contribute to this episode, reach
(54:25):
out. Let's connect. This showthrives because of an amazing community
and I appreciate each andevery one of you. So until next time,
have a great day and evenbetter week. And remember, keep growing.
Keep thriving. One more thingbefore you go. Have a great day,
have a great week and thankyou for being here. Thanks for listening
to this episode of One MoreThing before you go. Check out our
(54:48):
website@beforeyougopodcast.comyou can find us as well as subscribe
to the program and rate us onyour favorite podcast listening platform.
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