Unraveling The Media's Role in Racial Violence: A Conversation with Tia Oso

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Are you curious about the complex interplay between media and Black liberation? Join us as we sit down with Tia Oso, a celebrated cultural strategist, activist, and social justice leader. Tia shares her passionate journey from Mesa, Arizona to the national stage and her mission to achieve media reparations and Black narrative power by 2070. We also explore the urgent need for media reparations to rectify systemic inequities and advocate for media literacy and accountability. This conversation is essential listening for anyone committed to understanding and supporting the ongoing struggle for racial equity through the transformative power of media and narrative.

Click the links below to learn more about Tia Oso, Media 2070, and the media reparations movement.
https://www.instagram.com/tia.oso/
https://mediareparations.org/
https://www.freepress.net/issues/future-journalism/media-reparations
https://twitter.com/media2070

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Brothers and sisters.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
One mic, one mic, one mic.
Give me a moment with yourfriend.
I've never been up to a levelfor my thoughts before.
Welcome to the only one micPodcast called Gerard Brooklyn
Dre, with our very, very specialguest, ms Tia Oso.

(00:30):
Ms Tia is a strategist,activist, speaker and social
justice leader for Media 2070.
Amongst other things.
How are you doing, tia?

Speaker 1 (00:43):
Doing really well.
Cj, Thanks so much for havingme.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
Looking at your resume of like just social
justice, work longer than trainsmoke.
Let us talk about what she didhere.
You know this is like 10 yearsworth of work Global Black
Solidarity and Campaigns forBlack Migrant Justice in the US.
Human Rights Delegations at theUS-Mexican border, including
multiracial and black at theborder Conveyance.

(01:06):
Launching black voterengagement projects, including A
to Z Black Voter Alliance, wakeUp Arizona and the Black and
Engaged Tour.
You have so much If I actuallywent through this whole resume
here of stuff that you did, butthis is something that you know
a lot of people might reallyfind interesting Strategic
communications and culturalstrategy for the 2018 mass
bailout of Rackers Island withRFK Human Rights.

(01:29):
Rackers Island is currentlystill a cesspool, so we thank
you for that.
I mean, we got a lot of friendsthat thank you for that as well
.

Speaker 3 (01:37):
She's like the black Angela Davis.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
Yeah, how about it the?
dark-skinned Angela Davis, allright, and with the hair to
match folks With the hair tomatch folks With the hair to
match.
Keeping it 1,000.
I want you to let the peopleknow what you're doing.
Now you work with Media 2070.
I see you got a big push upthere for Media 2070 as the new
senior director, which looks tobe a very good look for the

(02:03):
organization.
So why don't you give people alittle bit more background than
I can provide on this show?
I could tell them about you,but I want you to tell them
about yourself.
Go ahead and take the floor toyou.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
Oh yeah, no, thank you so much for that
introduction.
Yeah, name's Tia Oso.
I use she and her pronouns.
I'm based in Mesa, arizona,which is right outside of
Phoenix, and you know we'll getinto that when we start talking
about the Tulsa Race Massacre.
Why Mesa?
So it's also really important.
But I am a culture strategistand organizer.
In all of my work I've learnedhow important it is that we have

(02:39):
media and narrative and culturestrategy that helps to advance
our policies.
The majority of my work,especially over the last 10
years, has been focused aroundBlack liberation and also the
work of like, helping tounderstand like global Black
identities and howinterconnected our struggles are
.
And the work of Media 2070, forthose who are not familiar, is

(03:01):
the media reparations campaignwe launched in 2020 in the wake
of the murder of George Floyd.
The organization that we're aproduct of at free press.
We, a group of black staffthere called the black caucus,
was really taking theorganization to task about how

(03:21):
you know the the racial thatracial reckoning moment.
Really taking the organizationto task about how you know the
racial that racial reckoningmoment.
Really taking the organizationto task about how they could be
putting more fuel to the firearound addressing racial
injustice in this country, andwe wanted to go beyond, you know
, dei measures and things ofthat nature, to actually getting

(03:43):
to root causes of the issues.
And so, because the work thatFree Press does is around the
media system, we dreamed up thegoal of media reparations and
really developing a campaignthat talks about the ways that
the media has harmed Blackcommunities, also talking about
the ways that our modern daycorporate media system, even the

(04:06):
roots of it in the economicsbackbone of our corporate media
system, are actually rooted inenslavement.
For folks who may not know thathistory, the first colonial
newspapers just like we have adsales today on Google and
AdSense and on social mediacolonial newspapers, you know,
put out ads for runaway slavesand that's how they were able to

(04:27):
finance their operations.
And so it's really importantfor us to know that history and
it's important for us to talkabout the ways that the media
perpetuates anti-Blackness andracial inequity today, and it's
important for us to hold themedia system to task for
reparations as well.
And so that is the work ofMedia 2070 to Afrofuturist

(04:48):
Project, and that's why 2070, bythe year 2070, our goal is to
make reparations real and we aremoving forward from today
towards 2070, where we know thatwe will have one and we'll be
victorious.
We will have one and we'll bevictorious, and we will have
Black narrative power to haveboth the capital as well as the
means of production and controland deliver and distribute Black

(05:10):
stories and Black media.
Where are you from Tia?
I'm from Mesa, arizona.

Speaker 3 (05:14):
You're born here in the United States of.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
America.
Born and raised yep, my dad isa Nigerian immigrant from Lagos,
nigeria, but my mom isAfrican-American.

Speaker 2 (05:23):
Okay, from Lagos Nigeria but my mom is
African-American.
Okay, so let me ask what ledyou into this whole you know
work of activism and all, andwho inspired you to do this?
Like I mean, what was it?
Was like somebody that you know, or was it something historical
that sparked your interest?

Speaker 1 (05:41):
in this type of work?
That's a good question.
I really have to give allcredit for that to my mom.
Her name is Ellen Oso.
She is a community organizerand an activist in her spare
time if there's such thing asBlack women have a spare time.
She was actually a preschoolteacher and worked for the
county Head Start program.
But my entire life growing upshe was also really heavily
involved in the community.

(06:01):
So we had a block watch programthat she and her friends the
county Head Start program.
But my entire life growing upshe was also really heavily
involved in the community.
So we had like a block watchprogram that she and her friends
were running.
She helped to do things, likethey called it, dress for
Success and helping likestruggling parents get the
clothes and like prepare for jobinterviews so they can get
better jobs to help supporttheir families.
She was a member of ACORN forfolks who understand what ACORN

(06:23):
was and she used to have peoplehere you know she had the
computer set up in the house andhelp people you know do their
taxes and the way that she, youknow, set that example for me.
She used to my mom and herfriends in the neighborhood
actually like got a crack housetorn down, like literally, just
like you know, take control ofthe block type of go getter.

(06:48):
And so I was on her hip, youknow, during all of those things
March of Fur, the MLK holidayhere in Arizona, all of those,
you know, really significantmoments and so being raised by
her, being a part of, you know,witnessing, you know her in
action and then also, becauseyou know our families in Arizona
, also raised in a historicallyBlack neighborhood that used to

(07:08):
be segregated, she raised all ofus with a sense of
understanding.
You know that we have tounderstand white supremacy, we
have to understand whatsegregation is, why everybody in
our neighborhood is Black andBrown.
And you know, when you go acrossa certain street, right, the
neighborhood is all white folksand having to understand how to
navigate that, in that you know,when you go across a certain
street, right, the neighborhoodis all white folks and having to
understand how to navigate that, in that you know sometimes

(07:30):
people who you know have racialanimus might try to treat a
little dark skinned Black girldifferently and that I ought not
, you know, fall for that and Idon't have to take that.
And so, really, my motherraised me up both with that
sense of, you know, communitypride as well as a sense of
understanding the history of ourfamily and history of Black

(07:52):
communities.
You should make us read Blackhistory at home all the time.
Then I go teach you this atschool.
But you will learn it, you willknow your history.
And so I kind of naturally, outof all of my siblings, I'm the
one who's most naturally rebeland most like kind of naturally
inclined to speak up againstinjustice, and you know, in Mesa

(08:15):
, arizona, there's like noshortage of opportunities to,
you know, try to resist.
So I grew up that way and theneventually, as a volunteer

(08:50):
advocate with the Black Alliancefor Just Immigration here in
Phoenix during theanti-immigrant you know kind of
like the height of things in2010 and got involved with the
marches and things.
And then there are a lot of bigrallies here where, you know, at
the end of the rally they'llsay, oh, if you want to work on
this issue more, you can sign upin the back.

(09:11):
That's how I got involved withBaji, first as a volunteer and
then once they, you know, saw myboth my personal connection
with my dad, being an immigrant,and then my skills and talents
as a teacher and advocate,promoted me to being the
national organizer, where I wasfor five years, where we helped
to start what everybody knowsnow as Black Lives Matter, like

(09:42):
as a tool and as a tactic andcommunications, but also how
important it is that we haveculture strategy at the center
of things, because, as a lot offolks know, black Lives Matter
didn't necessarily have amarketing and media strategy at
the beginning.
They, you know, didn't get thetrademark and the copyright and
all those things, because nobodywas thinking that it was gonna
turn out to be the globalphenomenon that it was.
And so Baji moved me to LosAngeles, where I ended up

(10:07):
working with the Revolve ImpactStudio, met actors and activists
and musicians who helped themto, you know, use their
platforms for change as well,and also eventually started
joining campaigns with FreePress and some of their
testimonies around, like FCC andbroadband access, and when they
started Media 2070, I wasalways a supporter.

Speaker 3 (10:30):
How was your dad?
Was your dad involved in thistype of thing?

Speaker 1 (10:34):
No, my dad is, you know how a lot of immigrant
communities.
It could be a toss up ofwhether or not they're going to
be, you know, kind of a lefty ora righty as far as things go.
Luckily, my dad is a verypolitically aware and like aware
of racial dynamics and he'svery much, you know, he's good
support from the sidelines buthe's kind of a typical Nigerian

(10:55):
that's very focused on makingmoney.

Speaker 3 (10:58):
Yeah, you know we grew up with a lot of African
brothers man that were goodfriends of ours.
You know we grew up with a lotof African brothers man that
were good friends of ours, Right, and I never really known them
for being involved in type andlike like activism, like
regarding things.
They were very political, veryknowledgeable about what was
going on and they would actuallyvoice their opinion, you know,

(11:19):
and just like a regular cornerconversation, but ain't no
marching or nothing like thatfor them.
You know what I mean.
So I was going to say nomarching, Ain't no marching, or
nothing like that for them.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
You know what I mean.
So I was going to say nomarching.
And it might even be, you know.
The thing I'll say is this myuncle, on my dad's side he was
very much a right wingconservative political and my
cousins, two of my girl cousinsthey are very much involved,

(11:44):
active.
I used to be on the phone withthem trying to figure out hey,
if somebody's on a student visa,they shouldn't be taking
arrests.
It's not that folks weren't outthere, but it wasn't maybe as
visible.
And then also, as an immigrant,when you come to this country,
the idea that you would beprotesting and an activist is
something that in your homecountry you could get killed.

(12:07):
There are people here who arehere, um, on asylum from being
political advocates right intheir home countries, and so the
reason why you come to theunited states is not to fight
the power necessarily, even ifyou understand the politics of
it and even if you're supportiveof it with all the activism
work that runs in your family.

Speaker 2 (12:26):
From what you're describing.
One more thing Shout out to mybut she did it.
Did you ever have, you or yourfamily, a lot of backlash?
Because this is Arizona at theend of the day, so did you have
a lot of backlash for a lot ofthings that you were standing up
for, or did you have a lot ofopposition from different other

(12:47):
organizations or what?

Speaker 1 (12:50):
I'll say that the dynamics in Arizona because
there was not a lot ofinvestment in Black organizing.
So especially in like 2010, 11,12, 13, 14.
This is before the post 2020moment, where there's like a
flood of resources fororganizing right, because Baji

(13:12):
was willing to invest in ourorganizing here, people were
just happy that there wassomeone who was organizing.
This is how I ended up beingthe one to organize a lot of
protests and things.
There was, of course, a lot oftensions around.
You know, we want to have Blackand Brown unity and I had to
explain to a lot of people thatwe need to build up Black
organizing before we can be onequal footing around coalition

(13:35):
building.
There's still tensions aboutthat.
I absolutely have been targetedfor, you know, right-wing
propaganda and like threats ofviolence, a lot of government
surveillance, which I've learnedhas, you know, very much came
with the territory of that work,and it did isolate me from my
family somewhat because I alsowas very concerned for their

(13:55):
safety and concerned that theycould be targeted by that as
well.
And so moving to Los Angelesfor me was a bit of a relief
because I felt like I coulddistance myself at the height of
my visibility I could distance,distance myself from my family
members that I wanted to alsohelp keep safe and, um yeah,

(14:16):
definitely been called radicaland told oh, you know, you're
getting quite a reputation.
I don't know what does thatmean why?

Speaker 2 (14:23):
It means you're doing something right, right.
So taking some people off.
You're doing something right.

Speaker 1 (14:29):
Exactly, Exactly.
We had a Asada Shakur teachingwhen they had escalated her on
the FBI most wanted list and thenumber of people that were like
, well, isn't she a terrorist?
What are you guys doing?
I was like, listen, no.
So yeah, I think that that,again, my kind of natural

(14:50):
inclination to questionauthority has also helped me,
helped shield me from feelingtoo bad about getting backlash,
honestly and truly.

Speaker 2 (14:59):
Did you ever have a conversation with Assata at all?
Were you able to talk to her atall?

Speaker 1 (15:03):
I haven't.
I know people who have spokenwith her and met with her.
I haven't had the opportunityto speak with her and when I had
the opportunity to go on adelegation to go and meet her, I
didn't go.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
Yeah, that's because her autobiography is one of my
favorite books.
I think I read a few times.

Speaker 1 (15:17):
Yeah, absolutely Required reading.

Speaker 3 (15:21):
Let me ask you a question in regards to bodgy and
this.
I don't know if this is a sillyquestion, but I'll throw it at
you.
You tell me if it's silly ornot.
You get a lot of pushback fromblack americans in regards to
this whole immigration thing,because I the reason why I ask
is because, as of late, you know, with this whole, I think and I
think this has to do with thewhole social media thing with,
like, uh, you know, this wholeputting black americans against

(15:43):
migrant workers and all thatother stuff like that, it seems
like lately I'm talking to Blackpeople, black Americans, I
don't care who come in thiscountry.
To be perfectly honest with you, this is my personal opinion,
but I've been talking to BlackAmericans lately and I'm like,
well, my friends and familymembers, and they're just saying
crazy stuff, like you know theyshouldn't be here, and I'm like

(16:05):
, who made us judge and juryover?
You know who should come hereor not, you know.
So you know, I just had to askthat question.
Do you get pushback frombrothers and sisters?

Speaker 1 (16:10):
when I first started organizing with bhaji.
Um, that was you know?

Speaker 2 (16:15):
I'm sorry, I don't want to cut you off there, but
can you explain to the peoplewhat bhaji is?
That may not know, because Iknow we've been saying it, but a
lot of people might not knowwhat it is.

Speaker 1 (16:24):
No problem.
So BAJI B-A-J-I stands for theBlack Alliance for Just
Immigration, and so our primaryfocus at the beginning of my
career with BAJI was working toeducate African-Americans about
why we don't belong on theanti-immigrant side of politics,
um, to help, uh, help,african-americans understand

(16:47):
just like you just said,brooklyn dre, the ways that
we're pitted, our communitiesare being pitted against one
another.
Um, this kind of false scarcityidea around you know there's a
limited number of jobs.
Um, that whole black jobs thing.
It came up again, you know, inthe president lecture this year.
Um, and doing like deepeducation and solidarity
building work.
Because also, when immigrantscome to this country immigrants

(17:10):
of all you know ethnicities andbackgrounds they're also
conditioned with anti-Blacknessand so it is like a potential
wedge between our communities.
And I think that what we seenow happening is that there's
been a, there has always beenand there continues to be a
concerted conservative effort toneutralize African-Americans

(17:35):
politically, because we are themost effective political force
for progressive values in theUnited States.
And so this idea that we shouldbe xenophobic, this idea that
we should be, you know, sopatriotic as to demonize and
vilify immigrants, all of thatis conservative talking points
and conservative kind ofradicalizing.

(17:57):
A lot of it is thriving onlineand in digital spaces and I
would question what theresources are, you know, being
really poured into that.
But yeah, absolutely had somevery tense and hostile, you know
, sessions and to the pointwhere we had to institute a
healing practice called AfricanDiaspora Dialogues, where we

(18:18):
would dedicate the time only tounpacking and addressing the
tensions betweenAfrican-Americans and Black
immigrant communities and figureout, you know where there could
be points of contention thatcould be worked out and worked
through, help understand youknow each other, one another's
histories and one another'sstruggles as well, and I think a

(18:39):
lot of that healing work and alot of this I call it, you know,
global Black identities.
There's a lot of identitydevelopment work right now that
is being, you know, targetedwith misinformation and
disinformation again againstBlack Americans to try to wedge
us against, you know, blackfolks that are outside of the
United States generally, which Ithink is really it's

(19:02):
disheartening to see, it'sreally sad and it's also really
dangerous because a lot of theat least the narratives that I
see, are ahistorical and it isnot how our forebearers in this
country, the way that theythought of their identity, was
not divorced from their Africanroots?
And is not this, you know, kindof pro-USA, this kind of pro-USA

(19:25):
narrative that we see beingperpetuated right now?
And I do think that it harmsall of us, especially because
this idea that the benefits andthe programs to help assimilate
or assist immigrants coming tothis country there's the idea
that those things are happeninginstead of programs happening
for Black people or instead ofus getting what it is that we

(19:48):
need in our communities is false.
What we should be able to seeis that, oh well, if you have
the resources to house peopleand to give people health care
and to help people get jobs, andthat means you have the
resources for all of us to haveeverything that we need.
Right, right.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
Yeah, so it sounds to me like we kind of falling for
the propaganda you knowabsolutely normally put out, but
now it's becoming moreself-destructive and impulsive
to the community.
So that's like a good segue intowhat we were going to talk
about.
Our main topic, um, how themedia plays a hand and, you know
, basically destroying ourpeople.

(20:24):
You know, um, through means ofjust imagery, just putting out
just little slogans, whatever itis.
That's subliminal.
And it's more subliminal thesedays because you know we have
access to all the social mediaand you know mainstream media
and all like that.
So, um, to use as an example, wetalk about Tulsa, oklahoma, and

(20:46):
the narrative on most peopleknow about the Tulsa massacres
is basically, it was a black,thriving town, white people
didn't like it and they justdestroyed the town.
Uh, but there's a lot deeperstory to how they got to that
point, where we got to themassacre, and a lot of people
don't know that story.
And when you do tell them like,wow, if we knew this, you know,

(21:07):
implement it within our Blackhistory people will be more
educated and more aware.
So, tia, if you want to goahead and jump into, we're going
to discuss how the media playeda role in the Tulsa massacre,
to give background on how thatall started and what led up to
it and how we see it today inour own media.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Yeah.
So for folks who are familiarwith the Tulsa Race Massacre in
1921, there was a young mannamed Dick Rowland who had some
sort of an encounter.
Young man named Dick Rowlandwho had some sort of an
encounter right with a whitewoman at a local hotel and the

(21:49):
details vary depending on whoyou talk to.
And then the accounts of theincident, their interaction, you
know.
It goes from he disrespectedher to he propositioned her to.
He, you know, manhandled her insome type of way.
And of course, by the time itcirculates through the white
community, we have this, thesekind of angry armed mobs saying

(22:15):
that you know we're going tobring this man to justice.
And over multiple days, whiterioters looted and burned parts
of Greenwood to the ground.
The governor declared martiallaw, african-americans were
detained en masse.
That you know.

(22:48):
24 to 36 hours of violenceburned 35 city blocks.
Over a thousand people wereinjured, something as many as,

(23:11):
like you know, 300 by the whitemobs.
It hasn't ever been fullyaccounted for.
And then, most recently, youknow they've initiated a Tulsa
Race Commission in 2001, youknow, trying to lead up to the
100 year anniversary, whichhappened in 19, excuse me, 2021,

(23:34):
in order to hold the governmentto account and to fight for
reparations, in which thelawsuit that has gone into court
multiple times was actuallyjust dismissed by the Supreme
Court of Tulsa.
And the things that I think are,you know, very particular to
our conversation is around therole of the media and the
newspaper coverage.
There were, you know, headlinesin the local newspaper,

(23:55):
including the Tulsa Tribune,saying you know, we need to get
this Negro who nabbed the whitegirl in the elevator attack this
white girl in the elevator.
Who nabbed the white girl inthe elevator, attacked this
white girl in the elevator.
We need to talk about the waysthat the media, you know, talked
about the riot.
Oh, there are 200 white men andwomen and children who were

(24:20):
injured.
Were the white men and women andchildren injured Because the
riot came over to our side ofthe street?
It's time for us to restoreorder in Tulsa and if it hadn't
been for Black newspapers, likethe Black Dispatch in Oklahoma,
we wouldn't have ever actuallyknown what really was happening.
The coverage of the Tulsa racemassacre also reflects not just

(24:48):
what happened there in Greenwoodhappened as a result of these,
you know, racial tensions thatwere fomented right by the media

(25:11):
, the way that the media talksabout demographic change.
The way that the media talksabout and, you know, describes
the people who are moving to anarea or describes these
incidences.
You know, did they have aninteraction in the elevator or
was she assaulted and accostedby this Negro man?
All of those things are thingsthat we need to look at when we
talk about the role of the mediaand racial violence and, in

(25:34):
particular, the Tulsa RaceMassacre.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
Right now it's the same thing that's going on, I
guess, in regards to the migrantworkers.
I had a sister that has adoctorate degree and I'm sitting
there, I'm talking to her andshe was spouting all this stuff
to me about these migrantworkers in New York, about how
they're destroying New York andall this other stuff like that.
And I'm like I'm from New York.
Their problem is not themigrant workers.

(25:56):
You know what I mean.
It's not at all the migrantworkers.
You kind of see how people aresheep, right.

Speaker 1 (26:04):
Like you know, if you pump enough information to a
person like, they'll justregurgitate it like it's true, I
think not even just you know,to be fair to people, I wouldn't
call them sheep, but let'sthink about the power of media
this is a podcast right thepower of sharing information
with people, the power of youknow, packaging information for

(26:28):
folks, because especially youknow now, but back then you know
we're talking about a newspaperthe resources and the amount of
time that it takes to puttogether documents and spread
information gives it a sense oflegitimacy and gives it an air

(26:48):
of legitimacy and authority Ifwe live in a society where so
much is happening.
Oh my gosh, I need somebody toexplain it to me.
We have a lot of trust in themedia and this is also why Black
newspapers are so important.
We have to have our own mediaright.
It became really clear.
It's like, oh, we can't trustthese media institutions again
that are built off of runningads for runaway slaves the Tulsa
Tribune was running ads for theKu Klux Klan, okay.

(27:12):
And so I think that, and aspeople we have to also
understand that narrative andstorytelling is so important to
how we make sense of the worldaround us, and that's what we
see happening whenmisinformation and
disinformation becomes fixed inpeople's minds.
Because if I read it, it mustbe true.

(27:33):
I read it somewhere.
You hear it all the time.
I read it somewhere, I heard itsomewhere, right, that's what
media is.
That's the purpose of media.
That's why, you know, even thisoutlet and this podcast exists
is because it's important for usto talk about things Right.
It's important for us to tellstories.
It's important for us to shareinformation.
As you know, human beings, it'sa very human thing to want to
try to make sense of somethingand to look for a resource

(27:55):
that's going to help it to makeit make sense to you, a resource
that's going to help it to makeit make sense to you.
And the fact that the dominantmedia and corporate media has
been used as a weapon againstour communities, not just with
newspapers but we talk about,you know, cnn and the 24 hour
news cycle and the crime beat.
There's a whole media industrybuilt on, you know, reporting

(28:17):
about crime and punishment andit also digs into our psyches
around the thrills and thechills and the stories of who's
really out there and who can youreally trust.
And look at how terrible allthese crimes are, which is also
racially motivated economicsaround perpetuating this idea of
who does the most crime.
Who's the most dangerous?

(28:38):
What areas of our country?
Because, as soon as I say, ifyou talk about gun violence,
who's the most dangerous?
What areas of our country?

Speaker 2 (28:43):
Because, as soon as I say if you talk about gun
violence, what's somebody goingto say?
What city are they going toshout out?
Yeah, New York, Chicago.

Speaker 1 (28:48):
Los Angeles, los Angeles, yeah, exactly.
And so it's important for us tobecome better consumers of news
and it's important for us tobecome more critical thinkers of
everything that we see on thescreen, especially now, get all
the way over into AI Right anddeep fakes and all of that.
You can't believe everythingthat you see now.
You have to bet the sourcemultiple times and make sure

(29:11):
that what is it we're seeing andhearing is authentic and, you
know, get news from a variety ofgood sources sources, but we
also and this is the thing thatwe are working towards with
Media 2070 is we believe that wedeserve to have a thriving
media system so that we can havemultiple good sources of
information and news.

Speaker 2 (29:28):
Right, and even if you read like, was it Joe Torres
and Juan Gonzalez's book Newsfor All.

Speaker 1 (29:36):
People News for All.

Speaker 2 (29:38):
People, yeah, and it shows you from the conception of
news, from the conception of,you know, public information,
starting with the mail, all theway up until we were able to
have the printed page, that fromthe native Americans, all the
way up to us.
It's always been this way.
It's been all this way sincethe creation of this whole thing

(30:00):
.
So even right now, as we talkedoffline, when you have, you
know, trump saying that you knowthey're out there in Ohio
eating dogs and cats, I mean thewhistle is you might say, oh,
the Haitian migrants.
But to the people who arewatching this, the masses that
you know, don't look at Haitianas being a separate thing from
being black, right?
So when I initially seen, I'mlike, oh, are you saying that

(30:23):
black people are eating dogs andcats?
Because that's what you know.
Somebody else is looking at orsomeone overseas.

Speaker 1 (30:28):
They're not seeing this you know, because tell me
the difference between a Haitianand a Nigerian and a brother
from Chicago Exactly, it's allthe same.
Which one could you pick out ofa lineup Exactly?
It's all the same.

Speaker 2 (30:39):
Which one could you pick out of a lineup Right,
right, and if you notice in thatdebate it's basically saying
that's what I heard, right.

Speaker 3 (30:48):
Exactly that's what I heard.
That's what I heard.
And that's the saddest thingthat when I watched that debate,
I was like how is he thepresident?
You know, how is he running forpresident of the United States?
And he's going to talk aboutthis information as if it's true
and he's going to say I saw iton television.
Like I'm talking, you know,like this is a regular Joe Snow.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
And then JD Vance came behind him and said I'll
make up anything if it'll get usfurther.
Basically I'm just paraphrasing, but he made the story up you
know so it's like, and then whenyou actually, if you ever seen,
like the people beinginterviewed there which you like
, the people being interviewedthere which you know, mostly
caucasian people or theirstories are based on, like you,
know, almost like a boogeymantheory well, a neighbor of mine

(31:24):
said this person had a trunkfull of cats and this person was
on a lawn so it becomes like aboogeyman effect.
And this is what we've seen,even when you look at, you know
the woman 10 to 1898, woman 10uh, coop.
Um, you look at the uh, youknow the Buffalo, the shooting,
just even the shootings in yourown neighborhood.
It gets sensationalized to apoint that, when the media does

(31:48):
portray it, if I'm this whiteperson sitting somewhere, in a
very affluent area I'm thinkingmy goodness, I don't want this
in my area.

Speaker 3 (31:58):
But that's what white politicians historically do, do
, is they just?
They pump fear into whitepeople for some reason.
I guess it's just somethingthat works.
I guess I don't know.

Speaker 1 (32:10):
But you know, fear and sensationalism the idea that
, the idea that you should beafraid and that because I'm a
politician, right, so I'm yoursolution.
You're scared.
I'm here smiling, I'm tellingyou, I have the answers I'm
making you feel good about.
Oh yeah, like you said, you'resitting somewhere cozy and safe

(32:31):
inside your house.
I want to stay cozy and safeinside my house.
I heard there's a boogeyman outthere of people that can't be
trusted.
They're not from this country,they're, you know.
I heard one man say yeah, youknow.
They were taking the ducksright off the pond in the park
and roasting them.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
Pigs and everything and.

Speaker 1 (32:55):
I'm laughing, but it's not funny, right, because
it's so absurd.
But it's also really dangerous,and there have been, you know,
in Springfield Ohio.
There are so many attacks nowhappening on that community.
They're calling in bomb threatsto the city hall.
They're calling in bomb threatsto the schools.
There have been death threatsagainst the woman who runs the

(33:16):
Haitian Times, against the womanwho runs the Haitian Times.
So the boogeyman that they'vecreated, right?
There's also this like, really,this right wing or, you know,
radicalized group of people thatare reading these hysteria,
these sensationalized accounts,and they feel like, oh well, the
patriotic thing for me to do isdo something about it, right.

(33:37):
And so, just like we saw inTulsa, we're seeing this also,
like you know, igniting thissense of vigilante justice,
where people are taking justiceinto their own hands, they think
, by attacking these blackcommunity.

Speaker 2 (33:51):
Yeah, and the twofold about that particular situation
is is one thing about the dogsto catch the ducks and the pigs,
but they're also talking aboutwell, the Haitian migrants are
coming here and getting all ofour benefits.
You know, they get betterhousing us with.
You know they're taking the jobs.
It's the same trope that'spretty much played out.
Um, during this time ofelections and all, where it's

(34:13):
like this is speaking to hisbase and not to make a, you know
, political conversation, buthe's speaking more to his base.
Who will say that?
And then we get terms likeblack jobs and you know things
like that.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
It turns like black jobs.
And we also get this idea that,um, you know, I've I'm in the
middle of a focus groupdeveloping, uh, messaging around
reparations, and we have reallydeeply held values right Around
what is right and what peopledeserve and what people need.

(34:46):
And so we all know that peopleneed housing right.
We all know that people needfood, we all know that we need
some level of healthcare tosupport our health and wellbeing
, and so it's also playing onour heartstrings to hear that,
oh, there are people who aregetting housing, but we know
that there's homelessness right,there are people who are
getting food stamp vouchers orSNAP benefits, but there are

(35:10):
people who are going hungryevery day.
But it's also playing on thepolitics of scarcity, because
why is it wrong for people to begetting housing?
Why is it wrong for people tobe getting SNAP benefits?
Is it because there are peoplein our community that we know
are displaced and homeless?

(35:31):
Is it because of theseimmigrants that they're
displaced or homeless?
Is it immigrants' fault thatfood is so expensive?
No, it's our government'sgovernment fault.
And then we go all the way intothe other thing that the media
likes to pick up hysteria about,which is this idea of like
social programs that benefiteverybody are socialism, and
socialism is bad and wrong andun-american I mean, are people

(35:55):
that dumb you?

Speaker 3 (35:57):
I mean, and maybe I might be wrong for saying, this
why do you tell me?
Because what happens is I lookat it's a legitimate question,
you know it's because it's like,like you said, we have social
media, so we have a lot ofdifferent news pulling us all
different ways right.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:15):
But you still have the internet.
I mean, you still can actuallypull up, you know crime reports
and you know different thingsLike you know.
I guess most people don't do it, but it's just like you cannot
be that dumb.
You know, in certain things I'msitting.
The reason why I said this I'min a VA hospital the other day.
I'm a veteran.
I'm sitting there and I'msitting amongst a bunch of black

(36:37):
people, white people.
I'm sitting amongst a bunch ofblack people, white people.
Old white man comes in.
He's sitting there watching theTrump news on the.
You know, while we're sittingthere and he waiting for a
doctor and they start talkingabout this migrant stuff and he
goes off.
He just like, yeah, this isright, they're raping all women.
You know they're doing this andthey're doing that.
And I'm sitting there and eventhough it's so embarrassing

(36:57):
embarrassing even some of theyoung white guys in there are
like this is crazy you know whatI mean so I don't know if are
people that dumb or they justknowingly racist and just want
to lean to this information or Idon't understand what's funny
about that that you mentionedthat.

Speaker 2 (37:11):
There's actually a documentary maybe y'all could
check this out.
It was, it's on prom.
It's called they brainwashed myfather and it's a documentary
where a woman charted her dadwho was you know the most.
I think he was a democrat, youknow from the 60s and 70s, more
liberal as you know the.
Uh, you know, times arechanging during the 70s and the

(37:33):
60s and 70s between that timeand she said what happens is you
know he's a truck driver.
I believe he's a truck driverand he started listening to you
know more, you know republicanradio like more you know, right
ring radio and um, as he beganto listen to it.
You know, yeah, the tuckercarlson's the you know the well,

(37:55):
his thing at that time was rushlimbaugh.
When Rush Limbaugh was alive,he loved Rush Limbaugh Like.
He listened to Rush Limbaughshow a few times and it became
like this thing to the pointwhere she documented how he
started parroting everythingthat Rush Limbaugh said.
It could be dead wrong, butbecause Rush Limbaugh said it,
he believed it.

(38:16):
He believed it.
And so she was showing acomparison of how this man, who
one time you know, was, you know, a person who believed in equal
rights and wasn't racist oranything of that nature how,
after a while of listening tothis stuff, can corrupt your
mind.
So and I'm, and I'm looking atthis thinking to myself, like,
whether it be a Democrat orRepublican, whether it's Fox

(38:38):
News, MSNBC, CNN or whatever, ifyou sat down and you ingested
that long enough, right, you'llstart believing this stuff, you
know.

Speaker 3 (38:47):
But that's why I said they're like sheep, because
I've literally talked todifferent groups of people and
sometimes I just get information, just listen to them and I'm
like I'm literally listening tothem read off, like, like points
and I'm like I'm literallylistening to them read off like
points.

Speaker 1 (39:01):
They're reading off the point.

Speaker 3 (39:02):
Everybody has the same talking points.
If you're a liberal, you gotthis talking point.
If you, you know, on the otherside, you got this talking point
and they're following it to theletter.
And even sometimes, when I'mspeaking to some Black people
about the, you know theDemocratic talking points, I'm
like you got to be out of yourmind.
If you believe this, you knowwhat I mean.
Like we're so dedicated to not,I don't know Nobody's objective

(39:24):
, no more.
Nobody really, you know, doesthe homework.
You know what I mean Because,to be honest with you, I think
when I was younger maybe I mighthave been immature, but I
thought news was more objectiveback then, Like now.
It seems like all of the newsoutlets if you sit down and
listen to them long enough.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
I mean like Everybody has an agenda.

Speaker 3 (39:44):
Everybody's pulling their own way.

Speaker 1 (39:46):
Every platform has an agenda.
I think that where I wouldagree with you is that people do
not do enough research,embedding of the information
that's being shared with them,and you absolutely.
If you ingest only your ownopinions and ideas, or one set
of opinions and ideas all thetime, you know there's going to
be confirmation bias.
It's much easier for a whiteman, I think, though, to be

(40:08):
indoctrinated by other white men.
It would be easy for me to bemore indoctrinated hearing the
same thing over and over fromanother Black woman, because
it's like, oh, I identify withher, and then here I am, hearing
over and over what it is thatshe has to say.
In this viewpoint, I think thatwe all could be susceptible,

(40:28):
right, if we don't do our duediligence and if you don't have
a practice around media literacy, to vet information, which a
lot of people are like oh, I'mgetting the information.
I got it from the news outletright.
I got it from this post online.
That is the information they'renot doing fact-checking.
That's why fact-checking is soimportant.
This is why research is soimportant.

(40:49):
This is why it's also reallyimportant to know how to be a
student of history and to read,know where to find the
information that people aresaying that they're citing and
the sources that they're sayingthat they're citing that you
know the rumor about the personwho's oh, her cat went missing
and she had Haitian neighbors.

(41:10):
She told a friend of hers andthat friend posted on the
Facebook, right, the originalwoman.
Her cat came back.
Her cat was in the house.
Yeah, oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 (41:19):
And she wasn't.
She's like her cat came back.
Her cat was in the house.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Yeah, oh my gosh, and she wasn't.
She's like, I'm not racist, butit was racist for you to say to
put a missing cat plus Haitianneighbor means somebody ate your
cat.
That is racist.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
That is racist.
That is racist and it's just acommon, you know nothing is just
a lack of common sense.

Speaker 3 (41:37):
You know.
Another thing is it's just alack of common sense Sometimes,
when the news just sayssomething to you, whether it be
something criminal, political,anytime, you just you're like oh
, come on, man, that's not evenpossible.
What they're saying right there, you know what I mean, it
doesn't even make any logicalsense.
You know so.
But you know, like I said, youguys got a lot more hope than me
.
I think they're sheep man.

(41:58):
You guys got a lot more hopethan me.
I think they're cheap man.
Like I said, I've been talkingto brothers and sisters recently
and you know we talk aboutpolitical things.

Speaker 1 (42:11):
And I'm like I grew up with you Like you want.
You want to get rid of Mexicans, you crazy.
You know where they're gettinginformation from.
Also, we have to start talkingabout tech consolidation and
media consolidation.
Tech consolidation and mediaconsolidation so the number of
outlets that used to exist don'tanymore.
There have been media tycoonslike Rupert Murdoch have bought
up a lot of what used to beindependent outlets or what used

(42:34):
to be locally owned.
Private equity is also playinga role, so there are fewer and
fewer people controlling whatwe're able to read and what
we're able to see.
And then, when it comes tosocial media Facebook and
Twitter and threads and what'sthe other one, Reddit these

(43:11):
platforms are designed to keepyou on the platform and they're
manipulating your brainchemistry, what your dopamine
receptors are, and also yourattention span and when
something is making you angry.
So when something issensationalized or is outrageous
, it is more compelling.
As outrageous, it is morecompelling, and so you're going
to keep on scrolling.
Or if it's a message board likeReddit or Facebook where you
can comment, you're going to geton there and comment and you're
going to read other people'soutrageous comments and then
you're going to get into themuck with them also.

(43:31):
So these platforms are alsodesigned.
So now we're consuming mediathat is being controlled by a
small number of people,controlled by people whose
motive is profit, notinformation.
It's not a mission driven, youknow.
It's not a mission drivenmotivation behind it.
They want to get as much moneyas possible, they want as many
eyes as possible.
The shift to digital means wewant as many clicks as possible.

(43:54):
So here goes a headline thatmight be misleading or isn't
even really properly vetted.
Here goes a headline that mightbe misleading or isn't even
really properly vetted.
So the media environment isfull of noise and full of
manipulation and manipulativetactics to keep people's eyes
and ears on it and notnecessarily to inform us.
It's also why independent newsis so important.

(44:15):
It's why citizen journalism isso important, because the uh,
corporate dominant medialandscape, um, the motivation
underlying it is not to informpeople so that we can, so that
everybody won't be dumb, Okay,so that everybody won't.

Speaker 3 (44:32):
Maybe, maybe I'm saying it the wrong way.
That's the Brooklyn to me, butyou know, I just you know that's
how I love it.
That's how it comes out, man.
It's when I just get frustrated.

Speaker 1 (44:43):
Like I said, I'm talking to people, educated
people, you know it isfrustrated, it's outrageous to
have somebody, when I firststarted doing political
education work and would puttogether a really
well-researched workshop forfolks, and then have at the end
of the workshop, someone turn tome and say, oh well, you know,
but don't Black people commitmore crimes?

Speaker 3 (45:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah , yeah, that's crazy Wild, but
it's funny that you should saythat I had a situation with a
white guy one time and he justhad this conversation and he
just started talking about, youknow, black women being on
welfare and I'm like you do knowthat there's more white women
on welfare.
You know, you can google this.
This is not like informationthat you know that's not

(45:22):
accessible to you, but it's likeI think we're just like
knowingly dumb now, you know,like nobody really wants to,
like you said, just do the workyeah, and there's a lot more
work to do that's a fact.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
And even like when you talked about, like citizen
journalism which has its prosand cons, because you know we
have those that want to do itright and then you got, you know
, alex jones doing what he didand jacking a lot of people up.
So it's like, you know, we kindof kind of vet that too yes yeah
, even in citizen journalism,because a lot of it is telephone

(45:56):
and speculation and theory andyeah, yeah you know, but there
are some good people out theredoing some good work and
research, but I often look at itas a rabbit hole to say, you
know, if this person said this,let me do my diligence and yes,
you know, and check on it myself.
and, um, what I wanted to askyou too is, because of media
2070s work and you know you mayhave explained this and a lot of

(46:20):
what you said and all, but weknow that you, you know you seek
reparations in terms of media,right, you know, a lot of people
think reparations, they think40 acres and a mule, a couple
dollars in your pocket, howeveryou want to view it, but with
the media reparation, what would?
What would it look like andwhat would we have to do to kind
of push that narrative forwardto say this is what we want?

(46:42):
Do we stop looking at theseoutlets?
Do we, you know, try to seekout our own media, if it's, if
it's some out there, cause it issome out there, but yeah,
absolutely.

Speaker 1 (46:53):
Um, that's a really good question, and so the
example that I'll give is, um,to your point about the man who
got radicalized by LieutenantRush Limbaugh.
The ways that the right wingand conservative got a hold of
the radio airwaves was through afederal policy of the FCC and
who they issued licenses to.

(47:14):
And you know, shout out to JoeTorres, who's our senior policy
advisor.
And you know, shout out to JoeTorres, who's our senior policy

(47:36):
advisor, he's doing thatresearch to show that there has
been repeatedly, there's beenfederal communications policy
that, like the FCC right, makingsure and ensuring that we have
actual equitable access to theairwaves and to radio licenses,
or maybe even making reparativeright, reparative funds towards
that, so that we can haveBlack-owned radio and
locally-owned radio thatreflects our perspectives.

(47:58):
It might look like us holdingthe large media companies to
task again, where their roots ofthe crime beat 24-hour news
cycles rooted in anti-Blackness,where they've made their bread
and butter in thesemulti-billion-dollar
conglomerates.
Maybe it looks like thosecompanies being held to task to

(48:18):
create reparative funds andresources for Black-owned and
controlled media, black-ownedand controlled broadcast media
as well.
Maybe it looks like at thelocal level you know there are
ways that our local stategovernments mandate that certain
types of advertising needs tohappen for public service

(48:39):
announcements or publicnotifications.
Maybe it looks like requiringthat a percentage of those funds
are dedicated to Black mediaoutlets and Black contractors
and Black advertisers.
There are a lot of opportunitiesbecause there are so many
different ways that our mediasystem has been anti-Black,
there are so many sites of harmthat we can cite and then there

(49:00):
are so many pathways tocompensation.
I believe that the victims andthe survivors I'm a descendant
of a Tulsa Race Massacresurviving family deserve
restitution for the harm thatthese media outlets have
perpetuated against our people,that there needs to be a
compensation, that we need toalso institute a media system

(49:23):
that is going to prevent thisperpetuation of radicalized
anti-Black news, sensationalizedcrime reporting.
There's been studies put out,for example, by Color of Change,
about the fact that the crimeis over-reported as a Black
issue, and to the point where ithas implications for our lived

(49:44):
everyday experience.
When you're interacting withyour doctor, when you're
interacting with your coworker,when you're interacting with
your attorney, when our childrenare interacting with school
disciplinary policies, they'recoming up against these
anti-Black tropes that have beenperpetuated and are being
perpetuated by the media.
And so what media reparationslooks like is addressing sites

(50:06):
of harm and then institutingrepair.
It looks like even theprofession of journalism being
repaired.
Our journalism manager, diamondHardiman, and Vinikia Williams,
our campaign manager.
They've developed a collegecurriculum for journalism
students to help transform evenhow journalism is taught and

(50:27):
teaching a more accurate andthorough history of the role of
the media in perpetuatinganti-Black racism and other
forms of racism anddiscrimination discrimination
and then teaching thosejournalism students how to be
better journalists so that whenthey go out in the world they're
not going to continue toperpetuate these cycles.
And that's also a part of mediareparations is, you know,

(50:47):
transforming the system, even inthe way that the system is
built and grown through.
What types of education do weget?
You talked a little bit earlierabout.
You know this idea of mediaobjectivity has never been
objective.
The actual you know whatthey're calling objective is
having a white man's perspective, right, that's what they're
calling being unbiased.

(51:08):
And so we need to correct thosethings.
And that's what mediareparations would look like is
correcting, understanding whatneeds to be corrected, what
needs to be repaired, and thenworking towards that.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Now I have another question, because what you said
stood out about having basicallyour own media, right.
So how do we hold our own mediaaccountable if we become
corrupt in some form or fashion?
Because, like, for instance,you know and I might not be
popular for saying this but wehave a black home station in

(51:39):
Philadelphia?
Right right and I mean youprobably heard the story of the
um, the uh, the, the show host,who was fired for you know, yes,
I did hear that the white houseprovided it with questions in
advance and whatnot, and sheadmitted to it.
Okay, yes, um, but thatparticular station and I've

(52:02):
noticed because I listen to themall the time which is more of a
, you know a biden harris, youknow support station.
They don't admit to that but youknow, all signs point to that
now the reason why I say that isbecause you might have people
who call into those shows, whomight have their opinion against

(52:23):
that administration, but you'reshutting them down because you
sat with Kamala, you've talkedto Joe, you know, you know, and
so, yeah, that kind of makesthem biased in that particular
stance, because you're notlooking at anybody else's
opinion and not to say that thepeople who call in and say, well
, I'm pro-Trump or I'mpro-Harris, it's just the fact

(52:46):
that when they're presentingtheir cause for why this
candidate is messed up as wellas that one is messed up, then
it's like, ok, we don't want tohear nothing about that, but
then you'll run, and this is thethis is the funny part here
want to hear nothing about that,but then you'll run, and this
is the this is the funny part toyou.
They will run severalcommercials after that,
basically saying, yeah, I'mvoting for harris, like you know
, like regular local commercials.
Yeah, we're voting for harrisbecause she's doing this, this

(53:08):
and this.
So how do we keep, like ourpeople, in check to make sure
that that media doesn't becomecorrupt to the point where, like
this, sister got fired from theadministration that you guys
promote, but yet nobody foughtto get her job back.
You fired her because of ofjournalistic integrity but, this
is your candidate, this is whoyou, this is who you're

(53:28):
promoting.
So nobody from the white housenobody from the station back
this woman on this whole thingand I've listened to her show
for a long time and for her tolose it just off of technicality
like that is crazy.
So this is how we got.
How do we police that?
How do we police that fromhappening?

Speaker 1 (53:43):
I don't disagree with you about that.
Hearing about that the decisionto fire her it made me think of
a few things.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
And it's Andrea Lawful Sanders.
That's who it was.

Speaker 1 (53:54):
Yes, it's Andrea.
It was yes, andrea.
Number one what we're talkingabout is ethics and the ways
that we hold, or should be ableto hold, our media institutions
accountable.
How every institution shouldhold itself accountable is that
there should be a code of ethicsthat they can be held to a

(54:15):
standard against that bias,political bias, even if it's
like a pro-police bias, you knowall of these different types of
things.
There should be a code ofethics that you can point to and
there should be some level ofinstitutional accountability.
It could be an advisory board,it could be a community advisory

(54:36):
board.
It could be advisory board.
It could be a standards boardthat they also are responsible
for answering to thattechnicality around giving the
candidate pre-clearance aroundthe questions.
It was a questionable action.
But my question in thatsituation was well, was the
disciplinary action for her tobe fired?

(54:58):
Was there not a level oftraining that could have
happened?
Was there not a level of youknow, when Whoopi Goldberg, you
know spouts out off his mouth onthe View, you know they'd be
like, okay, well, whoopi, you'regoing to have to miss a couple
episodes.
The severity of the punishmentagainst her I don't agree with
and I wasn't in you know anylevel of authority there, but I
think that having ethics andstandards and codes of conduct

(55:23):
are a sign of any organizationwith integrity, including media
organizations, institutions.

Speaker 2 (55:27):
Yeah, because Earl Ingram was on that same
interview with Andrew LawfulSanders.
And he said that he was providedthose same, you know, provide
the same questions Earl Ingramstill has.
Earl ingram still has his show,he still has his show.
So I mean, this is the thingthat we have to look like.
You know, we take our program,for instance, and we always tell

(55:47):
people, you know, to tell theaudience, whatever we doing, we
trying to be objective, you know.
I mean we, we look at asituation, we try to be
objective.
If something is right, it'sright.
If it's wrong, it's wrong.
You know, and the thing is withthis, you don't want to take
objectivity out of mediacompletely, you know, I mean,
because then we all, no matterwhat, you are leaning to one
side of a story.

(56:08):
So right, it's just that's whatI was looking at more towards
with.
How do we keep ourselves in interms of that?

Speaker 1 (56:14):
yeah, if some.
If there's a bias or a conflictof interest that needs to be
disclosed, then the person who'sreporting needs to disclose it
or reveal that so that theaudience can be fully informed.
But yeah, codes of ethics andconduct and standards and a
system for accountability shouldbe a part of any organization

(56:36):
that is serving especiallyserving an informative community
.
We should be able to point tothat and hold them to that.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
That's good, yeah.
And one last thing before youknow we we wrap up the, you know
, independent journalists.
If you want to, you'll say sucha thing.
You know we have the YouTubespace, we have a lot of podcasts
and networks and all.
How do you feel like, shouldyou know our journalists, help
to train these journalists to bekind of better and what they

(57:06):
are?
Because, like I said, you knowyou will look at a lot of people
who are doing what we're doingright now and even though we're
not journalists, we still can dothe diligence and everything
that everyone else is doing.
But we're reporting it from ourperspective or we're reporting
it from a, you know, I don'twant to say so much as a street
perspective, but just from areal perspective.
You know we don't have anagenda.

(57:26):
So the whole thing is is thatthose that have that knowledge,
how do you feel about themactually sharing that knowledge
with those that are trying tostart their platforms or are
already out doing their thing?
And you say, hey, you know, Isee what you're doing, but this
is how you know.
We can help you to do it alittle bit better.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
Oh yeah, absolutely.
I love that idea and I knowthat there are, at least in
Philadelphia, a feworganizations that are working
to help develop like peerlearning models, trainings
around like how to be you knowhow to practice investigative
journalism or how to do you knowqualitative research, things of
that nature.

(58:04):
There are people who are, youknow, instituting workshops
around how to you know addressbias right and how to you know
tell, do better storytellingwith you know multiracial
communities.
I think that any opportunitiesthat we have for community
building in peer-to-peerlearning I'm thinking about
racial equity in journalism,that is a fund for independent

(58:26):
and nonprofit BIPOC journalistsin newsrooms so there are
institutions and organizationsthat are thinking about how to
resource that work and thatlearning and give people
opportunities to buildrelationships so that we can get
folks, so that people can, youknow, be better representatives
of the communities that they'reserving.
Absolutely, yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
All right, and listen .
You know we thank you for yourtime.
Definitely, this is a lot ofinformation, a lot of
information.
We can go a lot deeper, but youknow time permits us from doing
that.
But I want you to let thepeople know where they can reach
you, your social handles andeverything, how they can support
the cause and everything likethat.
Go ahead and just speak to thepeople.
Let them know what they can doto help.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
Oh yeah, absolutely so.
Our website ismediareparationsorg.
That's where you can read ourgroundbreaking essay.
There's also an audio versionof it somewhere out here in the
world.
I have to get the link to itactually onto the website.
And then our social handle isat media 2070.
And I'm most active right nowon Instagram, even though I

(59:29):
don't be active on there.
But my own Instagram handle isat Tia Oso.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
Fist in the air for Tia.
A lot, a lot of social justicework.
Where do you see this allending up?
You know, with all the workthat you're doing, Because I
know it don't just start withMedia 2070, and you know
reparations and all.
So what do you see yourselfdoing?

Speaker 1 (59:51):
I see myself.
My ultimate goal is to becomean international woman of
leisure.
I got to get out of the UnitedStates on a regular basis for my
health and well-being.

Speaker 3 (01:00:07):
You sound like you're leaving the struggle man.
You're leaving us behind.

Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
Am I leaving or am I becoming?

Speaker 3 (01:00:12):
an elder.

Speaker 2 (01:00:15):
Am I elevating?
Go ahead and teach the nextgeneration how to do it right,
Exactly.
We got some more crack housesto close down, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
We do, and I'm going to be the instructor, as I, you
know, as I reach into, you know,becoming a more mature and
seasoned organizer.
I am learning that it isimportant for me to teach, and
it is important for me to teachthe lessons and the skills I've
learned to the next generation,because there's a lot of fire,
especially that 2020 moment.
I tell people we're out hereshutting down highways, and so

(01:00:46):
we shut down highways five yearsago, but you also have to know
how to go to the next citycouncil meeting.
You have to know how to go tothe state legislature Somebody
has to run for office and youhave to know how to go to the
state legislature somebody hasto run for office.
Ok, we all be fighting the powerall the time.
I mean we can, but we're goingto run ourselves low, you know,

(01:01:07):
and there's so many people thatI really love and respect,
fellow activists who we've lostover the years, and so that is
why, you know, I've had to makea concerted and stated effort
for my self-care and well-being,because-being, because being a
martyr is not my goal and I canbe really about that, and also
in order for us to.
You know, we're in a 400 yearstruggle here in the United

(01:01:28):
States.
And if we're going to winreparations, if we're going to
continue to win liberation, wehave to, you know, be healthy
enough to also reap the rewardsor reap the benefits.

Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
Do you think I mean, this is another quick question
Do you think that we dropped theball with, you know, the
momentum from Black Lives Matter?
Because I thought they hadreally good momentum and it
seemed like things just kind oflike went down afterwards.

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
That's a whole other episode.

Speaker 1 (01:01:58):
What I will say is that the same ways that you see
conservative talking pointsproliferating in Black
communities is a direct responseto the power that Black Lives
Matter had at its peak.

Speaker 2 (01:02:12):
There was a lot of good folks on the ground floor
that got caught up in thescandalous I should say uh,
scandalous, I should sayscandalous aspects of that
movement and uh, oh, absolutely,oh absolutely.
They had a lot of good peopleon the ground floor and I tell
you what one thing you could sayabout like these
pro-palestinian, you know,protests and all like that, them
cats, they, they go in there.

(01:02:33):
They'll show up anywhere, youknow a lot of times I think to
myself when I see that is likeyou know.
If we did that, you know, wouldyou get some type of change?

Speaker 1 (01:02:44):
But we did do that.
This is another episode.

Speaker 3 (01:02:47):
Right right, right, right right.

Speaker 1 (01:02:48):
I know what you want to say Black folks have done
everything from run for officeto have shootouts with the
police in this country.
Those people are not black.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Right, right, right Right.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
It's a different conversation.
It's a conversation that a lotof people don't want to have,
but I'll say every day it's likeif, if they were black, the
resistance would look different.

Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
Yeah, I don't know.
Highways is what she's saying.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:03:17):
Well, it was funny.
You just said that because it'slike, when you study the
history of some of the differentmovements around the world,
like they actually got theirideas from the movements here.

Speaker 2 (01:03:28):
Absolutely, absolutely.

Speaker 3 (01:03:31):
But somehow they were completely wrong.

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
They're not doing the same tactics that they got from
us.
They're not doing it in a blackbody.

Speaker 3 (01:03:39):
Right, right, you're right, you're right, You're
right.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
So it was like we stormed the Capitol.
That would have been like Stormit out.

Speaker 3 (01:03:47):
It's never going to happen.

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
We would have got picked up at the house.
We would have got picked up.

Speaker 3 (01:03:53):
I got news for you I ain't going, I ain't going.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
That's what I'm going to miss Before you could get in
the Uber it would have been theblack van would have got you A
little sack on your head thewhole night.
The whole night.
But I'm serious, yeah, yes,it's for real.

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
It's for real.
All right, listen.
We thank you so much.
This was such a very goodconversation.
Looking forward to it all week.
Alright, the Only One MikePodcast is available on all
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(01:04:37):
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(01:05:01):
comments and questions played onthe show.
We thank you once again foryour time, your audience, see
you once again, and we encourageyou to speak the truth quietly
and clearly, and listen toothers, even a dull and ignorant
, because they too have theirstory to tell.
So until next time, please keepin mind that if you never had
to run from the Ku Klux Klan,then you shouldn't have to run

(01:05:22):
from a black man.
Peace.

Speaker 3 (01:05:26):
Peace.