February 17, 2023 • 19 mins
Caitlin Harrison commonly hears clients and people in her life describing themselves and their needs as "too much". What this truly translates to is that we're living in an environment that is not enough for us. Listen in as Caitlin dives into societal pressures, systemic barriers, and her own experiences with privilege as a white therapist.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
My name is Caitlin Harrison and I'm out of session with Chi Minh
and Co a feelings for her podcast where we leave, our
therapists elves at the door andhave messy real conversations
about being human. Today's topic is feeling like
you're too much before I tell you a little bit about what our
podcast is about today. I need to give big props and
shout out to Amanda lamb and Danny maroof.
(00:21):
Oh, they are the two people at Chi Minh and Co who are putting
on this podcast and have made this possible.
They they literally have birthedthis of their own accord and you
can listen to them and hear moreabout them in the podcast right
before mine. So thank you, Amanda and Danny.
I so appreciate you. This podcast is for anyone who
(00:44):
has felt as though they were toomuch.
I'm going to talk about examplesof one feeling, like you're too
much comes up. How Society participates in this
insecurity, and how I navigate this limiting feeling myself, a
few examples of what it looks like when you're feeling like,
you're too much. How Society participates in this
insecurity and how I navigate myself this limiting feeling.
(01:08):
What prompted this topic for me is that I can almost guarantee
that. If I'm meeting with someone as a
therapist, if I meeting with a client, who is a member of an
oppressed group, it typically will come up in one of our
sessions. They'll look at me and say, I
(01:29):
just feel like I'm too much. And I hate it.
I hate hearing, like, people describe themselves, or describe
their needs as being too much. Because what I really am hearing
is when they feel like they're too much, is that something else
(01:52):
is happening, right? They are living in or in
community with or in a society that really is not.
Enough for them for their needs,but instead it becomes
internalized, it becomes this. This issue with myself, it
becomes I am the problem, right?Rather than something is at
(02:17):
play, here, something is a problem out there.
I hear it with friends to the worse is when I hear mainly men
talk about how, I don't know if I can date her.
She's too much. I hate that one.
I hate it so much and I resonatewith it in high school.
(02:38):
I was a theater, kid. Girl, I went to a small like
private Christian High School and because of that, I knew
everybody, or rather everybody knew me because I was very, I
don't know, flamboyant, I guess you could say I was I was I was
(03:01):
an extrovert in high school and I remember talking to one of my
friends and he said, oh yeah, guys don't want to date you
Kayla, because you're too aggressive.
But she's so weird because I wasn't doing anything I wasn't
dating. I wasn't making my feelings or
crushes, very known. And somehow I have the
(03:25):
reputation that I was too aggressive.
I was too much. Much and looking back on high
school. Caleb.
Really like she was wonderful. She she was so bold and creative
and she let her know her humor, speak for itself.
(03:47):
And she allowed herself to take up a lot of space.
But that really set with me for a while, you know, what does it
mean? If, you know, I'm straight and
I'm considering the people that I want to date and all these men
say I'm too aggressive. I'm too much.
I get angry about it with clients, I feel for them when
(04:10):
they bring up this topic of feeling like they're too much, I
get angry about it. When I hear different
conversations or news stories recently, it was women in Iran
who are fighting for basic humanrights and some of what the
(04:31):
issues could be boiled down to. And my perspective is Is that
their request for a choice and whether or not they want to
cover? Their hair has been considered
or deemed too much and it's brutal.
I think about it with clients orfriends or people that I meet
(04:51):
with that are able to talk to meabout their experiences of being
in a brown or black body and This feeling comes up of being
too much or being misunderstood and they are because our society
had is, so the specifically Western us Society is so
(05:18):
entrenched and white supremacy that, of course, they feel like
too much because our society arewhite supremacy.
This, this oppression is so, so large and overwhelming.
That really the message continually being put out into,
(05:41):
you know, from the ground up is,or should I say top-down, is
that if you are not white, you are not enough.
Also like let's talk about beauty, standards God, like this
thing of being too much like that is fatphobia.
Also write like taking up space having a body that is not thin
(06:09):
or skinny. You get deemed as undesirable
you get deemed as too much, you get deemed as You also like,
aren't provided suitable fashionobject options because your body
is too much and therefore requires too much fabric.
Like it's, it's BS, like it's there is such an issue with how
(06:36):
we portray people in society or like the representation that we
have, that is still. So, so limited. and, I really,
really hope that we continue notto settle for the crumbs of
representation that we are starting to get, we need more.
(06:57):
We need representation that allows for The complexity of
life. because if we don't see ourselves in media, if we don't
see ourselves in everyday life, if we don't see ourselves on our
(07:19):
feeds, then it can really reinstate this fact that I'm too
much or I'm different or I'm notenough.
For me, some of this comes up around my my past from of
(07:43):
growing up in a Conservative Christian, home school, and
church. I've done a lot of work on
deconstructing, my faith and deconstructing, my spirituality,
and figuring out what feels goodfor me.
What feels safe to talk about? What feels safe in my body and a
(08:05):
lot of it, I've had to reconstruct a spirituality and a
practice that includes pleasure.And with that, that's so
important. Because the way that I grew up
women and of course, how I grew up was held a lot of binary
(08:28):
around gender. So when I say woman, it is
limiting because it's that speaks to how I grew up, like it
was just man or woman. And so for those that were
socialized, female There was this idea that our bodies are
(08:49):
not our own. They are just for our husbands
Purity culture that is what that's a movement that started
in the 90s and took on a world of its own, and a world of pain.
For those that participate in Purity culture, taught that
women again, those socializes female were to take on this
(09:15):
burden. This It's yolk.
If you will to ensure that men that boys did not quote lust,
right? Which is so so ridiculous like
we as in like prepubescent children where somehow holding
(09:37):
the responsibility of of quote like luring or helping men not
to laugh. Just, that's gross, that's
really gross. And that is so huge.
And really, for me, like, there was so much subconsciously
working within me around, like, oh, well, my body is too much.
(10:01):
It's too powerful it, my body. And what I choose to wear, what
I choose to put on my body, has the power to quote make men
stumble. Wow, what, what's going on down?
Here, I don't know that feel scary.
So I'm not going to invest in orexplore or do very like regular
(10:28):
developmental things. and that is hard to reset, to be able to
make a home within myself, to feel safe in my body to become
aware of my body to say, to my body that you are enough, you
(10:53):
Have needs, it's okay to pay attention to these needs.
You're allowed to Talk to me. I had to like create
conversation between my body andmy mind because so much was
disconnected. It comes up to like with.
(11:21):
The work that I do. Now this, this fear of being too
much or not enough, I was talking with my husband the
other day about some, some relationships in my life, some
friendships where I'm feeling like, I not giving enough I am
(11:44):
so glad to have friends now thatare Social justice activists
they're very involved in naming acknowledging and fighting for a
more Equitable Equitable societyand community.
And I feel both encouraged by that and I also feel
(12:07):
consistently like I'm not enoughfor I'm never doing enough and
to me that gets translated as white guilt and shame.
And I'm not saying that it's notsome of those things.
And as I was discussing it with him, he said, well, yeah, that's
the thing Caitlin. Like you feel like you were too
(12:28):
much of a quote radical or liberal for your family and you
also feel like you were not enough for the friends that you
get to call family. Now and I really hit, he didn't
know. Also that I was thinking of
talking about this on the podcast.
So perhaps you Joey, it hit me in a big way because that is a
(12:57):
spectrum that I feel like I'm constantly moving in between
that I I feel as though I need to censor myself in a lot of
ways because I do love my family.
I do love the people who raised me.
I love my siblings. I love my cousin's, I love
(13:20):
everyone even though our Beliefsvery a lot.
And and so I fear sometimes pushing the boundaries I may be
losing some of that connection or relationship.
(13:42):
And on the flip side, I fear notbeing enough for the people who
are encouraging me to grow and to continue learning and
relearning. And that's a place that I find
myself often. I feel it and doing this
(14:03):
podcast. You know, is this is this
enough, am I naming enough? Because this topic of feeling
like too much, I Know, It resonates with so many and I
know my perspective is limited to my lived.
Experience, how I am a white cisgender?
(14:27):
A heterosexual woman who has a lot of privilege privilege and
education and marital status. And that feels both liberating
because I know I have a lot of ability and platform to stand on
(14:49):
and that feels limiting at timesbecause I know there's always
more that I can do. So, This was a little peek into.
this spectrum that I am swimmingand from time to time and my
(15:16):
biggest hope and help. It has always been being able to
reach out. making friends that you were able to be vulnerable
with choosing partners that pushyou and serve as a mirror, a
(15:39):
mirror for you to see your most beautiful parts and a mirror for
you to see your Shadow Self as well.
I say all this very vulnerable ebecause it's also a piece of
accountability. For me, I get to do more and I
want to do more and so if you are listening and this
(16:04):
resonates, I hope you can sit with it, sit with the discomfort
sit with the hope for something different sit with the The
creative imagination of building, a community that
supports you all of you. That allows you to.
(16:32):
Bloom and blossom and grow. Because we all need that.
Life is too short to. Be bogged down by the
limitations that the oppressors have put on us.
Because I refuse to be put back in a box.
(16:56):
I can't, there's too much. Sorry, just got caught up in the
irony of me saying there's too much but there is too much.
At risk. If I don't, if I stay in my box.
And if you stand this box, there's way too high of a cost
(17:20):
here. So what you just listened to was
some thoughts around this insecurity, or this feeling of
being too much, there were some examples in there of what this
looks like. Also some pieces of how Society
(17:44):
participates in this feeling andhow I myself am navigating this
limiting feeling. Before we go back into section
session, I am going to bring youto our community highlight today
is the Avenue 50 studio and I'm going to read from their
(18:06):
website. The Avenue 50 studio is an Arts
presentation organization, grounding and Chicana / Chicano
and Latino /. Latino culture Visual Arts and
the Northeast Los Angeles area. We seek to build bridges of
cultural understanding through artistic Actions.
We develop programming to informour community Through Innovative
(18:28):
projects that connect artists students academics and members
of the community. And I'm going to encourage you
to decolonize your social media feed by following at Fierce fat
Femme. That's FIA ERC e.
Fa T Fe mme Angelica has this istheir Instagram account.
(18:50):
They also have a tick tock and in and Facebook, I believe.
Eve and Angelica's whole work isabout unpacking and internalized
fatphobia and normalizing fat people in all aspects of Life.
They are a model lecture consultant.
They also have PCOS and talk a lot about their experience with
(19:13):
PCOS, but I love their feed and everything that it stands for.
So I highly recommend that you check that out.
Well, that's it for me today. See you, next time, when we're
out of session,
My name is Caitlin Harrison and I'm out of session with Chi Minh
and Co a feelings for her podcast where we leave, our
therapists elves at the door andhave messy real conversations
about being human. Today's topic is feeling like
you're too much before I tell you a little bit about what our
podcast is about today. I need to give big props and
shout out to Amanda lamb and Danny maroof.
(00:21):
Oh, they are the two people at Chi Minh and Co who are putting
on this podcast and have made this possible.
They they literally have birthedthis of their own accord and you
can listen to them and hear moreabout them in the podcast right
before mine. So thank you, Amanda and Danny.
I so appreciate you. This podcast is for anyone who
(00:44):
has felt as though they were toomuch.
I'm going to talk about examplesof one feeling, like you're too
much comes up. How Society participates in this
insecurity, and how I navigate this limiting feeling myself, a
few examples of what it looks like when you're feeling like,
you're too much. How Society participates in this
insecurity and how I navigate myself this limiting feeling.
(01:08):
What prompted this topic for me is that I can almost guarantee
that. If I'm meeting with someone as a
therapist, if I meeting with a client, who is a member of an
oppressed group, it typically will come up in one of our
sessions. They'll look at me and say, I
(01:29):
just feel like I'm too much. And I hate it.
I hate hearing, like, people describe themselves, or describe
their needs as being too much. Because what I really am hearing
is when they feel like they're too much, is that something else
(01:52):
is happening, right? They are living in or in
community with or in a society that really is not.
Enough for them for their needs,but instead it becomes
internalized, it becomes this. This issue with myself, it
becomes I am the problem, right?Rather than something is at
(02:17):
play, here, something is a problem out there.
I hear it with friends to the worse is when I hear mainly men
talk about how, I don't know if I can date her.
She's too much. I hate that one.
I hate it so much and I resonatewith it in high school.
(02:38):
I was a theater, kid. Girl, I went to a small like
private Christian High School and because of that, I knew
everybody, or rather everybody knew me because I was very, I
don't know, flamboyant, I guess you could say I was I was I was
(03:01):
an extrovert in high school and I remember talking to one of my
friends and he said, oh yeah, guys don't want to date you
Kayla, because you're too aggressive.
But she's so weird because I wasn't doing anything I wasn't
dating. I wasn't making my feelings or
crushes, very known. And somehow I have the
(03:25):
reputation that I was too aggressive.
I was too much. Much and looking back on high
school. Caleb.
Really like she was wonderful. She she was so bold and creative
and she let her know her humor, speak for itself.
(03:47):
And she allowed herself to take up a lot of space.
But that really set with me for a while, you know, what does it
mean? If, you know, I'm straight and
I'm considering the people that I want to date and all these men
say I'm too aggressive. I'm too much.
I get angry about it with clients, I feel for them when
(04:10):
they bring up this topic of feeling like they're too much, I
get angry about it. When I hear different
conversations or news stories recently, it was women in Iran
who are fighting for basic humanrights and some of what the
(04:31):
issues could be boiled down to. And my perspective is Is that
their request for a choice and whether or not they want to
cover? Their hair has been considered
or deemed too much and it's brutal.
I think about it with clients orfriends or people that I meet
(04:51):
with that are able to talk to meabout their experiences of being
in a brown or black body and This feeling comes up of being
too much or being misunderstood and they are because our society
had is, so the specifically Western us Society is so
(05:18):
entrenched and white supremacy that, of course, they feel like
too much because our society arewhite supremacy.
This, this oppression is so, so large and overwhelming.
That really the message continually being put out into,
(05:41):
you know, from the ground up is,or should I say top-down, is
that if you are not white, you are not enough.
Also like let's talk about beauty, standards God, like this
thing of being too much like that is fatphobia.
Also write like taking up space having a body that is not thin
(06:09):
or skinny. You get deemed as undesirable
you get deemed as too much, you get deemed as You also like,
aren't provided suitable fashionobject options because your body
is too much and therefore requires too much fabric.
Like it's, it's BS, like it's there is such an issue with how
(06:36):
we portray people in society or like the representation that we
have, that is still. So, so limited. and, I really,
really hope that we continue notto settle for the crumbs of
representation that we are starting to get, we need more.
(06:57):
We need representation that allows for The complexity of
life. because if we don't see ourselves in media, if we don't
see ourselves in everyday life, if we don't see ourselves on our
(07:19):
feeds, then it can really reinstate this fact that I'm too
much or I'm different or I'm notenough.
For me, some of this comes up around my my past from of
(07:43):
growing up in a Conservative Christian, home school, and
church. I've done a lot of work on
deconstructing, my faith and deconstructing, my spirituality,
and figuring out what feels goodfor me.
What feels safe to talk about? What feels safe in my body and a
(08:05):
lot of it, I've had to reconstruct a spirituality and a
practice that includes pleasure.And with that, that's so
important. Because the way that I grew up
women and of course, how I grew up was held a lot of binary
(08:28):
around gender. So when I say woman, it is
limiting because it's that speaks to how I grew up, like it
was just man or woman. And so for those that were
socialized, female There was this idea that our bodies are
(08:49):
not our own. They are just for our husbands
Purity culture that is what that's a movement that started
in the 90s and took on a world of its own, and a world of pain.
For those that participate in Purity culture, taught that
women again, those socializes female were to take on this
(09:15):
burden. This It's yolk.
If you will to ensure that men that boys did not quote lust,
right? Which is so so ridiculous like
we as in like prepubescent children where somehow holding
(09:37):
the responsibility of of quote like luring or helping men not
to laugh. Just, that's gross, that's
really gross. And that is so huge.
And really, for me, like, there was so much subconsciously
working within me around, like, oh, well, my body is too much.
(10:01):
It's too powerful it, my body. And what I choose to wear, what
I choose to put on my body, has the power to quote make men
stumble. Wow, what, what's going on down?
Here, I don't know that feel scary.
So I'm not going to invest in orexplore or do very like regular
(10:28):
developmental things. and that is hard to reset, to be able to
make a home within myself, to feel safe in my body to become
aware of my body to say, to my body that you are enough, you
(10:53):
Have needs, it's okay to pay attention to these needs.
You're allowed to Talk to me. I had to like create
conversation between my body andmy mind because so much was
disconnected. It comes up to like with.
(11:21):
The work that I do. Now this, this fear of being too
much or not enough, I was talking with my husband the
other day about some, some relationships in my life, some
friendships where I'm feeling like, I not giving enough I am
(11:44):
so glad to have friends now thatare Social justice activists
they're very involved in naming acknowledging and fighting for a
more Equitable Equitable societyand community.
And I feel both encouraged by that and I also feel
(12:07):
consistently like I'm not enoughfor I'm never doing enough and
to me that gets translated as white guilt and shame.
And I'm not saying that it's notsome of those things.
And as I was discussing it with him, he said, well, yeah, that's
the thing Caitlin. Like you feel like you were too
(12:28):
much of a quote radical or liberal for your family and you
also feel like you were not enough for the friends that you
get to call family. Now and I really hit, he didn't
know. Also that I was thinking of
talking about this on the podcast.
So perhaps you Joey, it hit me in a big way because that is a
(12:57):
spectrum that I feel like I'm constantly moving in between
that I I feel as though I need to censor myself in a lot of
ways because I do love my family.
I do love the people who raised me.
I love my siblings. I love my cousin's, I love
(13:20):
everyone even though our Beliefsvery a lot.
And and so I fear sometimes pushing the boundaries I may be
losing some of that connection or relationship.
(13:42):
And on the flip side, I fear notbeing enough for the people who
are encouraging me to grow and to continue learning and
relearning. And that's a place that I find
myself often. I feel it and doing this
(14:03):
podcast. You know, is this is this
enough, am I naming enough? Because this topic of feeling
like too much, I Know, It resonates with so many and I
know my perspective is limited to my lived.
Experience, how I am a white cisgender?
(14:27):
A heterosexual woman who has a lot of privilege privilege and
education and marital status. And that feels both liberating
because I know I have a lot of ability and platform to stand on
(14:49):
and that feels limiting at timesbecause I know there's always
more that I can do. So, This was a little peek into.
this spectrum that I am swimmingand from time to time and my
(15:16):
biggest hope and help. It has always been being able to
reach out. making friends that you were able to be vulnerable
with choosing partners that pushyou and serve as a mirror, a
(15:39):
mirror for you to see your most beautiful parts and a mirror for
you to see your Shadow Self as well.
I say all this very vulnerable ebecause it's also a piece of
accountability. For me, I get to do more and I
want to do more and so if you are listening and this
(16:04):
resonates, I hope you can sit with it, sit with the discomfort
sit with the hope for something different sit with the The
creative imagination of building, a community that
supports you all of you. That allows you to.
(16:32):
Bloom and blossom and grow. Because we all need that.
Life is too short to. Be bogged down by the
limitations that the oppressors have put on us.
Because I refuse to be put back in a box.
(16:56):
I can't, there's too much. Sorry, just got caught up in the
irony of me saying there's too much but there is too much.
At risk. If I don't, if I stay in my box.
And if you stand this box, there's way too high of a cost
(17:20):
here. So what you just listened to was
some thoughts around this insecurity, or this feeling of
being too much, there were some examples in there of what this
looks like. Also some pieces of how Society
(17:44):
participates in this feeling andhow I myself am navigating this
limiting feeling. Before we go back into section
session, I am going to bring youto our community highlight today
is the Avenue 50 studio and I'm going to read from their
(18:06):
website. The Avenue 50 studio is an Arts
presentation organization, grounding and Chicana / Chicano
and Latino /. Latino culture Visual Arts and
the Northeast Los Angeles area. We seek to build bridges of
cultural understanding through artistic Actions.
We develop programming to informour community Through Innovative
(18:28):
projects that connect artists students academics and members
of the community. And I'm going to encourage you
to decolonize your social media feed by following at Fierce fat
Femme. That's FIA ERC e.
Fa T Fe mme Angelica has this istheir Instagram account.
(18:50):
They also have a tick tock and in and Facebook, I believe.
Eve and Angelica's whole work isabout unpacking and internalized
fatphobia and normalizing fat people in all aspects of Life.
They are a model lecture consultant.
They also have PCOS and talk a lot about their experience with
(19:13):
PCOS, but I love their feed and everything that it stands for.
So I highly recommend that you check that out.
Well, that's it for me today. See you, next time, when we're
out of session,
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