April 25, 2024 • 20 mins
Due to the ANZAC public holiday we had a day off from recording. We didn't want to leave you without an episode, so here is a taste of what what our wonderful Outspoken Plus subscribers get every week.
It's time to get into your nostalgic feels.In 1999, Hi-5 burst onto the kids music scene. They were universally loved by kids and parents for their catchy pop music and wholesome vibes.
They even began rivalling Australian kids’ supergroup The Wiggles. There was one small difference though which became a problem for the cast… the business model.
In this series, we explore what was really happening behind the bubble gum illusion of Australia’s most popular kids entertainers… and what happened when they were no longer paid to maintain the facade.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Episode one, the making of High Five Together. In nineteen
ninety nine, High Five burst onto the kids music scene
Suck Suck. They were universally loved by kids and parents
(00:24):
for their catchy pop music and wholesome vibes.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Our director kept saying, more energy, more energy, give us more.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
That's really funny because Nathan and I took that really
personally and we just kept going up and up and up.
I was ready to explode. If you watched that first
series I had, I was like, hi, everyone like I
was that excited. At the end of the series, we
were at a rat party and he said, I was
never talking to you too. By the way, they even
began rivaling Australian kids supergroup The Wiggles. There was one
small difference though, which became a big problem for the cast.
(00:55):
The business model.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
It was busy. I mean, it was exhausting. At the
same time we were teenagers. We were loving the ride,
but it was long hours.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
In this series we explore what was really happening behind
the bubblegum illusion of Australia's most popular kids entertainers, and
what happened when they were no longer paid to maintain
the facade.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
You have your arguments, you have your ups and your downs.
It's like if you're working with someone constantly every single
day for ten years. Of course there's going to be
times where you getting each other's way or across the line.
But all in all, we were a great family and
we worked really well together.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
We are journalists, Kate and Sophie Torbert, and this is outspoken.
Plus I think we need to point out that we
were ten years old when High five first burst onto
the scene, and probably not their preschool demographic, but it's
safe to say we still loved the band. They definitely
did make a huge impression on me at the time,
(01:50):
and I think that that is the key to High
Fi's popularity, the fact that they didn't just appeal to
their target demographic. It was also older people and parents
who loved the music were fascinated by High Five. I
need to know what was your favorite High Five song,
because since doing the research, I have been listening to
a lot of them and they are getting stuck in
my head or this is a little bit embarrassing to admit,
(02:11):
but at our school we had red faces where for
those who aren't old enough to remember on hey, hey,
it's Saturday, there was a segment called Red Faces where
people would do skits and they'd get scored. So we
had that at our school and we did a number
of High Five performances. I think we did it to
the song North, South East and Western. Also Animals, so
they are my favorite. Let's throw on an upsot to
remind listeners of these songs, so second Animals. I wonder
(02:50):
if these are available on Spotify because I think I
need to make my own High five playlist now. And
High five will also iconic At Carols by Candlelight, they
made Carols by Candlelight and it's it's never been the
same since the original cast weren't on there on Christmas Eve. Yeah.
The fashion takes me back so much as well, because
there's so much layering going on. There's also a lot
of pedal pushes and skirts over the top of pedal pushes.
(03:12):
The hairstyles were also amazing. I remember Kelly always used
to have these really cool twisty updos, lots of butterfly clips, yeah,
butterfly clips, maybe a few slutstrands as well. And Tim
his hair was always so spiky, so much hair gel
going on there. Now, let's get into how it all
began because the concept of High five was developed when
Helen Harris and Posey Graham Evans joined forces and created
(03:34):
a production company called Kids Like Us. And it's pretty
interesting because Harris had already had great success in early
childhood entertainment because she was the creator of Bananas in Pajamas,
Oh Yeah, and Graham Evans actually went on to be
the mastermind behind McLeod's Daughters, so very successful women. And
the idea was to try and capture kids attention by
blending educational theories with musical appeal. So Harris and Graham
(03:58):
Evans worked on the concept with childhood educators and pitched
the idea of High five to Channel nine, who snapped
it up straight away. And it really helped at the
time because the head of drama at nine had a
young child. Now. The auditions to find the group were
held at the ABC studios in nineteen ninety eight, and
in an interview with Nathan Foley, he explained that he
was just eighteen at the time and he got a
(04:21):
call telling him that there were auditions being held for
new kids shows and they were looking for five presenters, singers,
dancers and actors. Now Nathan was one of three hundred
people that turned up to the first audition, and the
group was narrowed down until twenty five people remained. It's
quite interesting because it sort of reminds me of pop
stars back in the day and all of those talent shows,
(04:41):
because the group was then split into five groups of five,
and one of those groups contained Tim Harding, Kelly Crawford,
Nathan Foley, Charlie Robinson, and Kathleen Dileong Jones, who went
on to be the original members of High five Now.
Nathan said that their voices jelled so well together that
there was this real big aha moment and producers are like,
(05:02):
that is our group now. They started to record the
pilot at the ABC, and then when Channel nine took
on the show, everything started to move really quickly. I
think what really set High five apart was the music,
because it was able to stand alone from the show.
Even as a consumer of that show, my favorite bit
was the start and the end of the episode because
(05:22):
that's when they'd have the little concerts. Yeah, and it's
interesting because the creators of High five took inspiration from
the Spy Scales dance moves and they believed that preschoolers
could copy them, and they really did. We saw it
with songs like North, South, East and West. I mean
the kids sometimes got a little bit confused which direction
to go in. I think it seemed a lot cooler
than The Wiggles as well, because the performers were wearing
(05:45):
clothes that were very of the time, and they role
models for the kids. Well. The group style was modeled
on the fast paced nature of pop music, and in
a recent interview, Nathan Foley reflected on the success of
High Five and he put it down to the show's
ability to relate to botho kids and parents, and he
said parents could actually sit down and have a bit
of a laugh as well. Again, he said the music
(06:06):
was a very big part of it because, as you said,
it was pop orientated and while lyrically it was for
the kids, musically it was produced just like pop music,
so if you did get rid of the lyrics, you
could easily play it on radio. It's pretty crazy because
in the same year that the show launched, Sony Music
released High Five's debut album, which was called Jump and Jive,
(06:27):
and it reached number thirty three on the ARIA album charts.
What Play is My Mind looking back at this time
is just how young the members of the group were
when it first launched. So Charlie Robinson was the youngest
she was only eighteen, while Kelly was the oldest at
twenty five. And the idea was that High five weren't
meant to be childhood educators, but they were meant to
be more like older siblings or friends to the kids,
(06:49):
and I think this really worked well. At the time,
no one really knew how rapidly this show was going
to take off, and it really didn't take long for
High Five to become one of Australia's most success for
musical groups. The show was actually broadcast daily into eighty
one countries. They also topped the music charts, with four
of their albums reaching the top ten and receiving five
(07:10):
consecutive ARIA Music Awards for Best Children's Album and the
original group also received three Logis for Most Outstanding Children's Program.
And as you mentioned, they had this international fan base,
which meant they were regularly touring across Australia, Britain, New
Zealand and Singapore and merchandise was another huge part of
their success, so High Five actually had a range at
(07:31):
Kama which was not just clothing and accessories, but also
included dinnerware, games, craft products, backpacks, luggage, Christmas and Easter confectionery,
and even a jumping castle and carousel. Now success didn't
come easy though. The young group members worked really hard.
So they had forty five episodes to record each series,
and they spent three months each year recording the show.
(07:54):
So on a Sunday they would get their scripts and
then they'd spend three days rehearsing what they were going
to film, and then two days filming it. Now, the
filming days started very early in the morning and didn't
end until seven or eight at night, and in terms
of rehearsals, this involved learning scripts off by heart for
their segments, as well as new songs because they didn't
have an AUTOQ. And when they weren't filming, they toured
(08:17):
for seven months of the year, doing three one and
a half hour shows a day, six days a week
around Australia, Asia, New Zealand and the whole of the UK.
And after all of that they were allowed one month
off a year. I didn't realize that they were working
the cast members this hard. Now, despite the very grueling schedules,
there still wasn't enough time for them to tap into
the American market, so another High Five was actually created,
(08:41):
and in a recent interview, Nathan Foley spoke about how
he nearly ended up in hospital from the exhausting schedule.
Let's throw to what he said.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
It was busy. I mean it was exhausting. At the
same time, I think there's not a lot of groups
in the world that actually do the TV thing but
also do the recording also, so go and visit the
children's hospitals and also have no time. You know, we
were teenagers were loving the ride, but it was long hours.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Now, while people often compared High Five and The Wiggles,
there was a major difference between these two kids entertainment groups,
which was the business model. So the original members of
The Wiggles actually created their own concept and therefore they
owned the franchise and merchandising rights, whereas with High Five,
their members were paid a salary by the production company
(09:31):
which created them. So in terms of money, the Wiggles
definitely reigned supreme. In two thousand and eight, they topped
business magazines Business Reviews Weekly annual list of top earning
entertainers with forty five million dollars. High five ended up
coming in fifth place that year with eighteen million. However,
as I said, the members of High five did not
hold equity. I would really love to know what their
(09:54):
salaries were at the time and to have seen the
growth during the success.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Well, it seems like the production company did look after
the original faces of High five. But the thing is,
as soon as you left the group, you didn't get
paid anymore, so you're not living off the royalties like
the Wiggles. I mean in saying that the Wiggles did
write their own songs, it sounds like High five weren't
involved in that actual creative process. So I understand perhaps
(10:18):
not making royalties off the songs themselves, but they were
the faces of the brand. Well, their personal ip was
the brand. When you look at some of the merchandise
back then, it was literally cartoons based on them, like
they were the faces of this brand. I did see
recently that Sophia Bush was complaining about when she was
working on One Tree Hill that they often got used
(10:39):
to do ads and never got paid anything because they said, oh, well,
that's just to promote the show. That's the difficulty. When
there's a bunch of young people who were really eager
for their big break. They'll sign anything just to get
their foot in the door, and unfortunately those contracts have
long standing consequences. Yeah, and I think because everyone knew
how much the Wiggles were making and then saw High
Five were making a lot, you just assume that the
(11:01):
talent on the show is also rolling in it. And
Nathan recalled in an interview how he received a lot
of backlash when he appeared on I Will Survive after
leaving High Five, and people were saying he was too
loaded to go on the show and he didn't need
the money, and he said, well, unfortunately, that's actually not
the case. Did you ever feel like there was a
bit of competition between High Five and the Wiggles? Well,
(11:21):
as a kid, I love the Wiggles, but I feel
like I progressed to High Five, even though I was
probably too old to like High Five. And you would assume,
because there were only three big kids bands at the time,
that there would be some sort of competition, because really
it was High Five, the Wiggles, and to a lesser
extent than Holy Dook God, I've totally forgot about the
Hooly Doolies. But Nathan Foley has confirmed that there was
(11:43):
literally no competition between the bands. They said that they
used to do photo shoots together and they have actually
remained friends. Nathan even performed at the Wiggles reunion tour
back in twenty twenty for the Bushfire Appeal. Isn't that
so wholesome? I love the fact that there wasn't anything
unsavory going on behind the scenes. Two thousand and six,
sadly was the beginning of the end for the original
(12:03):
group when Kathleen announced she was pregnant and son Park
was brought in as her temporary replacement while she was
on maternity leave. And while Kathleen was intent on returning
to High five in two thousand and seven, she decided
to make her decision a permanent one to focus on motherhood.
So while Kathleen was the first member to leave, by
the end of two thousand and eight, all the original
(12:24):
cast members had been replaced. So this is in a
span of two years. I totally forgot this. But Tim
was the next original member to leave the group, and
he left because he got injured in a serious motorcycle
accident in June two thousand and seven. So the poor
thing ended up fracturing his spine and he was in
a wheelchair for six weeks, and his injuries left him
(12:44):
unable to keep up with the pace of High Five's performances,
and he was replaced by his understudy, Stevie Nicholson. He
officially ended up leaving the group in November two thousand
and seven after recovering from his injuries. Things were starting
to crumble because just three months later, Charlie decided to
leave the group because she wanted to pursue acting, and
Casey Burgess was brought in as Charlie's replacement. Big changes
(13:07):
were also happening on the business side of things, so
the Nine network and production company Southern Star purchased the
High five brand in March two thousand and eight, and
this meant the original creators Harris and Graham Evans were
no longer involved in the franchise, and just seven months
after this, Kelly announced she would be leaving the group
at the end of the year to explore other options.
(13:29):
A month later, Nathan said he would be leaving to
focus on his adult music career. Then in December, Kathleen's replacement,
Sun Park, revealed she too would be leaving as she
had only really signed on to be a temporary replacement. Now,
based on all of these exits, rumors started swelling that
Southern Star, who was the new production company, had dumped
Kelly and Nathan because they wanted to recruit younger and
(13:51):
cheaper replacements, and it was reported that Nathan and Kelly's
farewell at Karras by Candlelight was going to be a
strained affair, with sources close to the Grip claiming the
pair had been jilted by the production company. To make
matters worse, allegedly, Kelly and Nathan had been dropped without consultation,
and according to a source, Nathan was allegedly the last
(14:12):
year that his High Five days were numbered. So apparently
what happened is he stopped for petrol on the Northeast
coast and a guy at the petrol station said to him, Hey,
my brother just got your job yesterday. Now this was
the first time he'd heard he was being replaced. That
is so crushing. What are the odds of him stopping
at the specific petrol station that his replacements brother is
(14:35):
working on like the High five production team must have
been for Fox says now, there were media reports circulating
about this, and the source was spilling all of this
news to a journalist. I mean, let's be honest, I'd
assume that the source was Nathan. Well, look, they tried
to cover Nathan's tracks because they did say he refused
to comment on the matter, and quoted him saying, look,
I really don't want to talk about it. I've got
a contract until Christmas and I intend to honor it.
(14:58):
When the main person in the story he says I
don't want to talk about it, that means they've already
spoken behind the scenes. Yeah. Well, at the time, Sunpark
had to come out and deny she had felt pressure
to leave the group alongside Kelly and Nathan, and she
also reiterated that it was Kelly and Nathan who had resigned.
Looking back, I do think it seems quite feasible that
the decision around out seeing Kelly and Nathan was down
(15:20):
to money, because the original members of the group were
on very high salaries, which was a problem when you
then start bringing these new people in. Also, it becomes
an issue because they were doing so much touring. So
when there's extensive touring, maybe the company thought, fuck, we
can't afford this. I suppose it does make sense from
a financial perspective to replace them with younger talent, and
(15:41):
the new members ended up being a decade younger than
Kelly and Nathan and presumably a lot cheaper to employee
for concerts. That being said, I think it was detrimental
to the overall brand because, as you said, Kate, the
original members, they were on lunchboxes, they were on all
of the merch. Everyone loved those cast members, and I
don't think that they've ever been as relevant since they
(16:01):
got rid of all of the original cast members. Well,
Channel nine clearly thought that they could just replace the
original cast and everything would be fine. They recommitted to
five new series to be aired until twenty thirteen. However,
only three of these series ended up being produced, and
they had this plan that they thought that they didn't
need to rely solely on the appeal of the cast
(16:21):
members as individuals, but it was clear they began backtracking
by season two because they said that they were trying
to recreate the success of the earlier episodes by capturing
that earlier innocence, and in the thirteenth and final series
of High five and twenty eleven they even went back
to reintroducing fans to the old songs in a bid
to make it popular again. Well, it does make sense
(16:43):
because all of the kids had grown up by then,
so they wouldn't really know any different. I do find
it interesting that they said that their initial strategy was
to not concentrate on the cast members as individuals, because
when they brought over Casey Burgers to replace Charlie Robinson
used to be on Girls TV. Do you remember that
shel TV? Girl TV. I think a lot of our
(17:05):
listeners will remember it. It's like it's a girl. Don't
get that mad head. I've got enough for those songs.
So she already had a bit of a profile in
the children's entertainment space, so I thought she was a
really clever pickup. That being said, they were probably fearful
that they would have the same thing in this second
generation of High Five. They'd slowly lose class members and
lose relevance and want more money. Yeah, it will happen again. Yeah. Well.
(17:28):
By twenty twelve, nine were forced to sell High five
to a Malaysian equity group called Ajion's following financial difficulty
at the network, and this new production company shifted High
Five's commercial focus to the Southeast Asian market, and they
also wanted to have new group members, so the audition
process was filmed and actually turned into a documentary style
(17:49):
film called Some Kind Of Wonderful, which premiered exclusively through
Hoyts Cinemas and after extensive touring, this new group released
a spinoff show called High five House, which was filmed
in Singapore and Malaysia between twenty thirteen and fifteen. Wow,
that's pretty crazy. I wasn't aware of this High five House.
It's pretty wild to think how long the brand actually
(18:10):
lasted though, from nineteen ninety nine till twenty fifteen. They
kind a good run. No, well, they still continued their runs.
So in twenty sixteen, the Nine Network renewed its partnership
with the High five franchise and announced they were planning
to revive High five with the new cast in twenty seventeen,
and while it would feature a newcast and set, Nine
retained the original team of producers and writers, and the
(18:32):
show was filmed in Malaysia and aired at the start
of twenty seventeen on nine Go Now. A second series
was planned for twenty eighteen, but filming was halted and
the Australian production office was closed. The brand then relocated
to Singapore and all five members left the group, so
temporary touring members were used for the remainder of twenty eighteen,
(18:53):
with the franchise continuing to employ non permanent performers for
touring purposes in twenty nineteen. So it seemed like at
the end they were just like, can anyone just sing
and dance in this group? The songs were really good.
If you've got strong writing with songs, I think that
is going to set you in a good stead. But
the fact is kids want to know the performers they do.
(19:14):
And the difference with High Five compared to the Wiggles
at that time was they actually were a little bit
diverse in that they had females and males. And I
know everyone absolutely loved Kathleen because she was Filipino. And
I think as a kid, you really aligned to your
favorite member in the group. It might be one that
looks like you or has similar attributes to you. And
I think when they started replacing them with whoever, it
(19:37):
lost that sparkle. Yeah, now that's where we are going
to leave things today. On next week's episode, we'll be
diving straight into all the juicy scandals, including a controversial
men's magazine shoot, a sex scandal, and a secret engagement.
Plus we will explore where the original cast members are now.
I can't wait for that. I cannot wait now. This
(19:57):
podcast was recorded on the traditional land of the Ghana
people of the Adelaide Planes. We pay respect to elders
past and present and if you do enjoy the show,
we would love to see you share about it on
your Instagram stories. And thank you so much again for
being an outspoken Plus subscriber. We really appreciate it.
Episode one, the making of High Five Together. In nineteen
ninety nine, High Five burst onto the kids music scene
Suck Suck. They were universally loved by kids and parents
(00:24):
for their catchy pop music and wholesome vibes.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Our director kept saying, more energy, more energy, give us more.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
That's really funny because Nathan and I took that really
personally and we just kept going up and up and up.
I was ready to explode. If you watched that first
series I had, I was like, hi, everyone like I
was that excited. At the end of the series, we
were at a rat party and he said, I was
never talking to you too. By the way, they even
began rivaling Australian kids supergroup The Wiggles. There was one
small difference though, which became a big problem for the cast.
(00:55):
The business model.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
It was busy. I mean, it was exhausting. At the
same time we were teenagers. We were loving the ride,
but it was long hours.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
In this series we explore what was really happening behind
the bubblegum illusion of Australia's most popular kids entertainers, and
what happened when they were no longer paid to maintain
the facade.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
You have your arguments, you have your ups and your downs.
It's like if you're working with someone constantly every single
day for ten years. Of course there's going to be
times where you getting each other's way or across the line.
But all in all, we were a great family and
we worked really well together.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
We are journalists, Kate and Sophie Torbert, and this is outspoken.
Plus I think we need to point out that we
were ten years old when High five first burst onto
the scene, and probably not their preschool demographic, but it's
safe to say we still loved the band. They definitely
did make a huge impression on me at the time,
(01:50):
and I think that that is the key to High
Fi's popularity, the fact that they didn't just appeal to
their target demographic. It was also older people and parents
who loved the music were fascinated by High Five. I
need to know what was your favorite High Five song,
because since doing the research, I have been listening to
a lot of them and they are getting stuck in
my head or this is a little bit embarrassing to admit,
(02:11):
but at our school we had red faces where for
those who aren't old enough to remember on hey, hey,
it's Saturday, there was a segment called Red Faces where
people would do skits and they'd get scored. So we
had that at our school and we did a number
of High Five performances. I think we did it to
the song North, South East and Western. Also Animals, so
they are my favorite. Let's throw on an upsot to
remind listeners of these songs, so second Animals. I wonder
(02:50):
if these are available on Spotify because I think I
need to make my own High five playlist now. And
High five will also iconic At Carols by Candlelight, they
made Carols by Candlelight and it's it's never been the
same since the original cast weren't on there on Christmas Eve. Yeah.
The fashion takes me back so much as well, because
there's so much layering going on. There's also a lot
of pedal pushes and skirts over the top of pedal pushes.
(03:12):
The hairstyles were also amazing. I remember Kelly always used
to have these really cool twisty updos, lots of butterfly clips, yeah,
butterfly clips, maybe a few slutstrands as well. And Tim
his hair was always so spiky, so much hair gel
going on there. Now, let's get into how it all
began because the concept of High five was developed when
Helen Harris and Posey Graham Evans joined forces and created
(03:34):
a production company called Kids Like Us. And it's pretty
interesting because Harris had already had great success in early
childhood entertainment because she was the creator of Bananas in Pajamas,
Oh Yeah, and Graham Evans actually went on to be
the mastermind behind McLeod's Daughters, so very successful women. And
the idea was to try and capture kids attention by
blending educational theories with musical appeal. So Harris and Graham
(03:58):
Evans worked on the concept with childhood educators and pitched
the idea of High five to Channel nine, who snapped
it up straight away. And it really helped at the
time because the head of drama at nine had a
young child. Now. The auditions to find the group were
held at the ABC studios in nineteen ninety eight, and
in an interview with Nathan Foley, he explained that he
was just eighteen at the time and he got a
(04:21):
call telling him that there were auditions being held for
new kids shows and they were looking for five presenters, singers,
dancers and actors. Now Nathan was one of three hundred
people that turned up to the first audition, and the
group was narrowed down until twenty five people remained. It's
quite interesting because it sort of reminds me of pop
stars back in the day and all of those talent shows,
(04:41):
because the group was then split into five groups of five,
and one of those groups contained Tim Harding, Kelly Crawford,
Nathan Foley, Charlie Robinson, and Kathleen Dileong Jones, who went
on to be the original members of High five Now.
Nathan said that their voices jelled so well together that
there was this real big aha moment and producers are like,
(05:02):
that is our group now. They started to record the
pilot at the ABC, and then when Channel nine took
on the show, everything started to move really quickly. I
think what really set High five apart was the music,
because it was able to stand alone from the show.
Even as a consumer of that show, my favorite bit
was the start and the end of the episode because
(05:22):
that's when they'd have the little concerts. Yeah, and it's
interesting because the creators of High five took inspiration from
the Spy Scales dance moves and they believed that preschoolers
could copy them, and they really did. We saw it
with songs like North, South, East and West. I mean
the kids sometimes got a little bit confused which direction
to go in. I think it seemed a lot cooler
than The Wiggles as well, because the performers were wearing
(05:45):
clothes that were very of the time, and they role
models for the kids. Well. The group style was modeled
on the fast paced nature of pop music, and in
a recent interview, Nathan Foley reflected on the success of
High Five and he put it down to the show's
ability to relate to botho kids and parents, and he
said parents could actually sit down and have a bit
of a laugh as well. Again, he said the music
(06:06):
was a very big part of it because, as you said,
it was pop orientated and while lyrically it was for
the kids, musically it was produced just like pop music,
so if you did get rid of the lyrics, you
could easily play it on radio. It's pretty crazy because
in the same year that the show launched, Sony Music
released High Five's debut album, which was called Jump and Jive,
(06:27):
and it reached number thirty three on the ARIA album charts.
What Play is My Mind looking back at this time
is just how young the members of the group were
when it first launched. So Charlie Robinson was the youngest
she was only eighteen, while Kelly was the oldest at
twenty five. And the idea was that High five weren't
meant to be childhood educators, but they were meant to
be more like older siblings or friends to the kids,
(06:49):
and I think this really worked well. At the time,
no one really knew how rapidly this show was going
to take off, and it really didn't take long for
High Five to become one of Australia's most success for
musical groups. The show was actually broadcast daily into eighty
one countries. They also topped the music charts, with four
of their albums reaching the top ten and receiving five
(07:10):
consecutive ARIA Music Awards for Best Children's Album and the
original group also received three Logis for Most Outstanding Children's Program.
And as you mentioned, they had this international fan base,
which meant they were regularly touring across Australia, Britain, New
Zealand and Singapore and merchandise was another huge part of
their success, so High Five actually had a range at
(07:31):
Kama which was not just clothing and accessories, but also
included dinnerware, games, craft products, backpacks, luggage, Christmas and Easter confectionery,
and even a jumping castle and carousel. Now success didn't
come easy though. The young group members worked really hard.
So they had forty five episodes to record each series,
and they spent three months each year recording the show.
(07:54):
So on a Sunday they would get their scripts and
then they'd spend three days rehearsing what they were going
to film, and then two days filming it. Now, the
filming days started very early in the morning and didn't
end until seven or eight at night, and in terms
of rehearsals, this involved learning scripts off by heart for
their segments, as well as new songs because they didn't
have an AUTOQ. And when they weren't filming, they toured
(08:17):
for seven months of the year, doing three one and
a half hour shows a day, six days a week
around Australia, Asia, New Zealand and the whole of the UK.
And after all of that they were allowed one month
off a year. I didn't realize that they were working
the cast members this hard. Now, despite the very grueling schedules,
there still wasn't enough time for them to tap into
the American market, so another High Five was actually created,
(08:41):
and in a recent interview, Nathan Foley spoke about how
he nearly ended up in hospital from the exhausting schedule.
Let's throw to what he said.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
It was busy. I mean it was exhausting. At the
same time, I think there's not a lot of groups
in the world that actually do the TV thing but
also do the recording also, so go and visit the
children's hospitals and also have no time. You know, we
were teenagers were loving the ride, but it was long hours.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Now, while people often compared High Five and The Wiggles,
there was a major difference between these two kids entertainment groups,
which was the business model. So the original members of
The Wiggles actually created their own concept and therefore they
owned the franchise and merchandising rights, whereas with High Five,
their members were paid a salary by the production company
(09:31):
which created them. So in terms of money, the Wiggles
definitely reigned supreme. In two thousand and eight, they topped
business magazines Business Reviews Weekly annual list of top earning
entertainers with forty five million dollars. High five ended up
coming in fifth place that year with eighteen million. However,
as I said, the members of High five did not
hold equity. I would really love to know what their
(09:54):
salaries were at the time and to have seen the
growth during the success.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
Well, it seems like the production company did look after
the original faces of High five. But the thing is,
as soon as you left the group, you didn't get
paid anymore, so you're not living off the royalties like
the Wiggles. I mean in saying that the Wiggles did
write their own songs, it sounds like High five weren't
involved in that actual creative process. So I understand perhaps
(10:18):
not making royalties off the songs themselves, but they were
the faces of the brand. Well, their personal ip was
the brand. When you look at some of the merchandise
back then, it was literally cartoons based on them, like
they were the faces of this brand. I did see
recently that Sophia Bush was complaining about when she was
working on One Tree Hill that they often got used
(10:39):
to do ads and never got paid anything because they said, oh, well,
that's just to promote the show. That's the difficulty. When
there's a bunch of young people who were really eager
for their big break. They'll sign anything just to get
their foot in the door, and unfortunately those contracts have
long standing consequences. Yeah, and I think because everyone knew
how much the Wiggles were making and then saw High
Five were making a lot, you just assume that the
(11:01):
talent on the show is also rolling in it. And
Nathan recalled in an interview how he received a lot
of backlash when he appeared on I Will Survive after
leaving High Five, and people were saying he was too
loaded to go on the show and he didn't need
the money, and he said, well, unfortunately, that's actually not
the case. Did you ever feel like there was a
bit of competition between High Five and the Wiggles? Well,
(11:21):
as a kid, I love the Wiggles, but I feel
like I progressed to High Five, even though I was
probably too old to like High Five. And you would assume,
because there were only three big kids bands at the time,
that there would be some sort of competition, because really
it was High Five, the Wiggles, and to a lesser
extent than Holy Dook God, I've totally forgot about the
Hooly Doolies. But Nathan Foley has confirmed that there was
(11:43):
literally no competition between the bands. They said that they
used to do photo shoots together and they have actually
remained friends. Nathan even performed at the Wiggles reunion tour
back in twenty twenty for the Bushfire Appeal. Isn't that
so wholesome? I love the fact that there wasn't anything
unsavory going on behind the scenes. Two thousand and six,
sadly was the beginning of the end for the original
(12:03):
group when Kathleen announced she was pregnant and son Park
was brought in as her temporary replacement while she was
on maternity leave. And while Kathleen was intent on returning
to High five in two thousand and seven, she decided
to make her decision a permanent one to focus on motherhood.
So while Kathleen was the first member to leave, by
the end of two thousand and eight, all the original
(12:24):
cast members had been replaced. So this is in a
span of two years. I totally forgot this. But Tim
was the next original member to leave the group, and
he left because he got injured in a serious motorcycle
accident in June two thousand and seven. So the poor
thing ended up fracturing his spine and he was in
a wheelchair for six weeks, and his injuries left him
(12:44):
unable to keep up with the pace of High Five's performances,
and he was replaced by his understudy, Stevie Nicholson. He
officially ended up leaving the group in November two thousand
and seven after recovering from his injuries. Things were starting
to crumble because just three months later, Charlie decided to
leave the group because she wanted to pursue acting, and
Casey Burgess was brought in as Charlie's replacement. Big changes
(13:07):
were also happening on the business side of things, so
the Nine network and production company Southern Star purchased the
High five brand in March two thousand and eight, and
this meant the original creators Harris and Graham Evans were
no longer involved in the franchise, and just seven months
after this, Kelly announced she would be leaving the group
at the end of the year to explore other options.
(13:29):
A month later, Nathan said he would be leaving to
focus on his adult music career. Then in December, Kathleen's replacement,
Sun Park, revealed she too would be leaving as she
had only really signed on to be a temporary replacement. Now,
based on all of these exits, rumors started swelling that
Southern Star, who was the new production company, had dumped
Kelly and Nathan because they wanted to recruit younger and
(13:51):
cheaper replacements, and it was reported that Nathan and Kelly's
farewell at Karras by Candlelight was going to be a
strained affair, with sources close to the Grip claiming the
pair had been jilted by the production company. To make
matters worse, allegedly, Kelly and Nathan had been dropped without consultation,
and according to a source, Nathan was allegedly the last
(14:12):
year that his High Five days were numbered. So apparently
what happened is he stopped for petrol on the Northeast
coast and a guy at the petrol station said to him, Hey,
my brother just got your job yesterday. Now this was
the first time he'd heard he was being replaced. That
is so crushing. What are the odds of him stopping
at the specific petrol station that his replacements brother is
(14:35):
working on like the High five production team must have
been for Fox says now, there were media reports circulating
about this, and the source was spilling all of this
news to a journalist. I mean, let's be honest, I'd
assume that the source was Nathan. Well, look, they tried
to cover Nathan's tracks because they did say he refused
to comment on the matter, and quoted him saying, look,
I really don't want to talk about it. I've got
a contract until Christmas and I intend to honor it.
(14:58):
When the main person in the story he says I
don't want to talk about it, that means they've already
spoken behind the scenes. Yeah. Well, at the time, Sunpark
had to come out and deny she had felt pressure
to leave the group alongside Kelly and Nathan, and she
also reiterated that it was Kelly and Nathan who had resigned.
Looking back, I do think it seems quite feasible that
the decision around out seeing Kelly and Nathan was down
(15:20):
to money, because the original members of the group were
on very high salaries, which was a problem when you
then start bringing these new people in. Also, it becomes
an issue because they were doing so much touring. So
when there's extensive touring, maybe the company thought, fuck, we
can't afford this. I suppose it does make sense from
a financial perspective to replace them with younger talent, and
(15:41):
the new members ended up being a decade younger than
Kelly and Nathan and presumably a lot cheaper to employee
for concerts. That being said, I think it was detrimental
to the overall brand because, as you said, Kate, the
original members, they were on lunchboxes, they were on all
of the merch. Everyone loved those cast members, and I
don't think that they've ever been as relevant since they
(16:01):
got rid of all of the original cast members. Well,
Channel nine clearly thought that they could just replace the
original cast and everything would be fine. They recommitted to
five new series to be aired until twenty thirteen. However,
only three of these series ended up being produced, and
they had this plan that they thought that they didn't
need to rely solely on the appeal of the cast
(16:21):
members as individuals, but it was clear they began backtracking
by season two because they said that they were trying
to recreate the success of the earlier episodes by capturing
that earlier innocence, and in the thirteenth and final series
of High five and twenty eleven they even went back
to reintroducing fans to the old songs in a bid
to make it popular again. Well, it does make sense
(16:43):
because all of the kids had grown up by then,
so they wouldn't really know any different. I do find
it interesting that they said that their initial strategy was
to not concentrate on the cast members as individuals, because
when they brought over Casey Burgers to replace Charlie Robinson
used to be on Girls TV. Do you remember that
shel TV? Girl TV. I think a lot of our
(17:05):
listeners will remember it. It's like it's a girl. Don't
get that mad head. I've got enough for those songs.
So she already had a bit of a profile in
the children's entertainment space, so I thought she was a
really clever pickup. That being said, they were probably fearful
that they would have the same thing in this second
generation of High Five. They'd slowly lose class members and
lose relevance and want more money. Yeah, it will happen again. Yeah. Well.
(17:28):
By twenty twelve, nine were forced to sell High five
to a Malaysian equity group called Ajion's following financial difficulty
at the network, and this new production company shifted High
Five's commercial focus to the Southeast Asian market, and they
also wanted to have new group members, so the audition
process was filmed and actually turned into a documentary style
(17:49):
film called Some Kind Of Wonderful, which premiered exclusively through
Hoyts Cinemas and after extensive touring, this new group released
a spinoff show called High five House, which was filmed
in Singapore and Malaysia between twenty thirteen and fifteen. Wow,
that's pretty crazy. I wasn't aware of this High five House.
It's pretty wild to think how long the brand actually
(18:10):
lasted though, from nineteen ninety nine till twenty fifteen. They
kind a good run. No, well, they still continued their runs.
So in twenty sixteen, the Nine Network renewed its partnership
with the High five franchise and announced they were planning
to revive High five with the new cast in twenty seventeen,
and while it would feature a newcast and set, Nine
retained the original team of producers and writers, and the
(18:32):
show was filmed in Malaysia and aired at the start
of twenty seventeen on nine Go Now. A second series
was planned for twenty eighteen, but filming was halted and
the Australian production office was closed. The brand then relocated
to Singapore and all five members left the group, so
temporary touring members were used for the remainder of twenty eighteen,
(18:53):
with the franchise continuing to employ non permanent performers for
touring purposes in twenty nineteen. So it seemed like at
the end they were just like, can anyone just sing
and dance in this group? The songs were really good.
If you've got strong writing with songs, I think that
is going to set you in a good stead. But
the fact is kids want to know the performers they do.
(19:14):
And the difference with High Five compared to the Wiggles
at that time was they actually were a little bit
diverse in that they had females and males. And I
know everyone absolutely loved Kathleen because she was Filipino. And
I think as a kid, you really aligned to your
favorite member in the group. It might be one that
looks like you or has similar attributes to you. And
I think when they started replacing them with whoever, it
(19:37):
lost that sparkle. Yeah, now that's where we are going
to leave things today. On next week's episode, we'll be
diving straight into all the juicy scandals, including a controversial
men's magazine shoot, a sex scandal, and a secret engagement.
Plus we will explore where the original cast members are now.
I can't wait for that. I cannot wait now. This
(19:57):
podcast was recorded on the traditional land of the Ghana
people of the Adelaide Planes. We pay respect to elders
past and present and if you do enjoy the show,
we would love to see you share about it on
your Instagram stories. And thank you so much again for
being an outspoken Plus subscriber. We really appreciate it.
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