November 23, 2024 • 16 mins
Why are meetings always back-to-back? In this episode, we explore how constant demands on your time—without space to reset—lead to overwhelm, frustration, and decreased performance. Discover why this happens, how it affects you, and what you can do to gently rebel against the culture of non-stop appointments.
Plus, I share tips for creating space in your day and how a simple one-minute reset can help you regain clarity and energy between meetings. Reclaim your headspace and find a better way to work.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Gentle Rebellion where overwhelm is
optional.
Hello, hello, hello.
How are you doing?
Rant coming Ready?
Please explain to me whymeetings run back to back.
(00:25):
Meetings, appointments,everything runs back to back.
Why?
Why you can't sit, I wouldargue anyway.
In my opinion or maybe just forme, because it's all about me,
not really, it's all about youactually I can't sit for a
meeting for an hour and then gointo another meeting.
(00:48):
I just can't do it.
Can't do it even the days whenmeetings were in person.
So I guess, in a way, it'seasier to to fidget or you get
time of movement betweenmeetings.
No, it doesn't, it doesn'tmatter whether in person or
online.
An hour's meeting followed byanother hour's meeting, like I
would never, ever, ever bookcoaching clients back to back.
(01:11):
In fact, I have very strictlimits, with gaps in between,
because I know how to be at myabsolute best for my clients.
It matters to me.
It matters to me because I'mhighly conscientious and full of
integrity and love, which Iknow you are too, because that's
who this podcast is for Highlyconscientious, big hearted,
(01:36):
highly driven.
Is that a nightmare combination?
Maybe, and that feels like awhole nother episode.
Maybe, and that feels like awhole nother episode.
However, let's go back to thismeeting appointment thing.
For me right now, to do areally good job, I need space
(01:57):
between clients, and I alsolimit how many clients I would
see in a day.
This is very, very, veryimportant to me.
And what time of day I see them, so that I can be at my
absolute best.
It's very, very important to mebecause I only want to do an
excellent job.
That's just how I am.
(02:17):
So I set things up in order toenable that to be so.
Things up in order to enablethat to be so.
Now, if I have days where I havetoo many meetings, too many
meetings, even with spacebetween it, doesn't do me any
good.
It just doesn't do me any good,and those meetings become of
(02:38):
less value, or they could be ofhigh value, but if they're high
cost, to me that's notacceptable.
So sometimes I can have moremeetings than others.
It depends on what day it is,what time of year it is, there's
all sorts of things.
So right now, I'm having fewermeetings, because that's how it
works for me.
(02:58):
Autumn, winter that's how Iwant to do things.
I also don't want too manynetworking meetings at the
moment where I'm learning moreabout new people and
opportunities, because for me,this isn't my time of year for
starting new projects.
That's springtime, spring,summer.
I go bonkers for starting newprojects this time of year.
I have learned to slow down andto start to complete things.
(03:20):
That works for me.
It feels risky, because whenyou slow down to complete things
, it feels incredibly indulgent,but it's also deeply satisfying
.
So if we go back to this, whyare meetings run on the hour,
(03:43):
every hour or consecutively?
You can see whether that, foryou, resonates.
So if that's how you're having,you've either imposed it on
yourself or it is imposed on you.
What effect does that have onyou?
What effect does it?
Because I often talk to peoplewho are about to go on to their
next call and they really need abreak.
(04:05):
They really need a break, whichmeans that their next call is
seeping into their call with meand I just think what a shame,
because I was really enjoyingthis call with you and I value
your time and I value mine, butyour presence has already left
the room.
I'm no value mine, but yourpresence has already left the
(04:30):
room.
So what impact does havingappointments and meetings
consecutively?
What impact does it have on you?
And then think about how oftenyou get overwhelmed and
frustrated because you can'tquite do all the things you want
to do or you're not doing themin a way that you want to do
them.
So, whether that's gettingoverwhelmed and very compressed
during the day with all thedemands and not having enough
space for yourself, so that whenyou go home you're either very
(04:53):
the need to be distant from yourpartner or those you love so
that you've got time todecompress, or snappy, grumpy
person comes out or wailingbanshee comes out, just because
there's just not been enoughspace for you in the day.
So that's a high cost, right?
So what other costs are therefor you about not having space,
(05:14):
a break between meetings orappointments?
What are the costs for you?
So some of them are immediate,aren't they?
That withdrawing from onemeeting and not being quite
present and then not being fullypresent and prepared for the
next meeting, that's an obviousperformance cost.
Which, if people aren't reallypresent at the beginning, end of
meetings, why are they back toback?
(05:37):
Because it's not working.
It's not working for anyone,because if you have too many
meetings and you can't bepresent fully at the beginning
or the end you might as well notbe there.
It doesn't make any sense.
It would be better to runmeetings at five past and five
to.
That would make huge sense.
Or even better, at quarter pastthe hour and quarter to the
(05:58):
hour and shorten meetingsbecause God knows, they go on a
bit, don't they?
Goodness me?
Because God knows they go on abit, don't they?
Goodness me?
I mean, how often have you satin a really well-run, highly
constructive meeting where stuffactually got done and decided
and it was worth it?
It's hard to run and create thatkind of meeting right.
(06:18):
It takes real skill and ittakes a lot of preparation and
being fully present foreverybody there with a clear
idea and intention for usingthat time.
It requires treating that timeas precious for lots of reasons.
I mean, it's precious becausewe're humans and our time is
precious and coming together isa precious time because we can
(06:39):
create so much when we all cometogether.
But then there's also the otherthings you could be doing
instead.
So there's that cost.
There's the financial costisn't there For companies.
How much are your meetingscosting you when they're really
badly run but the long-term,stressy parts of it where you're
just you're not able to shiftbetween the demands of each
(07:03):
meeting, or you are becauseyou've learned to cope, because
you're really good at your joband you just get on with it and
you can kick on through.
You can do that, so you can doit.
You can move from one, say.
You can move from one meetingto the next and be kind of
present or get away with lookinglike you're present and you're
doing a good job.
Right, you've got it sussed.
(07:24):
But that that is a highcognitive performance and that
requires something from youwhich, if you're not doing it in
a way that is working for youor you, this difficult I'm.
Let me say that again, in orderto to do that really
effectively, that's verycognitively demanding To be
(07:48):
eloquent, to be on it, to haveall the information in your head
, to be welcoming you know, torun a meeting well, or to be in
a meeting and very bothefficient and using your words
really well and connecting withpeople, making good arguments,
having access to answers andinformation Like there's a lot
(08:10):
in that to come to be both warmand really on it.
There's a lot and it's highlyskilled and there are people who
can do it, but what's the cost?
So, even if there's no cost inyour performance, or no
noticeable cost in yourperformance at the time, is
(08:31):
there a cost later in the day?
And only you know, and it'slikely that it's different at
different times, but it's worthconsidering.
It's worth considering.
Is this costing me and is thereanything I can do about it?
Because it doesn't work for meand I can see the damage.
(08:52):
So, having burnt out, let me beyour terrible warning.
I can see the damage of pushingmyself to go from one highly
demanding cognitive task to thenext, over and over and over
again, and I enjoyed thechallenge of it because you give
my mind something to do and Ican't think about anything else.
And that's nice.
Like it's deeply rewarding todo those kind of hijinks
(09:15):
cognitively.
However, the cost for my bodywas very, very high and that
also resulted in costing meparts of myself that I then
started to miss, like theability to switch off and just
be present at home, the abilityto hug my dogs, even when I got
(09:37):
home, because it was just toomuch.
I just needed decompression.
It's almost like I needed to goin a decompression tank, you
know, and just be, have likespace, give me space for myself
and then it ran on, because onceI was in that very full on
state, I found it difficult.
Even even when I scheduleddowntime I found it difficult to
(09:59):
actually switch off or I'd beexhausted and have that
unwellness, that like achiness,that not quite myself, and I was
also more sensitive, morereactive, more, very much more
emotionally reactive.
It was just hard work.
It was hard work to make surethat life outside of work was as
(10:25):
full as work was and I didn'twant to give the work up because
I loved it and it matters to me.
So it's tricky.
How do we do this?
How do we have what we want?
So we want to do deeplysatisfying, deeply satisfying
work that's well paid, so we canhave the life we and we have
that part of us satisfied thatneeds to do something
cognitively demanding orcreative or working with people,
(10:48):
whatever it is.
We need that.
We need work.
Work matters Not just for themoney but for the satisfaction.
But we want more than that,because if we didn't want more
than that, we wouldn't befrustrated, we wouldn't be
overwhelmed, we'd just work allthe time.
But we also need to sleep, andsleep is tends to be very
affected by this constantpushing through, because in
(11:13):
order to go to sleep, you haveto let go, and when you're used
to pushing all the time, it'sdifficult to let go.
They're the opposite things,aren't they?
You have to let go and trust tosleep, or you just crash
because you're so exhausted.
And then there's the whole.
Well, actually, over time, thisis costing me part of my energy
and health, and it's harder tothink about things like
(11:35):
nutritious food and exercise,something good for me, some sort
of movement, a routine thatworks for me.
It's.
It can be hard to fit those inas well, mainly in a headspace
way, because often these thingscan be done very efficiently and
not take that much time.
But it's not that, it's theheadspace.
It can feel too indulgent tothen, when you've got lots of
(11:59):
pressures at work, to bethinking well, I also need to
sort out food for the week thattastes good and is highly
nutritious.
That can just it's too much,right it's?
I can't think of that as well,or it just becomes another
pressure.
Another thing to do, better atanother thing, to sort out
another problem, to solve,another thing to nail, you know,
(12:20):
and I do that, and then there'sthe whole space for joy.
I think for me that's whatstarted to go and it wasn't.
Interestingly, it wasn't fromnot practicing things that
should have created that.
So, for example, I did very.
(12:41):
I was very good at noticingthings like beautiful blossom,
the trees, you know, things thatare beautiful.
I've always been good at that,but it wasn't enough because I
was just so squished Everything,everything, just over time.
So it's a cumulative effect ofjust getting used to pushing
(13:03):
through and being very singleminded in order to do a very
demanding job.
It just squished me.
So there was less space, lessspace for joy, and particularly
the thing for me is that thingwhere you lose your ability to
laugh easily and have fun.
That's it for me, becauselaughter, that easy laughter,
(13:27):
that oh, look at me, I'm doingthat stressy pants thing again.
You know that ability to laughgently at yourself that you're
noticing when, noticing when I'mgoing into that very headstrong
, cognitively demanding mode andit's overriding everything else
as if it's the most importantthing in the world, that that
(13:48):
matters, that and it's so.
So what seems to be going onhere is that if we push too hard
at pushing on through gettinginto survival mode, even if it's
fun, even if it's reallyrewarding, we're helping lots of
other people and we'reabsolutely nailing it at work.
If we can't switch betweenmodes easily, that's when we
(14:08):
lose the ability to have thatother mode because we just don't
have an off switch.
We lose the off switch.
If the space between meetings,you can move between those
states in minute ways, whichmake all the difference.
But if there isn't spacebetween meetings, you're having
to push out for that space.
You're having to be.
You're either having to leave ameeting early, which is we all
(14:30):
know is really hard, or justturn up a bit late, and I bet
most people are just turning upa bit late, which then what you
get is a chaotic start whereactually people are on the Zoom
meeting and they're just waitingfor people.
Now, if the meeting startedpromptly at quarter past the
hour and people just got used tobeing expected to turn up, be
(14:54):
fully present and on it and itwas run well and it was really
welcoming, wouldn't that bebetter?
Just asking, I don't know.
Well, I do know.
I know what works for me, butwhat works for you, what works
for me, but what works for you?
So my rant is this why domeetings run back to back?
(15:15):
Why, what does it do?
What purpose does it serve,what's it costing and is there a
better way to do it?
And if you can't change yourappointments because you don't
have control over your calendar,how are you coping with the
need for a bit of space betweenappointments?
What are you doing and is thereanything else you can do that
(15:39):
would be more effective?
So just a quick plug for the OneMinute Marke audio if you
haven't already got it.
That's a one minute reset whicha lot of people do use between
meetings because there isn't anytime between meetings, because
they do run back to back, andthat's really helpful.
You can get that by going to mywebsite, heidimarke.
c o.
uk, or clicking the linkunderneath this episode, and
(16:01):
just give ita go See if it worksfor you.
Tends to create space.
So meetings how are theyaffecting you?
So meetings how are theyaffecting you If you run your
own schedule?
Can you try suggestingdifferent meetings, different
meeting start times?
Might be worth a try.
I'd love to know how you get onand if this resonated with you,
(16:22):
please do let me know.
Have a great week For moreresources to help you gently
(16:46):
rebel.
Welcome to the Gentle Rebellion where overwhelm is
optional.
Hello, hello, hello.
How are you doing?
Rant coming Ready?
Please explain to me whymeetings run back to back.
(00:25):
Meetings, appointments,everything runs back to back.
Why?
Why you can't sit, I wouldargue anyway.
In my opinion or maybe just forme, because it's all about me,
not really, it's all about youactually I can't sit for a
meeting for an hour and then gointo another meeting.
(00:48):
I just can't do it.
Can't do it even the days whenmeetings were in person.
So I guess, in a way, it'seasier to to fidget or you get
time of movement betweenmeetings.
No, it doesn't, it doesn'tmatter whether in person or
online.
An hour's meeting followed byanother hour's meeting, like I
would never, ever, ever bookcoaching clients back to back.
(01:11):
In fact, I have very strictlimits, with gaps in between,
because I know how to be at myabsolute best for my clients.
It matters to me.
It matters to me because I'mhighly conscientious and full of
integrity and love, which Iknow you are too, because that's
who this podcast is for Highlyconscientious, big hearted,
(01:36):
highly driven.
Is that a nightmare combination?
Maybe, and that feels like awhole nother episode.
Maybe, and that feels like awhole nother episode.
However, let's go back to thismeeting appointment thing.
For me right now, to do areally good job, I need space
(01:57):
between clients, and I alsolimit how many clients I would
see in a day.
This is very, very, veryimportant to me.
And what time of day I see them, so that I can be at my
absolute best.
It's very, very important to mebecause I only want to do an
excellent job.
That's just how I am.
(02:17):
So I set things up in order toenable that to be so.
Things up in order to enablethat to be so.
Now, if I have days where I havetoo many meetings, too many
meetings, even with spacebetween it, doesn't do me any
good.
It just doesn't do me any good,and those meetings become of
(02:38):
less value, or they could be ofhigh value, but if they're high
cost, to me that's notacceptable.
So sometimes I can have moremeetings than others.
It depends on what day it is,what time of year it is, there's
all sorts of things.
So right now, I'm having fewermeetings, because that's how it
works for me.
(02:58):
Autumn, winter that's how Iwant to do things.
I also don't want too manynetworking meetings at the
moment where I'm learning moreabout new people and
opportunities, because for me,this isn't my time of year for
starting new projects.
That's springtime, spring,summer.
I go bonkers for starting newprojects this time of year.
I have learned to slow down andto start to complete things.
(03:20):
That works for me.
It feels risky, because whenyou slow down to complete things
, it feels incredibly indulgent,but it's also deeply satisfying
.
So if we go back to this, whyare meetings run on the hour,
(03:43):
every hour or consecutively?
You can see whether that, foryou, resonates.
So if that's how you're having,you've either imposed it on
yourself or it is imposed on you.
What effect does that have onyou?
What effect does it?
Because I often talk to peoplewho are about to go on to their
next call and they really need abreak.
(04:05):
They really need a break, whichmeans that their next call is
seeping into their call with meand I just think what a shame,
because I was really enjoyingthis call with you and I value
your time and I value mine, butyour presence has already left
the room.
I'm no value mine, but yourpresence has already left the
(04:30):
room.
So what impact does havingappointments and meetings
consecutively?
What impact does it have on you?
And then think about how oftenyou get overwhelmed and
frustrated because you can'tquite do all the things you want
to do or you're not doing themin a way that you want to do
them.
So, whether that's gettingoverwhelmed and very compressed
during the day with all thedemands and not having enough
space for yourself, so that whenyou go home you're either very
(04:53):
the need to be distant from yourpartner or those you love so
that you've got time todecompress, or snappy, grumpy
person comes out or wailingbanshee comes out, just because
there's just not been enoughspace for you in the day.
So that's a high cost, right?
So what other costs are therefor you about not having space,
(05:14):
a break between meetings orappointments?
What are the costs for you?
So some of them are immediate,aren't they?
That withdrawing from onemeeting and not being quite
present and then not being fullypresent and prepared for the
next meeting, that's an obviousperformance cost.
Which, if people aren't reallypresent at the beginning, end of
meetings, why are they back toback?
(05:37):
Because it's not working.
It's not working for anyone,because if you have too many
meetings and you can't bepresent fully at the beginning
or the end you might as well notbe there.
It doesn't make any sense.
It would be better to runmeetings at five past and five
to.
That would make huge sense.
Or even better, at quarter pastthe hour and quarter to the
(05:58):
hour and shorten meetingsbecause God knows, they go on a
bit, don't they?
Goodness me?
Because God knows they go on abit, don't they?
Goodness me?
I mean, how often have you satin a really well-run, highly
constructive meeting where stuffactually got done and decided
and it was worth it?
It's hard to run and create thatkind of meeting right.
(06:18):
It takes real skill and ittakes a lot of preparation and
being fully present foreverybody there with a clear
idea and intention for usingthat time.
It requires treating that timeas precious for lots of reasons.
I mean, it's precious becausewe're humans and our time is
precious and coming together isa precious time because we can
(06:39):
create so much when we all cometogether.
But then there's also the otherthings you could be doing
instead.
So there's that cost.
There's the financial costisn't there For companies.
How much are your meetingscosting you when they're really
badly run but the long-term,stressy parts of it where you're
just you're not able to shiftbetween the demands of each
(07:03):
meeting, or you are becauseyou've learned to cope, because
you're really good at your joband you just get on with it and
you can kick on through.
You can do that, so you can doit.
You can move from one, say.
You can move from one meetingto the next and be kind of
present or get away with lookinglike you're present and you're
doing a good job.
Right, you've got it sussed.
(07:24):
But that that is a highcognitive performance and that
requires something from youwhich, if you're not doing it in
a way that is working for youor you, this difficult I'm.
Let me say that again, in orderto to do that really
effectively, that's verycognitively demanding To be
(07:48):
eloquent, to be on it, to haveall the information in your head
, to be welcoming you know, torun a meeting well, or to be in
a meeting and very bothefficient and using your words
really well and connecting withpeople, making good arguments,
having access to answers andinformation Like there's a lot
(08:10):
in that to come to be both warmand really on it.
There's a lot and it's highlyskilled and there are people who
can do it, but what's the cost?
So, even if there's no cost inyour performance, or no
noticeable cost in yourperformance at the time, is
(08:31):
there a cost later in the day?
And only you know, and it'slikely that it's different at
different times, but it's worthconsidering.
It's worth considering.
Is this costing me and is thereanything I can do about it?
Because it doesn't work for meand I can see the damage.
(08:52):
So, having burnt out, let me beyour terrible warning.
I can see the damage of pushingmyself to go from one highly
demanding cognitive task to thenext, over and over and over
again, and I enjoyed thechallenge of it because you give
my mind something to do and Ican't think about anything else.
And that's nice.
Like it's deeply rewarding todo those kind of hijinks
(09:15):
cognitively.
However, the cost for my bodywas very, very high and that
also resulted in costing meparts of myself that I then
started to miss, like theability to switch off and just
be present at home, the abilityto hug my dogs, even when I got
(09:37):
home, because it was just toomuch.
I just needed decompression.
It's almost like I needed to goin a decompression tank, you
know, and just be, have likespace, give me space for myself
and then it ran on, because onceI was in that very full on
state, I found it difficult.
Even even when I scheduleddowntime I found it difficult to
(09:59):
actually switch off or I'd beexhausted and have that
unwellness, that like achiness,that not quite myself, and I was
also more sensitive, morereactive, more, very much more
emotionally reactive.
It was just hard work.
It was hard work to make surethat life outside of work was as
(10:25):
full as work was and I didn'twant to give the work up because
I loved it and it matters to me.
So it's tricky.
How do we do this?
How do we have what we want?
So we want to do deeplysatisfying, deeply satisfying
work that's well paid, so we canhave the life we and we have
that part of us satisfied thatneeds to do something
cognitively demanding orcreative or working with people,
(10:48):
whatever it is.
We need that.
We need work.
Work matters Not just for themoney but for the satisfaction.
But we want more than that,because if we didn't want more
than that, we wouldn't befrustrated, we wouldn't be
overwhelmed, we'd just work allthe time.
But we also need to sleep, andsleep is tends to be very
affected by this constantpushing through, because in
(11:13):
order to go to sleep, you haveto let go, and when you're used
to pushing all the time, it'sdifficult to let go.
They're the opposite things,aren't they?
You have to let go and trust tosleep, or you just crash
because you're so exhausted.
And then there's the whole.
Well, actually, over time, thisis costing me part of my energy
and health, and it's harder tothink about things like
(11:35):
nutritious food and exercise,something good for me, some sort
of movement, a routine thatworks for me.
It's.
It can be hard to fit those inas well, mainly in a headspace
way, because often these thingscan be done very efficiently and
not take that much time.
But it's not that, it's theheadspace.
It can feel too indulgent tothen, when you've got lots of
(11:59):
pressures at work, to bethinking well, I also need to
sort out food for the week thattastes good and is highly
nutritious.
That can just it's too much,right it's?
I can't think of that as well,or it just becomes another
pressure.
Another thing to do, better atanother thing, to sort out
another problem, to solve,another thing to nail, you know,
(12:20):
and I do that, and then there'sthe whole space for joy.
I think for me that's whatstarted to go and it wasn't.
Interestingly, it wasn't fromnot practicing things that
should have created that.
So, for example, I did very.
(12:41):
I was very good at noticingthings like beautiful blossom,
the trees, you know, things thatare beautiful.
I've always been good at that,but it wasn't enough because I
was just so squished Everything,everything, just over time.
So it's a cumulative effect ofjust getting used to pushing
(13:03):
through and being very singleminded in order to do a very
demanding job.
It just squished me.
So there was less space, lessspace for joy, and particularly
the thing for me is that thingwhere you lose your ability to
laugh easily and have fun.
That's it for me, becauselaughter, that easy laughter,
(13:27):
that oh, look at me, I'm doingthat stressy pants thing again.
You know that ability to laughgently at yourself that you're
noticing when, noticing when I'mgoing into that very headstrong
, cognitively demanding mode andit's overriding everything else
as if it's the most importantthing in the world, that that
(13:48):
matters, that and it's so.
So what seems to be going onhere is that if we push too hard
at pushing on through gettinginto survival mode, even if it's
fun, even if it's reallyrewarding, we're helping lots of
other people and we'reabsolutely nailing it at work.
If we can't switch betweenmodes easily, that's when we
(14:08):
lose the ability to have thatother mode because we just don't
have an off switch.
We lose the off switch.
If the space between meetings,you can move between those
states in minute ways, whichmake all the difference.
But if there isn't spacebetween meetings, you're having
to push out for that space.
You're having to be.
You're either having to leave ameeting early, which is we all
(14:30):
know is really hard, or justturn up a bit late, and I bet
most people are just turning upa bit late, which then what you
get is a chaotic start whereactually people are on the Zoom
meeting and they're just waitingfor people.
Now, if the meeting startedpromptly at quarter past the
hour and people just got used tobeing expected to turn up, be
(14:54):
fully present and on it and itwas run well and it was really
welcoming, wouldn't that bebetter?
Just asking, I don't know.
Well, I do know.
I know what works for me, butwhat works for you, what works
for me, but what works for you?
So my rant is this why domeetings run back to back?
(15:15):
Why, what does it do?
What purpose does it serve,what's it costing and is there a
better way to do it?
And if you can't change yourappointments because you don't
have control over your calendar,how are you coping with the
need for a bit of space betweenappointments?
What are you doing and is thereanything else you can do that
(15:39):
would be more effective?
So just a quick plug for the OneMinute Marke audio if you
haven't already got it.
That's a one minute reset whicha lot of people do use between
meetings because there isn't anytime between meetings, because
they do run back to back, andthat's really helpful.
You can get that by going to mywebsite, heidimarke.
c o.
uk, or clicking the linkunderneath this episode, and
(16:01):
just give ita go See if it worksfor you.
Tends to create space.
So meetings how are theyaffecting you?
So meetings how are theyaffecting you If you run your
own schedule?
Can you try suggestingdifferent meetings, different
meeting start times?
Might be worth a try.
I'd love to know how you get onand if this resonated with you,
(16:22):
please do let me know.
Have a great week For moreresources to help you gently
(16:46):
rebel.
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