Do you ever feel like you’re forcing yourself into someone else’s version of productivity—like waking up at 5 a.m. or grinding through “deep work” even though it doesn’t feel natural to you?
In this episode, performance coach Amber Deibert shares her game-changing approach: discovering your unique productivity style by looking at how you naturally expend energy—just like the way you work out. If you’ve ever struggled to stay consistent with routines that don’t fit your life, this conversation will show you a better way.
By tuning in, you’ll learn:
- How to identify whether you’re wired for endurance-style work or high-intensity bursts.
- Why mismatched productivity systems lead to burnout—and how to design ones that align with your strengths.
- Simple shifts you can make right now to get more done in less time while feeling more energized.
Press play now to discover how to “work like you work out” and finally create a productivity rhythm that truly works for you.
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Sign up for the free Work Like You Workout™ workshop
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Life can be overwhelming, but on this podcast, you'll discover practical strategies to overcome overwhelm, imposter syndrome, and negative self-talk, manage time effectively, set boundaries, and stay productive in high-stress jobs—all while learning how to say no and prioritize self-care on the Overwhelmed Worki...
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Amber Deibert (00:00):
But what I find is, if you're not thriving in
your workplace, it might be thatyou're just in the wrong
environment.
Michelle Gauthier (00:10):
You're listening to Overwhelmed Working
Woman, the podcast that helpsyou be more calm and more
productive by doing less.
I'm your host, MichelleGauthier, a former Overwhelmed
Working Woman and current lifecoach.
On this show, we unpack thestress and pressure that today's
working woman experiences, andin each episode you'll get a
strategy to bring more calm,ease and relaxation to your life
(00:34):
.
Hey friends, welcome back.
Thanks for joining today.
I'm super excited to share thisconversation with you because
it really influenced the waythat I think about my own
productivity.
Today I'm talking with AmberDeibert.
She is a performance coach whohelps people in the sales field
get to the very top of theirgame, and what makes her work so
(00:57):
fascinating to me is how shehelps her clients use their
natural energy patterns to workmore effectively, instead of
forcing themselves to do thingsthat don't fit.
Her theory is that we can findout all we need to know about
our own productivity based onthe way that we like to work out
or expend our energy.
(01:18):
In this episode, we're going totalk about how your workout
style can reveal your ideal workstyle.
It's different if you like torun long distances versus take
the occasional walk, versus goto a HIIT class.
We're also going to talk aboutwhy productivity isn't about
doing more, but doing what fitsyour brain and your body best,
(01:39):
and then how to set up your daybased on what's best for you,
your breaks, your calendar, evenyour clothes or music to
support your focus and reduceyour overwhelm.
I do have to warn you that thisepisode is longer than the usual
one.
I usually try to keep myepisodes shorter than this, but
there was so much good stuff inhere and I really didn't want to
cut anything out, so you mighthave to listen to it over two
(02:00):
different sessions or something.
It's about 40 minutes long.
Okay, let's meet Amber.
Thank you, Amber, so much forbeing here today.
Amber and I are in a coachingmastermind together, and she was
the presenter one day when Iattended a meeting and I just
thought that what she had to saywas so brilliant and so helpful
that I wanted to bring it tothe audience.
Can you just tell us a littlebit about yourself and how you
(02:22):
got to be the type of coach thatyou are?
Amber Deibert (02:26):
Yes, thank you so much for having me.
I am a performance coach and Iwork specifically with
enterprise and strategic techsellers, so my clients are
selling at the highest levels toFortune 500 companies and I
help them specifically withtheir mindset and their
productivity.
My sweet spot is people whoknow what they need to do.
They just can't quite getthemselves to do it and I find
(02:46):
that it either comes down tolimiting beliefs and imposter
syndrome and mindset things, orit's that you don't have a
productivity system that worksfor you.
I'm so delighted to be on yourpodcast because working women is
something that's near and dearto my heart as a working mom and
thinking about how much thereis on our plates and how we want
to perform.
Michelle Gauthier (03:06):
Oh good, I'm so glad and I thought you would
be such a good fit for thisaudience, because one of the
things that I'm always workingon with my clients who are all
overwhelmed working women is theidea that you don't have to do
it Like, you don't have to getup at five in the morning and
approach your work in a certainway.
If that's not the way thatworks for you, you have to
(03:30):
understand, first learn andunderstand who you are, and then
create rules that work for youfor your best productivity.
So would you please tell usabout your theory on that?
We should essentially work theway that we work out.
Will you tell us a little bitabout how you developed that and
what it is?
Amber Deibert (03:42):
Yeah, totally, and I just want to touch on what
you talked about really quickly, and I love that you've said
that, because I think so many ofus.
I market on LinkedIn and I readall the LinkedIn posts and all
the posts from all the likeexperts.
They're like 20 year old dudeswho aren't married, who don't
have kids, and they're tellingyou what your morning routine
should look like.
But they're successful, likethey're working 16 hour days, 20
(04:08):
hour days, and they're gettingit done.
And so we think like oh, Ishould be that way and I love
your approach, michelle, of likeit's not how somebody else
designs it, it's how what worksbest for you.
They would be like I just knowthat I need to do more deep work
.
I keep reading about deep workand how important it is and I
would look at them and I'd belike, respectfully, you're not a
deep work kind of a person,like I don't know what it is
about you, but like that justdoesn't seem like a fit for you
and maybe you're trying tosqueeze yourself into a box that
(04:30):
doesn't fit you.
You're this beautiful statuethat doesn't fit in a
rectangular box, and so Irealized that you can learn a
lot about somebody and how theylike to expend their energy by
looking at their workout style.
So I have a theory that we liketo mentally expend energy the
same way we physically like toexpend energy.
(04:50):
So let me give you an example.
Imagine like an enduranceathlete versus maybe like a
CrossFit or high intensityinterval training athlete.
On the endurance side, when Ithink about endurance sports,
you have to do tons of upfrontplanning.
And as long as you've got allthe upfront planning done, then
when you're executing on theworkout, you are essentially in
(05:12):
deep work.
You have no more decisions thatyou have to make, you're just
doing it.
You made all the decisions aheadof time, or maybe an interval
training athlete, kind of like acircuit training athlete.
They might show up to the gymand they might like maybe say
Orange Theory.
They might look and see whatthe workout is today, but they
don't need to know the wholeworkout, they just need to know
the first thing and I find thatthose type of athletes work more
(05:35):
in short, intense bursts.
On the endurance side it's morelike low intensity, long
duration, and on the intervaltraining side it's more high
intensity, short duration, ifyou can design your workday
around that as well.
I find so many people who aremore of the interval training
kind of people but they'retrying to fit themselves in the
(05:55):
deep work bucket when actuallythey get more done in a shorter
period of time than most peoplecan do in a week.
Michelle Gauthier (06:02):
Yeah, I love that, and especially that
neither one of those is thebetter answer.
It's like whichever one sort ofcomes naturally to you or that
you're attracted to, is theright thing.
Okay, so what if somebody'slistening right now and they're
like, I don't work outconsistently?
Amber Deibert (06:17):
Oh, I'm so glad you asked that.
Like I want to give the caveatthat I don't actually care how
much you work out or how youwork out or if you're in shape.
What I want to know is how doyou physically like to expend
energy?
That's all I care about.
It might be that you're likeyou know what.
I just go for a walk with mydog.
And that's my favorite way tophysically expend energy.
That's fantastic.
(06:39):
We can learn so much from that.
Or maybe you're like you know Idon't exercise, or I used to be
in it.
This is my story.
I from that.
Or maybe you're like you know Idon't exercise, or I used to be
in it.
This is my story.
I used to be an enduranceathlete.
Then I had kids and I was likeI don't have the time for that,
and so now I am more of aninterval training kind of
athlete and my work style hasadjusted.
Michelle Gauthier (06:54):
Yes, oh my gosh.
I would absolutely say me too.
Used to run marathons.
Used to go for a run on Sundaymorning that would last three
hours.
There's no way that I wouldmake the time to do that anymore
.
I go to a boot camp typetraining and I show up for it.
I go five days a week right now,sometimes six, and it's a
(07:18):
different workout every day.
Three days are strength, threedays are cardio.
I really don't care what it is,I just go.
Sometimes I know what it is andsometimes I don't, because I
need to wear different sportsbras.
That's the only reason why Icare.
And when I go there I don'tknow what the workout is and the
trainer demos it and if I hadto repeat back the workout, I
could probably repeat back like20% of it and just have to kind
of get started see what otherpeople are doing.
(07:39):
You know, sort of figure it outalong the way.
So if we use that as an example, maybe that could be helpful
for me personally, but for otherpeople as well.
So what should I do work-wise,if you?
Know, that about me?
Amber Deibert (07:52):
Yes, and thank you for being the guinea pig.
It's always so much easier touse a specific example.
I call this process work likeyou work out.
We're going to look at yourworkout style and glean insights
from it of things that we canapply to your workday to help
you be more productive.
The way I think about it isthat you have an internal
blueprint for how your bodylikes to expend energy.
It's always been there, but wejust try to fit ourselves into a
(08:15):
mold that we aren't.
If you look at cues from howyou like to exercise, you can
establish these in your workday,and it's going to make things
so much easier.
So the first thing I like toask about is intensity.
Are these workouts prettyintense or are they like pretty
chill?
Super intense, yeah.
Do you prefer to work in likeshort, intense bursts or do you
prefer to have like slow, longworkdays?
Michelle Gauthier (08:39):
I would rather have the short, intense
bursts.
Amber Deibert (08:42):
Yes, which I find for a lot of entrepreneurs.
They kind of naturally get intotheir right mode.
So I've done this with a fewfriends of mine who are also
coaches and we find that theyare working in a way that works
really well for them.
But I find that with corporateemployees that's not usually the
case, because they're trying tobe something that they're not.
So that's the first thing tonote is what is the intensity?
(09:03):
So for somebody like you, Iwould definitely recommend
blocking out time to get allyour tasks knocked out in an
hour or whatever it is, andworking in short bursts.
Pomodoros, which, if you'veever heard of the Pomodoro
(09:26):
method, it's named after the guywho invented it used a timer
that looked like a tomato, andtomato is Pomodoro in Italian.
Michelle Gauthier (09:30):
I thought you were going to say his name was
like Anthony Pomodoro.
Amber Deibert (09:32):
It's like a tomato shaped kitchen timer.
Michelle Gauthier (09:34):
That's what it's called.
Amber Deibert (09:35):
It's named, but the Pomodoro technique is
essentially interval trainingfor the workday.
The idea is you do 25 minuteson, you take a five minute break
.
You do 25 minutes on, you takea five minute break.
We know that you're a highintensity person.
I like to know, like, what isthe ideal duration for your
workouts?
It sounds like you're doing aclass that they kind of decide
the duration for you.
How?
Michelle Gauthier (09:55):
long do you like to 45 minutes, 45 minutes?
It's funny because before Iwould have said when I was a
runner, I would have said that Ilike to run for an hour, but if
I could have gotten the sameworkout in 45 minutes, I would
have done 45 minutes.
Whatever's the most efficientway to get the most muscle, burn
the most calories, likewhatever I'm doing, I want it to
be like the most efficient wayto do it.
Amber Deibert (10:16):
Totally so.
What a lot of people don't knowwith the Pomodoro technique, or
don't give themselvespermission, is you can change
the duration of the Pomodorotechnique to whatever you want
it to be permission is you canchange the duration of the
Pomodoro technique to whateveryou want it to be.
I had a client who was a writer, and so 25 minutes was too
short for him, so he would do 45minute focus session with a 15
minute break you can do.
for me, for whatever reason, myworkouts were 20 minutes and 20
(10:37):
minutes was all I could do formy Pomodoro.
It was like 25 was too much but20 was the sweet spot.
So it's really helpful to lookat cues from how long you like
to exercise and that might bethe cue for about how long you
can focus in your workday.
So for you, michelle, you mighthave like an hour or two hour
block of.
This is when I'm going to getall my administrative tasks done
and you might break up thatblock into.
(11:00):
You can kind of toy with thedifferent durations.
But it might be a 45 minutework segment with a five minute
break and then maybe it's 25 andthen five minutes and then 25
and five minutes.
But toying with that durationcan be really helpful as well.
Michelle Gauthier (11:13):
That's such.
That is such a great pointbecause when I had a corporate
job, the type of job I had, Ipretty much had meetings all day
long and you know in thecorporate world how a 10 o'clock
meeting goes till 11 o'clockand 11 o'clock meeting starts at
11 o'clock and goes till 12o'clock.
Having my own business hashelped me learn that an hour
long meeting is too much and Ialways do my client meetings for
(11:34):
50 minutes and I think it's theperfect amount of time because
you know when you're doing aclient session you have to be
like fully engaged, you're notdoing anything else.
You're really listening at thislevel.
That's above and beyond regularlistening, and so 50 minutes
feels perfect to me, because Ineed the 10 in between to just
reset and refill your waterbottle restroom.
(11:54):
Yes, all that and I find,because I work with a lot of
people.
I work with entrepreneurs, butI work with a lot of corporate
people too and for them to haveeven a meeting on their calendar
where they have that 10 minutesis like whoa.
So I think it's good for them,too, to have the chance to you
know, reset.
I will never have a day everagain where I do nine one hour
(12:16):
calls in a row, right.
Sure, maybe that was themarathon runner in me who could
do that, but, oh my gosh, thatwas.
I can't imagine anyone wholoves that actually.
Amber Deibert (12:25):
That seems crazy.
So do you like to make your ownplan?
Do you like to have somebodyelse decide the plan for you?
Do you like to research otherpeople's ideas and then make
your own plan?
Michelle Gauthier (12:34):
And for you.
Amber Deibert (12:34):
Michelle, I love that you called out for yourself
of like I don't care what theworkout is, you don't need to
know what the workout is.
Somebody else that's a trustedadvisor has already decided it.
I work with salespeople andsometimes that comes into play
as well.
Some of them will be like no, Ihave to make my own plan.
It's going to be reallyimportant for you to make your
strategy of how you're going togo after these accounts and how
(12:55):
you're going to sell these deals.
But others are like no, I'dprefer that somebody else just
tell me what to do.
I'd prefer to sit on my Pelotonand show up and have them give
me the workout.
And for those kind of people, Ifind it's really helpful to go
out and find a trusted advisorwho can basically set the
blueprint for you of like thisis how to gain success in your
role.
Michelle Gauthier (13:14):
Yes, oh my gosh, absolutely.
I would not just want to takedirection from anyone.
I would rather be in chargethan take direction from someone
who I don't trust.
But when I trust someone as anauthority on a topic, I'm like
great, you've already done this,tell me everything.
I don't want to waste my timefiguring something out when you
already know it.
I'd be much happier to just payyou to tell me.
Amber Deibert (13:36):
Yes, and now I'm like I have too many constraints
.
I'd much rather just hire theperson who can tell me how to do
this, because it's going to beso much faster, so much more fun
.
Like, yes, I'm perfectlycompetent to do the research,
but I just don't have the timeRight.
Michelle Gauthier (13:49):
Oh, that makes so much sense.
I feel so validated.
Amber Deibert (13:51):
Yeah.
So then, another interestingvariable that I find is
mismatched, for a lot of myclients at least Do you like to
work out with other people, ordo you prefer to work out on
your?
Michelle Gauthier (14:01):
own Mine's a hundred percent other people.
When I like during COVID Iwould try to do these kind of
weightlifting like stuff thatI'm doing now on my own, and it
just it was like I needed thestructure.
I needed to get in my car andgo somewhere and I know my
friends are going to be there,but I go to different class time
so it's not the same peopleevery time.
I just need other people to bethere other people to be there.
Amber Deibert (14:26):
Okay, and I love that you made that distinction,
because for some people it'slike I go to be with my people.
I go play pickleball because Iget to hang out with my best
friends or me and my buddy.
We ride, we cycle every day andthat's because I want to hang
out with that specific buddy.
Other people are like I don'tcare who it is, I just want to
exercise with other peoplearound.
I want to feel like we're allin this together and there's
(14:47):
some camaraderie, and that's animportant distinction as well.
So, if you're like you and I,where we work from our home
offices, it's kind of just usEven having your spouse or your
partner sit at the same desk andwork with you can be really
helpful Going to a coffee shopwhere you feel like we're kind
of all in this together, we'reall working, can be helpful.
I get more done in virtualco-working sessions than I can
(15:09):
in a whole week.
Just in an hour because I'm likethey're looking at you, they're
going to see if you stand upfrom your desk like just stay
here and focus on this.
We're on Zoom, we're just mutedand I've had clients who do
this with colleagues and otherpeers.
But having somebody else therethat you feel like we're doing
this together can be really,really helpful.
Michelle Gauthier (15:28):
Yes, that makes total sense to me and I
don't have trouble gettingstarted Like if I was just here
for a week alone in my house.
I'm sure I would do tons ofwork.
But there's something about thecoaching mastermind you and I
are in together.
It's a great example of thekind of work where you're
bouncing ideas off people.
Has anyone ever done this?
Does anyone?
(15:48):
want to try this, and it's justso helpful to have colleagues,
because that's something thatyou don't have when you're an
entrepreneur.
Well, maybe you do if you own acompany with 100 people, but in
my case that's a good tip too,and I really do enjoy working at
coffee shops, even if I don'ttalk to anyone.
Amber Deibert (16:05):
Yeah, I do have a lot of clients who also are
like no, I just want to work outby myself, I don't want to be
around other people, and forthem it's really difficult if
they are required to go into theoffice.
And so a lot of them have beenable to work out arrangements
where maybe they work from homein the morning, then they go
into the office in the afternoon, when, when they're like less
(16:26):
focused, it's late in theafternoon, it's after lunch they
can be around colleagues andcollaborate.
Michelle Gauthier (16:31):
Yeah, that's a great tip.
Amber Deibert (16:32):
You are the kind of person that needs to work out
by yourself.
Try to give yourself space towork by yourself.
Me personally yeah.
Okay so we talked about a fewdifferent variables intensity,
duration.
Do you like to make your ownplan?
I also like to know how do youknow what you're going to do
every day?
For some people they have theirlike.
(16:53):
Maybe they're a weight trainerand they're like Monday is arms,
tuesday is back, wednesday islegs, thursday is core.
They have a plan for each dayof the week.
Other people are like I don'tknow.
I think I have 30 minutes ofexercise in me today and I'm
going to jump on the peloton andfind a 30 minute exercise.
Others are like I just walk mydog.
Others are like you.
Do you have a set structure forwhat you do?
(17:14):
Do you just go by your gutintuition?
Because there are a lot ofpeople who are like I, just kind
of like tune into what I wantand I do that.
Michelle Gauthier (17:22):
Oh my gosh, I literally can't imagine that
for working.
It's like the furthest fromwhat I do.
My personal process is I onSunday, I plan my whole week and
the first thing I do is I go tomy gym app and I look at the
protocol for the week and I seethat like Monday's arm day and
Tuesday's hit and Wednesday'swhatever.
So I can just see these are thedays.
(17:42):
It doesn't really matter,meaning I'm going to go anyway.
And then I look at all my clientsessions about my workout.
What the workout is and whattime I'm going is the literal
first thing that goes on mycalendar.
Amber Deibert (17:55):
So for someone like you, you don't necessarily
need the structure of knowingwhat you're going to do every
day, but you know that you'regoing to exercise every day.
Michelle Gauthier (18:03):
Yeah, and I think I know that over the
course of the week I'm going toexercise every day.
Yeah, and I think I know thatover the course of the week, I'm
going to do them all so.
I don't care what day arm day is, I just know it's.
I'm going to hit all of thethings that I want to do.
But now that you're saying this, I also record podcasts every
week, do interviews.
I just know, over the course ofa week I'm going to record two
podcasts at some point, and eachweek it's different, but I just
(18:26):
know.
I do try to like have a generalidea of when I'm going to do it
.
Now, you and I this is like astructured setup time to do it.
But if it's just me, I put iton the calendar.
But I know every week I'm goingto get that done.
Amber Deibert (18:38):
Yes, okay, I want to touch on that.
So for you, you got thestructure, you show up and I
think that that is going to alsobe similar to how your workday
goes, where you know, kind of,the six basic chunks of things
you're going to do every weekand for you it doesn't really
matter which day they fall on,but you know that those things
(18:58):
are going to happen and get done.
Yes, for some people where theyhave the kind of like okay,
monday is this Tuesday, is thislike Monday, is arms Tuesday is
back, whatever For them, I liketo have them set themes for each
day as well when, like, mondaymight be your planning day.
For some people who hateplanning, I also hate the idea
(19:18):
of like the word planning justleaves a bad taste in my mouth,
so I call it like list makingday.
I'm just going to look at all myaccounts.
I'm going to see what needs tohappen.
I'm going to make all my lists.
So Monday might be list makingday for my clients.
Tuesday might be like internalmeetings, wednesday is outreach.
Thursday is follow up, fridayis networking, whatever it might
be, but it's helpful to have atheme for each day if you're
(19:41):
that kind of a person, and forthe people who are more like, go
by their gut intuition.
They have the hardest time inthe corporate world because the
corporate world doesn't valueyou using your gut intuition.
But those people are some ofthe most successful people that
I've ever worked with.
So, giving yourself permissionto know that like and this is
similar to how you work too oflike you don't need to have a
(20:03):
set structure of when you'redoing things, but to have the
trust in yourself that you'regoing to get it done, and
allowing yourself thevariability and the variety of
giving yourself that.
Because, for some people,having a structure and knowing
what you're going to do everyday feels so.
It feels like there's so muchfriction, it feels like you're
trying to put me in a box that Idon't fit in.
I need variety, I need, I needthe variability, and so for
(20:26):
those people, it can be really,really freeing to just trust I'm
going to get it all done andI'm going to show up today and
decide what it is I'm going towork on today, and I don't need
to worry about trying toconstrain myself.
So I want to talk about yourvariable start time.
Everybody tells you that youshould time box your work.
What time is you have your listof tasks and you take your first
(20:48):
task and you schedule it onyour calendar.
And you take your second taskand you schedule everything on
your calendar.
You time block so you set asidea time for it.
I have done this for myself asan entrepreneur.
I've had my business for almosteight years now and I'd be very
thoughtful about when's thebest time for me to record my
podcast and I'd be like Tuesdayat 1.30 would be a perfect time
for me to record my podcast.
Inevitably, tuesday at 1.30happens, the calendar invite
(21:11):
pops up time to record yourpodcast and I would be like
don't tell me what to do.
Michelle Gauthier (21:18):
Who are you to tell me what I have?
Amber Deibert (21:19):
to do.
Just because you told me I haveto do it means I don't want to
do it.
I'm like you're the one whodecided this, amber.
It's ridiculous.
So for some of us, time boxingis not the right tactic for us,
and that's okay.
You can try instead.
Or maybe you set aside, likeduring these two hours this is
my administrative time and Iknow I have these five tasks
(21:42):
that I need to get done andanother really helpful tool is
to decide in advance how longyou'll let yourself spend on a
task.
Oh, that's good, I know I couldprobably polish that
presentation for the next fourdays, but really I probably only
need 40 minutes to finish itoff.
Yes, so you can time box.
(22:04):
Just decide in advance how longyou'll give yourself to finish
that task, but then giveyourself the flexibility to work
on that task whenever it isthat you want to work on it yeah
, I love that.
Michelle Gauthier (22:14):
That's a great idea too.
So it's like a little bit ofstructure, but not 100%
structure, and I have yet tofind somebody of all I've had my
business for eight years tooand of all the clients that I've
had.
I always try to help my clientsfigure out.
How much structure do I like inmy day?
You?
know do you like 80% structure,20% structure, more creative
(22:34):
type jobs.
They usually like lessstructure, but they still need
some, and I have yet to findsomebody who's like I like 100%
structure.
I want to know what I'm doingevery minute of every day and
have it on my calendar, and Ifeel like most planning methods
are kind of that idea of thatyou have to do that in order to
be successful.
So I love that you're sayinghave that block, but then let
(22:55):
yourself be the boss of what youwork on first and how long
you're going to work on it.
Something I noticed is when myclients like, let's say, a
client, I'm seeing my client,Lauren on Wednesday at 11.
And if she texts me and says Ican't do that time this week,
I'm so sorry.
Is there any way you could doMonday at 12?
To me that is like a non-ask.
(23:16):
I don't care at all.
Like I've got my working hours,I want to see her during the
week.
It doesn't make any differenceto me what day or what time she
shows up on my schedule and thathas never bothered me.
But I noticed that my clientsseem to feel really bad about it
.
And you're helping me realizethat it's just like my workouts,
like I don't care when arm dayis, I just care that I'm doing
(23:38):
arm day.
I don't care what time I seeLauren, I just care that I'm
seeing Lauren.
So that's really eye opening tome about why that seems to
really matter to other peoplebut it really doesn't matter to
me?
Amber Deibert (23:51):
Yeah, because they might be like, arm day is
Monday.
Michelle Gauthier (23:52):
Yes, that is very true.
That's probably exactly whatshe would say about herself.
Amber Deibert (23:56):
So, talking about the different variables that I
like to look at, one last funnyvariable is I like to look at
what clothes you like to wearand also any food or drink.
Some of these matter to peoplewhen they exercise.
Some of these don't matter topeople when they exercise.
And just if it does matter toyou like, if you have a
particular outfit that you liketo wear when you exercise.
(24:18):
It might be really helpful foryou to have a particular outfit
that you wear when you work.
It kind of sets your brain andtells you that you're in that
environment of, like it's worktime.
Yeah, if you might reallybenefit from listening to
particular music when you workas well.
Michelle Gauthier (24:33):
I do make myself the same drink, like this
pre-workout mix, and I put itin the same cup with a certain
amount of ice and water anddrink that and bring it into the
gym with me.
I would hate to work outwithout that.
I forgot it the other day and Ihad to buy a little packet of
it when I got there.
I still brought the cup with theice, but I couldn't find the
actual powder.
So that is like a big thing tome and I think it's like my
(24:56):
brain and my body's way ofsaying okay, now we're getting
ready to work out this this iswe're starting.
Amber Deibert (25:01):
Yeah, it might be really interesting to
incorporate that into your worktime as well.
Yeah whether it's a particulardrink or a particular snack or
something that you have at yourdesk.
It's all these really smallthings that can cue our body.
That it's work time, yeah.
So for me I use music.
I have a particular playlistthat I only listen to when I'm
(25:23):
doing deep, focused work.
Michelle Gauthier (25:25):
Oh interesting.
Amber Deibert (25:26):
I love listening to Hans Zimmer.
Michelle Gauthier (25:28):
He's a music?
Yeah, I was gonna say does ithave words, or is it just like
yeah, that's a great thought.
Amber Deibert (25:36):
Never.
So then your brain is like okay,this, this means we're doing
deep work, exactly, and becauseI only listen to that music when
I'm doing deep work.
Now, as soon as I hear thatfirst song, I listen to
Inception, and so as soon as Ihear that first song, it's like
my brain is like okay, we'refocused now.
Another thing that I'm doing isI'm learning about how we tend
(25:57):
to use different literalgeographic spaces in our home
for the wrong things.
So we're working where weshould be eating, or we're
scrolling where we should besleeping, or for me, I'm like
getting distracted where Ishould be working.
And so I'm experimenting withonly sitting at this desk when
I'm working and focused.
(26:18):
As soon as I get distracted,start doom scrolling like kind
of my attention fades.
I move away from my desk sothat it cues my body that when
I'm here I'm working.
And then I also, whenever I'mworking, I have a rule for
myself that I wear pants thathave a button and a zipper.
I love that because then itjust like nobody knows, I know
(26:43):
and it cues to me like this iswork time.
Michelle Gauthier (26:45):
Yes, oh my gosh, so many good things in
what you just said right there.
I think the idea of doing thewrong activities like activities
in the wrong place in our houseis a fascinating idea, and I
love the idea that if I need totake a break from work, that I
don't do it sitting at my desk,that I get up and go sit on my
couch if I want to scroll on myphone or switch to a different
(27:05):
area.
That's meant for that kind ofthing.
That is so cool, so many thingsthat you're teaching me.
I'm realizing.
Yeah, I do that, Like for meit's earrings.
When I'm going to work, I puton earrings, that's like my
indicator.
Yes, which are sitting on mydesk right now, because I can't
(27:30):
wear them.
With my big headphones that Iwear and I also fill up a big
pitcher of water and I have thatwith a glass and when I sit
down to work I always I feelkind of panicky if I don't have
that water sitting at my desk,like I couldn't walk into my
kitchen.
That's 10 feet away, but Ithink that is like okay, we're
starting to get down to like awhole day of work If there's a
full pitcher of water that meansI'm getting to a full day of
work.
So I really didn't even realizethat I was doing that, and I'm
going to proactively think aboutthe music one, because I don't
(27:51):
listen to music while I work.
The idea of listening tosomething like you're talking
about sounds fascinating.
Amber Deibert (27:56):
Yeah, it's different for everybody.
I had one of my clients justmessaged me yesterday.
He's like I got all my workdone.
I was listening to German beats.
I'm like I don't even know whatthat is.
That sounds great, or likeother people are.
Like it's trap music for me orlo-fi beats, or yeah, you can
really be strategic about it.
Michelle Gauthier (28:11):
Yeah, like whatever works for you.
And I think at my workout placewhen the music gets turned up
loud, that's when we're reallyworking out.
It's definitely an indicator,like when they're explaining the
workout or you're saying helloor whatever.
It might be on low, but thenwhen it gets loud, it's like
okay, now we're seriously doingit.
So I love the idea of doingthat at work too.
Amber Deibert (28:30):
Yeah, I'm going to try that, yeah, I have ADHD
and I've just got diagnosed ayear and a half ago and because
I teach productivity, so I'vebeen able to mask it for such a
long time.
But I was like, how come allthese things that work for other
people don't work for me?
And so I love what you'reteaching, michelle of like,
accept yourself, optimize foryou and who you are, and there's
(28:52):
always a lot of pushback withthis.
So like, well, you don'tunderstand, like I can't really,
because they expect me to besomething else and I need to
perform in a certain way inorder to be successful, and me
to be something else and I needto perform in a certain way in
order to be successful.
And I just love talking aboutthe other side of it, like okay,
let's imagine, michelle, youknow how you work best.
(29:13):
You've intuitively figured thisout for yourself.
But let's imagine that you tryto put yourself into somebody
else, someone else's box, andyou instead have to do the same
thing at the same time every day.
You have to have deep focus fortwo, three hours.
Michelle Gauthier (29:24):
No, I mean the opposite of productive, and
also I think it would make mehate a job that I actually love,
Like just that structure wouldbe enough to wreck it for me
much less a job you don't reallylike in the first place.
Amber Deibert (29:38):
Yeah, I had a client who was one of the top
salespeople.
It's really interesting workingwith salespeople because
there's literally a leaderboard.
He was one of the topsalespeople in his whole
organization and he works sofast and so efficiently.
It's just how he does it.
Same with his workouts reallyintense, super quick and so he
would get his work done in likethree hours.
(29:59):
But then he'd stay sitting athis desk because he was like
it's not okay to work threehours.
He was getting amazing resultsand working three hours, but
he's like you're supposed towork eight hours, so he would
just let himself sit at his deskand he would just deteriorate.
And I was like are you doinganybody a favor by letting
yourself deteriorate, get in aworse position, not manage your
(30:20):
energy by sitting at your deskfor eight hours?
Michelle Gauthier (30:23):
Everybody wins.
Amber Deibert (30:25):
when you optimize for your energy style and work
three hours a day, your team isnot complaining.
You're one of the topperforming people because,
you've optimized for how youwork best and we have to remove
all these shoulds and all thissocietal expectation of who we
think we should be, because it'sall 200 years old from the
industrial revolution.
(30:45):
What's most important to yourteam and your company is that
you are performing at your best.
Michelle Gauthier (30:52):
Yes, I agree, give yourself that permission.
This is such a good episode foreverybody to think about, for
themselves and then for thepeople who work for them, or
their kids or your spouse, youknow, to help them embrace the
way that they really are kind ofdesigned to work.
Is there one?
If somebody were to just makeone change or think about one
(31:15):
thing, what do you think is themost important?
Amber Deibert (31:18):
I actually would be interested.
If somebody is feelingoverwhelmed by this.
I would want to know, becausethe feedback that I usually get
when people learn this isthey're just like it turns on a
light bulb.
It unlocks something in them.
And I had somebody I do a freeworkshop on this every month and
I had somebody come to myworkshop and then email me a
week later and he was like hey,can I just talk to you about
what happened in the workshop?
I was like oh yeah, of course.
(31:39):
He was like hey, can I justtalk to you about what happened
in the workshop?
I was like oh yeah, of coursewe get on the call.
And he's like I just wanted totell you I got more out of that
workshop than I ever expected.
He's like I'm trying to not begenerous with this, but I think
that my productivity hasincreased 70%.
Michelle Gauthier (31:55):
Oh my gosh.
First of all, that's amazing,and the fact that the person
took the time to call you andtell you that that's so amazing.
Well, I think what happenssometimes is when we're because
most of my audience isoverwhelmed overachievers trying
their best at everything.
So sometimes something likethis that's a different way of
thinking can be like I've beendoing this wrong all along.
(32:16):
I haven't been doing the rightthings for myself.
How can I switch over?
I'm in a position where I'mthinking of, like where I used
to work, that we had callcenters and people had to work
certain hours and they didn'thave a lot of flexibility.
So that's why I'm thinking ifyou're not in a position, or if
you feel, like you've been doingit wrong this whole time what's
a?
different way they could do.
Amber Deibert (32:37):
Yeah, I'm going to again sort of answer your
question.
I want to just reiterate whatyou talk about, which is
accepting yourself.
For that person who's like,this sounds amazing, but I can't
do that because of theconstraints that I'm under.
I want to just reiterateeverybody wins when you are at
(32:57):
your best.
Let's imagine that you areworking in a way that doesn't
align with you and your energyand you burn out.
You don't benefit when you burnout.
Your team does not benefit whenyou burn out.
Your manager doesn't benefitwhen you burn out.
Your company doesn't benefitwhen you burn out.
Your family does not benefitwhen you burn out.
But let's imagine that you doset some small boundaries at
(33:21):
first, just small boundaries.
Start to protect your energy,start to work in a way that
aligns with you.
Who benefits?
You feel much better and nowyou're bringing your best self
to your work.
So your team is benefiting,your manager is happier because
you're performing better thanyou ever have before, your
company benefits from this andyour family benefits from this.
It feels so counterintuitiveand I don't understand why I'm
(33:47):
in the same boat of like.
No, there's no way that I cantake care of myself first, but
when you protect yourself andyour energy first and put
yourself in a position where youare operating at your best,
literally every person aroundyou wins.
Michelle Gauthier (34:03):
Yes, I love that.
I think that's perfect, becausethe way that you are and I'm
talking to everyone listening isright, Like the whatever it is
that you are, it's.
There's nothing that's wrong.
And if you go in with theassumption of accepting that and
knowing that it's right, thenyou can become this next level
(34:23):
version of yourself where you'rereally working in the way that
you prefer.
Oh my gosh, Amber, I could talkto you all day.
This is such a fascinatingtopic.
I absolutely love it.
Amber Deibert (34:33):
Can I give one more analogy for those people
who feel like they're just likebanging their heads against the
wall.
Michelle Gauthier (34:37):
Yes.
Amber Deibert (34:38):
I, for whatever reason, love to think of people
like plants.
So in my office here I've got abird of paradise it's like this
giant tropical plant and thenalso next to I've got a snake
plant the snake plant.
I don't have to water thisthing, like it could go for two
months and it will thrive.
It's also really far from thelight source and it's just like
doing its thing.
It's having a great time overhere.
(34:58):
Meanwhile, the bird of paradiseneeds water, like every couple
days, like I live in a desertand so this thing.
I really love my tropicalplants, but it is not thriving
here.
It needs water all the time,and I think about people the
same.
Let's imagine, like thisbeautiful tropical plant versus
a cactus.
Is the cactus wrong for needingless water?
Michelle Gauthier (35:22):
No.
Amber Deibert (35:23):
Like there are people out there who are like
you know what, I don't need tocollaborate as much as other
people.
I want you to give me theassignment and trust me to do it
and I will take care of it.
Versus, maybe there's atropical plant out there that
needs a lot of water, and arethey wrong for needing a lot of
water and support?
Absolutely not.
But what I find is, if you'renot thriving in your workplace,
it might be that you're just inthe wrong environment.
(35:45):
It might you just need morewater?
And the desert's not a badenvironment for cactuses, but
it's not great for tropicalplants, and so just knowing who
you are and what you need can bethe biggest unlock to finding
the success that you're lookingfor.
Michelle Gauthier (35:58):
I love that.
That is such a great analogy.
I too have lots of plants in myoffice and I'm thinking about
this yeah.
They're different.
It's another perk of having thewater on my desk all the time.
If somebody looks like theyneed some water, I can give them
some water.
Oh, that's amazing.
Amber Deibert (36:13):
I love it.
Michelle Gauthier (36:14):
Okay, I have to ask you two more questions,
the questions I ask every gueston the show, and the first one
is what do you do if you feeloverwhelmed to feel better?
What's your go-to strategy?
Amber Deibert (36:23):
I feel overwhelmed all the time with
ADHD and my go-to strategy istwo things.
Number one I need to make mytasks more clear.
To me overwhelm happens when Ieither something feels too big,
like I can't even do it, or it'sjust like too confusing.
I don't even have the braincells to figure out what's
(36:44):
happening here.
Number one I add clarity.
Rather than writing outpresentation on my task list,
like what actually needs tohappen with this presentation?
Is it finish the presentation?
Is it review the presentation?
Is it add photos to thepresentation?
So, number one, I add clarityand make it really easy for my
caveman brain to read it andknow exactly what needs to
(37:05):
happen with just one brain cell.
The second thing I do is I breakdown my tasks much smaller.
You can break down your tasksas small as you want.
Sometimes, when I'm reallyhesitating to do something and
I'm procrastinating, like makinga presentation, let's say I'll
say, like step number one, loginto Canva.
And I write that on my task listand do you know the dopamine
hit I get from crossing that off?
(37:27):
Yes, I do.
Yeah, you can break them up assmall as you want and make them
as easy as you want, andsometimes just getting the
inertia going and making themsuper clear and super small to
the point that I just want tocherry pick every task, like
well, I can log into Canva, likewatch me go.
Yes, cross that a point that Ijust want to cherry pick every
(37:49):
task.
Michelle Gauthier (37:49):
Like well, I can log into Canva, like watch
me go, yeah, cross that off, geta dopamine hit.
The next one is like brainstormideas like well, I can do that,
like watch me go, absolutelygreat, it feels like in order to
treat overwhelm, you just haveto keep making it smaller and
smaller until you get to thefeeling of oh, that's totally
doable, I can do that okay, andthen second question is what is
something that you do toconsistently save yourself time
or just do less?
So lately, it's AI.
(38:09):
Tell us how you use AI.
Amber Deibert (38:11):
I use AI for everything.
So I use typically ChatGPT andCloud.
Cloud tends to be better.
I create a lot of content.
Cloud tends to be more helpfulwith content, but I use it for
everything.
I use it for helping write aresponse to an email.
I use it for if I'm feelinglike those times when you just
want to write an angry response.
I write my angry response in AIand I say can you make this
(38:34):
nice?
Yes, can you make this likekind and considerate, but I
still get the benefit of likegetting all my emotions out.
Yes, I use it to plan out whatI'm doing.
I use it to answer questions.
I would use it to learn things.
I mean, I've automated a fewthings.
So there's like I'll record avoice note and then it will
automatically go through thisprocess and then it will output
(38:57):
a LinkedIn post for me based onwhat I said.
Exactly.
Michelle Gauthier (39:01):
Oh, that's amazing.
That's a great one.
Yes, okay.
So if you're not using AI, Ihave a feeling hopefully
everybody's used chat GPT alittle bit, but it is amazingly
helpful.
That is great, that's a greatanswer, and I really think
you're the first person to saythat.
Amber Deibert (39:14):
So thank you.
Michelle Gauthier (39:16):
Yes, thank you so much for sharing your
time and knowledge with us.
This is so great.
So you mentioned that you do afree workshop once a month.
Can you tell us about that?
And then just anything else, ifpeople want to follow you, you
said you're mostly on LinkedIn.
Give us all the scoop.
Amber Deibert (39:31):
Yes.
So if you have any questions,if you have any feedback, if
this was interesting for you,like, please reach out.
I love hearing from people.
You can come find me onLinkedIn just search Amber Diver
D-E-I-B-E-R-T.
You can come join my freeworkshop and get personalized
coaching on your workout style.
I go through the same processand I give people feedback,
exactly like I've given youtoday, michelle.
I'm like, okay, if you're thatkind of person, here would be a
(39:53):
technique that would be reallygood for you.
You can go to mentalmasterycomslash free workshop to sign up
for that.
Michelle Gauthier (39:59):
Okay, thank you so much.
I really appreciate your time.
I really enjoyed the interviewmyself.
Thank you for giving mepersonalized coaching.
Slash being a guest on thepodcast Amazing.
Amber Deibert (40:13):
Thank you so much .
Michelle Gauthier (40:15):
Thank you for listening to the Overwhelmed
Working Woman podcast.
If you want to learn more aboutmy work, head over to my
website at michellegauthiercom.
See you next week.
But what I find is, if you're not thriving in
your workplace, it might be thatyou're just in the wrong
environment.
Michelle Gauthier (00:10):
You're listening to Overwhelmed Working
Woman, the podcast that helpsyou be more calm and more
productive by doing less.
I'm your host, MichelleGauthier, a former Overwhelmed
Working Woman and current lifecoach.
On this show, we unpack thestress and pressure that today's
working woman experiences, andin each episode you'll get a
strategy to bring more calm,ease and relaxation to your life
(00:34):
.
Hey friends, welcome back.
Thanks for joining today.
I'm super excited to share thisconversation with you because
it really influenced the waythat I think about my own
productivity.
Today I'm talking with AmberDeibert.
She is a performance coach whohelps people in the sales field
get to the very top of theirgame, and what makes her work so
(00:57):
fascinating to me is how shehelps her clients use their
natural energy patterns to workmore effectively, instead of
forcing themselves to do thingsthat don't fit.
Her theory is that we can findout all we need to know about
our own productivity based onthe way that we like to work out
or expend our energy.
(01:18):
In this episode, we're going totalk about how your workout
style can reveal your ideal workstyle.
It's different if you like torun long distances versus take
the occasional walk, versus goto a HIIT class.
We're also going to talk aboutwhy productivity isn't about
doing more, but doing what fitsyour brain and your body best,
(01:39):
and then how to set up your daybased on what's best for you,
your breaks, your calendar, evenyour clothes or music to
support your focus and reduceyour overwhelm.
I do have to warn you that thisepisode is longer than the usual
one.
I usually try to keep myepisodes shorter than this, but
there was so much good stuff inhere and I really didn't want to
cut anything out, so you mighthave to listen to it over two
(02:00):
different sessions or something.
It's about 40 minutes long.
Okay, let's meet Amber.
Thank you, Amber, so much forbeing here today.
Amber and I are in a coachingmastermind together, and she was
the presenter one day when Iattended a meeting and I just
thought that what she had to saywas so brilliant and so helpful
that I wanted to bring it tothe audience.
Can you just tell us a littlebit about yourself and how you
(02:22):
got to be the type of coach thatyou are?
Amber Deibert (02:26):
Yes, thank you so much for having me.
I am a performance coach and Iwork specifically with
enterprise and strategic techsellers, so my clients are
selling at the highest levels toFortune 500 companies and I
help them specifically withtheir mindset and their
productivity.
My sweet spot is people whoknow what they need to do.
They just can't quite getthemselves to do it and I find
(02:46):
that it either comes down tolimiting beliefs and imposter
syndrome and mindset things, orit's that you don't have a
productivity system that worksfor you.
I'm so delighted to be on yourpodcast because working women is
something that's near and dearto my heart as a working mom and
thinking about how much thereis on our plates and how we want
to perform.
Michelle Gauthier (03:06):
Oh good, I'm so glad and I thought you would
be such a good fit for thisaudience, because one of the
things that I'm always workingon with my clients who are all
overwhelmed working women is theidea that you don't have to do
it Like, you don't have to getup at five in the morning and
approach your work in a certainway.
If that's not the way thatworks for you, you have to
(03:30):
understand, first learn andunderstand who you are, and then
create rules that work for youfor your best productivity.
So would you please tell usabout your theory on that?
We should essentially work theway that we work out.
Will you tell us a little bitabout how you developed that and
what it is?
Amber Deibert (03:42):
Yeah, totally, and I just want to touch on what
you talked about really quickly, and I love that you've said
that, because I think so many ofus.
I market on LinkedIn and I readall the LinkedIn posts and all
the posts from all the likeexperts.
They're like 20 year old dudeswho aren't married, who don't
have kids, and they're tellingyou what your morning routine
should look like.
But they're successful, likethey're working 16 hour days, 20
(04:08):
hour days, and they're gettingit done.
And so we think like oh, Ishould be that way and I love
your approach, michelle, of likeit's not how somebody else
designs it, it's how what worksbest for you.
They would be like I just knowthat I need to do more deep work
.
I keep reading about deep workand how important it is and I
would look at them and I'd belike, respectfully, you're not a
deep work kind of a person,like I don't know what it is
about you, but like that justdoesn't seem like a fit for you
and maybe you're trying tosqueeze yourself into a box that
(04:30):
doesn't fit you.
You're this beautiful statuethat doesn't fit in a
rectangular box, and so Irealized that you can learn a
lot about somebody and how theylike to expend their energy by
looking at their workout style.
So I have a theory that we liketo mentally expend energy the
same way we physically like toexpend energy.
(04:50):
So let me give you an example.
Imagine like an enduranceathlete versus maybe like a
CrossFit or high intensityinterval training athlete.
On the endurance side, when Ithink about endurance sports,
you have to do tons of upfrontplanning.
And as long as you've got allthe upfront planning done, then
when you're executing on theworkout, you are essentially in
(05:12):
deep work.
You have no more decisions thatyou have to make, you're just
doing it.
You made all the decisions aheadof time, or maybe an interval
training athlete, kind of like acircuit training athlete.
They might show up to the gymand they might like maybe say
Orange Theory.
They might look and see whatthe workout is today, but they
don't need to know the wholeworkout, they just need to know
the first thing and I find thatthose type of athletes work more
(05:35):
in short, intense bursts.
On the endurance side it's morelike low intensity, long
duration, and on the intervaltraining side it's more high
intensity, short duration, ifyou can design your workday
around that as well.
I find so many people who aremore of the interval training
kind of people but they'retrying to fit themselves in the
(05:55):
deep work bucket when actuallythey get more done in a shorter
period of time than most peoplecan do in a week.
Michelle Gauthier (06:02):
Yeah, I love that, and especially that
neither one of those is thebetter answer.
It's like whichever one sort ofcomes naturally to you or that
you're attracted to, is theright thing.
Okay, so what if somebody'slistening right now and they're
like, I don't work outconsistently?
Amber Deibert (06:17):
Oh, I'm so glad you asked that.
Like I want to give the caveatthat I don't actually care how
much you work out or how youwork out or if you're in shape.
What I want to know is how doyou physically like to expend
energy?
That's all I care about.
It might be that you're likeyou know what.
I just go for a walk with mydog.
And that's my favorite way tophysically expend energy.
That's fantastic.
(06:39):
We can learn so much from that.
Or maybe you're like you know Idon't exercise, or I used to be
in it.
This is my story.
I from that.
Or maybe you're like you know Idon't exercise, or I used to be
in it.
This is my story.
I used to be an enduranceathlete.
Then I had kids and I was likeI don't have the time for that,
and so now I am more of aninterval training kind of
athlete and my work style hasadjusted.
Michelle Gauthier (06:54):
Yes, oh my gosh.
I would absolutely say me too.
Used to run marathons.
Used to go for a run on Sundaymorning that would last three
hours.
There's no way that I wouldmake the time to do that anymore
.
I go to a boot camp typetraining and I show up for it.
I go five days a week right now,sometimes six, and it's a
(07:18):
different workout every day.
Three days are strength, threedays are cardio.
I really don't care what it is,I just go.
Sometimes I know what it is andsometimes I don't, because I
need to wear different sportsbras.
That's the only reason why Icare.
And when I go there I don'tknow what the workout is and the
trainer demos it and if I hadto repeat back the workout, I
could probably repeat back like20% of it and just have to kind
of get started see what otherpeople are doing.
(07:39):
You know, sort of figure it outalong the way.
So if we use that as an example, maybe that could be helpful
for me personally, but for otherpeople as well.
So what should I do work-wise,if you?
Know, that about me?
Amber Deibert (07:52):
Yes, and thank you for being the guinea pig.
It's always so much easier touse a specific example.
I call this process work likeyou work out.
We're going to look at yourworkout style and glean insights
from it of things that we canapply to your workday to help
you be more productive.
The way I think about it isthat you have an internal
blueprint for how your bodylikes to expend energy.
It's always been there, but wejust try to fit ourselves into a
(08:15):
mold that we aren't.
If you look at cues from howyou like to exercise, you can
establish these in your workday,and it's going to make things
so much easier.
So the first thing I like toask about is intensity.
Are these workouts prettyintense or are they like pretty
chill?
Super intense, yeah.
Do you prefer to work in likeshort, intense bursts or do you
prefer to have like slow, longworkdays?
Michelle Gauthier (08:39):
I would rather have the short, intense
bursts.
Amber Deibert (08:42):
Yes, which I find for a lot of entrepreneurs.
They kind of naturally get intotheir right mode.
So I've done this with a fewfriends of mine who are also
coaches and we find that theyare working in a way that works
really well for them.
But I find that with corporateemployees that's not usually the
case, because they're trying tobe something that they're not.
So that's the first thing tonote is what is the intensity?
(09:03):
So for somebody like you, Iwould definitely recommend
blocking out time to get allyour tasks knocked out in an
hour or whatever it is, andworking in short bursts.
Pomodoros, which, if you'veever heard of the Pomodoro
(09:26):
method, it's named after the guywho invented it used a timer
that looked like a tomato, andtomato is Pomodoro in Italian.
Michelle Gauthier (09:30):
I thought you were going to say his name was
like Anthony Pomodoro.
Amber Deibert (09:32):
It's like a tomato shaped kitchen timer.
Michelle Gauthier (09:34):
That's what it's called.
Amber Deibert (09:35):
It's named, but the Pomodoro technique is
essentially interval trainingfor the workday.
The idea is you do 25 minuteson, you take a five minute break
.
You do 25 minutes on, you takea five minute break.
We know that you're a highintensity person.
I like to know, like, what isthe ideal duration for your
workouts?
It sounds like you're doing aclass that they kind of decide
the duration for you.
How?
Michelle Gauthier (09:55):
long do you like to 45 minutes, 45 minutes?
It's funny because before Iwould have said when I was a
runner, I would have said that Ilike to run for an hour, but if
I could have gotten the sameworkout in 45 minutes, I would
have done 45 minutes.
Whatever's the most efficientway to get the most muscle, burn
the most calories, likewhatever I'm doing, I want it to
be like the most efficient wayto do it.
Amber Deibert (10:16):
Totally so.
What a lot of people don't knowwith the Pomodoro technique, or
don't give themselvespermission, is you can change
the duration of the Pomodorotechnique to whatever you want
it to be permission is you canchange the duration of the
Pomodoro technique to whateveryou want it to be.
I had a client who was a writer, and so 25 minutes was too
short for him, so he would do 45minute focus session with a 15
minute break you can do.
for me, for whatever reason, myworkouts were 20 minutes and 20
(10:37):
minutes was all I could do formy Pomodoro.
It was like 25 was too much but20 was the sweet spot.
So it's really helpful to lookat cues from how long you like
to exercise and that might bethe cue for about how long you
can focus in your workday.
So for you, michelle, you mighthave like an hour or two hour
block of.
This is when I'm going to getall my administrative tasks done
and you might break up thatblock into.
(11:00):
You can kind of toy with thedifferent durations.
But it might be a 45 minutework segment with a five minute
break and then maybe it's 25 andthen five minutes and then 25
and five minutes.
But toying with that durationcan be really helpful as well.
Michelle Gauthier (11:13):
That's such.
That is such a great pointbecause when I had a corporate
job, the type of job I had, Ipretty much had meetings all day
long and you know in thecorporate world how a 10 o'clock
meeting goes till 11 o'clockand 11 o'clock meeting starts at
11 o'clock and goes till 12o'clock.
Having my own business hashelped me learn that an hour
long meeting is too much and Ialways do my client meetings for
(11:34):
50 minutes and I think it's theperfect amount of time because
you know when you're doing aclient session you have to be
like fully engaged, you're notdoing anything else.
You're really listening at thislevel.
That's above and beyond regularlistening, and so 50 minutes
feels perfect to me, because Ineed the 10 in between to just
reset and refill your waterbottle restroom.
(11:54):
Yes, all that and I find,because I work with a lot of
people.
I work with entrepreneurs, butI work with a lot of corporate
people too and for them to haveeven a meeting on their calendar
where they have that 10 minutesis like whoa.
So I think it's good for them,too, to have the chance to you
know, reset.
I will never have a day everagain where I do nine one hour
(12:16):
calls in a row, right.
Sure, maybe that was themarathon runner in me who could
do that, but, oh my gosh, thatwas.
I can't imagine anyone wholoves that actually.
Amber Deibert (12:25):
That seems crazy.
So do you like to make your ownplan?
Do you like to have somebodyelse decide the plan for you?
Do you like to research otherpeople's ideas and then make
your own plan?
Michelle Gauthier (12:34):
And for you.
Amber Deibert (12:34):
Michelle, I love that you called out for yourself
of like I don't care what theworkout is, you don't need to
know what the workout is.
Somebody else that's a trustedadvisor has already decided it.
I work with salespeople andsometimes that comes into play
as well.
Some of them will be like no, Ihave to make my own plan.
It's going to be reallyimportant for you to make your
strategy of how you're going togo after these accounts and how
(12:55):
you're going to sell these deals.
But others are like no, I'dprefer that somebody else just
tell me what to do.
I'd prefer to sit on my Pelotonand show up and have them give
me the workout.
And for those kind of people, Ifind it's really helpful to go
out and find a trusted advisorwho can basically set the
blueprint for you of like thisis how to gain success in your
role.
Michelle Gauthier (13:14):
Yes, oh my gosh, absolutely.
I would not just want to takedirection from anyone.
I would rather be in chargethan take direction from someone
who I don't trust.
But when I trust someone as anauthority on a topic, I'm like
great, you've already done this,tell me everything.
I don't want to waste my timefiguring something out when you
already know it.
I'd be much happier to just payyou to tell me.
Amber Deibert (13:36):
Yes, and now I'm like I have too many constraints
.
I'd much rather just hire theperson who can tell me how to do
this, because it's going to beso much faster, so much more fun
.
Like, yes, I'm perfectlycompetent to do the research,
but I just don't have the timeRight.
Michelle Gauthier (13:49):
Oh, that makes so much sense.
I feel so validated.
Amber Deibert (13:51):
Yeah.
So then, another interestingvariable that I find is
mismatched, for a lot of myclients at least Do you like to
work out with other people, ordo you prefer to work out on
your?
Michelle Gauthier (14:01):
own Mine's a hundred percent other people.
When I like during COVID Iwould try to do these kind of
weightlifting like stuff thatI'm doing now on my own, and it
just it was like I needed thestructure.
I needed to get in my car andgo somewhere and I know my
friends are going to be there,but I go to different class time
so it's not the same peopleevery time.
I just need other people to bethere other people to be there.
Amber Deibert (14:26):
Okay, and I love that you made that distinction,
because for some people it'slike I go to be with my people.
I go play pickleball because Iget to hang out with my best
friends or me and my buddy.
We ride, we cycle every day andthat's because I want to hang
out with that specific buddy.
Other people are like I don'tcare who it is, I just want to
exercise with other peoplearound.
I want to feel like we're allin this together and there's
(14:47):
some camaraderie, and that's animportant distinction as well.
So, if you're like you and I,where we work from our home
offices, it's kind of just usEven having your spouse or your
partner sit at the same desk andwork with you can be really
helpful Going to a coffee shopwhere you feel like we're kind
of all in this together, we'reall working, can be helpful.
I get more done in virtualco-working sessions than I can
(15:09):
in a whole week.
Just in an hour because I'm likethey're looking at you, they're
going to see if you stand upfrom your desk like just stay
here and focus on this.
We're on Zoom, we're just mutedand I've had clients who do
this with colleagues and otherpeers.
But having somebody else therethat you feel like we're doing
this together can be really,really helpful.
Michelle Gauthier (15:28):
Yes, that makes total sense to me and I
don't have trouble gettingstarted Like if I was just here
for a week alone in my house.
I'm sure I would do tons ofwork.
But there's something about thecoaching mastermind you and I
are in together.
It's a great example of thekind of work where you're
bouncing ideas off people.
Has anyone ever done this?
Does anyone?
(15:48):
want to try this, and it's justso helpful to have colleagues,
because that's something thatyou don't have when you're an
entrepreneur.
Well, maybe you do if you own acompany with 100 people, but in
my case that's a good tip too,and I really do enjoy working at
coffee shops, even if I don'ttalk to anyone.
Amber Deibert (16:05):
Yeah, I do have a lot of clients who also are
like no, I just want to work outby myself, I don't want to be
around other people, and forthem it's really difficult if
they are required to go into theoffice.
And so a lot of them have beenable to work out arrangements
where maybe they work from homein the morning, then they go
into the office in the afternoon, when, when they're like less
(16:26):
focused, it's late in theafternoon, it's after lunch they
can be around colleagues andcollaborate.
Michelle Gauthier (16:31):
Yeah, that's a great tip.
Amber Deibert (16:32):
You are the kind of person that needs to work out
by yourself.
Try to give yourself space towork by yourself.
Me personally yeah.
Okay so we talked about a fewdifferent variables intensity,
duration.
Do you like to make your ownplan?
I also like to know how do youknow what you're going to do
every day?
For some people they have theirlike.
(16:53):
Maybe they're a weight trainerand they're like Monday is arms,
tuesday is back, wednesday islegs, thursday is core.
They have a plan for each dayof the week.
Other people are like I don'tknow.
I think I have 30 minutes ofexercise in me today and I'm
going to jump on the peloton andfind a 30 minute exercise.
Others are like I just walk mydog.
Others are like you.
Do you have a set structure forwhat you do?
(17:14):
Do you just go by your gutintuition?
Because there are a lot ofpeople who are like I, just kind
of like tune into what I wantand I do that.
Michelle Gauthier (17:22):
Oh my gosh, I literally can't imagine that
for working.
It's like the furthest fromwhat I do.
My personal process is I onSunday, I plan my whole week and
the first thing I do is I go tomy gym app and I look at the
protocol for the week and I seethat like Monday's arm day and
Tuesday's hit and Wednesday'swhatever.
So I can just see these are thedays.
(17:42):
It doesn't really matter,meaning I'm going to go anyway.
And then I look at all my clientsessions about my workout.
What the workout is and whattime I'm going is the literal
first thing that goes on mycalendar.
Amber Deibert (17:55):
So for someone like you, you don't necessarily
need the structure of knowingwhat you're going to do every
day, but you know that you'regoing to exercise every day.
Michelle Gauthier (18:03):
Yeah, and I think I know that over the
course of the week I'm going toexercise every day.
Yeah, and I think I know thatover the course of the week, I'm
going to do them all so.
I don't care what day arm day is, I just know it's.
I'm going to hit all of thethings that I want to do.
But now that you're saying this, I also record podcasts every
week, do interviews.
I just know, over the course ofa week I'm going to record two
podcasts at some point, and eachweek it's different, but I just
(18:26):
know.
I do try to like have a generalidea of when I'm going to do it
.
Now, you and I this is like astructured setup time to do it.
But if it's just me, I put iton the calendar.
But I know every week I'm goingto get that done.
Amber Deibert (18:38):
Yes, okay, I want to touch on that.
So for you, you got thestructure, you show up and I
think that that is going to alsobe similar to how your workday
goes, where you know, kind of,the six basic chunks of things
you're going to do every weekand for you it doesn't really
matter which day they fall on,but you know that those things
(18:58):
are going to happen and get done.
Yes, for some people where theyhave the kind of like okay,
monday is this Tuesday, is thislike Monday, is arms Tuesday is
back, whatever For them, I liketo have them set themes for each
day as well when, like, mondaymight be your planning day.
For some people who hateplanning, I also hate the idea
(19:18):
of like the word planning justleaves a bad taste in my mouth,
so I call it like list makingday.
I'm just going to look at all myaccounts.
I'm going to see what needs tohappen.
I'm going to make all my lists.
So Monday might be list makingday for my clients.
Tuesday might be like internalmeetings, wednesday is outreach.
Thursday is follow up, fridayis networking, whatever it might
be, but it's helpful to have atheme for each day if you're
(19:41):
that kind of a person, and forthe people who are more like, go
by their gut intuition.
They have the hardest time inthe corporate world because the
corporate world doesn't valueyou using your gut intuition.
But those people are some ofthe most successful people that
I've ever worked with.
So, giving yourself permissionto know that like and this is
similar to how you work too oflike you don't need to have a
(20:03):
set structure of when you'redoing things, but to have the
trust in yourself that you'regoing to get it done, and
allowing yourself thevariability and the variety of
giving yourself that.
Because, for some people,having a structure and knowing
what you're going to do everyday feels so.
It feels like there's so muchfriction, it feels like you're
trying to put me in a box that Idon't fit in.
I need variety, I need, I needthe variability, and so for
(20:26):
those people, it can be really,really freeing to just trust I'm
going to get it all done andI'm going to show up today and
decide what it is I'm going towork on today, and I don't need
to worry about trying toconstrain myself.
So I want to talk about yourvariable start time.
Everybody tells you that youshould time box your work.
What time is you have your listof tasks and you take your first
(20:48):
task and you schedule it onyour calendar.
And you take your second taskand you schedule everything on
your calendar.
You time block so you set asidea time for it.
I have done this for myself asan entrepreneur.
I've had my business for almosteight years now and I'd be very
thoughtful about when's thebest time for me to record my
podcast and I'd be like Tuesdayat 1.30 would be a perfect time
for me to record my podcast.
Inevitably, tuesday at 1.30happens, the calendar invite
(21:11):
pops up time to record yourpodcast and I would be like
don't tell me what to do.
Michelle Gauthier (21:18):
Who are you to tell me what I have?
Amber Deibert (21:19):
to do.
Just because you told me I haveto do it means I don't want to
do it.
I'm like you're the one whodecided this, amber.
It's ridiculous.
So for some of us, time boxingis not the right tactic for us,
and that's okay.
You can try instead.
Or maybe you set aside, likeduring these two hours this is
my administrative time and Iknow I have these five tasks
(21:42):
that I need to get done andanother really helpful tool is
to decide in advance how longyou'll let yourself spend on a
task.
Oh, that's good, I know I couldprobably polish that
presentation for the next fourdays, but really I probably only
need 40 minutes to finish itoff.
Yes, so you can time box.
(22:04):
Just decide in advance how longyou'll give yourself to finish
that task, but then giveyourself the flexibility to work
on that task whenever it isthat you want to work on it yeah
, I love that.
Michelle Gauthier (22:14):
That's a great idea too.
So it's like a little bit ofstructure, but not 100%
structure, and I have yet tofind somebody of all I've had my
business for eight years tooand of all the clients that I've
had.
I always try to help my clientsfigure out.
How much structure do I like inmy day?
You?
know do you like 80% structure,20% structure, more creative
(22:34):
type jobs.
They usually like lessstructure, but they still need
some, and I have yet to findsomebody who's like I like 100%
structure.
I want to know what I'm doingevery minute of every day and
have it on my calendar, and Ifeel like most planning methods
are kind of that idea of thatyou have to do that in order to
be successful.
So I love that you're sayinghave that block, but then let
(22:55):
yourself be the boss of what youwork on first and how long
you're going to work on it.
Something I noticed is when myclients like, let's say, a
client, I'm seeing my client,Lauren on Wednesday at 11.
And if she texts me and says Ican't do that time this week,
I'm so sorry.
Is there any way you could doMonday at 12?
To me that is like a non-ask.
(23:16):
I don't care at all.
Like I've got my working hours,I want to see her during the
week.
It doesn't make any differenceto me what day or what time she
shows up on my schedule and thathas never bothered me.
But I noticed that my clientsseem to feel really bad about it
.
And you're helping me realizethat it's just like my workouts,
like I don't care when arm dayis, I just care that I'm doing
(23:38):
arm day.
I don't care what time I seeLauren, I just care that I'm
seeing Lauren.
So that's really eye opening tome about why that seems to
really matter to other peoplebut it really doesn't matter to
me?
Amber Deibert (23:51):
Yeah, because they might be like, arm day is
Monday.
Michelle Gauthier (23:52):
Yes, that is very true.
That's probably exactly whatshe would say about herself.
Amber Deibert (23:56):
So, talking about the different variables that I
like to look at, one last funnyvariable is I like to look at
what clothes you like to wearand also any food or drink.
Some of these matter to peoplewhen they exercise.
Some of these don't matter topeople when they exercise.
And just if it does matter toyou like, if you have a
particular outfit that you liketo wear when you exercise.
(24:18):
It might be really helpful foryou to have a particular outfit
that you wear when you work.
It kind of sets your brain andtells you that you're in that
environment of, like it's worktime.
Yeah, if you might reallybenefit from listening to
particular music when you workas well.
Michelle Gauthier (24:33):
I do make myself the same drink, like this
pre-workout mix, and I put itin the same cup with a certain
amount of ice and water anddrink that and bring it into the
gym with me.
I would hate to work outwithout that.
I forgot it the other day and Ihad to buy a little packet of
it when I got there.
I still brought the cup with theice, but I couldn't find the
actual powder.
So that is like a big thing tome and I think it's like my
(24:56):
brain and my body's way ofsaying okay, now we're getting
ready to work out this this iswe're starting.
Amber Deibert (25:01):
Yeah, it might be really interesting to
incorporate that into your worktime as well.
Yeah whether it's a particulardrink or a particular snack or
something that you have at yourdesk.
It's all these really smallthings that can cue our body.
That it's work time, yeah.
So for me I use music.
I have a particular playlistthat I only listen to when I'm
(25:23):
doing deep, focused work.
Michelle Gauthier (25:25):
Oh interesting.
Amber Deibert (25:26):
I love listening to Hans Zimmer.
Michelle Gauthier (25:28):
He's a music?
Yeah, I was gonna say does ithave words, or is it just like
yeah, that's a great thought.
Amber Deibert (25:36):
Never.
So then your brain is like okay,this, this means we're doing
deep work, exactly, and becauseI only listen to that music when
I'm doing deep work.
Now, as soon as I hear thatfirst song, I listen to
Inception, and so as soon as Ihear that first song, it's like
my brain is like okay, we'refocused now.
Another thing that I'm doing isI'm learning about how we tend
(25:57):
to use different literalgeographic spaces in our home
for the wrong things.
So we're working where weshould be eating, or we're
scrolling where we should besleeping, or for me, I'm like
getting distracted where Ishould be working.
And so I'm experimenting withonly sitting at this desk when
I'm working and focused.
(26:18):
As soon as I get distracted,start doom scrolling like kind
of my attention fades.
I move away from my desk sothat it cues my body that when
I'm here I'm working.
And then I also, whenever I'mworking, I have a rule for
myself that I wear pants thathave a button and a zipper.
I love that because then itjust like nobody knows, I know
(26:43):
and it cues to me like this iswork time.
Michelle Gauthier (26:45):
Yes, oh my gosh, so many good things in
what you just said right there.
I think the idea of doing thewrong activities like activities
in the wrong place in our houseis a fascinating idea, and I
love the idea that if I need totake a break from work, that I
don't do it sitting at my desk,that I get up and go sit on my
couch if I want to scroll on myphone or switch to a different
(27:05):
area.
That's meant for that kind ofthing.
That is so cool, so many thingsthat you're teaching me.
I'm realizing.
Yeah, I do that, Like for meit's earrings.
When I'm going to work, I puton earrings, that's like my
indicator.
Yes, which are sitting on mydesk right now, because I can't
(27:30):
wear them.
With my big headphones that Iwear and I also fill up a big
pitcher of water and I have thatwith a glass and when I sit
down to work I always I feelkind of panicky if I don't have
that water sitting at my desk,like I couldn't walk into my
kitchen.
That's 10 feet away, but Ithink that is like okay, we're
starting to get down to like awhole day of work If there's a
full pitcher of water that meansI'm getting to a full day of
work.
So I really didn't even realizethat I was doing that, and I'm
going to proactively think aboutthe music one, because I don't
(27:51):
listen to music while I work.
The idea of listening tosomething like you're talking
about sounds fascinating.
Amber Deibert (27:56):
Yeah, it's different for everybody.
I had one of my clients justmessaged me yesterday.
He's like I got all my workdone.
I was listening to German beats.
I'm like I don't even know whatthat is.
That sounds great, or likeother people are.
Like it's trap music for me orlo-fi beats, or yeah, you can
really be strategic about it.
Michelle Gauthier (28:11):
Yeah, like whatever works for you.
And I think at my workout placewhen the music gets turned up
loud, that's when we're reallyworking out.
It's definitely an indicator,like when they're explaining the
workout or you're saying helloor whatever.
It might be on low, but thenwhen it gets loud, it's like
okay, now we're seriously doingit.
So I love the idea of doingthat at work too.
Amber Deibert (28:30):
Yeah, I'm going to try that, yeah, I have ADHD
and I've just got diagnosed ayear and a half ago and because
I teach productivity, so I'vebeen able to mask it for such a
long time.
But I was like, how come allthese things that work for other
people don't work for me?
And so I love what you'reteaching, michelle of like,
accept yourself, optimize foryou and who you are, and there's
(28:52):
always a lot of pushback withthis.
So like, well, you don'tunderstand, like I can't really,
because they expect me to besomething else and I need to
perform in a certain way inorder to be successful, and me
to be something else and I needto perform in a certain way in
order to be successful.
And I just love talking aboutthe other side of it, like okay,
let's imagine, michelle, youknow how you work best.
(29:13):
You've intuitively figured thisout for yourself.
But let's imagine that you tryto put yourself into somebody
else, someone else's box, andyou instead have to do the same
thing at the same time every day.
You have to have deep focus fortwo, three hours.
Michelle Gauthier (29:24):
No, I mean the opposite of productive, and
also I think it would make mehate a job that I actually love,
Like just that structure wouldbe enough to wreck it for me
much less a job you don't reallylike in the first place.
Amber Deibert (29:38):
Yeah, I had a client who was one of the top
salespeople.
It's really interesting workingwith salespeople because
there's literally a leaderboard.
He was one of the topsalespeople in his whole
organization and he works sofast and so efficiently.
It's just how he does it.
Same with his workouts reallyintense, super quick and so he
would get his work done in likethree hours.
(29:59):
But then he'd stay sitting athis desk because he was like
it's not okay to work threehours.
He was getting amazing resultsand working three hours, but
he's like you're supposed towork eight hours, so he would
just let himself sit at his deskand he would just deteriorate.
And I was like are you doinganybody a favor by letting
yourself deteriorate, get in aworse position, not manage your
(30:20):
energy by sitting at your deskfor eight hours?
Michelle Gauthier (30:23):
Everybody wins.
Amber Deibert (30:25):
when you optimize for your energy style and work
three hours a day, your team isnot complaining.
You're one of the topperforming people because,
you've optimized for how youwork best and we have to remove
all these shoulds and all thissocietal expectation of who we
think we should be, because it'sall 200 years old from the
industrial revolution.
(30:45):
What's most important to yourteam and your company is that
you are performing at your best.
Michelle Gauthier (30:52):
Yes, I agree, give yourself that permission.
This is such a good episode foreverybody to think about, for
themselves and then for thepeople who work for them, or
their kids or your spouse, youknow, to help them embrace the
way that they really are kind ofdesigned to work.
Is there one?
If somebody were to just makeone change or think about one
(31:15):
thing, what do you think is themost important?
Amber Deibert (31:18):
I actually would be interested.
If somebody is feelingoverwhelmed by this.
I would want to know, becausethe feedback that I usually get
when people learn this isthey're just like it turns on a
light bulb.
It unlocks something in them.
And I had somebody I do a freeworkshop on this every month and
I had somebody come to myworkshop and then email me a
week later and he was like hey,can I just talk to you about
what happened in the workshop?
I was like oh yeah, of course.
(31:39):
He was like hey, can I justtalk to you about what happened
in the workshop?
I was like oh yeah, of coursewe get on the call.
And he's like I just wanted totell you I got more out of that
workshop than I ever expected.
He's like I'm trying to not begenerous with this, but I think
that my productivity hasincreased 70%.
Michelle Gauthier (31:55):
Oh my gosh.
First of all, that's amazing,and the fact that the person
took the time to call you andtell you that that's so amazing.
Well, I think what happenssometimes is when we're because
most of my audience isoverwhelmed overachievers trying
their best at everything.
So sometimes something likethis that's a different way of
thinking can be like I've beendoing this wrong all along.
(32:16):
I haven't been doing the rightthings for myself.
How can I switch over?
I'm in a position where I'mthinking of, like where I used
to work, that we had callcenters and people had to work
certain hours and they didn'thave a lot of flexibility.
So that's why I'm thinking ifyou're not in a position, or if
you feel, like you've been doingit wrong this whole time what's
a?
different way they could do.
Amber Deibert (32:37):
Yeah, I'm going to again sort of answer your
question.
I want to just reiterate whatyou talk about, which is
accepting yourself.
For that person who's like,this sounds amazing, but I can't
do that because of theconstraints that I'm under.
I want to just reiterateeverybody wins when you are at
(32:57):
your best.
Let's imagine that you areworking in a way that doesn't
align with you and your energyand you burn out.
You don't benefit when you burnout.
Your team does not benefit whenyou burn out.
Your manager doesn't benefitwhen you burn out.
Your company doesn't benefitwhen you burn out.
Your family does not benefitwhen you burn out.
But let's imagine that you doset some small boundaries at
(33:21):
first, just small boundaries.
Start to protect your energy,start to work in a way that
aligns with you.
Who benefits?
You feel much better and nowyou're bringing your best self
to your work.
So your team is benefiting,your manager is happier because
you're performing better thanyou ever have before, your
company benefits from this andyour family benefits from this.
It feels so counterintuitiveand I don't understand why I'm
(33:47):
in the same boat of like.
No, there's no way that I cantake care of myself first, but
when you protect yourself andyour energy first and put
yourself in a position where youare operating at your best,
literally every person aroundyou wins.
Michelle Gauthier (34:03):
Yes, I love that.
I think that's perfect, becausethe way that you are and I'm
talking to everyone listening isright, Like the whatever it is
that you are, it's.
There's nothing that's wrong.
And if you go in with theassumption of accepting that and
knowing that it's right, thenyou can become this next level
(34:23):
version of yourself where you'rereally working in the way that
you prefer.
Oh my gosh, Amber, I could talkto you all day.
This is such a fascinatingtopic.
I absolutely love it.
Amber Deibert (34:33):
Can I give one more analogy for those people
who feel like they're just likebanging their heads against the
wall.
Michelle Gauthier (34:37):
Yes.
Amber Deibert (34:38):
I, for whatever reason, love to think of people
like plants.
So in my office here I've got abird of paradise it's like this
giant tropical plant and thenalso next to I've got a snake
plant the snake plant.
I don't have to water thisthing, like it could go for two
months and it will thrive.
It's also really far from thelight source and it's just like
doing its thing.
It's having a great time overhere.
(34:58):
Meanwhile, the bird of paradiseneeds water, like every couple
days, like I live in a desertand so this thing.
I really love my tropicalplants, but it is not thriving
here.
It needs water all the time,and I think about people the
same.
Let's imagine, like thisbeautiful tropical plant versus
a cactus.
Is the cactus wrong for needingless water?
Michelle Gauthier (35:22):
No.
Amber Deibert (35:23):
Like there are people out there who are like
you know what, I don't need tocollaborate as much as other
people.
I want you to give me theassignment and trust me to do it
and I will take care of it.
Versus, maybe there's atropical plant out there that
needs a lot of water, and arethey wrong for needing a lot of
water and support?
Absolutely not.
But what I find is, if you'renot thriving in your workplace,
it might be that you're just inthe wrong environment.
(35:45):
It might you just need morewater?
And the desert's not a badenvironment for cactuses, but
it's not great for tropicalplants, and so just knowing who
you are and what you need can bethe biggest unlock to finding
the success that you're lookingfor.
Michelle Gauthier (35:58):
I love that.
That is such a great analogy.
I too have lots of plants in myoffice and I'm thinking about
this yeah.
They're different.
It's another perk of having thewater on my desk all the time.
If somebody looks like theyneed some water, I can give them
some water.
Oh, that's amazing.
Amber Deibert (36:13):
I love it.
Michelle Gauthier (36:14):
Okay, I have to ask you two more questions,
the questions I ask every gueston the show, and the first one
is what do you do if you feeloverwhelmed to feel better?
What's your go-to strategy?
Amber Deibert (36:23):
I feel overwhelmed all the time with
ADHD and my go-to strategy istwo things.
Number one I need to make mytasks more clear.
To me overwhelm happens when Ieither something feels too big,
like I can't even do it, or it'sjust like too confusing.
I don't even have the braincells to figure out what's
(36:44):
happening here.
Number one I add clarity.
Rather than writing outpresentation on my task list,
like what actually needs tohappen with this presentation?
Is it finish the presentation?
Is it review the presentation?
Is it add photos to thepresentation?
So, number one, I add clarityand make it really easy for my
caveman brain to read it andknow exactly what needs to
(37:05):
happen with just one brain cell.
The second thing I do is I breakdown my tasks much smaller.
You can break down your tasksas small as you want.
Sometimes, when I'm reallyhesitating to do something and
I'm procrastinating, like makinga presentation, let's say I'll
say, like step number one, loginto Canva.
And I write that on my task listand do you know the dopamine
hit I get from crossing that off?
(37:27):
Yes, I do.
Yeah, you can break them up assmall as you want and make them
as easy as you want, andsometimes just getting the
inertia going and making themsuper clear and super small to
the point that I just want tocherry pick every task, like
well, I can log into Canva, likewatch me go.
Yes, cross that a point that Ijust want to cherry pick every
(37:49):
task.
Michelle Gauthier (37:49):
Like well, I can log into Canva, like watch
me go, yeah, cross that off, geta dopamine hit.
The next one is like brainstormideas like well, I can do that,
like watch me go, absolutelygreat, it feels like in order to
treat overwhelm, you just haveto keep making it smaller and
smaller until you get to thefeeling of oh, that's totally
doable, I can do that okay, andthen second question is what is
something that you do toconsistently save yourself time
or just do less?
So lately, it's AI.
(38:09):
Tell us how you use AI.
Amber Deibert (38:11):
I use AI for everything.
So I use typically ChatGPT andCloud.
Cloud tends to be better.
I create a lot of content.
Cloud tends to be more helpfulwith content, but I use it for
everything.
I use it for helping write aresponse to an email.
I use it for if I'm feelinglike those times when you just
want to write an angry response.
I write my angry response in AIand I say can you make this
(38:34):
nice?
Yes, can you make this likekind and considerate, but I
still get the benefit of likegetting all my emotions out.
Yes, I use it to plan out whatI'm doing.
I use it to answer questions.
I would use it to learn things.
I mean, I've automated a fewthings.
So there's like I'll record avoice note and then it will
automatically go through thisprocess and then it will output
(38:57):
a LinkedIn post for me based onwhat I said.
Exactly.
Michelle Gauthier (39:01):
Oh, that's amazing.
That's a great one.
Yes, okay.
So if you're not using AI, Ihave a feeling hopefully
everybody's used chat GPT alittle bit, but it is amazingly
helpful.
That is great, that's a greatanswer, and I really think
you're the first person to saythat.
Amber Deibert (39:14):
So thank you.
Michelle Gauthier (39:16):
Yes, thank you so much for sharing your
time and knowledge with us.
This is so great.
So you mentioned that you do afree workshop once a month.
Can you tell us about that?
And then just anything else, ifpeople want to follow you, you
said you're mostly on LinkedIn.
Give us all the scoop.
Amber Deibert (39:31):
Yes.
So if you have any questions,if you have any feedback, if
this was interesting for you,like, please reach out.
I love hearing from people.
You can come find me onLinkedIn just search Amber Diver
D-E-I-B-E-R-T.
You can come join my freeworkshop and get personalized
coaching on your workout style.
I go through the same processand I give people feedback,
exactly like I've given youtoday, michelle.
I'm like, okay, if you're thatkind of person, here would be a
(39:53):
technique that would be reallygood for you.
You can go to mentalmasterycomslash free workshop to sign up
for that.
Michelle Gauthier (39:59):
Okay, thank you so much.
I really appreciate your time.
I really enjoyed the interviewmyself.
Thank you for giving mepersonalized coaching.
Slash being a guest on thepodcast Amazing.
Amber Deibert (40:13):
Thank you so much .
Michelle Gauthier (40:15):
Thank you for listening to the Overwhelmed
Working Woman podcast.
If you want to learn more aboutmy work, head over to my
website at michellegauthiercom.
See you next week.
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