Ep. 267 - A Good Loser is Still a Loser and Other Useless Idioms

One of the most common yet destructive ideas in sports is that “a good loser is still a loser.” The language we use around winning and losing shapes our pickleball mindset. Listen in and learn how to replace harmful narratives with a healthier, more balanced approach to competition—one that strengthens both your game and your joy.  

Show Notes: https://betterpickleball.com/267-a-good-loser-is-still-a-loser-and-other-useless-idioms

Episode Transcript

(00:05):
Hello and welcome to Pickleball Therapy,the podcast dedicated to
your pickleball improvement.
I hope you're having a great week.
This week, we're going to tacklea very interesting subject.
It's a subject that'snear and dear to my heart.
It's actually a difficult subject totry and get our arms around because
the other side of the argumentis so pervasive, as you'll see.

(00:31):
I think youhave a lot of reactions to this episode, I
believe, because it's a very difficultarea, again, to navigate successfully.
But it's an area that I believe if wenavigate it successfully,
we'll develop much healthierengagement with this sport

(00:53):
as well as other activitiesthat we engage with in life.
If you've had a chance to read some of thebook we just published,
Pickleball Therapy, the Book.
The conversation in there about the lizardbrain is particularly relevant to
what we're talking about today.
I'm not going to dive into the lizardbrain too much, but if you've read the
book and you understand those pieces thatare just hardwired into these hardwired

(01:15):
circuits, you'll hear how some of thelanguage that we use
to talk about success in sportsemanates from this way that we're wired.
Here's the thing, we'reactually just wired this way.
It's difficult to overcome it, but you canbecause your ascension being, you have a

(01:39):
very powerful brain, and you can use thatbrain to work through some of
these words that you hear, ideas that willbe expressed that at first blush,
you're like, Oh, yeah, that makes sense.
But then once you'd go a littledeeper, you're like, Wait a minute.
Maybe it's not everythingthat it sounds at the outset.

(02:02):
As we dive into the episode, I wanted tolet you know that the book is available.
It's available right now in a digitaldelivery, which is a PDF, but
you can get an early copy of it.
If you'd rather wait for apaperback edition or a Kindle edition,

(02:25):
those will be coming out shortly.
But I highly recommend the book to you.
The folks who've read it so far,it's really resonated with them.
I think it's having an impact, and wewrote it for that purpose to help you
with your perspective in the sport.You can go to betterpickleball.
com and there's a link on top, so you canget that if that's something
of interest to you.
Also, I want to let you know that we'vejust added a whole bunch of

(02:45):
camps to our camp schedule.
We have one in December here.
The ones that I'm talkingabout are in Florida.
There's a couple in Arizona in Februarythat CJ is going to do out there.
It'll be really good if you're out WestCoast or want to visit
Arizona or want to see CJ.
Those are all three great reasonsto sign up for those camps.
If you want to come to the East Coast andto Tampa, particularly over the winter

(03:08):
months, we have some December, January,February, and March, I believe, dates.
If you are a If you've been to a campbefore or if you've been to TPS student
for a couple of rotations, you can come tothe graduate camp if you choose to do so.
We have our Better Pickleball camp, whichbasically covers a ton of pickleball using

(03:29):
the pickleball system concepts, and thenthe graduate camp, which is available if
you've been to one of our campsalready, because we go deeper.
You always keep on going deeperin this part, as you know.
All right, let me tee this up for you.
This came from one ofour students named Craig.
Craig, really appreciateyou sending this in.
This is in our Better Pickleballcommunity, our online community.

(03:53):
It's a learning mindset, and it talksabout, basically, I'll paraphrase it for
you, but it's about listening and readingto our views on having a learning mindset
and not getting too down on yourself,learning plateaus, expecting not
to master new things right away, don'tjudge how you're playing based on whether
you're going to lose, all of those things.

(04:13):
And it rang a bell with Craig, right?
So that's good.
We're making a connection on this.
It's registering, which is great.
But there's the pushback, not from Craigdirectly, but from what's around him.
So he watched a video on Netflix about theDallas Cowboys in the early
'90s and quarterbacks today.
And then basically,the documentary was all about

(04:37):
the win-win-win mentalitythat surrounds that world.
So quotes like, You're no better thanyour win-loss records as you are.
A good loser is a loser.
I strive for perfection all the time.
I realize I probably will not achieveperfection, but if I fall short,

(04:58):
my play will be excellent.
Winning is great, losing sucks.
I want my teammates all accountable orcalled out when they don't play well.
And then he says, I'm not advocatingthat we do any of this or suggesting that
your advice is not sound,but he wants to basically...
How do you reconcile these positions?
You're hearing from me amessage that says, Do your best.

(05:21):
Improve.Continue to advance your game.
I'm not saying you to throw in the towelwhen you're playing or go out on the court
and say you're going to lose,but you lose.
That's a fact.
If you're playing at level, you'regoing to lose at a 50/50 proposition.
So what we're trying to work is, how do weblend those two ideas of, I'm still going

(05:42):
to compete and give my best,but at the same time, I understand that
losing is a part of this, and I'mnot going to bring myself down too much
because of a loss that happens, whichagain, will happen when you play.
What's interesting about this, and again,I already thank you, Craig, but thanks for

(06:03):
framing this, is this is something thatI've been wrestling with for a number of
years, trying to find the right way toexplain what I would suggest you as a more
balanced, a more rational way ofengaging with the sport, including how we

(06:23):
go into it and then how we respond to iton the other end, when we're done with the
day of playing or a tournament, oranything else that you're doing.
When you want to have your results,how do you deal with those inputs?
Missing shots, popping theball up, all these things.
How do we deal with that as wenavigate through pickleball?

(06:44):
The quotes that I read to you, the onesthat Craig included in this comment,
what's interesting is it's basically howwe, as a society and as individuals, have
chosen to frame Athletic performance,sport, engagement with sport.
It's basically shorthand.

(07:05):
It's quick hitters, things like a goodloser, still a loser, losing sucks, right?
And they stick.They're easy.
And this is where the Lizard Our brainlatches on to that and
goes, Yeah, can't lose.Losing bad.
Let's move on.
And we're hardwired thatway, as I mentioned earlier.
But we're still sentient beings,possessed with the ability to examine

(07:26):
these sound bites, tosee if they make sense.
So what What I'm going to do in thisepisode is I'm going to
walk through some different ideas, somedifferent ways of perhaps
exposing some of the weaknesses in thesetypes of sound bites, and then
see if these resonate with you and helpyou perhaps avoid some of the

(07:48):
instant gratification of you, the instantfeeling of like, Yeah, that makes sense.
When we hear something like...
Basically, it's theRicky Bobby idea, right?
Either your first placeor your last place.
Those are the two choices, which there'sanother one that I've heard that says
basically, second place is still a loser,basically, in the whole

(08:11):
tournament, because you didn't win.
So by definition, you're a loser, whichI'm going to get that in a little bit when
we talk about thebaseball this season, because I was going
to include it in the RIF, but I decidedto bake it into the episode itself.
But we'll get to that in a second.
So let's talk about first,let's look at this thing.
Let's look at the phrases in terms of,does saying or thinking these words,

(08:33):
does it help you?
There's a natural suggestion in here, andCraig intimates this in his comment, which
is basically that it must help because thewinners are saying So the successful
quarterback, the successful team, thesuccessful player is saying,
well, winning is first or last.

(08:55):
It's I got to win, basically.So it must work.
But Think about that for a second.
What do you think the losing team inthose contests said to themselves?
What do you think the losing player in atennis match or in a pickleball match
or in a contest said to him or herself?

(09:15):
Probably the same words, same exact words.
This is not exclusive to thewinners are saying these things.
They're all saying these things.
It just happens that some of those arewinning because you're going
to have a winner and a loser.
So if both the winner the winner and theloser are saying abracadabra, and then the
winner wins, it doesn't mean thatabracadabra was the key to the winner

(09:36):
winning, because the loseralso said abracadabra.
So there's no real relationship betweenthe words that are being said and the
results that results are we getting.
So when both the winner and the loser aresaying the same thing,
then we probably shouldn't draw any causalconnection between this type of mentality,
these type of words,and the success of one of the sides

(10:00):
Because, again, the other side, thelosing side, said the exact same thing.
So that's one way of maybethinking about this in terms of...
Because we're assigning value to it, tothese words, because they're being
shared with us by the winner.
But the loser said the same thing.
So it probably doesn't have theeffect that we think it does.

(10:22):
So next thing, second is,what do the words really say?
What are we really sayingwhen we say these things?
So there's that one I'm saying you're nobetter than your win-loss
record says you are.
Now, this is classical circular reasoning.
Now, a win-loss record, so I've won20 games and lost five games or

(10:42):
whatever it is, is a data set.
So it's fact.It's just the thing.
I've won this many and lost this many.
So to saythat your record cannot be better or worse
than whatever the numbers are,not really saying anything.
It's just circular.Regular.
But here's the tricky part.
Here's where I thinkit gets a little bit...

(11:07):
It's what we're interpreting it.
So what we're saying iswe're reading into it.
We're not reading record,which is what it says.
You're no better thanyour win-loss record.
We're reading it as we, as humans, asathletes, are no better
than our win-loss record.
Now, I don't know about you, but I don'tplan on reducing my existence on this

(11:27):
planet or my engagement with the sport ofpickleball into a data set of wins and
losses, particularly not when if youunderstand the reality of the sport at
pretty much every level of play, except atthe extreme top
or extreme bottom, I guess.
But let's focus on the extreme top becausethat's what we're talking about here.
I'm not talking about here, but atmost levels of play, it's 50/50.

(11:51):
So you should have eventually2022 wins and
1,999 Define losses, roughly 50/50, right?
Or maybe the tell me around.
Still be 50/50, roughly.
So it's no reason to defineyourself based on this 50/50.
It doesn't make any sense.

(12:13):
Sothe first thing is to say you're
definitely a better personthan just a number in terms of
wins and losses in a pickleball.
It doesn't define you, and it doesn'teven define you as a pickleball player.
So do this for a second, right?
Think for a second about the 50th bestpro in pickleball, man or woman, right?

(12:37):
Pick him or her.
50th best pro in the tour, okay?
Now, is that player anamazing pickleball player?
Just an outstanding pickleball athlete?
I think so, right?
They're amazing.
An amazing pickleball player.
Now, their pro recordis not going to be great.

(13:01):
Their pro record, their PPA Tourtournament record, is probably
going to be under 50 % wins.Probably.
Does that make them nota good pickleball player?
I mean, that's just nonsense, right?
That the 50th best pickleball player onthe planet is not a good pickleball player
because they have a losing recorddoesn't make any sense to me.

(13:25):
And this leads into the third one, whichis, are Are we living
in an environment now?
We're going to set ourselves up for anenvironment where satisfaction
is reserved for one player?
Now, you can look at it like one player inthe world, if you want to look at it that
way, becauseno matter who you are, there's a better

(13:45):
player than you unless your name is BenJohns as a male player or Analee
Waters as a female player.
There's some sub-neichesin singles and stuff.
But in doubles, unless your name is one ofthose two names,
they're better players than you.Okay?
And so that's a world in which there'sonly one player on the men's side and one
player on the women's side that can lookin the mirror and go like, I am what my

(14:08):
win-loss record says, the best, right?
And even if you look at it in terms ofyour community or your tournaments and
stuff like that, it's just such a limitingway of playing and engaging with the
sport, I would say, wherethere has to be only one.
It's either I win everything orthere's a problem, I guess, right?

(14:28):
There's a deficiency inme and my pickleball.
Here's where I wanted to talk a little bitabout baseball, because I happen to be
following the Mariners in the playoffs,not because I'm a big baseball fan, but a
good friend of mine, Jim Ramsey,who's the data analyst at the PPA.
He and I were chatting about pickleballstatistics and things like that.
I knew his background was in doingbaseball statistics, so I just asked

(14:51):
him, was it the beginning of the play?
I'm like, Who you got?
He's like, he didn't say the Dodgers areprobably going to be the team to beat,
so he may still be right about that.
But then I asked him, Okay, give meHe goes, You know what?
I think the Maritors.
He goes, the Mariner's are an interestingstory based on their history, based
on Cal, based on all these things.
And so theyhad some tough battles, and they made it

(15:12):
through to the conference series,I think it's called in baseball.
And they lost inthe deciding seventh game against the
Toronto Bluejays, who rolled the New YorkYankees, historically powerhouse team.
So tough.
And they lost like 4-3in the seventh game.
That's about as good as it gets.

(15:34):
If you think about it, go to seven games,you have to play them at home because they
had a better record during the season, andyou lose four to three in their home in
the seventh game, and you get knocked out.
And the way that in the interview withthe catcher Cal was that it was a failure.
And that's unfortunate.
It doesn't mean you haveto be happy about not...

(15:57):
You wanted to win, right?
And you were doing your best to try andwin that game, as were the Blue Jays.
And the cookie didn't crumblein that way in that game.
And so you lost 4-3against a very good team.
And I think feeling it being a failure Tome, it's unfortunate because it robs the

(16:19):
player of a biggerperspective of what happened.
Again, it doesn't mean you have to belike, I got everything I wanted,
but can't we have, going back tothe bowl of ice cream, that idea.
Man, you made it.
You're one of four teams leftstanding at the end of the season.
Every other team is at home watching you,I guess, or doing whatever

(16:40):
they're doing, right?
So you're one of four teams,actually three teams at that stage
because the Dodgers already eliminated.I think it was the Brewers.
So you had the two teams left in yourconference that you were playing, you and
the Blue Jays,and you lose in the seventh game.
I mean, that's phenomenal.
Phenomenal applause to you for yourgreat season and a great payoff.

(17:02):
But again, capping that as afailure to me, it's unfortunate.
It's unfortunate that these young athletesare trained to process that way
because it doesn't change anything.
It's not like if he understood things, hada little bit of perspective,
a little broader perspective.
It's not like they're notgoing to play their hearts out.

(17:23):
It's not like they're notgoing to do their best to win.
But at the moment of losing that game,those athletes enter in a better position
to process that information moreconstructively and not feel so negative
about what was objectively agreat season for him and the team.
Anyway, that's just a better way ofthinking about it than just preserving it
for this idea that there's only one playerwho's entitled to feel good about

(17:46):
themselves because they're the onlyones that, I guess, nobody can beat.
Let's go back a minute to the wordsmeaning something and talk about
winning is great, losing...
I think it's losing sucksor losing still sucks.
Think about that for a second, too.
It sounds awesome.
Winning is great, losing sucks.
But what are we talking about?
Take a 4-5 team against a 3-5team, and the 4-5 team wins.

(18:12):
Is that winning great and losing, sucking?
Winning great for the 4-5 team,losing second for the 3-5 team?
I think the answer is no on both sides.
So it just doesn't really add anything.
And then you go back tothe 50-50 win-loss ratio.
And if you have this idea that winning isgreat and losing sucks, then you're going
to feel great half the time andsuck half the time, I guess.

(18:33):
That's just not a way that I want toengage in the sport, and I don't think
that really makes senseif you think about it.
Why not instead frame your performance,how you played, based on how you played?
Not the results, but how you played.
Did you give your best?
Did you try your best whenyou were playing out there?

(18:53):
That doesn't mean you made every shot.
That's nonsense, because even thebest players miss a lot of shots.
It's just instead Instead of looking at itlike, I won, so I feel good, I lose, so I
feel bad, it's, I played to my ability andhow I felt that day and everything else
within a range that I'm good with,whatever the results are, the results are.

(19:14):
No big deal, as opposed topinning so much on the results.
Because, again, winning is great, losingsucks, doesn't really add anything to the
conversation, from my perspective, otherthan just sounding cool
and a little sound bite.
Then, fifth, I want totalk about the words here.
They We get some conflation going on here,and I want to use one in particular here

(19:34):
about teammate accountability.
So the phrase was, I want my teammates,quote, held accountable or, quote,
called out when they don't play well.
So I want my teammates held accountableor called out when they don't play well.
Now, to me, what this means, and here'swhat I think this means,

(19:54):
and what it should mean, even if itdoesn't, is
I want my teammates to give their all.
I want my teammate to give theirbest effort in that contest.
I'm going to give my best effort.
I want my teammate to do so, whether we'replaying on a five-person basketball team,
11-person football side, nine players, I'mpretty sure, on baseball, or two

(20:18):
players in a doubles pickleball court.
And as long as the effort is there,it's not the result, guys.
And it shouldn't be the result becauseyour partner is going to miss shots,
and you are going to miss shots.
So if you evaluate it based on you misseda shot, then it's not

(20:38):
going to be constructive.
If you frame it based on,Hey, you didn't even go for the shot.
You didn't even go for the ball,then that's a different conversation.
I'll give you one example.
There are times when you'll see playerswho there's a ball that's popped up by a
teammate, and theirpartner will just give up.
Will basically put theirpaddle down or turn around.

(20:59):
Okay, Okay, you want to havea word with your partner then?
I have no problem with that.
But if the ball's popped up and yourpartner is trying their best to dig it out
and they don't dig it out or they don'tcontrol it, what's their complaint about?
Even if you generate a pop-up by youropponent and your partner goes to get it
and just misses the shot, you thinkthey were trying to miss the shot?

(21:20):
Nothing to get upset about there.
And that's where there's a conflationbetween,
I want my teammates held accountable orcalled out when they don't play well.
What we're talking about there isthe effort given, not the result.
And that's where the conflation comes in.
And what I wrote down here, a note that Iwrote down here, is that if you're playing
in a competitive setting, so you signed upfor a tournament, you've agreed to play

(21:43):
with someone in a tournament or in aleague, something a series like that,
then you and your partner should eachexpect the other to give your best
because you've signed up for that.
I don't think it's the same standard whenyou're an open player, rec player, having
a nice time on the pickleball court.
I think that's a different world.
But if you're playing competitively andyou've agreed to do it, you've said, I'll
sign up for a tournament with you, then Ithink it's reasonable for your partner to

(22:05):
expect the best of you to give your bestand for you to expect
them to give their best.
So I think that's pretty reasonable, butit's not based on results
again or winning the rallies.
And this now gets us to this properframing that I think is a better way to
couch your thinking about yourself as aplayer rather than in getting away from

(22:28):
this, winning is great losing sucks, orany of those types of ideas,
is that the way that an athlete at anylevel, whether at your level or at the
highest pro level, succeedsis through their process.
It's not because of some magic words thatthey say or repeat, like Abracadabra, or

(22:51):
I'm going to win, or whatever.
That's not how the athletesultimately are successful.
They're successful because of process.
They're successful because they know howto do the things that are necessary to
play their sport andperform in their arena well.
And the better they get at that process,the better they perform, and the better

(23:14):
they perform, the higherthe chance that they win.
Kobe Bryant was one of the best basketballplayers of all time, and there was
this thing called the Mamba mentality.
They call him the Black Mamba.
The The Mamba mentality wasbasically like, he's a killer.
He's getting the zone, and hedoes his thing, and whatever.

(23:36):
But here's the thing.
The Mamba mentality wasn't just some wordsthat he repeated to himself and got
into the zone or something like that.
The Mamba mentality was about him gettingup at 4: 00 in the morning, going to the
gym, and practicing harder than any otherplayer on the team, even when
he was the star of the team.
That's how he developed the Mambamentality, because

(23:56):
he had thrown up so many shots that heknew that when he threw up the shot the
way he wanted to throw itup, it was going to go in.
Had a high chance of going in.
That's how he performed at a high level,not because of some voodoo words
that he was uttering to himself.
That doesn't make any sense.
And so process and giving your best,it's how you improve.

(24:21):
It's through process andjust trying your hardest.
Giving your best, that's how you improve.
And that's how you give yourself the bestchance for success when you're
out there on the pickleball court.
And if you go out thereand you give your best
and you still lose, that does not suck.

(24:41):
That is just a natural part of the sportthat you have chosen to play, the sport
that you've chosen to fall in love with.
And it's frankly the part of any sportthat's competitive in nature
that you will ever play.
And it is nothing more than that,and it's nothing less than that.
It's simply you giving your bestand winning or losing is

(25:03):
the result of that process.
Period.Full stop.
So hopefully this helps, Craig, and helpsyou better process this information that
you receive from society,it's unavoidable.
It's out there.

(25:23):
Most of the books that I see aboutthe mental side of, not just pickleball,
the mental side ofsport, most of the words that you hear,
like the ones that Craig shared with usfrom that Netflix documentary, are all
couched in terms of, Wecongratulate you if you won.
We don't have anything to say to you, orYou should feel disappointed

(25:45):
or failure if you lose.
And there's no other option.
I believe that as,again, sentient human beings with rational
minds, we can find a way to navigate sportthat is healthier for you, more
constructive, and does not take away fromyour competitive fire, your wanting to

(26:08):
give it all and to do the best you canevery time you step out
on the pickleball court.
I know we went a little bit long on thispodcast, but this is a subject that
merited some additional discussion,some additional consideration.
I hope you enjoyed this episode.
Remember to check out the book.
If you're so inclined,go to betterpickleball.
com.
We'll put a link downin the show notes, too.
But if you go to betterpickleball.com, you'll see it up at the top.

(26:33):
I believe there's a buttonyou can click on there.
And remember to rate and reviewthe podcast if you have a moment.
And as always, share it with your friends,because if you enjoy the
podcast, they probably will, too.
I hope you have a great week, and I'll seeyou on the next episode
of Pickleball Therapy.
Be well.