November 13, 2024 • 57 mins
What if optimal health started with a simple dietary shift? In this episode of the Primal Foundations Podcast, Jake Thomas, a former US Marine turned lifestyle coach, shares his transformative journey from a vegan bodybuilding diet to embracing the carnivore lifestyle. He also opens up about his mother's battle with osteoporosis and how strength training and diet changes turned her health around, shaping his coaching philosophy.
We dive into different dietary approaches, challenge conventional nutritional wisdom, and explore why critical thinking is crucial when interpreting diet studies—especially those linking red meat to cancer. Jake's story highlights how small changes in diet can create big shifts in health, performance, and well-being. Tune in for actionable insights on aligning diet, exercise, and mindset for a healthier life.
Connect with Jake:
https://www.instagram.com/lifelikejake/
https://lifelikejake.com/
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Website: Primalfoundations.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the Primal Foundations podcast.
I'm your host, tony Pascola.
We will dive into what Ibelieve are the four central
foundations you need for ahealthy lifestyle Strength,
nutrition, movement and recovery.
Get ready to unlock your pathto optimal health and enjoy the
episode.
Our guest today is Jake Thomas.
(00:27):
For the listeners who don'tknow, jake is a former US Marine
and now lifestyle coach throughhis marquee Life.
Like Jake and the host of thevery successful podcast Sick,
scared and Stupid, you can checkout Jake's background story on
his first appearance of thePrimal Foundations podcast in
episode 12.
Jake, welcome back to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Thanks, tony, it's good to be here, it's good to
see you again Talking off screen.
I said you're looking leaner,still smiling, so I don't want
to say meaner, but you lookleaner, noticeably leaner.
You've been doing somethingright, for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I always said I'm trying to be like you, boss.
Just shred it like a Juliansalad over there Last time, like
we actually did um while I wason your podcast, but even before
, like episode 12.
So you're like this is over ayear ago.
You're an OG for the primalfoundations.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yeah, man, that was a good time.
Uh, you know we were both stillkind of cracking into certain
spaces and spaces and trying tofigure things out and poke the
bear, so to speak.
You know, being part of thisresistance underground movement
that's still kicking, and thengetting to see you and meet you
for the first time in Austin atHack your Health, the event
through KetoCon, and you know Iremember laughing with you about
(01:39):
that and how you went to thesame barbecue place like three
days in a row, not for barbecuebut for steak.
You know, for people that don'tknow like steak, whole steaks
and like a ribeye in this caseis not something you normally
find at a barbecue shop or shack.
You know it's usually cuts ofbeef, pound of this, quarter
pound of that, whatever ribs andsausage and stuff like that.
But that one place in particulardowntown in Austin, cooper's,
(02:03):
and you were like dude, you gotto go to this place and get the
ribeye and I was like of coursethe outer towner is telling me
to go to the place downtown onCongress.
I'm like in my mind, I'm like,you know, that's like a tourist
trap right, like right there inthe heart of downtown and it's
talking about eat the words.
Like Cooper's is good barbecue,but like that ribeye is is
absolutely nailed out of thisworld.
So once I had it, I understoodwhy you went three days in the
(02:25):
rain.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah, I, we.
I have to credit James Liebenthe uh, the carnivorous cause he
went there before and he's likeyou gotta have the ribeye here.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
And I'm thinking the same thing.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
I'm like this isn't the downtown area?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
This is not like real Texas barbecue, but we get
there.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
And I was.
I was shocked.
I went back again with our boy,casey rough, and then he left
for the airport and I was likekind of waiting around town.
I'm like.
I texted him like guess whereI'm at.
He's like you're not atCooper's.
Again I go, yes, I'm atCooper's three times in a week.
A weekend, but it was definitelywell worth it.
It was super cool to meet.
(03:00):
Like doing podcasts is greatand you get to kind of have a
little bit connection, but likewe got to meet each other at
Pack your Health, we had a lot.
We got to eat, we got to hangout.
You know, when I walked inthere it was my first one.
So I see I just interviewedReynolds again.
Yeah, I saw him.
He's like the first person.
I always joke.
He's like the mayor of thatwhole thing, like everybody
(03:22):
knows him and I like hugging him.
I turn around, I see you andthen I see casey, then I see
james.
I'm like thought this is great,like it's just super cool, um,
to get like all thoselike-minded people in there and
to just, you know, rub elbowswith each other, talk to
somebody new, talk to somebodythat you know, you, you've been
(03:42):
wanting to talk to.
There's like people, there'sheroes there for everybody.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
So it was just a really great experience.
Yeah, I had a blast man and and,uh, I was fortunate to bring my
mother, who you met, and it's abig deal for me because she is
a big reason why I got into thiswhole thing in the first place.
You know, my seven years ago mymother was given this really
dismal osteoporosis.
(04:06):
I don't know.
I should say let me rephrasethat she got a really bad bone
density scan score, like she hadvery negative bone density
scores and so her osteoporosishad really kind of taken over.
And her doctor who administeredthe exam and kind of gave her
the prognosis after the fact waslike you know, you're, you're
really not looking good.
(04:27):
I'd give you about a year tolive.
Now I believe how that wasinterpreted, or how he meant it
to be, was like if you took afall or if you had a break of
some kind, it would really bebad for you, given the state of
your bone density right now.
I mean, she was, I want to sayshe was like minus four or
something around there, likereally really.
And she was, I want to say shewas like minus four or something
around there, like reallyreally in a bad spot, definitely
in the critically red area.
(04:47):
And so when my mother, you know, when your mother tells you
like hey, I was given a year tolive, and I'm like what?
Like, like, hey, I've got somebad news.
I've got some some pretty heavynews.
My doctors gave me a year tolive.
Based on that, you don't evenhear the dot, dot, dot, dot dot,
you don't even hear the dot,dot, dot, dot, dot part.
All you hear is year to live.
And I was like whoa, whoa, holdon mom, like it sends off a lot
(05:09):
of alarms in your head andreally makes you come to the
moment of being afraid, you know, and I was like I can't lose my
mother right now, like I needyou mom, like I need you in life
.
And no, like denial, this can'tbe, does not compute, kind of
thing.
And then I started listeningand understanding the why behind
it and her in fact having thisvery serious case of
(05:32):
osteoporosis, and so that justput me on a mission of like what
can I do?
What can we do?
You know what's the remedy,what's the fix?
Like the Marine you know, youkind of mentioned that earlier
the Marine kicks into me andgoes like enemy, where you know,
search, find, kill, destroy.
Like what do we need to do tofix this problem, which is not
(05:52):
always the answer, but in thiscase I was definitely like
locate, close with and destroythe enemy, you know for sure.
And so I was alreadyexperimenting a lot with diets
and nutrition.
I've been competitively andprofessionally bodybuilding for
(06:12):
quite a while at this point, andwas doing various types of bro
dieting and if it fits yourmacros and standard American and
typical bodybuilding styledieting, and even gotten into
vegetarianism and veganism for acouple of years.
And veganism for a couple ofyears and, preceding her
diagnosis or prognosis, I'dstarted to get bips on carnivore
eating.
I'd done keto in the past.
So I started researching thecarnivore diet and I was through
(06:37):
a friend of mine.
He's like read this, watch this, listen to this.
And I was like, yeah, dude,I've done keto before.
And he's like no man, it's notketo.
No vegetables, no fruits, noavocados, no chocolate, no nuts.
Like just meat, just animals,fish, seafood, eggs.
I was like, all right, whateverman, I'll read, I'll watch, I
listen.
And I did and it made a lot ofsense.
You know I was not a vegan nora vegetarian for the ethics of
(07:00):
animals or for the environmentalconsciousness.
I dated a girl that was avegetarian.
She and I in turn became vegantogether.
That was my reasoning for that.
It was never about the twoother reasons as mentioned.
So for me it was actuallypretty easy to abandon veganism
and become a carnivore, so tospeak.
People hear that and they'relike, oh my God, you went from
vegan to carnivore.
Even though a lot of people dodo that, I was never having to
(07:22):
disassociate from some type ofmoral reason.
I did it, like I said, becausethis girl was dating, was a
vegetarian and we togetherexplored that plant-based world
and then became vegans together.
So the more I listened, themore I watched, the more I read,
the more I was curious.
And when I finally took thisfirst 30-day plunge into it, the
(07:44):
results to me were undeniablehow I felt, what I was able to
do with so little, so to speak,as a vegan bodybuilder.
I had, like, my pillbox.
Tony was like I can't even makethe dimensions of it, how big
it was.
I had five different doses foreach day and I had all seven
(08:05):
days.
So I had the five, the five boxby seven, so it's a 35 box,
right, and I had X amount ofpills per day.
So you know five times a day,whether I was taking this
supplement, this supplement,amino acid right Cause it
doesn't exist A couple othermicronutrients and minerals and
vitamins throughout the courseof the day five times, and some
other like bacterial cleansersand little droppers that I'm
(08:28):
doing things with.
On top of the other supplements,I'm taking protein powders,
amino acids, things that do notexist in the plant kingdom, that
you have to source outside ofit in order to create and get, I
should say, obtain, the macrosand micros that you want,
particularly as a bodybuilder oras a fitness model, where
you're trying to account forthose macros and the ratios that
(08:50):
you want them, but the factthat you do.
They don't exist in the naturalworld as a vegan.
So you have to have processedfoods, you have to have
supplements, whether it's thevitamins, the droppers, the
protein powders, whatever.
Add on top of that.
All the food is processed.
I was not a raw vegan, so I'meating tofu and tempeh and satay
(09:10):
and everything else that I canget to create protein with, but
at the same time, I'm usingsupplements and the vitamins to
get things in the ratios that Iwanted, all the while not
concerned or really aware of theheavy metals or the types of
mold or toxins that I'm beingexposed to through the
processing of all these thingsand I'm just like, oh, it's
(09:32):
vegan, it's good for me, cool,whatever.
When I went carnivore, all thatwent away.
No more pills no more.
No more.
You know five by seven vitaminbox and I was like damn, like I
was so proud of this thing.
It's cool, it's color coded,it's like my, it's like a
habitual thing.
(09:52):
No more of that, like that wasfirst.
No more droppers no more.
You know.
Scoops of amino acids no more.
Bcaas no more.
I mean amino acids, bcaas nomore.
Protein powders no more.
You know foods and wrapperspowders no more.
You know foods and wrappers and, like I said, tofu, tempeh,
satay, whatever eggs, steak,ground beef, bacon Like that was
(10:15):
what I ate pretty much forthose first 30 days where it was
a lot of steak, a lot of eggsand bacon and burgers, and I was
shocked yeah, that's whatyou're saying is because we get
this, a lot of people look toother people.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
They're like, well, so-and-so is vegan and they're
this or they're that or they'veachieved this.
It's really hard to do likeyou're saying, like not to say
that people can't do thosethings, but there is a lot of
supplementation.
Uh, it's a lot of extra workand things.
(10:46):
Again, if it's a moral thing oryou really think you're doing
it for your own health, whateverit may be, but there are
athletes out there, likeyourself at that moment in time,
where you wanted to do it veganor vegetarian.
But it is a lot of food andit's a.
You don't know where it'scoming from.
It's packaged, it's processedand there's so many supplements.
It is daunting.
I like just you talking about,like man, that's a lot of work.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yeah, yeah, and it is , it really is.
And you hit it well and saidlike it's not.
You know I don't want to sayright or wrong.
You know I don't want to bethat polarizing where I'm saying
it's right or it's wrong.
I'm just saying what I wentthrough, what I experienced, and
comparing the differences.
And if someone finds value inthat or they're able to relate
to that, cool.
But I'm explaining these thingsas they were, not how I
(11:30):
perceive them or what my opinionis.
But I was a vegan.
I was eating these things inorder to achieve the results I
wanted athletically.
I had to supplement because,again, these things did not
exist in the ratios that Ineeded them in in order to eat
and adhere to my macros.
Right, very specific.
Same thing in the if it fitsyour macros world.
(11:51):
Well, when you're not a vegan,you're wide open.
You can drink, you know,isopure 50 gram protein drinks
that have nothing else but thisliquefied protein, and you can
cheat and say, all right, I'mgoing to go eat a bunch of
Skittles and Sour Patch Kids andwatch a movie, and it'll still
fit in my macros.
Then I'll just down these eggwhites and whatever and it'll
work out.
It will and it can, becauseI've done it plenty of times.
(12:13):
I would eat Popeyes, oftentimesduring bodybuilding preps,
because people are like well,how do you do that?
I'm like, dude, you get the notthe fry, but the blackened
chicken strips.
Skip the sauces, get the dirtyrice with the green beans, skip
the mashed potatoes, skip thebiscuit.
There you go, there's your meal, there's your carbs, there's
your protein, there's yourvegetable for volume to fill you
(12:33):
up, and it works like a charm.
Now, you're not accounting forthe micros in there, the
vitamins that are going to beall out of whack because of the
processing and the inclusion ofthose synthetic versions of some
of those micronutrients.
So how you're going to feel isnot necessarily going to equate
to how good you might look.
But in this carnivore sense,which is the ultimate
(12:53):
elimination diet by way ofabsolute whole foods, whole,
complete, real, single foodsright, there's no ingredients to
them.
Eggs eggs are eggs, ground beefis ground beef ingredient.
You know, you, if it were evenin a package ground ingredients,
ground beef, you knowingredients.
Eggs, bacon, like okay, maybebacon.
(13:14):
You got to look forward to makesure there's no nitrates, no
extra additives and sugars andwhatnot, salts and different
spices, but for the most part,it's like ingredients ribeye,
steak ingredients, like you'reeating single ingredient foods
as opposed to foods made ofingredients, and that was huge
to me, huge aha moment.
Second one was, as a veganathlete, using the toilet a lot,
(13:37):
a lot of bathroom time, a lotof evacuation by way of I'm
thinking, well, it's because I'man athlete, my metabolism is
really high, I need to use thetoilet.
Thinking, well, it's becauseI'm an athlete, my metabolism is
really high, I need to use thetoilet three, four, five times a
day sometimes because I'm anathlete.
No, dude, that's all waste,that's all discard, that's all
what cannot be utilized oringested.
(13:58):
Thus it has to be discarded.
You know, just thinking about,like fiber and the types of, you
know, soluble versusnon-soluble fiber, and things
that can be ingested and brokendown as opposed to things that
can only be discarded.
So, consuming all those thingsmy body is extracting, having to
really particularize the foodsit's ingesting in order to
extract these little bits ofnutrients.
(14:19):
So all this stuff would comeinto it and the digestive system
is having to go.
Okay, just this and all thiscan go away.
So, between, like my duodenum,my genuina, my ileum, like all
these parts and phases of thedigestive tract, but some of
which are incorporating storage.
Some are discerning whichmicronutrients are for what and
(14:41):
what macronutrients are for what.
They're like whoa, whoa.
They're like whoa like.
We just need that and all thisother stuff can go, whereas when
I became a carnivore, bowelmovement frequency changed a lot
.
By changed a lot, I mean reallyfell off.
You know, sure, sometimes youcan have the runs for a couple
of days or have some, you know,uh, uncomfortable bowel
(15:03):
movements in your transitionalperiod, just because you're
taking in a lot more fat andyour colon is cleaning itself
out a bit, because now you don'thave a lot of substance there
to kind of hold some things andyou're going to just be kind of
pretty fluid.
You might have that.
But eventually, once your bodybecomes used to what it's
ingesting and really understandsthe processing of that, you're
(15:23):
not going to be discarding asmuch because you're going to be
retaining essentially everythingthat you're consuming.
The bioavailability of whatyou're consuming is basically
100.
There's no more having todiscern what is being ingested
can actually be utilized.
What do we need to discard?
There is no discard.
There's no casing, there's nohusk, there's no cellulose,
there's no fiber, there's nonehusk, there's no cellulose,
there's no fiber, there's no,there's none of that.
(15:45):
There's no roughage, it's allprotein and fat and cellular
volume, which is what we are.
So our body's able to recognizethat very easily.
The familiarity is very simpleIngest, consume, utilize and
then minimal discard, to thepoint now where I'm going the
furthest.
The longest I've gone is 11days without a bowel movement,
(16:07):
and people are like what?
That's crazy, you've got to besick.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
You got to be constipated.
Then that's exactly whatthey're going to go to.
Speaker 2 (16:15):
And I'm not.
It's weird at first when you'relike man.
I didn't get up this morningand do my manly first evacuation
of the day and then again andthen again the next day I'm like
I'm like, am I losing?
Like, am I, am I getting soft?
Is this making me soft, youknow?
Am I losing my manliness CauseI'm not getting up and doing my
morning glory?
(16:35):
No, and I was just like man.
That was a real aha moment tome Again, similarly to the
supplements and the vitamins andall that.
The fact that I didn't needthose things now and the fact
that I wasn't evacuating sofrequently.
I was like man, these are coolthings.
That again, it was starting todispel my opinion and my
feelings and promote what wasactually going on.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
Yeah, I heard.
I forgot who said it, butthey're just.
We were talking about.
You know, again, bowelmovements does come up in the
carnivore space because it is atransition from going anywhere
from two to three times a day tonot going for two to three days
, and everybody thinks it's acrazy thing and I forgot who
said it, but they're likenobody's winning the award for
(17:18):
the most amount of bowelmovements, Like there's no award
out there for that.
So but we you are utilizing alot of the nutrition and it's
bioavailable for you versus,like you were saying, the
excretion of everything else.
And that's one thing is becauseif I wave off of carnivore at
(17:39):
any point, like I will be goingto the bathroom more often and
then when I'm on carnivore Iwon't.
So it's like obviously my bodyis going to be taking in these
nutrients very efficiently andalso I don't have to buy a ton
of toilet paper, I swear to God.
I still have I don't have toLike a roll lasts months in my
(17:59):
place but then going circlingback to your mom, she's doing
mostly carnivore or if not allcarnivore, and then you're also
doing some strength trainingwith her, Like all of those
things of this lifestylecoaching.
And this was seven years agowhen she got that diagnosis.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
Yeah, so seven years ago was the diagnosis and for
several years after that she wasdoing a lot of things on her
own.
So she was working with someother people trainers wise.
Her nutrition, my mother'snutrition was never bad per se.
She's born and raised in Mexicoand grew up in an old world
kind of pick it, pull it, killit, eating foods that are
(18:38):
ingredients, not ingredientsthat create foods, not foods
made of ingredients.
So she, you know, we didn'thave sodas in the house growing
up, didn't have Lunchables goingto school.
We had, like you know, wholefoods for lunches.
I would say like the craziestprocessed things, though maybe
they're not the healthiest now,but still I would take them over
a lot of other things.
You know, I was the kid thatwould show up to school with
(19:00):
peanut butter, banana, celeryand honey sandwich on, like
whole grain or seven grain orsourdough and, like you know,
when you're in second gradenobody wants to trade you for
that.
Like it's.
It's the worst currency in theworld as far as in school stuff.
Right, because, like all myfriends had lunchables pizza,
(19:20):
kids cuisine like all these, youknow all the cool snack packs,
dude gushers.
I remember when gushers came outfruit rolls I was like, oh my
god, these are amazing yeahanybody want to trade for this
peanut butter, banana honeysandwich on sourdough with
celery and people like yeah, noso my mother raised us well, she
grew up well, but stillsomething was missing, something
(19:42):
was off.
Clearly you know thatosteoporosis.
It happened somehow.
So I started auditing whatshe's doing, how she's living,
how she's eating.
I love the people she wasworking with, but the work that
she was doing as far as in thephysical training that she was
undertaking was not in theinterest of combating this
(20:02):
osteoporosis.
Just like a metabolic panel,people that go get lipids done,
people that go take blood tests,a blood test, metabolic panel,
a drug screen, whatever a lipidtestosterone even is a test, a
test you can either study forand do well on, or a test you
(20:23):
show up and take and get thegrade you deserve.
Most people show up and justtake the test and they get the
grade they deserve.
And when they're upset about ohmy God, my testosterone is so
low, or like, oh my God, mycholesterol is so high, or like
why is my A1C?
You've got the grade youdeserve based on the work you're
putting in.
The test isn't out to get you,but just the same you can study,
(20:48):
prepare for that test and youwill get a favorable score based
on the work you put in.
So for my mother I said, okay,after a few years of this and
not seeing too much improvement,her body composition was not as
ideal as it should have been.
She's in great health.
We met my mother.
She's got good genes.
I was like we're not doingsomething right.
(21:09):
Are you sure these people areworking out this way?
Are you sure you're eating thisway, mom?
And finally I just gotfrustrated enough with it to be
honest.
I said, okay, you're workingwith me now, mom, you're
training with me, you're eatingwith me, I'm going to monitor
(21:30):
you, I'm going to put you in myapp with my coaching program,
with my people, so I can monitoryou and see what's going on.
And sure enough, it was a lotof.
It was not optimal dietaryadherence.
So, in combination with strengthtraining, two biggest things
that you know are oftenmisunderstood whether it's to
lose weight or reduce body fat,or to gain weight and improve
lean body muscle, you have togive in order to get.
If you want to lose weight, ifyou want to go into a calorie
(21:52):
deficit, if you want to reduceyour amount of overall
percentage body fat, to improveyour body composition, you're
going to have to give, by way ofmaybe having some hunger pains,
maybe having some irritability.
Maybe having some irritability,maybe having some brain fog,
maybe having some days where youjust don't feel great, having a
lot of urges to want to eattemptations yeah, you're going
to have to give.
(22:12):
In order to get what you wantFor gaining weight, putting on
size and mass, you're going tohave to eat.
That can be uncomfortable I'venever eaten this much.
I'm full.
If you want to gain weight,mass, put on muscle, you're
going to have to eat.
In order to do that.
You're going to have to eat theamount that's required in order
(22:33):
to get there.
On top of that, or combinedwith, you've got to train the
right way.
If it's to reduce thatpercentage of body fat or to
lose weight or to improve youragain kind of metabolic health
and just body composition, or toincrease that, you have to give
in order to get.
So.
My mother was doing a lot ofactivity but she wasn't eating
in an optimal alignment withwhat kind of activity she was
(22:56):
doing.
The activity she was doing wasnot promoting the best sense of
like recruitment for, let's say,things to combat osteoporosis,
like stem cells, like some typeof regeneration to her bone, you
know, to improve that density.
So I said, mom, we need to pumpsteel and we need to eat hearty
and heavy.
And so I was already a yearinto the diet and I was like mom
(23:20):
I really think you should trythis, let's give it a roll,
let's cut out the tortillas andmy tortillas.
My mother is again very healthyand it's just part of the
culture.
Coming from Mexico.
She ate corn tortillas, notflour, but still, you know,
these are not necessarilypromoting what we're after.
I was like mom we need to reallyget the protein in, we need to
really get the fat in, but wejust need these good, nutrient
(23:42):
dense food sources, thesewholesome places to where we can
really get this red meat that'sgoing to be loaded with
creatine.
That's going to really pumpyour ATP.
Really get that adenosinetriphosphate.
The energy center, the body'soptimal energy currency is ATP,
and not having enough protein,not having enough good quality,
(24:05):
bioavailable sources of creatinea la red meat the greatest
we're not really pumping thatATP.
So she's not getting the energyshe needs, she's not being able
to recruit the muscle growth,stimulation and recovery.
She's in need of same thingwith the bones, because the diet
wasn't adequate and it was notcomplemented with the right type
of training.
So we started to incorporateheavy and intense resistance
(24:27):
training several days a week,along with monitoring strictly
her amount of food, so much thatI remember the first day when
she was low on her fat she hadhit her protein but it was in
need of fat.
She had to take down like sixspoonfuls of butter and the next
morning she was like I can't dothat again with all that butter
to hit the numbers.
(24:47):
I was like, mom, you can, butyou don't want to, so let's make
sure we do.
We prepare better so that we'renot blindsided by that and then
have to do that again.
But in order to hit our numbers, we're going to do what it
takes.
And sure enough, two years later, scores reversed by reverses,
they drastically improved towhere her minus fours and fives
(25:08):
are now just teetering aroundminus ones.
So she's still not in positivegreen but she's no longer in
critically red and she's almosttouching the surface to break
even.
And she even ran her first uhMurph um workout this past
Memorial day.
Yeah, and she she hikes inaround the 20 pound vest pretty
much every day.
Uh, she's sprinting now doinglike intervals and then
(25:31):
lengthening her her.
Her sprint distances, even fromwhat she started with were just
like five second intervals andnow she's up to like 45 seconds
sprint intervals.
But lots of farmers, calories,lots of deadlifts, lots of
squats, lots of bench press,lots of heavy, low rep range
compound movements coupled withnutrient dense red meat,
creatine, rich food sources,osteoporosis and see the, the
(25:59):
combination, and I think this is, aesthetics aside, right, let's
just let's ditch that out theway.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
But getting people metabolically healthy and strong
, like those are the two bestthings you can do, and in tandem
.
The one other piece is withthat nutrition is with that
nutrition, like the inflammationis, we don't realize how shitty
we feel until we go to a dietlike this and when the
(26:27):
inflammation goes away, like, oh, that knee pain, that hip,
whatever, not to say that you'renever, ever going to have aches
and pains.
But for myself and for others,I feel like once you get that
inflammation out and you're ableto, like, feel better mentally
and physically, you're able totrain better, you just can wrap
(26:47):
your head around doing thislifestyle a little bit more, and
it's just so powerful.
And how old is your mom now?
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Uh, she'll be seven.
She, she's 72 now, so yeah,she'll be 73.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
She's lifting weights , eating steaks running sprints
yeah.
She is an absolute sweetheart.
You tell her I said hi, by theway as well, but no, she was
great and it's amazing what youguys can do.
I mean again one year to liveversus, you know, seven years
later and she's crushing it.
It's amazing.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Yeah, and great point about inflammation too.
You know, um, we, we, we, wetake for granted not feeling bad
.
There's a big differencebetween feeling good and not
feeling bad.
Not feeling bad means that youfeel good FYI to everybody,
because we all know when we feelbad, you know what I mean.
(27:43):
Like like you know, when youdon't feel good or we don't feel
well, like man, I feel likeshit, I'm sore, I don't have
energy.
Like we, we, we are the first tocomplain when things go wrong.
Like same thing, like you know.
Take service, for example.
Like on a on a flight.
Hey, when the flight goes well,everything's smooth.
We had a normal departure,there was no delay, great
(28:04):
takeoff, great service duringthe flight, great landing.
Like perfect experience.
We don't say anything about it.
We don't take the survey, wepiss off like no, but by God, if
that plane is delayed, we'reall on Twitter.
God damn you Delta.
If there's luggage issues, ifthere's something in-flight
experience that goes wrong,we're stuck on the runway.
(28:25):
We're all just complaining.
But when it's good, we don'tsay anything.
Our health is very similar.
It's rare that we praise howgood we feel.
We do it, don't get me wrong.
But it's rare because mostpeople aren't going to do it
every single day Like, oh my God, I feel amazing.
But when we feel bad, boy,that's news.
(28:46):
It's news to us, it's news topeople around us.
We can't wait to tell you aboutit.
Like I feel like shit today,like, oh my God, I don't feel
good.
We love to share thatnegativity.
So I say we take for grantednot feeling bad, because when
you feel bad you know it, butit's almost like you forget what
not feeling bad is like andthat's actually feeling good.
(29:09):
Not feeling bad is feeling good.
So, not having thatinflammation, not having that
issue, that chronic knee pain orthe brain fog or some type of
mental clarity or issues withsleep, when all those things
start going away, it's not thatyou've gone past the point of
status quo and now you're in theadvanced phase of feeling good.
(29:31):
No, this is normal.
We are not becoming superhuman.
My mother is not becoming asuperhuman.
That's normal human.
My mother is not becoming asuper human.
That's normal.
She had regressed all the waydown to where she was.
She had fallen back.
She was hindered.
Her living experience washindered by the degeneration of
what she was dealing with.
(29:51):
That's what most of us dealwith now.
How we feel the depression, theanxiety, the disorders or
disruptions that we all gothrough is like drag that we've
just gotten used to.
So when people heal around usand improve their lives around
us, we see them as superior.
It's like no dude, I'm notsuperior to you, you're just
(30:14):
behind and below by your ownchoosing.
For the most part it's like ina sprint 100-meter dash, for
example and a track coach ofmine in college told me this and
I'll never forget it he's likeyou ever watch the 100-meter?
He's like, and you see thewinner pull away.
I was like, yeah, totally, he'slike.
(30:34):
The guy's not pulling away.
The other people have fallenoff.
In a race like that, it's aboutperfection.
You mess up a start and youlose.
You come up too soon, you lose.
You don't stay low enough, youlose.
I love the 100 meter.
Even though Noah Lyles in hispast Olympics had not the best
start, was still able to comefrom behind.
(30:54):
Rarely this happens.
Statistics do have fallibilityand this one is just a hair of
it, but for the most part, 99%of the time, the winner is the
guy person that just holds itand everybody else falls off.
So it's not that he's gettingfaster.
It's just that he hits top end,holds that speed and doesn't
(31:15):
fall off.
We are not becoming superhuman.
It's just that everybody else,man, is in such a deficit and
has perceived that to be normal,that we've accepted it and that
everything else around us isseemingly, or rather when
something is better than that.
We're like man.
Tony, he's in great shape.
This guy's a superhuman.
It's like nah dog.
(31:35):
I just took off the parachute.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
And it's I always talk about this too the cards
are stacked against us like it'sa, it's a thing where, where
the perception is oh, like yourmother since her 70s, is she
lifting weights?
No way, that can't be possible.
Oh, like, I eat this way.
Right, this is the americandiet.
Like my grandfather lived to,whatever, so like I could eat,
(32:01):
like he did, kind of thing.
It's just like, all right, thekids growing up today I feel bad
, like I feel bad for kidsgrowing up today because they're
the landscape of their food andtheir choices is very doctored
up for them, and in schools,outside of schools, the home and
people are perceived like thisis healthy because it says, oh,
(32:21):
whole grain.
This is healthy because it'sheart healthy cereal.
Give me a freaking break, right?
So I think again, you werementioning earlier this
grassroots thing that we aredoing.
It's catching on, it's startingto gain momentum, but there is
a lot of work that needs to bedone.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Yeah, and I can tell you from the front line right
now I'm working on a secondmaster's right now at university
of Texas and Austin innutritional science, to proceed
my doctorate in nutritionalscience and I'm listening to it.
You know from the horse's mouthhaving to evaluate the material
objectively, doing a lot ofcase studies.
(32:59):
You know epidemiologicalstudies, a lot of case studies,
epidemiological studies, a lotof reviews of RCTs and
randomized controlled trials andjust peer reviews over and over
and over and read, analyze,summarize, read, analyze,
summarize.
So it's like some of which Idefinitely don't agree with, and
it's like really putting me ina conflicting place.
But then when I realized likehey, you're just reporting the
data as it is, take youremotions out of it, it's okay,
(33:22):
your opportunity will come.
But places like the WorldCancer Research Fund, the
American Cancer Society, theAmerican Medical Association,
the American Health Association,american Heart Association, you
, they rather have put forth somuch information for such a long
time decades, generations, evenfor them to change their
(33:44):
positions on things.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
I mean.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
For you and I, Tony, it's like we're single people,
we're individuals, so werepresent families.
We have spheres of influence,friends, clients, people that
come to us, confide in us, lookup to us, whatever are
influenced by us.
But for break it down, it'sjust us.
Our decisions are going toaffect us alone, Regardless of
what's around us.
It's going to affect us alone.
(34:05):
We're not an organization likethe AMA, the ACS or any of those
others that I mentioned.
We haven't written hundreds ofthousands of journals or peer
reviews or had hundreds ofthousands of case studies with
millions of people, to whichwe've then given synopses and
promote it, or dispelled ordisseminated information to be
(34:28):
able to create a narrative or aposition that we stand behind
and then to which millions ofpeople adhere, to caregivers
that promote it, that forward it, and then patients that listen
and adhere.
For them to have to change thatinformation, for you and I to
say, hey, I'm a vegan today, I'ma carnivore tomorrow, fine, but
(34:51):
for them to do that, what aboutall those millions of people
who listen to that adviceotherwise, All those hundreds of
thousands of doctors andpractitioners that have taken
that, given it to patients, allof the people that have
subscribed over the years, thedecades, the generations, to the
way they've said is right orthis is the best way to fight
cancer, to prevent cancer, toreduce risk, to be as healthy as
possible, to combat diabetes,to try to stop metabolic
(35:16):
syndrome.
Like we're talking about aGoliath, of a consciousness.
So, yeah, we are in this verylittle grassroots movement and
it is a Herculean effort, butI'm very grateful to be where I
am because I'm in the thick ofit as far as in hearing the
information and hearing the sidethat it's coming from, which is
(35:37):
fine, and I see tremendousupside because it's not trying
to necessarily totally demonizethe other side but simply just
offer a different perspective.
Example this morning I had myweekly live Q&A and one of my
clients was asking me about areport that I had shared with
them and I'm sharing all of myschoolwork and findings and
(35:59):
everything I'm working on withmy community so that they can
actually see like look, this isliterally right from the
teaching pulpit.
Here's my breakdown, here'swhat I had to do, here's what I
think about it, here's the truthbehind it.
Evaluate for yourselves.
And she was asking like well,what do you think about that
study?
Because it talks a lot aboutred meat as being a increaser of
risk for cancer and, like thereport, I had to or rather the
(36:23):
subject I had to work on was howthe inclusion of fruits,
vegetables and whole grainshelps reduce the risk of cancer.
And when I got that originallyI was like oh God, typical, like
great I was like you feeltargeted, You're like.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
I think they're targeting me.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
No.
And so, you know, my professor,I was like, is there any way I
could do this one on processedfood removal instead?
Just because I was like, oh God, not this one.
But then I was like you knowwhat, it's not about my opinion.
Just find the report, find areport, a peer review, a journal
, and report on that.
It's inclusion or it's what itincludes.
(36:59):
It's like, fine, okay, I can dothis.
So reading that, I'm like God,this is crazy, like what they're
evaluating it on.
They're saying you know to notconsume it based on this and
that.
And she is asking me, my clientwell, how would you, you know,
how do you respond to that?
And I said, well, because youhave no other information about
(37:20):
these people, these patients,the participants.
You know we've got 10,000people ranging from 18 to 65.
I have no idea what they looklike, no idea what their
activity levels are like, noidea what the rest of their
diets are really like.
And all you're just hearing isthat you're talking about
including red meat just out ofnowhere on that.
So these people could be sickinternally, these people could
(37:43):
be sick physically, these peoplecould be completely sedentary,
abled, disabled, who knows?
And all of a sudden you'regoing to just drop red meat into
that and blame the red meat asan issue for causing a greater
or having a greater risk forcancer.
Well, if it's to the standardAmerican diet and adding more
(38:03):
red meat to a diet that isalmost sick, comprised of almost
60% of their carbohydratescoming from processed foods
rather, 60% of the diet comingfrom processed foods 57, I
believe it's 57% of calories ofthe standard American diet come
by way of refined carbohydratesand otherwise processed foods
(38:24):
57%.
So yes, if you add red meat tothat, could it be problematic?
Sure, I agree with that andthat is what these studies and
findings propose, because that'swhat they're based on.
That's what they evaluate.
They evaluate the people addValorum, what are they consuming
?
They're consuming a standardAmerican diet and if 57 to 60%
of their calories are comingfrom refined sugar or
(38:46):
carbohydrate sources andprocessed foods, then yeah,
adding red meat to that is goingto be probably problematic,
because the cancer probabilityrisk is not coming from the meat
, it's coming from the otherthings, from the processed foods
.
And sure enough, my classmateswho had processed food reduction
as their findings report and asfar as in efforts to reduce
(39:07):
cancer risk, found crazyincreases in probability and
risk for people that consumedprimarily by way of carcinogens,
even though red meat is alsoclassified as class 1, class two
depending on what type.
But to think about that isdumbfounding.
I give an example of theBrazilian steakhouse all the
time.
So right now we're breathingnitrogen.
(39:29):
78% of the air we breathe isnitrogen, not oxygen.
People think like I need someO2.
It's like no dude, you neednitrogen more than anything.
Nitrogen is what we breathe.
The majority of Nitrogen is anessential part of life.
It is an essential molecule,the atoms that it is.
Without them we cannot breatheright.
(39:51):
Oxygen is critical as well, butwithout nitrogen there's no
life in plants and air andground and soil and animals and
ourselves.
Nitrogen alone is quite inert,but when you combine nitrogen
two of them with one tall urine,you've got TNT.
(40:13):
So by itself it's inert.
But when you take two of thesesuckers and combine it with a
tall urine, you've got thisbeautiful, combustible,
flammable, explosive, volatilecompound of trinitrotallurine.
Brazilian Steakhouse Tony, everytime we go there the meat makes
me so sick.
No, Jake, the meat did not makeyou sick.
Those five baskets of pao dequeijo you had to start off the
(40:35):
meal, the triple whipped polentaand mashed potatoes, and then
all the spice and sugarplantains fried in vegetable oil
you smashed.
And then all the shit you gotfrom the salad bar, the double
dessert that you got, plus thetwo bottles of wine you drank.
That plus the meat, you'reright, that made you sick.
Meanwhile Tony ate just theconya beef ribs, some lamb chops
(40:59):
, couple of sausages, and he'sready to run a marathon
afterwards.
I'm ready to roll over in awheelbarrow and die and I don't
know how I'm going to drive home.
And you're like all right, dude, I'll see you later.
I'm high on life.
It's not the meat.
So the same thing from thosestudies.
It's not fair to blame meat ascausing a higher probability of
(41:20):
cancer risk when all those otherthings are on board.
Back to that TNT thing.
Nitrogen alone, meat is notgoing to be the harmful thing,
but when you combine it two ofthem with toluene.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
First and foremost, that was the most elegant way to
say that rant was veryelegantly put.
I love that it was way betterthan I've ever heard anybody
talk about the topic.
But you're right, I mean, someof these majority of the studies
are just epidemiological andit's all like survey based.
I think I had this, I think Ihad that and combination.
(41:58):
We don't know the activitylevel, we don't know what's
going on with the person, andthen we're just going to cherry
pick a lot of this, a lot of thedata to just prove the points.
But yeah, very, very well said,and I think I think that's
amazing too.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
I didn't know you were going back to school, so
you're going to get anadditional doctorate, or so I'm
a glutton for education in thebest way and I have a master's
in business and currently doingmy master's, my second master's,
but in nutritional science.
But I'm going to, I'm precedingthe doctorate with this.
(42:32):
This is kind of like my, mysegue into the doctoral.
So I'll be starting thathopefully, uh, the fall next
year.
I get accepted with all myradical idealisms and whatnot,
but yeah, that's, uh, that's thetruth.
Man is, is, um, you can't blamethings that are, like you said,
kind of cherry picked, whereyou've got epidemiological
studies showing correlation, notnecessarily causation.
(42:55):
And then you know things likeFFQs or food frequency
questionnaires.
You know this, working withindividuals, one-on-one, having
people log their food, countcalories, macros, what'd you eat
, how much was it?
Like we messed up all the time,even me, you like.
You know, during competition,during performance I'm prepping
for a race, prepping for a showmiss a corner or cut a corner
(43:15):
here and there miss a detail,like maybe.
So you're telling me when wegot like a hundred thousand
person survey, like what type of?
How good is the adherence?
And that's even one of theflaws written in the abstract or
in the in the synopsis of theuh, of the studies.
A lot of them is.
It's difficult to gauge theaccuracy based on the input from
(43:35):
the participants because theyare susceptible to fallibility.
Well duh.
And then on the food frequencyquestionnaire how many of this,
how much of that?
The list is massive.
There could be all kind ofvariables in there there,
whereas you know there's veryfew in the carnivore world.
On the low carb, zero carb,keto world, like, one of the
(43:58):
assessments that I did wascomparing three diet types in
their relationship to cancerrisk or increased, reduced risk
or increased risk.
And they were a Mediterraneandiet, a ketogenic diet and a
plant-based diet.
And the study concluded thatthe Mediterranean diet was the
(44:20):
best as far as an overallreduction for cancer risk.
Like, okay, that's fair.
This study, the reason theydispelled the ketogenic diet,
though the findings did showsubstantial reduction in overall
tumor size, ding, ding, dingand improved metabolic health to
(44:41):
the body ding, ding, ding.
Not enough information studyinghas been done in order for us
to be able to promote this as alikely place for reduced cancer
risk.
Plant-based diet a healthyversion of the plant-based diet
was proved to promote reduction.
By way of like, I want to sayit was like 12%, I forget
(45:03):
exactly Healthy.
And then they went on to sayand I love this part in contrast
, unhealthy versions of theplant-based diet were shown to
show substantial increased riskin cancer.
And I was like, imagine that.
So back to veganism,vegetarianism and processed
foods.
I have mad respect for the rawvegan.
(45:25):
Mad respect because that is alion heart of a commitment, mad
respect to the raw vegan.
If you're not a raw vegan andyou're a vegan, or you're a
plant-based eater and you're nota raw plant-based eater, get
off your high horse and notthinking that you're not
consuming tons of processedfoods because you are To create
(45:46):
the foods you eat.
They are processed literally.
Whether you think they'reethically, environmentally or
morally sound or right to createthem.
They're made in a factory, in alab, in a plant, processed to
be packaged, boxed and wrapped,whatever for you to ingest,
whereas your raw vegans who Ilike I said, respect the hell
(46:07):
out of that's as is, pick it andpull it, pick it, pull it, eat
it, that's it.
God bless you.
So this healthy versusunhealthy version of a
plant-based diet for cancer risk, reduced or increased?
I was like, okay, that makessense.
Like sure, less risk, thatshould.
That's based on their healthyversion, less processed version
versus higher risk.
(46:27):
Increased risk, yeah, causethey're probably eating a bunch
of wrapped garbage that's fullof heavy metals, mold toxins,
its own version of carcinogensand God knows what else.
But yeah, my job right now isjust to report the findings as
they are until I'm given aresearch forum to kind of
(46:48):
further delve into these thingswhich, like I said, I'm not
trying to prove law and createdogma and religion.
The job of science, the job ofa scientist is not to prove law
but to constantly test to tryand disprove your hypothesis.
And that's what I'm trying todo is to test in efforts to
(47:10):
disprove the hypothesis.
But we have to compare it tothe currently, you know,
acknowledged rhetoric andinformation in order to test it,
because I'm testing thathypothesis same time testing
mine.
So it'll be this you knowongoing, uh, tennis match of
like.
Does this work?
Does that not work?
Let's, we'll see what they say,what you guys think, and, yeah,
(47:31):
we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 1 (47:33):
You're hitting the nail on the head.
I, I was.
I was gonna say that the yetprocess, yes, but ultra
processed, ultra palatable, easyto consume, um and over consume
these products?
Oh yeah, it's, it's.
It's crazy, and I know becausewe've.
We've too.
(47:54):
Like you know, I've had a stintof veganism for like two years
and it got to a point where Icouldn't eat enough.
And then when I did eat thosethings, literally my gut was
just like oh my God, like I justfelt like crap, I didn't feel
right and we talked about theinflammation and all those
things.
But I know we're kind ofstrapped for time.
But the one thing I want tokind of end with we got to
(48:14):
there's going to be a part threeto this because we have so much
to cover.
You know, I wanted to kind oftalk about your coaching, kind
of plug that as well.
Clients or people, like justkind of the people that are
coming to you, what are like thetop three essential steps
someone can take to becomehealthier or just kind of take
their health into their ownhands a little bit.
So when you see people come in,whether it's metabolic,
(48:38):
metabolically unhealthy or theyjust want to be more fit in the
world.
What are just three thingsright off the bat.
You're like these are the threeessential things we got to
start with.
Speaker 2 (48:48):
Oh for sure.
Great, great question, greatquestion.
So my thesis for my research isthe single most effective thing
we can do as human beings inregard to our health is
controlling what we put into ourmouths.
It's not a powder, it's notmeditation, it's not grounding,
it's not exercise.
It's that Single, single, mostexercise.
(49:16):
It's that Single, single, most.
We can get all the sleep we want, but if we're not taking care
of this, it's not going tomatter.
You can drink all the water youwant, you can manifest, you can
ground, you can conjure, youcan create, you can zen your way
to wherever you think you wantto go.
But this is the key right here.
So, whether it's for businesscoaching, relationship repair,
(49:36):
ptsd, substance abuse, trying tokick a habit like that,
somebody just trying to lookbetter, feel better, doesn't
matter.
I'm going to ask you how yourdiet is?
No, jake, I'm here for businesscoaching Great, how's your diet
?
No, my wife and I are trying towork on our marriage Great,
how's your diet?
No, I'm here every time becausethis is the gateway.
(49:57):
It's the gateway to belief,it's the gateway to
understanding and it's the firstplace to where you will
acknowledge an understanding ofimportance of that.
Because as long as that's beingmanipulated.
You talked about how we'reeating and how we feel based on
what we're eating.
I had a great conversation withDr Stephanie Rimka the other
(50:20):
day talking about pleasurebeings.
Unfortunately, we have freewill working against us and this
terrible thing called thetongue working against us, and
she was she corrected me reallywell she's like whoa, whoa, whoa
.
The tongue is a fantasticallypleasurable thing you know, and
(50:44):
she's, and she's big, um big insexual health also.
So she's like, she's like I needthat tongue and and it was
making me blush a lot, but shesays it much more eloquently
than I do, but nonetheless thetongue is a very important and
pleasurable muscle that we need.
And she kind of rephrased whatI was trying to say in the sense
(51:04):
that, yeah, our perception oftaste and flavor has been so
thwarted and manipulated that weare just pleasure seekers for
food rather than out of need.
Everything is hedonic asopposed to homeostatic.
That's not saying that we haveto eat only for utility and
purpose.
It shouldn't be enjoyable.
I love eating steak, I know youlove eating steak.
(51:26):
We love eating the way we dobecause it tastes good, it feels
good, it makes us feel great.
We don't do it because it'smiserable.
But contrast is that so much ofour understanding and
familiarity now with eating istotally based on hedonism, on
that hedonic, pleasurable senseof.
Give me that easy dopamine,like the chemical engineering of
(51:50):
these foods, how they arecreated in order to induce those
reactions.
Yeah, that's where we go wrong.
That's where pleasure is nowbeing misinterpreted and abused,
and perverted was the word sheused.
It's very true.
So for me, that first thing iswe got to figure out your diet.
I got to know what's going onin there, because I need you to
(52:11):
believe yourself, I need you tounderstand, to take off the mask
, to remove the blockages thatare existing, the dream killers
of substance that you're puttingin your body, that you won't be
able to believe in yourbusiness, you won't be able to
relate to or understand yourpartner, you won't be able to
walk away from that habit or beable to think and be happy,
(52:33):
getting rid of the PTSD, letalone like look, you touched on
it before Help me get biceps,Tony.
Help me get a butt, tony.
Help me become healthier, getstronger, feel better, move
better equates to looking better.
You do those in reverse.
It's not guaranteed.
I've got a masterclass inlooking great and feeling like
(52:57):
shit, not being healthy, notbeing that mobile Masterclass.
Did it as a fitness model, didit as a bodybuilder.
But as opposed to feel better,truly, by becoming healthier, by
getting stronger, by movingbetter, you're going to
inevitably look better.
So, talking about the diet firstimpressing on people, working
(53:18):
from the inside out in order tohave the outside be a reflection
of what's truly within there,and then that you got to trust
the process, man.
You got to trust the process.
You have to show up and youhave to be consistent.
Those are kind of all three inone, but diet number one, inside
out perspective number two, andtrust in the process Number
(53:39):
three.
Speaker 1 (53:40):
You got me all jacked up right now.
That was a great season.
Speaker 2 (53:45):
It's football season, dude, you know like there's a
lot of great coaches out there,there's a lot of great players
out there, so there's plenty ofbuzzwords and you know like
people talking about thesethings and you see these
successful coaches.
I was watching, uh, you know,yesterday, the, the women's
softball coach from oklahomashame on me for for not
remembering her name, but pattyuh, shame on me, but they're
(54:07):
working on four nationalchampionships in a row right now
.
She's got, I think, a total ofnine over there.
15 conference championships,like just 1,500 wins, I believe.
Something just insanely likeinsane stats.
And her talking to Pat McAfeeyesterday, who was just
previously talking to Nick Saban.
(54:27):
It's like they all say the samething Trust in the process,
belief, belief in yourself,commitment to a higher purpose,
you know, surrendering to thathigher purpose, and just the
consistency to stay with it.
Speaker 1 (54:39):
Having, uh, having a standard right like that's.
That's the standard there's novariation of it.
That's the standard for everyday.
That's the standard.
But I know you got to take offum real quick.
Where can people find you andconnect with you if they want to
reach out to Life Like Jake?
Speaker 2 (54:56):
You said it right there Every channel, all the
socials, everything is Life LikeJake.
So YouTube, tiktok, instagram,online, lifelikejakecom
everywhere and anywhere to getin touch with me.
Just look up Life Like Jake andyou'll find me and you'll find
me Awesome, Amazing.
Speaker 1 (55:12):
Well, appreciate the time.
It's great talking to you again.
There's so much more to cover.
We'll do another one upcoming,but thanks for everybody
listening again to anotherepisode of the Primal
Foundations Podcast.
Thank you all for joining us.
If you enjoyed this episode,don't forget to subscribe, like
and share.
See you all next time on thePrimal Foundations podcast.
Welcome to the Primal Foundations podcast.
I'm your host, tony Pascola.
We will dive into what Ibelieve are the four central
foundations you need for ahealthy lifestyle Strength,
nutrition, movement and recovery.
Get ready to unlock your pathto optimal health and enjoy the
episode.
Our guest today is Jake Thomas.
(00:27):
For the listeners who don'tknow, jake is a former US Marine
and now lifestyle coach throughhis marquee Life.
Like Jake and the host of thevery successful podcast Sick,
scared and Stupid, you can checkout Jake's background story on
his first appearance of thePrimal Foundations podcast in
episode 12.
Jake, welcome back to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Thanks, tony, it's good to be here, it's good to
see you again Talking off screen.
I said you're looking leaner,still smiling, so I don't want
to say meaner, but you lookleaner, noticeably leaner.
You've been doing somethingright, for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I always said I'm trying to be like you, boss.
Just shred it like a Juliansalad over there Last time, like
we actually did um while I wason your podcast, but even before
, like episode 12.
So you're like this is over ayear ago.
You're an OG for the primalfoundations.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yeah, man, that was a good time.
Uh, you know we were both stillkind of cracking into certain
spaces and spaces and trying tofigure things out and poke the
bear, so to speak.
You know, being part of thisresistance underground movement
that's still kicking, and thengetting to see you and meet you
for the first time in Austin atHack your Health, the event
through KetoCon, and you know Iremember laughing with you about
(01:39):
that and how you went to thesame barbecue place like three
days in a row, not for barbecuebut for steak.
You know, for people that don'tknow like steak, whole steaks
and like a ribeye in this caseis not something you normally
find at a barbecue shop or shack.
You know it's usually cuts ofbeef, pound of this, quarter
pound of that, whatever ribs andsausage and stuff like that.
But that one place in particulardowntown in Austin, cooper's,
(02:03):
and you were like dude, you gotto go to this place and get the
ribeye and I was like of coursethe outer towner is telling me
to go to the place downtown onCongress.
I'm like in my mind, I'm like,you know, that's like a tourist
trap right, like right there inthe heart of downtown and it's
talking about eat the words.
Like Cooper's is good barbecue,but like that ribeye is is
absolutely nailed out of thisworld.
So once I had it, I understoodwhy you went three days in the
(02:25):
rain.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yeah, I, we.
I have to credit James Liebenthe uh, the carnivorous cause he
went there before and he's likeyou gotta have the ribeye here.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
And I'm thinking the same thing.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
I'm like this isn't the downtown area?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
This is not like real Texas barbecue, but we get
there.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
And I was.
I was shocked.
I went back again with our boy,casey rough, and then he left
for the airport and I was likekind of waiting around town.
I'm like.
I texted him like guess whereI'm at.
He's like you're not atCooper's.
Again I go, yes, I'm atCooper's three times in a week.
A weekend, but it was definitelywell worth it.
It was super cool to meet.
(03:00):
Like doing podcasts is greatand you get to kind of have a
little bit connection, but likewe got to meet each other at
Pack your Health, we had a lot.
We got to eat, we got to hangout.
You know, when I walked inthere it was my first one.
So I see I just interviewedReynolds again.
Yeah, I saw him.
He's like the first person.
I always joke.
He's like the mayor of thatwhole thing, like everybody
(03:22):
knows him and I like hugging him.
I turn around, I see you andthen I see casey, then I see
james.
I'm like thought this is great,like it's just super cool, um,
to get like all thoselike-minded people in there and
to just, you know, rub elbowswith each other, talk to
somebody new, talk to somebodythat you know, you, you've been
(03:42):
wanting to talk to.
There's like people, there'sheroes there for everybody.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
So it was just a really great experience.
Yeah, I had a blast man and and,uh, I was fortunate to bring my
mother, who you met, and it's abig deal for me because she is
a big reason why I got into thiswhole thing in the first place.
You know, my seven years ago mymother was given this really
dismal osteoporosis.
(04:06):
I don't know.
I should say let me rephrasethat she got a really bad bone
density scan score, like she hadvery negative bone density
scores and so her osteoporosishad really kind of taken over.
And her doctor who administeredthe exam and kind of gave her
the prognosis after the fact waslike you know, you're, you're
really not looking good.
(04:27):
I'd give you about a year tolive.
Now I believe how that wasinterpreted, or how he meant it
to be, was like if you took afall or if you had a break of
some kind, it would really bebad for you, given the state of
your bone density right now.
I mean, she was, I want to sayshe was like minus four or
something around there, likereally really.
And she was, I want to say shewas like minus four or something
around there, like reallyreally in a bad spot, definitely
in the critically red area.
(04:47):
And so when my mother, you know, when your mother tells you
like hey, I was given a year tolive, and I'm like what?
Like, like, hey, I've got somebad news.
I've got some some pretty heavynews.
My doctors gave me a year tolive.
Based on that, you don't evenhear the dot, dot, dot, dot dot,
you don't even hear the dot,dot, dot, dot, dot part.
All you hear is year to live.
And I was like whoa, whoa, holdon mom, like it sends off a lot
(05:09):
of alarms in your head andreally makes you come to the
moment of being afraid, you know, and I was like I can't lose my
mother right now, like I needyou mom, like I need you in life
.
And no, like denial, this can'tbe, does not compute, kind of
thing.
And then I started listeningand understanding the why behind
it and her in fact having thisvery serious case of
(05:32):
osteoporosis, and so that justput me on a mission of like what
can I do?
What can we do?
You know what's the remedy,what's the fix?
Like the Marine you know, youkind of mentioned that earlier
the Marine kicks into me andgoes like enemy, where you know,
search, find, kill, destroy.
Like what do we need to do tofix this problem, which is not
(05:52):
always the answer, but in thiscase I was definitely like
locate, close with and destroythe enemy, you know for sure.
And so I was alreadyexperimenting a lot with diets
and nutrition.
I've been competitively andprofessionally bodybuilding for
(06:12):
quite a while at this point, andwas doing various types of bro
dieting and if it fits yourmacros and standard American and
typical bodybuilding styledieting, and even gotten into
vegetarianism and veganism for acouple of years.
And veganism for a couple ofyears and, preceding her
diagnosis or prognosis, I'dstarted to get bips on carnivore
eating.
I'd done keto in the past.
So I started researching thecarnivore diet and I was through
(06:37):
a friend of mine.
He's like read this, watch this, listen to this.
And I was like, yeah, dude,I've done keto before.
And he's like no man, it's notketo.
No vegetables, no fruits, noavocados, no chocolate, no nuts.
Like just meat, just animals,fish, seafood, eggs.
I was like, all right, whateverman, I'll read, I'll watch, I
listen.
And I did and it made a lot ofsense.
You know I was not a vegan nora vegetarian for the ethics of
(07:00):
animals or for the environmentalconsciousness.
I dated a girl that was avegetarian.
She and I in turn became vegantogether.
That was my reasoning for that.
It was never about the twoother reasons as mentioned.
So for me it was actuallypretty easy to abandon veganism
and become a carnivore, so tospeak.
People hear that and they'relike, oh my God, you went from
vegan to carnivore.
Even though a lot of people dodo that, I was never having to
(07:22):
disassociate from some type ofmoral reason.
I did it, like I said, becausethis girl was dating, was a
vegetarian and we togetherexplored that plant-based world
and then became vegans together.
So the more I listened, themore I watched, the more I read,
the more I was curious.
And when I finally took thisfirst 30-day plunge into it, the
(07:44):
results to me were undeniablehow I felt, what I was able to
do with so little, so to speak,as a vegan bodybuilder.
I had, like, my pillbox.
Tony was like I can't even makethe dimensions of it, how big
it was.
I had five different doses foreach day and I had all seven
(08:05):
days.
So I had the five, the five boxby seven, so it's a 35 box,
right, and I had X amount ofpills per day.
So you know five times a day,whether I was taking this
supplement, this supplement,amino acid right Cause it
doesn't exist A couple othermicronutrients and minerals and
vitamins throughout the courseof the day five times, and some
other like bacterial cleansersand little droppers that I'm
(08:28):
doing things with.
On top of the other supplements,I'm taking protein powders,
amino acids, things that do notexist in the plant kingdom, that
you have to source outside ofit in order to create and get, I
should say, obtain, the macrosand micros that you want,
particularly as a bodybuilder oras a fitness model, where
you're trying to account forthose macros and the ratios that
(08:50):
you want them, but the factthat you do.
They don't exist in the naturalworld as a vegan.
So you have to have processedfoods, you have to have
supplements, whether it's thevitamins, the droppers, the
protein powders, whatever.
Add on top of that.
All the food is processed.
I was not a raw vegan, so I'meating tofu and tempeh and satay
(09:10):
and everything else that I canget to create protein with, but
at the same time, I'm usingsupplements and the vitamins to
get things in the ratios that Iwanted, all the while not
concerned or really aware of theheavy metals or the types of
mold or toxins that I'm beingexposed to through the
processing of all these thingsand I'm just like, oh, it's
(09:32):
vegan, it's good for me, cool,whatever.
When I went carnivore, all thatwent away.
No more pills no more.
No more.
You know five by seven vitaminbox and I was like damn, like I
was so proud of this thing.
It's cool, it's color coded,it's like my, it's like a
habitual thing.
(09:52):
No more of that, like that wasfirst.
No more droppers no more.
You know.
Scoops of amino acids no more.
Bcaas no more.
I mean amino acids, bcaas nomore.
Protein powders no more.
You know foods and wrapperspowders no more.
You know foods and wrappers and, like I said, tofu, tempeh,
satay, whatever eggs, steak,ground beef, bacon Like that was
(10:15):
what I ate pretty much forthose first 30 days where it was
a lot of steak, a lot of eggsand bacon and burgers, and I was
shocked yeah, that's whatyou're saying is because we get
this, a lot of people look toother people.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
They're like, well, so-and-so is vegan and they're
this or they're that or they'veachieved this.
It's really hard to do likeyou're saying, like not to say
that people can't do thosethings, but there is a lot of
supplementation.
Uh, it's a lot of extra workand things.
(10:46):
Again, if it's a moral thing oryou really think you're doing
it for your own health, whateverit may be, but there are
athletes out there, likeyourself at that moment in time,
where you wanted to do it veganor vegetarian.
But it is a lot of food andit's a.
You don't know where it'scoming from.
It's packaged, it's processedand there's so many supplements.
It is daunting.
I like just you talking about,like man, that's a lot of work.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yeah, yeah, and it is , it really is.
And you hit it well and saidlike it's not.
You know I don't want to sayright or wrong.
You know I don't want to bethat polarizing where I'm saying
it's right or it's wrong.
I'm just saying what I wentthrough, what I experienced, and
comparing the differences.
And if someone finds value inthat or they're able to relate
to that, cool.
But I'm explaining these thingsas they were, not how I
(11:30):
perceive them or what my opinionis.
But I was a vegan.
I was eating these things inorder to achieve the results I
wanted athletically.
I had to supplement because,again, these things did not
exist in the ratios that Ineeded them in in order to eat
and adhere to my macros.
Right, very specific.
Same thing in the if it fitsyour macros world.
(11:51):
Well, when you're not a vegan,you're wide open.
You can drink, you know,isopure 50 gram protein drinks
that have nothing else but thisliquefied protein, and you can
cheat and say, all right, I'mgoing to go eat a bunch of
Skittles and Sour Patch Kids andwatch a movie, and it'll still
fit in my macros.
Then I'll just down these eggwhites and whatever and it'll
work out.
It will and it can, becauseI've done it plenty of times.
(12:13):
I would eat Popeyes, oftentimesduring bodybuilding preps,
because people are like well,how do you do that?
I'm like, dude, you get the notthe fry, but the blackened
chicken strips.
Skip the sauces, get the dirtyrice with the green beans, skip
the mashed potatoes, skip thebiscuit.
There you go, there's your meal, there's your carbs, there's
your protein, there's yourvegetable for volume to fill you
(12:33):
up, and it works like a charm.
Now, you're not accounting forthe micros in there, the
vitamins that are going to beall out of whack because of the
processing and the inclusion ofthose synthetic versions of some
of those micronutrients.
So how you're going to feel isnot necessarily going to equate
to how good you might look.
But in this carnivore sense,which is the ultimate
(12:53):
elimination diet by way ofabsolute whole foods, whole,
complete, real, single foodsright, there's no ingredients to
them.
Eggs eggs are eggs, ground beefis ground beef ingredient.
You know, you, if it were evenin a package ground ingredients,
ground beef, you knowingredients.
Eggs, bacon, like okay, maybebacon.
(13:14):
You got to look forward to makesure there's no nitrates, no
extra additives and sugars andwhatnot, salts and different
spices, but for the most part,it's like ingredients ribeye,
steak ingredients, like you'reeating single ingredient foods
as opposed to foods made ofingredients, and that was huge
to me, huge aha moment.
Second one was, as a veganathlete, using the toilet a lot,
(13:37):
a lot of bathroom time, a lotof evacuation by way of I'm
thinking, well, it's because I'man athlete, my metabolism is
really high, I need to use thetoilet.
Thinking, well, it's becauseI'm an athlete, my metabolism is
really high, I need to use thetoilet three, four, five times a
day sometimes because I'm anathlete.
No, dude, that's all waste,that's all discard, that's all
what cannot be utilized oringested.
(13:58):
Thus it has to be discarded.
You know, just thinking about,like fiber and the types of, you
know, soluble versusnon-soluble fiber, and things
that can be ingested and brokendown as opposed to things that
can only be discarded.
So, consuming all those thingsmy body is extracting, having to
really particularize the foodsit's ingesting in order to
extract these little bits ofnutrients.
(14:19):
So all this stuff would comeinto it and the digestive system
is having to go.
Okay, just this and all thiscan go away.
So, between, like my duodenum,my genuina, my ileum, like all
these parts and phases of thedigestive tract, but some of
which are incorporating storage.
Some are discerning whichmicronutrients are for what and
(14:41):
what macronutrients are for what.
They're like whoa, whoa.
They're like whoa like.
We just need that and all thisother stuff can go, whereas when
I became a carnivore, bowelmovement frequency changed a lot
.
By changed a lot, I mean reallyfell off.
You know, sure, sometimes youcan have the runs for a couple
of days or have some, you know,uh, uncomfortable bowel
(15:03):
movements in your transitionalperiod, just because you're
taking in a lot more fat andyour colon is cleaning itself
out a bit, because now you don'thave a lot of substance there
to kind of hold some things andyou're going to just be kind of
pretty fluid.
You might have that.
But eventually, once your bodybecomes used to what it's
ingesting and really understandsthe processing of that, you're
(15:23):
not going to be discarding asmuch because you're going to be
retaining essentially everythingthat you're consuming.
The bioavailability of whatyou're consuming is basically
100.
There's no more having todiscern what is being ingested
can actually be utilized.
What do we need to discard?
There is no discard.
There's no casing, there's nohusk, there's no cellulose,
there's no fiber, there's nonehusk, there's no cellulose,
there's no fiber, there's no,there's none of that.
(15:45):
There's no roughage, it's allprotein and fat and cellular
volume, which is what we are.
So our body's able to recognizethat very easily.
The familiarity is very simpleIngest, consume, utilize and
then minimal discard, to thepoint now where I'm going the
furthest.
The longest I've gone is 11days without a bowel movement,
(16:07):
and people are like what?
That's crazy, you've got to besick.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
You got to be constipated.
Then that's exactly whatthey're going to go to.
Speaker 2 (16:15):
And I'm not.
It's weird at first when you'relike man.
I didn't get up this morningand do my manly first evacuation
of the day and then again andthen again the next day I'm like
I'm like, am I losing?
Like, am I, am I getting soft?
Is this making me soft, youknow?
Am I losing my manliness CauseI'm not getting up and doing my
morning glory?
(16:35):
No, and I was just like man.
That was a real aha moment tome Again, similarly to the
supplements and the vitamins andall that.
The fact that I didn't needthose things now and the fact
that I wasn't evacuating sofrequently.
I was like man, these are coolthings.
That again, it was starting todispel my opinion and my
feelings and promote what wasactually going on.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
Yeah, I heard.
I forgot who said it, butthey're just.
We were talking about.
You know, again, bowelmovements does come up in the
carnivore space because it is atransition from going anywhere
from two to three times a day tonot going for two to three days
, and everybody thinks it's acrazy thing and I forgot who
said it, but they're likenobody's winning the award for
(17:18):
the most amount of bowelmovements, Like there's no award
out there for that.
So but we you are utilizing alot of the nutrition and it's
bioavailable for you versus,like you were saying, the
excretion of everything else.
And that's one thing is becauseif I wave off of carnivore at
(17:39):
any point, like I will be goingto the bathroom more often and
then when I'm on carnivore Iwon't.
So it's like obviously my bodyis going to be taking in these
nutrients very efficiently andalso I don't have to buy a ton
of toilet paper, I swear to God.
I still have I don't have toLike a roll lasts months in my
(17:59):
place but then going circlingback to your mom, she's doing
mostly carnivore or if not allcarnivore, and then you're also
doing some strength trainingwith her, Like all of those
things of this lifestylecoaching.
And this was seven years agowhen she got that diagnosis.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
Yeah, so seven years ago was the diagnosis and for
several years after that she wasdoing a lot of things on her
own.
So she was working with someother people trainers wise.
Her nutrition, my mother'snutrition was never bad per se.
She's born and raised in Mexicoand grew up in an old world
kind of pick it, pull it, killit, eating foods that are
(18:38):
ingredients, not ingredientsthat create foods, not foods
made of ingredients.
So she, you know, we didn'thave sodas in the house growing
up, didn't have Lunchables goingto school.
We had, like you know, wholefoods for lunches.
I would say like the craziestprocessed things, though maybe
they're not the healthiest now,but still I would take them over
a lot of other things.
You know, I was the kid thatwould show up to school with
(19:00):
peanut butter, banana, celeryand honey sandwich on, like
whole grain or seven grain orsourdough and, like you know,
when you're in second gradenobody wants to trade you for
that.
Like it's.
It's the worst currency in theworld as far as in school stuff.
Right, because, like all myfriends had lunchables pizza,
(19:20):
kids cuisine like all these, youknow all the cool snack packs,
dude gushers.
I remember when gushers came outfruit rolls I was like, oh my
god, these are amazing yeahanybody want to trade for this
peanut butter, banana honeysandwich on sourdough with
celery and people like yeah, noso my mother raised us well, she
grew up well, but stillsomething was missing, something
(19:42):
was off.
Clearly you know thatosteoporosis.
It happened somehow.
So I started auditing whatshe's doing, how she's living,
how she's eating.
I love the people she wasworking with, but the work that
she was doing as far as in thephysical training that she was
undertaking was not in theinterest of combating this
(20:02):
osteoporosis.
Just like a metabolic panel,people that go get lipids done,
people that go take blood tests,a blood test, metabolic panel,
a drug screen, whatever a lipidtestosterone even is a test, a
test you can either study forand do well on, or a test you
(20:23):
show up and take and get thegrade you deserve.
Most people show up and justtake the test and they get the
grade they deserve.
And when they're upset about ohmy God, my testosterone is so
low, or like, oh my God, mycholesterol is so high, or like
why is my A1C?
You've got the grade youdeserve based on the work you're
putting in.
The test isn't out to get you,but just the same you can study,
(20:48):
prepare for that test and youwill get a favorable score based
on the work you put in.
So for my mother I said, okay,after a few years of this and
not seeing too much improvement,her body composition was not as
ideal as it should have been.
She's in great health.
We met my mother.
She's got good genes.
I was like we're not doingsomething right.
(21:09):
Are you sure these people areworking out this way?
Are you sure you're eating thisway, mom?
And finally I just gotfrustrated enough with it to be
honest.
I said, okay, you're workingwith me now, mom, you're
training with me, you're eatingwith me, I'm going to monitor
(21:30):
you, I'm going to put you in myapp with my coaching program,
with my people, so I can monitoryou and see what's going on.
And sure enough, it was a lotof.
It was not optimal dietaryadherence.
So, in combination with strengthtraining, two biggest things
that you know are oftenmisunderstood whether it's to
lose weight or reduce body fat,or to gain weight and improve
lean body muscle, you have togive in order to get.
If you want to lose weight, ifyou want to go into a calorie
(21:52):
deficit, if you want to reduceyour amount of overall
percentage body fat, to improveyour body composition, you're
going to have to give, by way ofmaybe having some hunger pains,
maybe having some irritability.
Maybe having some irritability,maybe having some brain fog,
maybe having some days where youjust don't feel great, having a
lot of urges to want to eattemptations yeah, you're going
to have to give.
(22:12):
In order to get what you wantFor gaining weight, putting on
size and mass, you're going tohave to eat.
That can be uncomfortable I'venever eaten this much.
I'm full.
If you want to gain weight,mass, put on muscle, you're
going to have to eat.
In order to do that.
You're going to have to eat theamount that's required in order
(22:33):
to get there.
On top of that, or combinedwith, you've got to train the
right way.
If it's to reduce thatpercentage of body fat or to
lose weight or to improve youragain kind of metabolic health
and just body composition, or toincrease that, you have to give
in order to get.
So.
My mother was doing a lot ofactivity but she wasn't eating
in an optimal alignment withwhat kind of activity she was
(22:56):
doing.
The activity she was doing wasnot promoting the best sense of
like recruitment for, let's say,things to combat osteoporosis,
like stem cells, like some typeof regeneration to her bone, you
know, to improve that density.
So I said, mom, we need to pumpsteel and we need to eat hearty
and heavy.
And so I was already a yearinto the diet and I was like mom
(23:20):
I really think you should trythis, let's give it a roll,
let's cut out the tortillas andmy tortillas.
My mother is again very healthyand it's just part of the
culture.
Coming from Mexico.
She ate corn tortillas, notflour, but still, you know,
these are not necessarilypromoting what we're after.
I was like mom we need to reallyget the protein in, we need to
really get the fat in, but wejust need these good, nutrient
(23:42):
dense food sources, thesewholesome places to where we can
really get this red meat that'sgoing to be loaded with
creatine.
That's going to really pumpyour ATP.
Really get that adenosinetriphosphate.
The energy center, the body'soptimal energy currency is ATP,
and not having enough protein,not having enough good quality,
(24:05):
bioavailable sources of creatinea la red meat the greatest
we're not really pumping thatATP.
So she's not getting the energyshe needs, she's not being able
to recruit the muscle growth,stimulation and recovery.
She's in need of same thingwith the bones, because the diet
wasn't adequate and it was notcomplemented with the right type
of training.
So we started to incorporateheavy and intense resistance
(24:27):
training several days a week,along with monitoring strictly
her amount of food, so much thatI remember the first day when
she was low on her fat she hadhit her protein but it was in
need of fat.
She had to take down like sixspoonfuls of butter and the next
morning she was like I can't dothat again with all that butter
to hit the numbers.
(24:47):
I was like, mom, you can, butyou don't want to, so let's make
sure we do.
We prepare better so that we'renot blindsided by that and then
have to do that again.
But in order to hit our numbers, we're going to do what it
takes.
And sure enough, two years later, scores reversed by reverses,
they drastically improved towhere her minus fours and fives
(25:08):
are now just teetering aroundminus ones.
So she's still not in positivegreen but she's no longer in
critically red and she's almosttouching the surface to break
even.
And she even ran her first uhMurph um workout this past
Memorial day.
Yeah, and she she hikes inaround the 20 pound vest pretty
much every day.
Uh, she's sprinting now doinglike intervals and then
(25:31):
lengthening her her.
Her sprint distances, even fromwhat she started with were just
like five second intervals andnow she's up to like 45 seconds
sprint intervals.
But lots of farmers, calories,lots of deadlifts, lots of
squats, lots of bench press,lots of heavy, low rep range
compound movements coupled withnutrient dense red meat,
creatine, rich food sources,osteoporosis and see the, the
(25:59):
combination, and I think this is, aesthetics aside, right, let's
just let's ditch that out theway.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
But getting people metabolically healthy and strong
, like those are the two bestthings you can do, and in tandem
.
The one other piece is withthat nutrition is with that
nutrition, like the inflammationis, we don't realize how shitty
we feel until we go to a dietlike this and when the
(26:27):
inflammation goes away, like, oh, that knee pain, that hip,
whatever, not to say that you'renever, ever going to have aches
and pains.
But for myself and for others,I feel like once you get that
inflammation out and you're ableto, like, feel better mentally
and physically, you're able totrain better, you just can wrap
(26:47):
your head around doing thislifestyle a little bit more, and
it's just so powerful.
And how old is your mom now?
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Uh, she'll be seven.
She, she's 72 now, so yeah,she'll be 73.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
She's lifting weights , eating steaks running sprints
yeah.
She is an absolute sweetheart.
You tell her I said hi, by theway as well, but no, she was
great and it's amazing what youguys can do.
I mean again one year to liveversus, you know, seven years
later and she's crushing it.
It's amazing.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Yeah, and great point about inflammation too.
You know, um, we, we, we, wetake for granted not feeling bad
.
There's a big differencebetween feeling good and not
feeling bad.
Not feeling bad means that youfeel good FYI to everybody,
because we all know when we feelbad, you know what I mean.
(27:43):
Like like you know, when youdon't feel good or we don't feel
well, like man, I feel likeshit, I'm sore, I don't have
energy.
Like we, we, we are the first tocomplain when things go wrong.
Like same thing, like you know.
Take service, for example.
Like on a on a flight.
Hey, when the flight goes well,everything's smooth.
We had a normal departure,there was no delay, great
(28:04):
takeoff, great service duringthe flight, great landing.
Like perfect experience.
We don't say anything about it.
We don't take the survey, wepiss off like no, but by God, if
that plane is delayed, we'reall on Twitter.
God damn you Delta.
If there's luggage issues, ifthere's something in-flight
experience that goes wrong,we're stuck on the runway.
(28:25):
We're all just complaining.
But when it's good, we don'tsay anything.
Our health is very similar.
It's rare that we praise howgood we feel.
We do it, don't get me wrong.
But it's rare because mostpeople aren't going to do it
every single day Like, oh my God, I feel amazing.
But when we feel bad, boy,that's news.
(28:46):
It's news to us, it's news topeople around us.
We can't wait to tell you aboutit.
Like I feel like shit today,like, oh my God, I don't feel
good.
We love to share thatnegativity.
So I say we take for grantednot feeling bad, because when
you feel bad you know it, butit's almost like you forget what
not feeling bad is like andthat's actually feeling good.
(29:09):
Not feeling bad is feeling good.
So, not having thatinflammation, not having that
issue, that chronic knee pain orthe brain fog or some type of
mental clarity or issues withsleep, when all those things
start going away, it's not thatyou've gone past the point of
status quo and now you're in theadvanced phase of feeling good.
(29:31):
No, this is normal.
We are not becoming superhuman.
My mother is not becoming asuperhuman.
That's normal human.
My mother is not becoming asuper human.
That's normal.
She had regressed all the waydown to where she was.
She had fallen back.
She was hindered.
Her living experience washindered by the degeneration of
what she was dealing with.
(29:51):
That's what most of us dealwith now.
How we feel the depression, theanxiety, the disorders or
disruptions that we all gothrough is like drag that we've
just gotten used to.
So when people heal around usand improve their lives around
us, we see them as superior.
It's like no dude, I'm notsuperior to you, you're just
(30:14):
behind and below by your ownchoosing.
For the most part it's like ina sprint 100-meter dash, for
example and a track coach ofmine in college told me this and
I'll never forget it he's likeyou ever watch the 100-meter?
He's like, and you see thewinner pull away.
I was like, yeah, totally, he'slike.
(30:34):
The guy's not pulling away.
The other people have fallenoff.
In a race like that, it's aboutperfection.
You mess up a start and youlose.
You come up too soon, you lose.
You don't stay low enough, youlose.
I love the 100 meter.
Even though Noah Lyles in hispast Olympics had not the best
start, was still able to comefrom behind.
(30:54):
Rarely this happens.
Statistics do have fallibilityand this one is just a hair of
it, but for the most part, 99%of the time, the winner is the
guy person that just holds itand everybody else falls off.
So it's not that he's gettingfaster.
It's just that he hits top end,holds that speed and doesn't
(31:15):
fall off.
We are not becoming superhuman.
It's just that everybody else,man, is in such a deficit and
has perceived that to be normal,that we've accepted it and that
everything else around us isseemingly, or rather when
something is better than that.
We're like man.
Tony, he's in great shape.
This guy's a superhuman.
It's like nah dog.
(31:35):
I just took off the parachute.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
And it's I always talk about this too the cards
are stacked against us like it'sa, it's a thing where, where
the perception is oh, like yourmother since her 70s, is she
lifting weights?
No way, that can't be possible.
Oh, like, I eat this way.
Right, this is the americandiet.
Like my grandfather lived to,whatever, so like I could eat,
(32:01):
like he did, kind of thing.
It's just like, all right, thekids growing up today I feel bad
, like I feel bad for kidsgrowing up today because they're
the landscape of their food andtheir choices is very doctored
up for them, and in schools,outside of schools, the home and
people are perceived like thisis healthy because it says, oh,
(32:21):
whole grain.
This is healthy because it'sheart healthy cereal.
Give me a freaking break, right?
So I think again, you werementioning earlier this
grassroots thing that we aredoing.
It's catching on, it's startingto gain momentum, but there is
a lot of work that needs to bedone.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Yeah, and I can tell you from the front line right
now I'm working on a secondmaster's right now at university
of Texas and Austin innutritional science, to proceed
my doctorate in nutritionalscience and I'm listening to it.
You know from the horse's mouthhaving to evaluate the material
objectively, doing a lot ofcase studies.
(32:59):
You know epidemiologicalstudies, a lot of case studies,
epidemiological studies, a lotof reviews of RCTs and
randomized controlled trials andjust peer reviews over and over
and over and read, analyze,summarize, read, analyze,
summarize.
So it's like some of which Idefinitely don't agree with, and
it's like really putting me ina conflicting place.
But then when I realized likehey, you're just reporting the
data as it is, take youremotions out of it, it's okay,
(33:22):
your opportunity will come.
But places like the WorldCancer Research Fund, the
American Cancer Society, theAmerican Medical Association,
the American Health Association,american Heart Association, you
, they rather have put forth somuch information for such a long
time decades, generations, evenfor them to change their
(33:44):
positions on things.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
I mean.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
For you and I, Tony, it's like we're single people,
we're individuals, so werepresent families.
We have spheres of influence,friends, clients, people that
come to us, confide in us, lookup to us, whatever are
influenced by us.
But for break it down, it'sjust us.
Our decisions are going toaffect us alone, Regardless of
what's around us.
It's going to affect us alone.
(34:05):
We're not an organization likethe AMA, the ACS or any of those
others that I mentioned.
We haven't written hundreds ofthousands of journals or peer
reviews or had hundreds ofthousands of case studies with
millions of people, to whichwe've then given synopses and
promote it, or dispelled ordisseminated information to be
(34:28):
able to create a narrative or aposition that we stand behind
and then to which millions ofpeople adhere, to caregivers
that promote it, that forward it, and then patients that listen
and adhere.
For them to have to change thatinformation, for you and I to
say, hey, I'm a vegan today, I'ma carnivore tomorrow, fine, but
(34:51):
for them to do that, what aboutall those millions of people
who listen to that adviceotherwise, All those hundreds of
thousands of doctors andpractitioners that have taken
that, given it to patients, allof the people that have
subscribed over the years, thedecades, the generations, to the
way they've said is right orthis is the best way to fight
cancer, to prevent cancer, toreduce risk, to be as healthy as
possible, to combat diabetes,to try to stop metabolic
(35:16):
syndrome.
Like we're talking about aGoliath, of a consciousness.
So, yeah, we are in this verylittle grassroots movement and
it is a Herculean effort, butI'm very grateful to be where I
am because I'm in the thick ofit as far as in hearing the
information and hearing the sidethat it's coming from, which is
(35:37):
fine, and I see tremendousupside because it's not trying
to necessarily totally demonizethe other side but simply just
offer a different perspective.
Example this morning I had myweekly live Q&A and one of my
clients was asking me about areport that I had shared with
them and I'm sharing all of myschoolwork and findings and
(35:59):
everything I'm working on withmy community so that they can
actually see like look, this isliterally right from the
teaching pulpit.
Here's my breakdown, here'swhat I had to do, here's what I
think about it, here's the truthbehind it.
Evaluate for yourselves.
And she was asking like well,what do you think about that
study?
Because it talks a lot aboutred meat as being a increaser of
risk for cancer and, like thereport, I had to or rather the
(36:23):
subject I had to work on was howthe inclusion of fruits,
vegetables and whole grainshelps reduce the risk of cancer.
And when I got that originallyI was like oh God, typical, like
great I was like you feeltargeted, You're like.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
I think they're targeting me.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
No.
And so, you know, my professor,I was like, is there any way I
could do this one on processedfood removal instead?
Just because I was like, oh God, not this one.
But then I was like you knowwhat, it's not about my opinion.
Just find the report, find areport, a peer review, a journal
, and report on that.
It's inclusion or it's what itincludes.
(36:59):
It's like, fine, okay, I can dothis.
So reading that, I'm like God,this is crazy, like what they're
evaluating it on.
They're saying you know to notconsume it based on this and
that.
And she is asking me, my clientwell, how would you, you know,
how do you respond to that?
And I said, well, because youhave no other information about
(37:20):
these people, these patients,the participants.
You know we've got 10,000people ranging from 18 to 65.
I have no idea what they looklike, no idea what their
activity levels are like, noidea what the rest of their
diets are really like.
And all you're just hearing isthat you're talking about
including red meat just out ofnowhere on that.
So these people could be sickinternally, these people could
(37:43):
be sick physically, these peoplecould be completely sedentary,
abled, disabled, who knows?
And all of a sudden you'regoing to just drop red meat into
that and blame the red meat asan issue for causing a greater
or having a greater risk forcancer.
Well, if it's to the standardAmerican diet and adding more
(38:03):
red meat to a diet that isalmost sick, comprised of almost
60% of their carbohydratescoming from processed foods
rather, 60% of the diet comingfrom processed foods 57, I
believe it's 57% of calories ofthe standard American diet come
by way of refined carbohydratesand otherwise processed foods
(38:24):
57%.
So yes, if you add red meat tothat, could it be problematic?
Sure, I agree with that andthat is what these studies and
findings propose, because that'swhat they're based on.
That's what they evaluate.
They evaluate the people addValorum, what are they consuming
?
They're consuming a standardAmerican diet and if 57 to 60%
of their calories are comingfrom refined sugar or
(38:46):
carbohydrate sources andprocessed foods, then yeah,
adding red meat to that is goingto be probably problematic,
because the cancer probabilityrisk is not coming from the meat
, it's coming from the otherthings, from the processed foods
.
And sure enough, my classmateswho had processed food reduction
as their findings report and asfar as in efforts to reduce
(39:07):
cancer risk, found crazyincreases in probability and
risk for people that consumedprimarily by way of carcinogens,
even though red meat is alsoclassified as class 1, class two
depending on what type.
But to think about that isdumbfounding.
I give an example of theBrazilian steakhouse all the
time.
So right now we're breathingnitrogen.
(39:29):
78% of the air we breathe isnitrogen, not oxygen.
People think like I need someO2.
It's like no dude, you neednitrogen more than anything.
Nitrogen is what we breathe.
The majority of Nitrogen is anessential part of life.
It is an essential molecule,the atoms that it is.
Without them we cannot breatheright.
(39:51):
Oxygen is critical as well, butwithout nitrogen there's no
life in plants and air andground and soil and animals and
ourselves.
Nitrogen alone is quite inert,but when you combine nitrogen
two of them with one tall urine,you've got TNT.
(40:13):
So by itself it's inert.
But when you take two of thesesuckers and combine it with a
tall urine, you've got thisbeautiful, combustible,
flammable, explosive, volatilecompound of trinitrotallurine.
Brazilian Steakhouse Tony, everytime we go there the meat makes
me so sick.
No, Jake, the meat did not makeyou sick.
Those five baskets of pao dequeijo you had to start off the
(40:35):
meal, the triple whipped polentaand mashed potatoes, and then
all the spice and sugarplantains fried in vegetable oil
you smashed.
And then all the shit you gotfrom the salad bar, the double
dessert that you got, plus thetwo bottles of wine you drank.
That plus the meat, you'reright, that made you sick.
Meanwhile Tony ate just theconya beef ribs, some lamb chops
(40:59):
, couple of sausages, and he'sready to run a marathon
afterwards.
I'm ready to roll over in awheelbarrow and die and I don't
know how I'm going to drive home.
And you're like all right, dude, I'll see you later.
I'm high on life.
It's not the meat.
So the same thing from thosestudies.
It's not fair to blame meat ascausing a higher probability of
(41:20):
cancer risk when all those otherthings are on board.
Back to that TNT thing.
Nitrogen alone, meat is notgoing to be the harmful thing,
but when you combine it two ofthem with toluene.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
First and foremost, that was the most elegant way to
say that rant was veryelegantly put.
I love that it was way betterthan I've ever heard anybody
talk about the topic.
But you're right, I mean, someof these majority of the studies
are just epidemiological andit's all like survey based.
I think I had this, I think Ihad that and combination.
(41:58):
We don't know the activitylevel, we don't know what's
going on with the person, andthen we're just going to cherry
pick a lot of this, a lot of thedata to just prove the points.
But yeah, very, very well said,and I think I think that's
amazing too.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
I didn't know you were going back to school, so
you're going to get anadditional doctorate, or so I'm
a glutton for education in thebest way and I have a master's
in business and currently doingmy master's, my second master's,
but in nutritional science.
But I'm going to, I'm precedingthe doctorate with this.
(42:32):
This is kind of like my, mysegue into the doctoral.
So I'll be starting thathopefully, uh, the fall next
year.
I get accepted with all myradical idealisms and whatnot,
but yeah, that's, uh, that's thetruth.
Man is, is, um, you can't blamethings that are, like you said,
kind of cherry picked, whereyou've got epidemiological
studies showing correlation, notnecessarily causation.
(42:55):
And then you know things likeFFQs or food frequency
questionnaires.
You know this, working withindividuals, one-on-one, having
people log their food, countcalories, macros, what'd you eat
, how much was it?
Like we messed up all the time,even me, you like.
You know, during competition,during performance I'm prepping
for a race, prepping for a showmiss a corner or cut a corner
(43:15):
here and there miss a detail,like maybe.
So you're telling me when wegot like a hundred thousand
person survey, like what type of?
How good is the adherence?
And that's even one of theflaws written in the abstract or
in the in the synopsis of theuh, of the studies.
A lot of them is.
It's difficult to gauge theaccuracy based on the input from
(43:35):
the participants because theyare susceptible to fallibility.
Well duh.
And then on the food frequencyquestionnaire how many of this,
how much of that?
The list is massive.
There could be all kind ofvariables in there there,
whereas you know there's veryfew in the carnivore world.
On the low carb, zero carb,keto world, like, one of the
(43:58):
assessments that I did wascomparing three diet types in
their relationship to cancerrisk or increased, reduced risk
or increased risk.
And they were a Mediterraneandiet, a ketogenic diet and a
plant-based diet.
And the study concluded thatthe Mediterranean diet was the
(44:20):
best as far as an overallreduction for cancer risk.
Like, okay, that's fair.
This study, the reason theydispelled the ketogenic diet,
though the findings did showsubstantial reduction in overall
tumor size, ding, ding, dingand improved metabolic health to
(44:41):
the body ding, ding, ding.
Not enough information studyinghas been done in order for us
to be able to promote this as alikely place for reduced cancer
risk.
Plant-based diet a healthyversion of the plant-based diet
was proved to promote reduction.
By way of like, I want to sayit was like 12%, I forget
(45:03):
exactly Healthy.
And then they went on to sayand I love this part in contrast
, unhealthy versions of theplant-based diet were shown to
show substantial increased riskin cancer.
And I was like, imagine that.
So back to veganism,vegetarianism and processed
foods.
I have mad respect for the rawvegan.
(45:25):
Mad respect because that is alion heart of a commitment, mad
respect to the raw vegan.
If you're not a raw vegan andyou're a vegan, or you're a
plant-based eater and you're nota raw plant-based eater, get
off your high horse and notthinking that you're not
consuming tons of processedfoods because you are To create
(45:46):
the foods you eat.
They are processed literally.
Whether you think they'reethically, environmentally or
morally sound or right to createthem.
They're made in a factory, in alab, in a plant, processed to
be packaged, boxed and wrapped,whatever for you to ingest,
whereas your raw vegans who Ilike I said, respect the hell
(46:07):
out of that's as is, pick it andpull it, pick it, pull it, eat
it, that's it.
God bless you.
So this healthy versusunhealthy version of a
plant-based diet for cancer risk, reduced or increased?
I was like, okay, that makessense.
Like sure, less risk, thatshould.
That's based on their healthyversion, less processed version
versus higher risk.
(46:27):
Increased risk, yeah, causethey're probably eating a bunch
of wrapped garbage that's fullof heavy metals, mold toxins,
its own version of carcinogensand God knows what else.
But yeah, my job right now isjust to report the findings as
they are until I'm given aresearch forum to kind of
(46:48):
further delve into these thingswhich, like I said, I'm not
trying to prove law and createdogma and religion.
The job of science, the job ofa scientist is not to prove law
but to constantly test to tryand disprove your hypothesis.
And that's what I'm trying todo is to test in efforts to
(47:10):
disprove the hypothesis.
But we have to compare it tothe currently, you know,
acknowledged rhetoric andinformation in order to test it,
because I'm testing thathypothesis same time testing
mine.
So it'll be this you knowongoing, uh, tennis match of
like.
Does this work?
Does that not work?
Let's, we'll see what they say,what you guys think, and, yeah,
(47:31):
we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 1 (47:33):
You're hitting the nail on the head.
I, I was.
I was gonna say that the yetprocess, yes, but ultra
processed, ultra palatable, easyto consume, um and over consume
these products?
Oh yeah, it's, it's.
It's crazy, and I know becausewe've.
We've too.
(47:54):
Like you know, I've had a stintof veganism for like two years
and it got to a point where Icouldn't eat enough.
And then when I did eat thosethings, literally my gut was
just like oh my God, like I justfelt like crap, I didn't feel
right and we talked about theinflammation and all those
things.
But I know we're kind ofstrapped for time.
But the one thing I want tokind of end with we got to
(48:14):
there's going to be a part threeto this because we have so much
to cover.
You know, I wanted to kind oftalk about your coaching, kind
of plug that as well.
Clients or people, like justkind of the people that are
coming to you, what are like thetop three essential steps
someone can take to becomehealthier or just kind of take
their health into their ownhands a little bit.
So when you see people come in,whether it's metabolic,
(48:38):
metabolically unhealthy or theyjust want to be more fit in the
world.
What are just three thingsright off the bat.
You're like these are the threeessential things we got to
start with.
Speaker 2 (48:48):
Oh for sure.
Great, great question, greatquestion.
So my thesis for my research isthe single most effective thing
we can do as human beings inregard to our health is
controlling what we put into ourmouths.
It's not a powder, it's notmeditation, it's not grounding,
it's not exercise.
It's that Single, single, mostexercise.
(49:16):
It's that Single, single, most.
We can get all the sleep we want, but if we're not taking care
of this, it's not going tomatter.
You can drink all the water youwant, you can manifest, you can
ground, you can conjure, youcan create, you can zen your way
to wherever you think you wantto go.
But this is the key right here.
So, whether it's for businesscoaching, relationship repair,
(49:36):
ptsd, substance abuse, trying tokick a habit like that,
somebody just trying to lookbetter, feel better, doesn't
matter.
I'm going to ask you how yourdiet is?
No, jake, I'm here for businesscoaching Great, how's your diet
?
No, my wife and I are trying towork on our marriage Great,
how's your diet?
No, I'm here every time becausethis is the gateway.
(49:57):
It's the gateway to belief,it's the gateway to
understanding and it's the firstplace to where you will
acknowledge an understanding ofimportance of that.
Because as long as that's beingmanipulated.
You talked about how we'reeating and how we feel based on
what we're eating.
I had a great conversation withDr Stephanie Rimka the other
(50:20):
day talking about pleasurebeings.
Unfortunately, we have freewill working against us and this
terrible thing called thetongue working against us, and
she was she corrected me reallywell she's like whoa, whoa, whoa
.
The tongue is a fantasticallypleasurable thing you know, and
(50:44):
she's, and she's big, um big insexual health also.
So she's like, she's like I needthat tongue and and it was
making me blush a lot, but shesays it much more eloquently
than I do, but nonetheless thetongue is a very important and
pleasurable muscle that we need.
And she kind of rephrased whatI was trying to say in the sense
(51:04):
that, yeah, our perception oftaste and flavor has been so
thwarted and manipulated that weare just pleasure seekers for
food rather than out of need.
Everything is hedonic asopposed to homeostatic.
That's not saying that we haveto eat only for utility and
purpose.
It shouldn't be enjoyable.
I love eating steak, I know youlove eating steak.
(51:26):
We love eating the way we dobecause it tastes good, it feels
good, it makes us feel great.
We don't do it because it'smiserable.
But contrast is that so much ofour understanding and
familiarity now with eating istotally based on hedonism, on
that hedonic, pleasurable senseof.
Give me that easy dopamine,like the chemical engineering of
(51:50):
these foods, how they arecreated in order to induce those
reactions.
Yeah, that's where we go wrong.
That's where pleasure is nowbeing misinterpreted and abused,
and perverted was the word sheused.
It's very true.
So for me, that first thing iswe got to figure out your diet.
I got to know what's going onin there, because I need you to
(52:11):
believe yourself, I need you tounderstand, to take off the mask
, to remove the blockages thatare existing, the dream killers
of substance that you're puttingin your body, that you won't be
able to believe in yourbusiness, you won't be able to
relate to or understand yourpartner, you won't be able to
walk away from that habit or beable to think and be happy,
(52:33):
getting rid of the PTSD, letalone like look, you touched on
it before Help me get biceps,Tony.
Help me get a butt, tony.
Help me become healthier, getstronger, feel better, move
better equates to looking better.
You do those in reverse.
It's not guaranteed.
I've got a masterclass inlooking great and feeling like
(52:57):
shit, not being healthy, notbeing that mobile Masterclass.
Did it as a fitness model, didit as a bodybuilder.
But as opposed to feel better,truly, by becoming healthier, by
getting stronger, by movingbetter, you're going to
inevitably look better.
So, talking about the diet firstimpressing on people, working
(53:18):
from the inside out in order tohave the outside be a reflection
of what's truly within there,and then that you got to trust
the process, man.
You got to trust the process.
You have to show up and youhave to be consistent.
Those are kind of all three inone, but diet number one, inside
out perspective number two, andtrust in the process Number
(53:39):
three.
Speaker 1 (53:40):
You got me all jacked up right now.
That was a great season.
Speaker 2 (53:45):
It's football season, dude, you know like there's a
lot of great coaches out there,there's a lot of great players
out there, so there's plenty ofbuzzwords and you know like
people talking about thesethings and you see these
successful coaches.
I was watching, uh, you know,yesterday, the, the women's
softball coach from oklahomashame on me for for not
remembering her name, but pattyuh, shame on me, but they're
(54:07):
working on four nationalchampionships in a row right now
.
She's got, I think, a total ofnine over there.
15 conference championships,like just 1,500 wins, I believe.
Something just insanely likeinsane stats.
And her talking to Pat McAfeeyesterday, who was just
previously talking to Nick Saban.
(54:27):
It's like they all say the samething Trust in the process,
belief, belief in yourself,commitment to a higher purpose,
you know, surrendering to thathigher purpose, and just the
consistency to stay with it.
Speaker 1 (54:39):
Having, uh, having a standard right like that's.
That's the standard there's novariation of it.
That's the standard for everyday.
That's the standard.
But I know you got to take offum real quick.
Where can people find you andconnect with you if they want to
reach out to Life Like Jake?
Speaker 2 (54:56):
You said it right there Every channel, all the
socials, everything is Life LikeJake.
So YouTube, tiktok, instagram,online, lifelikejakecom
everywhere and anywhere to getin touch with me.
Just look up Life Like Jake andyou'll find me and you'll find
me Awesome, Amazing.
Speaker 1 (55:12):
Well, appreciate the time.
It's great talking to you again.
There's so much more to cover.
We'll do another one upcoming,but thanks for everybody
listening again to anotherepisode of the Primal
Foundations Podcast.
Thank you all for joining us.
If you enjoyed this episode,don't forget to subscribe, like
and share.
See you all next time on thePrimal Foundations podcast.
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