July 8, 2025 • 56 mins
In this episode of Printing's Alive, Warren Werbitt is joined by futurist Elatia Abate to explore the evolving landscape of the printing industry. They discuss how to balance current strategies with future AI advancements and the importance of embracing change over linear thinking. Reflecting on lessons from COVID, they highlight the value of human interaction and maintaining a positive mindset. The conversation delves into AI's role in communication, emotional intelligence, and ethical considerations. Elatia shares insights on AI conferences and steps for business integration, emphasizing the need for a future-led strategy.
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(00:10):
Everybody, I wanna welcome you back to anotheredition of the Printing's Alive podcast with,
you know it, another special guest, as all myguests are special.
So today we have Elisha Abate, the futurist.
How are you?
I'm fantastic, how are you?
I'm so glad to be here.
Ah, I'm thrilled that you're here.
(00:31):
So you are not my normal guest.
I mean, you're normal, but as I explained-Don't know about that.
Okay, well, we don't know what normal is, butyou know, you're not like the rest of us, not
that we're normal, and I'm certainly notnormal.
But, so we were, I'm in the world of the printworld, everything print, anything print, and
(00:54):
that's usually what I have on here, but we haveyou on today because I've seen you a couple of
times and we've spoken a couple of times andI'm just like, just wowed with, you know, the
whole thinking and what it is you're doing.
So before we start, just give us a brief, likea three liner on, I mean, go four if you want,
(01:15):
on what it is you do.
Yes, so the market would call me a futurist,which to me means going out to the edge of
disruption.
So looking at all the big things that arechanging our world and disrupting how we do
business and disrupting how we think aboutstrategy and leadership, and translating those
dynamics into tools, strategies, and frameworksthat companies and people can use to create
(01:40):
results right now.
And I think, so when I hear futurist, I thoughtcard reader,
Yeah.
Fortune teller.
I think they do.
Right?
I was hoping you were gonna bring your crystalball on, but I see you Yeah,
Ray Dalio actually has a great quote from hisbook, The Changing World Order.
(02:00):
It's, and I'm paraphrasing here, but it'ssomething like, He who reads a crystal ball or
something like that is destined to eat glass.
And that's kind of how that works in this spaceof futurism.
It is not about divination and much more aroundperception, pattern recognition, and then
proactively creating a future that you want.
(02:24):
Cool.
So this is actually pretty funny.
Well, funny to me.
You know, you're a futurist and I'm in theprinting world, and the printing world today,
and some people probably get angry at me, butthey all are, so it doesn't matter, but the
printing industry is so backend backwards andslow to change, right?
(02:45):
That's not to say that we don't have someamazing people and some awesome companies that
are leading the charge and making the changeand doing what they have to.
But if I had to do it on a scale of like, youknow, one to 10, how many people are doing,
it's very low.
So kudos to those of you that are, and I won'tmention any names, because I don't wanna make I
(03:09):
don't wanna make the others feel bad.
I don't worry about them feeling good, it's theothers, right?
Yeah.
So I find in our industry, no matter what ishappening, it is slow.
If equipment technology is changing and it'svery expensive for us to buy things, A lot of
companies are very slow in questions.
Some are so slow that they wait too long,they're too late, but they don't know it and
(03:32):
they still do it.
Same thing with people.
Some companies I talk to about AI, even thoughAI is exploding, although, you know, we should
always know AI has been around for twentyyears, we only heard about it two and a half
years ago as the average human, and now we'reall experts, and it's changing our lives, but
there's a lot of people still who are fightingit, or looking the other way and don't wanna
(03:57):
get involved.
We have owners that are 75 and 80 that have notrelinquished control of decision making.
I'm not even talking shares any of that, Justwithin the company.
So, you know, here we have you futurist.
(04:19):
What do you say when you start talking withpeople, when you start talking with companies
about change that needs to happen?
Yeah, yeah, so the most critical thing that Ithink that I do is really help set the context
and level for what's happening right now, orcertainly what's happening right now as I
(04:41):
perceive it through the lens of almost a decadeof research and study and creating solutions
for the big answers to the questions of thefuture of work and strategy.
And because my sense is, and by the way, Idon't think that print is in any way special in
this sense of some folks are not paying anyattention to AI and some folks are really out
(05:05):
at the cutting edge and there are all kinds offolks in between.
I think this is more prevalent or present thanwe might imagine.
Certainly oftentimes I walk into rooms wherereally smart people and I am surprised by the
lack of urgency around what's happening rightnow.
So all that to say, not so uncommon and thereason that I got into this work as a futurist
(05:32):
in the first place is that the size, and scopeof the velocity of disruption in our world is
so great and is continuing to increase that ifwe don't figure out how to upgrade our
thinking, our strategy, how it is that we dothings, then fundamentally, at least from a
business context, there's an expiration date onwhat it is that we're pursuing.
(05:54):
And so by level setting context anddemonstrating the degree of disruption that's
occurring, what that means and what that impactis for business, not only like what is the risk
that we're mitigating, but what is the upsidepotential that we're leaving on the table if we
don't do this, then that sort of sets a levelplaying field.
(06:15):
Because one of the things that I'm extremelypassionate about in this conversation is
eliminating the gatekeeping around it.
Because AI, I believe, is and should be foreverybody, And so the more we can make wherever
anybody is today fine, the easier it is forfolks to get on the on ramp.
(06:35):
And not everybody has to carry everythingthemselves in a company.
Yeah.
I mean, from the young people out there, Ithink we've learnt one thing, we don't need to
work five, six and seven days a week, becausewe're not on this planet to do that spend 82%
of our time working and 18% of our time to findout how to be leisurely.
(06:56):
I think it should be the other way around.
And I think AI has given us the ability, topotentially make some changes in our own lives
and how we do it.
So what would you say to people or to someonewho has, I don't know idea what you're talking
about, and you're talking to people, notcompanies, about starting to reflect and look
(07:20):
at what they're doing and how they maybe startto make changes, or the simple steps to take,
because everything everyone talks soundssimple, nothing is simple when it sounds it.
Yes, exactly.
And that's the beauty of like folks who arereally talented at what they do is distilling
extremely complex stuff into understandablebites so that you can then start to get excited
(07:44):
about diving in, and then the complexitydoesn't quite seem as complex.
So the basics are the following, right?
If we think about how fast things are changing,over time, and we can call this even the last
fifty, sixty years, the pace of change hasshifted from centuries to seasons to seconds.
(08:07):
And this is data that's pretty easily, youknow, available out in the world, but it took
the telephone nine hundred months, seventy fiveyears, to get to a 100,000,000 users.
It took ChatGPT as a tool two months to get tothat
meeting.
And
so it's the the that scope of differential inthe speed of change is so enormous that we
(08:34):
can't anymore just keep executing on whateverit is that we're doing to deliver today, today,
today, and relegate innovation or futureforward thinking to like that one week or two
days at an off-site with leadership.
The leadership tool that can help have accessto this or that can provide some access is what
I call simultaneous strategy.
(08:55):
So it's the ability to do both now producingresults focused work and future forward, future
incorporated thinking at the same time, andwhether that's an expansion of cognitive
capacity or the kinds of folks who you have onyour team who are able to do both at the same
time, This again allows you, it sets you up tocontinue to take advantage of whatever has had
(09:19):
your business be successful up until now, butalso not be the dinosaur and lose out on the
enormous opportunity that is unfolding aroundus.
So how many people, or what percentage ofpeople do you find that you meet that could
actually do both things at once?
It's a learned practice.
(09:40):
Find, and it is available to everybody.
So again, this is not like an only some specialgroup of folks are able to do this.
I find the people who are best able to do thishave some kind of experience either in improv
comedy of some kind, like they've taken classesat Second City or Gotham or something, they've
done some work around design thinking or userSo they've had to contemplate both, like, how
(10:07):
is it that the world is shifting and what is itthat's occurring right now?
So those kinds of folks tend to be easilyadaptable to this kind of work.
Where I have found folks who have a little bitmore challenge are people who are linear
process thinkers.
So I must have X in order to have Y in order tohave Z, or people who are-
(10:30):
Those sound like the accountants.
Yes, very much so, like operational folks whoare operationalizing things, keeping the
trains, you know, on track and on time.
And it's simply an additive to a way ofthinking.
It's not a replacement of that because it isvaluable, but that's, at least in my
experience, that's where I've seen folks whoare a little bit more easily inclined to that,
(10:53):
and then folks who have a little bit more of achallenge.
Oh, the other folks who have a real challengewith this tend to be either of the academic or
the pessimistic type and or both.
Right?
Academics are trained to look for what's wrong,right, in the design of arguments and the
design and rightly so for what it is that theydo.
(11:13):
But if you're always looking for what's wronginstead of what's possible, you're going to
have a hard time adapting to some of thecutting edge future stuff that's out here.
That also just sounds so negative, alwayslooking for what's wrong instead of just
looking for what's right.
Right?
Yeah.
Or even what's possible.
Right?
And oftentimes when I run workshops, less inkeynotes, because it's not exactly the dynamic
(11:38):
for that, but what I do at the beginning is Icreate a set of well, we, all the participants,
co create some agreements that we're gonna workwith, like ways of working for our time
together, and one of them is always gettingcurious and seeking the possible as opposed to,
again, what's wrong or how we've always donethings.
(11:59):
Well, you gave me hope because just this pastyear I did two levels of improv.
So now you gave me the motivation to continueand go to Most
valuable skill that I've, I had my firstexperience with improv in high school, thanks
to Jeff Crowley, my drama teacher, shout out toJeff, and by far and away, the most valuable
(12:25):
set of skills that I have used throughout mycareer.
Well, if it does anything, it takes away thatsense of vulnerability and insecurity, and you
you're out there and you're starting off whenyou're practicing before you're in front of an
audience, and you know, you're just, anyone whowatches whose line it is anyways, it's probably
(12:45):
the most popular improv stuff done that youwould know, and you're going out there and
you're just, you know, you're on the spot givensomething, and then you're just kind of doing
it, and what you learn is, you do what youwant.
It's up to the other people to think what theywant, right?
You're not doing Yeah,
and it's this dance of action, reaction,action, reaction, and as opposed to negating,
(13:12):
right?
So the first rule of improv is yes, and.
Whatever appears in the space, we agree thatit's here as opposed to saying the no, but.
And from that place, again, it sets thefoundation for everything is possible.
Like, of course, this absurd thing that we justtalked about unfolded in front of Of course,
there's an alien sitting in the room right now.
Of course, there's an elephant sitting on yourhead.
(13:34):
No matter how absurd it is, so you begin to seewhat's possible even if you don't know how yet.
And that's critical in the space of future andfuture forward strategy.
Yep.
And I think if the people sitting in theaudience that are watching improv and laughing,
because they're there, I wish all of them wouldtake that out when they go back into society,
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and look at a lot of things in the same way,and then it wouldn't be as serious or critical
at times when there's no need, right?
Because when you do that, you ended up buildingup this, I'll call it anxiety and stress all
around you.
Because where that comes from is the need orthe perceived need to control what's going on.
(14:19):
Like, if I just hold tighter, if I just controlthese things more, if I just do this, then
everything's gonna be okay, and I'm gonna beable to plan everything, and the world's gonna
continue to be how I want it to be.
And I just don't think that's the world thatwe're living in anymore.
And in the face of this, this is another thingthat I will often say at the beginning of my
speeches, and you've heard me provoke thisquestion before, that in the face of all of
(14:42):
this change that's happening, we have thisfundamental choice.
And we can either ignore it or wish we couldignore it and say, Why is this happening to us?
And hide under the couch and hope that it allgoes away.
Or we can step into the much more effective andmore empowering space and ask, given that this
is here, given that this is happening, what dowe want to create?
(15:02):
And again, those are all rooted in improv kindsof questions and experiences that allow for
possibility as opposed to sort of swirlingaround what's wrong.
And I take a lot of things that I've learned atCOVID because in COVID, it was new for all of
us.
We were all trapped for lack of better, youknow, wording, unless maybe you lived in
(15:27):
Florida then you were free to roam.
But you know, but I learned that there'snothing that important that you have to lose
your mind over and make yourself sick andcrazy.
Everybody knows it, everyone will wait if theyhave to, break away from that first initial
objection to say, okay, tomorrow, right?
(15:49):
The whole pleasing thing to try to please, pullback a little, and no one's gonna kill you if
you don't do a certain thing on a certain day,you just have to know, like back then, today,
to set the time that works for you or thedelivery date that you need to, you know, like
someone says, oh, could you deliver somethingon a Friday?
(16:11):
I'm like, are you working on the weekend or isMonday okay?
Yeah.
Why get the whole place running crazy onThursday, Friday to pack and ship when that
company might work on the weekend and could doit and could ship it on a Monday and get out
some other important stuff for other clientsthat are needed on the Friday?
I think we've got a lot of priorities mixed upin what we do or how we think.
(16:35):
And that goes into that space of co createdagreements, right?
Agreements versus And co created agreementsabout how we work, being clear about what we're
delivering and what are the resources that thatwill take.
And then being, you know, there's somethingthat I've learned over the years is that, you
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know, people who are up to really big things,people who are creating stuff in the world, by
function of the complexity of the things thatare going on, are not always able to keep their
word 100% of the time.
However, you can honor your word, and that'sreally critical in strong communication, and a
lot of that has to do with, like, what do youdo when the world is getting disrupted this
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quickly and things are scary and seeminglymoving very quickly and we need some space to
make decisions?
You can, instead of breaking your back todeliver on something that someone else maybe
didn't even want anyway, being able to stepinto a position and say, I know I promised you
X.
This is what we're facing.
(17:37):
Here are three ways that we could resolve forit.
I wanna ensure that we do it in a way that'sbest gonna meet what you need.
And so it's, you know, in so many ways, thethings that are strengths for helping us thrive
in the face of all the disruption, and inparticular, the technological disruption, are
rooted in really strong human interaction andconnection.
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And you said a key word that I think often getsoverlooked and not done well, and that's
communication, right?
Something I've learned again and again andagain, and probably will continue to keep
learning is, you know, times when you don't saysomething because you're fearful or you're
worried about what the response is gonna be,nine and a half out of 10 times when you go and
(18:25):
you actually get it out, even if it's a littlelate, the reaction is okay.
But in our heads, we get so fearful about whatthe response might be, right?
Predicting what's gonna be.
And I try to tell people, don't predict.
Like I practice it Don't assume.
Yeah, yeah, you make up a fantasy aboutsomething that may or may not be true.
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And that's rooted in a whole thing.
There's a great book, It's several years oldnow, but it's called Straight Line Leadership.
It's written by this guy named Dusan Ducic.
And one of the distinctions that he talks aboutin there is serving versus pleasing people.
And, you know, people pleasing is like a sneakylittle thing that many of us have learned over
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time.
But the funny thing about people pleasing isthat on the surface, we are doing it to We tell
ourselves a story that we're doing it to makethe other person happy, But really underneath
it, we're doing it to soothe our own weirdnessabout whatever, right?
But we're not soothing.
We're killing ourselves because it's not And,
yeah, and that's the even sneaky part of it,right, is that it totally backfired.
(19:33):
Well, sooner or later, that is a strategy thatjust doesn't work.
I just had that conversation yesterday withsomeone, something to do with me and responding
to someone, and I was telling them how Iresponded and they said, well, thoughtful
response, but you need to stop pleasing.
They're good, but it's gonna have no benefit toyou after.
(19:55):
Yeah, yeah.
Right?
So That's
Yeah, mhmm.
And I guess if I had the conversation yesterdayand you're bringing it up today, I said
somebody's sending me a real signal that that'simportant.
I was gonna pay attention to, yeah, for
So, I'm gonna have to make notes on that oneand go back, but, know, it's funny because I'm
hearing it from a couple of different peopledoing different things.
(20:16):
So when that happens, you really, I, I'll talkonly from the me, I have to go, wow, someone is
sending a signal messaging that I need to grabonto that I will need to use going forward,
Right?
Absolutely.
I I find that the universe whispers to us, andthen it will start to communicate a little more
(20:42):
loudly, and then it will start to shout.
And in my experience, it's better not to waitfor the flash bang.
It's better to listen when the message isquiet.
You know, if used mindset as a word inthinking, you just said the universe, I used to
listen to someone who always used to say, I'mputting it out in the universe with like, with
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a big, you know, a big, your hands up and a bigcall, and I used to laugh.
And then a few years ago, when I went throughsome stuff and then I started working to
rebuild, person I was working with and stilltoday, talked about the universe, talked about
putting it out there.
And it's a mindset thing because when I hitthat point, I was as low as low can go.
(21:26):
And I was doing anything to get up.
And I started to like, kind of say, okay, I'mputting it out there loud, I'm positive, I'm
putting it.
And not to be funny, but the energy that comesback really works, you know, along with the
meditation and some breathing exercises that weall take for granted breathing, game changers.
(21:47):
Yeah, well, total game changers.
And if you want to talk about, from thefuture's perspective, like what are some of the
leadership abilities and shifts that we need tomake, you hit on the core of one of them, which
is what I call business beyond the brain.
And this is in response to something that Irealized a few years ago that the quantity of
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input that we're receiving is so enormous thatour brain just, you know, our brains that
evolved linearly and locally literally can'tprocess it.
We already don't consciously process most ofthe information that we're getting in.
And so leadership shifts from a solelyintellectual exercise to one that's fully
(22:32):
embodied and a place from which we're creatingand leading and strategizing from a fully
anchored position in our humanity.
So what do people do?
Like we're talking and good, get it.
A lot of people listening or hearing theseconcepts, thoughts for the first time are
(22:56):
probably going, what, what, what?
But even, you know, so I go when I'm at aconference and I hear you and I hear others,
and I'm like freaking out because this is justgame changing, life lifting, and then I leave,
then I get home, and then I take my laundryout, and then I go to bed, and then I wake up,
and then I'm trying to find that energy that Ihad at the conference that I don't necessarily
(23:20):
have right now because I'm alone and there's noone to look at and give them a nudge and a high
five and a woah, what do we do?
Yeah, so the first thing, and what I attempt todo when I'm speaking or working with folks is
even in the space of a keynote, provide someactionable questions or frameworks that you
(23:40):
can, should one choose to, leave that day andstart to implement with.
But there's one of the leadership models thatI've developed over time is something that I
call regenerative resilience.
And it's in the fit, because why?
Well, resilience just in general, HarvardBusiness Review and McKinsey and Psychology
Today, everyone's like, this is one of thebiggest leadership things, everyone should have
(24:02):
it.
Resilience is fundamentally exhausting.
And especially when the disruption and changethat we're facing is not going to end, it's
just not.
The game is not how do I wait to get back tonormal and then reset myself?
It's how do we take and channel this disruptioninto something that will help us grow and
(24:25):
thrive, help our businesses grow and thrive,and in fact, energize us?
So under the umbrella of regenerativeresilience, there are three pillars to that
framework.
There's clarity, there's fearlessness, andthere's connection.
And under that umbrella of clarity, like Ican't tell you how powerful this is.
It is, first and foremost, getting super clearabout what it is that you wanna create.
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And you've heard me ask these three questionsbefore.
What do I wanna create?
What kind of impact do I wanna have?
And how do I wanna use my life for the life ofthe business?
By answering those things, you know where it isthat you're going.
Even if it's not, I want, you know, revenue xor position y, you have a general sense of
where you're going, the next layer of things isdefining what you value.
(25:10):
So what is it that you value about thatdestination?
Is it the financial freedom?
Is it the social impact?
Is it the adventure?
Is it whatever it might be for you?
And having those two things then comes as clearpiece of boundaries.
Now you know what to say yes or what to say noto.
Because anything, any conversation you'rehaving, any action you're taking, any strategy
(25:32):
you're planning is either aligned with theoutcome that you're looking for or it's not.
And that brings a sense of empowerment andexcitement and clarity, yeah, really around
what it is that you're creating.
So that is probably no.
As we said earlier, it's, like, simplest,simplest meaning I don't know how easy it is or
(25:55):
not, but it's those three questions.
It's defining the things that you value, andit's saying yes to what's aligned and no to
what isn't.
And you'll notice that in that sense ofclarity, I didn't say what AI tool you should
be learning how to use.
I didn't say what software business process oneshould be updating because any tool that you're
(26:16):
picking, any technology that you're going toinvest in must be linked to these outcomes that
you're looking to drive, And that will thenhelp cascade into the more tactical, practical
decisions around technology and training andthat kind of implementation.
I think a lot of people have to go back to thedrawing board and rethink the way they do
(26:37):
things.
Yeah.
Right?
And even at the end, when you were saying, youknow, the software AI tool, I think a lot of
people are thinking, what tool can I use tohelp change the way I'm thinking?
Which is backwards, and me and some others, I'mtelling everyone, you talk about AI, because
some are talking like it's the holy grail, I'msaying refer to it as a tool only.
(27:02):
A tool in your toolbox, and don't make it likethe best tool, the biggest tool or the only
tool, right?
Because there's still other processes anddifferent steps people can take to do things.
AI makes it a little easier, but it's notgonna, what do they say?
I mean, it's all new.
(27:22):
So it's a new saying.
If you're an expert using AI, it'll enhancewhat you do and make it more clearable, I don't
know if that's a word, but it'll make it, Imake up a lot of words, it'll make it easier
for other people to understand, right?
But if you are not an expert using AI and thenyou think you're an expert after, everyone's
(27:44):
gonna know you don't know what you're talkingabout.
Yeah, yeah.
And so this is my perspective and my opinion.
Intelligence doesn't go away.
Humanities doesn't go away.
Strong strategic thinking and criticalreasoning don't go away, in this phase that
we're in right now of AI development and, youknow, as it's continuing to get smarter and
(28:08):
better at what it does.
Now, I do think it's critical to split theconversation between business fundamentals and
then sort of AI in a more philosophical lens.
Business fundamentals, and this is where somany businesses get stuck.
So for those who are listening and you're like,how should I implement AI?
Should I train everybody on ChatGPT or Claudeor, you know, whatever?
(28:30):
Fill in the blank.
By the way, this is gonna be a mini clipbecause it's not important.
Back to this, anything that you're gonna trainsomebody on should be connected to a business
outcome that you're looking to drive.
Are you increasing revenue?
Do you need to make your sales process moreconsumer friendly?
(28:53):
Do you are your operations hitting a speedbump?
If you have tactical problems that you canmeasure and use AI to help you solve them,
start there and have it be linked to somethingthat's actually gonna drive something for your
business value as opposed to just like AIglitter.
You know?
Like, let's just do whatever it takes.
(29:14):
Now the other split of this conversation,though, which is where the futurists more
futurist piece comes into play is there arethree levels with which one can think about AI.
AI as a tool, AI as a collaborator, and AI as aconsciousness.
And it can be all three at the same time, but Ifind that parsing and thinking, particularly
(29:36):
with the large language models that learn fromour presence and interaction with them, that
quality of interaction, if I am interactingwith something as a tool, it is serving me, I
am commanding and controlling.
But if we are collaborating on something, thenit's a different kind of experience or
interaction.
(29:56):
Or if we're two human beings collectivelybuilding something, there's an interdependence
there and human empathy piece that might bemissing in some of the other spaces.
Well, yeah, the one thing with the AI is thereis no emotion, right?
Yes, there is.
Yet, yet.
(30:17):
And
the research is telling us that it is capableof understanding cues of emotional
intelligence, and the data is leaning toward weactually do get better results if we treat it
kindly, even though it's economically, and asfar as energy use is concerned, even though it
costs more, the results that you're getting arebetter.
(30:40):
I started off using it going, please, thankyou, and like, as if I'm talking to my friend,
then I heard somebody say, you know, they'rekind of asking you not to do that because it's
using up the space, the tokens, and it'scosting more.
And then I'm thinking, that's not my problem.
You put it out here, you created it, I'm gonnamake it what I want it to be.
(31:02):
Well, yeah, and if we think about what, it evenif okay.
Let's just take a consciousness piece of aconversation out of it.
If this is a tool that is interacting andlearning with humanity, don't we want it to be
biased toward the better qualities of humanity,which are treating each other with respect,
(31:24):
which are, you know, someone I think one of thecofounders of Google, I don't remember who it
was, but it's like bubbling out in the memeverse these days.
And it's like, if you threaten AI, it'll giveyou better results.
And, like, okay.
But over what period of time?
Right?
And because as human beings, I don't know ifyou've ever had a boss who is not or worked
(31:46):
with somebody who is toxic in that way.
Oh god, no.
Right?
Right?
It's like, sure.
For a period of time, I will perform betterunder that kind of pressure, but at some point
burnout is coming.
And so it's really, I think, is a question ofwhat is this world and future that we're
looking to create?
Do we want an AI and working environmentsbecause AI will be colleague coworker who only
(32:15):
respond to negativity and cruelty, or do wewant an environment where we're speaking
positivity into the space?
Yeah, well, always positive, because negativedoesn't get you anywhere.
It doesn't, not at, not at the long term, likethat's-
You know?
Yeah.
I mean, even AI, so AI in one area that wasgreat was, you know, I have to write an email
(32:37):
that was a nasty email, because I wasn't happy,and started off with all the F bombs, and I
knew I wasn't gonna send that one, but I justlet it go, because it was therapy, then I put
it into AI, I just said, can you recraft thisemail to get this point across, Not to make me
sound negative, not to make me sound evil orrevengeful.
(32:59):
And then it put out this email and I'mthinking, Oh my God, the new me.
How beautiful.
Yeah.
You and I have talked about this before.
It's also a great tool for helping shape reallydifficult conversations.
So if anybody is a recovering people pleaser oryou have to have a difficult conversation with
anyone in your environment, I have found it tobe an enormously useful tool to help shape
(33:25):
conversations that are direct, that arepowerful, that don't apologize for your
position, but are still empathetic in in theirdelivery.
So I found it enormously useful for this kindhuman interaction.
Also gives you things that you probably wouldnot think about ever on your own that you think
it's so simple that would come to your mind, itwouldn't even come close.
(33:46):
I mean, last year's Imagine, it was, and I'mgonna get the names mixed up, but I think it
was Adam Sack and Andy Brot, or Andy Brot andAdam Sack, one of the, those two fellows,
right?
Really, really smart, smart, smart guys.
And when they were up talking and they said,you know, we're greatest partners and we always
(34:06):
get along, but every now and again, we hit aroadblock and we turned to our third co founder
for help.
And he was referring to chat.
It's factual, there's no emotion, still gottacheck it.
And I thought from that day forward, I lookedat it in a different way, the Aon, different,
you know, using for different purposes, becausethose guys are really smart.
(34:29):
If they trust it, then I have to give it atleast the chance to trust it and not be so
skeptical and pessimistic about it.
Yeah, yeah, and bringing one's own discernmentto the conversation, right?
This data that just came out from MIT thatsays, that's talking about the cognitive debt,
(34:52):
which cognitive debt, as they're defining it,is or as is defined, I guess, in general,
because I had to look that up.
Wanted to make sure that I was clear about
what you're looking after just from everythingyou just said.
Like, what what does the action mean?
But it's apparently, it's as I read andunderstand it, it's essentially what happens
when and you just get the answer, but you don'tknow how you got there, right?
(35:13):
Like you guessed the right answer on a quiz,hooray, you got the right answer, but you
couldn't explain to me, like, these are thefour steps that I would need to do for the
actual problem solving.
And this is one of those places where I think,especially in this interim time as the tools
are developing, utilizing your own discernmentand your own sense of reality and sensibility
(35:35):
around quality and nuance inside ofconversations is critically important, but use
the tools.
And this is different from also different from,like, way back in the day when Excel was first,
you know, online or PowerPoint or whatever, andit took a million thousand years to, you know,
learn every nuance and start to and there isn'tthat barrier isn't there anymore.
(36:01):
And what's so rich and, you know, what I loveabout how you and I met, that there are so many
really smart people in many, many all allindustries who are utilizing and discovering
and on the hunt for AI tools that are used ininteresting and creative ways.
And so it's fun to not know how to doeverything yourself because then we get to
(36:24):
reach out to each other and say, hey, I've beenworking on a problem.
Are you using anything that helps solve thiskind of problem?
Do you know anybody who is using this kind ofthing?
And the community and connection and creativitystrengthens.
Well, was like the Imagine AI conference.
That was what was amazing because there wasnot, okay, maybe it's one, but there was really
not one person in that whole ensemble of peoplewho would not turn to the person beside them
(36:51):
and ask them something.
Where I'm sure like we have experienced at alot of other conferences, people don't talk
to this is one of the things, and plug to ourcommunity at Imagine AI Live, this is one of
the reasons why I love being a part of it somuch, is this collective sense of discovery and
(37:15):
exploration and care and caring for otherpeople.
The first day of the conference this year, thegathering this year, was all of these workshops
where people were sharing how to do many, many,many, many, many things.
No secrets.
No secret.
And that goes back to this notion that wetalked about earlier of like no gatekeeping.
(37:37):
I love this about this community.
And it really, you know, speaking of the thingsthat like you leave the conference like, but
how are you still jazzed about the things?
That connection, which again, you'll notice isanother human, very human piece of it, is what
makes the ongoing work not only possible, but,you know, like keeps the excitement and the
fuel underneath it.
(37:59):
You know, I've on a chat group, a WhatsAppgroup with like the founding members and a
bunch of the, yeah, founding members ofspeakers, and I mean, what is it, three weeks
ago?
There's chat every day.
It's a birthday, or somebody did something,went somewhere, or Alex was from Vegas, he went
(38:21):
to, I think, Google conference or something,and then he ended up in Chicago with Steve and
Dave Vince and everything, and now he's back inRome and he was going to Germany, but it's all
on there.
We all know, actually I have Alice coming onthe podcast on Friday.
Wanna try it.
He's amazing for teaching, right?
I want people to pick up on him to get morecomfortable with how easy it is once you It's
(38:45):
easy once you listen and understand a littlebit.
Yeah.
And the great thing about One of the thingsthat I really appreciate about space and just
of AI and particularly the large languagemodels and the tools that you can interact
with, there's a lot of space forexperimentation.
(39:05):
And if you don't know how something is workingor why something is working the way it's
working, you can say you can ask, So why didyou give me that answer?
What do you think makes this a strong answer ora strong solution?
And where might you see there being somechallenges or holes in the argument that you
presented to me?
So you can go learning together with it, whichfor me, as someone who is a very intellectually
(39:32):
curious person, I find that co learning dynamicreally exciting.
Well, I'm loving with the AI, and I love nowthat you get to do speak, because you don't
have to type everything, so it gets a littleeasier.
I'm having conversations about just differentthings, not even realizing that I'm going in,
it's a conversation that a half hour's passed,and I've asked a couple things, and then it
(39:55):
asked me things to, you know, to work on whatthe answers it's giving me and expanding on it.
And then I'm like, oh my God.
I know.
Nobody ever has to be alone anymore.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it's it can be an enormous enrichment.
And my my philosophy around this is that AI isreally a human empowerment technology.
(40:19):
And as we move through this conversation,something that we've sort of touched on lightly
as we move along, it is not something toabdicate all responsibility of all the things
in the stuff too.
Never.
However, it is a great support and can be agreat creative partner and a great, yeah, great
(40:42):
for so many things, productivity partner,
yeah.
I mean, I put in a lot of stuff in that I do,so it kind of learnt me, right?
Not a lot, more people know that it could learnyou, put in stuff you've done, you've written.
I mean, I put in something, gotta write aletter instead of, you know, I say, make it
sound like me.
It starts off with, hey, instead of dear.
I'm like, no, no, no, you need to make it moreprofessional.
(41:03):
Can't say, hey.
But even that makes it when I'm reading,looking, I'm going, oh my God, I'm
understanding me a little better or I'munderstanding how someone doesn't understand
what I'm saying, because now that I'm seeing itin writing, I don't understand what I said.
Yes.
And it can be an enormously helpful tool forthat kind of self reflection.
(41:28):
Messaging and positioning.
And to to your point, I've given it a lot ofinformation about who is my target audience and
what are the things that they care about andwhat are what are their pain points?
And and so the things that we create togetherare addressing the audience that I'm looking to
address.
Yeah, no, I think it's great.
So I'm encouraging I'm encouraging everyone touse it, but I'm encouraging everyone to pay for
(41:52):
it.
I keep saying that every time I talk about AI,pay the $20, give up a coffee, give up a double
vodka with soda.
It's so worth it.
You get the robust version, you're in your ownsecure place.
If you're using the free version, everythingyou put out there is for everybody else.
There was one company, print company that wascheap and the fella put his entire data, his
(42:14):
financials for years, everything up there.
Only wish I knew the name I can go check it.
Yeah.
But the story's scary.
Yeah, yeah.
And there's people that I've chatted with, andI go, Do you pay?
And they go, No, and I tell them why, and Iwatch them go white.
Yeah, yeah, and so you bring up a reallycritical point around, and I don't know that
(42:35):
this is a conversation to go really deeply intoethics and data privacy.
However, as folks are, to your point, as folksare beginning to utilize tools, understand,
especially if you're using the free version,that any data that you're putting in is being
used to train the tools and models.
So let's say if well, first, pay the $20.
(42:56):
100% agree with you, Warren.
Like, absolutely.
But second, if you're going to dump, let's sayyou're going to dump a contract a contract
language in to see where there might be holesor something like that before you spend the
several 100 or thousand dollars an hour for theattorney, scrub it
of Names.
Your name, of dollar amount, of addresses, ofall of this stuff so that it's even in the paid
(43:22):
version, you don't have proposal.
Right.
But that's also just being smart and not dumbwith your bank card and passwords and certain
things.
Don't get lazy and stupid is really the bottomline.
Right?
Because something, is no better way to say it.
(43:44):
Yeah, yeah.
Than to go and do it straight.
There's so many people out there that, oh myGod, they're doing that.
And other people are benefiting from it, right?
So just be Wow.
So much stuff.
Mean, there's so many things that come justfrom one little conversation that it branches
off.
And then if you touch the AI, it goes sideways.
(44:07):
So let's go back to the future.
Oh like, oh, that was a movie, right?
Back to the Future.
Like, you were ahead of your time.
If we go back to the future, what would youjust suggest a couple simple ways for people
maybe to just start putting themselves in a newplace so that they're ready to grasp some
(44:30):
things that are coming.
And what I say to everybody, everybody, it'snot like I talk to that many people, what I
want people to do is to open up to starthearing, like I'm telling people, yes, you
don't use AI, yes, you don't like it, but seewhat it is, know what it is, don't be ignorant
(44:51):
in a conversation about it when it's allaround.
Yeah, so I think first and foremost, there'sthe basics, right?
So don't skip over the tech column of whateveryour favorite, you know, New York Times, Wall
Street Journal, Economist, Financial Times,whatever it is that you're reading, don't skip
over that part.
Even if you are skimming, have a look at what'shappening out there.
(45:16):
Consult the major consulting firms, KPMG,Deloitte, McKinsey, PwC, there are all kinds of
free reports that you can get about the impactof AI in industry x.
You don't need to spend gazillions of dollars.
The information is there.
So first just go out and start exploring whatis possible impact.
(45:36):
But then secondly, and this is an analog toolthat I invite you to use, but I think of it as
a kaleidoscope.
We mentioned at the beginning of thisconversation that the speed of change has moved
from centuries to seasons to seconds, whichmeans if we're thinking about strategy in a
world where change was happening at a velocityof centuries, you could do a five year
(45:57):
strategic plan and not have to look up whileyou were executing against it until the five
years were over.
But now things are moving so quickly that thequality of strategic questions that we're
asking needs to shift.
And so if you're to ask three basic questions,one that is traditional, sort of, I call it
linear strategy, one that is a future ledstrategy, and another one that is a sort of a
(46:22):
present focus question, these three thingstogether, it's like a kaleidoscope.
So the same kind of information is in there,but every time you twist the end of it, you get
a new sort of pretty picture, which is the samewith your strategy.
So the first question is, what can we logicallydo with what we've already done and what we
already know?
This is if you're thinking about budgeting,this is like, okay.
(46:44):
Next year's budget is gonna be 10% over lastyear's.
Like that that kind of thing.
But it's like, what do what can we projectforward from the data that we already have?
The future focus question asks, given thatwe're here, free of constraints of the past,
what do we want to create?
And then you pull that future into your presentby acting toward it.
And then the third question is right now inthis very moment, what's emerging all around
(47:08):
us?
What's emerging in our clients and ourcustomers inside of our organization and the
technology that's here, the geopoliticallandscape?
And those three questions together can create,can help you see how much strategy has shifted,
where some of your blindsides might be in termsof thinking about what's what will be unfolding
(47:30):
for your business or and or industry as asthese next several months and years are
unfolding, and it will give you both, anopportunity to mitigate some risks and really
seize some exciting opportunities that are hereon the horizon.
Wow, sounds easy, but again, it's not thateasy, right?
I think it's definitely, I think- I'm
(47:51):
happy to help you do it.
Yeah, no, but I think people should take anhour or two, do the exercise, sit down, write
down their thoughts, then maybe take it, throwit into AI, ask it to help it to enhance it,
maybe to put it in a, you know, everything thatI do with, every task thing I do with AI, I ask
it to lay out the task.
(48:11):
Not that I'm using it, lay it out, give me theorder, how do you think I should approach it,
Right, not that I always follow it or ever, butI ask it just to know because by asking it,
seeing it, reading it, it's going into my mind.
It might not be used at this moment, but overthe years I've learned about the subconscious
too a lot, which is another four hour podcaston, right?
(48:35):
Because that's what controls you and makes youcrazy and gets you in trouble.
Yeah.
Every time.
But everything is just, it's just, the AI thinghas just made it easier to absorb some of it
because it gives it to you in point form and itgives it to you without the fluff.
Yeah, and it can give it to you in a tableformat and it can say, you can ask it to
(48:57):
compare the quality of the answers and what'smissing and what are the strengths of each of
these perspectives.
And so all that does is strengthen your abilityto design strategy, to evaluate strategy, and
then to go ahead and execute on it.
Wow.
So if you had to make a list, like you gave usthree things, but not the subs, three, give us
(49:23):
a list, one to five, whatever you think aremain things to do, not the subs.
So sit down, think about where you wanna be or
Yeah, okay.
So first, just if you've been skipping overarticles on AI because you have been assuming
that this is something that you're just gonnawait and see on, stop doing that and read the
(49:43):
articles.
Okay, so that's like 101 basics.
So get you in on the ground floor.
By the way, could they take the article, put itin the AI and get the summary vern perhaps?
They could also do that.
And if we're still suspicious of AI, then justread the damn article.
(50:05):
Or put it in another language model.
Yeah, or put it in another language model.
So that's the first thing.
Second thing, it's three basic questions.
What do I wanna create for myself and for mybusiness?
What kind of impact do I wanna have, myself andmy business?
And how do I wanna use my life and or the lifeof the business?
(50:27):
These three questions, when I tell you thepower of these two questions and their ability
to generate value, if you not only answer thembut then move forward to act on them, it's off
the charts.
Wow.
Okay, I don't wanna confuse anybody withanything else.
I'd like to kind of leave with them having thethree questions.
(50:50):
I will put those three questions in the writeup when I post the podcast.
Yes.
Right?
And then I would just tell anybody if you wantreach out to me and I could kind of help you
when I get the information from the other side.
Absolutely.
People can think of those three questions underthe concept of what I call future led strategy.
(51:14):
Right?
So if you want to create a future led strategy,it's what do I want to create?
What kind of impact do I want to have?
And how do I wanna use my life and the life ofthe business?
I mean, future, everyone's doing that.
They might not call it a future led strategy,but when the bank says, We need your forecasts
and we need your cash flows, same thing.
You're predicting the future to somebody.
AI just made all that stuff a lot easier,right?
(51:35):
But everything is, I think the wording got alot cleaner today when we talk about looking at
the future, instead of making it sound so, Idon't know, all over the place and cumbersome.
So it's pretty
Yeah.
That's the For me, that's the magic of what Iget to do is help distill all of the chaos into
(51:59):
things that make what's happening accessible sothat we can be empowered to make better
decisions.
And there is a lot of stuff happening.
There is
a Like, piling up, I mean, I'm into the wholeAI thing, and I can't read what I get because
it's too much.
And then I don't know if you get, I get therundown report every morning, which I'm
(52:23):
probably three weeks behind in catching up onit because everything is changing so quickly,
but at least I gland it and then I hear thingsand if there's a conversation somewhere, I'm
not feeling left out of the conversationbecause I know what's going on.
It's pretty cool.
That's it.
Step number one is read the stuff.
Yeah.
(52:43):
Well, it's always read the stuff, right?
I'm just thinking if only they had AI back whenI was in school, I'd probably have a few more
degrees maybe.
Or okay, maybe one, one degree.
We'll just start with before we get onto thesecond.
Okay, if people want to reach out to you.
Yes, the best way to do that, well, if you'reinterested in continuing or following parts of
(53:05):
this conversation, the place where I play themost online is on LinkedIn.
So feel free to connect with me there.
And then my website is myfirstandlastname.com.
So elishaabate.com and you can just send me anote there and I would be happy to continue the
conversation.
Just
to avoid traffic to your website, too muchtraffic, is there anybody, what's the, the,
(53:30):
the, the, buckets within which you, the typesof different people, like do you, is it the
small company or is there a minimum?
Like, I just don't want, I don't want anyonecalling you unexpected, you know, to be
rejected in a nice way or
Yeah.
No, there are clarifying questions and ways toreach out to me, so no one needs to worry about
(53:53):
that, and no question is too foolish.
Well, you know what?
That is so true because I remember all myteachers in school saying there is no bad
question.
I only wish I asked questions then.
I ask a lot of questions now, but I didn't askthem then.
Now I'm good to ask them, right?
So, Yeah,
(54:14):
so before we go, any final words to my millionsof listeners I wish I had?
Yes, well, first and foremost, I believe thatthis is the most exciting time that we have
ever had as humanity.
And we can create a compelling, abundant futurefor everybody if we partner together in
(54:35):
collaboration and community and with the verytechnology that's changing everything.
Love it, and all said with a smile.
Wow.
So first of all, Aisha, wanna thank you foryour time and for everything that we've
discussed, because I think the peoplelistening, most of them might not have ever had
an opportunity to maybe hear you or hear thetopic of the discussion.
(54:57):
To others listening, I really, really hope youmade it this far.
If you did make it this far, recommend thispodcast, particular podcast and the series, of
course, but this one in particular, to otherpeople that you know, so that they could hear,
they could listen in their car, they could berelaxed when they listen and they don't have to
be, I don't want everyone freaked out about AI,because it really, you gotta use it for its
(55:20):
benefit, not for its, you know, to make youcrazy and the other side of it.
Wow, we're gonna have you back again, becausethis is a conversation that doesn't end.
I wanna encourage everybody to keep thinkingabout the future.
I wanna encourage people to be thinking aboutchange.
If you don't, if you're not making any changes,you are in big trouble.
(55:42):
I'm not saying make big changes, but keepmaking little ones even so that you got the
momentum and you keep the momentum going.
I'm gonna end it with that just by saying thankyou for listening.
I appreciate all the viewers.
Ideas as always, me know.
I'm still waiting for people to call me.
If you wanna be on the podcast, call me.
You could reach me in a 100 different ways.
(56:03):
All that to say, thanks everybody.
Appreciate your time.
Alicia, again, thank you.
Thank you so much.
We'll see everybody back here soon.
Everybody, I wanna welcome you back to anotheredition of the Printing's Alive podcast with,
you know it, another special guest, as all myguests are special.
So today we have Elisha Abate, the futurist.
How are you?
I'm fantastic, how are you?
I'm so glad to be here.
Ah, I'm thrilled that you're here.
(00:31):
So you are not my normal guest.
I mean, you're normal, but as I explained-Don't know about that.
Okay, well, we don't know what normal is, butyou know, you're not like the rest of us, not
that we're normal, and I'm certainly notnormal.
But, so we were, I'm in the world of the printworld, everything print, anything print, and
(00:54):
that's usually what I have on here, but we haveyou on today because I've seen you a couple of
times and we've spoken a couple of times andI'm just like, just wowed with, you know, the
whole thinking and what it is you're doing.
So before we start, just give us a brief, likea three liner on, I mean, go four if you want,
(01:15):
on what it is you do.
Yes, so the market would call me a futurist,which to me means going out to the edge of
disruption.
So looking at all the big things that arechanging our world and disrupting how we do
business and disrupting how we think aboutstrategy and leadership, and translating those
dynamics into tools, strategies, and frameworksthat companies and people can use to create
(01:40):
results right now.
And I think, so when I hear futurist, I thoughtcard reader,
Yeah.
Fortune teller.
I think they do.
Right?
I was hoping you were gonna bring your crystalball on, but I see you Yeah,
Ray Dalio actually has a great quote from hisbook, The Changing World Order.
(02:00):
It's, and I'm paraphrasing here, but it'ssomething like, He who reads a crystal ball or
something like that is destined to eat glass.
And that's kind of how that works in this spaceof futurism.
It is not about divination and much more aroundperception, pattern recognition, and then
proactively creating a future that you want.
(02:24):
Cool.
So this is actually pretty funny.
Well, funny to me.
You know, you're a futurist and I'm in theprinting world, and the printing world today,
and some people probably get angry at me, butthey all are, so it doesn't matter, but the
printing industry is so backend backwards andslow to change, right?
(02:45):
That's not to say that we don't have someamazing people and some awesome companies that
are leading the charge and making the changeand doing what they have to.
But if I had to do it on a scale of like, youknow, one to 10, how many people are doing,
it's very low.
So kudos to those of you that are, and I won'tmention any names, because I don't wanna make I
(03:09):
don't wanna make the others feel bad.
I don't worry about them feeling good, it's theothers, right?
Yeah.
So I find in our industry, no matter what ishappening, it is slow.
If equipment technology is changing and it'svery expensive for us to buy things, A lot of
companies are very slow in questions.
Some are so slow that they wait too long,they're too late, but they don't know it and
(03:32):
they still do it.
Same thing with people.
Some companies I talk to about AI, even thoughAI is exploding, although, you know, we should
always know AI has been around for twentyyears, we only heard about it two and a half
years ago as the average human, and now we'reall experts, and it's changing our lives, but
there's a lot of people still who are fightingit, or looking the other way and don't wanna
(03:57):
get involved.
We have owners that are 75 and 80 that have notrelinquished control of decision making.
I'm not even talking shares any of that, Justwithin the company.
So, you know, here we have you futurist.
(04:19):
What do you say when you start talking withpeople, when you start talking with companies
about change that needs to happen?
Yeah, yeah, so the most critical thing that Ithink that I do is really help set the context
and level for what's happening right now, orcertainly what's happening right now as I
(04:41):
perceive it through the lens of almost a decadeof research and study and creating solutions
for the big answers to the questions of thefuture of work and strategy.
And because my sense is, and by the way, Idon't think that print is in any way special in
this sense of some folks are not paying anyattention to AI and some folks are really out
(05:05):
at the cutting edge and there are all kinds offolks in between.
I think this is more prevalent or present thanwe might imagine.
Certainly oftentimes I walk into rooms wherereally smart people and I am surprised by the
lack of urgency around what's happening rightnow.
So all that to say, not so uncommon and thereason that I got into this work as a futurist
(05:32):
in the first place is that the size, and scopeof the velocity of disruption in our world is
so great and is continuing to increase that ifwe don't figure out how to upgrade our
thinking, our strategy, how it is that we dothings, then fundamentally, at least from a
business context, there's an expiration date onwhat it is that we're pursuing.
(05:54):
And so by level setting context anddemonstrating the degree of disruption that's
occurring, what that means and what that impactis for business, not only like what is the risk
that we're mitigating, but what is the upsidepotential that we're leaving on the table if we
don't do this, then that sort of sets a levelplaying field.
(06:15):
Because one of the things that I'm extremelypassionate about in this conversation is
eliminating the gatekeeping around it.
Because AI, I believe, is and should be foreverybody, And so the more we can make wherever
anybody is today fine, the easier it is forfolks to get on the on ramp.
(06:35):
And not everybody has to carry everythingthemselves in a company.
Yeah.
I mean, from the young people out there, Ithink we've learnt one thing, we don't need to
work five, six and seven days a week, becausewe're not on this planet to do that spend 82%
of our time working and 18% of our time to findout how to be leisurely.
(06:56):
I think it should be the other way around.
And I think AI has given us the ability, topotentially make some changes in our own lives
and how we do it.
So what would you say to people or to someonewho has, I don't know idea what you're talking
about, and you're talking to people, notcompanies, about starting to reflect and look
(07:20):
at what they're doing and how they maybe startto make changes, or the simple steps to take,
because everything everyone talks soundssimple, nothing is simple when it sounds it.
Yes, exactly.
And that's the beauty of like folks who arereally talented at what they do is distilling
extremely complex stuff into understandablebites so that you can then start to get excited
(07:44):
about diving in, and then the complexitydoesn't quite seem as complex.
So the basics are the following, right?
If we think about how fast things are changing,over time, and we can call this even the last
fifty, sixty years, the pace of change hasshifted from centuries to seasons to seconds.
(08:07):
And this is data that's pretty easily, youknow, available out in the world, but it took
the telephone nine hundred months, seventy fiveyears, to get to a 100,000,000 users.
It took ChatGPT as a tool two months to get tothat
meeting.
And
so it's the the that scope of differential inthe speed of change is so enormous that we
(08:34):
can't anymore just keep executing on whateverit is that we're doing to deliver today, today,
today, and relegate innovation or futureforward thinking to like that one week or two
days at an off-site with leadership.
The leadership tool that can help have accessto this or that can provide some access is what
I call simultaneous strategy.
(08:55):
So it's the ability to do both now producingresults focused work and future forward, future
incorporated thinking at the same time, andwhether that's an expansion of cognitive
capacity or the kinds of folks who you have onyour team who are able to do both at the same
time, This again allows you, it sets you up tocontinue to take advantage of whatever has had
(09:19):
your business be successful up until now, butalso not be the dinosaur and lose out on the
enormous opportunity that is unfolding aroundus.
So how many people, or what percentage ofpeople do you find that you meet that could
actually do both things at once?
It's a learned practice.
(09:40):
Find, and it is available to everybody.
So again, this is not like an only some specialgroup of folks are able to do this.
I find the people who are best able to do thishave some kind of experience either in improv
comedy of some kind, like they've taken classesat Second City or Gotham or something, they've
done some work around design thinking or userSo they've had to contemplate both, like, how
(10:07):
is it that the world is shifting and what is itthat's occurring right now?
So those kinds of folks tend to be easilyadaptable to this kind of work.
Where I have found folks who have a little bitmore challenge are people who are linear
process thinkers.
So I must have X in order to have Y in order tohave Z, or people who are-
(10:30):
Those sound like the accountants.
Yes, very much so, like operational folks whoare operationalizing things, keeping the
trains, you know, on track and on time.
And it's simply an additive to a way ofthinking.
It's not a replacement of that because it isvaluable, but that's, at least in my
experience, that's where I've seen folks whoare a little bit more easily inclined to that,
(10:53):
and then folks who have a little bit more of achallenge.
Oh, the other folks who have a real challengewith this tend to be either of the academic or
the pessimistic type and or both.
Right?
Academics are trained to look for what's wrong,right, in the design of arguments and the
design and rightly so for what it is that theydo.
(11:13):
But if you're always looking for what's wronginstead of what's possible, you're going to
have a hard time adapting to some of thecutting edge future stuff that's out here.
That also just sounds so negative, alwayslooking for what's wrong instead of just
looking for what's right.
Right?
Yeah.
Or even what's possible.
Right?
And oftentimes when I run workshops, less inkeynotes, because it's not exactly the dynamic
(11:38):
for that, but what I do at the beginning is Icreate a set of well, we, all the participants,
co create some agreements that we're gonna workwith, like ways of working for our time
together, and one of them is always gettingcurious and seeking the possible as opposed to,
again, what's wrong or how we've always donethings.
(11:59):
Well, you gave me hope because just this pastyear I did two levels of improv.
So now you gave me the motivation to continueand go to Most
valuable skill that I've, I had my firstexperience with improv in high school, thanks
to Jeff Crowley, my drama teacher, shout out toJeff, and by far and away, the most valuable
(12:25):
set of skills that I have used throughout mycareer.
Well, if it does anything, it takes away thatsense of vulnerability and insecurity, and you
you're out there and you're starting off whenyou're practicing before you're in front of an
audience, and you know, you're just, anyone whowatches whose line it is anyways, it's probably
(12:45):
the most popular improv stuff done that youwould know, and you're going out there and
you're just, you know, you're on the spot givensomething, and then you're just kind of doing
it, and what you learn is, you do what youwant.
It's up to the other people to think what theywant, right?
You're not doing Yeah,
and it's this dance of action, reaction,action, reaction, and as opposed to negating,
(13:12):
right?
So the first rule of improv is yes, and.
Whatever appears in the space, we agree thatit's here as opposed to saying the no, but.
And from that place, again, it sets thefoundation for everything is possible.
Like, of course, this absurd thing that we justtalked about unfolded in front of Of course,
there's an alien sitting in the room right now.
Of course, there's an elephant sitting on yourhead.
(13:34):
No matter how absurd it is, so you begin to seewhat's possible even if you don't know how yet.
And that's critical in the space of future andfuture forward strategy.
Yep.
And I think if the people sitting in theaudience that are watching improv and laughing,
because they're there, I wish all of them wouldtake that out when they go back into society,
(13:58):
and look at a lot of things in the same way,and then it wouldn't be as serious or critical
at times when there's no need, right?
Because when you do that, you ended up buildingup this, I'll call it anxiety and stress all
around you.
Because where that comes from is the need orthe perceived need to control what's going on.
(14:19):
Like, if I just hold tighter, if I just controlthese things more, if I just do this, then
everything's gonna be okay, and I'm gonna beable to plan everything, and the world's gonna
continue to be how I want it to be.
And I just don't think that's the world thatwe're living in anymore.
And in the face of this, this is another thingthat I will often say at the beginning of my
speeches, and you've heard me provoke thisquestion before, that in the face of all of
(14:42):
this change that's happening, we have thisfundamental choice.
And we can either ignore it or wish we couldignore it and say, Why is this happening to us?
And hide under the couch and hope that it allgoes away.
Or we can step into the much more effective andmore empowering space and ask, given that this
is here, given that this is happening, what dowe want to create?
(15:02):
And again, those are all rooted in improv kindsof questions and experiences that allow for
possibility as opposed to sort of swirlingaround what's wrong.
And I take a lot of things that I've learned atCOVID because in COVID, it was new for all of
us.
We were all trapped for lack of better, youknow, wording, unless maybe you lived in
(15:27):
Florida then you were free to roam.
But you know, but I learned that there'snothing that important that you have to lose
your mind over and make yourself sick andcrazy.
Everybody knows it, everyone will wait if theyhave to, break away from that first initial
objection to say, okay, tomorrow, right?
(15:49):
The whole pleasing thing to try to please, pullback a little, and no one's gonna kill you if
you don't do a certain thing on a certain day,you just have to know, like back then, today,
to set the time that works for you or thedelivery date that you need to, you know, like
someone says, oh, could you deliver somethingon a Friday?
(16:11):
I'm like, are you working on the weekend or isMonday okay?
Yeah.
Why get the whole place running crazy onThursday, Friday to pack and ship when that
company might work on the weekend and could doit and could ship it on a Monday and get out
some other important stuff for other clientsthat are needed on the Friday?
I think we've got a lot of priorities mixed upin what we do or how we think.
(16:35):
And that goes into that space of co createdagreements, right?
Agreements versus And co created agreementsabout how we work, being clear about what we're
delivering and what are the resources that thatwill take.
And then being, you know, there's somethingthat I've learned over the years is that, you
(16:55):
know, people who are up to really big things,people who are creating stuff in the world, by
function of the complexity of the things thatare going on, are not always able to keep their
word 100% of the time.
However, you can honor your word, and that'sreally critical in strong communication, and a
lot of that has to do with, like, what do youdo when the world is getting disrupted this
(17:17):
quickly and things are scary and seeminglymoving very quickly and we need some space to
make decisions?
You can, instead of breaking your back todeliver on something that someone else maybe
didn't even want anyway, being able to stepinto a position and say, I know I promised you
X.
This is what we're facing.
(17:37):
Here are three ways that we could resolve forit.
I wanna ensure that we do it in a way that'sbest gonna meet what you need.
And so it's, you know, in so many ways, thethings that are strengths for helping us thrive
in the face of all the disruption, and inparticular, the technological disruption, are
rooted in really strong human interaction andconnection.
(18:01):
And you said a key word that I think often getsoverlooked and not done well, and that's
communication, right?
Something I've learned again and again andagain, and probably will continue to keep
learning is, you know, times when you don't saysomething because you're fearful or you're
worried about what the response is gonna be,nine and a half out of 10 times when you go and
(18:25):
you actually get it out, even if it's a littlelate, the reaction is okay.
But in our heads, we get so fearful about whatthe response might be, right?
Predicting what's gonna be.
And I try to tell people, don't predict.
Like I practice it Don't assume.
Yeah, yeah, you make up a fantasy aboutsomething that may or may not be true.
(18:46):
And that's rooted in a whole thing.
There's a great book, It's several years oldnow, but it's called Straight Line Leadership.
It's written by this guy named Dusan Ducic.
And one of the distinctions that he talks aboutin there is serving versus pleasing people.
And, you know, people pleasing is like a sneakylittle thing that many of us have learned over
(19:08):
time.
But the funny thing about people pleasing isthat on the surface, we are doing it to We tell
ourselves a story that we're doing it to makethe other person happy, But really underneath
it, we're doing it to soothe our own weirdnessabout whatever, right?
But we're not soothing.
We're killing ourselves because it's not And,
yeah, and that's the even sneaky part of it,right, is that it totally backfired.
(19:33):
Well, sooner or later, that is a strategy thatjust doesn't work.
I just had that conversation yesterday withsomeone, something to do with me and responding
to someone, and I was telling them how Iresponded and they said, well, thoughtful
response, but you need to stop pleasing.
They're good, but it's gonna have no benefit toyou after.
(19:55):
Yeah, yeah.
Right?
So That's
Yeah, mhmm.
And I guess if I had the conversation yesterdayand you're bringing it up today, I said
somebody's sending me a real signal that that'simportant.
I was gonna pay attention to, yeah, for
So, I'm gonna have to make notes on that oneand go back, but, know, it's funny because I'm
hearing it from a couple of different peopledoing different things.
(20:16):
So when that happens, you really, I, I'll talkonly from the me, I have to go, wow, someone is
sending a signal messaging that I need to grabonto that I will need to use going forward,
Right?
Absolutely.
I I find that the universe whispers to us, andthen it will start to communicate a little more
(20:42):
loudly, and then it will start to shout.
And in my experience, it's better not to waitfor the flash bang.
It's better to listen when the message isquiet.
You know, if used mindset as a word inthinking, you just said the universe, I used to
listen to someone who always used to say, I'mputting it out in the universe with like, with
(21:04):
a big, you know, a big, your hands up and a bigcall, and I used to laugh.
And then a few years ago, when I went throughsome stuff and then I started working to
rebuild, person I was working with and stilltoday, talked about the universe, talked about
putting it out there.
And it's a mindset thing because when I hitthat point, I was as low as low can go.
(21:26):
And I was doing anything to get up.
And I started to like, kind of say, okay, I'mputting it out there loud, I'm positive, I'm
putting it.
And not to be funny, but the energy that comesback really works, you know, along with the
meditation and some breathing exercises that weall take for granted breathing, game changers.
(21:47):
Yeah, well, total game changers.
And if you want to talk about, from thefuture's perspective, like what are some of the
leadership abilities and shifts that we need tomake, you hit on the core of one of them, which
is what I call business beyond the brain.
And this is in response to something that Irealized a few years ago that the quantity of
(22:10):
input that we're receiving is so enormous thatour brain just, you know, our brains that
evolved linearly and locally literally can'tprocess it.
We already don't consciously process most ofthe information that we're getting in.
And so leadership shifts from a solelyintellectual exercise to one that's fully
(22:32):
embodied and a place from which we're creatingand leading and strategizing from a fully
anchored position in our humanity.
So what do people do?
Like we're talking and good, get it.
A lot of people listening or hearing theseconcepts, thoughts for the first time are
(22:56):
probably going, what, what, what?
But even, you know, so I go when I'm at aconference and I hear you and I hear others,
and I'm like freaking out because this is justgame changing, life lifting, and then I leave,
then I get home, and then I take my laundryout, and then I go to bed, and then I wake up,
and then I'm trying to find that energy that Ihad at the conference that I don't necessarily
(23:20):
have right now because I'm alone and there's noone to look at and give them a nudge and a high
five and a woah, what do we do?
Yeah, so the first thing, and what I attempt todo when I'm speaking or working with folks is
even in the space of a keynote, provide someactionable questions or frameworks that you
(23:40):
can, should one choose to, leave that day andstart to implement with.
But there's one of the leadership models thatI've developed over time is something that I
call regenerative resilience.
And it's in the fit, because why?
Well, resilience just in general, HarvardBusiness Review and McKinsey and Psychology
Today, everyone's like, this is one of thebiggest leadership things, everyone should have
(24:02):
it.
Resilience is fundamentally exhausting.
And especially when the disruption and changethat we're facing is not going to end, it's
just not.
The game is not how do I wait to get back tonormal and then reset myself?
It's how do we take and channel this disruptioninto something that will help us grow and
(24:25):
thrive, help our businesses grow and thrive,and in fact, energize us?
So under the umbrella of regenerativeresilience, there are three pillars to that
framework.
There's clarity, there's fearlessness, andthere's connection.
And under that umbrella of clarity, like Ican't tell you how powerful this is.
It is, first and foremost, getting super clearabout what it is that you wanna create.
(24:48):
And you've heard me ask these three questionsbefore.
What do I wanna create?
What kind of impact do I wanna have?
And how do I wanna use my life for the life ofthe business?
By answering those things, you know where it isthat you're going.
Even if it's not, I want, you know, revenue xor position y, you have a general sense of
where you're going, the next layer of things isdefining what you value.
(25:10):
So what is it that you value about thatdestination?
Is it the financial freedom?
Is it the social impact?
Is it the adventure?
Is it whatever it might be for you?
And having those two things then comes as clearpiece of boundaries.
Now you know what to say yes or what to say noto.
Because anything, any conversation you'rehaving, any action you're taking, any strategy
(25:32):
you're planning is either aligned with theoutcome that you're looking for or it's not.
And that brings a sense of empowerment andexcitement and clarity, yeah, really around
what it is that you're creating.
So that is probably no.
As we said earlier, it's, like, simplest,simplest meaning I don't know how easy it is or
(25:55):
not, but it's those three questions.
It's defining the things that you value, andit's saying yes to what's aligned and no to
what isn't.
And you'll notice that in that sense ofclarity, I didn't say what AI tool you should
be learning how to use.
I didn't say what software business process oneshould be updating because any tool that you're
(26:16):
picking, any technology that you're going toinvest in must be linked to these outcomes that
you're looking to drive, And that will thenhelp cascade into the more tactical, practical
decisions around technology and training andthat kind of implementation.
I think a lot of people have to go back to thedrawing board and rethink the way they do
(26:37):
things.
Yeah.
Right?
And even at the end, when you were saying, youknow, the software AI tool, I think a lot of
people are thinking, what tool can I use tohelp change the way I'm thinking?
Which is backwards, and me and some others, I'mtelling everyone, you talk about AI, because
some are talking like it's the holy grail, I'msaying refer to it as a tool only.
(27:02):
A tool in your toolbox, and don't make it likethe best tool, the biggest tool or the only
tool, right?
Because there's still other processes anddifferent steps people can take to do things.
AI makes it a little easier, but it's notgonna, what do they say?
I mean, it's all new.
(27:22):
So it's a new saying.
If you're an expert using AI, it'll enhancewhat you do and make it more clearable, I don't
know if that's a word, but it'll make it, Imake up a lot of words, it'll make it easier
for other people to understand, right?
But if you are not an expert using AI and thenyou think you're an expert after, everyone's
(27:44):
gonna know you don't know what you're talkingabout.
Yeah, yeah.
And so this is my perspective and my opinion.
Intelligence doesn't go away.
Humanities doesn't go away.
Strong strategic thinking and criticalreasoning don't go away, in this phase that
we're in right now of AI development and, youknow, as it's continuing to get smarter and
(28:08):
better at what it does.
Now, I do think it's critical to split theconversation between business fundamentals and
then sort of AI in a more philosophical lens.
Business fundamentals, and this is where somany businesses get stuck.
So for those who are listening and you're like,how should I implement AI?
Should I train everybody on ChatGPT or Claudeor, you know, whatever?
(28:30):
Fill in the blank.
By the way, this is gonna be a mini clipbecause it's not important.
Back to this, anything that you're gonna trainsomebody on should be connected to a business
outcome that you're looking to drive.
Are you increasing revenue?
Do you need to make your sales process moreconsumer friendly?
(28:53):
Do you are your operations hitting a speedbump?
If you have tactical problems that you canmeasure and use AI to help you solve them,
start there and have it be linked to somethingthat's actually gonna drive something for your
business value as opposed to just like AIglitter.
You know?
Like, let's just do whatever it takes.
(29:14):
Now the other split of this conversation,though, which is where the futurists more
futurist piece comes into play is there arethree levels with which one can think about AI.
AI as a tool, AI as a collaborator, and AI as aconsciousness.
And it can be all three at the same time, but Ifind that parsing and thinking, particularly
(29:36):
with the large language models that learn fromour presence and interaction with them, that
quality of interaction, if I am interactingwith something as a tool, it is serving me, I
am commanding and controlling.
But if we are collaborating on something, thenit's a different kind of experience or
interaction.
(29:56):
Or if we're two human beings collectivelybuilding something, there's an interdependence
there and human empathy piece that might bemissing in some of the other spaces.
Well, yeah, the one thing with the AI is thereis no emotion, right?
Yes, there is.
Yet, yet.
(30:17):
And
the research is telling us that it is capableof understanding cues of emotional
intelligence, and the data is leaning toward weactually do get better results if we treat it
kindly, even though it's economically, and asfar as energy use is concerned, even though it
costs more, the results that you're getting arebetter.
(30:40):
I started off using it going, please, thankyou, and like, as if I'm talking to my friend,
then I heard somebody say, you know, they'rekind of asking you not to do that because it's
using up the space, the tokens, and it'scosting more.
And then I'm thinking, that's not my problem.
You put it out here, you created it, I'm gonnamake it what I want it to be.
(31:02):
Well, yeah, and if we think about what, it evenif okay.
Let's just take a consciousness piece of aconversation out of it.
If this is a tool that is interacting andlearning with humanity, don't we want it to be
biased toward the better qualities of humanity,which are treating each other with respect,
(31:24):
which are, you know, someone I think one of thecofounders of Google, I don't remember who it
was, but it's like bubbling out in the memeverse these days.
And it's like, if you threaten AI, it'll giveyou better results.
And, like, okay.
But over what period of time?
Right?
And because as human beings, I don't know ifyou've ever had a boss who is not or worked
(31:46):
with somebody who is toxic in that way.
Oh god, no.
Right?
Right?
It's like, sure.
For a period of time, I will perform betterunder that kind of pressure, but at some point
burnout is coming.
And so it's really, I think, is a question ofwhat is this world and future that we're
looking to create?
Do we want an AI and working environmentsbecause AI will be colleague coworker who only
(32:15):
respond to negativity and cruelty, or do wewant an environment where we're speaking
positivity into the space?
Yeah, well, always positive, because negativedoesn't get you anywhere.
It doesn't, not at, not at the long term, likethat's-
You know?
Yeah.
I mean, even AI, so AI in one area that wasgreat was, you know, I have to write an email
(32:37):
that was a nasty email, because I wasn't happy,and started off with all the F bombs, and I
knew I wasn't gonna send that one, but I justlet it go, because it was therapy, then I put
it into AI, I just said, can you recraft thisemail to get this point across, Not to make me
sound negative, not to make me sound evil orrevengeful.
(32:59):
And then it put out this email and I'mthinking, Oh my God, the new me.
How beautiful.
Yeah.
You and I have talked about this before.
It's also a great tool for helping shape reallydifficult conversations.
So if anybody is a recovering people pleaser oryou have to have a difficult conversation with
anyone in your environment, I have found it tobe an enormously useful tool to help shape
(33:25):
conversations that are direct, that arepowerful, that don't apologize for your
position, but are still empathetic in in theirdelivery.
So I found it enormously useful for this kindhuman interaction.
Also gives you things that you probably wouldnot think about ever on your own that you think
it's so simple that would come to your mind, itwouldn't even come close.
(33:46):
I mean, last year's Imagine, it was, and I'mgonna get the names mixed up, but I think it
was Adam Sack and Andy Brot, or Andy Brot andAdam Sack, one of the, those two fellows,
right?
Really, really smart, smart, smart guys.
And when they were up talking and they said,you know, we're greatest partners and we always
(34:06):
get along, but every now and again, we hit aroadblock and we turned to our third co founder
for help.
And he was referring to chat.
It's factual, there's no emotion, still gottacheck it.
And I thought from that day forward, I lookedat it in a different way, the Aon, different,
you know, using for different purposes, becausethose guys are really smart.
(34:29):
If they trust it, then I have to give it atleast the chance to trust it and not be so
skeptical and pessimistic about it.
Yeah, yeah, and bringing one's own discernmentto the conversation, right?
This data that just came out from MIT thatsays, that's talking about the cognitive debt,
(34:52):
which cognitive debt, as they're defining it,is or as is defined, I guess, in general,
because I had to look that up.
Wanted to make sure that I was clear about
what you're looking after just from everythingyou just said.
Like, what what does the action mean?
But it's apparently, it's as I read andunderstand it, it's essentially what happens
when and you just get the answer, but you don'tknow how you got there, right?
(35:13):
Like you guessed the right answer on a quiz,hooray, you got the right answer, but you
couldn't explain to me, like, these are thefour steps that I would need to do for the
actual problem solving.
And this is one of those places where I think,especially in this interim time as the tools
are developing, utilizing your own discernmentand your own sense of reality and sensibility
(35:35):
around quality and nuance inside ofconversations is critically important, but use
the tools.
And this is different from also different from,like, way back in the day when Excel was first,
you know, online or PowerPoint or whatever, andit took a million thousand years to, you know,
learn every nuance and start to and there isn'tthat barrier isn't there anymore.
(36:01):
And what's so rich and, you know, what I loveabout how you and I met, that there are so many
really smart people in many, many all allindustries who are utilizing and discovering
and on the hunt for AI tools that are used ininteresting and creative ways.
And so it's fun to not know how to doeverything yourself because then we get to
(36:24):
reach out to each other and say, hey, I've beenworking on a problem.
Are you using anything that helps solve thiskind of problem?
Do you know anybody who is using this kind ofthing?
And the community and connection and creativitystrengthens.
Well, was like the Imagine AI conference.
That was what was amazing because there wasnot, okay, maybe it's one, but there was really
not one person in that whole ensemble of peoplewho would not turn to the person beside them
(36:51):
and ask them something.
Where I'm sure like we have experienced at alot of other conferences, people don't talk
to this is one of the things, and plug to ourcommunity at Imagine AI Live, this is one of
the reasons why I love being a part of it somuch, is this collective sense of discovery and
(37:15):
exploration and care and caring for otherpeople.
The first day of the conference this year, thegathering this year, was all of these workshops
where people were sharing how to do many, many,many, many, many things.
No secrets.
No secret.
And that goes back to this notion that wetalked about earlier of like no gatekeeping.
(37:37):
I love this about this community.
And it really, you know, speaking of the thingsthat like you leave the conference like, but
how are you still jazzed about the things?
That connection, which again, you'll notice isanother human, very human piece of it, is what
makes the ongoing work not only possible, but,you know, like keeps the excitement and the
fuel underneath it.
(37:59):
You know, I've on a chat group, a WhatsAppgroup with like the founding members and a
bunch of the, yeah, founding members ofspeakers, and I mean, what is it, three weeks
ago?
There's chat every day.
It's a birthday, or somebody did something,went somewhere, or Alex was from Vegas, he went
(38:21):
to, I think, Google conference or something,and then he ended up in Chicago with Steve and
Dave Vince and everything, and now he's back inRome and he was going to Germany, but it's all
on there.
We all know, actually I have Alice coming onthe podcast on Friday.
Wanna try it.
He's amazing for teaching, right?
I want people to pick up on him to get morecomfortable with how easy it is once you It's
(38:45):
easy once you listen and understand a littlebit.
Yeah.
And the great thing about One of the thingsthat I really appreciate about space and just
of AI and particularly the large languagemodels and the tools that you can interact
with, there's a lot of space forexperimentation.
(39:05):
And if you don't know how something is workingor why something is working the way it's
working, you can say you can ask, So why didyou give me that answer?
What do you think makes this a strong answer ora strong solution?
And where might you see there being somechallenges or holes in the argument that you
presented to me?
So you can go learning together with it, whichfor me, as someone who is a very intellectually
(39:32):
curious person, I find that co learning dynamicreally exciting.
Well, I'm loving with the AI, and I love nowthat you get to do speak, because you don't
have to type everything, so it gets a littleeasier.
I'm having conversations about just differentthings, not even realizing that I'm going in,
it's a conversation that a half hour's passed,and I've asked a couple things, and then it
(39:55):
asked me things to, you know, to work on whatthe answers it's giving me and expanding on it.
And then I'm like, oh my God.
I know.
Nobody ever has to be alone anymore.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it's it can be an enormous enrichment.
And my my philosophy around this is that AI isreally a human empowerment technology.
(40:19):
And as we move through this conversation,something that we've sort of touched on lightly
as we move along, it is not something toabdicate all responsibility of all the things
in the stuff too.
Never.
However, it is a great support and can be agreat creative partner and a great, yeah, great
(40:42):
for so many things, productivity partner,
yeah.
I mean, I put in a lot of stuff in that I do,so it kind of learnt me, right?
Not a lot, more people know that it could learnyou, put in stuff you've done, you've written.
I mean, I put in something, gotta write aletter instead of, you know, I say, make it
sound like me.
It starts off with, hey, instead of dear.
I'm like, no, no, no, you need to make it moreprofessional.
(41:03):
Can't say, hey.
But even that makes it when I'm reading,looking, I'm going, oh my God, I'm
understanding me a little better or I'munderstanding how someone doesn't understand
what I'm saying, because now that I'm seeing itin writing, I don't understand what I said.
Yes.
And it can be an enormously helpful tool forthat kind of self reflection.
(41:28):
Messaging and positioning.
And to to your point, I've given it a lot ofinformation about who is my target audience and
what are the things that they care about andwhat are what are their pain points?
And and so the things that we create togetherare addressing the audience that I'm looking to
address.
Yeah, no, I think it's great.
So I'm encouraging I'm encouraging everyone touse it, but I'm encouraging everyone to pay for
(41:52):
it.
I keep saying that every time I talk about AI,pay the $20, give up a coffee, give up a double
vodka with soda.
It's so worth it.
You get the robust version, you're in your ownsecure place.
If you're using the free version, everythingyou put out there is for everybody else.
There was one company, print company that wascheap and the fella put his entire data, his
(42:14):
financials for years, everything up there.
Only wish I knew the name I can go check it.
Yeah.
But the story's scary.
Yeah, yeah.
And there's people that I've chatted with, andI go, Do you pay?
And they go, No, and I tell them why, and Iwatch them go white.
Yeah, yeah, and so you bring up a reallycritical point around, and I don't know that
(42:35):
this is a conversation to go really deeply intoethics and data privacy.
However, as folks are, to your point, as folksare beginning to utilize tools, understand,
especially if you're using the free version,that any data that you're putting in is being
used to train the tools and models.
So let's say if well, first, pay the $20.
(42:56):
100% agree with you, Warren.
Like, absolutely.
But second, if you're going to dump, let's sayyou're going to dump a contract a contract
language in to see where there might be holesor something like that before you spend the
several 100 or thousand dollars an hour for theattorney, scrub it
of Names.
Your name, of dollar amount, of addresses, ofall of this stuff so that it's even in the paid
(43:22):
version, you don't have proposal.
Right.
But that's also just being smart and not dumbwith your bank card and passwords and certain
things.
Don't get lazy and stupid is really the bottomline.
Right?
Because something, is no better way to say it.
(43:44):
Yeah, yeah.
Than to go and do it straight.
There's so many people out there that, oh myGod, they're doing that.
And other people are benefiting from it, right?
So just be Wow.
So much stuff.
Mean, there's so many things that come justfrom one little conversation that it branches
off.
And then if you touch the AI, it goes sideways.
(44:07):
So let's go back to the future.
Oh like, oh, that was a movie, right?
Back to the Future.
Like, you were ahead of your time.
If we go back to the future, what would youjust suggest a couple simple ways for people
maybe to just start putting themselves in a newplace so that they're ready to grasp some
(44:30):
things that are coming.
And what I say to everybody, everybody, it'snot like I talk to that many people, what I
want people to do is to open up to starthearing, like I'm telling people, yes, you
don't use AI, yes, you don't like it, but seewhat it is, know what it is, don't be ignorant
(44:51):
in a conversation about it when it's allaround.
Yeah, so I think first and foremost, there'sthe basics, right?
So don't skip over the tech column of whateveryour favorite, you know, New York Times, Wall
Street Journal, Economist, Financial Times,whatever it is that you're reading, don't skip
over that part.
Even if you are skimming, have a look at what'shappening out there.
(45:16):
Consult the major consulting firms, KPMG,Deloitte, McKinsey, PwC, there are all kinds of
free reports that you can get about the impactof AI in industry x.
You don't need to spend gazillions of dollars.
The information is there.
So first just go out and start exploring whatis possible impact.
(45:36):
But then secondly, and this is an analog toolthat I invite you to use, but I think of it as
a kaleidoscope.
We mentioned at the beginning of thisconversation that the speed of change has moved
from centuries to seasons to seconds, whichmeans if we're thinking about strategy in a
world where change was happening at a velocityof centuries, you could do a five year
(45:57):
strategic plan and not have to look up whileyou were executing against it until the five
years were over.
But now things are moving so quickly that thequality of strategic questions that we're
asking needs to shift.
And so if you're to ask three basic questions,one that is traditional, sort of, I call it
linear strategy, one that is a future ledstrategy, and another one that is a sort of a
(46:22):
present focus question, these three thingstogether, it's like a kaleidoscope.
So the same kind of information is in there,but every time you twist the end of it, you get
a new sort of pretty picture, which is the samewith your strategy.
So the first question is, what can we logicallydo with what we've already done and what we
already know?
This is if you're thinking about budgeting,this is like, okay.
(46:44):
Next year's budget is gonna be 10% over lastyear's.
Like that that kind of thing.
But it's like, what do what can we projectforward from the data that we already have?
The future focus question asks, given thatwe're here, free of constraints of the past,
what do we want to create?
And then you pull that future into your presentby acting toward it.
And then the third question is right now inthis very moment, what's emerging all around
(47:08):
us?
What's emerging in our clients and ourcustomers inside of our organization and the
technology that's here, the geopoliticallandscape?
And those three questions together can create,can help you see how much strategy has shifted,
where some of your blindsides might be in termsof thinking about what's what will be unfolding
(47:30):
for your business or and or industry as asthese next several months and years are
unfolding, and it will give you both, anopportunity to mitigate some risks and really
seize some exciting opportunities that are hereon the horizon.
Wow, sounds easy, but again, it's not thateasy, right?
I think it's definitely, I think- I'm
(47:51):
happy to help you do it.
Yeah, no, but I think people should take anhour or two, do the exercise, sit down, write
down their thoughts, then maybe take it, throwit into AI, ask it to help it to enhance it,
maybe to put it in a, you know, everything thatI do with, every task thing I do with AI, I ask
it to lay out the task.
(48:11):
Not that I'm using it, lay it out, give me theorder, how do you think I should approach it,
Right, not that I always follow it or ever, butI ask it just to know because by asking it,
seeing it, reading it, it's going into my mind.
It might not be used at this moment, but overthe years I've learned about the subconscious
too a lot, which is another four hour podcaston, right?
(48:35):
Because that's what controls you and makes youcrazy and gets you in trouble.
Yeah.
Every time.
But everything is just, it's just, the AI thinghas just made it easier to absorb some of it
because it gives it to you in point form and itgives it to you without the fluff.
Yeah, and it can give it to you in a tableformat and it can say, you can ask it to
(48:57):
compare the quality of the answers and what'smissing and what are the strengths of each of
these perspectives.
And so all that does is strengthen your abilityto design strategy, to evaluate strategy, and
then to go ahead and execute on it.
Wow.
So if you had to make a list, like you gave usthree things, but not the subs, three, give us
(49:23):
a list, one to five, whatever you think aremain things to do, not the subs.
So sit down, think about where you wanna be or
Yeah, okay.
So first, just if you've been skipping overarticles on AI because you have been assuming
that this is something that you're just gonnawait and see on, stop doing that and read the
(49:43):
articles.
Okay, so that's like 101 basics.
So get you in on the ground floor.
By the way, could they take the article, put itin the AI and get the summary vern perhaps?
They could also do that.
And if we're still suspicious of AI, then justread the damn article.
(50:05):
Or put it in another language model.
Yeah, or put it in another language model.
So that's the first thing.
Second thing, it's three basic questions.
What do I wanna create for myself and for mybusiness?
What kind of impact do I wanna have, myself andmy business?
And how do I wanna use my life and or the lifeof the business?
(50:27):
These three questions, when I tell you thepower of these two questions and their ability
to generate value, if you not only answer thembut then move forward to act on them, it's off
the charts.
Wow.
Okay, I don't wanna confuse anybody withanything else.
I'd like to kind of leave with them having thethree questions.
(50:50):
I will put those three questions in the writeup when I post the podcast.
Yes.
Right?
And then I would just tell anybody if you wantreach out to me and I could kind of help you
when I get the information from the other side.
Absolutely.
People can think of those three questions underthe concept of what I call future led strategy.
(51:14):
Right?
So if you want to create a future led strategy,it's what do I want to create?
What kind of impact do I want to have?
And how do I wanna use my life and the life ofthe business?
I mean, future, everyone's doing that.
They might not call it a future led strategy,but when the bank says, We need your forecasts
and we need your cash flows, same thing.
You're predicting the future to somebody.
AI just made all that stuff a lot easier,right?
(51:35):
But everything is, I think the wording got alot cleaner today when we talk about looking at
the future, instead of making it sound so, Idon't know, all over the place and cumbersome.
So it's pretty
Yeah.
That's the For me, that's the magic of what Iget to do is help distill all of the chaos into
(51:59):
things that make what's happening accessible sothat we can be empowered to make better
decisions.
And there is a lot of stuff happening.
There is
a Like, piling up, I mean, I'm into the wholeAI thing, and I can't read what I get because
it's too much.
And then I don't know if you get, I get therundown report every morning, which I'm
(52:23):
probably three weeks behind in catching up onit because everything is changing so quickly,
but at least I gland it and then I hear thingsand if there's a conversation somewhere, I'm
not feeling left out of the conversationbecause I know what's going on.
It's pretty cool.
That's it.
Step number one is read the stuff.
Yeah.
(52:43):
Well, it's always read the stuff, right?
I'm just thinking if only they had AI back whenI was in school, I'd probably have a few more
degrees maybe.
Or okay, maybe one, one degree.
We'll just start with before we get onto thesecond.
Okay, if people want to reach out to you.
Yes, the best way to do that, well, if you'reinterested in continuing or following parts of
(53:05):
this conversation, the place where I play themost online is on LinkedIn.
So feel free to connect with me there.
And then my website is myfirstandlastname.com.
So elishaabate.com and you can just send me anote there and I would be happy to continue the
conversation.
Just
to avoid traffic to your website, too muchtraffic, is there anybody, what's the, the,
(53:30):
the, the, buckets within which you, the typesof different people, like do you, is it the
small company or is there a minimum?
Like, I just don't want, I don't want anyonecalling you unexpected, you know, to be
rejected in a nice way or
Yeah.
No, there are clarifying questions and ways toreach out to me, so no one needs to worry about
(53:53):
that, and no question is too foolish.
Well, you know what?
That is so true because I remember all myteachers in school saying there is no bad
question.
I only wish I asked questions then.
I ask a lot of questions now, but I didn't askthem then.
Now I'm good to ask them, right?
So, Yeah,
(54:14):
so before we go, any final words to my millionsof listeners I wish I had?
Yes, well, first and foremost, I believe thatthis is the most exciting time that we have
ever had as humanity.
And we can create a compelling, abundant futurefor everybody if we partner together in
(54:35):
collaboration and community and with the verytechnology that's changing everything.
Love it, and all said with a smile.
Wow.
So first of all, Aisha, wanna thank you foryour time and for everything that we've
discussed, because I think the peoplelistening, most of them might not have ever had
an opportunity to maybe hear you or hear thetopic of the discussion.
(54:57):
To others listening, I really, really hope youmade it this far.
If you did make it this far, recommend thispodcast, particular podcast and the series, of
course, but this one in particular, to otherpeople that you know, so that they could hear,
they could listen in their car, they could berelaxed when they listen and they don't have to
be, I don't want everyone freaked out about AI,because it really, you gotta use it for its
(55:20):
benefit, not for its, you know, to make youcrazy and the other side of it.
Wow, we're gonna have you back again, becausethis is a conversation that doesn't end.
I wanna encourage everybody to keep thinkingabout the future.
I wanna encourage people to be thinking aboutchange.
If you don't, if you're not making any changes,you are in big trouble.
(55:42):
I'm not saying make big changes, but keepmaking little ones even so that you got the
momentum and you keep the momentum going.
I'm gonna end it with that just by saying thankyou for listening.
I appreciate all the viewers.
Ideas as always, me know.
I'm still waiting for people to call me.
If you wanna be on the podcast, call me.
You could reach me in a 100 different ways.
(56:03):
All that to say, thanks everybody.
Appreciate your time.
Alicia, again, thank you.
Thank you so much.
We'll see everybody back here soon.
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