September 12, 2025 • 40 mins
In this episode of the Profitable Painter Podcast, we sit down with Vital and Andrii, the founders of Ukie Painting in Charlotte, NC. They reveal the exact strategies that took them from two guys with a single car and no painting skills to a multi-million dollar business in just three years.
You'll learn how they:
- Started with $0: Their humble beginnings using door knocking, Facebook, and a car magnet to land their first clients.
- Broke Through the First $1M: The pivotal mentor advice that made them define their roles (Sales vs. Production) and finally start using subcontractors effectively.
- Scaled Past $2M: How they structured their team, promoted from within, and added key hires (like their estimator who sold $1.1M in his first year!).
- Mastered Branding & Marketing: Their relentless focus on looking professional (vehicle wraps, uniforms, yard signs) and nurturing past clients for a powerful referral engine.
- Plan to Hit $3.5M+: Their current focus on smoothing out cash flow by adding commercial work and their goals for the future.
If you're struggling to break through a revenue ceiling or feel stuck doing all the work yourself, this conversation is packed with actionable, real-world advice from two owners who have been in your shoes.
Key Takeaways:
- Why defining roles (Sales & Production) was the #1 factor in their initial growth.
- How to find, grade (A, B, C), and manage subcontractors from scratch.
- The simple, cost-effective branding tactics that made them look like a "big company."
- The importance of building a "huggable" team and promoting from within.
- Their advice for sub-$1M owners: Find a mentor who has done it before and implement their advice.
Subscribe to The Profitable Painter Podcast for more weekly strategies on mastering your numbers, boosting profits, and building a business that works for you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Profitable Painter Podcast.
The mission of this podcast issimple to help you navigate the
financial and tax aspects ofstarting, running and scaling a
professional painting business,from the brushes and ladders to
the spreadsheets and balancesheets.
We've got you covered.
But before we dive in, a quickword of caution.
While we strive to provideaccurate and up-to-date
financial and tax information,nothing you hear on this podcast
(00:22):
should be considered asfinancial advice specifically
and tax information.
Nothing you hear on thispodcast should be considered as
financial advice specificallyfor you or your business.
We're here to share generalknowledge and experiences, not
to replace the tailored adviceyou get from a professional
financial advisor or taxconsultant.
We strongly recommend youseeking individualized advice
before making any significantfinancial decision.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Profitable Painter Podcast, the
show where painting contractorslearn how to boost profits, cut
taxes and build a business thatworks for them.
I'm your host, daniel Honan,cpa, former painting business
owner, and your guide tomastering the numbers that drive
success.
Let's dive in and make yourbusiness more profitable, one
episode at a time.
Today, I'm super excited tospeak with Vital and Andre out
(01:06):
of North Carolina.
They have an amazing paintingbusiness, yuki Painting, out of
the Charlotte area, so I'm superexcited to jump in the
conversation to hear more abouttheir story.
Welcome to the podcast, guys.
How are you doing?
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Thank you, Daniel.
Thank you for having us Doingwell.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Awesome.
Thank you, daniel.
Absolutely Glad to have youguys on and just to kind of give
folks an understanding of whereyou're coming from.
Could you take me through howdid you get started in the
painting industry and what havebeen some major milestones along
the way?
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Do you want to get started?
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Happy to share with you guys how we started.
This is something that wereally would love to share with
you guys.
How we started, this is, uhsomething that we um really
would love to share witheveryone.
This is, uh something thatmakes us a little bit excited
when we share our story.
Um, because when we started, westarted as just two guys, um,
(02:01):
without money, without skills,just our ambition to do
something, and the idea camerandomly to Andre back in 2021.
The idea was let's do some kindof business for both of us, and
then Andre approached andmentioned, hey, let's do
(02:23):
painting.
And none of us really knowanything about painting.
Andre did a little bit of thepainting in the past for um, for
one of the rental managementproperty companies back in key
west florida, and a little bitfor commercial.
So he did knew a little bitabout that.
My knowledge was very tightabout painting and we just like,
(02:48):
okay, let's do it.
We went and purchased a verybasic set of tools and basically
started to advertise on thirdparty local applications.
(03:12):
We got signed up with Thumbtack, did a little bit of Facebook
later on and we started pickingup some business, did some door
knocking and the businessstarted picking up some business
, did some door knocking and thebusiness started picking up.
The first six months have been abig struggle Not so many
clients, not so much knowledge,not really know what we're doing
(03:35):
late hours into a differentstory because we were able to
get in touch with people thathave been doing painting
business for a long time andthey kind of guided us in the
(03:58):
direction of what we're doingwrong and what we're doing right
, and that was a big pivot forus talking to people that
already have completed asuccessful path in the past.
And then since then sinceprobably like 2022 we just
started growing prettyconsistently.
That's a.
That's a pretty short summary.
We can add way more things intoit, but that's a pretty short
(04:21):
summary how we started and howit started going well.
From which point?
Speaker 3 (04:25):
in the first six months we were both having the
jobs besides our paintingcompany, so we had to do
something that could pay ourbills, because with uk painting
we're keeping all the profitsinside of the company.
So that could allow us reinvestmoney and have things like
website order shirts.
Reinvest money and have thingslike website order shirts,
(04:49):
things like that and actually bywatching podcast in brandon
prupond with garrett martel.
He had podcast and that's howwe found about garrett and we
can talk to him.
He offered his consultation.
So we consulted with Garrettand since then he recommended us
to divide our responsibilities.
One of us is responsible forsales and marketing and another
(05:11):
one is responsible forproduction.
He told us more about how towork with subcontractors and he
told us about PCA Expo.
So after his conversation, wehad to change our business,
change our approach, and Ibelieve this is one of the
important periods of ourbusiness.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Nice.
So it sounds like you guysstarted pretty much from scratch
.
You didn't have any money orskills or anything, just an idea
, and then you've run with itfrom there, and so this is
awesome and it sounds likeyou're doing the subcontractor
model, who's focused on salesand who's focused on production.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Vitaly is responsible of sales and marketing and I'm
responsible for production.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Okay, so you get those rules split and the first
six months was rough.
You basically were justreinvesting all any profit back
into the business to grow.
You got some mentors to helpyou grow it to the next level.
Uh, and since 2022 it soundslike it's been growing pretty
consistently.
We're, we're what In terms ofrevenue.
(06:23):
Where are you guys at at thispoint?
Speaker 3 (06:28):
Last year we did almost 2.7.
So the first year was like280,000.
Then we did 800,000.
Then we did 1.6.
Last year we were aiming for 3,but we didn't hit our goal.
We got to almost 2.7.
And this year we're in a trackto do didn't hit our goal.
We got to like almost 2.7, andthis year we track to do like
3.5 to 3.8 wow, that's awesome3.5 million target this year, or
(06:56):
even higher well, target wasfour, but we had to change it
because we had terrible quarterone okay, bad quarter one.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
So you had to adjust it down a little bit.
So the original target was fourmillion, had to adjust it down
to 3.5, 3.8 million.
Okay, that's still amazing.
And so in 2024 it was 2.7,right, and then before that it
was 1.6.
You said, yeah, 1.6, so that issuper.
Speaker 4 (07:25):
And then before that it was 800 000, so you doubled
uh, and then when we doubledfrom 8 to 1.6, we thought that
every year we're going to beable to double.
That was like, okay, that seemsto be pretty easy.
That was the idea originally.
And, uh, that's where 3 millioncame.
Actually there was 3.2.
(07:45):
Uh, when we from 1.6, we wantedto get to like the 3.2, ideally
, uh, but it didn't happen.
And, um, that, that's what.
When we realized, okay, that's,uh, just doubling, that's,
that's not a real thing to do inthe real world, at least for us
.
At least for us, it it ispossible.
It's possible to triple.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Yeah, it's possible, but it's super rare, and
especially when you startgetting up to multi-millions.
Anything over 30% is amazing.
So 30% growth is amazing andyou guys have done that
consistently since 2022, itsounds like.
So that's amazing.
(08:31):
So, with that growth though I'msure already was that 800 to
1.6 was not too bad, but gettingpast 1.6 and above is probably
a bit more difficult.
Is that right?
Speaker 4 (08:57):
What about you, phil?
It wasn't as difficult and thesame thing that we are seeing
right now have seen in thequarter number one is the actual
quantity of potential clientsin the first quarter and the
(09:19):
last quarter, especially fromthe residential side.
So it wasn't difficult, we hadthe power to do so.
If we had enough sales we wouldbe able to produce those jobs.
So it wasn't the actual issueof producing, that was the
(09:40):
actual issue of getting enoughwork to do.
We just haven't had enough andI wouldn't say it was difficult.
But there was something thatmissing.
What we have discussed and wediscussed it very not so long
time ago ago, like a few daysbefore our meeting today that
(10:02):
the the last quarter of the year, in the first quarter of the
year, people do not residential,residentials are not really um
require for any, any sort ofpainting and they kind of hold
their money because of theholidays and the tax season.
But commercial jobs are stillgoing on.
(10:23):
So what we are trying to fixthis year and the next year,
we're going to try to attractmore commercial jobs for the
last quarter and the firstquarter, because the second and
the third quarter throughoutlast year and throughout this
year seems to be pretty good sofar.
So that's that's where itwasn't it like.
(10:43):
It wasn't hard or difficult.
We cannot say that we struggledwith something.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
it's just we haven't had enough volume of leads
coming in through the first andthe last quarter yeah, and from
my point of view, fromproduction side, last year was,
I would say, the mostinteresting because in 2023, I
was only project manager andVitaly was only estimator, and
(11:09):
then we had subcontractorsworking under us and last year
we had to add one more projectmanager, one more estimator and
one more office person.
So there was a year more reachof, like business movements not
necessarily painting movements,but more about related to
business as business.
So that was interesting.
(11:29):
And then last year it felt likefrom first month, from January
all the way to like probablymiddle of July it's like
building a plane on the way down.
You know, we have all thesejobs and we're trying to figure
out the way how to complete theefficiency with the proper
margins Although we think wehave systems in place but
(11:50):
they're not necessarily perfectand then till about end of July
middle of July we're kind ofgetting better and that's when
it starts to be smoother.
Like about this time of the yearwe can complete all the
projects pretty successful thatwe're trying to work on, and
until end of the year we shouldbe fine, like working with less
stress.
And then next year, dependingwhat kind of goal we're going to
(12:12):
have, it's going to be againsame story.
So if you want to growaggressively again, first six
months are going to have isgoing to be again same story.
So if you want to growaggressively again, first six
months are going to be struggleand then we're going to get on
our path when we know how toproduce all those jobs gotcha
okay.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
so it sounds like right now you're the constraint
in your business isn't yourability to produce the work,
it's's really just the theamount of leads or getting more
customers.
So you're trying to addcommercial in there to to get to
kind of smooth out the firstand the fourth quarter.
You've you've had a prettymostly smooth ride growing to
(12:52):
this point.
It was a little bit of achallenge to add in the
additional project manager andsalesperson from in 2024 to once
you guys grew past what youcould do between the two of you.
But you've pretty much stayedtrue to the subcontractor model
and just added on those projectmanager and sales roles and then
(13:17):
you're really just trying tounlock the next level of lead
flow and in commercial work.
Do you guys already have youalready broken into the
commercial stuff already, or isit pretty much just exclusively
residential?
Speaker 4 (13:32):
No, we did and we are doing way better in commercial
this year because that was theinitial goal to get a little bit
more involved into it, and weare doing more than we ever done
before.
Hopefully we're going to beable to produce and sell about
10% of the whole revenue thisyear and next year try to get
(13:53):
even a little bit more.
Maybe 12 to 15%.
Yes, we are doing a little bitmore.
Maybe 12% to 15%, okay, yes, weare doing a little bit better
with that.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Gotcha.
So 10% this year, just gettinginto it and then trying to grow
it from there.
Do you guys have a?
Because a lot of paintingbusinesses that I've worked with
they kind of want to have a50-50-ish split or maybe 60-40
split between residential andcommercial, just because
(14:20):
sometimes commercial is not asgreat with cash flow because of
the payment terms but commercialis usually really good with
cash flow because you can get upto a 50% deposit.
Do you guys have a plan withthat or what is that looking
like?
That's a good question.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
To be honest with you .
What is that looking like?
That?
That's a good question.
To be honest with you like thisis something that we probably
should put on paper and discuss.
We we haven't really decidedwhat percentage was going to
take again as of right now.
If we're going to hit 10% thisyear on commercial and 15% next
year, I think that's a reallygood start.
(14:56):
If we're going to get breakingdown more into it, I mean of
course we're not going to refuse, but that's going to change a
lot how we operate because themore commercials we do, the
different kind of cruise,different kind of approach, a
little bit different system ingeneral.
That's how I see it, dorey.
(15:18):
What's your perspective?
Speaker 3 (15:20):
on that.
Obviously we would like us tokeep up as a residential
repainting company, but when wehave some commercial projects
like 10%, 15%, that would becool but still there is extra
margin for dealing withcustomers and profitability of
commercial jobs are a little bitless.
There's a percentage.
(15:41):
So we want to keep on workingand building a residential
repaying company with somecommercial projects.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
Gotcha.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
I'd like to go back in time a little bit.
You said for the first sixmonths you were really having a
rough time, and then you gotsome help from some mentors and
then something changed and youobviously you started doubling
as soon, soon after that.
So what were the things thatyou learned that unlock that
(16:12):
growth for you guys?
Speaker 4 (16:15):
Let me let me tell one thing unlock that growth for
you guys.
Let me let me tell one thingandrew will get a little bit
deeper into um, like specificsof the roles, but the biggest
thing that, uh, first six monthsand it it seems to be very
obvious and seems to be right onthe surface, but we see more
examples, like us at PCA a lotthe biggest thing that basically
(16:40):
changed is just telling us hey,guys, break down, you do this
and you do this, you do sales,you do production.
First six months, we werepractically doing you know same
things, like I could find subs,I could manage them, andre could
sell the job and then, viceversa, go to the appointment,
(17:00):
like we would, you know, do eachother, um, in different days.
We'll have different roles andand that was the biggest mistake
that we have done so thebiggest impact was like, okay,
guys, you break down, you writedown the responsibilities, what
you're responsible for, whatyou're responsible for, and you
(17:21):
just you basically just go likethis and um, that was the
biggest one.
Of course, you can get more in,more deeper into the systems,
like what exactly helped us tochange, but that was probably
the biggest one, and we see moreexamples like this.
People don't really see it whenit's a partnership or even not
partnership.
Like you know, you will put abunch of different tasks on a
(17:43):
person.
Uh, that does things sales andproduction, and that, that and
that and that should be the case, uh, so that's the biggest one
I would like to fix it becausefor the first six months we
didn't have subcontractors.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
We had one, leo.
It was a guy on Facebook, Ithink.
Speaker 4 (18:02):
Yeah, even even that guy.
You know like you talk to him.
I talked to him like it was.
You know it was a mess, yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
We we were doing most of the work for first six
months for sure.
And then we even had the ideadoing only cabinets.
And then we even had the ideadoing only cabinets, like we
thought, okay, we're going to bea cabinet repeating company and
we were working on some of thecabinets.
And the idea of subcontracting.
We thought it would be likewhen you subcontract you just
give a job to the subcontractor,like you don't ever go there
(18:28):
again.
So kind of subcontractingdidn't feel appealing to us
because it didn't feel likewe're building something cool.
But then we learned what it'slike to work with subcontractors
when you're just using them asa labor, that's all.
So then we thought, oh, this iscool, and that's again after
talking with Garrett Martel andalso, I think, one of the things
(18:51):
that helped us that we didn'ttake money from the business
like we were always underpayingourselves, and that helped us to
have some capital in thebusiness that could allow us to
grow.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Gotcha, so it sounds like one.
Once you guys defined yourroles, you were able to focus
your effort on like I own this,this is my thing, I'm going to
kill this and you didn't have toworry about what the other
person's doing.
They're taking care of theirside.
So you, once you can focus yourenergy, you're just more
(19:25):
effective.
Sounds like that was one bigone.
And then also just themanagement of the subcontractors
and how to actually use themeffectively.
Could you talk a little bitmore about that?
What specifically did you dowith the subs that really
changed how you operated, yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Well, first that we just started using subs, like
Gary told us, have a list ofsubs that you can work with.
So we posted on Craigslist hey,we're looking for
subcontractors.
I think we talked with someSherwilliam guys, oh, and also I
would go to Sherwilliams andcall business cards, but that
was not very effective.
Like Efficient didn't help usout Mostly people from
(20:06):
Craigslist.
Then we had a little profile ofsubcontractors.
We would have like Worddocument as a template.
We would enter their name,their skills, like we would give
them rate or the way they look,abc level of their English, abc
, this type of stuff.
And then we had folder of thesefiles with different profiles
(20:27):
of subcontractors.
We had a folder with A, b and Csubs and then we knew what kind
of jobs we can give to what sub.
That's how it started, andGarrett initially told us that
we need to do 45% for labormaterials, but we tried that and
we were not able to get tothose uh numbers, so we were
(20:53):
doing like we're trying to dounder 50 percent up until now.
Do you remember anything elsefrom that period?
Speaker 4 (21:01):
in terms of the subs or in general.
Yeah, subs, um no, I feel likemore improvement, like there was
.
Of course, that was a bigimprovement.
Those little changes were thebig improvement, but I feel like
the biggest improvements withsubs.
They have been happening in thelast two years.
I think there was moresignificant changes in the sub
(21:27):
model for the last two yearsthan when we just start using
them okay.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
So in the beginning you guys were constrained on
your.
You were painting on the jobsite.
Uh, you didn't.
You weren't focused.
You started focusing on salesand marketing, like each of you
focused on your own lane.
You got got subcontractors tofree up your time so you're not
on the job site and a structuredway to pay them about 50% of
(21:57):
the job for labor and materialsand so that just freed up your
time to then, I'm assuming,focus on growing the business,
because then you grew prettypretty quickly.
After that, what were you doingon the marketing side?
I know you mentioned Facebook.
Quickly after that, what wereyou doing on the marketing side?
I know you mentioned Facebookand door knocking.
What was your primaryacquisition method to get that
much growth that quickly?
Speaker 4 (22:19):
That was still.
Facebook was still the biggestone at 800 and until 1.6 point,
Facebook and Google was thebiggest growth.
We've tried Every Door Directmail Saturated mail came just
last year but Every Door Directmail didn't work out really well
(22:40):
for us but we also didn't havea really good system to track
that.
We've had a few sponsorshipshere and there which we also did
not know the exact impact, butthe biggest ones that we can
really track very simple Googleand Facebook, organic and
non-organic.
When we started we createdInstagram page.
(23:01):
I remember us creating Instagrampage when we had our personal
vehicle and we had just a magnetyou keep painting with our
personal phone number and it waslike probably first few weeks
and we would just post even youknow, our vehicle with that
magnet on the side and it lookedsuper unprofessional right now.
(23:24):
But back then we thought like,wow, we're a big company, we got
, you know, we got advertisementon our vehicle, so even little
things like that, we actuallyhad somebody that.
And then we've heard thatsomewhere that to acquire a
client there's got to be a fewpoints of contact.
It's number one.
And we had a client his name'sKevin, one of the first clients,
(23:46):
and he called from the magnet,but he said that he has seen us
somewhere on Facebook first.
He's like when he's seen us onFacebook and then he has seen
the magnet, he's like okay, nowI can call.
So that was pretty cool.
But that's what we basicallyused, nothing really fancy.
But even until then we're notusing anything fancy right now,
(24:08):
but from day one we're not usinganything fancy right now.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
But from day one we had this idea of building the
brand.
We have this Ukrainianmarketing guy.
He created, like big brands inUkraine, multimillion companies
and he had his blog where he wastelling about power of brands
like that every brand has to beseen seven times before people
can trust him.
(24:30):
So we had this idea from dayone that we wanted to build a
brand.
So that helped us.
We always wear uniforms.
We tried to put magnets in thevehicle because once we got
banned we wrapped it up in ourcompany branding.
So we always had this type ofapproach.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Nice.
So a focus on brand.
You feel like that reallyhelped in the in in the
beginning with, I guess.
Can you tell me more aboutbranding, cause some folks, um,
branding can kind of seem alittle theoretical, but how are
you actually implementing it?
Is it just about the, you know,wrapping the vehicles and like
(25:11):
the, the logo and that sort ofthing, or there are more things
that you guys are doingintentionally to improve the
brand of the company?
Speaker 4 (25:18):
so last year we rebranded a little bit and we
added a few few sleeker things.
It's not how to show you sowe've seen this UP so it seems
like super simple andstraightforward, but it took us
like three months to come upwith this stuff Really a lot of
(25:42):
effort and it seems like thatactually helps to recognize.
I think that always puttingyour name out there gives a
really good brand awareness andit's not like about just saying
hey, call us.
It's just about putting yourname out there and just remind
people about yourself.
And if we're going to betalking about the biggest
(26:06):
marketing strategy that we have,that gives us the biggest
return.
That's going to be and I thinkevery company should strive for
that referrals and repeatclients.
And to wrap, it starts withproduction a site where we
follow up with the client, askthem to fill out the survey,
(26:30):
always send them emails.
Every client that we dealt withbefore gets two emails every
week with some kind of news ordiscounts or promos or just
informational ones.
This type of thing is to stayin touch with your people all
the time.
That helps to to build a brandLike.
(26:51):
We have a few clients that youknow.
They they know that UK paintingis a company that they able to
recommend to other people andthere's going to be no issues.
They know us like um, a bigcompany.
Some people just like approachand say, oh, I know you guys you
(27:11):
guys, you guys, you keeppainting.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
Yeah, some people think that you're a big company
for some reason, but I alsowould add that from day one we
had this idea that we want tolook professional.
We always motivate oursubcontractors to wear our yuki
painting shirts.
We always put yard sign by thehouse.
If our subs have a decentlooking van, we encourage them
(27:32):
and motivate them to put magnetson those vans.
We put door hangers to the nexthomes that we're working in and
, like Vitaly said, we'recalling after the job is
completed to make sureeverything is good.
We send a few emails, but alsowe have little presents that we
give after job completion.
(27:53):
We used to have different cups,different chips clippers, but
now we're doing only coastersthat have Yuki painting on it.
Who knows, maybe they're goingto throw it away, but one person
might leave it on the table andthen guests are going to come
and maybe see the brand or maybethey're going to talk about it,
who knows?
But we feel like that also addssome kind of credibility and
(28:14):
trust and knowledge for acompany.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
That makes a lot of sense.
So very deliberate effort onyour guys' part to make sure
that you look professional, thatyou look like a quality brand
and then also acting that way,trying to because you did a lot
of outbound marketing withFacebook ads and that sort of
(28:38):
thing but it sounds like you'rereally focused on also making
sure that you get repeat clientsand you nurture your customers
After you perform work for them.
You're periodically reachingout to them, you know monthly or
quarterly, to stay in touch,provide value and then you know
see if they need work again I'massuming as well to reactivate
(29:00):
them.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
And the Google reviews.
We tried to work hard ongetting Google reviews.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Google reviews.
Yeah, it's huge.
So so your growth definitelyimpressive.
It sounds like in the beginningyou fixed your.
Your constraint was basicallynot having enough workers.
You fix that withsubcontractors by getting those
Craigslist Craigslist ad postedand have that steady flow of
(29:25):
subcontractors.
Focus on brand you were able touse Facebook ads to get your
name out there quickly and thenprovide a great experience with
good branding, to get referralsand repeat customers to support
the growth.
And then in 2024, you actuallyhad to start hiring a team,
(29:48):
because up up into this point itsounds like you pretty much
were just doing subcontractorsand the two of you, but then
2024, you needed to add anothersalesperson, another production
manager did.
How did that change the dynamicor like what were the
challenges there?
Speaker 3 (30:08):
well, I want to say that I'm glad that we read the
book From Good to Great from JimCollins and he was saying that
better companies employ peoplewithin the company.
So we were looking right awayfrom who we can promote inside
of our company and we had oneguy, christian, who was painting
cabinets.
(30:28):
He was an American guy.
He was definitely smarter andbetter than a cabinet painter.
So we thought, okay, maybe hecan potentially become an
estimator.
And then we had anothersubcontractor who was also a
little bit too good to be asubcontractor, so we already
laid his eye on him even earlier, before we even told him that.
(30:51):
So both of those guys grewwithin the company.
So Juan became project managerand Christian became estimator,
and I think it made it so mucheasier.
We didn't have to teach themwhat kind of company we are,
what our values are.
Even we didn't have writtenvalues at the time, but from our
behaviors they could understandwhat kind of people we are.
(31:13):
So I think that helped us a lot, made it easier.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
Nice.
So it sounds like you promotedyour accounting guy to sales.
Did he have sales experience ordid you guys just train him?
No, just trained him.
Okay, awesome.
And how long has he been inthat role at this point?
Speaker 4 (31:36):
So at this point this is his second year as a
salesperson.
Okay, nice, he did, I believe1.1 or right under 1.2 million
first year.
That's awesome.
And this year so far, if hegoes as he goes, he's going to
(31:56):
hit 1.5.
That's awesome.
His ideal goal is going to be1.7.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
That's pretty impressive.
That's pretty impressive.
I mean going from like notdoing sales before, because I
don't know had he done salesbefore at all or nothing and
there is actually.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
There is a saying, not a saying by Nick Slavik he
separates salesperson andestimator.
Yeah, so from his by NickSlavik, he separates salesperson
and estimator.
Yeah, so from his behavioralperspective he is not a
salesperson.
He is not a person that willsell what is unsellable.
He is just a very great personwith the right knowledge and he
(32:44):
is doing good in this position,but he is more estimator than
salesperson gotcha.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
Well, he's definitely making sales for not being a
salesperson.
Uh, 1.1 million his first yearand then 1.5 this year that's,
that's awesome I'm coming rightnow.
Speaker 4 (33:00):
I'm looking at it he's at 785,000.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Yeah, that's amazing.
So you really liked him.
You thought you saw somethingin him.
For some reason you thought hewould be a good estimator or
salesperson and I'm assuming yougot him some good training.
Did you guys have a trainingprogram that you ran them
through to get them trained upback?
Speaker 4 (33:28):
um, back then we didn't really have, um, any good
system.
It just basically just go aheadand follow me and, uh, just
basically copy paste everything.
That's how it was.
And this year, 2025, we had tohire another salesperson and we
(33:50):
took time to prepare and get thesystem together.
So the new person, ryan, thatcame in on board this year.
He went through a prettysystemized training.
There was a few things missing,but in general, there was a.
There was SOP almost for everyline item that he needed to to
(34:11):
go over as a salesperson.
So back then, no, but in 2025,I already had a pretty good
system Did you also for Ryan?
Speaker 2 (34:20):
did you get him internally?
Was he a sub as well?
He was no, he was no, he was hewas, uh, external, okay gotcha,
but now that's, that's great.
Your first two hires, internal,from subs.
You just trained them up andsounds like they're both working
out really well and they'resecond year in, so something.
(34:40):
It sounds like you guys reallyset them up for success and you
really identified because I knowjust a lot of businesses those
two hires are the productionmanager role and the salesperson
role can be tough to fill,especially if it's the first one
outside of the owners thatyou're you're bringing on.
It's a little bit of a learningcurve.
It sounds like you guys knockedit out of the park on both of
(35:03):
them on the first try.
So you guys are doing somethingright.
Is there anything you like?
What do you think went right?
What did you guys?
Um, what do you think you didto get it right on the first try
with both those roles?
You think it was because I knowyou cited like the fact that
they were already in the company.
(35:23):
They knew you guys, so you guysknew they were good like.
They were good fit for thecompany.
That's probably a big plusthere.
Was there anything else?
Speaker 3 (35:32):
we have this guy in ukraine.
He he built the biggest bank inukraine and he said that I want
to work with people who I wantto hug that you want that you
won't work with people, thatwhat, that you want to give a
hug?
oh, give a hug, yeah, so luckilywe have everybody in the
company that, uh, I want to hugand that, uh, that is that feels
(35:54):
great toward this type ofpeople and then, like nick
slavik says, being decent humanbeing.
You know, we we kind of workdifferently, but I feel like
it's a similar story.
This is the foundation of anyrole just to find the right
people who can fill the rightrole.
So I think what helped us fromday one maybe we didn't have
(36:16):
that done perfectly, but we hadsome kind of responsibilities
written down.
We had their step-by-step ondaily operations, what they need
to do, kind of like their SAP.
We had some kind of KPIs inplace for them.
It wasn't perfect, but it wasthere and I think that helped us
out, that we didn't just throwthem on the field, say, hey,
figure this out, but we kind ofhad step-by-step explanations
(36:39):
for all the processes.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
Gotcha Cool, all right, awesome.
Well, I want to be respectfulof your time.
This has been super informative.
I think you guys have provideda ton of value to everyone
listening.
Do you have any final thoughtsfor the listeners or anything
from your perspective that youthink is super important when
growing your business beyond 3million in revenue that you'd
(37:04):
like to throw out there beforewe let you guys go?
Speaker 4 (37:14):
what?
What does usually people say?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
it's, it is, it spans the gambit, I guess.
Let me rephrase it.
So if you can put yourself backin the place of where you were
doing $800,000, and what wouldyou have liked to have known
(37:38):
then that would have sped upyour learning process.
To be at $ 3 million now Likewhat do you wish you would have
known back when you were sub amillion?
Maybe in that you were at800,000 after that first big
year.
What would you have liked tohave known that you didn't?
But now you know that has beenreally useful in growing beyond
(38:02):
$3 million in revenue.
Speaker 4 (38:06):
It's hard to again, it's basically the conversation
that we have had for those 40minutes and there is a bunch of
little things that really helpto get there, but the biggest
one, again, it's talking topeople that already went that
path and taking their experienceand actually implement and not
(38:32):
just listen to what is mentionedto you, but actually take those
notes and take the action onand everything that we are doing
.
We're not doing anythingspecial.
Maybe there are some thingsthat are different, but the
general idea is you knowsomebody already have done it
before, and there is so manypeople out there that are
smarter than you are that youshould listen and just copy
(38:56):
paste.
Speaker 3 (38:57):
Basically, yes, how I feel.
Also, like everybody, have madeso many mistakes and there's so
many good things that we canlearn from.
I would probably read the booktraction earner and the e-myth
michael gerber.
I think those are two reallyfundamental books for any
business.
And, yeah, just learning frompeople who have accomplished
(39:20):
what we're looking to accomplishand also to know what kind of
people to look up to.
I think it was important thatwe had vision where we want to
go.
From day one, when we justpainted with a brush in our
hands, we had the vision that wewant to become.
That time we thought we weregoing to become 10 million
dollar company.
Now we're not thinking thatwe're going to grow that big,
(39:43):
but we still have vision tobecome a business that can
operate itself and being more asan asset than than a job for
ourselves I think that'sexcellent advice.
Speaker 2 (39:53):
I really appreciate you, too, coming on and sharing
your story with us.
I think you're going to inspirea lot of people with this and
with that for our listeners.
We will see you next week,thank you.
Thank you so much.
Welcome to the Profitable Painter Podcast.
The mission of this podcast issimple to help you navigate the
financial and tax aspects ofstarting, running and scaling a
professional painting business,from the brushes and ladders to
the spreadsheets and balancesheets.
We've got you covered.
But before we dive in, a quickword of caution.
While we strive to provideaccurate and up-to-date
financial and tax information,nothing you hear on this podcast
(00:22):
should be considered asfinancial advice specifically
and tax information.
Nothing you hear on thispodcast should be considered as
financial advice specificallyfor you or your business.
We're here to share generalknowledge and experiences, not
to replace the tailored adviceyou get from a professional
financial advisor or taxconsultant.
We strongly recommend youseeking individualized advice
before making any significantfinancial decision.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Profitable Painter Podcast, the
show where painting contractorslearn how to boost profits, cut
taxes and build a business thatworks for them.
I'm your host, daniel Honan,cpa, former painting business
owner, and your guide tomastering the numbers that drive
success.
Let's dive in and make yourbusiness more profitable, one
episode at a time.
Today, I'm super excited tospeak with Vital and Andre out
(01:06):
of North Carolina.
They have an amazing paintingbusiness, yuki Painting, out of
the Charlotte area, so I'm superexcited to jump in the
conversation to hear more abouttheir story.
Welcome to the podcast, guys.
How are you doing?
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Thank you, Daniel.
Thank you for having us Doingwell.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Awesome.
Thank you, daniel.
Absolutely Glad to have youguys on and just to kind of give
folks an understanding of whereyou're coming from.
Could you take me through howdid you get started in the
painting industry and what havebeen some major milestones along
the way?
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Do you want to get started?
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Happy to share with you guys how we started.
This is something that wereally would love to share with
you guys.
How we started, this is, uhsomething that we um really
would love to share witheveryone.
This is, uh something thatmakes us a little bit excited
when we share our story.
Um, because when we started, westarted as just two guys, um,
(02:01):
without money, without skills,just our ambition to do
something, and the idea camerandomly to Andre back in 2021.
The idea was let's do some kindof business for both of us, and
then Andre approached andmentioned, hey, let's do
(02:23):
painting.
And none of us really knowanything about painting.
Andre did a little bit of thepainting in the past for um, for
one of the rental managementproperty companies back in key
west florida, and a little bitfor commercial.
So he did knew a little bitabout that.
My knowledge was very tightabout painting and we just like,
(02:48):
okay, let's do it.
We went and purchased a verybasic set of tools and basically
started to advertise on thirdparty local applications.
(03:12):
We got signed up with Thumbtack, did a little bit of Facebook
later on and we started pickingup some business, did some door
knocking and the businessstarted picking up some business
, did some door knocking and thebusiness started picking up.
The first six months have been abig struggle Not so many
clients, not so much knowledge,not really know what we're doing
(03:35):
late hours into a differentstory because we were able to
get in touch with people thathave been doing painting
business for a long time andthey kind of guided us in the
(03:58):
direction of what we're doingwrong and what we're doing right
, and that was a big pivot forus talking to people that
already have completed asuccessful path in the past.
And then since then sinceprobably like 2022 we just
started growing prettyconsistently.
That's a.
That's a pretty short summary.
We can add way more things intoit, but that's a pretty short
(04:21):
summary how we started and howit started going well.
From which point?
Speaker 3 (04:25):
in the first six months we were both having the
jobs besides our paintingcompany, so we had to do
something that could pay ourbills, because with uk painting
we're keeping all the profitsinside of the company.
So that could allow us reinvestmoney and have things like
website order shirts.
Reinvest money and have thingslike website order shirts,
(04:49):
things like that and actually bywatching podcast in brandon
prupond with garrett martel.
He had podcast and that's howwe found about garrett and we
can talk to him.
He offered his consultation.
So we consulted with Garrettand since then he recommended us
to divide our responsibilities.
One of us is responsible forsales and marketing and another
(05:11):
one is responsible forproduction.
He told us more about how towork with subcontractors and he
told us about PCA Expo.
So after his conversation, wehad to change our business,
change our approach, and Ibelieve this is one of the
important periods of ourbusiness.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Nice.
So it sounds like you guysstarted pretty much from scratch
.
You didn't have any money orskills or anything, just an idea
, and then you've run with itfrom there, and so this is
awesome and it sounds likeyou're doing the subcontractor
model, who's focused on salesand who's focused on production.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Vitaly is responsible of sales and marketing and I'm
responsible for production.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Okay, so you get those rules split and the first
six months was rough.
You basically were justreinvesting all any profit back
into the business to grow.
You got some mentors to helpyou grow it to the next level.
Uh, and since 2022 it soundslike it's been growing pretty
consistently.
We're, we're what In terms ofrevenue.
(06:23):
Where are you guys at at thispoint?
Speaker 3 (06:28):
Last year we did almost 2.7.
So the first year was like280,000.
Then we did 800,000.
Then we did 1.6.
Last year we were aiming for 3,but we didn't hit our goal.
We got to almost 2.7.
And this year we're in a trackto do didn't hit our goal.
We got to like almost 2.7, andthis year we track to do like
3.5 to 3.8 wow, that's awesome3.5 million target this year, or
(06:56):
even higher well, target wasfour, but we had to change it
because we had terrible quarterone okay, bad quarter one.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
So you had to adjust it down a little bit.
So the original target was fourmillion, had to adjust it down
to 3.5, 3.8 million.
Okay, that's still amazing.
And so in 2024 it was 2.7,right, and then before that it
was 1.6.
You said, yeah, 1.6, so that issuper.
Speaker 4 (07:25):
And then before that it was 800 000, so you doubled
uh, and then when we doubledfrom 8 to 1.6, we thought that
every year we're going to beable to double.
That was like, okay, that seemsto be pretty easy.
That was the idea originally.
And, uh, that's where 3 millioncame.
Actually there was 3.2.
(07:45):
Uh, when we from 1.6, we wantedto get to like the 3.2, ideally
, uh, but it didn't happen.
And, um, that, that's what.
When we realized, okay, that's,uh, just doubling, that's,
that's not a real thing to do inthe real world, at least for us
.
At least for us, it it ispossible.
It's possible to triple.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Yeah, it's possible, but it's super rare, and
especially when you startgetting up to multi-millions.
Anything over 30% is amazing.
So 30% growth is amazing andyou guys have done that
consistently since 2022, itsounds like.
So that's amazing.
(08:31):
So, with that growth though I'msure already was that 800 to
1.6 was not too bad, but gettingpast 1.6 and above is probably
a bit more difficult.
Is that right?
Speaker 4 (08:57):
What about you, phil?
It wasn't as difficult and thesame thing that we are seeing
right now have seen in thequarter number one is the actual
quantity of potential clientsin the first quarter and the
(09:19):
last quarter, especially fromthe residential side.
So it wasn't difficult, we hadthe power to do so.
If we had enough sales we wouldbe able to produce those jobs.
So it wasn't the actual issueof producing, that was the
(09:40):
actual issue of getting enoughwork to do.
We just haven't had enough andI wouldn't say it was difficult.
But there was something thatmissing.
What we have discussed and wediscussed it very not so long
time ago ago, like a few daysbefore our meeting today that
(10:02):
the the last quarter of the year, in the first quarter of the
year, people do not residential,residentials are not really um
require for any, any sort ofpainting and they kind of hold
their money because of theholidays and the tax season.
But commercial jobs are stillgoing on.
(10:23):
So what we are trying to fixthis year and the next year,
we're going to try to attractmore commercial jobs for the
last quarter and the firstquarter, because the second and
the third quarter throughoutlast year and throughout this
year seems to be pretty good sofar.
So that's that's where itwasn't it like.
(10:43):
It wasn't hard or difficult.
We cannot say that we struggledwith something.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
it's just we haven't had enough volume of leads
coming in through the first andthe last quarter yeah, and from
my point of view, fromproduction side, last year was,
I would say, the mostinteresting because in 2023, I
was only project manager andVitaly was only estimator, and
(11:09):
then we had subcontractorsworking under us and last year
we had to add one more projectmanager, one more estimator and
one more office person.
So there was a year more reachof, like business movements not
necessarily painting movements,but more about related to
business as business.
So that was interesting.
(11:29):
And then last year it felt likefrom first month, from January
all the way to like probablymiddle of July it's like
building a plane on the way down.
You know, we have all thesejobs and we're trying to figure
out the way how to complete theefficiency with the proper
margins Although we think wehave systems in place but
(11:50):
they're not necessarily perfectand then till about end of July
middle of July we're kind ofgetting better and that's when
it starts to be smoother.
Like about this time of the yearwe can complete all the
projects pretty successful thatwe're trying to work on, and
until end of the year we shouldbe fine, like working with less
stress.
And then next year, dependingwhat kind of goal we're going to
(12:12):
have, it's going to be againsame story.
So if you want to growaggressively again, first six
months are going to have isgoing to be again same story.
So if you want to growaggressively again, first six
months are going to be struggleand then we're going to get on
our path when we know how toproduce all those jobs gotcha
okay.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
so it sounds like right now you're the constraint
in your business isn't yourability to produce the work,
it's's really just the theamount of leads or getting more
customers.
So you're trying to addcommercial in there to to get to
kind of smooth out the firstand the fourth quarter.
You've you've had a prettymostly smooth ride growing to
(12:52):
this point.
It was a little bit of achallenge to add in the
additional project manager andsalesperson from in 2024 to once
you guys grew past what youcould do between the two of you.
But you've pretty much stayedtrue to the subcontractor model
and just added on those projectmanager and sales roles and then
(13:17):
you're really just trying tounlock the next level of lead
flow and in commercial work.
Do you guys already have youalready broken into the
commercial stuff already, or isit pretty much just exclusively
residential?
Speaker 4 (13:32):
No, we did and we are doing way better in commercial
this year because that was theinitial goal to get a little bit
more involved into it, and weare doing more than we ever done
before.
Hopefully we're going to beable to produce and sell about
10% of the whole revenue thisyear and next year try to get
(13:53):
even a little bit more.
Maybe 12 to 15%.
Yes, we are doing a little bitmore.
Maybe 12% to 15%, okay, yes, weare doing a little bit better
with that.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Gotcha.
So 10% this year, just gettinginto it and then trying to grow
it from there.
Do you guys have a?
Because a lot of paintingbusinesses that I've worked with
they kind of want to have a50-50-ish split or maybe 60-40
split between residential andcommercial, just because
(14:20):
sometimes commercial is not asgreat with cash flow because of
the payment terms but commercialis usually really good with
cash flow because you can get upto a 50% deposit.
Do you guys have a plan withthat or what is that looking
like?
That's a good question.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
To be honest with you .
What is that looking like?
That?
That's a good question.
To be honest with you like thisis something that we probably
should put on paper and discuss.
We we haven't really decidedwhat percentage was going to
take again as of right now.
If we're going to hit 10% thisyear on commercial and 15% next
year, I think that's a reallygood start.
(14:56):
If we're going to get breakingdown more into it, I mean of
course we're not going to refuse, but that's going to change a
lot how we operate because themore commercials we do, the
different kind of cruise,different kind of approach, a
little bit different system ingeneral.
That's how I see it, dorey.
(15:18):
What's your perspective?
Speaker 3 (15:20):
on that.
Obviously we would like us tokeep up as a residential
repainting company, but when wehave some commercial projects
like 10%, 15%, that would becool but still there is extra
margin for dealing withcustomers and profitability of
commercial jobs are a little bitless.
There's a percentage.
(15:41):
So we want to keep on workingand building a residential
repaying company with somecommercial projects.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
Gotcha.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
I'd like to go back in time a little bit.
You said for the first sixmonths you were really having a
rough time, and then you gotsome help from some mentors and
then something changed and youobviously you started doubling
as soon, soon after that.
So what were the things thatyou learned that unlock that
(16:12):
growth for you guys?
Speaker 4 (16:15):
Let me let me tell one thing unlock that growth for
you guys.
Let me let me tell one thingandrew will get a little bit
deeper into um, like specificsof the roles, but the biggest
thing that, uh, first six monthsand it it seems to be very
obvious and seems to be right onthe surface, but we see more
examples, like us at PCA a lotthe biggest thing that basically
(16:40):
changed is just telling us hey,guys, break down, you do this
and you do this, you do sales,you do production.
First six months, we werepractically doing you know same
things, like I could find subs,I could manage them, andre could
sell the job and then, viceversa, go to the appointment,
(17:00):
like we would, you know, do eachother, um, in different days.
We'll have different roles andand that was the biggest mistake
that we have done so thebiggest impact was like, okay,
guys, you break down, you writedown the responsibilities, what
you're responsible for, whatyou're responsible for, and you
(17:21):
just you basically just go likethis and um, that was the
biggest one.
Of course, you can get more in,more deeper into the systems,
like what exactly helped us tochange, but that was probably
the biggest one, and we see moreexamples like this.
People don't really see it whenit's a partnership or even not
partnership.
Like you know, you will put abunch of different tasks on a
(17:43):
person.
Uh, that does things sales andproduction, and that, that and
that and that should be the case, uh, so that's the biggest one
I would like to fix it becausefor the first six months we
didn't have subcontractors.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
We had one, leo.
It was a guy on Facebook, Ithink.
Speaker 4 (18:02):
Yeah, even even that guy.
You know like you talk to him.
I talked to him like it was.
You know it was a mess, yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
We we were doing most of the work for first six
months for sure.
And then we even had the ideadoing only cabinets.
And then we even had the ideadoing only cabinets, like we
thought, okay, we're going to bea cabinet repeating company and
we were working on some of thecabinets.
And the idea of subcontracting.
We thought it would be likewhen you subcontract you just
give a job to the subcontractor,like you don't ever go there
(18:28):
again.
So kind of subcontractingdidn't feel appealing to us
because it didn't feel likewe're building something cool.
But then we learned what it'slike to work with subcontractors
when you're just using them asa labor, that's all.
So then we thought, oh, this iscool, and that's again after
talking with Garrett Martel andalso, I think, one of the things
(18:51):
that helped us that we didn'ttake money from the business
like we were always underpayingourselves, and that helped us to
have some capital in thebusiness that could allow us to
grow.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Gotcha, so it sounds like one.
Once you guys defined yourroles, you were able to focus
your effort on like I own this,this is my thing, I'm going to
kill this and you didn't have toworry about what the other
person's doing.
They're taking care of theirside.
So you, once you can focus yourenergy, you're just more
(19:25):
effective.
Sounds like that was one bigone.
And then also just themanagement of the subcontractors
and how to actually use themeffectively.
Could you talk a little bitmore about that?
What specifically did you dowith the subs that really
changed how you operated, yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Well, first that we just started using subs, like
Gary told us, have a list ofsubs that you can work with.
So we posted on Craigslist hey,we're looking for
subcontractors.
I think we talked with someSherwilliam guys, oh, and also I
would go to Sherwilliams andcall business cards, but that
was not very effective.
Like Efficient didn't help usout Mostly people from
(20:06):
Craigslist.
Then we had a little profile ofsubcontractors.
We would have like Worddocument as a template.
We would enter their name,their skills, like we would give
them rate or the way they look,abc level of their English, abc
, this type of stuff.
And then we had folder of thesefiles with different profiles
(20:27):
of subcontractors.
We had a folder with A, b and Csubs and then we knew what kind
of jobs we can give to what sub.
That's how it started, andGarrett initially told us that
we need to do 45% for labormaterials, but we tried that and
we were not able to get tothose uh numbers, so we were
(20:53):
doing like we're trying to dounder 50 percent up until now.
Do you remember anything elsefrom that period?
Speaker 4 (21:01):
in terms of the subs or in general.
Yeah, subs, um no, I feel likemore improvement, like there was
.
Of course, that was a bigimprovement.
Those little changes were thebig improvement, but I feel like
the biggest improvements withsubs.
They have been happening in thelast two years.
I think there was moresignificant changes in the sub
(21:27):
model for the last two yearsthan when we just start using
them okay.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
So in the beginning you guys were constrained on
your.
You were painting on the jobsite.
Uh, you didn't.
You weren't focused.
You started focusing on salesand marketing, like each of you
focused on your own lane.
You got got subcontractors tofree up your time so you're not
on the job site and a structuredway to pay them about 50% of
(21:57):
the job for labor and materialsand so that just freed up your
time to then, I'm assuming,focus on growing the business,
because then you grew prettypretty quickly.
After that, what were you doingon the marketing side?
I know you mentioned Facebook.
Quickly after that, what wereyou doing on the marketing side?
I know you mentioned Facebookand door knocking.
What was your primaryacquisition method to get that
much growth that quickly?
Speaker 4 (22:19):
That was still.
Facebook was still the biggestone at 800 and until 1.6 point,
Facebook and Google was thebiggest growth.
We've tried Every Door Directmail Saturated mail came just
last year but Every Door Directmail didn't work out really well
(22:40):
for us but we also didn't havea really good system to track
that.
We've had a few sponsorshipshere and there which we also did
not know the exact impact, butthe biggest ones that we can
really track very simple Googleand Facebook, organic and
non-organic.
When we started we createdInstagram page.
(23:01):
I remember us creating Instagrampage when we had our personal
vehicle and we had just a magnetyou keep painting with our
personal phone number and it waslike probably first few weeks
and we would just post even youknow, our vehicle with that
magnet on the side and it lookedsuper unprofessional right now.
(23:24):
But back then we thought like,wow, we're a big company, we got
, you know, we got advertisementon our vehicle, so even little
things like that, we actuallyhad somebody that.
And then we've heard thatsomewhere that to acquire a
client there's got to be a fewpoints of contact.
It's number one.
And we had a client his name'sKevin, one of the first clients,
(23:46):
and he called from the magnet,but he said that he has seen us
somewhere on Facebook first.
He's like when he's seen us onFacebook and then he has seen
the magnet, he's like okay, nowI can call.
So that was pretty cool.
But that's what we basicallyused, nothing really fancy.
But even until then we're notusing anything fancy right now,
(24:08):
but from day one we're not usinganything fancy right now.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
But from day one we had this idea of building the
brand.
We have this Ukrainianmarketing guy.
He created, like big brands inUkraine, multimillion companies
and he had his blog where he wastelling about power of brands
like that every brand has to beseen seven times before people
can trust him.
(24:30):
So we had this idea from dayone that we wanted to build a
brand.
So that helped us.
We always wear uniforms.
We tried to put magnets in thevehicle because once we got
banned we wrapped it up in ourcompany branding.
So we always had this type ofapproach.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Nice.
So a focus on brand.
You feel like that reallyhelped in the in in the
beginning with, I guess.
Can you tell me more aboutbranding, cause some folks, um,
branding can kind of seem alittle theoretical, but how are
you actually implementing it?
Is it just about the, you know,wrapping the vehicles and like
(25:11):
the, the logo and that sort ofthing, or there are more things
that you guys are doingintentionally to improve the
brand of the company?
Speaker 4 (25:18):
so last year we rebranded a little bit and we
added a few few sleeker things.
It's not how to show you sowe've seen this UP so it seems
like super simple andstraightforward, but it took us
like three months to come upwith this stuff Really a lot of
(25:42):
effort and it seems like thatactually helps to recognize.
I think that always puttingyour name out there gives a
really good brand awareness andit's not like about just saying
hey, call us.
It's just about putting yourname out there and just remind
people about yourself.
And if we're going to betalking about the biggest
(26:06):
marketing strategy that we have,that gives us the biggest
return.
That's going to be and I thinkevery company should strive for
that referrals and repeatclients.
And to wrap, it starts withproduction a site where we
follow up with the client, askthem to fill out the survey,
(26:30):
always send them emails.
Every client that we dealt withbefore gets two emails every
week with some kind of news ordiscounts or promos or just
informational ones.
This type of thing is to stayin touch with your people all
the time.
That helps to to build a brandLike.
(26:51):
We have a few clients that youknow.
They they know that UK paintingis a company that they able to
recommend to other people andthere's going to be no issues.
They know us like um, a bigcompany.
Some people just like approachand say, oh, I know you guys you
(27:11):
guys, you guys, you keeppainting.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
Yeah, some people think that you're a big company
for some reason, but I alsowould add that from day one we
had this idea that we want tolook professional.
We always motivate oursubcontractors to wear our yuki
painting shirts.
We always put yard sign by thehouse.
If our subs have a decentlooking van, we encourage them
(27:32):
and motivate them to put magnetson those vans.
We put door hangers to the nexthomes that we're working in and
, like Vitaly said, we'recalling after the job is
completed to make sureeverything is good.
We send a few emails, but alsowe have little presents that we
give after job completion.
(27:53):
We used to have different cups,different chips clippers, but
now we're doing only coastersthat have Yuki painting on it.
Who knows, maybe they're goingto throw it away, but one person
might leave it on the table andthen guests are going to come
and maybe see the brand or maybethey're going to talk about it,
who knows?
But we feel like that also addssome kind of credibility and
(28:14):
trust and knowledge for acompany.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
That makes a lot of sense.
So very deliberate effort onyour guys' part to make sure
that you look professional, thatyou look like a quality brand
and then also acting that way,trying to because you did a lot
of outbound marketing withFacebook ads and that sort of
(28:38):
thing but it sounds like you'rereally focused on also making
sure that you get repeat clientsand you nurture your customers
After you perform work for them.
You're periodically reachingout to them, you know monthly or
quarterly, to stay in touch,provide value and then you know
see if they need work again I'massuming as well to reactivate
(29:00):
them.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
And the Google reviews.
We tried to work hard ongetting Google reviews.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Google reviews.
Yeah, it's huge.
So so your growth definitelyimpressive.
It sounds like in the beginningyou fixed your.
Your constraint was basicallynot having enough workers.
You fix that withsubcontractors by getting those
Craigslist Craigslist ad postedand have that steady flow of
(29:25):
subcontractors.
Focus on brand you were able touse Facebook ads to get your
name out there quickly and thenprovide a great experience with
good branding, to get referralsand repeat customers to support
the growth.
And then in 2024, you actuallyhad to start hiring a team,
(29:48):
because up up into this point itsounds like you pretty much
were just doing subcontractorsand the two of you, but then
2024, you needed to add anothersalesperson, another production
manager did.
How did that change the dynamicor like what were the
challenges there?
Speaker 3 (30:08):
well, I want to say that I'm glad that we read the
book From Good to Great from JimCollins and he was saying that
better companies employ peoplewithin the company.
So we were looking right awayfrom who we can promote inside
of our company and we had oneguy, christian, who was painting
cabinets.
(30:28):
He was an American guy.
He was definitely smarter andbetter than a cabinet painter.
So we thought, okay, maybe hecan potentially become an
estimator.
And then we had anothersubcontractor who was also a
little bit too good to be asubcontractor, so we already
laid his eye on him even earlier, before we even told him that.
(30:51):
So both of those guys grewwithin the company.
So Juan became project managerand Christian became estimator,
and I think it made it so mucheasier.
We didn't have to teach themwhat kind of company we are,
what our values are.
Even we didn't have writtenvalues at the time, but from our
behaviors they could understandwhat kind of people we are.
(31:13):
So I think that helped us a lot, made it easier.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
Nice.
So it sounds like you promotedyour accounting guy to sales.
Did he have sales experience ordid you guys just train him?
No, just trained him.
Okay, awesome.
And how long has he been inthat role at this point?
Speaker 4 (31:36):
So at this point this is his second year as a
salesperson.
Okay, nice, he did, I believe1.1 or right under 1.2 million
first year.
That's awesome.
And this year so far, if hegoes as he goes, he's going to
(31:56):
hit 1.5.
That's awesome.
His ideal goal is going to be1.7.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
That's pretty impressive.
That's pretty impressive.
I mean going from like notdoing sales before, because I
don't know had he done salesbefore at all or nothing and
there is actually.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
There is a saying, not a saying by Nick Slavik he
separates salesperson andestimator.
Yeah, so from his by NickSlavik, he separates salesperson
and estimator.
Yeah, so from his behavioralperspective he is not a
salesperson.
He is not a person that willsell what is unsellable.
He is just a very great personwith the right knowledge and he
(32:44):
is doing good in this position,but he is more estimator than
salesperson gotcha.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
Well, he's definitely making sales for not being a
salesperson.
Uh, 1.1 million his first yearand then 1.5 this year that's,
that's awesome I'm coming rightnow.
Speaker 4 (33:00):
I'm looking at it he's at 785,000.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Yeah, that's amazing.
So you really liked him.
You thought you saw somethingin him.
For some reason you thought hewould be a good estimator or
salesperson and I'm assuming yougot him some good training.
Did you guys have a trainingprogram that you ran them
through to get them trained upback?
Speaker 4 (33:28):
um, back then we didn't really have, um, any good
system.
It just basically just go aheadand follow me and, uh, just
basically copy paste everything.
That's how it was.
And this year, 2025, we had tohire another salesperson and we
(33:50):
took time to prepare and get thesystem together.
So the new person, ryan, thatcame in on board this year.
He went through a prettysystemized training.
There was a few things missing,but in general, there was a.
There was SOP almost for everyline item that he needed to to
(34:11):
go over as a salesperson.
So back then, no, but in 2025,I already had a pretty good
system Did you also for Ryan?
Speaker 2 (34:20):
did you get him internally?
Was he a sub as well?
He was no, he was no, he was hewas, uh, external, okay gotcha,
but now that's, that's great.
Your first two hires, internal,from subs.
You just trained them up andsounds like they're both working
out really well and they'resecond year in, so something.
(34:40):
It sounds like you guys reallyset them up for success and you
really identified because I knowjust a lot of businesses those
two hires are the productionmanager role and the salesperson
role can be tough to fill,especially if it's the first one
outside of the owners thatyou're you're bringing on.
It's a little bit of a learningcurve.
It sounds like you guys knockedit out of the park on both of
(35:03):
them on the first try.
So you guys are doing somethingright.
Is there anything you like?
What do you think went right?
What did you guys?
Um, what do you think you didto get it right on the first try
with both those roles?
You think it was because I knowyou cited like the fact that
they were already in the company.
(35:23):
They knew you guys, so you guysknew they were good like.
They were good fit for thecompany.
That's probably a big plusthere.
Was there anything else?
Speaker 3 (35:32):
we have this guy in ukraine.
He he built the biggest bank inukraine and he said that I want
to work with people who I wantto hug that you want that you
won't work with people, thatwhat, that you want to give a
hug?
oh, give a hug, yeah, so luckilywe have everybody in the
company that, uh, I want to hugand that, uh, that is that feels
(35:54):
great toward this type ofpeople and then, like nick
slavik says, being decent humanbeing.
You know, we we kind of workdifferently, but I feel like
it's a similar story.
This is the foundation of anyrole just to find the right
people who can fill the rightrole.
So I think what helped us fromday one maybe we didn't have
(36:16):
that done perfectly, but we hadsome kind of responsibilities
written down.
We had their step-by-step ondaily operations, what they need
to do, kind of like their SAP.
We had some kind of KPIs inplace for them.
It wasn't perfect, but it wasthere and I think that helped us
out, that we didn't just throwthem on the field, say, hey,
figure this out, but we kind ofhad step-by-step explanations
(36:39):
for all the processes.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
Gotcha Cool, all right, awesome.
Well, I want to be respectfulof your time.
This has been super informative.
I think you guys have provideda ton of value to everyone
listening.
Do you have any final thoughtsfor the listeners or anything
from your perspective that youthink is super important when
growing your business beyond 3million in revenue that you'd
(37:04):
like to throw out there beforewe let you guys go?
Speaker 4 (37:14):
what?
What does usually people say?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
it's, it is, it spans the gambit, I guess.
Let me rephrase it.
So if you can put yourself backin the place of where you were
doing $800,000, and what wouldyou have liked to have known
(37:38):
then that would have sped upyour learning process.
To be at $ 3 million now Likewhat do you wish you would have
known back when you were sub amillion?
Maybe in that you were at800,000 after that first big
year.
What would you have liked tohave known that you didn't?
But now you know that has beenreally useful in growing beyond
(38:02):
$3 million in revenue.
Speaker 4 (38:06):
It's hard to again, it's basically the conversation
that we have had for those 40minutes and there is a bunch of
little things that really helpto get there, but the biggest
one, again, it's talking topeople that already went that
path and taking their experienceand actually implement and not
(38:32):
just listen to what is mentionedto you, but actually take those
notes and take the action onand everything that we are doing
.
We're not doing anythingspecial.
Maybe there are some thingsthat are different, but the
general idea is you knowsomebody already have done it
before, and there is so manypeople out there that are
smarter than you are that youshould listen and just copy
(38:56):
paste.
Speaker 3 (38:57):
Basically, yes, how I feel.
Also, like everybody, have madeso many mistakes and there's so
many good things that we canlearn from.
I would probably read the booktraction earner and the e-myth
michael gerber.
I think those are two reallyfundamental books for any
business.
And, yeah, just learning frompeople who have accomplished
(39:20):
what we're looking to accomplishand also to know what kind of
people to look up to.
I think it was important thatwe had vision where we want to
go.
From day one, when we justpainted with a brush in our
hands, we had the vision that wewant to become.
That time we thought we weregoing to become 10 million
dollar company.
Now we're not thinking thatwe're going to grow that big,
(39:43):
but we still have vision tobecome a business that can
operate itself and being more asan asset than than a job for
ourselves I think that'sexcellent advice.
Speaker 2 (39:53):
I really appreciate you, too, coming on and sharing
your story with us.
I think you're going to inspirea lot of people with this and
with that for our listeners.
We will see you next week,thank you.
Thank you so much.
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