June 30, 2023 • 30 mins
Just before Thanksgiving in 2020, in the midst of a global pandemic, a loving wife and mother of three would discover that her 17-year-old daughter had taken her own life.
In an incredibly touching conversation with author K. L .Gilchrist, we walk through her journey of sudden bereavement. Gilchrist paints a poignant picture of the initial shock and grief that accompanied her daughter's untimely passing and her struggle for closure. Yet, in this darkness, she found solace by leaning on her faith. Gilchrist's perspective on trusting God amidst the storm is not only inspirational but also insightful.
https://www.klgilchrist.com
#childloss #suicide #radicaltrust #God #faith #grief
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Michelle (00:10):
Hey everybody and welcome back to Qualified, the
place where incredible peopleshare their stories of
overcoming great adversity andloss to inspire you and give you
hope.
I'm Michelle Heaton.
The loss of a child is like noother.
Grieving your child can makeyou feel so isolated and
(00:34):
misunderstood.
You can be in a room filledwith people and feel completely
alone, and the condolences fromother parents almost always seem
to include I can't even imaginewhat you're going through.
In truer words, we're neverspoken.
They can't imagine, nor wouldyou want them to, nor would you
(00:57):
want anyone to ever have toexperience the pain that cuts so
deep that you're not sure howyou'll make it through today or
tomorrow.
But for me, there was comfortin knowing that I wasn't the
only mom that lost a teenager.
I wasn't the only mother whowould ever have to wake up each
day and face a reality that mysweet son is no longer on this
(01:19):
earth with me.
I could talk with other parentswho experienced loss and who've
managed to move forward in lifewith a new story to tell, not
just a story of tragedy and loss, but one of hope and strength.
Well, my guest today is one ofthose inspirational moms.
Already a storyteller by trade.
(01:41):
She's an author of contemporaryChristian fiction for women,
with six published novels, acollection of short stories and
a deeply moving and highlyinsightful reflective section on
her website that she refers toas ramblings.
But her world changed foreverjust before Thanksgiving in 2020
(02:04):
, in the midst of a globalpandemic, when her 17-year-old
daughter passed away.
Her name is K.
L.
Gilchrist and it's my honor tohave her as my guest on the show
today.
Welcome to Qualified K.
L.
K.L. (02:20):
Hi, Michelle.
Thank you so much for having me.
Michelle (02:22):
I appreciate you, of course, of course.
Well, i'm deeply sorry for theloss of your daughter, jordan,
and I mentioned that her passingoccurred in the middle of what
was already a difficult time formany people.
Can you tell us about thecircumstances that surrounded
Jordan's passing?
K.L. (02:40):
Sure, like you said, it was shortly before Thanksgiving
2020, and my daughter chose toend her own life.
It was during schools werehomeschooling at the time, so,
although Jordan was around usall day long while she was going
online taking classes andeverything, she would usually
take her classes and then at theend of class she would kind of
(03:02):
go for a rest and we would allmeet up at the dinner table at
dinner, but she didn't come downthat day and we had no idea
that she had chosen to end herown life.
It wasn't something that shehad left a lot of clues or
anything, and we didn't knowwhat she was struggling with or
(03:24):
why.
It was just something that shechose And it just it changed the
trajectory of the rest of ourlives My myself, my husband, my
son and my daughter.
Life really hasn't been thesame.
We're walking around withpieces of our heart ripped out.
Michelle (03:45):
First of all, i'm so sorry for that.
I mean, that must have justbeen so devastating, and
especially sudden death.
We talked about losing ourchildren suddenly, and so we're
totally unprepared.
So tell us about those earlydays and go back to those days
right away afterwards.
How did you manage to hold ittogether for the sake of your
family, even though you werecompletely crushed by this?
K.L. (04:09):
I think that I like to refer to that time and all the
days after really as my realfootprints in the sand, moments
where I'm a person of faith orGod just kind of picked me up
and carried me through, becauseI know I didn't have anything
inside of me to deal with thatlevel of shock and trauma and
(04:31):
just utter sadness and confusion.
But somehow I woke up everymorning and it was one day at a
time, just kind of knowing OK,well, this isn't something that
we were chosen and we'redevastated, but we'll do what
the next best thing is to do.
So let our family know, let ourfriends know and honor her the
(04:57):
best way that we could, and justkind of lean on him.
Lean on him more, lean on Godmore.
I would say, yeah, that's key,isn't?
Michelle (05:06):
it.
Well, i mentioned in theopening that you're an author
and that you already hadestablished yourself in that
profession, with a number ofpublished fiction books under
your belt before Jordan'spassing.
But I read through the ramblingsection on your website and I
noticed that you've continued towrite more personal entries
that document the emotions youexperience following her death,
(05:27):
and in one entry I recallreading about how, only seven
days after losing Jordan, youwent to bed and whispered to God
if you want me to stay, give meanother day.
If there is no reason for me tobe here, cut my oxygen tonight
and bring me home to you.
Can you talk about that time inyour life and then that
decision that followed?
K.L. (05:46):
Absolutely.
It was the darkest time of myentire life.
I have been through thingsbefore.
I lost my father, i lost mygrandparents, but I felt like I
was at the bottom of a well AndI had this moment.
I have a little bench in frontof my bed where I just kind of
lean and pray before I go to bedeach night, and that was where
(06:09):
I met with the Lord And I saidOK, lord, i am in the dark and I
can't see how I'm going to feelhappy ever again.
It wasn't even how about how Ifelt.
I wasn't sure how I would be assomeone who lost a child
suddenly in that way, eventhough no matter how we lose our
children, it's devastating.
But there was just so muchconfusion.
(06:31):
I then I felt like, well, godis in control of my every step.
Therefore, if he wanted to endthe pain and the darkness that I
feel, he could.
So I literally was like there'snothing else for me to do and
lay down.
But when I got up that nextmorning and the sunlight was
(06:53):
coming through my window, i feltlike, right, then I had gotten
my answer There's more for me todo, there's more for me to be
here for.
And he brought to mind myyounger daughter, my older son,
my relationship with my husbandwhich, thank goodness, is an
extremely good relationship AndI'm very, very blessed to have
(07:15):
that And my writing career andother people.
I'm here for my own mother andeverything, and that I am not
done.
And so, even though it's goingto be painful, i kind of saw
myself visually.
It was like sliding downhilland being in this valley, but
that next morning I got up andit was almost like standing up
(07:37):
in the middle of the valley andlooking and seeing sunshine
coming over the peaks.
I'm still in there, but I cansee sunshine.
And it's like he was telling meevery day is going to be a
journey, but I'm going to bewith you, holding your hand
during this journey and walkeach day, one day at a time.
(08:00):
And so I started from thatmoment on, just walking one day
at a time.
Michelle (08:09):
Good for you, K.
L.
That requires a ton of strengthAnd you know, as I was reading
through your blog, i talkedabout how you put all those
emotions out there, and I thinkit's wonderful that you do that,
because I think your opennessright now also helps people,
because I know there'll bepeople listening who are in that
(08:30):
place in those early days, likeyou and I were, and we need
them to know that they're notalone and they can wake up
tomorrow and put one foot infront of the other.
So thank you for sharing that.
I know it's painful, but thatwas sort of the reason I wanted
to bring that out, because youpowered through it with God's
help.
Yes, absolutely.
And you also wrote at anotherplace.
(08:52):
In your ramblings You said myrelationship with my teenage
daughter was so precious and sopersonal.
No one else, not even myhusband, could understand that
death had ripped out a piece ofmy heart.
Do you remember when you spokethose words and why you felt
that way?
K.L. (09:09):
Oh, absolutely.
I love all my kids equally.
No one is better than the other.
but Jordan was definitely myeasygoing kid who was just kind
of right beside me andeverything I used to say my
oldest son is I can't hang outwith my oldest son because he's
too moody.
And my youngest child, who Inicknamed crazy I talk about her
(09:32):
sometimes in the dedication tomy books is she's too manic,
she's all over the place.
But Jordan was my mellow girlAnd she wasn't just my daughter,
she was my friend.
She was a lot of times we'd goshopping, we'd go to like the
makeup shops together and wewould talk about things And she
was very much my close friend.
(09:53):
I am an introvert so very, veryclose friendships are hard to
come by.
A lot of authors are introverts, so I don't feel bad saying
that It takes a lot toconcentrate on do what we do as
authors.
So being somebody who's usuallyeasy is very easy for me to
focus.
But it's hard for me to strikeup new relationships.
(10:15):
Jordan was kind of my in-housegirl that I just it was just a
joy to have her around Eversince she was just very little,
just very special to me, and soI felt like I wasn't just took
more than a child.
For me It was like this issomeone who is a very, very
special role, very special role,and she can't be replaced.
(10:41):
But I do have my memories and I.
she won't be replaced, but I'velearned to appreciate the other
people in my lives and tellthem that I love them and tell
them how much I appreciate themEvery day.
I'm a little I'm verymethodical about it now, like I
(11:01):
don't like to go too many daysabout telling my mom I love her
without telling, texting myfriends, texting my older son I
love you, mom loves you.
Not because I'm supersuspicious that something's
going to happen to them, butjust I always want them to know.
Yeah, a deeper appreciation ofwhat love means.
(11:23):
Yeah, they get that relationshipthat you had with her.
Michelle (11:26):
That's why I think it's so wrong, i guess, for any
of us to say I know what you'regoing through when someone loses
a loved one, because we don'tknow exactly what they're going
through.
No, no We know what it feels tohave lost, but the relationship
and the deepness of therelationship that you had with
that person really dictates thelevel of pain that you have when
(11:47):
you lose them.
It does?
K.L. (11:49):
Yeah, it does.
I've talked with people I'vegone to like minister groups,
like ReefShare, which was agreat help to me, and I've heard
people talk about differenttypes of death losing spouses
and aunts, uncles, grandparents,and it's always very sad
sounding, It's always verytragic.
(12:10):
But people also talked abouthaving deaths for people who
were blood relatives but theyweren't that close to them.
I remember hearing a lady talkabout having a father who had
been in prison her whole lifeAnd then when he passed away,
she didn't feel much of anything.
It just was like one of thosenotations or like lifetime
(12:32):
milestones, but it wasn'tanything that rocked her.
So when you have a deeprelationship with someone and
it's a walking with them type ofrelationship, their transition,
their passing is it knocks youon your back, just knocks you.
I know you went through thatwhen you lost your child.
It just knocks you And you'relooking up like, oh my gosh, oh,
(12:57):
oh, yeah.
Michelle (13:00):
Yeah, people liken it to losing the limb.
You know where you feel it.
You constantly look to seewhere that arm was or that leg
was, and it's not there, but youlearn eventually to live
without it.
K.L. (13:12):
Yes, yes, exactly that.
That's very much how it feels.
Michelle (13:17):
Yeah, but you still miss, it right You?
K.L. (13:19):
still miss it.
but you're walking throughwithout that limb, but you
remember when you had it, And aday doesn't go by.
Michelle (13:29):
Right.
Well, hey, when we talkedbefore, you shared that there
was a time when a coworker askedyou if you'd be willing to talk
to someone who they knew whohad also recently lost a child.
How did you feel about beingasked And, if you don't mind,
can you tell us how thatconversation went?
K.L. (13:45):
Oh, sure, i felt honored, first of all, that they thought
that I was centered, calmenough to actually talk to
someone and that I could talk tothem maturely, and I felt like,
oh well, okay, well, part ofthe reason why I am still here
and God did not take me home isto be able to talk to other
(14:06):
people and reassure them thatthey will get through it,
whether they're a person offaith or not a person of faith,
but I do always share my faithwhen I talk with them.
I talked with this young womanand she was only maybe a few
weeks away from her childpassing and she cried a lot And
I just remember feeling good,being there for her and being
(14:30):
able to listen, because I know Ineeded that person to could
just listen right away And Iwanted to be there for her and I
was glad I was able to be therefor her and hear her talk about
you and just kind of cry outher anguish and her tears and
everything she felt about herchild.
(14:51):
And I was glad to just kind ofbe a tool and God's tool built
and reassure her that she wouldget through each day, one day at
a time.
Michelle (15:01):
And then there's that scripture in 2 Corinthians that
talks about us comforting otherswith the comfort that we
receive from God.
So it's actually scripture.
All that doesn't make the painless, but it kind of gives us
purpose in the pain.
K.L. (15:15):
Yes, yeah, i love the way you said it, michelle.
It's in the pain.
Yeah, yeah, okay.
Michelle (15:22):
Yeah Well, we talked about sudden loss, and when we
lose someone we love suddenly,like we both did, without the
opportunity to say goodbye, itcan be so difficult to move
forward and find peace andclosure.
What would you say, K.
L.
to another person who'slistening that might be in those
early grief stages to give themhope about their future without
(15:44):
their child?
K.L. (15:50):
I would say and I don't mean to sound too simplistic,
but recognize that each day is agift.
Still, take it literally justone 24 hour, set at a time.
Rely on God for every provision, because he will and he does
provide.
I would say, if you're not aperson of faith, this may be a
(16:15):
good time to reach out to theLord and ask Him for strength
and deepen those bonds and makeHim your best friend, because
you're going to need that levelof covering and that entity to
hold you during the pain isexcruciating.
You need Him if you don't haveAnd for my people of faith who
(16:38):
have lost children, it'ssometimes even harder to
understand that the child isgone.
Well, how could God allow this?
Well, it's written in Scripturethat he knows every care on our
head and he knows every daythat you're supposed to be on
earth.
Now, we did not know how longour daughter was going to be
with us, but God knew it wasonly a surprise to us.
(17:01):
And as we trust Him and youhave to have like radical trust
that's what I mentioned toeveryone This is going to be a
trust level like none other.
You have to trust that, eventhough you did not like that.
Your child has gone before you.
He knows and has a plan, andthat was in it.
(17:24):
Are we you know the lesson welearned from Job, are we not?
are we totally take the goodand not accept God from the Lord
?
Sometimes when I'm talking topeople it's like I do have to
separate.
It's like believers, i think,can grasp it a little better.
For non-believers they'd haveto walk with God a little longer
(17:45):
, get to know God a littlelonger and to read scripture,
read the book of Job, which is avery, very good one.
For sorrow and pain and anguishand undeserved trauma, that's
probably the best one that thereis.
You know, just knowing that Godis, knows our story, the good
(18:05):
and bad, and accepting itradically is a big help.
Michelle (18:10):
Yeah, yeah, i always say that when people go through
trauma like this and lose aloved one, that they either run
to God or they run away from God, and I feel, you know, thank
God, i ran to God.
But, like you said, we have aGod and it does require radical
trust, but I think the return isthe depth of relationship that
(18:32):
we never had before, even if wedid know God before.
We need him now like oxygen.
But when you said that, i wasthinking, yeah, i mean so you
rely on him like never before.
Now, if we could rewind theclock, would we want our kids
back?
Of course, but this is the giftand the beauty that we received
in the midst of the pain.
K.L. (18:52):
Yeah, it really is.
It really is.
It has grown.
My daughter's death hasamazingly grown my relationship
with God.
I had been believer for morethan 23 years when she passed
away, but it just that dailywalk.
That day I'm relying on God.
(19:13):
Just this morning I was like,okay, god's, they have a really,
really busy day.
I have my youngest daughter andI.
Both are students at a dancestudio.
We have recital day coming upon Saturday.
So in the midst of everythinggoing on, i was like, okay, i'm
looking forward to talking toMichelle, go ahead on lessons at
(19:33):
last.
At the same time, i got to runout this morning get nails done
and get hair done and getsupplies and stuff for dance day
on Saturdays the busy days.
The first thing I did today waslike, okay, lord, i'm just
trusting you that you are goingto walk me through every single
moment of this day and it isgoing to turn out to glorify you
.
If I go before Michelle and I'ma complete mess, it's gonna
(19:55):
glorify you.
If I'm pulled together, it'sgoing to glorify you.
I am going to glorify you andtell you that, even the good and
the bad, i know you're there.
Any end, any end, any end.
It all makes sense.
Doesn't right now the griefdoesn't.
It never really will, but thereis an ending that's ultimate
(20:19):
and we will reach there, andthen we'll have ultimate peace
In the meantime, so, day to daywalk.
Michelle (20:27):
Yeah, yeah, that's very well said, thanks.
Thank you so much for yourhonesty and for sharing about
how you reach out to God forthat daily strength.
I do the same thing and there'slike a peace that the scripture
talks about, the peace thatpasses all understanding Because
it doesn't make sense.
How can you have peace in themidst of all of the chaos?
(20:49):
But there is a Holy Spirit,peace that comes upon us when we
call on God.
So, K.
L.
i just wanna take a minute andsort of summarize all the great
points you shared so far,because so much of it bears
repeating.
You explained how your decisionto take things one day at a time
helped you process youremotions and kept you from
(21:10):
feeling overwhelmed by yourgrief.
You talked about the impact oflosing a child suddenly and
under tragic circumstances, butyou acknowledged that, no matter
the cause of death, we canexperience healing and move
forward in life with a new senseof purpose and peace.
(21:31):
You learned how important it isto tell those in our lives how
much we love and care about themand to appreciate their
presence with us.
On a deeper level, youexperienced great sadness with
Jordan's passing and talkedabout your close bond and
friendship.
That left a terrible void, butyou said you have incredible
(21:52):
memories of your time togetherthat can never be taken away and
that you'll draw on thoseforever.
You discovered that your ownloss and grief experience would
serve as a tool to help anothergriever, and you were able to
provide a unique sense ofcomfort during another person's
time of sorrow.
You told us each day, as a gift, that Jordan's death deepened
(22:18):
your relationship with God andthat radically trusting God is
key to surviving the loss of aloved one and moving forward
each new day.
K.
L.
, what other lessons have youlearned from Jordan's passing
Can you share with someonelistening right now who needs
hope?
K.L. (22:37):
Okay, biggest life lesson I can share is number one.
Let go of trying to controlthings and let go of trying to
understand things.
Some things are just notunderstandable on our side of
being mortal, not at this moment.
Let go of that radically.
(22:59):
Trust God out everything,everything about your child,
everything, whether you had agood relationship with your
child or a mediocre or a badrelationship.
Trust it all.
Trust it all to him and knowyour child was here for the
(23:20):
amount of days that was meantfor them to be here.
And that's a hard lesson And Istill meet parents who are still
having a hard time acceptingthat.
But it is true.
We are here.
You and I are sitting here, notof our own accord, but because
we're supposed to be here atthis time when we're not
(23:43):
supposed to be here anymore.
We won't be.
That's right.
You have to trust that anddon't blame yourself.
Oh, that's the other big lessondo not, do not blame yourself.
Specifically, if you're in asituation where someone has
taken their life, recognize thatyou are not the deciding factor
(24:04):
of their lives.
If you were, that person couldhave isolated you.
They could have gone on theirway without you if you were the
only factor, but you're not.
Life is complex, people arecomplex.
People's bodily hormones arecomplex.
Mental illness is complex.
You are not to blame.
(24:26):
Do not blame yourself and donot allow others to say things,
because that happens too.
My pastor, the first couple ofyears after Jordan died, had
said you probably don't want totalk too much about that, and I
understand I love my pastor.
What he was trying to do wasmake sure that we were not hurt
(24:46):
by other people saying thingsand asking things and being
hurtful.
Michelle (24:53):
Like they did.
K.L. (24:54):
But I do want to.
I reached the point where I'mlike no, i want to be able to
comfort and be there for peoplewho have gone through a similar
situation and say it's horrible,it's devastating, but you can
get through it And don't blameyourself, and God loves you.
(25:18):
He loves you, but life iscomplex and it's hard sometimes.
Michelle (25:23):
Yeah, Yeah, that's really good.
Not to blame yourself is soimportant, no matter the cause
of death, because I think we allplay that game in our minds.
If we had only done this oronly done that.
K.L. (25:35):
And.
Michelle (25:36):
God knows the beginning and the end.
We had no control over itregardless.
Good to remember, very good.
Well, K.
L.
thank you so much for all ofthat.
I want you, if you would please, to just take a minute, because
I mentioned that you are aChristian fiction author.
What is Christian fiction forwomen And what can the reader
(25:57):
expect if they pick up one ofyour books?
K.L. (26:00):
I would say well, you know what?
The easiest way to explain itis entertainment for Christian
folk.
So, because I write for peopleof a faith background, in my
books there isn't a whole bunchof cursing and violence and
graphic sex or anything likethat.
(26:20):
I like to just kind of havestories, not necessarily where
people are or where thestoryline involves somebody
coming to Christ.
These are people who more sohave a faith level or they're
having up and down relationships, but they do believe that there
is a God And they have astoryline as well.
(26:42):
So I like to say, instead ofjust going to the bookstore and
picking up I don't know JohnGrisham or whoever, just reading
about anybody, there's a bunchof us out here who write things
And it's like no, you can readabout people who do have faith
And they go about their days,going through their situations
maybe a different way, becausepeople of faith have a biblical
(27:03):
worldview And so how someonewho's in the world may deal with
a situation, let's say likethis, with grieving, is going to
be a little different thansomeone who doesn't have a God.
I write fictional stories forpeople who go through different
things, like the Force and maybesingle parenting or getting
(27:23):
married as one of my favoritebooks to write.
What a book called Engaged,preparing for Marriage or
Preparing for Having Babies, orCareer Changes or even building
businesses.
I have a book that has a majorCEO in it, but they go through
things differently because ofthe biblical worldview And those
(27:43):
are the type of characters Icould read about.
I like my Christian friends tohave books that they can read,
that are clean, but still I liketo say they're not corny, they
are clean, they're not corny.
Michelle (27:55):
Yeah.
It's kind of like listening toChristian music versus listening
to any other kind of secularmusic.
It's just putting the good inthere.
however, you're spending yourpast time, so I like that very
much.
K.L. (28:07):
However, you're being entertained.
Yes, yeah.
Michelle (28:09):
Well, i'll put a link in the show notes so that
listeners can go to your websiteand purchase books if they're
interested.
Thank you so much.
Yeah, absolutely, is thereanything else you want to add
that I failed to ask you.
K.L. (28:23):
I just want to say I'll reiterate whoever's listening to
this God does really love you,no matter the trauma you're
going through being at loss of achild, loss of a parent or
divorce He is in that story.
The story, your life story, islike a tapestry and he's in
(28:45):
there weaving it with you.
It has ups and downs, but hedoes absolutely love you.
Trust him radically abouteverything, even and especially
your deepest trauma.
Trust him, he will always bethere for you.
Michelle (29:02):
Yeah, yeah, amen.
Well, thank you, K.
L.
It's been such an honor havingyou on the show today.
I know you got a busy day, soI'm gonna let you go.
But thank you so much for beingmy guest today.
K.L. (29:14):
Thank you, Michelle.
I truly appreciate it.
Thank you for the opportunity.
Michelle (29:19):
So, for those of you listening, i hope you heard the
hope in K.
L.
' s words today.
Right after Jordan's passing,she was in a very dark place and
she laid down to sleep, askingGod if you want me to stay, give
me another day, but if there'sno reason for me to be here,
(29:40):
have my oxygen tonight and bringme home to you.
But she found hope in themorning when she awoke to a new
day and a new sense of purpose,knowing that each day would be a
journey, but that God would beright there beside her on the
path.
My friend, losing a child is aterrible loss, i know, and the
(30:04):
deeper the love we shared, thedeeper the pain we'll have to
endure.
Grief is the price we pay forlove.
So hold tight to those aroundyou, love them well and tell
them often, and remember K.
L.
's encouragement to radicallytrust God in everything,
(30:25):
especially your deepest trauma.
He'll always be there for you.
Thanks for listening.
Hey everybody and welcome back to Qualified, the
place where incredible peopleshare their stories of
overcoming great adversity andloss to inspire you and give you
hope.
I'm Michelle Heaton.
The loss of a child is like noother.
Grieving your child can makeyou feel so isolated and
(00:34):
misunderstood.
You can be in a room filledwith people and feel completely
alone, and the condolences fromother parents almost always seem
to include I can't even imaginewhat you're going through.
In truer words, we're neverspoken.
They can't imagine, nor wouldyou want them to, nor would you
(00:57):
want anyone to ever have toexperience the pain that cuts so
deep that you're not sure howyou'll make it through today or
tomorrow.
But for me, there was comfortin knowing that I wasn't the
only mom that lost a teenager.
I wasn't the only mother whowould ever have to wake up each
day and face a reality that mysweet son is no longer on this
(01:19):
earth with me.
I could talk with other parentswho experienced loss and who've
managed to move forward in lifewith a new story to tell, not
just a story of tragedy and loss, but one of hope and strength.
Well, my guest today is one ofthose inspirational moms.
Already a storyteller by trade.
(01:41):
She's an author of contemporaryChristian fiction for women,
with six published novels, acollection of short stories and
a deeply moving and highlyinsightful reflective section on
her website that she refers toas ramblings.
But her world changed foreverjust before Thanksgiving in 2020
(02:04):
, in the midst of a globalpandemic, when her 17-year-old
daughter passed away.
Her name is K.
L.
Gilchrist and it's my honor tohave her as my guest on the show
today.
Welcome to Qualified K.
L.
K.L. (02:20):
Hi, Michelle.
Thank you so much for having me.
Michelle (02:22):
I appreciate you, of course, of course.
Well, i'm deeply sorry for theloss of your daughter, jordan,
and I mentioned that her passingoccurred in the middle of what
was already a difficult time formany people.
Can you tell us about thecircumstances that surrounded
Jordan's passing?
K.L. (02:40):
Sure, like you said, it was shortly before Thanksgiving
2020, and my daughter chose toend her own life.
It was during schools werehomeschooling at the time, so,
although Jordan was around usall day long while she was going
online taking classes andeverything, she would usually
take her classes and then at theend of class she would kind of
(03:02):
go for a rest and we would allmeet up at the dinner table at
dinner, but she didn't come downthat day and we had no idea
that she had chosen to end herown life.
It wasn't something that shehad left a lot of clues or
anything, and we didn't knowwhat she was struggling with or
(03:24):
why.
It was just something that shechose And it just it changed the
trajectory of the rest of ourlives My myself, my husband, my
son and my daughter.
Life really hasn't been thesame.
We're walking around withpieces of our heart ripped out.
Michelle (03:45):
First of all, i'm so sorry for that.
I mean, that must have justbeen so devastating, and
especially sudden death.
We talked about losing ourchildren suddenly, and so we're
totally unprepared.
So tell us about those earlydays and go back to those days
right away afterwards.
How did you manage to hold ittogether for the sake of your
family, even though you werecompletely crushed by this?
K.L. (04:09):
I think that I like to refer to that time and all the
days after really as my realfootprints in the sand, moments
where I'm a person of faith orGod just kind of picked me up
and carried me through, becauseI know I didn't have anything
inside of me to deal with thatlevel of shock and trauma and
(04:31):
just utter sadness and confusion.
But somehow I woke up everymorning and it was one day at a
time, just kind of knowing OK,well, this isn't something that
we were chosen and we'redevastated, but we'll do what
the next best thing is to do.
So let our family know, let ourfriends know and honor her the
(04:57):
best way that we could, and justkind of lean on him.
Lean on him more, lean on Godmore.
I would say, yeah, that's key,isn't?
Michelle (05:06):
it.
Well, i mentioned in theopening that you're an author
and that you already hadestablished yourself in that
profession, with a number ofpublished fiction books under
your belt before Jordan'spassing.
But I read through the ramblingsection on your website and I
noticed that you've continued towrite more personal entries
that document the emotions youexperience following her death,
(05:27):
and in one entry I recallreading about how, only seven
days after losing Jordan, youwent to bed and whispered to God
if you want me to stay, give meanother day.
If there is no reason for me tobe here, cut my oxygen tonight
and bring me home to you.
Can you talk about that time inyour life and then that
decision that followed?
K.L. (05:46):
Absolutely.
It was the darkest time of myentire life.
I have been through thingsbefore.
I lost my father, i lost mygrandparents, but I felt like I
was at the bottom of a well AndI had this moment.
I have a little bench in frontof my bed where I just kind of
lean and pray before I go to bedeach night, and that was where
(06:09):
I met with the Lord And I saidOK, lord, i am in the dark and I
can't see how I'm going to feelhappy ever again.
It wasn't even how about how Ifelt.
I wasn't sure how I would be assomeone who lost a child
suddenly in that way, eventhough no matter how we lose our
children, it's devastating.
But there was just so muchconfusion.
(06:31):
I then I felt like, well, godis in control of my every step.
Therefore, if he wanted to endthe pain and the darkness that I
feel, he could.
So I literally was like there'snothing else for me to do and
lay down.
But when I got up that nextmorning and the sunlight was
(06:53):
coming through my window, i feltlike, right, then I had gotten
my answer There's more for me todo, there's more for me to be
here for.
And he brought to mind myyounger daughter, my older son,
my relationship with my husbandwhich, thank goodness, is an
extremely good relationship AndI'm very, very blessed to have
(07:15):
that And my writing career andother people.
I'm here for my own mother andeverything, and that I am not
done.
And so, even though it's goingto be painful, i kind of saw
myself visually.
It was like sliding downhilland being in this valley, but
that next morning I got up andit was almost like standing up
(07:37):
in the middle of the valley andlooking and seeing sunshine
coming over the peaks.
I'm still in there, but I cansee sunshine.
And it's like he was telling meevery day is going to be a
journey, but I'm going to bewith you, holding your hand
during this journey and walkeach day, one day at a time.
(08:00):
And so I started from thatmoment on, just walking one day
at a time.
Michelle (08:09):
Good for you, K.
L.
That requires a ton of strengthAnd you know, as I was reading
through your blog, i talkedabout how you put all those
emotions out there, and I thinkit's wonderful that you do that,
because I think your opennessright now also helps people,
because I know there'll bepeople listening who are in that
(08:30):
place in those early days, likeyou and I were, and we need
them to know that they're notalone and they can wake up
tomorrow and put one foot infront of the other.
So thank you for sharing that.
I know it's painful, but thatwas sort of the reason I wanted
to bring that out, because youpowered through it with God's
help.
Yes, absolutely.
And you also wrote at anotherplace.
(08:52):
In your ramblings You said myrelationship with my teenage
daughter was so precious and sopersonal.
No one else, not even myhusband, could understand that
death had ripped out a piece ofmy heart.
Do you remember when you spokethose words and why you felt
that way?
K.L. (09:09):
Oh, absolutely.
I love all my kids equally.
No one is better than the other.
but Jordan was definitely myeasygoing kid who was just kind
of right beside me andeverything I used to say my
oldest son is I can't hang outwith my oldest son because he's
too moody.
And my youngest child, who Inicknamed crazy I talk about her
(09:32):
sometimes in the dedication tomy books is she's too manic,
she's all over the place.
But Jordan was my mellow girlAnd she wasn't just my daughter,
she was my friend.
She was a lot of times we'd goshopping, we'd go to like the
makeup shops together and wewould talk about things And she
was very much my close friend.
(09:53):
I am an introvert so very, veryclose friendships are hard to
come by.
A lot of authors are introverts, so I don't feel bad saying
that It takes a lot toconcentrate on do what we do as
authors.
So being somebody who's usuallyeasy is very easy for me to
focus.
But it's hard for me to strikeup new relationships.
(10:15):
Jordan was kind of my in-housegirl that I just it was just a
joy to have her around Eversince she was just very little,
just very special to me, and soI felt like I wasn't just took
more than a child.
For me It was like this issomeone who is a very, very
special role, very special role,and she can't be replaced.
(10:41):
But I do have my memories and I.
she won't be replaced, but I'velearned to appreciate the other
people in my lives and tellthem that I love them and tell
them how much I appreciate themEvery day.
I'm a little I'm verymethodical about it now, like I
(11:01):
don't like to go too many daysabout telling my mom I love her
without telling, texting myfriends, texting my older son I
love you, mom loves you.
Not because I'm supersuspicious that something's
going to happen to them, butjust I always want them to know.
Yeah, a deeper appreciation ofwhat love means.
(11:23):
Yeah, they get that relationshipthat you had with her.
Michelle (11:26):
That's why I think it's so wrong, i guess, for any
of us to say I know what you'regoing through when someone loses
a loved one, because we don'tknow exactly what they're going
through.
No, no We know what it feels tohave lost, but the relationship
and the deepness of therelationship that you had with
that person really dictates thelevel of pain that you have when
(11:47):
you lose them.
It does?
K.L. (11:49):
Yeah, it does.
I've talked with people I'vegone to like minister groups,
like ReefShare, which was agreat help to me, and I've heard
people talk about differenttypes of death losing spouses
and aunts, uncles, grandparents,and it's always very sad
sounding, It's always verytragic.
(12:10):
But people also talked abouthaving deaths for people who
were blood relatives but theyweren't that close to them.
I remember hearing a lady talkabout having a father who had
been in prison her whole lifeAnd then when he passed away,
she didn't feel much of anything.
It just was like one of thosenotations or like lifetime
(12:32):
milestones, but it wasn'tanything that rocked her.
So when you have a deeprelationship with someone and
it's a walking with them type ofrelationship, their transition,
their passing is it knocks youon your back, just knocks you.
I know you went through thatwhen you lost your child.
It just knocks you And you'relooking up like, oh my gosh, oh,
(12:57):
oh, yeah.
Michelle (13:00):
Yeah, people liken it to losing the limb.
You know where you feel it.
You constantly look to seewhere that arm was or that leg
was, and it's not there, but youlearn eventually to live
without it.
K.L. (13:12):
Yes, yes, exactly that.
That's very much how it feels.
Michelle (13:17):
Yeah, but you still miss, it right You?
K.L. (13:19):
still miss it.
but you're walking throughwithout that limb, but you
remember when you had it, And aday doesn't go by.
Michelle (13:29):
Right.
Well, hey, when we talkedbefore, you shared that there
was a time when a coworker askedyou if you'd be willing to talk
to someone who they knew whohad also recently lost a child.
How did you feel about beingasked And, if you don't mind,
can you tell us how thatconversation went?
K.L. (13:45):
Oh, sure, i felt honored, first of all, that they thought
that I was centered, calmenough to actually talk to
someone and that I could talk tothem maturely, and I felt like,
oh well, okay, well, part ofthe reason why I am still here
and God did not take me home isto be able to talk to other
(14:06):
people and reassure them thatthey will get through it,
whether they're a person offaith or not a person of faith,
but I do always share my faithwhen I talk with them.
I talked with this young womanand she was only maybe a few
weeks away from her childpassing and she cried a lot And
I just remember feeling good,being there for her and being
(14:30):
able to listen, because I know Ineeded that person to could
just listen right away And Iwanted to be there for her and I
was glad I was able to be therefor her and hear her talk about
you and just kind of cry outher anguish and her tears and
everything she felt about herchild.
(14:51):
And I was glad to just kind ofbe a tool and God's tool built
and reassure her that she wouldget through each day, one day at
a time.
Michelle (15:01):
And then there's that scripture in 2 Corinthians that
talks about us comforting otherswith the comfort that we
receive from God.
So it's actually scripture.
All that doesn't make the painless, but it kind of gives us
purpose in the pain.
K.L. (15:15):
Yes, yeah, i love the way you said it, michelle.
It's in the pain.
Yeah, yeah, okay.
Michelle (15:22):
Yeah Well, we talked about sudden loss, and when we
lose someone we love suddenly,like we both did, without the
opportunity to say goodbye, itcan be so difficult to move
forward and find peace andclosure.
What would you say, K.
L.
to another person who'slistening that might be in those
early grief stages to give themhope about their future without
(15:44):
their child?
K.L. (15:50):
I would say and I don't mean to sound too simplistic,
but recognize that each day is agift.
Still, take it literally justone 24 hour, set at a time.
Rely on God for every provision, because he will and he does
provide.
I would say, if you're not aperson of faith, this may be a
(16:15):
good time to reach out to theLord and ask Him for strength
and deepen those bonds and makeHim your best friend, because
you're going to need that levelof covering and that entity to
hold you during the pain isexcruciating.
You need Him if you don't haveAnd for my people of faith who
(16:38):
have lost children, it'ssometimes even harder to
understand that the child isgone.
Well, how could God allow this?
Well, it's written in Scripturethat he knows every care on our
head and he knows every daythat you're supposed to be on
earth.
Now, we did not know how longour daughter was going to be
with us, but God knew it wasonly a surprise to us.
(17:01):
And as we trust Him and youhave to have like radical trust
that's what I mentioned toeveryone This is going to be a
trust level like none other.
You have to trust that, eventhough you did not like that.
Your child has gone before you.
He knows and has a plan, andthat was in it.
(17:24):
Are we you know the lesson welearned from Job, are we not?
are we totally take the goodand not accept God from the Lord
?
Sometimes when I'm talking topeople it's like I do have to
separate.
It's like believers, i think,can grasp it a little better.
For non-believers they'd haveto walk with God a little longer
(17:45):
, get to know God a littlelonger and to read scripture,
read the book of Job, which is avery, very good one.
For sorrow and pain and anguishand undeserved trauma, that's
probably the best one that thereis.
You know, just knowing that Godis, knows our story, the good
(18:05):
and bad, and accepting itradically is a big help.
Michelle (18:10):
Yeah, yeah, i always say that when people go through
trauma like this and lose aloved one, that they either run
to God or they run away from God, and I feel, you know, thank
God, i ran to God.
But, like you said, we have aGod and it does require radical
trust, but I think the return isthe depth of relationship that
(18:32):
we never had before, even if wedid know God before.
We need him now like oxygen.
But when you said that, i wasthinking, yeah, i mean so you
rely on him like never before.
Now, if we could rewind theclock, would we want our kids
back?
Of course, but this is the giftand the beauty that we received
in the midst of the pain.
K.L. (18:52):
Yeah, it really is.
It really is.
It has grown.
My daughter's death hasamazingly grown my relationship
with God.
I had been believer for morethan 23 years when she passed
away, but it just that dailywalk.
That day I'm relying on God.
(19:13):
Just this morning I was like,okay, god's, they have a really,
really busy day.
I have my youngest daughter andI.
Both are students at a dancestudio.
We have recital day coming upon Saturday.
So in the midst of everythinggoing on, i was like, okay, i'm
looking forward to talking toMichelle, go ahead on lessons at
(19:33):
last.
At the same time, i got to runout this morning get nails done
and get hair done and getsupplies and stuff for dance day
on Saturdays the busy days.
The first thing I did today waslike, okay, lord, i'm just
trusting you that you are goingto walk me through every single
moment of this day and it isgoing to turn out to glorify you
.
If I go before Michelle and I'ma complete mess, it's gonna
(19:55):
glorify you.
If I'm pulled together, it'sgoing to glorify you.
I am going to glorify you andtell you that, even the good and
the bad, i know you're there.
Any end, any end, any end.
It all makes sense.
Doesn't right now the griefdoesn't.
It never really will, but thereis an ending that's ultimate
(20:19):
and we will reach there, andthen we'll have ultimate peace
In the meantime, so, day to daywalk.
Michelle (20:27):
Yeah, yeah, that's very well said, thanks.
Thank you so much for yourhonesty and for sharing about
how you reach out to God forthat daily strength.
I do the same thing and there'slike a peace that the scripture
talks about, the peace thatpasses all understanding Because
it doesn't make sense.
How can you have peace in themidst of all of the chaos?
(20:49):
But there is a Holy Spirit,peace that comes upon us when we
call on God.
So, K.
L.
i just wanna take a minute andsort of summarize all the great
points you shared so far,because so much of it bears
repeating.
You explained how your decisionto take things one day at a time
helped you process youremotions and kept you from
(21:10):
feeling overwhelmed by yourgrief.
You talked about the impact oflosing a child suddenly and
under tragic circumstances, butyou acknowledged that, no matter
the cause of death, we canexperience healing and move
forward in life with a new senseof purpose and peace.
(21:31):
You learned how important it isto tell those in our lives how
much we love and care about themand to appreciate their
presence with us.
On a deeper level, youexperienced great sadness with
Jordan's passing and talkedabout your close bond and
friendship.
That left a terrible void, butyou said you have incredible
(21:52):
memories of your time togetherthat can never be taken away and
that you'll draw on thoseforever.
You discovered that your ownloss and grief experience would
serve as a tool to help anothergriever, and you were able to
provide a unique sense ofcomfort during another person's
time of sorrow.
You told us each day, as a gift, that Jordan's death deepened
(22:18):
your relationship with God andthat radically trusting God is
key to surviving the loss of aloved one and moving forward
each new day.
K.
L.
, what other lessons have youlearned from Jordan's passing
Can you share with someonelistening right now who needs
hope?
K.L. (22:37):
Okay, biggest life lesson I can share is number one.
Let go of trying to controlthings and let go of trying to
understand things.
Some things are just notunderstandable on our side of
being mortal, not at this moment.
Let go of that radically.
(22:59):
Trust God out everything,everything about your child,
everything, whether you had agood relationship with your
child or a mediocre or a badrelationship.
Trust it all.
Trust it all to him and knowyour child was here for the
(23:20):
amount of days that was meantfor them to be here.
And that's a hard lesson And Istill meet parents who are still
having a hard time acceptingthat.
But it is true.
We are here.
You and I are sitting here, notof our own accord, but because
we're supposed to be here atthis time when we're not
(23:43):
supposed to be here anymore.
We won't be.
That's right.
You have to trust that anddon't blame yourself.
Oh, that's the other big lessondo not, do not blame yourself.
Specifically, if you're in asituation where someone has
taken their life, recognize thatyou are not the deciding factor
(24:04):
of their lives.
If you were, that person couldhave isolated you.
They could have gone on theirway without you if you were the
only factor, but you're not.
Life is complex, people arecomplex.
People's bodily hormones arecomplex.
Mental illness is complex.
You are not to blame.
(24:26):
Do not blame yourself and donot allow others to say things,
because that happens too.
My pastor, the first couple ofyears after Jordan died, had
said you probably don't want totalk too much about that, and I
understand I love my pastor.
What he was trying to do wasmake sure that we were not hurt
(24:46):
by other people saying thingsand asking things and being
hurtful.
Michelle (24:53):
Like they did.
K.L. (24:54):
But I do want to.
I reached the point where I'mlike no, i want to be able to
comfort and be there for peoplewho have gone through a similar
situation and say it's horrible,it's devastating, but you can
get through it And don't blameyourself, and God loves you.
(25:18):
He loves you, but life iscomplex and it's hard sometimes.
Michelle (25:23):
Yeah, Yeah, that's really good.
Not to blame yourself is soimportant, no matter the cause
of death, because I think we allplay that game in our minds.
If we had only done this oronly done that.
K.L. (25:35):
And.
Michelle (25:36):
God knows the beginning and the end.
We had no control over itregardless.
Good to remember, very good.
Well, K.
L.
thank you so much for all ofthat.
I want you, if you would please, to just take a minute, because
I mentioned that you are aChristian fiction author.
What is Christian fiction forwomen And what can the reader
(25:57):
expect if they pick up one ofyour books?
K.L. (26:00):
I would say well, you know what?
The easiest way to explain itis entertainment for Christian
folk.
So, because I write for peopleof a faith background, in my
books there isn't a whole bunchof cursing and violence and
graphic sex or anything likethat.
(26:20):
I like to just kind of havestories, not necessarily where
people are or where thestoryline involves somebody
coming to Christ.
These are people who more sohave a faith level or they're
having up and down relationships, but they do believe that there
is a God And they have astoryline as well.
(26:42):
So I like to say, instead ofjust going to the bookstore and
picking up I don't know JohnGrisham or whoever, just reading
about anybody, there's a bunchof us out here who write things
And it's like no, you can readabout people who do have faith
And they go about their days,going through their situations
maybe a different way, becausepeople of faith have a biblical
(27:03):
worldview And so how someonewho's in the world may deal with
a situation, let's say likethis, with grieving, is going to
be a little different thansomeone who doesn't have a God.
I write fictional stories forpeople who go through different
things, like the Force and maybesingle parenting or getting
(27:23):
married as one of my favoritebooks to write.
What a book called Engaged,preparing for Marriage or
Preparing for Having Babies, orCareer Changes or even building
businesses.
I have a book that has a majorCEO in it, but they go through
things differently because ofthe biblical worldview And those
(27:43):
are the type of characters Icould read about.
I like my Christian friends tohave books that they can read,
that are clean, but still I liketo say they're not corny, they
are clean, they're not corny.
Michelle (27:55):
Yeah.
It's kind of like listening toChristian music versus listening
to any other kind of secularmusic.
It's just putting the good inthere.
however, you're spending yourpast time, so I like that very
much.
K.L. (28:07):
However, you're being entertained.
Yes, yeah.
Michelle (28:09):
Well, i'll put a link in the show notes so that
listeners can go to your websiteand purchase books if they're
interested.
Thank you so much.
Yeah, absolutely, is thereanything else you want to add
that I failed to ask you.
K.L. (28:23):
I just want to say I'll reiterate whoever's listening to
this God does really love you,no matter the trauma you're
going through being at loss of achild, loss of a parent or
divorce He is in that story.
The story, your life story, islike a tapestry and he's in
(28:45):
there weaving it with you.
It has ups and downs, but hedoes absolutely love you.
Trust him radically abouteverything, even and especially
your deepest trauma.
Trust him, he will always bethere for you.
Michelle (29:02):
Yeah, yeah, amen.
Well, thank you, K.
L.
It's been such an honor havingyou on the show today.
I know you got a busy day, soI'm gonna let you go.
But thank you so much for beingmy guest today.
K.L. (29:14):
Thank you, Michelle.
I truly appreciate it.
Thank you for the opportunity.
Michelle (29:19):
So, for those of you listening, i hope you heard the
hope in K.
L.
' s words today.
Right after Jordan's passing,she was in a very dark place and
she laid down to sleep, askingGod if you want me to stay, give
me another day, but if there'sno reason for me to be here,
(29:40):
have my oxygen tonight and bringme home to you.
But she found hope in themorning when she awoke to a new
day and a new sense of purpose,knowing that each day would be a
journey, but that God would beright there beside her on the
path.
My friend, losing a child is aterrible loss, i know, and the
(30:04):
deeper the love we shared, thedeeper the pain we'll have to
endure.
Grief is the price we pay forlove.
So hold tight to those aroundyou, love them well and tell
them often, and remember K.
L.
's encouragement to radicallytrust God in everything,
(30:25):
especially your deepest trauma.
He'll always be there for you.
Thanks for listening.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!