I endeavor to end racism and intolerance in all that I do.
I continue to attend 12-step meetings and sponsor many on their journey through the 12 steps.
Started a non-profit called Kaos Basketball to provide competitive basketball (AAU) experience to financially disadvantaged families of youth athletes.
Continue to coach (currently 8th/9th grade).
You can reach Andy through email: ahudson@mktbuildersintl.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome, Andy, to the Quantum Alchemist Master
Podcast.
It's a pleasure to have you.
I'm very, very excited to haveyou here and to hear your story
about your hero's journey, howyou got to where you are today.
Please go ahead, share whateverit is you feel called to share
with us, with the audience today.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Good morning.
Good morning, as I waspreparing for this, I kept
thinking.
I was modeling in my brain allof the questions you were going
to ask me, and I didn't preparefor that.
Tell us about your hero'sjourney.
That was I was like a prize.
So I'm not sure that it is ahero's journey.
(00:42):
I'm not sure that it is ahero's journey.
I think of it as the journeythat I'm on and kind of where I
am now.
So I don't have muchperspective because it is a
(01:11):
first person.
Audience is growing up in therural South and you can imagine
all of the things that thatcomes with racism and bigotry
and all of the things that areassociated there as well.
As good, as well as the smalltown loving Andy Griffith aspect
.
You know, always feeling likethat town was just a sport coat
that was two sizes too small.
(01:32):
I just had to get out and seethe world.
I do that.
I go to college.
I stumble in my first years ofcollege and end up in an eating
disorder unit in Norfolk,virginia, struggling with
anorexia.
(01:54):
You know, come into recovery forthat.
But it was a lot like being ableto put down the drink and not
really do the work of recovery.
So I was able to put down thebehavior, didn't do a lot of
recovery, went on with life, gotmarried, had children et cetera
(02:15):
, and then 20 years later raninto that brick wall again and
realized that I had allowedmyself to become addicted again
and to destroy my life and runmy life into the rocks a second
time, this time with pornography, with sex addiction.
(02:42):
And so I think that for me, thejourney of having come into
recovery and simply been able toput down the offending behavior
without doing the internal work, I think that was a gift, in
that the second time I realizedI could probably put down this
(03:06):
offending behavior and notreally do the work and maybe
I'll be successful, who knows?
But if I do that, 20 years fromnow or 10 years from now, I'll
be back in a different room witha different addiction, and so I
(03:29):
think that that has reallyshaped my perspective and I give
a lot of thanks to my creatorand to the universe for giving
me the blessing of addiction, ofaddiction, because I don't
think my ears were attuned tothe spiritual lessons that I
(03:49):
needed.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
I don't think I would have heard those without this
gift to shape my perspective.
Yeah, that's, oh sorry.
Can I stop you for a moment todive?
Speaker 2 (04:03):
You can.
Yeah, sorry, Can I stop you fora?
Speaker 1 (04:05):
moment to dive.
You can, yeah, absolutelyno-transcript side, or the other
(04:27):
perspective of this.
Um, yes, a lot of times and Ispeak about myself um, we put
things under the rug, we numb up, whatever works at that point.
Whatever gets us to movethrough it Right, but the
(04:52):
universe has a beautiful way ofbringing it right back to you.
It's like hold my beer.
Hang on a minute.
Yeah, yes, I say, my God isgenerous in that he will
continue to turn up the volumeon pain until.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
I'm ready to listen.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Beautiful, beautiful.
Yeah, can you say that one moretime?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Sure, my God is very generous.
He will continue to turn up thevolume on pain until I'm ready
to listen.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Oh man, I don't know about you, that hit me.
Yes, yes, thank you, I'm sorry,continue, continue.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
No, I love what you said earlier.
I think when I came intorecovery the first time for the
eating disorder, I think Ibelieved that the offending
behavior was the problem, and Ihave come to believe now that
(06:00):
that's not the problem.
That's actually the solution.
It's a bad solution, but it'sthe best solution that I could
come up with.
The problem is the way that Istate it for myself is I am
unable to live life on life'sterms, so I'm looking for ways
(06:22):
to, I think, as you said, numbout, leave the here and now, not
deal with what is actuallyhappening.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
The discomfort, oh my gosh.
Yeah, you know it's.
For a long time myself, I wasswimming against the current of
life upstream.
That gets very tiring.
You burn out real quick andyou're not gonna.
I mean in my experience.
I cannot speak for everyone,but I didn't last very long.
(06:55):
Uh, trying trying to go against, against what is, and that's
not without saying don't let goof your vision, of your dreams,
of what you want to create.
That's, it's a different.
You know it's really hard.
A lot of the ancient books, theTao, and a lot of these books
you hear.
You know the ebb and flow oflife go with the Tao, blah, blah
(07:17):
, blah.
Okay, let me just lay back onthe sofa and let life run over
me.
That's not it.
And it's really a difficultthing to explain to people
unless body or you come to acertain understanding within
your heart.
It's very.
(07:39):
I don't know how I would beable to explain that to others,
it's a bit of a simple subject,yet it can be complex to
understand, to flow with life.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
I don't know how I would articulate that either,
other than to say I love theword that you used discomfort.
That's one that my wife and Iuse all the time.
We can do uncomfortable things,it's okay to be uncomfortable.
We can do uncomfortable things,it's okay to be uncomfortable.
(08:09):
I think perhaps the distinctionthat I might make for myself
has to do with clarity of whyI'm doing what I'm doing.
If I'm serving a higher purpose, and serving that higher
purpose makes me uncomfortable,then that's okay.
(08:29):
If I'm just trying to get alittle bit of comfort for myself
, trying to get that last cookie, and I'm fighting the crowd to
get that last cookie, then Iprobably need to look in the
mirror.
Wow, wow, wow.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Then I probably need to look in the mirror.
Wow, wow, wow, let's just.
I mean, I don't mean to pauseevery time, but the amount of
wisdom that you're bringing intothe space, it's like reading
all the ancient texts and tryingto break it down into modern
terms.
It really is, in other words,through your own journey that is
(09:05):
so heavy what you've justshared with us.
Thank you, because it happenedto me the same way.
I was going after that cookie.
I've owned and sold businesses,I've been in real estate.
I was running after that carrot, that carrot that it keeps
(09:26):
pulling away from you every timeyou get closer to it, until my
near death.
And then that carrot, it's gone.
Now the carrot is always.
It was never the destination,it was always the journey right
For, in my opinion.
So, walking in purpose, wakingup in purpose, um, aligning your
(09:48):
actions, your thoughts andeverything you do with that
purpose, is what gives you whatgives your life meaning.
I feel almost right yeah, yeah,I.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
I grew up in the Bible Belt, as I mentioned, and
there was the religion that Igrew up with.
I don't know how I came up withthese ideas I'm not going to
blame someone else idea that Godreally needed me to worship him
(10:25):
, that somehow he had such afragile ego that he needed my
praise and my worship on a dailybasis, or else, I don't know,
he was going to flip out and gopostal.
And it wasn't until I was anadult that I came to realize
(10:47):
several things.
Number one if he really is that, if he really has an ego that
is that fragile, then he'sprobably not the God that I want
to worship.
You know, if he really needs me, if I'm the guy he needs, we're
in bad trouble.
(11:07):
And so I came to believe thathe asked me to do these things
to help others, to serve thepoor and the sick and those who
are in prison and lonely.
That he asked me to do thosethings not because he needs it,
(11:27):
but because it's good for me.
He asks me to pray not becausehe needs my prayers, but because
it's good for me, it'snourishing for me to be in
communion wow.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
That is definitely a different perspective,
especially coming from areligious background, and I've
been through several majorreligions, initially, like six
years ago.
Well, throughout my life I wasraised Catholic and in Cuba
there's many different religions, and so I've explored a lot of
them, which I find beauty.
(12:00):
In absolutely all of them Ifind wisdom and I take what
serves me, and now I see myperception and perspective of
God, of course, has shifted,just like yours, and the
listeners don't have to agreeWhatever your God is is
absolutely beautiful for you.
I would like I like to focusand I say that to my family,
because we have non-believers,we have people from different
(12:21):
religions within the family andI would say, embody the
qualities of god.
So what are those qualities?
Right, being compassionate,patient, loving, helping others,
helping the sick, all the stuffyou mentioned.
So to me is like being more inalignment with.
I don't care what name, whatface you give it, what
institution you go to, if youpraise or not.
(12:42):
If you, that's fine, it's up toyou.
We have a lot of humanconditioning going on as well
and programming that it's like.
To me, it's more importantwhat's in your heart and and who
are you being as a person?
Right?
How are you behaving with yourkids, with your partner, with
your close ones?
Because if you go to church andthen you come back and your
home is a living hell, want tolook at that right.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
So I have a thought question for you, and I
frequently get this thought.
So in the 12 steps ofalcoholics, anonymous or in
addiction recovery, they youknow that aa model is used in a
lot of recovery groups.
There is talk of a higher power, and the question that I often
(13:28):
get from others in the programis do I have to have a God?
And so I have thoughts on that,but I'd love to hear your
thoughts.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Yeah, so no, you don't have to have a God, you
are God.
You are God in human form.
Right, god is chi, prana, lifeforce running through all of the
kingdoms, all of the dimensions, all of the life forms in the
multiverse, from my near death,from working with plant
(14:06):
medicines that's kind of my takeon it.
Um, so it's all of it.
It's an ecosystem, um, wherelove is really the guiding force
of the organized chaos.
Um.
So when we learn to tap intolove, um, our whole life changes
.
It does.
You don't have to call itanything.
You don't have to call it love,you don't have to call it
anything.
You don't have to call it love.
You don't have to call it god,you don't have to call it
(14:27):
universe, buddha, krishna,whatever.
You don't have to have a god,but it helps to have something,
even if it's, if you don't wantto label it, just something,
something I feel that it helpedme on my journey, but
(14:50):
essentially it is yourself, itis all of us, as the entire
ecosystem.
You know, with death andrebirth cycles, with experiences
not necessarily good or bad.
As we see it, they're justexperiences and learning and
lessons for the soul.
Good or bad, as we see it.
They're just experiences andlearning and lessons for the
soul.
So it's really hard tocomprehend that um at this level
, because when you're in the eyeof the storm and you're going
through cancer or you're goingthrough addiction, you're like,
(15:13):
yeah, where is God now?
Right?
So, um, it takes a while.
But if you speak to a lot ofnear death experiencers, if you
speak to, um, a lot of peoplewho've been through cancer, most
people did anchor on thathigher power, whatever it is for
them to get them through it.
Um, because you, you understandit as a lesson, just as an
(15:36):
experience, like an enrichingexperience, maybe not the best
experience on this meat suit,but but an experience, right, an
eternal soul.
So it really doesn't even touchyour core.
Your essence is untouchable andinfinite and eternal.
So, looking at it from thatperspective, you see life as the
(15:59):
.
You become the observer of yourlife, the witness, right.
So it's a little bit different.
It's a handful of answer foryour question.
I don't know if that helps any,because we can't force our
beliefs on anyone, so it'sreally difficult, but it really
helps to anchor to something,whatever it is.
It doesn't have to be God.
What about your kid?
(16:20):
Like, maybe your kid is yourreason, or maybe your pet, or
maybe your mom or whatever.
Whatever connects you to love,do that.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Yeah, that's I know for me.
When I have people ask me thatquestion, I frequently say I
need something bigger thanmyself.
The word, the word is notimportant.
Whether you call it God or theuniverse or group wisdom is fine
for me, but I think I neededsomething bigger than my own
(16:55):
brain, because my brain is whatgot me into trouble and wrecked
my life a couple of times.
So if my best thinking got meinto trouble, I need something
better than my best thinking gotme into trouble.
I need something better than mybest thinking you know what?
Speaker 1 (17:07):
let's dive into that real quick, because I actually
got from my guides a map ofconsciousness which I'll share
with you.
Oh, I would love that yeah,absolutely, and that really kind
of breaks.
And there's tons of map ofconsciousness um around um.
This one in particular, I justfeel like, is very clear, it's
easy to understand, it's not ascomplex as other maps of
(17:31):
consciousness and it kind ofbreaks down from that higher
power all the way through you,through yourself and your
reality, because there's so manythings that go into that.
Right, I'm not going to shareit and do a presentation here
because it's going to take awayfrom the podcast and it's not
going to be uploaded and peopleare not going to see it.
But in reality we're like amulti-layer being right, aside
(17:55):
from being multi-dimensionalliterally, like we have all
these archetypes, personas.
If you are familiar with Young'swork, you know we're kind of
complex, right, there's a lot oflayers to us so, and we're only
operating on 5% of ourconscious brain and operating
95% on the unconscious.
So whatever we're not aware ofis actually what's running the
(18:18):
programming.
So that's kind of what you haveto start questioning.
So I think a lot of what Iteach is I guide you to ask good
questions.
I'm not here to give you theanswer, because maybe your
answers are different than myanswers, because your journey is
different than mine, right?
But I'm here to get you to askgood questions.
So if I tell you there's a mapof consciousness, uh-huh, so
(18:38):
what does that mean?
So what's going on in my brain,you know?
And then you start kind of likepulling from that thread, right
?
So I'll leave it at that, but Iwill share it in private with
you.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
I love that.
Thank you so much for that.
Absolutely my pleasure.
I love the idea of asking goodquestions 100% yeah, um, there
was a thought that I had that Ilost now, so it'll come back
(19:13):
that's what I say to my son allthe time.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
I was going to come and tell you something, but
it'll come back to me it'll be aTourette's moment tonight when
I bolt up in the bed you cantext me.
Well, tell me, tell me moreabout.
Okay.
So you dealt with those two.
What else?
What else has happened?
(19:35):
Like, was there any other wall?
How'd you deal with that one?
Like what you ended up doingthat worked, because the idea
for me is to empower others toshare what has worked.
You know, did you have to getinto a specific program or how
were you able to navigatethrough that?
Speaker 2 (19:53):
So the way that it worked for me.
15 years ago, I was so sick andtired of myself.
I didn't want to be me one moreminute and I didn't want to go
(20:15):
on one more minute, and I really, in retrospect I believe it was
that I'm allergic to lying.
I have an allergy to lying.
If I do it, I will get sick.
And so my moment of truth camewhen I was so sick of being me
(20:39):
that I got down on my knees andI said God, you've got to kill
me or you've got to save me.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
That sounds oddly familiar.
I said the same thing.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
I said I can't, I can't wake up one more day like
this.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
I right, I can't do it for another minute.
Kill me now or save me.
And I really believe there wassome magic in that.
I believe that crying out inthe darkness and being willing
to accept what came from it wasa moment of divine inspiration,
(21:19):
if you will, if you will.
So I found SAA, which is a12-step group for those
struggling with sex addiction,and I feel very blessed to have
(21:42):
had people around me who coachedme how to go kind of, one day
at a time, how to take it onestep at a time, how to eat the
elephant one bite at a time.
You heard me mention earlierthat I believe I'm allergic to
lying.
I think that that is a centralpart of my addiction is not
being truthful.
And for me, the top layer thelayer that's obvious is saying
(22:07):
things that are not true.
But the next layer is sayingthings that are technically true
but create a false impression.
And you know, maybe the thirdlayer is omitting to say things
that I really should share.
And the fourth layer is tellingmyself stories in a way that
(22:33):
diminishes my own responsibilityor my own part in the story or,
in some cases, aggrandizes myown importance in the world.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
you keep saying all these beautiful nuggets of
wisdom and I don't know why Ijust keep literally I see you
with a podcast and I see youcoaching, coaching.
Yeah, I don't know if that hasever crossed your and I never
(23:10):
share this on a podcast, liketelling people.
I see you like blah, blah, blah.
It's just weird and random, butI just I saw you so
passionately speaking about itthat I think it would be amazing
for the world to have you andto have you as a mentor and a
coach.
I don't even know if that'swhat you do, but you can tell me
(23:31):
later after this, what you're.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Coach basketball.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Does that help?
Yes, everything helps,everything helps.
Imagine the ripple effectsyou're doing to those kids.
Everything helps.
Sorry, the ripple effectsyou're doing to those kids.
Everything helps, sorry.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
That's okay.
That's okay.
So in my journey, you know andI worked through the 12 steps
and it was a for me myexperience was that it was not.
How can I say this?
I'm a pretty smart guy and Idid well in school because I got
(24:15):
a, you know, a giant brain thiswork in recovery.
I had to learn that my bigbrain was actually an impediment
, sometimes that, as the IndigoGirls said, I'll think myself
into jail, you know.
(24:39):
So I had to learn that this isa different part of me, the
spirit and understanding how toconnect in the world in a way
that doesn't damage me anddoesn't damage those around me
needed a different part of me tobe engaged.
I was overusing one part part,and so that's really been the
(25:10):
work for me is to learn how totake the skills that God gave me
and to use them appropriately,as opposed to kind of overusing
the big brain.
The vision that I have is, youknow, I was kind of a lawyer
with one of those big yellowlegal pads taking notes and
somehow I came up with the ideathat if I could convince others
(25:34):
of my argument, that somehowthat made me right and what it
did is, it made me a goodsalesperson, but it didn't make
me any more right.
So it's been a journey of 15years since coming into recovery
(25:56):
.
What I have come to realize issomething that you mentioned on
this podcast that my addictionis not pornography.
Pornography was the medicinethat I took.
My addiction is an inability tobe uncomfortable, an inability
(26:18):
to deal with what's in front ofme, and so that's really my
journey.
Now is, how do I stay in themoment, how do I stay engaged?
How do I do the things thatwill not hurt me, not hurt the
world will add to the world.
(26:39):
If we're all in life schoolhere, how do I, how do I help
others through life school atthe same time as I'm making it
through?
Speaker 1 (26:53):
you know, I, before my, my near death, I always had
a calling of service, but andit's gonna have to do with what
you just mentioned in just amoment Um, but it was like more
(27:14):
ego centered um, to be honest.
And when we're smart in school,um, and we have all of these, I
would say gifts, because if wewere to be have to have born, be
born with, like, developmentaldelay or something you know, it
is what it is, so it's a gift.
I see it as a gift.
And how are you using that gift?
Let's just say I wasn't usingit the most appropriately.
(27:34):
And when we come into power andit doesn't matter, it could be
spiritual power, because onceyou have a higher understanding,
or it could be power in yourprofession, or it could be power
in your profession, or it couldbe power in your relationship.
So how we use power is verydelicate, because what I learned
in my near death is thatwhatever harm you do to others,
(27:54):
you're really doing it toyourself.
So it's a very delicate threadthere as to how we operate in
the world.
When I, when I crossed over, alot of what I had to deal with
was my own guilt and shame andjust myself, like judgment of
(28:18):
myself and my actions.
So it's really beautiful thatthere is not a person or a god
that will judge you.
In my personal experience, um,but it is myself.
So there's nowhere to run.
Even if you leave this realmthat you're, you're, it's right
(28:38):
here.
Right, it's consciousness.
So you got to deal with thatinner work.
Might as well do it here, whereyou're at right.
Might as well find that innerpeace, that inner love, that
inner wisdom, that compassion,that inner compass to kind of
guide you to make decisions thatfeel good to you without having
to putting all those layers.
(28:58):
And while in this map ofconsciousness I was able, when I
was downloading it, I was ableto tap into the collective
unconscious.
And a lot of what I found therewas sex addiction, pedophile
stuff like that.
But not judging it from thatpart, it is just we haven't
looked at it as a, as acollective, we haven't done the
(29:22):
work.
It's not good or bad 's, justis there.
And then how are we as ahumanity going to deal with that
right?
Are we going to continue thesex trafficking?
Are we going to continueabusing children like how?
Is that the path forward?
Is that how we see that thatwould lead us to a better world.
(29:43):
I'm'm not sure, you know thatdoesn't sound right to me.
So, really just questioningwhat is and how are we going to
do about it?
You could have decided to notdo the work and gone and gone in
a whole different direction,right?
So how are we using our freewill, our power?
Right, if you're?
in a place of power.
Most of the abuse comes fromfamily, from close family
(30:05):
parents, grandparents, you know,very close in the family.
So it's looking at that and I'mnot necessarily judging,
because who knows how they wereraised or who knows if they had
abuse, they're just carryingthis pattern, right.
So?
But if someone's coming acrossthis podcast or someone's in a
(30:26):
state of their life wherethey're bringing that
unconscious pattern, making itconscious, and you're aware that
you know, you always have theego, the super ego, which is
like, OK, this is right, this isnot right, this is my fantasy.
Should I actually carry it on?
Right?
So where?
Where is that balance?
(30:46):
Right?
So, just questioning yourselfagain, good questions,
questioning yourself how am Igoing to approach this up to how
far can I take this in my mindversus what am I going to act?
Actually act on you know?
And is that something that Iwant, a pattern that I want to
(31:08):
keep running in my unconsciousor subconscious mind, or do I
actually want to try to shiftand change?
because a lot of times, if youlive in this headspace, I feel
like it's hard to make realconnections like an intimacy
with people it's kind of likeyou can't fully connect because
no one's really going to fulfillthat fantasy anyway, like no
one's going to match it rightBecause it's not the common
(31:31):
relationship.
Let's just say so.
I feel it's an opportunity.
I see it as an opportunity forus to deal with it and to bring
it to light and to not make ittaboo.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
Like I don't really care.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
Maybe mean sex addiction, make it not taboo why
it's part of our lives, right,like if we keep putting it on
the rug, if we don't talk about,if there are no groups to deal
with this.
If there's, I mean it's, it'sgoing to, it's going to pop up
somewhere, I mean it is so, yeahwell in the environment that I
(32:09):
grew up in, I understood thatalcohol was dangerous.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
I understood that you know drinking and getting drunk
could be like a loaded gunRight, that addiction was a
possibility.
I also understood that drugswere bad, but nobody ever said
looking at pornography could beaddictive.
Nobody ever told me that.
Nobody ever told me that thiswas a dangerous, dangerous thing
(32:39):
that I was engaging with, andso I think you're right.
I love you.
Used the word ego there and Iso identified with you.
Said something about I had acalling to help, but it was ego
centered or something like that.
I so identify with that.
(33:03):
That, for me, ego thedefinition that I use is I am
attaching I to something that isnot I.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Wow Indentation for narrow pathways.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
One more time please.
The definition of ego that I useis I am attaching I to
something that is not I.
So it could be I am a goodfather, I am whatever I am.
That's what the bible refers toas the devil is, and that's
(34:02):
what is fighting my ability totruly, uh, be of help to myself
and everybody else on the planetis.
You know, maya angelou um had agreat analogy.
Oprah asked her her thoughts onwhat happened after she died
(34:22):
and she said I'm like a cup ofocean water.
When the cup breaks, the waterwill return to the ocean, and I
often use that, for, for me, egois thinking I'm the cup instead
of the ocean water that'spowerful.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
That's the same way I view it.
Yeah, it's the ebb and flow ofcreation, return to the source,
and then again energy justchanging form, right
Transforming.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Right and I find that I can have a lot more
compassion for others if Irealize that for me, I think of
it as all earth school and we'reall made of the same substance.
So perhaps this person is noton that lesson yet.
They're on whatever lessonthey're on, and it allows me to
(35:22):
give, to have a little morecompassion for them 100%.
The other thing that I wantedto bring up.
Do we have time to keep talking?
Speaker 1 (35:33):
We have time.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
I got until 9.30.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
Okay, yeah, we can do 930.
That's good.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
I mean the conversation's good so in my
mind.
I think of drugs as somethingthat feels good now but creates
damage long term.
So ice cream is a great examplefor me, because I love ice
(36:00):
cream.
I love it, it's delicious, itfeels good going down, but, boy,
I'm going to feel bad later.
I think of medicine as theopposite of drugs.
Medicine is something that maynot be pleasant in the near term
but is really beneficial in thelong term.
(36:21):
So it could be exercise, itcould be, and I think for me, a
big part of my journey isidentifying those things that
are quote unquote drugs in mylife.
Uh, social media sitting infront of the television.
(36:42):
Uh, doom scrolling on my phone.
Um, you know eating too manyoreo cookies.
Um, you know that they'rebringing me pleasure in the near
term, but they're really makinglife much harder over time.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yeah, you're just creating a huge medical bill at
the end, you know, putting yourhealth at stake, and I see that
playing out with my family.
So I feel like what a bravebunch of souls to come to
incarnate together to teach me,I mean and they're in their own
lessons too, right, but I takethe teaching of that right, like
(37:28):
to put themselves through thatto learn whatever it is that
they're there to learn.
But they're also teaching melike, okay, you still got time
to make some better choices here.
Okay, whether it comes tonutrition, to exercise, to
whatever it is, do it now, reapthe benefits later and you could
(37:51):
and exercise and all that stuff.
For me, I feel pretty goodright after doing it.
So I don't feel like you haveto wait so long.
Meditation, breath work, all ofthese things.
Yoga, right, what?
Going to the beach, evensomething so simple as that, um,
maybe doing a juice cleanse,whatever works for you.
Fasting for some people um, youhave so much more energy, focus
(38:13):
, clarity, like there are somany benefits to different
things.
You just have to find whatworks for you.
Like, if somebody like my wifeshe doesn't like yoga, I love
yoga, like she's, you know shelikes weight training, for
example.
I'm not a big weight trainerbut I love mobility and flow and
yoga and that kind of movement.
So I find what works for me,she finds what works for her.
(38:37):
Maybe we'll have a class wherewe kind of mix the two and kind
of compromise.
So find what works for you,maybe it's just a walk after
dinner, whatever, but but you'reI heard this somewhere, I can't
recall where, but I have neverforgotten it Fix your roof
before the hurricane comes.
(38:58):
In the middle of the hurricaneyou don't have time to go up to
the roof and fix it.
That's gone.
I don't even try to.
It's gone, it's gone.
I love that.
I love that Really.
Just, it really made an youknow an impact to me.
Like man, I'm at a time in mylife where and I've had health
issues which have forced me tochange my habits so fix the roof
(39:24):
now, when you're safe, when youdon't, the winds of the
hurricanes are not hitting you.
You can't fix it when you'regoing through cancer, when
you're going through.
I mean you could, but it'sgoing to be much harder.
You know what I mean.
Don't take much longer.
So, yeah, I just wanted to toshare that, that that we have
(39:44):
examples everywhere, even as asociety here in America the
overweight, the anxiety, thedepression, uh, since 2010 has
gone up over 50 somethingpercent, you know, admissions in
the ER for suicide attempts hasgone over 60%, so crazy, you
(40:07):
know.
Wow, yeah, so we have to starttaking some radical
responsibility for ourselves,for our life, for our own
healing journey.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
So, ms Rosita, can I throw out another idea?
Yeah, the study where they puta rat in a cage and they gave it
access to water, and then theygave it access to drugs, to
heroin I haven't heard aboutthat one, oh my gosh.
And the rat?
(40:37):
Can you imagine?
The rat becomes addicted toheroin.
And they did this experiment anumber of times and the rat
always becomes addicted toheroin, until a scientist came
along and said we're justputting a rat in a cage.
This is very depressing for therat.
This is not a normal scenariofor the rat.
(41:01):
And so he built a ratwonderland and he still offered
regular food and water andheroin, but he put a bunch of
rats in there.
So they had community, they hadengagement.
What happened?
The rats didn't become addictedto heroin.
(41:25):
And so I look at that inhumanity and I heard someone say
, relatively early in myrecovery journey they said you
know, a big part of the magic ofthe 12-step groups is that you
come in and there's a group ofpeople who just love you and
(41:49):
listen to you and whatever youspeak, at the end of the time
you're speaking, they say thankyou.
You're speaking, they say thankyou, that's all they say they
don't offer feedback, they don'toffer praise or criticism, just
thank you, I heard you.
And that this person said youknow, that's a big part of the
(42:11):
magic.
I was resistant to that idea,by the way, when I heard it, by
the way when I heard it.
But I have come to sincebelieve that human connection,
just loving and connecting withanother person, is, by itself,
magic.
You mentioned the word intimacyearlier and my wife and I, after
(42:36):
I began my own individualrecovery journey, we joined a
group for couples to recover andI heard someone in there say
intimacy into me.
You see, and I have to say,when I heard it it terrified me.
(42:56):
Heard it, it terrified me.
That was a horrible thingbecause I knew if anybody really
knew me they wouldn't love me.
That was the fear I lied to mywife because I thought if she
(43:22):
knew me, there's no way shewould stay with me.
And I have come to believe thatthat is learning how to let
other people in to see me.
Vulnerability AbsolutelyLearning how to be vulnerable
and learning how to receivevulnerability from others is
part of the healing of the worldthat I hope that we can all
participate in.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
Yeah, yeah, I mean that's so powerful, one sentence
after the other that you'resharing.
All of it is so full of wisdomand I feel a lot of people can
identify with it, because itdoesn't have to be sex or
alcohol or drugs or whateveryour addiction is.
There's plenty of addiction.
Maybe it's shopping, maybe it'sscrolling through your phone,
(44:05):
maybe it's caffeine.
I went through caffeineaddiction Really.
Yeah, I was drinking two RedBulls, two cups of coffee, and
that was like maybe three yearsago.
Yeah, it was one of the mostdifficult addictions to kind of.
(44:26):
You know, like.
I know it sounds weird and easy, but yeah it's.
It was difficult for me to tolet it go.
So it's interesting.
I of course I let it go after Istarted having health issues.
I let go of a lot of stuffbecause when, when you're
hospitalized and when you have adiagnosis where it's like, okay
(44:47):
, it's either this is going tokill me or I need to make
changes in my life, so you kindof make your choices right.
But yeah, it applies to anyaddiction, all the wisdom that
you're sharing.
So extremely grateful to haveyou here.
And also for couples I've beenwith my wife for 13 years, so of
(45:09):
course our relationship hasbeen through ups and downs.
Right, it's like a rollercoaster and it's falling in love
all over again with the newperson that she becomes.
That I become like.
Do you choose that person asshe is now, without wanting?
to change her, to change thatperson.
Um, and when you, when westarted what I call the inner
(45:30):
work in 2018, really sharing themonsters, if you want to call
it that, or your shadows, andreally allowing them to surface,
I think it's actually beautiful.
If that person is going to runor stay, I think it's.
You would want to know that man.
You know you don't want to staywith someone who, when your
(45:53):
worst comes out, is going to runon you.
I don't know.
You may want to reconsider thatRight.
worst comes out is going to runon you that I don't know.
You may want to reconsider thatright.
So I think it's beingvulnerable has.
Even if it's, let's just sayeven if it's.
Let's just put a scenario whereyou're with your wife and you
say, hey, I have this addictionto, to this fantasy or to this
(46:17):
sex or to this, whatever it is,and of course you can't share it
with her because you you feelyou know she's going to run,
she's not going to love me,whatever.
So what is the worst casescenario?
What would happen if you didshare it?
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Like what would happen?
Speaker 1 (46:29):
Would she run?
Would she work through it withyou?
Would you guys be able to findhelp?
Um, so you don't have to do italone.
It doesn't have to be your wife.
Maybe it's a group of peopleand a program designed for that.
Wherever you feel comfortable,to open up, but look for help
before you give up.
(46:50):
I know a lot of people who'vecommitted suicide and they've
left small children behind andit's very difficult for the
people that stay behind.
Speaker 2 (47:00):
Yeah.
So just look for help I wouldsay yes, I love that you have
said a mouthful.
There was a moment where I wascoming to grips with my own
addiction I had not shared itwith my wife yet and my
(47:26):
stepmother said she deserves tomake her own decision, that by
withholding information you aremaking the decision for her.
She deserves to have fullinformation and make the
decision for herself.
Speaker 1 (47:47):
Wow, that is heavy what you've just said.
Speaker 2 (47:51):
Just even if we're not technically lying,
withholding the information,that's a lot and that applies to
anything yeah, and I'm, I'm sothankful I I do believe that
because I have four childrenthat they, my four children
bought me probably six monthsworth of grace.
(48:13):
Yes, but I'm so happy that shechose to stay and work through
it with me, and there were manytimes when I would say, are you
going to stay?
And she would say I'm heretoday.
That's the.
That's the most I'm going topromise is I'm here today, you
(48:36):
know?
Do you know the Exodus storyfrom the Bible?
Speaker 1 (48:42):
No.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
The Jews are in slavery in Egypt and Moses comes
and says hey, god wants me tolead you out of slavery.
And eventually he gathers themup and they go through the Red
(49:04):
Sea and they go to the desertand they wander in the
wilderness for 40 years beforethey get to the promised land, a
land of milk and honey.
And I think of recovery much inthat same way.
It's out of slavery, butbetween slavery and the promised
(49:26):
land is the desert.
And there were many Israeliteswho grumbled and said you
brought us out here to thedesert to starve At least we had
food.
And slavery, let's go back.
Let's go back to slavery.
And so for us, in myrelationship with my wife, in my
own recovery, there absolutelyis struggle and discomfort.
(49:51):
It's not a straight line fromslavery to the promised land and
for me there absolutely was thetemptation to go back.
At least that's a devil that Iknow.
But I believe that the promisedland is the land of milk and
(50:13):
honey for a reason.
And the Israelites had to trustGod for manna.
He rained down manna one day ata time.
They couldn't store it up.
Very much like serenity, verymuch like trusting God one day
at a time.
I'm here today.
That's the best I've got.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Oh man, oh man, did you guys, did you?
If you're listening to this,does it feel peaceful to just
and safe to hear these words?
I hope you're really.
First of all, finish the entirepodcast because the amount of
(50:55):
wisdom we both shared it hasbeen because we've been through
it ourselves and we're speakingwith you guys from experience,
with an open heart thathopefully one word, one phrase
here can empower you to make apositive impact, a change in
your life.
That what you just said now andputting into stories, parables,
(51:23):
all that stuff.
There's a sweetness to thatbecause you can apply it to any
scenario of your life personal,professional, whatever it is.
It applies to everything right,Even just anchoring in your
roots, and that knowing rightthat you're always guided,
(51:45):
always supported, even if youcan't see it.
So thank you for sharing that.
That was deep.
Speaker 2 (51:52):
Thank you.
Thank you for making time andspace for me to be here with you
this morning.
I really, really appreciate itand I love and admire the work
that you're doing to make thisplanet better.
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (52:05):
Yeah, I am honored and I say the same thing to you.
Is there anything else you wantto leave the listeners with
before we hop off, and would youtell us if you want to share
what it is that you do and ifyou want to share where people
can contact you, you could dothat too.
You can self promote here atthe end if you want as well.
(52:29):
Your business, whatever it isthat you do, feel free.
If it's something you want toshare, up to you.
Speaker 2 (52:36):
I do not have anything to promote.
I export food to Latin America.
I represent US manufacturersinto Latin America, so there's
no promotion.
I also, in my spare time, coach, travel basketball because God
gave me much less athleticability than he gave me
(52:57):
competitive drive, so I've gotnothing to promote.
If people want to contact me,they can contact me.
Should I give my phone numberand email.
Speaker 1 (53:14):
No, we'll put an email down on the description
Beautiful.
Yeah, they can contact youthere All right.
Well, it's been an absolutepleasure for me, Andy.
I have learned tons from youand I hope to continue to learn
from you.
Thank you so, so much.
Speaker 2 (53:30):
Thank you so much for your time.
I really appreciate you too.
Welcome, Andy, to the Quantum Alchemist Master
Podcast.
It's a pleasure to have you.
I'm very, very excited to haveyou here and to hear your story
about your hero's journey, howyou got to where you are today.
Please go ahead, share whateverit is you feel called to share
with us, with the audience today.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Good morning.
Good morning, as I waspreparing for this, I kept
thinking.
I was modeling in my brain allof the questions you were going
to ask me, and I didn't preparefor that.
Tell us about your hero'sjourney.
That was I was like a prize.
So I'm not sure that it is ahero's journey.
(00:42):
I'm not sure that it is ahero's journey.
I think of it as the journeythat I'm on and kind of where I
am now.
So I don't have muchperspective because it is a
(01:11):
first person.
Audience is growing up in therural South and you can imagine
all of the things that thatcomes with racism and bigotry
and all of the things that areassociated there as well.
As good, as well as the smalltown loving Andy Griffith aspect
.
You know, always feeling likethat town was just a sport coat
that was two sizes too small.
(01:32):
I just had to get out and seethe world.
I do that.
I go to college.
I stumble in my first years ofcollege and end up in an eating
disorder unit in Norfolk,virginia, struggling with
anorexia.
(01:54):
You know, come into recovery forthat.
But it was a lot like being ableto put down the drink and not
really do the work of recovery.
So I was able to put down thebehavior, didn't do a lot of
recovery, went on with life, gotmarried, had children et cetera
(02:15):
, and then 20 years later raninto that brick wall again and
realized that I had allowedmyself to become addicted again
and to destroy my life and runmy life into the rocks a second
time, this time with pornography, with sex addiction.
(02:42):
And so I think that for me, thejourney of having come into
recovery and simply been able toput down the offending behavior
without doing the internal work, I think that was a gift, in
that the second time I realizedI could probably put down this
(03:06):
offending behavior and notreally do the work and maybe
I'll be successful, who knows?
But if I do that, 20 years fromnow or 10 years from now, I'll
be back in a different room witha different addiction, and so I
(03:29):
think that that has reallyshaped my perspective and I give
a lot of thanks to my creatorand to the universe for giving
me the blessing of addiction, ofaddiction, because I don't
think my ears were attuned tothe spiritual lessons that I
(03:49):
needed.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
I don't think I would have heard those without this
gift to shape my perspective.
Yeah, that's, oh sorry.
Can I stop you for a moment todive?
Speaker 2 (04:03):
You can.
Yeah, sorry, Can I stop you fora?
Speaker 1 (04:05):
moment to dive.
You can, yeah, absolutelyno-transcript side, or the other
(04:27):
perspective of this.
Um, yes, a lot of times and Ispeak about myself um, we put
things under the rug, we numb up, whatever works at that point.
Whatever gets us to movethrough it Right, but the
(04:52):
universe has a beautiful way ofbringing it right back to you.
It's like hold my beer.
Hang on a minute.
Yeah, yes, I say, my God isgenerous in that he will
continue to turn up the volumeon pain until.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
I'm ready to listen.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Beautiful, beautiful.
Yeah, can you say that one moretime?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Sure, my God is very generous.
He will continue to turn up thevolume on pain until I'm ready
to listen.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Oh man, I don't know about you, that hit me.
Yes, yes, thank you, I'm sorry,continue, continue.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
No, I love what you said earlier.
I think when I came intorecovery the first time for the
eating disorder, I think Ibelieved that the offending
behavior was the problem, and Ihave come to believe now that
(06:00):
that's not the problem.
That's actually the solution.
It's a bad solution, but it'sthe best solution that I could
come up with.
The problem is the way that Istate it for myself is I am
unable to live life on life'sterms, so I'm looking for ways
(06:22):
to, I think, as you said, numbout, leave the here and now, not
deal with what is actuallyhappening.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
The discomfort, oh my gosh.
Yeah, you know it's.
For a long time myself, I wasswimming against the current of
life upstream.
That gets very tiring.
You burn out real quick andyou're not gonna.
I mean in my experience.
I cannot speak for everyone,but I didn't last very long.
(06:55):
Uh, trying trying to go against, against what is, and that's
not without saying don't let goof your vision, of your dreams,
of what you want to create.
That's, it's a different.
You know it's really hard.
A lot of the ancient books, theTao, and a lot of these books
you hear.
You know the ebb and flow oflife go with the Tao, blah, blah
(07:17):
, blah.
Okay, let me just lay back onthe sofa and let life run over
me.
That's not it.
And it's really a difficultthing to explain to people
unless body or you come to acertain understanding within
your heart.
It's very.
(07:39):
I don't know how I would beable to explain that to others,
it's a bit of a simple subject,yet it can be complex to
understand, to flow with life.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
I don't know how I would articulate that either,
other than to say I love theword that you used discomfort.
That's one that my wife and Iuse all the time.
We can do uncomfortable things,it's okay to be uncomfortable.
We can do uncomfortable things,it's okay to be uncomfortable.
(08:09):
I think perhaps the distinctionthat I might make for myself
has to do with clarity of whyI'm doing what I'm doing.
If I'm serving a higher purpose, and serving that higher
purpose makes me uncomfortable,then that's okay.
(08:29):
If I'm just trying to get alittle bit of comfort for myself
, trying to get that last cookie, and I'm fighting the crowd to
get that last cookie, then Iprobably need to look in the
mirror.
Wow, wow, wow.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Then I probably need to look in the mirror.
Wow, wow, wow, let's just.
I mean, I don't mean to pauseevery time, but the amount of
wisdom that you're bringing intothe space, it's like reading
all the ancient texts and tryingto break it down into modern
terms.
It really is, in other words,through your own journey that is
(09:05):
so heavy what you've justshared with us.
Thank you, because it happenedto me the same way.
I was going after that cookie.
I've owned and sold businesses,I've been in real estate.
I was running after that carrot, that carrot that it keeps
(09:26):
pulling away from you every timeyou get closer to it, until my
near death.
And then that carrot, it's gone.
Now the carrot is always.
It was never the destination,it was always the journey right
For, in my opinion.
So, walking in purpose, wakingup in purpose, um, aligning your
(09:48):
actions, your thoughts andeverything you do with that
purpose, is what gives you whatgives your life meaning.
I feel almost right yeah, yeah,I.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
I grew up in the Bible Belt, as I mentioned, and
there was the religion that Igrew up with.
I don't know how I came up withthese ideas I'm not going to
blame someone else idea that Godreally needed me to worship him
(10:25):
, that somehow he had such afragile ego that he needed my
praise and my worship on a dailybasis, or else, I don't know,
he was going to flip out and gopostal.
And it wasn't until I was anadult that I came to realize
(10:47):
several things.
Number one if he really is that, if he really has an ego that
is that fragile, then he'sprobably not the God that I want
to worship.
You know, if he really needs me, if I'm the guy he needs, we're
in bad trouble.
(11:07):
And so I came to believe thathe asked me to do these things
to help others, to serve thepoor and the sick and those who
are in prison and lonely.
That he asked me to do thosethings not because he needs it,
(11:27):
but because it's good for me.
He asks me to pray not becausehe needs my prayers, but because
it's good for me, it'snourishing for me to be in
communion wow.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
That is definitely a different perspective,
especially coming from areligious background, and I've
been through several majorreligions, initially, like six
years ago.
Well, throughout my life I wasraised Catholic and in Cuba
there's many different religions, and so I've explored a lot of
them, which I find beauty.
(12:00):
In absolutely all of them Ifind wisdom and I take what
serves me, and now I see myperception and perspective of
God, of course, has shifted,just like yours, and the
listeners don't have to agreeWhatever your God is is
absolutely beautiful for you.
I would like I like to focusand I say that to my family,
because we have non-believers,we have people from different
(12:21):
religions within the family andI would say, embody the
qualities of god.
So what are those qualities?
Right, being compassionate,patient, loving, helping others,
helping the sick, all the stuffyou mentioned.
So to me is like being more inalignment with.
I don't care what name, whatface you give it, what
institution you go to, if youpraise or not.
(12:42):
If you, that's fine, it's up toyou.
We have a lot of humanconditioning going on as well
and programming that it's like.
To me, it's more importantwhat's in your heart and and who
are you being as a person?
Right?
How are you behaving with yourkids, with your partner, with
your close ones?
Because if you go to church andthen you come back and your
home is a living hell, want tolook at that right.
Speaker 2 (13:04):
So I have a thought question for you, and I
frequently get this thought.
So in the 12 steps ofalcoholics, anonymous or in
addiction recovery, they youknow that aa model is used in a
lot of recovery groups.
There is talk of a higher power, and the question that I often
(13:28):
get from others in the programis do I have to have a God?
And so I have thoughts on that,but I'd love to hear your
thoughts.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Yeah, so no, you don't have to have a God, you
are God.
You are God in human form.
Right, god is chi, prana, lifeforce running through all of the
kingdoms, all of the dimensions, all of the life forms in the
multiverse, from my near death,from working with plant
(14:06):
medicines that's kind of my takeon it.
Um, so it's all of it.
It's an ecosystem, um, wherelove is really the guiding force
of the organized chaos.
Um.
So when we learn to tap intolove, um, our whole life changes
.
It does.
You don't have to call itanything.
You don't have to call it love,you don't have to call it
anything.
You don't have to call it love.
You don't have to call it god,you don't have to call it
(14:27):
universe, buddha, krishna,whatever.
You don't have to have a god,but it helps to have something,
even if it's, if you don't wantto label it, just something,
something I feel that it helpedme on my journey, but
(14:50):
essentially it is yourself, itis all of us, as the entire
ecosystem.
You know, with death andrebirth cycles, with experiences
not necessarily good or bad.
As we see it, they're justexperiences and learning and
lessons for the soul.
Good or bad, as we see it.
They're just experiences andlearning and lessons for the
soul.
So it's really hard tocomprehend that um at this level
, because when you're in the eyeof the storm and you're going
through cancer or you're goingthrough addiction, you're like,
(15:13):
yeah, where is God now?
Right?
So, um, it takes a while.
But if you speak to a lot ofnear death experiencers, if you
speak to, um, a lot of peoplewho've been through cancer, most
people did anchor on thathigher power, whatever it is for
them to get them through it.
Um, because you, you understandit as a lesson, just as an
(15:36):
experience, like an enrichingexperience, maybe not the best
experience on this meat suit,but but an experience, right, an
eternal soul.
So it really doesn't even touchyour core.
Your essence is untouchable andinfinite and eternal.
So, looking at it from thatperspective, you see life as the
(15:59):
.
You become the observer of yourlife, the witness, right.
So it's a little bit different.
It's a handful of answer foryour question.
I don't know if that helps any,because we can't force our
beliefs on anyone, so it'sreally difficult, but it really
helps to anchor to something,whatever it is.
It doesn't have to be God.
What about your kid?
(16:20):
Like, maybe your kid is yourreason, or maybe your pet, or
maybe your mom or whatever.
Whatever connects you to love,do that.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Yeah, that's I know for me.
When I have people ask me thatquestion, I frequently say I
need something bigger thanmyself.
The word, the word is notimportant.
Whether you call it God or theuniverse or group wisdom is fine
for me, but I think I neededsomething bigger than my own
(16:55):
brain, because my brain is whatgot me into trouble and wrecked
my life a couple of times.
So if my best thinking got meinto trouble, I need something
better than my best thinking gotme into trouble.
I need something better than mybest thinking you know what?
Speaker 1 (17:07):
let's dive into that real quick, because I actually
got from my guides a map ofconsciousness which I'll share
with you.
Oh, I would love that yeah,absolutely, and that really kind
of breaks.
And there's tons of map ofconsciousness um around um.
This one in particular, I justfeel like, is very clear, it's
easy to understand, it's not ascomplex as other maps of
(17:31):
consciousness and it kind ofbreaks down from that higher
power all the way through you,through yourself and your
reality, because there's so manythings that go into that.
Right, I'm not going to shareit and do a presentation here
because it's going to take awayfrom the podcast and it's not
going to be uploaded and peopleare not going to see it.
But in reality we're like amulti-layer being right, aside
(17:55):
from being multi-dimensionalliterally, like we have all
these archetypes, personas.
If you are familiar with Young'swork, you know we're kind of
complex, right, there's a lot oflayers to us so, and we're only
operating on 5% of ourconscious brain and operating
95% on the unconscious.
So whatever we're not aware ofis actually what's running the
(18:18):
programming.
So that's kind of what you haveto start questioning.
So I think a lot of what Iteach is I guide you to ask good
questions.
I'm not here to give you theanswer, because maybe your
answers are different than myanswers, because your journey is
different than mine, right?
But I'm here to get you to askgood questions.
So if I tell you there's a mapof consciousness, uh-huh, so
(18:38):
what does that mean?
So what's going on in my brain,you know?
And then you start kind of likepulling from that thread, right
?
So I'll leave it at that, but Iwill share it in private with
you.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
I love that.
Thank you so much for that.
Absolutely my pleasure.
I love the idea of asking goodquestions 100% yeah, um, there
was a thought that I had that Ilost now, so it'll come back
(19:13):
that's what I say to my son allthe time.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
I was going to come and tell you something, but
it'll come back to me it'll be aTourette's moment tonight when
I bolt up in the bed you cantext me.
Well, tell me, tell me moreabout.
Okay.
So you dealt with those two.
What else?
What else has happened?
(19:35):
Like, was there any other wall?
How'd you deal with that one?
Like what you ended up doingthat worked, because the idea
for me is to empower others toshare what has worked.
You know, did you have to getinto a specific program or how
were you able to navigatethrough that?
Speaker 2 (19:53):
So the way that it worked for me.
15 years ago, I was so sick andtired of myself.
I didn't want to be me one moreminute and I didn't want to go
(20:15):
on one more minute, and I really, in retrospect I believe it was
that I'm allergic to lying.
I have an allergy to lying.
If I do it, I will get sick.
And so my moment of truth camewhen I was so sick of being me
(20:39):
that I got down on my knees andI said God, you've got to kill
me or you've got to save me.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
That sounds oddly familiar.
I said the same thing.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
I said I can't, I can't wake up one more day like
this.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
I right, I can't do it for another minute.
Kill me now or save me.
And I really believe there wassome magic in that.
I believe that crying out inthe darkness and being willing
to accept what came from it wasa moment of divine inspiration,
(21:19):
if you will, if you will.
So I found SAA, which is a12-step group for those
struggling with sex addiction,and I feel very blessed to have
(21:42):
had people around me who coachedme how to go kind of, one day
at a time, how to take it onestep at a time, how to eat the
elephant one bite at a time.
You heard me mention earlierthat I believe I'm allergic to
lying.
I think that that is a centralpart of my addiction is not
being truthful.
And for me, the top layer thelayer that's obvious is saying
(22:07):
things that are not true.
But the next layer is sayingthings that are technically true
but create a false impression.
And you know, maybe the thirdlayer is omitting to say things
that I really should share.
And the fourth layer is tellingmyself stories in a way that
(22:33):
diminishes my own responsibilityor my own part in the story or,
in some cases, aggrandizes myown importance in the world.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
you keep saying all these beautiful nuggets of
wisdom and I don't know why Ijust keep literally I see you
with a podcast and I see youcoaching, coaching.
Yeah, I don't know if that hasever crossed your and I never
(23:10):
share this on a podcast, liketelling people.
I see you like blah, blah, blah.
It's just weird and random, butI just I saw you so
passionately speaking about itthat I think it would be amazing
for the world to have you andto have you as a mentor and a
coach.
I don't even know if that'swhat you do, but you can tell me
(23:31):
later after this, what you're.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Coach basketball.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Does that help?
Yes, everything helps,everything helps.
Imagine the ripple effectsyou're doing to those kids.
Everything helps.
Sorry, the ripple effectsyou're doing to those kids.
Everything helps, sorry.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
That's okay.
That's okay.
So in my journey, you know andI worked through the 12 steps
and it was a for me myexperience was that it was not.
How can I say this?
I'm a pretty smart guy and Idid well in school because I got
(24:15):
a, you know, a giant brain thiswork in recovery.
I had to learn that my bigbrain was actually an impediment
, sometimes that, as the IndigoGirls said, I'll think myself
into jail, you know.
(24:39):
So I had to learn that this isa different part of me, the
spirit and understanding how toconnect in the world in a way
that doesn't damage me anddoesn't damage those around me
needed a different part of me tobe engaged.
I was overusing one part part,and so that's really been the
(25:10):
work for me is to learn how totake the skills that God gave me
and to use them appropriately,as opposed to kind of overusing
the big brain.
The vision that I have is, youknow, I was kind of a lawyer
with one of those big yellowlegal pads taking notes and
somehow I came up with the ideathat if I could convince others
(25:34):
of my argument, that somehowthat made me right and what it
did is, it made me a goodsalesperson, but it didn't make
me any more right.
So it's been a journey of 15years since coming into recovery
(25:56):
.
What I have come to realize issomething that you mentioned on
this podcast that my addictionis not pornography.
Pornography was the medicinethat I took.
My addiction is an inability tobe uncomfortable, an inability
(26:18):
to deal with what's in front ofme, and so that's really my
journey.
Now is, how do I stay in themoment, how do I stay engaged?
How do I do the things thatwill not hurt me, not hurt the
world will add to the world.
(26:39):
If we're all in life schoolhere, how do I, how do I help
others through life school atthe same time as I'm making it
through?
Speaker 1 (26:53):
you know, I, before my, my near death, I always had
a calling of service, but andit's gonna have to do with what
you just mentioned in just amoment Um, but it was like more
(27:14):
ego centered um, to be honest.
And when we're smart in school,um, and we have all of these, I
would say gifts, because if wewere to be have to have born, be
born with, like, developmentaldelay or something you know, it
is what it is, so it's a gift.
I see it as a gift.
And how are you using that gift?
Let's just say I wasn't usingit the most appropriately.
(27:34):
And when we come into power andit doesn't matter, it could be
spiritual power, because onceyou have a higher understanding,
or it could be power in yourprofession, or it could be power
in your profession, or it couldbe power in your relationship.
So how we use power is verydelicate, because what I learned
in my near death is thatwhatever harm you do to others,
(27:54):
you're really doing it toyourself.
So it's a very delicate threadthere as to how we operate in
the world.
When I, when I crossed over, alot of what I had to deal with
was my own guilt and shame andjust myself, like judgment of
(28:18):
myself and my actions.
So it's really beautiful thatthere is not a person or a god
that will judge you.
In my personal experience, um,but it is myself.
So there's nowhere to run.
Even if you leave this realmthat you're, you're, it's right
(28:38):
here.
Right, it's consciousness.
So you got to deal with thatinner work.
Might as well do it here, whereyou're at right.
Might as well find that innerpeace, that inner love, that
inner wisdom, that compassion,that inner compass to kind of
guide you to make decisions thatfeel good to you without having
to putting all those layers.
(28:58):
And while in this map ofconsciousness I was able, when I
was downloading it, I was ableto tap into the collective
unconscious.
And a lot of what I found therewas sex addiction, pedophile
stuff like that.
But not judging it from thatpart, it is just we haven't
looked at it as a, as acollective, we haven't done the
(29:22):
work.
It's not good or bad 's, justis there.
And then how are we as ahumanity going to deal with that
right?
Are we going to continue thesex trafficking?
Are we going to continueabusing children like how?
Is that the path forward?
Is that how we see that thatwould lead us to a better world.
(29:43):
I'm'm not sure, you know thatdoesn't sound right to me.
So, really just questioningwhat is and how are we going to
do about it?
You could have decided to notdo the work and gone and gone in
a whole different direction,right?
So how are we using our freewill, our power?
Right, if you're?
in a place of power.
Most of the abuse comes fromfamily, from close family
(30:05):
parents, grandparents, you know,very close in the family.
So it's looking at that and I'mnot necessarily judging,
because who knows how they wereraised or who knows if they had
abuse, they're just carryingthis pattern, right.
So?
But if someone's coming acrossthis podcast or someone's in a
(30:26):
state of their life wherethey're bringing that
unconscious pattern, making itconscious, and you're aware that
you know, you always have theego, the super ego, which is
like, OK, this is right, this isnot right, this is my fantasy.
Should I actually carry it on?
Right?
So where?
Where is that balance?
(30:46):
Right?
So, just questioning yourselfagain, good questions,
questioning yourself how am Igoing to approach this up to how
far can I take this in my mindversus what am I going to act?
Actually act on you know?
And is that something that Iwant, a pattern that I want to
(31:08):
keep running in my unconsciousor subconscious mind, or do I
actually want to try to shiftand change?
because a lot of times, if youlive in this headspace, I feel
like it's hard to make realconnections like an intimacy
with people it's kind of likeyou can't fully connect because
no one's really going to fulfillthat fantasy anyway, like no
one's going to match it rightBecause it's not the common
(31:31):
relationship.
Let's just say so.
I feel it's an opportunity.
I see it as an opportunity forus to deal with it and to bring
it to light and to not make ittaboo.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
Like I don't really care.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
Maybe mean sex addiction, make it not taboo why
it's part of our lives, right,like if we keep putting it on
the rug, if we don't talk about,if there are no groups to deal
with this.
If there's, I mean it's, it'sgoing to, it's going to pop up
somewhere, I mean it is so, yeahwell in the environment that I
(32:09):
grew up in, I understood thatalcohol was dangerous.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
I understood that you know drinking and getting drunk
could be like a loaded gunRight, that addiction was a
possibility.
I also understood that drugswere bad, but nobody ever said
looking at pornography could beaddictive.
Nobody ever told me that.
Nobody ever told me that thiswas a dangerous, dangerous thing
(32:39):
that I was engaging with, andso I think you're right.
I love you.
Used the word ego there and Iso identified with you.
Said something about I had acalling to help, but it was ego
centered or something like that.
I so identify with that.
(33:03):
That, for me, ego thedefinition that I use is I am
attaching I to something that isnot I.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Wow Indentation for narrow pathways.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
One more time please.
The definition of ego that I useis I am attaching I to
something that is not I.
So it could be I am a goodfather, I am whatever I am.
That's what the bible refers toas the devil is, and that's
(34:02):
what is fighting my ability totruly, uh, be of help to myself
and everybody else on the planetis.
You know, maya angelou um had agreat analogy.
Oprah asked her her thoughts onwhat happened after she died
(34:22):
and she said I'm like a cup ofocean water.
When the cup breaks, the waterwill return to the ocean, and I
often use that, for, for me, egois thinking I'm the cup instead
of the ocean water that'spowerful.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
That's the same way I view it.
Yeah, it's the ebb and flow ofcreation, return to the source,
and then again energy justchanging form, right
Transforming.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Right and I find that I can have a lot more
compassion for others if Irealize that for me, I think of
it as all earth school and we'reall made of the same substance.
So perhaps this person is noton that lesson yet.
They're on whatever lessonthey're on, and it allows me to
(35:22):
give, to have a little morecompassion for them 100%.
The other thing that I wantedto bring up.
Do we have time to keep talking?
Speaker 1 (35:33):
We have time.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
I got until 9.30.
Speaker 1 (35:36):
Okay, yeah, we can do 930.
That's good.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
I mean the conversation's good so in my
mind.
I think of drugs as somethingthat feels good now but creates
damage long term.
So ice cream is a great examplefor me, because I love ice
(36:00):
cream.
I love it, it's delicious, itfeels good going down, but, boy,
I'm going to feel bad later.
I think of medicine as theopposite of drugs.
Medicine is something that maynot be pleasant in the near term
but is really beneficial in thelong term.
(36:21):
So it could be exercise, itcould be, and I think for me, a
big part of my journey isidentifying those things that
are quote unquote drugs in mylife.
Uh, social media sitting infront of the television.
(36:42):
Uh, doom scrolling on my phone.
Um, you know eating too manyoreo cookies.
Um, you know that they'rebringing me pleasure in the near
term, but they're really makinglife much harder over time.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yeah, you're just creating a huge medical bill at
the end, you know, putting yourhealth at stake, and I see that
playing out with my family.
So I feel like what a bravebunch of souls to come to
incarnate together to teach me,I mean and they're in their own
lessons too, right, but I takethe teaching of that right, like
(37:28):
to put themselves through thatto learn whatever it is that
they're there to learn.
But they're also teaching melike, okay, you still got time
to make some better choices here.
Okay, whether it comes tonutrition, to exercise, to
whatever it is, do it now, reapthe benefits later and you could
(37:51):
and exercise and all that stuff.
For me, I feel pretty goodright after doing it.
So I don't feel like you haveto wait so long.
Meditation, breath work, all ofthese things.
Yoga, right, what?
Going to the beach, evensomething so simple as that, um,
maybe doing a juice cleanse,whatever works for you.
Fasting for some people um, youhave so much more energy, focus
(38:13):
, clarity, like there are somany benefits to different
things.
You just have to find whatworks for you.
Like, if somebody like my wifeshe doesn't like yoga, I love
yoga, like she's, you know shelikes weight training, for
example.
I'm not a big weight trainerbut I love mobility and flow and
yoga and that kind of movement.
So I find what works for me,she finds what works for her.
(38:37):
Maybe we'll have a class wherewe kind of mix the two and kind
of compromise.
So find what works for you,maybe it's just a walk after
dinner, whatever, but but you'reI heard this somewhere, I can't
recall where, but I have neverforgotten it Fix your roof
before the hurricane comes.
(38:58):
In the middle of the hurricaneyou don't have time to go up to
the roof and fix it.
That's gone.
I don't even try to.
It's gone, it's gone.
I love that.
I love that Really.
Just, it really made an youknow an impact to me.
Like man, I'm at a time in mylife where and I've had health
issues which have forced me tochange my habits so fix the roof
(39:24):
now, when you're safe, when youdon't, the winds of the
hurricanes are not hitting you.
You can't fix it when you'regoing through cancer, when
you're going through.
I mean you could, but it'sgoing to be much harder.
You know what I mean.
Don't take much longer.
So, yeah, I just wanted to toshare that, that that we have
(39:44):
examples everywhere, even as asociety here in America the
overweight, the anxiety, thedepression, uh, since 2010 has
gone up over 50 somethingpercent, you know, admissions in
the ER for suicide attempts hasgone over 60%, so crazy, you
(40:07):
know.
Wow, yeah, so we have to starttaking some radical
responsibility for ourselves,for our life, for our own
healing journey.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
So, ms Rosita, can I throw out another idea?
Yeah, the study where they puta rat in a cage and they gave it
access to water, and then theygave it access to drugs, to
heroin I haven't heard aboutthat one, oh my gosh.
And the rat?
(40:37):
Can you imagine?
The rat becomes addicted toheroin.
And they did this experiment anumber of times and the rat
always becomes addicted toheroin, until a scientist came
along and said we're justputting a rat in a cage.
This is very depressing for therat.
This is not a normal scenariofor the rat.
(41:01):
And so he built a ratwonderland and he still offered
regular food and water andheroin, but he put a bunch of
rats in there.
So they had community, they hadengagement.
What happened?
The rats didn't become addictedto heroin.
(41:25):
And so I look at that inhumanity and I heard someone say
, relatively early in myrecovery journey they said you
know, a big part of the magic ofthe 12-step groups is that you
come in and there's a group ofpeople who just love you and
(41:49):
listen to you and whatever youspeak, at the end of the time
you're speaking, they say thankyou.
You're speaking, they say thankyou, that's all they say they
don't offer feedback, they don'toffer praise or criticism, just
thank you, I heard you.
And that this person said youknow, that's a big part of the
(42:11):
magic.
I was resistant to that idea,by the way, when I heard it, by
the way when I heard it.
But I have come to sincebelieve that human connection,
just loving and connecting withanother person, is, by itself,
magic.
You mentioned the word intimacyearlier and my wife and I, after
(42:36):
I began my own individualrecovery journey, we joined a
group for couples to recover andI heard someone in there say
intimacy into me.
You see, and I have to say,when I heard it it terrified me.
(42:56):
Heard it, it terrified me.
That was a horrible thingbecause I knew if anybody really
knew me they wouldn't love me.
That was the fear I lied to mywife because I thought if she
(43:22):
knew me, there's no way shewould stay with me.
And I have come to believe thatthat is learning how to let
other people in to see me.
Vulnerability AbsolutelyLearning how to be vulnerable
and learning how to receivevulnerability from others is
part of the healing of the worldthat I hope that we can all
participate in.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
Yeah, yeah, I mean that's so powerful, one sentence
after the other that you'resharing.
All of it is so full of wisdomand I feel a lot of people can
identify with it, because itdoesn't have to be sex or
alcohol or drugs or whateveryour addiction is.
There's plenty of addiction.
Maybe it's shopping, maybe it'sscrolling through your phone,
(44:05):
maybe it's caffeine.
I went through caffeineaddiction Really.
Yeah, I was drinking two RedBulls, two cups of coffee, and
that was like maybe three yearsago.
Yeah, it was one of the mostdifficult addictions to kind of.
(44:26):
You know, like.
I know it sounds weird and easy, but yeah it's.
It was difficult for me to tolet it go.
So it's interesting.
I of course I let it go after Istarted having health issues.
I let go of a lot of stuffbecause when, when you're
hospitalized and when you have adiagnosis where it's like, okay
(44:47):
, it's either this is going tokill me or I need to make
changes in my life, so you kindof make your choices right.
But yeah, it applies to anyaddiction, all the wisdom that
you're sharing.
So extremely grateful to haveyou here.
And also for couples I've beenwith my wife for 13 years, so of
(45:09):
course our relationship hasbeen through ups and downs.
Right, it's like a rollercoaster and it's falling in love
all over again with the newperson that she becomes.
That I become like.
Do you choose that person asshe is now, without wanting?
to change her, to change thatperson.
Um, and when you, when westarted what I call the inner
(45:30):
work in 2018, really sharing themonsters, if you want to call
it that, or your shadows, andreally allowing them to surface,
I think it's actually beautiful.
If that person is going to runor stay, I think it's.
You would want to know that man.
You know you don't want to staywith someone who, when your
(45:53):
worst comes out, is going to runon you.
I don't know.
You may want to reconsider thatRight.
worst comes out is going to runon you that I don't know.
You may want to reconsider thatright.
So I think it's beingvulnerable has.
Even if it's, let's just sayeven if it's.
Let's just put a scenario whereyou're with your wife and you
say, hey, I have this addictionto, to this fantasy or to this
(46:17):
sex or to this, whatever it is,and of course you can't share it
with her because you you feelyou know she's going to run,
she's not going to love me,whatever.
So what is the worst casescenario?
What would happen if you didshare it?
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Like what would happen?
Speaker 1 (46:29):
Would she run?
Would she work through it withyou?
Would you guys be able to findhelp?
Um, so you don't have to do italone.
It doesn't have to be your wife.
Maybe it's a group of peopleand a program designed for that.
Wherever you feel comfortable,to open up, but look for help
before you give up.
(46:50):
I know a lot of people who'vecommitted suicide and they've
left small children behind andit's very difficult for the
people that stay behind.
Speaker 2 (47:00):
Yeah.
So just look for help I wouldsay yes, I love that you have
said a mouthful.
There was a moment where I wascoming to grips with my own
addiction I had not shared itwith my wife yet and my
(47:26):
stepmother said she deserves tomake her own decision, that by
withholding information you aremaking the decision for her.
She deserves to have fullinformation and make the
decision for herself.
Speaker 1 (47:47):
Wow, that is heavy what you've just said.
Speaker 2 (47:51):
Just even if we're not technically lying,
withholding the information,that's a lot and that applies to
anything yeah, and I'm, I'm sothankful I I do believe that
because I have four childrenthat they, my four children
bought me probably six monthsworth of grace.
(48:13):
Yes, but I'm so happy that shechose to stay and work through
it with me, and there were manytimes when I would say, are you
going to stay?
And she would say I'm heretoday.
That's the.
That's the most I'm going topromise is I'm here today, you
(48:36):
know?
Do you know the Exodus storyfrom the Bible?
Speaker 1 (48:42):
No.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
The Jews are in slavery in Egypt and Moses comes
and says hey, god wants me tolead you out of slavery.
And eventually he gathers themup and they go through the Red
(49:04):
Sea and they go to the desertand they wander in the
wilderness for 40 years beforethey get to the promised land, a
land of milk and honey.
And I think of recovery much inthat same way.
It's out of slavery, butbetween slavery and the promised
(49:26):
land is the desert.
And there were many Israeliteswho grumbled and said you
brought us out here to thedesert to starve At least we had
food.
And slavery, let's go back.
Let's go back to slavery.
And so for us, in myrelationship with my wife, in my
own recovery, there absolutelyis struggle and discomfort.
(49:51):
It's not a straight line fromslavery to the promised land and
for me there absolutely was thetemptation to go back.
At least that's a devil that Iknow.
But I believe that the promisedland is the land of milk and
(50:13):
honey for a reason.
And the Israelites had to trustGod for manna.
He rained down manna one day ata time.
They couldn't store it up.
Very much like serenity, verymuch like trusting God one day
at a time.
I'm here today.
That's the best I've got.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Oh man, oh man, did you guys, did you?
If you're listening to this,does it feel peaceful to just
and safe to hear these words?
I hope you're really.
First of all, finish the entirepodcast because the amount of
(50:55):
wisdom we both shared it hasbeen because we've been through
it ourselves and we're speakingwith you guys from experience,
with an open heart thathopefully one word, one phrase
here can empower you to make apositive impact, a change in
your life.
That what you just said now andputting into stories, parables,
(51:23):
all that stuff.
There's a sweetness to thatbecause you can apply it to any
scenario of your life personal,professional, whatever it is.
It applies to everything right,Even just anchoring in your
roots, and that knowing rightthat you're always guided,
(51:45):
always supported, even if youcan't see it.
So thank you for sharing that.
That was deep.
Speaker 2 (51:52):
Thank you.
Thank you for making time andspace for me to be here with you
this morning.
I really, really appreciate itand I love and admire the work
that you're doing to make thisplanet better.
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (52:05):
Yeah, I am honored and I say the same thing to you.
Is there anything else you wantto leave the listeners with
before we hop off, and would youtell us if you want to share
what it is that you do and ifyou want to share where people
can contact you, you could dothat too.
You can self promote here atthe end if you want as well.
(52:29):
Your business, whatever it isthat you do, feel free.
If it's something you want toshare, up to you.
Speaker 2 (52:36):
I do not have anything to promote.
I export food to Latin America.
I represent US manufacturersinto Latin America, so there's
no promotion.
I also, in my spare time, coach, travel basketball because God
gave me much less athleticability than he gave me
(52:57):
competitive drive, so I've gotnothing to promote.
If people want to contact me,they can contact me.
Should I give my phone numberand email.
Speaker 1 (53:14):
No, we'll put an email down on the description
Beautiful.
Yeah, they can contact youthere All right.
Well, it's been an absolutepleasure for me, Andy.
I have learned tons from youand I hope to continue to learn
from you.
Thank you so, so much.
Speaker 2 (53:30):
Thank you so much for your time.
I really appreciate you too.
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