April 11, 2024 • 24 mins
Not only do the words we have on our website and in our social media bios matter, but also how we are showing up and chatting with our queer couples for their photos and on their wedding day.
In this episode, I give some practical tips for things that I actually say to my couples to keep things feeling gender-netural and a safe environment, please steal them if you find it helpful!
As always, thanks for listening! :)
The intro and all instrumentals were written, sung and recorded by @JaynaDavisMusic
Queerly Beloved, I'm so glad you joined!
Please keep the community going by checking me out on instagram @wildlyconnectedphoto and come say hi! I'd love to hear from you! :)
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Microphone (Yeti Stereo (00:00):
Weirdly beloved.
(00:01):
Welcome back to this week'sepisode.
I wish you all a good morning,afternoon or evening whenever
you're tuning in.
And hopefully you all arestarting to experience some of
the lovely spring that we arehaving.
My name is Ana.
I assure.
She her pronouns and I am theowner and photographer at wildly
(00:22):
connected photography.
My DMS are always open.
So if you are listening ortuning in, please feel free to
say hello.
Otherwise, if you're listeningon Spotify, I would love to, if
you would type out some of yourthoughts about this episode and.
Leave it in the fun littleSpotify interactive thing.
(00:45):
That is really professional ofme.
So this week's episode might bea little bit shorter and
honestly kind of came spur ofthe moment I had other plans,
but this has.
Been sort of on my mind for thepast couple of months.
Something that I've just.
Been thinking about andexperiencing and wanted to chat
(01:07):
about it.
Especially as I think.
It feels really relevant.
Just as.
I don't know.
I think since releasing the howto be LGBTQ affirming versus
LGBTQ friendly episode, which ifyou have not yet listened,
please have it back a fewepisodes and listen.
(01:27):
Honestly, probably one of myfavorite episodes to date,
because I think it's really,really important for all of us
to make that mental shift.
And.
I feel like it just really,really clicked in my brain, like
my own brain, even now justbeing able to like, Tell people
that that means it's a verb.
It's an action.
It's being active and activelyshowing up.
(01:50):
So.
I think.
It's even shifted my ownperspective on how I think about
things.
And that's kind of why I wantedto do this week's episode.
Because, like I've been sayingfor the past couple of weeks,
words matter and what we say andwhat we do.
And especially what we say theydo really matter.
(02:12):
And so.
If you've been an OJI listenerhave been listening from the
start.
And or have retroactively goneback and listen to early
episodes.
There is probably going to besome similarities here to some
of the episodes that I firstreleased.
I did two back to back episodesabout how to pose LGBTQ couples.
(02:35):
I did one that was sort of more,a couple of facing one that was
sort of more a photographerslash vendor facing.
And so there are probably goingto be some similarities here,
but.
I wanted to sort of do arefresher on that because I
think it's important.
And B.
Just talk a little bit moregenerally.
I think Because I think thelanguage and how we interact
(03:00):
with our LGBTQ couples andclients is super, super
important.
And honestly, I think this issomething that I see even for,
for photographers, who mighthave like the rainbow flag in
their bio or.
Who say that they are LGBTQfriendly, these things are
things that I think people don'tmay not even realize or are
(03:22):
doing it because they feel thatmaybe it's going to make the
experience better.
But honestly, it's just sort of.
Odd.
And so I just want to kind oftalk about our interactions,
like what we say, what we do.
During a session during awedding day.
And so for couples listening, Ido hope that you will stick
(03:43):
around.
I have some notes for you at theend.
But for a lot of photographersand other wedding vendors tuning
in.
Definitely turn on yourlistening ears.
So.
This concept is.
I think.
Been on my brain so much,because I think I've just
(04:04):
witnessed things.
And the past couple of monthsthat I'm just like, Ooh, like.
These things I don't think areever done with malicious intent.
Like it's not, they're notmalicious.
It doesn't make people badpeople or anything not extreme.
I think it's just sort of like,Ooh, that just sort of, Gave me
the echo a little bit.
(04:26):
And.
So I hope that this again is notlike, wow.
These demands.
I just keep coming and like, Ican never get things, right.
Like, no.
I think.
It's just important to like putit out there to acknowledge it.
Like, I don't know, calling itout even feels like maybe too
(04:48):
strong of a word, but.
Just to be like, Hey.
These things I know you'retrying, but it's just not quite
it.
And how can we do things alittle bit differently?
So I wanted to start out withsome examples, things that I've
seen, things that I hear about.
And a lot of this will be likeposing specific because I think
(05:09):
that's just a very like physicalmanifestation of these kinds of
things, but there are thingsbeyond posing as well.
The first one that comes to mindis.
I very often see you whenworking with other photographers
and, or.
Like photos on Pinterest or onInstagram, if there is a lesbian
(05:30):
couple or two people thatidentify as women.
And one of them happens to bewearing like pants and like a
button up or a suit or whatever.
Like just automatically from theget go, people are like, yes.
She's going to do the masculineposes and that's that.
And I just, no, that's just notit like.
(05:52):
I get that.
If they, as a couple aremirroring what you traditionally
see for other sessions, thenit's easy to jump into that.
But just because someone'swearing pants or a suit that
does not automatically mean thatthe entirety of their energy.
Is masculine or that the quoteunquote traditional manly poses.
(06:15):
We'll feel good for them.
Like, that's just.
I think it's a bold assumptionto think that a lesbian woman
wants to pose the same exact wayas a man.
Just saying.
And then another thing that Ifrequently see is just.
Oh, The absolute.
Fear that I see.
(06:36):
Sweep across some people's faceswhen they realize that maybe
there's two suits or maybe thosetwo dresses or something totally
different.
And they.
Go into panic mode because.
They're unsure of like what todo with people that are wearing
two of the same thing, you know,traditionally they're like, oh,
(06:57):
well, Usually I do this poselike this because it shows off
the dress, but if there's nodress and like, what do I do?
And.
You know what, like, if youhaven't yet had this experience,
I'm not coming at you.
Like that's great.
Please go find some experienceslike practice and learn and look
at Pinterest and things likethat.
(07:19):
But I think just the panic thatoccurs of like, oh my God, like.
There's two people wearingsuits.
Like what do I even do?
Like what, what do I even showoff?
Right.
Cause I think.
Yeah, that concept goes back tolike my my episode all about.
The word bride and how there'sso much emphasis put on the word
bride.
And if there's not address,present, It's like people freak
(07:41):
out and you can see like theconfusion and the panic.
And so I would just say like,Look at Pinterest.
Talk to people.
Yeah.
I'm jumping ahead of myself.
Cause I'm, I'm going to givesome examples of how to move
past these things coming up.
But.
Another thing that.
(08:02):
Maybe some of you may think thatthis is a little bit mean for me
to say, but it's something thatI, myself and my partner have
personally witnessed andexperience.
Her.
And I have modeled for folks aswell as just like done other
photo shoots and.
I think something that we'veexperienced that.
(08:23):
Just doesn't feel quite right aswhen people just try too hard.
And I know that may sound harsh,but.
Sometimes people will show upwith this energy of like, oh,
well, these two are gay.
So like, that's how I'm going tolike present during this.
The session of like, I don't, Idon't know exactly how to
(08:46):
eloquently put it into words,but it's sort of like, As if
they were to show up to asession with us, just like slay
queen, oh, work at girl, likethat kind of thing.
We've definitely experiencedthat.
And it's just like, That's notus.
Like for us personally, that'snot our energy.
And like, We've never been likeupset or mad at someone who's
(09:08):
done that.
Right?
Like we see that they're tryingto connect that.
They're trying to, you know,make a, a fun environment for
us.
And that's great.
And we do appreciate that, but.
It's also just like notauthentic to us.
And it just gives us like alittle bit of the egg, like.
I promise you don't have to trythat hard.
(09:29):
Like you don't have to.
Sort of like put us in that boxalmost like for some people that
might truly be true andauthentic to them.
And, and if you pick up on thatenergy, like run with it,
please, by all means.
But it's just not the case foreverybody.
And so.
You know, bring.
Kindness into your session,bring good energy like, and you
(09:52):
can bring energy.
But it doesn't have to be sortof that like, Stereotypical
energy that I think peoplesometimes bring when they
realize that they're working orinteracting with someone queer.
So I think really just like, becool.
Be chill.
It's all good.
(10:12):
Unless it starts to feel like.
What you're envisioning isreally authentic to the couple.
Think.
That there are so many moreexamples, but those are just a
few.
And I did also want to notethat.
Honestly, like some of this.
Applies to how I see.
Photographers in particularinteracting with straight
(10:34):
couples too, right?
Like.
I think that I'm so deep intothis world and into this mindset
now that seeing photographers dothis as straight couples, like
also makes me feel a little bitweird, honestly, like.
I think if we can shift how wethink about things, it will have
(10:54):
a really, really positive impacton just like.
The industry in general and alsojust the world.
Right.
Of like, there are so many timeswhen I'm with photographers and
there's a straight couple andit's just like, so automatically
right off the bat, like.
Okay.
There's a man and a woman.
So we're going to have the manlike lead the woman.
(11:16):
We're going to have the man pickup the woman.
We're going to have the mantwirl.
Like, it's just very like rightoff the bat.
Putting you into you into boxesand that's that.
Honestly.
Yeah.
How many times can I say itgives me the egg in this
episode, but.
I mean, really, like we neverknow either too, right.
Like, just because it's a manand a woman.
(11:36):
We don't know, like one or bothof them could be part of the
community and they're justpresenting as a straight couple.
And they might really, reallyappreciate if you didn't have
the, do those stereotypical manand woman poses, like they might
really, really appreciate justdoing things more neutrally.
So.
I think the message here isthat.
Just.
(11:58):
Thinking about.
Our interactions and how we'reinteracting with our queer
couples, which often means doingthings.
A little bit more neutrally, butalso.
Really understanding the couplesdynamics like that is going to
be so, so good for any couple.
(12:19):
And I feel like just willenhance.
The experience for couplesacross the board.
Again, I know that this islikely going to have some
overlap with an older episode,but I just felt it was really,
really important to refresh usall on this subject.
Which is why I wanted to justshare some of the practical
things that I do during mysessions.
(12:40):
And.
If these sound good to like,please steal them, steal them,
take them, do, do what you willwith them because.
I think it's really, reallyimportant.
And I.
I have tried to work hard tomake my sessions feel like a
really safe experience and feelauthentic to the couple.
(13:01):
So one of the first things thatI do with a session is just
laying out the ground rules.
And I'm sure so many of you dothat.
But I think it's really, reallyimportant to say like, Hey, if I
say something that doesn't feelgood or authentic to you.
Or if I like make a suggestionof something we should do or try
(13:21):
and you're like, actually no,like that really, it doesn't
feel like us.
That feels a little bit weird.
Like.
Let them know it's okay.
Like.
It's a safe space and they'reallowed to say no, if they feel
uncomfortable.
And I think just making thatabundantly clear because
sometimes.
Couples are a little bit shy or.
(13:42):
If they're like me, they'reafraid of sounding me in or
anything like that.
And just being like, Hey, truly.
It's okay.
It's no big deal.
If you don't want to trysomething.
That's okay.
Like just making that really,really clear.
Because I also think we oftenforget what it's like to be in
front of the camera and couplesare often really nervous to be
(14:05):
in front of the camera.
So.
You know, they might just bedoing whatever you say, because
I think that's just how it isand that's how it goes.
And they don't know that there'san option to do something
differently.
Right.
So.
I always start my sessions withthat.
And then now I am going to givesome specific examples here,
but.
Just like across the board, likeso many things I say in this
(14:27):
podcast, just keeping itneutral, like starting with a
very neutral mindset, a neutralframework.
And then personalizing it basedon the couple because really
like.
The only time I'm ever like veryspecifically, like.
Why this person needs to dothis.
(14:48):
And this person in the coupleneeds to do that is like, If I
want to try a pose that's heightdependent, and then it's, you
know, You're not assuming like,oh, This person's going to stand
in the back because they're moremasculine.
It's like, Hey, I have this ideafor a post, but like, Hey, since
you're a little bit taller, likeit's going to work better.
(15:11):
If you see it in the back.
Like, even that I think.
Shifting that sort of languagecan be really, really helpful.
Practically speaking again, likeI said, I hope.
That some of this is helpful andthat you can steal these and try
these in your own sessions.
But.
There's something about thelike, Leading photos that I
(15:34):
think they're super cute.
Like I definitely take them.
Cause I think they're fun andcute.
And especially if in your, likea big, wide open naturey area,
like it just, yeah, I'mrambling, but.
I always start with, Hey, what'dyou do to tends to be more late.
And then they'll answer andwhoever is usually late or more
(15:57):
behind.
They going back and theirpartner goes in front.
Like that's how we determine it.
So I think the cool thing aboutthis is that you can make the
sessions like more fun and likea little bit of a game almost
too.
And it's really fun too, becausethat enhances the experience for
(16:18):
the couple to write.
Like I mentioned, because.
Then they have this fun littleconversation.
Sometimes they sort of playargue and they're like, oh,
well, I don't know.
Sometimes you're late.
And it becomes like, it makes itfun.
And it makes sort of a littlesmall memory for the couple to.
Another thing I do is if we'redoing something.
(16:39):
Just for an example, visually,like if there's a Ben tune,
you're going to have one of themsit and maybe the other is going
to stand behind them.
Just ask them like, which of youwants to sit and which of you
wants to stand and let themdetermine that.
Another thing that I do.
Instead of being like, Hey,John.
(16:59):
You.
pull in Jake.
I will be like, Hey, who wouldit feel more natural for this to
happen?
Like, if I am picturing a, aphoto where one of them is kind
of pulling the other end for akiss, I'm like, Who would it
feel more natural for this tohappen?
Like who do you think would dothis?
(17:21):
And then they're kind of like,usually they're both like, oh
yeah, like I will do this.
And it just you're like, oh,okay, cool.
Like, Maybe I want to guess thatmaybe I would have, I don't
know, but you're asking them andit gets them really, really
involved and.
Feel like they're collaboratingin the process too.
You can say, how would younormally greet each other when
(17:41):
you come home from work?
Would either of you ever spin ortwirl or pick up the other, like
you're asking them questions.
And it gives them permission tobe like, Yeah, and this is how
we're going to do it.
And then they'll just do it.
Or they might say like, no, thatthat's not something we really
want to do or feels like.
(18:03):
Part of how we expressourselves.
And that's great.
You ask the question and youmove on.
And I think like I miss all ofthese things that can feel more
personalized.
Just continue to do things thatare super neutral, right?
Like, I don't think there'salways a need for there to be a
ton of photos where there's.
(18:26):
I again, I don't know how toeloquently say it, but almost
where you can see thetraditional gender roles.
You know, things like holdinghands.
Things like kissing things, likeputting your foreheads together
or rubbing noses, like so manyof those things that can be
super, super neutral, like makesure to sprinkle in lots of that
(18:46):
too, because.
That'll just help things, keepthings neutral and.
Also, they're just cute.
So.
Yeah, those are some things thatI do in my sessions.
I think really, really, reallythe mentality to have is ask
them questions.
And like the fun part is, isthat you learn so much about
(19:06):
them.
By asking these questions.
And this goes beyondphotographers too.
Like planners Flores vendors,like ask them questions.
I will say that until the end oftime asking questions.
We'll give you a really, reallygood understanding of how to
interact and treat eachindividual couple.
Cause that's such a beautifulthing about the queer community
(19:28):
too, right?
Is that we're all so differentand how our relationships
present are also different.
And not to say that that's nottrue within straight
relationships.
I believe that there isbeautiful.
Diversity there as well, butthere's just so many more
dynamics present and it'sreally, really cool to get to
learn about a couple in thisway.
(19:49):
And so.
For the couples who have stuckwith us and listened.
If there are things that youhave experienced in sessions or
while planning your wedding.
Please, let me know.
I would love to be able to sharewith other people, some things
that you've experienced and howwe can.
Make those better or moreneutral experiences.
(20:09):
But I think this is just mymessage to you to hopefully
remind and empower you.
To speak up.
If you feel that a photographeror a vendor.
It's sort of cornering you orputting you into a box like.
Please let us know.
I know that's sometimes easiersaid than done, but.
It's it's our job like.
(20:31):
We are carrying your love storyin our hands.
If it sounds very dramatic, butlike for this, this time, when
you're planning a wedding orkind of putting your love on
more display for the world tosee like, We are carrying that
and we want to do that well Andso.
(20:51):
I think it can look like, youknow, before an engagement
session, letting yourphotographer know, like, Hey.
We don't really want to do anypictures of us, like picking the
other up or in talking to othervendors, just like, you know
what, like.
A lot of the traditional likequote unquote broad or quote
unquote groom roles, just likedon't really apply to us.
(21:13):
And.
We would love to just like showup as ourselves and not feel
like we have to do certainthings just because of our names
or pronouns.
Like.
I know that can be really hardand scary to say.
But hopefully if you're workingwith the right people, they will
hear you and receive that well,and.
Be able to carry that energygoing forward.
(21:35):
So.
Yeah, I'm just encouraging mereally to as best as you can
speak up for yourselves or.
You know, have your friends orfamily help you with that too?
Because.
Yeah, how, how we speak to thecommunity and interact with the
community is so important.
So.
Clearly beloved.
Thank you so much for tuning inand for listening.
(21:57):
Again, I do know.
That this has some repeatedthemes from earlier episodes,
but I think it's really, reallyimportant to be reminded of
this.
And to be reminded that likegoing into 20, 24 and like the
upcoming busy wedding season,like.
There are so many things that wecan be doing.
To make our LGBTQ plus clientsfeel more safe.
(22:21):
And things that we should becarrying over into every wedding
and how we interact and treatcouples that.
We'll hopefully have a greaterripple effect on the entire
wedding industry and just like.
Basically encourage the industryto be more neutral and ask more
questions.
I think that's, that's reallythe goal here.
(22:42):
So.
If you ever have any questionsabout.
More things that you could besaying or doing or trying during
your sessions or in, when you'reinteracting with clients and
couples.
Please don't hesitate to reachout.
I'm always happy to chat aboutit.
And always just happy to chatand say hello to any of you.
(23:02):
So clearly beloved have anamazing.
Morning day evening, and I willsee you next week.
Weirdly beloved.
(00:01):
Welcome back to this week'sepisode.
I wish you all a good morning,afternoon or evening whenever
you're tuning in.
And hopefully you all arestarting to experience some of
the lovely spring that we arehaving.
My name is Ana.
I assure.
She her pronouns and I am theowner and photographer at wildly
(00:22):
connected photography.
My DMS are always open.
So if you are listening ortuning in, please feel free to
say hello.
Otherwise, if you're listeningon Spotify, I would love to, if
you would type out some of yourthoughts about this episode and.
Leave it in the fun littleSpotify interactive thing.
(00:45):
That is really professional ofme.
So this week's episode might bea little bit shorter and
honestly kind of came spur ofthe moment I had other plans,
but this has.
Been sort of on my mind for thepast couple of months.
Something that I've just.
Been thinking about andexperiencing and wanted to chat
(01:07):
about it.
Especially as I think.
It feels really relevant.
Just as.
I don't know.
I think since releasing the howto be LGBTQ affirming versus
LGBTQ friendly episode, which ifyou have not yet listened,
please have it back a fewepisodes and listen.
(01:27):
Honestly, probably one of myfavorite episodes to date,
because I think it's really,really important for all of us
to make that mental shift.
And.
I feel like it just really,really clicked in my brain, like
my own brain, even now justbeing able to like, Tell people
that that means it's a verb.
It's an action.
It's being active and activelyshowing up.
(01:50):
So.
I think.
It's even shifted my ownperspective on how I think about
things.
And that's kind of why I wantedto do this week's episode.
Because, like I've been sayingfor the past couple of weeks,
words matter and what we say andwhat we do.
And especially what we say theydo really matter.
(02:12):
And so.
If you've been an OJI listenerhave been listening from the
start.
And or have retroactively goneback and listen to early
episodes.
There is probably going to besome similarities here to some
of the episodes that I firstreleased.
I did two back to back episodesabout how to pose LGBTQ couples.
(02:35):
I did one that was sort of more,a couple of facing one that was
sort of more a photographerslash vendor facing.
And so there are probably goingto be some similarities here,
but.
I wanted to sort of do arefresher on that because I
think it's important.
And B.
Just talk a little bit moregenerally.
I think Because I think thelanguage and how we interact
(03:00):
with our LGBTQ couples andclients is super, super
important.
And honestly, I think this issomething that I see even for,
for photographers, who mighthave like the rainbow flag in
their bio or.
Who say that they are LGBTQfriendly, these things are
things that I think people don'tmay not even realize or are
(03:22):
doing it because they feel thatmaybe it's going to make the
experience better.
But honestly, it's just sort of.
Odd.
And so I just want to kind oftalk about our interactions,
like what we say, what we do.
During a session during awedding day.
And so for couples listening, Ido hope that you will stick
(03:43):
around.
I have some notes for you at theend.
But for a lot of photographersand other wedding vendors tuning
in.
Definitely turn on yourlistening ears.
So.
This concept is.
I think.
Been on my brain so much,because I think I've just
(04:04):
witnessed things.
And the past couple of monthsthat I'm just like, Ooh, like.
These things I don't think areever done with malicious intent.
Like it's not, they're notmalicious.
It doesn't make people badpeople or anything not extreme.
I think it's just sort of like,Ooh, that just sort of, Gave me
the echo a little bit.
(04:26):
And.
So I hope that this again is notlike, wow.
These demands.
I just keep coming and like, Ican never get things, right.
Like, no.
I think.
It's just important to like putit out there to acknowledge it.
Like, I don't know, calling itout even feels like maybe too
(04:48):
strong of a word, but.
Just to be like, Hey.
These things I know you'retrying, but it's just not quite
it.
And how can we do things alittle bit differently?
So I wanted to start out withsome examples, things that I've
seen, things that I hear about.
And a lot of this will be likeposing specific because I think
(05:09):
that's just a very like physicalmanifestation of these kinds of
things, but there are thingsbeyond posing as well.
The first one that comes to mindis.
I very often see you whenworking with other photographers
and, or.
Like photos on Pinterest or onInstagram, if there is a lesbian
(05:30):
couple or two people thatidentify as women.
And one of them happens to bewearing like pants and like a
button up or a suit or whatever.
Like just automatically from theget go, people are like, yes.
She's going to do the masculineposes and that's that.
And I just, no, that's just notit like.
(05:52):
I get that.
If they, as a couple aremirroring what you traditionally
see for other sessions, thenit's easy to jump into that.
But just because someone'swearing pants or a suit that
does not automatically mean thatthe entirety of their energy.
Is masculine or that the quoteunquote traditional manly poses.
(06:15):
We'll feel good for them.
Like, that's just.
I think it's a bold assumptionto think that a lesbian woman
wants to pose the same exact wayas a man.
Just saying.
And then another thing that Ifrequently see is just.
Oh, The absolute.
Fear that I see.
(06:36):
Sweep across some people's faceswhen they realize that maybe
there's two suits or maybe thosetwo dresses or something totally
different.
And they.
Go into panic mode because.
They're unsure of like what todo with people that are wearing
two of the same thing, you know,traditionally they're like, oh,
(06:57):
well, Usually I do this poselike this because it shows off
the dress, but if there's nodress and like, what do I do?
And.
You know what, like, if youhaven't yet had this experience,
I'm not coming at you.
Like that's great.
Please go find some experienceslike practice and learn and look
at Pinterest and things likethat.
(07:19):
But I think just the panic thatoccurs of like, oh my God, like.
There's two people wearingsuits.
Like what do I even do?
Like what, what do I even showoff?
Right.
Cause I think.
Yeah, that concept goes back tolike my my episode all about.
The word bride and how there'sso much emphasis put on the word
bride.
And if there's not address,present, It's like people freak
(07:41):
out and you can see like theconfusion and the panic.
And so I would just say like,Look at Pinterest.
Talk to people.
Yeah.
I'm jumping ahead of myself.
Cause I'm, I'm going to givesome examples of how to move
past these things coming up.
But.
Another thing that.
(08:02):
Maybe some of you may think thatthis is a little bit mean for me
to say, but it's something thatI, myself and my partner have
personally witnessed andexperience.
Her.
And I have modeled for folks aswell as just like done other
photo shoots and.
I think something that we'veexperienced that.
(08:23):
Just doesn't feel quite right aswhen people just try too hard.
And I know that may sound harsh,but.
Sometimes people will show upwith this energy of like, oh,
well, these two are gay.
So like, that's how I'm going tolike present during this.
The session of like, I don't, Idon't know exactly how to
(08:46):
eloquently put it into words,but it's sort of like, As if
they were to show up to asession with us, just like slay
queen, oh, work at girl, likethat kind of thing.
We've definitely experiencedthat.
And it's just like, That's notus.
Like for us personally, that'snot our energy.
And like, We've never been likeupset or mad at someone who's
(09:08):
done that.
Right?
Like we see that they're tryingto connect that.
They're trying to, you know,make a, a fun environment for
us.
And that's great.
And we do appreciate that, but.
It's also just like notauthentic to us.
And it just gives us like alittle bit of the egg, like.
I promise you don't have to trythat hard.
(09:29):
Like you don't have to.
Sort of like put us in that boxalmost like for some people that
might truly be true andauthentic to them.
And, and if you pick up on thatenergy, like run with it,
please, by all means.
But it's just not the case foreverybody.
And so.
You know, bring.
Kindness into your session,bring good energy like, and you
(09:52):
can bring energy.
But it doesn't have to be sortof that like, Stereotypical
energy that I think peoplesometimes bring when they
realize that they're working orinteracting with someone queer.
So I think really just like, becool.
Be chill.
It's all good.
(10:12):
Unless it starts to feel like.
What you're envisioning isreally authentic to the couple.
Think.
That there are so many moreexamples, but those are just a
few.
And I did also want to notethat.
Honestly, like some of this.
Applies to how I see.
Photographers in particularinteracting with straight
(10:34):
couples too, right?
Like.
I think that I'm so deep intothis world and into this mindset
now that seeing photographers dothis as straight couples, like
also makes me feel a little bitweird, honestly, like.
I think if we can shift how wethink about things, it will have
(10:54):
a really, really positive impacton just like.
The industry in general and alsojust the world.
Right.
Of like, there are so many timeswhen I'm with photographers and
there's a straight couple andit's just like, so automatically
right off the bat, like.
Okay.
There's a man and a woman.
So we're going to have the manlike lead the woman.
(11:16):
We're going to have the man pickup the woman.
We're going to have the mantwirl.
Like, it's just very like rightoff the bat.
Putting you into you into boxesand that's that.
Honestly.
Yeah.
How many times can I say itgives me the egg in this
episode, but.
I mean, really, like we neverknow either too, right.
Like, just because it's a manand a woman.
(11:36):
We don't know, like one or bothof them could be part of the
community and they're justpresenting as a straight couple.
And they might really, reallyappreciate if you didn't have
the, do those stereotypical manand woman poses, like they might
really, really appreciate justdoing things more neutrally.
So.
I think the message here isthat.
Just.
(11:58):
Thinking about.
Our interactions and how we'reinteracting with our queer
couples, which often means doingthings.
A little bit more neutrally, butalso.
Really understanding the couplesdynamics like that is going to
be so, so good for any couple.
(12:19):
And I feel like just willenhance.
The experience for couplesacross the board.
Again, I know that this islikely going to have some
overlap with an older episode,but I just felt it was really,
really important to refresh usall on this subject.
Which is why I wanted to justshare some of the practical
things that I do during mysessions.
(12:40):
And.
If these sound good to like,please steal them, steal them,
take them, do, do what you willwith them because.
I think it's really, reallyimportant.
And I.
I have tried to work hard tomake my sessions feel like a
really safe experience and feelauthentic to the couple.
(13:01):
So one of the first things thatI do with a session is just
laying out the ground rules.
And I'm sure so many of you dothat.
But I think it's really, reallyimportant to say like, Hey, if I
say something that doesn't feelgood or authentic to you.
Or if I like make a suggestionof something we should do or try
(13:21):
and you're like, actually no,like that really, it doesn't
feel like us.
That feels a little bit weird.
Like.
Let them know it's okay.
Like.
It's a safe space and they'reallowed to say no, if they feel
uncomfortable.
And I think just making thatabundantly clear because
sometimes.
Couples are a little bit shy or.
(13:42):
If they're like me, they'reafraid of sounding me in or
anything like that.
And just being like, Hey, truly.
It's okay.
It's no big deal.
If you don't want to trysomething.
That's okay.
Like just making that really,really clear.
Because I also think we oftenforget what it's like to be in
front of the camera and couplesare often really nervous to be
(14:05):
in front of the camera.
So.
You know, they might just bedoing whatever you say, because
I think that's just how it isand that's how it goes.
And they don't know that there'san option to do something
differently.
Right.
So.
I always start my sessions withthat.
And then now I am going to givesome specific examples here,
but.
Just like across the board, likeso many things I say in this
(14:27):
podcast, just keeping itneutral, like starting with a
very neutral mindset, a neutralframework.
And then personalizing it basedon the couple because really
like.
The only time I'm ever like veryspecifically, like.
Why this person needs to dothis.
(14:48):
And this person in the coupleneeds to do that is like, If I
want to try a pose that's heightdependent, and then it's, you
know, You're not assuming like,oh, This person's going to stand
in the back because they're moremasculine.
It's like, Hey, I have this ideafor a post, but like, Hey, since
you're a little bit taller, likeit's going to work better.
(15:11):
If you see it in the back.
Like, even that I think.
Shifting that sort of languagecan be really, really helpful.
Practically speaking again, likeI said, I hope.
That some of this is helpful andthat you can steal these and try
these in your own sessions.
But.
There's something about thelike, Leading photos that I
(15:34):
think they're super cute.
Like I definitely take them.
Cause I think they're fun andcute.
And especially if in your, likea big, wide open naturey area,
like it just, yeah, I'mrambling, but.
I always start with, Hey, what'dyou do to tends to be more late.
And then they'll answer andwhoever is usually late or more
(15:57):
behind.
They going back and theirpartner goes in front.
Like that's how we determine it.
So I think the cool thing aboutthis is that you can make the
sessions like more fun and likea little bit of a game almost
too.
And it's really fun too, becausethat enhances the experience for
(16:18):
the couple to write.
Like I mentioned, because.
Then they have this fun littleconversation.
Sometimes they sort of playargue and they're like, oh,
well, I don't know.
Sometimes you're late.
And it becomes like, it makes itfun.
And it makes sort of a littlesmall memory for the couple to.
Another thing I do is if we'redoing something.
(16:39):
Just for an example, visually,like if there's a Ben tune,
you're going to have one of themsit and maybe the other is going
to stand behind them.
Just ask them like, which of youwants to sit and which of you
wants to stand and let themdetermine that.
Another thing that I do.
Instead of being like, Hey,John.
(16:59):
You.
pull in Jake.
I will be like, Hey, who wouldit feel more natural for this to
happen?
Like, if I am picturing a, aphoto where one of them is kind
of pulling the other end for akiss, I'm like, Who would it
feel more natural for this tohappen?
Like who do you think would dothis?
(17:21):
And then they're kind of like,usually they're both like, oh
yeah, like I will do this.
And it just you're like, oh,okay, cool.
Like, Maybe I want to guess thatmaybe I would have, I don't
know, but you're asking them andit gets them really, really
involved and.
Feel like they're collaboratingin the process too.
You can say, how would younormally greet each other when
(17:41):
you come home from work?
Would either of you ever spin ortwirl or pick up the other, like
you're asking them questions.
And it gives them permission tobe like, Yeah, and this is how
we're going to do it.
And then they'll just do it.
Or they might say like, no, thatthat's not something we really
want to do or feels like.
(18:03):
Part of how we expressourselves.
And that's great.
You ask the question and youmove on.
And I think like I miss all ofthese things that can feel more
personalized.
Just continue to do things thatare super neutral, right?
Like, I don't think there'salways a need for there to be a
ton of photos where there's.
(18:26):
I again, I don't know how toeloquently say it, but almost
where you can see thetraditional gender roles.
You know, things like holdinghands.
Things like kissing things, likeputting your foreheads together
or rubbing noses, like so manyof those things that can be
super, super neutral, like makesure to sprinkle in lots of that
(18:46):
too, because.
That'll just help things, keepthings neutral and.
Also, they're just cute.
So.
Yeah, those are some things thatI do in my sessions.
I think really, really, reallythe mentality to have is ask
them questions.
And like the fun part is, isthat you learn so much about
(19:06):
them.
By asking these questions.
And this goes beyondphotographers too.
Like planners Flores vendors,like ask them questions.
I will say that until the end oftime asking questions.
We'll give you a really, reallygood understanding of how to
interact and treat eachindividual couple.
Cause that's such a beautifulthing about the queer community
(19:28):
too, right?
Is that we're all so differentand how our relationships
present are also different.
And not to say that that's nottrue within straight
relationships.
I believe that there isbeautiful.
Diversity there as well, butthere's just so many more
dynamics present and it'sreally, really cool to get to
learn about a couple in thisway.
(19:49):
And so.
For the couples who have stuckwith us and listened.
If there are things that youhave experienced in sessions or
while planning your wedding.
Please, let me know.
I would love to be able to sharewith other people, some things
that you've experienced and howwe can.
Make those better or moreneutral experiences.
(20:09):
But I think this is just mymessage to you to hopefully
remind and empower you.
To speak up.
If you feel that a photographeror a vendor.
It's sort of cornering you orputting you into a box like.
Please let us know.
I know that's sometimes easiersaid than done, but.
It's it's our job like.
(20:31):
We are carrying your love storyin our hands.
If it sounds very dramatic, butlike for this, this time, when
you're planning a wedding orkind of putting your love on
more display for the world tosee like, We are carrying that
and we want to do that well Andso.
(20:51):
I think it can look like, youknow, before an engagement
session, letting yourphotographer know, like, Hey.
We don't really want to do anypictures of us, like picking the
other up or in talking to othervendors, just like, you know
what, like.
A lot of the traditional likequote unquote broad or quote
unquote groom roles, just likedon't really apply to us.
(21:13):
And.
We would love to just like showup as ourselves and not feel
like we have to do certainthings just because of our names
or pronouns.
Like.
I know that can be really hardand scary to say.
But hopefully if you're workingwith the right people, they will
hear you and receive that well,and.
Be able to carry that energygoing forward.
(21:35):
So.
Yeah, I'm just encouraging mereally to as best as you can
speak up for yourselves or.
You know, have your friends orfamily help you with that too?
Because.
Yeah, how, how we speak to thecommunity and interact with the
community is so important.
So.
Clearly beloved.
Thank you so much for tuning inand for listening.
(21:57):
Again, I do know.
That this has some repeatedthemes from earlier episodes,
but I think it's really, reallyimportant to be reminded of
this.
And to be reminded that likegoing into 20, 24 and like the
upcoming busy wedding season,like.
There are so many things that wecan be doing.
To make our LGBTQ plus clientsfeel more safe.
(22:21):
And things that we should becarrying over into every wedding
and how we interact and treatcouples that.
We'll hopefully have a greaterripple effect on the entire
wedding industry and just like.
Basically encourage the industryto be more neutral and ask more
questions.
I think that's, that's reallythe goal here.
(22:42):
So.
If you ever have any questionsabout.
More things that you could besaying or doing or trying during
your sessions or in, when you'reinteracting with clients and
couples.
Please don't hesitate to reachout.
I'm always happy to chat aboutit.
And always just happy to chatand say hello to any of you.
(23:02):
So clearly beloved have anamazing.
Morning day evening, and I willsee you next week.
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