July 25, 2023 • 26 mins
For many people, Social Security will be their primary income source in retirement, but some individuals have sufficient assets or income from other sources, making them less dependent on Social Security benefits.
James explains the factors that can affect when you should collect Social Security and how to create a dynamic strategy.
Questions Answered:
What if you have sufficient assets/ income that you don't depend on Social Security for your retirement needs?
How should that change your approach to collecting social security?
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
2:36 If you don't need Social Security
5:40 First thing to look at
7:48 Listener's situation
10:11 Working in retirement
12:50 The second thing to look at
14:30 The third thing to look at
15:44 The fourth thing to look at
17:15 Examples
20:18 Needing cash down the line
24:49 Final thoughts
25:22 Outro
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
For many people, social security will be their
primary income source inretirement.
They're only income source, butcertainly their primary source.
But what if that's not the casefor you?
What if you have sufficientassets or sufficient income
outside of social security suchthat you don't depend upon those
benefits for your retirementneeds?
That's the case.
How should that change yourapproach to collecting social
(00:21):
security?
Well, that and more is whatwe'll be discussing on today's
episode of Ready for Retirement.
This is another episode ofReady for Retirement.
I'm your host, james Cannell,and I'm here to teach you how to
get the most out of life withyour money.
And now on to the episode.
It's fair to say that socialsecurity is a pretty important
(00:41):
component of just abouteverybody's retirement plan.
However, the extent to whichyou depend upon those benefits
or you have other assets orincome sources to supplement
those benefits in large part iswhat's going to drive your
decision as to when you shouldcollect and how you can most
effectively capture that andincorporate those benefits into
your plan.
In today's episode it's goingto be based upon a listener
(01:02):
question.
This question comes from Isana,and Isana says quick question,
but just says we're 59 and 62and we are retired.
We don't need social security.
However, should we take it nowversus take it later?
Also, what do we do when weneed cash and we're in a down
market?
So pretty short, pretty sweet?
That's entirely the question.
Thank you, isana, forsubmitting that, but it's
(01:23):
important because, as I said,for some people they retire and
if social security is your onlyincome source, you really don't
have any other option but tocollect it right then.
However, if you retire and youdo have other assets, other
income sources, then you have alittle bit more flexibility as
to when you do collect socialsecurity, and the decision to do
(01:43):
so should depend upon a fewfactors of which we're going to
be going through today together.
Before we jump in, as always, Ilike to highlight the review of
the week.
Thank you to all of you whohave taken the time to do so,
but it really means quite a bitto me and it helps a lot of
other people to find the show.
This review comes from usernameLove and Neezer, and Love and
Neezer gives the show 5 starsand the review says there are
(02:05):
dozens of retirement podcastsout there.
I've listened to a ton of them.
Ready for retirement is far andaway the best.
James is a gifted educator.
He chooses relevant topics andpresents often complex
information in a remarkablyclear and concise manner.
Well worth your time to listen.
Thanks, james, for a wealth ofvery useful information.
Love and Neezer, thank you verymuch.
I always smile real big when Iget reviews like that.
(02:26):
So thank you for taking thetime to do so and please, if
you've enjoyed the show andyou've gotten value from it,
please take a quick moment toleave a 5 star review so that
more people can find the show aswell.
So with that, let's jump in.
And as we're talking about whenshould you collect social
security if you happen to be ina situation where you don't
necessarily need it?
Here's what you shouldn't do.
(02:46):
Most people do one of twothings.
On the one hand, they'll sayyou know what tomorrow's not
guaranteed, take it now.
And while there's some truth tothat advice, if you are just
looking at from that standpoint,oftentimes you just tend to be
rationalizing an inability todelay gratification.
Or maybe it's not an inabilityto delay gratification, but it
(03:08):
is an inability to think forwardinto the future, to think about
yourself at 70 and 80 andbeyond, and it becomes a very
short sided decision and I'llget pushback on that.
Sometimes People say well, james, what if I die at 65?
And they'll use that as the beall end, all reason and
justification to collect early.
Well, if you die at 65, it'scertainly a tragedy, but the
(03:31):
tragedy here is a life cut short.
The tragedy is not gosh, Icould have collected social
security for three years and Ididn't.
You're not going to be on yourdeath bed and massively
regretting the fact that youmissed out on all those dollars
that you otherwise could havecollected.
So, yes, there is truth to this.
And if you knew for certainthat you were going to die at 65
, then yes, take social securityas soon as you can, because the
(03:55):
numbers and the odds are inyour favor that you're
definitely going to get more outof it than you would if you
delayed the problem.
None of us actually have anyidea how long we're going to
live.
And to add on to that, I've metwith many people who are in
their 70s, who are in their 80s.
They collected as soon as theycould because of the same
rationalization Tomorrow's notguaranteed.
Take what you can when you canand leave it at that.
(04:17):
And that felt real good forsome time.
But then, later on in life,once that social security
benefit didn't stretch quite asfar because of inflation and
because it exhausted their otherresources.
They look back with profoundregret that they collected so
early and ended up sabotagingtheir future.
So that's people on the onehand.
Now, on the other hand, I've metwith a lot of other people or
(04:38):
talked to a lot of other peoplewho say you know what your
benefits max out of age 70,.
Therefore, it only makes senseto collect age 70.
Well, that too may be the wrongapproach, especially if, by
delaying your benefits until 70,you convinced yourself that you
need to work a job you don'twant to be working at until that
point.
Now here's the thing For somepeople, collecting at age 62
(04:59):
might be best, for other people,waiting until 70 might be best,
and for still others, somewherein between might be best.
But the reason or the goal ofthis conversation is to help you
understand what are the actualfactors you should be looking at
to determine that decision, asopposed to just looking at it
from the standpoint of take itas soon as you can, as fast as
you can, because we don't knowwhat's guaranteed in the future,
(05:20):
or, on the other hand, wait aslong as possible in all
situations, therefore delayingmuch of your benefit.
So, if those are the wrong waysto approach this decision,
what's the right way?
Well, there's a number of thingsthat you want to look at.
Put to start, here's the firstthing that you want to do.
You want to start with anaccurate comparison.
So the first thing that you'redoing is you're looking at the
(05:42):
numbers of it.
What makes most sense, what'sgoing to put the most cumulative
dollars into your pocket, basedupon some set of assumptions
we're making, one of which, ofcourse, is how long you're going
to live?
So when you look at this, here'swhat most people do.
They look at what would yourbenefit be if you collected at
age 62, and they project thatout for say, 20, 30 plus years.
And they say what would yourcumulative benefit be if you
(06:04):
collect at age 67 or 70?
And they project that out 20,30 years.
And what they're looking for iswhat's called a break even
point.
So if you collect earlier, it'sa lower benefit, but you have
more years of collecting.
So it initially favors you.
Because you're collectingearlier, your cumulative benefit
is larger than otherwise wouldhave been if you delayed
(06:25):
benefits and collected zero forsome time, versus if you wait
all the way until 70, forexample.
Well, now your monthly benefitis much larger, but you've only
collected it for a shorterperiod of time.
So what you start to look at isyou're looking for what's
called a break even point.
At what point does it make moresense to collect at 70?
Because, yes, you've collectedfor fewer years, but because
(06:46):
it's a higher amount, it's nowexceeded the total dollars that
you put in your pocket bycollecting early.
Well, when you look at that,depending on which ages you're
comparing, you might get a breakeven point somewhere around age
80 or 81.
So conventional wisdom saysthis.
It says look, if you're goingto retire, if you think you're
going to live past the age of 81, well then you delay your
(07:07):
benefit, you want to maximizethat, what that monthly benefit
would be, and, yes, you're goingto collect for fewer years, but
if you live at least until age81, you're going to have
sufficient cumulative benefitsto offset what you could have
collected by collecting earlier.
Now, that's right to an extent.
If you're just looking at thatin a vacuum and you're only
(07:28):
looking at the social securitynumbers, that analysis is right
your break even point somewherebetween age 80 or 81 or
thereabouts is true.
You can look it up, you canmake an Excel sheet.
There's nothing wrong aboutthat, until you start to
understand that that doesn'ttake into account other factors,
primary of which is opportunitycost.
(07:48):
Let's take a look at Isana'ssituation, to use her as an
example.
And now, granted, I don'tactually know how much she has
in her portfolio, but what I doknow is she says that she and
her husband don't need socialsecurity.
So either they have a pensionthat's covering all their basic
needs or they have a portfoliothat's covering all their basic
needs.
For a second, I'm going toassume that they have a
portfolio that's covering alltheir basic needs, to the extent
(08:11):
that they don't need socialsecurity.
Well, let's look at hersituation.
If she and her husband were towait to collect social security
at age 70, instead of collectingage 62, they're in a position
to do so.
But where's income going tocome from between ages 62 and
age 70?
Well, it would come from theirportfolio.
They'd have to draw thatportfolio down, even if their
(08:32):
portfolio could support it.
They are drawing down assets tolive on.
Well, what's the opportunitycost of these extra dollars they
spent by pulling money fromtheir portfolio between 62 and
70 that otherwise could havecontinued growing.
So it's not as if you can justwait until 17 has no other
impact on the rest of your plan.
(08:52):
It means you're either you'reworking longer, you're saving
less, you're drawing down yourportfolio more.
There are trade-offs to doingso.
So when we factor in thoseopportunity costs and when you
look at the fact that collectingearly means your portfolio
can't keep growing more than itotherwise would have, well, then
all of a sudden the break-evenpoint is pushed out several
(09:13):
years.
It does depend upon what rateof return can you get from your
investments.
If you're getting no rate ofreturn on your investments, then
it hasn't changed thatbreak-even point at all.
But if you're getting apositive rate of return, the
higher that rate of return, themore it pushes out that
break-even age.
And From there it's notunrealistic to think that the
new break-even age is somewherein your mid to late 80s or even
(09:35):
beyond.
But again, it does come back towhat rate of return could you
get on your assets that youotherwise would have been
drawing down.
So that's where I'd start.
You have to look at thisaccurately.
Don't just look at it to sayokay the decision comes down to
am I gonna live to 80 or 81 orbeyond, or am I gonna die before
that?
You have to understand theaccurate break-even, which is
(09:56):
dependent upon your specificfactors, like your other income
sources, your assets.
Are you continuing to work ornot?
It really does depend on yoursituation.
From there, here's what I thenlook at an Isana situation to
make the ultimate decision.
Number one is do either of youintend to work at all?
Why I ask this is even thoughyou don't need income.
(10:18):
It sounds like Isana from whatyou've told me in your question.
Some people they retire and thenthey get bored and they say you
know what, I'm gonna go startdoing something part-time, and
part-time turns into full-timeand before you know it they're
working and earning a lot ofmoney again.
Or some people retire and theysay you know, I'm gonna do some
consulting work or maybe justtinker on the side, creating
this thing.
That really then turns into amuch bigger thing.
(10:40):
Then they originally thought itcould be now, if that's the
case, that's great.
But here's the thing If you'recollecting social security and
you're under full retirement age, then the limit of how much you
can earn before social securitystarts withholding some
benefits for 2023 is 21,240dollars.
After that point, every twodollars you earn above that
(11:03):
threshold, social securitywithholds one dollar of benefits
.
Now it, to an extent, gets paidback or does get paid back at a
later date.
But what you are doing isyou're locking in a lower
benefit and maybe shouldn't haveotherwise done that.
So if you think there's a goodchance that you will go back to
work before your full retirementage, which in this case is
gonna be age 67, then it mightmake sense to withhold or not
(11:25):
take benefits yet.
Now you could always file forbenefits, and I've done this
with clients before where theyfiled for benefits.
They've collected six months,eight months, ten months goes by
and they say, oh geez, Iactually am earning income that
I did not anticipate I wouldearn.
Social security does allow youto pay back those benefits and
essentially act as if you neverfiled, and then there's no
earnings test that you have toworry about.
(11:46):
So if you know for certainyou're not gonna work, then it
would be okay to collectbenefits before full retirement
age.
If you think there's a strongchance you will work and that
any income from that work isgoing to exceed the earnings
limit.
Well then it might make senseto delay collecting until you're
not working anymore.
One other side note on thisthat's important to understand
is this is specific to theindividual.
(12:08):
So let's assume that he saw onour spouse they both retire and
he saw me goes back to work, buther husband stays retired.
Well, he saw no, it be subjectto the earnings limit.
She couldn't earn more thantwenty one thousand two hundred
and forty dollars without hersocial security being penalized,
assuming she was collectingbenefits.
But her husband could, becausehe's not working in this
instance.
So it's not looking at yourjoint income, it is looking at
(12:30):
you specifically in any incomethat you are responsible for.
And another thing to note isthis only applies to wages.
So if you have a pension orinvestment income or rental
income, that type of incomedoesn't count against this
earnings limit.
It's really just earned incomethat is going to count against
that.
So a couple important things tonote with that.
(12:50):
The second thing I look at whendetermining when to collect
social security if you don'tneed the money is still
longevity.
So regardless of whether youneed the money or not, you still
want to look at it from theframework of what's going to
help me maximize the impact ofthese dollars within my
financial plan or within myfinancial strategy.
So a big factor of that, maybethe biggest factor in that, is
(13:10):
longevity, as we talked about,there's a break-even point and
while I disagree with the waypeople typically talk about that
break-even point, I absolutelyagree that you need to factor in
a break-even point and thatbreak-even point should factor
in outside details likeopportunity cost.
So if you're looking at thisand saying, okay, I really don't
need these social securitybenefits, but I'm in really poor
(13:31):
health, my spouse is in reallypoor health, we don't have a
family history of longevity.
We probably don't have thatlong to live.
That's a pretty compellingreason to collect social
security early Versus Isan.
I'm going to pick on you againor use you as an example.
Let's assume you and yourspouse are in wonderful health
and you say you know what myparents both lived until the
late 90s.
I even had an aunt that livedto 100.
(13:52):
You start looking at it fromthat standpoint.
Well, you probably, if you'rein good health and have family
history of good health andlongevity, it probably makes
more sense to consider pushingthat age back.
So your longevity is still acrucial factor in deciding when
should you collect socialsecurity, but make sure that
you're looking at it from theright standpoint of what's the
true break-even age for yourspecific situation.
(14:14):
Hey everyone, it's me again forthe Disclaimer.
Please be smart about this.
Before doing anything, pleasebe sure to consult with your tax
planner or financial planner.
Nothing in this podcast shouldbe construed as investment, tax,
legal or other financial advice.
It is for informationalpurposes only.
The third thing I'd look at whenconsidering when to collect
benefits is do you have anychildren under the age of 19
(14:36):
that are still in school?
If so, well, that may seemfully irrelevant.
If so, you can get additionalsocial security benefits.
So social security willactually pay you more if you're
of social security age andyou're collecting benefits.
If you have a child that'sunder 19 and they're still in
school full time, you're gettingextra benefits.
So what does that do?
(14:57):
Well, this goes back into thatbreak-even calculation and
pushes the break-even age outeven further, because now, by
collecting early, not only isthere not a negative opportunity
cost by having to take morefrom your investments, but now
there's actually more income, atleast in those initial months
or years, from doing so.
So when you're looking atsocial security, there's not
(15:18):
just your benefit.
There's your benefit that'sbased on your earnings record
and that's called your primaryinsurance amount, and that's
what you're eligible for at yourfull retirement age, which is
between ages 66 and 67.
Now, on top of that, there'sspousal benefits, there's
survivor benefits, there'schildren's benefits, there's all
kinds of other benefits, andyou do need to be aware of how
(15:38):
this would impact you and yourpotential strategy, or your best
strategy for when you shouldcollect your social security.
Then the fourth thing ispreferences.
Now, this is not mutuallyexclusive, but, for example, if
I were to present you with twooptions, one of which is
maximizing guaranteed income andthe other is leaving money to
kids or heirs, which do youprefer, Okay?
(16:00):
So your initial thought mightbe James, what on earth do those
have to do with social security?
Well, if you chose the formerof hey, I would really want to
maximize guaranteed income.
Well then the best way to dothat is you delay your social
security benefit and if youcollect at 70, there's a
guaranteed income source that'sfully maximized.
It's the highest level that youcan get from social security.
(16:20):
So now, at age 70, in additionto having a good portfolio or
pension, you have a few thousandextra guaranteed dollars coming
in per month.
So if you're looking at yoursituation and want that extra
guarantee, that's a prettyattractive option.
Now what if, instead, you saidyou know what, I don't
necessarily care about moremaximized guaranteed income, but
I do really care about leavingmoney to heirs or leaving money
(16:43):
to kids or whoever it might be?
Well, if you collect socialsecurity early and put that
money into a growth-orientedinvestment account because,
remember, we're assuming thatyou don't necessarily need those
dollars in this situation Wellthen all of a sudden, that money
, if you need it, it's stillyours, but if you don't, then it
passes to the kids.
So keep this in mind.
(17:04):
Many people think of socialsecurity as an investment.
How do I maximize my investmenthere?
But social security is not aninvestment.
It is intentionally designed asinsurance or as a social safety
net.
Let's take a look at an exampleto compare this.
Let's assume that you have aterm life insurance policy.
Well, if you have a term lifeinsurance policy and a thousand
other people have that sameexact term life insurance policy
(17:26):
, then even if everyone's payingthe same exact premium, not
everyone is going to receiveequal benefits.
By design, most people won'tget as much out of their policy
as they put into it.
Assume it's a 20-year term lifeinsurance policy.
You paid premiums for 20straight years.
Most people will get nothingout because they'll still be
alive after 20 years and thedeath benefit won't ever pay out
(17:48):
.
So you might pay your premiumfor 20 years, 30 years and then
stop.
There's no return on investmentversus you.
Compare that to someone whomaybe only paid their premium
for four years or five years butthen they died.
Well, their errors will getsignificantly more from the
insurance company than they everpaid in.
Now, that's how it's designed.
It's insurance that's designedto be an investment.
(18:10):
So when you're looking at socialsecurity, understand that it's
from the same standpoint.
It's insurance.
It's old age insurance.
If you get old and don't havemoney the longer you live,
there's a social safety netaccording to the design that
will help you meet your needs.
Or even if you paid a ton ofmoney into social security but
you passed away before the ageof 62, you don't get any
(18:31):
benefits.
Now your survivor might, butyou personally don't get any.
If your spouse also dies beforethat age, then all that money
it essentially goes poof.
And it doesn't go poof.
It's still there, but it'spaying out other people, it's
not going back to you.
So if you wait until 70,thinking you're maximizing your
investment, but then you dieright at 70, well then your
(18:52):
non-spouse heirs don't getanything.
Yes, your spouse will getspousal benefits, but your
children if you're trying tomaximize something for them,
they won't continue to get yourbenefits, regardless of how much
you've paid in.
Now, if you want social securityto be more like an investment,
then you could view it as such.
But what you would have to dois you'd have to start
collecting early and then takethat income and then invest that
(19:16):
income into something else thatyou could pass on to your heirs
.
So you collect at 62, forexample, you get a couple
thousand dollars per month.
You could direct deposit thatright to an investment account,
have it invested, and now if youpass away at 70 or whenever you
pass away, it's not as if yourbenefit ceases.
Your ongoing benefit certainlyceases, but whatever you've
(19:37):
accrued in that account that canpass on to heirs.
So when I say that, the fourthconsideration comes down to
preferences, this is what I mean.
Would you rather maximize yourguaranteed income?
Well, if so, wait until 70versus.
Would you prefer to leave moremoney to kids or to heirs,
regardless of when you pass?
Well, in that case, I may bemore inclined to say collect
(20:00):
earlier, because you could starttaking money out of the system,
putting it into a differentinvestment account, which is
still fully available to you ifyou need it, but if not, that's
money that can pass to the nextgeneration.
So neither is right nor wrong,but more comes down to your
personal preferences and whatyou're trying to accomplish with
your plan.
And then, finally, the last partof Isana's question.
(20:20):
She says also what do we dowhen we need cash and we're in a
down market?
Now, this may seem like it hasnothing to do with the rest of
the question, but it actuallydoes.
Now, whether you are or aren'tcollecting social security, the
goal is still the same.
The goal, and what I'drecommend is don't sell your
stock or be in a position whereyou don't have to sell your
stock investments when they'redown in value.
(20:41):
Now how do you do this?
You could have cash set asidethat you live on during a bear
market, you could have a bondallocation in your portfolio
that you live on in a bearmarket, or you could live off of
other income sources.
Here's how this ties into thesocial security decision.
Let's assume and again I have noidea how much Isana has in her
portfolio.
I don't know she has anythingin her portfolio.
(21:02):
It could be a pension or rentalincome that she's living on.
But for a second, let's assumethat her expenses again I'm
making this up, this is not fromher question let's assume her
expenses are $6,000 per monthand she and her husband have
$1.8 million in their portfolio.
Well, if they collect 4% peryear of their $1.8 million
portfolio, that covers exactlythe $6,000 per month, or $72,000
(21:26):
per year.
So that specific example, orthis specific example, could be
an example of how she doesn'tquote unquote need social
security.
However, it would still benefitand we can see that right here.
So let's assume again, they'retaking $6,000 per month from
your $1.8 million portfolio, butthen the market drops and they
don't have cash to live on.
Let's assume they don't have abond allocation to live on and
(21:48):
they don't want to have to selltheir stock investments.
Well, what do they do in thissituation?
Well, one thing they could do.
Let's assume they are both 62at this point, but they both
turned on social security.
I don't know what their socialsecurity benefits would be, but
let's just assume that each ofthem are eligible for $2,000 per
month.
Well, now, all of a sudden,they have $4,000 per month
coming in.
That's not dependent upon theirinvestments, but they still
(22:11):
want to live on $6,000 per month.
Well, the remaining $2,000,that's what would need to come
from their portfolio.
Now, $2,000 per month or $24,000per year, if you divided that
by their portfolio value of $1.8million in this example, now,
all of a sudden, that representsa 1.3% withdrawal rate.
When you look at that, you'dsay, oh James, well, they still
(22:31):
have to take out 1.3% of theirportfolio.
Doesn't that mean they stillhave to sell 1.3% of their
stocks?
Well, no, because ideally andagain, this depends on how
you're invested but even just abasic stock portfolio, assuming
it's well-diversified, should beyielding more than that, just
in dividend income.
So dividends alone, they're notmaking you sell any of your
(22:51):
stocks, and that income alonecould supplement social security
in this situation.
And if you're in that position,then a down market all of a
sudden does not have as much ofan impact on you as otherwise
would have.
If you still need to come upwith that 4% or 5%, or whatever
your withdrawal rate is, to meetthe entirety of your needs.
Now you could say, james,wouldn't it be great to reinvest
(23:12):
those dividends when themarket's going down?
Sure, but at some point there'swhat's financially right and
there's what actually makessense for us.
We don't want to delay spendingdown our portfolio because of
the bear market.
Or do we just want to live ondividends and call today and not
be too concerned if we're notreinvesting those for maximum
profit over time?
So sure, it would be great toreinvest those dividends, but as
(23:34):
long as you could just live onthose dividends and not have to
sell your stock, well then whatthat means is that's giving you
the income necessary withouthaving to sell stocks in a down
market.
So we saw in this question thatyou do have of.
What do we do in a down market?
Well, the same thing that you'dalways do try not to sell
investments that are down insocial security, or turning on
(23:55):
social security could be one wayin which you do this.
And another thing that thisbrings up just a quick side note
is what this question shows isthat your social security
strategy should be dynamic.
For example, I might haveclients that retire at 60 and
we'll map out their plan andtheir income strategy.
We say, okay, here's what we'regoing to live on from 60 to 67.
(24:15):
And 67 comes around that's whenit makes most sense for you to
collect social security.
And we look at it and wedetermine that's their social
security strategy, what we'renot locked into, that that's not
set in stone and something thatcan't possibly deviate, because
what we're doing is we'regauging their portfolio each
year and we might run into ascenario where we say, look,
inflation in down markets, it'sjust putting too much pressure
(24:39):
on your portfolio to have tosupport all of your needs
between 60 and 67.
And while we thought that 67would be the ideal age, what
we're seeing now I'm using thisas a hypothetical, not saying
this is a recommendation toeveryone, but what we're seeing
now is maybe one or maybe bothof you actually collect social
security earlier than weoriginally anticipated.
So, yes, have a strategy foryour social security, but don't
(25:02):
be afraid to revisit that eachyear, based on what's happening
in the market, what's happeningwith inflation, what's happening
with your spending, what'shappening with your assets, your
other income sources.
This can and should besomething that you're at least
revisiting once a year to see ifit still makes most sense to do
so.
So that is all I have fortoday's episode.
Isana, thank you very much forthat question.
(25:22):
I hope that answered yourquestion or at least gave you
good framework to think through,and for all of you other
listeners.
I appreciate you taking thetime to tune in.
I hope that was helpful for youas well.
If you've not already done so,please leave a review for the
show if you're enjoying thiscontent, and if you've not
already done so, be sure tocheck us out on YouTube under
channel name root financial.
We can find this podcast thatwe're doing right now, and you
(25:43):
can find other great contentabout how to create a better,
more meaningful retirement andto help you get the most out of
life with your money.
So that is it for today.
Thank you for listening andI'll see you next time.
Thank you for listening toanother episode of the ready for
retirement podcast.
If you want to see how rootfinancial can help you implement
the techniques I discussed thispodcast, then go to
(26:04):
rootfinancialpartnerscom andclick start here, where you can
schedule a call to one of ouradvisors.
We work with clients all overthe country and we love the
opportunity to speak with youabout your goals and how we
might be able to help.
And please remember, nothing wediscuss on this podcast is
intended to serve as advice.
You should always consult afinancial, legal or tax
professional who's familiar withyour unique circumstances
(26:25):
before making any financialdecisions.
For many people, social security will be their
primary income source inretirement.
They're only income source, butcertainly their primary source.
But what if that's not the casefor you?
What if you have sufficientassets or sufficient income
outside of social security suchthat you don't depend upon those
benefits for your retirementneeds?
That's the case.
How should that change yourapproach to collecting social
(00:21):
security?
Well, that and more is whatwe'll be discussing on today's
episode of Ready for Retirement.
This is another episode ofReady for Retirement.
I'm your host, james Cannell,and I'm here to teach you how to
get the most out of life withyour money.
And now on to the episode.
It's fair to say that socialsecurity is a pretty important
(00:41):
component of just abouteverybody's retirement plan.
However, the extent to whichyou depend upon those benefits
or you have other assets orincome sources to supplement
those benefits in large part iswhat's going to drive your
decision as to when you shouldcollect and how you can most
effectively capture that andincorporate those benefits into
your plan.
In today's episode it's goingto be based upon a listener
(01:02):
question.
This question comes from Isana,and Isana says quick question,
but just says we're 59 and 62and we are retired.
We don't need social security.
However, should we take it nowversus take it later?
Also, what do we do when weneed cash and we're in a down
market?
So pretty short, pretty sweet?
That's entirely the question.
Thank you, isana, forsubmitting that, but it's
(01:23):
important because, as I said,for some people they retire and
if social security is your onlyincome source, you really don't
have any other option but tocollect it right then.
However, if you retire and youdo have other assets, other
income sources, then you have alittle bit more flexibility as
to when you do collect socialsecurity, and the decision to do
(01:43):
so should depend upon a fewfactors of which we're going to
be going through today together.
Before we jump in, as always, Ilike to highlight the review of
the week.
Thank you to all of you whohave taken the time to do so,
but it really means quite a bitto me and it helps a lot of
other people to find the show.
This review comes from usernameLove and Neezer, and Love and
Neezer gives the show 5 starsand the review says there are
(02:05):
dozens of retirement podcastsout there.
I've listened to a ton of them.
Ready for retirement is far andaway the best.
James is a gifted educator.
He chooses relevant topics andpresents often complex
information in a remarkablyclear and concise manner.
Well worth your time to listen.
Thanks, james, for a wealth ofvery useful information.
Love and Neezer, thank you verymuch.
I always smile real big when Iget reviews like that.
(02:26):
So thank you for taking thetime to do so and please, if
you've enjoyed the show andyou've gotten value from it,
please take a quick moment toleave a 5 star review so that
more people can find the show aswell.
So with that, let's jump in.
And as we're talking about whenshould you collect social
security if you happen to be ina situation where you don't
necessarily need it?
Here's what you shouldn't do.
(02:46):
Most people do one of twothings.
On the one hand, they'll sayyou know what tomorrow's not
guaranteed, take it now.
And while there's some truth tothat advice, if you are just
looking at from that standpoint,oftentimes you just tend to be
rationalizing an inability todelay gratification.
Or maybe it's not an inabilityto delay gratification, but it
(03:08):
is an inability to think forwardinto the future, to think about
yourself at 70 and 80 andbeyond, and it becomes a very
short sided decision and I'llget pushback on that.
Sometimes People say well, james, what if I die at 65?
And they'll use that as the beall end, all reason and
justification to collect early.
Well, if you die at 65, it'scertainly a tragedy, but the
(03:31):
tragedy here is a life cut short.
The tragedy is not gosh, Icould have collected social
security for three years and Ididn't.
You're not going to be on yourdeath bed and massively
regretting the fact that youmissed out on all those dollars
that you otherwise could havecollected.
So, yes, there is truth to this.
And if you knew for certainthat you were going to die at 65
, then yes, take social securityas soon as you can, because the
(03:55):
numbers and the odds are inyour favor that you're
definitely going to get more outof it than you would if you
delayed the problem.
None of us actually have anyidea how long we're going to
live.
And to add on to that, I've metwith many people who are in
their 70s, who are in their 80s.
They collected as soon as theycould because of the same
rationalization Tomorrow's notguaranteed.
Take what you can when you canand leave it at that.
(04:17):
And that felt real good forsome time.
But then, later on in life,once that social security
benefit didn't stretch quite asfar because of inflation and
because it exhausted their otherresources.
They look back with profoundregret that they collected so
early and ended up sabotagingtheir future.
So that's people on the onehand.
Now, on the other hand, I've metwith a lot of other people or
(04:38):
talked to a lot of other peoplewho say you know what your
benefits max out of age 70,.
Therefore, it only makes senseto collect age 70.
Well, that too may be the wrongapproach, especially if, by
delaying your benefits until 70,you convinced yourself that you
need to work a job you don'twant to be working at until that
point.
Now here's the thing For somepeople, collecting at age 62
(04:59):
might be best, for other people,waiting until 70 might be best,
and for still others, somewherein between might be best.
But the reason or the goal ofthis conversation is to help you
understand what are the actualfactors you should be looking at
to determine that decision, asopposed to just looking at it
from the standpoint of take itas soon as you can, as fast as
you can, because we don't knowwhat's guaranteed in the future,
(05:20):
or, on the other hand, wait aslong as possible in all
situations, therefore delayingmuch of your benefit.
So, if those are the wrong waysto approach this decision,
what's the right way?
Well, there's a number of thingsthat you want to look at.
Put to start, here's the firstthing that you want to do.
You want to start with anaccurate comparison.
So the first thing that you'redoing is you're looking at the
(05:42):
numbers of it.
What makes most sense, what'sgoing to put the most cumulative
dollars into your pocket, basedupon some set of assumptions
we're making, one of which, ofcourse, is how long you're going
to live?
So when you look at this, here'swhat most people do.
They look at what would yourbenefit be if you collected at
age 62, and they project thatout for say, 20, 30 plus years.
And they say what would yourcumulative benefit be if you
(06:04):
collect at age 67 or 70?
And they project that out 20,30 years.
And what they're looking for iswhat's called a break even
point.
So if you collect earlier, it'sa lower benefit, but you have
more years of collecting.
So it initially favors you.
Because you're collectingearlier, your cumulative benefit
is larger than otherwise wouldhave been if you delayed
(06:25):
benefits and collected zero forsome time, versus if you wait
all the way until 70, forexample.
Well, now your monthly benefitis much larger, but you've only
collected it for a shorterperiod of time.
So what you start to look at isyou're looking for what's
called a break even point.
At what point does it make moresense to collect at 70?
Because, yes, you've collectedfor fewer years, but because
(06:46):
it's a higher amount, it's nowexceeded the total dollars that
you put in your pocket bycollecting early.
Well, when you look at that,depending on which ages you're
comparing, you might get a breakeven point somewhere around age
80 or 81.
So conventional wisdom saysthis.
It says look, if you're goingto retire, if you think you're
going to live past the age of 81, well then you delay your
(07:07):
benefit, you want to maximizethat, what that monthly benefit
would be, and, yes, you're goingto collect for fewer years, but
if you live at least until age81, you're going to have
sufficient cumulative benefitsto offset what you could have
collected by collecting earlier.
Now, that's right to an extent.
If you're just looking at thatin a vacuum and you're only
(07:28):
looking at the social securitynumbers, that analysis is right
your break even point somewherebetween age 80 or 81 or
thereabouts is true.
You can look it up, you canmake an Excel sheet.
There's nothing wrong aboutthat, until you start to
understand that that doesn'ttake into account other factors,
primary of which is opportunitycost.
(07:48):
Let's take a look at Isana'ssituation, to use her as an
example.
And now, granted, I don'tactually know how much she has
in her portfolio, but what I doknow is she says that she and
her husband don't need socialsecurity.
So either they have a pensionthat's covering all their basic
needs or they have a portfoliothat's covering all their basic
needs.
For a second, I'm going toassume that they have a
portfolio that's covering alltheir basic needs, to the extent
(08:11):
that they don't need socialsecurity.
Well, let's look at hersituation.
If she and her husband were towait to collect social security
at age 70, instead of collectingage 62, they're in a position
to do so.
But where's income going tocome from between ages 62 and
age 70?
Well, it would come from theirportfolio.
They'd have to draw thatportfolio down, even if their
(08:32):
portfolio could support it.
They are drawing down assets tolive on.
Well, what's the opportunitycost of these extra dollars they
spent by pulling money fromtheir portfolio between 62 and
70 that otherwise could havecontinued growing.
So it's not as if you can justwait until 17 has no other
impact on the rest of your plan.
(08:52):
It means you're either you'reworking longer, you're saving
less, you're drawing down yourportfolio more.
There are trade-offs to doingso.
So when we factor in thoseopportunity costs and when you
look at the fact that collectingearly means your portfolio
can't keep growing more than itotherwise would have, well, then
all of a sudden the break-evenpoint is pushed out several
(09:13):
years.
It does depend upon what rateof return can you get from your
investments.
If you're getting no rate ofreturn on your investments, then
it hasn't changed thatbreak-even point at all.
But if you're getting apositive rate of return, the
higher that rate of return, themore it pushes out that
break-even age.
And From there it's notunrealistic to think that the
new break-even age is somewherein your mid to late 80s or even
(09:35):
beyond.
But again, it does come back towhat rate of return could you
get on your assets that youotherwise would have been
drawing down.
So that's where I'd start.
You have to look at thisaccurately.
Don't just look at it to sayokay the decision comes down to
am I gonna live to 80 or 81 orbeyond, or am I gonna die before
that?
You have to understand theaccurate break-even, which is
(09:56):
dependent upon your specificfactors, like your other income
sources, your assets.
Are you continuing to work ornot?
It really does depend on yoursituation.
From there, here's what I thenlook at an Isana situation to
make the ultimate decision.
Number one is do either of youintend to work at all?
Why I ask this is even thoughyou don't need income.
(10:18):
It sounds like Isana from whatyou've told me in your question.
Some people they retire and thenthey get bored and they say you
know what, I'm gonna go startdoing something part-time, and
part-time turns into full-timeand before you know it they're
working and earning a lot ofmoney again.
Or some people retire and theysay you know, I'm gonna do some
consulting work or maybe justtinker on the side, creating
this thing.
That really then turns into amuch bigger thing.
(10:40):
Then they originally thought itcould be now, if that's the
case, that's great.
But here's the thing If you'recollecting social security and
you're under full retirement age, then the limit of how much you
can earn before social securitystarts withholding some
benefits for 2023 is 21,240dollars.
After that point, every twodollars you earn above that
(11:03):
threshold, social securitywithholds one dollar of benefits
.
Now it, to an extent, gets paidback or does get paid back at a
later date.
But what you are doing isyou're locking in a lower
benefit and maybe shouldn't haveotherwise done that.
So if you think there's a goodchance that you will go back to
work before your full retirementage, which in this case is
gonna be age 67, then it mightmake sense to withhold or not
(11:25):
take benefits yet.
Now you could always file forbenefits, and I've done this
with clients before where theyfiled for benefits.
They've collected six months,eight months, ten months goes by
and they say, oh geez, Iactually am earning income that
I did not anticipate I wouldearn.
Social security does allow youto pay back those benefits and
essentially act as if you neverfiled, and then there's no
earnings test that you have toworry about.
(11:46):
So if you know for certainyou're not gonna work, then it
would be okay to collectbenefits before full retirement
age.
If you think there's a strongchance you will work and that
any income from that work isgoing to exceed the earnings
limit.
Well then it might make senseto delay collecting until you're
not working anymore.
One other side note on thisthat's important to understand
is this is specific to theindividual.
(12:08):
So let's assume that he saw onour spouse they both retire and
he saw me goes back to work, buther husband stays retired.
Well, he saw no, it be subjectto the earnings limit.
She couldn't earn more thantwenty one thousand two hundred
and forty dollars without hersocial security being penalized,
assuming she was collectingbenefits.
But her husband could, becausehe's not working in this
instance.
So it's not looking at yourjoint income, it is looking at
(12:30):
you specifically in any incomethat you are responsible for.
And another thing to note isthis only applies to wages.
So if you have a pension orinvestment income or rental
income, that type of incomedoesn't count against this
earnings limit.
It's really just earned incomethat is going to count against
that.
So a couple important things tonote with that.
(12:50):
The second thing I look at whendetermining when to collect
social security if you don'tneed the money is still
longevity.
So regardless of whether youneed the money or not, you still
want to look at it from theframework of what's going to
help me maximize the impact ofthese dollars within my
financial plan or within myfinancial strategy.
So a big factor of that, maybethe biggest factor in that, is
(13:10):
longevity, as we talked about,there's a break-even point and
while I disagree with the waypeople typically talk about that
break-even point, I absolutelyagree that you need to factor in
a break-even point and thatbreak-even point should factor
in outside details likeopportunity cost.
So if you're looking at thisand saying, okay, I really don't
need these social securitybenefits, but I'm in really poor
(13:31):
health, my spouse is in reallypoor health, we don't have a
family history of longevity.
We probably don't have thatlong to live.
That's a pretty compellingreason to collect social
security early Versus Isan.
I'm going to pick on you againor use you as an example.
Let's assume you and yourspouse are in wonderful health
and you say you know what myparents both lived until the
late 90s.
I even had an aunt that livedto 100.
(13:52):
You start looking at it fromthat standpoint.
Well, you probably, if you'rein good health and have family
history of good health andlongevity, it probably makes
more sense to consider pushingthat age back.
So your longevity is still acrucial factor in deciding when
should you collect socialsecurity, but make sure that
you're looking at it from theright standpoint of what's the
true break-even age for yourspecific situation.
(14:14):
Hey everyone, it's me again forthe Disclaimer.
Please be smart about this.
Before doing anything, pleasebe sure to consult with your tax
planner or financial planner.
Nothing in this podcast shouldbe construed as investment, tax,
legal or other financial advice.
It is for informationalpurposes only.
The third thing I'd look at whenconsidering when to collect
benefits is do you have anychildren under the age of 19
(14:36):
that are still in school?
If so, well, that may seemfully irrelevant.
If so, you can get additionalsocial security benefits.
So social security willactually pay you more if you're
of social security age andyou're collecting benefits.
If you have a child that'sunder 19 and they're still in
school full time, you're gettingextra benefits.
So what does that do?
(14:57):
Well, this goes back into thatbreak-even calculation and
pushes the break-even age outeven further, because now, by
collecting early, not only isthere not a negative opportunity
cost by having to take morefrom your investments, but now
there's actually more income, atleast in those initial months
or years, from doing so.
So when you're looking atsocial security, there's not
(15:18):
just your benefit.
There's your benefit that'sbased on your earnings record
and that's called your primaryinsurance amount, and that's
what you're eligible for at yourfull retirement age, which is
between ages 66 and 67.
Now, on top of that, there'sspousal benefits, there's
survivor benefits, there'schildren's benefits, there's all
kinds of other benefits, andyou do need to be aware of how
(15:38):
this would impact you and yourpotential strategy, or your best
strategy for when you shouldcollect your social security.
Then the fourth thing ispreferences.
Now, this is not mutuallyexclusive, but, for example, if
I were to present you with twooptions, one of which is
maximizing guaranteed income andthe other is leaving money to
kids or heirs, which do youprefer, Okay?
(16:00):
So your initial thought mightbe James, what on earth do those
have to do with social security?
Well, if you chose the formerof hey, I would really want to
maximize guaranteed income.
Well then the best way to dothat is you delay your social
security benefit and if youcollect at 70, there's a
guaranteed income source that'sfully maximized.
It's the highest level that youcan get from social security.
(16:20):
So now, at age 70, in additionto having a good portfolio or
pension, you have a few thousandextra guaranteed dollars coming
in per month.
So if you're looking at yoursituation and want that extra
guarantee, that's a prettyattractive option.
Now what if, instead, you saidyou know what, I don't
necessarily care about moremaximized guaranteed income, but
I do really care about leavingmoney to heirs or leaving money
(16:43):
to kids or whoever it might be?
Well, if you collect socialsecurity early and put that
money into a growth-orientedinvestment account because,
remember, we're assuming thatyou don't necessarily need those
dollars in this situation Wellthen all of a sudden, that money
, if you need it, it's stillyours, but if you don't, then it
passes to the kids.
So keep this in mind.
(17:04):
Many people think of socialsecurity as an investment.
How do I maximize my investmenthere?
But social security is not aninvestment.
It is intentionally designed asinsurance or as a social safety
net.
Let's take a look at an exampleto compare this.
Let's assume that you have aterm life insurance policy.
Well, if you have a term lifeinsurance policy and a thousand
other people have that sameexact term life insurance policy
(17:26):
, then even if everyone's payingthe same exact premium, not
everyone is going to receiveequal benefits.
By design, most people won'tget as much out of their policy
as they put into it.
Assume it's a 20-year term lifeinsurance policy.
You paid premiums for 20straight years.
Most people will get nothingout because they'll still be
alive after 20 years and thedeath benefit won't ever pay out
(17:48):
.
So you might pay your premiumfor 20 years, 30 years and then
stop.
There's no return on investmentversus you.
Compare that to someone whomaybe only paid their premium
for four years or five years butthen they died.
Well, their errors will getsignificantly more from the
insurance company than they everpaid in.
Now, that's how it's designed.
It's insurance that's designedto be an investment.
(18:10):
So when you're looking at socialsecurity, understand that it's
from the same standpoint.
It's insurance.
It's old age insurance.
If you get old and don't havemoney the longer you live,
there's a social safety netaccording to the design that
will help you meet your needs.
Or even if you paid a ton ofmoney into social security but
you passed away before the ageof 62, you don't get any
(18:31):
benefits.
Now your survivor might, butyou personally don't get any.
If your spouse also dies beforethat age, then all that money
it essentially goes poof.
And it doesn't go poof.
It's still there, but it'spaying out other people, it's
not going back to you.
So if you wait until 70,thinking you're maximizing your
investment, but then you dieright at 70, well then your
(18:52):
non-spouse heirs don't getanything.
Yes, your spouse will getspousal benefits, but your
children if you're trying tomaximize something for them,
they won't continue to get yourbenefits, regardless of how much
you've paid in.
Now, if you want social securityto be more like an investment,
then you could view it as such.
But what you would have to dois you'd have to start
collecting early and then takethat income and then invest that
(19:16):
income into something else thatyou could pass on to your heirs
.
So you collect at 62, forexample, you get a couple
thousand dollars per month.
You could direct deposit thatright to an investment account,
have it invested, and now if youpass away at 70 or whenever you
pass away, it's not as if yourbenefit ceases.
Your ongoing benefit certainlyceases, but whatever you've
(19:37):
accrued in that account that canpass on to heirs.
So when I say that, the fourthconsideration comes down to
preferences, this is what I mean.
Would you rather maximize yourguaranteed income?
Well, if so, wait until 70versus.
Would you prefer to leave moremoney to kids or to heirs,
regardless of when you pass?
Well, in that case, I may bemore inclined to say collect
(20:00):
earlier, because you could starttaking money out of the system,
putting it into a differentinvestment account, which is
still fully available to you ifyou need it, but if not, that's
money that can pass to the nextgeneration.
So neither is right nor wrong,but more comes down to your
personal preferences and whatyou're trying to accomplish with
your plan.
And then, finally, the last partof Isana's question.
(20:20):
She says also what do we dowhen we need cash and we're in a
down market?
Now, this may seem like it hasnothing to do with the rest of
the question, but it actuallydoes.
Now, whether you are or aren'tcollecting social security, the
goal is still the same.
The goal, and what I'drecommend is don't sell your
stock or be in a position whereyou don't have to sell your
stock investments when they'redown in value.
(20:41):
Now how do you do this?
You could have cash set asidethat you live on during a bear
market, you could have a bondallocation in your portfolio
that you live on in a bearmarket, or you could live off of
other income sources.
Here's how this ties into thesocial security decision.
Let's assume and again I have noidea how much Isana has in her
portfolio.
I don't know she has anythingin her portfolio.
(21:02):
It could be a pension or rentalincome that she's living on.
But for a second, let's assumethat her expenses again I'm
making this up, this is not fromher question let's assume her
expenses are $6,000 per monthand she and her husband have
$1.8 million in their portfolio.
Well, if they collect 4% peryear of their $1.8 million
portfolio, that covers exactlythe $6,000 per month, or $72,000
(21:26):
per year.
So that specific example, orthis specific example, could be
an example of how she doesn'tquote unquote need social
security.
However, it would still benefitand we can see that right here.
So let's assume again, they'retaking $6,000 per month from
your $1.8 million portfolio, butthen the market drops and they
don't have cash to live on.
Let's assume they don't have abond allocation to live on and
(21:48):
they don't want to have to selltheir stock investments.
Well, what do they do in thissituation?
Well, one thing they could do.
Let's assume they are both 62at this point, but they both
turned on social security.
I don't know what their socialsecurity benefits would be, but
let's just assume that each ofthem are eligible for $2,000 per
month.
Well, now, all of a sudden,they have $4,000 per month
coming in.
That's not dependent upon theirinvestments, but they still
(22:11):
want to live on $6,000 per month.
Well, the remaining $2,000,that's what would need to come
from their portfolio.
Now, $2,000 per month or $24,000per year, if you divided that
by their portfolio value of $1.8million in this example, now,
all of a sudden, that representsa 1.3% withdrawal rate.
When you look at that, you'dsay, oh James, well, they still
(22:31):
have to take out 1.3% of theirportfolio.
Doesn't that mean they stillhave to sell 1.3% of their
stocks?
Well, no, because ideally andagain, this depends on how
you're invested but even just abasic stock portfolio, assuming
it's well-diversified, should beyielding more than that, just
in dividend income.
So dividends alone, they're notmaking you sell any of your
(22:51):
stocks, and that income alonecould supplement social security
in this situation.
And if you're in that position,then a down market all of a
sudden does not have as much ofan impact on you as otherwise
would have.
If you still need to come upwith that 4% or 5%, or whatever
your withdrawal rate is, to meetthe entirety of your needs.
Now you could say, james,wouldn't it be great to reinvest
(23:12):
those dividends when themarket's going down?
Sure, but at some point there'swhat's financially right and
there's what actually makessense for us.
We don't want to delay spendingdown our portfolio because of
the bear market.
Or do we just want to live ondividends and call today and not
be too concerned if we're notreinvesting those for maximum
profit over time?
So sure, it would be great toreinvest those dividends, but as
(23:34):
long as you could just live onthose dividends and not have to
sell your stock, well then whatthat means is that's giving you
the income necessary withouthaving to sell stocks in a down
market.
So we saw in this question thatyou do have of.
What do we do in a down market?
Well, the same thing that you'dalways do try not to sell
investments that are down insocial security, or turning on
(23:55):
social security could be one wayin which you do this.
And another thing that thisbrings up just a quick side note
is what this question shows isthat your social security
strategy should be dynamic.
For example, I might haveclients that retire at 60 and
we'll map out their plan andtheir income strategy.
We say, okay, here's what we'regoing to live on from 60 to 67.
(24:15):
And 67 comes around that's whenit makes most sense for you to
collect social security.
And we look at it and wedetermine that's their social
security strategy, what we'renot locked into, that that's not
set in stone and something thatcan't possibly deviate, because
what we're doing is we'regauging their portfolio each
year and we might run into ascenario where we say, look,
inflation in down markets, it'sjust putting too much pressure
(24:39):
on your portfolio to have tosupport all of your needs
between 60 and 67.
And while we thought that 67would be the ideal age, what
we're seeing now I'm using thisas a hypothetical, not saying
this is a recommendation toeveryone, but what we're seeing
now is maybe one or maybe bothof you actually collect social
security earlier than weoriginally anticipated.
So, yes, have a strategy foryour social security, but don't
(25:02):
be afraid to revisit that eachyear, based on what's happening
in the market, what's happeningwith inflation, what's happening
with your spending, what'shappening with your assets, your
other income sources.
This can and should besomething that you're at least
revisiting once a year to see ifit still makes most sense to do
so.
So that is all I have fortoday's episode.
Isana, thank you very much forthat question.
(25:22):
I hope that answered yourquestion or at least gave you
good framework to think through,and for all of you other
listeners.
I appreciate you taking thetime to tune in.
I hope that was helpful for youas well.
If you've not already done so,please leave a review for the
show if you're enjoying thiscontent, and if you've not
already done so, be sure tocheck us out on YouTube under
channel name root financial.
We can find this podcast thatwe're doing right now, and you
(25:43):
can find other great contentabout how to create a better,
more meaningful retirement andto help you get the most out of
life with your money.
So that is it for today.
Thank you for listening andI'll see you next time.
Thank you for listening toanother episode of the ready for
retirement podcast.
If you want to see how rootfinancial can help you implement
the techniques I discussed thispodcast, then go to
(26:04):
rootfinancialpartnerscom andclick start here, where you can
schedule a call to one of ouradvisors.
We work with clients all overthe country and we love the
opportunity to speak with youabout your goals and how we
might be able to help.
And please remember, nothing wediscuss on this podcast is
intended to serve as advice.
You should always consult afinancial, legal or tax
professional who's familiar withyour unique circumstances
(26:25):
before making any financialdecisions.
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