July 3, 2024 • 30 mins
Inspired by Dr. Jennifer Heisz's book "Move the Body, Heal the Mind," we discuss how physical activity can be a powerful antidote to anxiety and depression Stories of remarkable persistence, like Bob Goff's relentless pursuit of his law school dreams, illustrate the importance of pushing past mental or physical blocks—whether rooted in fear, trauma, or past experiences.
The duo shares how they do not hear the word 'no' and just continue on their journey. Do you want excuses to be your path and allow life's blocks allow you to stop pursuing your dream or do you want to figure out another way there.
Through a heartfelt narrative, Ann shares the poignant experience of reconnecting with her brother Keith, only to face the heartbreak of his final words and the complexity of his passing. This chapter explores the yearning for deeper connections and how even indirect forms of validation, like Keith’s regular listenership to our podcast, can bring comfort. We reflect on our unique bond, the challenges of dealing with death, and the treasured memories that keep loved ones present in our lives. Join us for an episode filled with raw emotion, practical advice, and a reminder of the strength found in small, consistent steps forward.
Follow us on Tina and Ann's website https://www.realtalktinaann.com/
Facebook: Real Talk with Tina and Ann | Facebook
or at: podcastrealtalktinaann@gmail.com or annied643@gmail.com
Apple Podcasts: Real Talk with Tina and Ann on Apple Podcasts
Spotify: Real Talk with Tina and Ann | Podcast on Spotify
Amazon Music: Real Talk with Tina and Ann Podcast | Listen on Amazon Music
iHeart Radio: Real Talk with Tina and Ann Podcast | Listen on Amazon Music
Castro: Real Talk with Tina and Ann (castro.fm)
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to Real Talk with Tina and Anne.
I am Anne, and this is part twoof Make Excuses or Make
Adjustments.
I really hope you get to listento part one.
If not, please go to Real Talkwith Tina and Anne.
On our website it's justrealtalktinaannecom and you can
get all of our episodes and youcan join us each week anywhere
(00:30):
you get your podcast.
You can listen to us everySunday morning at 11 am on
wdjyfmcom out of Atlanta andonline.
You can also listen to us onDenver's radio station 92.9 and
89.3.
You can listen online atdenveropenmediaorg and you can
watch us on San Francisco'sPacifica Community Television on
(00:52):
Comcast Channel 26 and 27 andonline at Pacific Coast TV.
You can also watch all of ourepisodes on YouTube at Real Talk
with Tina and Anne.
You can reach us on Facebook atReal Talk with Tina and Anne.
You can reach us on Facebook atReal Talk with Tina and Anne
and you can go catch all of ourepisodes.
Like I said, atrealtalktinaannecom, you can
(01:13):
catch our monthly newslettersand you can also get special
messages.
All right, well, here is parttwo of make excuses or make
adjustments.
Like I said in another episode,if I am where I was three
months ago or six months ago,you know.
I'm going to figure out why andI'm going to move.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
That's so good.
Sitting leads to morestagnation.
I love that.
And then, equally so, movingleads to more movement.
You know there's a book, yeah,oh, I like that.
Yeah, you know there's a book,yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Oh, I like that.
Yeah, I mean, there's a bookMove the Body, heal the Mind by
Dr Jennifer Heisz H-E-I-S-Z.
I'm not sure, but she is aneuroscientist who discusses
research on how fitness andexercise can combat mental
health conditions such asanxiety, dementia, ADHD and
(02:08):
depression, and offers a planfor improving focus, creativity
and sleep.
She says that physicalinactivity is the greatest risk
factor contributing to dementiaand anxiety.
It's as much a factor asgenetics and it says that
exercise's anti-inflammatoryproperties makes it the most
(02:29):
effective treatment strategy forthose who are depressed and
don't respond to antidepressants.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Yeah, she's not the only one that does that.
There's so, so, so, so, so muchresearch in people who are
neuroscientists and sportsscientists and you name it, who
are right on board with this.
And that's why I couldn'tfigure out because you know,
with the disease that my mom hasthe early onset Alzheimer's why
, as I know I'm in this pivotaldecade of my forties why am I
(02:58):
not wanting to move?
That's so counter to who I amas being driven, and it turns
out, the only obstacle in my waywas me.
I just needed to start, and nowI'm moving and I want to move.
So you're right, no sittingback, you can be tired and
stagnant or you can get up andmove.
But you know, and and I'm noteven doing like a ton I'm making
(03:20):
sure that I walk a mile, alittle over a mile, every
morning.
It's a start.
You know, it's not anythinghuge and I get that, but it is a
start and I think that's whatcounts, yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
You know, getting back to the blocks that we
encounter in our life and I havehad many blocks that appear
like just a straight out no, Idon't take that no, and I just
keep moving and changing courseor figure out a different way,
and I think you know that's areally good example of what
you're talking about.
A block should never stop youfrom what you want.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Yeah, yeah, I think so too.
Now, sometimes you know theysay when a door closes, a window
opens or another door opens, orhowever the saying goes you
know, sometimes there might be ablock for a reason we don't
understand, and maybe, maybeit's for it is going to change
your direction and you're,you're going to reach some other
goal or some some but you don'tstop but right you, you can't
(04:14):
stop you, you got to keep moving.
I mean, think of all the timesthat people have been told no.
And in in the book love does,there is a chapter.
So each chapter, I think I'vesaid before, is its own story,
and one of the chapters talksabout how, really about what
we're saying.
If I'm remembering it correctly, bob Goff wanted to be in a
certain school to be a lawyerand he was told no, no, no, no,
(04:36):
no.
Well, he sat outside the dean'soffice for about eight hours
one day and just sat there untilhe was given the time of day to
make his case.
And then he did and he got in,and so it's a really great,
fascinating story about whatwe're talking about.
That's amazing, yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
And about giving up.
You know, going back to thatcat, he was afraid to try.
It's easier to stay stucksometimes because risk is scary
and the risk of failing canoverpower not trying at all.
I'm afraid the cat learned notto go near any stove because to
him or her, whichever it was,you know they were all hot, they
(05:19):
were all hot.
So the more I think about this,it takes me back to that
11-year-old Ann who was at thetop of her game and my dad died
and I, for the next decades inmy life, thought you know, I
just felt that associationbetween bad and that's, you know
, success.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
So this reminds me of someone that I love very, very
dearly former pastor friend ofmine.
His 29-year-old son just passedaway A sudden sickness.
I don't even know if theycompletely know what had
happened.
They found him in his home andfour days of not being able to
(06:00):
use the restroom and his bodywas shutting down and then in
the hospital he had a stroke anda heart attack.
Oh my Immediately went into theICU.
They don't know why at all.
The last update on maybe whathappened no drugs, nothing like
that.
They thought maybe heavy metaltoxicity was contributing in
some way to it, but I have notheard what the final say was.
(06:24):
But on Sunday his son hadpassed away at 29 years old and
I know that it's rocked him andhis family and my heart is just
absolutely broken for them.
What he had said the other dayjust on his Facebook post is
kind of about what we're talkingabout.
(06:44):
He said his son really lovedgardening and their garden looks
like it is just withering away,overgrown, weedy, disgusting,
because they haven't been ableto move in a while, meaning do
something with it because theirson has been so sick.
And they said they finallydecided you know what?
(07:05):
There is a time for grief, butthere's also a time to still
live, and so they went out andthey weeded it and they picked
the berries that were picked sothat they didn't just become
nothing, and it was really aheartbreaking illustration, I
think, of what we're talkingabout here.
Sometimes it's hard to move, butyou got to keep moving, and so
I wrote to move.
But you got to keep moving, andso I wrote to him and I said a
(07:27):
few things, and among them wasthat I used to wish and I don't
know if I've ever shared this onthe podcast before, but I used
to wish if something.
There's been several really big, major, heartbreaking things
that have happened in my lifeand I know I'm not the only one.
I mean in your life and so manyof our listeners' lives and at
times I've wished that the worldwould have stopped and just
(07:48):
taken a moment to grieve with me.
But if we all did that foreverybody, all we would ever do
is stand still, and you can'thave that.
So at the same time, it's apain to heal it, as I've talked
about many times, but it's alsoa good thing that the world
doesn't stay stagnant, becausewe do need to move and life has
to still go on, even with thepain.
(08:09):
You have to learn to live withit, and so moving is just so, so
important.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
And you're right about that.
I mean, it's just relearninghow to live.
I mean it's just a new seasonand it's like that little kid in
me, that baby in me, that thenI have.
I learned how to walk.
Now I have casts.
So there was something heavythat was put on me, there was
something that you know wascreated it to be harder for me
(08:37):
to walk, but I figured it out.
And then they take the castsoff and my legs were completely
different, and so then I had tolearn again.
But you know it's, it's thatsame process in every single day
of our lives when things happen.
You know, and we just have to.
You know, when you and Istarted the podcast, we didn't
(08:57):
know what we were doing.
When you and I you know, startedin journalism or whatever.
Whatever it is, you can justput insert whatever it is.
You can just put insertwhatever it is.
You just have to what your,what your husband said, you have
to use there or makeadjustments that's right.
That's right.
That might be the title of thisepisode because I love it,
(09:19):
he'll love it too I really lovethat and that is just perfect.
I mean, I mean, you just got tokeep moving.
You just have to figure it out.
If you keep moving, it willjust right itself.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Absolutely In perfect progress.
Just keep on moving in theright direction.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Life is like riding a bicycle To keep your balance,
you must keep moving.
I love that, and that's byAlbert Einstein.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
Well, he was a genius .
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Yeah, he was, but it's true, if you quit pedaling,
you're going to fall.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, yeah, it's so true, he knew what he was
talking about.
So, friends, the big takeawaymake excuses or you can make
adjustments, but we would saykeep moving forward in the right
direction.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Thank you for listening and we will see you
next time.
I'm adding this to our podcastbecause right after we taped
that particular episode, thatparticular episode, the brother
that I spoke about, who sent methe email saying that I
(10:37):
reminding me of how I learned towalk three times and how I was
always very determined and how Inever gave up Well, those ended
up being the last words he eversaid to me.
Well, those ended up being thelast words he ever said to me,
and I find that reallyinteresting that those were his
last words to me and I willcarry those words forever.
I very much appreciate thatemail.
I mean, my brother was one whonever failed listening to every
(11:03):
single one of our episodes andwas all about it, so supportive.
And it's interesting becausethis is a man who chose not to
be in our family's life for mostof his life and you know, I
(11:26):
can't get in his head.
I can't figure out why he didit, and I'm going to be spending
some time in the next weeksbeing able to talk to some
people who knew him and I hopeto learn more about him, because
I didn't know that much abouthim.
I knew him as a little baby.
(11:48):
And then I knew him, as youknow, an 11-year-old kid whose
dad had passed away and he camehome for that funeral.
And then I learned about him inmy 40s when my mom passed away
(12:08):
and he came home for that.
We had different moms, but then, you know, I had to
purposefully and intentionallymake it a point to reach out to
him, find him and make him apart of my life, and he was a
part of my life and my youngerkids' lives for the last few
(12:31):
years, and I'm really glad thatwe did that, that he would come
for a week at a time.
It means the world to me thatwe got to spend that time and I
find it really interesting thatthat was how we ended that he
sent me that email and you know,another thing that happened was
(12:52):
that he told me he loved me,like a few weeks before he
passed away.
I find it interesting thosethings happen, you know, and
that was the first time he hadever said that to me.
You know, when I found out thathe had passed away and I know
anybody that's ever dealt withthis and, honestly, this is the
(13:14):
first time I've ever dealt withsomething to this extent because
you know, the adults in theroom always handled it and I
figured out that I am the onlythe oldest living relative in my
immediate family, minus myhusband and my friend who lives
(13:36):
with us.
But other than that, I mean I'mtalking mom, dad and brother
and I'm the last one standingand it's kind of a scary time.
He never had any family, nowife, no kids, so I was his
(13:56):
living, his closest livingrelative.
So they started.
I started getting phone callsfrom medical examiner and, you
know, the police, whoinvestigated his passing at home
, because that's just somethingthat happens when you pass away
at home and he had fallen a fewdays before and they thought
(14:19):
that, you know, I think thatthey wanted to rule that out.
They wanted to rule everythingelse out other than natural
causes, but then it ended upbeing just natural causes.
But you know, it's a reallyscary thing to realize that
you're it.
(14:40):
And I think it started toreally hit me when I started
getting all these messages frompeople and they wanted things
from me that I was like, wait asecond.
In fact, I found out about thiswhen I was on vacation in
(15:03):
Florida, wasn't even home.
I got the phone call from hisroommates that he had passed.
You know I needed a minute toget home process, figure this
out and what needed to happenfirst.
(15:25):
Second, and this is where thiswhole entire thing leads me
right here, I felt the weight ofall of it In this podcast.
This is so amazing how ourpodcasts always kind of are
(15:49):
parallel with other things thathappen in our lives, or right
before something happens in ourand Tina's life and my life.
But, of course, we were all ina state of shock and the only
way for me to do this was justto keep moving and we just
(16:09):
talked about that.
I remember sitting there, I waswaiting for the.
I was waiting for the medicalexaminer's grief counselor to
call me back which, by the way,if she's listening to this,
that's funny.
Call me back, um, because nowit's been over a week.
(16:32):
But she called me, she gave meall these options and it was
really overwhelming.
And she said one of the thingsthat you could do is donate his
body to science.
Now, this is a doctor who was achiropractor, but I mean, he
had medical books upon medicalbooks and he had.
(16:53):
He was autistic for sure.
Not, he did not lead with hisfeelings, he led with his brain
and everything was veryanalytical.
And I was like, oh my gosh,that would be perfect, I'll just
donate his body to science,because I personally didn't have
(17:14):
the money to pay for a funeral.
And I was like, okay, I mean, Icould see him up there going.
Yes, you know, he would be allabout it, and uh.
So then I waited like three days.
I called again.
She said that she would directme in the right, in the right
(17:36):
direction for, um, how to makethese phone calls, who to call
and everything.
So I waited and finally, andwith his roommates, I could feel
the frustration on their end aswell, and finally I just said
to myself I'm just going tostart doing this.
So my friend and I, we juststarted looking up places to
(17:59):
donate science in this statethat he had passed away, and so
we found out, called the firstone.
They said sorry, but we don'ttake people that had been
autopsied.
And that was only because theyneeded to find out how, why he
passed away at home.
And then the second place saidsorry, we don't take anybody
(18:22):
past five days of being deceased.
Well, if I would have maybeacted a day sooner, we would
have been able to meet thatdeadline.
But it just goes back to.
You know that I was waiting forthat phone call and the
heaviness during that waitingperiod was waiting for that
phone call and the heavinessduring that waiting period was
just getting worse and worse.
I mean, I cannot tell you howthe weight got worse and worse
(18:51):
and harder and harder, heavierand heavier the longer that I
sat in this.
I didn't know what to do.
I didn't even know the firstthing to do, so I went from
there to just starting to Googlecrematoriums.
(19:16):
One popped up.
I just called him, that's it.
I just start talking to thisman and I just start telling him
my situation.
He was so wonderful to me, hewas exactly what I needed at
(19:40):
that moment and he's who we wentwith.
But I just started moving.
That is the key.
The helplessness came too,because here I am, I'm two, two
states away.
I'm not where he is.
(20:02):
The roommates, his body,everything else, the medical
examiner, the investigator,they're all in the same state.
I'm two states away and here Iam trying to make decisions,
make calls and how, banks andfree-reasing accounts, and
(20:23):
you're trying to make the bestdecisions for the deceased on
the wishes that they would wantand he never left anything for
us.
This is a really great lessonfor anybody who has not done
(20:43):
that Don't pass away and nothave all that stuff in place.
If we would have known hiswishes, he didn't have any
wishes anywhere, any wishesanywhere.
The roommates had to search forpaperwork to help me in deciding
very important things, and evensocial security numbers or
(21:12):
birth certificates and thingslike that.
I mean.
Having everything in order isso important to the people that
are left behind, because I cantell you what, what they're not
thinking.
They don't even know what to dofirst.
So get a will, put papers inorder, tell people what you want
(21:35):
, tell the people around youwhat you want and make it legal
if you can.
One of the first things I didafter I adopted my kids was you
know, got everything in orderand you're doing everybody a
favor by doing that favor bydoing that.
(22:07):
The other part of this is goingback to the moving.
Just do.
The more I did, the more theweight came off and I could
literally feel the heaviness.
Leave me, the heaviness, leaveme.
The more I sat, the heavier itgot, the more I felt like I
(22:28):
couldn't do anything.
The more I did, the less itfelt and the more I was able to
handle it.
One of the other things thatwas a part of this that was
weighing so heavily on me was mylittles.
You know, I've got two olderkids and three little kids.
(22:48):
My three littles were prettyclose to their Uncle Keith.
They have been through so muchalready.
I wanted them to enjoy the restof their vacation.
I didn't want to tell them onvacation, I knew that for sure.
I had had that association withmy dad passing away and great
(23:11):
things.
And you know, uh, somethinggreat and something tragic
happened at the same time andthat stayed with me for such a
long time.
So I was like I'm gonna letthem, let them enjoy, I'm going
to let you know.
I contacted some of my cousinsand different things like that,
(23:33):
but, you know, started to talkabout it whenever they weren't
around, to try to process what Ineeded to do when I did get
back, but never with an air shotof them.
And then, you know, the dayswent by when, after we got home
and I was doing all of this, Iwanted everything in place.
I did not want the complicationof telling them to, I just
(23:58):
wanted them to enjoy.
I didn't.
You know, every single timethat you have something tragic
happen, that part of your lifeis never able to be brought back
, you can't, you can never getit back again.
And I just wanted him to stillbe alive in their eyes.
(24:23):
I guess wanted him to still bealive in their eyes.
I guess I didn't want them tohave that yet.
I wanted that spirit of them tostill have them, for him to
still be alive.
Maybe it was kind of still myway of not permanently having
(24:45):
him gone.
You know, it's really strangebecause not very many people
have been in my life all of mylife.
Just about I was adopted, butsince I was adopted, not very
many.
I mean, he was the longestliving person that has known me
(25:09):
my entire life and had all thestories, and that's not there
anymore.
So it's not just the loss ofthe person sometimes and that's
the biggest loss, but it's notalways that's.
It's the stories, it's thememories.
It's the biggest loss, but it'snot always it's the stories,
it's the memories, it's whatcould be.
(25:31):
You know, the idea of him.
There was never a time in mylife where I did not hold on to
the idea of him.
I still have his pictures hungup in my house when he was
younger, One of him holding meas a baby.
I still have a book that hegave me when I was a baby and he
(25:54):
signed it.
Your brother, keith, you know.
Those are the kind of thingsthat I've held on to, tangible
things, because I wanted,because I wanted, I longed for a
relationship with him that hewas not giving me.
And it's interesting because hisroommates shared with me that
(26:18):
he was not that person that theyknew.
The absent person that ourfamily knew.
He was this really amazingloving man, that nobody that,
every single person that met him, they just loved him because of
how great of a person he wasand he had so many friends.
It's kind of weird to hear thatthe person that you knew had a
(26:44):
completely different life andwas giving to others what you
always wanted but were neverable to get from them.
And you know, what's weird isthat he really did try in the
end.
He really honestly tried in theend to give us his absolute
(27:04):
what best, the best brother thathe could possibly be or the
best uncle For so many lessonsthat I got out of this, and it's
just been one week since he'spassed away, when I'm doing this
Just one week.
You know it's interesting doingthis just one week, you know
(27:32):
it's interesting.
But lots of times I can seesometimes not everybody that
watches or listens to thepodcasts in areas that they live
, and every single week I couldsee that his city would come up
as one of the people wholistened to the podcast.
It was just my way of always.
(27:53):
Every week I would look for hiscity to come up.
It was my way of him likevisiting me.
I don't know I knew he heard me, he validated me, me.
I don't know, I knew he heardme, he validated me, and then I
would get the email or the textsaying, you know, some messages
to me about what he had heardand that was really amazing to
(28:16):
me.
It was like a part of ourrelationship that I longed for
was being fulfilled.
But the week before he hadpassed away, he had fallen and I
noticed that he didn't listenand I was like, oh well, that's
strange and were.
We had really amazing numbersfrom Nielsen, and so you know, I
(28:55):
told my brother, I texted himthat our numbers were really
good for the first winter ofbeing on the radio, never heard
back.
Now I know why I'm going tomiss, just knowing that it's
(29:16):
like he's on the other side ofthe podcast and I'm talking.
He's on the other side of thatphone in a way, and he's
messaging me back.
So, keith, I love you, I lovethe idea of you my entire life
(29:52):
and I'm very thankful andgrateful that you were my
brother in a really weird way,even though you were as absent
as you were In my mind, you werealways there and I'm going to
miss that.
I'm going to miss that.
Welcome to Real Talk with Tina and Anne.
I am Anne, and this is part twoof Make Excuses or Make
Adjustments.
I really hope you get to listento part one.
If not, please go to Real Talkwith Tina and Anne.
On our website it's justrealtalktinaannecom and you can
get all of our episodes and youcan join us each week anywhere
(00:30):
you get your podcast.
You can listen to us everySunday morning at 11 am on
wdjyfmcom out of Atlanta andonline.
You can also listen to us onDenver's radio station 92.9 and
89.3.
You can listen online atdenveropenmediaorg and you can
watch us on San Francisco'sPacifica Community Television on
(00:52):
Comcast Channel 26 and 27 andonline at Pacific Coast TV.
You can also watch all of ourepisodes on YouTube at Real Talk
with Tina and Anne.
You can reach us on Facebook atReal Talk with Tina and Anne.
You can reach us on Facebook atReal Talk with Tina and Anne
and you can go catch all of ourepisodes.
Like I said, atrealtalktinaannecom, you can
(01:13):
catch our monthly newslettersand you can also get special
messages.
All right, well, here is parttwo of make excuses or make
adjustments.
Like I said in another episode,if I am where I was three
months ago or six months ago,you know.
I'm going to figure out why andI'm going to move.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
That's so good.
Sitting leads to morestagnation.
I love that.
And then, equally so, movingleads to more movement.
You know there's a book, yeah,oh, I like that.
Yeah, you know there's a book,yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Oh, I like that.
Yeah, I mean, there's a bookMove the Body, heal the Mind by
Dr Jennifer Heisz H-E-I-S-Z.
I'm not sure, but she is aneuroscientist who discusses
research on how fitness andexercise can combat mental
health conditions such asanxiety, dementia, ADHD and
(02:08):
depression, and offers a planfor improving focus, creativity
and sleep.
She says that physicalinactivity is the greatest risk
factor contributing to dementiaand anxiety.
It's as much a factor asgenetics and it says that
exercise's anti-inflammatoryproperties makes it the most
(02:29):
effective treatment strategy forthose who are depressed and
don't respond to antidepressants.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Yeah, she's not the only one that does that.
There's so, so, so, so, so muchresearch in people who are
neuroscientists and sportsscientists and you name it, who
are right on board with this.
And that's why I couldn'tfigure out because you know,
with the disease that my mom hasthe early onset Alzheimer's why
, as I know I'm in this pivotaldecade of my forties why am I
(02:58):
not wanting to move?
That's so counter to who I amas being driven, and it turns
out, the only obstacle in my waywas me.
I just needed to start, and nowI'm moving and I want to move.
So you're right, no sittingback, you can be tired and
stagnant or you can get up andmove.
But you know, and and I'm noteven doing like a ton I'm making
(03:20):
sure that I walk a mile, alittle over a mile, every
morning.
It's a start.
You know, it's not anythinghuge and I get that, but it is a
start and I think that's whatcounts, yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
You know, getting back to the blocks that we
encounter in our life and I havehad many blocks that appear
like just a straight out no, Idon't take that no, and I just
keep moving and changing courseor figure out a different way,
and I think you know that's areally good example of what
you're talking about.
A block should never stop youfrom what you want.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Yeah, yeah, I think so too.
Now, sometimes you know theysay when a door closes, a window
opens or another door opens, orhowever the saying goes you
know, sometimes there might be ablock for a reason we don't
understand, and maybe, maybeit's for it is going to change
your direction and you're,you're going to reach some other
goal or some some but you don'tstop but right you, you can't
(04:14):
stop you, you got to keep moving.
I mean, think of all the timesthat people have been told no.
And in in the book love does,there is a chapter.
So each chapter, I think I'vesaid before, is its own story,
and one of the chapters talksabout how, really about what
we're saying.
If I'm remembering it correctly, bob Goff wanted to be in a
certain school to be a lawyerand he was told no, no, no, no,
(04:36):
no.
Well, he sat outside the dean'soffice for about eight hours
one day and just sat there untilhe was given the time of day to
make his case.
And then he did and he got in,and so it's a really great,
fascinating story about whatwe're talking about.
That's amazing, yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
And about giving up.
You know, going back to thatcat, he was afraid to try.
It's easier to stay stucksometimes because risk is scary
and the risk of failing canoverpower not trying at all.
I'm afraid the cat learned notto go near any stove because to
him or her, whichever it was,you know they were all hot, they
(05:19):
were all hot.
So the more I think about this,it takes me back to that
11-year-old Ann who was at thetop of her game and my dad died
and I, for the next decades inmy life, thought you know, I
just felt that associationbetween bad and that's, you know
, success.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
So this reminds me of someone that I love very, very
dearly former pastor friend ofmine.
His 29-year-old son just passedaway A sudden sickness.
I don't even know if theycompletely know what had
happened.
They found him in his home andfour days of not being able to
(06:00):
use the restroom and his bodywas shutting down and then in
the hospital he had a stroke anda heart attack.
Oh my Immediately went into theICU.
They don't know why at all.
The last update on maybe whathappened no drugs, nothing like
that.
They thought maybe heavy metaltoxicity was contributing in
some way to it, but I have notheard what the final say was.
(06:24):
But on Sunday his son hadpassed away at 29 years old and
I know that it's rocked him andhis family and my heart is just
absolutely broken for them.
What he had said the other dayjust on his Facebook post is
kind of about what we're talkingabout.
(06:44):
He said his son really lovedgardening and their garden looks
like it is just withering away,overgrown, weedy, disgusting,
because they haven't been ableto move in a while, meaning do
something with it because theirson has been so sick.
And they said they finallydecided you know what?
(07:05):
There is a time for grief, butthere's also a time to still
live, and so they went out andthey weeded it and they picked
the berries that were picked sothat they didn't just become
nothing, and it was really aheartbreaking illustration, I
think, of what we're talkingabout here.
Sometimes it's hard to move, butyou got to keep moving, and so
I wrote to move.
But you got to keep moving, andso I wrote to him and I said a
(07:27):
few things, and among them wasthat I used to wish and I don't
know if I've ever shared this onthe podcast before, but I used
to wish if something.
There's been several really big, major, heartbreaking things
that have happened in my lifeand I know I'm not the only one.
I mean in your life and so manyof our listeners' lives and at
times I've wished that the worldwould have stopped and just
(07:48):
taken a moment to grieve with me.
But if we all did that foreverybody, all we would ever do
is stand still, and you can'thave that.
So at the same time, it's apain to heal it, as I've talked
about many times, but it's alsoa good thing that the world
doesn't stay stagnant, becausewe do need to move and life has
to still go on, even with thepain.
(08:09):
You have to learn to live withit, and so moving is just so, so
important.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
And you're right about that.
I mean, it's just relearninghow to live.
I mean it's just a new seasonand it's like that little kid in
me, that baby in me, that thenI have.
I learned how to walk.
Now I have casts.
So there was something heavythat was put on me, there was
something that you know wascreated it to be harder for me
(08:37):
to walk, but I figured it out.
And then they take the castsoff and my legs were completely
different, and so then I had tolearn again.
But you know it's, it's thatsame process in every single day
of our lives when things happen.
You know, and we just have to.
You know, when you and Istarted the podcast, we didn't
(08:57):
know what we were doing.
When you and I you know, startedin journalism or whatever.
Whatever it is, you can justput insert whatever it is.
You can just put insertwhatever it is.
You just have to what your,what your husband said, you have
to use there or makeadjustments that's right.
That's right.
That might be the title of thisepisode because I love it,
(09:19):
he'll love it too I really lovethat and that is just perfect.
I mean, I mean, you just got tokeep moving.
You just have to figure it out.
If you keep moving, it willjust right itself.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Absolutely In perfect progress.
Just keep on moving in theright direction.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Life is like riding a bicycle To keep your balance,
you must keep moving.
I love that, and that's byAlbert Einstein.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
Well, he was a genius .
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Yeah, he was, but it's true, if you quit pedaling,
you're going to fall.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, yeah, it's so true, he knew what he was
talking about.
So, friends, the big takeawaymake excuses or you can make
adjustments, but we would saykeep moving forward in the right
direction.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Thank you for listening and we will see you
next time.
I'm adding this to our podcastbecause right after we taped
that particular episode, thatparticular episode, the brother
that I spoke about, who sent methe email saying that I
(10:37):
reminding me of how I learned towalk three times and how I was
always very determined and how Inever gave up Well, those ended
up being the last words he eversaid to me.
Well, those ended up being thelast words he ever said to me,
and I find that reallyinteresting that those were his
last words to me and I willcarry those words forever.
I very much appreciate thatemail.
I mean, my brother was one whonever failed listening to every
(11:03):
single one of our episodes andwas all about it, so supportive.
And it's interesting becausethis is a man who chose not to
be in our family's life for mostof his life and you know, I
(11:26):
can't get in his head.
I can't figure out why he didit, and I'm going to be spending
some time in the next weeksbeing able to talk to some
people who knew him and I hopeto learn more about him, because
I didn't know that much abouthim.
I knew him as a little baby.
(11:48):
And then I knew him, as youknow, an 11-year-old kid whose
dad had passed away and he camehome for that funeral.
And then I learned about him inmy 40s when my mom passed away
(12:08):
and he came home for that.
We had different moms, but then, you know, I had to
purposefully and intentionallymake it a point to reach out to
him, find him and make him apart of my life, and he was a
part of my life and my youngerkids' lives for the last few
(12:31):
years, and I'm really glad thatwe did that, that he would come
for a week at a time.
It means the world to me thatwe got to spend that time and I
find it really interesting thatthat was how we ended that he
sent me that email and you know,another thing that happened was
(12:52):
that he told me he loved me,like a few weeks before he
passed away.
I find it interesting thosethings happen, you know, and
that was the first time he hadever said that to me.
You know, when I found out thathe had passed away and I know
anybody that's ever dealt withthis and, honestly, this is the
(13:14):
first time I've ever dealt withsomething to this extent because
you know, the adults in theroom always handled it and I
figured out that I am the onlythe oldest living relative in my
immediate family, minus myhusband and my friend who lives
(13:36):
with us.
But other than that, I mean I'mtalking mom, dad and brother
and I'm the last one standingand it's kind of a scary time.
He never had any family, nowife, no kids, so I was his
(13:56):
living, his closest livingrelative.
So they started.
I started getting phone callsfrom medical examiner and, you
know, the police, whoinvestigated his passing at home
, because that's just somethingthat happens when you pass away
at home and he had fallen a fewdays before and they thought
(14:19):
that, you know, I think thatthey wanted to rule that out.
They wanted to rule everythingelse out other than natural
causes, but then it ended upbeing just natural causes.
But you know, it's a reallyscary thing to realize that
you're it.
(14:40):
And I think it started toreally hit me when I started
getting all these messages frompeople and they wanted things
from me that I was like, wait asecond.
In fact, I found out about thiswhen I was on vacation in
(15:03):
Florida, wasn't even home.
I got the phone call from hisroommates that he had passed.
You know I needed a minute toget home process, figure this
out and what needed to happenfirst.
(15:25):
Second, and this is where thiswhole entire thing leads me
right here, I felt the weight ofall of it In this podcast.
This is so amazing how ourpodcasts always kind of are
(15:49):
parallel with other things thathappen in our lives, or right
before something happens in ourand Tina's life and my life.
But, of course, we were all ina state of shock and the only
way for me to do this was justto keep moving and we just
(16:09):
talked about that.
I remember sitting there, I waswaiting for the.
I was waiting for the medicalexaminer's grief counselor to
call me back which, by the way,if she's listening to this,
that's funny.
Call me back, um, because nowit's been over a week.
(16:32):
But she called me, she gave meall these options and it was
really overwhelming.
And she said one of the thingsthat you could do is donate his
body to science.
Now, this is a doctor who was achiropractor, but I mean, he
had medical books upon medicalbooks and he had.
(16:53):
He was autistic for sure.
Not, he did not lead with hisfeelings, he led with his brain
and everything was veryanalytical.
And I was like, oh my gosh,that would be perfect, I'll just
donate his body to science,because I personally didn't have
(17:14):
the money to pay for a funeral.
And I was like, okay, I mean, Icould see him up there going.
Yes, you know, he would be allabout it, and uh.
So then I waited like three days.
I called again.
She said that she would directme in the right, in the right
(17:36):
direction for, um, how to makethese phone calls, who to call
and everything.
So I waited and finally, andwith his roommates, I could feel
the frustration on their end aswell, and finally I just said
to myself I'm just going tostart doing this.
So my friend and I, we juststarted looking up places to
(17:59):
donate science in this statethat he had passed away, and so
we found out, called the firstone.
They said sorry, but we don'ttake people that had been
autopsied.
And that was only because theyneeded to find out how, why he
passed away at home.
And then the second place saidsorry, we don't take anybody
(18:22):
past five days of being deceased.
Well, if I would have maybeacted a day sooner, we would
have been able to meet thatdeadline.
But it just goes back to.
You know that I was waiting forthat phone call and the
heaviness during that waitingperiod was waiting for that
phone call and the heavinessduring that waiting period was
just getting worse and worse.
I mean, I cannot tell you howthe weight got worse and worse
(18:51):
and harder and harder, heavierand heavier the longer that I
sat in this.
I didn't know what to do.
I didn't even know the firstthing to do, so I went from
there to just starting to Googlecrematoriums.
(19:16):
One popped up.
I just called him, that's it.
I just start talking to thisman and I just start telling him
my situation.
He was so wonderful to me, hewas exactly what I needed at
(19:40):
that moment and he's who we wentwith.
But I just started moving.
That is the key.
The helplessness came too,because here I am, I'm two, two
states away.
I'm not where he is.
(20:02):
The roommates, his body,everything else, the medical
examiner, the investigator,they're all in the same state.
I'm two states away and here Iam trying to make decisions,
make calls and how, banks andfree-reasing accounts, and
(20:23):
you're trying to make the bestdecisions for the deceased on
the wishes that they would wantand he never left anything for
us.
This is a really great lessonfor anybody who has not done
(20:43):
that Don't pass away and nothave all that stuff in place.
If we would have known hiswishes, he didn't have any
wishes anywhere, any wishesanywhere.
The roommates had to search forpaperwork to help me in deciding
very important things, and evensocial security numbers or
(21:12):
birth certificates and thingslike that.
I mean.
Having everything in order isso important to the people that
are left behind, because I cantell you what, what they're not
thinking.
They don't even know what to dofirst.
So get a will, put papers inorder, tell people what you want
(21:35):
, tell the people around youwhat you want and make it legal
if you can.
One of the first things I didafter I adopted my kids was you
know, got everything in orderand you're doing everybody a
favor by doing that favor bydoing that.
(22:07):
The other part of this is goingback to the moving.
Just do.
The more I did, the more theweight came off and I could
literally feel the heaviness.
Leave me, the heaviness, leaveme.
The more I sat, the heavier itgot, the more I felt like I
(22:28):
couldn't do anything.
The more I did, the less itfelt and the more I was able to
handle it.
One of the other things thatwas a part of this that was
weighing so heavily on me was mylittles.
You know, I've got two olderkids and three little kids.
(22:48):
My three littles were prettyclose to their Uncle Keith.
They have been through so muchalready.
I wanted them to enjoy the restof their vacation.
I didn't want to tell them onvacation, I knew that for sure.
I had had that association withmy dad passing away and great
(23:11):
things.
And you know, uh, somethinggreat and something tragic
happened at the same time andthat stayed with me for such a
long time.
So I was like I'm gonna letthem, let them enjoy, I'm going
to let you know.
I contacted some of my cousinsand different things like that,
(23:33):
but, you know, started to talkabout it whenever they weren't
around, to try to process what Ineeded to do when I did get
back, but never with an air shotof them.
And then, you know, the dayswent by when, after we got home
and I was doing all of this, Iwanted everything in place.
I did not want the complicationof telling them to, I just
(23:58):
wanted them to enjoy.
I didn't.
You know, every single timethat you have something tragic
happen, that part of your lifeis never able to be brought back
, you can't, you can never getit back again.
And I just wanted him to stillbe alive in their eyes.
(24:23):
I guess wanted him to still bealive in their eyes.
I guess I didn't want them tohave that yet.
I wanted that spirit of them tostill have them, for him to
still be alive.
Maybe it was kind of still myway of not permanently having
(24:45):
him gone.
You know, it's really strangebecause not very many people
have been in my life all of mylife.
Just about I was adopted, butsince I was adopted, not very
many.
I mean, he was the longestliving person that has known me
(25:09):
my entire life and had all thestories, and that's not there
anymore.
So it's not just the loss ofthe person sometimes and that's
the biggest loss, but it's notalways that's.
It's the stories, it's thememories.
It's the biggest loss, but it'snot always it's the stories,
it's the memories, it's whatcould be.
(25:31):
You know, the idea of him.
There was never a time in mylife where I did not hold on to
the idea of him.
I still have his pictures hungup in my house when he was
younger, One of him holding meas a baby.
I still have a book that hegave me when I was a baby and he
(25:54):
signed it.
Your brother, keith, you know.
Those are the kind of thingsthat I've held on to, tangible
things, because I wanted,because I wanted, I longed for a
relationship with him that hewas not giving me.
And it's interesting because hisroommates shared with me that
(26:18):
he was not that person that theyknew.
The absent person that ourfamily knew.
He was this really amazingloving man, that nobody that,
every single person that met him, they just loved him because of
how great of a person he wasand he had so many friends.
It's kind of weird to hear thatthe person that you knew had a
(26:44):
completely different life andwas giving to others what you
always wanted but were neverable to get from them.
And you know, what's weird isthat he really did try in the
end.
He really honestly tried in theend to give us his absolute
(27:04):
what best, the best brother thathe could possibly be or the
best uncle For so many lessonsthat I got out of this, and it's
just been one week since he'spassed away, when I'm doing this
Just one week.
You know it's interesting doingthis just one week, you know
(27:32):
it's interesting.
But lots of times I can seesometimes not everybody that
watches or listens to thepodcasts in areas that they live
, and every single week I couldsee that his city would come up
as one of the people wholistened to the podcast.
It was just my way of always.
(27:53):
Every week I would look for hiscity to come up.
It was my way of him likevisiting me.
I don't know I knew he heard me, he validated me, me.
I don't know, I knew he heardme, he validated me, and then I
would get the email or the textsaying, you know, some messages
to me about what he had heardand that was really amazing to
(28:16):
me.
It was like a part of ourrelationship that I longed for
was being fulfilled.
But the week before he hadpassed away, he had fallen and I
noticed that he didn't listenand I was like, oh well, that's
strange and were.
We had really amazing numbersfrom Nielsen, and so you know, I
(28:55):
told my brother, I texted himthat our numbers were really
good for the first winter ofbeing on the radio, never heard
back.
Now I know why I'm going tomiss, just knowing that it's
(29:16):
like he's on the other side ofthe podcast and I'm talking.
He's on the other side of thatphone in a way, and he's
messaging me back.
So, keith, I love you, I lovethe idea of you my entire life
(29:52):
and I'm very thankful andgrateful that you were my
brother in a really weird way,even though you were as absent
as you were In my mind, you werealways there and I'm going to
miss that.
I'm going to miss that.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.