June 15, 2023 • 37 mins
How can storytellers in media play a critical role in preventing gun violence? Actor Adam Brody joins us to share his insights on Hollywood's influence on gun culture and the power of storytelling to change hearts and minds. As an actor, Adam recognizes the impact that the stories we tell can have on shaping people's perceptions and the importance of having a higher level of conversation about gun violence, similar to the conversations we're finally having about gender and minority representation.
We discuss the needs to challenge cultural myths and present the risks and consequences of gun violence in a way that isn't threatening, and the potential of storytellers to make a difference in the fight against gun violence.
Further Reading:
Hollywood Actors, Directors, Creators Discuss Gun Safety (Brady)
Gun Guidelines for the Media (Hollywood Health and Society)
'Yellowstone' and Hollywood's Quiet Pivot to Showing Gun Safety Onscreen (the Ankler)
Adam Brody, Piper Perabo and More Call for Less Gun Violence on Screen at White House Roundtable: ‘Hollywood Has Been Due for a Reckoning’ (Variety)
Wrap Roundtable: Adam Brody Calls Out Onscreen Gun Violence as Big Part of the Problem – ‘American as Apple Pie’ (the Wrap)
For more information on Brady, follow us on social media @Bradybuzz or visit our website at bradyunited.org.
Full transcripts and bibliographies of this episode are available at bradyunited.org/podcast.
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 1-800-273-8255.
In a crisis? Text HOME to 741741 to connect with a Crisis Counselor 24/7.
Music provided by: David “Drumcrazie” Curby
Special thanks to Hogan Lovells for their long-standing legal support
℗&©2019 Red, Blue, and Brady
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
This is the legal disclaimer, where I tell you
that the views, thoughts andopinions shared on this podcast
belong solely to our guests andhosts and not necessarily Brady
or Brady's affiliates.
Please note this podcastcontains discussions of violence
that some people may finddisturbing.
It's okay, we find itdisturbing too.
Hey, everybody, welcome back toanother episode of Red Bull and
(00:44):
Brady.
I'm one of your hosts, jj, andtoday we're bringing you episode
two in our Show Your Safetyseries.
As you would know from theprevious episode, which I know
you've all listened to, showYour Safety is Brady's new
initiative where we're using thepower of storytellers in media
to fight gun violence throughall different sorts of avenues.
(01:05):
Today, kelly and I had theprivilege to sit down with actor
Adam Brody.
You've seen him on TV, you'veseen him in the movies and now
you're going to see him as anactivist.
We're going to start with Har'squestion.
Can you introduce yourself?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Adam Jared Brody of the San Diego Brody's.
I've been an actor for 24 yearsand that's me.
Well, an activist too, i dabble, i shout from my living room.
(01:41):
But I don't know whatconstitutes being an activist,
but I don't feel I've earnedthat label.
But I'm happy for theopportunity.
I'm happy to be here and try it.
I'm just happy for theopportunity to help in any way I
can.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
I feel like being an activist, though it's on a
spectrum.
I think just being aparticipant is enough.
Then, of course, there's, ithink, the folks that we meet
all the time who are like, iwould say, like capital A Yeah
yeah, yeah, like I've made ittheir life's work.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
Yeah, i am thankful for them.
I envy them, i'm not, but youknow.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
It was room for everybody.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Maybe someday It's not too late.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Well, for today.
we said you're here, we're inDC, for people who don't know.
So could you tell us why you'rein DC with Brady this week and
how you became interested andinvolved in efforts to prevent
gun violence?
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Sure, Well, I mean, in terms of gun violence in
general, it's one of thosethings.
I mean I have a lot ofpolitical and thoughts and
humanist thoughts.
To me it's the most flagrant.
I mean, it's the easiest fix,It's the biggest cell phone,
(02:55):
It's the most embarrassing, butthat's not the point.
I don't care.
It's the biggest abominationbecause of how simple, in a way,
the problem is.
I don't mean the solutions toget where we need to get are
simple.
The roadmap to get there isdifficult and clogged, but we're
(03:18):
unique in this way.
So we have other case teststhat prove that you don't have
to live like this and we areliterally and metaphorically
well.
I don't want to use any violentlanguage, but It's really hard,
though actually We have thesound of the podcast.
I was having this talk.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
A lot of gun metaphor in.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
English language.
It's built into our culture tothe point where it's
linguistically like it's therefor everything.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
So I mean, of all the causes, this is the one I sort
of were willfully.
Not only are so many, I meanagain, it's the number one cause
of death for children, anyways.
So there's that and it makes mewant to scream and it seems
like, of course I don't want todeny, some segments of the
(04:08):
population are affected muchmore than others, but this is
something that you can't totallybuy your way out of.
I mean, this is weird.
It's like domestic terrorism.
We're willingly letting thishappen willfully.
Anyways, those are some of mybasic thoughts about gun
violence And then, morespecifically, hollywood and our
(04:29):
culture and the stories we tell.
I think Hollywood is due for areal look in the mirror about
our influence and our influenceon promoting it.
I think Hollywood is makingmuch better gun commercials than
the gun companies themselves orthe NRA or any of these asshole
(04:51):
politicians.
There's no question in my mindthat a lot of the attraction and
sex appeal comes from themovies and shows and stories we
tell.
And so I don't want to soundlike a prude, i don't want to be
a prude and I don't want to bea censor, and at the same time I
(05:13):
totally think smoking.
We minimized it, then had somerules and got rid of it.
You can't smoke in an outdooradvertising campaign.
You can't smoke if it's not orrated R movie, and it's to me.
We're living through thisepidemic and something of that
magnitude is in order, and Ithink it would do a lot of good
(05:34):
as well as just.
I wish I didn't have to call itHollywood, but we know what we
mean when I mean have just ahigher level of conversation, in
the same way that we're finallyhaving it long overdue on
gender and minorityrepresentation.
When we tell stories now, we'remuch more conscious of these
things than we were five yearsago or a decade ago, and I just
(05:55):
feel like we haven't even begunthe work on guns yet.
But if we could, that's a powerwe have.
We can't force any laws yet,but we can change some hearts
and minds, and clearlysomething's broken in the hearts
and minds of this country,because I know that there's, as
I understand it, there's aminority.
You know, i understand that themajority want safer, safer
(06:16):
restrictions, less guns, etcetera, but and I understand
that we have a bit of a minorityrule in this country for
various reasons, but even so,the majority that wants it.
It's not so overwhelming thatwe're voting these people out of
office.
That won't, because they won'tchange the laws.
I mean, we still have a prettydivided, divided politicians,
(06:38):
and so I still think like weneed to do more work And at
least that's where perhaps wecan come in in terms of changing
the culture, and so, yeah,anyways, that said, brady,
through Twitter, reached out tome because I've been a bit vocal
about this stuff And and I wasthankful for the opportunity to
come And we, you know it waskind of a brainstorming session
(06:59):
really, but and and while I'mvery much here for that and I'm
very much here for because Ithink there's a myriad of ways,
you know, a lot of it was aboutsafe gun storage pretty, you
know, if you're gonna, we're notgonna get rid of guns and
movies, but let's think aboutstoring them more safely.
And I think all, all ideas,there's a million ways to chip
away at this and the way wedepict it or not depict it, and
(07:23):
and culturally, And so I thinkthere's a lot of good ideas
there, but for me, more thaneven, you know, brainstorming or
coming out with any specificplan, and just just raising
awareness of it's time to havethe conversation and look at it
with a harder lens.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
I think you know there's.
There's a lot that I think thatyou that you brought up.
That we're gonna discuss in asecond.
But one of the things that wehad discussed with Matt Nix on
the podcast was this idea oflike smoking went in movies and
in TV shows from being the thingthat like cool noir detective
did to like that was like thebumbling low class like.
There was this culture shift ofsmoking wasn't what heroes did,
(08:01):
right.
So is there a shift and thatcan be also be done with like
showing firearms and things like.
It's not.
I think it's used as asignifier.
So much for like.
This person is a badass, thisperson's very masculine, this
person is the guy in charge.
Why?
Because he's got the gun, he'sgot the gun skills.
So maybe there's a norm shift,even within content.
That can be done.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
There's a whole.
Yeah, well, as you said,there's a scale or a spectrum of
act activism.
I think there's a spectrum ofof of how you represent guns on
screen and and theireffectiveness.
You know, and I think that'sabsolutely shifting it to a more
negative character is one andand and again.
(08:41):
Safe storage, making storagecool, just like seatbelt.
Your hero should wear aseatbelt.
You know, like, have yourregular, your lead characters,
put on a seatbelt when they getin the car.
Same, you know they couldprobably have a safe.
You know, have a, have a somesafe storage.
And at the same time again, ihate to be like the nag in the
prude of the bunch, but I alsothink and again, i don't make my
(09:03):
action isn't my bread andbutter, even though I dabble and
I enjoy it and I watch it, iconsume it.
But but I also just think like,yeah, i mean less, what about
just less too?
and what about?
you know, in the same way, thatit's like no one's saying, you
know, let's get rid of all theguns, are saying like let's get
rid of assault weapons and thenlet's have some red flag, while
(09:24):
I was like we can, we can dothings like that and there's a
scale, you know, and I think wecould, we, you know, even just
quantity matters and and I just,if ever, before you do it,
think twice, think if there's analternative.
Do I need that because it'salso lazy?
I mean not always.
Sometimes it's essential forthe writing and they are
dramatic and they are cinematic,but oftentimes it's it's, it's
(09:46):
lazy and it's a crutch, and it'smuch more creative to think of
something deeper, or think of atleast that thing deep, more
deeply, and even if you aregoing to use it, think of it,
you know, think of where it camefrom, think of the
repercussions, etc.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
And I think one thing .
I could hear someone who maywant it, may be in good faith,
or maybe it's not, but someonemight say well, so what you're
saying is, it's the movies,that's the problem or it's the
media.
That's the problem.
But we know that Americanmovies, we are sort of the
leader around the world, butonly here do we have these
(10:23):
problems.
So why do you think that youknow it's particularly, there is
a role to play forentertainment, but it's
something about the system thatwe're in that really leads to
the shootings that we're seeinghere on Arsalao but not in the
UK.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Yeah, I was having this conversation earlier, and I
mean I think it, yeah, thepeculiarities of our political
system have the gridlock, theyou know have a lot.
I agree, clearly it's true that, like, we're the only ones that
have this, but our moviestravel and video games travel,
but that's the situation we'rein, you know, and I'm not even
saying I don't know if it's thechicken or the egg, you know,
but I'm not saying it's causingit necessarily, but I'm saying
(11:01):
it would help if we dialed itback, because these things are a
lot less sexy when Ted Cruzholds them, you know, than they
are when Keanu Reeves holds them.
That's a fact, you know.
and Hollywood is made up ofmodels, and you know.
and so, yeah, i thinkstigmatizing them a little more
and glamorizing them a littleless would go a long way to
(11:24):
moving the culture and themindset and forwarding the
conversation.
And with doing that, ideallyenough people could come over to
the side to vote in a way thatwe could actually enact
legislation.
I would love to live in theworld where we didn't have to
worry about it.
I could still make an argumentthat it might be time to evolve
from such a war-like mindset,but regardless, and as said, as
(11:45):
someone again, i keep saying itbut I love boxing.
I love, you know, i love sport,i like combat, but in certain
you know areas, but yeah, i meanregardless, i could say that it
might be just time to sort ofevolve anyway.
but either way, this is thesituation we find ourselves in
and me, as an actor, what can Ido?
(12:06):
Well, i could.
you know, i'm very conscious,again, of other, i'm conscious
of so many things.
I mean, i'm conscious of, andmore and more and more all the
time, of the sexism you knowthat's in a script I read, or et
cetera.
And you know, i don't feel thatit's stymied.
I feel like I'm a better artist, i feel like I'm a deeper
(12:28):
thinker than I was five, 10years ago.
so I don't feel, yeah, i don'tfeel stymied by thinking more
deeply and wisely about some ofthese issues and trying to tell
stories without mind.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
So I wonder what you would say to folks who would say
well, of course then, likeAmerican movies are in media and
whatnot is inherently violentbecause our society is violent.
Do you think it's just kind ofchicken and egg thing again, of
just mirroring and thenamplifying or.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
Again, i was having this conversation earlier and we
were talking about the foundingof this country and you know we
were sort of it was a violentrebellion and an overthrow and
or you know, at least not anoverthrow but a rebellion
nonetheless.
And you know this image of youknow, very self-made and very
independent and and I don't know, i don't know if that
(13:21):
psychology and all we've, youknow that mindset and that myth
we've, or you know truth, butalso you know we've mythologized
it over the years and I don'tknow if that's taken such deep
root that that's how we seeourselves.
Yeah, chicken or the egg, is ita mirror or not?
Well, i don't know, but let'swork on both, you know.
(13:43):
I mean, i guess like I wouldtake help on either side of the,
you know either side of thatchicken, or the chicken or the
egg and the egg.
Both need help, and harder.
You know I'm in the chickenbusiness, so I'll try and help
with the chicken and see if wecan't get the egg to come along.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Yeah, and something kind of in the background of
this conversation too is intalking about, for example,
firearms being emblematic ofcool right.
And we've had other guests onthe podcast come on and talk
about gender and masculinity andthe ways that for some men they
may think this is a way that Iwill ascend to coolness.
So then they buy the firearm intheir home and then they end up
(14:22):
hurting themselves.
And we live in a country wheremost of the gun deaths are
suicide and so some of thesedepictions too.
It may be that maybe it doesn'tcause someone to go out and
hurt someone else, but it causessomeone to go out, get a gun,
have that gun and then hurtthemselves when they go through
a hard time.
And Brady has an initiativecalled Show Your Safety which
engages, you know, leaders inthe television and film industry
(14:45):
, which you are, to sort ofmodel gun safety on screen in
order to change the culture, aswe've been talking about.
And you sign on to an openletter committing to make these
changes.
And so I'm wondering, since yousign on, what are some tangible
or even intangible ways thatthat started to influence you or
to change the way you thinkabout maybe a scene or a script?
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yeah, well, like I said, I mean I have the enviable
or unenviable position of nothaving to face this question too
much, because most of the stuffI get sent my way is rather
peaceful.
But I just did a movie.
It didn't change much.
I mean, i did do a movie overthe summer where I hold a gun
the whole movie And I thoughtlong and hard about it and I did
(15:29):
it And I'm still just to beperfectly honest.
So my justification was okay.
There's one gun in the movie.
I'm the bad guy.
It's a grounded movie And it'san instrument of terror in it.
Nothing good happens from it.
Only people you love get killed, you know.
So there are consequences forsure.
And it's more terrifying thananything.
(15:51):
That's one side of it And I canjustify it that way And I could
counter argument go yeah, but Igot some cool tattoos in it.
It's shot well, i look kind ofcool And that in of itself is an
ad, and so it's not black andwhite.
And if I had to tabulate it, iwould say that it comes out more
(16:14):
pro gun, but it comes out moreof an advocate for gun than a
detraction, even though it hasthose sort of stakes and
consequences built into it.
I'm still not denying that inmany, in probably the stronger
way, it is still.
You know, i don't wanna saypromotes, but you know it
(16:36):
doesn't-.
Condemn maybe It certainlydoesn't condemn And probably
it's still a little bitglorifies, And so I don't know.
But I did it And that onedidn't cross the line for me, I
would do it again.
I wouldn't do a movie likeBullet Train, you know I'm not
offered it, so it's not aproblem.
But like I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I don't think I would do
something at this point with alot of flippant gun violence for
(17:00):
shits and giggles.
I think I totally would havefive years ago and 10 years ago
I would have loved it, you know.
And now I see that I'm gonna goand I'm gonna just open up my
thing and put my sniper thingtogether And it makes me sick,
It makes me like to touch it.
You know I don't get a goodfeeling from it.
That's not a story I wanna tell, unless there's a great, unless
(17:22):
there's a really good reason.
But anyways, I don't know.
It's unquantifiable thesethings, you know, And so just
kind of making the bestcalculation I can.
But time will tell.
And do you answer your questionabout how tangible, like what
it really looks like for me?
And you know, I may never haveto pass on something that's, you
(17:42):
know, too gun-riddled.
I'll bullet late in or whatever.
Because of the nature of youknow who I am, But we'll see.
But I can make fun of the peoplethat do.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
And I think too, in some ways, what you're saying is
sort of what Brady is trying todo in some ways, which is
change culture, because you said10 years ago you would have
been like this is awesome, andthen five years ago you may not
have thought about it as much,and now you're at a point where
you're at least engaging andthinking about things
differently, and I think that'skind of what we want to happen.
(18:15):
It's just for at least forpeople to think, and not just on
your side, but on our side too,and by our side I mean
non-actors In Hollywood.
But just, you know, if you'regoing, if you're thinking about
buying a gun and you're afraidand you want it for self-defense
, can we at least get someone tothink about it, think about the
weight of it and safe storage.
So in some ways you're kind ofmodeling just what we want,
(18:38):
which is just to really thinkabout holistically firearms and
culture around them, rather thanjust sort of being an autopilot
.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
I think there's something tangible too, though,
and good and like actors ordirectors are like the folks who
are involved in storytelling,even if they are portraying, say
, like firearms ownership in aparticular way, where it's seen
as something that you reallylike, want, or that it's
enviable, like coming out to say, and that's a character that I
play and a thing that is made up, and it is not like how I live
(19:08):
my life.
And so, while my character maydo this thing and portrays gun
ownership as a really cool thing, hey, can we talk about the
fact that we lose eight kids aday, you know, to unsecured
firearms in the home?
So it's not as like entangledas I think of, like Charlton
Heston And like the charactersthat he played and then who he
was as a person for the NRAright.
So it's not that like I'm acowboy both on screen and in
(19:29):
real life.
You should wanna be like me.
It's hey, like consume themedia that I'm in, like I'm good
at my job, like it, but knowthat like as a real person.
These are also my opinions onthis here, or some things that,
like, you should read and checkup with.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
It's totally true.
However, i still feel that youknow the stories.
You know that we tell on screenand have a wider you know, and
that are promoted and that arecut into trailers and posters
and plastered throughout theworld has a wider reach than
(20:03):
anything I'm gonna say here.
You know, and so I don't know.
I am concerned first andforemost with that and, quite
simply, making it a little lesship.
I'm sick of it.
I'm sick of all these guysfucking raiding buildings with
their cool trigger fingers.
They're dorks they're dorks.
(20:25):
And it is such a crutch formasculinity and I don't know
they just never reckon with,like the truth, the reality of
that you know, And yeah, it'sthe leading cause of death for
kids.
It's time to have an adult, abig boy conversation and an
(20:50):
adult conversation about thisstuff And yeah, but I'm all for
anything, any little bit hereand there, in the same way that
I think the bill that was passedrecently seems pretty small,
but I'll take it And anything,anything, anything will save
lives.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
You're talking about the safer community.
Is that what it was like as ahouse?
Speaker 2 (21:11):
Anything.
I'm sure that saved lives, youknow, and so I don't know.
It was interesting again to bein this meeting and everyone had
different And again some peoplelike Matt are coming from gun
shows, you know, and there are alot of people from Yellowstone
represented and so differentcultures, different genres and
they obviously have a slightlydifferent take.
(21:31):
They're not necessarilyclamoring for less, but they're
clamoring for slightly differentrepresentation.
And I'll take it save storage,make it cool, great.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Yeah, and I think some of what you're saying too
about the stories that we tellin the culture.
I mean, I totally see that assomeone, as a black woman, for
example, and like the mediadepictions and the way that you
get these sort of stereotypesdisseminated through culture and
people don't even realize thatthey've picked up certain ideas
about people, but it's beenthrough entertainment.
(22:05):
So, Because we have spoken to alot of survivors, people who
have been shot but are nowparaplegic or suffering lifelong
, whether it's physical ormental or both Consequences is
that on TV a lot of times whensomeone is shot, they pop back
up.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
You know if it's like a detective show.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
It's like oh, i was out for a day and now I'm back
on the beat.
Yeah, we were talking aboutthat a lot.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
He was in fact, matt Nix and I were just talking and
he was saying, in Breaking Bad,the brother-in-law I think it's
the one guy Anyway he gets shotand then he recovers for like a
season, you know, and then hethought that was, and I agree,
and not all shows can bebreaking bad and not all shows
can do that kind of thing.
(22:49):
But yeah, i do think We alsotalked a lot as a group about,
yeah, not only the recovery butthe trauma to the body.
And you know, it's this weirdconundrum with, like it's a
rating system thing.
So like, if you shoot someoneand there's like a little speck
of blood, you can get PG-13.
And then your movie can make,your movie can be advertised.
(23:10):
It allows you to be advertisedmore places at different times,
make more money.
If you show it realistically,it's an automatic R And so
there's a real financialdisincentive, even though they
still want the violence to liketo completely sanitize it, and
so it's kind of the worst ofboth worlds.
I mean, it's a conundrum and Ifeel like the studios and the
(23:35):
rating systems need a bit of anadjustment to.
You know, because that's, yeah,that seems backwards.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Yeah, and it's interesting.
Sorry, i'm going script hereBecause I'm not in Hollywood, i
don't understand all the ratingstuff, but I think it's
interesting that there's such a.
It's PG-13 for a little bit ofblood, r for a lot, and we'll
regulate that.
But then when students are like, please, i don't want to die in
my classroom, i don't want tosee my friends die in my
classroom, that's, that's fine,that's not PG-13.
(24:06):
That's like elementary schoolstudents.
You know, we're fine with themseeing real death.
We don't want to do anythingabout that, but we will.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Yeah, we can't have it on the movies, yeah, although
although even that, you know, imean, i know this is very
controversial and I don't knowwhat it would look like
literally, or just, you know,conceptually.
But the idea of, like, what ifwe have to look at more of this
carnage?
I don't know, i don't want tolook at it, but I mean, would it
(24:35):
have an impact?
Probably, if I don't mean, idon't mean the movie depictions,
i mean the real stuff.
I don't know, like I said, idon't know the practicality of
that, but I do know that soundsimpactful.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
See, i wish and this is like I wish that I wish that
if it, if people saw it, itwould matter.
But I just but I don't.
I think we are now living in aworld such where it's become
normalized to the point where Ithink people have like shooting
fatigue.
So we know that there's a massshooting practically every day.
Yeah, sure, sure, make the news,but I also think that, like
(25:11):
post Sandy Hook and we stillcouldn't get a band pack, like I
I think that certainly topeople on the ground, there
might be a groundswell if theysaw those images and went this
is what I mean, kelly and I havetalked to survivors who have
been like this is what my thisis the last image I have of my
kid Like I had to do a DNA testto identify my child Like wow,
and they go to talk to theirelecteds and their electeds
(25:32):
don't vote.
So I think it would absolutelyhave a groundswell thing.
I don't think to the, tocertain people in power who have
that voting power right nowYeah, i think the ones who have
said no so far.
I don't think that would moveto a yes.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Oh, i don't.
I think those ones who said noto personally demonize them.
I know you guys I don't know ifyou can or not, but I will.
I think they're, you know,amoral ghouls and the fact that
I know it's only a handful ofthem, but they, they, they in
many ways represent, arerepresentative of their entire
party.
The trend of of of AR 15 pins,which is a, is a, a mascot of
(26:06):
murdered children.
I know they claim it meansother things, but it's actually
to troll.
It's actually to troll.
Uh, fucking people and and andwho care about dead kids.
It's so ghoulish I can't thinkI can't think of anything more
ghoulish, more awful.
I wear, and wear, a Nazi flag.
(26:26):
It's a.
this is where's Swastika?
There's no difference to me.
It's that outland.
it's that obscene, it's thatevil.
And uh, i don't think there'sanything changing their minds.
I don't think they have them, ijust think they want power.
They don't care, like I don'tthink they're they care about
anyone, but I do think agroundswell and you know, back
(26:48):
to the movies and culture, it'slike if enough people and I
don't know what it's going totake to to to reach critical
mass, but I think we have toreach critical mass.
you know, i know and forgive meif I said this earlier on the
same podcast versus aconversation I had an hour ago
but like I know that we havecertain democratic you know it's
sort of like it's a bit ofminority rule with peculiarities
(27:09):
to our, to our government, andthere's a bit of minority rule,
and I know that, yes, of course,the, the majority of Americans
want some version of uh gun,safety gun, whatever, whatever
benign uh descriptor suits you.
But, um, less murder And but notenough.
And again, i know it's a bit ofminority rule, but it's, it's
(27:32):
not so so, so, lopsided, stillnot enough to like vote these
people out, and that is mindblowing to me.
And again, that's where I feellike, well, let's talk
culturally, then let's talkattitudes, um, but what say you?
I mean what?
what is it going to take?
What are?
when does this reach criticalmass and do we have to?
(27:52):
is it, is it just Vietnam?
And it's just about putting amillion more people into the
furnace until people go?
okay, now, i've had it.
Now.
Now, or is there?
what is the fucking problem?
Speaker 1 (28:05):
I mean that's a million dollar question.
I'll just sit here and sit here, I mean part of it.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Part of it, I do think, is I mean, it's just the
structural problem, right, Andlike part of the structural
issues come from all the otherissues, like racism, for example
, like why isn't DC a state?
You know, so there's some of itis just we have these structures
, we have voter suppression, wehave ways of making sure that
not everybody has a say.
(28:31):
That aside, i do think with gunsand some of the entrenched, the
fact that a lot of people maynot vote something that we've
come across in our work is wetalk to people or we're in
spaces.
You know you'll be in alegislative space where there
are people who are ghoulish.
There.
We're not trying to, we can'tget them, but there are some
people that genuinely believethat, for whatever reason maybe
(28:55):
it's because of the guncompanies, maybe it's because of
some cultural thing with theirgrandpa that having a gun does
make them safer.
And if you're trying to have agun law, you are impeding in
their capacity to protect theirfamily And so you are a threat
to them.
And that's where I think a lotof this cultural work is
actually really importantbecause, to your point, the gun
(29:17):
industry has had a head start.
Some of our mythologies havehad a head start for decades and
centuries in some ways ofconvincing people that, like
this, gun is going to make yousafer.
And so for the people that arecoming at this and they're
coming at it with good faith andworking in the space for a
while.
I know it.
I've talked to a lot of friendsand they're like I don't get it
And I'm like I don't either, butI have had to enter in And
(29:39):
there are people that genuinelydo think like this is keeping me
safe, and if you are passing alaw, what you're actually doing
is you're on the slippery slope,which you're ultimately trying
to do is take away my capacityto keep my family safe, and so
that's where I think, helping toshow the risk and to show the
consequences in a way that's notthreatening because, like for
(30:02):
some people, they're not.
If it's coming at them from meor someone, they're going to say
, like you're a gunrapper,versus a story, so right, right.
There is a deep belief for a lotof people.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Yeah, Does that come from?
yeah, where do you think itcomes from?
Speaker 1 (30:18):
I mean.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
I guess a lot of places.
But yeah, i think.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
I mean starting from the fact that we're a nation
founded on settler colonialismAnd then that really needed to,
for a variety of reasons, to buyinto the mythos of like this
individualism.
Everybody had a gun wild white,like you need that for a
variety of reasons And then youneed it.
I think in the modern era, likeI think from the 60s on, when
(30:41):
the NRA started pounding moneyinto kind of that two prong
system that yes, a gun will makeyou safer in the home and that
a good guy with a gun canprevent.
I mean that came post SandyHook and Parkland but like that
a good guy with a gun will,despite the fact that that is
not true there have been, nowthat so many poor grad students
(31:03):
have spent so much time writinglike on like this, that these
two things are not true.
But when you've spent enoughmoney on the ad campaign and
you've had, like, theconferences and the cons and
everything else, that this isconsistent, it gets so tied in
then with your view of self andlike who you are.
I'm a protector, I need thisAnd again as Kelly said it.
(31:25):
So it makes cognitive sense thatanyone attempting to remove
this is attempting to chip awayof who I am as an American, as
an American, and then youstarted adding layers as an
American man, as an Americanwhite man, the protector, and
the law is interesting too.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
it's like I mean, i know it sounds self evident and
there's not much differencebetween that And I'm safe, i'm
keeping my family safe.
But the protector thing is a.
It's a powerful, you know it'sa powerful state.
You are a police officer, youare.
You know you are a sheriff, youare.
It's an authority position andand a power position.
(31:59):
You know that.
I guess, yeah, you feel lesspowerful without it.
I mean, i get that.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
To your point about the stories that we tell.
I mean it does?
it will make a difference,because even you know I'm
thinking of Jennifer Carlsonshe's a sociologist and she did
a lot of work around gender andgun violence and how the gun
industry sort of markets selfdefense.
Yeah, they focus on crime thatprimarily affects only white men
(32:27):
, and that's the type of it'sstranger danger, right?
So this idea of you're walkingdown the street, someone comes
after you, you need a firearm.
Well, a lot of crime happensbetween people who know each
other, or it's interpersonal orsorry, intimate partner violence
, and those are not, you know.
A lot of times in the movies orin TV it's like the homeowner,
it's the someone breaks in, theygot it, they protect their
(32:48):
family they're not reallyshowing like domestic violence
or you know, intimate partnerviolence, and so it kind of can
spur people to saying like I'mgoing to, i want to do that, i
want to buy a gun so I canprotect my family, and it's like
the call is coming from insidethe house.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah totally, totally , totally, totally, totally,
totally.
Yeah, it's, these are, theseare fantasies, that that we
create and imprint on people andkids, and it's, it's a
privilege to be able to do it,but it is a, it is a
responsibility, it is a powerAnd I think that, you know, i
(33:26):
just think a deeper, deeperthought about it is warranted
and exciting, by the way, iactually find it exciting.
I don't find this drab, i don'tfind this to be a bummer, like
I think, and I don't think itmeans that every show has to.
You know it has to be all aboutlockboxes and and and and and
(33:46):
tears, after you know.
But I just think there's awhole world of, you know,
stories and heroes and villainsand and and and and.
Let's get creative, is there?
Speaker 1 (33:59):
any?
do you have any hopes, like, inparticular, where you could see
like an initiative like thisgoing pie in the sky or Yeah, I
would love.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
I have no idea the feasibility of it, but because
it doesn't necessarily have toinvolve the government, I think
it would involve more of studiosand you don't have to deal with
that, You deal with the MPAAand you deal with studios and
it's a packed shame.
I don't care whatever it is, butbut um, where again I would say
to me pie in the sky but feelsdoable in the next five, 10
(34:31):
years is outdoor, outdoor ads.
I feel like that or like, evenmaybe like prime time, you know,
like make it a bit more of arated R, make it a cigarette,
and like we'll start withoutdoor and then we can talk
about what times of TV can youshow, whatever.
But like that is one that feelsdoesn't seem to repel or not
(34:54):
repel, um recoil or fucking gunterminology, um, um, anyways, it
doesn't seem to turn off peopletoo much.
You know, i've been floating inand I've it's, it's peaked some
interest and um, yeah, i feellike if we could take it off of
billboards, and you know, andthen, other than that, and I
think even more, you know, uh,achievable is just the
(35:19):
conversation of, and the Dweebafine of, of locking and loading
in your trailers and in all yourstories and in all your you
know for all, and I'll just youknow, um, yeah, that just just
just.
you're not as cool as you thinkAnd it's it's, you know, think
(35:40):
about the downstream effects.
just think about it, and and,and see if it's all necessary.
you know, um, and if everyonecould dial it back by a matter
of degrees, that would be great.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
I think that those like small, achievable steps
though, like just building onething after another, that's how
you know tangible changeactually happens.
So that's great.
And I mean seriously, adam, wecan't.
We can't thank you enough forputting your time and attention
behind this and for coming ontoday Hey want to share with the
podcast.
Listeners can now get in touchwith us here at Red, blue and
(36:14):
Brady via phone or text message.
Simply call or text us at480-744-3452 with your thoughts.
Questions concerns ideas, catpictures, whatever.
Speaker 3 (36:27):
Thanks for listening.
As always, brady's life-savingwork in Congress, the courts and
communities across the countryis made possible thanks to you.
For more information on Bradyor how to get involved in the
fight against gun violence,please like and subscribe to the
podcast.
Get in touch with us atBradyUnitedorg or on social at
BradyBuzz.
Be brave and remember.
(36:48):
Take action, not size.
This is the legal disclaimer, where I tell you
that the views, thoughts andopinions shared on this podcast
belong solely to our guests andhosts and not necessarily Brady
or Brady's affiliates.
Please note this podcastcontains discussions of violence
that some people may finddisturbing.
It's okay, we find itdisturbing too.
Hey, everybody, welcome back toanother episode of Red Bull and
(00:44):
Brady.
I'm one of your hosts, jj, andtoday we're bringing you episode
two in our Show Your Safetyseries.
As you would know from theprevious episode, which I know
you've all listened to, showYour Safety is Brady's new
initiative where we're using thepower of storytellers in media
to fight gun violence throughall different sorts of avenues.
(01:05):
Today, kelly and I had theprivilege to sit down with actor
Adam Brody.
You've seen him on TV, you'veseen him in the movies and now
you're going to see him as anactivist.
We're going to start with Har'squestion.
Can you introduce yourself?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Adam Jared Brody of the San Diego Brody's.
I've been an actor for 24 yearsand that's me.
Well, an activist too, i dabble, i shout from my living room.
(01:41):
But I don't know whatconstitutes being an activist,
but I don't feel I've earnedthat label.
But I'm happy for theopportunity.
I'm happy to be here and try it.
I'm just happy for theopportunity to help in any way I
can.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
I feel like being an activist, though it's on a
spectrum.
I think just being aparticipant is enough.
Then, of course, there's, ithink, the folks that we meet
all the time who are like, iwould say, like capital A Yeah
yeah, yeah, like I've made ittheir life's work.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
Yeah, i am thankful for them.
I envy them, i'm not, but youknow.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
It was room for everybody.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Maybe someday It's not too late.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Well, for today.
we said you're here, we're inDC, for people who don't know.
So could you tell us why you'rein DC with Brady this week and
how you became interested andinvolved in efforts to prevent
gun violence?
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Sure, Well, I mean, in terms of gun violence in
general, it's one of thosethings.
I mean I have a lot ofpolitical and thoughts and
humanist thoughts.
To me it's the most flagrant.
I mean, it's the easiest fix,It's the biggest cell phone,
(02:55):
It's the most embarrassing, butthat's not the point.
I don't care.
It's the biggest abominationbecause of how simple, in a way,
the problem is.
I don't mean the solutions toget where we need to get are
simple.
The roadmap to get there isdifficult and clogged, but we're
(03:18):
unique in this way.
So we have other case teststhat prove that you don't have
to live like this and we areliterally and metaphorically
well.
I don't want to use any violentlanguage, but It's really hard,
though actually We have thesound of the podcast.
I was having this talk.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
A lot of gun metaphor in.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
English language.
It's built into our culture tothe point where it's
linguistically like it's therefor everything.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
So I mean, of all the causes, this is the one I sort
of were willfully.
Not only are so many, I meanagain, it's the number one cause
of death for children, anyways.
So there's that and it makes mewant to scream and it seems
like, of course I don't want todeny, some segments of the
(04:08):
population are affected muchmore than others, but this is
something that you can't totallybuy your way out of.
I mean, this is weird.
It's like domestic terrorism.
We're willingly letting thishappen willfully.
Anyways, those are some of mybasic thoughts about gun
violence And then, morespecifically, hollywood and our
(04:29):
culture and the stories we tell.
I think Hollywood is due for areal look in the mirror about
our influence and our influenceon promoting it.
I think Hollywood is makingmuch better gun commercials than
the gun companies themselves orthe NRA or any of these asshole
(04:51):
politicians.
There's no question in my mindthat a lot of the attraction and
sex appeal comes from themovies and shows and stories we
tell.
And so I don't want to soundlike a prude, i don't want to be
a prude and I don't want to bea censor, and at the same time I
(05:13):
totally think smoking.
We minimized it, then had somerules and got rid of it.
You can't smoke in an outdooradvertising campaign.
You can't smoke if it's not orrated R movie, and it's to me.
We're living through thisepidemic and something of that
magnitude is in order, and Ithink it would do a lot of good
(05:34):
as well as just.
I wish I didn't have to call itHollywood, but we know what we
mean when I mean have just ahigher level of conversation, in
the same way that we're finallyhaving it long overdue on
gender and minorityrepresentation.
When we tell stories now, we'remuch more conscious of these
things than we were five yearsago or a decade ago, and I just
(05:55):
feel like we haven't even begunthe work on guns yet.
But if we could, that's a powerwe have.
We can't force any laws yet,but we can change some hearts
and minds, and clearlysomething's broken in the hearts
and minds of this country,because I know that there's, as
I understand it, there's aminority.
You know, i understand that themajority want safer, safer
(06:16):
restrictions, less guns, etcetera, but and I understand
that we have a bit of a minorityrule in this country for
various reasons, but even so,the majority that wants it.
It's not so overwhelming thatwe're voting these people out of
office.
That won't, because they won'tchange the laws.
I mean, we still have a prettydivided, divided politicians,
(06:38):
and so I still think like weneed to do more work And at
least that's where perhaps wecan come in in terms of changing
the culture, and so, yeah,anyways, that said, brady,
through Twitter, reached out tome because I've been a bit vocal
about this stuff And and I wasthankful for the opportunity to
come And we, you know it waskind of a brainstorming session
(06:59):
really, but and and while I'mvery much here for that and I'm
very much here for because Ithink there's a myriad of ways,
you know, a lot of it was aboutsafe gun storage pretty, you
know, if you're gonna, we're notgonna get rid of guns and
movies, but let's think aboutstoring them more safely.
And I think all, all ideas,there's a million ways to chip
away at this and the way wedepict it or not depict it, and
(07:23):
and culturally, And so I thinkthere's a lot of good ideas
there, but for me, more thaneven, you know, brainstorming or
coming out with any specificplan, and just just raising
awareness of it's time to havethe conversation and look at it
with a harder lens.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
I think you know there's.
There's a lot that I think thatyou that you brought up.
That we're gonna discuss in asecond.
But one of the things that wehad discussed with Matt Nix on
the podcast was this idea oflike smoking went in movies and
in TV shows from being the thingthat like cool noir detective
did to like that was like thebumbling low class like.
There was this culture shift ofsmoking wasn't what heroes did,
(08:01):
right.
So is there a shift and thatcan be also be done with like
showing firearms and things like.
It's not.
I think it's used as asignifier.
So much for like.
This person is a badass, thisperson's very masculine, this
person is the guy in charge.
Why?
Because he's got the gun, he'sgot the gun skills.
So maybe there's a norm shift,even within content.
That can be done.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
There's a whole.
Yeah, well, as you said,there's a scale or a spectrum of
act activism.
I think there's a spectrum ofof of how you represent guns on
screen and and theireffectiveness.
You know, and I think that'sabsolutely shifting it to a more
negative character is one andand and again.
(08:41):
Safe storage, making storagecool, just like seatbelt.
Your hero should wear aseatbelt.
You know, like, have yourregular, your lead characters,
put on a seatbelt when they getin the car.
Same, you know they couldprobably have a safe.
You know, have a, have a somesafe storage.
And at the same time again, ihate to be like the nag in the
prude of the bunch, but I alsothink and again, i don't make my
(09:03):
action isn't my bread andbutter, even though I dabble and
I enjoy it and I watch it, iconsume it.
But but I also just think like,yeah, i mean less, what about
just less too?
and what about?
you know, in the same way, thatit's like no one's saying, you
know, let's get rid of all theguns, are saying like let's get
rid of assault weapons and thenlet's have some red flag, while
(09:24):
I was like we can, we can dothings like that and there's a
scale, you know, and I think wecould, we, you know, even just
quantity matters and and I just,if ever, before you do it,
think twice, think if there's analternative.
Do I need that because it'salso lazy?
I mean not always.
Sometimes it's essential forthe writing and they are
dramatic and they are cinematic,but oftentimes it's it's, it's
(09:46):
lazy and it's a crutch, and it'smuch more creative to think of
something deeper, or think of atleast that thing deep, more
deeply, and even if you aregoing to use it, think of it,
you know, think of where it camefrom, think of the
repercussions, etc.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
And I think one thing .
I could hear someone who maywant it, may be in good faith,
or maybe it's not, but someonemight say well, so what you're
saying is, it's the movies,that's the problem or it's the
media.
That's the problem.
But we know that Americanmovies, we are sort of the
leader around the world, butonly here do we have these
(10:23):
problems.
So why do you think that youknow it's particularly, there is
a role to play forentertainment, but it's
something about the system thatwe're in that really leads to
the shootings that we're seeinghere on Arsalao but not in the
UK.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Yeah, I was having this conversation earlier, and I
mean I think it, yeah, thepeculiarities of our political
system have the gridlock, theyou know have a lot.
I agree, clearly it's true that, like, we're the only ones that
have this, but our moviestravel and video games travel,
but that's the situation we'rein, you know, and I'm not even
saying I don't know if it's thechicken or the egg, you know,
but I'm not saying it's causingit necessarily, but I'm saying
(11:01):
it would help if we dialed itback, because these things are a
lot less sexy when Ted Cruzholds them, you know, than they
are when Keanu Reeves holds them.
That's a fact, you know.
and Hollywood is made up ofmodels, and you know.
and so, yeah, i thinkstigmatizing them a little more
and glamorizing them a littleless would go a long way to
(11:24):
moving the culture and themindset and forwarding the
conversation.
And with doing that, ideallyenough people could come over to
the side to vote in a way thatwe could actually enact
legislation.
I would love to live in theworld where we didn't have to
worry about it.
I could still make an argumentthat it might be time to evolve
from such a war-like mindset,but regardless, and as said, as
(11:45):
someone again, i keep saying itbut I love boxing.
I love, you know, i love sport,i like combat, but in certain
you know areas, but yeah, i meanregardless, i could say that it
might be just time to sort ofevolve anyway.
but either way, this is thesituation we find ourselves in
and me, as an actor, what can Ido?
(12:06):
Well, i could.
you know, i'm very conscious,again, of other, i'm conscious
of so many things.
I mean, i'm conscious of, andmore and more and more all the
time, of the sexism you knowthat's in a script I read, or et
cetera.
And you know, i don't feel thatit's stymied.
I feel like I'm a better artist, i feel like I'm a deeper
(12:28):
thinker than I was five, 10years ago.
so I don't feel, yeah, i don'tfeel stymied by thinking more
deeply and wisely about some ofthese issues and trying to tell
stories without mind.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
So I wonder what you would say to folks who would say
well, of course then, likeAmerican movies are in media and
whatnot is inherently violentbecause our society is violent.
Do you think it's just kind ofchicken and egg thing again, of
just mirroring and thenamplifying or.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
Again, i was having this conversation earlier and we
were talking about the foundingof this country and you know we
were sort of it was a violentrebellion and an overthrow and
or you know, at least not anoverthrow but a rebellion
nonetheless.
And you know this image of youknow, very self-made and very
independent and and I don't know, i don't know if that
(13:21):
psychology and all we've, youknow that mindset and that myth
we've, or you know truth, butalso you know we've mythologized
it over the years and I don'tknow if that's taken such deep
root that that's how we seeourselves.
Yeah, chicken or the egg, is ita mirror or not?
Well, i don't know, but let'swork on both, you know.
(13:43):
I mean, i guess like I wouldtake help on either side of the,
you know either side of thatchicken, or the chicken or the
egg and the egg.
Both need help, and harder.
You know I'm in the chickenbusiness, so I'll try and help
with the chicken and see if wecan't get the egg to come along.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Yeah, and something kind of in the background of
this conversation too is intalking about, for example,
firearms being emblematic ofcool right.
And we've had other guests onthe podcast come on and talk
about gender and masculinity andthe ways that for some men they
may think this is a way that Iwill ascend to coolness.
So then they buy the firearm intheir home and then they end up
(14:22):
hurting themselves.
And we live in a country wheremost of the gun deaths are
suicide and so some of thesedepictions too.
It may be that maybe it doesn'tcause someone to go out and
hurt someone else, but it causessomeone to go out, get a gun,
have that gun and then hurtthemselves when they go through
a hard time.
And Brady has an initiativecalled Show Your Safety which
engages, you know, leaders inthe television and film industry
(14:45):
, which you are, to sort ofmodel gun safety on screen in
order to change the culture, aswe've been talking about.
And you sign on to an openletter committing to make these
changes.
And so I'm wondering, since yousign on, what are some tangible
or even intangible ways thatthat started to influence you or
to change the way you thinkabout maybe a scene or a script?
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yeah, well, like I said, I mean I have the enviable
or unenviable position of nothaving to face this question too
much, because most of the stuffI get sent my way is rather
peaceful.
But I just did a movie.
It didn't change much.
I mean, i did do a movie overthe summer where I hold a gun
the whole movie And I thoughtlong and hard about it and I did
(15:29):
it And I'm still just to beperfectly honest.
So my justification was okay.
There's one gun in the movie.
I'm the bad guy.
It's a grounded movie And it'san instrument of terror in it.
Nothing good happens from it.
Only people you love get killed, you know.
So there are consequences forsure.
And it's more terrifying thananything.
(15:51):
That's one side of it And I canjustify it that way And I could
counter argument go yeah, but Igot some cool tattoos in it.
It's shot well, i look kind ofcool And that in of itself is an
ad, and so it's not black andwhite.
And if I had to tabulate it, iwould say that it comes out more
(16:14):
pro gun, but it comes out moreof an advocate for gun than a
detraction, even though it hasthose sort of stakes and
consequences built into it.
I'm still not denying that inmany, in probably the stronger
way, it is still.
You know, i don't wanna saypromotes, but you know it
(16:36):
doesn't-.
Condemn maybe It certainlydoesn't condemn And probably
it's still a little bitglorifies, And so I don't know.
But I did it And that onedidn't cross the line for me, I
would do it again.
I wouldn't do a movie likeBullet Train, you know I'm not
offered it, so it's not aproblem.
But like I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I don't think I would do
something at this point with alot of flippant gun violence for
(17:00):
shits and giggles.
I think I totally would havefive years ago and 10 years ago
I would have loved it, you know.
And now I see that I'm gonna goand I'm gonna just open up my
thing and put my sniper thingtogether And it makes me sick,
It makes me like to touch it.
You know I don't get a goodfeeling from it.
That's not a story I wanna tell, unless there's a great, unless
(17:22):
there's a really good reason.
But anyways, I don't know.
It's unquantifiable thesethings, you know, And so just
kind of making the bestcalculation I can.
But time will tell.
And do you answer your questionabout how tangible, like what
it really looks like for me?
And you know, I may never haveto pass on something that's, you
(17:42):
know, too gun-riddled.
I'll bullet late in or whatever.
Because of the nature of youknow who I am, But we'll see.
But I can make fun of the peoplethat do.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
And I think too, in some ways, what you're saying is
sort of what Brady is trying todo in some ways, which is
change culture, because you said10 years ago you would have
been like this is awesome, andthen five years ago you may not
have thought about it as much,and now you're at a point where
you're at least engaging andthinking about things
differently, and I think that'skind of what we want to happen.
(18:15):
It's just for at least forpeople to think, and not just on
your side, but on our side too,and by our side I mean
non-actors In Hollywood.
But just, you know, if you'regoing, if you're thinking about
buying a gun and you're afraidand you want it for self-defense
, can we at least get someone tothink about it, think about the
weight of it and safe storage.
So in some ways you're kind ofmodeling just what we want,
(18:38):
which is just to really thinkabout holistically firearms and
culture around them, rather thanjust sort of being an autopilot
.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
I think there's something tangible too, though,
and good and like actors ordirectors are like the folks who
are involved in storytelling,even if they are portraying, say
, like firearms ownership in aparticular way, where it's seen
as something that you reallylike, want, or that it's
enviable, like coming out to say, and that's a character that I
play and a thing that is made up, and it is not like how I live
(19:08):
my life.
And so, while my character maydo this thing and portrays gun
ownership as a really cool thing, hey, can we talk about the
fact that we lose eight kids aday, you know, to unsecured
firearms in the home?
So it's not as like entangledas I think of, like Charlton
Heston And like the charactersthat he played and then who he
was as a person for the NRAright.
So it's not that like I'm acowboy both on screen and in
(19:29):
real life.
You should wanna be like me.
It's hey, like consume themedia that I'm in, like I'm good
at my job, like it, but knowthat like as a real person.
These are also my opinions onthis here, or some things that,
like, you should read and checkup with.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
It's totally true.
However, i still feel that youknow the stories.
You know that we tell on screenand have a wider you know, and
that are promoted and that arecut into trailers and posters
and plastered throughout theworld has a wider reach than
(20:03):
anything I'm gonna say here.
You know, and so I don't know.
I am concerned first andforemost with that and, quite
simply, making it a little lesship.
I'm sick of it.
I'm sick of all these guysfucking raiding buildings with
their cool trigger fingers.
They're dorks they're dorks.
(20:25):
And it is such a crutch formasculinity and I don't know
they just never reckon with,like the truth, the reality of
that you know, And yeah, it'sthe leading cause of death for
kids.
It's time to have an adult, abig boy conversation and an
(20:50):
adult conversation about thisstuff And yeah, but I'm all for
anything, any little bit hereand there, in the same way that
I think the bill that was passedrecently seems pretty small,
but I'll take it And anything,anything, anything will save
lives.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
You're talking about the safer community.
Is that what it was like as ahouse?
Speaker 2 (21:11):
Anything.
I'm sure that saved lives, youknow, and so I don't know.
It was interesting again to bein this meeting and everyone had
different And again some peoplelike Matt are coming from gun
shows, you know, and there are alot of people from Yellowstone
represented and so differentcultures, different genres and
they obviously have a slightlydifferent take.
(21:31):
They're not necessarilyclamoring for less, but they're
clamoring for slightly differentrepresentation.
And I'll take it save storage,make it cool, great.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Yeah, and I think some of what you're saying too
about the stories that we tellin the culture.
I mean, I totally see that assomeone, as a black woman, for
example, and like the mediadepictions and the way that you
get these sort of stereotypesdisseminated through culture and
people don't even realize thatthey've picked up certain ideas
about people, but it's beenthrough entertainment.
(22:05):
So, Because we have spoken to alot of survivors, people who
have been shot but are nowparaplegic or suffering lifelong
, whether it's physical ormental or both Consequences is
that on TV a lot of times whensomeone is shot, they pop back
up.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
You know if it's like a detective show.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
It's like oh, i was out for a day and now I'm back
on the beat.
Yeah, we were talking aboutthat a lot.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
He was in fact, matt Nix and I were just talking and
he was saying, in Breaking Bad,the brother-in-law I think it's
the one guy Anyway he gets shotand then he recovers for like a
season, you know, and then hethought that was, and I agree,
and not all shows can bebreaking bad and not all shows
can do that kind of thing.
(22:49):
But yeah, i do think We alsotalked a lot as a group about,
yeah, not only the recovery butthe trauma to the body.
And you know, it's this weirdconundrum with, like it's a
rating system thing.
So like, if you shoot someoneand there's like a little speck
of blood, you can get PG-13.
And then your movie can make,your movie can be advertised.
(23:10):
It allows you to be advertisedmore places at different times,
make more money.
If you show it realistically,it's an automatic R And so
there's a real financialdisincentive, even though they
still want the violence to liketo completely sanitize it, and
so it's kind of the worst ofboth worlds.
I mean, it's a conundrum and Ifeel like the studios and the
(23:35):
rating systems need a bit of anadjustment to.
You know, because that's, yeah,that seems backwards.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Yeah, and it's interesting.
Sorry, i'm going script hereBecause I'm not in Hollywood, i
don't understand all the ratingstuff, but I think it's
interesting that there's such a.
It's PG-13 for a little bit ofblood, r for a lot, and we'll
regulate that.
But then when students are like, please, i don't want to die in
my classroom, i don't want tosee my friends die in my
classroom, that's, that's fine,that's not PG-13.
(24:06):
That's like elementary schoolstudents.
You know, we're fine with themseeing real death.
We don't want to do anythingabout that, but we will.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Yeah, we can't have it on the movies, yeah, although
although even that, you know, imean, i know this is very
controversial and I don't knowwhat it would look like
literally, or just, you know,conceptually.
But the idea of, like, what ifwe have to look at more of this
carnage?
I don't know, i don't want tolook at it, but I mean, would it
(24:35):
have an impact?
Probably, if I don't mean, idon't mean the movie depictions,
i mean the real stuff.
I don't know, like I said, idon't know the practicality of
that, but I do know that soundsimpactful.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
See, i wish and this is like I wish that I wish that
if it, if people saw it, itwould matter.
But I just but I don't.
I think we are now living in aworld such where it's become
normalized to the point where Ithink people have like shooting
fatigue.
So we know that there's a massshooting practically every day.
Yeah, sure, sure, make the news,but I also think that, like
(25:11):
post Sandy Hook and we stillcouldn't get a band pack, like I
I think that certainly topeople on the ground, there
might be a groundswell if theysaw those images and went this
is what I mean, kelly and I havetalked to survivors who have
been like this is what my thisis the last image I have of my
kid Like I had to do a DNA testto identify my child Like wow,
and they go to talk to theirelecteds and their electeds
(25:32):
don't vote.
So I think it would absolutelyhave a groundswell thing.
I don't think to the, tocertain people in power who have
that voting power right nowYeah, i think the ones who have
said no so far.
I don't think that would moveto a yes.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Oh, i don't.
I think those ones who said noto personally demonize them.
I know you guys I don't know ifyou can or not, but I will.
I think they're, you know,amoral ghouls and the fact that
I know it's only a handful ofthem, but they, they, they in
many ways represent, arerepresentative of their entire
party.
The trend of of of AR 15 pins,which is a, is a, a mascot of
(26:06):
murdered children.
I know they claim it meansother things, but it's actually
to troll.
It's actually to troll.
Uh, fucking people and and andwho care about dead kids.
It's so ghoulish I can't thinkI can't think of anything more
ghoulish, more awful.
I wear, and wear, a Nazi flag.
(26:26):
It's a.
this is where's Swastika?
There's no difference to me.
It's that outland.
it's that obscene, it's thatevil.
And uh, i don't think there'sanything changing their minds.
I don't think they have them, ijust think they want power.
They don't care, like I don'tthink they're they care about
anyone, but I do think agroundswell and you know, back
(26:48):
to the movies and culture, it'slike if enough people and I
don't know what it's going totake to to to reach critical
mass, but I think we have toreach critical mass.
you know, i know and forgive meif I said this earlier on the
same podcast versus aconversation I had an hour ago
but like I know that we havecertain democratic you know it's
sort of like it's a bit ofminority rule with peculiarities
(27:09):
to our, to our government, andthere's a bit of minority rule,
and I know that, yes, of course,the, the majority of Americans
want some version of uh gun,safety gun, whatever, whatever
benign uh descriptor suits you.
But, um, less murder And but notenough.
And again, i know it's a bit ofminority rule, but it's, it's
(27:32):
not so so, so, lopsided, stillnot enough to like vote these
people out, and that is mindblowing to me.
And again, that's where I feellike, well, let's talk
culturally, then let's talkattitudes, um, but what say you?
I mean what?
what is it going to take?
What are?
when does this reach criticalmass and do we have to?
(27:52):
is it, is it just Vietnam?
And it's just about putting amillion more people into the
furnace until people go?
okay, now, i've had it.
Now.
Now, or is there?
what is the fucking problem?
Speaker 1 (28:05):
I mean that's a million dollar question.
I'll just sit here and sit here, I mean part of it.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Part of it, I do think, is I mean, it's just the
structural problem, right, Andlike part of the structural
issues come from all the otherissues, like racism, for example
, like why isn't DC a state?
You know, so there's some of itis just we have these structures
, we have voter suppression, wehave ways of making sure that
not everybody has a say.
(28:31):
That aside, i do think with gunsand some of the entrenched, the
fact that a lot of people maynot vote something that we've
come across in our work is wetalk to people or we're in
spaces.
You know you'll be in alegislative space where there
are people who are ghoulish.
There.
We're not trying to, we can'tget them, but there are some
people that genuinely believethat, for whatever reason maybe
(28:55):
it's because of the guncompanies, maybe it's because of
some cultural thing with theirgrandpa that having a gun does
make them safer.
And if you're trying to have agun law, you are impeding in
their capacity to protect theirfamily And so you are a threat
to them.
And that's where I think a lotof this cultural work is
actually really importantbecause, to your point, the gun
(29:17):
industry has had a head start.
Some of our mythologies havehad a head start for decades and
centuries in some ways ofconvincing people that, like
this, gun is going to make yousafer.
And so for the people that arecoming at this and they're
coming at it with good faith andworking in the space for a
while.
I know it.
I've talked to a lot of friendsand they're like I don't get it
And I'm like I don't either, butI have had to enter in And
(29:39):
there are people that genuinelydo think like this is keeping me
safe, and if you are passing alaw, what you're actually doing
is you're on the slippery slope,which you're ultimately trying
to do is take away my capacityto keep my family safe, and so
that's where I think, helping toshow the risk and to show the
consequences in a way that's notthreatening because, like for
(30:02):
some people, they're not.
If it's coming at them from meor someone, they're going to say
, like you're a gunrapper,versus a story, so right, right.
There is a deep belief for a lotof people.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Yeah, Does that come from?
yeah, where do you think itcomes from?
Speaker 1 (30:18):
I mean.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
I guess a lot of places.
But yeah, i think.
Speaker 1 (30:21):
I mean starting from the fact that we're a nation
founded on settler colonialismAnd then that really needed to,
for a variety of reasons, to buyinto the mythos of like this
individualism.
Everybody had a gun wild white,like you need that for a
variety of reasons And then youneed it.
I think in the modern era, likeI think from the 60s on, when
(30:41):
the NRA started pounding moneyinto kind of that two prong
system that yes, a gun will makeyou safer in the home and that
a good guy with a gun canprevent.
I mean that came post SandyHook and Parkland but like that
a good guy with a gun will,despite the fact that that is
not true there have been, nowthat so many poor grad students
(31:03):
have spent so much time writinglike on like this, that these
two things are not true.
But when you've spent enoughmoney on the ad campaign and
you've had, like, theconferences and the cons and
everything else, that this isconsistent, it gets so tied in
then with your view of self andlike who you are.
I'm a protector, I need thisAnd again as Kelly said it.
(31:25):
So it makes cognitive sense thatanyone attempting to remove
this is attempting to chip awayof who I am as an American, as
an American, and then youstarted adding layers as an
American man, as an Americanwhite man, the protector, and
the law is interesting too.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
it's like I mean, i know it sounds self evident and
there's not much differencebetween that And I'm safe, i'm
keeping my family safe.
But the protector thing is a.
It's a powerful, you know it'sa powerful state.
You are a police officer, youare.
You know you are a sheriff, youare.
It's an authority position andand a power position.
(31:59):
You know that.
I guess, yeah, you feel lesspowerful without it.
I mean, i get that.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
To your point about the stories that we tell.
I mean it does?
it will make a difference,because even you know I'm
thinking of Jennifer Carlsonshe's a sociologist and she did
a lot of work around gender andgun violence and how the gun
industry sort of markets selfdefense.
Yeah, they focus on crime thatprimarily affects only white men
(32:27):
, and that's the type of it'sstranger danger, right?
So this idea of you're walkingdown the street, someone comes
after you, you need a firearm.
Well, a lot of crime happensbetween people who know each
other, or it's interpersonal orsorry, intimate partner violence
, and those are not, you know.
A lot of times in the movies orin TV it's like the homeowner,
it's the someone breaks in, theygot it, they protect their
(32:48):
family they're not reallyshowing like domestic violence
or you know, intimate partnerviolence, and so it kind of can
spur people to saying like I'mgoing to, i want to do that, i
want to buy a gun so I canprotect my family, and it's like
the call is coming from insidethe house.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah totally, totally , totally, totally, totally,
totally.
Yeah, it's, these are, theseare fantasies, that that we
create and imprint on people andkids, and it's, it's a
privilege to be able to do it,but it is a, it is a
responsibility, it is a powerAnd I think that, you know, i
(33:26):
just think a deeper, deeperthought about it is warranted
and exciting, by the way, iactually find it exciting.
I don't find this drab, i don'tfind this to be a bummer, like
I think, and I don't think itmeans that every show has to.
You know it has to be all aboutlockboxes and and and and and
(33:46):
tears, after you know.
But I just think there's awhole world of, you know,
stories and heroes and villainsand and and and and.
Let's get creative, is there?
Speaker 1 (33:59):
any?
do you have any hopes, like, inparticular, where you could see
like an initiative like thisgoing pie in the sky or Yeah, I
would love.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
I have no idea the feasibility of it, but because
it doesn't necessarily have toinvolve the government, I think
it would involve more of studiosand you don't have to deal with
that, You deal with the MPAAand you deal with studios and
it's a packed shame.
I don't care whatever it is, butbut um, where again I would say
to me pie in the sky but feelsdoable in the next five, 10
(34:31):
years is outdoor, outdoor ads.
I feel like that or like, evenmaybe like prime time, you know,
like make it a bit more of arated R, make it a cigarette,
and like we'll start withoutdoor and then we can talk
about what times of TV can youshow, whatever.
But like that is one that feelsdoesn't seem to repel or not
(34:54):
repel, um recoil or fucking gunterminology, um, um, anyways, it
doesn't seem to turn off peopletoo much.
You know, i've been floating inand I've it's, it's peaked some
interest and um, yeah, i feellike if we could take it off of
billboards, and you know, andthen, other than that, and I
think even more, you know, uh,achievable is just the
(35:19):
conversation of, and the Dweebafine of, of locking and loading
in your trailers and in all yourstories and in all your you
know for all, and I'll just youknow, um, yeah, that just just
just.
you're not as cool as you thinkAnd it's it's, you know, think
(35:40):
about the downstream effects.
just think about it, and and,and see if it's all necessary.
you know, um, and if everyonecould dial it back by a matter
of degrees, that would be great.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
I think that those like small, achievable steps
though, like just building onething after another, that's how
you know tangible changeactually happens.
So that's great.
And I mean seriously, adam, wecan't.
We can't thank you enough forputting your time and attention
behind this and for coming ontoday Hey want to share with the
podcast.
Listeners can now get in touchwith us here at Red, blue and
(36:14):
Brady via phone or text message.
Simply call or text us at480-744-3452 with your thoughts.
Questions concerns ideas, catpictures, whatever.
Speaker 3 (36:27):
Thanks for listening.
As always, brady's life-savingwork in Congress, the courts and
communities across the countryis made possible thanks to you.
For more information on Bradyor how to get involved in the
fight against gun violence,please like and subscribe to the
podcast.
Get in touch with us atBradyUnitedorg or on social at
BradyBuzz.
Be brave and remember.
(36:48):
Take action, not size.
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