Bridging Policy and Compassion With the White House's Quest for Gun Violence Prevention

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
JJ Janflone (00:08):
This is the Legal Disclaimer, where I tell you
that the views, thoughts andopinions shared on this podcast
belong solely to our guests andhosts and not necessarily Brady
or Brady's affiliates.
Please note this podcastcontains discussions of violence
that some people may finddisturbing.
It's okay, we find itdisturbing too.
Hey, everybody, welcome to avery special episode of Red,

(00:44):
blue and Brady.
I'm JJ, one of your hosts, andin this week's episode, my
co-host, kelly Sampson, and Iwere so fortunate to sit down
not just with Chris Brown, thepresident of Brady, but with
Greg Jackson and Rob Wilcox ofthe White House Office of Gun
Violence Prevention, and we satdown in the you may have guessed
it White House.

(01:07):
Greg and Rob welcomed all of usin to talk not just about the
Office of Gun ViolencePrevention and Brady, but about
the reality of fighting for gunviolence prevention in 2024, and
what we can all be lookingforward to in the year ahead as
activists, advocates and, youknow, american citizens.

(01:27):
If you want to see ourbeautiful smiling faces and have
an extended version of thispodcast, feel free to hop on
over to Brady's YouTube page,where a full, unedited version
is posted and you can see whatit's really like to be in the
room with us when we record.
A link to that will be in thedescription of this episode.
So without further ado, I'mjust going to slide us right on

(01:48):
into the episode itself.
Enjoy and remember the office.
And you know this podcastwouldn't be here without you.

Kris Brown (01:57):
I'm Chris Brown.
I am the president of Brady.

Rob Wilcox (02:00):
United Against Gun.

Greg Jackson (02:00):
Violence and I'm very.

Kris Brown (02:02):
I have a lot of good days, some really hard days,
and today's a great day to behere with the leaders of the
Office of Gun ViolencePrevention and with you guys.
So thank you.

I love a good day.

Kris Brown (02:13):
Yes, we have to celebrate, though.

Like, I feel like give people their flowers when
you can and like, enjoy the goodtimes of the good conversations
Absolutely, and so with that,maybe we can kick it over to you
two, gentlemen, I'll start so.

Greg Jackson one of the deputies for the White
House Office of Gun ViolencePrevention, also special
assistant to the president.
I guess my job here is to helpus build out this really
historic, transformative effortto address gun violence in our
country, and we'll talk moreabout our office as a whole.
But Rob and I have really beena yin-yang, building out this

(02:46):
all-government approach andthinking about the reactive
efforts that need to be builtout as well as the long-term and
short-term proactive efforts,and so I'm excited to be here
kind of lean deeper into theinvestments and how we can bring
more resources to those whohave been impacted by gun
violence and so excited to buildthat momentum.

Rob, how about you?

Rob Wilcox (03:05):
to those who have been impacted by gun violence
and so excited to build thatmomentum.
Rob, how about you?
So I'm Rob Wilcox.
I'm the other special assistantto the president for gun
violence prevention and deputydirector of this White House
office, and I think we're hereto carry out the president's and
vice president's vision andcommitment, because both of them
know that this issue is filledwith pain, but they know that
with that pain comes so muchpurpose.
But it only gets them withpolicy, and so this office is

(03:27):
meant to execute that policy andimplement that policy, and so
we honestly come to this jobevery single day with really
just one goal in mind, which issaving lives, and using the
incredible tools at our disposalin the federal government that
have, honestly, never been usedbefore to do that.

And I love that you highlighted the pain to purpose
part of this, because I thinkso many folks have come to gun
violence prevention becausethey've been directly impacted
and I know that's the realityfor both of you unfortunately,
and so I'm wondering, as much asyou're comfortable, if everyone
at the table could share howyou got into this gun violence
prevention work, as opposed tolike there's so many other
social good things that youcould be doing.

you're all clearly brilliant well, I mean, for me,
I was someone who was alwayspassionate about politics and
government and I I was that kidwhen I was young and even though
I grew up in rural virginia,part of my youth I was watching
c-span and reading about martinluther king and obsessed over
the malcolm x movie and was,like man, there's so much power
in people, you know, to make theworld a better place, and all I

(04:27):
could see was challenges and Ithought, well, if I could get
into politics and government,maybe this people power I could
be one of those leaders to helpharness that to make our country
better.
So I started my career reallyin politics and did two
presidential campaigns, a coupleSenate campaigns and a handful
of congressional campaigns aswell.
I thought that was kind of mycalling.

(04:48):
It was, you know, kind ofhelping to become a kingmaker
for future leaders, until I wasshot in April of 2013,.
And the bullet that hit me hittwo arteries near the cost of my
life, and there was just twodistinguishing moments.
One was how I was treated inthe hospital.
Two distinguishing moments Onewas how I was treated in the
hospital.
When I entered the hospital, Iwas interrogated by

(05:08):
investigators about my role inthe crime and I was treated as a
suspect while I was fightingfor my life, literally, and so I
just that really stuck with methat, no matter what I had done
to make this world a betterplace, in the most urgent moment
of my life I was seen as apotential criminal, as opposed
to a life to save.

(05:28):
And then the other side of itwas when I made it through my
surgery, I turned on CNN and Iwas shot three days after the
failed Senate background checkvote and I was watching the same
leaders that I helped elect,that I believed in and I was
passionate about that I haddevoted most of my life to
serving or fighting for, makeexcuses of how they couldn't
take action on this issue andthat this wasn't the time and

(05:50):
they couldn't find the solution,couldn't come to common ground.
And so I lost, frankly, a lot offaith in just empowering people
to be those leaders and decidedthat I was going to pivot from
electing and fighting forleaders to fighting for this
issue, and if those leadersaren't aligned with this issue,
then they're not aligned with me.
And so that's where I made thathard pivot from campaign

(06:13):
politics to really issueadvocacy and issue organizing.
And so, yeah, I hadn't turnedback.
But I spent 10 years in thatfight alongside a lot of you
here.
It was not easy.
I think the first six or sevenyears we were just kind of
yelling at the wall.

We're going to talk about that in a minute.
It's just like how much haschanged so quickly.

Yeah, yeah and so, but that's really what got me
started, and I'm just reallythankful that that moment of
trauma really has led to nowkind of an era of triumph for
our movement, and I'm just gladto be a part of that.

Rob Wilcox (06:46):
And to your point, JJ, about things changing
quickly, they also took time.
Yes, and I think about how Igot involved and I grew up in
Brooklyn, new York, between acouple of housing projects in
the 80s and 90s and there wasviolence, but my family never
thought about themselves as theones.

They thought about us, my brother and I.

Rob Wilcox (07:09):
But I think what brought the issue of guns
directly to our family was acousin across the country in
Northern California and she wasbeautiful inside and out and my
aunt and uncle, Nick and Amanda,had been donating to Brady for
years, which is wild to me.
But then she was home fromwinter break from Haverford and
volunteering at the local mentalhealth hospital and this
individual stopped taking hismedicine and he walked in and

(07:30):
killed her and his brother sawthe sign and wanted to take
action and did it and thatfuneral.
I wasn't there but I went rightto the funeral.
And that moment sticks with meand I think about it.
And I told myself then that Iwas going to do what I could
about this issue.
And then I went to DC rightafter I graduated college and I
came right to Brady becausethat's who was doing incredible
work.
But I can tell you, in 2001,.

(07:51):
What I remember clear as I sithere now, was the article in the
Washington Post where the NRAsaid with the election of George
W Bush they'd work out of theWest Wing.
And we're going to talk about alot of this in this podcast,
but what I can tell you is, 20years later, they're not working
out of the West Wing.
It is gun violence survivorsand the Office of Gun Violence
Prevention.

Yeah, and that's amazing, y'all have a plaque.
You're there.

Kris Brown (08:14):
You know what?

I mean, and I think that that's astounding for
folks who, as I mentioned, fordecades have been working in
this, for decades have beenseeing people who we've lost,
who have been taken from us, andare saying, okay, well, I'm
still going to be here, I'mstill going to fight, but now
we're starting to see thatmomentum.
I think really fall there.
And I'm wondering too, like forChris so you don't come to this
movement?

Kelly Sampson (08:34):
as a survivor.

How do you get involved with this?
You know how did what made youdecide Brady's going to be the
thing, gun violence is going tobe the thing that you devote a
lot of your professional life to.

Kris Brown (08:45):
Yeah, well, I think, like many people of my
generation, I remember exactlywhere I was when Jim Brady was
shot in the assassinationattempt of Ronald Reagan.
That was a seminal moment in mylife, and so I think, as an
American, regardless of where weare, what we do, especially
fast forward to.
All of these years later.

(09:06):
The reality is, most of us feellike we're only a few steps
away from potential violencewith guns, and so what brought
me to this is I worked on theissue of gun violence prevention
when I worked on Capitol Hill along time ago now Capitol Hill
a long time ago now.

(09:26):
I got to meet Jim and SarahBrady and I viewed them as most
staffers did, who would clamorto meet these folks, because
they did it with passion andenthusiasm, just like these guys
do every single day, and whatthey bring to the roles.
But they also had heart andhumor, and that's how it is that
you get things done over a longperiod of time six years and
seven votes.
To me that was a testament ofgreat success.

(09:47):
Like my hero, john Lewis right,I think of our movement as
basically a movement right, acollective movement for a safer
America for all.
For me, what brought me backwas I lived overseas with my
family.
I have two children.
Back was I lived overseas withmy family.

(10:07):
I have two children, two girls.
I lived in Switzerland whereper capita it's the highest gun
ownership in all of Europe andthey don't have gun violence
like we have here.

The fact of the matter is, you are inspected
randomly for how you store gunsin Switzerland.

Kris Brown (10:19):
Wow, right, so safe storage is required.
And it gave me a differentquality of life and that was
meaningful enough to me thatwhen I moved back to the United
States, I thought this is theissue, that I think that I want
to spend my time on as anactivist as an activist because
I care about my country, I careabout its future and I think, if

(10:45):
you consider yourself a deeplypatriotic American, the only
thing you can choose is to be achampion and an advocate for gun
violence prevention.
So that's why I'm so proud tosit here today.

I feel pumped up now, but thank you all for
sharing how you got involved andI know for some people
listening to the podcast they'refamiliar with you all, but I
hope everyone listening hasheard that.
Robin Greger the real deal andthey are in the white house for
you, and so I'm wondering if youcould break it down and start

(11:17):
from the beginning.
What does it mean to have anOffice of Gun Violence
Prevention in the White House?
Some people might be thinkingwell, don't we already have
Congress?
Like what is it, what does it do, what's the purpose and why was
it founded?

Rob Wilcox (11:30):
Look it's founded because the president has a
commitment to this issue periodand the president has taken
action on this issue since thefirst day and he's done.
He's made more executive actionthan any president in history,
not just on one type of gunviolence, but all Domestic
violence, community violence,mass shootings, school shootings

(11:52):
, firearm suicide.
He tried to do as much as hecould with the tools that he had
.
Thanks to this movement, we alsopassed the law, the Bipartisan
Safer Communities Act, whichgave a whole set of new tools
and investments, and so thisoffice is the manifestation of
his desire to do every singlething possible to address this
crisis.
And so when he hired us, hesaid I need you to do four

(12:14):
things.
This is where Greg and I weretag team.

But he said I need you to implement the
Bipartisan Safer Communities Actmy executive actions.

Rob Wilcox (12:21):
So we've had to dig deep into where's the funding
going, how's it beingprioritized?
Are we actually solving thisproblem and are we using the
tools to ensure that guns aren'tgetting into the wrong hands
and we're holding the gunindustry accountable?
The second thing is to be bold.
Bring your new ideas, think ofnew executive actions, thing he
said be bold, bring your newideas, think of new executive
actions.
And so we put 80 ideas in playacross 16 agencies, because his

(12:42):
view and vision and that of thevice president is that it isn't
just a single agency's problem,it's not a single person's
problem, it's all of us, and sowe've really broken it down so
it's not just a Department ofJustice, but Department of Labor
, education, health and HumanServices.
And each of them are asked asimple question education,
health and human services.
And each of them are asked asimple question what can you do
for this crisis?

(13:02):
And our first week on the job,the vice president and president
convened the cabinet and athird of that meeting was taken
up on our issue, where they werechallenged to bring ideas to
the table.

And then we were sent to go make sure that we
were getting it done and thesethings are showing up in real
ways.

Rob Wilcox (13:18):
It's grant programs for youth employment that
prioritize communities that havesuffered violence, that are
serving the kids who've beenjust as impacted, because we
know summer youth employmentmeans less violence.
It's the Department ofEducation leaning in and saying
we're going to talk about securegun storage, we're going to
encourage principals and givethem the tools they need to make
sure that we are helpingcommunities do better, because

(13:40):
we know safe gun storage saveslives, means less teen suicide,
less accidents, fewer schoolshootings, fewer thefts, and so
that, I think, has been some ofthe big challenges that we've
gotten, and it's because thispresident and vice president
believe to their core that wehave to be doing everything in
our power to address the numberone killer of kids and youth in
this country.

(14:00):
But those are just the firsttwo that she's missing, and Greg
can talk to the next two.

Well, the third big charge was how do we expand
partnerships at the state andlocal level?
And I think, as activists,especially folks who are very
active in their cities and intheir states, you know, we know
those fights in statelegislatures or in budget
meetings, the city council,pretty intimately, but it's rare
, I think, especially asactivists, for us to see the
White House play a role in thosetypes of battles.

(14:28):
And so the president laid outthat, hey, we need to help them
fight these fights.
We know that we're seeinghistoric momentum across the
country, whether it's assaultweapons ban in different states
or 30 states that are investingin community violence
intervention for the first time.
But how do we get in and help?

(14:48):
And so the first thing we didwas we pulled together a
convening of state legislatorsto highlight those who are doing
outstanding work, especially instates that are a little
tougher because of theDemocratic makeup or the
legislative makeup.
And we thought we would havemaybe 10, 20 legislators come,
but we had over 100 legislatorsrepresenting 39 states.
It was the largest convening inWhite House history of state
legislators.
Of any issue of thisadministration but of gun

(15:09):
violence, this was the largestthey've ever had, and we packed
the room and the energy wasn'tsomber, it wasn't anger, it was
energy and excitement.
And we saw folks from redstates that were like, hey,
we're moving forward with victimservices.
We saw folks in blue statesthat were like, hey, we can do
better on state storage.
And we saw folks in the middlethat for the first time, saw
their role in the fight and soin that convening we rolled out

(15:31):
our Safer States Agenda whichfrankly was a collaboration,
along with so many differentorganizations throughout the
movement, of really the best ofwhat they've been fighting for
years, whether that's creatingoffices, fighting for trauma
recovery centers, looking atloss of stolen guns, all of the
different fights that we as amovement have been fighting for
so long.

Rob Wilcox (15:51):
We laid those out as a.

Sanford State's agenda and showed that hey these
are all ideas that the WhiteHouse supports.
These are ways that you cansave lives.
And guess what?
Here's a report card to showwhere your state is, and many of
them are like whoa, you know,we're going to walk through and
brag.

No, you've got to work on these, right.
New York, you've got to gethere.
Oh, guess what?

Rob Wilcox (16:14):
Texas is ahead of you here.

Whoa, texas, yes, texas is ahead in this area, and
so that was a big eye-openingmoment.
And, on top of all of that,this was when we first started
the vice president closed theevent and she challenged them.
She said I know we can do more,I know we can succeed, I know
that we can change this, and weneed an aggressive fight at the
state and local level, just likewe're seeing federally.
And so, of those 39 states, 27of those states have already

(16:38):
advanced, introduced and somehave even passed new legislation
from that agenda and directlycredited the Safer States Agenda
, which we know was acollaborative effort across the
movement.
So we're going to keep buildingon that, looking at cities,
looking at counties and reallyshowing communities across the
country how they can all play arole in making our country safer
, as opposed to just waiting forWashington to take action.

(17:00):
Our last big challenge, whichI'm most passionate about,
frankly, is improving inservices for victims and
communities that have beenimpacted by gun violence.
The president saw in Buffalo,in Uvalde, in frankly, all the
day to day gun violence, theletters that are mailed to him
he actually reads many of theletters that folks write that
we're not doing enough forvictims.

(17:22):
We're leaving them behind andwe're leaving them with hospital
bills, we're leaving them withtrauma and we're leaving them
without hope, and that isfueling this cycle of violence.
And we saw in Buffalo andUbalde, where communities that
were already struggling withresources and supports were
totally destroyed by thesetragedies.
And so our team has beenbuilding out a 12-agency

(17:42):
FEMA-style response.
We've done a series oflistening sessions.
We talked with Howlin Park lastweek, we talked with the
community in Baltimore two weeksbefore that, and we're hearing
from these communities, in theaftermath of their tragedies,
what could have been donedifferently?

what?

supports could they have and how do we improve
moving forward?
Secondly, we're looking at howdo we make changes to the
supports for people who don'tget the media and looking
specifically at VOCA, and justrecently we introduced a new
proposed rule that will expandthe usage of VOCA, that will
make it more equitable, thatwill remove some of those
barriers that we know areblocking folks from getting the

(18:16):
resources they need, and thecomment period is open until
April 5th of 2024.
So we hope that folks who havebeen impacted by this crisis
will look to that and reallyweigh in on.
Is this going far enough?
How do we improve the resourcesfor victims and those who have
been impacted by gun violence?
And our office is workingreally closely with agencies to
make sure that we are doing asmuch as possible to help people

(18:37):
recover after tragedy violence,and our office is working really
closely with agencies to makesure that we are doing as much
as possible to help peoplerecover after tragedy.
And the one last challenge isand this is from the vice
president director she said thatif there's something great,
that's happening in the countryshe wants to know about it.
And if we can lift it, we should, because the best ideas are not
always coming from thisbuilding.
They're coming from communitiesall over the country, and so

(18:59):
we're doing our best to liftthings, whether it's the CBI
Leadership Academy, theUniversity of Chicago or Palo
Corp, which is using AmeriCorpsresources to provide employment
opportunities in Philadelphia orDetroit, where they have folks
who are volunteers.
They have young folks who arenow working with law enforcement
and doing some of the civilianback-of work to support law

(19:20):
enforcement with the UrbanSafety Corps.
Like these different, creative,innovative ways that
communities are working toaddress this crisis.
We're lifting and trying tohelp facilitate the sharing of
these ideas, because that's whata true all of government but
really a true public healthapproach is is applying all of
these different ideas fromdifferent angles and knowing

(19:41):
that we don't have all theanswers, but we're in a place to
help lift all of that.

And I mean thank you both so much for everything
that you do and also forexplaining that, because I think
what you're really showing is,without this office, there's so
many resources that people wouldnever get access to.
And I'm just wondering youmentioned VOCA if you could for
people who are listening, whodon't know what that is like.

Briefly, oh yeah, so VOCA the Victims of Crime Act
the key piece I'm talking aboutis it provides federal funding
for victims of violent crime tobe compensated after that
tragedy by the government.
And so for me, when I was shot,I had twenty two thousand
dollars in hospital bills andthanks to VOCA and victims
compensation, I was able to bereimbursed for those bills.

(20:23):
But, unfortunately, across thecountry, so many folks either
don't know about these resourcesthey're, either that the
process is too difficult whenyou've lost a loved one, to fill
out paperwork and processreceipts and reimbursements is a
really heavy toll on top ofeverything else or the bigger

(20:44):
problem is that folks are beingdenied, and we've looked very
deeply at the law and realizedthat there's a lot of gray area
of what does it mean for you tocontribute to that shooting
right In the current law?
If you jaywalk and get hit by aspeeding car, well, did you
contribute?
Or should that car not havebeen speeding in the first place
?
And that's unclear in thecurrent way that the VOCO rule
is defined, and so we'reproposing to clarify what it
means to contribute.
We also are looking to prohibitthe use of previous criminal

(21:06):
history to decide whether or notyou should be compensated for
your victimization.

But then lastly, looking at, how do we?

create a clear definition of what it means to
be compliant and to work withlaw enforcement.
And so, for me personally, whenI was shot, I was interrogated
while I was in and out ofconsciousness after being shot
and suffered from blood loss.
So if I don't answer a fewquestions during that
investigation, it doesn't mean Idon't want to help solve the
crime.

It means maybe.

I'm fighting for my life, and that is still
unclear in too many communitiesand in too many situations.
Still unclear in too manycommunities and in too many
situations, and so this newproposed rule will provide
clearer definitions and clearerresponsibilities.
That the state and the overallgovernment should play a larger
role in ensuring that everythingis being done to solve the
crime, but we're not puttingpressure on people that are
fighting for their lives or justlost a loved one to weigh in in

(21:55):
order to be compensated.

And that's so important, because so much of
what I'm hearing is that this iscommunity driven, this is need
driven.
This is not.
This is how we think in anacademic sense.
We'll solve the problem, thoughI'm certain, knowing all of you
, that, like, there is anacademic plan behind it, but
that these are issues that folksbrought and said these are
things I need, these are thingsI want and do and I think that's
so essential and so importantand probably makes people feel a

(22:19):
little more comfortable toaccessing those resources,
seeing an office function inthat way and I know just from
spoiler alert.
Red Bull and Brady associatedwith Brady, but I know from
working at Brady that's a lot ofhow our action comes from too.
It's not necessarily what wethink in kind of a highfalutin
nonprofit sense, but like whatwe know people have been asking
for in kind of a highfalutinnonprofit sense, but like what

(22:42):
we know people have been askingfor and for.
Chris, on your end, brady justcelebrated 30 years of the Brady
Bill and then 50 years ofexistence in the month of
February.
And so I'm wondering for youwhat does it feel like to say,
okay, it's been 30 years sincethe Brady Bill, it's been 50
years since the formation bill,it's been 50 years since the
formation of our nonprofit.
This is the year we have anoffice of gun violence

(23:03):
prevention.
What does it feel like for youto have this resource now
present and to exist, and didyou think this was going to
happen?
Well, I'm not going to say nobut you know, was this on your
do we give us to say on thebingo card and like the 2023
bingo?

Kris Brown (23:20):
card that you thought was going to happen Well
, if.
I had a wish list, which I did,of things that I wanted to have
happen this?
Was probably at the very top,and it was for many in the
movement who really thought thathaving an office like this was
essential to bring all ofgovernment together I think Rob

(23:42):
and Greg in particular, assurvivors, but also as experts
in the area of gun violenceprevention, because this is a
complex area.
It's very straightforward in theone sense we have individuals
who are being shot, the numberone killer of our kids right,
these are basic facts.
The solutions are multifacetedand complex and we have long

(24:04):
thought of it as a particularagency, for example HHS or CDC.
Let's get more funding so thatwe can.
Let's get some funding Gunviolence.
Well, yes, that's very basic and, of course, this is a top
priority to continue for thisoffice, but when you think about
the power of the federalgovernment, to lead the many

(24:27):
agencies that have a role inpotentially advancing gun
violence prevention, inassisting victims, as Greg has
said and we hear from manysurvivors as a survivor-led
organization Jim and Sarah andwe hearkened back when we
celebrated our 50th anniversaryto Pete Shields so many others

(24:48):
who have come before us who'vemade changes For us.
we are looking, though, forcatalytic change, and I would
say that the Office of GunViolence Prevention is part of
that catalytic change, becauseit's transforming something
where we would say, hey, let'smake a priority CDC funding,
since we were zeroed out allthis time.
Now, we say let's look at everyagency of the federal government

(25:10):
and see what they can do.
And not only that.
We understand, too, that mayorsacross this country right city
councils across this countryview gun violence as one of
their top priority issues.
The impact is local many timesfor everyday gun violence, and
the reality is new ideas andassistance that the federal

(25:33):
government can provide along thelines that you're saying, Greg,
are so integral so importantand the policy expertise that
this office brings for themyriad additional rules that are
stemming from the executiveactions.
I mean this president honestlyhas done more to combat gun
violence than any president inhistory.

(25:56):
So having an office that can dothis in this multifaceted way
was a top priority and somethingI hoped and dreamed would
happen, but I do think that it'scatalytic, along with so many
other things that we're nowseeing happen at the federal
level, and I hope many stateswill follow suit.

Thanks for highlighting that to the
catalytic nature of it, becauseI know one of the things that
happens just by having thisoffice is that you continue to
have pressure instead of justhaving it be headline go away,
headline go away.
Now it's the very president andthe vice president of the
country who have made this apermanent part of their agenda,
which is huge.
And we're sitting here in March, so the year's still got a long

(26:37):
way to go.
So I'm wondering for 2024, whatsorts of opportunities do you
see?
And then, what sorts ofchallenges do you see
specifically for gun violenceprevention?
This year there's a lot.

You know, I just I want to brag on Rob real quick.
When you think aboutopportunities, because Rob is,
he's the Beethoven at the pianoat times.
But yesterday, just yesterday,we had a meeting with 12
agencies and in the Rooseveltroom I mean the president, the
heroes of people in the old room, that's the old office, that's
how close we were.

(27:15):
And Rob facilitated a meetingwith some of the most senior
leadership across these agenciesand talked specifically about
safe storage and the importanceof storm firearms, and we talked
with the Department of Defense,we talked with Veterans Affairs
.
It's already doing thisthroughout their community.
Doj has already rolled out themost comprehensive guide on safe
storage.
But then we also turned andlooked to the Department of
Interior and found that theyalready have a huge campaign in

(27:35):
the tribal community thatthey've already built out, but
they hadn't partnered with theDepartment of Justice before.
We looked over to the Office ofthe Department of Agriculture,
who knows that farmers are atgreat risk to suicide by firearm
, and now are sitting next toVeterans Affairs and saying, wow
, we could use these exact sameresources to expand what we're
doing.
And we saw housing and urbandevelopment, a community that's

(27:57):
unfortunately often overlooked.

Seeing that, oh, I have resources in the
Department of Justice here here.

Here that can all weigh in and that type of
collaboration has never evenhappened on a Zoom call.
But here we are in theRoosevelt room having a
discussion about how we canapproach an all-government
effort to shift the culturearound how people see
responsible gun ownership andreally lift the standard.
And that was facilitated by Rob, and I could have never been

(28:24):
more proud to work alongside him.
But I think there's moments likethat where we think that we're
doing all we can and maybe oneagency is doing a tremendous job
.
But in all of these effortswhether it's funding strategies
to support communities that havebeen devastated by gun violence
, whether it's shifting theculture through awareness,
whether it's making sure apolicy is being fully

(28:45):
implemented there is a ton ofopportunity even from just
pulling together differentagencies to zero in on this.
And that's what we did withCOVID-19.
And you saw how we were able todrastically turn around what
was the largest health crisis ofmany of our lifetimes.
But in America the presidentsays this himself you know we

(29:06):
have a history of going throughcrisis and coming out stronger,
and that's because of the powerand the will of the American
people, but also thecollaboration and leadership of
the White House.
And our biggest opportunity inthis moment is to bring together
all of these agencies to fightfor these big areas and these
big opportunities to shiftculture, to shift policy, but

(29:26):
also bring resources to thosewho are most in need.
And I'm sure Rob has some moreconcrete things, but I had to
just brag for him because I'msure he wouldn't do it.

As we said, this is a time for like celebration of
flowers and acknowledging thatyou know this is a hugely
important Thing and that youdon't have to question it If we
need to be so bold, so how aboutyou Rob anything here in the
coming year?

Rob Wilcox (29:47):
I mean, look, we know that we have seen rates of
gun violence that were bothunaccepted and Exceptionally
high, and we have seen apresident who's leaned in To
kind of pull all the levers hecan pull, and what we've finally
seen is some of this gunviolence go down, but not nearly
enough.
And so I think what I'm lookingforward to is doubling down, and
I think we can accelerate theinvestment.

(30:09):
We can accelerate taking onirresponsible actors in the gun
industry.
We can accelerate strengtheningour background checks, and I
think about just a few things.
We can accelerate strengtheningour background checks and I
think about just a few things.
You know, just a few weeks ago,for the first time ever, the
president, in a message to thecountry, named Community
Violence Awareness Week, andthat was thanks to Greg Jackson
who proposed it, and thepresident said yes, and then we

(30:31):
spent a week focusing on thesolutions to community violence
raising awareness of the

issue rethinking it, reframing it and committing
ourselves to addressing it, andso we brought together state
legislators.

Rob Wilcox (30:42):
We had the first ever convening with nearly 1,000
leaders across the country totalk about funding opportunities
, not just at one agency butacross three.
We went to Philadelphia to seehow the work was happening on
the ground and we had thisincredible graduation with 31 of
the really the brightest starsin the community violence
intervention field who got tospend their graduation with the

(31:04):
vice president and the governorof Maryland and Greg and myself
and it was beautiful and theywalked out fired up, but they're
going to go do the mostincredible work, and so that
inspires me that this summerwe're going to have
less gun violence than we've hadsince before COVID me that this
summer we're going to have lessgun miles than we've had since
before COVID.
It inspires me that I thinkabout the Brady background

(31:25):
checks in 30 years, how muchwork we've just done in the past
couple of years and how muchwe'll be able to do.
We're in the process offinalizing a regulation that
could effectively close the gunshow loophole, close the online
sales loophole.

Things that.

Rob Wilcox (31:35):
Chris and Brady have been working on for years.
I mean Jim and Sarah.
Brady and I worked at Brady in2001 and again in 2013,.
We've been trying to close thatfor a long time and we've come
up short a number of times.
In 2000, after the horribleshooting at the Columbine High
School, there was a bipartisanbill that came to the floor and
it got 50 votes in the Senate,with Al Gore casting a

(31:57):
tie-breaking vote, and it failsin the House.
The Senate with Al Gore castinga tie-breaking vote and it
fails in the House.
And, honestly, it was a darkperiod for the gun safety
movement.

for years, the gun industry got more protections
than ever before.

Rob Wilcox (32:06):
We didn't invest in solutions and we are living with
the consequences of the NRAwriting our gun laws.
And in 2013, when we sawanother tragic shooting, there
was another bill that sought totake over this gun show loophole
, this online sale loophole, toexpand the Brady background
checks that we know work.
And again it fails.
It only has 50 Democrats tovote for and four Republicans.

(32:27):
And then, 10 years later, in2022, we see another horrible
shooting at a school and aterrible shooting in Buffalo.
And this time we go back tothat negotiating table with more
momentum than we've ever hadbefore, with more movement power
, with more ideas.
Yeah, because we didn't just goand say let's get background
checks.
We said let's go in and getfunding for red flag

(32:48):
implementation, let's go in andmake an enhanced background
check, let's fund communityviolence intervention, let's
make the largest commitment toyouth mental health in history.
And instead of failing, wesucceeded.
But it wasn't just that we had50 Democrats, which we did again
, but we had 15 Republicans showup.
And when the NRA said no thesenator said yes, and now we get

(33:10):
to implement that law and weare about to implement some of
these pieces that will take theBrady background checks to
places they've never seenGetting at people who are
offering guns for sale at gunshows or online ads the source
of so many of the traffic guns.
And this enhanced backgroundcheck is like Brady background
check 2.0.
I mean, instead of just lookingat the database, we're calling
into states, looking forinformation, and so we're doing

(33:31):
this for 18, 19, 20-year-olds.
And do you know, what we foundIs, since we've implemented this
, we've increased denials forthat population by 25% and the
stories are life-saving.
There was one individual whotried to buy a gun at a gun
store.
It had to be a long gun orshotgun, so like an AR-15.
And the Brady Packers said go.
But when they called in withthis enhanced check, what they

(33:54):
found is they had been committedto a mental institution just a
few weeks prior, a person whowas literally just in crisis.
So instead, of a yes, it was ano, and so, instead of a tragedy
, potentially a life saved andthis, to me, is what's exciting
is we are focusing on the realproblems community violence,
suicide, threats to our schools,threats in the intimate partner
setting and we are applying allthe solutions.

(34:14):
So I am like filled withoptimism because, for all the
heartbreak that we share in thismovement, it is the hope and
possibility of saving lives thatkeeps us going.
So I cannot wait to come towork tomorrow and the day after
that, and the day after that,because that is the privilege
the president gives us in thisentire movement a chance to work

(34:36):
on this issue every single day,because that's what we know it
deserves.

Well, your hope is infectious.
I feel it.
I feel it and I think.

Oh, I wanted to add something too.
I mean, even beyond introducingnew solutions, implementing new
developments, one of the mostpowerful things of this office
existing is that we're able toconnect those who have been
impacted with the realgovernment resources that exist.
And so I just think about thelast two weeks.
We all know about Uvalde andhow challenging and tragic that

(35:10):
was, and many of us know folkswho were there, or families or
survivors, and I've heardmultiple times from mothers and
families how difficult theprocess to get support was for
them of the DOJ Office ofVictims of Crime, and they laid
out all of their challenges andnow there's a chance for them to
talk through and help refinethings.

(35:31):
You know we were rolling outfunding for 14,000 school-based
mental health professionals as aresult of the Bipartisan Safety
Communities Act.
When we looked at the firstround of folks who applied,
there were clear gaps and one ofthe gaps was that there wasn't
enough HBCUs at the table 264wards, only two HBCUs.

(35:51):
But just yesterday we broughttogether 12 HBCUs and the
morning that the actual fundingfor the second round was
announced 8 am it was announced11 am 12 HBCUs were being
briefed on these resources andwe found that in Morgan State
they're already doing the workin Baltimore schools.
In Howard University they'realready building out mental

(36:14):
health strategies to help andthey even have a mobile crisis
center that they're about tolaunch.
So we're seeing that we'reconnecting the real people who
are impacted with the resourcesthat exist and that watchful eye
and us being that bridge, Ithink might be the most powerful
part of this is that there'salready so much the government
can offer, but for too long thecommunities and the activists

(36:37):
and the leaders we have beentrying to figure it out on our
own, and now you have a teamhere that is getting the biggest
crash course possible on whatexists out there and then are
empowered not just encouraged,empowered to connect those
communities with what's possiblein the government, and so we're
just so excited to do that.
We have four events this week.

(36:58):
I mean every week.
I think we probably set arecord for how many people we
bring in this building.
Because we always have a herd offolks here, because we want to
make sure that we are being thatbridge and facilitator of how
do we get the communities andthe individuals who have been
overlooked not just in the roombut at the table, getting the
resources and helping to shiftand impact the decisions that

(37:19):
are made here.

I was going to say that's what's so beautiful
about the office.
You mentioned the CDI week, andthose are communities that are
often suffering from the.
They're being disenfranchisedor being oppressed or being hurt
in all these ways, and for theWhite House to go out and say
you're coming in here and you'regoing to have to think.
The table is incredibly powerful, especially in an era when so

(37:40):
many people are cynical aboutgovernment and about democracy.
And it's now the office of thepresidency and the vice
presidency is going to some ofthe most impacted communities
and saying come here, we want tohear from you, we want to help
you.
That's so beautiful.

I mean one quick story on that.
We had a call with there were28 teens that were shot in a
mass shooting in Baltimore anddidn't get the media, didn't get
the press.
We did a listening session andthere were mothers there that
talked about how teens were shoton their front porch and were
there for hours trying to gethelp and they had to come back.

(38:13):
So that was their home.
You know, that was their homeand they were in public housing
and had housing assistance.
One person said that her sonwouldn't come home for a month
because he was just too afraid,terrified, and they were telling
these stories, bawling, andthey said you guys got to work
on your city services and I saidwait, man, this is not the city
, this is the senior leadershipfor housing and urban

(38:35):
development for the country thatyou're talking to.
So we're not just helping,we're just not focused on
changing your condition.
You're informing how we look atthis issue from housing and
urban development forever.
And that is the small exampleof how these gaps, these bridges
that we're building, are notjust helping individuals.
It's really shifting the entireculture of how government

(38:57):
responds and thinks aboutaddressing this issue.

Rob Wilcox (39:01):
To Greg's point, going from what we can do
federally to the challenge thatI think we have is it shouldn't
just be this energy coming fromthe White House.
We need it in governor'smansions, we need it in city
halls, we need it everywhere,because for too long this issue
was just in a single lane.
But what we know to address thepublic health crisis is you
have to do it all, and so weneed offices in all of these

(39:24):
places, but they can't just betucked away.
I think some of the magic inthis office is where the
president and vice presidentdemand to be placed, which is
one step below them.
We are literally one personaway from the president when we
need help, we need action, whenwe are briefing, and that gives
us tremendous ability toactually make this change.
So that is essential.

(39:44):
And then you've got to get theright people, the people who
understand this issue, tounderstand this pain, but also
the promise of the policy, andyou've got to give them the
mandate to do it all.
And that is what we need right,because it can't just be a
White House Office of GunViolence Prevention.

We need a Maryland .

Rob Wilcox (40:00):
Office of Gun Violence Prevention, and I know
our friend, governor Moore, isworking on that, but we also
need local offices of violenceprevention.
That is the ecosystem thisissue deserves so that we
actually can tackle this in allits forms.
And so, as we are working tobuild this, I think we need
everyone's help to put this inplace everywhere, so that we can
make sure we're saving lives.

Well, and I think that that leads to kind of a
great, maybe even final questionfor us to start segueing into,
because the danger with danger,with this, of course, is I know
you're- all very busy people butkelly and I will track you
forever and you've got lives tosave.
So you can't just talk to usforever.
Although we'd like it, we wouldtake it, but I you know so
obviously your advocacy efforts,not new right advocacy efforts

(40:46):
of Brady.
It's not a new thing.
What the office hasaccomplished in short time is
amazing.
Right, you guys hit the groundrunning and have been like
sprinting in a marathon,although I was thinking really
re-describing it.
It's almost like before gunviolence everyone was kind of
running in a race together, butnot touching.
Now we've all kind of linkedhands, which is a beautiful yet
terrifying image right, youdon't want to get in your way or

(41:09):
away as we get to that finishline.
But I'm wondering, you know,what can listeners who are out
there in the world?
What can they be thinking aboutdoing?
What is something that they cando actionable in?
the next year, in 2024,specifically, that could help
move the needle, could help maketheir community safer, could
help make their family safer inmany ways.

(41:30):
Is it advocating, as you said,for we need all of these offices
, Was it?
Are you calling your mayor?
Are you calling your governor?
What is it that they can bedoing and what on kind of maybe
on the advocacy end for Brady,are you really excited about
saying move Chris.

Kris Brown (41:44):
Well, I think the answer always is do all the
things.
I think the point that was madearound the first of all the
fact that they're one personaway, greg and Rob and Steph
Feldman one person away from thepresident and the vice
president is super important.
Their power to actually bringpeople together to convene not

(42:07):
only folks who may be heads ofagencies, but also the impact on
victims of gun violence to beable to come in and have that
audience with these seniorleaders where a lot of victims
have felt denied that.
So I guess the first thing thatI think is really important as
advocates, as activists thatwe're thinking about our Brady
chapters is spread the good newsBecause in a lot of ways the

(42:32):
enemy of the gun violenceprevention movement is not
always the folks on the otherside, what I would say.
Second amendment extremistsright.
We're not against gun owners.
Right, we have many gun ownerswho are a part of this.
It's hopelessness.
So make sure that youunderstand how important this
office is, the gains that we'remaking across this country, and

(42:55):
then take action around.
What I always talk about isyour sphere of influence.
We all have that right and theability to be able to think
about the kinds of things thisofficer is doing.

Think about where you live.
Think about the people who havethis officer is doing.

Kris Brown (43:08):
Think about where you live.
Think about the people who havesome role to play in reducing
gun violence in yourneighborhood, in your community,
and get engaged with them.
Get engaged in your communitywith others who may be part of
your civic association.
If you're a parent, your PTA.
Engage in discussions with yourschool systems around, say,

(43:29):
storage.
We have a whole now proposaland approach coming from the.

Rob Wilcox (43:33):
White.

Kris Brown (43:33):
House about what that should look like, but
ultimately it's us as citizenswho can engage our elected
officials at the local and statelevel to ask what are you?
Doing to combat gun violence.

And have you thought about not only?

Kris Brown (43:49):
all of the things that you can do from a policy
standpoint, but also enforcement.
A policy means nothing if wedon't come together and help
ensure that that policy isenforced and then engage.
Make sure that, as individuals,we're supporting the people who
represent us who are going to?
become and are gun violenceprevention champions.

(44:11):
All of those things are superimportant.
That's how we're here, that'show we get the catalytic at
change and that's how we look 5,10, 15, 20 years from now
hopefully even shorter back andsay we solved this public health
crisis.
Let's move on to the next hardthing.

That's our goal.
Yeah, I mean, that's beautifuland I think, before we continue
like, I even think of just Ithink my experience has been so
different because I only cameinto the gun violence prevention
movement about four and a halfyears ago.
Kelly, you've been in it forquite a while longer.
I think how long About eightyears.

That's not a sure .

Time has no meaning for me anymore.
But I think it's one of thosethings where I've seen such a
culture change and the way thatpeople are talking about gun
violence and even my short timeat Brady from people who early
conversations were so hard and Iwould be struggling and people
in the office who had beenworking on it for eight, 10, 15
years would say oh, you shouldhave seen it 15 years ago.
I couldn't get a meeting.
This is amazing now and I feellike even in the last year we've

(45:11):
been on a rollercoaster offolks are really, even if they
even if folks aren't necessarilyengaged they want to know and I
think that a lot of thatprobably we can, we can credit
to some of the culture changework that Brady's doing, but
also to the incredible work thatyour, your office, is doing.

So what are things that people can?

be doing right now.
That could help you out.

Rob Wilcox (45:30):
Well, I don't think it's about helping us out, as
much as we're here to serve thepeople of this country and
fulfill the president's wish toend gun violence in our time.

I will say that I think a lot of what we're doing
needs people to take action.

Rob Wilcox (45:43):
So the secure storage piece that Chris just
mentioned I mean in some waysthat was both a ground up and
now it's a spread out right.
I think so many Bradyvolunteers and Moms of man
Action volunteers really thoughtup this idea in the first place
of going to schools and sayingwhy don't we talk more about
secure storage?
I know my aunt and uncle, whoare my heroes, nick and Amanda
they did a lot of that work inCalifornia alongside Sheikha

(46:05):
Hamilton, and that then boils upto the US Department of
Education saying we should alldo this.
But then it goes back down andit's up to the schools yet again
to pick up that mantle andpeople in those districts to say
why are we doing this?
And not just how do we raiseawareness, but how do we make
devices secure, storage devicesaccessible, right?

(46:26):
And so there's always going tobe more to do locally, to take
what we're doing and run with it.
And when we're talking aboutthese grant programs that we
think can be so impactful, wecan talk about them, we can
release them, we can promotethem, but it takes people to say
hey, are we applying to them?
Mayor, have we thought of ourcomprehensive plan?
Do we have an office, and so Iwould hope that we are serving

(46:46):
people number one, but numbertwo, the things that we're
putting out.
They should just pick up andrun with, because hopefully, all
these pieces are things that weend up doing together, because
that's the only way we solvethis.

I think you said it earlier, right, it's never
going to be a top-down approach.

Rob Wilcox (47:00):
This is how we do it , but what we can do is make
tools and resources availablefor people to design the
strategies that work to healtheir communities for people to
design the strategies that workto heal their communities.
So I think that's what I wouldsay, but it's not anything that
they have to do for us.
They certainly not.
I think we're here to servethem.

Yeah, I'll just add.
I mean I think we also wereally need everyone to lean in
on the solutions.
I think we talk so much aboutthe problem of gun violence, how
bad it is and how unsafe it isand where you can't go to school
or you can't go to a parade oryou can't go to church, but we
don't spend enough time talkingabout the solutions and what's
working and we think about oh,it's not safe in my neighborhood

(47:43):
, well, how do I protect my homeversus how do I get out there
and help my neighborhood becomea safer place?
And that's one thing that ouroffice is completely focused on
is like how do we advance asmany solutions as possible?
But if we can get everyonewho's concerned about this issue

(48:04):
to get into a solutionsoriented mindset, it will make a
major difference.
And we always talk about how,you know, hurt people, hurt
people.
And our mantra is more the healpeople, heal people.
So how can we figure out how toheal as many folks as possible,
knowing that that spread willhave a huge impact?
And I put on my phone becausethere's a quote from Martin
Luther King that I always hangon to it's that darkness cannot
drive out darkness.

(48:25):
Only light can do that and hatecannot drive out hate.
Only light can do that and hatecannot drive out hate.
Only love can do that, and weare really fighting against
darkness.
At the end of the day, this isthe most traumatic and,
unfortunately, in so manymoments, some of the most
heinous tragedies that we'rewitnessing on this planet, and

(48:49):
we have to figure out how do webring light into this and get to
those who are in crisis, get tothe youth that are, that are
scared, that are fearful, thatare lashing out, get to those
who are afraid to move in theworld and maybe want to end
themselves.
Like how do we get light tothose who are most in need,
knowing that that's the realbattle that we're fighting?
you know, we joke we don't talkabout the nra anymore.
I mean they they're bankruptand they're you know, just lost

(49:11):
his case.
The real battle is how do wehelp shift the American mindset
from a place of fear and despairto hope and love, because
that's what we have toaccomplish and all of this
policy, I think, is a part ofhow we get there.
But that internal shift canstart with us, because we've
seen the worst of it and for usto still be hopeful, I think is

(49:32):
a very courageous thing.

Completely agree.
I was just going to say I feellike the theme emerging from
what you shared and what youshared is just like you were
saying sometimes we think thatthe enemy or not the enemy, the
opposition, is someone else, andreally it's our own attitude
and our own posture of like wecan do this, we can do this.
We can actually live in acountry of philosophy.
So I really appreciate that.

Kris Brown (49:56):
I do think that one of the things that's related to
the point you make is how wethink about change in this
country, and there's a quotethat I'm going to completely
mangle, but I will attempt itanyway.
There's a quote that I'm goingto completely mangle, but I will
attempt it anyway that changeis slow and slow and slow, and

(50:17):
then it happens all at once.
Right, and I think about thatas we're celebrating the 50th
anniversary of Brady, knowingthat Jim and Sarah took six
years and seven votes to get thelaw passed, that in that time,
30 years later, 4.9 millionsales had two prohibited
purchasers have been stopped,and that there are people
walking around alive todaybecause of that law, and not a

(50:38):
small number at all.
And so, while it may be thatsometimes a year or two or three
goes by, where we're toiling inwhat feels like the salt mines,
there's a reason for it andthere's a purpose behind that.
All of us sitting here todayreally stand on the shoulders of
others who came before us, whosaid enough, and in my small way

(51:02):
, even if I don't know thattomorrow something monumental
can happen, I'm going to howlinto what can feel like a
hurricane, but it still issomething that.
I must do, and if every Americancan be so inspired, we'd be
done with this.
And that, I think, is verycompelling to me when I think

(51:23):
about why what you're saying isso important and your point,
Kelly, which is the hope is ineach of us.
We carry that and the light isthere, and that's what guides
what we do every single day, andso I like thinking about
dwelling on that as sort of afinal thought.

And this was a very I'm going to like.
This is one I bottle.
This is one of like theepisodes I think I'm gonna come
back to when I need inspiration,because I think that that's
such a big, important note maybeto leave on for our listeners.
A lot of folks who listen to usare folks who work in gun
violence prevention, whose names, unfortunately, I will never
know.
Yeah right, because in theircommunity, every day they're
getting up to do gun violenceprevention work, but they're

(52:07):
never going to be on a nationalstage they work for, maybe like
a small organization they'redoing the work by themselves, or
when they come, they're likethey're working with brady but
we don't get to see them.
You know it's that kind of thing, but they're part of this
office and that means they're inthese rooms and so they are
talking to the president.
They're there and I think thatthat's a really beautiful thing

(52:29):
to hold on to.
So thanks so much to all threeof you.
Thank you to you two in theoffice for hosting us.
Hey want to share with thepodcast.
Listeners can now get in touchwith us here at Red Blue and
Brady via phone or text message.
Simply call or text us at480-744-3452 with your thoughts,

(52:50):
questions, concerns, ideas, catpictures, whatever.

Thanks for listening.
As always, brady's lifesavingwork in Congress, the courts and
communities across the countryis made possible thanks to you.
For more information on Bradyor how to get involved in the
fight against gun violence,please like and subscribe to the
podcast.
Or how to get involved in thefight against gun violence,
please like and subscribe to thepodcast.
Get in touch with us atbradyunitedorg or on social at
Brady Buzz.
Be brave and remember.

(53:15):
Take action, not sides.
Bye.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Bridging Policy and Compassion With the White House's Quest for Gun Violence Prevention