July 17, 2023 • 60 mins
Hi Red Fern Listeners! I was recently a guest on a fabulous wine podcast called The TallMikeWine Podcast. Host Mike Stone and I talk about, what else, but books and wine. I offer up a mini summer reading list and Mike explains how he comes up with all those wine adjectives. Mike is a self-professed wine geek who creates fun, relatable conversations around wine. And did I mention that he is a former disc jockey? Enjoy, and I will be back in the fall with a new lineup.
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Website: https://www.buzzsprout.com/1435309
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Episode Transcript
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Unknown (00:04):
Hey, Red Fern listeners. This is your host,
Amy Mair. And I'm checking inwith you. It's middle of summer.
And I hope you're doing lots ofreading. I know I sure am. And
I'm working on our fall andupper my following up as we
speak. But in the meantime, Iwanted to offer up a different
(00:25):
kind of podcast I'd like toshare with you, I recently had
the opportunity to be a guest ona podcast. And that podcast is
the TallMikeWine Podcast hostedby Mike Stone. And here's sort
of my equivalents, but in thewine world, and we ran into each
other. I was on vacation about ayear ago, in Sonoma, and he
(00:48):
works at Nicholson Ranch, whichis a great winery if you're in
the area.
And we got to talking andthought there might be a way for
us to collaborate. So I justwent on his podcast and gave a
mini summer reading list. And atthe same time, we paired the
books with wine, and talkedabout all things wine, and I
(01:08):
learned also to work on my wineadjectives. So I think I've got
floral down and a couple ofother things. So you have to
listen in. But Tom, Mike is thereal deal. He is very serious
about his wine, but doesn't takehimself too seriously. So I
think that's a really goodcombo. And he's a former disc
jockey. So I think he has awonderful voice that you'll
(01:31):
enjoy. So please check him out.
And I will talk to you soon andI will be back in the fall with
more episodes. Okay. Talk to youlater. Bye.
On the Tom Mike wine podcast, Isaw Mike, how's it going?
(01:51):
You don't have to call me Tom.
Mike, if you don't want to okay,but you would be amazed at how
many people just call me thatwhen they meet me in person
and have to add she is Canadian.
I want to throw that out. Can Iput ice
in my mind? It might offend somepeople but it does not offend
me. But Ichose books because it's
something that I know because Iwanted it to seem authentic. It
is your second choice. It wouldprobably be knitting and you
(02:15):
would not want my blind podcast.
The cellphones have beensilenced. The wine is poured.
And just like that the podcastbegins. It's the tall Mike wine
(02:35):
podcast, the wine podcast that'snot all about wine. Although
wine can be boring, and who cansit still for that. The wind
podcasts heard in 65 countrieson six continents and in 48 of
these United States, fromColorado, Ohio, to Detroit Lakes
(02:55):
Minnesota, from Rawlins Wyomingto Paul's Bo Washington, where
they make that Paul's bow bread,the bread whose recipe was
inspired by the Bible. Prettycrazy. Paul's bow. Thanks for
tuning in. I'm Mike stone, yourhost and eponymous tall wine
guy. I work at a winery inSonoma, California. And for more
(03:18):
than half my life I've beenreally into wine. And I like to
share the fun part withconversation. If you enjoy these
conversations, scroll up anddown and through the older
episodes, get yourself caughtup. Also, I'll nag you again
about leaving a rating and areview on Apple podcasts and be
sure you're subscribed onwhatever app it is you're using.
(03:39):
So you don't miss an episode.
They tell me it helps a lot.
Let's get to the conversation.
It's episode 42. And my guest isa podcast host. She's also
Canadian. Her podcast is not awine podcast, but a podcast that
focuses on books. We met whenshe and some friends visited
(04:01):
Nicholson ranch so she has winecred. Speaking to us via zoom
from Vancouver BC the host ofthe Red Fern book review podcast
Amy Mair. Hello, Amy.
Hi, Tom. Mike. How's it going?
I'm so happy to be here.
I'm doing great. I'm doing well.
You don't have to call me tallMike, if you don't want to. But
(04:22):
you would be amazed at how manypeople just call me that when
they meet me in person. BecauseI'm tall. Weird. How long you
go. Where are you in Sonoma? Itseems like a while back to me.
It was last spring and I was ona girls trip for a big milestone
(04:43):
birthday for me. And I rememberwe had this great picnic at
Nicholson ranch and then wemoved over for wine tasting. And
that's where I met you.
Yes, it has happened a few timesless than a handful where
somebody I work with, says hey,there's a fellow podcaster In
that group over there, youshould go say hi. Or I'll be
(05:03):
hosting someone and I'll mentionthe podcast. And they'll be
like, Oh, I have a podcast. Sohere is the vague premise for
this episode. Way, way back inthe early 1990s. When I began my
wine journey, I was invited winetasting by some coworkers as a
non wine drinking guy in hislate 20s. One of the things I
(05:23):
noticed as I got to know otherpeople visiting the wineries,
let's call them wine people, isthey seem to be into things I
was into, for example, food, notjust talking about food they
ate, but cooking, theingredients, methods, time, they
spent cooking food, shopping forthings to cook, et cetera. Also,
(05:44):
movies, not so much whatever thehot VCR rental of the moment
was, but movies of a certainsort in the Art House Foreign
specific movies from directorsthey liked. Going deeper than
most people I knew at the timediscussing things about the
movies, and books, these peoplewould talk about books they were
reading, which wasn't unusual inand of itself. But again, it
(06:05):
seemed to go just a littledeeper, I got the feeling that
books were more important moreof a priority to my new
acquaintances at these wineries,and I really liked that in a
sort of aspirational way. Myconclusion here is pretty
simple. I think people that aremore into wine who might listen
to a wine podcast are more thanlikely into books as well now
(06:27):
tell me if I'm sounding tooelitist? Or does this make sense
to you, Amy,it makes complete sense, I think
they go together, I would say mybook club definitely agrees with
that. Because the number onereason we get together is
actually I believe, not to readthe books, but to connect. And
so what that means is forprobably the first hour that
we're together, we're usuallydrinking wine, and hearing a
(06:48):
charcuterie platter, and then wewill go over and talk about the
books, I think that goestogether. But you know, I
thought about some othercommonalities. And people read
for many reasons, I would saythey read to learn to relax to
escape. Just like people mightunwind like a glass of wine
after work, you might read achapter of a book. And I think
(07:11):
it's even better if you do bothtogether, they are a great
combination. But a couple otherthings I was thinking about is
that all those things like saycooking wine, books, and movies,
they're super accessible on onelevel. And if you want, you can
do a deep dive, you can getreally into it. And then you can
spend hours connecting withpeople. And I find I've met all
(07:34):
kinds of people. And anotherthing I don't know if you think
this is true, but I was thinkingabout it. Sometimes it's a less
vulnerable way of connectingwith people. So I find people
will argue and debate acharacter with me. And I feel
like I've had this reallyintense discussion, but maybe
I've actually had a bad day. ButI feel kind of lighter and more
enriched because I sharedsomething with someone. And I
(07:56):
love it when people get mad atthe characters like their
people. So I don't know ifpeople get mad at the wine or
I'm trying to think if peopleget mad at wine. I mean, there
are definitely added characterslike you search for a specific
wine because you've heardcertain things about it, or
you've had certain wines of thissort, and then you find a
different one. And it's not asgood as you thought it was going
(08:18):
to be. You might be mad ordisappointed about that. I like
where you're going with that. Idon't know that I can really
relate it to wine. But yeah, Imean, books are great because
you're sharing a story that cameout of somebody's brain. And the
people aren't real. I havetasks. Amy with coming up with a
small list of summer reading forus. We'll get to that in a
little bit. But first, thank youfor turning me on to a book
(08:42):
called station 11. A few monthsback by Emily St. John Mandel.
It was a really in mywheelhouse. Do you remember what
you said about the book?
Whatever it was, I went out andfound it immediately.
That book is amazing because itwas actually written in 2014.
And she predicts a pandemic.
(09:02):
It was a avian flu.
It's a flu. Okay. Itwas much more, of course severe
than COVID-19 The Coronavirusbecause it wiped out. I mean,
they don't really say in thebook, specifically. It's very,
very much a sort of postapocalyptic dystopian story and
I kind of gravitate to is Idon't know why that is. Economic
(09:24):
repetative thing. Yeah. But inthe book, it seems to me like
the this virus has wiped outprobably 95% of the population,
which means there's nobody doany of the jobs that provide us
modern comforts. There's nogasoline, so there are no cars.
There's no electricitygenerated. So there's no
(09:45):
electricity for lights, nothingis being manufactured. So
everything that these people areusing. Everything is just stuff
they still have.
I thought it was very relevantin light of what we've gone
through. I obviously it's In afantasy, or worst case scenario,
I think the writing is off thehook. I love that. And I have to
(10:06):
add, she is Canadian. So I wantto throw that out. Oh, Canada.
She also wrote a couple of otherbig books. And I think, did you
talk about her in general on anepisode,
I did a podcast on Her mostrecent book, which is Sea of
Tranquility. That's a big, bigbook. And this is a kind of
science fiction where someonekind of keeps appearing in
(10:30):
different moments in time.
There's a word for that. Shelikes sci fi. And there's a
future world and there's far inthe past world. It's really,
really, really good. When Canadawas colonized, they would send
wealthy either second born sonsor sons that were a
disappointment. They would sendthem to Canada, and kind of hope
(10:50):
that they wouldn't come back.
It's about one of those. No,that's how Canada was built.
Partly not disappointingsons. The Second Sons, that's
that's really interesting.
I can't remember the name. Ihave to look it up. But it's
like a cold something men andsent to far flung places because
(11:11):
they needed people to colonizedifficult places. Anyway, it's
colonialists. It's an excellentall of her books. There's
another one that's a take off onBernie Madoff. It's called the
glass hotel. It's also set inBritish Columbia. I think you'd
like that too. All right.
I'm gonna become an expert onEmily St. John Mandel, the works
(11:33):
of let's talk about how youdescribe books, I find it really
impressive, because I listen toyour podcasts. And I think
there's another common threadhere. Because when wine people
talk about wine, you know, thelegit tasting notes full of
flowery words and descriptions.
People who visit me at thewinery say, how do you do that?
So Amy,how do you do that? Well, okay,
(11:55):
I was thinking about this. And Iwas comparing it to wine again.
So I drink wine on the regular,but I'm not confident to see
what I think about it. If youask me, and I'm probably going
to ask me what I think about theone I'm drinking. I'll say it
kind of quietly or not withconfidence. So I think when I
talk about books, I sell it, oneof the number one things is I
(12:19):
have confidence when I describethe books, I think that helps.
Let me ask you this, becausethis is what this is, this is
basically how we create thismagical thing called a wine
review, or a wine tasting note.
We have a series of prompts. Andit's basically you know, you can
start anywhere you want it, youknow, you start with the smell,
(12:39):
okay, or the color. And there'sa bunch of different you know,
prompts like, is it this color?
Is it this color? Is it thiscolor? Is it lighter? That
color? Is it more medium thatcolor? Or is it deep that color?
Now, the sudden you're using adeep magenta, and then you've
already started off with this,like, wow, this wine is deep
magenta, and that is a good wayto start. And then the aroma,
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you want to know if it's if it'sstrong, or if it's not so
strong. And then you just startpulling things out of it, you
know, you can go from thefruits. And then you start
sniffing and people say, I can'tget the specific fruits like
that. You always say Oh,cheerio, BlackBerry, oh, this, I
say, Well, then don't worryabout what specific fruit it is.
Think about what color it is.
And say it's red fruit is bluefruit. It's black fruit. Because
(13:24):
I think when you tastesomething, and you say what
color is it instead of sayingWhat fruit do you taste? You're
a little more vague. People canlatch on to that. Yeah, I see.
And then you start breaking itdown. Okay, now we've decided
it's red fruit is a darker redfruit. Is it heavier red fruit?
Or is it lighter red fruit likea strawberry? Or is it a deep
(13:45):
dark red fruit like a black,cherry or plum. And you just
prompt yourself and you justwork your way through and then
you move from fruit and then yougo to anything earthy. Anything
wood Z. And then the one Ialways forget. And miss out on
sometimes is floral? Do yousmell any flowers? In this wine?
Chances are you will, becausewine tends to smell like
(14:09):
flowers. That's kind of how itworks. So do you do something
similar to that when youwhile you're talking? I guess I
do a little bit but not asstructured, as you said. But I
wrote down some adjectives thatI use, because I was thinking
about it. But I do first of alldescribe the genre to explain it
because you know, what are wedealing with here is a
historical fiction, what is itand within that I can have some
(14:32):
adjectives. And then I oftenwill compare it to something
that you know, like one of thebooks I'm going to talk about
today, I will compare it to aQuentin Tarantino movie. So I've
said that and I know right nowyou probably have somewhat of a
thought of what that could belike. So I'll try to pick
something that everybody knowsand then I just give my kind of
(14:53):
reaction. I noticed that I willoften use the same adjective
Isn't it sometimes it's lazy,and sometimes it's good. And one
of the words I like isatmospheric. Okay, station 11 is
atmospheric, very muchso very, very much. So it's
funny that you mentioned QuentinTarantino. That's very vivid for
me. And if you were here in mystudio, you would laugh because
(15:13):
on the wall across from whereI'm sitting, there are two movie
posters framed. One of them isReservoir Dogs.
Oh, nice. Yeah.
So you do have a series ofprompts, but you don't call it
that so much. That's sort ofwhat I have. Because once you
get to the point where you'vebeen using the prompts, you just
(15:36):
do that automatically.
Now, if the question is wine, Iknow there's obviously
subjectivity to what you'redoing. But is there is it pretty
objective? Like if you'retrained? Could I taste the wine?
You're drinking and tastefloral? And you don't? And is
that? Yes, those both? Correct.
It's this is something I alwaysassure people at the winery is
(15:57):
wine tasting is a 100%subjective pursuit, just like
books. Because you're tastingthe wine and smelling the wine
with your body, parts of yourbody. And those parts of body of
your body have been formed overthe course of your whole life.
How do you know what this smellslike? How do you know what that
(16:18):
smells like? You might not knowwhat some things smell like that
other people do because theywere exposed to those things
throughout the course of theirlife. And an example I always
use is my girlfriend Sabrina. Igrew up in the Pacific
Northwest. And she grew up inRio de Janeiro, Brazil. So I'm
really good with foresty things.
She's really good with tropicalfruit. And tropical fruit comes
up as sort of a mainstay andwhen you're tasting certain
(16:43):
wines, certain categories ofwines, Chardonnays from the same
region. For example, if you lookthrough a whole bunch of reviews
from those Chardonnays you'regonna see the towards tropical
fruit come up all the time, andthey might even delve into the
actual fruits, you know,pineapple, guava, et cetera. So
I you know, I grew up in theNorthwest, and we didn't we
didn't have a lot of fancy foodin my house when I was a kid.
(17:03):
But we did have canned pineappleoccasionally. So tropical fruit
I understand to be pineapple. Iknow the smell. So I can swirl
that. Somebody says tropicalfruit. I'm like, oh, yeah, I get
that. I get pineapple. Yeah,yeah. Swirling, swirling,
swirling. I'm sitting on thecouch. And Sabrina is with me.
I'll say, Let's smell thistropical fruit is all about
pineapple. And she's like whom?
findable. And there's guava. Andthere's papaya. And there's
(17:29):
mango. She's got them in herhead. Right? I don't. Right? I
didn't grow up in Rio deJaneiro. Right? So it is to get
back to your original question.
No matter how much education youhave, no matter how much you
think you've exercised yourpalate and developed your
vocabulary as relating to sensememory, which is all this is,
it's all about remembering whatthat is from when you tasted or
(17:52):
smelled it. At some point inyour entire life. No two people
are tasting the exact same winein the same way. Because you're
tasting it with your like yourtongue, your tongue is your
tongue. And nobody else's tonguehas lived that same life now
people in your family might. Youknow, I've never even thought
about this. Do you have brothersand sisters? I do have two older
sisters. So you guys might havesimilar palates, because you
(18:15):
grew up in the same house withthe same parents cooking the
same food and going to the sameplaces on vacation and smelling
various things that uniquely toyour family and your journey.
But still, you're going to havesome differences of opinion. You
might say I like this one, andyour sister might say you're
wrong. And of course you're not.
(18:38):
But she might say that right?
Because that's the way sisters.
Yeah, yeah. And I'm theyoungest, so Oh, okay. Not gonna
be right.
I'm the middle child of three,three boys. All right, you
anticipated this moment. And ithas finally come the moment on
the podcast where I say to myguest, Amy, what skin your
(19:01):
class?
Okay, before I do this, I'mgoing to ask the question, and
I'm not going to do it if it'sgoing to offend you. But I can
always edit it out. I put ice inmy wine. And I wasn't going to
do it. But I won't do it. But Iwas just wondering, what are
your thoughts on that? Itmight have been it might offend
some people, but it does notoffend me. Now, caveat. If
you've spent more than 20 or $30on this bottle of wine, I would
(19:26):
say don't do don't do that.
Because you're you're alteringthe flavor. Okay, I'm not gonna
do that. So yeah, but you have awine that's a little more
expensive than that or no, no,it's like, Well, this was $3.
Canadian and I don't know whatit would be for you because it
depends on it could also dependon the tax on the wine because
sometimes the tax I'm going toleave it as is but okay, I don't
(19:48):
know if I'm pronouncing thiscorrectly. But you asked me to
find a book with wineconnection. So yes, the first
books I'm going to talk abouthas that and you It takes place
in Orvieto, Italy. And I couldnot find at my local wine store,
I could not find a wine basethere, which I was secretly kind
(20:08):
of relieved about because thewine that I was looking for was
a sweet white, which I don'tlike. This is in the book that's
in the book. So what I did was Ifound a wine. If I pronounce it
correctly, it's from Lazio,Italy. And it's called the Lesko
Podio de Chelsea. And it's awhite wine, and it's a little on
(20:30):
the drier side.
And you should you send me apicture of it last night, and I
did a whole bunch of research.
So it's from a region calledMatthias going name. They
actually have do you have thebottle there? On the front? It
just says the name of the wineand the winery in the vintage.
And when I looked at that, Ithought, okay, there must be a
(20:50):
little more to that. So I lookedat that wine and it told me
where it came from. And it said,month a via scone A. And before
the word month, a few Sconnie.
Is there is there backlabel, there is a label on the
back, it's hard to read itbecause it's it's clear with the
writing on it. Oh, it mentionsthe line that I know you're
going to talk about which iswhat known for past AST s
(21:13):
Test test test, and the threetests one of the first one has
one exclamation mark, the secondone has two and the third one
has three and that's actually apart of the region. The proper
name of the region is est estest monta vs. Coney. Okay, so
this is first of all, this is ablend of three different grapes
or skeptiko Trebbiano, which isone of the most widely planted
(21:36):
white wine grapes in all ofItaly. And Malva sia now the
grown on rocky soils of themonth of Visconti this vineyard
is at 400 meters which is about1300 feet, which is fairly high
altitude. Now, here are thetasting notes. Prominent green
herbal nose, would you agree?
Oh gosh.
(21:58):
Now I'm just see I'm promptingyou saying do you get anything
herbal? Does it smell a littlebit green? Do you smell any
green figs? Because this is inthe note green figs, citrus
underripe pair?
I definitely don't can't tellthe pair. It's a kind of little
if I can use the word sharp,which I like. Okay. I feel it
(22:18):
grabs you a little bit. Yeah.
Okay. There's a little bitminerally on the finish. Okay,
does it like yeah, like you justlicked a rock or something?
I'm sure. Yeah, I wouldn't havethought to say that. But yeah,
some of these wind things, youknow, are really parsing them.
It's like, why do we even haveto go there you know. And then
(22:39):
it says here it's a versatilelike for seafood, and
vegetables. So now the name eseste este, a 12th century Bishop
traveling to the Vatican to meetthe Pope sent a scout ahead to
survey the villages along theroute searching for the best
wines. And he was to Mark asked,Latin for it is on the door of
(23:04):
the NS where the wine impressedis a guide for the bishop to
follow up at a month a fee isgonna be in the scout fell in
love with the local wine andwrote est, est EST on the door.
And the rest, as they say, ishistory. The story sort of got
bastardized, I guess at somepoint because then there's
another story about a 12thcentury German Bishop John
(23:27):
Fuger. Traveling to Rome for thecoronation of Henry the Fifth as
the Holy Roman Emperor and onhis travels who were sent his
major demo ahead of him to tastethe local wines report back
which wines were Vinum St.
bonum. As with other retellings,the Midge Domo documented his
research by writing St. Chuck onthe door of establishments whose
wines he enjoyed and being soimpressed with the wines at
(23:49):
month a few scone a punctuatedhis message with multiple est
est est. The bishop himself wasalso so impressed with the wines
that he canceled the rest of hisjourney, and stayed in monta
Visconti until his death andtoday there is a tomb in a local
church in multifeed stonybelieved to be the resting place
of BishopFulgur Wow. historic venue
(24:09):
vineyardlet's 900 year old history right
there. Or I guess we could say,legend, because we don't know.
We don't know if that's real,but it's kind of fun. That's
another reason I love wine. Soyou like this wine then?
I like it a lot. I like a drierwine. It doesn't have okay, I
(24:30):
know if I'm using the rightwords, but it doesn't have a
strong aftertaste to me. Isthat okay? Strong in a bad way?
Yeah, not in a bad way. Becausewhen you say the word aftertaste
in wine terms what we're alllooking for us wine people with
an aftertaste. We don't callit Dex actually sounds negative.
We call it the finish. Okay,when you swallow the wine, what
(24:50):
happens in your mouth? Is it agood thing and does it linger?
Oh, I see. Okay, is that easier?
I find that easier with a redwine to tell. That is that
you should have some finish on awhite wine. But typically red
wines are more complex ingeneral because of the
winemaking process. But I cantaste a little I'm reading,
there's a little sailing tasteand I
(25:12):
taste that. So it's in the notesthat I have. It's a little it
gets a little salty. Yeah,I like that. I think it's good.
Typically when you're when youswallow wine, two things are
gonna happen. Your mouth getsdrier and or your mouth waters.
Drier means you just experiencedtannins, which is compound in
the skins of the grapes thatdries your mouth out. And then
(25:33):
the mouth watering is from theacidity in the wine. And that's
a good thing too, because itbalances out the fruit flavor.
Because if you just have thisfruit and there's no
counteracting acidity, then youget a wine that we call flabby.
Oh, well, I'm happy to discoverthis. I would amazing, right.
It is interesting.
I will put a picture of Amy'swine on my Instagram, and a
picture of Amy sitting in her.
What room are you in?
(25:55):
This is our dining room. I lovethe wallpaper. Thanks. I have
some funky wallpaper. It's likebig circles that are I think
they're supposed to be kind offlowers, but they're modern.
It looks a little bitpsychedelic to me. Like it looks
like this could be you could besitting in a dining room that
was wallpapered in 1968 You knowI'm like, ya funky they hit the
(26:15):
other hippies came in andremodeled the house. Yeah. All
right, let's get this list outhere. Amy's summer reading
recommendations. I am excitedfor this. Okay, so
I picked three books and I triedto think all books I think are a
bit crowd pleasers. When I thinkit's summer reads, I think of a
(26:38):
super, super easy book, or maybea longer involved saga.
Okay, that's that was gonna be aquestion I was gonna ask you
like, what makes it a summerbook, but you just you just
nailed it right therewas there to maybe a thriller.
This first, but that is justclearly meant. So this is the
villa I'm gonna recommend. Thefirst one I'm gonna recommend is
(27:00):
the villa. And it's clearlylike, meant for a book club.
It's kind of hitting a lot ofthose sweet spots for I would
say, a female reader. It'scalled the villa. It's by Rachel
Hawkins. And she's written a fewdifferent thrillers. And she
wrote a book called The wifeupstairs. And it's kind of got a
lot of things going on. Butbasically, it's two women in
(27:21):
their 30s, Emily and chess. Andthey've been best friends since
they were little girls. They'renow novelists, each of them wow.
One is more successful than theother and they kind of lost
touch a little bit. I would saythey're kind of frenemies. Oh,
so like this already. So Emily'skind of not having a good time.
(27:43):
She's getting divorced. She'shaving trouble with her writing.
And chess is very successful.
And she comes to us again, youknow, that friend that just kind
of comes back into town. Andit's just like, hey, let's get
together. And yeah, where weleft off. And she's like,
Listen, I've rented this villafor six weeks. And she's very
(28:05):
successful in Italy. And we'regoing to go there. We're going
to drink wine and read books.
Not kidding. And escape. Let'sgo. And she's like, awesome. I
want to get out of my life.
Let's go. They go. And it's avilla and or beato. And there is
a little paragraph, I could readabout the wine itself. You know,
(28:27):
please do let's hear it. Okay,so they kind of get there. And
when they get there, they startto tour the villa, but they
really want to get to eating anddrinking and hanging out. So
they start to make dinner andthey say, we feast on the
asparagus cooked with lemon andolive oil and the chicken and
potatoes, the gravy somehow richand vibrant all at once. All of
(28:50):
it washed down with cold glassesof the Orvieto wine the region
is famous for. It's sweeter thanI normally drink, but it tastes
like summer. By the time I getup from the table. I'm fuller
than I've been in ages and alsomore than a little tipsy. The
wine is sort of setting thatscene. Yeah, what happens?
There's a couple of otherstorylines. So while they're
(29:11):
there, they start to uncover amystery. The Rolling Stones, I
think, in the 60s 70s recordedan album in Europe at Villa. And
so they're kind of recreating,it's not the Rolling Stones. But
there has been a murder manyyears ago from a rock band
visiting this villa, will startto uncover a mystery. That's the
(29:33):
thriller part. And then it's gotand that storyline. So they kind
of alternate voices in differentpoints of view that was inspired
by Did you watch Daisy Jones inthe six on television or you
might have read the book? No, Idon't even know who that is.
Okay, so it's a book and it'sabout it's inspired by Fleetwood
Mac and it's a big hot book anda big show. And so it's
(29:56):
basically about kind of groovynow 1970s Rock and roll, okay,
that storyline going on wherethey're investigating this
murder at these young peoplekind of overtaking this mansion
in the 70s, partying andrecording an album. And then the
last storyline is Frankenstein.
The book came about that wholestory because a bunch of Percy
(30:19):
Shelley and Mary Shelley endedup on at a villa kind of like
this villa. So all these peoplehave those names. So there's
kind of all these thingshappening. And then also funny
enough, although I don't knowthis lands, there's a some
podcasters in their and aseparate storyline that are also
investigating this murder. But Ithink they're there just because
(30:42):
podcasting is trendy,right and true crime is huge
and true crimes. So this book, Iwould give it four stars, it's
not five, but I think it's oneof those books that you take on
a beach, preferably with a glassof wine, and you really enjoy
(31:02):
it. You escape, but I don'tthink for me, it didn't stay
with me forever. But that's kindof what I want in a summer read.
For summer read, I don't want tobe taxed. I just want to have
some fun.
So do you want to enjoy it inthe moment? Yeah. Okay, what's
next? The next one is I'm gonnaput the names of all these books
in the authors in the shownotes. So if you scroll down the
(31:24):
show notes from this episode asyou're listening, if you're
driving, don't do that rightnow.
The next one is a lot of fun.
It's called age advice. Andhere's the cover you can see
it's for people listening. It'sa black cover with just great
gold letters.
Like that. I want to get pickedfor
(31:48):
a crime thriller that in India,it's by a young author, her name
is deep T Kapoor and this bookis long. It looks a
little thick. Yeah, you'reholding up a thick book there.
How many pages?
It's 600 550. But it is a pageturner. It's not hard to read.
(32:08):
Okay. It's a book aboutgangsters, lovers, false
friendships, forbidden romanceand corruption. And this is the
book that is sort of thisQuentin Tarantino style. Okay.
Well, look, I think what peoplelike about it is it set in
India, and it gets into, youknow, the versus strong class
system in India. And it kind oflooks at everything from the
(32:32):
deep poverty to crime families,wealthy people, there's a lot
going on. The book is about thewadiya crime family. There's a
servant who kind of comes fromsuper humble beginnings, but
it's somehow caught up in allthis. There's a play the son
who's kind of named Sonny, He'sa playboy. He's trying to outdo
(32:53):
his father, but he's kind ofjust not doing anything and just
partying. Now sendhim to Canada. Yeah,
they might send him to Canada.
That's right. Good. To get one.
And then there's Anita, who's acurious journalist, and she is
falling in love with Sonny, andshe's kind of caught between
reporting the truth of thestory, and then her love for
(33:14):
him. And it starts off with Iguess, I would say just just to
tell you what it starts offwith. There's a speeding
Mercedes jumps the curb, andfive people die. All this page
one. This is page one. Wow. It'sa rich man's car. But the rich
man isn't there and the servantis there. No. So that's how it
(33:35):
starts. And it's unfortunate.
What I liked about it is it'sthe author's young, so it's a
very fresh book, it's movesquickly. It's pretty violent. So
I found that difficult, buteveryone I've talked to liked
it. And I think this would alsoappeal to men, women, all kinds
of people.
Okay. All right, you have onemore for us.
(33:57):
The last one is called YellowFace by Rf Wang. And it is my
favorite book that I've readthis year.
Oh, do you have it there?
Oh, I don't have it because Ilent it out. Sorry. Just send me
a picture of it. Okay,I'll send you a picture. All
these things for the Instagrampost.
It deals with diversity, racism,cultural appropriation. Also,
(34:21):
with the heart of it. It's a lotabout the bad things that can
happen on social media, onTwitter and that kind of thing.
And basically, it's to women,young women who went to Yale,
and their rising novelists. Sothis is another novelists theme.
One of them is Asian one of themisms, and then there's a bad
accident and the Asian woman Hername is Athena. She dies. And
(34:46):
she's an incredible writer likeshe's a rising star. And in a
very quick moments, her supposedfriend steals her manuscript for
a book and passes it off as herown. No That's, that's the
setup.
Okay? No, that is that's adevice. It's been used a bunch
of times.
Right? You know what you'reright about that. And that two
(35:08):
books that just came out thatwere very good. There's a book
called the plot, by Jean havefour legs. And that's about the
same thing. And then there's abook called, who is Maude Dixon
by Alexandra Andrews. And itdoes the same. But I think what
I liked this book is, first ofall, the author super young, so
I almost can't quantify thewriting. It's just she's like 26
(35:30):
or 27. And she's just doingsomething really fresh and new,
like a different language. Yes,it's like a different language.
She talks about racism, sheherself is Asian, and you'll be
uncomfortable at moments, youlearn a lot. Like it's she's
just talking about tropes, andit's a thriller. And the writing
(35:50):
is good. So I just couldn't putit down. I thought it was really
good, really creative and new.
Very nice. Yeah, very, verynice. I'm starting to get a
little sweaty thinking aboutthat book. How do you choose
which books to read, and end upon your podcast? Where's a great
place to read about books?
When I start, I read what Inaturally like just that I if I
(36:13):
wasn't doing a podcast, becauseI feel that people will hear the
authenticity and my voice if Ireally like it, and of course,
and I like thrillers, I likeliterary fiction, historical
fiction memoirs, but that can bea little limiting. I can't do
everything on that. So I bringon people with different
viewpoints. And I'll bring onfriends or authors themselves to
(36:36):
talk so I can try new things andlearn where do I find books? New
York Times for sure. All right,I speak to my friends. There's a
blog in Canada called 40 Nightsshelf, which I learned about new
Canadian authors. I would saythat staff shelf of any really
(36:58):
great indie bookstore, you canlook this at the staff picks and
what you're looking for is atany given time, the more I do
this, there's only kind of like20 bucks maximum at a time in
the world that people are notmaybe in North America that are
getting touted. And there's somegreat books. Go to a really
great independent store, youmight find something stumbled
(37:21):
across something that youwouldn't, so
is your chance to give a shoutout to your local independent
bookstore.
Oh, okay. I gotta give a shoutout to Hager books. It's in my
neighborhood nager books inVancouver, in Vancouver
neighborhood are you in? I'm ina neighborhood called
Kerrisdale.
I just subscribed to a coolbookish newsletter called The
(37:43):
millions. I really don't knowwhere it comes from. I don't
know if those that someonementioned on a podcast and I
subscribed and I like it so far.
When I have time to read it.
Sometimes it just comes in dropsin my mailbox. And I'm like,
Okay, I'll just keep that there.
And then there's like two orthree weeks worth, but it's
called the millions. I'm sureit's based in New York City
similar. The New Yorker for meis also a good source of book
reviews. And long stories aboutauthors. Here where I live in
(38:07):
Marin County, California,there's a bookstore called book
passage. And if there's a authormaking his way into the Bay
Area, oftentimes they will showup at book passage was actually
just a 15 minute drive from myhouse. Yeah, I mean, this is
Morgan counties a little bitshishi in that way, for sure.
And there's a local chain herecalled copper fields that has
(38:29):
few locations, and one is just afew minutes drive from my house.
Sometimes those bookstores hasreally good ones have great
Instagrams or newsletters, Oh,totally. Or you can get good
ideas because I opposite indiebookstores are great because
they're usually staffed withpeople that read a lot. And
it's really it feels good to gointo a bookstore and talk to
(38:51):
people to like books. Totally.
Are you ready to find out what'sin my glass?
Yes, all I know isit's red, so it is red because
it's swirling wine. Well, youhave Italian wine in your glass.
So I decided to put Italian winein my glass. The wine I am
currently sipping is a fairlyinexpensive read and I'm loving
(39:12):
and I'm like sucking it downwhile we're talking. But if we
don't finish the interview,reason, Mike just got drunk.
This is a winery that I've hadwine from before, but I've never
had this particular wine becausethis is sort of their starter
red blend. The wineries calledMK two pillows. So the wind is
called Ah, cool. That's a spacecue you Oh, this is based on the
(39:34):
Latin, depending on what websiteyou look at. It sort of means
where we begin, and this is sortof their entry level. Red wine
2017 Vintage month. villosa ison the coast of Tuscany, in an
area called Bolgheri which isone of the hottest areas in
(39:55):
Tuscany, so they grow a lot ofthose darker thicker skin
grapes. And the winemaker is aSwiss guy named Fabio Ciara
loto. And he says it's easy toproduce these wines because
they're so concentrated becausewe live in such a hot climate.
What is hard is to achieveelegance and finesse, he's
already admitting like I've gotthe good fruit. And I could just
(40:17):
make the wine and it would beamazing, but I'm going to make
it even better than that. Andit's true. I've had three or
four of the wines that theyproduce from just 17 acres. So
this is a small, small winery.
They make some higher end stuff.
They've got one called Nardo,which is a Tuscan dialect word
for lavender. They make winecalled gabbro, which is 100%
(40:41):
Cabernet Sauvignon. And thenannual, which is their red
blend. It's a little bit moreexpensive than the Aqua that I
am drinking. It's a blend of 30%Multiple Ciano 30% Cabernet
Sauvignon 20% Sangiovese Z 10%Mar salon, and 10% Allah Conte,
that's five grapes. Four of themare Italian grapes. One of them
(41:02):
is a French Bordeaux grape. Thevery basic way you would
subscript describe this wine isit's a super Tuscan, which means
they're using it Suskind grapes,but they're adding something
different in there to make it alittle more impressive. The
Cabernet Sauvignon, this one isgreat, that we retails for like
25 bucks.
(41:23):
What would you serve that with?
Or how would you? I mean, you'redrinking it here, but what kind
of food would yourun out of drinking it all by
itself? on an empty stomach,anything of that kind of rustic
Mediterranean thing you know,seared meats, seared vegetables,
it's summertime. So you fire upthe grill and you get some
veggies on there. And you putsome, maybe some Italian
(41:46):
sausages on there, maybe somemaybe some steaks, keep it
simple. This is one of thosewines that doesn't need a lot of
adornment around it with foodbecause it really the flavors
are very bright. They reallypop. And I mentioned lavender,
and the name of one of the winesis not this one. But there's
definitely a good hit ofsomething very floral, lavender
re on the nose. And then it getsinto all the red fruits, all the
(42:07):
different cherries andraspberries and blackberries. So
it's darker red fruits.
That's really good.
I wish you were here becauseit's one of those. I'm in a
house by myself right now. Like,I wish there was somebody to
share with me. Yeah, itsounds really good.
And then it gets really juicy inthe mouth, which tasted then all
of a sudden your wine, yourmouth just starts to water. And
(42:30):
it's like you just bid into thewhole cluster of grapes. And
like a almost like you can feelthe juice running down your
chin. You know, have somelisteners up in Vancouver, you
do I get the I get the downloadstats from my podcast host site.
Oh, that's fine. And it saysthat I have some Vancouver
listeners. Maybe you're one ofthem. I don't know, I'm
one of them. I am one of them.
(42:51):
The funny thing about thestatistics we get as podcasters
is just vague locations wherethe listeners are coming from,
not who these people are really,I do have a great friend up your
way. And my friend Sam, who's ageologist, she may be tuning in,
but I do get downloads from BC.
Let's talk about starting apodcast. I think we started
around the same time, give ortake a few months. Tell me what
(43:13):
prompted you to start a podcast?
Well, I'd never heard a podcastuntil COVID head. And one thing
in Canada, we had super strictrules like more than the United
States. And we really couldn'teven at one point, barely leave
the house. And so I'm home and Idiscovered podcasts and they
(43:37):
became how I got through COVID.
And I was so interested in theintimacy of it have a journalism
background. I like that youcould find something very
specific, like so specific.
Yeah. And it would do a deepdive. And I just I thought it
seemed like the person wassomething if they're done really
(43:59):
well, if they're talkingdirectly to me. I just
challenged myself that followingJanuary. So January 2021. Really
just to do something creativeand use skills in a different
way. My main goal was to do apodcast, it wasn't to do books.
But I chose books because it'ssomething that I know, because I
(44:19):
wanted it to seem authentic.
Like it was yoursecond choice. Oh,
weird. It's it would probably beknitting and you would not we
probably wouldn't have met, weprobably wouldn't have met. So I
just thought that there's acouple of things. I can talk
about knowledgeably and Ithought I just did it for fun.
And I didn't have an agenda withit and it just kind of kept
(44:42):
going and I got some followers.
I really like it. Yeah, I don'tknow. What about you. When did
you start it and why?
January of 2021 the same?
Yeah. Just like you I didn'tknow anything about podcasts.
I'd heard about them. They wereout there bouncing around
because I come from the world ofradio. Okay, so I I worked in
radio for 15 years, up untilabout the latter part of the
(45:03):
1990s at the apex of the DaveMatthews sensation, and I got
out of business because it justwasn't fun anymore. And I
stumbled into restaurant workby, by accident. And that worked
with my love of wine, which Ihad already had. I already had
love of wine, radio career,which means now I can talk about
(45:23):
wine like somebody who knowswhat they're talking about,
because that's what radio iscome up with a soundbite.
What's the natural progressionfor you like, it's just so easy
that with that, right, radio,the radio
thing stayed dormant in methough, from 1998 until the
latter 20 teens when podcastscame around, and I'm like, Oh,
they're creating little shows. Ican create a little show. Okay,
(45:46):
and so I thought about for along time. And then I got an
email, you know, from just something relating to podcasts. And
there was this host site that Iuse now, that was all about
looking at our videos. This ishow you started a podcast. And
I'm like, Okay, how does itwork? Because now because you
use Buzzsprout? I useBuzzsprout. Yeah. And they're so
helpful. They are actually so Istarted looking at these videos,
(46:08):
then I got an account and Ithought, Okay, I got an account
now. I just need to do it. So Idid it. I talked to my boss and
said, Hey, I'm thinking ofstarting a wine podcast. I want
you to be my first guest. So hesat for an interview. And my
boss is a guy from India. Idon't know if you met him when
you were at the winery, DeepakOkay, he's the guy from India is
making wine in Sonoma,California. And the story how we
(46:28):
got from point A to point B isjust lots of twists and turns.
And I think that's really a funthing about a lot of us in the
wine business. Because none ofus grew up as kids people
saying, What do you want to bewhen you grow up, and you're
that I want to work in a winery?
I find it it's a great form ofstorytelling, and it's very
autobiographical. And it can bevery relatable, because most of
us who we are today is not whowe thought we were going to be
(46:49):
when we were little kids. No.
And so I figured out how thetechnical thing worked. And then
I started the podcast. But yeah,I was already I was like a
podcast host waiting to happen.
Somebody just had to light thefuse I need to but little bit
different was interesting.
Because when we first talked, wetalked, what after we first met
and what I realized you are init, you really want to connect
(47:13):
and hear about people'sindividual stories. And for me,
I was kind of had thatjournalist hat as I wanted to
provide information, right? Alsobe creative. I think we meet
somewhere in the middle withwanting to be creative and have
fun, but I really appreciatethat about you that you were
like, I just want to likeconnect and get to know the why
behind people.
(47:33):
And I want to put on a show.
Yes, exactly. My view is moreabout it's a show, you know, it
starts with like a little bit ofhere's a preview, here's some
clips, here's your music. Bam,bam, bam. And then here's my
que, because I like to put on ashow and I've done with all the
editing and I uploaded andscheduled a release. I feel like
I'm unveiling a new painting.
Yeah, it's really, yeah, it's agreat, it's a great, great
(47:57):
feeling. What's the oddest orfunniest or strangest thing
that's happened to you while youwere recording your podcast?
Well, this won't surprise youbecause you have experienced in
radio. But one of the problems Ihad when I started I used to
handwrite my or not handwritewrite out my scripts doesn't
work. But what I didn'tunderstand is what people are
(48:19):
really looking for within reasonis the mistakes. Because then
you become human. I had my dogbarged in, someone was knocking
on the door. I couldn't getrecording started. I kept that
in. But the biggest thing thathappened was I had a friend of
mine who's a sci fi nerd. And Ihad no interest in sci fi. And
(48:40):
then I kind of made him readsomething that I thought might
have appealed to my listeners.
And we both didn't like thebook. And I refused to finish
the book. I couldn't sleepbecause I was like, Well, no
one's gonna want to listen. AndI didn't, I'm glad everybody
down. He was one of my biggestepisodes because I just won. And
I was like, I don't like thisbook at all. In fact, I didn't
finish it.
(49:00):
It's because you are real. Youlet the real Amy be seen by your
audience.
And people really liked it. AndI had literally thought, oh my
god, I'm gonna lose listeners.
That was a really big turningpoint for me, because it allowed
me to kind of relax a bit andrealize that I don't have to
tell everybody everything. Andreally what I am is I'm an
ambassador for reading. I wantto get people excited. They
(49:23):
don't have to know everything.
And they do want to connect,they want to know what's going
on in your life within reason.
They totally do. Yeah, soanyway, that was I would say not
finishing a book and then goingon and talking about it and
complaining about it.
It's just like when I have awine I open a wine like I you
know, I try and bring wines ontothe show that have some kind of
(49:44):
a story. Yeah, and they're funto talk about, like your wine
like my wine today. And I'vedone this before where you know,
I've had a guest sitting with mein the studio we put together up
the winery. When we do we'll doit live and in person. We're
like, well, this isn't thisisn't great. Eat, you know,
we're all amped to really getinto this wine and then you open
(50:04):
it. It's like, yeah, it doesn'treally work. And it's real. You
know, it's not like when youturn on say, you know, Good
Morning America or whatever, andthey're doing this thing and
everything is, yeah, this isamazing. This is a great thing.
And it's amazing. And it'samazing. And it's great. And we
all love it. And no, they neversay, Yeah, this, this isn't this
isn't what we thought it wasgoing to be. No, because that's,
(50:25):
that's the real experience. Youknow, you you go out shopping
for something or you find arecipe for something you want to
cook, and you follow it to theletter and then you taste it.
You're like, Yeah, this is,let's get a pizza. That was kind
of your moment. Let's get pizza.
Yeah, I didn't like this book.
Let's just get a pizza book.
Your podcast is the Red Fernbook review. I know you named it
(50:46):
for a favorite book Where theRed Fern Grows, which I've never
read. And I know it was a moviein the 1970s. And it was remade
in the early 2000s. I stillremember like, vaguely being in
a movie theater as a kid seeinga preview for Where the Red Fern
Grows. And looking back on melike, whatever it was 10 year
(51:06):
old me at the time, there was afeeling in the pit of my stomach
watching that trailer like oh,that's gonna be fucking sad. It
is. Yeah, so I never saw Wherethe Red Fern Grows. But you
named your podcast after it.
Tell me whyit was probably one of the first
chapter books I read. It's waswritten in 1961. It's about a
young boy in the Ozarks with toread, they're called Redbone
(51:29):
Coonhounds. They're huntingdogs. Yeah. Big Dan little and
it was those arcs. Andbasically, spoiler alert, the
dogs dying. No, you gotta know,just smell the dogs.
It's gonna rip your heart out.
I didn't know that was gonnahappen. It's for kids. And I got
(51:50):
so attached to the dogs. Andthere's this like, very
heartwarming ending. There'slike a parable throughout about
a Red Fern and it ends upsprouting out through one of
their graves one there and Ijust I think I cried for like a
week. What I I think the pointis, I don't know now how good or
(52:11):
bad it was. Really was the firsttime I understood that. Books
have that kind of power. Right?
Totally. And that's, that's whythat's a great lesson. And but
me I'm just like, No, I'm out.
No. is gonna get really sad.
I'm, I am not here for it. Haveyou guessed it on many podcasts?
(52:32):
Amy?
No, this is the first time andit's so much fun. And it's hard.
Like it's getting easier now.
But like, it's hard to be askedthe questions like I like it. I
like asking the questions. Oh,answering see. So it's really
good to see understand. When Ihave guests how they might feel
(52:54):
sure. No, this is good. This isa good like a turnabout kind of
thing. Yeah, but I'm a prettyeasy Inquisitor. I mean, I'm not
like, you know, I'm not like,well, this from 60 minutes. No,
yeah. Are there other podcastsyou listen to the you might
recommend?
There's two that I'm really intoright now. One is called wiser
than me. And it's oh, this is?
I just literally Dr. Julia LouisDreyfus, right. Somebody
(53:17):
mentioned that to me.
So she's interviewing olderwomen and finding that relevance
and big name women like JaneFonda, Amy Tan, and she's also
hilarious, like, so sheinterviews on a garden and
halfway through, she's like, canI ask you about that chicken
recipe? Could I do this like shegets, it's just so funny. Like,
(53:38):
she just is very good. Thesewomen talk about their past and
what made them who they are. AndI think it's great. And it's
funny. The other one that I'msuper into is called Dear
therapists with two therapistsLaurie Gottlieb and Guy winch.
And then someone comes on writesin the letter and has a serious
problem, and they help solve it.
And it's actually really, reallyhelpful. So if you don't go to
(54:02):
therapy, this is a free therapy.
Okay. Entertaining.
I heard an ad I was listening topodcasts the other day. And, you
know, when when a podcast fromlike a celebrity or a well known
podcast is ads, and there'susually ads for other podcasts.
I'm usually if I'm in the car,you know, I can't quite reach
(54:22):
the phone. And I shouldn't lookat the phone when I'm driving
anyway, so But I try and youknow, skim through the ads, but
I couldn't skim through the adbecause I was, you know, driving
and slept traffic. All of asudden, this ad comes on for a
books podcast, and I'm like, Oh,it's a book podcast. Cool. I can
talk. I can talk to me aboutthis. It was a podcast called
Moms don't have time to readbooks. Have you heard of this? I
(54:45):
thinkshe might be the biggest podcast
in my space.
Oh, you know what? I hated thead. The woman's name is Zb
Owens. Yeah,it's a lot but she's
a mom for kids. But she has thisYeah, I'm a mom. And we don't
have time to read books. Andit's kind of this cartoony mom
(55:05):
persona that she puts on. AndI'm, like, talk to me, like, I'm
a real person. Don't talk to melike I'm a child, this adult or
I don't even know what she'sgoing for. But I just my started
God the year, I want to say shestarted like a long time ago.
And like 2016 2018, what shedoes is her whole thing is is
(55:27):
super short and sweet. Shebrings on an author, and she
brings on all the best authors,they all go see her whatever the
latest book is. And it's short,like, it's 30 minutes or less.
She's got tons of energy. It'ssuper accessible. But I like
something more nuanced.
Personally, I justfelt like it was here's a big
(55:47):
schmear of very sweet, overlysweet, sickening jam. Please
enjoy.
I think for the average reader,people will like it because they
get an interview with theauthor. But for me, I want
something a little more. Ithink, personally, as a
listener, I want something alittle more subtle.
I just hated the whole idea ofher podcast. And then I Googled
(56:10):
her. Oh, she's a big deal. Ifound out she's a big deal. But
you know what? She's also thedaughter of a billionaire.
Yeah, that's true. That doesn't.
There's another reason to think.
Sure, zippy. Last question,where do you read? Mostly, what
are the perfect conditions foryou? And is there a dangerous
(56:33):
looking stack of books thereright now? I'm thinking about my
bedside table.
I have books everywhere in thehouse. But I would say, I have
kids that are grown up to boys.
But I used to, I still am amorning person. And I did it
because it was when no one wasaround. I'd like to get up
early. And I read it and knockoff the kitchen for probably
(56:54):
about an hour. And I like itbecause nobody's around bugging
me. And then I'm free to bebugged when they're up. If
they're if they're home, or ifmy husband's home. But one of my
biggest problems is I put a lotof books on hold at the library.
And so I feel under artificialpressure to finish like, I could
just pay the dollar, or I couldjust turn it back in. But I'm
(57:17):
like, no, no, no, I have to readbecause I have to get back into.
Right. Well, well, that's goodthat you're patronizing the
library though. That's, that'san important thing to know,
though. I mean, all these books.
Yeah, I read in bed. I try andread during the day, but I just
find that I've got other thingsI want to do when I have spare
time. So it's hard for me, I'mprobably down to reading one or
(57:38):
two books a year. I hate toadmit that somebody who hosts
books podcast.
You know what, though, it is sohard, like it's hard to fit it
in. And you've got so manyoptions now. And the truth is, I
would read a lot but I wouldn'tread as much as I do. I probably
read half as much as I do. I dobecause I am doing this podcast.
I think having a podcast givesyou an excuse to read more
(58:00):
books. Yeah, I'm gonna use thatfor for drinking more wine. This
is for the podcast. It's justresearch. It's just research.
Slippery slope.
Yes. Hey, thanks for hangingout with us. That was really
fun. Thank you so much forhaving me on. They learned a lot
too. And now you've made me moreconfident to like use wine
(58:23):
adjectives.
Good. Hang on. I'm going to readthe closing credits. Okay. Okay.
V tall Mike wind podcast wasconceived and is written,
produced, edited and maintainedby yours truly. Today's episode
came to you from my home studioin Novato, California. I'd love
(58:46):
to hear from you. If you have aquestion, a comment, a
suggestion? Or a guest or atopic or if you want to have
your very own stack of officialtall Mike wind podcast coasters.
I didn't show you the coasters.
Amy, did I give you one when youcame to visit?
You did? Oh, you have one? Ihave one. Okay, good. Thank you.
It's a nice coaster.
(59:07):
It is a nice coaster. And ifyou'd like to have your own you
can email me at Tom Mikewine@gmail.com to see behind the
scenes of today's episode and tofollow along as I drink wine and
cook and eat some delicious foodand otherwise live the good
life. Follow me on Instagram attal Mike wine. Did you drop that
(59:29):
five star review yet on Applepodcasts? Come on. What's the
whole Bob? That tell me it helpsa lot. Thanks to Amy Mair for
hanging out. I'll have anotherepisode for you soon. But for
now, I'm Mike stone. Keepswirling. Keep sniffing. keep
sipping Cheers.
Hey, Red Fern listeners. This is your host,
Amy Mair. And I'm checking inwith you. It's middle of summer.
And I hope you're doing lots ofreading. I know I sure am. And
I'm working on our fall andupper my following up as we
speak. But in the meantime, Iwanted to offer up a different
(00:25):
kind of podcast I'd like toshare with you, I recently had
the opportunity to be a guest ona podcast. And that podcast is
the TallMikeWine Podcast hostedby Mike Stone. And here's sort
of my equivalents, but in thewine world, and we ran into each
other. I was on vacation about ayear ago, in Sonoma, and he
(00:48):
works at Nicholson Ranch, whichis a great winery if you're in
the area.
And we got to talking andthought there might be a way for
us to collaborate. So I justwent on his podcast and gave a
mini summer reading list. And atthe same time, we paired the
books with wine, and talkedabout all things wine, and I
(01:08):
learned also to work on my wineadjectives. So I think I've got
floral down and a couple ofother things. So you have to
listen in. But Tom, Mike is thereal deal. He is very serious
about his wine, but doesn't takehimself too seriously. So I
think that's a really goodcombo. And he's a former disc
jockey. So I think he has awonderful voice that you'll
(01:31):
enjoy. So please check him out.
And I will talk to you soon andI will be back in the fall with
more episodes. Okay. Talk to youlater. Bye.
On the Tom Mike wine podcast, Isaw Mike, how's it going?
(01:51):
You don't have to call me Tom.
Mike, if you don't want to okay,but you would be amazed at how
many people just call me thatwhen they meet me in person
and have to add she is Canadian.
I want to throw that out. Can Iput ice
in my mind? It might offend somepeople but it does not offend
me. But Ichose books because it's
something that I know because Iwanted it to seem authentic. It
is your second choice. It wouldprobably be knitting and you
(02:15):
would not want my blind podcast.
The cellphones have beensilenced. The wine is poured.
And just like that the podcastbegins. It's the tall Mike wine
(02:35):
podcast, the wine podcast that'snot all about wine. Although
wine can be boring, and who cansit still for that. The wind
podcasts heard in 65 countrieson six continents and in 48 of
these United States, fromColorado, Ohio, to Detroit Lakes
(02:55):
Minnesota, from Rawlins Wyomingto Paul's Bo Washington, where
they make that Paul's bow bread,the bread whose recipe was
inspired by the Bible. Prettycrazy. Paul's bow. Thanks for
tuning in. I'm Mike stone, yourhost and eponymous tall wine
guy. I work at a winery inSonoma, California. And for more
(03:18):
than half my life I've beenreally into wine. And I like to
share the fun part withconversation. If you enjoy these
conversations, scroll up anddown and through the older
episodes, get yourself caughtup. Also, I'll nag you again
about leaving a rating and areview on Apple podcasts and be
sure you're subscribed onwhatever app it is you're using.
(03:39):
So you don't miss an episode.
They tell me it helps a lot.
Let's get to the conversation.
It's episode 42. And my guest isa podcast host. She's also
Canadian. Her podcast is not awine podcast, but a podcast that
focuses on books. We met whenshe and some friends visited
(04:01):
Nicholson ranch so she has winecred. Speaking to us via zoom
from Vancouver BC the host ofthe Red Fern book review podcast
Amy Mair. Hello, Amy.
Hi, Tom. Mike. How's it going?
I'm so happy to be here.
I'm doing great. I'm doing well.
You don't have to call me tallMike, if you don't want to. But
(04:22):
you would be amazed at how manypeople just call me that when
they meet me in person. BecauseI'm tall. Weird. How long you
go. Where are you in Sonoma? Itseems like a while back to me.
It was last spring and I was ona girls trip for a big milestone
(04:43):
birthday for me. And I rememberwe had this great picnic at
Nicholson ranch and then wemoved over for wine tasting. And
that's where I met you.
Yes, it has happened a few timesless than a handful where
somebody I work with, says hey,there's a fellow podcaster In
that group over there, youshould go say hi. Or I'll be
(05:03):
hosting someone and I'll mentionthe podcast. And they'll be
like, Oh, I have a podcast. Sohere is the vague premise for
this episode. Way, way back inthe early 1990s. When I began my
wine journey, I was invited winetasting by some coworkers as a
non wine drinking guy in hislate 20s. One of the things I
(05:23):
noticed as I got to know otherpeople visiting the wineries,
let's call them wine people, isthey seem to be into things I
was into, for example, food, notjust talking about food they
ate, but cooking, theingredients, methods, time, they
spent cooking food, shopping forthings to cook, et cetera. Also,
(05:44):
movies, not so much whatever thehot VCR rental of the moment
was, but movies of a certainsort in the Art House Foreign
specific movies from directorsthey liked. Going deeper than
most people I knew at the timediscussing things about the
movies, and books, these peoplewould talk about books they were
reading, which wasn't unusual inand of itself. But again, it
(06:05):
seemed to go just a littledeeper, I got the feeling that
books were more important moreof a priority to my new
acquaintances at these wineries,and I really liked that in a
sort of aspirational way. Myconclusion here is pretty
simple. I think people that aremore into wine who might listen
to a wine podcast are more thanlikely into books as well now
(06:27):
tell me if I'm sounding tooelitist? Or does this make sense
to you, Amy,it makes complete sense, I think
they go together, I would say mybook club definitely agrees with
that. Because the number onereason we get together is
actually I believe, not to readthe books, but to connect. And
so what that means is forprobably the first hour that
we're together, we're usuallydrinking wine, and hearing a
(06:48):
charcuterie platter, and then wewill go over and talk about the
books, I think that goestogether. But you know, I
thought about some othercommonalities. And people read
for many reasons, I would saythey read to learn to relax to
escape. Just like people mightunwind like a glass of wine
after work, you might read achapter of a book. And I think
(07:11):
it's even better if you do bothtogether, they are a great
combination. But a couple otherthings I was thinking about is
that all those things like saycooking wine, books, and movies,
they're super accessible on onelevel. And if you want, you can
do a deep dive, you can getreally into it. And then you can
spend hours connecting withpeople. And I find I've met all
(07:34):
kinds of people. And anotherthing I don't know if you think
this is true, but I was thinkingabout it. Sometimes it's a less
vulnerable way of connectingwith people. So I find people
will argue and debate acharacter with me. And I feel
like I've had this reallyintense discussion, but maybe
I've actually had a bad day. ButI feel kind of lighter and more
enriched because I sharedsomething with someone. And I
(07:56):
love it when people get mad atthe characters like their
people. So I don't know ifpeople get mad at the wine or
I'm trying to think if peopleget mad at wine. I mean, there
are definitely added characterslike you search for a specific
wine because you've heardcertain things about it, or
you've had certain wines of thissort, and then you find a
different one. And it's not asgood as you thought it was going
(08:18):
to be. You might be mad ordisappointed about that. I like
where you're going with that. Idon't know that I can really
relate it to wine. But yeah, Imean, books are great because
you're sharing a story that cameout of somebody's brain. And the
people aren't real. I havetasks. Amy with coming up with a
small list of summer reading forus. We'll get to that in a
little bit. But first, thank youfor turning me on to a book
(08:42):
called station 11. A few monthsback by Emily St. John Mandel.
It was a really in mywheelhouse. Do you remember what
you said about the book?
Whatever it was, I went out andfound it immediately.
That book is amazing because itwas actually written in 2014.
And she predicts a pandemic.
(09:02):
It was a avian flu.
It's a flu. Okay. Itwas much more, of course severe
than COVID-19 The Coronavirusbecause it wiped out. I mean,
they don't really say in thebook, specifically. It's very,
very much a sort of postapocalyptic dystopian story and
I kind of gravitate to is Idon't know why that is. Economic
(09:24):
repetative thing. Yeah. But inthe book, it seems to me like
the this virus has wiped outprobably 95% of the population,
which means there's nobody doany of the jobs that provide us
modern comforts. There's nogasoline, so there are no cars.
There's no electricitygenerated. So there's no
(09:45):
electricity for lights, nothingis being manufactured. So
everything that these people areusing. Everything is just stuff
they still have.
I thought it was very relevantin light of what we've gone
through. I obviously it's In afantasy, or worst case scenario,
I think the writing is off thehook. I love that. And I have to
(10:06):
add, she is Canadian. So I wantto throw that out. Oh, Canada.
She also wrote a couple of otherbig books. And I think, did you
talk about her in general on anepisode,
I did a podcast on Her mostrecent book, which is Sea of
Tranquility. That's a big, bigbook. And this is a kind of
science fiction where someonekind of keeps appearing in
(10:30):
different moments in time.
There's a word for that. Shelikes sci fi. And there's a
future world and there's far inthe past world. It's really,
really, really good. When Canadawas colonized, they would send
wealthy either second born sonsor sons that were a
disappointment. They would sendthem to Canada, and kind of hope
(10:50):
that they wouldn't come back.
It's about one of those. No,that's how Canada was built.
Partly not disappointingsons. The Second Sons, that's
that's really interesting.
I can't remember the name. Ihave to look it up. But it's
like a cold something men andsent to far flung places because
(11:11):
they needed people to colonizedifficult places. Anyway, it's
colonialists. It's an excellentall of her books. There's
another one that's a take off onBernie Madoff. It's called the
glass hotel. It's also set inBritish Columbia. I think you'd
like that too. All right.
I'm gonna become an expert onEmily St. John Mandel, the works
(11:33):
of let's talk about how youdescribe books, I find it really
impressive, because I listen toyour podcasts. And I think
there's another common threadhere. Because when wine people
talk about wine, you know, thelegit tasting notes full of
flowery words and descriptions.
People who visit me at thewinery say, how do you do that?
So Amy,how do you do that? Well, okay,
(11:55):
I was thinking about this. And Iwas comparing it to wine again.
So I drink wine on the regular,but I'm not confident to see
what I think about it. If youask me, and I'm probably going
to ask me what I think about theone I'm drinking. I'll say it
kind of quietly or not withconfidence. So I think when I
talk about books, I sell it, oneof the number one things is I
(12:19):
have confidence when I describethe books, I think that helps.
Let me ask you this, becausethis is what this is, this is
basically how we create thismagical thing called a wine
review, or a wine tasting note.
We have a series of prompts. Andit's basically you know, you can
start anywhere you want it, youknow, you start with the smell,
(12:39):
okay, or the color. And there'sa bunch of different you know,
prompts like, is it this color?
Is it this color? Is it thiscolor? Is it lighter? That
color? Is it more medium thatcolor? Or is it deep that color?
Now, the sudden you're using adeep magenta, and then you've
already started off with this,like, wow, this wine is deep
magenta, and that is a good wayto start. And then the aroma,
(13:02):
you want to know if it's if it'sstrong, or if it's not so
strong. And then you just startpulling things out of it, you
know, you can go from thefruits. And then you start
sniffing and people say, I can'tget the specific fruits like
that. You always say Oh,cheerio, BlackBerry, oh, this, I
say, Well, then don't worryabout what specific fruit it is.
Think about what color it is.
And say it's red fruit is bluefruit. It's black fruit. Because
(13:24):
I think when you tastesomething, and you say what
color is it instead of sayingWhat fruit do you taste? You're
a little more vague. People canlatch on to that. Yeah, I see.
And then you start breaking itdown. Okay, now we've decided
it's red fruit is a darker redfruit. Is it heavier red fruit?
Or is it lighter red fruit likea strawberry? Or is it a deep
(13:45):
dark red fruit like a black,cherry or plum. And you just
prompt yourself and you justwork your way through and then
you move from fruit and then yougo to anything earthy. Anything
wood Z. And then the one Ialways forget. And miss out on
sometimes is floral? Do yousmell any flowers? In this wine?
Chances are you will, becausewine tends to smell like
(14:09):
flowers. That's kind of how itworks. So do you do something
similar to that when youwhile you're talking? I guess I
do a little bit but not asstructured, as you said. But I
wrote down some adjectives thatI use, because I was thinking
about it. But I do first of alldescribe the genre to explain it
because you know, what are wedealing with here is a
historical fiction, what is itand within that I can have some
(14:32):
adjectives. And then I oftenwill compare it to something
that you know, like one of thebooks I'm going to talk about
today, I will compare it to aQuentin Tarantino movie. So I've
said that and I know right nowyou probably have somewhat of a
thought of what that could belike. So I'll try to pick
something that everybody knowsand then I just give my kind of
(14:53):
reaction. I noticed that I willoften use the same adjective
Isn't it sometimes it's lazy,and sometimes it's good. And one
of the words I like isatmospheric. Okay, station 11 is
atmospheric, very muchso very, very much. So it's
funny that you mentioned QuentinTarantino. That's very vivid for
me. And if you were here in mystudio, you would laugh because
(15:13):
on the wall across from whereI'm sitting, there are two movie
posters framed. One of them isReservoir Dogs.
Oh, nice. Yeah.
So you do have a series ofprompts, but you don't call it
that so much. That's sort ofwhat I have. Because once you
get to the point where you'vebeen using the prompts, you just
(15:36):
do that automatically.
Now, if the question is wine, Iknow there's obviously
subjectivity to what you'redoing. But is there is it pretty
objective? Like if you'retrained? Could I taste the wine?
You're drinking and tastefloral? And you don't? And is
that? Yes, those both? Correct.
It's this is something I alwaysassure people at the winery is
(15:57):
wine tasting is a 100%subjective pursuit, just like
books. Because you're tastingthe wine and smelling the wine
with your body, parts of yourbody. And those parts of body of
your body have been formed overthe course of your whole life.
How do you know what this smellslike? How do you know what that
(16:18):
smells like? You might not knowwhat some things smell like that
other people do because theywere exposed to those things
throughout the course of theirlife. And an example I always
use is my girlfriend Sabrina. Igrew up in the Pacific
Northwest. And she grew up inRio de Janeiro, Brazil. So I'm
really good with foresty things.
She's really good with tropicalfruit. And tropical fruit comes
up as sort of a mainstay andwhen you're tasting certain
(16:43):
wines, certain categories ofwines, Chardonnays from the same
region. For example, if you lookthrough a whole bunch of reviews
from those Chardonnays you'regonna see the towards tropical
fruit come up all the time, andthey might even delve into the
actual fruits, you know,pineapple, guava, et cetera. So
I you know, I grew up in theNorthwest, and we didn't we
didn't have a lot of fancy foodin my house when I was a kid.
(17:03):
But we did have canned pineappleoccasionally. So tropical fruit
I understand to be pineapple. Iknow the smell. So I can swirl
that. Somebody says tropicalfruit. I'm like, oh, yeah, I get
that. I get pineapple. Yeah,yeah. Swirling, swirling,
swirling. I'm sitting on thecouch. And Sabrina is with me.
I'll say, Let's smell thistropical fruit is all about
pineapple. And she's like whom?
findable. And there's guava. Andthere's papaya. And there's
(17:29):
mango. She's got them in herhead. Right? I don't. Right? I
didn't grow up in Rio deJaneiro. Right? So it is to get
back to your original question.
No matter how much education youhave, no matter how much you
think you've exercised yourpalate and developed your
vocabulary as relating to sensememory, which is all this is,
it's all about remembering whatthat is from when you tasted or
(17:52):
smelled it. At some point inyour entire life. No two people
are tasting the exact same winein the same way. Because you're
tasting it with your like yourtongue, your tongue is your
tongue. And nobody else's tonguehas lived that same life now
people in your family might. Youknow, I've never even thought
about this. Do you have brothersand sisters? I do have two older
sisters. So you guys might havesimilar palates, because you
(18:15):
grew up in the same house withthe same parents cooking the
same food and going to the sameplaces on vacation and smelling
various things that uniquely toyour family and your journey.
But still, you're going to havesome differences of opinion. You
might say I like this one, andyour sister might say you're
wrong. And of course you're not.
(18:38):
But she might say that right?
Because that's the way sisters.
Yeah, yeah. And I'm theyoungest, so Oh, okay. Not gonna
be right.
I'm the middle child of three,three boys. All right, you
anticipated this moment. And ithas finally come the moment on
the podcast where I say to myguest, Amy, what skin your
(19:01):
class?
Okay, before I do this, I'mgoing to ask the question, and
I'm not going to do it if it'sgoing to offend you. But I can
always edit it out. I put ice inmy wine. And I wasn't going to
do it. But I won't do it. But Iwas just wondering, what are
your thoughts on that? Itmight have been it might offend
some people, but it does notoffend me. Now, caveat. If
you've spent more than 20 or $30on this bottle of wine, I would
(19:26):
say don't do don't do that.
Because you're you're alteringthe flavor. Okay, I'm not gonna
do that. So yeah, but you have awine that's a little more
expensive than that or no, no,it's like, Well, this was $3.
Canadian and I don't know whatit would be for you because it
depends on it could also dependon the tax on the wine because
sometimes the tax I'm going toleave it as is but okay, I don't
(19:48):
know if I'm pronouncing thiscorrectly. But you asked me to
find a book with wineconnection. So yes, the first
books I'm going to talk abouthas that and you It takes place
in Orvieto, Italy. And I couldnot find at my local wine store,
I could not find a wine basethere, which I was secretly kind
(20:08):
of relieved about because thewine that I was looking for was
a sweet white, which I don'tlike. This is in the book that's
in the book. So what I did was Ifound a wine. If I pronounce it
correctly, it's from Lazio,Italy. And it's called the Lesko
Podio de Chelsea. And it's awhite wine, and it's a little on
(20:30):
the drier side.
And you should you send me apicture of it last night, and I
did a whole bunch of research.
So it's from a region calledMatthias going name. They
actually have do you have thebottle there? On the front? It
just says the name of the wineand the winery in the vintage.
And when I looked at that, Ithought, okay, there must be a
(20:50):
little more to that. So I lookedat that wine and it told me
where it came from. And it said,month a via scone A. And before
the word month, a few Sconnie.
Is there is there backlabel, there is a label on the
back, it's hard to read itbecause it's it's clear with the
writing on it. Oh, it mentionsthe line that I know you're
going to talk about which iswhat known for past AST s
(21:13):
Test test test, and the threetests one of the first one has
one exclamation mark, the secondone has two and the third one
has three and that's actually apart of the region. The proper
name of the region is est estest monta vs. Coney. Okay, so
this is first of all, this is ablend of three different grapes
or skeptiko Trebbiano, which isone of the most widely planted
(21:36):
white wine grapes in all ofItaly. And Malva sia now the
grown on rocky soils of themonth of Visconti this vineyard
is at 400 meters which is about1300 feet, which is fairly high
altitude. Now, here are thetasting notes. Prominent green
herbal nose, would you agree?
Oh gosh.
(21:58):
Now I'm just see I'm promptingyou saying do you get anything
herbal? Does it smell a littlebit green? Do you smell any
green figs? Because this is inthe note green figs, citrus
underripe pair?
I definitely don't can't tellthe pair. It's a kind of little
if I can use the word sharp,which I like. Okay. I feel it
(22:18):
grabs you a little bit. Yeah.
Okay. There's a little bitminerally on the finish. Okay,
does it like yeah, like you justlicked a rock or something?
I'm sure. Yeah, I wouldn't havethought to say that. But yeah,
some of these wind things, youknow, are really parsing them.
It's like, why do we even haveto go there you know. And then
(22:39):
it says here it's a versatilelike for seafood, and
vegetables. So now the name eseste este, a 12th century Bishop
traveling to the Vatican to meetthe Pope sent a scout ahead to
survey the villages along theroute searching for the best
wines. And he was to Mark asked,Latin for it is on the door of
(23:04):
the NS where the wine impressedis a guide for the bishop to
follow up at a month a fee isgonna be in the scout fell in
love with the local wine andwrote est, est EST on the door.
And the rest, as they say, ishistory. The story sort of got
bastardized, I guess at somepoint because then there's
another story about a 12thcentury German Bishop John
(23:27):
Fuger. Traveling to Rome for thecoronation of Henry the Fifth as
the Holy Roman Emperor and onhis travels who were sent his
major demo ahead of him to tastethe local wines report back
which wines were Vinum St.
bonum. As with other retellings,the Midge Domo documented his
research by writing St. Chuck onthe door of establishments whose
wines he enjoyed and being soimpressed with the wines at
(23:49):
month a few scone a punctuatedhis message with multiple est
est est. The bishop himself wasalso so impressed with the wines
that he canceled the rest of hisjourney, and stayed in monta
Visconti until his death andtoday there is a tomb in a local
church in multifeed stonybelieved to be the resting place
of BishopFulgur Wow. historic venue
(24:09):
vineyardlet's 900 year old history right
there. Or I guess we could say,legend, because we don't know.
We don't know if that's real,but it's kind of fun. That's
another reason I love wine. Soyou like this wine then?
I like it a lot. I like a drierwine. It doesn't have okay, I
(24:30):
know if I'm using the rightwords, but it doesn't have a
strong aftertaste to me. Isthat okay? Strong in a bad way?
Yeah, not in a bad way. Becausewhen you say the word aftertaste
in wine terms what we're alllooking for us wine people with
an aftertaste. We don't callit Dex actually sounds negative.
We call it the finish. Okay,when you swallow the wine, what
(24:50):
happens in your mouth? Is it agood thing and does it linger?
Oh, I see. Okay, is that easier?
I find that easier with a redwine to tell. That is that
you should have some finish on awhite wine. But typically red
wines are more complex ingeneral because of the
winemaking process. But I cantaste a little I'm reading,
there's a little sailing tasteand I
(25:12):
taste that. So it's in the notesthat I have. It's a little it
gets a little salty. Yeah,I like that. I think it's good.
Typically when you're when youswallow wine, two things are
gonna happen. Your mouth getsdrier and or your mouth waters.
Drier means you just experiencedtannins, which is compound in
the skins of the grapes thatdries your mouth out. And then
(25:33):
the mouth watering is from theacidity in the wine. And that's
a good thing too, because itbalances out the fruit flavor.
Because if you just have thisfruit and there's no
counteracting acidity, then youget a wine that we call flabby.
Oh, well, I'm happy to discoverthis. I would amazing, right.
It is interesting.
I will put a picture of Amy'swine on my Instagram, and a
picture of Amy sitting in her.
What room are you in?
(25:55):
This is our dining room. I lovethe wallpaper. Thanks. I have
some funky wallpaper. It's likebig circles that are I think
they're supposed to be kind offlowers, but they're modern.
It looks a little bitpsychedelic to me. Like it looks
like this could be you could besitting in a dining room that
was wallpapered in 1968 You knowI'm like, ya funky they hit the
(26:15):
other hippies came in andremodeled the house. Yeah. All
right, let's get this list outhere. Amy's summer reading
recommendations. I am excitedfor this. Okay, so
I picked three books and I triedto think all books I think are a
bit crowd pleasers. When I thinkit's summer reads, I think of a
(26:38):
super, super easy book, or maybea longer involved saga.
Okay, that's that was gonna be aquestion I was gonna ask you
like, what makes it a summerbook, but you just you just
nailed it right therewas there to maybe a thriller.
This first, but that is justclearly meant. So this is the
villa I'm gonna recommend. Thefirst one I'm gonna recommend is
(27:00):
the villa. And it's clearlylike, meant for a book club.
It's kind of hitting a lot ofthose sweet spots for I would
say, a female reader. It'scalled the villa. It's by Rachel
Hawkins. And she's written a fewdifferent thrillers. And she
wrote a book called The wifeupstairs. And it's kind of got a
lot of things going on. Butbasically, it's two women in
(27:21):
their 30s, Emily and chess. Andthey've been best friends since
they were little girls. They'renow novelists, each of them wow.
One is more successful than theother and they kind of lost
touch a little bit. I would saythey're kind of frenemies. Oh,
so like this already. So Emily'skind of not having a good time.
(27:43):
She's getting divorced. She'shaving trouble with her writing.
And chess is very successful.
And she comes to us again, youknow, that friend that just kind
of comes back into town. Andit's just like, hey, let's get
together. And yeah, where weleft off. And she's like,
Listen, I've rented this villafor six weeks. And she's very
(28:05):
successful in Italy. And we'regoing to go there. We're going
to drink wine and read books.
Not kidding. And escape. Let'sgo. And she's like, awesome. I
want to get out of my life.
Let's go. They go. And it's avilla and or beato. And there is
a little paragraph, I could readabout the wine itself. You know,
(28:27):
please do let's hear it. Okay,so they kind of get there. And
when they get there, they startto tour the villa, but they
really want to get to eating anddrinking and hanging out. So
they start to make dinner andthey say, we feast on the
asparagus cooked with lemon andolive oil and the chicken and
potatoes, the gravy somehow richand vibrant all at once. All of
(28:50):
it washed down with cold glassesof the Orvieto wine the region
is famous for. It's sweeter thanI normally drink, but it tastes
like summer. By the time I getup from the table. I'm fuller
than I've been in ages and alsomore than a little tipsy. The
wine is sort of setting thatscene. Yeah, what happens?
There's a couple of otherstorylines. So while they're
(29:11):
there, they start to uncover amystery. The Rolling Stones, I
think, in the 60s 70s recordedan album in Europe at Villa. And
so they're kind of recreating,it's not the Rolling Stones. But
there has been a murder manyyears ago from a rock band
visiting this villa, will startto uncover a mystery. That's the
(29:33):
thriller part. And then it's gotand that storyline. So they kind
of alternate voices in differentpoints of view that was inspired
by Did you watch Daisy Jones inthe six on television or you
might have read the book? No, Idon't even know who that is.
Okay, so it's a book and it'sabout it's inspired by Fleetwood
Mac and it's a big hot book anda big show. And so it's
(29:56):
basically about kind of groovynow 1970s Rock and roll, okay,
that storyline going on wherethey're investigating this
murder at these young peoplekind of overtaking this mansion
in the 70s, partying andrecording an album. And then the
last storyline is Frankenstein.
The book came about that wholestory because a bunch of Percy
(30:19):
Shelley and Mary Shelley endedup on at a villa kind of like
this villa. So all these peoplehave those names. So there's
kind of all these thingshappening. And then also funny
enough, although I don't knowthis lands, there's a some
podcasters in their and aseparate storyline that are also
investigating this murder. But Ithink they're there just because
(30:42):
podcasting is trendy,right and true crime is huge
and true crimes. So this book, Iwould give it four stars, it's
not five, but I think it's oneof those books that you take on
a beach, preferably with a glassof wine, and you really enjoy
(31:02):
it. You escape, but I don'tthink for me, it didn't stay
with me forever. But that's kindof what I want in a summer read.
For summer read, I don't want tobe taxed. I just want to have
some fun.
So do you want to enjoy it inthe moment? Yeah. Okay, what's
next? The next one is I'm gonnaput the names of all these books
in the authors in the shownotes. So if you scroll down the
(31:24):
show notes from this episode asyou're listening, if you're
driving, don't do that rightnow.
The next one is a lot of fun.
It's called age advice. Andhere's the cover you can see
it's for people listening. It'sa black cover with just great
gold letters.
Like that. I want to get pickedfor
(31:48):
a crime thriller that in India,it's by a young author, her name
is deep T Kapoor and this bookis long. It looks a
little thick. Yeah, you'reholding up a thick book there.
How many pages?
It's 600 550. But it is a pageturner. It's not hard to read.
(32:08):
Okay. It's a book aboutgangsters, lovers, false
friendships, forbidden romanceand corruption. And this is the
book that is sort of thisQuentin Tarantino style. Okay.
Well, look, I think what peoplelike about it is it set in
India, and it gets into, youknow, the versus strong class
system in India. And it kind oflooks at everything from the
(32:32):
deep poverty to crime families,wealthy people, there's a lot
going on. The book is about thewadiya crime family. There's a
servant who kind of comes fromsuper humble beginnings, but
it's somehow caught up in allthis. There's a play the son
who's kind of named Sonny, He'sa playboy. He's trying to outdo
(32:53):
his father, but he's kind ofjust not doing anything and just
partying. Now sendhim to Canada. Yeah,
they might send him to Canada.
That's right. Good. To get one.
And then there's Anita, who's acurious journalist, and she is
falling in love with Sonny, andshe's kind of caught between
reporting the truth of thestory, and then her love for
(33:14):
him. And it starts off with Iguess, I would say just just to
tell you what it starts offwith. There's a speeding
Mercedes jumps the curb, andfive people die. All this page
one. This is page one. Wow. It'sa rich man's car. But the rich
man isn't there and the servantis there. No. So that's how it
(33:35):
starts. And it's unfortunate.
What I liked about it is it'sthe author's young, so it's a
very fresh book, it's movesquickly. It's pretty violent. So
I found that difficult, buteveryone I've talked to liked
it. And I think this would alsoappeal to men, women, all kinds
of people.
Okay. All right, you have onemore for us.
(33:57):
The last one is called YellowFace by Rf Wang. And it is my
favorite book that I've readthis year.
Oh, do you have it there?
Oh, I don't have it because Ilent it out. Sorry. Just send me
a picture of it. Okay,I'll send you a picture. All
these things for the Instagrampost.
It deals with diversity, racism,cultural appropriation. Also,
(34:21):
with the heart of it. It's a lotabout the bad things that can
happen on social media, onTwitter and that kind of thing.
And basically, it's to women,young women who went to Yale,
and their rising novelists. Sothis is another novelists theme.
One of them is Asian one of themisms, and then there's a bad
accident and the Asian woman Hername is Athena. She dies. And
(34:46):
she's an incredible writer likeshe's a rising star. And in a
very quick moments, her supposedfriend steals her manuscript for
a book and passes it off as herown. No That's, that's the
setup.
Okay? No, that is that's adevice. It's been used a bunch
of times.
Right? You know what you'reright about that. And that two
(35:08):
books that just came out thatwere very good. There's a book
called the plot, by Jean havefour legs. And that's about the
same thing. And then there's abook called, who is Maude Dixon
by Alexandra Andrews. And itdoes the same. But I think what
I liked this book is, first ofall, the author super young, so
I almost can't quantify thewriting. It's just she's like 26
(35:30):
or 27. And she's just doingsomething really fresh and new,
like a different language. Yes,it's like a different language.
She talks about racism, sheherself is Asian, and you'll be
uncomfortable at moments, youlearn a lot. Like it's she's
just talking about tropes, andit's a thriller. And the writing
(35:50):
is good. So I just couldn't putit down. I thought it was really
good, really creative and new.
Very nice. Yeah, very, verynice. I'm starting to get a
little sweaty thinking aboutthat book. How do you choose
which books to read, and end upon your podcast? Where's a great
place to read about books?
When I start, I read what Inaturally like just that I if I
(36:13):
wasn't doing a podcast, becauseI feel that people will hear the
authenticity and my voice if Ireally like it, and of course,
and I like thrillers, I likeliterary fiction, historical
fiction memoirs, but that can bea little limiting. I can't do
everything on that. So I bringon people with different
viewpoints. And I'll bring onfriends or authors themselves to
(36:36):
talk so I can try new things andlearn where do I find books? New
York Times for sure. All right,I speak to my friends. There's a
blog in Canada called 40 Nightsshelf, which I learned about new
Canadian authors. I would saythat staff shelf of any really
(36:58):
great indie bookstore, you canlook this at the staff picks and
what you're looking for is atany given time, the more I do
this, there's only kind of like20 bucks maximum at a time in
the world that people are notmaybe in North America that are
getting touted. And there's somegreat books. Go to a really
great independent store, youmight find something stumbled
(37:21):
across something that youwouldn't, so
is your chance to give a shoutout to your local independent
bookstore.
Oh, okay. I gotta give a shoutout to Hager books. It's in my
neighborhood nager books inVancouver, in Vancouver
neighborhood are you in? I'm ina neighborhood called
Kerrisdale.
I just subscribed to a coolbookish newsletter called The
(37:43):
millions. I really don't knowwhere it comes from. I don't
know if those that someonementioned on a podcast and I
subscribed and I like it so far.
When I have time to read it.
Sometimes it just comes in dropsin my mailbox. And I'm like,
Okay, I'll just keep that there.
And then there's like two orthree weeks worth, but it's
called the millions. I'm sureit's based in New York City
similar. The New Yorker for meis also a good source of book
reviews. And long stories aboutauthors. Here where I live in
(38:07):
Marin County, California,there's a bookstore called book
passage. And if there's a authormaking his way into the Bay
Area, oftentimes they will showup at book passage was actually
just a 15 minute drive from myhouse. Yeah, I mean, this is
Morgan counties a little bitshishi in that way, for sure.
And there's a local chain herecalled copper fields that has
(38:29):
few locations, and one is just afew minutes drive from my house.
Sometimes those bookstores hasreally good ones have great
Instagrams or newsletters, Oh,totally. Or you can get good
ideas because I opposite indiebookstores are great because
they're usually staffed withpeople that read a lot. And
it's really it feels good to gointo a bookstore and talk to
(38:51):
people to like books. Totally.
Are you ready to find out what'sin my glass?
Yes, all I know isit's red, so it is red because
it's swirling wine. Well, youhave Italian wine in your glass.
So I decided to put Italian winein my glass. The wine I am
currently sipping is a fairlyinexpensive read and I'm loving
(39:12):
and I'm like sucking it downwhile we're talking. But if we
don't finish the interview,reason, Mike just got drunk.
This is a winery that I've hadwine from before, but I've never
had this particular wine becausethis is sort of their starter
red blend. The wineries calledMK two pillows. So the wind is
called Ah, cool. That's a spacecue you Oh, this is based on the
(39:34):
Latin, depending on what websiteyou look at. It sort of means
where we begin, and this is sortof their entry level. Red wine
2017 Vintage month. villosa ison the coast of Tuscany, in an
area called Bolgheri which isone of the hottest areas in
(39:55):
Tuscany, so they grow a lot ofthose darker thicker skin
grapes. And the winemaker is aSwiss guy named Fabio Ciara
loto. And he says it's easy toproduce these wines because
they're so concentrated becausewe live in such a hot climate.
What is hard is to achieveelegance and finesse, he's
already admitting like I've gotthe good fruit. And I could just
(40:17):
make the wine and it would beamazing, but I'm going to make
it even better than that. Andit's true. I've had three or
four of the wines that theyproduce from just 17 acres. So
this is a small, small winery.
They make some higher end stuff.
They've got one called Nardo,which is a Tuscan dialect word
for lavender. They make winecalled gabbro, which is 100%
(40:41):
Cabernet Sauvignon. And thenannual, which is their red
blend. It's a little bit moreexpensive than the Aqua that I
am drinking. It's a blend of 30%Multiple Ciano 30% Cabernet
Sauvignon 20% Sangiovese Z 10%Mar salon, and 10% Allah Conte,
that's five grapes. Four of themare Italian grapes. One of them
(41:02):
is a French Bordeaux grape. Thevery basic way you would
subscript describe this wine isit's a super Tuscan, which means
they're using it Suskind grapes,but they're adding something
different in there to make it alittle more impressive. The
Cabernet Sauvignon, this one isgreat, that we retails for like
25 bucks.
(41:23):
What would you serve that with?
Or how would you? I mean, you'redrinking it here, but what kind
of food would yourun out of drinking it all by
itself? on an empty stomach,anything of that kind of rustic
Mediterranean thing you know,seared meats, seared vegetables,
it's summertime. So you fire upthe grill and you get some
veggies on there. And you putsome, maybe some Italian
(41:46):
sausages on there, maybe somemaybe some steaks, keep it
simple. This is one of thosewines that doesn't need a lot of
adornment around it with foodbecause it really the flavors
are very bright. They reallypop. And I mentioned lavender,
and the name of one of the winesis not this one. But there's
definitely a good hit ofsomething very floral, lavender
re on the nose. And then it getsinto all the red fruits, all the
(42:07):
different cherries andraspberries and blackberries. So
it's darker red fruits.
That's really good.
I wish you were here becauseit's one of those. I'm in a
house by myself right now. Like,I wish there was somebody to
share with me. Yeah, itsounds really good.
And then it gets really juicy inthe mouth, which tasted then all
of a sudden your wine, yourmouth just starts to water. And
(42:30):
it's like you just bid into thewhole cluster of grapes. And
like a almost like you can feelthe juice running down your
chin. You know, have somelisteners up in Vancouver, you
do I get the I get the downloadstats from my podcast host site.
Oh, that's fine. And it saysthat I have some Vancouver
listeners. Maybe you're one ofthem. I don't know, I'm
one of them. I am one of them.
(42:51):
The funny thing about thestatistics we get as podcasters
is just vague locations wherethe listeners are coming from,
not who these people are really,I do have a great friend up your
way. And my friend Sam, who's ageologist, she may be tuning in,
but I do get downloads from BC.
Let's talk about starting apodcast. I think we started
around the same time, give ortake a few months. Tell me what
(43:13):
prompted you to start a podcast?
Well, I'd never heard a podcastuntil COVID head. And one thing
in Canada, we had super strictrules like more than the United
States. And we really couldn'teven at one point, barely leave
the house. And so I'm home and Idiscovered podcasts and they
(43:37):
became how I got through COVID.
And I was so interested in theintimacy of it have a journalism
background. I like that youcould find something very
specific, like so specific.
Yeah. And it would do a deepdive. And I just I thought it
seemed like the person wassomething if they're done really
(43:59):
well, if they're talkingdirectly to me. I just
challenged myself that followingJanuary. So January 2021. Really
just to do something creativeand use skills in a different
way. My main goal was to do apodcast, it wasn't to do books.
But I chose books because it'ssomething that I know, because I
(44:19):
wanted it to seem authentic.
Like it was yoursecond choice. Oh,
weird. It's it would probably beknitting and you would not we
probably wouldn't have met, weprobably wouldn't have met. So I
just thought that there's acouple of things. I can talk
about knowledgeably and Ithought I just did it for fun.
And I didn't have an agenda withit and it just kind of kept
(44:42):
going and I got some followers.
I really like it. Yeah, I don'tknow. What about you. When did
you start it and why?
January of 2021 the same?
Yeah. Just like you I didn'tknow anything about podcasts.
I'd heard about them. They wereout there bouncing around
because I come from the world ofradio. Okay, so I I worked in
radio for 15 years, up untilabout the latter part of the
(45:03):
1990s at the apex of the DaveMatthews sensation, and I got
out of business because it justwasn't fun anymore. And I
stumbled into restaurant workby, by accident. And that worked
with my love of wine, which Ihad already had. I already had
love of wine, radio career,which means now I can talk about
(45:23):
wine like somebody who knowswhat they're talking about,
because that's what radio iscome up with a soundbite.
What's the natural progressionfor you like, it's just so easy
that with that, right, radio,the radio
thing stayed dormant in methough, from 1998 until the
latter 20 teens when podcastscame around, and I'm like, Oh,
they're creating little shows. Ican create a little show. Okay,
(45:46):
and so I thought about for along time. And then I got an
email, you know, from just something relating to podcasts. And
there was this host site that Iuse now, that was all about
looking at our videos. This ishow you started a podcast. And
I'm like, Okay, how does itwork? Because now because you
use Buzzsprout? I useBuzzsprout. Yeah. And they're so
helpful. They are actually so Istarted looking at these videos,
(46:08):
then I got an account and Ithought, Okay, I got an account
now. I just need to do it. So Idid it. I talked to my boss and
said, Hey, I'm thinking ofstarting a wine podcast. I want
you to be my first guest. So hesat for an interview. And my
boss is a guy from India. Idon't know if you met him when
you were at the winery, DeepakOkay, he's the guy from India is
making wine in Sonoma,California. And the story how we
(46:28):
got from point A to point B isjust lots of twists and turns.
And I think that's really a funthing about a lot of us in the
wine business. Because none ofus grew up as kids people
saying, What do you want to bewhen you grow up, and you're
that I want to work in a winery?
I find it it's a great form ofstorytelling, and it's very
autobiographical. And it can bevery relatable, because most of
us who we are today is not whowe thought we were going to be
(46:49):
when we were little kids. No.
And so I figured out how thetechnical thing worked. And then
I started the podcast. But yeah,I was already I was like a
podcast host waiting to happen.
Somebody just had to light thefuse I need to but little bit
different was interesting.
Because when we first talked, wetalked, what after we first met
and what I realized you are init, you really want to connect
(47:13):
and hear about people'sindividual stories. And for me,
I was kind of had thatjournalist hat as I wanted to
provide information, right? Alsobe creative. I think we meet
somewhere in the middle withwanting to be creative and have
fun, but I really appreciatethat about you that you were
like, I just want to likeconnect and get to know the why
behind people.
(47:33):
And I want to put on a show.
Yes, exactly. My view is moreabout it's a show, you know, it
starts with like a little bit ofhere's a preview, here's some
clips, here's your music. Bam,bam, bam. And then here's my
que, because I like to put on ashow and I've done with all the
editing and I uploaded andscheduled a release. I feel like
I'm unveiling a new painting.
Yeah, it's really, yeah, it's agreat, it's a great, great
(47:57):
feeling. What's the oddest orfunniest or strangest thing
that's happened to you while youwere recording your podcast?
Well, this won't surprise youbecause you have experienced in
radio. But one of the problems Ihad when I started I used to
handwrite my or not handwritewrite out my scripts doesn't
work. But what I didn'tunderstand is what people are
(48:19):
really looking for within reasonis the mistakes. Because then
you become human. I had my dogbarged in, someone was knocking
on the door. I couldn't getrecording started. I kept that
in. But the biggest thing thathappened was I had a friend of
mine who's a sci fi nerd. And Ihad no interest in sci fi. And
(48:40):
then I kind of made him readsomething that I thought might
have appealed to my listeners.
And we both didn't like thebook. And I refused to finish
the book. I couldn't sleepbecause I was like, Well, no
one's gonna want to listen. AndI didn't, I'm glad everybody
down. He was one of my biggestepisodes because I just won. And
I was like, I don't like thisbook at all. In fact, I didn't
finish it.
(49:00):
It's because you are real. Youlet the real Amy be seen by your
audience.
And people really liked it. AndI had literally thought, oh my
god, I'm gonna lose listeners.
That was a really big turningpoint for me, because it allowed
me to kind of relax a bit andrealize that I don't have to
tell everybody everything. Andreally what I am is I'm an
ambassador for reading. I wantto get people excited. They
(49:23):
don't have to know everything.
And they do want to connect,they want to know what's going
on in your life within reason.
They totally do. Yeah, soanyway, that was I would say not
finishing a book and then goingon and talking about it and
complaining about it.
It's just like when I have awine I open a wine like I you
know, I try and bring wines ontothe show that have some kind of
(49:44):
a story. Yeah, and they're funto talk about, like your wine
like my wine today. And I'vedone this before where you know,
I've had a guest sitting with mein the studio we put together up
the winery. When we do we'll doit live and in person. We're
like, well, this isn't thisisn't great. Eat, you know,
we're all amped to really getinto this wine and then you open
(50:04):
it. It's like, yeah, it doesn'treally work. And it's real. You
know, it's not like when youturn on say, you know, Good
Morning America or whatever, andthey're doing this thing and
everything is, yeah, this isamazing. This is a great thing.
And it's amazing. And it'samazing. And it's great. And we
all love it. And no, they neversay, Yeah, this, this isn't this
isn't what we thought it wasgoing to be. No, because that's,
(50:25):
that's the real experience. Youknow, you you go out shopping
for something or you find arecipe for something you want to
cook, and you follow it to theletter and then you taste it.
You're like, Yeah, this is,let's get a pizza. That was kind
of your moment. Let's get pizza.
Yeah, I didn't like this book.
Let's just get a pizza book.
Your podcast is the Red Fernbook review. I know you named it
(50:46):
for a favorite book Where theRed Fern Grows, which I've never
read. And I know it was a moviein the 1970s. And it was remade
in the early 2000s. I stillremember like, vaguely being in
a movie theater as a kid seeinga preview for Where the Red Fern
Grows. And looking back on melike, whatever it was 10 year
(51:06):
old me at the time, there was afeeling in the pit of my stomach
watching that trailer like oh,that's gonna be fucking sad. It
is. Yeah, so I never saw Wherethe Red Fern Grows. But you
named your podcast after it.
Tell me whyit was probably one of the first
chapter books I read. It's waswritten in 1961. It's about a
young boy in the Ozarks with toread, they're called Redbone
(51:29):
Coonhounds. They're huntingdogs. Yeah. Big Dan little and
it was those arcs. Andbasically, spoiler alert, the
dogs dying. No, you gotta know,just smell the dogs.
It's gonna rip your heart out.
I didn't know that was gonnahappen. It's for kids. And I got
(51:50):
so attached to the dogs. Andthere's this like, very
heartwarming ending. There'slike a parable throughout about
a Red Fern and it ends upsprouting out through one of
their graves one there and Ijust I think I cried for like a
week. What I I think the pointis, I don't know now how good or
(52:11):
bad it was. Really was the firsttime I understood that. Books
have that kind of power. Right?
Totally. And that's, that's whythat's a great lesson. And but
me I'm just like, No, I'm out.
No. is gonna get really sad.
I'm, I am not here for it. Haveyou guessed it on many podcasts?
(52:32):
Amy?
No, this is the first time andit's so much fun. And it's hard.
Like it's getting easier now.
But like, it's hard to be askedthe questions like I like it. I
like asking the questions. Oh,answering see. So it's really
good to see understand. When Ihave guests how they might feel
(52:54):
sure. No, this is good. This isa good like a turnabout kind of
thing. Yeah, but I'm a prettyeasy Inquisitor. I mean, I'm not
like, you know, I'm not like,well, this from 60 minutes. No,
yeah. Are there other podcastsyou listen to the you might
recommend?
There's two that I'm really intoright now. One is called wiser
than me. And it's oh, this is?
I just literally Dr. Julia LouisDreyfus, right. Somebody
(53:17):
mentioned that to me.
So she's interviewing olderwomen and finding that relevance
and big name women like JaneFonda, Amy Tan, and she's also
hilarious, like, so sheinterviews on a garden and
halfway through, she's like, canI ask you about that chicken
recipe? Could I do this like shegets, it's just so funny. Like,
(53:38):
she just is very good. Thesewomen talk about their past and
what made them who they are. AndI think it's great. And it's
funny. The other one that I'msuper into is called Dear
therapists with two therapistsLaurie Gottlieb and Guy winch.
And then someone comes on writesin the letter and has a serious
problem, and they help solve it.
And it's actually really, reallyhelpful. So if you don't go to
(54:02):
therapy, this is a free therapy.
Okay. Entertaining.
I heard an ad I was listening topodcasts the other day. And, you
know, when when a podcast fromlike a celebrity or a well known
podcast is ads, and there'susually ads for other podcasts.
I'm usually if I'm in the car,you know, I can't quite reach
(54:22):
the phone. And I shouldn't lookat the phone when I'm driving
anyway, so But I try and youknow, skim through the ads, but
I couldn't skim through the adbecause I was, you know, driving
and slept traffic. All of asudden, this ad comes on for a
books podcast, and I'm like, Oh,it's a book podcast. Cool. I can
talk. I can talk to me aboutthis. It was a podcast called
Moms don't have time to readbooks. Have you heard of this? I
(54:45):
thinkshe might be the biggest podcast
in my space.
Oh, you know what? I hated thead. The woman's name is Zb
Owens. Yeah,it's a lot but she's
a mom for kids. But she has thisYeah, I'm a mom. And we don't
have time to read books. Andit's kind of this cartoony mom
(55:05):
persona that she puts on. AndI'm, like, talk to me, like, I'm
a real person. Don't talk to melike I'm a child, this adult or
I don't even know what she'sgoing for. But I just my started
God the year, I want to say shestarted like a long time ago.
And like 2016 2018, what shedoes is her whole thing is is
(55:27):
super short and sweet. Shebrings on an author, and she
brings on all the best authors,they all go see her whatever the
latest book is. And it's short,like, it's 30 minutes or less.
She's got tons of energy. It'ssuper accessible. But I like
something more nuanced.
Personally, I justfelt like it was here's a big
(55:47):
schmear of very sweet, overlysweet, sickening jam. Please
enjoy.
I think for the average reader,people will like it because they
get an interview with theauthor. But for me, I want
something a little more. Ithink, personally, as a
listener, I want something alittle more subtle.
I just hated the whole idea ofher podcast. And then I Googled
(56:10):
her. Oh, she's a big deal. Ifound out she's a big deal. But
you know what? She's also thedaughter of a billionaire.
Yeah, that's true. That doesn't.
There's another reason to think.
Sure, zippy. Last question,where do you read? Mostly, what
are the perfect conditions foryou? And is there a dangerous
(56:33):
looking stack of books thereright now? I'm thinking about my
bedside table.
I have books everywhere in thehouse. But I would say, I have
kids that are grown up to boys.
But I used to, I still am amorning person. And I did it
because it was when no one wasaround. I'd like to get up
early. And I read it and knockoff the kitchen for probably
(56:54):
about an hour. And I like itbecause nobody's around bugging
me. And then I'm free to bebugged when they're up. If
they're if they're home, or ifmy husband's home. But one of my
biggest problems is I put a lotof books on hold at the library.
And so I feel under artificialpressure to finish like, I could
just pay the dollar, or I couldjust turn it back in. But I'm
(57:17):
like, no, no, no, I have to readbecause I have to get back into.
Right. Well, well, that's goodthat you're patronizing the
library though. That's, that'san important thing to know,
though. I mean, all these books.
Yeah, I read in bed. I try andread during the day, but I just
find that I've got other thingsI want to do when I have spare
time. So it's hard for me, I'mprobably down to reading one or
(57:38):
two books a year. I hate toadmit that somebody who hosts
books podcast.
You know what, though, it is sohard, like it's hard to fit it
in. And you've got so manyoptions now. And the truth is, I
would read a lot but I wouldn'tread as much as I do. I probably
read half as much as I do. I dobecause I am doing this podcast.
I think having a podcast givesyou an excuse to read more
(58:00):
books. Yeah, I'm gonna use thatfor for drinking more wine. This
is for the podcast. It's justresearch. It's just research.
Slippery slope.
Yes. Hey, thanks for hangingout with us. That was really
fun. Thank you so much forhaving me on. They learned a lot
too. And now you've made me moreconfident to like use wine
(58:23):
adjectives.
Good. Hang on. I'm going to readthe closing credits. Okay. Okay.
V tall Mike wind podcast wasconceived and is written,
produced, edited and maintainedby yours truly. Today's episode
came to you from my home studioin Novato, California. I'd love
(58:46):
to hear from you. If you have aquestion, a comment, a
suggestion? Or a guest or atopic or if you want to have
your very own stack of officialtall Mike wind podcast coasters.
I didn't show you the coasters.
Amy, did I give you one when youcame to visit?
You did? Oh, you have one? Ihave one. Okay, good. Thank you.
It's a nice coaster.
(59:07):
It is a nice coaster. And ifyou'd like to have your own you
can email me at Tom Mikewine@gmail.com to see behind the
scenes of today's episode and tofollow along as I drink wine and
cook and eat some delicious foodand otherwise live the good
life. Follow me on Instagram attal Mike wine. Did you drop that
(59:29):
five star review yet on Applepodcasts? Come on. What's the
whole Bob? That tell me it helpsa lot. Thanks to Amy Mair for
hanging out. I'll have anotherepisode for you soon. But for
now, I'm Mike stone. Keepswirling. Keep sniffing. keep
sipping Cheers.
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