September 6, 2024 • 27 mins
Today we discuss how leaders become a captivating speaker that can entertain and inspire audiences. Our guest Peter George is an author of a book on this subject and a public speaking coach. Ever wondered how a speaker can turn a mundane presentation into an unforgettable experience? Peter shares his personal journey from battling a lisp and stutter to becoming a highly sought-after public speaker. Discover how transforming your focus from yourself to your audience can significantly elevate your public speaking game, enhancing both your personal brand and business impact.
Imagine grabbing your audience's attention right from the start—Peter George reveals his top techniques for doing just that. Whether it's starting with a compelling story, posing a thought-provoking question, or presenting a startling statistic, Peter teaches us how to avoid the common pitfalls that can derail even the most prepared speakers. Learn how to maintain audience engagement in today’s distraction-filled environment by tailoring your message to resonate with diverse segments, ensuring it remains relevant and impactful.
Finally, we delve into the importance of concise communication and relentless practice. Drawing inspiration from TEDx talks and top performers who constantly refine their craft, Peter emphasizes treating presentations as conversations, even with large audiences. Gain insights into how relentless practice and specialized coaching can elevate your public speaking skills to new heights. Whether you're a seasoned speaker or just starting, Peter George's practical advice will help you consistently captivate and engage your audience, making each speaking opportunity truly count.
Get Peter's Book, download more than 50 public speaking tips and learn about his coaching services.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Eric Eden (00:00):
Welcome to today's episode.
Today we are talking about howto be a captivating public
speaker, how to inspire peopleand entertain people.
We have a great guest to helpus go through that today, Peter
George, welcome to the show.
Peter George (00:15):
Hi, eric, it's a pleasure to be here.
Eric Eden (00:18):
You've been in the public speaking space for
decades, why don't we start offby you talking a little bit
about who you are and what youdo?
Peter George (00:28):
I'm a public speaking coach, professional
speaker and author of anaward-winning book on public
speaking, and I get the mostpleasure in my life out of
helping people accomplish theirgoals.
I love helping people and ifpublic speaking can help them do
that, whether they're using itin business or otherwise, then
(00:51):
I'm more than happy to help themachieve their goals, their
initiatives and practicallychange their lives.
Eric Eden (01:01):
That's awesome.
I think public speaking can bevery rewarding.
I think it's a great strategyfor executives to grow their
company.
It's a great part of personalbranding, and so I think it's
definitely a skill worthmastering, and perhaps it's
harder than most people imagineit is on the surface.
Peter George (01:24):
Public speaking is really quite simple in the way
that our minds interact.
That doesn't make it easy, likea lot of things in life.
Very simple concept, not quiteso simple to implement, but the
great thing is, eric, anybodycan implement it.
Anybody can learn to be aneffective, captivating speaker.
(01:45):
I've been speaking on stage formore than 30 years.
I've been training for morethan 19 years and I grew up with
a lisp and a stutter.
If there's anybody who reallywouldn't make it on stage, it's
me.
I never had any idea I would bedoing what I do for a living.
Eric Eden (02:05):
That's awesome.
We're ready to be inspired.
Why don't you tell us a storyabout some of the best marketing
that you've done, that you'rethe most proud of, that you
think has had the most impact?
What?
Peter George (02:19):
may have had the most impact is what got me
speaking on stage.
I was asked to speak at aconference and I really didn't
want to.
It was representing my companymy own company, and it was a
fledgling company and they askedme to speak on stage about what
we were doing because it waschanging the way things were
being done.
And I agreed to and I wasn'tthat great at it, but I tried to
(02:43):
do my best and then, once I didit, I was asked more and more
to speak on stage at conferencesand other events and my wife,
who was my partner in my company, who was also an accountant,
noticed that every time I spokewe had a bump in revenue.
So it didn't take thisaccounting mind very long to say
(03:04):
, hey, do more of that.
So the more I spoke, the morerevenue we had and the more our
business increased and grew andit grew into be a very
successful business that we soldlater on, but much of its
success came from my being outin what would be the public of
(03:25):
our industry.
Eric Eden (03:27):
That's awesome.
Every time you spoke, you mademore money.
I think there's no easier wayto say it than that.
It's a great proof point forwhy executives getting out there
and speaking, founders gettingout there and speaking makes a
lot of sense.
Peter George (03:43):
I was going to say .
Think of music.
People go out on the road for areason they connect with people
straight on, head on.
So those people in the audiencecan say, yeah, I want to buy
more of your merchandise, I wantto buy more of your songs.
And executives can do the samething for their industry Not
speak about their business perse, but speak about a part of
(04:03):
the industry, a part of thebusiness that matters to others.
They get recognition and theirbusiness may grow.
It's a great way to connectwith your target audience.
Eric Eden (04:14):
So what's the hardest thing about being a
speaker?
That you coach people on?
Peter George (04:21):
One of the things that we all think about when
we're asked to speak is what amI going to say?
How am I going to present it?
What if I make a mistake?
What if I don't captivate theaudience?
What if I and we make it aboutus, and that's reasonable.
We're the ones up there infront of everybody.
The truth of the matter is it'snot about us.
(04:42):
Yes, we have to understand whatthe content is.
Yes, we have to present it in away that people are going to
want to listen and internalizethat information.
That's all true.
However, when we make it aboutus, the audience knows that.
When we make it about theaudience and how they're going
to benefit and how they're goingto walk away with greater
(05:06):
knowledge and abilities thatthey didn't have prior to coming
, that's the secret.
You transform an audience.
Let me ask you this, ericYou've been in business for a
while.
You ever go to a meeting andafter an hour, that meeting's
over and you're walking outsaying I will never, ever get
those 60 minutes back into mylife.
(05:27):
Complete waste of time.
You ever been in a meeting likethat?
Eric Eden (05:31):
Too often, unfortunately.
Right, it's what gives meetingsa bad name.
Peter George (05:36):
If people don't leave a meeting, if they don't
leave a breakout, a conference,a keynote, whatever it might be
changed in some way, transformedin some way, then why did we
have this meeting?
And that's the problem withmeetings and talks and seminars
and the like is often peoplearen't transformed because the
speaker didn't intend totransform those people.
(05:58):
So when you speak, I don't carewhat the situation is, work to
transform those people.
If they leave, the same waythey came in, whether it's
virtual or in person, then whydo you have the meeting?
At that point, it's justinformation and you can send an
information on a PDF throughemail and they'd appreciate that
(06:20):
.
Eric Eden (06:20):
Yeah, so it's definitely more than
broadcasting, and I guess thatleads me to one of my questions
is how can people consistentlywow their audience and get that
sort of opposite reaction thatyou're talking about?
Peter George (06:47):
ask Wowing is when we go into it with that, we may
or may not hit that, but if wego in to serve them with a
service mindset, that's a littledifferent.
That's a great way to wow them.
By the way, that's a great wayto separate yourself from the
guy who just comes and vomitsinformation all over them.
When you can learn to connectwith them, they can digest and
internalize what you're saying,so it benefits them.
That's a wow, and it's notdifficult to learn how to do
(07:11):
that.
And that's the great thingabout it is when you service
people, they appreciate it.
The only thing you really gotto do when it comes to public
speaking is not only make itabout them as opposed to you,
but deliver it in a way thattruly engages them, and that's
not difficult to learn at all.
Eric Eden (07:30):
What are some of those strategies that you teach
your clients and how to engagethe audience?
I think the first one youmentioned is don't make it about
you, make it about them.
But what are a couple otherthings that people can do to be
engaging?
Peter George (07:43):
Right off the bat, let me ask you this how long do
you think, according to somescientists, how long do you
think you have to engage anaudience and have them have
confidence in you?
How much time does it take?
How much time do you have to dothat?
Eric Eden (07:59):
I think very little time, much less time than people
think.
You have to have a really goodhook at the beginning.
If you start off slow, peoplejust tune it out pretty quickly,
like even within a coupleminutes.
I think, yeah, you have threeseconds.
Peter George (08:13):
Yeah.
So there are ways to extendthat before you ever open your
mouth.
That's one of the things Itrain my clients on.
But let's say you have thosethree seconds.
Let's say you have 30 seconds.
Some scientists say you have upto 30 seconds.
So let's take that, we'll get.
We'll make it a little morelenient.
You've got to get theirattention right off the bat,
because if you don't, man,you've got to spend an awful lot
(08:35):
of time trying to get it, andone of the ways to do that is to
speak to them directly.
Have a question, have a story,have a startling stat.
In some way get their attention.
Too many of us come out and sayit's a pleasure to be here as
opposed to what Not be here.
I'd like to thank so-and-so forhaving me here.
(08:57):
Eric, when you open a magazine,how many articles do you see
that before it gets to theheadline, it says I would love
to thank the editor for havingme in this particular issue of
this magazine.
Eric Eden (09:12):
Never.
Yeah, you're wasting your time.
Peter George (09:14):
No writer would ever do that.
They get to the point.
They grab you.
Yet in speaking we do theselittle pleasantries for some
reason.
No, it's not about the peoplewho invited you.
It's not about you, and it's apleasure to be here.
It's not about oh, I hadhandouts for you but I forgot
them in my printer or I'mnervous, or any things you might
say to them.
(09:34):
Get to the point.
Get their attention right offthe bat, and I mentioned some
great ways to do that.
A question always gets ourattention because as human
beings, we're conditioned toanswer questions, whether it's a
real question or a rhetoricalquestion.
Tell them a story that will gettheir attention, as long as
it's a compelling story andpertains to the point of the
(09:57):
talk.
Come up with a startlingstatistic that grabs their
attention.
Get their attention from momentone.
When you do that, then it'smuch easier to keep that wheel
going just by ticking the top tokeep their attention than it is
to get that wheel running allover again.
Eric Eden (10:16):
Yeah, sometimes people come out with a good joke
, but it has to be a good joke.
Peter George (10:21):
Yeah, most of us aren't very good at jokes.
That whole thing about startwith a joke If the joke pertains
to the talk, okay.
But then you better make sureyou're good at telling jokes,
and not just in your living room.
Your timing has to be spot on.
Jokes are not as much about thepunchline as they are about the
timing.
So your timing has to beexcellent, and when you're
(10:42):
nervous, your timing generallyisn't excellent.
So humor, yes, add humor whenyou can.
Even in business talks, addhumor Jokes.
Structured jokes might be adifferent story, depending on
your ability to tell them undera stressful situation.
Eric Eden (11:00):
Not everyone's a comedian, for sure no that's why
they get paid very good moneyand sometimes if you're in front
of a big live audience and thejoke doesn't really work, that
will add to your anxieties.
Worth considering, but alsoworth planning out.
Peter George (11:18):
I told a joke once in front of 750 people and it
absolutely bombed.
I went against my own adviceWhile walking on stage I threw
out my opening and said I'mgoing to start with this joke.
Eric Eden (11:31):
Horrible idea.
Yeah, it's heartbreaking.
So it's interesting.
I was at a conference last weekand one of the things I noticed
was when people were even inthe main keynote session forget
about breakout sessions, butwhen people are watching the
keynotes.
There was almost a thousandpeople in this keynote session
(11:54):
and I saw that a solid 85 to 90%of people were on their phones
while the speaker was speaking,and these were well-known
keynote speakers talking thateveryone should have been paying
rapt attention, but they wereeven distracted doom scrolling
(12:15):
while the keynote was going.
So how do you break throughthat sort of world we're living
in right now where people areonly half paying attention
anyways?
What can you do to be engagingto overcome things like that?
Generally?
Peter George (12:28):
that's on the speaker and not in the
presentation itself.
But the prep.
We often forget to prep andthat's a doomsday scenario.
You want to know who's in youraudience and there's ways to
accomplish that.
You want to know who's in youraudience.
If I go speak to marketers mybackground is marketing then hey
, I can just speak my language.
But what if there are financepeople in that audience?
(12:50):
What if there are financepeople in that audience?
What if there are IT people inthat audience?
These people think differentlythan a marketer's mindset.
I have to present to them too,and we forget that.
We think we can just go talkabout what we want to talk about
and it's going to resonate witheverybody.
Nope, wouldn't that be nice ifit were the case.
But that's why you were seeing80% of the people tune out.
(13:11):
What that keynote, or thosekeynotes, were saying to those
people, was designed in a waythat it just happened to
represent with 20%, not theother 80%.
You can design where that'sflipped, where it's resonating
with 80% and the other 20%.
You could do a song and danceor anything else, and it
(13:32):
probably wouldn't get theirattention.
But you can flip that simplynot easily by researching your
audience and designing your talkto resonate with each one of
those audiences, not a generalaudience, it's anything else.
If you're not specific, thenwhat luck are you going to have?
If you go marketing and youmarket to everybody, what luck
(13:54):
are you going to have?
Very little.
You target a specific audienceand you can do that in your talk
as well.
Eric Eden (14:03):
You can almost always tell how much they
prepared or if people arewinging it.
If you're paying attention tothe speaker, you can tell just
because they don't know theaudience they are presenting
things that you can just lookaround the room are not
connecting with people.
So I agree 100%.
Being prepared seems like anobvious thing, but I often see
(14:27):
the worst is like panels whereyou can just see if there's a
couple people talking at thesame time and they haven't even
rehearsed and planned it out.
You just end up with a mess.
Peter George (14:40):
When I've been on panels, I've spoken to other
people hey, you want to gettogether and just talk this
through?
We'll just wing it when we getthere, cool.
So what we're saying is we arenot going to take the time to
serve the audience.
The audience has taken its timeto be there, but we're just
going to give them a first draft.
We're just going to throw it outthere and see if it works.
(15:00):
Yeah, don't do that.
I hate that.
I agree and, to paraphrase DaleCarnegie, the unprepared
speaker gets exactly what he orshe deserves 100%.
Eric Eden (15:09):
So how do you think about the size of audiences?
This is always something thatinterests me.
I'm curious what is some of thebiggest audiences that you've
spoken to?
And then how do you reconcilethat with some of the talks
you've given that you think arethe most impactful?
Peter George (15:26):
The largest audience I've spoken to is a
little over 2,000.
And I find that much easierthan speaking to 10 people.
What we think of this, eric,when we say we're going to have
a conversation, okay, no problem, then we put the word
presentation in its place andsuddenly it becomes a problem.
I've got to do this, and how amI going to present?
What am I going to say?
(15:46):
How am I going to interact withthem?
All these things we have allthese, this connotation of what
a presentation is and it's justa conversation.
Now, it's a very specificallycreated conversation, but it's a
conversation.
Even those people might not bespeaking out.
They're still communicatingback with you.
You can see it in their face,you can see it in their body
movement, you can see if they'reholding a phone or not.
(16:08):
You know what they're saying,what they're thinking, as long
as you look and get thatresponse from that audience,
many people say you know what,peter?
I'm great with one, two, threepeople, but you put 15 people in
front of me, or any more thanthat, and I don't know how to
speak with them.
The problem, eric, is you can'tspeak to 15 people, you can't
(16:29):
speak to 100 people, you can'tspeak to 2,000 people.
You can only speak to oneeffectively, no-transcript.
But we try to speak to 2,000people and that's why we fail at
it.
But when we devise ourconversation, our presentation
that I'm speaking to onereplicated 50, 100, 2,000 times
(16:51):
and I use my words that connectwith the singular person, not
trying to speak to a group of2,000, making someone feel just
a little bit of a big group.
You want everybody to feel likeyou're the only one they're
speaking to and it makes it somuch easier to create a
presentation with that mindset,as opposed to how do I go out
(17:11):
and speak to a hundred or athousand people?
Speak to one, you look ateverybody, you make eye contact
with people, but you speak usingwords that are designed to
speak to one person.
That's when the people in theaudience go wow, eric was
speaking to me.
He knew what I was thinking.
How was that?
These other 1,999 people mustbe PO'd because he was only
(17:36):
talking to me.
Now you want that to happen2,000 times people sitting there
and each person saying that.
It's impractical to thinkthat's going to happen for all
of them.
But when you design itcorrectly, the vast majority
will walk away thinking you werespeaking just to them.
It's no different than being inthe audience listening to your
(17:57):
favorite singer and you'rethinking that singer is singing
just to you, even though there's18,000 people in that
auditorium.
Eric Eden (18:06):
I think that's a great tip.
If you're trying to speak toeverybody, you're speaking to
nobody, so that's a fantasticway to really be engaged with
people.
So let me ask how do you coachpeople to do a great job at TEDx
?
Much of it is the same way Icoach them anyway.
Peter George (18:23):
But you have to remember TEDx has a limitation
of 18 minutes, which is cool.
You have to break everythingdown into 18 minutes or less and
I've had people I've coachedwho've given tremendous TEDx
talks that are five minutes.
So when you break it down it'sactually more difficult than if
you have more time.
(18:43):
There was an old saying andit's attributed to presidents
and people before presidents,and it had to do with writing,
but you can use the same thingwith speaking.
Forgive the length of theletter, if I had more time I
would have made it shorter,because it's much more difficult
to make things concise.
So we could ramble and ramble.
(19:03):
When you get things down to 18minutes or less, that's pretty
cool, I think.
Anyway, everybody's attentionspan is a 20 minute attention
span.
Now I don't necessarily agreewith that.
A compelling, captivatingspeaker can keep people's
attention for 60 minutes, 90minutes and longer.
Eric Eden (19:25):
So I have seen that a lot of conferences are doing
sessions that are shorter,closer to 20 minutes, versus
just giving everybody either 30minutes or an hour, minutes or
an hour.
I think a lot of the problemwith that is sometimes, if a
speaker is given a half hour oran hour of time, like a longer
(19:46):
block of time, in a lot of casesthey will just fill that time
with stuff that's not thatcaptivating, like the example
you gave of having a bunch ofopening things that aren't
really that engaging, likehousekeeping and just thanking
people and just weird thingsthat sort of fill the time, like
housekeeping and just thankingpeople and just weird things to
sort of fill the time, and thatat the end as well.
(20:07):
And I think people sometimes addextra things to get to the time
and then they're oh, like Ihave 30 minutes to fill.
I better find some more thingsto say, whereas if you take the
opposite approach of what youwere saying about TED Talks, of
their 18 minutes, you start byreally thinking about what is
the thing I need to convey andhow do I most concisely convey
(20:28):
that?
I think if people start there,you get great, and if you need
more time, I think that's fine,but a lot of people are just
filling it up is what I've seen.
But I am glad that a lot ofconferences are forcing people
to shorter times for that reasonand it hopefully makes people
think that way, but not alwaysis my experience.
Peter George (20:47):
I and my clients have all run into people saying
you've got an hour and I and myclients sometimes say to them I
can't do that Because what youwant for this specific audience
will not fill an hour.
We can't come up withinformation to fill an hour.
It's not right for you, it'snot right for the audience.
(21:09):
This might be a 30-minutepresentation for what you're
asking for.
I just spoke in Massachusettslast month, five weeks ago, and
when they contacted me last yearthey said we'd like you to
speak for an hour and here'swhat we'd like you to speak
about.
And I said I can't do it.
That's not going to be fair tothe audience.
(21:31):
That's two hours, easy, I canprobably get fitted into two
hours and that's what we endedup doing is two hours.
It was just this morning.
I received the testimonial forthat and as soon as I read it I
forwarded it to my wife and saidthis is one of the better
testimonials I've received in my37 years of speaking on stage.
(21:53):
And that was two hours.
Eric Eden (21:56):
I think you just have to fit your talk for the
right amount of time and not tryto.
You just have to fit your talkfor the right amount of time and
not try to extend itunnaturally or shorten it for
the time you need, because Ithink there are topics that
people would pay attention foran hour or two hours, like
you're saying, but a lot oftopics, no.
So you really have to size yourtalk correctly and make sure
(22:18):
that you're doing it in theright amount of time.
Let me ask you about your book.
People are often verypassionate about their books.
You've put a lot of effort intoyour book over the years.
Can you share with us a shortsynopsis of why you think this
(22:38):
book is for everybody who wantsto be a great speaker?
I encourage everyone to get thewhole book, but if you could
pitch it to us just for 30seconds, Sure, I wrote this book
and actually the book peopleread is the third iteration.
Peter George (22:51):
I tore the first two apart because I wanted it to
follow the way I actually trainmy clients.
So it goes from explaining whywe get nervous and how you can
manage those nerves, not get ridof them.
You don't want to get rid ofthem.
You just want to change thatnervous energy into powerful
energy.
How to construct a presentationthere's 900 ways to do it, but
(23:14):
this is just one that worksextremely well and it's very
easy to follow.
Well and it's very easy tofollow.
And then how to present it tothe unconscious mind, using the
tone of your voice, your bodylanguage, your gesturing, all
the things that people don'tthink about but actually make a
difference to them when you'representing.
And it takes you step by step.
And it's been fortunate enoughto win a number of awards,
(23:35):
including the internet runner upof the international book of
the Year in 2023.
Eric Eden (23:43):
Awesome.
I'm going to link to it in theshow notes so everyone can
easily get to it.
If you want to be a captivatingspeaker, I think it's a great
book to have that formula toachieve that sort of outcome.
Before we wrap up, is there anyother advice or secrets you
could share about being acaptivating and incredible and
(24:08):
inspiring speaker?
Peter George (24:10):
Rehearse, rehearse , rehearse, again and again.
The people who are the best inthe world at what they do
rehearse, train, practice,whatever their industry may call
it.
I'm from New England and peoplemight have heard, outside of
New England may have heard, ofthis guy that was here for 20
years named Tom Brady.
What did Tom do on the days hewasn't playing?
(24:34):
Practiced and practiced.
He not only had a head coach,he not only had an offensive
coach, he not only had aquarterback coach, he had a
throwing coach.
The guy who's considered thebest ever at what he did had all
these coaches who had him.
Practice and practice.
He didn't practice because hewas great.
(24:56):
He became great because hepracticed.
Eric Eden (25:01):
Amazing advice.
Thank you for being on thepodcast today sharing these
stories and your advice.
Again, I'm going to link toyour website and your book in
the show notes so people caneasily get the book and get in
touch if they'd like to learnmore.
Appreciate you being on theshow today.
Peter George (25:19):
Thank you, eric, and thank you to your listeners.
Welcome to today's episode.
Today we are talking about howto be a captivating public
speaker, how to inspire peopleand entertain people.
We have a great guest to helpus go through that today, Peter
George, welcome to the show.
Peter George (00:15):
Hi, eric, it's a pleasure to be here.
Eric Eden (00:18):
You've been in the public speaking space for
decades, why don't we start offby you talking a little bit
about who you are and what youdo?
Peter George (00:28):
I'm a public speaking coach, professional
speaker and author of anaward-winning book on public
speaking, and I get the mostpleasure in my life out of
helping people accomplish theirgoals.
I love helping people and ifpublic speaking can help them do
that, whether they're using itin business or otherwise, then
(00:51):
I'm more than happy to help themachieve their goals, their
initiatives and practicallychange their lives.
Eric Eden (01:01):
That's awesome.
I think public speaking can bevery rewarding.
I think it's a great strategyfor executives to grow their
company.
It's a great part of personalbranding, and so I think it's
definitely a skill worthmastering, and perhaps it's
harder than most people imagineit is on the surface.
Peter George (01:24):
Public speaking is really quite simple in the way
that our minds interact.
That doesn't make it easy, likea lot of things in life.
Very simple concept, not quiteso simple to implement, but the
great thing is, eric, anybodycan implement it.
Anybody can learn to be aneffective, captivating speaker.
(01:45):
I've been speaking on stage formore than 30 years.
I've been training for morethan 19 years and I grew up with
a lisp and a stutter.
If there's anybody who reallywouldn't make it on stage, it's
me.
I never had any idea I would bedoing what I do for a living.
Eric Eden (02:05):
That's awesome.
We're ready to be inspired.
Why don't you tell us a storyabout some of the best marketing
that you've done, that you'rethe most proud of, that you
think has had the most impact?
What?
Peter George (02:19):
may have had the most impact is what got me
speaking on stage.
I was asked to speak at aconference and I really didn't
want to.
It was representing my companymy own company, and it was a
fledgling company and they askedme to speak on stage about what
we were doing because it waschanging the way things were
being done.
And I agreed to and I wasn'tthat great at it, but I tried to
(02:43):
do my best and then, once I didit, I was asked more and more
to speak on stage at conferencesand other events and my wife,
who was my partner in my company, who was also an accountant,
noticed that every time I spokewe had a bump in revenue.
So it didn't take thisaccounting mind very long to say
(03:04):
, hey, do more of that.
So the more I spoke, the morerevenue we had and the more our
business increased and grew andit grew into be a very
successful business that we soldlater on, but much of its
success came from my being outin what would be the public of
(03:25):
our industry.
Eric Eden (03:27):
That's awesome.
Every time you spoke, you mademore money.
I think there's no easier wayto say it than that.
It's a great proof point forwhy executives getting out there
and speaking, founders gettingout there and speaking makes a
lot of sense.
Peter George (03:43):
I was going to say .
Think of music.
People go out on the road for areason they connect with people
straight on, head on.
So those people in the audiencecan say, yeah, I want to buy
more of your merchandise, I wantto buy more of your songs.
And executives can do the samething for their industry Not
speak about their business perse, but speak about a part of
(04:03):
the industry, a part of thebusiness that matters to others.
They get recognition and theirbusiness may grow.
It's a great way to connectwith your target audience.
Eric Eden (04:14):
So what's the hardest thing about being a
speaker?
That you coach people on?
Peter George (04:21):
One of the things that we all think about when
we're asked to speak is what amI going to say?
How am I going to present it?
What if I make a mistake?
What if I don't captivate theaudience?
What if I and we make it aboutus, and that's reasonable.
We're the ones up there infront of everybody.
The truth of the matter is it'snot about us.
(04:42):
Yes, we have to understand whatthe content is.
Yes, we have to present it in away that people are going to
want to listen and internalizethat information.
That's all true.
However, when we make it aboutus, the audience knows that.
When we make it about theaudience and how they're going
to benefit and how they're goingto walk away with greater
(05:06):
knowledge and abilities thatthey didn't have prior to coming
, that's the secret.
You transform an audience.
Let me ask you this, ericYou've been in business for a
while.
You ever go to a meeting andafter an hour, that meeting's
over and you're walking outsaying I will never, ever get
those 60 minutes back into mylife.
(05:27):
Complete waste of time.
You ever been in a meeting likethat?
Eric Eden (05:31):
Too often, unfortunately.
Right, it's what gives meetingsa bad name.
Peter George (05:36):
If people don't leave a meeting, if they don't
leave a breakout, a conference,a keynote, whatever it might be
changed in some way, transformedin some way, then why did we
have this meeting?
And that's the problem withmeetings and talks and seminars
and the like is often peoplearen't transformed because the
speaker didn't intend totransform those people.
(05:58):
So when you speak, I don't carewhat the situation is, work to
transform those people.
If they leave, the same waythey came in, whether it's
virtual or in person, then whydo you have the meeting?
At that point, it's justinformation and you can send an
information on a PDF throughemail and they'd appreciate that
(06:20):
.
Eric Eden (06:20):
Yeah, so it's definitely more than
broadcasting, and I guess thatleads me to one of my questions
is how can people consistentlywow their audience and get that
sort of opposite reaction thatyou're talking about?
Peter George (06:47):
ask Wowing is when we go into it with that, we may
or may not hit that, but if wego in to serve them with a
service mindset, that's a littledifferent.
That's a great way to wow them.
By the way, that's a great wayto separate yourself from the
guy who just comes and vomitsinformation all over them.
When you can learn to connectwith them, they can digest and
internalize what you're saying,so it benefits them.
That's a wow, and it's notdifficult to learn how to do
(07:11):
that.
And that's the great thingabout it is when you service
people, they appreciate it.
The only thing you really gotto do when it comes to public
speaking is not only make itabout them as opposed to you,
but deliver it in a way thattruly engages them, and that's
not difficult to learn at all.
Eric Eden (07:30):
What are some of those strategies that you teach
your clients and how to engagethe audience?
I think the first one youmentioned is don't make it about
you, make it about them.
But what are a couple otherthings that people can do to be
engaging?
Peter George (07:43):
Right off the bat, let me ask you this how long do
you think, according to somescientists, how long do you
think you have to engage anaudience and have them have
confidence in you?
How much time does it take?
How much time do you have to dothat?
Eric Eden (07:59):
I think very little time, much less time than people
think.
You have to have a really goodhook at the beginning.
If you start off slow, peoplejust tune it out pretty quickly,
like even within a coupleminutes.
I think, yeah, you have threeseconds.
Peter George (08:13):
Yeah.
So there are ways to extendthat before you ever open your
mouth.
That's one of the things Itrain my clients on.
But let's say you have thosethree seconds.
Let's say you have 30 seconds.
Some scientists say you have upto 30 seconds.
So let's take that, we'll get.
We'll make it a little morelenient.
You've got to get theirattention right off the bat,
because if you don't, man,you've got to spend an awful lot
(08:35):
of time trying to get it, andone of the ways to do that is to
speak to them directly.
Have a question, have a story,have a startling stat.
In some way get their attention.
Too many of us come out and sayit's a pleasure to be here as
opposed to what Not be here.
I'd like to thank so-and-so forhaving me here.
(08:57):
Eric, when you open a magazine,how many articles do you see
that before it gets to theheadline, it says I would love
to thank the editor for havingme in this particular issue of
this magazine.
Eric Eden (09:12):
Never.
Yeah, you're wasting your time.
Peter George (09:14):
No writer would ever do that.
They get to the point.
They grab you.
Yet in speaking we do theselittle pleasantries for some
reason.
No, it's not about the peoplewho invited you.
It's not about you, and it's apleasure to be here.
It's not about oh, I hadhandouts for you but I forgot
them in my printer or I'mnervous, or any things you might
say to them.
(09:34):
Get to the point.
Get their attention right offthe bat, and I mentioned some
great ways to do that.
A question always gets ourattention because as human
beings, we're conditioned toanswer questions, whether it's a
real question or a rhetoricalquestion.
Tell them a story that will gettheir attention, as long as
it's a compelling story andpertains to the point of the
(09:57):
talk.
Come up with a startlingstatistic that grabs their
attention.
Get their attention from momentone.
When you do that, then it'smuch easier to keep that wheel
going just by ticking the top tokeep their attention than it is
to get that wheel running allover again.
Eric Eden (10:16):
Yeah, sometimes people come out with a good joke
, but it has to be a good joke.
Peter George (10:21):
Yeah, most of us aren't very good at jokes.
That whole thing about startwith a joke If the joke pertains
to the talk, okay.
But then you better make sureyou're good at telling jokes,
and not just in your living room.
Your timing has to be spot on.
Jokes are not as much about thepunchline as they are about the
timing.
So your timing has to beexcellent, and when you're
(10:42):
nervous, your timing generallyisn't excellent.
So humor, yes, add humor whenyou can.
Even in business talks, addhumor Jokes.
Structured jokes might be adifferent story, depending on
your ability to tell them undera stressful situation.
Eric Eden (11:00):
Not everyone's a comedian, for sure no that's why
they get paid very good moneyand sometimes if you're in front
of a big live audience and thejoke doesn't really work, that
will add to your anxieties.
Worth considering, but alsoworth planning out.
Peter George (11:18):
I told a joke once in front of 750 people and it
absolutely bombed.
I went against my own adviceWhile walking on stage I threw
out my opening and said I'mgoing to start with this joke.
Eric Eden (11:31):
Horrible idea.
Yeah, it's heartbreaking.
So it's interesting.
I was at a conference last weekand one of the things I noticed
was when people were even inthe main keynote session forget
about breakout sessions, butwhen people are watching the
keynotes.
There was almost a thousandpeople in this keynote session
(11:54):
and I saw that a solid 85 to 90%of people were on their phones
while the speaker was speaking,and these were well-known
keynote speakers talking thateveryone should have been paying
rapt attention, but they wereeven distracted doom scrolling
(12:15):
while the keynote was going.
So how do you break throughthat sort of world we're living
in right now where people areonly half paying attention
anyways?
What can you do to be engagingto overcome things like that?
Generally?
Peter George (12:28):
that's on the speaker and not in the
presentation itself.
But the prep.
We often forget to prep andthat's a doomsday scenario.
You want to know who's in youraudience and there's ways to
accomplish that.
You want to know who's in youraudience.
If I go speak to marketers mybackground is marketing then hey
, I can just speak my language.
But what if there are financepeople in that audience?
(12:50):
What if there are financepeople in that audience?
What if there are IT people inthat audience?
These people think differentlythan a marketer's mindset.
I have to present to them too,and we forget that.
We think we can just go talkabout what we want to talk about
and it's going to resonate witheverybody.
Nope, wouldn't that be nice ifit were the case.
But that's why you were seeing80% of the people tune out.
(13:11):
What that keynote, or thosekeynotes, were saying to those
people, was designed in a waythat it just happened to
represent with 20%, not theother 80%.
You can design where that'sflipped, where it's resonating
with 80% and the other 20%.
You could do a song and danceor anything else, and it
(13:32):
probably wouldn't get theirattention.
But you can flip that simplynot easily by researching your
audience and designing your talkto resonate with each one of
those audiences, not a generalaudience, it's anything else.
If you're not specific, thenwhat luck are you going to have?
If you go marketing and youmarket to everybody, what luck
(13:54):
are you going to have?
Very little.
You target a specific audienceand you can do that in your talk
as well.
Eric Eden (14:03):
You can almost always tell how much they
prepared or if people arewinging it.
If you're paying attention tothe speaker, you can tell just
because they don't know theaudience they are presenting
things that you can just lookaround the room are not
connecting with people.
So I agree 100%.
Being prepared seems like anobvious thing, but I often see
(14:27):
the worst is like panels whereyou can just see if there's a
couple people talking at thesame time and they haven't even
rehearsed and planned it out.
You just end up with a mess.
Peter George (14:40):
When I've been on panels, I've spoken to other
people hey, you want to gettogether and just talk this
through?
We'll just wing it when we getthere, cool.
So what we're saying is we arenot going to take the time to
serve the audience.
The audience has taken its timeto be there, but we're just
going to give them a first draft.
We're just going to throw it outthere and see if it works.
(15:00):
Yeah, don't do that.
I hate that.
I agree and, to paraphrase DaleCarnegie, the unprepared
speaker gets exactly what he orshe deserves 100%.
Eric Eden (15:09):
So how do you think about the size of audiences?
This is always something thatinterests me.
I'm curious what is some of thebiggest audiences that you've
spoken to?
And then how do you reconcilethat with some of the talks
you've given that you think arethe most impactful?
Peter George (15:26):
The largest audience I've spoken to is a
little over 2,000.
And I find that much easierthan speaking to 10 people.
What we think of this, eric,when we say we're going to have
a conversation, okay, no problem, then we put the word
presentation in its place andsuddenly it becomes a problem.
I've got to do this, and how amI going to present?
What am I going to say?
(15:46):
How am I going to interact withthem?
All these things we have allthese, this connotation of what
a presentation is and it's justa conversation.
Now, it's a very specificallycreated conversation, but it's a
conversation.
Even those people might not bespeaking out.
They're still communicatingback with you.
You can see it in their face,you can see it in their body
movement, you can see if they'reholding a phone or not.
(16:08):
You know what they're saying,what they're thinking, as long
as you look and get thatresponse from that audience,
many people say you know what,peter?
I'm great with one, two, threepeople, but you put 15 people in
front of me, or any more thanthat, and I don't know how to
speak with them.
The problem, eric, is you can'tspeak to 15 people, you can't
(16:29):
speak to 100 people, you can'tspeak to 2,000 people.
You can only speak to oneeffectively, no-transcript.
But we try to speak to 2,000people and that's why we fail at
it.
But when we devise ourconversation, our presentation
that I'm speaking to onereplicated 50, 100, 2,000 times
(16:51):
and I use my words that connectwith the singular person, not
trying to speak to a group of2,000, making someone feel just
a little bit of a big group.
You want everybody to feel likeyou're the only one they're
speaking to and it makes it somuch easier to create a
presentation with that mindset,as opposed to how do I go out
(17:11):
and speak to a hundred or athousand people?
Speak to one, you look ateverybody, you make eye contact
with people, but you speak usingwords that are designed to
speak to one person.
That's when the people in theaudience go wow, eric was
speaking to me.
He knew what I was thinking.
How was that?
These other 1,999 people mustbe PO'd because he was only
(17:36):
talking to me.
Now you want that to happen2,000 times people sitting there
and each person saying that.
It's impractical to thinkthat's going to happen for all
of them.
But when you design itcorrectly, the vast majority
will walk away thinking you werespeaking just to them.
It's no different than being inthe audience listening to your
(17:57):
favorite singer and you'rethinking that singer is singing
just to you, even though there's18,000 people in that
auditorium.
Eric Eden (18:06):
I think that's a great tip.
If you're trying to speak toeverybody, you're speaking to
nobody, so that's a fantasticway to really be engaged with
people.
So let me ask how do you coachpeople to do a great job at TEDx
?
Much of it is the same way Icoach them anyway.
Peter George (18:23):
But you have to remember TEDx has a limitation
of 18 minutes, which is cool.
You have to break everythingdown into 18 minutes or less and
I've had people I've coachedwho've given tremendous TEDx
talks that are five minutes.
So when you break it down it'sactually more difficult than if
you have more time.
(18:43):
There was an old saying andit's attributed to presidents
and people before presidents,and it had to do with writing,
but you can use the same thingwith speaking.
Forgive the length of theletter, if I had more time I
would have made it shorter,because it's much more difficult
to make things concise.
So we could ramble and ramble.
(19:03):
When you get things down to 18minutes or less, that's pretty
cool, I think.
Anyway, everybody's attentionspan is a 20 minute attention
span.
Now I don't necessarily agreewith that.
A compelling, captivatingspeaker can keep people's
attention for 60 minutes, 90minutes and longer.
Eric Eden (19:25):
So I have seen that a lot of conferences are doing
sessions that are shorter,closer to 20 minutes, versus
just giving everybody either 30minutes or an hour, minutes or
an hour.
I think a lot of the problemwith that is sometimes, if a
speaker is given a half hour oran hour of time, like a longer
(19:46):
block of time, in a lot of casesthey will just fill that time
with stuff that's not thatcaptivating, like the example
you gave of having a bunch ofopening things that aren't
really that engaging, likehousekeeping and just thanking
people and just weird thingsthat sort of fill the time, like
housekeeping and just thankingpeople and just weird things to
sort of fill the time, and thatat the end as well.
(20:07):
And I think people sometimes addextra things to get to the time
and then they're oh, like Ihave 30 minutes to fill.
I better find some more thingsto say, whereas if you take the
opposite approach of what youwere saying about TED Talks, of
their 18 minutes, you start byreally thinking about what is
the thing I need to convey andhow do I most concisely convey
(20:28):
that?
I think if people start there,you get great, and if you need
more time, I think that's fine,but a lot of people are just
filling it up is what I've seen.
But I am glad that a lot ofconferences are forcing people
to shorter times for that reasonand it hopefully makes people
think that way, but not alwaysis my experience.
Peter George (20:47):
I and my clients have all run into people saying
you've got an hour and I and myclients sometimes say to them I
can't do that Because what youwant for this specific audience
will not fill an hour.
We can't come up withinformation to fill an hour.
It's not right for you, it'snot right for the audience.
(21:09):
This might be a 30-minutepresentation for what you're
asking for.
I just spoke in Massachusettslast month, five weeks ago, and
when they contacted me last yearthey said we'd like you to
speak for an hour and here'swhat we'd like you to speak
about.
And I said I can't do it.
That's not going to be fair tothe audience.
(21:31):
That's two hours, easy, I canprobably get fitted into two
hours and that's what we endedup doing is two hours.
It was just this morning.
I received the testimonial forthat and as soon as I read it I
forwarded it to my wife and saidthis is one of the better
testimonials I've received in my37 years of speaking on stage.
(21:53):
And that was two hours.
Eric Eden (21:56):
I think you just have to fit your talk for the
right amount of time and not tryto.
You just have to fit your talkfor the right amount of time and
not try to extend itunnaturally or shorten it for
the time you need, because Ithink there are topics that
people would pay attention foran hour or two hours, like
you're saying, but a lot oftopics, no.
So you really have to size yourtalk correctly and make sure
(22:18):
that you're doing it in theright amount of time.
Let me ask you about your book.
People are often verypassionate about their books.
You've put a lot of effort intoyour book over the years.
Can you share with us a shortsynopsis of why you think this
(22:38):
book is for everybody who wantsto be a great speaker?
I encourage everyone to get thewhole book, but if you could
pitch it to us just for 30seconds, Sure, I wrote this book
and actually the book peopleread is the third iteration.
Peter George (22:51):
I tore the first two apart because I wanted it to
follow the way I actually trainmy clients.
So it goes from explaining whywe get nervous and how you can
manage those nerves, not get ridof them.
You don't want to get rid ofthem.
You just want to change thatnervous energy into powerful
energy.
How to construct a presentationthere's 900 ways to do it, but
(23:14):
this is just one that worksextremely well and it's very
easy to follow.
Well and it's very easy tofollow.
And then how to present it tothe unconscious mind, using the
tone of your voice, your bodylanguage, your gesturing, all
the things that people don'tthink about but actually make a
difference to them when you'representing.
And it takes you step by step.
And it's been fortunate enoughto win a number of awards,
(23:35):
including the internet runner upof the international book of
the Year in 2023.
Eric Eden (23:43):
Awesome.
I'm going to link to it in theshow notes so everyone can
easily get to it.
If you want to be a captivatingspeaker, I think it's a great
book to have that formula toachieve that sort of outcome.
Before we wrap up, is there anyother advice or secrets you
could share about being acaptivating and incredible and
(24:08):
inspiring speaker?
Peter George (24:10):
Rehearse, rehearse , rehearse, again and again.
The people who are the best inthe world at what they do
rehearse, train, practice,whatever their industry may call
it.
I'm from New England and peoplemight have heard, outside of
New England may have heard, ofthis guy that was here for 20
years named Tom Brady.
What did Tom do on the days hewasn't playing?
(24:34):
Practiced and practiced.
He not only had a head coach,he not only had an offensive
coach, he not only had aquarterback coach, he had a
throwing coach.
The guy who's considered thebest ever at what he did had all
these coaches who had him.
Practice and practice.
He didn't practice because hewas great.
(24:56):
He became great because hepracticed.
Eric Eden (25:01):
Amazing advice.
Thank you for being on thepodcast today sharing these
stories and your advice.
Again, I'm going to link toyour website and your book in
the show notes so people caneasily get the book and get in
touch if they'd like to learnmore.
Appreciate you being on theshow today.
Peter George (25:19):
Thank you, eric, and thank you to your listeners.
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