September 5, 2024 • 25 mins
How does being in the military prepare you to be a great marketer? In today's episode we discuss using military precision to drive digital marketing success. Our guest is Jim Fuhs, a retired Marine Corps Lieutenant Colonel who has become an influencer marketing expert. Discover how Jim's disciplined approach led to rapid success with Amazon's influencer program and the creation of DealCasters, a show that caught the attention of industry giants like Dave Jackson and brands like Shure microphones. Jim explains how his military background equipped him with the skills necessary for thriving in the fast-paced world of digital marketing and offers actionable tips on starting your journey with simple, accessible tech.
Jim shares stories about his podcast Dealcasters and how they Live Streamed to over 10,000 people on Amazon for black Friday. Jim has helped fascinate training for podcasters on live streaming at industry events like Podfest.
Join us as we explore the powerful strategies behind successful live streaming on platforms like LinkedIn, YouTube, TikTok, and Instagram. Jim reveals the importance of understanding your audience and choosing the right platform to achieve your goals, whether to educate or entertain. Learn how to leverage recorded content for evergreen value, enhance your live stream quality, and utilize AI tools like Descript to polish your videos. We wrap up with essential advice on starting small, avoiding overspending on gear, and practicing consistently to build a solid foundation for your influencer brand. This episode is packed with practical insights and resources to help you succeed in the ever-evolving world of digital marketing and live streaming.
Visit Jim's web site to learn more on this topic and connect with Jim.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to today's episode.
Today we are talking aboutinfluencer marketing and we have
a great guest to help us talkthrough that, Jim Fuse from
Fusion Marketing.
Welcome to the show.
Great to be here, Eric.
Thanks for having me.
So why don't we start off byyou sharing just a minute or two
about who you are and what youdo?
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, so a little unusual maybe for someone that
got into influencer marketing.
I retired from the Marine Corpsas a Lieutenant Colonel 15
years ago, and so, in my journeyto figure out what I wanted to
do next, I got into digitalmarketing in about 2016,.
Started doing live streaming in2018, had a show for about five
(00:43):
years called the Tim and Jimshow, and then, during the
pandemic, a friend of mine, rossBrand, who runs a show called
Livestream Universe, put a videoout about hey, amazon's got
this influencer program that youcan apply to and if you get in,
you can go live.
And so I did that and I gotapproved.
With my Twitter account, whichis something you can't even use
(01:06):
anymore I called my friend,chris and said, hey, we can
finally do a show together,literally in two hours.
We set up DealCasters on Amazonand started going live in July
of 2020.
From that point forward, thingshave really been amazing, and
I'm now looked at as a I guess,an Amazon influencer, but I also
(01:29):
do digital marketing remotelive stream production with
products like StreamYard.
It's a lot of fun because wedon't make it our full-time
thing, because we do these otherthings, because you just never
know what's going to happen.
People may not like yourproducts, algorithms change and
things like that.
So, yeah, I've been doing itfor four, yeah, a little over
four years now.
(01:49):
We've been running deal castersand it's been really successful
.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
So how did being in the military and the Marines
prepare you to be a marketer?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
I think it's probably more about process discipline,
understanding attention todetail specifically.
I think we see probably moreabout process discipline,
understanding attention todetail specifically.
I think we see that a lot withpeople when they're doing things
in marketing in general is theyforget some of the little
things or they don't think aboutwhat else is coming up.
Sometimes we talk about thosemarketing fails where people put
(02:22):
something on auto schedule andall of a sudden some world event
happens and it really givesthem a bad look.
So you have to always be payingattention.
So I think that's where theMarine Corps really helped me
was attention to detail and thediscipline to get things done.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
I think that's a very interesting point because a lot
of marketing is about thedetails.
If you get a lot of the littledetails wrong, things don't
really work.
So, being highly organized, oneof my favorite prompts when I'm
putting stuff into ChatGPT isI'll be like make it punchier,
(03:01):
and I keep wanting to saytighten it up, sort out all the
details.
So I think that I can't reallydo that quite for us yet.
So you really have to, as amarketer, be willing to look
into every detail, every pixel,make sure that every aspect of
marketing programs are great.
So I can see how that hasbenefited you, although it's not
(03:24):
necessarily obvious.
I don't know that.
I've had anyone on the show whosaid that Military Life really
prepared them for marketing.
So that's an awesomecompetitive advantage for you, I
think.
But let's hear a story.
We're ready to be inspiredabout some of the best marketing
that you've done.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah.
So really I would say whatwe've done with DealCasters was
we didn't know it was going tobe amazing, but it has been for
us because we had builtconnections in the social media
marketing world, we were able toreach out to some really big
name people and I think justthat having Amazon as a part of
(04:05):
our brand.
So, as an example, dave Jackson, who is Hall of Fame podcaster,
runs a school of podcasting wasreleasing his book, how to
Profit from your Podcast, and somy friend, chris, who knew Dave
, said hey, dave, how'd you liketo be on our show, which we had
only had three episodes, and,of course, most people how many
(04:26):
down we're going to go live onAmazon.
And so you get that the dogtilting their head look like
what you can go live on Amazon.
And so he came on our show onthe release day of his book.
So that happened.
So we started to have otherpeople Chris Kermitsos, we've
had Mitch Jackson, winnie Sun, alot of big names in different
(04:48):
spaces and it's all because ofthe appeal of having Amazon as
one of the places that thesepeople are going to be on.
And so then, as people startedto see our shows, started to see
our podcast, brands startedreaching out to us as opposed to
us having to go out to them,and that led to we've been
(05:10):
connected now, I think, withShure microphones for probably
three, four years, and by thatmeaning we get stuff before it
gets released to the generalpublic.
We sign NDAs, we're doing videosso that on launch day our
videos are already out there onall the different platforms, and
it's nice to be able to helppeople, give them advice when it
(05:33):
really comes to tech.
And so really our tagline isdon't fear the gear.
Because Chris and I are both acouple of guys in our fifties
that we like tech, but we knowthat there's a lot of people
that are afraid of it.
How do I go live or whatmicrophone do I need?
And we try to keep it simpleand we let people like look, you
(05:56):
can start with your phonecamera, you don't even need to
go get a lot of lighting andwork your way up, need to go get
a lot of lighting and work yourway up.
And we also have businessesapproach us about hey, how do we
get on Amazon?
Now, we don't necessarily knowall the details of getting on
Amazon, but we can give themadvice if they are like look,
(06:16):
you need to create manufacturingvideos from your company
showing how your product works.
You need to be out on, youreally need to be omni-channel.
I think that's one of the thingsthat marketers have to be aware
of, and I think that's been apart of our success is that
we're not just on Amazon.
We're taking those Amazon linksand putting them out on, as we
(06:39):
like to say, all the other tubes, and that even led to our
YouTube channel was monetized.
We have a second channel.
It's funny we call it Men Aboutthe House, because we're just
regular guys like everyone else,eric, and we use pressure
cookers and lawn stuff, and so,since that's not really tech,
but Amazon doesn't restrict youwhat you can talk about, it's
(06:59):
like let's create a new channelso it doesn't muddy up our brand
when you're on YouTube.
So that's really led to that.
And then I would say One of theI guess you could say most
humbling things is ChrisKermitsos, who runs PodFest,
which is one of the biggerpodcasting conferences, came to
us and said hey, I want you guysto do a full day.
(07:23):
We got to speak as well, and itwas just really not something
that when we started thisinfluencer marketing journey
that we thought would everhappen.
So those are things to me thathave really made this worthwhile
(07:44):
and we continue to benefit fromit.
As we like to say, we literallymake money while we sleep.
Don't sleep on it completely,because things change and you
have to be prepared for thosechanges.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
That's awesome.
So you were able to mixtogether influencer marketing,
live streaming in order to getsome really interesting brand
deals deals and the livestreaming specifically was in a
(08:16):
unique way on Amazon, whichmakes sense for deal casters,
because everyone's looking for adeal, and then, when you did
that really well, you got branddeals coming to you right.
That's really interestingbecause that's a different way
to monetize than a lot of peopleinitially think about with
podcasts, right.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Oh yeah, I think sometimes people get caught up
in the metric side.
When they're approaching people, they're like how many
followers do you have, or how doyou have this or that.
But I think the fact that wewere on Amazon and the quality
of our show because we do a lotwith graphics and things that
make it interesting it's reallyabout, as Chris and I like to
(08:51):
say, it's about pattern,interrupt right, like you try to
keep this show to a certainlength as well, because you
realize we call it the old shortattention span theater, so you
got to be to the point, be quick, and it's the same thing.
When it's a interview, we wantto make it interesting and when
we're doing product demos, wewant to switch up the products
(09:12):
we're talking about every fewminutes, because nobody wants to
watch somebody talk about thesame microphone for 30 minutes
straight.
10 minute videos do a lotbetter than, say, the long ones,
even though they say that thelong form video is somewhere
(09:35):
somehow going to become thething that people want to do.
But we'll see.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Yeah, I think a lot of people are saying on YouTube
you should do at least threeYouTube shorts for every longer
video, and I'd only been doinglike one YouTube short for
longer videos and I was like, oh, let me try that, and I think
doing three is definitely betterif you can to promote the
longer form stuff.
So I think there's a lot oflittle interesting things like
(10:02):
that that I've learned.
But what have you learned aboutinfluencer marketing over the
past few years and the journeyyou described?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I think part of it is you don't say yes to everything
.
You say yes to those thingsthat you would use, that you
believe in.
We've said a lot of no's.
One of the things, too, is weuse some Amazon seller software
called Helium 10 that allows usto actually take a look at these
(10:30):
products before we do anythingwith them to know what their
sales are like.
Because we get a lot of not tosay there's anything wrong with
stuff from China.
But we'll get these Chinesecompanies approaching us like,
hey, we want to send you thismicrophone and it's okay, but
it's a cheap microphone.
It's not something we'renecessarily interested in, and
we can see that they're reallynot making a lot of sales.
(10:51):
And so, when you think aboutproduct placement, if that
product's not even gettinglooked at on Amazon because
there's so many others there,why spend all that time doing it
?
Same thing, if you're usingsoftware we like to use
StreamYard, ecamm, things likethat you should be using that
product because it really isn'ta good look on you as an
(11:13):
influencer to say, hey, I reallylike this thing, and then
people find out you don't evenuse it.
So I think that's something toothat these businesses have
found is find your own advocates.
If you're thinking about beingan influencer, what I would say
is if you use something, dovideos and other forms.
Blogs are still a good thing todo.
(11:35):
Big fan of Substack.
Write about it, talk about thefeatures and benefits, and they
will see that you're doing that.
Don't always look at doingthings as what's in it for me.
Look at it as how can I help mycommunity get better at
whatever it is you're trying tohelp them with.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Yeah, I think that's great advice to only be an
influencer for products that youreally believe in Don't say yes
to everything and the productsthat you naturally use.
It makes a lot of sense thatyou would get behind endorsing
those.
I'm passionate about a lot ofthe softwares and tools that I
(12:13):
use as a marketer and often justorganically recommend it to all
my friends because the tools Ifind that I really like.
It makes sense.
I think that naturally is agood extension in place for
influencers to start right.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yes, and in fact that's a great example because
when you think about it, that'swhere we all, whether we realize
it or not, we're influencers,even if it's in our small circle
, because somebody will say, hey, where'd you get that?
And so a lot of times,influencer marketing Amazon even
specifically, if I give you thelink to buy a microphone or a
(12:49):
bottle of energy drink orwhatever, you're not paying any
more to get it and I'm gettinganywhere from two to four
percent for you buying thatproduct.
So it's really, it's a win.
I don't think people shouldfeel like, oh, it feels slimy,
you're telling people anyway, sowhy not maybe make a teeny bit
of money off of it?
Speaker 1 (13:08):
Yeah, absolutely, and so do you still recommend to?
Speaker 2 (13:19):
people that they should figure out a strategy for
live streaming.
Is that something that you'rean advocate for?
The way we behave has changedagain.
During the pandemic, everybodywas inside, they had more time
to sit in front of their screens, but now it's like people are
back to sometimes it's hybridwork, sometimes it's remote only
(13:41):
, but they're doing other things.
So I think we're into more of a.
I want to watch things ondemand.
So, even if you're going live,don't get frustrated that you
don't have a lot of peoplewatching you at the time you go
live, because you're not goingto find a perfect time.
Remember the replays, right?
You're going to get a lot morereplay viewers and I think going
(14:01):
back to what you said, eric,taking that long form content
and chopping it up into toshorts and reels will bring
people back to oh, I want to seethe full episode.
I want to see more of what wenton during that episode.
I think that's really where thestrength of your live stream
can help you and it buildscommunity.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Yeah, absolutely.
I think live streaming isdifferent across the platforms.
As you mentioned you, doinglive streaming on Amazon is
particularly unique.
I haven't run across a lot ofpeople doing that.
I happen to see a lot of peopledoing live streaming on
everything from TikTok toLinkedIn to Facebook and, you
(14:44):
mentioned, even X has somecapability to do it.
So I'm curious what platformsare people thinking about live
streaming on?
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Are there any that are particularly interesting
these days?
If you're in the B2B space, Iwould say LinkedIn and YouTube
are the two that I wouldprobably go with first.
I am not as big a fan of goinglive on Facebook as maybe
several years ago, because thatgoes back to depending on what
your show is.
I just don't think people arewatching a lot of live streams
(15:18):
on Facebook.
You're seeing a lot of people,especially if they are, say,
niche or even, as an example,the people that are into the
politics things, them.
Live streaming on YouTube is.
They're getting thousands ofpeople joining in and I guess
some of it's because people wantto say whatever they want to
say on whatever side of theaisle they're on.
(15:40):
So I think that's where YouTubelives.
It can be strong.
Linkedin, the fact that you'reable to get in front of a
business audience, I think, isgood as well.
I really haven't gone live onTikTok.
I could.
I haven't Even with Instagram.
When I think of those platformsfor me, it's not to say it's
the same for everyone.
I don't spend a lot of time onthose platforms wanting to
(16:03):
consume live content, so I knowit works for some people.
I'm not saying it's wrong, butI think it goes back to who is
the audience that you're tryingto reach where I think TikTok?
Obviously younger folks.
I know some older folks are onit and Instagram as well and are
you trying to train or are youtrying to entertain?
I think that's another bigdifference and I think TikTok is
(16:27):
more mindless scrollingentertainment Same, to some
point, with Instagram as well.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
I do my fair share of mindless scrolling.
There's nothing wrong with thatat all.
Nothing, that's right.
The one thing you said that Ireally like and I agree with is
live streaming on YouTube.
There's 2 billion people whoare watching YouTube every month
.
It's more than Netflix.
It's a number two website onthe internet.
Google has done a lot of thingsto make sure of that.
(16:54):
So I really agree that YouTubewould be a great place for a lot
of people to start with livestreaming, and I think the
LinkedIn thing is interestingbecause of some of the things
that they do, like they notifyall of your connections when
you're live.
Things like that could drawsome more people in.
But I love your tip about thinkabout it as a marketer
(17:19):
holistically, not just whathappens when you go live, and
maybe you can introduce somedrama of watch what happens when
I go live.
Just let people know they thinksomething crazy could happen,
even if it's not going to.
But aside from watch, whathappens when I go live Just let
people know they think somethingcrazy could happen, even if
it's not going to.
But aside from watch whathappens when it goes live, I
like the idea of what you dowith deal casters is you still
(17:40):
do the recorded version and thenyou have the full long version
recorded and then you can stilldo clips and repurpose content
from that and even do writtencontent from that, like blog
articles from the transcripts ofgoing live.
So there's a lot of ways to usethat content beyond just the
live itself.
I was thinking back to five toseven years ago when webinars
(18:05):
were a lot more of the standardstaple, like pre-COVID for B2B,
and I remembered as a CMO that alot of times we get I don't
know 100 or 200 people on a livewebinar.
But then when I put therecording of the webinar on the
website after I looked at itafter six months it'd be like
thousands of people had watchedthe recorded version.
The power of having somethingrecorded and available evergreen
(18:31):
is pretty powerful and that'sessentially what YouTube is
doing right, like they have allthe stuff there from months or
years ago and if you search onthe right thing, you'll get to a
video that was put out three orsix months ago.
You don't care right, it'severgreen.
It's there and I look at howold stuff is, but people watch
stuff that isn't super recentall the time for training and
(18:51):
for education.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
And the other neat thing, it's your legacy, right?
Who would have thought that,instead of having to run around
with a, we'll call it a webcamof some sort, like now your kids
and your grandkids can say oh,that's what mom or dad looked
like when they were doing thesevideos and they see what you're
like and your personality atdifferent ages, and so it's
another way to.
(19:13):
We've created this memory bankon social media that we didn't
even realize we were doing.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
So any tips, tricks, secrets that you could recommend
for marketers about livestreams?
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I think one don't keep putting it off right.
We're all willing to forgivethose first few streams where
you're trying to get better.
I think the biggest thing ismake sure that you have good
audio, number one.
People will forgive the videoaspect as you get better and try
to get better 1% every time.
(19:47):
Take a look at what did I do?
Am I saying lots of ums and ahsand other things?
That's where maybe you go to aplace like Toastmasters to
become a better speaker.
But don't be afraid of doing it.
And I think even with recordedvideo, it doesn't have to be
perfect.
I think that's the other thingI feel like oh, I got to keep
(20:08):
redoing this and redoing this.
And of course, there are someAI tools.
I'm not saying that you shouldnecessarily use it.
That can correct some of yourmistakes using AI, but sometimes
it's a little bit obvious.
So just I would say, use thatwith caution.
But if you have to start outwith your phone, put it in front
(20:28):
of your face, record it.
If you don't like it, delete it, do it again.
So if you need to at first do afew recorded videos, then get
into the live.
For me, live has always workedbetter, kind of like we are here
with somebody else.
I think it's very difficult todo unless that's just your
personality, a talking head byyourself, a live stream.
I think that's a little bit ofa challenge, especially if
(20:51):
nobody's there to engage with100%, so I love that advice.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
I think that I use Descript to edit all of my
recorded videos.
It's my favorite editing tooland they have this one feature
in it where, with a click of abutton, you can remove all the
transition words like er and I'mgoing to keep trying to be
better at not using those crutchwords as much, but until I get
(21:20):
there, that's awesome and oneclick sometimes you can remove
all of those things and editingvery easily.
So that's one of the examplesof the AI tools that I love on
the recorded piece.
But you can always justpractice to become more fluent
for the live versions and, likeyou said, practice makes perfect
.
Do some run-throughs and have aco-host.
(21:41):
Those are great ideas to, Ithink, make the lives better.
Any final thoughts oninfluencers and live streaming
that I didn't ask that you wantto share?
Speaker 2 (21:52):
It's never too late to start.
I started in my 50s.
There's people starting intheir 60s and 70s.
But I would also say don't quityour day job when you go into
this stuff.
I would say, make sure thatyou've got a backup plan because
it may not work out.
Because as much as everyonesays that, oh, everyone can be a
creator, let's be honest,that's not really true.
(22:12):
It takes work, it takespractice, and I'm not saying you
can't do it, but sometimesyou're going to have to work to
get to that point where itstarts to be a success.
And don't go spend $10,000 ongear and then say I spent all
this money and I'm not makingany money.
Start simple, start small andbuild your way up, just like you
would with your business.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
I think that's great advice.
I would add to that that ittakes time right.
So it'll take time to build itup, probably longer than we all
would like or think up front,and so that's a great reason to
be thoughtful about planning itout and just understand it'll
take longer than we will like toscale some of these things and
get to some of the those greatsuccess outcomes that you shared
(22:56):
here.
But I really appreciate yourinsights because I think that
live streaming is a great toolfor influencers and I think it's
important for people tounderstand some of the amazing
tricks and nuances that we'vetalked about here today.
So I'm going to link to yourwebsite and your show so people
(23:17):
can go check it out and get intouch with you if they'd like to
talk about this more and learnmore.
We really appreciate you beingwith us today.
Thanks so much.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Thank you, eric.
It's great to be here.
Take care everyone.
Welcome to today's episode.
Today we are talking aboutinfluencer marketing and we have
a great guest to help us talkthrough that, Jim Fuse from
Fusion Marketing.
Welcome to the show.
Great to be here, Eric.
Thanks for having me.
So why don't we start off byyou sharing just a minute or two
about who you are and what youdo?
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, so a little unusual maybe for someone that
got into influencer marketing.
I retired from the Marine Corpsas a Lieutenant Colonel 15
years ago, and so, in my journeyto figure out what I wanted to
do next, I got into digitalmarketing in about 2016,.
Started doing live streaming in2018, had a show for about five
(00:43):
years called the Tim and Jimshow, and then, during the
pandemic, a friend of mine, rossBrand, who runs a show called
Livestream Universe, put a videoout about hey, amazon's got
this influencer program that youcan apply to and if you get in,
you can go live.
And so I did that and I gotapproved.
With my Twitter account, whichis something you can't even use
(01:06):
anymore I called my friend,chris and said, hey, we can
finally do a show together,literally in two hours.
We set up DealCasters on Amazonand started going live in July
of 2020.
From that point forward, thingshave really been amazing, and
I'm now looked at as a I guess,an Amazon influencer, but I also
(01:29):
do digital marketing remotelive stream production with
products like StreamYard.
It's a lot of fun because wedon't make it our full-time
thing, because we do these otherthings, because you just never
know what's going to happen.
People may not like yourproducts, algorithms change and
things like that.
So, yeah, I've been doing itfor four, yeah, a little over
four years now.
(01:49):
We've been running deal castersand it's been really successful
.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
So how did being in the military and the Marines
prepare you to be a marketer?
Speaker 2 (02:00):
I think it's probably more about process discipline,
understanding attention todetail specifically.
I think we see probably moreabout process discipline,
understanding attention todetail specifically.
I think we see that a lot withpeople when they're doing things
in marketing in general is theyforget some of the little
things or they don't think aboutwhat else is coming up.
Sometimes we talk about thosemarketing fails where people put
(02:22):
something on auto schedule andall of a sudden some world event
happens and it really givesthem a bad look.
So you have to always be payingattention.
So I think that's where theMarine Corps really helped me
was attention to detail and thediscipline to get things done.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
I think that's a very interesting point because a lot
of marketing is about thedetails.
If you get a lot of the littledetails wrong, things don't
really work.
So, being highly organized, oneof my favorite prompts when I'm
putting stuff into ChatGPT isI'll be like make it punchier,
(03:01):
and I keep wanting to saytighten it up, sort out all the
details.
So I think that I can't reallydo that quite for us yet.
So you really have to, as amarketer, be willing to look
into every detail, every pixel,make sure that every aspect of
marketing programs are great.
So I can see how that hasbenefited you, although it's not
(03:24):
necessarily obvious.
I don't know that.
I've had anyone on the show whosaid that Military Life really
prepared them for marketing.
So that's an awesomecompetitive advantage for you, I
think.
But let's hear a story.
We're ready to be inspiredabout some of the best marketing
that you've done.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah.
So really I would say whatwe've done with DealCasters was
we didn't know it was going tobe amazing, but it has been for
us because we had builtconnections in the social media
marketing world, we were able toreach out to some really big
name people and I think justthat having Amazon as a part of
(04:05):
our brand.
So, as an example, dave Jackson, who is Hall of Fame podcaster,
runs a school of podcasting wasreleasing his book, how to
Profit from your Podcast, and somy friend, chris, who knew Dave
, said hey, dave, how'd you liketo be on our show, which we had
only had three episodes, and,of course, most people how many
(04:26):
down we're going to go live onAmazon.
And so you get that the dogtilting their head look like
what you can go live on Amazon.
And so he came on our show onthe release day of his book.
So that happened.
So we started to have otherpeople Chris Kermitsos, we've
had Mitch Jackson, winnie Sun, alot of big names in different
(04:48):
spaces and it's all because ofthe appeal of having Amazon as
one of the places that thesepeople are going to be on.
And so then, as people startedto see our shows, started to see
our podcast, brands startedreaching out to us as opposed to
us having to go out to them,and that led to we've been
(05:10):
connected now, I think, withShure microphones for probably
three, four years, and by thatmeaning we get stuff before it
gets released to the generalpublic.
We sign NDAs, we're doing videosso that on launch day our
videos are already out there onall the different platforms, and
it's nice to be able to helppeople, give them advice when it
(05:33):
really comes to tech.
And so really our tagline isdon't fear the gear.
Because Chris and I are both acouple of guys in our fifties
that we like tech, but we knowthat there's a lot of people
that are afraid of it.
How do I go live or whatmicrophone do I need?
And we try to keep it simpleand we let people like look, you
(05:56):
can start with your phonecamera, you don't even need to
go get a lot of lighting andwork your way up, need to go get
a lot of lighting and work yourway up.
And we also have businessesapproach us about hey, how do we
get on Amazon?
Now, we don't necessarily knowall the details of getting on
Amazon, but we can give themadvice if they are like look,
(06:16):
you need to create manufacturingvideos from your company
showing how your product works.
You need to be out on, youreally need to be omni-channel.
I think that's one of the thingsthat marketers have to be aware
of, and I think that's been apart of our success is that
we're not just on Amazon.
We're taking those Amazon linksand putting them out on, as we
(06:39):
like to say, all the other tubes, and that even led to our
YouTube channel was monetized.
We have a second channel.
It's funny we call it Men Aboutthe House, because we're just
regular guys like everyone else,eric, and we use pressure
cookers and lawn stuff, and so,since that's not really tech,
but Amazon doesn't restrict youwhat you can talk about, it's
(06:59):
like let's create a new channelso it doesn't muddy up our brand
when you're on YouTube.
So that's really led to that.
And then I would say One of theI guess you could say most
humbling things is ChrisKermitsos, who runs PodFest,
which is one of the biggerpodcasting conferences, came to
us and said hey, I want you guysto do a full day.
(07:23):
We got to speak as well, and itwas just really not something
that when we started thisinfluencer marketing journey
that we thought would everhappen.
So those are things to me thathave really made this worthwhile
(07:44):
and we continue to benefit fromit.
As we like to say, we literallymake money while we sleep.
Don't sleep on it completely,because things change and you
have to be prepared for thosechanges.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
That's awesome.
So you were able to mixtogether influencer marketing,
live streaming in order to getsome really interesting brand
deals deals and the livestreaming specifically was in a
(08:16):
unique way on Amazon, whichmakes sense for deal casters,
because everyone's looking for adeal, and then, when you did
that really well, you got branddeals coming to you right.
That's really interestingbecause that's a different way
to monetize than a lot of peopleinitially think about with
podcasts, right.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Oh yeah, I think sometimes people get caught up
in the metric side.
When they're approaching people, they're like how many
followers do you have, or how doyou have this or that.
But I think the fact that wewere on Amazon and the quality
of our show because we do a lotwith graphics and things that
make it interesting it's reallyabout, as Chris and I like to
(08:51):
say, it's about pattern,interrupt right, like you try to
keep this show to a certainlength as well, because you
realize we call it the old shortattention span theater, so you
got to be to the point, be quick, and it's the same thing.
When it's a interview, we wantto make it interesting and when
we're doing product demos, wewant to switch up the products
(09:12):
we're talking about every fewminutes, because nobody wants to
watch somebody talk about thesame microphone for 30 minutes
straight.
10 minute videos do a lotbetter than, say, the long ones,
even though they say that thelong form video is somewhere
(09:35):
somehow going to become thething that people want to do.
But we'll see.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Yeah, I think a lot of people are saying on YouTube
you should do at least threeYouTube shorts for every longer
video, and I'd only been doinglike one YouTube short for
longer videos and I was like, oh, let me try that, and I think
doing three is definitely betterif you can to promote the
longer form stuff.
So I think there's a lot oflittle interesting things like
(10:02):
that that I've learned.
But what have you learned aboutinfluencer marketing over the
past few years and the journeyyou described?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I think part of it is you don't say yes to everything
.
You say yes to those thingsthat you would use, that you
believe in.
We've said a lot of no's.
One of the things, too, is weuse some Amazon seller software
called Helium 10 that allows usto actually take a look at these
(10:30):
products before we do anythingwith them to know what their
sales are like.
Because we get a lot of not tosay there's anything wrong with
stuff from China.
But we'll get these Chinesecompanies approaching us like,
hey, we want to send you thismicrophone and it's okay, but
it's a cheap microphone.
It's not something we'renecessarily interested in, and
we can see that they're reallynot making a lot of sales.
(10:51):
And so, when you think aboutproduct placement, if that
product's not even gettinglooked at on Amazon because
there's so many others there,why spend all that time doing it
?
Same thing, if you're usingsoftware we like to use
StreamYard, ecamm, things likethat you should be using that
product because it really isn'ta good look on you as an
(11:13):
influencer to say, hey, I reallylike this thing, and then
people find out you don't evenuse it.
So I think that's something toothat these businesses have
found is find your own advocates.
If you're thinking about beingan influencer, what I would say
is if you use something, dovideos and other forms.
Blogs are still a good thing todo.
(11:35):
Big fan of Substack.
Write about it, talk about thefeatures and benefits, and they
will see that you're doing that.
Don't always look at doingthings as what's in it for me.
Look at it as how can I help mycommunity get better at
whatever it is you're trying tohelp them with.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Yeah, I think that's great advice to only be an
influencer for products that youreally believe in Don't say yes
to everything and the productsthat you naturally use.
It makes a lot of sense thatyou would get behind endorsing
those.
I'm passionate about a lot ofthe softwares and tools that I
(12:13):
use as a marketer and often justorganically recommend it to all
my friends because the tools Ifind that I really like.
It makes sense.
I think that naturally is agood extension in place for
influencers to start right.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yes, and in fact that's a great example because
when you think about it, that'swhere we all, whether we realize
it or not, we're influencers,even if it's in our small circle
, because somebody will say, hey, where'd you get that?
And so a lot of times,influencer marketing Amazon even
specifically, if I give you thelink to buy a microphone or a
(12:49):
bottle of energy drink orwhatever, you're not paying any
more to get it and I'm gettinganywhere from two to four
percent for you buying thatproduct.
So it's really, it's a win.
I don't think people shouldfeel like, oh, it feels slimy,
you're telling people anyway, sowhy not maybe make a teeny bit
of money off of it?
Speaker 1 (13:08):
Yeah, absolutely, and so do you still recommend to?
Speaker 2 (13:19):
people that they should figure out a strategy for
live streaming.
Is that something that you'rean advocate for?
The way we behave has changedagain.
During the pandemic, everybodywas inside, they had more time
to sit in front of their screens, but now it's like people are
back to sometimes it's hybridwork, sometimes it's remote only
(13:41):
, but they're doing other things.
So I think we're into more of a.
I want to watch things ondemand.
So, even if you're going live,don't get frustrated that you
don't have a lot of peoplewatching you at the time you go
live, because you're not goingto find a perfect time.
Remember the replays, right?
You're going to get a lot morereplay viewers and I think going
(14:01):
back to what you said, eric,taking that long form content
and chopping it up into toshorts and reels will bring
people back to oh, I want to seethe full episode.
I want to see more of what wenton during that episode.
I think that's really where thestrength of your live stream
can help you and it buildscommunity.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Yeah, absolutely.
I think live streaming isdifferent across the platforms.
As you mentioned you, doinglive streaming on Amazon is
particularly unique.
I haven't run across a lot ofpeople doing that.
I happen to see a lot of peopledoing live streaming on
everything from TikTok toLinkedIn to Facebook and, you
(14:44):
mentioned, even X has somecapability to do it.
So I'm curious what platformsare people thinking about live
streaming on?
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Are there any that are particularly interesting
these days?
If you're in the B2B space, Iwould say LinkedIn and YouTube
are the two that I wouldprobably go with first.
I am not as big a fan of goinglive on Facebook as maybe
several years ago, because thatgoes back to depending on what
your show is.
I just don't think people arewatching a lot of live streams
(15:18):
on Facebook.
You're seeing a lot of people,especially if they are, say,
niche or even, as an example,the people that are into the
politics things, them.
Live streaming on YouTube is.
They're getting thousands ofpeople joining in and I guess
some of it's because people wantto say whatever they want to
say on whatever side of theaisle they're on.
(15:40):
So I think that's where YouTubelives.
It can be strong.
Linkedin, the fact that you'reable to get in front of a
business audience, I think, isgood as well.
I really haven't gone live onTikTok.
I could.
I haven't Even with Instagram.
When I think of those platformsfor me, it's not to say it's
the same for everyone.
I don't spend a lot of time onthose platforms wanting to
(16:03):
consume live content, so I knowit works for some people.
I'm not saying it's wrong, butI think it goes back to who is
the audience that you're tryingto reach where I think TikTok?
Obviously younger folks.
I know some older folks are onit and Instagram as well and are
you trying to train or are youtrying to entertain?
I think that's another bigdifference and I think TikTok is
(16:27):
more mindless scrollingentertainment Same, to some
point, with Instagram as well.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
I do my fair share of mindless scrolling.
There's nothing wrong with thatat all.
Nothing, that's right.
The one thing you said that Ireally like and I agree with is
live streaming on YouTube.
There's 2 billion people whoare watching YouTube every month
.
It's more than Netflix.
It's a number two website onthe internet.
Google has done a lot of thingsto make sure of that.
(16:54):
So I really agree that YouTubewould be a great place for a lot
of people to start with livestreaming, and I think the
LinkedIn thing is interestingbecause of some of the things
that they do, like they notifyall of your connections when
you're live.
Things like that could drawsome more people in.
But I love your tip about thinkabout it as a marketer
(17:19):
holistically, not just whathappens when you go live, and
maybe you can introduce somedrama of watch what happens when
I go live.
Just let people know they thinksomething crazy could happen,
even if it's not going to.
But aside from watch, whathappens when I go live Just let
people know they think somethingcrazy could happen, even if
it's not going to.
But aside from watch whathappens when it goes live, I
like the idea of what you dowith deal casters is you still
(17:40):
do the recorded version and thenyou have the full long version
recorded and then you can stilldo clips and repurpose content
from that and even do writtencontent from that, like blog
articles from the transcripts ofgoing live.
So there's a lot of ways to usethat content beyond just the
live itself.
I was thinking back to five toseven years ago when webinars
(18:05):
were a lot more of the standardstaple, like pre-COVID for B2B,
and I remembered as a CMO that alot of times we get I don't
know 100 or 200 people on a livewebinar.
But then when I put therecording of the webinar on the
website after I looked at itafter six months it'd be like
thousands of people had watchedthe recorded version.
The power of having somethingrecorded and available evergreen
(18:31):
is pretty powerful and that'sessentially what YouTube is
doing right, like they have allthe stuff there from months or
years ago and if you search onthe right thing, you'll get to a
video that was put out three orsix months ago.
You don't care right, it'severgreen.
It's there and I look at howold stuff is, but people watch
stuff that isn't super recentall the time for training and
(18:51):
for education.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
And the other neat thing, it's your legacy, right?
Who would have thought that,instead of having to run around
with a, we'll call it a webcamof some sort, like now your kids
and your grandkids can say oh,that's what mom or dad looked
like when they were doing thesevideos and they see what you're
like and your personality atdifferent ages, and so it's
another way to.
(19:13):
We've created this memory bankon social media that we didn't
even realize we were doing.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
So any tips, tricks, secrets that you could recommend
for marketers about livestreams?
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I think one don't keep putting it off right.
We're all willing to forgivethose first few streams where
you're trying to get better.
I think the biggest thing ismake sure that you have good
audio, number one.
People will forgive the videoaspect as you get better and try
to get better 1% every time.
(19:47):
Take a look at what did I do?
Am I saying lots of ums and ahsand other things?
That's where maybe you go to aplace like Toastmasters to
become a better speaker.
But don't be afraid of doing it.
And I think even with recordedvideo, it doesn't have to be
perfect.
I think that's the other thingI feel like oh, I got to keep
(20:08):
redoing this and redoing this.
And of course, there are someAI tools.
I'm not saying that you shouldnecessarily use it.
That can correct some of yourmistakes using AI, but sometimes
it's a little bit obvious.
So just I would say, use thatwith caution.
But if you have to start outwith your phone, put it in front
(20:28):
of your face, record it.
If you don't like it, delete it, do it again.
So if you need to at first do afew recorded videos, then get
into the live.
For me, live has always workedbetter, kind of like we are here
with somebody else.
I think it's very difficult todo unless that's just your
personality, a talking head byyourself, a live stream.
I think that's a little bit ofa challenge, especially if
(20:51):
nobody's there to engage with100%, so I love that advice.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
I think that I use Descript to edit all of my
recorded videos.
It's my favorite editing tooland they have this one feature
in it where, with a click of abutton, you can remove all the
transition words like er and I'mgoing to keep trying to be
better at not using those crutchwords as much, but until I get
(21:20):
there, that's awesome and oneclick sometimes you can remove
all of those things and editingvery easily.
So that's one of the examplesof the AI tools that I love on
the recorded piece.
But you can always justpractice to become more fluent
for the live versions and, likeyou said, practice makes perfect
.
Do some run-throughs and have aco-host.
(21:41):
Those are great ideas to, Ithink, make the lives better.
Any final thoughts oninfluencers and live streaming
that I didn't ask that you wantto share?
Speaker 2 (21:52):
It's never too late to start.
I started in my 50s.
There's people starting intheir 60s and 70s.
But I would also say don't quityour day job when you go into
this stuff.
I would say, make sure thatyou've got a backup plan because
it may not work out.
Because as much as everyonesays that, oh, everyone can be a
creator, let's be honest,that's not really true.
(22:12):
It takes work, it takespractice, and I'm not saying you
can't do it, but sometimesyou're going to have to work to
get to that point where itstarts to be a success.
And don't go spend $10,000 ongear and then say I spent all
this money and I'm not makingany money.
Start simple, start small andbuild your way up, just like you
would with your business.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
I think that's great advice.
I would add to that that ittakes time right.
So it'll take time to build itup, probably longer than we all
would like or think up front,and so that's a great reason to
be thoughtful about planning itout and just understand it'll
take longer than we will like toscale some of these things and
get to some of the those greatsuccess outcomes that you shared
(22:56):
here.
But I really appreciate yourinsights because I think that
live streaming is a great toolfor influencers and I think it's
important for people tounderstand some of the amazing
tricks and nuances that we'vetalked about here today.
So I'm going to link to yourwebsite and your show so people
(23:17):
can go check it out and get intouch with you if they'd like to
talk about this more and learnmore.
We really appreciate you beingwith us today.
Thanks so much.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Thank you, eric.
It's great to be here.
Take care everyone.
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