July 21, 2025 • 46 mins
Is stress making you sick? In today’s episode of the Reset Podcast, Ash is joined by returning guest Madison Dohnt a qualified naturopath, scientist and educator to break down how stress affects your physical and mental health, and what you can do to heal.
This conversation is a must listen for high-achieving women, especially if you’ve been feeling overwhelmed, exhausted or burnt out but aren’t sure where to start.
We explore:💭 How stress silently builds up in the body (even if your mind feels “fine”)🧠 The difference between healthy and unhealthy stress📉 How chronic stress can increase your risk of disease🧪 Tools like hormone testing and tracking that Madison uses with clients🍲 Food, lifestyle and mindset shifts that reduce stress naturally🚨 Early warning signs of stress most people miss💡 The #1 thing to do today if you’re feeling overwhelmed
Whether you’re feeling constantly tired, juggling too much or just want to understand the science of stress, this episode will help you feel more in control and supported.
Watch Reset Podcast interview on Burnout with Psychologist Maddison: https://youtu.be/jWSwcPOt4zw?si=xno2fWPTZV3P8slM
Watch Madison's previous interview on Reset: https://youtu.be/LOqLJq8Vkpc?si=uDM0dUJ-2dZrKMid
Connect with Madison Dohnt:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/madisondohnt Website: https://www.modernbalance.co
Connect with Ash Cam on Instagram:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ashcam____/
Follow the Reset Podcast on Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/reset___podcast/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:05):
Hello and welcome back to Reset.Today we are diving deep into
the world of stress, which I know all of us experience at
various levels across life. To explore this topic, I have a
guest with me, Madison. Don't you might remember her
from a previous episode where wewere learning all about female
hormones. Madison, welcome back.
(00:26):
To reset, Thank you so much for having me again.
It's exciting to be back. Yeah, I love having you in
because just to remind everyone,Madison's got a background in
both science and neuropathy, andI think that blend is just so
special and what the world needsright now.
So thank you for agreeing to come back.
No, that's OK. I feel I'm just so excited to
break more of the stigma behind natural medicine, linking it
(00:49):
back with science, because when I made that realization, I was
like, oh, it is actually backed by evidence.
So. Yeah, and it doesn't have to be
an either or. Like it's the combined effort
that really makes a difference. So we're talking stress.
Tell me, from your professional opinion, what does stress
actually do to our bodies? The easiest way to kind of
(01:12):
describe this is by thinking about the fight or flight
response. Because when we think stress, or
at least when I do, it's very easy to kind of compartmentalize
it into it's all in your head and it's all mental, But there
is also physical stress and mental and physical stress are
linked. So when you experience mental
stress, you're going to have a, a physical reaction in the body.
(01:33):
So to make it really simple to, to link, I think about that
fight or flight response going all the way back to, you know,
Cavemen days when we were getting chased by a lion.
And what happens to the body when we have that stressor And
when we're like, OK, we need to either fight, flight or freeze.
Our body sends cortisol to all of our different body systems to
(01:57):
be able to prepare for that response.
And so now we might get a bill in the mail and we still, we
haven't evolved past that. It's a survival response.
So we still have all of those physical changes in the body.
If that bill, it's a little bit of perception, if that actually
triggers the fight or flight in US.
So things like speeding up your,your breathing, your muscles
(02:19):
tense to get ready to fight willrun away.
You've got things like your digestive system kind of shuts
down when I say that system shutdown.
It's just that your body is prioritizing blood flow to
things like your heart because you're going to have to run all
your muscles or all these other body systems.
So it's a big like prioritization system.
(02:39):
And so they, the blood flow goesaway from like the digestive
system. So the opposite of fight or
flight is rest and digest. So if we think back to all of
that and also you don't need to be ovulating if you are in a
really stressful environment because the risk that that
pregnancy is going to go to fulltime and be safe is not very
high anyway. So when we're stressed, our body
(03:02):
directs that blood flow away from ovulation and the hormones
towards all of the survival systems.
Yeah. And I think it's so easy for us
to think that stress just lives in a moment like the getting a
bill example if you're financially stressed, but it has
lasting impacts on our body. I know you were saying there's
(03:24):
some really interesting researchcoming out around stress and the
impact on illness and disease and things like that.
Can you educate us all? Yeah, researching this, I went
down such a rabbit hole. It's just so, so interesting
because we can all speak from experience, We've all been
stressed before, but to actuallysee how prevalent it is is quite
(03:44):
scary. There was a stat from the
American Psychological Association that 77% of people
experience physical symptoms dueto stress.
So that's just wild. And I would argue that's
probably even higher. It's it is a bit harder to do
studies that assign causation because there are so many
different factors in our diet and lifestyle that contribute to
(04:07):
different symptoms. So it's really hard to kind of
put someone in a vacuum and follow them over time and be
like, you need to eat the exact same diet as a hundred other
people. You're not allowed to change
anything else. You need to do the exact same
exercise. And it's just the stress that
we're going to change. So it's really hard to do
lifestyle studies, but I think we've all been in that place
(04:28):
where we've experienced maybe burnout or maybe people don't
even know that they are experiencing burnout.
And so it really can impact us in a lot of different ways, even
causing little things that we don't necessarily associate to
stress, but they're still like nagging symptoms every single
day. Yeah, and you mentioned some
examples before, like our breath, our pace of our breath
(04:49):
might change our heart, but whatelse?
I know like sometimes I would feel stress in my gut or like
what are some other things that people might be experiencing if
they're stressed? Yeah, absolutely.
So that again, that links back to that fight or flight response
in the gut, right? It's like it's taking away that
attention from the rest and digest and the calming of
everything moving nicely throughthe digestive system.
(05:11):
And it's really disrupting that.Other things can be like
headaches. Fatigue is a huge one, and that
one makes a little bit more sense.
But mood changes as well. We've got blood sugar crashes,
so many different things, and then they those little things,
when they persist over time, they lead to bigger conditions
and symptoms and hormonal imbalances as well.
(05:33):
Yeah. So is the flip side true then as
well? If we if stress can cause all
these issues in our body, can reducing stress reduce issues
and illness and help us live easier lives?
I'm sure the answer is yes, but tell me about it.
Yeah, absolutely. And there's a lot more research
coming out about the the power of mindfulness and the power of
(05:56):
doing breath work and yoga and all of those beautiful
activities. Breath work is a really, and it
doesn't even have to be in like the sense that you go to a
breath work class, but even justsitting there and doing the box
breath where you breathe in for four, hold for four, breathe out
for four, hold for four. That is one of the most simplest
(06:16):
things that anybody can do. And that manually overrides the
fight or flight system. Because if you think about it,
the fight or flight survival system speeds up your breath.
And if you kind of reach in and be like, hold on, I'm going to
manually turn this off or turn this dial to where I want it to
be, then over time your body starts getting the idea that
(06:40):
it's like, OK, no, actually we are safe.
We're breathing slow, therefore it's all going to be OK.
Yeah. Is one more influential than the
other? Like our mind or our body or
it's just we kind of feed off the 2.
That's a good question. I definitely think it's we feed
off either 1. Hormonally.
(07:01):
For example, progesterone is a really beautiful hormone that
works on the receptors in the brain for calming and reducing
anxiety and we need to ovulate in order to make progesterone.
So if women have irregular cycles, PCOS, they're not
ovulating, then they are not going to be making their own
progesterone. And therefore they're going to
(07:22):
have maybe higher levels of anxiety, which is then going to
lead to more stress. And then more stress is going to
impact ovulation, which is then going to mean they're not
producing progesterone. And it's kind of like a big
vicious cycle. So there's definitely that side
of things. But also, I ever since I got an
aura ring, which has been for a while now, it changed my
perception on physical stress because when we think physical
(07:44):
stress, I think we think like exercise.
And so my stress levels would beup after I was, you know, having
a little dance while I was getting ready in the morning or
getting ready to like go out fordinner or something like that.
And my stress levels would be high.
And I'm like, it's a Friday afternoon, I'm going out for
dinner. I am not stressed like I am
switched off. I'm happy.
I'm having a great time dancing.Why are my stress levels high?
(08:08):
This aura ring is broken. And yeah, I just really started
to learn that obviously dancing it's like physical activity.
I mean, I wasn't even getting that into it.
I'm like in front of the mirror.I'm actually like you just
busted all these rooms to trigger.
That Well, yeah, apparently it'sspiked the stress more than I
thought it did. And, and it's learning that we
(08:31):
need to take that rest both mentally and physically.
And yeah, you can't have one without the other.
It needs to be, I mean, you can do it at different times, but
you know, you can be in a bubblebath and be going through your
To Do List and mentally just like being stressed.
Or you can be really, really happy, but like physically
dancing and moving your body. And then that's also putting
(08:52):
good stress on your body, but stress nonetheless.
And I think people just need to balance that out with rest,
which is what we're not doing enough of.
So I guess the word stress sounds bad.
I think we've got this connotation of it, but there's
probably healthy levels of stress in our life that fuels us
to move forward and make progress and do things like, can
(09:14):
you kind of explain good stress versus not so good stress?
Yeah, absolutely. And when I think stress, the
easiest way to make it tangible is like the stress hormone is
cortisol, and cortisol is still a really, really important
hormone. When we talk about stress, we
kind of make it out to be the bad guy.
And I guess chronically high cortisol levels do cause
problems, but cortisol is also the hormone that gets you up and
(09:37):
out of bed in the morning and you need it and so on.
A cortisol test, we don't just want to see this like baseline
flat, like we want to see that your cortisol levels are rising
to get you up and then, you know, slowly drifting off
towards the day and stress, you know is we can all feel it when
we don't care about something, then we're not going to be
motivated. We're not going to push forward
(09:59):
and reach deadlines or hit goalssooner rather than later.
If there's nothing on the line, then we're just kind of like meh
and no one wants to live a meh life.
So it is still really important to have a little bit of it's
like that good pressure, but there is also you can put bad
pressure on yourself when something, I guess the
perception of of something is going to be worse or more
(10:23):
important than really it actually is.
It's like if something is causing you stress, especially
if it's like this goes for things on your To Do List as
well. It's like, OK, but if you didn't
do that today, is the world going to end?
Like, is something really, really bad going to happen?
Or cannot wait for tomorrow, cannot wait for next week.
You'll get it done eventually. But I think it's really easy to
(10:44):
feel like everything needs to get done right now.
And I catch myself in that all the time.
Because stress isn't something that you just like, fix and then
it goes away for the rest of your life.
It's like a conscious effort to to keep on top of it.
Yeah. And I think that's a good
reminder to all of us. There's so many high achievers
that once you do with that burnout point, you think right
now my new goal is to live a completely stress free life,
(11:08):
which A is not achievable and B,like you said, is a bit meh.
Like it's you're going to get bored if like no one wants that.
I guess sometimes we can be veryaware that we're stressed, but
other times it can kind of creepon up on us silently.
If we live in this like chronic kind of stressed state, what are
(11:32):
some of the signs and symptoms our body might be showing us if
we silently stressed, I guess? Yeah, the fatigue 1 is the
obvious one, right. But also just general mood
changes, headaches, insomnia. It's like that tired but wired.
So it's like you're exhausted because you're doing so much.
You're so busy, you've got so much on your mind, but you still
(11:54):
can't get to sleep. Yeah.
Like what is going on? Or you're waking around like two
or three in the morning and, andit's just your subconscious
can't just chill. So there's all of those type of
symptoms. For me, a really big one is, and
this may come over the years of like personal development that
I've done, but it's if I kind oflose passion for like my work
(12:17):
and my business. And it's like, you know, I, I
started my business because I amso passionate about what I do
and I'm so excited to just keep building it.
But if I just kind of start resenting it, then I'm like,
hold on, like I think this, I just need to like take a break
for a little bit. Yeah.
Yeah, that's probably my biggestsign that comes even before all
(12:38):
of those physical symptoms. But I think it's really common
for people to be like just have to push through.
And I mean, this can go down another wormhole, but that's
that whole like masculine first feminine way of doing business.
It's that like the feminine is alittle bit more intuitive and
it's like leaning into the flow and and what feels good.
And you still need to have like the structure and discipline and
like get stuff done. But I think masculine is a
(13:01):
little bit more like push through, do, do, do, which can
just be really hard with like the different hormones.
And I mean, I think men should also lean into their intuition
too, but. For sure, yeah.
Yeah. Speaking of the differences with
men and women, do you find the rates of stress and burnout in
men and women are different? Yeah, so the research actually
(13:23):
does show that women experience or they rate themselves stressed
more frequently and they rate themselves higher.
There is also biological differences.
The research actually suggested that women release more oxytocin
when they're stressed, which is like the love hormone, the.
Interesting, do we love being stressed?
What is this toxic like cycle? Where is.
(13:45):
It's a feedback loop to kind of reduce the stress.
Yeah, yeah. But then are we chasing it?
I didn't even go down that stress.
Is addictive sometimes. I mean, it is, isn't?
It Yeah. Interesting.
Yeah, that's a whole rabbit holein itself.
I think the body's just trying to protect itself.
But like anything that like not anything but some things that
(14:06):
are bad for us, they're a littlebit addictive, right?
So there definitely could be that aspect of it and the body's
trying to be protective. But that also could be why
women, I think when they're stressed it, they kind of react
a little bit more internally or kind of like don't maybe voice
it as much or react. Whereas with men, they've got
(14:27):
those high levels of testosterone.
They're also releasing adrenaline, as are we.
But the research suggests that they're more likely to kind of
act out when they're stressed. And I was like, OK, I just found
that super interesting. But also, women are more
sensitive to cortisol. So if they are experiencing the
same level of stress, they're a little bit more sensitive to it
(14:49):
as men. And yeah.
It's interesting, like that whole addictive side of it.
And I know personally, being pregnant right now, I've really
tried to intentionally slow down.
And that's not my normal, That'snot my normal pace.
And I've been having conversations with a few friends
lately of like, you know what? I kind of miss a little bit of
(15:11):
that, like on reflection, toxic burnout working style that I've
had in the past. And I'm like, why?
Why am I missing that? But it like it feeds a certain
side of me and maybe there's so many layers to that.
Well, drive and passion. How do we get drive and passion
without the stress? And I think maybe in pregnancy
(15:34):
when we're trying to to slow down and calm, and that's a
really important part of trying to conceive as well.
Totally. Like I've seen just so many
women where they've gotten on top of their stress or even
something outside of their control has gone away.
And then that's when they fall pregnant after years of trying.
And it's just like I knew it, like I just, and again, hard to
assign causation, but it's just the coincidence keeps happening
(15:58):
over and over again. And that's what we work on too.
But yeah, I think leaning towards, it's not about like not
doing anything or kind of stopping everything.
It's about leaning towards the things that light you up and are
a little bit easier to kind of have that drive and passion as
opposed to just pushing through on the things that you don't
want to do. And that's probably really
important as well after birth toprevent you from losing your
(16:20):
identity too, if you're leaning in to doing more of the things
that light you up. Yeah.
Let's talk more a little bit about the kind of examples of
that you've seen in clients and your friendship circles around
stress impacting say fertility or health outcomes and things
like that. Do you have some kind of
examples of where you've seen stress either make something so
(16:43):
much harder or make or reducing it has made it so much easier?
There's, it's hard to like nail it down into one example, but I
know for myself, stress was definitely my major root cause
for my PCOS and for my acne as well.
And when I was diagnosed with PCOS, So one of the diagnostic
criteria is high androgens. And so androgens are the
(17:04):
collective term for male hormones, but women have them as
well and need them. It's important.
And it wasn't when I got diagnosed, it wasn't actually my
testosterone that was high. It was my DHEA's that were high.
And so that is an androgen that's produced in the adrenal
glands. So that was kind of like that
light bulb moment for me where Iwas like, OK, like my androgens
(17:24):
are high. I've got PCOS, it's driving my
acne, but it's not testosterone.It's mostly from the adrenals.
And that aligned with what I wasfeeling or kind of what I was
learning about myself because I'm an A type personality.
So I'm like perfectionist. I'm like, let's go and achieve
all of these goals and do all ofthese things.
(17:45):
And I want them all done now. And I still do that, but I have
to like catch myself. And so when I really started to
take that seriously, that's whenI saw like the improvements in
my health and then maintaining that.
And I still catch myself out. So like my period might be a
couple of days early or later. And that will always be like,
when I think back, I'm like, oh,I've actually had a really
(18:07):
stressful month. So that's really important part
of it. But healing and doing that
stress management in order to heal something, it isn't just
about going to do yoga or doing the bubble baths or you know,
going for walks, although they're all really important
things. It's really important to also
address the subconscious stresses.
(18:28):
Go to a psychologist. I even tried like hypnosis,
which I really didn't know what to expect.
I'd never done it before. Like the concept you, you think
about it from movies and you're just like, I'm about to get
hypnotized. Like what am I?
What am I going to do? But you're in total control the
whole time. For those who have never done it
before, it's just more about it tapping into your subconscious
and the things that are driving that worry and driving that
(18:50):
stress because this can be a little bit triggering, but
stress really is perception. Like it's the brain that
triggers the stress response. And so someone can get a bill in
the mail and they don't go into that fight or flight.
Somebody else can get a bit billin the mail and then they do go
into that fight or flight. So if we can try and learn
(19:10):
things like detachment, learn things like not having to tie
our worth to our achievements and just all of those personal
development things. I I really do believe that the
more personal development you do, the more you're going to
have control over your stress. Yeah, I had another medicine on
the podcast a little while ago, psychologist medicine, and we
(19:32):
talked about burnout from a purepsychology perspective, but she
had a really good framework there.
It's just the circle of control and sort of putting everything
that is in the middle circle of like things that are within your
control. And then on the outside of that,
it's things that are within yourinfluence and then things that
are just completely outside of your control.
And it's so interesting when yousit down and start to map it out
(19:53):
in a framework like that. So few things actually sit in
the middle and then anything that's out of it.
And I know my partner and I sortof use this in conversations
now. It's like, well, what is within
your control? Yeah, OK.
It's these things. And then so many other factors
that we spend so much time, likebeing consumed by or worrying
about and considering like we literally can't do anything
(20:15):
about. And so it's really liberating
when you're like, well, it's notin that middle circle.
Let it go, let it go. And it's a muscle and you've got
to like, like, flex it and strengthen it and stuff.
But it can be really empowering.Yeah, and you're human, like
you're going to get caught up inthat.
And then it's just about coming back to it.
Like we're sometimes or a lot ofthe time stress comes up quietly
(20:38):
and secretly and it maybe even slowly over time.
And you don't actually notice ituntil one day you're just like,
gosh, I am just so overwhelmed right now.
And that's when you have to remember your tools and, and
remembering how much those toolshelped you last time.
Because sometimes it's when you're so bogged down in that
stress, it's not always as easy as like, ohh, I'll just fix it.
(20:59):
Like, some people are so caught up in it and it can really feel
overwhelming to actually start addressing it.
But yeah, it's just about just starting somewhere and
remembering how much those toolshelped you before.
Totally and yeah, there's there's different phases of your
life or different seasons that you'll be in that something that
wouldn't have stressed previous you stresses current you.
(21:19):
Like I know when I've been incredibly stressed in the past,
my partner Alex will say like, oh, what do you think we should
have for dinner? And like, I'd just been through
a season of work where I was making thousands of decisions
and I just broke down in tears. And I was like, I don't know.
And I need you to decide. Like, I cannot make another
decision. And if you ask me now, like,
what do you want for dinner? That that's not a stressful
(21:41):
question at all. But it was a huge red flag at
the time of like, oh, we've pushed way past the limits of
what is acceptable here. Yeah.
And that, I mean, maybe it may stress you out if you had that
same decision fatigue now. Yeah.
Yeah. It's, it's very interesting how
sometimes it's like that straw that broke the camel's back.
Yeah. And that can mean that we snap
(22:02):
at our friends or our family or our partners because our
partners are the ones that are that they're most of the time.
But again, it's coming back to that self-awareness and
immediately knowing, hold on, I snapped because of this, not
actually because of the thing that I snapped about.
Yes. And then it's like going back
and, you know, apologizing and being self aware and thinking
forward about how can I regulatethis in the future?
(22:25):
Or it's, I don't think people are preventative enough.
It's like we wait until we reactto think, oh, hold on, I'm
stressed. I need to actually do something
about this instead of like seeing it sneak up on us.
And after practice, if it gets, it becomes a bit easier to see
it sneaking up. But yeah, it's still very easy
to do. So easy to do.
(22:45):
Talk to me about measuring stress levels.
So I guess we can sort of do this self-awareness, but what
are some tools that you would recommend to a client to
actually measure the level of stress that's happening in our
body? Yeah, so there's definitely like
psychological scales where you can even just ask yourself, how
stressed am I out of 10? How often do we really ask
ourselves that on a regular basis?
(23:06):
If it's in your. Point for a second, everyone
should ask themselves that question right now.
Like right now 10. Like how stressed am I right
now? I'm going to ask you how
stressed are you out of 10 rightnow?
I'm pretty chill to be honest. I'm pretty pretty.
Cute. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Like I said, I'm in this season of like growth and surrender.
Like grow a baby, grow a podcast, but surrender to like,
(23:27):
what will be will be with all ofit.
And yeah, I'm in a nice chill season, but like I said, I kind
of miss a little bit of this, like toxic burnout productivity,
which I know will come again in the future.
But right now this is my season season.
Was it hard to get there? Yeah, it's uncomfortable to be
like this for me. Yeah.
(23:48):
Did you have to do lots of like mindset work or personal
development to to keep bringing yourself back into that and
sitting with it? Yeah, and I think even moving to
the Gold Coast, like it was a two year fertility journey, like
if I am really honest with myself about it, like the act of
trying to conceive happened veryfast, but only because it was 2
(24:09):
years of creating an environmentand a lifestyle that just
allowed me to really like slow down, tap into that feminine
side of myself. And yeah, it, it's, it's
interesting. Like I said, it's it's right for
right now, but I am excited about future me being able to
(24:30):
lean into a little bit more of ahustle again.
Yeah, absolutely. Go, go, go.
I miss a bit of her. Yeah, yeah.
She'll come back. She'll come back, but right now,
like, like I said, I've got the responsibility of growing a baby
girl and regulating her nervous system during that process.
And the more I think about it, it's like, OK, well, she's also
(24:52):
developing her eggs for the future.
And if she chooses to have a child, like the way I grow and
nurture her now is influencing future generations as well.
So I'm like, it's OK, Just pause.
Absolutely. And it happened so fast.
So it's like try and soak it up and be present.
And I just love what you said about the fact that it's, even
though the actual trying to conceive happened so fast, it
(25:14):
was all the work that you'd doneprior.
And a lot of people don't know that like that's the work to be
done. And so they get to OK, I'm ready
to start trying now and that's when they start their journey.
And yeah, it can be really disappointing for a lot of
people because even just like the pill, which I know we spoke
about a lot last episode, but it's like people go off the pill
(25:35):
and they're like expecting to fall pregnant within the next
couple of months. And it's, it's a lot more prep
work. But like you said, even just
like the stress piece, if you'restressed, it's so, so much
harder to fall pregnant. So and you know, you want to
have a healthy pregnancy as well.
So it's not just OK, now I've fallen pregnant, I can go back
to the stress. It's also how can I maintain
(25:55):
this beautiful environment that's low cortisol, really
nurturing. Yeah.
And yeah, stress plays a huge part in that.
Yeah, for sure. And and takes time.
Like if you have lived at this like high stress, busy version
of yourself for years, it doesn't happen instantly.
You can't just oh, I went on a holiday and now like my whole
brain and body has changed. Like, yeah, it does take time,
(26:17):
yeah. Yeah, and there's lots of silent
stresses as well, like going back to the difference between
men and women. It's I think women carry a lot
more of a silent load, a lot more of, you know, even just
thinking about the tribe and thecommunity and thinking about
their To Do List and all of the things that they've got to do.
And when it comes to pregnancy, you can look like you're doing
(26:38):
fine from the outside, but there's just so much that is on
you. So yeah, I think that's also why
the stress levels and burnout ishiring women.
Yeah, definitely. And I'm sure a lot of people are
listening and they're like, Yep,that's me, I'm stressed, I'm
burnt out. I don't want to be as stressed
or burnout as I am. What are some proactive things
(26:58):
you would recommend that the person listening can do to start
to intentionally lower their stress levels?
Yeah. So I think all of this just pick
what sounds best to you. The the thing that's going to be
the most effective is the thing that feels good to your nervous
system and feels good to you. So, you know, if you don't want
(27:19):
to go to a yoga class, if you couldn't think of anything
worse, then don't. Yeah, don't force yourself to go
to a yoga class hoping that it'll make you less stressed.
Yeah, probably going to make youless stressed, yeah.
Yeah, I, I love yoga, but like Ican't, I just, I still can't do
yin even though I will happily sit there and meditate and not
move. But I think it's the stretches
and then I'm just like, I'm sickof being in this position.
(27:40):
I just want to move. But you know, I sit there and I
do think about my To Do List. So anything that kind of works
for you in getting you out of that fight or fly.
And you can really feel it when you're calm, when you're, when
your breathing is not increased,when your muscles are not tense.
Like if you're sitting there on the couch like all tensed up,
then you're probably not like you're probably in that fight or
(28:01):
flight mode or running through your To Do List.
So things that can break you outof that fight or flight because
sometimes it's hard. It has control over us
essentially or feels like it does.
And it's so hard to just break it initially, just even standing
up away from your computer or whatever it is and going outside
and just like taking a big breath of fresh air, that could
(28:22):
probably take, depending on how far your desk is away from
outside, like maybe 5 seconds ifyou're just like going out to
the balcony or something. It's just that patent interrupt.
It's just that interrupter that then gives you the opportunity
to just rethink, reset, and thencome back in.
Maybe you could go for a walk. You could do things like yoga
(28:42):
something if you don't have timeto actually like go and do
something. Even going on to Spotify and
going into what is it called thepeaceful meditation playlist.
It's like one of my most played things like, you know, when it
like has the Spotify wrapped andthen it's like you listen to no
music. I mean music, but like
meditation. I listen to that all the time
(29:05):
when I'm stressed, like in the car, it'll just be like this
peaceful little music. And when I'm going for a walk or
yes, you could do that. Even if you're like working and
you can't stop working, just something like putting that in
the background can just help soften the environment.
Lighting a candle or just littlethings in your environment to
(29:26):
help soften it instead and make it less masculine and hustle and
push and more like I'm choosing to do this.
But yeah, anything where you're kind of like just stepping out
of that, that thought pattern offeeling stuck in the fight or
flight and helping to reset. Yeah.
I wonder if it's helpful for people to kind of write
themselves like 3 things that they know can just instantly
(29:48):
snap them out of that whatever cycle they're in.
Because I know when you are super stressed, your brain can
just go blank. Yeah, even like keeping it in
notes on your phone or something.
Like here's three things that can just instantly like disrupt
that pattern. Even sticky note on the desk.
Yeah, just right in front of you, if you.
So it doesn't get lost in the notes.
Yeah, I think that's a great idea writing that list because
(30:10):
often it's when you're stressed,you kind of we actually out lose
a lot of our peripheral vision when we're stressed and we kind
of hone in and focus. And so you you do like the world
find kind of falls around you and you fall into this like
vertex of focus and just something to try and like help
pull you out of that because it's really hard sometimes to
(30:30):
pull yourself out of that. So if you have those three
things that you can fall on, you're not feeling creative in
that time of stress to think of them then and there.
So be proactive, have them aheadof time so that you can fall
back on them. I think that's a great idea.
Yeah, something I think all of us are pretty guilty of doing is
having our phones. And like, you know, when you
first wake up in the morning, you grab your phone.
(30:53):
And then I know previously we'd grab my phone, I would instantly
check work emails. And this is at a time where I
would be working across multipletime zones.
So of course, like notificationsare wild and I would use the
anxiety from that to like, boom,I'm so wide awake now, let's get
out, let's start the day. Do not advise that at all.
(31:17):
But that was just like this pattern that I was in.
And about a year ago, I think maybe a bit longer now, I
started sleeping with my phone on aeroplane mode.
I would still still guilty of using it as my alarm clock, but
it stays on aeroplane mode for at least the 1st 30 minutes of
my day and just allows me to getup and enjoy a morning that is a
(31:40):
little bit slower. It's still like I can still get
up, I can still get ready, I canstill like on the dream days.
I also go for a walk and things like that before taking it off
aeroplane mode and it is just such an empowering thing to do.
It takes a while before that petcan feel normal and OK and
comfortable, but it has been a game changer.
(32:02):
It has been an absolute game changer.
And I think speaking to anyone who thinks like, no, I need to
check my messages first thing inthe morning when I wake up, then
set your alarm 10 minutes earlier.
Yeah, Like, no one is that in demand unless you are a medical
doctor on call. And literally it's life or
death. Like, your phone is on call on
(32:24):
those days. OK, fine.
Most of us can gift ourselves a little bit of time in the
morning to just wake up without using those notifications and
things as like a crazy trigger for us to start our day.
Yeah, I love that. It's such a good way to wake up,
wake up slowly, wake up with like by yourself.
And just that's when you can even just like go grab yourself
(32:45):
like something to eat or something to drink or like a tea
and then just go sit on the lounge and just just chill for
10 minutes. Yeah, just be or go for a walk.
That's even better. I also want to like put the
disclaimer that you don't have to be perfect in order to be on
top of your stress. Like I have definitely done that
before and I am so guilty of notdoing it right now.
Like I do look at my phone firstthing in the morning and I know
(33:08):
that's like #1 tip on how to, what not to do.
But I, I do, I use the, the light to wake me up because
that's what it is LED. It just like it wakes you up.
But I think it's really helpful to not have like work emails on
your phone if you can help it. And my preference is waking up
with like natural light. So that is always my preference.
(33:29):
Even on weekends when I don't set alarms, it will be the light
that wakes me up, not my phone. But if you have like automatic
blinds, that might be like a bitof a bougie recommendation, but
I don't but I would love to. And then I would just like have
it set and that would be my alarm as they would just like
slowly start rising and I would awake with the sun.
You can't get those like lamps that gradually come on.
(33:53):
I had one, I had one of those. Yeah.
It was called Lumi, and it was when I was living in London
because the mornings are so dark.
Yeah. And so you set it to whatever
time you want to wake up and it slowly lights up the room.
Like I think it starts 10 minutes before your alarm.
Yeah, it was. It was great.
When I moved back to Australia, I gave it, I gifted it to a
friend who was still living there.
(34:13):
But yeah, it was effective. If you live somewhere and you're
listening to this and you're like, I can't wake up with the
because of my work schedule or anything like that.
Like these little lights to create that are really cool.
Yeah, that's awesome. And I think as well, like having
your, your, if you have a partner, having them on this
same journey of like self development and like personal
(34:36):
awareness and can be really, really beneficial because if
you're trying to implement things like that or an early
morning walk and they don't wantbright lights in the bedroom of
a morning, it could be such a barrier to healing in general,
not just about stress. So I think trying to like be on
that same page and maybe not at the same level or, you know, as
far along, you might have done work for years prior, but it's
(34:57):
about just like, are we on the same page in terms of wanting to
manage our stress and what are we going to do?
How can we support each other? And like, I recently just bought
an air purifier, not stress related, but like I checked in
with my partner and I was like, are you OK for me to like have
this going during the night? Because the last thing you want
to do is like, want to do something for your health and
(35:18):
then, you know, it annoy your partner or something like that.
And then they're like, Nope, notin the bedroom.
So yeah, I think just being on the same page can also make this
a lot easier. But like in summary, if you're,
let's say you're like 100% stressed, even if you can just
do one thing that lowers that by5%, it's going to make the next
step easier and the next step easier.
(35:39):
So don't think that like you have to sit down and write this
big, I'm not going to be stressed from tomorrow on with
plan. Like just do one thing, even if
that's a walk, a 10 minute walk.If that's all you can manage
today, just do that. Or if all you can manage is lie
on your bed, like listening to meditation music because you
just don't want to move, you don't want to think Amazing.
(36:01):
Yeah, just do something. Well, saying no to something you
don't want to do, yes. I think as women especially, we
grow up thinking we have to say yes to everything.
And just because we can doesn't mean we should.
Yeah. And it's, it's such a empowering
word to suddenly be able to say.And it doesn't mean that you
(36:21):
don't like your friends if you're saying no to doing
something with them or you are going to miss out on things at
work. Like I think just being really
intentional about what you say yes to, but then also what you
say no to can be really. Absolutely.
You've got to protect your energy and starting with the
little things means that when itit comes to setting a bigger
boundary later, you're going to have a little bit more practice
(36:44):
under your sleeve. Like setting boundaries isn't
easy, but you can get better at it.
And there is always going to be like, you know, you're OK with
setting these little boundaries.Like, you know, Oh no, I'm not
going to like come for drinks tonight, whatever.
But that means that you're then going to be a little bit more
equipped in practice to set those bigger boundaries that do
(37:05):
really, really matter to you that are actually like, we'll
hold on. No, I don't feel comfortable
with this or I have 0 interest in doing that.
Yeah. All of that contributes to our
the things that we think about ourselves subconsciously, the
things that we worry about subconsciously, the things that
we are anxious about because yeah, if we're anxious about or
we don't really want to do this thing, but we've kind of said
(37:26):
yes to make somebody else happy.That's all anxiety that is just
riding your your stress and yourworry subconsciously.
Yeah, for sure. And I think being aware of what
we consume as well, like social media, the news, the media, like
even who we spend our time with has such a big influence on us.
And I know that when there's been certain, like I remember
(37:47):
back to the pandemic and then different wars that are
happening in things like my partner Alex will really dive
deep in wanting all the updates.And on reflection now he's like,
OK, yeah, you were right. That was really impacting my
mood and my mindset and how I showed up in the world.
But it becomes this addiction. And I think it's important for
(38:07):
us to be aware of, OK, just because this information is
there doesn't mean I need it instantly.
And if it's triggering me, then carve out time in the day.
When is a good time? Like if, if you do want these
updates about global events thatare going to make you feel
really stressed, really anxious,choose when you consume them.
(38:28):
And maybe first thing in the morning is not the best time.
Last thing at night might not bethe best time.
It might be like, OK, give myself an hour to to go deep
into this topic in the middle ofthe day and then sandwich it
with with calmness around. Because if it's constantly
checking these notifications that are causing you like stress
and anxiety like that ripples throughout your entire world.
(38:50):
100% And I think a lot of peoplemay have noticed that during
Covic because it was such a heightened experience, perhaps
they don't realize the same things happening now, just like
on a lower scale. And yeah, the way that I kind of
got over that is, or managed that is, I don't watch the news
(39:10):
on TVI follow a select few or like, yeah, maybe even one
Instagram page that delivers thenews that I need.
They often deliver it in carousel form.
So it's not like video just likein your face and it's like boom,
boom, boom. It's like, you know, you can see
as much of the story as you want.
There's some text, you get it, but you don't need all of the
(39:31):
like, emotional life. Yeah, yeah.
I think it's the daily Oz from memory, if people are interested
in that. But yeah, that's the one I like.
Yeah, Are there many? Are there any common myths that
you hear about stress that you'dlove to bust during this
episode? I think people just thinking
that it's all in their head or that it's they feel like it's a
(39:56):
conscious thing, like they're either consciously stressed or
they're not consciously stressed.
And I think that people don't realize how subconscious.
Stress can be, and depending on how you are raised and depending
on the tendencies that you have to, for example, be a people
pleaser, that will determine like your baseline level stress
essentially because it's like, are you worrying about what
(40:19):
everybody else thinks? Are you worrying about pleasing
everybody all the time? And if you are, then that's
probably like a little bit higher than where you should be
like in terms of your stress level just constantly.
And then when you are more stressed about work and and the
conscious things, then it's going to peak it a little bit
even higher. Yeah, because you've then got
more on your plate to think and worry about.
So I think there's that is that people feeling like, oh, I'm not
(40:42):
stressed. It's like people are creating
their own myths around like, yeah, no, I'm OK, I'm all right.
But it's like checking with yourbody and going on about like
measuring stress. If you want to be objective
about it, there are tests that you can actually do to see where
your cortisol levels are at. So it's not just about like your
opinion and being subjective about like where I am on the
(41:02):
scale from 1:00 to 10:00. But yes, you can measure
cortisol on either a blood test or there is like a urine test
which is more accurate. It also measures the cortisol
throughout the day and the clearance of cortisol so how
your adrenals are are working asopposed to just like a blood
test that shows one snapshot of your cortisol levels in time in
your blood. So there's that.
(41:24):
Or you can look into things likea wearable group or an aura ring
that will show you things like your heart rate, your breathing
rate in real time. It also can calculate and give
you like a stress scale. But you don't even need anything
fancy like that. Even if you just have like even
Fitbits do, we can get Fitbits that do it for like under $100
(41:44):
or something that just show you your heart rate throughout the
day. And if your heart rate is
sitting quite high, like up towards the hundreds or more
than you really want, want to start thinking about, OK, well,
how can I get this small down towards like around 60?
Great. It doesn't have to be 60, but
just if it's over 100 then startstart thinking about what you
(42:04):
can do. OK, So what would happen if
someone's listening and they're like, yeah, maybe I'm stressed,
maybe I'm not, I don't care. And they just keep cruising
through life at whatever their stress level is.
What can happen to us? Chronic stress, it's, it's that
like constant level of stress where we kind of keep pushing
through and then it persists. I like to think of chronic
(42:28):
stress as like a fire alarm in our house.
That's like the analogy that I use.
And so it's like, like we said, stress can be helpful.
So if there's a fire in your house, you want that fire alarm
to be going off like you want todo something about it.
But if we don't do something about it and that fire alarm is
just going to keep on going likethe whole time 24/7 ongoing,
(42:49):
you're going, it's going to makelike you're tired, you're going
to get sick of it. You're going to like hearings
going to go, you're going to have insomnia because you're not
sleeping. You might feel, you know, a
little bit bloated and puffy andlethargic.
And over time it's going to start building up.
So in the short term it can be helpful.
But if we don't get onto it and address it and turn that fight
(43:13):
or flight off, over time, it's just going to build up and it's
going to make us, you know, havemore inflammation and eventually
start performing at a lower thanwe should be.
And then that can lead to those chronic conditions.
It can lead to hormonal imbalances, PCOS, lots of things
including like cardiovascular disease as well, which is one of
(43:34):
the leading causes of death globally too.
So I think a lot of people thinkwe don't need to worry about
that stuff until, you know, we're retired or or whatnot.
But longevity and long term health really starts now.
So I think it's really importantto be proactive, like we've
said, instead of waiting and putting things off until the
(43:55):
problem is is too big, because often it's a lot harder to treat
things reactively than it is proactively.
Yeah, and I think another nice reminder just to kind of round
this out, like you were saying before, is stress is subjective
and it's how you see the world. And so it's okay if you want to
start managing your stress levels and you're feeling like a
(44:17):
certain situation is really stressful for you, you don't
need to compare yourself againstothers and be like, oh, but Mads
can do all these things and it doesn't stress her.
It's like, that's OK. She's going to get stressed
about other things. Like I will be stressed about
these. And I still need to take a
proactive approach of like caring for myself.
And it's not this competition ofwho can handle more stress
(44:37):
because you don't know the context of what's happening
behind the scenes. Absolutely.
And you don't know how much stress people are under.
It's like that little Instagram thing, right?
It's like calm front, but like, who knows, yeah.
Yeah, there's, there's constantly lots of things going
on in everybody's life and everybody's going to go through
grief and most people are going to go through heartbreak and,
(44:59):
you know, stresses about money and different things like that.
So it's like we all experience it.
But if someone is tolerating it a little bit better or it looks
like they're able to hold more, they've probably done more work.
They've probably been doing likepersonal development for years
and years and years. And so I don't think it's a time
thing. It's like, you know, in a few
years time, I'll be so much better at managing my stress.
(45:19):
It's like like a work thing. Well, how much work are you
doing? Because you could hold a lot
more stress in one month's time if you, you know, read some
books and put the effort into itand do the meditations and even
just start getting curious abouthow you can improve.
That's all it really takes is that curiosity and and like we
(45:40):
said, just like one step at a time.
Yeah, one step at a time. Yeah, Mads, thank you.
Thank you so much for joining meon the couch for exploring this
topic. I know that, yeah, stress is
something that impacts all of usin good ways, bad ways, hard
ways, but I think just talking about it more helps to normalize
it. So thank you.
Yeah, thank you so much for having me on such a fun
conversation. And I think awareness is, is all
(46:02):
it takes. So yeah, just encourage
everybody to check in with themselves.
Yeah, beautiful. Thank you.
Hello and welcome back to Reset.Today we are diving deep into
the world of stress, which I know all of us experience at
various levels across life. To explore this topic, I have a
guest with me, Madison. Don't you might remember her
from a previous episode where wewere learning all about female
hormones. Madison, welcome back.
(00:26):
To reset, Thank you so much for having me again.
It's exciting to be back. Yeah, I love having you in
because just to remind everyone,Madison's got a background in
both science and neuropathy, andI think that blend is just so
special and what the world needsright now.
So thank you for agreeing to come back.
No, that's OK. I feel I'm just so excited to
break more of the stigma behind natural medicine, linking it
(00:49):
back with science, because when I made that realization, I was
like, oh, it is actually backed by evidence.
So. Yeah, and it doesn't have to be
an either or. Like it's the combined effort
that really makes a difference. So we're talking stress.
Tell me, from your professional opinion, what does stress
actually do to our bodies? The easiest way to kind of
(01:12):
describe this is by thinking about the fight or flight
response. Because when we think stress, or
at least when I do, it's very easy to kind of compartmentalize
it into it's all in your head and it's all mental, But there
is also physical stress and mental and physical stress are
linked. So when you experience mental
stress, you're going to have a, a physical reaction in the body.
(01:33):
So to make it really simple to, to link, I think about that
fight or flight response going all the way back to, you know,
Cavemen days when we were getting chased by a lion.
And what happens to the body when we have that stressor And
when we're like, OK, we need to either fight, flight or freeze.
Our body sends cortisol to all of our different body systems to
(01:57):
be able to prepare for that response.
And so now we might get a bill in the mail and we still, we
haven't evolved past that. It's a survival response.
So we still have all of those physical changes in the body.
If that bill, it's a little bit of perception, if that actually
triggers the fight or flight in US.
So things like speeding up your,your breathing, your muscles
(02:19):
tense to get ready to fight willrun away.
You've got things like your digestive system kind of shuts
down when I say that system shutdown.
It's just that your body is prioritizing blood flow to
things like your heart because you're going to have to run all
your muscles or all these other body systems.
So it's a big like prioritization system.
(02:39):
And so they, the blood flow goesaway from like the digestive
system. So the opposite of fight or
flight is rest and digest. So if we think back to all of
that and also you don't need to be ovulating if you are in a
really stressful environment because the risk that that
pregnancy is going to go to fulltime and be safe is not very
high anyway. So when we're stressed, our body
(03:02):
directs that blood flow away from ovulation and the hormones
towards all of the survival systems.
Yeah. And I think it's so easy for us
to think that stress just lives in a moment like the getting a
bill example if you're financially stressed, but it has
lasting impacts on our body. I know you were saying there's
(03:24):
some really interesting researchcoming out around stress and the
impact on illness and disease and things like that.
Can you educate us all? Yeah, researching this, I went
down such a rabbit hole. It's just so, so interesting
because we can all speak from experience, We've all been
stressed before, but to actuallysee how prevalent it is is quite
(03:44):
scary. There was a stat from the
American Psychological Association that 77% of people
experience physical symptoms dueto stress.
So that's just wild. And I would argue that's
probably even higher. It's it is a bit harder to do
studies that assign causation because there are so many
different factors in our diet and lifestyle that contribute to
(04:07):
different symptoms. So it's really hard to kind of
put someone in a vacuum and follow them over time and be
like, you need to eat the exact same diet as a hundred other
people. You're not allowed to change
anything else. You need to do the exact same
exercise. And it's just the stress that
we're going to change. So it's really hard to do
lifestyle studies, but I think we've all been in that place
(04:28):
where we've experienced maybe burnout or maybe people don't
even know that they are experiencing burnout.
And so it really can impact us in a lot of different ways, even
causing little things that we don't necessarily associate to
stress, but they're still like nagging symptoms every single
day. Yeah, and you mentioned some
examples before, like our breath, our pace of our breath
(04:49):
might change our heart, but whatelse?
I know like sometimes I would feel stress in my gut or like
what are some other things that people might be experiencing if
they're stressed? Yeah, absolutely.
So that again, that links back to that fight or flight response
in the gut, right? It's like it's taking away that
attention from the rest and digest and the calming of
everything moving nicely throughthe digestive system.
(05:11):
And it's really disrupting that.Other things can be like
headaches. Fatigue is a huge one, and that
one makes a little bit more sense.
But mood changes as well. We've got blood sugar crashes,
so many different things, and then they those little things,
when they persist over time, they lead to bigger conditions
and symptoms and hormonal imbalances as well.
(05:33):
Yeah. So is the flip side true then as
well? If we if stress can cause all
these issues in our body, can reducing stress reduce issues
and illness and help us live easier lives?
I'm sure the answer is yes, but tell me about it.
Yeah, absolutely. And there's a lot more research
coming out about the the power of mindfulness and the power of
(05:56):
doing breath work and yoga and all of those beautiful
activities. Breath work is a really, and it
doesn't even have to be in like the sense that you go to a
breath work class, but even justsitting there and doing the box
breath where you breathe in for four, hold for four, breathe out
for four, hold for four. That is one of the most simplest
(06:16):
things that anybody can do. And that manually overrides the
fight or flight system. Because if you think about it,
the fight or flight survival system speeds up your breath.
And if you kind of reach in and be like, hold on, I'm going to
manually turn this off or turn this dial to where I want it to
be, then over time your body starts getting the idea that
(06:40):
it's like, OK, no, actually we are safe.
We're breathing slow, therefore it's all going to be OK.
Yeah. Is one more influential than the
other? Like our mind or our body or
it's just we kind of feed off the 2.
That's a good question. I definitely think it's we feed
off either 1. Hormonally.
(07:01):
For example, progesterone is a really beautiful hormone that
works on the receptors in the brain for calming and reducing
anxiety and we need to ovulate in order to make progesterone.
So if women have irregular cycles, PCOS, they're not
ovulating, then they are not going to be making their own
progesterone. And therefore they're going to
(07:22):
have maybe higher levels of anxiety, which is then going to
lead to more stress. And then more stress is going to
impact ovulation, which is then going to mean they're not
producing progesterone. And it's kind of like a big
vicious cycle. So there's definitely that side
of things. But also, I ever since I got an
aura ring, which has been for a while now, it changed my
perception on physical stress because when we think physical
(07:44):
stress, I think we think like exercise.
And so my stress levels would beup after I was, you know, having
a little dance while I was getting ready in the morning or
getting ready to like go out fordinner or something like that.
And my stress levels would be high.
And I'm like, it's a Friday afternoon, I'm going out for
dinner. I am not stressed like I am
switched off. I'm happy.
I'm having a great time dancing.Why are my stress levels high?
(08:08):
This aura ring is broken. And yeah, I just really started
to learn that obviously dancing it's like physical activity.
I mean, I wasn't even getting that into it.
I'm like in front of the mirror.I'm actually like you just
busted all these rooms to trigger.
That Well, yeah, apparently it'sspiked the stress more than I
thought it did. And, and it's learning that we
(08:31):
need to take that rest both mentally and physically.
And yeah, you can't have one without the other.
It needs to be, I mean, you can do it at different times, but
you know, you can be in a bubblebath and be going through your
To Do List and mentally just like being stressed.
Or you can be really, really happy, but like physically
dancing and moving your body. And then that's also putting
(08:52):
good stress on your body, but stress nonetheless.
And I think people just need to balance that out with rest,
which is what we're not doing enough of.
So I guess the word stress sounds bad.
I think we've got this connotation of it, but there's
probably healthy levels of stress in our life that fuels us
to move forward and make progress and do things like, can
(09:14):
you kind of explain good stress versus not so good stress?
Yeah, absolutely. And when I think stress, the
easiest way to make it tangible is like the stress hormone is
cortisol, and cortisol is still a really, really important
hormone. When we talk about stress, we
kind of make it out to be the bad guy.
And I guess chronically high cortisol levels do cause
problems, but cortisol is also the hormone that gets you up and
(09:37):
out of bed in the morning and you need it and so on.
A cortisol test, we don't just want to see this like baseline
flat, like we want to see that your cortisol levels are rising
to get you up and then, you know, slowly drifting off
towards the day and stress, you know is we can all feel it when
we don't care about something, then we're not going to be
motivated. We're not going to push forward
(09:59):
and reach deadlines or hit goalssooner rather than later.
If there's nothing on the line, then we're just kind of like meh
and no one wants to live a meh life.
So it is still really important to have a little bit of it's
like that good pressure, but there is also you can put bad
pressure on yourself when something, I guess the
perception of of something is going to be worse or more
(10:23):
important than really it actually is.
It's like if something is causing you stress, especially
if it's like this goes for things on your To Do List as
well. It's like, OK, but if you didn't
do that today, is the world going to end?
Like, is something really, really bad going to happen?
Or cannot wait for tomorrow, cannot wait for next week.
You'll get it done eventually. But I think it's really easy to
(10:44):
feel like everything needs to get done right now.
And I catch myself in that all the time.
Because stress isn't something that you just like, fix and then
it goes away for the rest of your life.
It's like a conscious effort to to keep on top of it.
Yeah. And I think that's a good
reminder to all of us. There's so many high achievers
that once you do with that burnout point, you think right
now my new goal is to live a completely stress free life,
(11:08):
which A is not achievable and B,like you said, is a bit meh.
Like it's you're going to get bored if like no one wants that.
I guess sometimes we can be veryaware that we're stressed, but
other times it can kind of creepon up on us silently.
If we live in this like chronic kind of stressed state, what are
(11:32):
some of the signs and symptoms our body might be showing us if
we silently stressed, I guess? Yeah, the fatigue 1 is the
obvious one, right. But also just general mood
changes, headaches, insomnia. It's like that tired but wired.
So it's like you're exhausted because you're doing so much.
You're so busy, you've got so much on your mind, but you still
(11:54):
can't get to sleep. Yeah.
Like what is going on? Or you're waking around like two
or three in the morning and, andit's just your subconscious
can't just chill. So there's all of those type of
symptoms. For me, a really big one is, and
this may come over the years of like personal development that
I've done, but it's if I kind oflose passion for like my work
(12:17):
and my business. And it's like, you know, I, I
started my business because I amso passionate about what I do
and I'm so excited to just keep building it.
But if I just kind of start resenting it, then I'm like,
hold on, like I think this, I just need to like take a break
for a little bit. Yeah.
Yeah, that's probably my biggestsign that comes even before all
(12:38):
of those physical symptoms. But I think it's really common
for people to be like just have to push through.
And I mean, this can go down another wormhole, but that's
that whole like masculine first feminine way of doing business.
It's that like the feminine is alittle bit more intuitive and
it's like leaning into the flow and and what feels good.
And you still need to have like the structure and discipline and
like get stuff done. But I think masculine is a
(13:01):
little bit more like push through, do, do, do, which can
just be really hard with like the different hormones.
And I mean, I think men should also lean into their intuition
too, but. For sure, yeah.
Yeah. Speaking of the differences with
men and women, do you find the rates of stress and burnout in
men and women are different? Yeah, so the research actually
(13:23):
does show that women experience or they rate themselves stressed
more frequently and they rate themselves higher.
There is also biological differences.
The research actually suggested that women release more oxytocin
when they're stressed, which is like the love hormone, the.
Interesting, do we love being stressed?
What is this toxic like cycle? Where is.
(13:45):
It's a feedback loop to kind of reduce the stress.
Yeah, yeah. But then are we chasing it?
I didn't even go down that stress.
Is addictive sometimes. I mean, it is, isn't?
It Yeah. Interesting.
Yeah, that's a whole rabbit holein itself.
I think the body's just trying to protect itself.
But like anything that like not anything but some things that
(14:06):
are bad for us, they're a littlebit addictive, right?
So there definitely could be that aspect of it and the body's
trying to be protective. But that also could be why
women, I think when they're stressed it, they kind of react
a little bit more internally or kind of like don't maybe voice
it as much or react. Whereas with men, they've got
(14:27):
those high levels of testosterone.
They're also releasing adrenaline, as are we.
But the research suggests that they're more likely to kind of
act out when they're stressed. And I was like, OK, I just found
that super interesting. But also, women are more
sensitive to cortisol. So if they are experiencing the
same level of stress, they're a little bit more sensitive to it
(14:49):
as men. And yeah.
It's interesting, like that whole addictive side of it.
And I know personally, being pregnant right now, I've really
tried to intentionally slow down.
And that's not my normal, That'snot my normal pace.
And I've been having conversations with a few friends
lately of like, you know what? I kind of miss a little bit of
(15:11):
that, like on reflection, toxic burnout working style that I've
had in the past. And I'm like, why?
Why am I missing that? But it like it feeds a certain
side of me and maybe there's so many layers to that.
Well, drive and passion. How do we get drive and passion
without the stress? And I think maybe in pregnancy
(15:34):
when we're trying to to slow down and calm, and that's a
really important part of trying to conceive as well.
Totally. Like I've seen just so many
women where they've gotten on top of their stress or even
something outside of their control has gone away.
And then that's when they fall pregnant after years of trying.
And it's just like I knew it, like I just, and again, hard to
assign causation, but it's just the coincidence keeps happening
(15:58):
over and over again. And that's what we work on too.
But yeah, I think leaning towards, it's not about like not
doing anything or kind of stopping everything.
It's about leaning towards the things that light you up and are
a little bit easier to kind of have that drive and passion as
opposed to just pushing through on the things that you don't
want to do. And that's probably really
important as well after birth toprevent you from losing your
(16:20):
identity too, if you're leaning in to doing more of the things
that light you up. Yeah.
Let's talk more a little bit about the kind of examples of
that you've seen in clients and your friendship circles around
stress impacting say fertility or health outcomes and things
like that. Do you have some kind of
examples of where you've seen stress either make something so
(16:43):
much harder or make or reducing it has made it so much easier?
There's, it's hard to like nail it down into one example, but I
know for myself, stress was definitely my major root cause
for my PCOS and for my acne as well.
And when I was diagnosed with PCOS, So one of the diagnostic
criteria is high androgens. And so androgens are the
(17:04):
collective term for male hormones, but women have them as
well and need them. It's important.
And it wasn't when I got diagnosed, it wasn't actually my
testosterone that was high. It was my DHEA's that were high.
And so that is an androgen that's produced in the adrenal
glands. So that was kind of like that
light bulb moment for me where Iwas like, OK, like my androgens
(17:24):
are high. I've got PCOS, it's driving my
acne, but it's not testosterone.It's mostly from the adrenals.
And that aligned with what I wasfeeling or kind of what I was
learning about myself because I'm an A type personality.
So I'm like perfectionist. I'm like, let's go and achieve
all of these goals and do all ofthese things.
(17:45):
And I want them all done now. And I still do that, but I have
to like catch myself. And so when I really started to
take that seriously, that's whenI saw like the improvements in
my health and then maintaining that.
And I still catch myself out. So like my period might be a
couple of days early or later. And that will always be like,
when I think back, I'm like, oh,I've actually had a really
(18:07):
stressful month. So that's really important part
of it. But healing and doing that
stress management in order to heal something, it isn't just
about going to do yoga or doing the bubble baths or you know,
going for walks, although they're all really important
things. It's really important to also
address the subconscious stresses.
(18:28):
Go to a psychologist. I even tried like hypnosis,
which I really didn't know what to expect.
I'd never done it before. Like the concept you, you think
about it from movies and you're just like, I'm about to get
hypnotized. Like what am I?
What am I going to do? But you're in total control the
whole time. For those who have never done it
before, it's just more about it tapping into your subconscious
and the things that are driving that worry and driving that
(18:50):
stress because this can be a little bit triggering, but
stress really is perception. Like it's the brain that
triggers the stress response. And so someone can get a bill in
the mail and they don't go into that fight or flight.
Somebody else can get a bit billin the mail and then they do go
into that fight or flight. So if we can try and learn
(19:10):
things like detachment, learn things like not having to tie
our worth to our achievements and just all of those personal
development things. I I really do believe that the
more personal development you do, the more you're going to
have control over your stress. Yeah, I had another medicine on
the podcast a little while ago, psychologist medicine, and we
(19:32):
talked about burnout from a purepsychology perspective, but she
had a really good framework there.
It's just the circle of control and sort of putting everything
that is in the middle circle of like things that are within your
control. And then on the outside of that,
it's things that are within yourinfluence and then things that
are just completely outside of your control.
And it's so interesting when yousit down and start to map it out
(19:53):
in a framework like that. So few things actually sit in
the middle and then anything that's out of it.
And I know my partner and I sortof use this in conversations
now. It's like, well, what is within
your control? Yeah, OK.
It's these things. And then so many other factors
that we spend so much time, likebeing consumed by or worrying
about and considering like we literally can't do anything
(20:15):
about. And so it's really liberating
when you're like, well, it's notin that middle circle.
Let it go, let it go. And it's a muscle and you've got
to like, like, flex it and strengthen it and stuff.
But it can be really empowering.Yeah, and you're human, like
you're going to get caught up inthat.
And then it's just about coming back to it.
Like we're sometimes or a lot ofthe time stress comes up quietly
(20:38):
and secretly and it maybe even slowly over time.
And you don't actually notice ituntil one day you're just like,
gosh, I am just so overwhelmed right now.
And that's when you have to remember your tools and, and
remembering how much those toolshelped you last time.
Because sometimes it's when you're so bogged down in that
stress, it's not always as easy as like, ohh, I'll just fix it.
(20:59):
Like, some people are so caught up in it and it can really feel
overwhelming to actually start addressing it.
But yeah, it's just about just starting somewhere and
remembering how much those toolshelped you before.
Totally and yeah, there's there's different phases of your
life or different seasons that you'll be in that something that
wouldn't have stressed previous you stresses current you.
(21:19):
Like I know when I've been incredibly stressed in the past,
my partner Alex will say like, oh, what do you think we should
have for dinner? And like, I'd just been through
a season of work where I was making thousands of decisions
and I just broke down in tears. And I was like, I don't know.
And I need you to decide. Like, I cannot make another
decision. And if you ask me now, like,
what do you want for dinner? That that's not a stressful
(21:41):
question at all. But it was a huge red flag at
the time of like, oh, we've pushed way past the limits of
what is acceptable here. Yeah.
And that, I mean, maybe it may stress you out if you had that
same decision fatigue now. Yeah.
Yeah. It's, it's very interesting how
sometimes it's like that straw that broke the camel's back.
Yeah. And that can mean that we snap
(22:02):
at our friends or our family or our partners because our
partners are the ones that are that they're most of the time.
But again, it's coming back to that self-awareness and
immediately knowing, hold on, I snapped because of this, not
actually because of the thing that I snapped about.
Yes. And then it's like going back
and, you know, apologizing and being self aware and thinking
forward about how can I regulatethis in the future?
(22:25):
Or it's, I don't think people are preventative enough.
It's like we wait until we reactto think, oh, hold on, I'm
stressed. I need to actually do something
about this instead of like seeing it sneak up on us.
And after practice, if it gets, it becomes a bit easier to see
it sneaking up. But yeah, it's still very easy
to do. So easy to do.
(22:45):
Talk to me about measuring stress levels.
So I guess we can sort of do this self-awareness, but what
are some tools that you would recommend to a client to
actually measure the level of stress that's happening in our
body? Yeah, so there's definitely like
psychological scales where you can even just ask yourself, how
stressed am I out of 10? How often do we really ask
ourselves that on a regular basis?
(23:06):
If it's in your. Point for a second, everyone
should ask themselves that question right now.
Like right now 10. Like how stressed am I right
now? I'm going to ask you how
stressed are you out of 10 rightnow?
I'm pretty chill to be honest. I'm pretty pretty.
Cute. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Like I said, I'm in this season of like growth and surrender.
Like grow a baby, grow a podcast, but surrender to like,
(23:27):
what will be will be with all ofit.
And yeah, I'm in a nice chill season, but like I said, I kind
of miss a little bit of this, like toxic burnout productivity,
which I know will come again in the future.
But right now this is my season season.
Was it hard to get there? Yeah, it's uncomfortable to be
like this for me. Yeah.
(23:48):
Did you have to do lots of like mindset work or personal
development to to keep bringing yourself back into that and
sitting with it? Yeah, and I think even moving to
the Gold Coast, like it was a two year fertility journey, like
if I am really honest with myself about it, like the act of
trying to conceive happened veryfast, but only because it was 2
(24:09):
years of creating an environmentand a lifestyle that just
allowed me to really like slow down, tap into that feminine
side of myself. And yeah, it, it's, it's
interesting. Like I said, it's it's right for
right now, but I am excited about future me being able to
(24:30):
lean into a little bit more of ahustle again.
Yeah, absolutely. Go, go, go.
I miss a bit of her. Yeah, yeah.
She'll come back. She'll come back, but right now,
like, like I said, I've got the responsibility of growing a baby
girl and regulating her nervous system during that process.
And the more I think about it, it's like, OK, well, she's also
(24:52):
developing her eggs for the future.
And if she chooses to have a child, like the way I grow and
nurture her now is influencing future generations as well.
So I'm like, it's OK, Just pause.
Absolutely. And it happened so fast.
So it's like try and soak it up and be present.
And I just love what you said about the fact that it's, even
though the actual trying to conceive happened so fast, it
(25:14):
was all the work that you'd doneprior.
And a lot of people don't know that like that's the work to be
done. And so they get to OK, I'm ready
to start trying now and that's when they start their journey.
And yeah, it can be really disappointing for a lot of
people because even just like the pill, which I know we spoke
about a lot last episode, but it's like people go off the pill
(25:35):
and they're like expecting to fall pregnant within the next
couple of months. And it's, it's a lot more prep
work. But like you said, even just
like the stress piece, if you'restressed, it's so, so much
harder to fall pregnant. So and you know, you want to
have a healthy pregnancy as well.
So it's not just OK, now I've fallen pregnant, I can go back
to the stress. It's also how can I maintain
(25:55):
this beautiful environment that's low cortisol, really
nurturing. Yeah.
And yeah, stress plays a huge part in that.
Yeah, for sure. And and takes time.
Like if you have lived at this like high stress, busy version
of yourself for years, it doesn't happen instantly.
You can't just oh, I went on a holiday and now like my whole
brain and body has changed. Like, yeah, it does take time,
(26:17):
yeah. Yeah, and there's lots of silent
stresses as well, like going back to the difference between
men and women. It's I think women carry a lot
more of a silent load, a lot more of, you know, even just
thinking about the tribe and thecommunity and thinking about
their To Do List and all of the things that they've got to do.
And when it comes to pregnancy, you can look like you're doing
(26:38):
fine from the outside, but there's just so much that is on
you. So yeah, I think that's also why
the stress levels and burnout ishiring women.
Yeah, definitely. And I'm sure a lot of people are
listening and they're like, Yep,that's me, I'm stressed, I'm
burnt out. I don't want to be as stressed
or burnout as I am. What are some proactive things
(26:58):
you would recommend that the person listening can do to start
to intentionally lower their stress levels?
Yeah. So I think all of this just pick
what sounds best to you. The the thing that's going to be
the most effective is the thing that feels good to your nervous
system and feels good to you. So, you know, if you don't want
(27:19):
to go to a yoga class, if you couldn't think of anything
worse, then don't. Yeah, don't force yourself to go
to a yoga class hoping that it'll make you less stressed.
Yeah, probably going to make youless stressed, yeah.
Yeah, I, I love yoga, but like Ican't, I just, I still can't do
yin even though I will happily sit there and meditate and not
move. But I think it's the stretches
and then I'm just like, I'm sickof being in this position.
(27:40):
I just want to move. But you know, I sit there and I
do think about my To Do List. So anything that kind of works
for you in getting you out of that fight or fly.
And you can really feel it when you're calm, when you're, when
your breathing is not increased,when your muscles are not tense.
Like if you're sitting there on the couch like all tensed up,
then you're probably not like you're probably in that fight or
(28:01):
flight mode or running through your To Do List.
So things that can break you outof that fight or flight because
sometimes it's hard. It has control over us
essentially or feels like it does.
And it's so hard to just break it initially, just even standing
up away from your computer or whatever it is and going outside
and just like taking a big breath of fresh air, that could
(28:22):
probably take, depending on how far your desk is away from
outside, like maybe 5 seconds ifyou're just like going out to
the balcony or something. It's just that patent interrupt.
It's just that interrupter that then gives you the opportunity
to just rethink, reset, and thencome back in.
Maybe you could go for a walk. You could do things like yoga
(28:42):
something if you don't have timeto actually like go and do
something. Even going on to Spotify and
going into what is it called thepeaceful meditation playlist.
It's like one of my most played things like, you know, when it
like has the Spotify wrapped andthen it's like you listen to no
music. I mean music, but like
meditation. I listen to that all the time
(29:05):
when I'm stressed, like in the car, it'll just be like this
peaceful little music. And when I'm going for a walk or
yes, you could do that. Even if you're like working and
you can't stop working, just something like putting that in
the background can just help soften the environment.
Lighting a candle or just littlethings in your environment to
(29:26):
help soften it instead and make it less masculine and hustle and
push and more like I'm choosing to do this.
But yeah, anything where you're kind of like just stepping out
of that, that thought pattern offeeling stuck in the fight or
flight and helping to reset. Yeah.
I wonder if it's helpful for people to kind of write
themselves like 3 things that they know can just instantly
(29:48):
snap them out of that whatever cycle they're in.
Because I know when you are super stressed, your brain can
just go blank. Yeah, even like keeping it in
notes on your phone or something.
Like here's three things that can just instantly like disrupt
that pattern. Even sticky note on the desk.
Yeah, just right in front of you, if you.
So it doesn't get lost in the notes.
Yeah, I think that's a great idea writing that list because
(30:10):
often it's when you're stressed,you kind of we actually out lose
a lot of our peripheral vision when we're stressed and we kind
of hone in and focus. And so you you do like the world
find kind of falls around you and you fall into this like
vertex of focus and just something to try and like help
pull you out of that because it's really hard sometimes to
(30:30):
pull yourself out of that. So if you have those three
things that you can fall on, you're not feeling creative in
that time of stress to think of them then and there.
So be proactive, have them aheadof time so that you can fall
back on them. I think that's a great idea.
Yeah, something I think all of us are pretty guilty of doing is
having our phones. And like, you know, when you
first wake up in the morning, you grab your phone.
(30:53):
And then I know previously we'd grab my phone, I would instantly
check work emails. And this is at a time where I
would be working across multipletime zones.
So of course, like notificationsare wild and I would use the
anxiety from that to like, boom,I'm so wide awake now, let's get
out, let's start the day. Do not advise that at all.
(31:17):
But that was just like this pattern that I was in.
And about a year ago, I think maybe a bit longer now, I
started sleeping with my phone on aeroplane mode.
I would still still guilty of using it as my alarm clock, but
it stays on aeroplane mode for at least the 1st 30 minutes of
my day and just allows me to getup and enjoy a morning that is a
(31:40):
little bit slower. It's still like I can still get
up, I can still get ready, I canstill like on the dream days.
I also go for a walk and things like that before taking it off
aeroplane mode and it is just such an empowering thing to do.
It takes a while before that petcan feel normal and OK and
comfortable, but it has been a game changer.
(32:02):
It has been an absolute game changer.
And I think speaking to anyone who thinks like, no, I need to
check my messages first thing inthe morning when I wake up, then
set your alarm 10 minutes earlier.
Yeah, Like, no one is that in demand unless you are a medical
doctor on call. And literally it's life or
death. Like, your phone is on call on
(32:24):
those days. OK, fine.
Most of us can gift ourselves a little bit of time in the
morning to just wake up without using those notifications and
things as like a crazy trigger for us to start our day.
Yeah, I love that. It's such a good way to wake up,
wake up slowly, wake up with like by yourself.
And just that's when you can even just like go grab yourself
(32:45):
like something to eat or something to drink or like a tea
and then just go sit on the lounge and just just chill for
10 minutes. Yeah, just be or go for a walk.
That's even better. I also want to like put the
disclaimer that you don't have to be perfect in order to be on
top of your stress. Like I have definitely done that
before and I am so guilty of notdoing it right now.
Like I do look at my phone firstthing in the morning and I know
(33:08):
that's like #1 tip on how to, what not to do.
But I, I do, I use the, the light to wake me up because
that's what it is LED. It just like it wakes you up.
But I think it's really helpful to not have like work emails on
your phone if you can help it. And my preference is waking up
with like natural light. So that is always my preference.
(33:29):
Even on weekends when I don't set alarms, it will be the light
that wakes me up, not my phone. But if you have like automatic
blinds, that might be like a bitof a bougie recommendation, but
I don't but I would love to. And then I would just like have
it set and that would be my alarm as they would just like
slowly start rising and I would awake with the sun.
You can't get those like lamps that gradually come on.
(33:53):
I had one, I had one of those. Yeah.
It was called Lumi, and it was when I was living in London
because the mornings are so dark.
Yeah. And so you set it to whatever
time you want to wake up and it slowly lights up the room.
Like I think it starts 10 minutes before your alarm.
Yeah, it was. It was great.
When I moved back to Australia, I gave it, I gifted it to a
friend who was still living there.
(34:13):
But yeah, it was effective. If you live somewhere and you're
listening to this and you're like, I can't wake up with the
because of my work schedule or anything like that.
Like these little lights to create that are really cool.
Yeah, that's awesome. And I think as well, like having
your, your, if you have a partner, having them on this
same journey of like self development and like personal
(34:36):
awareness and can be really, really beneficial because if
you're trying to implement things like that or an early
morning walk and they don't wantbright lights in the bedroom of
a morning, it could be such a barrier to healing in general,
not just about stress. So I think trying to like be on
that same page and maybe not at the same level or, you know, as
far along, you might have done work for years prior, but it's
(34:57):
about just like, are we on the same page in terms of wanting to
manage our stress and what are we going to do?
How can we support each other? And like, I recently just bought
an air purifier, not stress related, but like I checked in
with my partner and I was like, are you OK for me to like have
this going during the night? Because the last thing you want
to do is like, want to do something for your health and
(35:18):
then, you know, it annoy your partner or something like that.
And then they're like, Nope, notin the bedroom.
So yeah, I think just being on the same page can also make this
a lot easier. But like in summary, if you're,
let's say you're like 100% stressed, even if you can just
do one thing that lowers that by5%, it's going to make the next
step easier and the next step easier.
(35:39):
So don't think that like you have to sit down and write this
big, I'm not going to be stressed from tomorrow on with
plan. Like just do one thing, even if
that's a walk, a 10 minute walk.If that's all you can manage
today, just do that. Or if all you can manage is lie
on your bed, like listening to meditation music because you
just don't want to move, you don't want to think Amazing.
(36:01):
Yeah, just do something. Well, saying no to something you
don't want to do, yes. I think as women especially, we
grow up thinking we have to say yes to everything.
And just because we can doesn't mean we should.
Yeah. And it's, it's such a empowering
word to suddenly be able to say.And it doesn't mean that you
(36:21):
don't like your friends if you're saying no to doing
something with them or you are going to miss out on things at
work. Like I think just being really
intentional about what you say yes to, but then also what you
say no to can be really. Absolutely.
You've got to protect your energy and starting with the
little things means that when itit comes to setting a bigger
boundary later, you're going to have a little bit more practice
(36:44):
under your sleeve. Like setting boundaries isn't
easy, but you can get better at it.
And there is always going to be like, you know, you're OK with
setting these little boundaries.Like, you know, Oh no, I'm not
going to like come for drinks tonight, whatever.
But that means that you're then going to be a little bit more
equipped in practice to set those bigger boundaries that do
(37:05):
really, really matter to you that are actually like, we'll
hold on. No, I don't feel comfortable
with this or I have 0 interest in doing that.
Yeah. All of that contributes to our
the things that we think about ourselves subconsciously, the
things that we worry about subconsciously, the things that
we are anxious about because yeah, if we're anxious about or
we don't really want to do this thing, but we've kind of said
(37:26):
yes to make somebody else happy.That's all anxiety that is just
riding your your stress and yourworry subconsciously.
Yeah, for sure. And I think being aware of what
we consume as well, like social media, the news, the media, like
even who we spend our time with has such a big influence on us.
And I know that when there's been certain, like I remember
(37:47):
back to the pandemic and then different wars that are
happening in things like my partner Alex will really dive
deep in wanting all the updates.And on reflection now he's like,
OK, yeah, you were right. That was really impacting my
mood and my mindset and how I showed up in the world.
But it becomes this addiction. And I think it's important for
(38:07):
us to be aware of, OK, just because this information is
there doesn't mean I need it instantly.
And if it's triggering me, then carve out time in the day.
When is a good time? Like if, if you do want these
updates about global events thatare going to make you feel
really stressed, really anxious,choose when you consume them.
(38:28):
And maybe first thing in the morning is not the best time.
Last thing at night might not bethe best time.
It might be like, OK, give myself an hour to to go deep
into this topic in the middle ofthe day and then sandwich it
with with calmness around. Because if it's constantly
checking these notifications that are causing you like stress
and anxiety like that ripples throughout your entire world.
(38:50):
100% And I think a lot of peoplemay have noticed that during
Covic because it was such a heightened experience, perhaps
they don't realize the same things happening now, just like
on a lower scale. And yeah, the way that I kind of
got over that is, or managed that is, I don't watch the news
(39:10):
on TVI follow a select few or like, yeah, maybe even one
Instagram page that delivers thenews that I need.
They often deliver it in carousel form.
So it's not like video just likein your face and it's like boom,
boom, boom. It's like, you know, you can see
as much of the story as you want.
There's some text, you get it, but you don't need all of the
(39:31):
like, emotional life. Yeah, yeah.
I think it's the daily Oz from memory, if people are interested
in that. But yeah, that's the one I like.
Yeah, Are there many? Are there any common myths that
you hear about stress that you'dlove to bust during this
episode? I think people just thinking
that it's all in their head or that it's they feel like it's a
(39:56):
conscious thing, like they're either consciously stressed or
they're not consciously stressed.
And I think that people don't realize how subconscious.
Stress can be, and depending on how you are raised and depending
on the tendencies that you have to, for example, be a people
pleaser, that will determine like your baseline level stress
essentially because it's like, are you worrying about what
(40:19):
everybody else thinks? Are you worrying about pleasing
everybody all the time? And if you are, then that's
probably like a little bit higher than where you should be
like in terms of your stress level just constantly.
And then when you are more stressed about work and and the
conscious things, then it's going to peak it a little bit
even higher. Yeah, because you've then got
more on your plate to think and worry about.
So I think there's that is that people feeling like, oh, I'm not
(40:42):
stressed. It's like people are creating
their own myths around like, yeah, no, I'm OK, I'm all right.
But it's like checking with yourbody and going on about like
measuring stress. If you want to be objective
about it, there are tests that you can actually do to see where
your cortisol levels are at. So it's not just about like your
opinion and being subjective about like where I am on the
(41:02):
scale from 1:00 to 10:00. But yes, you can measure
cortisol on either a blood test or there is like a urine test
which is more accurate. It also measures the cortisol
throughout the day and the clearance of cortisol so how
your adrenals are are working asopposed to just like a blood
test that shows one snapshot of your cortisol levels in time in
your blood. So there's that.
(41:24):
Or you can look into things likea wearable group or an aura ring
that will show you things like your heart rate, your breathing
rate in real time. It also can calculate and give
you like a stress scale. But you don't even need anything
fancy like that. Even if you just have like even
Fitbits do, we can get Fitbits that do it for like under $100
(41:44):
or something that just show you your heart rate throughout the
day. And if your heart rate is
sitting quite high, like up towards the hundreds or more
than you really want, want to start thinking about, OK, well,
how can I get this small down towards like around 60?
Great. It doesn't have to be 60, but
just if it's over 100 then startstart thinking about what you
(42:04):
can do. OK, So what would happen if
someone's listening and they're like, yeah, maybe I'm stressed,
maybe I'm not, I don't care. And they just keep cruising
through life at whatever their stress level is.
What can happen to us? Chronic stress, it's, it's that
like constant level of stress where we kind of keep pushing
through and then it persists. I like to think of chronic
(42:28):
stress as like a fire alarm in our house.
That's like the analogy that I use.
And so it's like, like we said, stress can be helpful.
So if there's a fire in your house, you want that fire alarm
to be going off like you want todo something about it.
But if we don't do something about it and that fire alarm is
just going to keep on going likethe whole time 24/7 ongoing,
(42:49):
you're going, it's going to makelike you're tired, you're going
to get sick of it. You're going to like hearings
going to go, you're going to have insomnia because you're not
sleeping. You might feel, you know, a
little bit bloated and puffy andlethargic.
And over time it's going to start building up.
So in the short term it can be helpful.
But if we don't get onto it and address it and turn that fight
(43:13):
or flight off, over time, it's just going to build up and it's
going to make us, you know, havemore inflammation and eventually
start performing at a lower thanwe should be.
And then that can lead to those chronic conditions.
It can lead to hormonal imbalances, PCOS, lots of things
including like cardiovascular disease as well, which is one of
(43:34):
the leading causes of death globally too.
So I think a lot of people thinkwe don't need to worry about
that stuff until, you know, we're retired or or whatnot.
But longevity and long term health really starts now.
So I think it's really importantto be proactive, like we've
said, instead of waiting and putting things off until the
(43:55):
problem is is too big, because often it's a lot harder to treat
things reactively than it is proactively.
Yeah, and I think another nice reminder just to kind of round
this out, like you were saying before, is stress is subjective
and it's how you see the world. And so it's okay if you want to
start managing your stress levels and you're feeling like a
(44:17):
certain situation is really stressful for you, you don't
need to compare yourself againstothers and be like, oh, but Mads
can do all these things and it doesn't stress her.
It's like, that's OK. She's going to get stressed
about other things. Like I will be stressed about
these. And I still need to take a
proactive approach of like caring for myself.
And it's not this competition ofwho can handle more stress
(44:37):
because you don't know the context of what's happening
behind the scenes. Absolutely.
And you don't know how much stress people are under.
It's like that little Instagram thing, right?
It's like calm front, but like, who knows, yeah.
Yeah, there's, there's constantly lots of things going
on in everybody's life and everybody's going to go through
grief and most people are going to go through heartbreak and,
(44:59):
you know, stresses about money and different things like that.
So it's like we all experience it.
But if someone is tolerating it a little bit better or it looks
like they're able to hold more, they've probably done more work.
They've probably been doing likepersonal development for years
and years and years. And so I don't think it's a time
thing. It's like, you know, in a few
years time, I'll be so much better at managing my stress.
(45:19):
It's like like a work thing. Well, how much work are you
doing? Because you could hold a lot
more stress in one month's time if you, you know, read some
books and put the effort into itand do the meditations and even
just start getting curious abouthow you can improve.
That's all it really takes is that curiosity and and like we
(45:40):
said, just like one step at a time.
Yeah, one step at a time. Yeah, Mads, thank you.
Thank you so much for joining meon the couch for exploring this
topic. I know that, yeah, stress is
something that impacts all of usin good ways, bad ways, hard
ways, but I think just talking about it more helps to normalize
it. So thank you.
Yeah, thank you so much for having me on such a fun
conversation. And I think awareness is, is all
(46:02):
it takes. So yeah, just encourage
everybody to check in with themselves.
Yeah, beautiful. Thank you.
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