In this episode, Stephanie Olson and Rebecca Saunders dive into the critical topic of teaching youth about body boundaries. They highlight the importance of using anatomically correct terms so children can effectively report abuse and avoid misunderstandings. The conversation includes a real-life example where a child’s incorrect term created confusion.
Stephanie and Rebecca emphasize how parents can reassure children that their safety is the highest priority, encourage them to speak up about discomfort, and model healthy boundaries in everyday life—such as limiting phone calls after certain hours. They also stress the importance of not keeping secrets, underscoring that early education on body safety and boundaries empowers children to protect themselves and fosters resilience.
Everyone has resilience, but what does that mean, and how do we use it in life and leadership? Join Stephanie Olson, an expert in resiliency and trauma, every week as she talks to other experts living lives of resilience. Stephanie also shares her own stories of addictions, disordered eating, domestic and sexual violence, abandonment, and trauma, and shares the everyday struggles and joys of everyday life. As a wife, mom, and CEO she gives commentaries and, sometimes, a few rants to shed light on what makes a person resilient. So, if you have experienced adversity in life in any way and want to learn how to better lead your family, your workplace, and, well, your life, this podcast is for you!
https://setmefreeproject.net
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Stephanie Olson (00:16):
Stephanie, hello and welcome to resilience
and relationships R and R, I amStephanie Olson, and I'm here
with Mecca Saunders, yay. Sookay, we are going to talk. I
love this topic, but it'suncomfortable for some people, I
know, but we're going to talkabout body boundaries with
(00:38):
youth. Do you want to kind ofstart that conversation of what,
what we mean by that, what youmean by
Unknown (00:44):
that. So what? It's definitely one of those
conversations that is necessary.
Can feel extremelyuncomfortable, but it doesn't
have to. But what we're talkingabout is, how do you talk to
your kids, and we'll go throughwhat different ages, how this
looks different. But how do youtalk to your kids about what are
and are not appropriate thingswith their body. So, yeah, no,
what boundaries should you haveup? Can those change from person
(01:05):
to person? What does that looklike?
Stephanie Olson (01:09):
Right, right?
And, you know, I've, I've seensome really interesting things
with with boundaries, but Ithink it really starts with one
very important piece of that isteaching your youth the
anatomically correct body partnames. And I think for some
(01:34):
reason that is uncomfortable forparents and caregivers to do
sometimes. I'm not sure why, butwhat we know is there are real
dangerous problems if you don'tname those correctly, two
Unknown (01:56):
and four. And I can tell you that sometimes it is
awkward that when my son willscream out, you know, don't
touch my body part when I'mchanging, right? Well, it's
awkward, yeah, yeah, thebenefits definitely outweigh the
risks. And so what is that risk?
You want to explain that?
Stephanie Olson (02:15):
Yeah. So there was a, an actually, very well
known story about a or at leastwell known in our circles, about
a mom who taught her to say andwe are not going to be using
those terms only because of thealgorithm, not because we're
(02:36):
ashamed of those terms, But webecause we don't want YouTube
specifically to not allow thisto go anywhere you actually get
to see the podcast. Yes, it'simportant. So there was a mom
who actually taught her daughterto name her body part cookie,
(02:57):
and instead of the V body part.
And so she actually did get SAby a male family member. And she
told her teacher, who sheconsidered to be her safe adult.
And she went and told herteacher, my daddy, or whomever
it was, has been touching mycookie well to the teacher, she
(03:23):
thought she was actually talkingabout like a chocolate chip
cookie that you eat, andsomebody was trying to touch her
cookie or steal her cookie, orwhatever. And the SA went, even
though disclosed by the littlegirl went on reported because
the teacher, at first didn'tunderstand what was actually
(03:48):
being reported. And so it'simportant that we teach our
children the appropriate names,so that if they do need to
disclose whether to us orsomebody else that they have the
appropriately appropriateterminology to share that with
the appropriate people,
Unknown (04:09):
and that is definitely worth any discomfort, because,
yeah, I mean just imagining thatlittle girl and and another
thing happens too, you know,whenever she tries to report
this And it's treated like nobig deal, because they don't
understand what she's saying,right? You're thinking, then,
oh, I guess this is okay.
Stephanie Olson (04:28):
It's okay, or I'm not being heard, or no one
really cares. I mean, there's somany things that can come from
something like that and it, youknow, it really doesn't matter
what body part we're talkingabout. We need to teach them the
anatomically correct terms sothat when they do report, if
(04:52):
they do report, not when if theydo have to report, they people
understand what they're talkingabout. And it's
Unknown (04:59):
also a protection. To factor against that abuse ever
occurring. There have beenconversations with convicted. I
don't know if I can say P word,people who are offenders,
convented offenders, yeah, forwords, yeah. I know we're we
have to be so careful, which isironic, which is ironic, yes,
(05:20):
but offenders of children whohad been convicted and
imprisoned, and they have evenconfirmed, you know, if a child
will say you can't touch myanatomically correct body part,
they are less likely becausethey know, oh, that's a child
who's been talked to. Yes,they're probably going to tell
Stephanie Olson (05:40):
exactly this is somebody that knows this, which
means, yes, to your point,they've had these conversations
with their loved ones, and sothis is not going to be, it's
not going to be an easy mark forthem, so to speak. Yeah, that's
not
Unknown (05:56):
move on to someone who hasn't, which is important,
right to know, because we allneed to be having these
conversations. We don't want
Stephanie Olson (06:03):
to make it exactly and so let's make sure
that all of our kids become thatperson who, you know, they go to
next and then, okay, that's notgoing to work, and next. And
that is what education is allabout. From a very young age.
I'll say it again. I've said it100 times, but when people ask
(06:23):
me, at what age do you starttalking to your child about sex
so early that they don'tremember when you started the
conversation? And that's ageappropriate. You know, we want
to do it in appropriate way thatthey understand, that they can
relate to, that they'recomfortable with. We don't want
(06:44):
to be giving children adultconversations and topics, but we
do want to have thoseconversations at an age
appropriate and developmentallyappropriate way to our youth as
as young as very beginning.
Unknown (07:03):
And I do want to, I want to say too, just to
clarify, yeah, so saying thosecorrect terms makes it less
likely, but it's not 100% sothey're like, We need to be
still watching and everything.
But I just wanted to make alittle disclaimer about that, in
case you're listening and youthink, Oh, well, that happened
to me or someone I know, and wedid not your fault, right?
Active factor that we can share?
Stephanie Olson (07:29):
Yeah, I that's a great point. And of course, we
know, and whether you have beenessayed, whether your child has
been essayed, somebody in yourfamily, it is not the person's
fault who has been essayed. Itis the perpetrators fault all of
the time, 100% of the time, nomatter what. And so I do think
(07:51):
that's a very important thing toshare, and I and I think to that
point, you know, it's reallyinteresting, and I'm just going
to go here for a little bit, andwe can keep talking about some
other stuff, but I just heardsomebody share that they were
essayed as a child, and theirmom talked to law enforcement,
(08:15):
and law enforcement said, You donot want to put them through a
trial, through prosecution, allof those things. And so mom came
back and said, We're not goingto pursue this. We're not going
to do anything out ofprotection. But what this child
(08:37):
heard and carried for the restof her life, until healing
really started to set in, wasyou aren't worth pursuing
action, and I do think we haveto be really careful how we
(08:58):
respond and and that we do it ina way that teaches our youth. I
will go to the ends of the earthto protect you. It doesn't
matter, and you are my toppriority, and that can be done
(09:22):
in different ways. And I'm notsaying that everything should I
mean. I'm personally all aboutreporting and making sure that
this perpetrator doesn't do itagain. And yet, every situation
is very different. Somesituations are beyond the
statute of limitations, and soreporting is no longer an
(09:46):
option, or whatever the case maybe, but regardless, as parents
and caregivers, we need to givethat impression verbally,
physically, that you are thepriority. And we will protect
you through this.
Unknown (10:03):
Absolutely, I'm glad you brought that up.
Stephanie Olson (10:05):
Yeah, I hear a lot of stories. In fact, I know
one personally, like I know thepeople where a young girl was
essayed by dad. So it wasbiological dad essayed by dad.
(10:26):
Mom protected dad, and so didn'tdo anything. You know, it'll
never happen again. And then thefamily protected dad, and
actually the daughter then stillhad a relationship with dad,
(10:46):
still brought her kids around.
Now grandpa and Grandpa essayedthe grandchildren. I think what
happened was grandpa also, orthis guy essayed somebody else's
child so out of the family, alsolike a friend, and that person
(11:06):
pursued prosecution, and hewound up getting convicted and
spent time in prison and woundup dying in prison. It was it,
but I remember thinking that thepain of that child who was
originally essayed, because notonly did the essay happen, but
(11:34):
mom didn't protect her, andwhether you recognize that early
on as a child as that's notprotection or it, you do
understand it, it traumatizesyou, and so that does come out
later in life, and therecognition that this person
(11:57):
didn't protect me. Who shouldhave protected me is really
important. That's a really bigthing. Yeah, my goodness,
Unknown (12:08):
it's hard. What a heartbreaking story, yes, and to
know, not isolated either, thatthat happens all over right?
Stephanie Olson (12:18):
And the reality is, and I think this is
important to say that is neverone and done. You know? I mean,
if you see that happening,whether in your family, somebody
else's, you have to have theexpectation that that will
happen again, if not to thatindividual, to another
(12:39):
individual, and so just beingmindful of that piece, I think,
is important,
Unknown (12:44):
and that can be really hard to accept.
Stephanie Olson (12:47):
But yeah, yeah for sure. So, so talk about some
other boundaries that just wentreally heavy right away.
Unknown (13:02):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, like we said, we're not we're not
scared of saying stuff. We'renot scared. We are not so yes,
body boundaries, I really startwith that foundation of being
able to talk about things in themost accurate way. Another
foundational piece, I believe,is developing that relationship
(13:22):
with your children to where theywill ask you or talk to you if
something else, and you did awhole episode on that,
Stephanie Olson (13:29):
yeah, yeah, that that has to start with all
of the conversations that wedon't care about, that your Kids
want to talk about, and makingthem a priority. And I always
say that when your kids walkinto the room, or the kids that
(13:50):
you're serving, or whomever thatyou Your eyes should light up
like there is no one else moreimportant in your world right at
that moment. And I think that'swhere it starts, because you
can't have a conversation with akiddo that is, like, super heavy
(14:11):
and deep, if that, if that'syour first real conversation,
not gonna really happen. It'snot gonna work. Now let
Unknown (14:18):
us look at you like, why are you doing this? Yeah,
Stephanie Olson (14:21):
why are you torturing both of us right now?
Yes, yeah, so go ahead and speakto that a little bit.
Unknown (14:30):
Yeah. I I see this with my littles, and it's that I want
to show you, this tower I builtover and unlike you, just put
one more block on it. It hasn'teven changed. But it's
important. We need to appreciateit, and it
Stephanie Olson (14:44):
makes it really does. It really does.
Unknown (14:47):
So once those foundational pieces are laid,
then we start talking aboutboundaries in themselves, and
what is a boundary? So how wouldyou describe that? And when
would you describe that?
Boundaries?
Stephanie Olson (15:00):
Are one of my favorite conversations in the
world. Seriously, I could talkabout boundaries all day long,
and it's not because they'reeasy to set or easy to do, but
they're so important and we allneed to get it so this is how I
define boundaries. I defined,define boundaries as they're
(15:23):
they're like fences, and fencescan keep us in or keep us out,
so they can protect usinternally, or they can keep
other people out to keep usprotected. So that's how I look
at it. And a boundary can be assimple as, please don't call me
(15:47):
past nine o'clock because I'msleeping after nine, although
that's where Do Not Disturb onyour phone comes in. I say I
live and die by that that'sreally important, but that could
be a boundary. Just don't callme past or you know, once I'm
with my family in the evening,that's my family time, unless
(16:08):
it's an emergency, I'm not gonnabe on the phone whatever that
could be a boundary, or assevere as you are, not a safe
person in my life, and I nolonger want contact with you,
and I no longer want to to havea relationship with you. So I
(16:32):
think boundaries can look like anumber of different things like
that.
Unknown (16:37):
Yeah. And so teaching kids about boundaries that can
start. I mean, really, reallylittle. I actually, I talked to
my littles about that. I've gota four year old and a two year
old, and like you might hear mytwo year old say, respect my
boundary when he's mad.
Stephanie Olson (16:56):
That's right, that's fabulous, by the way. But
yes, we've talked
Unknown (17:00):
about it. And so usually them, it's, you know, I
just, I try to introduce thelanguage, because it's important
that they have that language andthat they know that they can set
it so, right? Instead of, youknow, my brother pushed down my
tower, and I'm gonna, you know,push him over, I say, okay,
look, you can say, I'm asking toplay alone right now. Please
respect that, right? And so isit flawless?
Stephanie Olson (17:23):
No, no, but I have to interject. I have to
interject because I have heardRebecca on the phone copious
amounts of time talking to her.
You are such a good mom. I justlove hearing you talk to your
kids, because I, I don'tremember being that amazing or
that gentle. I, you know, I'msure it's it all changes in your
(17:48):
mind at some point, but you'rejust so compassionate and
caring, and you have such agreat way with you. And I feel
like I was always like, stop.
You know, don't hate yourbrother, whatever you just are.
So sometimes too, you are justvery gentle and compassionate. I
(18:09):
love that, so I digress,
Unknown (18:14):
yes to that. I mean body boundaries, specifically we
I don't know. You can tell me, Idon't know that this is the
right thing to do. It's justkind of what we've done that's
been okay for us, but we gothrough scenarios. And so
especially me, it's just me andthe kids. And so I've, you know,
(18:35):
I'm outnumbered, and so I tryvery hard to help them
understand, like we have rulesfor a reason we need to know. So
if someone ever makes you feeluncomfortable, what do you do?
You tell mom. Yeah, thishappens. What do you do? You and
all the answers are you tellmom. Always tell mom. And so I
just try to drill that intotheir heads. But one of the
(18:55):
things we've talked about too,is if someone touches your body
in a way that you don't like.
You ask them to stop, and youtell Mom, is there anything that
you would add to that?
Stephanie Olson (19:08):
Well, I think that's great. And I would add
that there is absolutely noright or wrong to that. So for
example, if somebody wants tohold your hand. Let's it's a
friend at school, a littlepreschool friend, that wants to
hold your hand. And if you don'tfeel comfortable holding that
friend's hand, you get to say, Idon't feel comfortable holding
(19:31):
my friend's hand. And, you know,and talk to mom, I, I think
hugging, you know, things likethat. So that's the only thing I
would add that it doesn't haveto be, you know, I know a lot of
people talk about if somebodytouches you in your bathing suit
areas, is what, what they callit sometimes. And of course, we
(19:51):
would use those anatomicallycorrect terms with our with our
children, but I think it isimportant that we just let them
know. It doesn't matter that youdon't have to hug somebody, that
you don't have to let somebodytouch you on. You know, it's
different. If you have a twoyear old and mom's picking you
(20:12):
up and they don't want to bepicked up, that's a totally
different thing. And and you canexplain that to youth too, like
these are the differences theythey're smart, they get it. But,
yeah, I think that's reallyimportant. That doesn't matter
what it is you tell mom and butyou could also tell that person,
no, thank you. So I love that.
How do
Unknown (20:33):
you think that conversation shifts as children
age? You know, you've had kidsthat have completely grown up,
so you've been through all thosestages. What have you noticed?
Stephanie Olson (20:42):
Completely grown up. I will do those air
quotes too. Yes.
Um, gosh, you know, I don't. Ithink the only thing that
doesn't change, or that doeschange with that conversation,
(21:06):
is with adults. You maybe don'thave to go and tell your mom,
right? You can, and if mom's asafe place, that's great, but
that you should if it, if it issomething that you don't feel
comfortable with and it's notegregious, yeah, please don't
touch me or don't post that onsocial media. I don't want to
(21:28):
hug. I'm not a hugger. Whateverit is, you get to say no and
keep doing that. It's good to dothat. But if it's something that
is a problem and that kind ofgoes into the essay area, then,
who are your safe adults thatyou can talk to, who are the
people in your life and andwe're talking adults right now,
but so other safe adults who arethe people in your life that you
(21:51):
do feel comfortable going to andletting them know, because that
stuff you should never have tokeep to yourself, let somebody
else bear that burden with you
Unknown (22:02):
absolutely and so there's another piece to this,
where we see language kind ofshifting, because you used to
hear a lot about like, goodtouches versus bad touch, right?
But we've seen that this is notvery helpful anymore, because
the reality is even a touch thatwe would call bad, like an
(22:23):
inappropriate touch, wouldpossibly produce some kind of
physical sensation that kidswould sit with bad. So how do
you how do you keep that in mindwhen you're having these
conversations? How do you shiftthat language?
Stephanie Olson (22:39):
Yes, I think that that's it's so good that
we're talking about this,because good touch, bad touch is
subjective, right? A hug couldbe bad touch to somebody, and
that's okay, that's a goodthing, right? And or it's not a
good thing, it's not a bad it'sa neutral thing, but it's not a
bad thing. Yeah, at the sametime, we do know that our bodies
(23:03):
respond to touch in aphysiological way that's normal.
That's a positive thing that'snot in control. It's nothing we
can control. And so I think thatthat has been very confusing for
people who have been essayed,particularly people, young
(23:24):
people who have neverexperienced that before, or this
is a new sensation, or whateverthat it it may absolutely feel
good, so to speak, but thatdoesn't make it appropriate, and
it's so I and I've actuallyheard this from people who are
(23:48):
perpetrators, and their theirrationale is, well, they liked
it because They responded thatdoes not mean anything, and
shame on you, right? So I thinkthat we need to be really well.
(24:09):
And again, this, this comes tojust saying what it is, being
honest, being open,communicating in a way that is
clear. And so if, if you'retalking about some sort of essay
from somebody else, you want tobe really clear what that is and
(24:30):
what that might look like. And Ithink there's nothing wrong with
teaching kids your body doesreact to things, because it's
your body, it it's reactive attimes. And so, yeah, what are
your thoughts?
Unknown (24:46):
Yeah, I I like what you're saying. I think it's that
is probably the mostuncomfortable piece of this. And
so because of that, I thinkit's, it's a lot easier to
ignore, right? Yeah. We don'twant to go there. But for
someone, especially someonewho's young, who may experience
(25:07):
abuse, if you haven't talkedabout it, there's shame that
comes with that. Yeah, you know,you've heard survivors talk
about you know, I didn't want totell anyone, because my body
right? That means I was okaywith it. It doesn't, yeah. And
so I like the idea of, you know,helping them understand that
your body might respond, butthat doesn't mean that you're
(25:29):
okay with it, and it doesn'tmean that you've done anything
wrong, right? Absolutely. And Ithink just as we're talking it
makes me think of, I'm very bigon object lessons. I love a good
object lesson. It makes me thinkof ice, like in a good way, that
I might teach this to my kids,and I'm literally brainstorming
this as we're talking. I lovethis, yeah, um, putting a piece
(25:52):
of ice on your skin, like yourbody will react to that. If you
hold it there long, if it willgo numb, yeah, control that. You
did not make your skin go numb.
It's the ice doing that, right?
Does that mean that you evenlike that sensation? It is
something happens. And so Ithink it might be a way I
explain it to them when they'rea little bit good, I like that.
Stephanie Olson (26:11):
That's really good, yeah. And then maybe tell
them, don't hold ice on thereand don't do that.
Unknown (26:20):
Like I said, brainstorming in real time.
Stephanie Olson (26:25):
No, that is great. Yeah, no, I think that's
a really good piece of advice onthat. And I was thinking of
something else. Hold on justsecond that made me think
maybe I'll come to it. So whatother boundaries with youth do
(26:47):
you think are important to putinto place?
Unknown (26:50):
Well, something I always tell my kids, and
honestly, any kid that willlisten, I just I think this
should be public. PublicKnowledge is that we don't keep
Stephanie Olson (27:00):
secrets. Okay, this is a good one. I want to
talk about this a little bit.
Unknown (27:05):
Yeah, yeah. It doesn't matter what it's about, whether
it's about your body, whetherit's about, you know, a gift,
whatever, we do not keepsecrets. And so if anyone tells
you to keep a secret, you comeand tell me immediately. And so
far they have, which is great,there's still so little. I hope
it continues that way. Butliterally, the other day, my
(27:25):
daughter had said, someone askedme if I wanted a sucker, and
they said, to keep it a secretfrom you, but I won't. And I'm
like, good job. You can have oneinteresting because she knows.
And like, you tell me all thetime, yeah, and I think probably
a broken record. I feel like Isay that more than anything
else. You just, you tell me,yeah. I think sometimes you know
(27:48):
that this can be our littlesecret, and that is a way that
women can start too. It canstart with, will you keep my
secret about this innocuousthing?
Stephanie Olson (27:56):
Yes, exactly.
Okay, so here's my challengethat I hear all the time. I just
I want to hear your thoughts onthis. So I had a grandma who was
throwing a surprise party forher son told her grandkids about
it, which I wouldn't have donethat I learned the very hard way
not to tell kids about presentsand things like that, because
(28:21):
they will Blab. So just Yeah,keep it to yourself. But so she
told her grandkids, and thensaid, Don't Tell dad. This is a
secret talk about
Unknown (28:34):
that. I would hope that they would go tell their dad. I
mean, the words could triggerthat response of like, oh, you
told me a secret. I'm gonna tellit Yes. In that, I tell my kids
that there's a differencebetween Secrets and Surprises.
Okay, yep, surprises you canshare with some people,
Stephanie Olson (28:52):
and you can share with everyone at a certain
time. So like the surpriseparty, you can't tell dad, but
you can tell mom, and it alwayseverybody finds out in the end.
So it's not a it's not a secretthat stays a secret. It's not
our little secret. It'ssomething that everybody finds
(29:13):
out. Yeah, right.
Unknown (29:15):
So, yeah, surprise party, you can tell mom or
whoever else, and then on theday of the party, dad will know
too, it will be public, right?
And I never get in trouble. Ifyou accidentally tell a
surprise, you don't get introuble, right? No consequence,
Stephanie Olson (29:31):
yes, yes, yeah, that's good. I same things the
difference between a surpriseand a secret. And really, that's
kind of the only time I canthink of where you would be
telling somebody, don't tell soand so appropriately, you know a
kiddo that you would be sayingthat would be a surprise party
(29:54):
or present of some sort. So youdo have to be really careful.
And I. Think that goes back toappropriate verbiage. The word
secret has a whole differentconnotation to it. Yeah, that's
a that's good
Unknown (30:10):
and kind of with that.
If there's ever a situationwhere someone tells you, you
know, if you tell I will do X,Y, Z, that's an immediate red
flag too. You need to tell meright away, and you're not going
to get in trouble for that.
Yeah. For that. Yeah, and I'vetried to, you know, one of my
one of my kids, actually askedme the other day when we were
kind of going through some ofthis stuff again. Um, well, what
(30:32):
happens if they want to hurtyou? Which I said, Look at my
muscles, which are actuallyconsistent, but handle it. They
have
Stephanie Olson (30:42):
to get through me first. Yeah, that's good,
Unknown (30:48):
though, yeah. I mean, there's, there is no
consequence. You will never bein trouble for telling me the
truth, and I try to live thatout in other things too, like
you do something wrong, you tellme the truth. You're not in
trouble for telling me. We'restill going to have to right the
wrong, whatever it is, butyou're it's automatically less
if you just tell me the truth,because I want to get across how
(31:08):
important that is.
Stephanie Olson (31:09):
Yeah. Okay, so how do you then respond to the
well, what if they say they'regoing to hurt you? Because you
really do have to respond tothat at some point. Right? And
likelihood and here's, here'sthe hard thing, because the
likelihood is the majority ofpeople who say that will not
(31:30):
follow through with that. And sowe can legitimately say that the
chances of that happening arenot high. You don't ever want to
make a promise like that willnever happen. You You don't want
to indicate that. I mean, youcan never say never. But I think
to really highlight that, thatthat probably won't happen. And
(31:55):
most people who say that won't,won't actually do anything. It's
just a scare tactic. Yeah.
Unknown (32:03):
And I think commuting, communicating that to our kids
is fine. You know, this is a waythat sometimes people who want
to do harm will try to scare youinto Not telling. But you need
to tell anyways. And same thingif they threaten to hurt you. I
mean, you need, you need to tellanyways, because that's the only
way we can get out of thesituation.
Stephanie Olson (32:22):
I used to tell my kids, all rules get broken,
like so, for example, ifsomebody I mean, we know, even
though most traffickedindividuals are not kidnapped,
we know that kidnapping doeshappen, right? And so I used to
tell my kids, if anybody everpicks you up, that is not
(32:47):
supposed to. There are no morerules on the table. If you're in
a store, you can kick TVs off,you can break things, you can
yell, you can shout, you canscream, whatever. There are no
rules, and I think that's animportant thing to really
communicate, because our kidsare taught, you know, don't
(33:09):
yell, whatever you do, don'tbreak something, don't touch
that. But once you're insurvival mode, all of those
rules are off the table.
Unknown (33:18):
I really, I really, really like that, yeah, because
I've told my kids, you know, ifsomeone were ever to try to take
you or keep you away from mom,you hurt them. But I didn't even
think about, you know, notthings off shelves draw
attention to yourself. So I'mgonna have to add that entire
conversation.
Stephanie Olson (33:34):
Yeah, yeah. I think that's really important.
Unfortunately, no one ever hadto use something like that, but
it is good for them to knowthat. Okay, so here's a boundary
I would love to talk to youabout. And this actually
happened to my adult daughter atwork, and it was like a, you
(33:59):
know, a fast food restaurant orwhatever. And she worked with,
or works with a lot of men, andthey called her babe, honey or
whatever. And so I asked her,what, what she said? And she, I
(34:22):
think she rolled her eyes intoanyway. I don't know. I can't
remember if I know. In my head,she didn't handle it the way I
would want her to handle it. Ican tell you that. And so I
said, you know, if somebodycalls you a name, I mean,
regardless of what the name is.
I'm not talking about like anecessarily like a mean name,
but if somebody calls you a namethat you're not comfortable
(34:47):
with, I don't even care. Like ii personally go by Stephanie.
There are some people who callme stuff and I. Actually okay
with certain people, if I've hadrelationships with them for a
long time. My husband alwayscalled me Steph, and so all of
(35:08):
his friends called me Steph. Andso there's certain people I
have, some people in in ascolleagues, who I've been
colleagues with for a long time,who call me Steph, but I
personally don't love the nameSteph, and so when I'm on the
phone with a salesperson, forexample, and they're like, hey,
Steph, how are you I always saymy name is Stephanie, because
(35:30):
you've not earned the right tocall me. Steph, yes. And I think
that's very like, you see, myname is Stephanie. I think it's
very I don't know what's theword like. It's quite an
assumption to call me by anickname, in my opinion, if
you've never met me in my entirelife. So that is like a non
(35:51):
extreme form of that and and andto be okay with. Actually, my
name is Stephanie, or ifsomebody mispronounces your
name, or whatever. But if, ifsome guy is calling me babe or
honey or sweetie, I'mimmediately gonna respond. My
(36:11):
name is not Sweetie, it'sStephanie. And then if they
continue that, you're no longerin my presence, right? I mean,
there's nothing I'm not gonnaand if that's my boss, for
example, Even so, I mean, itwasn't her boss, but, I mean,
even so, I would take care ofthat, right? So, but yeah, talk
(36:34):
about that a little bit.
Unknown (36:39):
Well, I think there's a few different ways you can
approach it. So, you know, Imean, everyone has different
comfort levels, but if it'ssomething that you're not
comfortable with, I mean, youryour direct approach, that's
great. Yeah, I sometimesstruggle being direct. Like, if
it's about my kids,
Stephanie Olson (36:55):
yes, you have no problem, right?
Unknown (36:59):
I struggle with that interesting to say something
more like, Oh, that's reallyweird. You would call me that
and then just continue whateverI'm doing. Or that's funny. I
don't know that your wife wouldlike
Stephanie Olson (37:10):
that. Yeah, that's good. I don't think so.
Yeah, yeah, you can absolutely.
I mean, obviously this is nolonger I mean youth, obviously,
if you're six, you're not goingto say, but also teaching
littles to be able to say myname is, or I like to be called
to scan, that is, it is a verygood thing. And then to be to be
(37:36):
confident in that. And, yeah,I've, I've, I've accidentally
called people. Oh my gosh, Iknow what it was. This is, this
is funny. I met a woman and wehad a coffee. So I'm it was like
I met her at a networking thing,and we were talking, and I kept
calling her the wrong name thewhole time we were we were
(38:00):
talking, and finally I knew theowner of the restaurant, and she
came over, and I said, this isthe owner of the restaurant. And
the woman introduced herselfwith her real name with a real
name. And I said, Oh my gosh. Iso I actually said, Oh my gosh.
(38:24):
I've been calling you such andsuch this entire time. Why
didn't you tell me what you
Unknown (38:38):
she committed she's like, that's my name. Now, okay,
Stephanie Olson (38:40):
I know. Well, so that's what, yeah. I was
like, well, now your name isthis. You know, Jesus actually
changed a lot of names. He wouldgo around. Your name is no
longer solid as Paul. It's nolonger Yeah, so that is, that is
what I decided to do with her.
But yeah, I was like, Why didn'tyou tell me that wasn't your
name? If somebody calls me Susanover and over again, I'm going
(39:04):
to say something. My mom doesthat because her sister's name
is Susan, and my name isStephanie, and so she calls me
Sue all the time. And I'll belike, yeah, Stephanie, but
that's a mom. Moms get your namewrong, and that's okay. Oh,
yeah, that was important to
Unknown (39:23):
see a world where kids are taught that, that it's okay
to yourself, and as adults,they're not uncomfortable about
it. They just respectfully, andthat's the keyword, too,
respectfully, yeah, to be rude.
Stephanie Olson (39:36):
It's it absolutely you can say
everything very respectfully.
And you I think the bottom lineis people don't want to
embarrass somebody or make themfeel bad, but I was absolutely
more embarrassed when I foundout I had been calling her the
wrong name for the last hour. SoI think that is. Just because at
(39:58):
some point you have to tellsomebody, right?
Unknown (40:03):
You were gonna find out eventually, right?
Stephanie Olson (40:07):
Maybe, I guess, or I just call her that name for
the rest of Yeah, I just, Ithink that is a really important
piece that we do feelcomfortable saying, No, that's
actually not what I like to becalled. I like to be called
this.
Unknown (40:23):
So I was just talking to a child, a kindergarten age
child in our family, and thechild was telling me that their
teacher
Stephanie Olson (40:35):
was a yeller.
Oh,
Unknown (40:38):
I'm like, Oh, that's really unfortunate. And so this
child, I'm trying not toidentify so hard, but saying,
you know, my teacher yelled atme, and it hurt my feelings, and
I don't want to ask anymore togo to the bathroom.
Stephanie Olson (40:51):
Oh, sad, really
Unknown (40:53):
sensitive little one.
And so what I said to this childis, it's okay. What you need to
do next time is say, hey, Yes,Ma'am, can you please talk to me
nicer? And that is totally okay.
And if you get in trouble forthat, you call me
Stephanie Olson (41:10):
yes for that, yes. So that's what I try
Unknown (41:14):
to teach, even my kids.
You know, that's good. I'm gonnalisten to what you're saying.
Stephanie Olson (41:18):
Also, please be nice. Don't like Right, right?
Unknown (41:27):
Yeah, no, that's no matter what age you are, you
should be able to say that,please talk nicer to me.
Stephanie Olson (41:31):
I think that's very important. Yeah, wow.
That's good. I love it. Well,anything else on boundaries or,
I mean, we could talk aboutboundaries for ever, ever,
because boundaries just are thisand I and what I've noticed is
that when people are in abusivesituations, boundaries are much
(41:58):
harder, and so it is reallyhelping with those boundaries
early on, so that if anunhealthy situation arises, or a
relationship that's notappropriate, or a relationship
that is appropriate, but thenall of A sudden turns abusive,
(42:20):
and now it's not anymore thatyou recognize that right away,
so that when if somebody crossesthat boundary, you are really
comfortable saying, Hey, youjust crossed my boundary. Don't
do that again. They do thatagain. Now we're done and and so
I do think that's one of thethings. People who do harm
(42:44):
really count on the fact thatyou're not going to be strong
enough to set a boundary andthen ask somebody to follow
through with that. And I thinkif we can teach that at a very
young age, our kids will be muchsafer. It'll help them for life.
Yeah, for sure. Well, this wasgood. I like this. It started
out really hard. Hopefully wewent a little lighter. We got
(43:06):
lighter as we went,
Unknown (43:10):
well, good stuff.
Revisit this later and go intomore even as adults.
Stephanie Olson (43:16):
I love boundaries. Yeah, it's a good
conversation. So I agree. Let's,let's talk about boundaries
again as adults, and what thosecan look like and why they're so
important. And, yeah, thatsounds good. Awesome, yeah.
Well, thank you. All right.
Well, we appreciate your time,and we will see you next time
(43:37):
get some R and R, bye. You.
Stephanie, hello and welcome to resilience
and relationships R and R, I amStephanie Olson, and I'm here
with Mecca Saunders, yay. Sookay, we are going to talk. I
love this topic, but it'suncomfortable for some people, I
know, but we're going to talkabout body boundaries with
(00:38):
youth. Do you want to kind ofstart that conversation of what,
what we mean by that, what youmean by
Unknown (00:44):
that. So what? It's definitely one of those
conversations that is necessary.
Can feel extremelyuncomfortable, but it doesn't
have to. But what we're talkingabout is, how do you talk to
your kids, and we'll go throughwhat different ages, how this
looks different. But how do youtalk to your kids about what are
and are not appropriate thingswith their body. So, yeah, no,
what boundaries should you haveup? Can those change from person
(01:05):
to person? What does that looklike?
Stephanie Olson (01:09):
Right, right?
And, you know, I've, I've seensome really interesting things
with with boundaries, but Ithink it really starts with one
very important piece of that isteaching your youth the
anatomically correct body partnames. And I think for some
(01:34):
reason that is uncomfortable forparents and caregivers to do
sometimes. I'm not sure why, butwhat we know is there are real
dangerous problems if you don'tname those correctly, two
Unknown (01:56):
and four. And I can tell you that sometimes it is
awkward that when my son willscream out, you know, don't
touch my body part when I'mchanging, right? Well, it's
awkward, yeah, yeah, thebenefits definitely outweigh the
risks. And so what is that risk?
You want to explain that?
Stephanie Olson (02:15):
Yeah. So there was a, an actually, very well
known story about a or at leastwell known in our circles, about
a mom who taught her to say andwe are not going to be using
those terms only because of thealgorithm, not because we're
(02:36):
ashamed of those terms, But webecause we don't want YouTube
specifically to not allow thisto go anywhere you actually get
to see the podcast. Yes, it'simportant. So there was a mom
who actually taught her daughterto name her body part cookie,
(02:57):
and instead of the V body part.
And so she actually did get SAby a male family member. And she
told her teacher, who sheconsidered to be her safe adult.
And she went and told herteacher, my daddy, or whomever
it was, has been touching mycookie well to the teacher, she
(03:23):
thought she was actually talkingabout like a chocolate chip
cookie that you eat, andsomebody was trying to touch her
cookie or steal her cookie, orwhatever. And the SA went, even
though disclosed by the littlegirl went on reported because
the teacher, at first didn'tunderstand what was actually
(03:48):
being reported. And so it'simportant that we teach our
children the appropriate names,so that if they do need to
disclose whether to us orsomebody else that they have the
appropriately appropriateterminology to share that with
the appropriate people,
Unknown (04:09):
and that is definitely worth any discomfort, because,
yeah, I mean just imagining thatlittle girl and and another
thing happens too, you know,whenever she tries to report
this And it's treated like nobig deal, because they don't
understand what she's saying,right? You're thinking, then,
oh, I guess this is okay.
Stephanie Olson (04:28):
It's okay, or I'm not being heard, or no one
really cares. I mean, there's somany things that can come from
something like that and it, youknow, it really doesn't matter
what body part we're talkingabout. We need to teach them the
anatomically correct terms sothat when they do report, if
(04:52):
they do report, not when if theydo have to report, they people
understand what they're talkingabout. And it's
Unknown (04:59):
also a protection. To factor against that abuse ever
occurring. There have beenconversations with convicted. I
don't know if I can say P word,people who are offenders,
convented offenders, yeah, forwords, yeah. I know we're we
have to be so careful, which isironic, which is ironic, yes,
(05:20):
but offenders of children whohad been convicted and
imprisoned, and they have evenconfirmed, you know, if a child
will say you can't touch myanatomically correct body part,
they are less likely becausethey know, oh, that's a child
who's been talked to. Yes,they're probably going to tell
Stephanie Olson (05:40):
exactly this is somebody that knows this, which
means, yes, to your point,they've had these conversations
with their loved ones, and sothis is not going to be, it's
not going to be an easy mark forthem, so to speak. Yeah, that's
not
Unknown (05:56):
move on to someone who hasn't, which is important,
right to know, because we allneed to be having these
conversations. We don't want
Stephanie Olson (06:03):
to make it exactly and so let's make sure
that all of our kids become thatperson who, you know, they go to
next and then, okay, that's notgoing to work, and next. And
that is what education is allabout. From a very young age.
I'll say it again. I've said it100 times, but when people ask
(06:23):
me, at what age do you starttalking to your child about sex
so early that they don'tremember when you started the
conversation? And that's ageappropriate. You know, we want
to do it in appropriate way thatthey understand, that they can
relate to, that they'recomfortable with. We don't want
(06:44):
to be giving children adultconversations and topics, but we
do want to have thoseconversations at an age
appropriate and developmentallyappropriate way to our youth as
as young as very beginning.
Unknown (07:03):
And I do want to, I want to say too, just to
clarify, yeah, so saying thosecorrect terms makes it less
likely, but it's not 100% sothey're like, We need to be
still watching and everything.
But I just wanted to make alittle disclaimer about that, in
case you're listening and youthink, Oh, well, that happened
to me or someone I know, and wedid not your fault, right?
Active factor that we can share?
Stephanie Olson (07:29):
Yeah, I that's a great point. And of course, we
know, and whether you have beenessayed, whether your child has
been essayed, somebody in yourfamily, it is not the person's
fault who has been essayed. Itis the perpetrators fault all of
the time, 100% of the time, nomatter what. And so I do think
(07:51):
that's a very important thing toshare, and I and I think to that
point, you know, it's reallyinteresting, and I'm just going
to go here for a little bit, andwe can keep talking about some
other stuff, but I just heardsomebody share that they were
essayed as a child, and theirmom talked to law enforcement,
(08:15):
and law enforcement said, You donot want to put them through a
trial, through prosecution, allof those things. And so mom came
back and said, We're not goingto pursue this. We're not going
to do anything out ofprotection. But what this child
(08:37):
heard and carried for the restof her life, until healing
really started to set in, wasyou aren't worth pursuing
action, and I do think we haveto be really careful how we
(08:58):
respond and and that we do it ina way that teaches our youth. I
will go to the ends of the earthto protect you. It doesn't
matter, and you are my toppriority, and that can be done
(09:22):
in different ways. And I'm notsaying that everything should I
mean. I'm personally all aboutreporting and making sure that
this perpetrator doesn't do itagain. And yet, every situation
is very different. Somesituations are beyond the
statute of limitations, and soreporting is no longer an
(09:46):
option, or whatever the case maybe, but regardless, as parents
and caregivers, we need to givethat impression verbally,
physically, that you are thepriority. And we will protect
you through this.
Unknown (10:03):
Absolutely, I'm glad you brought that up.
Stephanie Olson (10:05):
Yeah, I hear a lot of stories. In fact, I know
one personally, like I know thepeople where a young girl was
essayed by dad. So it wasbiological dad essayed by dad.
(10:26):
Mom protected dad, and so didn'tdo anything. You know, it'll
never happen again. And then thefamily protected dad, and
actually the daughter then stillhad a relationship with dad,
(10:46):
still brought her kids around.
Now grandpa and Grandpa essayedthe grandchildren. I think what
happened was grandpa also, orthis guy essayed somebody else's
child so out of the family, alsolike a friend, and that person
(11:06):
pursued prosecution, and hewound up getting convicted and
spent time in prison and woundup dying in prison. It was it,
but I remember thinking that thepain of that child who was
originally essayed, because notonly did the essay happen, but
(11:34):
mom didn't protect her, andwhether you recognize that early
on as a child as that's notprotection or it, you do
understand it, it traumatizesyou, and so that does come out
later in life, and therecognition that this person
(11:57):
didn't protect me. Who shouldhave protected me is really
important. That's a really bigthing. Yeah, my goodness,
Unknown (12:08):
it's hard. What a heartbreaking story, yes, and to
know, not isolated either, thatthat happens all over right?
Stephanie Olson (12:18):
And the reality is, and I think this is
important to say that is neverone and done. You know? I mean,
if you see that happening,whether in your family, somebody
else's, you have to have theexpectation that that will
happen again, if not to thatindividual, to another
(12:39):
individual, and so just beingmindful of that piece, I think,
is important,
Unknown (12:44):
and that can be really hard to accept.
Stephanie Olson (12:47):
But yeah, yeah for sure. So, so talk about some
other boundaries that just wentreally heavy right away.
Unknown (13:02):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, like we said, we're not we're not
scared of saying stuff. We'renot scared. We are not so yes,
body boundaries, I really startwith that foundation of being
able to talk about things in themost accurate way. Another
foundational piece, I believe,is developing that relationship
(13:22):
with your children to where theywill ask you or talk to you if
something else, and you did awhole episode on that,
Stephanie Olson (13:29):
yeah, yeah, that that has to start with all
of the conversations that wedon't care about, that your Kids
want to talk about, and makingthem a priority. And I always
say that when your kids walkinto the room, or the kids that
(13:50):
you're serving, or whomever thatyou Your eyes should light up
like there is no one else moreimportant in your world right at
that moment. And I think that'swhere it starts, because you
can't have a conversation with akiddo that is, like, super heavy
(14:11):
and deep, if that, if that'syour first real conversation,
not gonna really happen. It'snot gonna work. Now let
Unknown (14:18):
us look at you like, why are you doing this? Yeah,
Stephanie Olson (14:21):
why are you torturing both of us right now?
Yes, yeah, so go ahead and speakto that a little bit.
Unknown (14:30):
Yeah. I I see this with my littles, and it's that I want
to show you, this tower I builtover and unlike you, just put
one more block on it. It hasn'teven changed. But it's
important. We need to appreciateit, and it
Stephanie Olson (14:44):
makes it really does. It really does.
Unknown (14:47):
So once those foundational pieces are laid,
then we start talking aboutboundaries in themselves, and
what is a boundary? So how wouldyou describe that? And when
would you describe that?
Boundaries?
Stephanie Olson (15:00):
Are one of my favorite conversations in the
world. Seriously, I could talkabout boundaries all day long,
and it's not because they'reeasy to set or easy to do, but
they're so important and we allneed to get it so this is how I
define boundaries. I defined,define boundaries as they're
(15:23):
they're like fences, and fencescan keep us in or keep us out,
so they can protect usinternally, or they can keep
other people out to keep usprotected. So that's how I look
at it. And a boundary can be assimple as, please don't call me
(15:47):
past nine o'clock because I'msleeping after nine, although
that's where Do Not Disturb onyour phone comes in. I say I
live and die by that that'sreally important, but that could
be a boundary. Just don't callme past or you know, once I'm
with my family in the evening,that's my family time, unless
(16:08):
it's an emergency, I'm not gonnabe on the phone whatever that
could be a boundary, or assevere as you are, not a safe
person in my life, and I nolonger want contact with you,
and I no longer want to to havea relationship with you. So I
(16:32):
think boundaries can look like anumber of different things like
that.
Unknown (16:37):
Yeah. And so teaching kids about boundaries that can
start. I mean, really, reallylittle. I actually, I talked to
my littles about that. I've gota four year old and a two year
old, and like you might hear mytwo year old say, respect my
boundary when he's mad.
Stephanie Olson (16:56):
That's right, that's fabulous, by the way. But
yes, we've talked
Unknown (17:00):
about it. And so usually them, it's, you know, I
just, I try to introduce thelanguage, because it's important
that they have that language andthat they know that they can set
it so, right? Instead of, youknow, my brother pushed down my
tower, and I'm gonna, you know,push him over, I say, okay,
look, you can say, I'm asking toplay alone right now. Please
respect that, right? And so isit flawless?
Stephanie Olson (17:23):
No, no, but I have to interject. I have to
interject because I have heardRebecca on the phone copious
amounts of time talking to her.
You are such a good mom. I justlove hearing you talk to your
kids, because I, I don'tremember being that amazing or
that gentle. I, you know, I'msure it's it all changes in your
(17:48):
mind at some point, but you'rejust so compassionate and
caring, and you have such agreat way with you. And I feel
like I was always like, stop.
You know, don't hate yourbrother, whatever you just are.
So sometimes too, you are justvery gentle and compassionate. I
(18:09):
love that, so I digress,
Unknown (18:14):
yes to that. I mean body boundaries, specifically we
I don't know. You can tell me, Idon't know that this is the
right thing to do. It's justkind of what we've done that's
been okay for us, but we gothrough scenarios. And so
especially me, it's just me andthe kids. And so I've, you know,
(18:35):
I'm outnumbered, and so I tryvery hard to help them
understand, like we have rulesfor a reason we need to know. So
if someone ever makes you feeluncomfortable, what do you do?
You tell mom. Yeah, thishappens. What do you do? You and
all the answers are you tellmom. Always tell mom. And so I
just try to drill that intotheir heads. But one of the
(18:55):
things we've talked about too,is if someone touches your body
in a way that you don't like.
You ask them to stop, and youtell Mom, is there anything that
you would add to that?
Stephanie Olson (19:08):
Well, I think that's great. And I would add
that there is absolutely noright or wrong to that. So for
example, if somebody wants tohold your hand. Let's it's a
friend at school, a littlepreschool friend, that wants to
hold your hand. And if you don'tfeel comfortable holding that
friend's hand, you get to say, Idon't feel comfortable holding
(19:31):
my friend's hand. And, you know,and talk to mom, I, I think
hugging, you know, things likethat. So that's the only thing I
would add that it doesn't haveto be, you know, I know a lot of
people talk about if somebodytouches you in your bathing suit
areas, is what, what they callit sometimes. And of course, we
(19:51):
would use those anatomicallycorrect terms with our with our
children, but I think it isimportant that we just let them
know. It doesn't matter that youdon't have to hug somebody, that
you don't have to let somebodytouch you on. You know, it's
different. If you have a twoyear old and mom's picking you
(20:12):
up and they don't want to bepicked up, that's a totally
different thing. And and you canexplain that to youth too, like
these are the differences theythey're smart, they get it. But,
yeah, I think that's reallyimportant. That doesn't matter
what it is you tell mom and butyou could also tell that person,
no, thank you. So I love that.
How do
Unknown (20:33):
you think that conversation shifts as children
age? You know, you've had kidsthat have completely grown up,
so you've been through all thosestages. What have you noticed?
Stephanie Olson (20:42):
Completely grown up. I will do those air
quotes too. Yes.
Um, gosh, you know, I don't. Ithink the only thing that
doesn't change, or that doeschange with that conversation,
(21:06):
is with adults. You maybe don'thave to go and tell your mom,
right? You can, and if mom's asafe place, that's great, but
that you should if it, if it issomething that you don't feel
comfortable with and it's notegregious, yeah, please don't
touch me or don't post that onsocial media. I don't want to
(21:28):
hug. I'm not a hugger. Whateverit is, you get to say no and
keep doing that. It's good to dothat. But if it's something that
is a problem and that kind ofgoes into the essay area, then,
who are your safe adults thatyou can talk to, who are the
people in your life and andwe're talking adults right now,
but so other safe adults who arethe people in your life that you
(21:51):
do feel comfortable going to andletting them know, because that
stuff you should never have tokeep to yourself, let somebody
else bear that burden with you
Unknown (22:02):
absolutely and so there's another piece to this,
where we see language kind ofshifting, because you used to
hear a lot about like, goodtouches versus bad touch, right?
But we've seen that this is notvery helpful anymore, because
the reality is even a touch thatwe would call bad, like an
(22:23):
inappropriate touch, wouldpossibly produce some kind of
physical sensation that kidswould sit with bad. So how do
you how do you keep that in mindwhen you're having these
conversations? How do you shiftthat language?
Stephanie Olson (22:39):
Yes, I think that that's it's so good that
we're talking about this,because good touch, bad touch is
subjective, right? A hug couldbe bad touch to somebody, and
that's okay, that's a goodthing, right? And or it's not a
good thing, it's not a bad it'sa neutral thing, but it's not a
bad thing. Yeah, at the sametime, we do know that our bodies
(23:03):
respond to touch in aphysiological way that's normal.
That's a positive thing that'snot in control. It's nothing we
can control. And so I think thatthat has been very confusing for
people who have been essayed,particularly people, young
(23:24):
people who have neverexperienced that before, or this
is a new sensation, or whateverthat it it may absolutely feel
good, so to speak, but thatdoesn't make it appropriate, and
it's so I and I've actuallyheard this from people who are
(23:48):
perpetrators, and their theirrationale is, well, they liked
it because They responded thatdoes not mean anything, and
shame on you, right? So I thinkthat we need to be really well.
(24:09):
And again, this, this comes tojust saying what it is, being
honest, being open,communicating in a way that is
clear. And so if, if you'retalking about some sort of essay
from somebody else, you want tobe really clear what that is and
(24:30):
what that might look like. And Ithink there's nothing wrong with
teaching kids your body doesreact to things, because it's
your body, it it's reactive attimes. And so, yeah, what are
your thoughts?
Unknown (24:46):
Yeah, I I like what you're saying. I think it's that
is probably the mostuncomfortable piece of this. And
so because of that, I thinkit's, it's a lot easier to
ignore, right? Yeah. We don'twant to go there. But for
someone, especially someonewho's young, who may experience
(25:07):
abuse, if you haven't talkedabout it, there's shame that
comes with that. Yeah, you know,you've heard survivors talk
about you know, I didn't want totell anyone, because my body
right? That means I was okaywith it. It doesn't, yeah. And
so I like the idea of, you know,helping them understand that
your body might respond, butthat doesn't mean that you're
(25:29):
okay with it, and it doesn'tmean that you've done anything
wrong, right? Absolutely. And Ithink just as we're talking it
makes me think of, I'm very bigon object lessons. I love a good
object lesson. It makes me thinkof ice, like in a good way, that
I might teach this to my kids,and I'm literally brainstorming
this as we're talking. I lovethis, yeah, um, putting a piece
(25:52):
of ice on your skin, like yourbody will react to that. If you
hold it there long, if it willgo numb, yeah, control that. You
did not make your skin go numb.
It's the ice doing that, right?
Does that mean that you evenlike that sensation? It is
something happens. And so Ithink it might be a way I
explain it to them when they'rea little bit good, I like that.
Stephanie Olson (26:11):
That's really good, yeah. And then maybe tell
them, don't hold ice on thereand don't do that.
Unknown (26:20):
Like I said, brainstorming in real time.
Stephanie Olson (26:25):
No, that is great. Yeah, no, I think that's
a really good piece of advice onthat. And I was thinking of
something else. Hold on justsecond that made me think
maybe I'll come to it. So whatother boundaries with youth do
(26:47):
you think are important to putinto place?
Unknown (26:50):
Well, something I always tell my kids, and
honestly, any kid that willlisten, I just I think this
should be public. PublicKnowledge is that we don't keep
Stephanie Olson (27:00):
secrets. Okay, this is a good one. I want to
talk about this a little bit.
Unknown (27:05):
Yeah, yeah. It doesn't matter what it's about, whether
it's about your body, whetherit's about, you know, a gift,
whatever, we do not keepsecrets. And so if anyone tells
you to keep a secret, you comeand tell me immediately. And so
far they have, which is great,there's still so little. I hope
it continues that way. Butliterally, the other day, my
(27:25):
daughter had said, someone askedme if I wanted a sucker, and
they said, to keep it a secretfrom you, but I won't. And I'm
like, good job. You can have oneinteresting because she knows.
And like, you tell me all thetime, yeah, and I think probably
a broken record. I feel like Isay that more than anything
else. You just, you tell me,yeah. I think sometimes you know
(27:48):
that this can be our littlesecret, and that is a way that
women can start too. It canstart with, will you keep my
secret about this innocuousthing?
Stephanie Olson (27:56):
Yes, exactly.
Okay, so here's my challengethat I hear all the time. I just
I want to hear your thoughts onthis. So I had a grandma who was
throwing a surprise party forher son told her grandkids about
it, which I wouldn't have donethat I learned the very hard way
not to tell kids about presentsand things like that, because
(28:21):
they will Blab. So just Yeah,keep it to yourself. But so she
told her grandkids, and thensaid, Don't Tell dad. This is a
secret talk about
Unknown (28:34):
that. I would hope that they would go tell their dad. I
mean, the words could triggerthat response of like, oh, you
told me a secret. I'm gonna tellit Yes. In that, I tell my kids
that there's a differencebetween Secrets and Surprises.
Okay, yep, surprises you canshare with some people,
Stephanie Olson (28:52):
and you can share with everyone at a certain
time. So like the surpriseparty, you can't tell dad, but
you can tell mom, and it alwayseverybody finds out in the end.
So it's not a it's not a secretthat stays a secret. It's not
our little secret. It'ssomething that everybody finds
(29:13):
out. Yeah, right.
Unknown (29:15):
So, yeah, surprise party, you can tell mom or
whoever else, and then on theday of the party, dad will know
too, it will be public, right?
And I never get in trouble. Ifyou accidentally tell a
surprise, you don't get introuble, right? No consequence,
Stephanie Olson (29:31):
yes, yes, yeah, that's good. I same things the
difference between a surpriseand a secret. And really, that's
kind of the only time I canthink of where you would be
telling somebody, don't tell soand so appropriately, you know a
kiddo that you would be sayingthat would be a surprise party
(29:54):
or present of some sort. So youdo have to be really careful.
And I. Think that goes back toappropriate verbiage. The word
secret has a whole differentconnotation to it. Yeah, that's
a that's good
Unknown (30:10):
and kind of with that.
If there's ever a situationwhere someone tells you, you
know, if you tell I will do X,Y, Z, that's an immediate red
flag too. You need to tell meright away, and you're not going
to get in trouble for that.
Yeah. For that. Yeah, and I'vetried to, you know, one of my
one of my kids, actually askedme the other day when we were
kind of going through some ofthis stuff again. Um, well, what
(30:32):
happens if they want to hurtyou? Which I said, Look at my
muscles, which are actuallyconsistent, but handle it. They
have
Stephanie Olson (30:42):
to get through me first. Yeah, that's good,
Unknown (30:48):
though, yeah. I mean, there's, there is no
consequence. You will never bein trouble for telling me the
truth, and I try to live thatout in other things too, like
you do something wrong, you tellme the truth. You're not in
trouble for telling me. We'restill going to have to right the
wrong, whatever it is, butyou're it's automatically less
if you just tell me the truth,because I want to get across how
(31:08):
important that is.
Stephanie Olson (31:09):
Yeah. Okay, so how do you then respond to the
well, what if they say they'regoing to hurt you? Because you
really do have to respond tothat at some point. Right? And
likelihood and here's, here'sthe hard thing, because the
likelihood is the majority ofpeople who say that will not
(31:30):
follow through with that. And sowe can legitimately say that the
chances of that happening arenot high. You don't ever want to
make a promise like that willnever happen. You You don't want
to indicate that. I mean, youcan never say never. But I think
to really highlight that, thatthat probably won't happen. And
(31:55):
most people who say that won't,won't actually do anything. It's
just a scare tactic. Yeah.
Unknown (32:03):
And I think commuting, communicating that to our kids
is fine. You know, this is a waythat sometimes people who want
to do harm will try to scare youinto Not telling. But you need
to tell anyways. And same thingif they threaten to hurt you. I
mean, you need, you need to tellanyways, because that's the only
way we can get out of thesituation.
Stephanie Olson (32:22):
I used to tell my kids, all rules get broken,
like so, for example, ifsomebody I mean, we know, even
though most traffickedindividuals are not kidnapped,
we know that kidnapping doeshappen, right? And so I used to
tell my kids, if anybody everpicks you up, that is not
(32:47):
supposed to. There are no morerules on the table. If you're in
a store, you can kick TVs off,you can break things, you can
yell, you can shout, you canscream, whatever. There are no
rules, and I think that's animportant thing to really
communicate, because our kidsare taught, you know, don't
(33:09):
yell, whatever you do, don'tbreak something, don't touch
that. But once you're insurvival mode, all of those
rules are off the table.
Unknown (33:18):
I really, I really, really like that, yeah, because
I've told my kids, you know, ifsomeone were ever to try to take
you or keep you away from mom,you hurt them. But I didn't even
think about, you know, notthings off shelves draw
attention to yourself. So I'mgonna have to add that entire
conversation.
Stephanie Olson (33:34):
Yeah, yeah. I think that's really important.
Unfortunately, no one ever hadto use something like that, but
it is good for them to knowthat. Okay, so here's a boundary
I would love to talk to youabout. And this actually
happened to my adult daughter atwork, and it was like a, you
(33:59):
know, a fast food restaurant orwhatever. And she worked with,
or works with a lot of men, andthey called her babe, honey or
whatever. And so I asked her,what, what she said? And she, I
(34:22):
think she rolled her eyes intoanyway. I don't know. I can't
remember if I know. In my head,she didn't handle it the way I
would want her to handle it. Ican tell you that. And so I
said, you know, if somebodycalls you a name, I mean,
regardless of what the name is.
I'm not talking about like anecessarily like a mean name,
but if somebody calls you a namethat you're not comfortable
(34:47):
with, I don't even care. Like ii personally go by Stephanie.
There are some people who callme stuff and I. Actually okay
with certain people, if I've hadrelationships with them for a
long time. My husband alwayscalled me Steph, and so all of
(35:08):
his friends called me Steph. Andso there's certain people I
have, some people in in ascolleagues, who I've been
colleagues with for a long time,who call me Steph, but I
personally don't love the nameSteph, and so when I'm on the
phone with a salesperson, forexample, and they're like, hey,
Steph, how are you I always saymy name is Stephanie, because
(35:30):
you've not earned the right tocall me. Steph, yes. And I think
that's very like, you see, myname is Stephanie. I think it's
very I don't know what's theword like. It's quite an
assumption to call me by anickname, in my opinion, if
you've never met me in my entirelife. So that is like a non
(35:51):
extreme form of that and and andto be okay with. Actually, my
name is Stephanie, or ifsomebody mispronounces your
name, or whatever. But if, ifsome guy is calling me babe or
honey or sweetie, I'mimmediately gonna respond. My
(36:11):
name is not Sweetie, it'sStephanie. And then if they
continue that, you're no longerin my presence, right? I mean,
there's nothing I'm not gonnaand if that's my boss, for
example, Even so, I mean, itwasn't her boss, but, I mean,
even so, I would take care ofthat, right? So, but yeah, talk
(36:34):
about that a little bit.
Unknown (36:39):
Well, I think there's a few different ways you can
approach it. So, you know, Imean, everyone has different
comfort levels, but if it'ssomething that you're not
comfortable with, I mean, youryour direct approach, that's
great. Yeah, I sometimesstruggle being direct. Like, if
it's about my kids,
Stephanie Olson (36:55):
yes, you have no problem, right?
Unknown (36:59):
I struggle with that interesting to say something
more like, Oh, that's reallyweird. You would call me that
and then just continue whateverI'm doing. Or that's funny. I
don't know that your wife wouldlike
Stephanie Olson (37:10):
that. Yeah, that's good. I don't think so.
Yeah, yeah, you can absolutely.
I mean, obviously this is nolonger I mean youth, obviously,
if you're six, you're not goingto say, but also teaching
littles to be able to say myname is, or I like to be called
to scan, that is, it is a verygood thing. And then to be to be
(37:36):
confident in that. And, yeah,I've, I've, I've accidentally
called people. Oh my gosh, Iknow what it was. This is, this
is funny. I met a woman and wehad a coffee. So I'm it was like
I met her at a networking thing,and we were talking, and I kept
calling her the wrong name thewhole time we were we were
(38:00):
talking, and finally I knew theowner of the restaurant, and she
came over, and I said, this isthe owner of the restaurant. And
the woman introduced herselfwith her real name with a real
name. And I said, Oh my gosh. Iso I actually said, Oh my gosh.
(38:24):
I've been calling you such andsuch this entire time. Why
didn't you tell me what you
Unknown (38:38):
she committed she's like, that's my name. Now, okay,
Stephanie Olson (38:40):
I know. Well, so that's what, yeah. I was
like, well, now your name isthis. You know, Jesus actually
changed a lot of names. He wouldgo around. Your name is no
longer solid as Paul. It's nolonger Yeah, so that is, that is
what I decided to do with her.
But yeah, I was like, Why didn'tyou tell me that wasn't your
name? If somebody calls me Susanover and over again, I'm going
(39:04):
to say something. My mom doesthat because her sister's name
is Susan, and my name isStephanie, and so she calls me
Sue all the time. And I'll belike, yeah, Stephanie, but
that's a mom. Moms get your namewrong, and that's okay. Oh,
yeah, that was important to
Unknown (39:23):
see a world where kids are taught that, that it's okay
to yourself, and as adults,they're not uncomfortable about
it. They just respectfully, andthat's the keyword, too,
respectfully, yeah, to be rude.
Stephanie Olson (39:36):
It's it absolutely you can say
everything very respectfully.
And you I think the bottom lineis people don't want to
embarrass somebody or make themfeel bad, but I was absolutely
more embarrassed when I foundout I had been calling her the
wrong name for the last hour. SoI think that is. Just because at
(39:58):
some point you have to tellsomebody, right?
Unknown (40:03):
You were gonna find out eventually, right?
Stephanie Olson (40:07):
Maybe, I guess, or I just call her that name for
the rest of Yeah, I just, Ithink that is a really important
piece that we do feelcomfortable saying, No, that's
actually not what I like to becalled. I like to be called
this.
Unknown (40:23):
So I was just talking to a child, a kindergarten age
child in our family, and thechild was telling me that their
teacher
Stephanie Olson (40:35):
was a yeller.
Oh,
Unknown (40:38):
I'm like, Oh, that's really unfortunate. And so this
child, I'm trying not toidentify so hard, but saying,
you know, my teacher yelled atme, and it hurt my feelings, and
I don't want to ask anymore togo to the bathroom.
Stephanie Olson (40:51):
Oh, sad, really
Unknown (40:53):
sensitive little one.
And so what I said to this childis, it's okay. What you need to
do next time is say, hey, Yes,Ma'am, can you please talk to me
nicer? And that is totally okay.
And if you get in trouble forthat, you call me
Stephanie Olson (41:10):
yes for that, yes. So that's what I try
Unknown (41:14):
to teach, even my kids.
You know, that's good. I'm gonnalisten to what you're saying.
Stephanie Olson (41:18):
Also, please be nice. Don't like Right, right?
Unknown (41:27):
Yeah, no, that's no matter what age you are, you
should be able to say that,please talk nicer to me.
Stephanie Olson (41:31):
I think that's very important. Yeah, wow.
That's good. I love it. Well,anything else on boundaries or,
I mean, we could talk aboutboundaries for ever, ever,
because boundaries just are thisand I and what I've noticed is
that when people are in abusivesituations, boundaries are much
(41:58):
harder, and so it is reallyhelping with those boundaries
early on, so that if anunhealthy situation arises, or a
relationship that's notappropriate, or a relationship
that is appropriate, but thenall of A sudden turns abusive,
(42:20):
and now it's not anymore thatyou recognize that right away,
so that when if somebody crossesthat boundary, you are really
comfortable saying, Hey, youjust crossed my boundary. Don't
do that again. They do thatagain. Now we're done and and so
I do think that's one of thethings. People who do harm
(42:44):
really count on the fact thatyou're not going to be strong
enough to set a boundary andthen ask somebody to follow
through with that. And I thinkif we can teach that at a very
young age, our kids will be muchsafer. It'll help them for life.
Yeah, for sure. Well, this wasgood. I like this. It started
out really hard. Hopefully wewent a little lighter. We got
(43:06):
lighter as we went,
Unknown (43:10):
well, good stuff.
Revisit this later and go intomore even as adults.
Stephanie Olson (43:16):
I love boundaries. Yeah, it's a good
conversation. So I agree. Let's,let's talk about boundaries
again as adults, and what thosecan look like and why they're so
important. And, yeah, thatsounds good. Awesome, yeah.
Well, thank you. All right.
Well, we appreciate your time,and we will see you next time
(43:37):
get some R and R, bye. You.
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