August 21, 2025 • 43 mins
In this conversation, Stephanie Olson and Rebecca Saunders delve into the complexities of addiction, exploring not only traditional substance abuse but also behavioral addictions like food and technology. They discuss the societal perceptions of alcoholism, the importance of recognizing signs of addiction, and the critical role of support systems in recovery. The conversation emphasizes the need for compassion and understanding in discussions about addiction, highlighting personal stories and the journey towards healing.
takeaways
- Addiction can manifest in various forms, not just substances.
- Alcoholism is often normalized in society, making it harder to recognize as a problem.
- Daily habits can lead to addiction, even without a genetic predisposition.
- Support systems are crucial for those struggling with addiction.
- Self-awareness is key in recognizing personal addictions.
- It's important to seek help and talk to trusted individuals about addiction.
- Compassion is necessary when discussing addiction with others.
- Everyone has their own struggles, and what may not affect one person can deeply impact another.
- Recovery is a complete life change that requires support and understanding.
- There is no shame in asking for help regarding addiction.
Sound Bites
- "I've never been addicted to anything."
- "It's a complete life change."
- "There's no shame in asking for help."
Chapters
00:00
Understanding Addiction Beyond Substances
03:10
Personal Experiences with Alcoholism
06:19
Defining Addiction: Signs and Symptoms
09:27
Seeking Help and Support for Addictions
12:13
Navigating Addictions We Can't Avoid
15:08
The Social Dynamics of Addiction
17:59
Empathy and Understanding in Addiction Conversations
20:56
Real-Life Stories and Peer Pressure in Recovery
26:32
The Challenge of Sobriety
27:50
Life Changes and Support in Recovery
29:10
Understanding Addiction and Accountability
30:45
The Impact of Addiction on Relationships
34:01
The Role of Enablers in Addiction
36:24
Gratitude and Reflection on Sobriety
38:59
Self-Awareness and Seeking Help
43:05
R&R Outro.mp4
Everyone has resilience, but what does that mean, and how do we use it in life and leadership? Join Stephanie Olson, an expert in resiliency and trauma, every week as she talks to other experts living lives of resilience. Stephanie also shares her own stories of addictions, disordered eating, domestic and sexual violence, abandonment, and trauma, and shares the everyday struggles and joys of everyday life. As a wife, mom, and CEO she gives commentaries and, sometimes, a few rants to shed light on what makes a person resilient. So, if you have experienced adversity in life in any way and want to learn how to better lead your family, your workplace, and, well, your life, this podcast is for you!
https://setmefreeproject.net
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Stephanie Olson (00:16):
Foreign Hello and welcome to R and R
resilience in and relationships,real talk for real life. I'm
Stephanie Olson, and I'm herewith Rebecca Saunders, yes, yay.
And we are going to be talkingaddictions today.
Unknown (00:32):
So keeping it super light hearted.
Stephanie Olson (00:34):
Yeah, no, I think that's good. No, I think
it's a very important topic Ihad, and I'll talk about my my
personal addictions, which isplentiful, but I had somebody
say to me once, I've never beenaddicted to anything, and I
(00:55):
actually knew for a fact thatthey had been and it wasn't
wasn't drugs, it wasn't alcohol,it wasn't something typical, and
so in their mind, they didn'tsee it as an addiction.
Unknown (01:12):
That's interesting.
But, you know, I think that alot of people would fall into
that category, because I knowthat some of the big things that
come to my mind we talkaddiction, I'm thinking drugs,
alcohol, you know, sometimesit's substance, but it doesn't
just have
Stephanie Olson (01:28):
to be that it does not and so, like,
personally, and I've shared thismany times, I'm an open book,
but I am a recovering alcoholic,and although I would say, I
always say addict too, primarilybecause I did drugs. Alcohol was
(01:50):
my drug of choice, and so thatwas where I really had my
issues. But I was a dailydrinker and a very functional
alcoholic, and so I think a lotof people would have been
surprised. People who knew, knewme well, were not at all
surprised. But, you know, Ithink that alcohol is one of
(02:15):
those addictions that is, Ithink it's an epidemic
alcoholism, and I think wereally don't realize how big it
is, because we've got, you know,the mommy, yeah, sip times, or
whatever they call them. Youknow, there's just a bigger,
(02:38):
widely accepted and we talkabout alcohol. We royal we all
of the time, and how, oh yeah,I'm gonna be doing some daily
drinking during covid. We heardabout that all the time, and I
think alcoholism absolutelyskyrocketed during that point.
(02:58):
So yeah, what are your thoughtsabout that. It was just
Unknown (03:01):
on a Facebook group, like, a day or two ago, one of
these parenting groups. And, youknow, people ask for advice, and
honestly, it's better forentertainment than anything
else. Yeah, right. There wassomeone who had said, you know,
I'm getting so overwhelmed withmy kids, I've started having,
you know, a couple drinks everynight. It really helps. Am I
doing something wrong? I'mstarting to feel a little
(03:22):
concerned. And it was kind ofdisheartening the amount of
comments like, No, you deservethat wine. You don't whatever.
There was one person whocommented and was saying, you
know, if this is becoming aroutine for you that's hard to
break, then that's addiction.
This is a problem, and they weregetting ripped apart in the
comments. Don't make her feelbad. Don't judge her. And I said
her advice. Well, yes, if youhave to have this to get through
(03:50):
your day, it's a
Stephanie Olson (03:53):
problem. Yeah, yeah, you know. So when, when I
started drinking, I was veryyoung, and I always drank
differently than my friends. Ithought, well, I looked I
(04:14):
couldn't stop thinking about mynext drunk. So the first time I
got drunk, I was 16, and Iblacked out that night. That was
my very first drunk. And that'snot normal. That's not typical
drinking. And so I I continuedto drink like that. And whereas
(04:40):
my friends were like, Whatever,let's get together. Oh yeah, we
can drink. I was like, okay,when's my next drunk? When am I
going to drink again? It wasjust a different experience. And
I always tell the story mygrandparents drank every night
at four o'clock PM. They had oneManhattan, and. And I, when I
(05:01):
lived with them, I wanted thatmaraschino cherry in the
Manhattan. Didn't want the onesin the fridge. I wanted the one
in the Manhattan because ittasted so much better. So my
philosophy is that I thinkthere's two kinds of alcoholics.
There's the kind that arepredisposed to it through
(05:23):
genetics. And you see that a lotin family lines. And I found out
that my biological father, who Idon't know, died of alcoholism,
and so it was very embedded intoboth sides of my family, even
though I didn't know the otherside. But I also think there are
those habitual drunks. I shouldI call them. I call myself a
(05:46):
drunk. So I'm not trying to beoffensive, but those habitual
alcoholics, just like you'retalking about, where I don't
have a genetic, predisposed predis predisposation, pre dis I'm
not predisposed genetically, butI am exhausted, I'm busy, and at
(06:13):
five o'clock, when I'm doneworking or being a mom or
whatever, I have a drink, andNow I have two, and I need to
have that every night just tofeel calm, or whatever the case
may be. And you become analcoholic through habit. So
that's my that's kind of what Isee, those
Unknown (06:35):
two pieces. I can definitely see that. And I would
think that this would extendpast just alcoholism too.
Because, I mean, we see the samekind of thing with other
substances or even justbehaviors. Yeah, you know, I
mean, like, a very different wayto take this. But I mean, how
many times are we checking ourphone, right? Yeah. And can you
(06:58):
leave the house without it,right? You leave the room
without it,
Stephanie Olson (07:01):
right? And what happens when you do and I think
that's the key thing. And thisis all how I always defined
alcoholism, in a sense, becausepeople say, I'm not an
alcoholic, I'm a problemdrinker, or whatever. But if you
(07:22):
are thinking about your nextdrink, that's probably a red
flag. But more than that, if youcan have, if you don't know you
have a drink, and you don't knowif that's going to be one drink
or 10 drinks, you just don'tknow that's yes, that's, that's
(07:43):
a problem. And you can be abinge drinker for, you know, a
weekend, and not have a drinkfor three months, and then a
binge drinker on the weekend.
That doesn't make you any lessof an alcoholic. And so I think
we have this mindset of analcoholic who sits under a
bridge with a bag and no teeth.
(08:06):
But that's not necessarily thecase. And I think, to your
point, what you're talkingabout, it's the same thing with
a phone. I have a hard timeleaving the house without my
phone, and I would probably say,Yes, I'm addicted to my phone.
So, you know, at what point doyou term determine, yeah, that's
(08:31):
an addiction.
Unknown (08:33):
That's a good question, because I would say that I'm I'm
probably addicted to my phonetoo. Get really anxious if I
leave without it, you know, if Ican't find it, I start to get
sometimes angry, of like, Oh,where did I put that? You know,
yes, yeah. So, okay, do youthink that kind of your internal
thoughts and behaviors are theway to measure addiction? Or do
(08:54):
you think that there's anotherway to measure that?
Stephanie Olson (08:57):
Well, I think there's a couple of ways to
measure that, one is if it'sinterfering with your life and
so certainly internal things if,if you're questioning, then
there is probably an addiction.
I don't think you know i i havenever questioned. Am I addicted
(09:18):
to brushing my teeth? I don'tknow. I'm making that up, but
you know, something I do everyday, something I do three times
a day, and yet I don't it's,it's not like, oh my gosh, when
am I going to do that again? Ihave to do that right now. And
(09:40):
I'm sure there's peopleaddicted. To brushing their
teeth. Who knows? But so I thinkyou can look at that internally,
if it's causing you angst, andit's you think, Gosh, I think I
have a problem. But also ifother people are noticing it,
hey, I think you you're on your.
Phone all the time, or you'reyou drink all the time, or you
(10:04):
eat unhealthy food. I mean,whatever it may be, other people
notice it, and they're concernedfor you. That's not being
judgmental, that's havingconcern for somebody. And I
think that's a fair thing, but Ido think if it starts to
interfere with your life now,you can't do certain things
because of your addiction. Youcan't function at work, or there
(10:29):
are things affecting yourfamily, those are signs as well.
Unknown (10:33):
So what is your advice to someone who might find
themselves, you know, they'requestioning, I think I might be
addicted to this. Other peopleare noticing. I'm starting to
notice. What can they do?
Stephanie Olson (10:47):
Well, that's a great question. I think there's
a lot of resources out there,and there's certainly resources
when it comes to addictions,like alcohol, drugs, you know,
even food, sugar, things likethat, you can get online and and
find, how do I combat sugaraddiction, or, How can I combat
(11:10):
whatever? And I think it's it'sfair to go talk to somebody if
you have questions about whatthat might look like. But I do
think that making sure that youhave somebody in your life who's
trusted, who you can go to andsay, What are your thoughts
about this? This is where I'mseeing problems, and there's a
(11:32):
lot of great support groups outthere on all of those things.
And so getting involved andactive in some of those things I
think are really important, butI'm all about, you know,
finding, you know, Google, someof those, those resources near
you, where can I get help foralcohol addiction? Where can I
(11:54):
get help for drug addiction? Andthere's even controversy
surrounding that, like somepeople will say, you know,
alcohol, alcoholism is not adisease. You can choose whether
you drink or not. Same with anyaddiction, right? So you can
(12:15):
choose whether you pick up adrug or not. You can choose
whether you pick up a phone ornot, and all of those, and
whether we're talking about allthose things like sex, porn,
whatever, all of everyaddiction, and that that's true,
there is a moment in time whereyou make a choice to say, I'm
(12:35):
going to do this or I'm notgoing to do This, but it, I
think it's what drives you thatthat compulsion is is part of
the disease. And some peoplehave said, instead of a disease,
it's like you have an allergy toit. And so if you have an
allergy to dairy, shouldprobably stay away from dairy.
(12:57):
Same thing with any otheraddiction.
Unknown (13:01):
Okay? What if staying away is not an option? Because
it makes me think of likethere's something that you can
cut out, right? So who's not todrink, but, yeah, food
addiction. I have to eat tolive. Yeah? How? How can you
manage something that you can'tcut out?
Stephanie Olson (13:18):
Yeah, that is really hard, and I've actually
dealt with both alcoholism,disordered eating, so all of the
things, and I think it I alsowas a two pack a day smoker. I
drank three pots of coffeebefore 3pm moderation is not my
(13:40):
middle name, I'm not a fan ofmoderation, but it is so much
easier stopping something thanit is cutting back on something
or changing your lifestyle. Andfood is one of those things you
can't cut out sugar, right? Butfood is one of those things that
(14:02):
you can't cut out food, and soyou have to learn to eat in a
healthy way and to do the andit's that is hard, and that's
where I'm all about therapy.
That's where I think therapyhelps, because we can find a
good therapist who specializesin each of those areas to help
us navigate those waters,because that is it was 10 times
(14:24):
easier, I will tell you to now.
It wasn't easy. It was hard toquit drinking. It was very hard
to quit smoking, but thedisordered eating piece is
really challenging, because youcannot quit eating, which also
(14:46):
disordered eating, right? So,yeah, that's other and he's also
Right, right? Exactly,
Unknown (14:54):
man that that is a challenge. I think of just
myself like soda. I There havebeen multiple points in my life
I got my Pepsi. Here, yeah,multiple points in my life that
I've cut it out, but I haven'treally struggled trying to do
moderation with this. It'sinteresting, like it's all or
nothing. I have a hard time ifit's in my house, yeah, I go to
(15:15):
it. And I learned for me, theonly way I don't have is it if I
don't buy it at all. And so Ican totally see where you're
saying something that you haveto continue doing right, eating,
eating, that would be a lotharder, but it sounds like the
common thread. What I've heardyou say is finding people,
finding support.
Stephanie Olson (15:35):
Yeah, I and it's the appropriate support.
Because you know, that just mademe think of something when you
said, soda is a addiction. Ihave never been I've never been
a fan of soda, period. And sosoda was never a problem for me.
(15:58):
I would drink soda, maybe tostop eating or something like
that, but it was never like,Okay, I've got to have my soda.
But that doesn't mean that it'snot a problem for other people.
And I think it's kind of likewe've talked about trauma. What
is traumatic for me is notnecessarily traumatic for you,
but trauma is trauma, is trauma.
And so what I might fall intoaddiction with may not be
(16:20):
something you would at all. AndI think we have to really honor
those conversations with people.
And so like that woman who said,this is something that's
happening to me, I'm strugglingwith it for people to respond
(16:42):
with you deserve it. Don't worryabout it and and is not helpful.
And my guess is that themajority of people who've said
You deserve it have a problemthemselves. I I would, because
when we have a problem. We wantothers around us who have the
(17:03):
same problem. Is this an issue?
Yeah, exactly. I used to justifymy drinking all just by watching
TV. Well, they're drinking wineon TV, so obviously it's not a
problem. You can justifyanything, right? But I think
when somebody is reaching outfor help, the last thing they
need to hear is you're fine.
(17:25):
Don't worry about it. Quit beingjudgmental. Do what you want.
And if I wouldn't be reachingout exactly. And I think the
whole you know, soda thing is aperfect example. It has never
affected me. That does not meanthat I shouldn't have compassion
(17:46):
or understanding when it'ssomebody else. And I think
that's a really good point,yeah, yeah.
Unknown (17:53):
And I think that I would argue that all of us are
probably addicted to
Stephanie Olson (17:58):
something, uh huh. It's just, what is the
thing I agree, you know, andwhat can you see it not do
without, yeah,
Unknown (18:07):
yeah. Because I know there are tons of people in my
life that like using the sodaexample, just because it's easy
to be in my life, that would saythat's not a problem at all. And
maybe one or two that would say,your body's screaming for
Stephanie Olson (18:18):
water, right?
You need to drink water, right?
Right? But the
Unknown (18:22):
people who don't say to the problem, like, it's very
easy to lean into that of like,oh, no, one thinks it's a
problem. It's probably not aproblem. It's fine, right? And
then I think that it would beeasy if you see yourself as
someone who's never gone throughaddiction, never struggled with
that in any capacity to then bejudgmental and harsh with
(18:43):
others, because that's them, notme. Yeah,
Stephanie Olson (18:49):
yeah. Well, it's interesting, because when I
quit drinking, and I was arounda lot of alcoholics, and when I
quit drinking, those people,those people, I don't mean it
like that, but the people whowere, people in your life, in my
life, who were drinking, andfrankly, still are those people
(19:14):
had a real problem with mequitting, and It's because it
shines a mirror on them when,when you have an addiction, and
you're hanging out with all thepeople who have the same
addiction, and you say, I'mgoing to quit, they don't. They
hear a couple things like crap,I'm losing my drinking buddy, or
(19:36):
I'm losing my Pepsi buddy orwhatever. But also, if they
think they have a problem, thenI must have a problem. And I
think that's a hard thing tolook at and say, Okay, I don't
want to, I don't want to look attheir problem and have think
that they're they need to stopbecause. That just shines a
(20:01):
mirror on me. That makes
Unknown (20:03):
a lot of sense. Yeah, and I see how relationships
could get strained there,because you don't want to be
close to someone who's pointingout something about you that you
don't like, even if they're notdirectly talking about you.
That's uncomfortable. It
Stephanie Olson (20:16):
is well, and you know, the other thing I
would say is that you know, AAsays you have to change your
playgrounds and playmates. Sowhen you are in an addiction and
your whole circle is filling,that you've got to find new
(20:42):
people in your life, or new youknow. And so I think that's
really hard, too. When I gotsober, I was very fortunate,
because we wound up physicallymoving out of the city into a
new city. So I had been soberfor two years, and then we moved
and so when we moved into my newhouse, I had never that that
(21:06):
house. Had never known Mia'sdrinker, and so we had a dry
house, and it was great. And andso, you know, I think those are
things that help, but you haveto also be mindful that the
whole world is surrounding anysort of addiction, right?
(21:27):
Illicit drugs are easier to giveup to some I mean, they're not
easier to kick, I would say, butit's easier to move away from
that, in a sense, depending onwhat the drugs are, because you
can really get away from thepeople who are doing that
(21:48):
alcohol is much harder because,and please don't hear me say
it's easier to quit heroin thanalcohol. I'm not saying that the
drugs are very hard to kick, butI think it's kind of the dynamic
of food versus alcohol, or foodversus drugs. You you go
(22:13):
anywhere and there's alcohol asopposed to, right, illicit
drugs, right?
Unknown (22:19):
It's advertised to you, you go into a restaurant,
they're immediately asking, Doyou want some wine? Can I get
you a drink? Yeah, very easy tosay, Yes and No,
Stephanie Olson (22:29):
exactly, yeah.
So I have a funny story for you.
Not sure it's well, I think it'sfunny. So I was in New York with
my oldest, and we were in LittleItaly, and we went to this
fabulous cafe. Well, it was likea it was a dessert and coffee
(22:54):
Cafe, and you could either buyit was lovely, and you could
either buy the dessert andleave, and there was like a
area, or you could sit and havea drink and some dessert. Well,
we decided to sit, and obviouslywe were there for dessert. And I
(23:15):
had, I think Noelle did have adrink of age, and I said to the
waiter, I just would likewhatever cheesecake. I don't
know what it was, I would justlike this. And he flipped the
menu over, because on the otherside of the menu were all the
cocktails. And he said, No, youwant one of these? And I said,
(23:38):
No, I don't. I'll just havedessert. That's where it should
have stopped. But I oh my gosh.
He was like, Nope, you want oneof these? We went back and forth
three times at least, and Isaid, No, I don't want to drink.
I would just like dessert and adecaf coffee or water, whatever.
(24:00):
And he fought me on it, andaggressive, upselling it. Yeah,
it really was. And finally Isaid, and I was very boisterous.
I did not keep quiet. Butfinally I said, I would like you
(24:20):
to stop asking me if I wouldlike drink. I'm a recovering
alcoholic, and I don't drink, soplease stop asking me. And
everyone turned around, and hewas like, Oh, I'm sorry. And he
walked away,
Unknown (24:42):
and Noel looked for the next person.
Stephanie Olson (24:45):
Well, just wait. Noelle looked at me, and
she was like, You warned him. SoI was like, okay, yes, I did. I
did. Well, he came back and hesaid, I don't believe. Leave
you, but I'm not going to askyou anymore. And I said, want
(25:07):
you to prove that. Well, I did.
I said, come here. And I openedup my wallet, because I carry a
chip with me all the time, and Ihave, usually, the last you
know, the year that I'mcurrently on in my wallet. And I
said, come here. And I said,Look at this. Do you know what
this is? And he said, No. And Isaid, turn around. Look closer.
(25:28):
And he was like, Oh. I said,that says I'm sober. I think it
was 21 years at the time sinceI'm sober. 21 years. I'm not
lying. Don't ever do that tosomebody again, ever. And he
apologized profusely. Actuallysaid something like, this is
like, I'm in a movie. I don'tknow it was just bizarre, but
(25:50):
there was a woman behind me whowalked up to me and she said, I
just wanted to thank you. I havetwo years sobriety today, and we
are here to celebrate withdessert, and what you did just
helped me. You know, stay soberfor one more you tear up. Yeah,
(26:14):
it was a very cool experience,but it just showed the amount of
I mean, talk about weird peerpressure. That's not even peer
pressure. That's like somestranger pressure.
Unknown (26:32):
I mean, imagine if you were freshly sober one week, 30
days
Stephanie Olson (26:35):
exactly. I it was, it was appalling. And so
that's why I said, Don't ever dothat to anybody ever again. And
that's exactly it. It does nottake much to justify and to
fold. And I know withalcoholism, I think it's like
80% of people will relapse. Andso it's not uncommon, and we
(27:00):
have to really support peoplethat are getting off of, you
know, drugs, alcohol, the it'shard to do. It's hard to do, and
it takes a tremendous amount ofcourage, a tremendous amount of
support, and a tremendous amountof grit, really, and turning it
over. It's a surrender, constantsurrender. But I just think that
(27:25):
that's people need to be mindfulof those things, whether it is
food, whatever addiction that weneed to be honoring. Of people,
if they say no, I know that'sweird, but they mean, no, it's
consent.
Unknown (27:41):
Yes. Man, I feel like something that's probably not
recognized enough by someone whohasn't had a loved one struggle,
or, you know, have struggledthemselves, is it's not just I'm
giving this thing up, it's I'mchanging my entire life because
this was such a problem. And,yeah, that needs to be respected
Stephanie Olson (28:04):
right now.
That's really true, because itis a complete life change and,
and even, you know, even whenwe're talking about eating
healthy foods, you know, same,same thing or whatever, you
know, I I have had to really bemindful of my food intake. And
it's not so much what I eat, buthow I eat, and my relationship
(28:32):
with food, and looking at foodas good or bad, or, you know,
things like that. I've had tochange all of that mindset. But
then, at the same time, as I getolder, there are things that I I
mean, back in the day, I usedto, if I wanted to lose weight,
I would stop eating for two daysand lose like, you know, 10
(28:56):
pounds, like in my 20s, butthat's not the case as you age.
And so there are all thosethings that you have to think
about your
Unknown (29:11):
you were talking about some things that you know you've
changed to make it easier foryou. And I think that one of the
other things that people cantend to do that really do this
recovering person a disserviceis poke holes at that. Well,
that's so weird that you'redoing that. What do you mean?
You don't want to go here or dothis or pornography. Addiction
is a good example. There'ssomeone I know that had
(29:33):
struggled with an addiction topornography, and so he has put
guardrails in place for himself.
Sure. You know, phone is lockeddown. Things are sent to a
sponsor. You know, if you lookat those websites, it triggers
someone else's phone, yeah? Orthat accountability piece that's
a great thing, yeah, that'sactively approaching the problem
and trying to set up safeguardsfor yourself. Yeah? Ever he has
faced a little bit of what wasthe word I'm looking. Ridicule,
(29:59):
ridiculed, yeah, because you'rea grown man and you have to be
babysat, Mm, hmm. Well, it's notthat. It's trying to be
responsible, and I think thatsometimes, whether it's
pornography, addiction,alcoholism, whatever, that that
can happen too. Yeah, you know,oh, it's so embarrassing that
you have to do that? Well, Idon't think it's embarrassing. I
(30:21):
think it's a sign of strengththat you're into that.
Stephanie Olson (30:26):
I think that's a great point. I agree. And I
think too people who don'tunderstand how I think you're
right. I think everybody isaddicted in some way, to
something. And you know, if wewere to be honest with
ourselves, or look at that, it'shard and and some of it, you
know, some of it may seemhealthy, like I'm I'm addicted
(30:48):
to exercise, or I'm addicted towhatever. But you know, some of
it could seem very harmless, butaddiction, true addiction, takes
over your entire life. And sowith pornography addiction, I
know people who couldn't evenfunction because of that
(31:09):
addiction, or, of course, ruinfamilies. And you know, same
thing with drugs and alcohol andfood. I mean, I don't know if
you ever have seen, oh my gosh,I I went on a kind of a binge
bad, no pun intended, of like,my 600 pound life or whatever,
(31:32):
oh my gosh. It's a fascinatingshow, and I weirdly love it for
some reason, like interestingand heartbreaking at the same
time it is and then sometimesvery redemptive. You know,
sometimes it's like, reallyencouraging to watch, because
these people change their entirelives. But these people, of
course, are completely addictedto food. You know? What is a
(31:55):
common theme woven in that,especially in that show, or in
that yes, an enabler, there'salways an enabler. And I think
that's probably true with mostaddictions. There's somebody who
does not want you, not evenintentionally. It's not even
(32:16):
like I don't want you to getsober or I don't want you to
stop eating or get get healthy,or I don't even think, but if
you do, then you're gonna leaveme. Or if you do, you know it's
all this other emotion, which iswhy learning codependency is
also a conviction, right? Well,and I think
Unknown (32:38):
sometimes it comes from a place of like, I don't want to
see you struggle. I don't wantto see you be sad. And even if
you need to go through a periodof being sad to be healthy, I
don't want you that
Stephanie Olson (32:49):
right, right?
Cuz it does suck getting gettingfree from that. With
Unknown (32:55):
a lot of those addictions too. There's physical
symptoms, the withdrawal, ohyeah, go through, yeah, that's
hard to
Stephanie Olson (33:01):
watch. Yeah, it absolutely is, because you are
literally sick, right? I mean,it's, it's a sickness. I
remember when I quit smoking,plus, like smoking, you're just,
mean, you know, when you quitsmoking, here, have a cigarette.
You are no fun to be around. Butit is, yeah, any type of
(33:22):
withdrawal is hor, you know,it's just hard on the body.
You're probably not thatpleasant to be around. And so I
think that. But I think in thoseshows, it's often, you know, the
person is morbidly obese, andthen the person who's enabling
(33:43):
is also obese, just not morbidlyobese. And so it's just a it's
an interesting dynamic, whichis, I think this the the same
with just about with so manyenablers, not all of them, but,
you know, so many enablers. It'sjust interesting,
Unknown (34:01):
well, and I wonder sometimes, too, if there's
almost, like this internalcompetitiveness of like, I
struggle, but I need you tostruggle more than me so I can
feel okay about myself.
Stephanie Olson (34:11):
Ooh, yeah, no one would want to admit that.
No, that's a little selfish. Butno, it's true. Yeah, because you
say I'm not as bad as thatperson, right? I remember, so I,
(34:31):
I used to sponsor people quite abit in programs. I used to
sponsor people and, um, and one,Gal told me that I don't know
she was telling me something andabout her and her story was like
(34:51):
everybody else's story. Youknow, I think all of us feel
like, oh my gosh, either I'm theworst there is, or I'm not as
bad. Is that, but we, we arealone like we don't. Nobody
understands. Nobody's beenthere. And so I said to her, you
are not unique. And she justshe, she kind of was shocked,
(35:14):
and I and I said, you're likeeverybody else who's addicted to
this, and it's no different. Sodon't consider yourself unique
in this, because you're not. AndI think sometimes that's a
reality that needs to be slappedin our face as addicts, because
we do feel very unique, and noone will understand. And I have
(35:37):
to deal with this by myself andor I don't want to get help for
this because, and it's, it's youare so not alone, and there's so
much support out there. Butyeah, we're there's always
something,
Unknown (35:51):
yeah, I'm sure that was hard to hear, but important to
hear.
Stephanie Olson (35:56):
Well, I don't know. She never got sober, so
yeah, which is, which is yetsober, right, right, yeah, which
is, it's sad. Some people justhave a really hard time. And
it's, it's, it's hard, and I'mjust grateful. I have to, I have
(36:20):
to say, so I got sober when Iwas, I was like 32 and I am so
grateful that I'm not one ofthose women my age, like out in
the bars and just getting drunk.
And I'm just so grateful. And II've had a weird, maybe
(36:40):
addiction, I don't know. No,it's not addiction. It's a
guilty pleasure, because I couldstop at any time. No, I'm just
kidding. I have a guiltypleasure of watching body
cameras of alcohol, of drug,drunk drivers, and it's
fascinating to watch everysingle drunk driver on that
(37:03):
thing is, like, I live rightover there. I've only had one
drink, or I've had no drinksevery single one. But it's just
a good reminder, like, thank youGod, that I am sober because I
do not want to experience thatevery day in my life. I
Unknown (37:24):
think that makes a lot of sense. Like, hey, that's
where I could have been. So gladthat's not me right now, yeah,
Stephanie Olson (37:32):
yeah. I I'm a I would, I would love to have. I
think it would be really cool tohear just somebody have a
conversation of somebody'stestimony, or, you know,
something that somebody did giveup as as an addict, or whatever
it may be, and just hear theirstory. Because I think it's
(37:53):
important to hear other people'sstories and how they recovered,
and that redemption piece, Ithink those are the most
important. That's how I alwaysknow, by the way, somebody is
healthy to speak at their story,whether it be a survivor of
something, whether it besomebody who's addicted, because
(38:16):
their story is not about thegory details. Their story is
that redemption piece, and Ithink that's the bottom line,
and what it needs to be forpeople.
Unknown (38:28):
Yeah, that's what can really have the power to help.
Stephanie Olson (38:31):
Yes, exactly.
So yeah, I think that's a it's agood, good conversation, but I
do think it's important toreally be mindful, and it's self
awareness, right? What are thethings in my life that are
holding me back, or, what arethe things in my life that are
not serving me, that I need tolet go, and what are the things
(38:54):
in my life that are literallykeeping me from moving forward.
And I think when we can look atthat and identify those things,
if there's nothing awesome, butif there are things going to get
the help that you need, findingthose resources in your area,
talking to someone who has beenthere, or somebody who is
(39:18):
licensed in that area, and Ithink there is no shame in
asking for help, Shame on peoplewho make somebody feel bad for
asking for help or telling themto continue in what they're
asking for help for. But thereis no shame, and there's so many
people who can support in fact,I will tell you i I'm very open
(39:41):
about my alcoholism, and I justrecently announced that I was 23
years sober at a event I was atthank you, and somebody
approached me and said that. Isthat that is so amazing. And I
had several people tell me, I'veexperienced that. I've gone
(40:05):
through that. You know, you justdon't know who is going through
something like that or who needshelp until you're just open
sometime for a server who outsyou because you because you
don't want a cocktail. Oh mygosh, I don't do that. That,
that guy, he should, I, I, Ican't even, I mean, it's the
(40:30):
weirdest story, because I can'timagine doing that to anybody,
like, what an idiot. But at thesame time, it was cool because
it made a difference insomeone's life, and thank
goodness it wasn't her. He didthat too. True. Seriously, come
on,
Unknown (40:51):
next level.
Stephanie Olson (40:54):
Good it is, but now it's a good story.
Unknown (41:00):
Looks back on that every time he's putting
Stephanie Olson (41:02):
menus out. I hope he does. I hope he does.
But you know, even, even in mywork, you know, I will, you
know, I do a lot of networking.
I go to a lot of networkingthings, and I cannot tell you
how many people are like, let'smeet over cocktails or just go
have a glass of wine orwhatever, and I'm fine with
(41:23):
that. I'm not gonna I wouldnever embarrass somebody, but at
the same time, that's howacceptable it is, and I think
why it's such an epidemic. Iappreciate
Unknown (41:40):
your openness with everything today, and I think
this is really important forsomeone to hear. And I don't
know kind of my takeaway fromthis, that I think is going to
stick in my mind is, if someonereally wants the best for you,
then they're going to comealongside you and support you,
even if they don't quiteunderstand your
Stephanie Olson (41:59):
problem. Yeah, that's a good point. I agree,
yeah. Well, thank you. Yeah. Ilove, I love talking about
things like that, because it'sclose to my heart, and I know
other people struggle with it,and just to give a place, and so
I would offer, like, if that'ssomething you are going through
and you need someone to talk, toreach out, because I am more
(42:21):
than welcome to I am more thanwelcome. I'm more than happy to
have a conversation withsomebody. And you can reach us
at, it is in our notes, in thepodcast or YouTube, but you can
reach me at Stephanie at set mefree project.net, and Rebecca at
set me free project.net, andwe'd be happy to talk about
(42:42):
addictions or human traffickingor anything that's right, yes.
So thank you so much. This was agood conversation. Rebecca,
thank you for thank you forsuggesting it. And if there's
something you want to hear,please let us know we would love
to hear from you and we'll seeyou next time get some R and R.
(43:05):
Bye. You.
Foreign Hello and welcome to R and R
resilience in and relationships,real talk for real life. I'm
Stephanie Olson, and I'm herewith Rebecca Saunders, yes, yay.
And we are going to be talkingaddictions today.
Unknown (00:32):
So keeping it super light hearted.
Stephanie Olson (00:34):
Yeah, no, I think that's good. No, I think
it's a very important topic Ihad, and I'll talk about my my
personal addictions, which isplentiful, but I had somebody
say to me once, I've never beenaddicted to anything, and I
(00:55):
actually knew for a fact thatthey had been and it wasn't
wasn't drugs, it wasn't alcohol,it wasn't something typical, and
so in their mind, they didn'tsee it as an addiction.
Unknown (01:12):
That's interesting.
But, you know, I think that alot of people would fall into
that category, because I knowthat some of the big things that
come to my mind we talkaddiction, I'm thinking drugs,
alcohol, you know, sometimesit's substance, but it doesn't
just have
Stephanie Olson (01:28):
to be that it does not and so, like,
personally, and I've shared thismany times, I'm an open book,
but I am a recovering alcoholic,and although I would say, I
always say addict too, primarilybecause I did drugs. Alcohol was
(01:50):
my drug of choice, and so thatwas where I really had my
issues. But I was a dailydrinker and a very functional
alcoholic, and so I think a lotof people would have been
surprised. People who knew, knewme well, were not at all
surprised. But, you know, Ithink that alcohol is one of
(02:15):
those addictions that is, Ithink it's an epidemic
alcoholism, and I think wereally don't realize how big it
is, because we've got, you know,the mommy, yeah, sip times, or
whatever they call them. Youknow, there's just a bigger,
(02:38):
widely accepted and we talkabout alcohol. We royal we all
of the time, and how, oh yeah,I'm gonna be doing some daily
drinking during covid. We heardabout that all the time, and I
think alcoholism absolutelyskyrocketed during that point.
(02:58):
So yeah, what are your thoughtsabout that. It was just
Unknown (03:01):
on a Facebook group, like, a day or two ago, one of
these parenting groups. And, youknow, people ask for advice, and
honestly, it's better forentertainment than anything
else. Yeah, right. There wassomeone who had said, you know,
I'm getting so overwhelmed withmy kids, I've started having,
you know, a couple drinks everynight. It really helps. Am I
doing something wrong? I'mstarting to feel a little
(03:22):
concerned. And it was kind ofdisheartening the amount of
comments like, No, you deservethat wine. You don't whatever.
There was one person whocommented and was saying, you
know, if this is becoming aroutine for you that's hard to
break, then that's addiction.
This is a problem, and they weregetting ripped apart in the
comments. Don't make her feelbad. Don't judge her. And I said
her advice. Well, yes, if youhave to have this to get through
(03:50):
your day, it's a
Stephanie Olson (03:53):
problem. Yeah, yeah, you know. So when, when I
started drinking, I was veryyoung, and I always drank
differently than my friends. Ithought, well, I looked I
(04:14):
couldn't stop thinking about mynext drunk. So the first time I
got drunk, I was 16, and Iblacked out that night. That was
my very first drunk. And that'snot normal. That's not typical
drinking. And so I I continuedto drink like that. And whereas
(04:40):
my friends were like, Whatever,let's get together. Oh yeah, we
can drink. I was like, okay,when's my next drunk? When am I
going to drink again? It wasjust a different experience. And
I always tell the story mygrandparents drank every night
at four o'clock PM. They had oneManhattan, and. And I, when I
(05:01):
lived with them, I wanted thatmaraschino cherry in the
Manhattan. Didn't want the onesin the fridge. I wanted the one
in the Manhattan because ittasted so much better. So my
philosophy is that I thinkthere's two kinds of alcoholics.
There's the kind that arepredisposed to it through
(05:23):
genetics. And you see that a lotin family lines. And I found out
that my biological father, who Idon't know, died of alcoholism,
and so it was very embedded intoboth sides of my family, even
though I didn't know the otherside. But I also think there are
those habitual drunks. I shouldI call them. I call myself a
(05:46):
drunk. So I'm not trying to beoffensive, but those habitual
alcoholics, just like you'retalking about, where I don't
have a genetic, predisposed predis predisposation, pre dis I'm
not predisposed genetically, butI am exhausted, I'm busy, and at
(06:13):
five o'clock, when I'm doneworking or being a mom or
whatever, I have a drink, andNow I have two, and I need to
have that every night just tofeel calm, or whatever the case
may be. And you become analcoholic through habit. So
that's my that's kind of what Isee, those
Unknown (06:35):
two pieces. I can definitely see that. And I would
think that this would extendpast just alcoholism too.
Because, I mean, we see the samekind of thing with other
substances or even justbehaviors. Yeah, you know, I
mean, like, a very different wayto take this. But I mean, how
many times are we checking ourphone, right? Yeah. And can you
(06:58):
leave the house without it,right? You leave the room
without it,
Stephanie Olson (07:01):
right? And what happens when you do and I think
that's the key thing. And thisis all how I always defined
alcoholism, in a sense, becausepeople say, I'm not an
alcoholic, I'm a problemdrinker, or whatever. But if you
(07:22):
are thinking about your nextdrink, that's probably a red
flag. But more than that, if youcan have, if you don't know you
have a drink, and you don't knowif that's going to be one drink
or 10 drinks, you just don'tknow that's yes, that's, that's
(07:43):
a problem. And you can be abinge drinker for, you know, a
weekend, and not have a drinkfor three months, and then a
binge drinker on the weekend.
That doesn't make you any lessof an alcoholic. And so I think
we have this mindset of analcoholic who sits under a
bridge with a bag and no teeth.
(08:06):
But that's not necessarily thecase. And I think, to your
point, what you're talkingabout, it's the same thing with
a phone. I have a hard timeleaving the house without my
phone, and I would probably say,Yes, I'm addicted to my phone.
So, you know, at what point doyou term determine, yeah, that's
(08:31):
an addiction.
Unknown (08:33):
That's a good question, because I would say that I'm I'm
probably addicted to my phonetoo. Get really anxious if I
leave without it, you know, if Ican't find it, I start to get
sometimes angry, of like, Oh,where did I put that? You know,
yes, yeah. So, okay, do youthink that kind of your internal
thoughts and behaviors are theway to measure addiction? Or do
(08:54):
you think that there's anotherway to measure that?
Stephanie Olson (08:57):
Well, I think there's a couple of ways to
measure that, one is if it'sinterfering with your life and
so certainly internal things if,if you're questioning, then
there is probably an addiction.
I don't think you know i i havenever questioned. Am I addicted
(09:18):
to brushing my teeth? I don'tknow. I'm making that up, but
you know, something I do everyday, something I do three times
a day, and yet I don't it's,it's not like, oh my gosh, when
am I going to do that again? Ihave to do that right now. And
(09:40):
I'm sure there's peopleaddicted. To brushing their
teeth. Who knows? But so I thinkyou can look at that internally,
if it's causing you angst, andit's you think, Gosh, I think I
have a problem. But also ifother people are noticing it,
hey, I think you you're on your.
Phone all the time, or you'reyou drink all the time, or you
(10:04):
eat unhealthy food. I mean,whatever it may be, other people
notice it, and they're concernedfor you. That's not being
judgmental, that's havingconcern for somebody. And I
think that's a fair thing, but Ido think if it starts to
interfere with your life now,you can't do certain things
because of your addiction. Youcan't function at work, or there
(10:29):
are things affecting yourfamily, those are signs as well.
Unknown (10:33):
So what is your advice to someone who might find
themselves, you know, they'requestioning, I think I might be
addicted to this. Other peopleare noticing. I'm starting to
notice. What can they do?
Stephanie Olson (10:47):
Well, that's a great question. I think there's
a lot of resources out there,and there's certainly resources
when it comes to addictions,like alcohol, drugs, you know,
even food, sugar, things likethat, you can get online and and
find, how do I combat sugaraddiction, or, How can I combat
(11:10):
whatever? And I think it's it'sfair to go talk to somebody if
you have questions about whatthat might look like. But I do
think that making sure that youhave somebody in your life who's
trusted, who you can go to andsay, What are your thoughts
about this? This is where I'mseeing problems, and there's a
(11:32):
lot of great support groups outthere on all of those things.
And so getting involved andactive in some of those things I
think are really important, butI'm all about, you know,
finding, you know, Google, someof those, those resources near
you, where can I get help foralcohol addiction? Where can I
(11:54):
get help for drug addiction? Andthere's even controversy
surrounding that, like somepeople will say, you know,
alcohol, alcoholism is not adisease. You can choose whether
you drink or not. Same with anyaddiction, right? So you can
(12:15):
choose whether you pick up adrug or not. You can choose
whether you pick up a phone ornot, and all of those, and
whether we're talking about allthose things like sex, porn,
whatever, all of everyaddiction, and that that's true,
there is a moment in time whereyou make a choice to say, I'm
(12:35):
going to do this or I'm notgoing to do This, but it, I
think it's what drives you thatthat compulsion is is part of
the disease. And some peoplehave said, instead of a disease,
it's like you have an allergy toit. And so if you have an
allergy to dairy, shouldprobably stay away from dairy.
(12:57):
Same thing with any otheraddiction.
Unknown (13:01):
Okay? What if staying away is not an option? Because
it makes me think of likethere's something that you can
cut out, right? So who's not todrink, but, yeah, food
addiction. I have to eat tolive. Yeah? How? How can you
manage something that you can'tcut out?
Stephanie Olson (13:18):
Yeah, that is really hard, and I've actually
dealt with both alcoholism,disordered eating, so all of the
things, and I think it I alsowas a two pack a day smoker. I
drank three pots of coffeebefore 3pm moderation is not my
(13:40):
middle name, I'm not a fan ofmoderation, but it is so much
easier stopping something thanit is cutting back on something
or changing your lifestyle. Andfood is one of those things you
can't cut out sugar, right? Butfood is one of those things that
(14:02):
you can't cut out food, and soyou have to learn to eat in a
healthy way and to do the andit's that is hard, and that's
where I'm all about therapy.
That's where I think therapyhelps, because we can find a
good therapist who specializesin each of those areas to help
us navigate those waters,because that is it was 10 times
(14:24):
easier, I will tell you to now.
It wasn't easy. It was hard toquit drinking. It was very hard
to quit smoking, but thedisordered eating piece is
really challenging, because youcannot quit eating, which also
(14:46):
disordered eating, right? So,yeah, that's other and he's also
Right, right? Exactly,
Unknown (14:54):
man that that is a challenge. I think of just
myself like soda. I There havebeen multiple points in my life
I got my Pepsi. Here, yeah,multiple points in my life that
I've cut it out, but I haven'treally struggled trying to do
moderation with this. It'sinteresting, like it's all or
nothing. I have a hard time ifit's in my house, yeah, I go to
(15:15):
it. And I learned for me, theonly way I don't have is it if I
don't buy it at all. And so Ican totally see where you're
saying something that you haveto continue doing right, eating,
eating, that would be a lotharder, but it sounds like the
common thread. What I've heardyou say is finding people,
finding support.
Stephanie Olson (15:35):
Yeah, I and it's the appropriate support.
Because you know, that just mademe think of something when you
said, soda is a addiction. Ihave never been I've never been
a fan of soda, period. And sosoda was never a problem for me.
(15:58):
I would drink soda, maybe tostop eating or something like
that, but it was never like,Okay, I've got to have my soda.
But that doesn't mean that it'snot a problem for other people.
And I think it's kind of likewe've talked about trauma. What
is traumatic for me is notnecessarily traumatic for you,
but trauma is trauma, is trauma.
And so what I might fall intoaddiction with may not be
(16:20):
something you would at all. AndI think we have to really honor
those conversations with people.
And so like that woman who said,this is something that's
happening to me, I'm strugglingwith it for people to respond
(16:42):
with you deserve it. Don't worryabout it and and is not helpful.
And my guess is that themajority of people who've said
You deserve it have a problemthemselves. I I would, because
when we have a problem. We wantothers around us who have the
(17:03):
same problem. Is this an issue?
Yeah, exactly. I used to justifymy drinking all just by watching
TV. Well, they're drinking wineon TV, so obviously it's not a
problem. You can justifyanything, right? But I think
when somebody is reaching outfor help, the last thing they
need to hear is you're fine.
(17:25):
Don't worry about it. Quit beingjudgmental. Do what you want.
And if I wouldn't be reachingout exactly. And I think the
whole you know, soda thing is aperfect example. It has never
affected me. That does not meanthat I shouldn't have compassion
(17:46):
or understanding when it'ssomebody else. And I think
that's a really good point,yeah, yeah.
Unknown (17:53):
And I think that I would argue that all of us are
probably addicted to
Stephanie Olson (17:58):
something, uh huh. It's just, what is the
thing I agree, you know, andwhat can you see it not do
without, yeah,
Unknown (18:07):
yeah. Because I know there are tons of people in my
life that like using the sodaexample, just because it's easy
to be in my life, that would saythat's not a problem at all. And
maybe one or two that would say,your body's screaming for
Stephanie Olson (18:18):
water, right?
You need to drink water, right?
Right? But the
Unknown (18:22):
people who don't say to the problem, like, it's very
easy to lean into that of like,oh, no, one thinks it's a
problem. It's probably not aproblem. It's fine, right? And
then I think that it would beeasy if you see yourself as
someone who's never gone throughaddiction, never struggled with
that in any capacity to then bejudgmental and harsh with
(18:43):
others, because that's them, notme. Yeah,
Stephanie Olson (18:49):
yeah. Well, it's interesting, because when I
quit drinking, and I was arounda lot of alcoholics, and when I
quit drinking, those people,those people, I don't mean it
like that, but the people whowere, people in your life, in my
life, who were drinking, andfrankly, still are those people
(19:14):
had a real problem with mequitting, and It's because it
shines a mirror on them when,when you have an addiction, and
you're hanging out with all thepeople who have the same
addiction, and you say, I'mgoing to quit, they don't. They
hear a couple things like crap,I'm losing my drinking buddy, or
(19:36):
I'm losing my Pepsi buddy orwhatever. But also, if they
think they have a problem, thenI must have a problem. And I
think that's a hard thing tolook at and say, Okay, I don't
want to, I don't want to look attheir problem and have think
that they're they need to stopbecause. That just shines a
(20:01):
mirror on me. That makes
Unknown (20:03):
a lot of sense. Yeah, and I see how relationships
could get strained there,because you don't want to be
close to someone who's pointingout something about you that you
don't like, even if they're notdirectly talking about you.
That's uncomfortable. It
Stephanie Olson (20:16):
is well, and you know, the other thing I
would say is that you know, AAsays you have to change your
playgrounds and playmates. Sowhen you are in an addiction and
your whole circle is filling,that you've got to find new
(20:42):
people in your life, or new youknow. And so I think that's
really hard, too. When I gotsober, I was very fortunate,
because we wound up physicallymoving out of the city into a
new city. So I had been soberfor two years, and then we moved
and so when we moved into my newhouse, I had never that that
(21:06):
house. Had never known Mia'sdrinker, and so we had a dry
house, and it was great. And andso, you know, I think those are
things that help, but you haveto also be mindful that the
whole world is surrounding anysort of addiction, right?
(21:27):
Illicit drugs are easier to giveup to some I mean, they're not
easier to kick, I would say, butit's easier to move away from
that, in a sense, depending onwhat the drugs are, because you
can really get away from thepeople who are doing that
(21:48):
alcohol is much harder because,and please don't hear me say
it's easier to quit heroin thanalcohol. I'm not saying that the
drugs are very hard to kick, butI think it's kind of the dynamic
of food versus alcohol, or foodversus drugs. You you go
(22:13):
anywhere and there's alcohol asopposed to, right, illicit
drugs, right?
Unknown (22:19):
It's advertised to you, you go into a restaurant,
they're immediately asking, Doyou want some wine? Can I get
you a drink? Yeah, very easy tosay, Yes and No,
Stephanie Olson (22:29):
exactly, yeah.
So I have a funny story for you.
Not sure it's well, I think it'sfunny. So I was in New York with
my oldest, and we were in LittleItaly, and we went to this
fabulous cafe. Well, it was likea it was a dessert and coffee
(22:54):
Cafe, and you could either buyit was lovely, and you could
either buy the dessert andleave, and there was like a
area, or you could sit and havea drink and some dessert. Well,
we decided to sit, and obviouslywe were there for dessert. And I
(23:15):
had, I think Noelle did have adrink of age, and I said to the
waiter, I just would likewhatever cheesecake. I don't
know what it was, I would justlike this. And he flipped the
menu over, because on the otherside of the menu were all the
cocktails. And he said, No, youwant one of these? And I said,
(23:38):
No, I don't. I'll just havedessert. That's where it should
have stopped. But I oh my gosh.
He was like, Nope, you want oneof these? We went back and forth
three times at least, and Isaid, No, I don't want to drink.
I would just like dessert and adecaf coffee or water, whatever.
(24:00):
And he fought me on it, andaggressive, upselling it. Yeah,
it really was. And finally Isaid, and I was very boisterous.
I did not keep quiet. Butfinally I said, I would like you
(24:20):
to stop asking me if I wouldlike drink. I'm a recovering
alcoholic, and I don't drink, soplease stop asking me. And
everyone turned around, and hewas like, Oh, I'm sorry. And he
walked away,
Unknown (24:42):
and Noel looked for the next person.
Stephanie Olson (24:45):
Well, just wait. Noelle looked at me, and
she was like, You warned him. SoI was like, okay, yes, I did. I
did. Well, he came back and hesaid, I don't believe. Leave
you, but I'm not going to askyou anymore. And I said, want
(25:07):
you to prove that. Well, I did.
I said, come here. And I openedup my wallet, because I carry a
chip with me all the time, and Ihave, usually, the last you
know, the year that I'mcurrently on in my wallet. And I
said, come here. And I said,Look at this. Do you know what
this is? And he said, No. And Isaid, turn around. Look closer.
(25:28):
And he was like, Oh. I said,that says I'm sober. I think it
was 21 years at the time sinceI'm sober. 21 years. I'm not
lying. Don't ever do that tosomebody again, ever. And he
apologized profusely. Actuallysaid something like, this is
like, I'm in a movie. I don'tknow it was just bizarre, but
(25:50):
there was a woman behind me whowalked up to me and she said, I
just wanted to thank you. I havetwo years sobriety today, and we
are here to celebrate withdessert, and what you did just
helped me. You know, stay soberfor one more you tear up. Yeah,
(26:14):
it was a very cool experience,but it just showed the amount of
I mean, talk about weird peerpressure. That's not even peer
pressure. That's like somestranger pressure.
Unknown (26:32):
I mean, imagine if you were freshly sober one week, 30
days
Stephanie Olson (26:35):
exactly. I it was, it was appalling. And so
that's why I said, Don't ever dothat to anybody ever again. And
that's exactly it. It does nottake much to justify and to
fold. And I know withalcoholism, I think it's like
80% of people will relapse. Andso it's not uncommon, and we
(27:00):
have to really support peoplethat are getting off of, you
know, drugs, alcohol, the it'shard to do. It's hard to do, and
it takes a tremendous amount ofcourage, a tremendous amount of
support, and a tremendous amountof grit, really, and turning it
over. It's a surrender, constantsurrender. But I just think that
(27:25):
that's people need to be mindfulof those things, whether it is
food, whatever addiction that weneed to be honoring. Of people,
if they say no, I know that'sweird, but they mean, no, it's
consent.
Unknown (27:41):
Yes. Man, I feel like something that's probably not
recognized enough by someone whohasn't had a loved one struggle,
or, you know, have struggledthemselves, is it's not just I'm
giving this thing up, it's I'mchanging my entire life because
this was such a problem. And,yeah, that needs to be respected
Stephanie Olson (28:04):
right now.
That's really true, because itis a complete life change and,
and even, you know, even whenwe're talking about eating
healthy foods, you know, same,same thing or whatever, you
know, I I have had to really bemindful of my food intake. And
it's not so much what I eat, buthow I eat, and my relationship
(28:32):
with food, and looking at foodas good or bad, or, you know,
things like that. I've had tochange all of that mindset. But
then, at the same time, as I getolder, there are things that I I
mean, back in the day, I usedto, if I wanted to lose weight,
I would stop eating for two daysand lose like, you know, 10
(28:56):
pounds, like in my 20s, butthat's not the case as you age.
And so there are all thosethings that you have to think
about your
Unknown (29:11):
you were talking about some things that you know you've
changed to make it easier foryou. And I think that one of the
other things that people cantend to do that really do this
recovering person a disserviceis poke holes at that. Well,
that's so weird that you'redoing that. What do you mean?
You don't want to go here or dothis or pornography. Addiction
is a good example. There'ssomeone I know that had
(29:33):
struggled with an addiction topornography, and so he has put
guardrails in place for himself.
Sure. You know, phone is lockeddown. Things are sent to a
sponsor. You know, if you lookat those websites, it triggers
someone else's phone, yeah? Orthat accountability piece that's
a great thing, yeah, that'sactively approaching the problem
and trying to set up safeguardsfor yourself. Yeah? Ever he has
faced a little bit of what wasthe word I'm looking. Ridicule,
(29:59):
ridiculed, yeah, because you'rea grown man and you have to be
babysat, Mm, hmm. Well, it's notthat. It's trying to be
responsible, and I think thatsometimes, whether it's
pornography, addiction,alcoholism, whatever, that that
can happen too. Yeah, you know,oh, it's so embarrassing that
you have to do that? Well, Idon't think it's embarrassing. I
(30:21):
think it's a sign of strengththat you're into that.
Stephanie Olson (30:26):
I think that's a great point. I agree. And I
think too people who don'tunderstand how I think you're
right. I think everybody isaddicted in some way, to
something. And you know, if wewere to be honest with
ourselves, or look at that, it'shard and and some of it, you
know, some of it may seemhealthy, like I'm I'm addicted
(30:48):
to exercise, or I'm addicted towhatever. But you know, some of
it could seem very harmless, butaddiction, true addiction, takes
over your entire life. And sowith pornography addiction, I
know people who couldn't evenfunction because of that
(31:09):
addiction, or, of course, ruinfamilies. And you know, same
thing with drugs and alcohol andfood. I mean, I don't know if
you ever have seen, oh my gosh,I I went on a kind of a binge
bad, no pun intended, of like,my 600 pound life or whatever,
(31:32):
oh my gosh. It's a fascinatingshow, and I weirdly love it for
some reason, like interestingand heartbreaking at the same
time it is and then sometimesvery redemptive. You know,
sometimes it's like, reallyencouraging to watch, because
these people change their entirelives. But these people, of
course, are completely addictedto food. You know? What is a
(31:55):
common theme woven in that,especially in that show, or in
that yes, an enabler, there'salways an enabler. And I think
that's probably true with mostaddictions. There's somebody who
does not want you, not evenintentionally. It's not even
(32:16):
like I don't want you to getsober or I don't want you to
stop eating or get get healthy,or I don't even think, but if
you do, then you're gonna leaveme. Or if you do, you know it's
all this other emotion, which iswhy learning codependency is
also a conviction, right? Well,and I think
Unknown (32:38):
sometimes it comes from a place of like, I don't want to
see you struggle. I don't wantto see you be sad. And even if
you need to go through a periodof being sad to be healthy, I
don't want you that
Stephanie Olson (32:49):
right, right?
Cuz it does suck getting gettingfree from that. With
Unknown (32:55):
a lot of those addictions too. There's physical
symptoms, the withdrawal, ohyeah, go through, yeah, that's
hard to
Stephanie Olson (33:01):
watch. Yeah, it absolutely is, because you are
literally sick, right? I mean,it's, it's a sickness. I
remember when I quit smoking,plus, like smoking, you're just,
mean, you know, when you quitsmoking, here, have a cigarette.
You are no fun to be around. Butit is, yeah, any type of
(33:22):
withdrawal is hor, you know,it's just hard on the body.
You're probably not thatpleasant to be around. And so I
think that. But I think in thoseshows, it's often, you know, the
person is morbidly obese, andthen the person who's enabling
(33:43):
is also obese, just not morbidlyobese. And so it's just a it's
an interesting dynamic, whichis, I think this the the same
with just about with so manyenablers, not all of them, but,
you know, so many enablers. It'sjust interesting,
Unknown (34:01):
well, and I wonder sometimes, too, if there's
almost, like this internalcompetitiveness of like, I
struggle, but I need you tostruggle more than me so I can
feel okay about myself.
Stephanie Olson (34:11):
Ooh, yeah, no one would want to admit that.
No, that's a little selfish. Butno, it's true. Yeah, because you
say I'm not as bad as thatperson, right? I remember, so I,
(34:31):
I used to sponsor people quite abit in programs. I used to
sponsor people and, um, and one,Gal told me that I don't know
she was telling me something andabout her and her story was like
(34:51):
everybody else's story. Youknow, I think all of us feel
like, oh my gosh, either I'm theworst there is, or I'm not as
bad. Is that, but we, we arealone like we don't. Nobody
understands. Nobody's beenthere. And so I said to her, you
are not unique. And she justshe, she kind of was shocked,
(35:14):
and I and I said, you're likeeverybody else who's addicted to
this, and it's no different. Sodon't consider yourself unique
in this, because you're not. AndI think sometimes that's a
reality that needs to be slappedin our face as addicts, because
we do feel very unique, and noone will understand. And I have
(35:37):
to deal with this by myself andor I don't want to get help for
this because, and it's, it's youare so not alone, and there's so
much support out there. Butyeah, we're there's always
something,
Unknown (35:51):
yeah, I'm sure that was hard to hear, but important to
hear.
Stephanie Olson (35:56):
Well, I don't know. She never got sober, so
yeah, which is, which is yetsober, right, right, yeah, which
is, it's sad. Some people justhave a really hard time. And
it's, it's, it's hard, and I'mjust grateful. I have to, I have
(36:20):
to say, so I got sober when Iwas, I was like 32 and I am so
grateful that I'm not one ofthose women my age, like out in
the bars and just getting drunk.
And I'm just so grateful. And II've had a weird, maybe
(36:40):
addiction, I don't know. No,it's not addiction. It's a
guilty pleasure, because I couldstop at any time. No, I'm just
kidding. I have a guiltypleasure of watching body
cameras of alcohol, of drug,drunk drivers, and it's
fascinating to watch everysingle drunk driver on that
(37:03):
thing is, like, I live rightover there. I've only had one
drink, or I've had no drinksevery single one. But it's just
a good reminder, like, thank youGod, that I am sober because I
do not want to experience thatevery day in my life. I
Unknown (37:24):
think that makes a lot of sense. Like, hey, that's
where I could have been. So gladthat's not me right now, yeah,
Stephanie Olson (37:32):
yeah. I I'm a I would, I would love to have. I
think it would be really cool tohear just somebody have a
conversation of somebody'stestimony, or, you know,
something that somebody did giveup as as an addict, or whatever
it may be, and just hear theirstory. Because I think it's
(37:53):
important to hear other people'sstories and how they recovered,
and that redemption piece, Ithink those are the most
important. That's how I alwaysknow, by the way, somebody is
healthy to speak at their story,whether it be a survivor of
something, whether it besomebody who's addicted, because
(38:16):
their story is not about thegory details. Their story is
that redemption piece, and Ithink that's the bottom line,
and what it needs to be forpeople.
Unknown (38:28):
Yeah, that's what can really have the power to help.
Stephanie Olson (38:31):
Yes, exactly.
So yeah, I think that's a it's agood, good conversation, but I
do think it's important toreally be mindful, and it's self
awareness, right? What are thethings in my life that are
holding me back, or, what arethe things in my life that are
not serving me, that I need tolet go, and what are the things
(38:54):
in my life that are literallykeeping me from moving forward.
And I think when we can look atthat and identify those things,
if there's nothing awesome, butif there are things going to get
the help that you need, findingthose resources in your area,
talking to someone who has beenthere, or somebody who is
(39:18):
licensed in that area, and Ithink there is no shame in
asking for help, Shame on peoplewho make somebody feel bad for
asking for help or telling themto continue in what they're
asking for help for. But thereis no shame, and there's so many
people who can support in fact,I will tell you i I'm very open
(39:41):
about my alcoholism, and I justrecently announced that I was 23
years sober at a event I was atthank you, and somebody
approached me and said that. Isthat that is so amazing. And I
had several people tell me, I'veexperienced that. I've gone
(40:05):
through that. You know, you justdon't know who is going through
something like that or who needshelp until you're just open
sometime for a server who outsyou because you because you
don't want a cocktail. Oh mygosh, I don't do that. That,
that guy, he should, I, I, Ican't even, I mean, it's the
(40:30):
weirdest story, because I can'timagine doing that to anybody,
like, what an idiot. But at thesame time, it was cool because
it made a difference insomeone's life, and thank
goodness it wasn't her. He didthat too. True. Seriously, come
on,
Unknown (40:51):
next level.
Stephanie Olson (40:54):
Good it is, but now it's a good story.
Unknown (41:00):
Looks back on that every time he's putting
Stephanie Olson (41:02):
menus out. I hope he does. I hope he does.
But you know, even, even in mywork, you know, I will, you
know, I do a lot of networking.
I go to a lot of networkingthings, and I cannot tell you
how many people are like, let'smeet over cocktails or just go
have a glass of wine orwhatever, and I'm fine with
(41:23):
that. I'm not gonna I wouldnever embarrass somebody, but at
the same time, that's howacceptable it is, and I think
why it's such an epidemic. Iappreciate
Unknown (41:40):
your openness with everything today, and I think
this is really important forsomeone to hear. And I don't
know kind of my takeaway fromthis, that I think is going to
stick in my mind is, if someonereally wants the best for you,
then they're going to comealongside you and support you,
even if they don't quiteunderstand your
Stephanie Olson (41:59):
problem. Yeah, that's a good point. I agree,
yeah. Well, thank you. Yeah. Ilove, I love talking about
things like that, because it'sclose to my heart, and I know
other people struggle with it,and just to give a place, and so
I would offer, like, if that'ssomething you are going through
and you need someone to talk, toreach out, because I am more
(42:21):
than welcome to I am more thanwelcome. I'm more than happy to
have a conversation withsomebody. And you can reach us
at, it is in our notes, in thepodcast or YouTube, but you can
reach me at Stephanie at set mefree project.net, and Rebecca at
set me free project.net, andwe'd be happy to talk about
(42:42):
addictions or human traffickingor anything that's right, yes.
So thank you so much. This was agood conversation. Rebecca,
thank you for thank you forsuggesting it. And if there's
something you want to hear,please let us know we would love
to hear from you and we'll seeyou next time get some R and R.
(43:05):
Bye. You.
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