In this episode of Restoration Beyond the Couch, Dr. Lee Long sits down with Dr. Debra Atkisson, a seasoned psychiatrist and certified coach, to explore practical strategies for mental health and resilience. Drawing from over 20 years of experience and her upcoming book, Master Your Storm, Dr. Atkisson shares valuable insights into navigating challenges and fostering personal growth.
This enlightening conversation dives into actionable advice and empowering tips, offering listeners tools to enhance their mental wellness and live their healthiest lives. Don't miss this inspiring episode that brings expert guidance and fresh perspectives on mastering life's storms.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to Restoration Beyond the Couch,
hosted by Dr Lee Long.
In this episode, dr Longinterviews Dr Deborah Atkison, a
board-certified psychiatristand professional certified coach
with over 20 years ofexperience.
Based in Fort Worth, texas, drAtkison has dedicated her career
to helping individuals livetheir healthiest lives.
Has dedicated her career tohelping individuals live their
(00:23):
healthiest lives.
She is the author of theupcoming book Master your Storm
Insights from a Psychiatrist andCoach, which offers profound
wisdom and practical strategiesfor navigating mental health
challenges.
Join us as Dr Atkinson sharesher experiences in psychiatry
and coaching.
Together with Dr Long, they'llexplore the intersection of
(00:45):
mental health and personalgrowth, delivering actionable
insights that you can apply toyour own life.
Your path to mental wellnessstarts here.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Welcome, Dr Atkinson.
It's so nice to have you withus.
It's great to be here.
Yeah, when we set this up, Igot super excited because I
remember the very first time Imet you and it's I don't know I
won't tell our listeners howlong ago that was.
It was decades ago, yes.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Which have passed rather quickly, haven't they?
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Rather quickly, rather quickly, and some of us
have weathered really well,yourself, and you too, and some
of us have weathered really wellyourself.
Thank you too, thanks, but Iremember you were working with I
don't remember if it was a PHPor an IOP, for the little ones,
as I call them and anotherpsychiatrist had invited me to
(01:44):
come for lunch to talk aboutrestoration because it was brand
new at the time.
And you were.
He, for whatever reason reasoncouldn't make it to the lunch.
You were the the onlypsychiatrist that that showed up
for the lunch and, uh, I thinkthat there were some drug reps
there to talk about the, the new, the newest, latest, greatest,
yes, and you and I startedtalking, and we started talking
about parenting and philosophiesof things and our theoretical
(02:11):
bents, and it was like an hourwent by like that.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
It did.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
And since then it's like I feel like we've been fast
friends we have.
I just have been nostalgiclately and thinking back on that
.
It was just such a really cool.
I just remember going home andtelling my wife what a, what a
great lunch that was and howcool it was to meet you, to have
so much synergy and such.
(02:37):
So anyway, thanks for all theyears and thanks for being here.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Well, thank you.
And you know, I have to say Ialso get nostalgic about things
and at that phase of my lifewhen we met I thought great guy,
great philosophy, he's a greattherapist.
I'm hoping we do more worktogether, which we did over the
years.
We went through the DBTtraining here with the whole
team, got to know the team well,came over and we meet with you
(03:01):
regularly.
We've shared patients, have avery similar way of seeing
things, which is really nice anddid all kinds of extra learning
about using nutrition betterand ways we could help with that
and about a holistic approachto mental health which is what a
lot of this is that you'redoing right now, which I am
really excited about that you'rehelping people understand that
(03:24):
everybody needs to look at theirown mental health and needs to
look at all the other areas oftheir life to have a truly
holistic way of living life atits fullest and take care of
yourself.
And the other thing I'm goingto say that I've come to
appreciate over the years isconnection, and so back in those
days I would meet someone likeI had a strong connection with
(03:46):
you, which is continued notunderstanding.
Maybe there are notcoincidences and perhaps
connections happen for a reasonand then synergy happens with
what people are doing and itgoes on to better your community
, to help better enrich peoplearound you and helps enrich your
(04:06):
own life.
So I want to thank you for theconnection.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Oh, that's really cool.
I appreciate that Right back atyou, thank you.
So you mentioned a lot of whatyou've been doing, a lot of what
you've done, but you've been achild, an adolescent, an adult
psychiatrist for just a littlebit.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
A long time, a long time.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
A long time.
Yes, sir.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
More than 30 years, we shall say I like that, we'll
leave it there.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
But what I love about your zest and spirit is that
you haven't just stuck in thatlane, and so can you tell us all
the other things that you'vealso done.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
So you know, I became a physician because I really
wanted to help people, and I did.
I was very blessed at a youngerage to get in touch with the
fact that I had been givencertain interests and abilities
that aligned well with my truespirit of wanting to be a helper
.
I'm a classic helper and that'swhat I want to do.
(05:10):
I want to help people and somedicine was a great fit.
It was while I was in medicalschool that I got in touch with
mental health and how importantand foundational it is.
If you talk to a primary caredoctor, they'll tell you a
minimum of 30% of the patientswho walk in my office every day
from primary care they arecoming for issues that are
(05:31):
really related to their mentalhealth, which all of us know.
Anxiety and depression aboundand it's not doesn't, sadly,
appear to be getting any better,which we can have a whole talk
about that.
But that's what led me into that.
But what I began to learn overthe years in working with
patients is that peopleeverybody needs different
(05:54):
approaches and people eachindividual is a very different
person and we do get ourexperiences in working with
people, so we have ideas oftools we can use to help them.
But we have to really thinkabout what each person's needs
are.
And that led me to realize Ineeded to grow my own skill set.
So I made a decision after avery long number of years in
(06:15):
private practice about 26 yearsin Fort Worth that I would step
into the role of becoming aprofessional, certified coach.
So I went to the TCU MedicalCenter.
They recruited me there and Iwas a coach for the medical
students for five years.
During that period of time Ibecame certified and today I do
(06:36):
some work that is related to thepractice of psychiatry and I do
work related to coaching, andthere's an area of intersection
where those?
two things are very importantand very holistic.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
And I want to pause for a second and I want to make
sure to point out one of themost phenomenal things that I
think being a coach tophysicians offers is.
I know that I have heard fromso many physicians that
residency medical school is soand I'm just going to be really
(07:07):
blunt here it's traumatic.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
It is very traumatizing.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
And that there's not- .
Speaker 3 (07:12):
And we sustain everyone in their training,
accumulates a lot of macrotraumas.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yes, which, by the time, you are a seasoned
physician and have decades underyour belt those traumas really
do break forth.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
You've worked with a lot of physicians.
Oh, I have.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
And it breaks my heart to think that these folks
are going into this professionto be such a help to the world.
I will talk about.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
That's why I did it with the med students, because I
wanted to give back and Iwanted to be able to help them.
And today I still work withsome physicians, residents and
med students who reach out to me.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
I ran, I used to run with one of the, a person who
was over residence for a certainschool and a hospital and such.
But one of the things that wewould talk about on some of our
longer runs were how hard it wasfor residents and just their
mental health their mentalhygiene just suffered so greatly
(08:12):
and how this person's goal wasto eliminate or to reduce.
I was dumbfounded.
Suicides for these individuals.
And when you said to me hey,I'm, I'm going to be a coach for
the medical school, I just, Ijust want you to know that my in
(08:32):
my heart, I was just staying.
I've been giving you a standingovation ever since because this
is such a a group ofindividuals that I think we need
to protect.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
I cannot tell you how much I appreciate the fact that
you're spotlighting that in ourconversation today, because I
do want to comment on that.
So I loved being in my practiceand today I still do a small
amount of practice.
I mean, I absolutely loveworking with patients and I
think that's part of my ownpurpose that I will not walk
away from.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
The world is so happy to hear that.
Speaker 3 (09:04):
And I do love it very much.
But I also want to say that whenthe new medical school was
being built here and I wasapproached by someone about the
fact that they were going todevelop a coaching program
specifically for us to work withmedical students, the more I
learned about coaching, the moreI realized this could be an
answer for a lot of the issuesthat happen in health care
(09:26):
across the board, especiallywith the physicians, because if
they have someone who works withthem in medical school
residency and as youngattendings, it can make an
enormous difference in theirlife, which makes a difference
within their own family, withincommunity and then across the
board with all of us, in theirown family, within community and
then across the board with allof us In medical school.
(09:47):
Today, things are better, but Ican tell you that medical school
is extremely traumatic.
The individuals who areattracted to going into health
care, and especially who go intomedicine, are people who feel a
strong sense of purpose, thatthey want to indeed be helpers,
which, if you're that type ofperson type two on the Enneagram
(10:08):
if you're that type of person,by nature you will often take
care of other people before youtake care of yourself.
That can become a lethalcombination for a doctor,
because the amount of work,especially in medical school and
residency, that you have toabsorb and do is so enormous
that it becomes impossible to doeverything perfectly.
(10:31):
That's the other component, andI think these principles apply
to people in other work areas.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
I've seen it with attorneys.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
I've seen it with a very driven businessman that
I've worked with as a coach.
I've seen this across the boardand in academics same thing.
People who really want to exceland who are perfectionistic may
often put their last, theirneeds, last on the list, and
when that happens it's a perfectstorm.
If you add to that any geneticsusceptibility for depression or
(11:03):
anxiety or you heap on top ofthat other life stressors, then
you have a storm that can leadpeople to really being at risk
for such a suicide.
Sad to say that I'm going tosay this today, but in the
epidemic of suicide we have inour nation, of all professions,
physicians have the highest percapita number of individuals in
(11:26):
a profession who commit suicide.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Wow, so they've jumped the dentistry.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
They have.
They're number one as far asprofessions and, interestingly,
women psychiatrists, of which Iam one.
Women psychiatrists lead thelist too, and I have many
thoughts as to why that is.
I think that femalepsychiatrists tend to be very
nurturing and they tend to beeven better or worse, however
(11:52):
you want to think about that atputting people's needs high on
the list and often will not takecare of their own and will
often ignore their own self-care.
So as a coach, I learned a lotas I worked with medical
students and that led me todoing some work with residents
and I have now coachedphysicians.
I can tell you, during thepandemic I was virtually you
(12:14):
know, on Zoom, like all the restof us, trapped in that box, but
I was coaching doctors who wereon the front line.
I coached some emergency roomdoctors and hospitalists and the
stories that I would hear abouthow they had to put on all of
the equipment this is before wehad the vaccine.
If you all remember, doctorslooked like they were aliens
from outer space and all of thatequipment to protect them.
(12:37):
While they were in the roomseeing the patient, how they had
to be at their bedside and theyknew they were the last human
contact they would have beforethat person died and the
incredible toll it took on thatdoctor as he or she was there
with an iPad, helping thisindividual connect to the people
they loved as they were dying.
It was beyond traumatizing.
(13:00):
And I know that during thepandemic there was so much
acknowledgement about ourdoctors, our heroes, and, sad to
say, we've kind of gone back tobusiness as usual.
You know now that we've emergedfrom the pandemic.
But that leads me to a pointthat I want to make that I think
we as a community can learn,related to what the pandemic
(13:20):
taught us.
We had a horrific time that wastraumatizing.
If you will notice, people don'treally talk about it much
anymore and if you go back andknow I was not practicing
medicine during the time of theSpanish flu, but if you go back
to about 100 or so years, morethan 100 years ago, if you go,
look at the Spanish flu and thatperiod of time, the same
(13:41):
phenomenon happened.
Many people died.
It was horribly traumatic toeveryone and that is, they
finally emerged from it.
People didn't really talk aboutit and process it, and the
reason I'm bringing that up isbecause I think for doctors in
their training.
As you mentioned, there's acumulative effect of traumas.
I think for everybody there wasan impact from the pandemic,
(14:05):
even if you had no one who wasclose to you who was ill or died
.
You didn't get ill or die, butyour whole life changed and
there was a tremendous anxietyand worry.
So the reason I bring this up isI just encourage everybody take
a moment to sort of reflectabout maybe life before the
pandemic, life during thepandemic and life today.
(14:26):
If you'll take a moment to dothat, it will actually help you
move forward and be, I think, bemore productive and process
whatever's going on and if youfind there are things you really
need to process, reach out.
We know how great therapy is,we know how great coaching is,
but we also know how great asupport system is Family members
(14:46):
, ministers, other people thatyou can talk to.
So I do want to take a momentjust to highlight that, because
I'm running into that withpatients today even who are
really doing what I call limpingalong.
They're functioning, butthey're limping along, certainly
not living their best life, andthat's the thing I've always
tried to be about, is I reallywant to help people live their
(15:08):
best life.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
I love that and I boy , I second that.
I think that I was just talkingwith somebody earlier this week
who is was trying to to figureout how to engage their partner
who had lost a family member, aparent, and they were like I
(15:34):
don't know how to bring it up,and it was like that's sort of
the thought behind mosttraumatic experiences we think
we should just push them off tothe side, and I don't think it's
ill-intended, I think it's theopposite.
I think we don't bring it upbecause we think I don't want to
cause them harm or bring painto them.
(15:57):
Pain's already there.
I know that when I lost my Ilost both of my parents five
weeks apart, almost 18 years ago, and I felt like a pariah after
that happened because peopledidn't want to bring it up, they
didn't want to make me sad.
Well, guess what?
I already was sad and there wasstill that space in me that
(16:17):
that if you brought it up and Iwas in a happy moment, I have
enough internal bandwidth to beable to interact with something
sad and still have a happymoment as well.
And I think that you like whatyou're saying.
With the pandemic, it's or or or, anything like let's not forget
these things, let's we don'thave to sit in the negative, but
(16:38):
we certainly do need tounderstand where we are with it.
You know, I mean the termintrapersonal understanding or
intrapersonal perceptualunderstanding is something that
is very important to me in mycareer.
It's because intrapersonal forthose of you listening is
(17:00):
because I know you're veryfamiliar with this is the
understanding of self how do Iinteract with something?
And I think that we've lostthat.
We cover over things.
We don't know how to sort thatthrough, we don't know where we
are with something and thereforewe become very reactionary
instead of responsive, and itimpacts our interpersonal
(17:24):
understanding, or ourinterpersonal perceptual
understanding, which is how Irelate to you.
That's the we.
What is our interpersonal?
Speaker 3 (17:35):
And I also think if you don't have that good
interpersonal understanding, youcan misinterpret others, other
people, and that impacts yourinterpersonal relationships with
others.
You don't interpret theirintention or their motive or
what they're trying to do in therelationship.
Yes, you project your own underthe things you don't understand
(17:59):
about yourself and they're notresolved onto them A hundred
percent.
And so you're completely, ahundred percent correct.
You've got to start with thatgood internal understanding.
And that's where I thinkmindfulness comes in as a
foundation, because you have tobe, whatever form of therapy
you're doing or whatever you'redoing, to take care of yourself.
Mindfulness has to be afoundation, it has to be.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
That self-awareness, I agree with you.
And to your point, I think youknow DBT, which is something
that we do a lot of, and that wego back together doing the
training together.
That was a long training.
It was a long time ago.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Wasn't that almost three years by the time we did
it all?
Because we had to do the studytogether for over a year.
We had to see a certain numberof patients together and meet a
certain number of times, andthen we went through a couple of
weeks of very intensivetraining and exam.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
And we did.
And what's so crazy is that andI don't know if everybody
realizes this I don't think theydo that as a group.
There were some people thatwere in our final training that
did not graduate.
Yes, you remember they had thatceremony for us where you had
to go quietly and mindfully,look into everybody's eyes and
(19:13):
offer gratitude only with a gazethat was intense, offer
gratitude only with a gaze thatwas intense.
Yes, that was intense.
But DBT is, to your point, isvery foundationally based on
mindfulness and understanding.
That sense of mindfulness andeverything is built on top of
that.
That's the base layer and Ithink it's that, like, like
you're bringing in, is thatintrapersonal understanding.
(19:36):
And you look at our culture andhow a lot of things are
misunderstood, and my hypothesisI'm not, I'm not certain, I'm
curious in this area, but myhypothesis is that we are
missing the intrapersonalperceptual understanding in our
world.
Therefore, we really miss eachother 100%.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
I'm going to comment on that.
I think that that is the keyright there to one of the
reasons why we have so manyissues in our country with
mental health, because I'm goingto be the first person to say I
wouldn't live anywhere butAmerica.
I love America and my familyhas been here since the 1600s
(20:26):
helping build this country,literally build it.
Farmers, construction workers,police officers, ministers,
teachers I mean, I am frompeople who have helped build
America and I love America, sothat's something I know we share
in common.
But, that being said, I think,because of the way our culture
is here in America is we alwayshave taken the position of we're
(20:48):
moving forward, we're buildingthings, we're excelling, and
there isn't a moment of hittingthe pause button.
Whenever something does come up, it's like well, I mean, I'm
also a fifth generation Texan,so you know, we know what we
think here in Texas.
You just pull yourself up byyour bootstraps and you keep on
going Right.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
So especially in West .
Speaker 3 (21:07):
Texas, especially in West Texas, and so and I you
know there's a lot of goodthings about the strength and
resilience that comes with thatattitude, but the only thing I
would say is that I think, evenif you're a tough, strong person
, before you pull thosebootstraps up, take a moment to
just hit the pause button andacknowledge what's going on with
(21:28):
you, what you're dealing with,and give yourself a little bit
of self-compassion and kindnessin the moment.
One of the things I did withthe medical students that I want
to comment on and this is anexercise that I think can be
extrapolated to anything anyoneis doing when I had young
medical students who wereinteracting with patients who
(21:49):
were significantly ill for thefirst time, I'll never forget
one who today is in training tobe an emergency room physician,
and she will be an amazing one.
But I remember when I beganworking with her, she was an
extremely empathic young woman,very kind, very empathic and
very caring, and she came to meand said I need to talk about
(22:09):
this because I don't know if I'mgoing to be able to be a doctor
.
I said well, let's sit down andtalk.
What has happened?
She said I have a patient I'vebeen following as part of my
experience and this patient hasdeveloped a very severe terminal
medical illness and because Ihad a rapport with the patient.
(22:29):
When they learned that that wasthe diagnosis, I was in the room
with the attending doctor.
The patient had said when myfamily comes in here, can you
also be in the room while I talkwith my family about this, with
the doctor?
And that was part of herlearning experience.
So she was in the room and shesaid this has haunted me.
(22:50):
It has haunted me.
You know.
She called me Coach Deb, that'swhat they call me.
Because this has haunted me.
Coach Deb, that's what theycall me because this has haunted
me, coach Deb, because I havecarried this with me.
And she had these big, dark,haunted looking eyes and I said
to her let's take a momenttogether about why it's haunting
you.
So we talked that through andthen I said to her do you
(23:12):
realize that your presence washelpful and supportive?
She wasn't really able to seethat and as we talked I said
your purpose as a doctor is totry to help a person get well.
When you have a situation wherethat cannot happen, what is
your next purpose as a doctor?
She said to be compassionate,to be kind, to give them support
(23:34):
and to alleviate suffering.
I said do you feel you did thatto give them support and to
alleviate suffering?
I said do you feel you did that?
She said yes, I said so.
In that moment, were you yourbest for that person?
She looked at me with thisawakening realization in her
eyes and she said I was.
I said so.
You did what you were meant todo.
(23:56):
So what I would encourage you todo going forward is when you
are with a patient, I want youto be who you are because you
bring healing in the interaction.
You bring those things.
But when you step out of thatroom and close the door, I'm
going to ask you to pauseoutside the door before you go
to the next patient, I want youto reflect on what you did in
(24:16):
the moment and that you broughtin the moment what you needed to
bring for that patient, andthen I want you to however, it
will work for you.
I want you to release, releaseit, and so what we worked out
together is what she wasliterally going to do is think
about that.
She was simply going to openher hands like this, to release
it mindfully and take a breath,and then she would go pick up
(24:40):
the chart for the next patient.
So I asked her to practice thatand she practiced it and she
came when she graduated.
We talked right before shegraduated.
I got to be there and walk inwith the group.
As they did that.
She said I carry that with meand I use it as a tool.
And she said, honestly, I don'tthink there's any way I could
go into emergency medicine if Ididn't have that way of coping.
(25:03):
And she said it doesn't takelong at all, but it keeps me
from becoming depleted and keepsthat big sack on my back, full
of the burdens of what I've beendealing with all day from
getting bigger and bigger.
It keeps my load lighter.
Dealing with all day fromgetting bigger and bigger, it
keeps my load lighter.
And so I would encourage anyonewith whatever they do daily, to
(25:26):
remember some sort of practicelike that to help them be
present in the moment, be whoyou are, utilize those gifts,
use your purpose in that moment,but then allow it to go,
because that way you're able togo on and continue to serve your
purpose.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
I think that's so well stated, so well stated.
I have conceptualized that withsome professional athletes that
I work with that.
They have to turn the page orthey have to shut it out, and
the damage that shutting it outdoes to them and to their
families is really significant.
(26:02):
And it's like you build a silothat you can put it over here
and you can.
You can rest that stuff in thesilo, but at the end of the game
or at the you know, the turn ofthe quarter or the end of the
inning, you really do have to,to your point, open that silo
and mentalize or go through thatthe whole letting that go.
(26:25):
Otherwise you're going to shutyourself off and you lose a
sense of interpersonalperceptual understanding.
Therefore, you don't have theability to perceive others and
experience as well.
Speaker 3 (26:40):
Besides the cumulative effect that carrying
that around does, it begins towarp your self-perception.
So if you don't momentarily letyour brain think through and
process and release, what willhappen over time is you will
begin to feel you're carryingaround with you a lot of what
Failures, you're carrying arounda lot of things that didn't go
(27:03):
the way they should, and I thinkthat begins to really impact
people negatively.
I think in our culture we dostrive for perfectionism All of
us do.
I think you and I have beenguilty of that too right.
We set high standards and highgoals we want to reach, and
what's ironic to me is that whenpeople actually do reach those
goals, they don't take a momentto celebrate, because you know I
(27:25):
talk about using that moment torelease things.
You also should allow yourself,when you reach a pinnacle or
you've met a goal, to take amoment and celebrate it, even if
it's just an internalcelebration of I made that goal.
This is pretty great andwhatever the way you look at
things, I know that for myself.
(27:46):
When that happens for me and Itake that pause, I say thank you
, thank you, god, for lettingthis happen, thank you, and when
I do that, it's like thatbegins to help as well your own
sense of purpose and ability.
I'm going to, I'm going toreally kind of have a free
association here and move intoimposter syndrome, because I
(28:07):
actually think this is one ofthe things that could help
people with imposter syndromeExactly.
I have seen so many people andworked with so many people who
are high achieving, who don'ttake that moment to say the
marker happened, I've reachedthis marker, I've got to this
milestone.
That doesn't mean maybe thereisn't another mountain for me to
climb, but I've reached thisone.
(28:28):
Thank you, I did it.
This is great.
And in that moment, whoever youwant to thank, have gratitude.
I know for me, because of whereI sit in my own spiritual and
faith life.
I always believe that nothingis possible for me without God,
and so I take a moment to liftup and thank him, and then I
(28:51):
also say to him I know thiswould be possible without you
and I want you to show mewhatever you want me to do next,
because that's where I believemy own path has come from.
Other people as they look,whatever their faith tradition,
they need to think about that,and also I also take a moment to
think about the people I knowwho've helped me get there and I
(29:13):
have a moment of gratitude forthem Because I really believe
that if people could do that,that will begin to internally
going back to where you are theintra-psyche.
Go back there.
That will internally begin tostrengthen and reinforce the
traits and gifts that you have,to where you don't carry around
(29:33):
the imposter syndrome.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Right, and I love how you're saying that because it
takes us to a point of purposeof purpose.
You know, you and I talkedbefore we started rolling about
the whole idea of the blue zones.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
And you were saying some really neat things about
that.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Well, you know, now here I am in my West Texas voice
, I will do the best I can topronounce it.
That concept of ikigai that theJapanese have I-K-I-G-A-I, and
that whole purpose is seenwithin a lot of the blue zones.
I know in Okinawa, one of theblue zones, ikigai is alive and
(30:13):
well and what that basically isis the sense of purpose, but
they have refined it down to thethings that you are gifted or
can do and that you'reinterested in and that bring you
joy in doing and what yourcommunity and world needs.
So if you were to circle thoseVenn diagrams and bring that
(30:35):
together, if the nucleus of thatis Ikigai.
And so in Okinawa, for instance, they have a high number of
people who live to be 100 yearsold, for instance, they have a
high number of people who liveto be 100 years old, and it is
believed that, of course, as isin common with all the blue
zones, people eat healthier,they exercise more, they have
(30:56):
connections with other peopleand a sense of community.
You know, this is a whole thing.
Going on in America today isthe epidemic of loneliness.
That's another whole topic wecan talk about, but that's going
on.
But they have a sense ofconnection and with others.
But then they have theirpurpose, their reason for living
.
You can talk to somebody intheir nineties over there and
you will find they're continuingto follow their purpose.
(31:18):
That doesn't mean people'spurpose doesn't change over time
.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
Right, I think about parents, you know, and this in
our culture tends to rest moreheavily on mothers, yes, where
mothers often feel, when theirkids are leaving the nest, so to
speak, what's their purpose?
Even working mothers feel thatway, and I know dads do too.
(31:43):
But I think there's a differentconnection with mothers and I
think that, yeah, like wemothers, purposes can shift.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
I hear this and I see this, and I'm going to say to
any mother who's empty nestingout there I've done that too, so
I know what that's like.
But what I'm going to say isthat all of the skills that you
developed as a mother to safelyshepherd a person all the way to
adulthood, that is no smallfeat.
That is a monumental task, verymonumental, you know.
(32:13):
Congratulate yourself that youwere able to get an adult to the
point they were able tosuccessfully leave.
That's a huge accomplishment.
You work yourself out of a jobwhen you're a mother, so to
speak, but it also means you'vesucceeded.
That's right.
Those same skill sets areincredibly helpful and I would
encourage you to find a way touse those for your purpose.
Moving forward, mentoring otherwomen is extremely important.
(32:36):
I do that today.
I mentor some women who areprofessionals, women who have
reached out to me and asked meto do that, which has been a
great honor for me and has alsogiven me more purpose and has
helped me reflect and think moreabout things too.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
Yeah, I think that the whole concept of Ikigai
makes so, you know, dovetailingthat into the whole
intrapersonal perceptualunderstanding If you don't know
who you are, you don't have aconnection to your purpose.
And I think, I think it's justso important that we understand
(33:12):
more about who we are, weunderstand what our purpose is,
we understand, you know why arewe here.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
Right, you know I do want to take a moment as to why
I wrote this book.
We've talked about that, so Idon't consider myself a major
writer and when you read thebook you'll as both a
psychiatrist and a coach, I havelearned something that I know.
(33:49):
I've experienced it, you'veexperienced it.
We've all experienced thingswhere we have, at different
points in our life, we have astorm and when the storm happens
, we often don't know how wewill face it.
I briefly comment on this.
In my book, one of the majorimportant points in my life was
when I was in my last year oftraining as a child psychiatrist
.
I was a very physically healthywoman.
(34:11):
I ran five miles a day, but Ideveloped non-Hodgkin's lymphoma
.
So that was a major storm I hadto face in my last year of
challenge having cancer, workingthrough that and that was a
very long time ago, might I add.
But it was during that timethat I was able to fortunately
use and lean into some of thecoping skills that I had going
(34:34):
through that.
But it also I developed moreresilience going through that
process as well, and it gave mepause to know this is a major
storm.
I've had other storms in mylife, we all have had them.
Your storm doesn't identify you, that's right.
Your storm helps you as you gothrough it and grow.
The reason I wrote this book isbecause, as a coach, what I was
(34:54):
beginning to realize when Iworked with people, I might want
to give them some sort of fieldwork or assignment to work on
between sessions.
I would look for certain thingsand I couldn't find them.
So what I've written here is aguide that could be helpful for
anyone, I think from age 15 andup.
That has to do with if there'sa reason you're reaching out to
(35:15):
try to figure out somethingabout yourself.
The first part of this booktalks about why did you pick the
book up?
It talks about what you need todo is find your why, which is
your purpose.
That's right.
The book talks about very basictools that you begin with, which
is basic mindfulness skills,and each chapter, which is
between five and ten pages, isfollowed with a couple of pages
(35:39):
of questions.
So it's a book workbook whereyou simply read the question,
write the answers and move on.
It's for you, and so you find amindfulness exercise you do.
Then you develop intention.
What do I want to do?
What am I trying to accomplish?
And then you need to look at aphase of evaluation where you
look over all areas of your lifeand figure where do I need to
(36:01):
start.
And then I have going into this, each one talking about
physical, emotional,psychological, intellectual,
financial and spiritual health.
Those are the areas I've askedyou to look at each one and you
decide which of those do I needto do the deepest dive into.
(36:22):
Then the book talks about how doyou have some coping skills
when you're dealing with stress,and then it talks about how do
you develop resilience.
It talks about action andaccountability and then,
literally the last threechapters is helping you build.
You start out with building aplan.
You come back in 30 days andlook at what you wrote.
(36:42):
Did I follow it?
What do I need to tweak to makeit better?
You tweak it and then the lastthing you do is this is what I
think will work.
I can keep this in play as Imove forward to three months and
beyond, because, guess what?
We know that if we work onsomething for three months,
we're probably going to get somemeasurable results that will
(37:03):
help us move forward.
So it's a guide.
At the end of the book.
Each section has references todifferent books that you can go
to and other resources to helpyou if you want to take a deeper
dive into something, so I putthis together for that purpose
and I hope that it helps somepeople.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
You know, one of the things that I love about all the
things you just said issomething that I think is a real
marker of who you are, is thatif I can't find it, I'm going to
go make it.
And I love that.
I love that Because, like yousaid, you know, at the beginning
(37:39):
of all this you said I'm ahelper, I'm a true helper.
Two on the Enneagram, and Ithink you really are, and that
is quintessentially who you are.
If, if it's not out there, thenI'm going to go find.
If it's out there, I'm going togo find it.
If I can't find it, I'm goingto create it, and I would say
that, yeah, where, where canpeople pick this up?
Speaker 3 (37:59):
So I just did the final grammatical edits and I
have been working with Dr DaleOkuduru with White Coat
Publishing on this project and abig shout out to him because
he's a great guy who also liveshis purpose and has a great
Christian walk himself, so I'vebeen very appreciative of having
(38:19):
made that connection with him,and so the final grammatical
edits were just done.
This will actually be able tobe found by November the 1st,
online at Amazoncom.
You'll be able to pick it up inpaperback form.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Fantastic and the book is called Master your Storm
.
Speaker 3 (38:35):
Master your Storm Insights from a Psychiatrist and
Coach.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
I mean what a valuable, what a valuable piece.
I mean that that having allwell, having highlights of your
wisdom I don't think the, Idon't think any library could
hold all your wisdom, but Ithink having the highlights of
your wisdom in these areas, youknow, in one place I think, is a
fantastic offering.
(39:01):
So thank you for taking thetime to do that.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Well, I appreciate that and you have been a part of
this journey as well, becauseI've talked with you about
concepts with this before, whichhas been very helpful and made
me reflect a lot as I wentthrough the process.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
Well, thank you for that.
I uh, I, I, you know.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
I do want to comment on that.
I do want to take a moment,because the whole thing you're
doing here with RestorationBeyond the Couch I am so
grateful you're doing it,because it takes all of your
years of experience and workingwith people and what you've
observed, but also what you'veintegrated in some of the
research you did in getting yourdoctorate related to using
(39:41):
therapy to help people, helpthem explore their internal self
, their intraself, and you'veput all this together.
But the thing that I reallylike about what you're elevating
about it, which is where wespeak the same language, is the
holistic approach.
You must look at everything andthen figure out.
There are going to be areasthat I have strengths, but
(40:03):
there's also areas that need tobe shored up, and there's not a
thing wrong with shoring thingsup.
It just makes you stronger andbetter as a person and better
able to live into your purpose.
So I'm really hoping that thispodcast reaches a lot of
audiences, because I think it'ssomething that everybody could
gain from.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
Thank you for that.
I think it's something thateverybody could gain from.
Thank you for that.
The heart behind this is thatyou know there's recently been a
book that's written that saysthat you know, mental health has
been, or mental health practicehas been, part of the demise of
our culture, and I just thinkthat it's only partially
(40:43):
accurate that it's when mentalhealth practice is wallowing
like a pig in mud in all of yournegative thoughts and feelings.
Yes, that is not a positivething for people in our culture
is that we would just settle inand just wallow around in all of
(41:04):
our hurts and pains.
But there's a sense in mentalhealth that it's like, yes, we
have to acknowledge them, likewe've talked about in this time
together.
We do have to acknowledge thembecause they're part of what
we've experienced, but weacknowledge them, not to live
with them.
But just like you were sayingto this beautiful soul that's
(41:24):
now moving on to be an amazingphysician, is that we open our
hands and we allow those to go.
We, you know, in some of ourpractice we call that willing
hands is that we openly let thatgo so that we can be more
positive and experience the goodthings in life as well and,
like you said earlier, wecrystallize the positive instead
(41:47):
of moving past it.
Yes, we crystallize thepositive and I hope what I hope
for every listener that everengages with this podcast is
that you will see that there ishope.
Our tagline here at Restorationis celebrating restored freedom
.
Yes, and that's our hope is thatyou would have a life worth
(42:10):
living such that you couldcelebrate restored freedom.
Yes, we look at the varyingdifferent areas of our lives,
just like in your book.
It's where.
Where have we fallen short notto live there, to understand
(42:32):
what to build upon such that wecould then have a life worth
living to celebrate our restoredfreedom?
Speaker 3 (42:36):
I absolutely love that, and I believe the other
part of that that just goes handin glove is you can have a part
in choosing what defines youand your life.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, and I think your community is a
part of that.
That helps you see who you are.
It's so funny because I workout at a gym that does not have
mirrors and people think, well,why don't you have a mirror?
Because I need to see what I'mdoing, to check my form.
Well, the heart behind that isyou have to ask somebody will
(43:11):
you be my mirror for me?
And that's the heart behind it.
That's the owner of the gym isa good friend, um, shout out to
EnduroLab.
But it's that's part of theheart behind that is we're not
going to have mirrors in the gymbecause I want you to rely on
your community.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
What a great concept.
Speaker 2 (43:26):
And then a neat concept and so that we would be
the mirror for one another.
And it's interesting becauseone of my peers in my workout,
one of my workout groups, shewas saying to me I couldn't
figure it out, I didn't have amirror I needed.
And she said but then, whenthis other peer in the group
slowed down and really talked methrough it, I finally got it,
(43:47):
because we were mirroring foreach other what we were doing.
And I thought to myself yes,and that's the heart behind the
purpose is that we have acommunity to mirror back to us
what we're doing, because Ifrankly believe that we were
given the physical to understandthe metaphysical.
Speaker 3 (44:05):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
And it's a lot of metaphor.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
This could be another conversation one day, but it's
about all the work that ishappening in terms of physics,
of understanding all thedifferent realms of possibility.
Yes, and it relates tomindfulness, dreams, other
things along those lines.
All of that, yes.
Speaker 2 (44:24):
And that is a whole conversation.
It is a whole conversation thatI can't wait to have, Because
that's part of where my geekingout has moved me to and to be
continued.
Speaker 3 (44:38):
To be continued.
Speaker 2 (44:39):
yes, Well, I just want to say again, Dr A that's
how I've always referred to you,Coach Deb as they refer to you,
or Dr Atkinson, as yourpatients may refer to you is
that I just want to say thankyou again for taking time out of
your schedule to come and sitwith us, and sit with me and
talk to us about just a sliverof your wisdom, Just a sliver of
(45:03):
your wisdom.
Speaker 3 (45:03):
Thank you so much for asking me and let me just say I
appreciate your phrase sliverof wisdom, but it has to do with
life experiences and it justhas to do with the connections
with other people, what I'velearned from other people,
including you, so keep carryingon.
This is great work, thank you.
Speaker 4 (45:20):
If you found value in our discussion and wish to
uncover more about thefascinating world of mental
wellness, don't forget tosubscribe to the podcast.
Stay tuned for our upcomingepisodes, where Dr Long will
continue to delve intoempowering therapies and
strategies for mental wellness.
Your journey to understandingand embracing mental health is
just beginning and we're excitedto have you with us every step
(45:42):
of the way.
Until next time, keep exploring, keep growing and remember to
celebrate restored freedom asyou uncover it.
Welcome to Restoration Beyond the Couch,
hosted by Dr Lee Long.
In this episode, dr Longinterviews Dr Deborah Atkison, a
board-certified psychiatristand professional certified coach
with over 20 years ofexperience.
Based in Fort Worth, texas, drAtkison has dedicated her career
to helping individuals livetheir healthiest lives.
Has dedicated her career tohelping individuals live their
(00:23):
healthiest lives.
She is the author of theupcoming book Master your Storm
Insights from a Psychiatrist andCoach, which offers profound
wisdom and practical strategiesfor navigating mental health
challenges.
Join us as Dr Atkinson sharesher experiences in psychiatry
and coaching.
Together with Dr Long, they'llexplore the intersection of
(00:45):
mental health and personalgrowth, delivering actionable
insights that you can apply toyour own life.
Your path to mental wellnessstarts here.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Welcome, Dr Atkinson.
It's so nice to have you withus.
It's great to be here.
Yeah, when we set this up, Igot super excited because I
remember the very first time Imet you and it's I don't know I
won't tell our listeners howlong ago that was.
It was decades ago, yes.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Which have passed rather quickly, haven't they?
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Rather quickly, rather quickly, and some of us
have weathered really well,yourself, and you too, and some
of us have weathered really wellyourself.
Thank you too, thanks, but Iremember you were working with I
don't remember if it was a PHPor an IOP, for the little ones,
as I call them and anotherpsychiatrist had invited me to
(01:44):
come for lunch to talk aboutrestoration because it was brand
new at the time.
And you were.
He, for whatever reason reasoncouldn't make it to the lunch.
You were the the onlypsychiatrist that that showed up
for the lunch and, uh, I thinkthat there were some drug reps
there to talk about the, the new, the newest, latest, greatest,
yes, and you and I startedtalking, and we started talking
about parenting and philosophiesof things and our theoretical
(02:11):
bents, and it was like an hourwent by like that.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
It did.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
And since then it's like I feel like we've been fast
friends we have.
I just have been nostalgiclately and thinking back on that
.
It was just such a really cool.
I just remember going home andtelling my wife what a, what a
great lunch that was and howcool it was to meet you, to have
so much synergy and such.
(02:37):
So anyway, thanks for all theyears and thanks for being here.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Well, thank you.
And you know, I have to say Ialso get nostalgic about things
and at that phase of my lifewhen we met I thought great guy,
great philosophy, he's a greattherapist.
I'm hoping we do more worktogether, which we did over the
years.
We went through the DBTtraining here with the whole
team, got to know the team well,came over and we meet with you
(03:01):
regularly.
We've shared patients, have avery similar way of seeing
things, which is really nice anddid all kinds of extra learning
about using nutrition betterand ways we could help with that
and about a holistic approachto mental health which is what a
lot of this is that you'redoing right now, which I am
really excited about that you'rehelping people understand that
(03:24):
everybody needs to look at theirown mental health and needs to
look at all the other areas oftheir life to have a truly
holistic way of living life atits fullest and take care of
yourself.
And the other thing I'm goingto say that I've come to
appreciate over the years isconnection, and so back in those
days I would meet someone likeI had a strong connection with
(03:46):
you, which is continued notunderstanding.
Maybe there are notcoincidences and perhaps
connections happen for a reasonand then synergy happens with
what people are doing and itgoes on to better your community
, to help better enrich peoplearound you and helps enrich your
(04:06):
own life.
So I want to thank you for theconnection.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Oh, that's really cool.
I appreciate that Right back atyou, thank you.
So you mentioned a lot of whatyou've been doing, a lot of what
you've done, but you've been achild, an adolescent, an adult
psychiatrist for just a littlebit.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
A long time, a long time.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
A long time.
Yes, sir.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
More than 30 years, we shall say I like that, we'll
leave it there.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
But what I love about your zest and spirit is that
you haven't just stuck in thatlane, and so can you tell us all
the other things that you'vealso done.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
So you know, I became a physician because I really
wanted to help people, and I did.
I was very blessed at a youngerage to get in touch with the
fact that I had been givencertain interests and abilities
that aligned well with my truespirit of wanting to be a helper
.
I'm a classic helper and that'swhat I want to do.
(05:10):
I want to help people and somedicine was a great fit.
It was while I was in medicalschool that I got in touch with
mental health and how importantand foundational it is.
If you talk to a primary caredoctor, they'll tell you a
minimum of 30% of the patientswho walk in my office every day
from primary care they arecoming for issues that are
(05:31):
really related to their mentalhealth, which all of us know.
Anxiety and depression aboundand it's not doesn't, sadly,
appear to be getting any better,which we can have a whole talk
about that.
But that's what led me into that.
But what I began to learn overthe years in working with
patients is that peopleeverybody needs different
(05:54):
approaches and people eachindividual is a very different
person and we do get ourexperiences in working with
people, so we have ideas oftools we can use to help them.
But we have to really thinkabout what each person's needs
are.
And that led me to realize Ineeded to grow my own skill set.
So I made a decision after avery long number of years in
(06:15):
private practice about 26 yearsin Fort Worth that I would step
into the role of becoming aprofessional, certified coach.
So I went to the TCU MedicalCenter.
They recruited me there and Iwas a coach for the medical
students for five years.
During that period of time Ibecame certified and today I do
(06:36):
some work that is related to thepractice of psychiatry and I do
work related to coaching, andthere's an area of intersection
where those?
two things are very importantand very holistic.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
And I want to pause for a second and I want to make
sure to point out one of themost phenomenal things that I
think being a coach tophysicians offers is.
I know that I have heard fromso many physicians that
residency medical school is soand I'm just going to be really
(07:07):
blunt here it's traumatic.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
It is very traumatizing.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
And that there's not- .
Speaker 3 (07:12):
And we sustain everyone in their training,
accumulates a lot of macrotraumas.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yes, which, by the time, you are a seasoned
physician and have decades underyour belt those traumas really
do break forth.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
You've worked with a lot of physicians.
Oh, I have.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
And it breaks my heart to think that these folks
are going into this professionto be such a help to the world.
I will talk about.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
That's why I did it with the med students, because I
wanted to give back and Iwanted to be able to help them.
And today I still work withsome physicians, residents and
med students who reach out to me.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
I ran, I used to run with one of the, a person who
was over residence for a certainschool and a hospital and such.
But one of the things that wewould talk about on some of our
longer runs were how hard it wasfor residents and just their
mental health their mentalhygiene just suffered so greatly
(08:12):
and how this person's goal wasto eliminate or to reduce.
I was dumbfounded.
Suicides for these individuals.
And when you said to me hey,I'm, I'm going to be a coach for
the medical school, I just, Ijust want you to know that my in
(08:32):
my heart, I was just staying.
I've been giving you a standingovation ever since because this
is such a a group ofindividuals that I think we need
to protect.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
I cannot tell you how much I appreciate the fact that
you're spotlighting that in ourconversation today, because I
do want to comment on that.
So I loved being in my practiceand today I still do a small
amount of practice.
I mean, I absolutely loveworking with patients and I
think that's part of my ownpurpose that I will not walk
away from.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
The world is so happy to hear that.
Speaker 3 (09:04):
And I do love it very much.
But I also want to say that whenthe new medical school was
being built here and I wasapproached by someone about the
fact that they were going todevelop a coaching program
specifically for us to work withmedical students, the more I
learned about coaching, the moreI realized this could be an
answer for a lot of the issuesthat happen in health care
(09:26):
across the board, especiallywith the physicians, because if
they have someone who works withthem in medical school
residency and as youngattendings, it can make an
enormous difference in theirlife, which makes a difference
within their own family, withincommunity and then across the
board with all of us, in theirown family, within community and
then across the board with allof us In medical school.
(09:47):
Today, things are better, but Ican tell you that medical school
is extremely traumatic.
The individuals who areattracted to going into health
care, and especially who go intomedicine, are people who feel a
strong sense of purpose, thatthey want to indeed be helpers,
which, if you're that type ofperson type two on the Enneagram
(10:08):
if you're that type of person,by nature you will often take
care of other people before youtake care of yourself.
That can become a lethalcombination for a doctor,
because the amount of work,especially in medical school and
residency, that you have toabsorb and do is so enormous
that it becomes impossible to doeverything perfectly.
(10:31):
That's the other component, andI think these principles apply
to people in other work areas.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
I've seen it with attorneys.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
I've seen it with a very driven businessman that
I've worked with as a coach.
I've seen this across the boardand in academics same thing.
People who really want to exceland who are perfectionistic may
often put their last, theirneeds, last on the list, and
when that happens it's a perfectstorm.
If you add to that any geneticsusceptibility for depression or
(11:03):
anxiety or you heap on top ofthat other life stressors, then
you have a storm that can leadpeople to really being at risk
for such a suicide.
Sad to say that I'm going tosay this today, but in the
epidemic of suicide we have inour nation, of all professions,
physicians have the highest percapita number of individuals in
(11:26):
a profession who commit suicide.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Wow, so they've jumped the dentistry.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
They have.
They're number one as far asprofessions and, interestingly,
women psychiatrists, of which Iam one.
Women psychiatrists lead thelist too, and I have many
thoughts as to why that is.
I think that femalepsychiatrists tend to be very
nurturing and they tend to beeven better or worse, however
(11:52):
you want to think about that atputting people's needs high on
the list and often will not takecare of their own and will
often ignore their own self-care.
So as a coach, I learned a lotas I worked with medical
students and that led me todoing some work with residents
and I have now coachedphysicians.
I can tell you, during thepandemic I was virtually you
(12:14):
know, on Zoom, like all the restof us, trapped in that box, but
I was coaching doctors who wereon the front line.
I coached some emergency roomdoctors and hospitalists and the
stories that I would hear abouthow they had to put on all of
the equipment this is before wehad the vaccine.
If you all remember, doctorslooked like they were aliens
from outer space and all of thatequipment to protect them.
(12:37):
While they were in the roomseeing the patient, how they had
to be at their bedside and theyknew they were the last human
contact they would have beforethat person died and the
incredible toll it took on thatdoctor as he or she was there
with an iPad, helping thisindividual connect to the people
they loved as they were dying.
It was beyond traumatizing.
(13:00):
And I know that during thepandemic there was so much
acknowledgement about ourdoctors, our heroes, and, sad to
say, we've kind of gone back tobusiness as usual.
You know now that we've emergedfrom the pandemic.
But that leads me to a pointthat I want to make that I think
we as a community can learn,related to what the pandemic
(13:20):
taught us.
We had a horrific time that wastraumatizing.
If you will notice, people don'treally talk about it much
anymore and if you go back andknow I was not practicing
medicine during the time of theSpanish flu, but if you go back
to about 100 or so years, morethan 100 years ago, if you go,
look at the Spanish flu and thatperiod of time, the same
(13:41):
phenomenon happened.
Many people died.
It was horribly traumatic toeveryone and that is, they
finally emerged from it.
People didn't really talk aboutit and process it, and the
reason I'm bringing that up isbecause I think for doctors in
their training.
As you mentioned, there's acumulative effect of traumas.
I think for everybody there wasan impact from the pandemic,
(14:05):
even if you had no one who wasclose to you who was ill or died
.
You didn't get ill or die, butyour whole life changed and
there was a tremendous anxietyand worry.
So the reason I bring this up isI just encourage everybody take
a moment to sort of reflectabout maybe life before the
pandemic, life during thepandemic and life today.
(14:26):
If you'll take a moment to dothat, it will actually help you
move forward and be, I think, bemore productive and process
whatever's going on and if youfind there are things you really
need to process, reach out.
We know how great therapy is,we know how great coaching is,
but we also know how great asupport system is Family members
(14:46):
, ministers, other people thatyou can talk to.
So I do want to take a momentjust to highlight that, because
I'm running into that withpatients today even who are
really doing what I call limpingalong.
They're functioning, butthey're limping along, certainly
not living their best life, andthat's the thing I've always
tried to be about, is I reallywant to help people live their
(15:08):
best life.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
I love that and I boy , I second that.
I think that I was just talkingwith somebody earlier this week
who is was trying to to figureout how to engage their partner
who had lost a family member, aparent, and they were like I
(15:34):
don't know how to bring it up,and it was like that's sort of
the thought behind mosttraumatic experiences we think
we should just push them off tothe side, and I don't think it's
ill-intended, I think it's theopposite.
I think we don't bring it upbecause we think I don't want to
cause them harm or bring painto them.
(15:57):
Pain's already there.
I know that when I lost my Ilost both of my parents five
weeks apart, almost 18 years ago, and I felt like a pariah after
that happened because peopledidn't want to bring it up, they
didn't want to make me sad.
Well, guess what?
I already was sad and there wasstill that space in me that
(16:17):
that if you brought it up and Iwas in a happy moment, I have
enough internal bandwidth to beable to interact with something
sad and still have a happymoment as well.
And I think that you like whatyou're saying.
With the pandemic, it's or or or, anything like let's not forget
these things, let's we don'thave to sit in the negative, but
(16:38):
we certainly do need tounderstand where we are with it.
You know, I mean the termintrapersonal understanding or
intrapersonal perceptualunderstanding is something that
is very important to me in mycareer.
It's because intrapersonal forthose of you listening is
(17:00):
because I know you're veryfamiliar with this is the
understanding of self how do Iinteract with something?
And I think that we've lostthat.
We cover over things.
We don't know how to sort thatthrough, we don't know where we
are with something and thereforewe become very reactionary
instead of responsive, and itimpacts our interpersonal
(17:24):
understanding, or ourinterpersonal perceptual
understanding, which is how Irelate to you.
That's the we.
What is our interpersonal?
Speaker 3 (17:35):
And I also think if you don't have that good
interpersonal understanding, youcan misinterpret others, other
people, and that impacts yourinterpersonal relationships with
others.
You don't interpret theirintention or their motive or
what they're trying to do in therelationship.
Yes, you project your own underthe things you don't understand
(17:59):
about yourself and they're notresolved onto them A hundred
percent.
And so you're completely, ahundred percent correct.
You've got to start with thatgood internal understanding.
And that's where I thinkmindfulness comes in as a
foundation, because you have tobe, whatever form of therapy
you're doing or whatever you'redoing, to take care of yourself.
Mindfulness has to be afoundation, it has to be.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
That self-awareness, I agree with you.
And to your point, I think youknow DBT, which is something
that we do a lot of, and that wego back together doing the
training together.
That was a long training.
It was a long time ago.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Wasn't that almost three years by the time we did
it all?
Because we had to do the studytogether for over a year.
We had to see a certain numberof patients together and meet a
certain number of times, andthen we went through a couple of
weeks of very intensivetraining and exam.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
And we did.
And what's so crazy is that andI don't know if everybody
realizes this I don't think theydo that as a group.
There were some people thatwere in our final training that
did not graduate.
Yes, you remember they had thatceremony for us where you had
to go quietly and mindfully,look into everybody's eyes and
(19:13):
offer gratitude only with a gazethat was intense, offer
gratitude only with a gaze thatwas intense.
Yes, that was intense.
But DBT is, to your point, isvery foundationally based on
mindfulness and understanding.
That sense of mindfulness andeverything is built on top of
that.
That's the base layer and Ithink it's that, like, like
you're bringing in, is thatintrapersonal understanding.
(19:36):
And you look at our culture andhow a lot of things are
misunderstood, and my hypothesisI'm not, I'm not certain, I'm
curious in this area, but myhypothesis is that we are
missing the intrapersonalperceptual understanding in our
world.
Therefore, we really miss eachother 100%.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
I'm going to comment on that.
I think that that is the keyright there to one of the
reasons why we have so manyissues in our country with
mental health, because I'm goingto be the first person to say I
wouldn't live anywhere butAmerica.
I love America and my familyhas been here since the 1600s
(20:26):
helping build this country,literally build it.
Farmers, construction workers,police officers, ministers,
teachers I mean, I am frompeople who have helped build
America and I love America, sothat's something I know we share
in common.
But, that being said, I think,because of the way our culture
is here in America is we alwayshave taken the position of we're
(20:48):
moving forward, we're buildingthings, we're excelling, and
there isn't a moment of hittingthe pause button.
Whenever something does come up, it's like well, I mean, I'm
also a fifth generation Texan,so you know, we know what we
think here in Texas.
You just pull yourself up byyour bootstraps and you keep on
going Right.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
So especially in West .
Speaker 3 (21:07):
Texas, especially in West Texas, and so and I you
know there's a lot of goodthings about the strength and
resilience that comes with thatattitude, but the only thing I
would say is that I think, evenif you're a tough, strong person
, before you pull thosebootstraps up, take a moment to
just hit the pause button andacknowledge what's going on with
(21:28):
you, what you're dealing with,and give yourself a little bit
of self-compassion and kindnessin the moment.
One of the things I did withthe medical students that I want
to comment on and this is anexercise that I think can be
extrapolated to anything anyoneis doing when I had young
medical students who wereinteracting with patients who
(21:49):
were significantly ill for thefirst time, I'll never forget
one who today is in training tobe an emergency room physician,
and she will be an amazing one.
But I remember when I beganworking with her, she was an
extremely empathic young woman,very kind, very empathic and
very caring, and she came to meand said I need to talk about
(22:09):
this because I don't know if I'mgoing to be able to be a doctor
.
I said well, let's sit down andtalk.
What has happened?
She said I have a patient I'vebeen following as part of my
experience and this patient hasdeveloped a very severe terminal
medical illness and because Ihad a rapport with the patient.
(22:29):
When they learned that that wasthe diagnosis, I was in the room
with the attending doctor.
The patient had said when myfamily comes in here, can you
also be in the room while I talkwith my family about this, with
the doctor?
And that was part of herlearning experience.
So she was in the room and shesaid this has haunted me.
(22:50):
It has haunted me.
You know.
She called me Coach Deb, that'swhat they call me.
Because this has haunted me.
Coach Deb, that's what theycall me because this has haunted
me, coach Deb, because I havecarried this with me.
And she had these big, dark,haunted looking eyes and I said
to her let's take a momenttogether about why it's haunting
you.
So we talked that through andthen I said to her do you
(23:12):
realize that your presence washelpful and supportive?
She wasn't really able to seethat and as we talked I said
your purpose as a doctor is totry to help a person get well.
When you have a situation wherethat cannot happen, what is
your next purpose as a doctor?
She said to be compassionate,to be kind, to give them support
(23:34):
and to alleviate suffering.
I said do you feel you did thatto give them support and to
alleviate suffering?
I said do you feel you did that?
She said yes, I said so.
In that moment, were you yourbest for that person?
She looked at me with thisawakening realization in her
eyes and she said I was.
I said so.
You did what you were meant todo.
(23:56):
So what I would encourage you todo going forward is when you
are with a patient, I want youto be who you are because you
bring healing in the interaction.
You bring those things.
But when you step out of thatroom and close the door, I'm
going to ask you to pauseoutside the door before you go
to the next patient, I want youto reflect on what you did in
(24:16):
the moment and that you broughtin the moment what you needed to
bring for that patient, andthen I want you to however, it
will work for you.
I want you to release, releaseit, and so what we worked out
together is what she wasliterally going to do is think
about that.
She was simply going to openher hands like this, to release
it mindfully and take a breath,and then she would go pick up
(24:40):
the chart for the next patient.
So I asked her to practice thatand she practiced it and she
came when she graduated.
We talked right before shegraduated.
I got to be there and walk inwith the group.
As they did that.
She said I carry that with meand I use it as a tool.
And she said, honestly, I don'tthink there's any way I could
go into emergency medicine if Ididn't have that way of coping.
(25:03):
And she said it doesn't takelong at all, but it keeps me
from becoming depleted and keepsthat big sack on my back, full
of the burdens of what I've beendealing with all day from
getting bigger and bigger.
It keeps my load lighter.
Dealing with all day fromgetting bigger and bigger, it
keeps my load lighter.
And so I would encourage anyonewith whatever they do daily, to
(25:26):
remember some sort of practicelike that to help them be
present in the moment, be whoyou are, utilize those gifts,
use your purpose in that moment,but then allow it to go,
because that way you're able togo on and continue to serve your
purpose.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
I think that's so well stated, so well stated.
I have conceptualized that withsome professional athletes that
I work with that.
They have to turn the page orthey have to shut it out, and
the damage that shutting it outdoes to them and to their
families is really significant.
(26:02):
And it's like you build a silothat you can put it over here
and you can.
You can rest that stuff in thesilo, but at the end of the game
or at the you know, the turn ofthe quarter or the end of the
inning, you really do have to,to your point, open that silo
and mentalize or go through thatthe whole letting that go.
(26:25):
Otherwise you're going to shutyourself off and you lose a
sense of interpersonalperceptual understanding.
Therefore, you don't have theability to perceive others and
experience as well.
Speaker 3 (26:40):
Besides the cumulative effect that carrying
that around does, it begins towarp your self-perception.
So if you don't momentarily letyour brain think through and
process and release, what willhappen over time is you will
begin to feel you're carryingaround with you a lot of what
Failures, you're carrying arounda lot of things that didn't go
(27:03):
the way they should, and I thinkthat begins to really impact
people negatively.
I think in our culture we dostrive for perfectionism All of
us do.
I think you and I have beenguilty of that too right.
We set high standards and highgoals we want to reach, and
what's ironic to me is that whenpeople actually do reach those
goals, they don't take a momentto celebrate, because you know I
(27:25):
talk about using that moment torelease things.
You also should allow yourself,when you reach a pinnacle or
you've met a goal, to take amoment and celebrate it, even if
it's just an internalcelebration of I made that goal.
This is pretty great andwhatever the way you look at
things, I know that for myself.
(27:46):
When that happens for me and Itake that pause, I say thank you
, thank you, god, for lettingthis happen, thank you, and when
I do that, it's like thatbegins to help as well your own
sense of purpose and ability.
I'm going to, I'm going toreally kind of have a free
association here and move intoimposter syndrome, because I
(28:07):
actually think this is one ofthe things that could help
people with imposter syndromeExactly.
I have seen so many people andworked with so many people who
are high achieving, who don'ttake that moment to say the
marker happened, I've reachedthis marker, I've got to this
milestone.
That doesn't mean maybe thereisn't another mountain for me to
climb, but I've reached thisone.
(28:28):
Thank you, I did it.
This is great.
And in that moment, whoever youwant to thank, have gratitude.
I know for me, because of whereI sit in my own spiritual and
faith life.
I always believe that nothingis possible for me without God,
and so I take a moment to liftup and thank him, and then I
(28:51):
also say to him I know thiswould be possible without you
and I want you to show mewhatever you want me to do next,
because that's where I believemy own path has come from.
Other people as they look,whatever their faith tradition,
they need to think about that,and also I also take a moment to
think about the people I knowwho've helped me get there and I
(29:13):
have a moment of gratitude forthem Because I really believe
that if people could do that,that will begin to internally
going back to where you are theintra-psyche.
Go back there.
That will internally begin tostrengthen and reinforce the
traits and gifts that you have,to where you don't carry around
(29:33):
the imposter syndrome.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Right, and I love how you're saying that because it
takes us to a point of purposeof purpose.
You know, you and I talkedbefore we started rolling about
the whole idea of the blue zones.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
And you were saying some really neat things about
that.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Well, you know, now here I am in my West Texas voice
, I will do the best I can topronounce it.
That concept of ikigai that theJapanese have I-K-I-G-A-I, and
that whole purpose is seenwithin a lot of the blue zones.
I know in Okinawa, one of theblue zones, ikigai is alive and
(30:13):
well and what that basically isis the sense of purpose, but
they have refined it down to thethings that you are gifted or
can do and that you'reinterested in and that bring you
joy in doing and what yourcommunity and world needs.
So if you were to circle thoseVenn diagrams and bring that
(30:35):
together, if the nucleus of thatis Ikigai.
And so in Okinawa, for instance, they have a high number of
people who live to be 100 yearsold, for instance, they have a
high number of people who liveto be 100 years old, and it is
believed that, of course, as isin common with all the blue
zones, people eat healthier,they exercise more, they have
(30:56):
connections with other peopleand a sense of community.
You know, this is a whole thing.
Going on in America today isthe epidemic of loneliness.
That's another whole topic wecan talk about, but that's going
on.
But they have a sense ofconnection and with others.
But then they have theirpurpose, their reason for living
.
You can talk to somebody intheir nineties over there and
you will find they're continuingto follow their purpose.
(31:18):
That doesn't mean people'spurpose doesn't change over time
.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
Right, I think about parents, you know, and this in
our culture tends to rest moreheavily on mothers, yes, where
mothers often feel, when theirkids are leaving the nest, so to
speak, what's their purpose?
Even working mothers feel thatway, and I know dads do too.
(31:43):
But I think there's a differentconnection with mothers and I
think that, yeah, like wemothers, purposes can shift.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
I hear this and I see this, and I'm going to say to
any mother who's empty nestingout there I've done that too, so
I know what that's like.
But what I'm going to say isthat all of the skills that you
developed as a mother to safelyshepherd a person all the way to
adulthood, that is no smallfeat.
That is a monumental task, verymonumental, you know.
(32:13):
Congratulate yourself that youwere able to get an adult to the
point they were able tosuccessfully leave.
That's a huge accomplishment.
You work yourself out of a jobwhen you're a mother, so to
speak, but it also means you'vesucceeded.
That's right.
Those same skill sets areincredibly helpful and I would
encourage you to find a way touse those for your purpose.
Moving forward, mentoring otherwomen is extremely important.
(32:36):
I do that today.
I mentor some women who areprofessionals, women who have
reached out to me and asked meto do that, which has been a
great honor for me and has alsogiven me more purpose and has
helped me reflect and think moreabout things too.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
Yeah, I think that the whole concept of Ikigai
makes so, you know, dovetailingthat into the whole
intrapersonal perceptualunderstanding If you don't know
who you are, you don't have aconnection to your purpose.
And I think, I think it's justso important that we understand
(33:12):
more about who we are, weunderstand what our purpose is,
we understand, you know why arewe here.
Speaker 3 (33:19):
Right, you know I do want to take a moment as to why
I wrote this book.
We've talked about that, so Idon't consider myself a major
writer and when you read thebook you'll as both a
psychiatrist and a coach, I havelearned something that I know.
(33:49):
I've experienced it, you'veexperienced it.
We've all experienced thingswhere we have, at different
points in our life, we have astorm and when the storm happens
, we often don't know how wewill face it.
I briefly comment on this.
In my book, one of the majorimportant points in my life was
when I was in my last year oftraining as a child psychiatrist
.
I was a very physically healthywoman.
(34:11):
I ran five miles a day, but Ideveloped non-Hodgkin's lymphoma
.
So that was a major storm I hadto face in my last year of
challenge having cancer, workingthrough that and that was a
very long time ago, might I add.
But it was during that timethat I was able to fortunately
use and lean into some of thecoping skills that I had going
(34:34):
through that.
But it also I developed moreresilience going through that
process as well, and it gave mepause to know this is a major
storm.
I've had other storms in mylife, we all have had them.
Your storm doesn't identify you, that's right.
Your storm helps you as you gothrough it and grow.
The reason I wrote this book isbecause, as a coach, what I was
(34:54):
beginning to realize when Iworked with people, I might want
to give them some sort of fieldwork or assignment to work on
between sessions.
I would look for certain thingsand I couldn't find them.
So what I've written here is aguide that could be helpful for
anyone, I think from age 15 andup.
That has to do with if there'sa reason you're reaching out to
(35:15):
try to figure out somethingabout yourself.
The first part of this booktalks about why did you pick the
book up?
It talks about what you need todo is find your why, which is
your purpose.
That's right.
The book talks about very basictools that you begin with, which
is basic mindfulness skills,and each chapter, which is
between five and ten pages, isfollowed with a couple of pages
(35:39):
of questions.
So it's a book workbook whereyou simply read the question,
write the answers and move on.
It's for you, and so you find amindfulness exercise you do.
Then you develop intention.
What do I want to do?
What am I trying to accomplish?
And then you need to look at aphase of evaluation where you
look over all areas of your lifeand figure where do I need to
(36:01):
start.
And then I have going into this, each one talking about
physical, emotional,psychological, intellectual,
financial and spiritual health.
Those are the areas I've askedyou to look at each one and you
decide which of those do I needto do the deepest dive into.
(36:22):
Then the book talks about how doyou have some coping skills
when you're dealing with stress,and then it talks about how do
you develop resilience.
It talks about action andaccountability and then,
literally the last threechapters is helping you build.
You start out with building aplan.
You come back in 30 days andlook at what you wrote.
(36:42):
Did I follow it?
What do I need to tweak to makeit better?
You tweak it and then the lastthing you do is this is what I
think will work.
I can keep this in play as Imove forward to three months and
beyond, because, guess what?
We know that if we work onsomething for three months,
we're probably going to get somemeasurable results that will
(37:03):
help us move forward.
So it's a guide.
At the end of the book.
Each section has references todifferent books that you can go
to and other resources to helpyou if you want to take a deeper
dive into something, so I putthis together for that purpose
and I hope that it helps somepeople.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
You know, one of the things that I love about all the
things you just said issomething that I think is a real
marker of who you are, is thatif I can't find it, I'm going to
go make it.
And I love that.
I love that Because, like yousaid, you know, at the beginning
(37:39):
of all this you said I'm ahelper, I'm a true helper.
Two on the Enneagram, and Ithink you really are, and that
is quintessentially who you are.
If, if it's not out there, thenI'm going to go find.
If it's out there, I'm going togo find it.
If I can't find it, I'm goingto create it, and I would say
that, yeah, where, where canpeople pick this up?
Speaker 3 (37:59):
So I just did the final grammatical edits and I
have been working with Dr DaleOkuduru with White Coat
Publishing on this project and abig shout out to him because
he's a great guy who also liveshis purpose and has a great
Christian walk himself, so I'vebeen very appreciative of having
(38:19):
made that connection with him,and so the final grammatical
edits were just done.
This will actually be able tobe found by November the 1st,
online at Amazoncom.
You'll be able to pick it up inpaperback form.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Fantastic and the book is called Master your Storm
.
Speaker 3 (38:35):
Master your Storm Insights from a Psychiatrist and
Coach.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
I mean what a valuable, what a valuable piece.
I mean that that having allwell, having highlights of your
wisdom I don't think the, Idon't think any library could
hold all your wisdom, but Ithink having the highlights of
your wisdom in these areas, youknow, in one place I think, is a
fantastic offering.
(39:01):
So thank you for taking thetime to do that.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Well, I appreciate that and you have been a part of
this journey as well, becauseI've talked with you about
concepts with this before, whichhas been very helpful and made
me reflect a lot as I wentthrough the process.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
Well, thank you for that.
I uh, I, I, you know.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
I do want to comment on that.
I do want to take a moment,because the whole thing you're
doing here with RestorationBeyond the Couch I am so
grateful you're doing it,because it takes all of your
years of experience and workingwith people and what you've
observed, but also what you'veintegrated in some of the
research you did in getting yourdoctorate related to using
(39:41):
therapy to help people, helpthem explore their internal self
, their intraself, and you'veput all this together.
But the thing that I reallylike about what you're elevating
about it, which is where wespeak the same language, is the
holistic approach.
You must look at everything andthen figure out.
There are going to be areasthat I have strengths, but
(40:03):
there's also areas that need tobe shored up, and there's not a
thing wrong with shoring thingsup.
It just makes you stronger andbetter as a person and better
able to live into your purpose.
So I'm really hoping that thispodcast reaches a lot of
audiences, because I think it'ssomething that everybody could
gain from.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
Thank you for that.
I think it's something thateverybody could gain from.
Thank you for that.
The heart behind this is thatyou know there's recently been a
book that's written that saysthat you know, mental health has
been, or mental health practicehas been, part of the demise of
our culture, and I just thinkthat it's only partially
(40:43):
accurate that it's when mentalhealth practice is wallowing
like a pig in mud in all of yournegative thoughts and feelings.
Yes, that is not a positivething for people in our culture
is that we would just settle inand just wallow around in all of
(41:04):
our hurts and pains.
But there's a sense in mentalhealth that it's like, yes, we
have to acknowledge them, likewe've talked about in this time
together.
We do have to acknowledge thembecause they're part of what
we've experienced, but weacknowledge them, not to live
with them.
But just like you were sayingto this beautiful soul that's
(41:24):
now moving on to be an amazingphysician, is that we open our
hands and we allow those to go.
We, you know, in some of ourpractice we call that willing
hands is that we openly let thatgo so that we can be more
positive and experience the goodthings in life as well and,
like you said earlier, wecrystallize the positive instead
(41:47):
of moving past it.
Yes, we crystallize thepositive and I hope what I hope
for every listener that everengages with this podcast is
that you will see that there ishope.
Our tagline here at Restorationis celebrating restored freedom
.
Yes, and that's our hope is thatyou would have a life worth
(42:10):
living such that you couldcelebrate restored freedom.
Yes, we look at the varyingdifferent areas of our lives,
just like in your book.
It's where.
Where have we fallen short notto live there, to understand
(42:32):
what to build upon such that wecould then have a life worth
living to celebrate our restoredfreedom?
Speaker 3 (42:36):
I absolutely love that, and I believe the other
part of that that just goes handin glove is you can have a part
in choosing what defines youand your life.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Yes, yes, yes, yes, and I think your community is a
part of that.
That helps you see who you are.
It's so funny because I workout at a gym that does not have
mirrors and people think, well,why don't you have a mirror?
Because I need to see what I'mdoing, to check my form.
Well, the heart behind that isyou have to ask somebody will
(43:11):
you be my mirror for me?
And that's the heart behind it.
That's the owner of the gym isa good friend, um, shout out to
EnduroLab.
But it's that's part of theheart behind that is we're not
going to have mirrors in the gymbecause I want you to rely on
your community.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
What a great concept.
Speaker 2 (43:26):
And then a neat concept and so that we would be
the mirror for one another.
And it's interesting becauseone of my peers in my workout,
one of my workout groups, shewas saying to me I couldn't
figure it out, I didn't have amirror I needed.
And she said but then, whenthis other peer in the group
slowed down and really talked methrough it, I finally got it,
(43:47):
because we were mirroring foreach other what we were doing.
And I thought to myself yes,and that's the heart behind the
purpose is that we have acommunity to mirror back to us
what we're doing, because Ifrankly believe that we were
given the physical to understandthe metaphysical.
Speaker 3 (44:05):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
And it's a lot of metaphor.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
This could be another conversation one day, but it's
about all the work that ishappening in terms of physics,
of understanding all thedifferent realms of possibility.
Yes, and it relates tomindfulness, dreams, other
things along those lines.
All of that, yes.
Speaker 2 (44:24):
And that is a whole conversation.
It is a whole conversation thatI can't wait to have, Because
that's part of where my geekingout has moved me to and to be
continued.
Speaker 3 (44:38):
To be continued.
Speaker 2 (44:39):
yes, Well, I just want to say again, Dr A that's
how I've always referred to you,Coach Deb as they refer to you,
or Dr Atkinson, as yourpatients may refer to you is
that I just want to say thankyou again for taking time out of
your schedule to come and sitwith us, and sit with me and
talk to us about just a sliverof your wisdom, Just a sliver of
(45:03):
your wisdom.
Speaker 3 (45:03):
Thank you so much for asking me and let me just say I
appreciate your phrase sliverof wisdom, but it has to do with
life experiences and it justhas to do with the connections
with other people, what I'velearned from other people,
including you, so keep carryingon.
This is great work, thank you.
Speaker 4 (45:20):
If you found value in our discussion and wish to
uncover more about thefascinating world of mental
wellness, don't forget tosubscribe to the podcast.
Stay tuned for our upcomingepisodes, where Dr Long will
continue to delve intoempowering therapies and
strategies for mental wellness.
Your journey to understandingand embracing mental health is
just beginning and we're excitedto have you with us every step
(45:42):
of the way.
Until next time, keep exploring, keep growing and remember to
celebrate restored freedom asyou uncover it.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!