188. Ellen Greenberg (Part II): Did This Bride-to-Be Stab Herself 20 Times?

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
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(00:24):
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Speaker 2 (00:38):
Hello, and welcome to Reverie True Crime. I'm your host page.
This is part two of the death of Ellen Greenberg.
In part one, we learned that Ellen was a twenty
seven year old first grade teacher, engaged to be married,

(00:59):
and found dead on her kitchen floor with twenty stab wounds,
ten of them to the back of her head and neck,
and a knife buried four inches deep into her chest.
The medical examiner initially ruled it a homicide, then five
weeks later he changed it to suicide. The police said

(01:23):
the apartment door was lightched from inside, so Ellen must
have been alone, But as we discovered that story had holes,
the security guard, who supposedly witnessed the fiance breaking down
the door. He signed a statement saying he was never there.

(01:45):
The crime scene cleaned before police could properly investigate it,
the victim's electronics removed by the fiance's uncle, a prominent
attorney before police even obtained a search warrant, and the
wounds themselves, multiple forensic experts would later say some of

(02:09):
them were biomechanically impossible to self inflict. Ellen's parents, Josh
and Sandy Greenberg, spent the next fourteen years fighting for
the truth. They hired investigators, consulted renowned forensic pathologists, and

(02:30):
filed lawsuits. They spent over eight hundred thousand dollars of
their own money. This is the story of that fight
and a case that to this day raises one simple question.
Can someone really stab themselves twenty times and have it

(02:51):
called a suicide. Let's get started and find out what
the experts have to say. In October of twenty twenty five,
Chief Medical Examiner doctor Lindsay Simon would issue a new
report as part of a court settlement. In that report,

(03:12):
she documented twenty additional bruises that had never been noted before,
bringing the total to thirty one bruises. She also found
three more quote perforations in the skin that had not
been documented, raising the total number of wounds to twenty three,

(03:34):
not twenty as originally reported. Despite finding more injuries than
the original autopsy, more wounds, more bruises, more evidence of trauma,
doctor Simon still concluded Ellen's death was suicide. She wrote
that the forearm contusions could hypothetically be caused by fingers,

(03:59):
but noted there were only three on each arm, indicating
quote an incomplete grip. She suggested the bruises on Ellen's
right forearm appeared to be of different ages. To the
Greenberg family and their experts, this explanation was absurd. An

(04:20):
incomplete grip, different ages, That's exactly what you'd expect from
repeated abuse. To doctor Simon and the city of Philadelphia,
it was still suicide. For fourteen years, Josh and Sandy
Greenberg have fought. They filed lawsuits, They hired investigators, they

(04:46):
commissioned expert reports. They even spent over eight hundred thousand
dollars of their own money pursuing justice for their daughter.
In twenty nineteen, they filed a civil suit against the
Philadelphia Medical Examiner's Office, and doctor Marlon Osborne, seeking to

(05:08):
change Ellen's manner of death from suicide to homicide or undetermined.
The case worked its way through the courts. In January
of twenty twenty, a judge allowed it to proceed past
the motion to dismiss stage. The city appealed, and the

(05:30):
trial was delayed by the pandemic. In October of twenty
twenty one, Philadelphia Court of common Please Judge Glennis D.
Hill ruled that the family suit could proceed to trial,
but the city appealed again to the Commonwealth Court, arguing
that under Pennsylvania law, a medical examiner's inherently discretionary professional

(05:57):
opinion cannot be challenged, and that even if the findings
were incorrect, the Greenbergs lacked the legal standing to challenge them.
In September of twenty twenty three, the Commonwealth Court ruled
against the Greenbergs in a two to one decision. The

(06:17):
court acknowledged that the investigation was deeply flawed, but said
they had no choice under the law but decide with
the city due to procedural restrictions. The judges wrote that
the Greenbergs lacked standing to bring their claim. This ruling

(06:38):
was both devastating and validating. On one hand, the Greenbergs
lost their case. On the other, two Commonwealth Court judges
had publicly stated what the family had been saying for years,
the investigation into Ellen's death was deeply flawed. The court's

(07:02):
opinion raised serious questions about the authorities who first investigated
Ellen's death. Josh Greenberg told CBS News Philadelphia quote, they
the judges have blatantly said the investigation was faulty on
the part of the police, on the part of the

(07:24):
medical examiner, on the part of the district attorney end quote.
But the Greenbergs did not give up. They appealed to
the Pennsylvania Supreme Court, the state's highest court. In July
of twenty twenty four, in a stunning development, the Supreme

(07:46):
Court of Pennsylvania agreed to hear the case. This was
significant because the Supreme Court takes only a tiny fraction
of cases, only those that have brought odd implications for
all Pennsylvanians. Pod Rosa said when he heard the news quote,

(08:08):
I'm extremely pleased too, and a little surprised given how
hard it is to have a case accepted for review
by the Pennsylvania Supreme Court. The Court can only take
a very small fraction of cases, and then only those
which impact Pennsylvanians across the state. According to the Court's order,

(08:31):
the Supreme Court would consider whether quote, executors and administrators
of an estate have standing to challenge an erroneous finding
recorded on the decedent's death certificate where that finding constitutes
a bar or material impediment to recovery of victims, compensation, restitution,

(08:56):
or for wrongful death, as well as private criminal complaints
end quote. In other words, do families have the right
to challenge a medical examiner's determination when that determination blocks
them from seeking justice? The Supreme Court case is expected

(09:19):
to be heard sometime in twenty twenty five. As of
this recording, no date has been set. It's worth noting
that Justice David N. Wect, whose father, doctor Cyril H. Wect,
is one of the forensic experts the Greenbergs consulted, recused

(09:40):
himself from the case. Meanwhile, in twenty eighteen, the case
was referred to the Pennsylvania Attorney General's Office for review.
The ag at the time was Josh Shapiro, who is
now the Governor of Pennsylvania. In twenty nineteen, the AG's

(10:00):
office announced they had reviewed the case and found evidence
on Ellen's computer pointing towards suicide. They claimed Ellen had
searched for terms like quote suicide methods, quick suicide, and
painless suicide in the weeks before her death. The Greenberg

(10:24):
family's attorneys disputed this. They pointed out that Sam Goldberg's uncle,
James Schwartzman, had taken possession of Ellen's computers before police
could properly examine them. The chain of custody was broken.
How reliable was this evidence? Moreover, the AG's statement conflicted

(10:50):
with the original twenty eleven Medical Examiner's investigation report, which
stated quote keyword searches were done on every computer searching
for suicide information, and the examination did not reveal anything remarkable.
In other words, the police is on forensic examination in

(11:12):
twenty eleven found no suicide related searches, but the AG's
office in twenty nineteen claimed they did. Who was telling
the truth? The Internet community uncovered another concerning detail, Josh
Shapiro had connections to both the Goldberg and Schwartzmann families.

(11:38):
In July of twenty twenty two. To avoid the quote
appearance of a conflict of interest, Shapiro's office sent the
case to the Chester County District Attorney's office. In April
of twenty twenty four, the Greenberg family won the right
to depose Guy Deandria, a former phil Ladelphia prosecutor who

(12:02):
reviewed Ellen's case and publicly expressed doubts about the suicide ruling.
DeAndrea told NBC ten Philadelphia that there were several elements
of the case that made him believe Ellen's death should
not have been categorized as suicide. The court ruled that

(12:23):
DeAndrea could be deposed on or before May sixth of
twenty twenty four. Josh and Sandy said in a statement, quote,
we are pleased, and so should every parent in America.
Ellen's death is so obviously a murder. This case is
riddled with delay tactics. End quote. In November of twenty

(12:49):
twenty four, the Chester County DA announced that they could
not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that a crime was committed.
The vestigation was placed on an active status. The office
said in a statement, quote, because we cannot meet our

(13:10):
burden of proof with the information and evidence presently available,
we place this investigation in an inactive status. There is
no statute of limitations for criminal homicide in Pennsylvania, and
because investigations can take new directions, we are not closing

(13:32):
the case end quote. Joseph Podraza called the Chester County
investigation quote extremely disappointing, but the Greenbergs remained steadfast in
their belief that Ellen was murdered. In addition to the
Supreme Court case about challenging the death certificate, the Greenbergs

(13:56):
filed a second civil suit in October of twenty two
against members of the Medical Examiner's Office, the Police Department,
and the DA's office. This suit seeks monetary damages for
intentional infliction of emotional distress, alleging that the investigation was

(14:19):
quote embarrassingly botched and followed by a contemptible conspiracy to
cover it up. In December of twenty twenty four, Tom
and Please Judge Michael Erdos held a hearing on that
second suit. Defense attorneys argued for the case to be dismissed.

(14:41):
Judge Erdos dismissed one defendant, but withheld judgment on four others.
During the hearing, Judge Erdos made a remarkable statement from
the bench, quote, I don't think anyone disagrees the crime
scene should have been handled differently. End quote. He added

(15:04):
that while he was not there to rule on Ellen's
cause of death, quote, the fact the death certificate still
lists the cause of death as suicide is puzzling end quote.
That emotional distress lawsuit remains ongoing as of this recording.

(15:24):
On January thirty first, twenty twenty five, just days before
a civil trial was set to begin, something extraordinary happened.
Doctor Marlon Osborne, the pathologist who had performed Ellen's autopsy
and ruled her death a suicide, signed a sworn verification statement.

(15:48):
In it, he wrote, quote, I am now aware that
information exists which draws into question, for example, whether Ellen's fiance,
Say was witnessed entering the apartment before placing the nine
to one one call on January sixth, twenty eleven, whether

(16:09):
the door was forced open as reported, whether Ellen's body
was moved by someone else inside the apartment with her
at or near the time of her death, and the
findings of Lindsay Emery, MD from her neuropathological evaluation of
Ellen's cervical segment sample. He concluded, quote, it is my

(16:34):
professional opinion Ellen's manner of death should be should be
designated as something other than suicide. End quote. For the Greenbergs,
this was a watershed moment. The pathologist who had changed
the ruling to suicide was now saying he was wrong.

(16:57):
Ellen didn't kill herself. On February third, twenty twenty five,
just before jury selection was set to begin, the parties
reached a settlement. The city of Philadelphia agreed to two things,
pay the Greenbergs six hundred fifty thousand dollars less than

(17:18):
the eight hundred thousand that they had spent on the investigation,
and have the Medical Examiner's office re examine Ellen's case.
Sandy Greenberg told CNN, quote, We're very excited. I mean,
never in my wildest dreams did I think anything like

(17:39):
this was going to happen. End quote. The settlement was
held as a victory. Finally, after fourteen years, there would
be an independent review, the truth would come out. But
then came October twenty twenty five. As part of the settlement,

(18:00):
doctor Lindsay Simon, Philadelphia's chief medical examiner, was tasked with
conducting an independent review of Ellen's case. For months, the
Greenberg family waited what would the review find? Would it
acknowledge the biomechanical impossibilities, the post mortem wound, the bruises,

(18:23):
the moved body, the broken chain of custody. On October tenth,
twenty twenty five, doctor Simon released her findings thirty two pages.
Her conclusion quote, the manner of Ellen Greenberg's death is
best classified as suicide. End quote. Doctor Simon's report acknowledged

(18:51):
that quote the distribution of injuries is admittedly unusual. She
maintained that quote, the fact remains that Ellen would be
capable of inflicting these injuries herself. She categorized many of
the wounds as hesitation wounds tentative self inflicted injuries. She

(19:16):
noticed that Sam Goldberg's DNA was not on the knife.
She stated that surveillance footage, key card swipes, and phone
logs corroborated Sam's timeline. She found no evidence of an
abusive relationship. Doctor Simon also attributed Ellen's death to her anxiety,

(19:40):
specifically her worry about the grades that she was submitting
for her students on the day she died. She wrote
that Ellen feared the grades quote would indicate that she
had previously given inflated grades to her students, and that
this anxiety combined with a recent medication change, led to

(20:04):
her suicide. To the Greenberg family and their attorneys, this
was a slap in the face. Joseph Podraza, the family's attorney,
issued a blistering statement quote Simon's so called independent review
of Ellen Greenberg's death is a deeply flawed attempt to

(20:27):
justify a predetermined conclusion. It includes false claims like the
assertion that a stab wound in Ellen's final column was
made during autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert,
including the city's own neuropathologist. By ignoring key evidence that

(20:50):
contradicts suicide, like the extensive three D photogrammetry proving Ellen
could not self inflict all of those wounds, unexplained bruises,
missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship, etc.

(21:11):
Simon builds a flimsy case on distorted portrayals of Ellen's
mental health, propped up by cynical distortions of Ellen's managed anxiety,
a condition widely experienced daily by over forty million Americans.
This report is an embarrassment to the city and an

(21:33):
insult to Ellen and her family. Here's what makes doctor
Simon's report even more peculiar. In her materials reviewed section,
she listed five expert opinions stating Ellen's death was a homicide.

(21:54):
She also listed the Hulu documentary Death and Apartment six'
o Three What happened To Ellen greenberg as source. Material Nancy,
schwartzman the documentary's, director was. Stunned she, said, quote it's, like,
oh are you just getting up to speed on this?

(22:15):
Case maybe she needed sort of the Cliffs notes version
of the case or. Something they should use their microscopes
instead of WATCHING tv end. Quote On october, fourteenth twenty twenty,
five at a court, hearing The Medical examiner's office officially
told a judge it was sticking by the suicide. Ruling

(22:40):
The greenberg's attorney stated they disagreed with the. Report the
city did not, comment and so as of, today the
official manner of death For Ellen Ray greenberg remains. Suicide
fourteen years, later we still don't know what happened To

(23:01):
Ellen greenberg in those final hours Of january twenty, sixth twenty.
Eleven we know she came home from work around one thirty.
Pm we Know Sam goldberg went to the gym around
four forty five. Pm we know he called nine to
one one at six thirty three pm and said that

(23:25):
he had Found ellen on the floor with blood. Everywhere
with blood, Everywhere but what happened in? Between Was ellen
alone in that apartment or with someone else? There the official,
story the one The Philadelphia police And Medical Examiner's office

(23:47):
have clung to for fourteen, years is This ellen was
suffering from severe. Anxiety she was worried about her teaching.
Performance she had recently changed. Medications on that snowy, afternoon
alone in her, apartment she took a knife from the

(24:08):
kitchen and stabbed herself twenty, times including ten times in
the back of her head and. Neck she severed her
own spinal, Cord she punctured her own, Brain she collapsed
her own, lung and then with a, knife buried four
inches into her. Heart she died slumped against the kitchen.

(24:33):
Cabinets the door was latched from. Inside sam had to
break it. Down therefore she must have been. Alone therefore
it must be. Suicide let's look at what we actually
know and what doesn't add. Up for, years the latch

(24:53):
door was the cornerstone of the suicide. Theory sam couldn't
get in because the swing bar was locked from, inside
a witness the security guard saw him break down the. Door,
Therefore ellen was alone except the security, Guard Philip, hanton

(25:17):
signed a declaration stating he did not Accompany sam to
the sixth floor and was not present When sam entered the.
Apartment security footage from six point thirty TWO pm Shows
sam entering the elevator. Alone so who Witnessed sam breaking

(25:38):
down the, door no, one. Apparently, moreover questions remain about
the door. Itself The greenberg family's investigators noted that the
door could potentially be latched from outside using fishing line
or similar, material a technique documented in other. Cases was this,

(26:04):
Investigated there's no evidence that it. Was but there's an
even more intriguing. Detail Melissa, ware the apartment building's property
manager at the, time TOLD cnn that it was possible
the door locked itself due to its. Design she explained

(26:27):
that she once had the swing bar latch swing closed
by itself after closing the door with, force the mechanism
could potentially engage on its. Own this raises a disturbing.
Possibility what if the door wasn't locked from the inside

(26:47):
When ellen? Died what if it latched itself after someone,
left possibly slamming the. Door and here is another. Oddity
If sam was desperately trying to get into the apartment
for over an, hour, knocking, calling, texting shouting through the,

(27:08):
door why didn't any neighbors hear? Him why didn't anyone
report a? Disturbance the building had other, residents yet no
one came forward to say that they had Heard sam's
frantic attempts to Reach. Ellen in, fact no neighbors reported

(27:29):
any loud noises or arguments that day at. All sam
says that he left for the gym around four forty
five that afternoon and returned to find the door. Latched
he then spent an hour trying to Reach ellen before
breaking down the door around six point. Thirty but security

(27:52):
footage Shows sam entering the elevator alone at six thirty two,
pm just one minute before he called nine to one
one at six point thirty. Three If sam had been
trying to get into the apartment for an, hour if
he'd consulted with the security, guard if he'd called his

(28:14):
attorney relatives for, advice why does the footage show him
entering the elevator just seconds before he called nine to one.
One some have Suggested sam may have gone up and
down multiple, times or that the timestamp on the footage is,
incorrect but these explanations have never been officially. Confirmed before

(28:40):
calling nine one, One sam called his cousin and, uncle both.
Attorneys James, schwartzman in, particular is a highly experienced defense
attorney and former. Prosecutor why Would sam's first instinct be
to call lawyers rather than nine to one one if

(29:04):
his fiance was in. Danger The schwartzmans have said through
their representative that they Told sam to get help from
the security guard and then to break the door, down
but critics argue that calling attorneys before calling emergency services
is suspicious. Behavior during the nine to one one, Call

(29:28):
sam sounds, distressed but according to the, transcript it takes
more than two minutes Before sam mentions that there's a
knife In ellen's. Chest you can go back and listen
to the nine one one call in part, one when
the operator asks him to PERFORM, Cpr sam hesitates and,

(29:50):
ASKS i have to. Write you'll have to go back
and listen to exactly how he said. It the operator
then Instructs sam to Tilt ellen's head. Back that's When
sam says he discovered the. Knife but here's the. Problem

(30:11):
in his statement to police later that, Night sam said
he Saw ellen lying on the ground with a knife
in her chest when he first entered the. Apartment so
which is. It did he see the knife immediately or
did he only discover it when the nine one one
operator told him to move her. Head this inconsistency has

(30:37):
never been adequately. Explained let's talk about the elephant in the.
Room can someone stab themselves twenty? Times the, answer according
to medical, literature is, yes but it's extremely. Rare most
self inflicted stabbings involve a single wound or a cluster

(31:02):
of wounds in easily accessible areas the, chest, abdomen, wrists
or neck from the. Front multiple stab wounds to the
back of the head and neck almost unheard of in suicide.
Cases Doctor Wayne ross testified that some Of ellen's wounds

(31:26):
were biomechanically impossible to self inflict based on the angles
and depth he. HAD a police officer tried to replicate
the wounds using THREE d. Photogrammetry she could not do.
It then there's the wound To ellen's spinal, cord the

(31:48):
one that appeared to show no vital, response suggesting it
was inflicted after. Death and let's not forget the most fundamental.
Question after sustaining wounds to her brain and spinal cord
that would have caused impaired loss of, consciousness how Could

(32:09):
ellen have continued to stab? Herself how could she have
maintained the strength and coordination to drive a knife four
inches into her own? Chest it defies medical. Logic thirty
one bruises in various stages of, healing some, fresh many

(32:33):
older bruising patterns that are consistent with manual. Strangulation contusions
on her forearms consistent with. Restraint Doctor simon's report acknowledges
the bruises but dismisses. Them she suggests the forearm bruises

(32:53):
show an incomplete grip and notes that they appear to
be of different, ages as if that somehow makes them less.
Suspicious but to domestic violence, experts bruises in various stages
of healing are a red. Flag they suggest repeated trauma over.

(33:16):
Time ellen's friends have said she never mentioned physical, abuse
but many victims of domestic violence hide the, abuse especially
when they're engaged to be married and planning a. Wedding
Was ellen being. Abused we may never, know but the

(33:37):
bruises raise serious questions that have never been adequately. Investigated
so let's talk about the dynamic Between ellen And. Sam,
publicly they appeared to be a happy. Couple sam has
never been charged with any. Crime he cooperated with, Police

(33:59):
HIS dna was not found on the murder. Weapon his
attorney relatives have maintained his, innocence but there are troubling.
Details multiple friends Noted ellen's anxiety increased significantly after she
moved in With. Sam she texted her parents, QUOTE i

(34:22):
want to leave this. Place get me. Out was she
referring to her, job the, apartment the. Relationship ellen's Friend
Erica hamilton recalled That ellen was worried about confidentiality with her,
therapist as if she had something she needed to keep.

(34:44):
Secret one Of ellen's, Uncles James, glattz Told DATELINE nbc
that In december of twenty, ten just a month Before ellen's,
Death ellen called him sounding really. Distraught she asked to
stay with him and his. Wife when he asked what was,

(35:05):
Wrong ellen, said, QUOTE i just can't deal with everything
that's going on right. Now James glattz said that his
wife Suggested ellen come stay with, them but Then ellen
never followed. Up glattz, said, quote we just figured she

(35:25):
got over, it worked it. Out did she work it
out or did something prevent her from. Leaving there's also
the matter of the. Wedding some sources Say ellen was
having second, thoughts others say she was. Excited the truth
is probably somewhere in. Between she Loved, sam but she

(35:49):
was stressed and. Overwhelmed none of this Proves sam did anything,
wrong but it does paint a picture of a relationship under.
Strain Remember sam's uncle entered the apartment and Removed ellen's, purse,
laptop and cell phone before police could properly secure the.

(36:12):
Scene the apartment was professionally, cleaned blood evidence was washed.
Away when police finally executed their search, warrant critical evidence
was gone or. Compromised The greenberg's attorney noted that surveillance
footage from the building is. Incomplete there are. Gaps why

(36:38):
were certain portions deleted or never? Recorded and what About
ellen's phone, records emails and computer? Files what do they?
Show The Attorney general's office Claimed ellen had searched for suicide,
methods but the original police forensic examination found no such.

(37:00):
Searches someone is, wrong so who is? It without access
to the, complete uncompromised digital, evidence we can't know What
ellen was thinking in her final. Days the most disturbing
aspect of this case is not just what happened To.
Ellen it's what happened after the police treated the scene

(37:25):
as a suicide from minute. One they didn't call the
crime scene, Unit they allowed the apartment to be, Cleaned
they permitted a relative of the fiance to remove. Evidence
the medical examiner ruled it a, homicide then changed it
to suicide after quote conferring with law. Enforcement The Attorney general's,

(37:50):
office led by a man with connections to the families,
involved claimed to find evidence of suicide searches that the
original POLICE pa investigation never. Found expert after expert has
said this was not a. SUICIDE a neuropathologist found evidence
of a post mortem, wound a biomechanical analysis showed some

(38:16):
wounds were impossible to self. Inflict renowned forensic pathologists called it,
homicide and yet the official ruling remains. Suicide Why some
have suggested incompetence that the initial investigators simply botched the,

(38:37):
case and everyone since has been trying to cover up the.
Mistakes others believe something more, sinister that someone with power
and influence has been working behind the scenes to Ensure
ellen's death remains classified as, suicide preventing a homicide investigation

(39:00):
that might lead to uncomfortable. Questions James schwartzman's position as
a prominent attorney and later as president judge of The
court Of Judicial discipline has raised. Eyebrows did his influence
play a role in how the case was. Handled there's
no evidence of, impropriety but the perception of conflict of interest.

(39:25):
Remains Josh shapiro's connections to the families involved also raised
questions about whether his office's handling of the case was truly.
Impartial to his, Credit shapiro eventually recused his, office but
only after years of. Pressure the truth, is we don't

(39:50):
know if there was a cover. Up what we do
know is that the investigation was compromised from the, beginning
and that compromise has made it nearly impossible to determine the.
Truth as of, Today Ellen greenberg's case remains open in
the public, consciousness but closed in official. Records no one

(40:15):
has been, charged no one is under. Investigation Sam goldberg
has moved on with his, life and The Philadelphia police
And Medical Examiner's office stand by their. Ruling josh And
Sandy greenberg are now in their. Seventies they've spent fourteen

(40:36):
years in over eight hundred thousand dollars fighting for their.
Daughter they've endured countless, interviews, depositions, hearings and. Appeals they've
had to Relive ellen's death over and over and. Over sandy, said,
quote we just want justice For. Ellen we want the.

(40:59):
Truth but at this point will they ever get? It
the case is a bureaucratic. Nightmare pennsylvania law doesn't allow
families to sue to overturn a medical examiner's. Determination The
greenberg's civil suit could only seek to correct the death,

(41:21):
certificate which would require proving the medical examiner was wrong
as a matter of, law an incredibly high. Bar even
if they somehow got the manner of death changed to
homicide or, undetermined that would not automatically trigger a criminal.

(41:41):
Investigation the statute Of limitations doesn't apply to. Murder but
after fourteen, years memories, fade evidence, disappears and witnesses die
or move. Away the reality Is Ellen greenberg, killer if
there was, one will likely never face. Justice it's easy

(42:07):
to get lost in the forensic, details the legal, arguments
the conspiracy, theories but at the center of this case
as a human, Being Ellen Ray greenberg was twenty seven years.
Old she was a first grade teacher who loved. Children
she was a, daughter a, friend a. Fiance she had

(42:30):
her whole life ahead of. Her she Loved Penn state,
football she played. Tennis she was close with her, parents
she was planning a, wedding and she wanted to start a.
Family and On january twenty, sixth twenty, eleven her life
ended in a pool of blood on a kitchen. Floor

(42:54):
Whether ellen took her own life or whether someone took
it from, her tragedy is the. SAME a bright light was,
extinguished a family was, shattered and fourteen years, later they
still don't have. Closure Sandy greenberg once, said, QUOTE i

(43:16):
want people to know Who ellen. Was she wasn't just a.
Statistic she was a, beautiful loving person who deserved better than.
This Josh greenberg added, Quote we're not going to. Stop
we're going to keep fighting until we get justice for our.

(43:37):
Daughter as the years go, by as they grow, older
as the public moves on to new cases and new,
Controversies you have to wonder Will Ellen greenberg ever get?
Justice the death Of Ellen greenberg raises questions that go
far beyond one case In. Philadelphia it asks how much

(44:03):
power do medical examiners have to determine the truth and
what happens when they get it? Wrong how can families
seek justice when the system tells them there's nothing to.
Investigate can someone with twenty stab, wounds including ten to
the back of their head and, neck really have committed?

(44:25):
Suicide and if medical experts say, no why does the
official ruling say? Yes most, fundamentally what is the truth?
Worth is it worth eight hundred thousand dollars fourteen years
of fighting a family's peace of? Mind for The, greenbergs

(44:49):
the answer is, yes the truth is worth everything because
without truth there can be no. Justice BUT i do
have faith that one day justice will. Prevail the truth
will always come to. Light if you know, something if

(45:12):
you saw, something if you have any information about what
happened On january twenty, sixth twenty, eleven please come. Forward
ellen's family is still. Waiting if you or someone you
know is struggling with mental health, issues please reach. Out

(45:35):
The National Suicide Prevention lifeline is available twenty four to
seven at nine eight. Eight thank you for listening to
this series On Ellen. Greenberg until next, time, friends stay
safe and take.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Care thank you for listening to this. Episode as we close,
out let us not. Forget awareness is our greatest defense
in a world that can be dark and. Grim vigilance
is our beacon of hope when it comes to the
cases we have explored together that have remained. Unsolved if
you happen to hold a piece of the, puzzle dare

(46:12):
to step. Forward As Arthur lois McMaster Bouge hold once,
said the dead cannot cry out for. Justice it is
a duty of the living to do so for. Them
until we, reconvene my, friends stay vigilant and stay. Informed

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