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February 25, 2025 18 mins

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Explore the complex realities behind the military's COVID vaccine mandate and its aftermath in this thought-provoking episode. We delve into the journey of service members who faced discharge for refusing the vaccine and the newly introduced options for reinstatement. With insights into the administration's decision to allow those affected back into service, we unravel the emotional and logistical ramifications of rejoining the military landscape. 

What concerns do these members have about acceptance in a changed environment, and how will unit cohesion be impacted? Are the few who have taken the path back ready for the challenges that await them—both from within the ranks and in reclaiming their sense of belonging? With current statistics showing only a fraction of those eligible have chosen to return, it raises pressing questions about trust and the military's evolving culture.

Join us as we discuss these vital issues and more, providing a platform for service members to share their stories and insights. We invite you to engage with us and foster a community that understands and supports those navigating these tumultuous waters. Be sure to subscribe, leave a review, and share your thoughts on this compelling topic!

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So, back in 2021, the Secretary of Defense mandated
the COVID vaccine.
This caused a huge issue in theArmy because not all service
members wanted the vaccine.
Those who refused the vaccinewere ultimately booted from the
Army.
Now, fast forward to 2023 andthe mandate was lifted because
of it being unnecessarilyburdened on all service members

(00:28):
unnecessarily burden on allservice members, so ultimately
labeling the discharges asunjust and those who were forced
out.
What does that mean?
Stick around and find out,roger Sarn, all right.
So welcome back to the Roger SSarnt Podcast, where we talk all
things Army and I'm your host,sarnt Cruz.

(00:50):
So today we're talking aboutPresident Trump's new COVID
reinstatement and towards theend, I'll show you guys the
order itself.
And, without further ado, asalways, let's get started.
And without further ado, asalways, let's get started.
So thousands of service memberswere discharged for refusing

(01:10):
COVID vaccine.
We're all aware of that right.
So now the military is offeringthem a way back.
But is that really?
Is it really that simple?
Is it really going to be thateasy to just, oh hey, I want to
get back in?
Some are ready to return,probably without hesitation Not

(01:32):
many, as we'll see in a secondWhile many others aren't even
sure if they can even trust asystem that let them go, and
could we blame him?
So I guess what does that meanfor the army culture, like unit
cohesion and those who neverleft?
Let's see what the fact sheetsays about the.

(01:55):
How many troops have takenadvantage of being able to come
back in, all right.
So here we go.
Here we go.
Fact sheet Pret, let's go here.
So this was back in october 2nd2023 and this was on cnncom,

(02:17):
and it says only 43 of more than8 000 discharged from the us
military for refusing COVIDvaccine have rejoined, and this
was written back in 2023.
It's a three-minute read Everytime.
I say I'll leave it in thedescription.
It's going to be on my GoogleDrive.

(02:38):
So you click on the GoogleDrive.
It's probably like the fourthone down.
You click on it and then youcan see it.
I'll have a um, a word documentwith all the links.
Then you just click them andread them so you can formulate
your own opinion.
So this is back in 2023, right?
So what does the fact sheet sayhere?
January 27th 2025, presidenttrump reinstate service members

(03:03):
discharged for refusing thecovid vaccine.
Right, and we'll slide all theway down to here from 2021 to
2023, the biden administrationand former secretary of defense
lloyd austin, discharged over 8000 we already know that solely
because of the vaccine.
So this and now, if youactually think about it, because

(03:28):
we did have a drop in retention, right, and it says right here,
it says such dismissal likelyhad a chilling effect on
recruitment.
What do you guys think aboutthat?
Right, if I'm in the, if I'mwatching people in the military
right that are defending thecountry, defending the nation,

(03:48):
and we're sitting here and we'rethinking, well, you know, not
many American, many Americansdid get it.
I don't know what thepercentage is you guys.
If you guys know what thepercentages of Americans that
actually voluntarily got theCOVID vaccine, you can drop it
in the comments.
But, um, it was split, right,some people didn't want it, some
people got it, I had to get it.

(04:09):
I don't think my ex-wife got it.
So even in my household it wassplit 50-50,.
Right.
So it says it could have beenthe reason why it's collective
recruiting targets around 41,000recruits.
Right, so they were missed,they missed it, they missed it.

(04:33):
And then it says again,reconfirming that only 43 troops
have joined.
Right, that's.
That's a massive, that's asmall number right, that's a
very small number to recruit tohave come back.
I would have thought it wouldhave been more like if I would

(04:54):
have gotten out, like I knowmany troops that got out and, um
, I would have probably cameback in, especially if I'm
picking up where I left off.
But we'll see how that worksout, right, as we progress.
So let's keep going.
Um, I think for all those comingback, um, it's not just about
putting on the uniform, likeputting the uniform back on.

(05:17):
It's about getting what theylost right.
The new policy lets reinstatedservice members return to their
former rank.
It gives them full back pay,benefits, bonuses that they
would have lost or received.
I'm sorry that they lost orwould have received, but after

(05:42):
months or even years, how arethey actually going to fit back
in?
I think that's the biggestquestion.
How are they going to fit backin?
I think that's the biggestquestion.
How are they going to fit backin?
And will the military itselftruly make them whole again?
Like you know the sense ofcamaraderie and all that cool
stuff, but like you, you're outfor a couple years, you're
living your life, you're notthinking about anything, and

(06:03):
then all of a sudden you're backRight.
So let's let's try and likebreak down what that kind of
means for those returning Right.
So let's think about this Willthey get their battle buddies
Right?
Because when, for instance, mybattle buddies from my first

(06:25):
duty station I've never I can'teven think about how many have I
ran across since then like faceto face.
I keep in touch with them,right.
We message each other every nowand again on Facebook,
sometimes the younger ones thatI know will be on IG, whatever.

(06:46):
But in reality, like from myfirst duty station, I don't see
many of them right, but I dokeep like in connection with
them.
The next thing is those who leftkind of got cut off right.
So when you're coming back in,where are you going to be

(07:08):
stationed?
Are you going to go back tothat same unit because it says
they're going to be able to pickback off, pick back up where
they left off?
So when I was in um, when thecovid man mandate was in effect,
I was in third brigade 3-8battalion.
So if I would have not takenthe shot and I would have gotten

(07:31):
out, would I go back to ThirdBrigade 3-8 Battalion?
Would that be my comeback or doI get to pick somewhere Like
what's that process?
And let's say they did bringhim back to that said unit or
battalion.
I was in HHC.
It's not the same.
You're the new dude now, right,you're coming back and you're

(07:55):
that new guy.
You're the NFG, right?
You're not coming back to thesame individuals who you knew
two, three years ago.
So it's a whole differentballgame.
Even now, I'm in 2nd Brigadeand when I go down to 3 brigade
land, I don't see many of theguys that I knew.
There's a couple of them there,but not the ones like from when

(08:16):
I was there.
Another question I think is goodto ask is are they going to be
treated differently becauseleaders feel some type of way
right, differently becauseleaders feel some type of way
right?
Um, this is, this is a roughone, right?
This is I think this is adebatable uh question, because,

(08:38):
at the end of the day, you'regetting a second chance and,
whether you like president trumpor not, he's giving us a second
chance.
Those who got out, whatever.
But some may see it as you'regetting a second chance on
insubordination because youdidn't get out on your own.
Some some did, some that letlet their time lapse, whatever,
but those who were pushed out,they may come back and be like

(09:00):
oh, that's that COVID dude, youknow, I don't know, maybe
they'll accept them with withopen arms.
Not everyone needs to know whereyou're coming from, why you're
here, whatever it is, butsomehow some way people find out
because you have, um, you haveyour, your, your s1 clerks and
they talk oh, he's back, they'renot there, and then that that
conversation leaks and leaks andleaks and it keeps going.

(09:21):
Your commanders are definitelygoing to know.
So how does that work?
I think, right, like, are theygoing to be treated differently,
right, so?
And when you take a hiatus, likelet's think about this, put
this in perspective Like whenyou go on, leave and you come
back, don't you feel lost?
I know, I do.

(09:42):
Like, if I, if I take anythingover a week, I come back and
it's like I don't even knowwhere I'm at, right, so is this
the same thing?
Or is it kind of like worst?
Right, that's how you say it.
Worst or worse, worst, I don'tknow.
But yeah, you're gone for twoyears and you come back and it's

(10:06):
kind of like you got to getinto the groove again.
Um, if you didn't work out likeit's so many aspects on, on, on
the, on the psyche, that wedon't consider, which is
probably why only 43 troopsjoined.
They're like you know what, Ihave an exercise and so much.
I got to deal with these waking, I got to deal with the field,
I got to deal with that.
It's not worth the back pay,who knows.
But I guess, what do you guysthink put in the comments?

(10:30):
I want to read your thoughtsand you, those who have
commented, know that I come,I'll answer back and, um, it'll
probably take me a day or twosometimes if I'm like too busy,
but I definitely comment and Iand I um comment on my.
I do my own comments, right,cause ain't nobody, I don't have
a team, it's just me.
All right, I digress.

(10:52):
So, um, I don't think, um, likenot everyone was discharged.
Like some service member, likeI mentioned before, like some
service members chose to justwalk away rather than take the
vaccine.
Right, let their time expire.
Now they too have a chance tocome back in with no penalty, to

(11:18):
their rank, their pay, theirservice status.
Now, these guys are a bitdifferent because they just let
their time expire versus beingpushed out Because of this.
Will they be welcomed the sameway as those who are forced out?
That's a huge question that isgoing to remain to be answered.

(11:44):
Right, I have yet to run into asoldier that has been
reinstated from COVID.
Right, have any of you Likethat's actually that would be
like a good one, like let meknow down below, because I don't
know of any, and you got the?
Like I said you got the onethat got pushed out and then you
got the one who let their timeexpire, but they both were out

(12:06):
because of the same reason.
And who's to say, like, whenthey come back in, if, if,
they're going to be accepted?
I think that's my biggest worry.
Like, what's the exception?
Right?
Like, how is that going to bethe reintegration?
Right, I think that's thebiggest thing in my issue.
That in my head.
Real quick, if you're listeningon the podcast, download and

(12:29):
leave a review, thank you.
Now let's get this straight realfast.
Like, reinstatement doesn'tmean that they're going to get a
free pass, right, while servicemembers can return.
This order doesn't protect themfrom disciplinary or even
administrative actions, like ifthey violated like any UCMJ.

(12:52):
It doesn't protect them fromthat and it specifically says
that, and we'll talk about it ina second, when I, when we read
the the executive order so whatdoes that actually mean in
practice?
Like, could troops be comingback to still face consequences
for their past actions?
I think that's kind of like.

(13:14):
Uh, another question that I haveright, could you imagine
getting your rank taken away or,even worse, getting kicked back
out?
Like this is exactly what I'm,what I'm talking about right
here.
It's like I don't, I don't getit.
Like, if you leave it open, isthis just like a catch 22?
Like, oh well, they're going tocome back in a catch 22?

(13:41):
Like, oh well, they're gonnacome back in, but because you,
you, you violated whatever um,ucmj or whatever article, now
you're gonna get, now you can besubject to it.
Not that they will do it Idon't think that that they'll be
that crazy but, um, yeah, like,let's see, I don't know, I
don't know, I need to.
I need to run into someonewho's come back in One of those
43 as of 2023.

(14:02):
But let's get into thisexecutive order real fast, right
?
So, reinstating service membersdischarged under the military's
COVID-19 vaccine mandate, whichwas last month, almost a month
to three days from now.
Last month, almost a month tothree days from now.
So by the authority vested inme as president, by the

(14:23):
Constitution and the laws of theUnited States of America, I
hereby order Right, so we'regoing to jump all the way down
to Alpha.
You guys can read this on yourown, but I gonna highlight alpha
, bravo and charlie real fast.
So alpha says make reinstatementavailable to all members of the

(14:45):
military active and reserve whoare discharged solely for
refusing to receive the covidvaccine back the covid 19
vaccine, and who request to bereinstated.
Right, it's not that they'regoing to get reinstated off the
bat, they got to actually askfor it.
Right, they got to do there's aprocess for it.

(15:06):
Bravo says enable those servicemembers reinstated under this
section to revert to theirformer rank and receive full
back pay, benefits, bonuspayments or compensation and
moves into Charlie.
Allow any service member whoprovide a written and sworn

(15:28):
attestation I guess that I'venever heard of that one that
they voluntarily left theservice or allowed their service
to their service to lapseaccording to appropriate
procedures, rather than beingvaccinated under the vaccine
mandate, to return to servicewith no impact on their service

(15:50):
status, rank or pay.
So if you were forced out, likeI said and if you were just
voluntary, just let your timeexpire, you ets, boom, you are
golden.
Now, if we read section three,this is.
This is where this is why Isaid the last statement that I

(16:10):
said additional agencyresponsibility.
Nothing in this order precludesdisciplinary or administrative
action for conduct that isprescribed by Chapter 47 of
Title 10 United States Code ofMilitary Justice.
You see what I mean.
I don't know, it's a rough one,but either way, at the end of

(16:38):
the day, this isn't just aboutthe policy, it's about the
people.
Right, service members who leftor were forced out now have a
path back, but the questionstill remains.
Right, we just read it.
The question still remains Willthey be fully welcomed?
Will they even like?

(17:00):
Will the trust even be restored, like in the system itself?
Will this ever happen again isprobably what they're thinking,
right?
Oh, something else is going tohappen.
They're going to force us out,blah, blah, blah.
And what impact will this haveon the military as a whole?
But I'll tell you one thing'sfor sure this decision is just.

(17:22):
It's like the beginning of amuch bigger conversation, I
would say.
But if you like this video, Ihave another one for you.
That's about soldiers and theirmental health.
I recorded that out inStockyard.
You can go ahead and watch it,but before you go, remember you
don't have to embrace the suckif you got the right tools in

(17:43):
your ruck.
I'm Sarn Cruz and I'll see youin the next one.
Peace.
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