September 7, 2025 • 54 mins
Some weeks you’re just over yourself, right? That was me this week, and funnily enough that’s exactly what Kel and I ended up diving into. We talked about those little moments where you trip over your own mental shoelaces - anxiety flares, self-sabotage, second-guessing yourself - and how bloody human that is.
We riffed on slowing down to speed up, breaking up with data and devices (yes, I may have dumped my smartwatch mid-chat), and finding ways to actually get out of our own way so we can show up as who we really are. Kel shared how she’s flipping anxiety on its head, I got honest about my own patterns of busy-ness and loneliness, and together we landed on the idea that feelings aren’t facts... and small reps are what actually shift things.
If you’ve ever caught yourself thinking, 'FFS, I’m sick of my own shit' then mate, this one’s for you!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm Tiff. This is role with the punches, and we're
turning life's hardest hits into wins. Nobody wants to go
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Their team of Melbourne family lawyers have extensive experience in
(00:29):
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reach out to Mark and the team at www dot
test Artfamilylawyers dot com dot au won't belong and you'll
(00:54):
be doing the introduction. Kel Bloody Hell, Hi, welcome back,
Kel Smith, Hey Tiff, what's going on? What isn't? Mate?
What isn't I've just been waiting for enough excitement and
energy back in my Tiff at PM world to be
able to squeeze out a pod with any sort of
personality behind me, not always my best. I like to
(01:19):
do my podcast early in the day because I can
fade fast at night, and this week has been one
of those bade fast kind of weeks fade fast.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Is it the weather. I've had a few people tell
me that they're feeling shit because of the weather.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
I think that it might be that this has been
the first year that I haven't been absolutely slaughtered by
the whole winter blues, you know, the whole seasonal effective disorder.
And I've really embraced it. I've really talked about how
grateful I am, how good this winter's been, how I
haven't felt that, you know, that kind of misery. But
something about I do think something about this week had
(01:54):
a bit of a sharp turn and I got really, oh, okay,
I'm sick of it now, I'm sick of it. I'm
sick of the dark at six pm. I'm sick of it.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
It's raining, it's raining, it's windy, it's cold, it's miserable,
so let's just join in.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It's all like I'm just putting out emotional fires, Like
I've just put out an emotional fire, and then I
turn around and I'm miserable about something else again, which
might just lead into what we're going to talk about today.
Speaker 3 (02:24):
I think it will. And it's also I think I
mentioned to you last time that I had this really
kind of big source of anxiety. It was removed from
my every day and I was like, great, this is
really good. You know, I'll be smooth sailing. You know,
this thing like it's been on my shoulders for a
very long time, it's finally gone. I can just sail
(02:46):
through life and know every other little thing has started
to creep in and it's like, hey, what about me?
Look over here now I'm going to give you the shit,
So now you can overthink about me. Really really.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
It's mayhem, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Absolute mayhem? And so that's I think. I messaged you
and I said, the next time we chat, let's talk
about how do you get out of your own way
in order to just be yourself? Like I had this
one morning. I was leaving the gym and I said
to my partner, I'm just really sick of myself. And
this is when one of these little anxiety flares was happening,
(03:25):
and I knew that it was just ridiculous. I was
building it up to be something that it wasn't. Of
course I was, And it was like, well, how do
you just get out of your own way so that
you can start reaching your potential?
Speaker 2 (03:44):
I get it, and you know, I think about it
a lot, right, and from not with anxiety so much.
But I guess like sometimes like this week when I
just felt crap again and you just roll your eyes
and go, oh, come on, and it's like because it
changes how you.
Speaker 3 (04:04):
Show up, absolutely it does.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, And so for me I often just think I
say that too to myself. I'm like, I get sick
of myself, Like what am I supposed to do with this?
This is like you don't want to drag that shit
around and make it an excuse. But also it exists.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
It totally does, totally does so even you know for
me work wise, So it's you know, it's you know,
well spoken about between us that I'm like, you know,
lacking confidence and all that kind of stuff, and.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Well it's annihilating thing after things.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
Right, and and so it's it's at the point now
where I'm like, stop, stop talking about not having any confidence,
because the more I talk about it, the more present
it is. Yeah, and just start the doing. But this
is where I'm like, get out of your own way.
It's like it feels like tripping over a mental shoelace,
(05:03):
you know, like you're you're launching yourself or heading towards something,
whether it's you know, big steps or little steps, and
then suddenly that lace just falls in front of you
and you trip yourself up and you go, oh, there
it is, there it is.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
I was thinking about this today. I just had a
lady on earlier that I was talking to God Magnificent
talk about some you know, I looked at her bio
before I jumped onto the conversation and just was like,
is this one person does? How does one person just
just the achievements where you just go, how is one
(05:36):
woman just does this and this and this and this
and this and all these different interests you know, like
psychologist and filmmaker and author and like just executes and
not people things like and nails it and I just
love that. Can't look and I can't even get through
(05:59):
this sentence with it losing my train of thought on
exactly the point I was going to make about that, well.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
I mean overwhelmed by noose.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
It was the fact that at the very end I
was we were talking about, she was talking about that
mental you know, that self talk. She'd written a book
for kids around that. And it's so like, it's interesting
because I'm having conversations everything every single day. And so
there's the fitness aspect of me that understands the biology
(06:29):
and our physical body and the relationship between that and
our minds. So they's just get the fuck up and
do the thing because that creates a change, and the
change the behavior will change the thoughts, and the thoughts
will change the behavior. But it's a loop, and then
you can override things, but also things do exist, and
(06:50):
also they need to be addressed because they will whether
you override them or not. They are still there and
they will still keep poking their little head through. And
it's I think that's where I'm just so curious and
intrigued by how everybody gets through that, because it's all different.
There's no one way, no.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
I actually saw on my new favorite thing, TikTok the
other day this woman who was interviewing Chris Hemsworth about
his series where he's you know, challenging his mental and
physical abilities. And she sat down and she said, oh
my goodness, I'm so anxious about interviewing you, as anyone
(07:32):
would be, because you know, Chris Hemsworth high. And he said,
all right, let's let's talk about that. He said, because
I have dealt with anxiety. And what I've done is,
you know, thought about it in an absolutely different way.
So I've reframed it, and you know, he embraces it,
and I'll have to find it and send it so
(07:53):
you can share it with people. But it was this
beautiful reframe and you know, you're looking at this guy
who is you know for and he's explaining how he
deals with anxiety, and it's so fascinating and it was
a really good kind of mental research of Okay, well,
let's embrace it. Let's see whether this can actually be exciting.
(08:16):
And am I anxious about something because I really care
about it? Or am I anxious just because that little
thing is crept up and tapping me on the shoulder?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
And when do you pay attention? And when do you know?
It's like, what do I need to do now to
shift change or get through it or accept it? What
do I need to do now? But also it's happening
for a reason, like whether it's anxiety or it's burnout,
It's come into the moment for a reason, either doing
too much, or something's out of alignment, or something's in
(08:51):
our world that's pressing a button we're not yet aware of.
So we need to change in the moment. We need
to be able to get through that or get over that,
or change our state. But then, you know, using the
burnout example, you can't just keep doing what you're doing.
You can't see. Like me at the moment, I'm reintroducing
(09:13):
cardio hit training just buts really small bites of it,
not the duration that I used to do, and I'm
just learning how much of that can I reintroduce? And
I've got to be careful because i don't want to
bloody burnout again. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Yeah, this is something else that I've been interested in
as well, that the concept of slowing down to speed
up or slowing down to progress, and the idea as
well of disconnecting in order to connect. So how much
do we pull back in order to rebuild our reserves
(09:51):
so that we're at our peak when we need to be.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
I've turned off all of my data on my watch.
I think in this very moment right now, I might
do something. I was thinking about it just before I
went for a little I went for the run just
before this, and I'm thinking about taking the watch off
and not wearing it at all. Wow, which I can't
see much data at all. But there's the awareness. You
(10:17):
don't like, if your phone's sitting next to you right now,
you have ten percent cognitive decline. You're distracted. If you
sleep with your phone beside your bed, your brain is
hyper vigilant. Just like if you sleep in a bed
that is not your own, like a hotel room, your
brain is hyper vigilant because you're in a different environment.
(10:40):
And we're not aware of that until we hear a
podcast that tells us and then we repeat it to
kel on our podcast, you know. But it's like there's
the awareness of it. And I've been feeling great not
monitoring and looking at waking up and looking at my
fucking sleep that I know is a shit data anyway,
and I just thought, well, now what am I really tracked?
(11:04):
I don't really even need to have it on. There's
no goals, like if I want to watch, maybe I'll
just get a watch that tells me the time that
actually looks nice.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
There's a thought I think I did mention this to you. Actually,
maybe it was on the Year project where we were
talking about data and tracking and my like, I have
a love of watches. It's my go to jewelry to
have a fascination. But yeah, I wear my Apple Watch
mainly because you know, I will kick myself in the
ask him, I haven't closed all of those rings every
(11:38):
day and really why, Like I've become a slave to
this digital device. And so I'm actually I'm going on
a holiday in a few weeks, and I thought, I'm
not going to take it with me. I'm just gonna
wear a watch that will tell me the time. And
won't that be a novelty and see if that kind
of gives me a bit of freedom and whether or
(11:59):
not I actually go back to it when I get home.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Yeah, do you reckon? I should? It's not even on
my wrist right now, because it's sitting there on charge.
I went to take it off and I was like, oh,
it's not on. It might have already happened.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah, do it? Get right right?
Speaker 2 (12:16):
That's it. There's none TIFFs, data.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
Free, data free. And you know you can get these
beautiful because I have a love of watches. You can
get these beautiful stainless steel Tiffany Die or Tiffany Face
watches in your brand blue. So you should treat yourself.
How many million dollars is they're going to pretend one
(12:39):
you can get I think, you know, Cassio be listening,
send one.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Hey Cassio.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Yeah, or you can go the role X version, depending
on you know your budget.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Okay, all right, there you go. All right, what are
the changes?
Speaker 3 (13:00):
What other changes?
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Well, what other ways do you think you get in
your way?
Speaker 3 (13:06):
Oh my goodness. So before sitting down for this, I
went for I think what the kids now are calling
a mindful walk, So just going for a walk without
any device or input. So you know, I think I
used to do that every day when I had to
walk home from school. So no headphones in, no phone call,
(13:28):
no music, no podcast, and it just really did allow,
you know, a lot of thought process to occur because
there was nothing else going on. It's like, okay, well
this is actually it's you know, it's windy, the sky
is still blue, that sun looks nice. I can smell
you know, people's fireplaces kicking in, and it was really
(13:48):
quite nice. And it was just this quite noticeable difference
there was I wasn't preoccupied with anything else other than
going on this walk. And that's probably one of the
biggest ways that I don't know if it's self sabotaged,
but definitely get in my own way. It's that I'm
(14:08):
I'm very connected to well, let's face it, my phone
probably you know, I would dare say eighty percent of
the time, whether it's scrolling, reading, whatever it is, because
you know, you've got to get all of those notifications
at the right time and all of the emails, and
what if someone messages and I don't answer, you know
quick enough. You know, when when did that ever? Like
(14:33):
when did that begin? You know, when we just kind
of became so addicted, like there's no other word for it, right,
addicted to that digital hit rather than just going for
that walk and enjoying just walking. Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
I'm the same. I've at the moment, got app blockers
that block the apps morning morning until a certain time
I don't even know at time, and then again at noon.
So there's a little bit of a window sometime mid
morning and a bit of a window mid afternoon, and
then I turn it off like it's blocked so I
(15:10):
can't I can open them, which I do by habit, Right,
you pick up the phone, I'm LIKEOK, and then it
just it opens and then it pops up on a
screen and it pretty much says piss off. Yeah, put
the phone down. What a you're doing? You're not allowed
And then it tells you account of how many times
you've tried to use the app, and you're.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
Like, oh, shut up, it's shaming you.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Yeah, can't shame me.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I didn't mean too, Isn't it just it's bizarre that
there's apps to block apps. And I've even seen now
in my scrolls, in my doom scrolls that people have
created like little physical like kind of little bricks that
are magnets and you stick them like on your fridge
or something like well away from wherever you are, and
(15:56):
you bluetooth your phone to it, and somehow like you
can link the apps to this physical device that you
don't want to access. And then if you're on to
open those apps, like let's say you're on the couch
and you're like, I'm going to check Instagram, you have
to go and scan this thing that's in another part
of the house in order to get into your app. Wow,
(16:18):
So people are making money off like genius for the
people making money off that, because we are all addicted
to it, right, but seriously, what the fuck?
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Yeah? I often think about the quality of my relationships
and the stories in my head. Because we are connected,
we're connected online, we see and we have an experience
that's not real. And I think that that exists more
than we notice. I think it's for me, it exists
more than I noticed, because I've been thinking about it
recently and going, I wonder what shift there would be
(16:50):
in a lot of my relationships and how much I
call and talk and keep in touch or reach out
and ask questions, and because like, how much do people
like to be listened to? How good is it when
someone listens to you? But when you call someone that
you've watched, you like, everyone knows what I've done. I've
put it up forty eight times on fucking Facebook. By lunchtime,
(17:13):
there's not much to listen to.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
No even even my name will say to me, So
you know, I've spoken to this person in the family
and this has happened. I'm like, yep, yep. Instead of
just being able to go, well, here's my nan, who's
you know, the oracle of the family and she wants
to share all of the stories. Well, yeah, I've seen
them all online mostly, and so now she'll go, have
you seen it on the line, or can I tell you.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
Have you seen it on the line.
Speaker 3 (17:42):
Yeah, yeah, it's very cute. And then you know there's
there's the flip side right of these devices and access.
So I just got her an Alexis speaker. So she's
she's legally blind, and I thought, what can I get
her that, you know, will help open up her world
a bit. And so she's got the Alexa speaker. She
tunes into the podcasts. But she told me that a
(18:05):
few weeks ago. Yeah, she told me a few weeks
ago that she couldn't sleep, and so she asked the
speaker to play music that her mom used to play,
and she said it was like being a kid and
they would all gather around the wireless in the lounge
room and listen to the music that her mother loved.
(18:26):
And she said it was just incredible, like I just
brought back all of these memories. And so now she
you know, she thinks Alexa is her best friend when
she listens to her and does what she's told. But yeah,
that's that's you know, I would say that that's an
absolute positive of being connected.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah, what Probably my favorite device is my Google Home
because it's just it's my alarm clock. So I don't
have to look at the phone to set the alarm clock.
I can play music on that. I wish that it
could play my insight Time app without me to That's
the only thing is at the moment, I've got these
(19:04):
beautiful meditations that I listened to before bed, and I
go straight to sleep listening it's such there's one that's
just magic for me at the moment. And so I've
got the phone in the room though, which is one
of my preferred rules, is to not have it in
the room. But because I'm going straight to sleep, I
feel okay about it. But ideally I would like to
not have it in the fucking room. But yeah, I
(19:27):
can tell Spotify to play it a meditation, but sometimes
play some funky, weird stuff. I'm like, not that one.
Play my insight Time with that dude, with the good
one that I really like that puts me to sleep.
You know when you listen to the same one over
and over and over and then one day you're like,
I've never heard this bit.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
Before because you've fallen asleep.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Yeah, I've never heard this all the way through.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
How good is that? Yeah? I love a meditation. So
there's one on the Headspace app. And it's a guided
meditation with Eric Banner, and he has got the voice
for it. He's definitely got the yeah, absolutely straight to
sleep all right and then there should do a meditation
(20:12):
app go the buck to sleep very soothing. So what
about you like if I can flip the question.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
I reckon? For me, it's the it's the unconscious patterns.
It's catching myself out because I feel like i've I've
I latched onto the curiosity around how much I do
that for a long time, like areas where I feel
like I'm not getting ahead here or I keep making change,
(20:47):
like I keep changing jumping from thing to thing. What's
making me do that? And so I feel like it's
it's putting the pieces of those puzzled puzzles together, like
do I want what I say I want? And if
I'm the only reason I'm not achieving things because I
keep going to because I never it's not like anything's failed.
(21:10):
There's never been anything that I've kicked off with that's
been a failure. In fact, I often am surprised by
how well something might go when I have an idea
and just go with it. But then I've often looked
back and not seen it through and I've had a
story about that, but i've and I would start to
(21:31):
question my stories. I'm like, well, you say that that
sounds really humble and good, but is that true? Like
do you just do you just not feel worthy of
being successful? Do you not feel worthy of making money
from things that you create? Do you fear that you're
(21:52):
actually not that good? So if you leave it behind
before you have a chance to fail, then that was
by choice and that then no one would see you fail.
Or A question I used to always ask was if
financially when I get my finance, if once I feel
financially secure in my life, well then I can focus
(22:16):
on relationships. And like I think, deep down I'm a
bit fucking scared of those. So part of me goes, well,
let's not achieve this because that shit over there. We're
not going there. Ever.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Oh that's a big one. That's a very big one. Yeah. Yeah,
so and the same right, Like I I think I've
told you. So, I'm really forcing myself to write something
at least twice a week and publish it on my substack.
And I'm also being more I'm pushing myself to put
(22:57):
myself out there more in terms of you know, this
is even if it's just a photo of me, that
is with whatever I've written until like this, you know,
this process of being on the podcast started. I was like,
I can't do that. No one gives a shit about
what I say, nobody wants to see me. It's it's
(23:18):
that safety net, right, Like if I don't do it,
then I won't fail. But if I don't do it,
then I'll never know whether I could have succeeded. But
it's so similar, like it's yeah that if I don't
take the first step, then I don't have to worry
(23:40):
about potentially getting to the second step, which is terrifying.
So therefore I can just maybe I can think about it,
you know, because thinking about it is fine, and I
can kind of plan for it. But it's got to
be the right time to actually take the first step,
because if the first step actually goes anywhere, then well
(24:00):
that second step is it's not going to work, because
I really really am scared of that. It's yeah, it's
that loop, right, yeah, And.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Do you wonder where it comes from? Do you have
any idea of where where it comes from? An instance
where something happened that is that that story has been
built on.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
Yes and no. Yeah, that's a fascinating one. Like I
remember so in school, for instance, I was known for
writing so short stories. I think like our school had
a short story competition and the winner would be published
in the yearbook each at the end of each year,
(24:44):
and I got it like I think five years in
a row or something, and it was just you know,
that's you know, Kelly's going to be a writer, that's
what she's going to do. And then I remember someone
and it still sticks in my mind, you know, kind
of arch nemesis at high school and she's like, well,
what are you going to do after high school? I said.
(25:05):
She's like, everyone's just gonna have kids, and I'm like, no,
I think I'm going to have a career first. And
she goes, yeah, well that's right, you think you're going
to have a career. And I was like, oh, so
there was there was always this kind of flip side
of things. There was the people that would kind of believe,
and then the people who didn't, and their voices were
(25:30):
always much louder because it's so much easier to believe
the negative than the positive. And even if it's like
you know, nine people out of ten say something that's
that's good, and then number ten says something that's not.
You're like, well, number ten's correct.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Mm yeah, I was thinking when I I don't know
when I kind of realized this, but when my parents
had we lived in a shop when I was really young,
So about three, we moved into a shop. They had
a seven day a week little like like summer Bay
little it was yeah, turn a speech a little summer Bay,
(26:08):
tazzy summer Bay and seven day week shop. And then
after that they went into My mom and dad went
into business with friends in a motel and restaurant, which
was cool for me because I got to live in
a motel room. We had live music every Saturday night,
and it was kind of cool. That business partnership turned
out sour. They turned out losing a lot of money
(26:28):
and Mum lost her house and it was shit all right,
so shit outcome. People turned to shit when you go
into business. And then a few years ago I went
into business with some blokes and invested a lot of
money and long story short, didn't work out well, lost
a lot of money, and I literally a few years
later I was like, wow, Wow, how do we repeat
(26:53):
the things. They just felt like I'd literally repeated what
they'd done and not seen it at the time.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
And I was like, fucking hell, yeah, it's do you
think it's just a known it's a known behavior, or
it's familiar, like it's a kind of muscle memory.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
I'm sure actually on that. On the idea of that
what I found weird when I moved to Melbourne as
a So I was at lateeen when I moved to
Melbourne seventeen I think seventeen or eighteen or nineteen. Clearly
have no idea. Probably should learn my lifetimeline. But anyway,
(27:38):
I moved to Melbourne and I was working in hospitality
and studying travel, and I started doing their design work.
I started doing their menus and stuff and they were
like that's really good, can you and then peep customers
that would come in. So I started doing all this
business and then I was like, oh, you should register
in ABN and make a little business. I was like
(27:59):
I remember getting going online and registering an ABN and
feeling like this tiny, little tazzy girl. I was like,
oh my god, I've got a business. And it's like
I grew up in business, like my first memories almost
were business. We lived in two businesses, and I thought
(28:22):
it was astounding that I had just gone down and
registered this Aben had a business, And that was weird
to me because I'm like, hmm, your parents rant they
were business people.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
But it's different doing it for you. It's different doing
it for yourself though, mm Like it's a pretty big
achievement to do that for yourself, and particularly after having moved,
Like did you move over here on your own?
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Yeah, well dad was here. I moved over here and
lived with him to begin with.
Speaker 3 (28:49):
Yeah, now I think, yeah, doing things on your own.
So for me, I have always been driven by people
saying that I can't do something. So it's kind of like,
tell me I can't do it, and I will dig
my heels in because I am a stubborn, determined little
(29:12):
shit and I will show you that I can do
what you said I couldn't. So even you know, people saying, oh,
you think you're going to go to UNI, so I
did twice, or you think you're going to do that?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
Do you?
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Yeah? I do, and I did, which is it's such
a it's a ridiculous contrast to then go, I don't
really have much confidence.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
That is a contrast. Yeah, what's that about?
Speaker 3 (29:46):
I think. I think, in all honesty, it's probably the
levels of anxiety that I've previously had, which I dramatically
reduced now and even even from you having these conversations
with you and great, like people are telling me you're
far more engaged when we have conversations.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Now.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
This is like with my friends and family, right, You're
more confident in what you're saying. And even just the
other day, like I was talking to my boss about
presenting at work and I said I was presenting something
to one person and my voice started cracking, and she's like,
it's only what you think because when you present, you
(30:30):
hide it so well that you're nervous, Like you come
across so confidently. And I'm like, great, maybe I should
take up poker or something, because it's certainly not how
I feel. But I don't know. Maybe now it's more
stepping into it, and maybe it's been the same for
you as well. But the idea of getting out of
your own way is just I read this thing the
(30:51):
other day. Actually this is getting back to the digital space.
But I plug a lot into chat GPT. I love it.
Think it's great use in the right way. And I said,
based on what you know about me, what do you
think should be in my mantra? And it came back
(31:12):
with this, you know, based on all of the work
that you're doing, all of the writing that you're doing,
because it's you know, it's doing all my gym workouts
for me, all this really cool stuff. And it said,
I am not becoming I am And that was like,
you know, it was like that, that's actually it's even
(31:34):
if I'm not truly ready to believe that yet, Like
I think it's something that I really am almost ready
to embrace that with all the work that I've done.
You know, I'm not becoming that person anymore. I am
that person. I can kind of step into that space.
(31:55):
But at the same time, like I'm saying that and
I'm like, oh my god, I sounds so cocky, like
it's and I'm not meaning to, but it's coming across
that way. But it's That's kind of where I'm still
at around getting out of my own way, Like when
can I get to the point of just going yep,
work is done, well, the majority of the work is done.
There still will always be work to do, but you know,
(32:17):
I can own this space quite comfortably now, I.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Reckon it's also I don't know, there seems to be
a lot coming back to I guess that idea of
using your voice, like it's when you own it, it's
when you speak it, when you show up, and so like,
at what point was that not okay?
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Oh A lot of the time, Yeah, a lot of
the time, I think. Yeah, as a kid, definitely not okay.
Kids were you know, in my household, it was like
kids were not to have voices at all. So that's
probably where I be came very introverted and you know,
(33:03):
very much in my own head. And actually it's probably
started writing, reading a lot, writing a lot, and then
even yeah, in like school, you know, the only red
head kid in primary school, the only red head kid.
The bullying was just ridiculous, and getting to high school
the same. So it was just learning to I think
(33:24):
it was a way of protecting myself.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
Hmm. I can't remember having, you know, the whole pink
hair phase and that, you know, the needing an image
to be my voice and for the to help create
the persona so people would see the image of these
chicks got bright, pink fucking hair, she must be awesome,
(33:49):
and then I just put like, ah, the show, I'll
fucking look how loud I am. And it's like, in
reality not loud. Like at the time. I remember when
I went through that stage, and you know, like I
was still in my twenties then I was working in hospitality.
I was die my hair bright pink bud jermy Dane
matching bloody, matching eye shadows and pink hair and pink
(34:12):
eye shadow or purple hair and purple eye shadow, and
you know, and I remember the first time that I
ended up d dying brown again and literally saying, I
just it just doesn't feel like I need that anymore.
And I never felt like I needed it when I
had it. I just thought that was me. I was like, oh,
this is but it was really it was because I
(34:32):
was too shy. I was too scared to really speak
up for myself, so I would make sure that I
stood out in some sort of bold way without needing
to speak out.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
So yeah, that's the complete opposite too, like I completely
understand it, but in the opposite way. And one of
my now very good friends is very similar. So I
remember the first time I at her and she talks,
just talks and talks and talks, and I was like,
who who's this check? You just won't shut up, and
(35:10):
she was as loud as I was quiet. And then
we're out one night and we both sat down and
because we were in like a bar or a club
or something like that, and she was like, I just
need to sit down, like I find this so overwhelming,
and I said, yeah, me too, and she goes, it's
the reason why she goes. Whenever I'm overwhelmed, that's when
(35:31):
I talk a lot. And I looked at her and
I'm like, whenever I'm overwhelmed, I shut down. And we
just went, oh hello, And we've been really good friends
ever since, and you know, every time we catch up
it's like this great DNM. But it was just this
chance that we both kind of said, this is how
(35:53):
I feel and this is why I present the way
that I do, and we both went same, same bit different.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
I remember the last couple of years just realizing when
I'm rushing into the gym to work, when i'd be
rushing in there and doing a workout, and you know,
like and at some point it's kind of realizing that
people there's these faces there right, and I'm in my head,
(36:23):
like I'll be, I'm thinking about stuff. I've just done
a podcast, I'm heading into the gym. I'm going to
squeeze in a quick workout, and then I've got my client,
and then I'm going to be heading back out and
I've got something else on. And so there's this and
i'd walk through and maybe not even see people. And
there's times when I would just think people would probably
be looking at you to connect. And it's not that
(36:46):
I'm not looking at them, but I'm not because I'm
actually I'm visualizing in my head or I'm talking in
my head. I'm thinking about the next plan.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
Yeah. It was like, oh, you need like people. Imagine
how that comes across. Imagine how intimidating that is.
Speaker 3 (37:07):
Absolutely, like how it's a fascinating thing. How do other
people view you y being the great overthinker. That's something
that's always on my mind. And even the other day
something happened at work and I was like, really, like,
why would why would that person do that? You know,
(37:29):
they must they don't like me. That's it. I've done
something to upset them. They don't like me. They must
think that I'm completely unapproachable. So they've gone and done
it this way, and then today I found out that
it was just they thought I wasn't there. That was it.
And I've gone, okay, so all of this this spiral
(37:51):
in my own mind of your shit, no one likes you.
You've done something to really piss that person off. You're
unapproachable because you just you know, you're so unlikable. No,
they just thought I wasn't there.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
That's like me with the whole busyness, little misindependent, bloody
carry on. It's like I'm always so busy and you know,
unapproachable for things. And then in a moment where I'll
be like, oh, I'm exhausted, and I'll and then you
get all sad and lonely, and I'll catch myself at
times thinking no one loves you, oh and just assessing
(38:30):
this and thing going you create this like that's not
that they don't love you. They just think you're fucking bit.
They don't realize you're having a night off and you're
lonely and sad right now. They think you're doing seventy
eight podcasts and training people. Yep, yeah, you know, like
times roll and it's good, like it's great to have
the self awareness to catch your thoughts and be able
(38:53):
to review when they're repetitive behaviors where it's like, ah,
I've occasionally come across thinking this way, and also I
can see how I am one hundred percent the creator
of everything that leads to that happening or being that way,
Like there is one hundred percent responsibility for how you
(39:16):
perceive that people treat you is because of the ecosystem
of your life and relationships that you create.
Speaker 3 (39:25):
Do you find that because you're aware of it though,
that you can catch it sooner?
Speaker 2 (39:33):
Yeah, yeap, And that's what I mean. I guess before
when it was like about making changes, so that used
to happen a lot because I used to be busy
all the time and then hit a wall and then
be sad as fark. And now it's less so, but
it'll be familiar. You'll catch will be like, oh, am
I still doing that. Like I've spent a lot of
time this year. I have a couple of days off
(39:55):
client free. Haven't done that for years because I'm a
lunatic and spend and make sure that I'm spending regular
time with the people who are close to me. But
it's still there will still be those little moments, and
there will just be moments of you know, it might
just be that I'm tired. It's not what I'm doing
anything wrong. Yeah, I'm working on the relationships. But yeah,
(40:17):
I catch it now, and it's just a good chance
to review. Am I still do and think? Could I
do things? Could I be a better friend? Am I
still being a bit unavailable? Or am I just tired
right now? And is it winter and the weather's miserable?
Come on Melbourne.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
And your watch is probably telling you to take a break.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Well, me and the watch, we're broken up now done,
dumped dumped dumped it.
Speaker 3 (40:45):
Yeah, no, it is. I'm noticing now as well. One
of the biggest things for me has also been to
be able to respond rather than react. And I'm noticing
that in a lot of situations where I'd be very
highly reactive, that I'm responding in very different ways, which
(41:07):
is really nice. So it's like, Okay, well that was
that was old me, and I don't need to reach
for that anymore. There's more that I can actually go to,
and there's better things that I can go to in
that moment, and that's due to all of the work
with my amazing shrink, so I actually don't need to
(41:29):
see anymore. So that's that's a big win. But yeah,
even just the conversations, so being able to talk like
this about something and you know, not not be scared
of it anymore. Just so, yeah, it's a conversation, and
you know, if someone wants to listen to it, then great,
and if it's not for them, then great, but it's
(41:52):
it's certainly helping in a lot of ways to go. Well,
if I can talk to you like this, then being
in alignment with who I am and my values means
that I should be able to talk to anyone like this.
So I'm trying to present this more to everyone and
(42:12):
I'm finding that that is giving me a lot of calm,
which is.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Really nice, realizing that the way we feel is not
a reflection of the way we are. So when I
first started the podcast, the whole idea was to develop
a skill, and so I had no kind of benchmark
(42:42):
on it's got to be this good to put it up,
and I had no plan of how to run a conversation.
I just started doing it for experience, and I decided
that every single podcast I recorded I would put up,
and there were times. There were times where I'd have
a conversation and feel horrific. In the middle. I was like, Oh,
you're so dumb, You're so not good at this, Like
(43:05):
this is not a great experience for them. And then
I would put it up and afterwards I'd listen and
it was not the way I was perceiving it. That
was just internal me. And I'm measurably different now than
i was five years ago. But I frequently have those
moments where I feel really dumb and I can't articulate
(43:31):
the way that I want to, or I'm observing as
i'm speaking and I'm listening and I'm making those judgments
and I'm like, well, this is not you know. It's
like like when people achieve. So when Craig talks about
the mountain, you're like, you climb the mountain, you get
on top of the mountain, You're like, oh, wrong, mountain.
So the mountain's not the thing. Like, we're always going
(43:52):
to feel confident or not confident, or especially if we're
aiming to grow, we're always going to feel a bit nervous.
We're going to have that in critic. We're going to
fear judgment, because that's hardwired into us as humans. We're
going to feel all those things. That doesn't mean anything.
And it was easy to digest that in the in
when I reflect on boxing, because that was a place
(44:16):
where you show up and you get punched in the
face all the time. And there were so many times
where I had a perception of performance and it was
the polar opposite. I'm hammering myself with you know, oh
this is you know, I'm so crap. I'm so crap.
And a coach would say, that's what the hell is
wrong with you? That the best you've ever performed. I
remember in twenty nineteen my coach got somebody, a girl
(44:40):
to come and spa so I'd never met her. She
comes apart. It was an utter blood bath. Some people
are just bleeders. And her nose. I hat that nose
and we were covered. It was revolting. I wore a
white top too. There was blood all over us, and
I had this I was going to this thing where
when things were un so, I sparred John Manu. He
(45:02):
hits like a frag trating He's currently number one in Australia,
so he's a weapon. And I was doing really well
against him. I was really making some progress, and then
she came in and I would just get like performance
anxiety where I would gas in that so I would
be able to feel gassed straight up, which made things
feel different because my body felt different, and I had
(45:26):
to I remember, I had to go and run a
workshop afterwards. I did. We did the sparring, however, many rounds,
and then I left and I was texting when I
arrived where I needed to be, I was texting my
coach and I'm like, I just don't know why. I
don't know why it has to be there. I was
having a big winge he and eventually he's like, what's
wrong with you?
Speaker 3 (45:45):
Mate?
Speaker 2 (45:47):
You cleaned, you wiped the floor with her, and all
I can hear from you is complaining. And I'm like,
because I didn't believe that I did a good think
because I'm going off this feeling if things were unfamiliar
and I must be crap. And like he used to
always say to me, you don't believe in yourself. And
(46:08):
I was so reliant on and he wasn't one to
ever dish out compliments, so I was like, if you
ever got a compliment, it was like, yes, this is
like a world championship in itself, But eventually I kind
of was like, I think maybe it's a bit right
with that. I was so reliant on other people's opinion
because you can't always trust how you're perceiving a situation.
(46:30):
You're in the middle of my damn, what a ship's
bit fickle sport?
Speaker 3 (46:35):
Yeah, it is kind of terrifying that you say some
people are just bleeders. That's what I took from that.
I feel exactly the same way on my mindful walk
that I had before I sat down with you. I thought,
you know, at the moment, there's people saying you're really
(46:59):
good at this, and it's like, I bet that there's
so many people that would love to hear that, and look,
I'd love hearing it, let's be honest, but they would
love this opportunity. And so I'm purposefully on my own
back now about well, what do I do with this
(47:19):
because it's such a wonderful opportunity. How do I keep
it going, how do I do it for myself? How
do I keep the momentum up? But there is still
that absolutely look I don't think it will ever go,
but that voice that's like who do you think you are? Like, really,
who do you think you are? Like it's and it's
(47:43):
that metaphorical. You know, you're just knocking yourself out all
the time because you don't believe what other people are saying.
But it's almost now that switch of well, if a
number of people are saying it, then maybe there's some
truth to it, maybe those negative voices are being outweighed,
(48:04):
but it's still reliant on those external voices, not my own.
Speaker 2 (48:11):
I caught up with someone I hadn't seen for a
few years just last week, and they made some similar
comment around look watching where I'd started and how on
what I've grown to over the last few years and
what I've developed them things I've done, and they were like,
you've just over a you know, I can't even remember
(48:31):
the terms they used, but I just kind of shocked me.
And I was like, really, because you forget that other
people are seeing a version and you're creating your own
shit story, shit little fairy tale in your head that's
doesn't have a happy ending. And it was just like, really, like,
(48:52):
it's nice, it's nice to be reminded that I don't
know that what are people seeing.
Speaker 3 (49:01):
It's lovely to be reminded, but I think it's also
getting out of that trap of needing to be reminded. Yeah.
I listened to a podcast the other day with the
CEO of Airbnb, and he's also a bodybuilder. And before
when you said that you started this because you wanted
to develop a skill, he was talking about how, you know,
(49:23):
he started Airbnb I think with a friend, and he'd
had no experience obviously in running a business like that
or being a CEO. So everything he did he treated
as just being like a rep in the gym, because
that's what he could equate it to from being a bodybuilder. Right,
So it was all just what's the next skill I
(49:47):
can develop? So rather than you know, letting those voices
take over, those voices of doubt, it's like, well, it's
just building on a skill, which is what you've just said.
And maybe that's the Maybe that's the secret. I don't know.
Maybe it's to get out of your own way, like
don't concentrate on yourself, just concentrate on the next thing
(50:09):
that you can build.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
Yeah, and I think the same could. Yeah, like that
idea of having a plan, like I was always open
to look at It wasn't just the building the skill,
it was the I value networking relationships and wow, like wow,
look at who I get to connect with for moments
that open opportunities. And because at the time I started it,
(50:34):
I was working online for the paramedics right so Ambulance
Victoria through the pandemic. When when we shut down, I
was doing their wellness program. So every day I was
myself and at yoga instructor because not everyone wants to
metaphorical punches in their face and their land room every day,
so we had some yoga as well. And Feel Good
(50:56):
Friday was what I developed, which started as the idea
of having wine or something of a Friday albough. Then
I started getting guests on. Then the idea of a
podcast came to me, and because of that I had
this gutsy little ability to reach out to people. Well.
First I had Craig Harper and Paul Taylor and a
range of and some of the brilliant paramedics that have
(51:18):
got high profiles in my grasp. So I put together
this six week panel of guests and I was like, Wow,
that's thousands of dollars worth of guess and they're just
people in my network, and so to build on that,
I got to reach out to people and say, hey,
would you come and speak to on a live call
with me to the ambulance Victoria Paramedics. So I had
(51:39):
the kind of the backing of a brand and the
idea that well, then you start to have touch points
and relationships like christ, now I have a fucking album.
Now I have an album from one of Australia's biggest
rock stars. Like that was all because of the podcast.
(52:01):
That's that's very cool. I didn't realize that's how it started.
Like that's you were doing good. You're doing lots of
that's for the particularly during the pandemic, like to be
doing something to support the people that had it the hardest. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:17):
My one of my aunts is a nurse and she
was like it was just trauma, absolute trauma. So to
be doing something for the people that were dealing with that,
like go you.
Speaker 2 (52:27):
Oh and go then, because that was such that was
soul food for me. Like that's why the pandemic felt
like a positive thing for me, because I got to connect,
I got to do good. I got to I love
paramedics like they're such beautiful souls. So I just got
to know so many good humans and have them all
of a sudden in my circle. And yeah, I probably
(52:50):
would have struggled a lot more through that time if
I didn't have that beautiful opportunity to happen.
Speaker 3 (52:58):
Yeah it was Look, it was a shit time, wasn't it.
But yeah, I think people did manage to get some
good out of it. And you know, there's been some
silver linings. As one of my friends calls them, there
was some silver linings of COVID big.
Speaker 2 (53:13):
Time, big time. We're going to wrap up because I've
got three minutes before I've got to be knocking on
the zoom door of another call. So thanks for another
great chat.
Speaker 3 (53:24):
Oh, thank you, it's wonderful. I'm going to send you
my draft plan for some interviews that I would like
to do on my own podcast. Just quietly, all.
Speaker 2 (53:37):
Right, And do you want to tell everyone where they
can find your substack?
Speaker 3 (53:42):
Kelsmith dot substack dot com.
Speaker 2 (53:45):
Go there you go go check it out, everybody.
Speaker 3 (53:48):
Thanks Kel, Thanks Tied, see ya, see.
Speaker 1 (53:51):
Ya, she said, it's now never I got fighting in
my blood.
Speaker 3 (54:00):
The lions garatry call the coast Garatue, the Gastcaritue at
cost garitry,
She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm Tiff. This is role with the punches, and we're
turning life's hardest hits into wins. Nobody wants to go
to court, and don't. My friends at test Art Family
Lawyers know that they offer all forms of alternative dispute resolution.
Their team of Melbourne family lawyers have extensive experience in
(00:29):
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reach out to Mark and the team at www dot
test Artfamilylawyers dot com dot au won't belong and you'll
(00:54):
be doing the introduction. Kel Bloody Hell, Hi, welcome back,
Kel Smith, Hey Tiff, what's going on? What isn't? Mate?
What isn't I've just been waiting for enough excitement and
energy back in my Tiff at PM world to be
able to squeeze out a pod with any sort of
personality behind me, not always my best. I like to
(01:19):
do my podcast early in the day because I can
fade fast at night, and this week has been one
of those bade fast kind of weeks fade fast.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Is it the weather. I've had a few people tell
me that they're feeling shit because of the weather.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
I think that it might be that this has been
the first year that I haven't been absolutely slaughtered by
the whole winter blues, you know, the whole seasonal effective disorder.
And I've really embraced it. I've really talked about how
grateful I am, how good this winter's been, how I
haven't felt that, you know, that kind of misery. But
something about I do think something about this week had
(01:54):
a bit of a sharp turn and I got really, oh, okay,
I'm sick of it now, I'm sick of it. I'm
sick of the dark at six pm. I'm sick of it.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
It's raining, it's raining, it's windy, it's cold, it's miserable,
so let's just join in.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It's all like I'm just putting out emotional fires, Like
I've just put out an emotional fire, and then I
turn around and I'm miserable about something else again, which
might just lead into what we're going to talk about today.
Speaker 3 (02:24):
I think it will. And it's also I think I
mentioned to you last time that I had this really
kind of big source of anxiety. It was removed from
my every day and I was like, great, this is
really good. You know, I'll be smooth sailing. You know,
this thing like it's been on my shoulders for a
very long time, it's finally gone. I can just sail
(02:46):
through life and know every other little thing has started
to creep in and it's like, hey, what about me?
Look over here now I'm going to give you the shit,
So now you can overthink about me. Really really.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
It's mayhem, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Absolute mayhem? And so that's I think. I messaged you
and I said, the next time we chat, let's talk
about how do you get out of your own way
in order to just be yourself? Like I had this
one morning. I was leaving the gym and I said
to my partner, I'm just really sick of myself. And
this is when one of these little anxiety flares was happening,
(03:25):
and I knew that it was just ridiculous. I was
building it up to be something that it wasn't. Of
course I was, And it was like, well, how do
you just get out of your own way so that
you can start reaching your potential?
Speaker 2 (03:44):
I get it, and you know, I think about it
a lot, right, and from not with anxiety so much.
But I guess like sometimes like this week when I
just felt crap again and you just roll your eyes
and go, oh, come on, and it's like because it
changes how you.
Speaker 3 (04:04):
Show up, absolutely it does.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, And so for me I often just think I
say that too to myself. I'm like, I get sick
of myself, Like what am I supposed to do with this?
This is like you don't want to drag that shit
around and make it an excuse. But also it exists.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
It totally does, totally does so even you know for
me work wise, So it's you know, it's you know,
well spoken about between us that I'm like, you know,
lacking confidence and all that kind of stuff, and.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Well it's annihilating thing after things.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
Right, and and so it's it's at the point now
where I'm like, stop, stop talking about not having any confidence,
because the more I talk about it, the more present
it is. Yeah, and just start the doing. But this
is where I'm like, get out of your own way.
It's like it feels like tripping over a mental shoelace,
(05:03):
you know, like you're you're launching yourself or heading towards something,
whether it's you know, big steps or little steps, and
then suddenly that lace just falls in front of you
and you trip yourself up and you go, oh, there
it is, there it is.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
I was thinking about this today. I just had a
lady on earlier that I was talking to God Magnificent
talk about some you know, I looked at her bio
before I jumped onto the conversation and just was like,
is this one person does? How does one person just
just the achievements where you just go, how is one
(05:36):
woman just does this and this and this and this
and this and all these different interests you know, like
psychologist and filmmaker and author and like just executes and
not people things like and nails it and I just
love that. Can't look and I can't even get through
(05:59):
this sentence with it losing my train of thought on
exactly the point I was going to make about that, well.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
I mean overwhelmed by noose.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
It was the fact that at the very end I
was we were talking about, she was talking about that
mental you know, that self talk. She'd written a book
for kids around that. And it's so like, it's interesting
because I'm having conversations everything every single day. And so
there's the fitness aspect of me that understands the biology
(06:29):
and our physical body and the relationship between that and
our minds. So they's just get the fuck up and
do the thing because that creates a change, and the
change the behavior will change the thoughts, and the thoughts
will change the behavior. But it's a loop, and then
you can override things, but also things do exist, and
(06:50):
also they need to be addressed because they will whether
you override them or not. They are still there and
they will still keep poking their little head through. And
it's I think that's where I'm just so curious and
intrigued by how everybody gets through that, because it's all different.
There's no one way, no.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
I actually saw on my new favorite thing, TikTok the
other day this woman who was interviewing Chris Hemsworth about
his series where he's you know, challenging his mental and
physical abilities. And she sat down and she said, oh
my goodness, I'm so anxious about interviewing you, as anyone
(07:32):
would be, because you know, Chris Hemsworth high. And he said,
all right, let's let's talk about that. He said, because
I have dealt with anxiety. And what I've done is,
you know, thought about it in an absolutely different way.
So I've reframed it, and you know, he embraces it,
and I'll have to find it and send it so
(07:53):
you can share it with people. But it was this
beautiful reframe and you know, you're looking at this guy
who is you know for and he's explaining how he
deals with anxiety, and it's so fascinating and it was
a really good kind of mental research of Okay, well,
let's embrace it. Let's see whether this can actually be exciting.
(08:16):
And am I anxious about something because I really care
about it? Or am I anxious just because that little
thing is crept up and tapping me on the shoulder?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
And when do you pay attention? And when do you know?
It's like, what do I need to do now to
shift change or get through it or accept it? What
do I need to do now? But also it's happening
for a reason, like whether it's anxiety or it's burnout,
It's come into the moment for a reason, either doing
too much, or something's out of alignment, or something's in
(08:51):
our world that's pressing a button we're not yet aware of.
So we need to change in the moment. We need
to be able to get through that or get over that,
or change our state. But then, you know, using the
burnout example, you can't just keep doing what you're doing.
You can't see. Like me at the moment, I'm reintroducing
(09:13):
cardio hit training just buts really small bites of it,
not the duration that I used to do, and I'm
just learning how much of that can I reintroduce? And
I've got to be careful because i don't want to
bloody burnout again. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Yeah, this is something else that I've been interested in
as well, that the concept of slowing down to speed
up or slowing down to progress, and the idea as
well of disconnecting in order to connect. So how much
do we pull back in order to rebuild our reserves
(09:51):
so that we're at our peak when we need to be.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
I've turned off all of my data on my watch.
I think in this very moment right now, I might
do something. I was thinking about it just before I
went for a little I went for the run just
before this, and I'm thinking about taking the watch off
and not wearing it at all. Wow, which I can't
see much data at all. But there's the awareness. You
(10:17):
don't like, if your phone's sitting next to you right now,
you have ten percent cognitive decline. You're distracted. If you
sleep with your phone beside your bed, your brain is
hyper vigilant. Just like if you sleep in a bed
that is not your own, like a hotel room, your
brain is hyper vigilant because you're in a different environment.
(10:40):
And we're not aware of that until we hear a
podcast that tells us and then we repeat it to
kel on our podcast, you know. But it's like there's
the awareness of it. And I've been feeling great not
monitoring and looking at waking up and looking at my
fucking sleep that I know is a shit data anyway,
and I just thought, well, now what am I really tracked?
(11:04):
I don't really even need to have it on. There's
no goals, like if I want to watch, maybe I'll
just get a watch that tells me the time that
actually looks nice.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
There's a thought I think I did mention this to you. Actually,
maybe it was on the Year project where we were
talking about data and tracking and my like, I have
a love of watches. It's my go to jewelry to
have a fascination. But yeah, I wear my Apple Watch
mainly because you know, I will kick myself in the
ask him, I haven't closed all of those rings every
(11:38):
day and really why, Like I've become a slave to
this digital device. And so I'm actually I'm going on
a holiday in a few weeks, and I thought, I'm
not going to take it with me. I'm just gonna
wear a watch that will tell me the time. And
won't that be a novelty and see if that kind
of gives me a bit of freedom and whether or
(11:59):
not I actually go back to it when I get home.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Yeah, do you reckon? I should? It's not even on
my wrist right now, because it's sitting there on charge.
I went to take it off and I was like, oh,
it's not on. It might have already happened.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah, do it? Get right right?
Speaker 2 (12:16):
That's it. There's none TIFFs, data.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
Free, data free. And you know you can get these
beautiful because I have a love of watches. You can
get these beautiful stainless steel Tiffany Die or Tiffany Face
watches in your brand blue. So you should treat yourself.
How many million dollars is they're going to pretend one
(12:39):
you can get I think, you know, Cassio be listening,
send one.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Hey Cassio.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Yeah, or you can go the role X version, depending
on you know your budget.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Okay, all right, there you go. All right, what are
the changes?
Speaker 3 (13:00):
What other changes?
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Well, what other ways do you think you get in
your way?
Speaker 3 (13:06):
Oh my goodness. So before sitting down for this, I
went for I think what the kids now are calling
a mindful walk, So just going for a walk without
any device or input. So you know, I think I
used to do that every day when I had to
walk home from school. So no headphones in, no phone call,
(13:28):
no music, no podcast, and it just really did allow,
you know, a lot of thought process to occur because
there was nothing else going on. It's like, okay, well
this is actually it's you know, it's windy, the sky
is still blue, that sun looks nice. I can smell
you know, people's fireplaces kicking in, and it was really
(13:48):
quite nice. And it was just this quite noticeable difference
there was I wasn't preoccupied with anything else other than
going on this walk. And that's probably one of the
biggest ways that I don't know if it's self sabotaged,
but definitely get in my own way. It's that I'm
(14:08):
I'm very connected to well, let's face it, my phone
probably you know, I would dare say eighty percent of
the time, whether it's scrolling, reading, whatever it is, because
you know, you've got to get all of those notifications
at the right time and all of the emails, and
what if someone messages and I don't answer, you know
quick enough. You know, when when did that ever? Like
(14:33):
when did that begin? You know, when we just kind
of became so addicted, like there's no other word for it, right,
addicted to that digital hit rather than just going for
that walk and enjoying just walking. Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
I'm the same. I've at the moment, got app blockers
that block the apps morning morning until a certain time
I don't even know at time, and then again at noon.
So there's a little bit of a window sometime mid
morning and a bit of a window mid afternoon, and
then I turn it off like it's blocked so I
(15:10):
can't I can open them, which I do by habit, Right,
you pick up the phone, I'm LIKEOK, and then it
just it opens and then it pops up on a
screen and it pretty much says piss off. Yeah, put
the phone down. What a you're doing? You're not allowed
And then it tells you account of how many times
you've tried to use the app, and you're.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
Like, oh, shut up, it's shaming you.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Yeah, can't shame me.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I didn't mean too, Isn't it just it's bizarre that
there's apps to block apps. And I've even seen now
in my scrolls, in my doom scrolls that people have
created like little physical like kind of little bricks that
are magnets and you stick them like on your fridge
or something like well away from wherever you are, and
(15:56):
you bluetooth your phone to it, and somehow like you
can link the apps to this physical device that you
don't want to access. And then if you're on to
open those apps, like let's say you're on the couch
and you're like, I'm going to check Instagram, you have
to go and scan this thing that's in another part
of the house in order to get into your app. Wow,
(16:18):
So people are making money off like genius for the
people making money off that, because we are all addicted
to it, right, but seriously, what the fuck?
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Yeah? I often think about the quality of my relationships
and the stories in my head. Because we are connected,
we're connected online, we see and we have an experience
that's not real. And I think that that exists more
than we notice. I think it's for me, it exists
more than I noticed, because I've been thinking about it
recently and going, I wonder what shift there would be
(16:50):
in a lot of my relationships and how much I
call and talk and keep in touch or reach out
and ask questions, and because like, how much do people
like to be listened to? How good is it when
someone listens to you? But when you call someone that
you've watched, you like, everyone knows what I've done. I've
put it up forty eight times on fucking Facebook. By lunchtime,
(17:13):
there's not much to listen to.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
No even even my name will say to me, So
you know, I've spoken to this person in the family
and this has happened. I'm like, yep, yep. Instead of
just being able to go, well, here's my nan, who's
you know, the oracle of the family and she wants
to share all of the stories. Well, yeah, I've seen
them all online mostly, and so now she'll go, have
you seen it on the line, or can I tell you.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
Have you seen it on the line.
Speaker 3 (17:42):
Yeah, yeah, it's very cute. And then you know there's
there's the flip side right of these devices and access.
So I just got her an Alexis speaker. So she's
she's legally blind, and I thought, what can I get
her that, you know, will help open up her world
a bit. And so she's got the Alexa speaker. She
tunes into the podcasts. But she told me that a
(18:05):
few weeks ago. Yeah, she told me a few weeks
ago that she couldn't sleep, and so she asked the
speaker to play music that her mom used to play,
and she said it was like being a kid and
they would all gather around the wireless in the lounge
room and listen to the music that her mother loved.
(18:26):
And she said it was just incredible, like I just
brought back all of these memories. And so now she
you know, she thinks Alexa is her best friend when
she listens to her and does what she's told. But yeah,
that's that's you know, I would say that that's an
absolute positive of being connected.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah, what Probably my favorite device is my Google Home
because it's just it's my alarm clock. So I don't
have to look at the phone to set the alarm clock.
I can play music on that. I wish that it
could play my insight Time app without me to That's
the only thing is at the moment, I've got these
(19:04):
beautiful meditations that I listened to before bed, and I
go straight to sleep listening it's such there's one that's
just magic for me at the moment. And so I've
got the phone in the room though, which is one
of my preferred rules, is to not have it in
the room. But because I'm going straight to sleep, I
feel okay about it. But ideally I would like to
not have it in the fucking room. But yeah, I
(19:27):
can tell Spotify to play it a meditation, but sometimes
play some funky, weird stuff. I'm like, not that one.
Play my insight Time with that dude, with the good
one that I really like that puts me to sleep.
You know when you listen to the same one over
and over and over and then one day you're like,
I've never heard this bit.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
Before because you've fallen asleep.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
Yeah, I've never heard this all the way through.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
How good is that? Yeah? I love a meditation. So
there's one on the Headspace app. And it's a guided
meditation with Eric Banner, and he has got the voice
for it. He's definitely got the yeah, absolutely straight to
sleep all right and then there should do a meditation
(20:12):
app go the buck to sleep very soothing. So what
about you like if I can flip the question.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
I reckon? For me, it's the it's the unconscious patterns.
It's catching myself out because I feel like i've I've
I latched onto the curiosity around how much I do
that for a long time, like areas where I feel
like I'm not getting ahead here or I keep making change,
(20:47):
like I keep changing jumping from thing to thing. What's
making me do that? And so I feel like it's
it's putting the pieces of those puzzled puzzles together, like
do I want what I say I want? And if
I'm the only reason I'm not achieving things because I
keep going to because I never it's not like anything's failed.
(21:10):
There's never been anything that I've kicked off with that's
been a failure. In fact, I often am surprised by
how well something might go when I have an idea
and just go with it. But then I've often looked
back and not seen it through and I've had a
story about that, but i've and I would start to
(21:31):
question my stories. I'm like, well, you say that that
sounds really humble and good, but is that true? Like
do you just do you just not feel worthy of
being successful? Do you not feel worthy of making money
from things that you create? Do you fear that you're
(21:52):
actually not that good? So if you leave it behind
before you have a chance to fail, then that was
by choice and that then no one would see you fail.
Or A question I used to always ask was if
financially when I get my finance, if once I feel
financially secure in my life, well then I can focus
(22:16):
on relationships. And like I think, deep down I'm a
bit fucking scared of those. So part of me goes, well,
let's not achieve this because that shit over there. We're
not going there. Ever.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Oh that's a big one. That's a very big one. Yeah. Yeah,
so and the same right, Like I I think I've
told you. So, I'm really forcing myself to write something
at least twice a week and publish it on my substack.
And I'm also being more I'm pushing myself to put
(22:57):
myself out there more in terms of you know, this
is even if it's just a photo of me, that
is with whatever I've written until like this, you know,
this process of being on the podcast started. I was like,
I can't do that. No one gives a shit about
what I say, nobody wants to see me. It's it's
(23:18):
that safety net, right, Like if I don't do it,
then I won't fail. But if I don't do it,
then I'll never know whether I could have succeeded. But
it's so similar, like it's yeah that if I don't
take the first step, then I don't have to worry
(23:40):
about potentially getting to the second step, which is terrifying.
So therefore I can just maybe I can think about it,
you know, because thinking about it is fine, and I
can kind of plan for it. But it's got to
be the right time to actually take the first step,
because if the first step actually goes anywhere, then well
(24:00):
that second step is it's not going to work, because
I really really am scared of that. It's yeah, it's
that loop, right, yeah, And.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
Do you wonder where it comes from? Do you have
any idea of where where it comes from? An instance
where something happened that is that that story has been
built on.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
Yes and no. Yeah, that's a fascinating one. Like I
remember so in school, for instance, I was known for
writing so short stories. I think like our school had
a short story competition and the winner would be published
in the yearbook each at the end of each year,
(24:44):
and I got it like I think five years in
a row or something, and it was just you know,
that's you know, Kelly's going to be a writer, that's
what she's going to do. And then I remember someone
and it still sticks in my mind, you know, kind
of arch nemesis at high school and she's like, well,
what are you going to do after high school? I said.
(25:05):
She's like, everyone's just gonna have kids, and I'm like, no,
I think I'm going to have a career first. And
she goes, yeah, well that's right, you think you're going
to have a career. And I was like, oh, so
there was there was always this kind of flip side
of things. There was the people that would kind of believe,
and then the people who didn't, and their voices were
(25:30):
always much louder because it's so much easier to believe
the negative than the positive. And even if it's like
you know, nine people out of ten say something that's
that's good, and then number ten says something that's not.
You're like, well, number ten's correct.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Mm yeah, I was thinking when I I don't know
when I kind of realized this, but when my parents
had we lived in a shop when I was really young,
So about three, we moved into a shop. They had
a seven day a week little like like summer Bay
little it was yeah, turn a speech a little summer Bay,
(26:08):
tazzy summer Bay and seven day week shop. And then
after that they went into My mom and dad went
into business with friends in a motel and restaurant, which
was cool for me because I got to live in
a motel room. We had live music every Saturday night,
and it was kind of cool. That business partnership turned
out sour. They turned out losing a lot of money
(26:28):
and Mum lost her house and it was shit all right,
so shit outcome. People turned to shit when you go
into business. And then a few years ago I went
into business with some blokes and invested a lot of
money and long story short, didn't work out well, lost
a lot of money, and I literally a few years
later I was like, wow, Wow, how do we repeat
(26:53):
the things. They just felt like I'd literally repeated what
they'd done and not seen it at the time.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
And I was like, fucking hell, yeah, it's do you
think it's just a known it's a known behavior, or
it's familiar, like it's a kind of muscle memory.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
I'm sure actually on that. On the idea of that
what I found weird when I moved to Melbourne as
a So I was at lateeen when I moved to
Melbourne seventeen I think seventeen or eighteen or nineteen. Clearly
have no idea. Probably should learn my lifetimeline. But anyway,
(27:38):
I moved to Melbourne and I was working in hospitality
and studying travel, and I started doing their design work.
I started doing their menus and stuff and they were
like that's really good, can you and then peep customers
that would come in. So I started doing all this
business and then I was like, oh, you should register
in ABN and make a little business. I was like
(27:59):
I remember getting going online and registering an ABN and
feeling like this tiny, little tazzy girl. I was like,
oh my god, I've got a business. And it's like
I grew up in business, like my first memories almost
were business. We lived in two businesses, and I thought
(28:22):
it was astounding that I had just gone down and
registered this Aben had a business, And that was weird
to me because I'm like, hmm, your parents rant they
were business people.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
But it's different doing it for you. It's different doing
it for yourself though, mm Like it's a pretty big
achievement to do that for yourself, and particularly after having moved,
Like did you move over here on your own?
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Yeah, well dad was here. I moved over here and
lived with him to begin with.
Speaker 3 (28:49):
Yeah, now I think, yeah, doing things on your own.
So for me, I have always been driven by people
saying that I can't do something. So it's kind of like,
tell me I can't do it, and I will dig
my heels in because I am a stubborn, determined little
(29:12):
shit and I will show you that I can do
what you said I couldn't. So even you know, people saying, oh,
you think you're going to go to UNI, so I
did twice, or you think you're going to do that?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
Do you?
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Yeah? I do, and I did, which is it's such
a it's a ridiculous contrast to then go, I don't
really have much confidence.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
That is a contrast. Yeah, what's that about?
Speaker 3 (29:46):
I think. I think, in all honesty, it's probably the
levels of anxiety that I've previously had, which I dramatically
reduced now and even even from you having these conversations
with you and great, like people are telling me you're
far more engaged when we have conversations.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Now.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
This is like with my friends and family, right, You're
more confident in what you're saying. And even just the
other day, like I was talking to my boss about
presenting at work and I said I was presenting something
to one person and my voice started cracking, and she's like,
it's only what you think because when you present, you
(30:30):
hide it so well that you're nervous, Like you come
across so confidently. And I'm like, great, maybe I should
take up poker or something, because it's certainly not how
I feel. But I don't know. Maybe now it's more
stepping into it, and maybe it's been the same for
you as well. But the idea of getting out of
your own way is just I read this thing the
(30:51):
other day. Actually this is getting back to the digital space.
But I plug a lot into chat GPT. I love it.
Think it's great use in the right way. And I said,
based on what you know about me, what do you
think should be in my mantra? And it came back
(31:12):
with this, you know, based on all of the work
that you're doing, all of the writing that you're doing,
because it's you know, it's doing all my gym workouts
for me, all this really cool stuff. And it said,
I am not becoming I am And that was like,
you know, it was like that, that's actually it's even
(31:34):
if I'm not truly ready to believe that yet, Like
I think it's something that I really am almost ready
to embrace that with all the work that I've done.
You know, I'm not becoming that person anymore. I am
that person. I can kind of step into that space.
(31:55):
But at the same time, like I'm saying that and
I'm like, oh my god, I sounds so cocky, like
it's and I'm not meaning to, but it's coming across
that way. But it's That's kind of where I'm still
at around getting out of my own way, Like when
can I get to the point of just going yep,
work is done, well, the majority of the work is done.
There still will always be work to do, but you know,
(32:17):
I can own this space quite comfortably now, I.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Reckon it's also I don't know, there seems to be
a lot coming back to I guess that idea of
using your voice, like it's when you own it, it's
when you speak it, when you show up, and so like,
at what point was that not okay?
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Oh A lot of the time, Yeah, a lot of
the time, I think. Yeah, as a kid, definitely not okay.
Kids were you know, in my household, it was like
kids were not to have voices at all. So that's
probably where I be came very introverted and you know,
(33:03):
very much in my own head. And actually it's probably
started writing, reading a lot, writing a lot, and then
even yeah, in like school, you know, the only red
head kid in primary school, the only red head kid.
The bullying was just ridiculous, and getting to high school
the same. So it was just learning to I think
(33:24):
it was a way of protecting myself.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
Hmm. I can't remember having, you know, the whole pink
hair phase and that, you know, the needing an image
to be my voice and for the to help create
the persona so people would see the image of these
chicks got bright, pink fucking hair, she must be awesome,
(33:49):
and then I just put like, ah, the show, I'll
fucking look how loud I am. And it's like, in
reality not loud. Like at the time. I remember when
I went through that stage, and you know, like I
was still in my twenties then I was working in hospitality.
I was die my hair bright pink bud jermy Dane
matching bloody, matching eye shadows and pink hair and pink
(34:12):
eye shadow or purple hair and purple eye shadow, and
you know, and I remember the first time that I
ended up d dying brown again and literally saying, I
just it just doesn't feel like I need that anymore.
And I never felt like I needed it when I
had it. I just thought that was me. I was like, oh,
this is but it was really it was because I
(34:32):
was too shy. I was too scared to really speak
up for myself, so I would make sure that I
stood out in some sort of bold way without needing
to speak out.
Speaker 3 (34:46):
So yeah, that's the complete opposite too, like I completely
understand it, but in the opposite way. And one of
my now very good friends is very similar. So I
remember the first time I at her and she talks,
just talks and talks and talks, and I was like,
who who's this check? You just won't shut up, and
(35:10):
she was as loud as I was quiet. And then
we're out one night and we both sat down and
because we were in like a bar or a club
or something like that, and she was like, I just
need to sit down, like I find this so overwhelming,
and I said, yeah, me too, and she goes, it's
the reason why she goes. Whenever I'm overwhelmed, that's when
(35:31):
I talk a lot. And I looked at her and
I'm like, whenever I'm overwhelmed, I shut down. And we
just went, oh hello, And we've been really good friends
ever since, and you know, every time we catch up
it's like this great DNM. But it was just this
chance that we both kind of said, this is how
(35:53):
I feel and this is why I present the way
that I do, and we both went same, same bit different.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
I remember the last couple of years just realizing when
I'm rushing into the gym to work, when i'd be
rushing in there and doing a workout, and you know,
like and at some point it's kind of realizing that
people there's these faces there right, and I'm in my head,
(36:23):
like I'll be, I'm thinking about stuff. I've just done
a podcast, I'm heading into the gym. I'm going to
squeeze in a quick workout, and then I've got my client,
and then I'm going to be heading back out and
I've got something else on. And so there's this and
i'd walk through and maybe not even see people. And
there's times when I would just think people would probably
be looking at you to connect. And it's not that
(36:46):
I'm not looking at them, but I'm not because I'm
actually I'm visualizing in my head or I'm talking in
my head. I'm thinking about the next plan.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
Yeah. It was like, oh, you need like people. Imagine
how that comes across. Imagine how intimidating that is.
Speaker 3 (37:07):
Absolutely, like how it's a fascinating thing. How do other
people view you y being the great overthinker. That's something
that's always on my mind. And even the other day
something happened at work and I was like, really, like,
why would why would that person do that? You know,
(37:29):
they must they don't like me. That's it. I've done
something to upset them. They don't like me. They must
think that I'm completely unapproachable. So they've gone and done
it this way, and then today I found out that
it was just they thought I wasn't there. That was it.
And I've gone, okay, so all of this this spiral
(37:51):
in my own mind of your shit, no one likes you.
You've done something to really piss that person off. You're
unapproachable because you just you know, you're so unlikable. No,
they just thought I wasn't there.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
That's like me with the whole busyness, little misindependent, bloody
carry on. It's like I'm always so busy and you know,
unapproachable for things. And then in a moment where I'll
be like, oh, I'm exhausted, and I'll and then you
get all sad and lonely, and I'll catch myself at
times thinking no one loves you, oh and just assessing
(38:30):
this and thing going you create this like that's not
that they don't love you. They just think you're fucking bit.
They don't realize you're having a night off and you're
lonely and sad right now. They think you're doing seventy
eight podcasts and training people. Yep, yeah, you know, like
times roll and it's good, like it's great to have
the self awareness to catch your thoughts and be able
(38:53):
to review when they're repetitive behaviors where it's like, ah,
I've occasionally come across thinking this way, and also I
can see how I am one hundred percent the creator
of everything that leads to that happening or being that way,
Like there is one hundred percent responsibility for how you
(39:16):
perceive that people treat you is because of the ecosystem
of your life and relationships that you create.
Speaker 3 (39:25):
Do you find that because you're aware of it though,
that you can catch it sooner?
Speaker 2 (39:33):
Yeah, yeap, And that's what I mean. I guess before
when it was like about making changes, so that used
to happen a lot because I used to be busy
all the time and then hit a wall and then
be sad as fark. And now it's less so, but
it'll be familiar. You'll catch will be like, oh, am
I still doing that. Like I've spent a lot of
time this year. I have a couple of days off
(39:55):
client free. Haven't done that for years because I'm a
lunatic and spend and make sure that I'm spending regular
time with the people who are close to me. But
it's still there will still be those little moments, and
there will just be moments of you know, it might
just be that I'm tired. It's not what I'm doing
anything wrong. Yeah, I'm working on the relationships. But yeah,
(40:17):
I catch it now, and it's just a good chance
to review. Am I still do and think? Could I
do things? Could I be a better friend? Am I
still being a bit unavailable? Or am I just tired
right now? And is it winter and the weather's miserable?
Come on Melbourne.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
And your watch is probably telling you to take a break.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Well, me and the watch, we're broken up now done,
dumped dumped dumped it.
Speaker 3 (40:45):
Yeah, no, it is. I'm noticing now as well. One
of the biggest things for me has also been to
be able to respond rather than react. And I'm noticing
that in a lot of situations where I'd be very
highly reactive, that I'm responding in very different ways, which
(41:07):
is really nice. So it's like, Okay, well that was
that was old me, and I don't need to reach
for that anymore. There's more that I can actually go to,
and there's better things that I can go to in
that moment, and that's due to all of the work
with my amazing shrink, so I actually don't need to
(41:29):
see anymore. So that's that's a big win. But yeah,
even just the conversations, so being able to talk like
this about something and you know, not not be scared
of it anymore. Just so, yeah, it's a conversation, and
you know, if someone wants to listen to it, then great,
and if it's not for them, then great, but it's
(41:52):
it's certainly helping in a lot of ways to go. Well,
if I can talk to you like this, then being
in alignment with who I am and my values means
that I should be able to talk to anyone like this.
So I'm trying to present this more to everyone and
(42:12):
I'm finding that that is giving me a lot of calm,
which is.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Really nice, realizing that the way we feel is not
a reflection of the way we are. So when I
first started the podcast, the whole idea was to develop
a skill, and so I had no kind of benchmark
(42:42):
on it's got to be this good to put it up,
and I had no plan of how to run a conversation.
I just started doing it for experience, and I decided
that every single podcast I recorded I would put up,
and there were times. There were times where I'd have
a conversation and feel horrific. In the middle. I was like, Oh,
you're so dumb, You're so not good at this, Like
(43:05):
this is not a great experience for them. And then
I would put it up and afterwards I'd listen and
it was not the way I was perceiving it. That
was just internal me. And I'm measurably different now than
i was five years ago. But I frequently have those
moments where I feel really dumb and I can't articulate
(43:31):
the way that I want to, or I'm observing as
i'm speaking and I'm listening and I'm making those judgments
and I'm like, well, this is not you know. It's
like like when people achieve. So when Craig talks about
the mountain, you're like, you climb the mountain, you get
on top of the mountain, You're like, oh, wrong, mountain.
So the mountain's not the thing. Like, we're always going
(43:52):
to feel confident or not confident, or especially if we're
aiming to grow, we're always going to feel a bit nervous.
We're going to have that in critic. We're going to
fear judgment, because that's hardwired into us as humans. We're
going to feel all those things. That doesn't mean anything.
And it was easy to digest that in the in
when I reflect on boxing, because that was a place
(44:16):
where you show up and you get punched in the
face all the time. And there were so many times
where I had a perception of performance and it was
the polar opposite. I'm hammering myself with you know, oh
this is you know, I'm so crap. I'm so crap.
And a coach would say, that's what the hell is
wrong with you? That the best you've ever performed. I
remember in twenty nineteen my coach got somebody, a girl
(44:40):
to come and spa so I'd never met her. She
comes apart. It was an utter blood bath. Some people
are just bleeders. And her nose. I hat that nose
and we were covered. It was revolting. I wore a
white top too. There was blood all over us, and
I had this I was going to this thing where
when things were un so, I sparred John Manu. He
(45:02):
hits like a frag trating He's currently number one in Australia,
so he's a weapon. And I was doing really well
against him. I was really making some progress, and then
she came in and I would just get like performance
anxiety where I would gas in that so I would
be able to feel gassed straight up, which made things
feel different because my body felt different, and I had
(45:26):
to I remember, I had to go and run a
workshop afterwards. I did. We did the sparring, however, many rounds,
and then I left and I was texting when I
arrived where I needed to be, I was texting my
coach and I'm like, I just don't know why. I
don't know why it has to be there. I was
having a big winge he and eventually he's like, what's
wrong with you?
Speaker 3 (45:45):
Mate?
Speaker 2 (45:47):
You cleaned, you wiped the floor with her, and all
I can hear from you is complaining. And I'm like,
because I didn't believe that I did a good think
because I'm going off this feeling if things were unfamiliar
and I must be crap. And like he used to
always say to me, you don't believe in yourself. And
(46:08):
I was so reliant on and he wasn't one to
ever dish out compliments, so I was like, if you
ever got a compliment, it was like, yes, this is
like a world championship in itself, But eventually I kind
of was like, I think maybe it's a bit right
with that. I was so reliant on other people's opinion
because you can't always trust how you're perceiving a situation.
(46:30):
You're in the middle of my damn, what a ship's
bit fickle sport?
Speaker 3 (46:35):
Yeah, it is kind of terrifying that you say some
people are just bleeders. That's what I took from that.
I feel exactly the same way on my mindful walk
that I had before I sat down with you. I thought,
you know, at the moment, there's people saying you're really
(46:59):
good at this, and it's like, I bet that there's
so many people that would love to hear that, and look,
I'd love hearing it, let's be honest, but they would
love this opportunity. And so I'm purposefully on my own
back now about well, what do I do with this
(47:19):
because it's such a wonderful opportunity. How do I keep
it going, how do I do it for myself? How
do I keep the momentum up? But there is still
that absolutely look I don't think it will ever go,
but that voice that's like who do you think you are? Like, really,
who do you think you are? Like it's and it's
(47:43):
that metaphorical. You know, you're just knocking yourself out all
the time because you don't believe what other people are saying.
But it's almost now that switch of well, if a
number of people are saying it, then maybe there's some
truth to it, maybe those negative voices are being outweighed,
(48:04):
but it's still reliant on those external voices, not my own.
Speaker 2 (48:11):
I caught up with someone I hadn't seen for a
few years just last week, and they made some similar
comment around look watching where I'd started and how on
what I've grown to over the last few years and
what I've developed them things I've done, and they were like,
you've just over a you know, I can't even remember
(48:31):
the terms they used, but I just kind of shocked me.
And I was like, really, because you forget that other
people are seeing a version and you're creating your own
shit story, shit little fairy tale in your head that's
doesn't have a happy ending. And it was just like, really, like,
(48:52):
it's nice, it's nice to be reminded that I don't
know that what are people seeing.
Speaker 3 (49:01):
It's lovely to be reminded, but I think it's also
getting out of that trap of needing to be reminded. Yeah.
I listened to a podcast the other day with the
CEO of Airbnb, and he's also a bodybuilder. And before
when you said that you started this because you wanted
to develop a skill, he was talking about how, you know,
(49:23):
he started Airbnb I think with a friend, and he'd
had no experience obviously in running a business like that
or being a CEO. So everything he did he treated
as just being like a rep in the gym, because
that's what he could equate it to from being a bodybuilder. Right,
So it was all just what's the next skill I
(49:47):
can develop? So rather than you know, letting those voices
take over, those voices of doubt, it's like, well, it's
just building on a skill, which is what you've just said.
And maybe that's the Maybe that's the secret. I don't know.
Maybe it's to get out of your own way, like
don't concentrate on yourself, just concentrate on the next thing
(50:09):
that you can build.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
Yeah, and I think the same could. Yeah, like that
idea of having a plan, like I was always open
to look at It wasn't just the building the skill,
it was the I value networking relationships and wow, like wow,
look at who I get to connect with for moments
that open opportunities. And because at the time I started it,
(50:34):
I was working online for the paramedics right so Ambulance
Victoria through the pandemic. When when we shut down, I
was doing their wellness program. So every day I was
myself and at yoga instructor because not everyone wants to
metaphorical punches in their face and their land room every day,
so we had some yoga as well. And Feel Good
(50:56):
Friday was what I developed, which started as the idea
of having wine or something of a Friday albough. Then
I started getting guests on. Then the idea of a
podcast came to me, and because of that I had
this gutsy little ability to reach out to people. Well.
First I had Craig Harper and Paul Taylor and a
range of and some of the brilliant paramedics that have
(51:18):
got high profiles in my grasp. So I put together
this six week panel of guests and I was like, Wow,
that's thousands of dollars worth of guess and they're just
people in my network, and so to build on that,
I got to reach out to people and say, hey,
would you come and speak to on a live call
with me to the ambulance Victoria Paramedics. So I had
(51:39):
the kind of the backing of a brand and the
idea that well, then you start to have touch points
and relationships like christ, now I have a fucking album.
Now I have an album from one of Australia's biggest
rock stars. Like that was all because of the podcast.
(52:01):
That's that's very cool. I didn't realize that's how it started.
Like that's you were doing good. You're doing lots of
that's for the particularly during the pandemic, like to be
doing something to support the people that had it the hardest. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:17):
My one of my aunts is a nurse and she
was like it was just trauma, absolute trauma. So to
be doing something for the people that were dealing with that,
like go you.
Speaker 2 (52:27):
Oh and go then, because that was such that was
soul food for me. Like that's why the pandemic felt
like a positive thing for me, because I got to connect,
I got to do good. I got to I love
paramedics like they're such beautiful souls. So I just got
to know so many good humans and have them all
of a sudden in my circle. And yeah, I probably
(52:50):
would have struggled a lot more through that time if
I didn't have that beautiful opportunity to happen.
Speaker 3 (52:58):
Yeah it was Look, it was a shit time, wasn't it.
But yeah, I think people did manage to get some
good out of it. And you know, there's been some
silver linings. As one of my friends calls them, there
was some silver linings of COVID big.
Speaker 2 (53:13):
Time, big time. We're going to wrap up because I've
got three minutes before I've got to be knocking on
the zoom door of another call. So thanks for another
great chat.
Speaker 3 (53:24):
Oh, thank you, it's wonderful. I'm going to send you
my draft plan for some interviews that I would like
to do on my own podcast. Just quietly, all.
Speaker 2 (53:37):
Right, And do you want to tell everyone where they
can find your substack?
Speaker 3 (53:42):
Kelsmith dot substack dot com.
Speaker 2 (53:45):
Go there you go go check it out, everybody.
Speaker 3 (53:48):
Thanks Kel, Thanks Tied, see ya, see.
Speaker 1 (53:51):
Ya, she said, it's now never I got fighting in
my blood.
Speaker 3 (54:00):
The lions garatry call the coast Garatue, the Gastcaritue at
cost garitry,
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