June 11, 2025 • 50 mins
In this ep, I sat down with Rod Owen, and let me tell you, this chat doesn’t pull any punches. Rod’s a former AFL player who opens up in an incredibly raw and powerful way about the abuse he endured as a kid (and in athlete), the addiction that followed him for decades, and how he hit rock bottom and clawed his way back. We talked about his footy days, the drinking culture, the drugs, the attempt he made on his own life, and the long road to recovery...
Rod’s now over six years sober, doing the deep work, and using his story to try and make a real difference to a broken system. This one’s heavy, but it’s important. Real, unfiltered, and deeply human.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm tiff. This is Roll with the Punches and we're
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(00:29):
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reach out to Mark and the team at www dot
test Artfamilylawyers dot com dot au rod Owen. Welcome to
(00:53):
Roll with the Punches.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Thank you TIF, thanks for having us.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Been introduced to you by very good made of mine
that I used to punch in the face a lot.
Shout out to Mick. How do you know Mick?
Speaker 3 (01:08):
Early days Brown Cheltenham and then we reacquainted on Messenger
Facebook all that. Yeah, those kids do that day as
we do. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
I was going to ask if you punched Mick in
the face two and then I realized as I'm asking
that you're probably not aware that I mean we used
to do boxing training together and that I used to box,
So I was like, that would be a weird thing
that I'm saying to Rod right now if he doesn't
have any context.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Well, no, I would have taken that. I didn't know
how many fights to do.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
I had fourteen fights, okay, well wait, I started at
fifty seven, went down to fort in the fifty four category,
and then back up to fifty seven again, fifty seven
fifty eight.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
That's when you haven't got a nose like mine, so
you must have.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
I don't know how many fights have you had in
the ring? Add out? I was probably thinking maybe out
would have been a more relevant question at times in
your life.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Yes, a lot, a lot, I would say, in the ring,
probably for four or five just amateur. Yeah, it was
never fit and tried to not bluff, but justdn't didn't
want to do the training. But I've got found out,
God found out pretty quick. You can run, but you
(02:42):
can't hide in there. Yeah, as you know it, as
you know. But I've got full full respect for the fighters,
that's for sure. It's the hardest training of attempted to do.
I wouldn't say I was one hundred percent committed to it.
But I just love the sport.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
I always found it fascinating the people like yourself that
could jump in there with like I was the opposite
I was. I never felt fit enough. I trained so hard,
probably so too consistently without periodization, to the point of
burnout all of the time, but never felt like I
could ever be fit enough. And fitness it was always
(03:26):
my best mate in that situation. It was like, I will,
I will stay stronger for longer.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Yeah. Yeah, that's when you're in you know, you've got
to really count on your fitness to get you through
when you're getting punched in that you know, continually punched
and body punched and everything. That's the fittest that Yeah,
the fitness really comes through.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Let's for my listeners that aren't perhaps footy fanatics, let's
introduce who you are. Give them it of a background
so they can catch up with who this pugilist on
the other end of my call is right.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
Now, a pugilist, I don't think so, Well, what do
I start. I'm Plade at Sincula in nineteen eighty three.
It's in a football club. Well, there's a lot of
a lot of history in that, but we'll get to that.
We got sacked halfway through the year, then went to
(04:31):
Frankston for the rest of that nineteen ninety and then
ended up getting signed by I went to Melbourne three year,
then went to Brisbane after that Brisbane Bears three year
under Robert Walls, and then they just walked away from
it after ninety two. And there was no money in
(04:55):
a back then but there is now there was, and
a lot of injuries and yeah, a lot of alcohol
and drugs and everything like that back then. So yeah,
I burned out by the time I started when I
was sixteen.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
I was going to say that that it's so young.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Well, at the time, I just I hated school. I
had to get out of school and I went to
a school mental Grammar that it was very strict on
education and it was a great sporting school I was.
I ended up getting a sports scholarship, but I just
hated teachers. And you know, it was on intensive report
(05:37):
cards and where if you got every class was graded
either satisfactory or unsatisfactory, so you either got an S
or A. You you got two years in the week
meant two canes. So yeah, I get away.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
With that today, would we well, yeah, the butt was
pretty well accustomed to came. Wow, this is so funny
to have conversations like this, which feels like five minutes ago,
but here stories that feel like we're talking hundreds of
years ago, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
It's like what that just.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
How rapidly life and what's acceptable changes.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
See if I can't believe I'm talking to you at
fifty eight, Like I look back on them, I'm going
back to where my career started, and it feels just
like you know, yesterday. I can remember I remember getting
the telegrams of congratulations in the mail and thinking this
(06:44):
is you know, and now it's sot with the phones
and everything like that. It's certainly changed, you know in
the last forty years.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah, telegrams are right. Hey, when did you when did
you decide on footy? Was that a childhood dream or
was that one of a few choices you'd just think
you'd have a crack?
Speaker 3 (07:06):
Oh look, yeah, putty. Back in the day, if you
can imagine, well, my father was so passionate, Sinkilda, the
whole family was. And back then it was all suburbs,
whatever suburbs. You grew up in that's basically who you followed, yea,
or who you supported. And I was in the Sekuilda
(07:28):
area in Beau Maris and I played little League from
nine years of age, played three years little League nine,
ten and eleven and that just yeah, I just had
a mad you know. It was just passionate about playing
(07:49):
fulllly unpassionate. I've got that addictive personality where I do something,
I've got to do it over and over and over again,
which has led to alcohol and drug abuse and all that.
So it's been a it's been a while ride. But
I can probably say I'm six years, seven months and
(08:09):
two days clean today.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
So congratulations. Do you so it's something you have marked
up somewhere or how do you keep track on that?
Speaker 3 (08:19):
Well, I'm in a twelve step program and it's a
it's an app where you read a daily reading every
day and it's got your your your days on there.
It's something I never thought would come to this. I
just thought i'd I'd drink myself to death like a
(08:40):
lot of my mates sitting concreting and whatnot and are
no longer with us. But yeah, I'm pretty happy. My
life's a lot, a lot easier now, although there's it's
it's not perfect.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Does it get harder before it gets easier? When you're
like in terms of there's a lot of peeling back
the layers and getting vulnerable and getting honest and feeling
things that we're probably not even where we're running from. Like,
how hard does it get when it's like I'm guessing
you had a rock bottom moment in addiction before you
(09:19):
started to get better, But from rock bottom? Does it
get harder before it gets easier?
Speaker 3 (09:25):
Wow, that's a great question. Yeah, rock Bottom was tying
a belt around my neck and hanging off the door
and that was yeah, and then crying for never cried
like that after my old mandt really opened up. Yeah,
(09:48):
the rock Bottom was bad.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Was that a thought? Was that thought and decision something
that seminal? Was it something that came quite quickly and
almost I felt like a different entity making choices on behalf
of your life?
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Tiff to be perfically honest. I think I've thought about
suicide a lot of my life. I mean, we get
to the nitty gritty. I was my lasted all my
school life by perpetrators at Bomarris Primary School, then went
(10:24):
to men's own grammar and the same stuff happened, yeah,
and then ended up you know how people might ask
why did you go and play you know, school life,
but then at little league training had happened as well.
The same perpetrator used to coach, used to be our
library teacher, our sports coach at Bamara's Primary and then
(10:48):
drive us to kild A little. I was just it's
since my story came out with Russell Jackson in twenty
twenty one, they've had a Bomris Primary School government inquiry
Board of Inquiry. I think I don't know the exact figures,
(11:10):
but I would say there'd be over a thousand kids
that have come forward with this. I think what would
have happened if I hadn't come forward with anyone else
made an impact. I'm not sure, but I'm just so
relieved that I didn't well, that the pin of the
belt didn't go in the hole because it would have
(11:32):
been over So it's amazing and and it was rock bottom.
Now I look back and there's only two people that
stuck by me throughout that rock bottom experience, and that
was my beautiful fiance Kylie and my youngest daughter Zoey,
who those two would come down to the to the
(11:55):
rehab on a Sunday, so I do jail time on
the Sunday and those two stuck by me, and from
there went from yeah, we've got a great bond.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
Is it in the moments after that, after that attempt
where you realize you've survived, was there relief, fear, anger, confusion?
Like what was your experience.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
For all of the above, It was just the brain.
Since being in recovery, I've learned I do a lot
ice spars every day, cold showers. The whole mind was
just just going one hundred miles an hour and I
couldn't stop the negative thoughts and you know all that
(12:46):
going on. And I've done a transcendental meditation course where
meditator twice a day. So my whole life has changed
and slowed down. Where when I was and as I'd
wake up, I'd drink, have a line, a line of
drink whatever, just to keep going. And in the end,
(13:07):
it's progression until you know, we hit rock bottom. And
there's been so many that have knocked them so committed suicide.
I should say that mates of mine who you know,
who were molested by this group of people. I don't.
I don't know, I don't want it's called anyway dogs
(13:28):
and I won't go any further with it. But there's
Aye and we lost one just before Christmas who was
just couldn't get off the couch. It was just that
you know, drug, drugs and alcohol, and he was abused
(13:49):
a little league and everything like that and then killed
himself last assemble, I just found out. So it's just
an homy going, yeah, well it's I don't know, it's
it's hard to talk about. I freeze up and all that. So, yeah,
that's that's trauma.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
When's the first time you and to whom was the
first time you spoke it out loud? And prior to that,
was it something that you acknowledged and admitted to yourself
or you suppressed and put into a black box in
the back of your mind.
Speaker 3 (14:27):
We suppressed I told I told some I told a
person and I wasn't believed and then it sekilled her.
I told my dad when we were walking into under thirteen.
So they had junior development squad and all the kids
went down there, and as I was walking in, I said, Dad,
(14:48):
what if what if this Briggs is here? All right?
Don't worry something while I'm alive, no one will touch you.
And he died two years later. Yeah, and that's grief
because I had a solicten it. Tell me in a case,
he goes you, being molested wasn't as bad as you're
(15:11):
losing your father, And of course what do you make
he goes nah. You know, he was trying to tell me,
you know that being molested wasn't as bad as losing
your father, and I went, well, yeah, one's traum or,
one's grief m hm so's.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
And also in losing your father, you lost a protective mechanism,
that safety exactly.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
And the only reason I stayed was because he loves
and killed mm hmm, which you know, back then, loyalty
was was huge. You know, someone gave you, you know,
their word that meant something. Now that's you know, a
contract's not even worth the paper it's written on, and
(15:59):
your word does made much like it used to. So yeah,
it's anyway, we're trying to get to the bottom of
of HM.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Told I didn't believe you. At what point did you
open up and feel heard and believed? And then and
then at what point were you ready to go public
with this? Because it's too huge.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Oh well I am. That's the drinking and the first
time that I felt because I always thought I was
growing up different, you know, bern abused and all that.
You didn't want to tell anyone for fear of being
branded back then and gay whatever, you know, which bullying
(16:50):
was huge back then currently still is now. So when
I reached some Kilda, I started training with Saint Kila
Seniors at fifteen because dad was dying of cancer and
he just wanted me to see me train. And after
(17:10):
the Christmas break we finished training and we all got
on the beers and that was the first time I
realized I was an alcoholic, because looking back, I had
five or six cans and just couldn't just loved it
because my confidence grew and all that being a fifteen
year old trying to mix with twenty two, twenty three,
(17:30):
twenty four year olds, and then no one told me
to stop, so I I thought, wow, this is good.
And then the last practice match of March, so that
was Christmas time eighty two, and then we rolled into
eighty three. The last practice match, I kicked seven goals
(17:52):
in three quarters against Collingwood and that was and the
old man died January thirty one, January sorry, January three
in eighty three, wow, just before that, So he didn't
see he played. I kicked the first game I played.
Must have been looking down on him.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I was going to say, do you feel like that.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
The higher power? He's my higher power who I always
pray to and you know, guide me. So he must
have had a tough job for those forty years of addiction.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
I was going to say, what was your what was
your connection with him throughout the tough times and then
throughout the better times.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
Well, the connection now is a lot, a lot more loving.
You know, I jump around when I'm talking about stuff.
But so sixteen I started playing league football, and by
thirty I was in jail for assault. Wow. And no one,
(18:58):
no one could put the the pieces together. You know.
I've always only went back as far as saying it
was the death of my father at sixteen and then
some killed her duty of care and blah blah blah
and give me drugs to play and all that bullshit.
(19:18):
And I would never go back to being molester or
anything like that. But sin killed A football club are
a pedophile organization, as I've really I've got a list
of all of them and what took place and everything.
I just needed to get to court and then after that,
(19:39):
I'll you know, embarrass them and just tell it as
it was, as it is, you know, in the AFL
keep protecting them and all that. So it's amazing what
they get away with or got away with.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, yeah, it's enormous mhm.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
But they didn't give a fuck they honestly, looking back,
I would have, you know, so my dad, I would
have done anything, you know, for the Red, White and Black.
And then you know, halfway through ninety ninety, I was
having big dramas with the coach and in without I
(20:22):
wasn't doing the training. I was, you know, I was
an addict. I just couldn't say no, you know, and
I had friends obviously, hangers on, go on, let's go,
let's party, let's party, you know, okay, And then you know,
I wasn't doing the training and I went there.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
And you know, I told him I'm an alcoholic and
I'm addicted to speed and shattermines and all that, and
they go, oh, go home and tell your mom and
we'll have a meeting about your future.
Speaker 3 (20:57):
But mom knew what was going gone as mothers do
with their sons and went on, she goes, just can't
just relax, you know, everything will be all right. They
come come in and f on the door and say
we're sacking. No, that was it. I said, I'll get
the fuck out of the house, and that was it.
(21:20):
They dragged you out of school, but I was willing,
you know, I wanted to get out because being molested
and gained yeah, everything like that. And then this club.
So that that was when the loops nineteen ninety. So
(21:42):
I was twenty four through twenty four, eight years. Yeah,
managed sixty sixty games in that eight years and had
a hell of a lot of injuries and whatnot. It
was a pretty wild world role.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Yeah, and talk a bit about like the road to addiction.
How turbulent was it, how quick was it? How at
what point did you know you were you were in
real trouble with it.
Speaker 3 (22:19):
Wind So when you can look back and leaving school
at fifteen, I had no trade or no white collar
job or anything like that was never going to be.
So I found a job where you're allowed to drink
at work back in the day, and that was concrete,
(22:41):
you know. I just wheel the barrows in of conk
and you wash tools and just get the beers for
the boys, and that was it. Yeah, it's progressive addiction
as far as I know about it. You're born, it's born.
There's some brain stimulant or something in it. We just
(23:06):
can't say no, you've got to once, not enough in
a thousands, or maybe not enough, I'm going to you know,
I just became Wow, you'd fall asleep or flake it
or get knocked out or whatever, and then you know,
straight away my intention was yet back on it, get
(23:27):
back on it. And that that was pretty much pretty
much from Wow, from when I was at Brisbane. Yeah,
when I got to the Gold Coast, it was the start,
real start. I mean Saint Kilda was bad, but I
(23:48):
at Melbourne. I managed to stay off everything for from
the pre season when I did my knee again in
round nine and then the old the old devil on
your shoulders say just have one, yeah, one led to
(24:11):
right on. So yeah, look, anyone who's got who's got
the personality like I have, just there is help out there.
Twelve step program or I went into a rehab and
that was the greatest thing I didn't learn. Did the
(24:32):
twelve steps of recovery and yeah, I'm great. I'm forever
grateful for that program.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Yeah, and what was that the first I guess, big
attempt was that the first chosen path, like okay, I'm
going to go do twelve steps or with the other
attempts of I'm getting clean, I'm getting.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
I tried many many times, and then I thought it
was a moral failing on my path, like a week
so and say yeah and that, but it just this,
you know, it's compulsive, obsessive. You know recently, you know,
I make months off gambling, and that's that's brilliant. I mean,
(25:17):
it's it's funny when you When I first started, all
I wanted to do. All I thought I had a
problem with was gambling. Sorry it was alcohol and drugs.
But after getting clean and sober, gambling was just an escape, escapeism.
And then that got a big problem. I hate saying
(25:42):
it was. I wouldn't admit it. That's the thing you
try and justify it, everything going on and whatnot, and yeah,
just money would just go out now I look at it.
But yeah, I've learned now that's the main thing, learning slowly.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Yeah, what do you need from the people, Well, I
guess through your experience. What the people around you that
that were pivotal to your recovery, what did they do well?
What did you need from them? And I guess maybe
the tough love version and the and the.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
Yeah, well I needed that that circuit breakout. And that's
what rehab did. I went into a into a one
month dry out, the detox environment. It doesn't work for everyone.
I love this dream of your main rehabit. It's it's
(26:45):
pretty strict, but it's more based around you know, meditation, yoga,
cold showers, a bit of training, hm, that sort of stuff.
And I'd love that can up. But I've drifted off again.
But the ice fas for me have saved my life
(27:09):
in transcendental meditation two things, because I just couldn't could
not stop thinking. And as it says in the Power
and Now, the mind is a magnificent tool if used correctly. Yeah,
but we only use five percent and I don't even
(27:29):
think I used that. Yeah, if you can switch it
off and whatnot and just meditate for twenty minutes just
gives that circuit breaker and it's just so relaxing for
someone who's got that addictive personality.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
It seems like a I did a transcendental meditation course
years ago, and I remember how good it felt once
I'd gotten into it. It seems look for someone like yourself,
that's that real thrill, take a competitive like you're an athlete,
You're doing all the things. Was it hard to get into?
(28:11):
Was it hard to start the practice? Like sitting down
and shouting out for twenty minutes and letting the thoughts
just be there?
Speaker 3 (28:18):
Well, learning meditations, it doesn't just come naturally when you
when you're first learning. But I did the same, went
to a course and I didn't really I didn't know
what to expect. But you know the guy was instant
Kilda Road. Yeah, yeah, level eighteen or something, Yes, yes,
(28:43):
what was Richard Richard Alders, But yeah it was fat well,
it was the best course of done mar Rishi gogi.
And that's as I said, that just enables me to
stop the negative thoughts going in. Like there's times now
(29:04):
where I say, in moments, why don't you just have
one and then you know what I've learned now and
all that it's you can't you can't know, And I
wouldn't I wouldn't want to go back to the right
I was back then. What the steps have taught me
(29:28):
is just opened eyes to ourself. Wish I was for
my children, for my my ex, for my family and
all that. And that's one thing that we are that
we don't see until we get claim is how fucked
up we were self centered and and all that. But
(29:53):
on the flip side of that, it just makes me
aware of how fucked up some killed a football club
up and how the a f L. I just they
manipulate the public. Yeah, I'm not a fan of the
a f L. As you can a.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Little bit shining through there. I've always I always grapple
with the idea with so many things. And I mean
I had an experience somewhat similar to yours throughout my childhood,
(30:38):
and so that idea that so many people have, and
that's and it's people like yourself speaking up and speaking
out that hopefully will change the world. But it's you know,
that idea of money and power and status allows organizations
(30:58):
or situations to just be swept under the rug. And
it's so complex and it's so hard to fight. And
I'm just to see someone like yourself put yourself out there,
like I'm really proud, and I know how hard that
would be how long have you? When did you? When
(31:21):
did you kind of open up publicly and start talking
about this?
Speaker 3 (31:27):
That was all the steps, doing the steps and getting
clean and a good made of mind who got into recovery.
He said, if you're going to bring out your story,
you've got to get clean and sober. Yeah, and that
(31:47):
was great words. But actually sitting down and reading the
literature and realizing that you're not alone. Your story is
not unique. Yeah. Not everyone's been lived a life that
you or me have. We've all got our own journey,
(32:07):
and my journey is what it is. Until my story
came out, it was twenty twenty one, and a good
maid of mind, Luke Waders wanted to do the story
and even before, but I wasn't ready. It's funny how
the life just things happened for a reason and whatnot.
(32:31):
And I said, no, I'm not ready anyway. That was
twenty ten or so twenty one. Russell Jackson just did
a story on Robbie Muller about his base. You know
that the club will do nothing for him, and he's
not in a good way. Robbie, I'd love him, and
you know I read that story and it was so
(32:54):
well articulated, and you know, I loved the story itself. Iran,
I said, would you be interested in doing a story
on me? He goes, I've been trying to find you
for the last year or two. Well, so let's meet.
So Russell came up, Uh, Frankston Boy Funky tamp and
(33:19):
came up and you know, got a great rapport and yeah,
I trusted him, you know with the story that. Yeah,
it's so you know, I've kept so much still, you know,
so much more is coming out, but you know that
I've and that's with trauma that my psychiatrist is like,
(33:43):
you'll keep bringing up stuff the more I don't know
if it's the cleaner, the cleaner you get, the more
clarity all that. But in the subconscious and I keep
reading you know, yeah, what's his name, Eckart Toll books.
Have you read? The Magic in the Mind is a
book that I read as well, and he talks about
(34:05):
the voice in your subconscious and that's what basically, you know,
when I was rock bottom, you know this, this voice
said get up and tell your story week so and so,
and you know that's all why the pin didn't go
in the belt and cut my circulation off in five
(34:27):
seconds and all that. Yeah, and I didn't. I heard
some mates of mine go through the claim. Earlier in
two thousand and in my court case, I told the
judge then Betty King, that I was abused, but she said,
you're not here for unless being molested. You're here from
(34:51):
the assault. And that was the last and not a word.
And Betty King's best friend, this Jack Rush, defended my
perpetrator in the case against these blokes, you know, the judge,
the lawyers all, I don't get me started on that,
but it all h secured.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
I'm so sorry.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
Yeah, well, we're trying to do something about it. I mean,
I can't change the past, you know, I can't. It
should never have happened. He got moved from It's like
the Catholic church. These teachers get moved from school to
school back in the day, and so many children back
(35:38):
in the day should never have been molested. And then
we wonder why Australia is falling to pieces. There you
look at my life and you know Oxy Conton's heroin
which I didn't know, but you know, putting a needle
in the arm, that's the only thing that saved me.
That I never did it. And this is why they
(35:58):
don't say eighty percent of yeah people in jail have
been molested or sexually abused, or yeah, it's just how
do you stop it? He's got the balls to you know,
bring in the death penalty maybe, or yeah, it's something's
(36:21):
going to change. If nothing changes, nothing changed. And the
way this country has declined in my forty years, that
you know, from when I was sixteen to now, it's
just becoming it's not a very good place to live in.
I mean, I still love it, but it's you go
out to a shopping center on a Sunday and you
(36:42):
know you've got kids, machetes, Like how I have a
fist fight of your week? Dogs? What do you have
to cut people up and kill them?
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Like we're in a public place. Why was it in
such a public place.
Speaker 3 (36:54):
Well, because they knew they'd get stopped. They wanted to
kill each other. Just say hey, yeah, stick one in
me and stick one in you, or something like yeah,
it's well you shouldn't laugh because it's just one's fifteen
and sixteen. If you want to chose some carriage, jump
in the ring, you know, and put the gloves on
and punch the shit out of each other or UFC
(37:17):
some grappling and choke each other out. But no, they're cowards.
They use notes. I don't know where that came from,
but that's the way I feel because I've got young kids.
You know someone stabbed there. Well, well you just don't
want to think about the world's getting crazy tiffed.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
I think it is. You know it was it was
a Saturday afternoon there was a shooting and carry on
in South Melbourne, and then it was the next night
that the machines and I was just like, what is
going on?
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (37:49):
And then it takes well you know that conversation around
how long it takes to ban a machete. I'm like, well,
hang on, what is what are we needing machetes for? Anyway?
What is the use of a machine in this country?
Just been it? How hard can it be? Why we've
got fucking massive weapons like that slice people up?
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Well, I don't want to go down that path with
some Paul Enhands and you know had it right a
few years ago. I think you know who knows we
can't keep Australia our little island anymore. It's a multicultural society.
(38:28):
We live in and you know that's great, but you
know they want to carry machetes. They can and do
it back in their homeland.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
And I find it, you know, it's frustrating to sit
in a space where you see like everyone has an
experience and a trauma of whatever, you know, and then
some people become perpetrators.
Speaker 3 (38:50):
But it's like.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
The ones who are becoming perpetrators seem to be slipping
through the traps and not held to a count, and
then the ones who are slipping through a different trap
are easier to hold to account. It's like, oh, you've
got a drug addiction. You're the problem here. You're you're
the problem. Let's put you in jail. You've punched someone
in the face, And it's really, well, what about the
(39:15):
people over here that are quietly causing a ripple effective
chaos that is far far more serious than one person
getting punched in the face who probably deserved it.
Speaker 3 (39:26):
Well, you know, no doubt. You know what I read
it picked up the Herald's son a couple of weeks ago,
probably a month ago, and it said better fhile living
next door to school, and they're allowed now not to
be ankle brokes. No ankle bracelet, and I just this
(39:51):
is a joke. We went into the in the parliament
to get this bill passed that volunteers can be held
accountable for their action, and this liberal corec stood up
and board against the bill getting passed. So he was
(40:13):
basically defending pedophiles. And doesn't matter what his name is,
it's up but the young YOUNGSPI, I know, I felt
like standing up and gay, yeah if you had kids.
Obviously haven't got kids, but you know it's right pedophilia
(40:33):
through you know, up there, up in the courts, in
the police, everywhere. It's you know, wherever I said it,
wherever children are, there will be pedophiles. Lok hmm. That's
that's how bad it's Scottlde, you know since yeah, my
(40:55):
story came out as I said, thousand thou around southeastern
So but it's let alone all that. I think it's
up in ben Ballarat where hell did all and Grisdale
and in the church. It's surrendous.
Speaker 2 (41:11):
With the work you're doing. What what's the ideal outcome
for you? Short and long term?
Speaker 3 (41:20):
Oh short, I just got to stay clean and saber
every day, one day at a time. And long term
i'd love the opportunity to speak to speak to school
kids about how life can one day be going fine
(41:46):
and then you know, alcohol and drugs come into your
life and they can fall apart pretty quick. You know
the effects of gambling, lived experience. I suppose you know,
to get it out there. Yeah, I can help one
and that's you know, that's enough. But I'd love to
(42:09):
I'd love the opportunity to just to try and help.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
When you reflect back at any stage of your life,
can you identify maybe a time, a message and the
person to deliver that message that could have shifted your path?
Speaker 3 (42:37):
Quick answers no, because this is what being my lester does.
It took away my yeah, my soul, just the pain,
the shock, you know, I just froze.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
This is my gripe with a lot of the crap
people carry on with resilience these days because I learned
and when I started boxing at twenty nine, my memories
started coming out to the surface and I was like,
there's all of this, all of these accolades for getting
punched in the face and it doesn't hurt, and doing
(43:13):
the thing and doing the hard thing, and it's like,
this is dissociation. I can't really feel those punches because
I am going into a state of dissociation because I
learned how to do that when I was a kid,
because that kept me safe. It was a bit like
the same thing. So I think there's not enough context
around our behavior and our understanding of what looks like
(43:33):
courage and resilience, but what might actually be some coping mechanism.
We're not even where we're doing, and then we celebrate
that with a few beers. We feel good, and then
a few years down the road, here we are.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
Yeah. I don't know about I just loved the training.
I didn't look at it that way that I just
loved it. I love training hard, like I'd go and
have whatever, thirty forty beers and bombs and whatever, and
then the next night belonging myself on the track, stewing
(44:11):
it just the pain to feel that pain that I'd
felt at nine ten eleven, and the freezing and then
you know, I've broken bones and punching things when I
get drunk, just I'd come out sideways my whole and
then people would go, oh, he's just off his head. Now,
(44:35):
what was up in the subconscious trying to hide it all? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,
now I can. I can go and meditate and chill out.
And now I'm in bed. I'm in bed at eight o'clock. Yeah,
I'm up at four in the morning. But I loved it. Yeah,
(44:59):
I love that. Then you go for a walk or
do something, you know, do some sort of training that
allows me to to do it because I haven't worked
for eight years. I was concreting back in him. Made
a hip replacement. And that's what brought out there, and
that's what brought on the rock bottom was the painkillers.
(45:20):
Here's the mentality of being at Addie. I thought, I'm
still alive. I'm fifty one. I've drunk all my life
of smoked, you know, bombs and whatever and bet on
coke and everything else that can't kill me. Now I
have a crack at the end. N an Oxicon. Wow,
that's what killed over twenty million Americans. Wow, the oxycont
(45:46):
Have you seen that movie? No, it's about it's about
the family who made oxy Cone. M hmm.
Speaker 2 (46:01):
Wow, okay, so on Netflix.
Speaker 3 (46:03):
Yeah it was. I think it's painful two years ago. Wow,
it's an eye opener. The government knew how bad it
was killing people, and they said, we're making too much
money out of it. Shut up to the authorities. It's
(46:25):
a joke.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
Yeah, yeah, I just looked it up. That's going to
it's gone on my watch list.
Speaker 3 (46:30):
It's it's an I. But that's the guy who dies
at the end of think. I was pretty much. I
was very close, but I just kept swallowing it. But
that's addiction, you know.
Speaker 2 (46:46):
And in the in the midst of that, do you
have an awareness that you're walking a fine line between
life and death with what you're consuming, or you don't
even there's no admit of that.
Speaker 3 (46:58):
I didn't care back in the day, and that's been
selfish because I had two beautiful young girls growing up
and I prefer to stay out drinking and drugging with yeah,
with mates, you know, and didn't give us ship about
women who was just drinking, drugging and partying all that.
(47:23):
And I didn't care if I lived or died. Now,
but that's that was the pain I was hiding, you know,
And the grace of God, you know, the story came
out and it's it's made a change. Well, I hope
it continues to make a change and people held accountable
(47:44):
and justices served. Yeah. So yeah, well I'll mentioned it
again so killed in the a f L tour An
Education Department. Yeah, it's incredible, much aim. Of course, I.
Speaker 2 (48:03):
Love the work you're doing. I love the I love
the I guess the journey you're sharing your own journey,
and that the ability to impact other people. How can
we how can my listeners follow find you? Help you?
You know, is there anything you would like to promote
(48:24):
or anywhere you'd like them to go.
Speaker 3 (48:27):
I'm just waiting for a court case too, to vicarious
liability bill to get past and and that, and then
who knows I need. I really want to open a
rehab to help you addicts, and you know, and just
(48:48):
try and change people's if they want to. Not everyone,
not everyone wants to, and I fully understand, but I
don't know. I can be contacted. I lead my email
with you if and whatever, if they want to reach out,
we'll see what we can do. I can direct them
(49:09):
wherever you know they feel where they're at at this
stage of the addiction, and just know that there's help
out there. Any twelve step DNA is what I did. Aa'
is another one. There's ga gambling, all sorts of help
(49:29):
out there. Yeah, amazing, mate.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Well everyone you heard that. If you want to get
in touch, reach out and I will introduce you.
Speaker 3 (49:39):
Rod.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
Thank you so much for coming on the show for
a chat. It's been an absolute pleasure. I've really enjoyed
speaking with.
Speaker 3 (49:46):
You, saying, Tiff, was that an hour? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (49:50):
It goes quick, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (49:51):
Well, I didn't think I had an hour of chat
in me.
Speaker 2 (49:54):
I reckon, You've got I reckon. You could chat away
for quite some time. It's been in it barely enjoy
it being a pretty shitty topic to discuss. It has
been a real pleasure to speak to you and hear
a bit about your story and mostly you recover and
work you're doing.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
So thank you, Thank you for having me to.
Speaker 1 (50:13):
She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 3 (50:23):
It
She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm tiff. This is Roll with the Punches and we're
turning life's hardest hits into wins. Nobody wants to go
to court, and don't. My friends at test Art Family
Lawyers know that they offer all forms of alternative dispute resolution.
Their team of Melbourne family lawyers have extensive experience in
(00:29):
all areas of family law to facto and same sex couples,
custody and children, family violence and intervention orders, property settlements
and financial agreements. Test Art is in your corner, so
reach out to Mark and the team at www dot
test Artfamilylawyers dot com dot au rod Owen. Welcome to
(00:53):
Roll with the Punches.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Thank you TIF, thanks for having us.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Been introduced to you by very good made of mine
that I used to punch in the face a lot.
Shout out to Mick. How do you know Mick?
Speaker 3 (01:08):
Early days Brown Cheltenham and then we reacquainted on Messenger
Facebook all that. Yeah, those kids do that day as
we do. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
I was going to ask if you punched Mick in
the face two and then I realized as I'm asking
that you're probably not aware that I mean we used
to do boxing training together and that I used to box,
So I was like, that would be a weird thing
that I'm saying to Rod right now if he doesn't
have any context.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Well, no, I would have taken that. I didn't know
how many fights to do.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
I had fourteen fights, okay, well wait, I started at
fifty seven, went down to fort in the fifty four category,
and then back up to fifty seven again, fifty seven
fifty eight.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
That's when you haven't got a nose like mine, so
you must have.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
I don't know how many fights have you had in
the ring? Add out? I was probably thinking maybe out
would have been a more relevant question at times in
your life.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Yes, a lot, a lot, I would say, in the ring,
probably for four or five just amateur. Yeah, it was
never fit and tried to not bluff, but justdn't didn't
want to do the training. But I've got found out,
God found out pretty quick. You can run, but you
(02:42):
can't hide in there. Yeah, as you know it, as
you know. But I've got full full respect for the fighters,
that's for sure. It's the hardest training of attempted to do.
I wouldn't say I was one hundred percent committed to it.
But I just love the sport.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
I always found it fascinating the people like yourself that
could jump in there with like I was the opposite
I was. I never felt fit enough. I trained so hard,
probably so too consistently without periodization, to the point of
burnout all of the time, but never felt like I
could ever be fit enough. And fitness it was always
(03:26):
my best mate in that situation. It was like, I will,
I will stay stronger for longer.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Yeah. Yeah, that's when you're in you know, you've got
to really count on your fitness to get you through
when you're getting punched in that you know, continually punched
and body punched and everything. That's the fittest that Yeah,
the fitness really comes through.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Let's for my listeners that aren't perhaps footy fanatics, let's
introduce who you are. Give them it of a background
so they can catch up with who this pugilist on
the other end of my call is right.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
Now, a pugilist, I don't think so, Well, what do
I start. I'm Plade at Sincula in nineteen eighty three.
It's in a football club. Well, there's a lot of
a lot of history in that, but we'll get to that.
We got sacked halfway through the year, then went to
(04:31):
Frankston for the rest of that nineteen ninety and then
ended up getting signed by I went to Melbourne three year,
then went to Brisbane after that Brisbane Bears three year
under Robert Walls, and then they just walked away from
it after ninety two. And there was no money in
(04:55):
a back then but there is now there was, and
a lot of injuries and yeah, a lot of alcohol
and drugs and everything like that back then. So yeah,
I burned out by the time I started when I
was sixteen.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
I was going to say that that it's so young.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Well, at the time, I just I hated school. I
had to get out of school and I went to
a school mental Grammar that it was very strict on
education and it was a great sporting school I was.
I ended up getting a sports scholarship, but I just
hated teachers. And you know, it was on intensive report
(05:37):
cards and where if you got every class was graded
either satisfactory or unsatisfactory, so you either got an S
or A. You you got two years in the week
meant two canes. So yeah, I get away.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
With that today, would we well, yeah, the butt was
pretty well accustomed to came. Wow, this is so funny
to have conversations like this, which feels like five minutes ago,
but here stories that feel like we're talking hundreds of
years ago, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
It's like what that just.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
How rapidly life and what's acceptable changes.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
See if I can't believe I'm talking to you at
fifty eight, Like I look back on them, I'm going
back to where my career started, and it feels just
like you know, yesterday. I can remember I remember getting
the telegrams of congratulations in the mail and thinking this
(06:44):
is you know, and now it's sot with the phones
and everything like that. It's certainly changed, you know in
the last forty years.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah, telegrams are right. Hey, when did you when did
you decide on footy? Was that a childhood dream or
was that one of a few choices you'd just think
you'd have a crack?
Speaker 3 (07:06):
Oh look, yeah, putty. Back in the day, if you
can imagine, well, my father was so passionate, Sinkilda, the
whole family was. And back then it was all suburbs,
whatever suburbs. You grew up in that's basically who you followed, yea,
or who you supported. And I was in the Sekuilda
(07:28):
area in Beau Maris and I played little League from
nine years of age, played three years little League nine,
ten and eleven and that just yeah, I just had
a mad you know. It was just passionate about playing
(07:49):
fulllly unpassionate. I've got that addictive personality where I do something,
I've got to do it over and over and over again,
which has led to alcohol and drug abuse and all that.
So it's been a it's been a while ride. But
I can probably say I'm six years, seven months and
(08:09):
two days clean today.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
So congratulations. Do you so it's something you have marked
up somewhere or how do you keep track on that?
Speaker 3 (08:19):
Well, I'm in a twelve step program and it's a
it's an app where you read a daily reading every
day and it's got your your your days on there.
It's something I never thought would come to this. I
just thought i'd I'd drink myself to death like a
(08:40):
lot of my mates sitting concreting and whatnot and are
no longer with us. But yeah, I'm pretty happy. My
life's a lot, a lot easier now, although there's it's
it's not perfect.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Does it get harder before it gets easier? When you're
like in terms of there's a lot of peeling back
the layers and getting vulnerable and getting honest and feeling
things that we're probably not even where we're running from. Like,
how hard does it get when it's like I'm guessing
you had a rock bottom moment in addiction before you
(09:19):
started to get better, But from rock bottom? Does it
get harder before it gets easier?
Speaker 3 (09:25):
Wow, that's a great question. Yeah, rock Bottom was tying
a belt around my neck and hanging off the door
and that was yeah, and then crying for never cried
like that after my old mandt really opened up. Yeah,
(09:48):
the rock Bottom was bad.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Was that a thought? Was that thought and decision something
that seminal? Was it something that came quite quickly and
almost I felt like a different entity making choices on behalf
of your life?
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Tiff to be perfically honest. I think I've thought about
suicide a lot of my life. I mean, we get
to the nitty gritty. I was my lasted all my
school life by perpetrators at Bomarris Primary School, then went
(10:24):
to men's own grammar and the same stuff happened, yeah,
and then ended up you know how people might ask
why did you go and play you know, school life,
but then at little league training had happened as well.
The same perpetrator used to coach, used to be our
library teacher, our sports coach at Bamara's Primary and then
(10:48):
drive us to kild A little. I was just it's
since my story came out with Russell Jackson in twenty
twenty one, they've had a Bomris Primary School government inquiry
Board of Inquiry. I think I don't know the exact figures,
(11:10):
but I would say there'd be over a thousand kids
that have come forward with this. I think what would
have happened if I hadn't come forward with anyone else
made an impact. I'm not sure, but I'm just so
relieved that I didn't well, that the pin of the
belt didn't go in the hole because it would have
(11:32):
been over So it's amazing and and it was rock bottom.
Now I look back and there's only two people that
stuck by me throughout that rock bottom experience, and that
was my beautiful fiance Kylie and my youngest daughter Zoey,
who those two would come down to the to the
(11:55):
rehab on a Sunday, so I do jail time on
the Sunday and those two stuck by me, and from
there went from yeah, we've got a great bond.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
Is it in the moments after that, after that attempt
where you realize you've survived, was there relief, fear, anger, confusion?
Like what was your experience.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
For all of the above, It was just the brain.
Since being in recovery, I've learned I do a lot
ice spars every day, cold showers. The whole mind was
just just going one hundred miles an hour and I
couldn't stop the negative thoughts and you know all that
(12:46):
going on. And I've done a transcendental meditation course where
meditator twice a day. So my whole life has changed
and slowed down. Where when I was and as I'd
wake up, I'd drink, have a line, a line of
drink whatever, just to keep going. And in the end,
(13:07):
it's progression until you know, we hit rock bottom. And
there's been so many that have knocked them so committed suicide.
I should say that mates of mine who you know,
who were molested by this group of people. I don't.
I don't know, I don't want it's called anyway dogs
(13:28):
and I won't go any further with it. But there's
Aye and we lost one just before Christmas who was
just couldn't get off the couch. It was just that
you know, drug, drugs and alcohol, and he was abused
(13:49):
a little league and everything like that and then killed
himself last assemble, I just found out. So it's just
an homy going, yeah, well it's I don't know, it's
it's hard to talk about. I freeze up and all that. So, yeah,
that's that's trauma.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
When's the first time you and to whom was the
first time you spoke it out loud? And prior to that,
was it something that you acknowledged and admitted to yourself
or you suppressed and put into a black box in
the back of your mind.
Speaker 3 (14:27):
We suppressed I told I told some I told a
person and I wasn't believed and then it sekilled her.
I told my dad when we were walking into under thirteen.
So they had junior development squad and all the kids
went down there, and as I was walking in, I said, Dad,
(14:48):
what if what if this Briggs is here? All right?
Don't worry something while I'm alive, no one will touch you.
And he died two years later. Yeah, and that's grief
because I had a solicten it. Tell me in a case,
he goes you, being molested wasn't as bad as you're
(15:11):
losing your father, And of course what do you make
he goes nah. You know, he was trying to tell me,
you know that being molested wasn't as bad as losing
your father, and I went, well, yeah, one's traum or,
one's grief m hm so's.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
And also in losing your father, you lost a protective mechanism,
that safety exactly.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
And the only reason I stayed was because he loves
and killed mm hmm, which you know, back then, loyalty
was was huge. You know, someone gave you, you know,
their word that meant something. Now that's you know, a
contract's not even worth the paper it's written on, and
(15:59):
your word does made much like it used to. So yeah,
it's anyway, we're trying to get to the bottom of
of HM.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Told I didn't believe you. At what point did you
open up and feel heard and believed? And then and
then at what point were you ready to go public
with this? Because it's too huge.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Oh well I am. That's the drinking and the first
time that I felt because I always thought I was
growing up different, you know, bern abused and all that.
You didn't want to tell anyone for fear of being
branded back then and gay whatever, you know, which bullying
(16:50):
was huge back then currently still is now. So when
I reached some Kilda, I started training with Saint Kila
Seniors at fifteen because dad was dying of cancer and
he just wanted me to see me train. And after
(17:10):
the Christmas break we finished training and we all got
on the beers and that was the first time I
realized I was an alcoholic, because looking back, I had
five or six cans and just couldn't just loved it
because my confidence grew and all that being a fifteen
year old trying to mix with twenty two, twenty three,
(17:30):
twenty four year olds, and then no one told me
to stop, so I I thought, wow, this is good.
And then the last practice match of March, so that
was Christmas time eighty two, and then we rolled into
eighty three. The last practice match, I kicked seven goals
(17:52):
in three quarters against Collingwood and that was and the
old man died January thirty one, January sorry, January three
in eighty three, wow, just before that, So he didn't
see he played. I kicked the first game I played.
Must have been looking down on him.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I was going to say, do you feel like that.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
The higher power? He's my higher power who I always
pray to and you know, guide me. So he must
have had a tough job for those forty years of addiction.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
I was going to say, what was your what was
your connection with him throughout the tough times and then
throughout the better times.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
Well, the connection now is a lot, a lot more loving.
You know, I jump around when I'm talking about stuff.
But so sixteen I started playing league football, and by
thirty I was in jail for assault. Wow. And no one,
(18:58):
no one could put the the pieces together. You know.
I've always only went back as far as saying it
was the death of my father at sixteen and then
some killed her duty of care and blah blah blah
and give me drugs to play and all that bullshit.
(19:18):
And I would never go back to being molester or
anything like that. But sin killed A football club are
a pedophile organization, as I've really I've got a list
of all of them and what took place and everything.
I just needed to get to court and then after that,
(19:39):
I'll you know, embarrass them and just tell it as
it was, as it is, you know, in the AFL
keep protecting them and all that. So it's amazing what
they get away with or got away with.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, yeah, it's enormous mhm.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
But they didn't give a fuck they honestly, looking back,
I would have, you know, so my dad, I would
have done anything, you know, for the Red, White and Black.
And then you know, halfway through ninety ninety, I was
having big dramas with the coach and in without I
(20:22):
wasn't doing the training. I was, you know, I was
an addict. I just couldn't say no, you know, and
I had friends obviously, hangers on, go on, let's go,
let's party, let's party, you know, okay, And then you know,
I wasn't doing the training and I went there.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
And you know, I told him I'm an alcoholic and
I'm addicted to speed and shattermines and all that, and
they go, oh, go home and tell your mom and
we'll have a meeting about your future.
Speaker 3 (20:57):
But mom knew what was going gone as mothers do
with their sons and went on, she goes, just can't
just relax, you know, everything will be all right. They
come come in and f on the door and say
we're sacking. No, that was it. I said, I'll get
the fuck out of the house, and that was it.
(21:20):
They dragged you out of school, but I was willing,
you know, I wanted to get out because being molested
and gained yeah, everything like that. And then this club.
So that that was when the loops nineteen ninety. So
(21:42):
I was twenty four through twenty four, eight years. Yeah,
managed sixty sixty games in that eight years and had
a hell of a lot of injuries and whatnot. It
was a pretty wild world role.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Yeah, and talk a bit about like the road to addiction.
How turbulent was it, how quick was it? How at
what point did you know you were you were in
real trouble with it.
Speaker 3 (22:19):
Wind So when you can look back and leaving school
at fifteen, I had no trade or no white collar
job or anything like that was never going to be.
So I found a job where you're allowed to drink
at work back in the day, and that was concrete,
(22:41):
you know. I just wheel the barrows in of conk
and you wash tools and just get the beers for
the boys, and that was it. Yeah, it's progressive addiction
as far as I know about it. You're born, it's born.
There's some brain stimulant or something in it. We just
(23:06):
can't say no, you've got to once, not enough in
a thousands, or maybe not enough, I'm going to you know,
I just became Wow, you'd fall asleep or flake it
or get knocked out or whatever, and then you know,
straight away my intention was yet back on it, get
(23:27):
back on it. And that that was pretty much pretty
much from Wow, from when I was at Brisbane. Yeah,
when I got to the Gold Coast, it was the start,
real start. I mean Saint Kilda was bad, but I
(23:48):
at Melbourne. I managed to stay off everything for from
the pre season when I did my knee again in
round nine and then the old the old devil on
your shoulders say just have one, yeah, one led to
(24:11):
right on. So yeah, look, anyone who's got who's got
the personality like I have, just there is help out there.
Twelve step program or I went into a rehab and
that was the greatest thing I didn't learn. Did the
(24:32):
twelve steps of recovery and yeah, I'm great. I'm forever
grateful for that program.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Yeah, and what was that the first I guess, big
attempt was that the first chosen path, like okay, I'm
going to go do twelve steps or with the other
attempts of I'm getting clean, I'm getting.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
I tried many many times, and then I thought it
was a moral failing on my path, like a week
so and say yeah and that, but it just this,
you know, it's compulsive, obsessive. You know recently, you know,
I make months off gambling, and that's that's brilliant. I mean,
(25:17):
it's it's funny when you When I first started, all
I wanted to do. All I thought I had a
problem with was gambling. Sorry it was alcohol and drugs.
But after getting clean and sober, gambling was just an escape, escapeism.
And then that got a big problem. I hate saying
(25:42):
it was. I wouldn't admit it. That's the thing you
try and justify it, everything going on and whatnot, and yeah,
just money would just go out now I look at it.
But yeah, I've learned now that's the main thing, learning slowly.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Yeah, what do you need from the people, Well, I
guess through your experience. What the people around you that
that were pivotal to your recovery, what did they do well?
What did you need from them? And I guess maybe
the tough love version and the and the.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
Yeah, well I needed that that circuit breakout. And that's
what rehab did. I went into a into a one
month dry out, the detox environment. It doesn't work for everyone.
I love this dream of your main rehabit. It's it's
(26:45):
pretty strict, but it's more based around you know, meditation, yoga,
cold showers, a bit of training, hm, that sort of stuff.
And I'd love that can up. But I've drifted off again.
But the ice fas for me have saved my life
(27:09):
in transcendental meditation two things, because I just couldn't could
not stop thinking. And as it says in the Power
and Now, the mind is a magnificent tool if used correctly. Yeah,
but we only use five percent and I don't even
(27:29):
think I used that. Yeah, if you can switch it
off and whatnot and just meditate for twenty minutes just
gives that circuit breaker and it's just so relaxing for
someone who's got that addictive personality.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
It seems like a I did a transcendental meditation course
years ago, and I remember how good it felt once
I'd gotten into it. It seems look for someone like yourself,
that's that real thrill, take a competitive like you're an athlete,
You're doing all the things. Was it hard to get into?
(28:11):
Was it hard to start the practice? Like sitting down
and shouting out for twenty minutes and letting the thoughts
just be there?
Speaker 3 (28:18):
Well, learning meditations, it doesn't just come naturally when you
when you're first learning. But I did the same, went
to a course and I didn't really I didn't know
what to expect. But you know the guy was instant
Kilda Road. Yeah, yeah, level eighteen or something, Yes, yes,
(28:43):
what was Richard Richard Alders, But yeah it was fat well,
it was the best course of done mar Rishi gogi.
And that's as I said, that just enables me to
stop the negative thoughts going in. Like there's times now
(29:04):
where I say, in moments, why don't you just have
one and then you know what I've learned now and
all that it's you can't you can't know, And I
wouldn't I wouldn't want to go back to the right
I was back then. What the steps have taught me
(29:28):
is just opened eyes to ourself. Wish I was for
my children, for my my ex, for my family and
all that. And that's one thing that we are that
we don't see until we get claim is how fucked
up we were self centered and and all that. But
(29:53):
on the flip side of that, it just makes me
aware of how fucked up some killed a football club
up and how the a f L. I just they
manipulate the public. Yeah, I'm not a fan of the
a f L. As you can a.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Little bit shining through there. I've always I always grapple
with the idea with so many things. And I mean
I had an experience somewhat similar to yours throughout my childhood,
(30:38):
and so that idea that so many people have, and
that's and it's people like yourself speaking up and speaking
out that hopefully will change the world. But it's you know,
that idea of money and power and status allows organizations
(30:58):
or situations to just be swept under the rug. And
it's so complex and it's so hard to fight. And
I'm just to see someone like yourself put yourself out there,
like I'm really proud, and I know how hard that
would be how long have you? When did you? When
(31:21):
did you kind of open up publicly and start talking
about this?
Speaker 3 (31:27):
That was all the steps, doing the steps and getting
clean and a good made of mind who got into recovery.
He said, if you're going to bring out your story,
you've got to get clean and sober. Yeah, and that
(31:47):
was great words. But actually sitting down and reading the
literature and realizing that you're not alone. Your story is
not unique. Yeah. Not everyone's been lived a life that
you or me have. We've all got our own journey,
(32:07):
and my journey is what it is. Until my story
came out, it was twenty twenty one, and a good
maid of mind, Luke Waders wanted to do the story
and even before, but I wasn't ready. It's funny how
the life just things happened for a reason and whatnot.
(32:31):
And I said, no, I'm not ready anyway. That was
twenty ten or so twenty one. Russell Jackson just did
a story on Robbie Muller about his base. You know
that the club will do nothing for him, and he's
not in a good way. Robbie, I'd love him, and
you know I read that story and it was so
(32:54):
well articulated, and you know, I loved the story itself. Iran,
I said, would you be interested in doing a story
on me? He goes, I've been trying to find you
for the last year or two. Well, so let's meet.
So Russell came up, Uh, Frankston Boy Funky tamp and
(33:19):
came up and you know, got a great rapport and yeah,
I trusted him, you know with the story that. Yeah,
it's so you know, I've kept so much still, you know,
so much more is coming out, but you know that
I've and that's with trauma that my psychiatrist is like,
(33:43):
you'll keep bringing up stuff the more I don't know
if it's the cleaner, the cleaner you get, the more
clarity all that. But in the subconscious and I keep
reading you know, yeah, what's his name, Eckart Toll books.
Have you read? The Magic in the Mind is a
book that I read as well, and he talks about
(34:05):
the voice in your subconscious and that's what basically, you know,
when I was rock bottom, you know this, this voice
said get up and tell your story week so and so,
and you know that's all why the pin didn't go
in the belt and cut my circulation off in five
(34:27):
seconds and all that. Yeah, and I didn't. I heard
some mates of mine go through the claim. Earlier in
two thousand and in my court case, I told the
judge then Betty King, that I was abused, but she said,
you're not here for unless being molested. You're here from
(34:51):
the assault. And that was the last and not a word.
And Betty King's best friend, this Jack Rush, defended my
perpetrator in the case against these blokes, you know, the judge,
the lawyers all, I don't get me started on that,
but it all h secured.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
I'm so sorry.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
Yeah, well, we're trying to do something about it. I mean,
I can't change the past, you know, I can't. It
should never have happened. He got moved from It's like
the Catholic church. These teachers get moved from school to
school back in the day, and so many children back
(35:38):
in the day should never have been molested. And then
we wonder why Australia is falling to pieces. There you
look at my life and you know Oxy Conton's heroin
which I didn't know, but you know, putting a needle
in the arm, that's the only thing that saved me.
That I never did it. And this is why they
(35:58):
don't say eighty percent of yeah people in jail have
been molested or sexually abused, or yeah, it's just how
do you stop it? He's got the balls to you know,
bring in the death penalty maybe, or yeah, it's something's
(36:21):
going to change. If nothing changes, nothing changed. And the
way this country has declined in my forty years, that
you know, from when I was sixteen to now, it's
just becoming it's not a very good place to live in.
I mean, I still love it, but it's you go
out to a shopping center on a Sunday and you
(36:42):
know you've got kids, machetes, Like how I have a
fist fight of your week? Dogs? What do you have
to cut people up and kill them?
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Like we're in a public place. Why was it in
such a public place.
Speaker 3 (36:54):
Well, because they knew they'd get stopped. They wanted to
kill each other. Just say hey, yeah, stick one in
me and stick one in you, or something like yeah,
it's well you shouldn't laugh because it's just one's fifteen
and sixteen. If you want to chose some carriage, jump
in the ring, you know, and put the gloves on
and punch the shit out of each other or UFC
(37:17):
some grappling and choke each other out. But no, they're cowards.
They use notes. I don't know where that came from,
but that's the way I feel because I've got young kids.
You know someone stabbed there. Well, well you just don't
want to think about the world's getting crazy tiffed.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
I think it is. You know it was it was
a Saturday afternoon there was a shooting and carry on
in South Melbourne, and then it was the next night
that the machines and I was just like, what is
going on?
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (37:49):
And then it takes well you know that conversation around
how long it takes to ban a machete. I'm like, well,
hang on, what is what are we needing machetes for? Anyway?
What is the use of a machine in this country?
Just been it? How hard can it be? Why we've
got fucking massive weapons like that slice people up?
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Well, I don't want to go down that path with
some Paul Enhands and you know had it right a
few years ago. I think you know who knows we
can't keep Australia our little island anymore. It's a multicultural society.
(38:28):
We live in and you know that's great, but you
know they want to carry machetes. They can and do
it back in their homeland.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
And I find it, you know, it's frustrating to sit
in a space where you see like everyone has an
experience and a trauma of whatever, you know, and then
some people become perpetrators.
Speaker 3 (38:50):
But it's like.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
The ones who are becoming perpetrators seem to be slipping
through the traps and not held to a count, and
then the ones who are slipping through a different trap
are easier to hold to account. It's like, oh, you've
got a drug addiction. You're the problem here. You're you're
the problem. Let's put you in jail. You've punched someone
in the face, And it's really, well, what about the
(39:15):
people over here that are quietly causing a ripple effective
chaos that is far far more serious than one person
getting punched in the face who probably deserved it.
Speaker 3 (39:26):
Well, you know, no doubt. You know what I read
it picked up the Herald's son a couple of weeks ago,
probably a month ago, and it said better fhile living
next door to school, and they're allowed now not to
be ankle brokes. No ankle bracelet, and I just this
(39:51):
is a joke. We went into the in the parliament
to get this bill passed that volunteers can be held
accountable for their action, and this liberal corec stood up
and board against the bill getting passed. So he was
(40:13):
basically defending pedophiles. And doesn't matter what his name is,
it's up but the young YOUNGSPI, I know, I felt
like standing up and gay, yeah if you had kids.
Obviously haven't got kids, but you know it's right pedophilia
(40:33):
through you know, up there, up in the courts, in
the police, everywhere. It's you know, wherever I said it,
wherever children are, there will be pedophiles. Lok hmm. That's
that's how bad it's Scottlde, you know since yeah, my
(40:55):
story came out as I said, thousand thou around southeastern
So but it's let alone all that. I think it's
up in ben Ballarat where hell did all and Grisdale
and in the church. It's surrendous.
Speaker 2 (41:11):
With the work you're doing. What what's the ideal outcome
for you? Short and long term?
Speaker 3 (41:20):
Oh short, I just got to stay clean and saber
every day, one day at a time. And long term
i'd love the opportunity to speak to speak to school
kids about how life can one day be going fine
(41:46):
and then you know, alcohol and drugs come into your
life and they can fall apart pretty quick. You know
the effects of gambling, lived experience. I suppose you know,
to get it out there. Yeah, I can help one
and that's you know, that's enough. But I'd love to
(42:09):
I'd love the opportunity to just to try and help.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
When you reflect back at any stage of your life,
can you identify maybe a time, a message and the
person to deliver that message that could have shifted your path?
Speaker 3 (42:37):
Quick answers no, because this is what being my lester does.
It took away my yeah, my soul, just the pain,
the shock, you know, I just froze.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
This is my gripe with a lot of the crap
people carry on with resilience these days because I learned
and when I started boxing at twenty nine, my memories
started coming out to the surface and I was like,
there's all of this, all of these accolades for getting
punched in the face and it doesn't hurt, and doing
(43:13):
the thing and doing the hard thing, and it's like,
this is dissociation. I can't really feel those punches because
I am going into a state of dissociation because I
learned how to do that when I was a kid,
because that kept me safe. It was a bit like
the same thing. So I think there's not enough context
around our behavior and our understanding of what looks like
(43:33):
courage and resilience, but what might actually be some coping mechanism.
We're not even where we're doing, and then we celebrate
that with a few beers. We feel good, and then
a few years down the road, here we are.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
Yeah. I don't know about I just loved the training.
I didn't look at it that way that I just
loved it. I love training hard, like I'd go and
have whatever, thirty forty beers and bombs and whatever, and
then the next night belonging myself on the track, stewing
(44:11):
it just the pain to feel that pain that I'd
felt at nine ten eleven, and the freezing and then
you know, I've broken bones and punching things when I
get drunk, just I'd come out sideways my whole and
then people would go, oh, he's just off his head. Now,
(44:35):
what was up in the subconscious trying to hide it all? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,
now I can. I can go and meditate and chill out.
And now I'm in bed. I'm in bed at eight o'clock. Yeah,
I'm up at four in the morning. But I loved it. Yeah,
(44:59):
I love that. Then you go for a walk or
do something, you know, do some sort of training that
allows me to to do it because I haven't worked
for eight years. I was concreting back in him. Made
a hip replacement. And that's what brought out there, and
that's what brought on the rock bottom was the painkillers.
(45:20):
Here's the mentality of being at Addie. I thought, I'm
still alive. I'm fifty one. I've drunk all my life
of smoked, you know, bombs and whatever and bet on
coke and everything else that can't kill me. Now I
have a crack at the end. N an Oxicon. Wow,
that's what killed over twenty million Americans. Wow, the oxycont
(45:46):
Have you seen that movie? No, it's about it's about
the family who made oxy Cone. M hmm.
Speaker 2 (46:01):
Wow, okay, so on Netflix.
Speaker 3 (46:03):
Yeah it was. I think it's painful two years ago. Wow,
it's an eye opener. The government knew how bad it
was killing people, and they said, we're making too much
money out of it. Shut up to the authorities. It's
(46:25):
a joke.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
Yeah, yeah, I just looked it up. That's going to
it's gone on my watch list.
Speaker 3 (46:30):
It's it's an I. But that's the guy who dies
at the end of think. I was pretty much. I
was very close, but I just kept swallowing it. But
that's addiction, you know.
Speaker 2 (46:46):
And in the in the midst of that, do you
have an awareness that you're walking a fine line between
life and death with what you're consuming, or you don't
even there's no admit of that.
Speaker 3 (46:58):
I didn't care back in the day, and that's been
selfish because I had two beautiful young girls growing up
and I prefer to stay out drinking and drugging with yeah,
with mates, you know, and didn't give us ship about
women who was just drinking, drugging and partying all that.
(47:23):
And I didn't care if I lived or died. Now,
but that's that was the pain I was hiding, you know,
And the grace of God, you know, the story came
out and it's it's made a change. Well, I hope
it continues to make a change and people held accountable
(47:44):
and justices served. Yeah. So yeah, well I'll mentioned it
again so killed in the a f L tour An
Education Department. Yeah, it's incredible, much aim. Of course, I.
Speaker 2 (48:03):
Love the work you're doing. I love the I love
the I guess the journey you're sharing your own journey,
and that the ability to impact other people. How can
we how can my listeners follow find you? Help you?
You know, is there anything you would like to promote
(48:24):
or anywhere you'd like them to go.
Speaker 3 (48:27):
I'm just waiting for a court case too, to vicarious
liability bill to get past and and that, and then
who knows I need. I really want to open a
rehab to help you addicts, and you know, and just
(48:48):
try and change people's if they want to. Not everyone,
not everyone wants to, and I fully understand, but I
don't know. I can be contacted. I lead my email
with you if and whatever, if they want to reach out,
we'll see what we can do. I can direct them
(49:09):
wherever you know they feel where they're at at this
stage of the addiction, and just know that there's help
out there. Any twelve step DNA is what I did. Aa'
is another one. There's ga gambling, all sorts of help
(49:29):
out there. Yeah, amazing, mate.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Well everyone you heard that. If you want to get
in touch, reach out and I will introduce you.
Speaker 3 (49:39):
Rod.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
Thank you so much for coming on the show for
a chat. It's been an absolute pleasure. I've really enjoyed
speaking with.
Speaker 3 (49:46):
You, saying, Tiff, was that an hour? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (49:50):
It goes quick, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (49:51):
Well, I didn't think I had an hour of chat
in me.
Speaker 2 (49:54):
I reckon, You've got I reckon. You could chat away
for quite some time. It's been in it barely enjoy
it being a pretty shitty topic to discuss. It has
been a real pleasure to speak to you and hear
a bit about your story and mostly you recover and
work you're doing.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
So thank you, Thank you for having me to.
Speaker 1 (50:13):
She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 3 (50:23):
It
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