August 4, 2025 • 10 mins
Chemical safety: sounds straightforward, right? You’ve got your SDS, PPE, and eyewash stations. But what happens when your team mixes, sprays, or supercharges those chemicals in ways the manufacturer never imagined? With a CHMM on the mic, this is part coaching, part humor, and 100% actionable.
Key Takeaways –Â
1. The SDS might not be helpful based on how youre using the chemical.Â
- Reality check: Most Safety Data Sheets are written based on lab conditions and "intended use"—not how your sanitation team might be using them. Â
- Pro Tip: Ask yourself, “Was this SDS written by someone who’s ever worn PPE, on a harvest room floor, at 2 AM?” Maybe not.
2. Exposure Limits Are Great—If You Can Measure Them
- Common failure: SDS says “use respirator if above X ppm.” Great. Now… how are you measuring ppm in your facility?
- Real examples:
- No meter for that specific chemical
- Using outdated Dräger tubes that are non-specific
3. “More Isn’t Better”Â
- Scenario: You double the chemical strength during deep cleaning due to finding some "buggies." Now your PPE, risk profile, engineering controls—all need to change. Did they?
- Surprise consequences:
- Equipment degradation because the stronger solution wasn’t considered $$$
- PPE may not be adequate for the levels used
4. Training Misses the Human Factor
- You’ve trained on:
- Where the SDS is
- How to handle and/or mix
- Which PPE to wear
- But you forgot to train on:
- What happens when the goggles fog up
- That instinctive move to scratch your eye with a gloved hand
- Spraying above your head and having chemical rain down your back
5. Eyewash Stations: Functional on First Shift, ???? On Off Shifts
- Classic issue: “We check them every Monday at 9 AM.” But chemical use spikes on nights, weekends, and during deep cleans
- Also overlooked:
- Eyewashes with scalding hot water
- No eyewash where non-routine chemical usage occurs
Actionable Advice :
- Revisit every chemical on-site: How is it used, applied, stored, and disposed? Does that match the SDS?
- Evaluate your meters: Can you measure the chemical levels you're basing levels of PPE on?
- Update PPE assessments based on how chemicals are used
- Retrain your teams with realistic, scenario-based walk-throughs
- Audit all eyewash stations across all shifts, all departments, and all rarely used roomsÂ
Final Words from Joe & Jen:
- We’re not saying you have these problems. We’re saying we’ve seen them—a lot.
- These gaps sneak in when paperwork replaces field observations.
- If you need help identifying these gaps, we do onsite audits, coaching, and training at AllenSafety.com and AllenSafetyCoaching.com.
SEO Keywords:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, welcome back.
I have no idea what we'recovering this week.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Let's do chemical safety gaps.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Okay, chemical safety gaps Five.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
What, whatever, we'll just start counting.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Okay, here we go.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Welcome back Today, joe Jen.
Chemical safety gaps A weekstarted counting the other day.
A lot of chemicals we work with.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, I need a lot more.
We really let's just do anevaluation and start talking
about it.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I just did a call with somebody today and they're
like oh, and we haveformaldehyde on site.
And I was like oh yeah, noproblem.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
I've done that too.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
I worked with that at the mill too.
No, problem.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
So Almost everywhere we go has a chemical Large
quantity, not just little bags.
We deal with lots of questionsand problems.
We're like you know what, Maybethis is a faster way to help
more people.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
Also, I guess, spoiler alert, you have a CHMM.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
There is that too, and I deal with chemicals every
once in a while.
All right, so we're going tostart off one of the weird
things, because these are justrandom.
Order of your five.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
No particular order okay.
No particular order okay.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
You know that the SDS is made for most the way we use
it right.
It's just use it in normalstate.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Okay, so yeah, who is writing the SDSs is really what
you want to know.
So, when you're getting achemical from a company, you're
thinking in your mind there'sthis very, very intensified
testing being done.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Right.
How it affects the human,different ways it can be used
chemist is writing this sds notalways so usually always yeah.
So there's different ways thatpeople do it.
We just want you know that sdsis a good idea.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Most of the way that people use the products we're
around, sds is just it doesn'tcover it Right the chemical in a
way that maybe the manufacturerdidn't take into consideration
when writing yes.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
We may mix them.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Yep, Mix them, dilute them, atomize them change our
PPE.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Yeah Cause, it'll say on there if you here's, here's
the other one that goes with it.
Second one here.
It'll say on the sds you go tothis level must wear something
respiratory how are we measuring?
Speaker 1 (02:07):
oh, that's my number two.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
There's a lot of chemicals that there's no meter
for the sds yeah so I'm sostupid way that I can measure
the particulates in there.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
That's correct yeah, I can do things like get an o2
meter.
Great, that tells me percentageof displaced oxygen.
It doesn't tell me howchemicals doing a million of
that chemicals in the room.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
It's greater tubes where you'll say you'll get some
meters, when you'll get someSDS, and you'll say huh
milligram cubed.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
What?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
is that so?
Yeah, so when you so, when youget these different, different
things, yeah, you got to figureout is the SDS relevant for what
you're doing?
Is it relevant the way you'regoing to use that product?
And then how are you going todecide which is another one, my
third one's, ppe.
How do I decide the PPE?
I got to have a way to measureso they all start tying in
together, but they're not.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
So here's my question , because this is something that
we hear always More is better,more is always better.
Let's make it stronger.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
If I decide to add more today, then that changed
all the stuff I did for normaluse.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Yeah, we may not be in normal use.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I may not have the right PPE, the meter may not be.
Oh, we don't need a meterbecause we do it at this level,
but on Fridays we add morechemical.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Or we're doing some kind of intensified sanitation,
hand scrubbing, things like thatAbsolutely.
Yeah, so now I'm using strongerand instead of foaming, I am
doing something different withit?
Correct, or it's stronger andwe haven't taken into
consideration for one being inan engineering background.
What's that doing in myelectrical and in my equipment?
That I'm just hosing downeverywhere first.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
I could also have.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
The human being.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Absolutely that could change the respiratory.
What if that air change was ina confined space now and uses
the same chemical, with the sameparts per million, with the
same PPE, but you change thesurface area and the area around
that person breathing becausenow you're in a confined space.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
So I'm thinking in scenarios like in the rendering
areas or we've got likedifferent, like kind of little
off rooms.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
You've got a lot of plants.
Also have duct work on theroofs.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
Yeah, we've got the duct work.
I'm thinking ovens and fryersand all those things that we
don't clean maybe every day, butit's the periodic stuff and
it's kind of built up some stuffand we've got to use more
chemicals.
The idea to get it broken upand that really does change your
PPE, your exposure levels, yourrespiratory contact.
(04:31):
Dermatitis exposure really doeschange your ppe, your exposure
levels, your respiratory contactdermatitis, exposure, potential
things like that, absolutelyanother one I have.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
This is like four, I think training and here's the
here's the biggest one abouttraining.
It's not to me if we trainpeople on an sds or train people
on how to use a chemical,sometimes we don't train them.
When you're upside down, you'respraying the chemical, or maybe
you're crawling on your backand then you move a couple feet
and it drips on you and you movea couple of your drip turn, you
got're spraying the chemical ormaybe you're crawling on your
back and then you move a couplefeet and it drips on you and you
move a couple feet, it drips onyou.
You got to keep the chemicaloff the people.
(04:57):
Who cares how much PPE is ifit's dripping on you Below,
wherever it is?
Speaker 1 (05:01):
So that to me goes back to job hazard analysis and
PPE assessments and stuff.
And you know that, again,that's a routine, non-routine
routine, right?
Kind of in that gray area andit goes back to spraying above
(05:22):
your head whether you're layingdown or standing up, whether
you've got stuff around yourneck to protect you.
This move right here, yeah mynose itches.
It's pick up my pick up, pick upmy goggles real quick yeah,
because they're fogging and yeahthat's the, that's the
conversations that we're nothaving in correct in the
chemical that's the trainingthing I'm looking for.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I'm fogged, but now I can't see.
It was better to have clearglasses when I'm handling the
chemical than to be fogged whenI'm handling the chemical.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Well, I mean, you just have to consider someone's
normal, daily, how many timesthey touch their face, their
nose itches their eye itches,their glasses are fogged.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
You don't realize how many times you do it.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Until you're not supposed to, it's not the.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Everyone has trained on how to use a chemical.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Everyone has trained about chemical stuff and we're
usually pretty good aboutcovering.
Here's where you find your sdsthat's correct how you mix it.
Pour this into this.
Don't do it the other way.
We're pretty good aboutcovering a lot of that
information about thestep-by-step and how it relates
to your job.
It's the other stuff that we'vegot to consider of wash your
gloves first, before you touchyour face.
Take them off or whatever, becareful about the angles that
(06:24):
you don't get the stuff runningdown the back of your neck.
And then it's burning everynight.
Chronic exposure stuff,absolutely.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
And here's my fifth one, I guess oh, I don't know
Each episode we try to give yousomething to take back, look at
your business and see your realrisk.
So for today's episode, youneed to go evaluate every place.
You have an eyewash and shower,and the reason for that is is
because we put eyewash andshowers in when they build
(06:51):
plants for normal day use, likethe SDS.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Oh, that's not where I'm headed with this, but on the
eyewash and shower.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
There's things that come about you're not sure of,
yeah, so one of them is is thatyou may have chemicals that
entire area during two hours ofthe day and there's no eye wash
and shower never close.
We're really great at doing eyewash inspections on day shift at
nine o'clock every monday atnine, I do it yep day shift,
everything's perfect go checkyour eye wash in the boiler room
yeah because sometimes they'rehot for the first few seconds
(07:18):
and you're like that's weird'sweird.
Well, it's not weird, but Imean.
The point I want you to look atis just go back and look at eye
wash and showers.
Use that as your baseline andstart breaking down all these
other variables.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Some of the folks that have maybe got some tenure
on sanitation in the utilitiesand the oil and engineering
areas, they may know this stuff.
You hire a new individual.
They have no idea that that'show this is plumbed.
You've got to just double checkthat stuff.
Maybe make a note If we canmake some changes.
Obviously that's what we wantto do.
These are our opinions.
(07:49):
This is my opinion.
This is his opinion, based onwhat we've seen.
We're not saying every one ofthese are at your location.
We're not saying any of themare.
We're saying they could be.
We've seen them in the past.
Absolutely Double check whenyou're doing your rounds and
your inspections, your periodicsafety evaluations or walkabouts
, whatever you want to call them.
Just check for some of thisstuff.
Check on different shifts, goin and just see what's going on.
(08:10):
Absolutely, joe and I dosanitation audits and
evaluations A lot of chemicals,sanitation safety training and
chemical stuff.
So if you want some on-sitesupport in regards to internal
sanitation, external sanitation,an evaluation, safety audit,
safety training, any of thatstuff how to navigate the gray
area between sanitation andguarding the safety rules that
(08:35):
get a little little graySometimes when we're trying to
do sanitation give us a call,alan-safetycom.
We are more than happy to getyou on the books and on the
schedule.
We're happy to come see you.
Otherwise,allensafetycoachingcom is a
really great in-between andeconomical way that you can have
email-based coaching with us.
It's free, it's included inyour membership, as well as
access to over 100 differentvideos.
(08:56):
So that's a great in-between inbetween.
And, as always, thanks forwatching, thanks for watching
and please, if this helps you,please like, subscribe, share,
do all the things I know most ofyou don't want to comment.
You don't want to put your nameout there because people say
weird stuff.
I totally get that, but itreally truly does help us.
If you are willing to sharethis to your company, use it as
(09:18):
a toolbox, talk any of thosethings.
So if you thought it was helpful, please help others find us,
because that's really the onlyreason why we're doing this to
try and help.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Trying to help you, it's not sure, not for making
money because we are in the hole, you guys.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Thank you everyone thanks, take care and have a
great week.
Thank you for listening to Safe, Efficient, Profitable a worker
safety podcast.
If you're looking for morein-depth discussions or
step-by-step solutions on all ofthe different safety and
regulatory topics, please visitus at wwwallensafetycoachingcom
for web-based virtual coachingand training, or at
(09:50):
wwwallensafetycom to book ourteam for onsite services,
training sessions to ordermerchandise, to learn more about
our team and what services.
Thank you so much for yoursupport.
Thank you.
All right, welcome back.
I have no idea what we'recovering this week.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Let's do chemical safety gaps.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Okay, chemical safety gaps Five.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
What, whatever, we'll just start counting.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Okay, here we go.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Welcome back Today, joe Jen.
Chemical safety gaps A weekstarted counting the other day.
A lot of chemicals we work with.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, I need a lot more.
We really let's just do anevaluation and start talking
about it.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I just did a call with somebody today and they're
like oh, and we haveformaldehyde on site.
And I was like oh yeah, noproblem.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
I've done that too.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
I worked with that at the mill too.
No, problem.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
So Almost everywhere we go has a chemical Large
quantity, not just little bags.
We deal with lots of questionsand problems.
We're like you know what, Maybethis is a faster way to help
more people.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
Also, I guess, spoiler alert, you have a CHMM.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
There is that too, and I deal with chemicals every
once in a while.
All right, so we're going tostart off one of the weird
things, because these are justrandom.
Order of your five.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
No particular order okay.
No particular order okay.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
You know that the SDS is made for most the way we use
it right.
It's just use it in normalstate.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Okay, so yeah, who is writing the SDSs is really what
you want to know.
So, when you're getting achemical from a company, you're
thinking in your mind there'sthis very, very intensified
testing being done.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Right.
How it affects the human,different ways it can be used
chemist is writing this sds notalways so usually always yeah.
So there's different ways thatpeople do it.
We just want you know that sdsis a good idea.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Most of the way that people use the products we're
around, sds is just it doesn'tcover it Right the chemical in a
way that maybe the manufacturerdidn't take into consideration
when writing yes.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
We may mix them.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Yep, Mix them, dilute them, atomize them change our
PPE.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Yeah Cause, it'll say on there if you here's, here's
the other one that goes with it.
Second one here.
It'll say on the sds you go tothis level must wear something
respiratory how are we measuring?
Speaker 1 (02:07):
oh, that's my number two.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
There's a lot of chemicals that there's no meter
for the sds yeah so I'm sostupid way that I can measure
the particulates in there.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
That's correct yeah, I can do things like get an o2
meter.
Great, that tells me percentageof displaced oxygen.
It doesn't tell me howchemicals doing a million of
that chemicals in the room.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
It's greater tubes where you'll say you'll get some
meters, when you'll get someSDS, and you'll say huh
milligram cubed.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
What?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
is that so?
Yeah, so when you so, when youget these different, different
things, yeah, you got to figureout is the SDS relevant for what
you're doing?
Is it relevant the way you'regoing to use that product?
And then how are you going todecide which is another one, my
third one's, ppe.
How do I decide the PPE?
I got to have a way to measureso they all start tying in
together, but they're not.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
So here's my question , because this is something that
we hear always More is better,more is always better.
Let's make it stronger.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
If I decide to add more today, then that changed
all the stuff I did for normaluse.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Yeah, we may not be in normal use.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I may not have the right PPE, the meter may not be.
Oh, we don't need a meterbecause we do it at this level,
but on Fridays we add morechemical.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Or we're doing some kind of intensified sanitation,
hand scrubbing, things like thatAbsolutely.
Yeah, so now I'm using strongerand instead of foaming, I am
doing something different withit?
Correct, or it's stronger andwe haven't taken into
consideration for one being inan engineering background.
What's that doing in myelectrical and in my equipment?
That I'm just hosing downeverywhere first.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
I could also have.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
The human being.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Absolutely that could change the respiratory.
What if that air change was ina confined space now and uses
the same chemical, with the sameparts per million, with the
same PPE, but you change thesurface area and the area around
that person breathing becausenow you're in a confined space.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
So I'm thinking in scenarios like in the rendering
areas or we've got likedifferent, like kind of little
off rooms.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
You've got a lot of plants.
Also have duct work on theroofs.
Speaker 1 (04:10):
Yeah, we've got the duct work.
I'm thinking ovens and fryersand all those things that we
don't clean maybe every day, butit's the periodic stuff and
it's kind of built up some stuffand we've got to use more
chemicals.
The idea to get it broken upand that really does change your
PPE, your exposure levels, yourrespiratory contact.
(04:31):
Dermatitis exposure really doeschange your ppe, your exposure
levels, your respiratory contactdermatitis, exposure, potential
things like that, absolutelyanother one I have.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
This is like four, I think training and here's the
here's the biggest one abouttraining.
It's not to me if we trainpeople on an sds or train people
on how to use a chemical,sometimes we don't train them.
When you're upside down, you'respraying the chemical, or maybe
you're crawling on your backand then you move a couple feet
and it drips on you and you movea couple of your drip turn, you
got're spraying the chemical ormaybe you're crawling on your
back and then you move a couplefeet and it drips on you and you
move a couple feet, it drips onyou.
You got to keep the chemicaloff the people.
(04:57):
Who cares how much PPE is ifit's dripping on you Below,
wherever it is?
Speaker 1 (05:01):
So that to me goes back to job hazard analysis and
PPE assessments and stuff.
And you know that, again,that's a routine, non-routine
routine, right?
Kind of in that gray area andit goes back to spraying above
(05:22):
your head whether you're layingdown or standing up, whether
you've got stuff around yourneck to protect you.
This move right here, yeah mynose itches.
It's pick up my pick up, pick upmy goggles real quick yeah,
because they're fogging and yeahthat's the, that's the
conversations that we're nothaving in correct in the
chemical that's the trainingthing I'm looking for.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I'm fogged, but now I can't see.
It was better to have clearglasses when I'm handling the
chemical than to be fogged whenI'm handling the chemical.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Well, I mean, you just have to consider someone's
normal, daily, how many timesthey touch their face, their
nose itches their eye itches,their glasses are fogged.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
You don't realize how many times you do it.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Until you're not supposed to, it's not the.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Everyone has trained on how to use a chemical.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Everyone has trained about chemical stuff and we're
usually pretty good aboutcovering.
Here's where you find your sdsthat's correct how you mix it.
Pour this into this.
Don't do it the other way.
We're pretty good aboutcovering a lot of that
information about thestep-by-step and how it relates
to your job.
It's the other stuff that we'vegot to consider of wash your
gloves first, before you touchyour face.
Take them off or whatever, becareful about the angles that
(06:24):
you don't get the stuff runningdown the back of your neck.
And then it's burning everynight.
Chronic exposure stuff,absolutely.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
And here's my fifth one, I guess oh, I don't know
Each episode we try to give yousomething to take back, look at
your business and see your realrisk.
So for today's episode, youneed to go evaluate every place.
You have an eyewash and shower,and the reason for that is is
because we put eyewash andshowers in when they build
(06:51):
plants for normal day use, likethe SDS.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Oh, that's not where I'm headed with this, but on the
eyewash and shower.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
There's things that come about you're not sure of,
yeah, so one of them is is thatyou may have chemicals that
entire area during two hours ofthe day and there's no eye wash
and shower never close.
We're really great at doing eyewash inspections on day shift at
nine o'clock every monday atnine, I do it yep day shift,
everything's perfect go checkyour eye wash in the boiler room
yeah because sometimes they'rehot for the first few seconds
(07:18):
and you're like that's weird'sweird.
Well, it's not weird, but Imean.
The point I want you to look atis just go back and look at eye
wash and showers.
Use that as your baseline andstart breaking down all these
other variables.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Some of the folks that have maybe got some tenure
on sanitation in the utilitiesand the oil and engineering
areas, they may know this stuff.
You hire a new individual.
They have no idea that that'show this is plumbed.
You've got to just double checkthat stuff.
Maybe make a note If we canmake some changes.
Obviously that's what we wantto do.
These are our opinions.
(07:49):
This is my opinion.
This is his opinion, based onwhat we've seen.
We're not saying every one ofthese are at your location.
We're not saying any of themare.
We're saying they could be.
We've seen them in the past.
Absolutely Double check whenyou're doing your rounds and
your inspections, your periodicsafety evaluations or walkabouts
, whatever you want to call them.
Just check for some of thisstuff.
Check on different shifts, goin and just see what's going on.
(08:10):
Absolutely, joe and I dosanitation audits and
evaluations A lot of chemicals,sanitation safety training and
chemical stuff.
So if you want some on-sitesupport in regards to internal
sanitation, external sanitation,an evaluation, safety audit,
safety training, any of thatstuff how to navigate the gray
area between sanitation andguarding the safety rules that
(08:35):
get a little little graySometimes when we're trying to
do sanitation give us a call,alan-safetycom.
We are more than happy to getyou on the books and on the
schedule.
We're happy to come see you.
Otherwise,allensafetycoachingcom is a
really great in-between andeconomical way that you can have
email-based coaching with us.
It's free, it's included inyour membership, as well as
access to over 100 differentvideos.
(08:56):
So that's a great in-between inbetween.
And, as always, thanks forwatching, thanks for watching
and please, if this helps you,please like, subscribe, share,
do all the things I know most ofyou don't want to comment.
You don't want to put your nameout there because people say
weird stuff.
I totally get that, but itreally truly does help us.
If you are willing to sharethis to your company, use it as
(09:18):
a toolbox, talk any of thosethings.
So if you thought it was helpful, please help others find us,
because that's really the onlyreason why we're doing this to
try and help.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Trying to help you, it's not sure, not for making
money because we are in the hole, you guys.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Thank you everyone thanks, take care and have a
great week.
Thank you for listening to Safe, Efficient, Profitable a worker
safety podcast.
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