280: From Kuwait Refugee to Multi-Millionaire - How Lloyed Lobo Used Community Led Growth to Succeed
September 5, 2023 • 44 mins
EPISODE SUMMARY
How did one man go from a war refugee to a successful multi-millionaire? Check this out:
Lloyed Lobo had a tough childhood, living in Kuwait right when Saddam Hussain invaded. His story about how his family got out, and then how he learned how to thrive is amazing. He earned much of his success due to his knowledge of how to build a community. A strong community can accelerate a company.
In this week’s episode of Scale Your SaaS, Lloyd Lobo, Co-founder and board member at Boast, shares insights on winning with the help of building community with host and B2B SaaS Sales Coach Matt Wolach. Let’s dive in!
PODCAST-AT-A-GLANCE
Podcast: Scale Your SaaS with Matt Wolach
Episode: Episode No. 280, "From Kuwait Refugee to Multi-Millionaire - How Lloyed Lobo Used Community-Led Growth to Succeed"
Host: Matt Wolach, a B2B SaaS sales coach, Entrepreneur, and Investor
Guest: Lloyd Lobo, Co-founder and Board Member at Boast
TOP TIPS FROM THIS EPISODE
- Compete in a More Focused Market
- Build a Loyal Niche Audience
EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS
- The Concept of Movement
- Consistency Is Key
TOP QUOTES
Lloyed Lobo
[7:00] “Life isn’t about the journey or the destination. It’s your companions who you go through it with.”
[8:10] “Sales is the best skill to learn if you want to be an entrepreneur. Sales is finding your first customers, figuring out and prioritizing what to build.”
[21:25] “Five rules for community-led growth that can be applied within their own businesses. The first step is starting with the ideal customer profile.”
[39:00] “When you sell features, you die with those features. When you sell aspiration, you live forever.”
Matt Wolach
[19:04] “How frustrating is it when you have a great demo? You're feeling good. They like it. It seems like a done deal. And then crickets, nothing reaches out. They're not responding to you at all.”
[32:19] “I talked to so many leaders who try something and it might have been the right thing, but they never gave themselves a chance to prove it. They never gave themselves a chance to get better at it and show themselves that that's the right thing. And so they stop it before it ever evolves into that phenomenal, perfect way to drive leads or get people excited or close deals or whatever it is. So I love that you're saying that be consistent, be persistent with it, keep it going. And I think that that's really critical.”
LEARN MORE
To learn more about Boast, visit: https://boast.ai/contact/
You can also find Lloyed Lobo on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lloyedlobo/
For more about how host Matt Wolach helps software companies achieve maximum growth, visit https://mattwolach.com/
Get even more tips by following Matt elsewhere:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Matt Wolach (00:10):
You're definitely going to want to hear the story
of Lloyd Lobo this guy went froma refugee in Kuwait as a kid to
be able to exit his companystill keep a good share of the
company still keep a board seatstill impacts how that company
moves forward because of how herun his company. He is an expert
at community led growth. He hada lot of struggle figured out
(00:32):
how to solve that struggle interms of growing his company
through community led growth andhe shares exactly what to do so
that you can get a lot of peopleexcited about what you're doing
passionate and evangelical aboutyour product. This is a great
listen, I tell you, he is so funto listen to to hear his story.
So really enjoy this one.
Intro/ Outro (00:51):
Welcome to Scale Your SaaS, the podcast that
gives you proven techniques andformulas for boosting your
revenue and achieving your dreamexit brought to you by a guy
who's done just that multipletimes. Here's your host, Matt
Wolach,
Matt Wolach (01:07):
and welcome to Scale Your SaaS Thank you very
much for being here. I am reallyglad that you made it. So if you
have to first time definitelysubscribe to the show. This is
something where we're gonna behere to help you grow, help you
scale help you understand how torun an incredible company, and
somebody who knows how to do allof those things is with us
today. And I am jacked for this.
Everybody meet Lloyd Lobo.
(01:28):
Lloyd, how you doing?
Lloyd Lobo (01:29):
I am doing well what energy Matt. Now you you created
this virtuous cycle here becauseI'm gonna have to match your
energy you attract the energyyou give out. This is gonna be
exciting. I'm super pumped.
Thanks for having me.
Matt Wolach (01:40):
Absolutely. I'm so glad to have you here. And I
feel like you're somebody whobrings the enthusiasm and the
passion. So I don't think you'llhave any trouble matching that
energy. But let me make surethat everybody knows who you
are. So Lloyd Lobo, he is theCo-founder and a board member at
Boast he has been anentrepreneur podcast host
community builder and as theco-founder of Boast.ai. He
(02:02):
leverages the community ledgrowth model to bootstrap the
company to eight figure revenueinsecure, over 100 million in
funding, while also co foundingtraction, which is a community
empowering over 100,000innovators through connections
content and capital. Boast is afin tech platform that provides
R&D funding to help innovativecompanies fuel their growth. So
(02:24):
Lloyd absolutely understandsgrowing companies scale, and
making sure that he helps othersalong the way. So Lloyd, once
again, thanks for coming on theshow.
Lloyd Lobo (02:33):
Thank you for having me. I've heard great things. I
love your show. So I'm superpumped. Super excited to be in
front of your community.
Matt Wolach (02:39):
Awesome. Thank you.
Well, tell me what have you beenup to lately? And what's coming
up for you?
Lloyd Lobo (02:42):
Definitely. So not too long ago, we sold a majority
stake in the company at boastright 50 To some odd percent,
and had a transition. So me andmy co founders, like stepped out
of the day to day of thecompany. As a part of that I
went through my internal journeyof like, ah, what do I do this
company was my identity. I hadprobably over the last several
(03:04):
years only focused on last 10years only focused on business
on work, right did a couple offailed startups boast traction,
that that whole workenvironment, that community that
that was my tribe, that was myidentity. So leaving the day to
day of both and stepping to aboard was actually a hard
decision for me. I ended upprobably depressed I ended up
(03:28):
like clueless what to do. And mywife kept nagging at me, she's
like, you're in a fortunateposition, you can do whatever
you want. Why are you Where areyou latching on to things you
don't have instead of making themost of what you have. But I
realized that over the lastseveral years, I've neglected my
kids, I spent no time with them.
So ejected out of San FranciscoBay Area and moved to Dubai a
(03:50):
location where like, you know,it's completely disconnected but
still have a lot of friends andbut like not that same day to
day vibe, like, hey, Brandon,hustle, you got to do a company.
It's a different environment,which is more relaxed, more
subdued, everything is done foryou kind of like Disneyland for
(04:10):
adults. So I came upon all thisfree time and I started to
reflect on my journey as a kidgrowing up. And this is a very
common thread in my life. It wascommunity. My grandparents grew
up in the slums of India. My momgrew up in the slums of Mumbai.
And as a kid, when I used tovisit those, my grandparents, it
was all community. It was allpeople coming together. They
(04:34):
lived in this, probably fourwalls that was maybe fit for
three, four people, but 10 kids,and two parents lived in there,
and tin foil roof. And everytime I'd visit India asked my
grandfather, why do you have thestranger living here? And he
would tell me the only way tocreate abundance in life is to
help others without expectinganything in return. And those
(04:56):
memories as a kid. It used toRain every summer I'd go and
like puddles would turn intoponds and we were swimming in
the muck and watching TV was asocial activity because not many
of those houses i It's hard tosay houses because I don't know
what to call it. Right thosestructures had TVs so like,
(05:16):
every night you'd watch TV or amovie that will come on the
cable television, people wouldcome in and watch so they're
cooked in and like others are,are watching from the grills of
the window. I remember likeyou'd get fresh milk from the
from the cows and there was likea cow shed there. And one
evening, I as a kid, I wanted tobring a cow home and they let me
(05:40):
bring it so like, that was avery community wide vibe. And
then I was nine years old. Onemorning, my mom wakes me up and
says, Hey, I don't think you cango to school anymore. There's a
war has been hit the Gulf Warand Kuwait. My first reaction as
a kid was I knew I was going tofail. Grade four, because I had
studied for a math exam. Ialways used to procrastinate as
(06:06):
a kid, show up. It's a geo examgeography exam. My mom wakes me
up and she's like, I don't thinkyou can go to school. The war is
hit my first reaction is yes,you're never gonna find out. I
failed. But then when it sankin, right? When I started to see
a kid, I see the worry on theirface currencies are invalid.
There's no phones, you don'tknow where you're gonna go. And
(06:27):
that day, I went down thebuilding with my dad and saw
concern faces around. And peopleare trying to figure out what do
you do? Right, the security hascompletely lapsed Saddam Hussein
has taken over the country withhis troops. There's no no
certainty of what's going tohappen. And so people started to
come together and say, okay, youdon't want all guarded the
(06:48):
building from eight to 12. Youguarded from 12, to four, all
organized food, all organizedsupplies, yada, yada. And that's
that's what I realized, likewhat is communities like?
Somebody has an aspiration or aproblem, they look around,
others face the same, they cometogether. And every building
became a sub community. And theword of mouth spread,
(07:09):
coordinated with the UNembassies and it became the
largest evacuation movementprobably in his time, and took
us to safety. And as I went fromKuwait, to Baghdad, to Jordan,
on this rickety bus on theHighway of Death, buses were
bombed, you weren't sure you'regoing to live or die currencies
are invalid. Probably thereshould have been concerned adult
faces around the bus. But all Icould see is my parents, our
(07:32):
friends, all these adultssinging, playing the guitar
laughing. And I'm like, What isgoing on here? And then I
realized that it's neither thedestination nor the journeys,
the companions that matter themost, right? You could be on the
Highway of Death, on the way tohell. But great companions make
it memorable. Or you could besipping champagne with your ship
(07:56):
sipping Doha caviar with toxicpeople and want to get out of
there. Right? And then afterthat, already, Canada, yeah,
you've been there. You energyvampires, you just don't want to
be there. Right.
Matt Wolach (08:14):
So true, so true.
Lloyd Lobo (08:16):
And you know what I look at the slums of India or
the Gulf War. And then afterengineering, I made my way to
Canada with my parents aftergraduating engineering work at a
number of startups actually, Ifinished engineering and the
first job I took was coldcalling for a small company. And
entrepreneur I talked to said,the best skill you can learn if
(08:38):
you want to be an entrepreneursomeday sales. And I agree sales
is everything fast forwardtoday, sales is finding your
first customers figuring out andprioritizing what to build
convincing your wife afterrepeated failure to do the next
step of convincing investorsevangelizing the press employees
to join on low pay. It'severything. But so through that
(09:01):
cold calling job, my parentswere losing it right. You're
making 30k dialing for dollars,or a friend's kids did
engineering the work andMicrosoft and Google What are
you doing, right? But I made myway from from Canada to the
United States because my mygirlfriend who was also refugee
of the Gulf War, went to medschool and work on a series of
(09:21):
startups after a few failures,then connected with my best
friend from college, who was inthe space and wanted to do a
start up in this r&d tax creditsr&d funding because he was doing
it manually at big fouraccounting firms. And when we
came together to make cold callsto people to see if they'll buy
the service, nobody would talkto us imagine I randomly call
(09:43):
you and say hey, you know what,if you give me your product
development information, I'llget you some money from the
government. You gotta thinklike, you know, 10 years ago,
you're gonna think this is likea spammy thing. And even should
do it. Why should I give tworandos my, my data when I can go
to a big four accounting firm Sowe were getting slammed shut a
lot or like talking to like,companies that could even use a
(10:06):
service. And so the light bulbwent on is like K. Community is
part of like, the DNA here likemine personally. And the one
thing I can do is rely on thatcommunity we had as a function
of being a part of failedstartups have a bit of a
network. And, you know, it'snever the product you're
(10:27):
selling, but it's the outcome,you're driving for the customer.
And we knew people wanted r&dfunding to accelerate
innovation. They wanted toaccelerate innovation, to drive
business growth. Why can't theywhat stops them from driving
business growth is all thesethings that they don't know. So
that was a timer podcast inexists? There were no like
(10:48):
tactical events, it was all veryhigh level. So we started
finding founders in our networkwas a level up from our audience
to come and share behind closeddoors, their learnings, how did
you get your first customers?
How did you write your firstsales scripts? How did you build
your first product? How do youmake your first few hires Right?
Like, how do you run a marketingcampaign that generates results
(11:10):
are just not from straight fromthe people who did it? The
founders or the early employees?
And then our messaging changefrom Hey, buy my stuff to hey,
we're hosting an event with Xinfluencer or x person who's
going to talk about why topicthat's relevant to your
business. We got 10 spots wouldyou love to come? There's going
(11:32):
to be some pizza. People startedcoming. first meetup. 10 people
showed up 1520 30 People startedshowing up. One fine day 200
people landed at that co workingspace. And they're like, Guys,
this is not a pizza night meetup. It's a full blown
conference. Fast forward nowseven, eight years that's
(11:55):
evolved into a large communitytraction, it helped us bootstrap
to almost 10 million in funding.
I mean, almost 10 million inrevenue and lots of funding
between debt and equity tookover 100 million. We met our
investors who bought thecompany. Through that community,
they came to an event we met theguys who gave us the 100 million
that facility through thatcommunities is done a lot. So
(12:15):
that was the other reflectionthat I that I left the day to
day of the company. And like Isaid, I ended up depressed,
drunk, overweight, I was like, Ilost my identity. So I started
just dabbling in things. Andthings that I think's to
overcome it, right, like a lotof what we do, to battled
depression is what medicationmeditation and masturbation,
(12:39):
masturbation being euphemism forall the other things you do, you
don't go to the root cause. Butsometimes, you know, attacking
the root cause is the mostimportant thing. Because if it's
the environment, or the peoplethat's bothering you, then you
got to change that. Because noamount of medication or
meditation is going to solve it.
It's just kicking the canfurther. And I kept thinking
(13:03):
that you know, drinking andpartying and doing all these
other things is going to help meget away and then I realized
it's not it's the environment,right? But But through that
exercise, I got extremelyoverweight and unhealthy and the
peloton community is what helpedme get to good health. My wife
(13:23):
wakes me up and she's like, lookat you. If something happens to
you, your family is going to beleft holding the bag you've
barely spent any time with thekids. Now that you've come into
some money instead of spendingtime with them, you're moping
about like leaving the day today of your company. And in
she's like, right after Easter.
The funny thing was right afterthe exit. I was working, working
working and our seller let thedeal go through and I'll take
(13:46):
everyone to Bora Bora. And she'sshe would always say nobody
cares about your Bora Bora. Wecare about having dinner time
with you are focused on with youwith the phones away. Nobody
cares about one vacation a yearthat is a compound interest on
being together a little bitevery day is what builds
relationships and I neverthought about that. And, and so
the deal happened. We bookedeveryone to Bora Bora, my family
(14:12):
my parents my sister two daysbefore Moreover, I got bilateral
COVID pneumonia was hospitalizedunable to breathe. Oh no. And
and I promised myself after thatincident that I'd come back and
spend more time with the kidsand get better. But all habits
die real hard. The company wentobviously came into funding in
(14:33):
growth mode. We added like80 100 people and it's just
things got chaotic and mydaughter comes to me and she's
like dad, everything you said inthe press and to us that if you
died your biggest regret wouldwould be you didn't spend enough
time with us was a lie. And I'mlike sweetie, listen. I don't
(14:55):
want to say we got lots ofpeople there's you know It's
chaotic times when you grow fromlike 3040 ish to 120 130 ish we
got to do right by them andshe's like Dad Why don't you go
work for somebody thinks likeyou so I can have my dad back.
Right and so a lot of theseconflicting things as they
depart the day to day was waseating me and my wife's like,
(15:18):
you might not get a third chanceif you rely on these things,
these external you know externalthings to get your mind off
right it has to come from withinyou the glass is always half
full. So that night as I lay onbed, unable to sleep, I see the
peloton which had probably wehad for like four years but turn
(15:40):
into a clothing rush. So Mike,let me hop on regular she's
given me the health lecture overand over, she's a physician I'm
gonna hop on and hop on the theinstructor Coincidentally, I get
this instructor which I'm gladthat happened. I felt an instant
connection she was coming offmaternity leave and didn't feel
as strong. And so she broughther vulnerable self and she
(16:01):
said, Hey, I don't feel asstrong. I'm weak. I can't write
as before I don't want to dothis. And then she yells out
self pity is toxic one crank oneshift one right on the block I
am I can, with I have the tigerfrom Rocky playing. So that one
ride went so fast turned intotwo turn three. And as a
community I relied on peoplehigh fiving each other I was
looking forward to my dailyrides, streaks. And so when I
(16:22):
came back to good health andfreedom, and as I reflected on
like, I've been an entrepreneurworking like 80 100 hours a week
for the last 10 years, I don'tknow how to sit and do nothing.
And I have all this free time.
And my journey from my parentsbeing the slums of India to
having literally SlumdogMillionaire, being financial
(16:46):
freedom, the one thing I can dois pay homage to the community.
Right. And so I started talkingto hundreds and 1000s of people
about community researching andjust trying to see if there are
parallels to my learnings likewe bootstrap boast based on that
and got our investors and startto find very common threads and
(17:07):
then started talking and askingthe same questions and found 13
common rules amongst all thesecommunity led businesses from
Harley Davidson to HubSpot, thatI put into a book called from
grassroots to greatness, 13rules to build iconic brands
with community led growth. Andthe one common theme, or 111,
(17:28):
common theme in that in thatjourney was which which you will
find funny is from Christ orChristianity, to CrossFit.
Therefore common themes are verycommon framework. Really, when
people listen to you, or buyyour product, you have an
audience.
(17:48):
You bring that audiencetogether, to interact with one
another, you have a community,you bring that community
together to create impact. It'sa movement, and through rituals
and undying faith and itspurpose. That movement then
turns into a cult or religion.
That's why I said from Christ toCrossFit, this is the journey of
every obscure idea to iconic,right. And so it was
(18:15):
interesting, right? Audience,community, movement, religion,
or cult, like, try to try to,you know, ignore our religion
side of things, because I don'twant to take it in that track,
but argue with somebody with acult brand like a CrossFit or a
Harley fan, or Apple, Apple, orBitcoin and they'll
Matt Wolach (18:38):
cut you, right?
Yes, absolutely.
Lloyd Lobo (18:41):
How did it start? It started with an audience. And
then we came together and becamea community, then the community
started to work together tocreate something, and it became
a movement and then throughcertain rituals and beliefs. In
this purpose, it turns into acall. So I talked about some of
that. And it is very, veryfascinating.
Matt Wolach (19:04):
We'll be right back. Skill your SAS is
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(19:26):
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They're not responding to you atall. And when these software
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are following up the wrong way.
Or actually, I should say withthe wrong medium. What they're
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(19:49):
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(20:10):
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(20:56):
poor wind. And we're back. Yeah.
And this book coming up. I mean,that sounds amazing. It's coming
out in September, right.
Lloyd Lobo (21:08):
September 12. We'll do the pre sale later this week,
early next week. And and yeah,so September 12, is what it is.
Matt Wolach (21:18):
I love it. So what can you share with our audience
about some of these rules forcommunity led growth that they
can apply within their ownbusinesses?
Lloyd Lobo (21:25):
Definitely. So I'll break down some very basic
things. And it might be it mightbe very easy to digest here. So
five or four or five rules, I'llshare in a very tactical way and
effectively put it in theframework of not maybe how
Harley did it or Apple did itbecause it's it might be very
(21:46):
hard to connect with a brandthat's worth billions. But I
could talk about my journeygoing into 10 million bootstrap
with no marketing team. Right?
And that that might connectbetter. So I think the step
number one and you'll appreciatethis given you sales is your
life is your lifeline, right isstarting with the ideal customer
(22:07):
profile, like figuring out anunderserved niche and
identifying their pains, figureout where they eat, breathe,
drink sleep, don't just figureout the problems, but figure out
their aspirations and goals, howcan they become the best
versions of themselves, right?
So a lot of the times whathappens is we focused on the
(22:29):
solution should focus on theproblem or the aspiration
because customers care about theoutcome for them, they don't
care about your product. I wantto I want to get fit, I don't
care about a gym membership. Iwant to get more leads, I don't
care about the marketingautomation tool. But the thing
is, we get so hyped up in ourproduct and our features that we
(22:50):
forget the customer and some ofthese big big iconic brands are
focused on the purpose right theend purpose is like what are you
driving? What is the outcomeyou're driving? What is it what
is the purpose for the customerfor that audience? So start
there, once you have that, drawthe circle of influence around
your customer. So you have theICP so I boasted was innovators
(23:13):
basically people who build newproducts or improved existing
products. Now what is the circleof influence? Meaning? Who are
the influencers, that your idealcustomer profile listens to?
When you have that list? Thoseare people if you host events or
podcasts or meetups or webinars,you can invite us speakers,
(23:34):
right? Because you will gettheir brand rub. The second is
who what are the tools orservices do they buy? So if it's
an entrepreneur and I'm sellingthem r&d funding, well, probably
it's startup legal, probablyit's venture capitalists
probably it is people who selltools like Stripe or HubSpot,
all the whole stack that founderwould buy, right? That's the
(23:57):
gusto for payroll. So those arepeople that you could partner
with like say if you did events,conferences, webinars, meetups,
like you can do joint partneractivity with them. And then the
third is what channels where arethe Hangout? Basically, where
are they frequent? Like? Arethey on LinkedIn? Or are they on
Twitter? Like you got to figureout where they hang out what
(24:18):
blogs what magazines they read,so you can be prevalent there so
if they read TechCrunch, butyou're throwing stuff on PR
Newswire, then why like go whereyour audiences, right? If
they're asking for LinkedIn andyou're blasting the hell out of
friggin Instagram, then you gotto ask yourself where What are
you trying to attract? Right. Sothat the so you start with the
(24:38):
ICP, you figure out theaspirations and goals and the
problems, not just what yoursolution solves. And the other
benefit of focusing on theaspiration or the problem is if
you focus on the solution,you'll keep making your solution
better. If you focus on theproblem and the customers
aspiration You'll grow beyondyour solution to a big iconic
(25:02):
company, right? Because if youlook at every company that's 100
million in revenue, they'realways Multi Product companies
like Salesforce like Salesforce,a web billions in revenue, they
don't just have the CRM, theyhave the Cs, and they have the
marketing automation. They haveservices. Every major company
has a second act and a third actand a fourth act. If you're just
(25:23):
focused on your solution, youwill never see beyond your
product, you have to understandwhat is the customer's
aspiration? What are the goals?
What are they what are theytrying to drive, what are they
trying to become. And that's howyou can make that leap of adding
product to product free. So it'svery important. And that's how
you can come up with also withcontent, right? If you only
think about your solution,you'll only ever talk about your
(25:43):
solution. But if you think aboutthe customer's aspiration, you
fall in love with your customer.
And you can help them becomesuccessful beyond your product
or service. You're obviously foryou know, HubSpot, which we're
all familiar with. I was anengineer who went into sales,
like I said, and eventuallyended up at a startup in sales.
(26:06):
But it's so happens whenstartups don't have product
market fit. You end up in sales,but you have to actually be also
product manager, product managerand do marketing for like, Oh,
we don't have any customers Sofigure out who you should sell
to and then by the way, figureout what what we need to build.
And then also figure out how welaunched this was the best
(26:27):
experience ever. I nevercomplain I barely got paid, I
think I got paid like $45,000 isthe best experience ever. Those
were the like, you know, thatdrawn a lot. You learn so much.
But during that time, this was Ithink design five or six. There
was no content around digitalmarketing, online marketing
anything so I started Googlingon all I found was HubSpot
(26:50):
inbound community and theirinbound marketing certificate.
And I remember Gary Vaynerchukwith chubby little guy selling
wine wine TV was teaching acourse on their on YouTube,
YouTube marketing, like how tohow to create YouTube videos. So
I learned a lot is a function ofthat. But that's that's what it
is right? If you focus on thecustomers aspiration, then
(27:11):
HubSpot became one of the topmarketing automation platforms
and added sales now adding CES,it's grown based on following
the customers aspirations. Sothat's what you should start
with. Then the second step, thethird, the once you figure out
the ICP and figure out theircircle of influence, then you
figure out what type ofcommunity you want to build.
(27:33):
There are three types ofcommunities you can build. There
is a community of practice,which is bringing people
together to learn about ourtopic, right? You're, you're
building effectively a communityof practice here with the SAS,
SAS ver is a community ofpractice, as well. HubSpot
inbound is a community ofpractice, where people want to
learn about a specific fieldthat has nothing to do with the
(27:55):
product, gain sites, customersuccess, community pulse.
Gainsight is a great example. Ijoined their community, they had
no product. And then eventuallysomeday they built they built a
product and people were like,Hey, you educated me on customer
success? Why wouldn't I use yourproduct? So once you've once
you've figured that out, soCommunity of Practice, then the
(28:15):
second one is community aproduct, which is learning about
a product, like how do I getbetter at Microsoft? Or how do I
get better at GitHub? Or how doI get better at Atlassian?
Right. And the third one is acommunity of play where you come
together around socialactivities. Like I would say, in
many ways all the Red Bull has acommunity of evangelists around
(28:36):
Red Bull, but it's really acommunity of player hosting high
energy events, right? But likeyour paddle club, or your soccer
club, do you belong to any ofthose kinds of communities?
Matt Wolach (28:47):
I have a golf fleet. Yep.
Lloyd Lobo (28:48):
Exactly right.
That's great. It's fun, it'sfun. If you don't have product
market fit, meaning you don'thave at least 100 Customers who
love your product, use it andwant to congregate. There is no
point in building a communityproduct because in the
beginning, you're just trying toget people to learn about you
and spread the message. And whenyou have a community a product,
when you barely have anycustomers, nobody's going to
(29:09):
want to come hang out there.
Like we don't want to buy yourstuff, right. And so So figure
out the community you want tobuild if you don't a product
market fit, it's a community ofpractice or community of play.
Then you start following thatframework of audience community,
movement, religion and creatingthe audience can start with you
(29:32):
know, ICP, write down 100 200burning questions that your
audience has. So you cangenerate a repository of ideas
like think hey, if I have towrite this ultimate guide to
XYZ, what chapters sub chaptersand topics it would include.
Then you can turn that one formof content into multiple forms
right like so you interview say,sure you have your list of
(29:54):
influencers, interview them on alive zoom like an on a zoom
webinar. Turn that into Thevideo for YouTube the audio for
podcast, turned the shorts intoYouTube shorts, tick tock in
serials. Take the text posted onLinkedIn on on Twitter. So you
start building a bit of anaudience there. Consistency is
(30:15):
key, you can you can turn aseries of videos into an e book
or a course like on Maven or oneof these cohort based learning
courses or just a recordedcourse on Thinkific or something
like that. But you startbuilding an audience. The key is
consistency, though a lot ofpeople are not consistent,
right? We the first meetup wedid if we just stopped after the
(30:39):
third meetup, because only1010 10 People were showing up,
then we'd give up right? Butbecause we kept that
consistency, we got kicked outof the core game space when 200
people showed up one day, and itturned into attraction
eventually. And then during thepandemic, we had to cancel a
(30:59):
conference. And he didn't knowwhat to do. We had 54 or 55
speakers lined up. I personallycouldn't bring myself to do a
two day virtual summit because Ican't sit through a virtual
summit personally. So I'm like,I'm never gonna organize this,
let alone if the tech fail.
Let's see. You know how thathappens. Yeah, reports. So I
requested every speaker to joinus for a live ama session once a
(31:21):
week. And that gave me likewebinars for a year now blasted
our same audience. And everyweek, five 600 people show up.
But very quickly, within amatter of a month or two, we
started getting requests fromother speakers to join because
people liked that format of onehour a week like a TV show that
unit. So we made it to a weekand now you're getting four or
(31:45):
500 people tuning in your videoswent to YouTube or YouTube on
average. Yeah, YouTube's if yougo to the traction coffee,
YouTube, you'll see each sessionin the past several months
averages eight to 10,000 views.
And and then that grew our emaildatabase went from I think in
the pandemic from 30,000subscribers to 100 and some odd
(32:08):
1000 subscribers over a two yearspan. That's phenomena have
consistent the first few ones wedid 4050 people showed up. If we
weren't consistent though. It'sdone ran just
Matt Wolach (32:20):
staying with it. I talked to so many leaders who
try something and it might havebeen the right thing, but they
never gave themselves a chanceto prove it. They never gave
themselves a chance to getbetter at it and show themselves
that that's the right thing. Andso they stop it before it ever
evolves into that phenomenal,perfect way to drive leads or
(32:41):
get people excited or closedeals or whatever it is. So I
love that you're saying that beconsistent, be persistent with
it, keep it going. And I thinkthat that's really critical.
Lloyd Lobo (32:51):
That is that is very critical consistency. So Jason
Lemkin did the foreword on mybook from grassroots to
greatness, and honest forward,he, there's a quote I use, which
says consistency is the magicingredient that turns small
actions into big achievements.
You see if what Jason did withSastre is he, before it became
(33:15):
faster and the world's largestcommunity for business software.
He wrote two to three postsevery day on Quora for two
years, never stopped, neverstopped even till today, he
writes every day, right? OnLinkedIn, when when the audience
changed the world change fromother platforms and blogs to
(33:37):
LinkedIn for business. Sure thatconsistency is key, man, we
stop. And really consistency iswhat leads to eventually
becoming an overnight success.
We talked about our friend,Melissa cornea, she had been
writing on LinkedIn every day,almost every day or three, four
times a week, for the last yearand a half or so. And lately,
(33:59):
every post of her has been goingviral, like 1000 plus views in
the last six weeks, right? She'shad like a hit, and every six it
takes time. So you got to beconsistent. So once once you do
that, once you do that, you haveone form of content, you turn
into multiple pieces of content.
This is where people don'trealize it's not super hard. If
you figure out your ICP andfigure out their influencers,
(34:24):
you start reaching out, evenstart a podcast, right. I
understand lots of podcastshere. But if you have the best
podcast for a very specificniche that nobody else is doing,
right? It's better to go andenjoy
Matt Wolach (34:38):
a lot of people from our show. We get a lot of
people who come to us from ourshow. Exactly. It's so much fun.
And you're right we get a lot ofrepurposing out of it. And it's
it's I mean, a lot of greatthings marketing wise come from
it. But what I love is just thelearning the meeting great
people like yourself, it's justso cool how, you know you can
(34:58):
just kind of create thiscommunity like you're saying,
and now you've got people whoare supportive of you, people
who believe in you, and peoplewho trust you to help them out.
And it's pretty cool.
Lloyd Lobo (35:09):
Definitely. So now you have this audience building.
The next step is bring youraudience together. You can one a
few ways you can do it. Right.
You can open these recordings upto the public, make it live
interactive online meetup. Havethe newsletter because the
audience again is one waycommunication. Yes, LinkedIn,
you can comment and all of that,but it's still one to many in
many regards, right? Well,community is where audience to
(35:31):
audience happens not audience tohost where your own community
members can interact with oneanother. So maybe you start by
opening up the Zoom recordings,but maybe have like a chat group
on WhatsApp or discord. I thinkthough, what is invaluable is
hosting meetups every once in awhile. Because anytime you
(35:52):
incorporate more than twosenses, you start to build
stronger connections and bonds,right? If we were doing this in
person, we'd get to know eachother as families and probably
have a meal or two togetherwould talk about random things.
And that's when you start tobuild genuine connections and
you know, the power of in personwhen it comes to sales, right?
Why do you go on the golf coursewith people,
Matt Wolach (36:13):
I literally just told my clients today face to
face is the number one way tosell. And in software, we don't
get that often we get, you know,zoom, which is next best thing,
but it's definitely not as goodas being right there.
Lloyd Lobo (36:27):
But bringing people together in a community setting
is not really selling, it'shaving fun, right and around a
specific topic. And so when youdo that, you start to build
stronger connections. So do theonline stuff. Do the discord or
Whatsapp group or slack. If youraudience wants to interact their
seed and drive, you really haveto curate and seed it to drive
(36:49):
that interaction. And do thelive amas. But try to have in
person cadence of meetups, itdoesn't have to be a fancy
conference that you take a yearto plan. I mean, yes, we do that
attraction. But imagine justbringing 2032 people together.
(37:10):
You can you can do somethinglike that with a two week notice
and put it on rotation every twoweeks. Right? That's easy to do.
Yeah. 2030 people show, but thatthat camaraderie builds over
time, right. So you broughtpeople together, then from
there, you know, I think I thinkwhat that looks like is making
that commitment to say I'm gonnapost daily. I'm gonna, I'm gonna
(37:34):
send a newsletter, weekly, I'mgoing to release a podcast
Weekly. I'm going to curate thechat daily, then I'll do monthly
meetups. I'll do quarterlyretreats and maybe a big event,
once a year kind of thing, somecadence where people can feel
they're part of a ritual kind ofthing. How do you go go to being
(37:55):
a movement, it's all aboutcoming together for a purpose
that's greater and beyond yourproduct, right? It's bring like
Harley almost went bankrupt inthe 80s. Rebuild the company in
the ethos of community communityis not a marketing strategy.
That's the one thing I want tosay. Community is a business
strategy, Harley, when theyfaced competition from the
(38:16):
Japanese manufacturers,whatever, almost under in the
80s. So employees went out thereand deliberately started Harley
riding clubs, employees becamewriters, writers became
employees oversight from thePresident, they organize the big
same Harley campaign. Today,Harley has launched campaigns to
donate to breast cancer andautism and all kinds of things.
(38:38):
It's a movement, right? Likeweekend warriors plays a hardly
person just by what they'rewearing. Now, you don't have to
go that far back. Because youknow, a lot of people will say,
Oh, these are iconic brands fromlike, decades ago. Look at Mr.
Beast. Right and Mr. Beast isbiggest influencer came out of
nowhere through consistency, thesame thing. But what did he do
(39:01):
with his money, he didn't lacehis pockets. He could hop on a
private jet. But he took thatmoney and he does things
differently. That stands outright like curing people of
blindness or raising bringingthe community together, putting
where his money he putting hismouth where his money is or
money where his mouth is saying,I'm gonna put this money but you
donate to so bringing peopletogether to donate 20 million to
(39:25):
plant 20 million trees or raise30 million to take out 30
million out of the ocean. That'show you bring your community to
create a movement because Itruly believe there is no good
or bad people. There's Shades ofGrey, everyone wants to do
something good or has goodintentions for the most. And
(39:49):
life happens right? Think aboutthe lives we live, pick drive
kids, mortgage, car payments,taxes, life happens. You running
around, you're working and soyou can't bring sometimes you
can't don't have the time totake up a cause solo. But if you
can join, you know, in greatcommunity communities are built
(40:12):
on great alignment around greatpurpose. If you can align with
somebody's purpose, and feellike even if you're making a
small effort, those smalldroplets lead to a big ocean and
creates a big impact. You willdo it.
Matt Wolach (40:27):
I love it. I love it. And as we wrap here,
something about Mr. B, since youbrought him up, the reason he
was able to make that impact isbecause you go back to your
consistency. He did 1000 days,1000 days of videos straight,
kept doing it kept doing it keptdoing it and learning, learning
(40:48):
learning every single time totry and tweak update. What can I
change? He spoke with others,hey, what can I fix? How can we
improve it? And 1000 daysstraight? You mean you want to
get good at something, do itevery day for 1000 days. And
that's what he did.
Lloyd Lobo (41:02):
That is consistency is the magic ingredient that
turns small actions into bigoutcomes as a quote from Jason
Lemkin in the book. And yeah,you can get it on from
grassroots to greatness.com, orLloyd lobo.com. There's an E in
my name. So type from grassrootsto greatness.com. It'll be on
presale on August 16, or 17th.
And then you can get a copy onSeptember, the 12th. But, you
(41:28):
know, as we as we wrap here.
Yesterday's innovation is alwaystoday's option and tomorrow's
commodity. If you build acommunity, you won't you won't
become a commodity. Look atApple, it always talks about the
aspiration, it doesn't havebetter features than its
competitors. Not quite. It'salways talking about the
(41:51):
aspiration. Look at Nike, thesame thing, right? Nike has
probably one of the largestcommunities of athletes with
this running clubs, basketballclubs. It's it's around the
aspiration, not the product,when you sell features, you die
with those features. When yousell the aspiration, the
aspiration lives on forever. Andso building around the purpose
(42:15):
is what people want to align on,especially in today, right in
2023, we're talking about recordnumber of layoffs. But people
are able to make a living byconsulting on Fiverr or Upwork.
Right, or driving an Uber anddoing DoorDash people can make a
living and guess what the livingthey make right now. They can
(42:36):
optimize for taxes. And theydon't have to be answerable to
your clock. So they want to be apart of something, it better be
purpose driven. A great exampleof that alignment is when
President Kennedy was walkingthe halls of NASA at midnight,
he sees this janitor sweepingthe room. And he asks, What are
(42:58):
you doing this late? And he'slike, sir, I'm putting a man on
the moon. Think about howpowerful that is, right?
Cascading the purpose from thetop to the person who does the
smallest of the small jobsthinks that that little piece of
work is doing is part of movingthe purpose in a great
(43:19):
direction. So that's how I loveit.
Matt Wolach (43:24):
I love it, Lloyd, this has been super enjoyable. I
really appreciate you coming onsharing your story, we will put
the link to the book into theshow notes. So everybody go grab
that. And we'll put also yourlink for your LinkedIn, all that
fun stuff. If you're watchingthis, you'll see that in the
description down on YouTube, ifyou're listening to it, you'll
see it in the show notes. ButLloyd, this is awesome. Thank
(43:45):
you so much for coming on andsharing all of your wisdom.
Lloyd Lobo (43:48):
Thank you so much, Matt. This was a pleasure. And
like I said at the beginning youattract the energy you give out
so thank you for for being thatenergetic host and putting out
the best in me man.
Matt Wolach (43:59):
My pleasure. I really appreciate that and
everybody out there. Iappreciate you being here.
Again, make sure you'resubscribed to the show. You do
not want to miss any otherupcoming amazing guests like
Lloyd. So definitely hit thatand then we will see you next
time. Take care. Awesome.
Intro/ Outro (44:17):
Thanks for listening to Scale Your SaaS for
more help on finding great leadsand closing more deals. Go to
Mattwolach.com
You're definitely going to want to hear the story
of Lloyd Lobo this guy went froma refugee in Kuwait as a kid to
be able to exit his companystill keep a good share of the
company still keep a board seatstill impacts how that company
moves forward because of how herun his company. He is an expert
at community led growth. He hada lot of struggle figured out
(00:32):
how to solve that struggle interms of growing his company
through community led growth andhe shares exactly what to do so
that you can get a lot of peopleexcited about what you're doing
passionate and evangelical aboutyour product. This is a great
listen, I tell you, he is so funto listen to to hear his story.
So really enjoy this one.
Intro/ Outro (00:51):
Welcome to Scale Your SaaS, the podcast that
gives you proven techniques andformulas for boosting your
revenue and achieving your dreamexit brought to you by a guy
who's done just that multipletimes. Here's your host, Matt
Wolach,
Matt Wolach (01:07):
and welcome to Scale Your SaaS Thank you very
much for being here. I am reallyglad that you made it. So if you
have to first time definitelysubscribe to the show. This is
something where we're gonna behere to help you grow, help you
scale help you understand how torun an incredible company, and
somebody who knows how to do allof those things is with us
today. And I am jacked for this.
Everybody meet Lloyd Lobo.
(01:28):
Lloyd, how you doing?
Lloyd Lobo (01:29):
I am doing well what energy Matt. Now you you created
this virtuous cycle here becauseI'm gonna have to match your
energy you attract the energyyou give out. This is gonna be
exciting. I'm super pumped.
Thanks for having me.
Matt Wolach (01:40):
Absolutely. I'm so glad to have you here. And I
feel like you're somebody whobrings the enthusiasm and the
passion. So I don't think you'llhave any trouble matching that
energy. But let me make surethat everybody knows who you
are. So Lloyd Lobo, he is theCo-founder and a board member at
Boast he has been anentrepreneur podcast host
community builder and as theco-founder of Boast.ai. He
(02:02):
leverages the community ledgrowth model to bootstrap the
company to eight figure revenueinsecure, over 100 million in
funding, while also co foundingtraction, which is a community
empowering over 100,000innovators through connections
content and capital. Boast is afin tech platform that provides
R&D funding to help innovativecompanies fuel their growth. So
(02:24):
Lloyd absolutely understandsgrowing companies scale, and
making sure that he helps othersalong the way. So Lloyd, once
again, thanks for coming on theshow.
Lloyd Lobo (02:33):
Thank you for having me. I've heard great things. I
love your show. So I'm superpumped. Super excited to be in
front of your community.
Matt Wolach (02:39):
Awesome. Thank you.
Well, tell me what have you beenup to lately? And what's coming
up for you?
Lloyd Lobo (02:42):
Definitely. So not too long ago, we sold a majority
stake in the company at boastright 50 To some odd percent,
and had a transition. So me andmy co founders, like stepped out
of the day to day of thecompany. As a part of that I
went through my internal journeyof like, ah, what do I do this
company was my identity. I hadprobably over the last several
(03:04):
years only focused on last 10years only focused on business
on work, right did a couple offailed startups boast traction,
that that whole workenvironment, that community that
that was my tribe, that was myidentity. So leaving the day to
day of both and stepping to aboard was actually a hard
decision for me. I ended upprobably depressed I ended up
(03:28):
like clueless what to do. And mywife kept nagging at me, she's
like, you're in a fortunateposition, you can do whatever
you want. Why are you Where areyou latching on to things you
don't have instead of making themost of what you have. But I
realized that over the lastseveral years, I've neglected my
kids, I spent no time with them.
So ejected out of San FranciscoBay Area and moved to Dubai a
(03:50):
location where like, you know,it's completely disconnected but
still have a lot of friends andbut like not that same day to
day vibe, like, hey, Brandon,hustle, you got to do a company.
It's a different environment,which is more relaxed, more
subdued, everything is done foryou kind of like Disneyland for
(04:10):
adults. So I came upon all thisfree time and I started to
reflect on my journey as a kidgrowing up. And this is a very
common thread in my life. It wascommunity. My grandparents grew
up in the slums of India. My momgrew up in the slums of Mumbai.
And as a kid, when I used tovisit those, my grandparents, it
was all community. It was allpeople coming together. They
(04:34):
lived in this, probably fourwalls that was maybe fit for
three, four people, but 10 kids,and two parents lived in there,
and tin foil roof. And everytime I'd visit India asked my
grandfather, why do you have thestranger living here? And he
would tell me the only way tocreate abundance in life is to
help others without expectinganything in return. And those
(04:56):
memories as a kid. It used toRain every summer I'd go and
like puddles would turn intoponds and we were swimming in
the muck and watching TV was asocial activity because not many
of those houses i It's hard tosay houses because I don't know
what to call it. Right thosestructures had TVs so like,
(05:16):
every night you'd watch TV or amovie that will come on the
cable television, people wouldcome in and watch so they're
cooked in and like others are,are watching from the grills of
the window. I remember likeyou'd get fresh milk from the
from the cows and there was likea cow shed there. And one
evening, I as a kid, I wanted tobring a cow home and they let me
(05:40):
bring it so like, that was avery community wide vibe. And
then I was nine years old. Onemorning, my mom wakes me up and
says, Hey, I don't think you cango to school anymore. There's a
war has been hit the Gulf Warand Kuwait. My first reaction as
a kid was I knew I was going tofail. Grade four, because I had
studied for a math exam. Ialways used to procrastinate as
(06:06):
a kid, show up. It's a geo examgeography exam. My mom wakes me
up and she's like, I don't thinkyou can go to school. The war is
hit my first reaction is yes,you're never gonna find out. I
failed. But then when it sankin, right? When I started to see
a kid, I see the worry on theirface currencies are invalid.
There's no phones, you don'tknow where you're gonna go. And
(06:27):
that day, I went down thebuilding with my dad and saw
concern faces around. And peopleare trying to figure out what do
you do? Right, the security hascompletely lapsed Saddam Hussein
has taken over the country withhis troops. There's no no
certainty of what's going tohappen. And so people started to
come together and say, okay, youdon't want all guarded the
(06:48):
building from eight to 12. Youguarded from 12, to four, all
organized food, all organizedsupplies, yada, yada. And that's
that's what I realized, likewhat is communities like?
Somebody has an aspiration or aproblem, they look around,
others face the same, they cometogether. And every building
became a sub community. And theword of mouth spread,
(07:09):
coordinated with the UNembassies and it became the
largest evacuation movementprobably in his time, and took
us to safety. And as I went fromKuwait, to Baghdad, to Jordan,
on this rickety bus on theHighway of Death, buses were
bombed, you weren't sure you'regoing to live or die currencies
are invalid. Probably thereshould have been concerned adult
faces around the bus. But all Icould see is my parents, our
(07:32):
friends, all these adultssinging, playing the guitar
laughing. And I'm like, What isgoing on here? And then I
realized that it's neither thedestination nor the journeys,
the companions that matter themost, right? You could be on the
Highway of Death, on the way tohell. But great companions make
it memorable. Or you could besipping champagne with your ship
(07:56):
sipping Doha caviar with toxicpeople and want to get out of
there. Right? And then afterthat, already, Canada, yeah,
you've been there. You energyvampires, you just don't want to
be there. Right.
Matt Wolach (08:14):
So true, so true.
Lloyd Lobo (08:16):
And you know what I look at the slums of India or
the Gulf War. And then afterengineering, I made my way to
Canada with my parents aftergraduating engineering work at a
number of startups actually, Ifinished engineering and the
first job I took was coldcalling for a small company. And
entrepreneur I talked to said,the best skill you can learn if
(08:38):
you want to be an entrepreneursomeday sales. And I agree sales
is everything fast forwardtoday, sales is finding your
first customers figuring out andprioritizing what to build
convincing your wife afterrepeated failure to do the next
step of convincing investorsevangelizing the press employees
to join on low pay. It'severything. But so through that
(09:01):
cold calling job, my parentswere losing it right. You're
making 30k dialing for dollars,or a friend's kids did
engineering the work andMicrosoft and Google What are
you doing, right? But I made myway from from Canada to the
United States because my mygirlfriend who was also refugee
of the Gulf War, went to medschool and work on a series of
(09:21):
startups after a few failures,then connected with my best
friend from college, who was inthe space and wanted to do a
start up in this r&d tax creditsr&d funding because he was doing
it manually at big fouraccounting firms. And when we
came together to make cold callsto people to see if they'll buy
the service, nobody would talkto us imagine I randomly call
(09:43):
you and say hey, you know what,if you give me your product
development information, I'llget you some money from the
government. You gotta thinklike, you know, 10 years ago,
you're gonna think this is likea spammy thing. And even should
do it. Why should I give tworandos my, my data when I can go
to a big four accounting firm Sowe were getting slammed shut a
lot or like talking to like,companies that could even use a
(10:06):
service. And so the light bulbwent on is like K. Community is
part of like, the DNA here likemine personally. And the one
thing I can do is rely on thatcommunity we had as a function
of being a part of failedstartups have a bit of a
network. And, you know, it'snever the product you're
(10:27):
selling, but it's the outcome,you're driving for the customer.
And we knew people wanted r&dfunding to accelerate
innovation. They wanted toaccelerate innovation, to drive
business growth. Why can't theywhat stops them from driving
business growth is all thesethings that they don't know. So
that was a timer podcast inexists? There were no like
(10:48):
tactical events, it was all veryhigh level. So we started
finding founders in our networkwas a level up from our audience
to come and share behind closeddoors, their learnings, how did
you get your first customers?
How did you write your firstsales scripts? How did you build
your first product? How do youmake your first few hires Right?
Like, how do you run a marketingcampaign that generates results
(11:10):
are just not from straight fromthe people who did it? The
founders or the early employees?
And then our messaging changefrom Hey, buy my stuff to hey,
we're hosting an event with Xinfluencer or x person who's
going to talk about why topicthat's relevant to your
business. We got 10 spots wouldyou love to come? There's going
(11:32):
to be some pizza. People startedcoming. first meetup. 10 people
showed up 1520 30 People startedshowing up. One fine day 200
people landed at that co workingspace. And they're like, Guys,
this is not a pizza night meetup. It's a full blown
conference. Fast forward nowseven, eight years that's
(11:55):
evolved into a large communitytraction, it helped us bootstrap
to almost 10 million in funding.
I mean, almost 10 million inrevenue and lots of funding
between debt and equity tookover 100 million. We met our
investors who bought thecompany. Through that community,
they came to an event we met theguys who gave us the 100 million
that facility through thatcommunities is done a lot. So
(12:15):
that was the other reflectionthat I that I left the day to
day of the company. And like Isaid, I ended up depressed,
drunk, overweight, I was like, Ilost my identity. So I started
just dabbling in things. Andthings that I think's to
overcome it, right, like a lotof what we do, to battled
depression is what medicationmeditation and masturbation,
(12:39):
masturbation being euphemism forall the other things you do, you
don't go to the root cause. Butsometimes, you know, attacking
the root cause is the mostimportant thing. Because if it's
the environment, or the peoplethat's bothering you, then you
got to change that. Because noamount of medication or
meditation is going to solve it.
It's just kicking the canfurther. And I kept thinking
(13:03):
that you know, drinking andpartying and doing all these
other things is going to help meget away and then I realized
it's not it's the environment,right? But But through that
exercise, I got extremelyoverweight and unhealthy and the
peloton community is what helpedme get to good health. My wife
(13:23):
wakes me up and she's like, lookat you. If something happens to
you, your family is going to beleft holding the bag you've
barely spent any time with thekids. Now that you've come into
some money instead of spendingtime with them, you're moping
about like leaving the day today of your company. And in
she's like, right after Easter.
The funny thing was right afterthe exit. I was working, working
working and our seller let thedeal go through and I'll take
(13:46):
everyone to Bora Bora. And she'sshe would always say nobody
cares about your Bora Bora. Wecare about having dinner time
with you are focused on with youwith the phones away. Nobody
cares about one vacation a yearthat is a compound interest on
being together a little bitevery day is what builds
relationships and I neverthought about that. And, and so
the deal happened. We bookedeveryone to Bora Bora, my family
(14:12):
my parents my sister two daysbefore Moreover, I got bilateral
COVID pneumonia was hospitalizedunable to breathe. Oh no. And
and I promised myself after thatincident that I'd come back and
spend more time with the kidsand get better. But all habits
die real hard. The company wentobviously came into funding in
(14:33):
growth mode. We added like80 100 people and it's just
things got chaotic and mydaughter comes to me and she's
like dad, everything you said inthe press and to us that if you
died your biggest regret wouldwould be you didn't spend enough
time with us was a lie. And I'mlike sweetie, listen. I don't
(14:55):
want to say we got lots ofpeople there's you know It's
chaotic times when you grow fromlike 3040 ish to 120 130 ish we
got to do right by them andshe's like Dad Why don't you go
work for somebody thinks likeyou so I can have my dad back.
Right and so a lot of theseconflicting things as they
depart the day to day was waseating me and my wife's like,
(15:18):
you might not get a third chanceif you rely on these things,
these external you know externalthings to get your mind off
right it has to come from withinyou the glass is always half
full. So that night as I lay onbed, unable to sleep, I see the
peloton which had probably wehad for like four years but turn
(15:40):
into a clothing rush. So Mike,let me hop on regular she's
given me the health lecture overand over, she's a physician I'm
gonna hop on and hop on the theinstructor Coincidentally, I get
this instructor which I'm gladthat happened. I felt an instant
connection she was coming offmaternity leave and didn't feel
as strong. And so she broughther vulnerable self and she
(16:01):
said, Hey, I don't feel asstrong. I'm weak. I can't write
as before I don't want to dothis. And then she yells out
self pity is toxic one crank oneshift one right on the block I
am I can, with I have the tigerfrom Rocky playing. So that one
ride went so fast turned intotwo turn three. And as a
community I relied on peoplehigh fiving each other I was
looking forward to my dailyrides, streaks. And so when I
(16:22):
came back to good health andfreedom, and as I reflected on
like, I've been an entrepreneurworking like 80 100 hours a week
for the last 10 years, I don'tknow how to sit and do nothing.
And I have all this free time.
And my journey from my parentsbeing the slums of India to
having literally SlumdogMillionaire, being financial
(16:46):
freedom, the one thing I can dois pay homage to the community.
Right. And so I started talkingto hundreds and 1000s of people
about community researching andjust trying to see if there are
parallels to my learnings likewe bootstrap boast based on that
and got our investors and startto find very common threads and
(17:07):
then started talking and askingthe same questions and found 13
common rules amongst all thesecommunity led businesses from
Harley Davidson to HubSpot, thatI put into a book called from
grassroots to greatness, 13rules to build iconic brands
with community led growth. Andthe one common theme, or 111,
(17:28):
common theme in that in thatjourney was which which you will
find funny is from Christ orChristianity, to CrossFit.
Therefore common themes are verycommon framework. Really, when
people listen to you, or buyyour product, you have an
audience.
(17:48):
You bring that audiencetogether, to interact with one
another, you have a community,you bring that community
together to create impact. It'sa movement, and through rituals
and undying faith and itspurpose. That movement then
turns into a cult or religion.
That's why I said from Christ toCrossFit, this is the journey of
every obscure idea to iconic,right. And so it was
(18:15):
interesting, right? Audience,community, movement, religion,
or cult, like, try to try to,you know, ignore our religion
side of things, because I don'twant to take it in that track,
but argue with somebody with acult brand like a CrossFit or a
Harley fan, or Apple, Apple, orBitcoin and they'll
Matt Wolach (18:38):
cut you, right?
Yes, absolutely.
Lloyd Lobo (18:41):
How did it start? It started with an audience. And
then we came together and becamea community, then the community
started to work together tocreate something, and it became
a movement and then throughcertain rituals and beliefs. In
this purpose, it turns into acall. So I talked about some of
that. And it is very, veryfascinating.
Matt Wolach (19:04):
We'll be right back. Skill your SAS is
supported by Toro wave. Lots ofsoftware leaders I talked to who
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(19:26):
crickets, nothing reach out.
They're not responding to you atall. And when these software
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Or actually, I should say withthe wrong medium. What they're
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(20:10):
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(20:56):
poor wind. And we're back. Yeah.
And this book coming up. I mean,that sounds amazing. It's coming
out in September, right.
Lloyd Lobo (21:08):
September 12. We'll do the pre sale later this week,
early next week. And and yeah,so September 12, is what it is.
Matt Wolach (21:18):
I love it. So what can you share with our audience
about some of these rules forcommunity led growth that they
can apply within their ownbusinesses?
Lloyd Lobo (21:25):
Definitely. So I'll break down some very basic
things. And it might be it mightbe very easy to digest here. So
five or four or five rules, I'llshare in a very tactical way and
effectively put it in theframework of not maybe how
Harley did it or Apple did itbecause it's it might be very
(21:46):
hard to connect with a brandthat's worth billions. But I
could talk about my journeygoing into 10 million bootstrap
with no marketing team. Right?
And that that might connectbetter. So I think the step
number one and you'll appreciatethis given you sales is your
life is your lifeline, right isstarting with the ideal customer
(22:07):
profile, like figuring out anunderserved niche and
identifying their pains, figureout where they eat, breathe,
drink sleep, don't just figureout the problems, but figure out
their aspirations and goals, howcan they become the best
versions of themselves, right?
So a lot of the times whathappens is we focused on the
(22:29):
solution should focus on theproblem or the aspiration
because customers care about theoutcome for them, they don't
care about your product. I wantto I want to get fit, I don't
care about a gym membership. Iwant to get more leads, I don't
care about the marketingautomation tool. But the thing
is, we get so hyped up in ourproduct and our features that we
(22:50):
forget the customer and some ofthese big big iconic brands are
focused on the purpose right theend purpose is like what are you
driving? What is the outcomeyou're driving? What is it what
is the purpose for the customerfor that audience? So start
there, once you have that, drawthe circle of influence around
your customer. So you have theICP so I boasted was innovators
(23:13):
basically people who build newproducts or improved existing
products. Now what is the circleof influence? Meaning? Who are
the influencers, that your idealcustomer profile listens to?
When you have that list? Thoseare people if you host events or
podcasts or meetups or webinars,you can invite us speakers,
(23:34):
right? Because you will gettheir brand rub. The second is
who what are the tools orservices do they buy? So if it's
an entrepreneur and I'm sellingthem r&d funding, well, probably
it's startup legal, probablyit's venture capitalists
probably it is people who selltools like Stripe or HubSpot,
all the whole stack that founderwould buy, right? That's the
(23:57):
gusto for payroll. So those arepeople that you could partner
with like say if you did events,conferences, webinars, meetups,
like you can do joint partneractivity with them. And then the
third is what channels where arethe Hangout? Basically, where
are they frequent? Like? Arethey on LinkedIn? Or are they on
Twitter? Like you got to figureout where they hang out what
(24:18):
blogs what magazines they read,so you can be prevalent there so
if they read TechCrunch, butyou're throwing stuff on PR
Newswire, then why like go whereyour audiences, right? If
they're asking for LinkedIn andyou're blasting the hell out of
friggin Instagram, then you gotto ask yourself where What are
you trying to attract? Right. Sothat the so you start with the
(24:38):
ICP, you figure out theaspirations and goals and the
problems, not just what yoursolution solves. And the other
benefit of focusing on theaspiration or the problem is if
you focus on the solution,you'll keep making your solution
better. If you focus on theproblem and the customers
aspiration You'll grow beyondyour solution to a big iconic
(25:02):
company, right? Because if youlook at every company that's 100
million in revenue, they'realways Multi Product companies
like Salesforce like Salesforce,a web billions in revenue, they
don't just have the CRM, theyhave the Cs, and they have the
marketing automation. They haveservices. Every major company
has a second act and a third actand a fourth act. If you're just
(25:23):
focused on your solution, youwill never see beyond your
product, you have to understandwhat is the customer's
aspiration? What are the goals?
What are they what are theytrying to drive, what are they
trying to become. And that's howyou can make that leap of adding
product to product free. So it'svery important. And that's how
you can come up with also withcontent, right? If you only
think about your solution,you'll only ever talk about your
(25:43):
solution. But if you think aboutthe customer's aspiration, you
fall in love with your customer.
And you can help them becomesuccessful beyond your product
or service. You're obviously foryou know, HubSpot, which we're
all familiar with. I was anengineer who went into sales,
like I said, and eventuallyended up at a startup in sales.
(26:06):
But it's so happens whenstartups don't have product
market fit. You end up in sales,but you have to actually be also
product manager, product managerand do marketing for like, Oh,
we don't have any customers Sofigure out who you should sell
to and then by the way, figureout what what we need to build.
And then also figure out how welaunched this was the best
(26:27):
experience ever. I nevercomplain I barely got paid, I
think I got paid like $45,000 isthe best experience ever. Those
were the like, you know, thatdrawn a lot. You learn so much.
But during that time, this was Ithink design five or six. There
was no content around digitalmarketing, online marketing
anything so I started Googlingon all I found was HubSpot
(26:50):
inbound community and theirinbound marketing certificate.
And I remember Gary Vaynerchukwith chubby little guy selling
wine wine TV was teaching acourse on their on YouTube,
YouTube marketing, like how tohow to create YouTube videos. So
I learned a lot is a function ofthat. But that's that's what it
is right? If you focus on thecustomers aspiration, then
(27:11):
HubSpot became one of the topmarketing automation platforms
and added sales now adding CES,it's grown based on following
the customers aspirations. Sothat's what you should start
with. Then the second step, thethird, the once you figure out
the ICP and figure out theircircle of influence, then you
figure out what type ofcommunity you want to build.
(27:33):
There are three types ofcommunities you can build. There
is a community of practice,which is bringing people
together to learn about ourtopic, right? You're, you're
building effectively a communityof practice here with the SAS,
SAS ver is a community ofpractice, as well. HubSpot
inbound is a community ofpractice, where people want to
learn about a specific fieldthat has nothing to do with the
(27:55):
product, gain sites, customersuccess, community pulse.
Gainsight is a great example. Ijoined their community, they had
no product. And then eventuallysomeday they built they built a
product and people were like,Hey, you educated me on customer
success? Why wouldn't I use yourproduct? So once you've once
you've figured that out, soCommunity of Practice, then the
(28:15):
second one is community aproduct, which is learning about
a product, like how do I getbetter at Microsoft? Or how do I
get better at GitHub? Or how doI get better at Atlassian?
Right. And the third one is acommunity of play where you come
together around socialactivities. Like I would say, in
many ways all the Red Bull has acommunity of evangelists around
(28:36):
Red Bull, but it's really acommunity of player hosting high
energy events, right? But likeyour paddle club, or your soccer
club, do you belong to any ofthose kinds of communities?
Matt Wolach (28:47):
I have a golf fleet. Yep.
Lloyd Lobo (28:48):
Exactly right.
That's great. It's fun, it'sfun. If you don't have product
market fit, meaning you don'thave at least 100 Customers who
love your product, use it andwant to congregate. There is no
point in building a communityproduct because in the
beginning, you're just trying toget people to learn about you
and spread the message. And whenyou have a community a product,
when you barely have anycustomers, nobody's going to
(29:09):
want to come hang out there.
Like we don't want to buy yourstuff, right. And so So figure
out the community you want tobuild if you don't a product
market fit, it's a community ofpractice or community of play.
Then you start following thatframework of audience community,
movement, religion and creatingthe audience can start with you
(29:32):
know, ICP, write down 100 200burning questions that your
audience has. So you cangenerate a repository of ideas
like think hey, if I have towrite this ultimate guide to
XYZ, what chapters sub chaptersand topics it would include.
Then you can turn that one formof content into multiple forms
right like so you interview say,sure you have your list of
(29:54):
influencers, interview them on alive zoom like an on a zoom
webinar. Turn that into Thevideo for YouTube the audio for
podcast, turned the shorts intoYouTube shorts, tick tock in
serials. Take the text posted onLinkedIn on on Twitter. So you
start building a bit of anaudience there. Consistency is
(30:15):
key, you can you can turn aseries of videos into an e book
or a course like on Maven or oneof these cohort based learning
courses or just a recordedcourse on Thinkific or something
like that. But you startbuilding an audience. The key is
consistency, though a lot ofpeople are not consistent,
right? We the first meetup wedid if we just stopped after the
(30:39):
third meetup, because only1010 10 People were showing up,
then we'd give up right? Butbecause we kept that
consistency, we got kicked outof the core game space when 200
people showed up one day, and itturned into attraction
eventually. And then during thepandemic, we had to cancel a
(30:59):
conference. And he didn't knowwhat to do. We had 54 or 55
speakers lined up. I personallycouldn't bring myself to do a
two day virtual summit because Ican't sit through a virtual
summit personally. So I'm like,I'm never gonna organize this,
let alone if the tech fail.
Let's see. You know how thathappens. Yeah, reports. So I
requested every speaker to joinus for a live ama session once a
(31:21):
week. And that gave me likewebinars for a year now blasted
our same audience. And everyweek, five 600 people show up.
But very quickly, within amatter of a month or two, we
started getting requests fromother speakers to join because
people liked that format of onehour a week like a TV show that
unit. So we made it to a weekand now you're getting four or
(31:45):
500 people tuning in your videoswent to YouTube or YouTube on
average. Yeah, YouTube's if yougo to the traction coffee,
YouTube, you'll see each sessionin the past several months
averages eight to 10,000 views.
And and then that grew our emaildatabase went from I think in
the pandemic from 30,000subscribers to 100 and some odd
(32:08):
1000 subscribers over a two yearspan. That's phenomena have
consistent the first few ones wedid 4050 people showed up. If we
weren't consistent though. It'sdone ran just
Matt Wolach (32:20):
staying with it. I talked to so many leaders who
try something and it might havebeen the right thing, but they
never gave themselves a chanceto prove it. They never gave
themselves a chance to getbetter at it and show themselves
that that's the right thing. Andso they stop it before it ever
evolves into that phenomenal,perfect way to drive leads or
(32:41):
get people excited or closedeals or whatever it is. So I
love that you're saying that beconsistent, be persistent with
it, keep it going. And I thinkthat that's really critical.
Lloyd Lobo (32:51):
That is that is very critical consistency. So Jason
Lemkin did the foreword on mybook from grassroots to
greatness, and honest forward,he, there's a quote I use, which
says consistency is the magicingredient that turns small
actions into big achievements.
You see if what Jason did withSastre is he, before it became
(33:15):
faster and the world's largestcommunity for business software.
He wrote two to three postsevery day on Quora for two
years, never stopped, neverstopped even till today, he
writes every day, right? OnLinkedIn, when when the audience
changed the world change fromother platforms and blogs to
(33:37):
LinkedIn for business. Sure thatconsistency is key, man, we
stop. And really consistency iswhat leads to eventually
becoming an overnight success.
We talked about our friend,Melissa cornea, she had been
writing on LinkedIn every day,almost every day or three, four
times a week, for the last yearand a half or so. And lately,
(33:59):
every post of her has been goingviral, like 1000 plus views in
the last six weeks, right? She'shad like a hit, and every six it
takes time. So you got to beconsistent. So once once you do
that, once you do that, you haveone form of content, you turn
into multiple pieces of content.
This is where people don'trealize it's not super hard. If
you figure out your ICP andfigure out their influencers,
(34:24):
you start reaching out, evenstart a podcast, right. I
understand lots of podcastshere. But if you have the best
podcast for a very specificniche that nobody else is doing,
right? It's better to go andenjoy
Matt Wolach (34:38):
a lot of people from our show. We get a lot of
people who come to us from ourshow. Exactly. It's so much fun.
And you're right we get a lot ofrepurposing out of it. And it's
it's I mean, a lot of greatthings marketing wise come from
it. But what I love is just thelearning the meeting great
people like yourself, it's justso cool how, you know you can
(34:58):
just kind of create thiscommunity like you're saying,
and now you've got people whoare supportive of you, people
who believe in you, and peoplewho trust you to help them out.
And it's pretty cool.
Lloyd Lobo (35:09):
Definitely. So now you have this audience building.
The next step is bring youraudience together. You can one a
few ways you can do it. Right.
You can open these recordings upto the public, make it live
interactive online meetup. Havethe newsletter because the
audience again is one waycommunication. Yes, LinkedIn,
you can comment and all of that,but it's still one to many in
many regards, right? Well,community is where audience to
(35:31):
audience happens not audience tohost where your own community
members can interact with oneanother. So maybe you start by
opening up the Zoom recordings,but maybe have like a chat group
on WhatsApp or discord. I thinkthough, what is invaluable is
hosting meetups every once in awhile. Because anytime you
(35:52):
incorporate more than twosenses, you start to build
stronger connections and bonds,right? If we were doing this in
person, we'd get to know eachother as families and probably
have a meal or two togetherwould talk about random things.
And that's when you start tobuild genuine connections and
you know, the power of in personwhen it comes to sales, right?
Why do you go on the golf coursewith people,
Matt Wolach (36:13):
I literally just told my clients today face to
face is the number one way tosell. And in software, we don't
get that often we get, you know,zoom, which is next best thing,
but it's definitely not as goodas being right there.
Lloyd Lobo (36:27):
But bringing people together in a community setting
is not really selling, it'shaving fun, right and around a
specific topic. And so when youdo that, you start to build
stronger connections. So do theonline stuff. Do the discord or
Whatsapp group or slack. If youraudience wants to interact their
seed and drive, you really haveto curate and seed it to drive
(36:49):
that interaction. And do thelive amas. But try to have in
person cadence of meetups, itdoesn't have to be a fancy
conference that you take a yearto plan. I mean, yes, we do that
attraction. But imagine justbringing 2032 people together.
(37:10):
You can you can do somethinglike that with a two week notice
and put it on rotation every twoweeks. Right? That's easy to do.
Yeah. 2030 people show, but thatthat camaraderie builds over
time, right. So you broughtpeople together, then from
there, you know, I think I thinkwhat that looks like is making
that commitment to say I'm gonnapost daily. I'm gonna, I'm gonna
(37:34):
send a newsletter, weekly, I'mgoing to release a podcast
Weekly. I'm going to curate thechat daily, then I'll do monthly
meetups. I'll do quarterlyretreats and maybe a big event,
once a year kind of thing, somecadence where people can feel
they're part of a ritual kind ofthing. How do you go go to being
(37:55):
a movement, it's all aboutcoming together for a purpose
that's greater and beyond yourproduct, right? It's bring like
Harley almost went bankrupt inthe 80s. Rebuild the company in
the ethos of community communityis not a marketing strategy.
That's the one thing I want tosay. Community is a business
strategy, Harley, when theyfaced competition from the
(38:16):
Japanese manufacturers,whatever, almost under in the
80s. So employees went out thereand deliberately started Harley
riding clubs, employees becamewriters, writers became
employees oversight from thePresident, they organize the big
same Harley campaign. Today,Harley has launched campaigns to
donate to breast cancer andautism and all kinds of things.
(38:38):
It's a movement, right? Likeweekend warriors plays a hardly
person just by what they'rewearing. Now, you don't have to
go that far back. Because youknow, a lot of people will say,
Oh, these are iconic brands fromlike, decades ago. Look at Mr.
Beast. Right and Mr. Beast isbiggest influencer came out of
nowhere through consistency, thesame thing. But what did he do
(39:01):
with his money, he didn't lacehis pockets. He could hop on a
private jet. But he took thatmoney and he does things
differently. That stands outright like curing people of
blindness or raising bringingthe community together, putting
where his money he putting hismouth where his money is or
money where his mouth is saying,I'm gonna put this money but you
donate to so bringing peopletogether to donate 20 million to
(39:25):
plant 20 million trees or raise30 million to take out 30
million out of the ocean. That'show you bring your community to
create a movement because Itruly believe there is no good
or bad people. There's Shades ofGrey, everyone wants to do
something good or has goodintentions for the most. And
(39:49):
life happens right? Think aboutthe lives we live, pick drive
kids, mortgage, car payments,taxes, life happens. You running
around, you're working and soyou can't bring sometimes you
can't don't have the time totake up a cause solo. But if you
can join, you know, in greatcommunity communities are built
(40:12):
on great alignment around greatpurpose. If you can align with
somebody's purpose, and feellike even if you're making a
small effort, those smalldroplets lead to a big ocean and
creates a big impact. You willdo it.
Matt Wolach (40:27):
I love it. I love it. And as we wrap here,
something about Mr. B, since youbrought him up, the reason he
was able to make that impact isbecause you go back to your
consistency. He did 1000 days,1000 days of videos straight,
kept doing it kept doing it keptdoing it and learning, learning
(40:48):
learning every single time totry and tweak update. What can I
change? He spoke with others,hey, what can I fix? How can we
improve it? And 1000 daysstraight? You mean you want to
get good at something, do itevery day for 1000 days. And
that's what he did.
Lloyd Lobo (41:02):
That is consistency is the magic ingredient that
turns small actions into bigoutcomes as a quote from Jason
Lemkin in the book. And yeah,you can get it on from
grassroots to greatness.com, orLloyd lobo.com. There's an E in
my name. So type from grassrootsto greatness.com. It'll be on
presale on August 16, or 17th.
And then you can get a copy onSeptember, the 12th. But, you
(41:28):
know, as we as we wrap here.
Yesterday's innovation is alwaystoday's option and tomorrow's
commodity. If you build acommunity, you won't you won't
become a commodity. Look atApple, it always talks about the
aspiration, it doesn't havebetter features than its
competitors. Not quite. It'salways talking about the
(41:51):
aspiration. Look at Nike, thesame thing, right? Nike has
probably one of the largestcommunities of athletes with
this running clubs, basketballclubs. It's it's around the
aspiration, not the product,when you sell features, you die
with those features. When yousell the aspiration, the
aspiration lives on forever. Andso building around the purpose
(42:15):
is what people want to align on,especially in today, right in
2023, we're talking about recordnumber of layoffs. But people
are able to make a living byconsulting on Fiverr or Upwork.
Right, or driving an Uber anddoing DoorDash people can make a
living and guess what the livingthey make right now. They can
(42:36):
optimize for taxes. And theydon't have to be answerable to
your clock. So they want to be apart of something, it better be
purpose driven. A great exampleof that alignment is when
President Kennedy was walkingthe halls of NASA at midnight,
he sees this janitor sweepingthe room. And he asks, What are
(42:58):
you doing this late? And he'slike, sir, I'm putting a man on
the moon. Think about howpowerful that is, right?
Cascading the purpose from thetop to the person who does the
smallest of the small jobsthinks that that little piece of
work is doing is part of movingthe purpose in a great
(43:19):
direction. So that's how I loveit.
Matt Wolach (43:24):
I love it, Lloyd, this has been super enjoyable. I
really appreciate you coming onsharing your story, we will put
the link to the book into theshow notes. So everybody go grab
that. And we'll put also yourlink for your LinkedIn, all that
fun stuff. If you're watchingthis, you'll see that in the
description down on YouTube, ifyou're listening to it, you'll
see it in the show notes. ButLloyd, this is awesome. Thank
(43:45):
you so much for coming on andsharing all of your wisdom.
Lloyd Lobo (43:48):
Thank you so much, Matt. This was a pleasure. And
like I said at the beginning youattract the energy you give out
so thank you for for being thatenergetic host and putting out
the best in me man.
Matt Wolach (43:59):
My pleasure. I really appreciate that and
everybody out there. Iappreciate you being here.
Again, make sure you'resubscribed to the show. You do
not want to miss any otherupcoming amazing guests like
Lloyd. So definitely hit thatand then we will see you next
time. Take care. Awesome.
Intro/ Outro (44:17):
Thanks for listening to Scale Your SaaS for
more help on finding great leadsand closing more deals. Go to
Mattwolach.com
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