Scaling Clean Episode 47: Nextracker and Doral Renewables

This episode of Scaling Clean is a first on two fronts. We’ve interviewed not one, but two guests, and captured it all on video. I sat down with Nextracker founder and CEO Dan Shugar and Doral Renewables CEO Nick Cohen to hear the story behind Mammoth Solar, America’s largest solar project, and how it’s fueling prosperity in the heart of Indiana.

The project’s name comes from a woolly mammoth whose bones were discovered in the field next to the site, and are now on display at the Smithsonian. Dan and Nick share how they made it a priority to work directly with landowners and the community while introducing agrivoltaics. Nick emphasized the importance of protecting landowner rights, and Dan highlights how local steel manufacturing is essential to Mammoth’s long-term impact.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
And this is Scaling Clean, the podcast for clean economy CE OS
investors and the people who advise them.
I'm your host, Melissa Baldwin. Each show we bring you usable
insights from tested leaders that you can apply to the
business of running your business.

(00:20):
This is a special episode for Scaling Clean.
We've had repeat guests on the show before, but we've never had
a joint interview. I'm pleased to have two
incredible CE OS joining me today.
Dan Sugar is the CEO of Nexttracker, the leading global
solar tracking company for 10 years, running Nexttracker IPO D
in 2023. And in the last year, they've
announced new products and technology, expanding the

(00:43):
company's platform beyond solar trackers.
Nick Cohen is the CEO of Doral Renewables, a developer with 17
gigawatts of projects across 22 states.
Doral is the renewable energy developer behind America's
biggest solar project, Mammoth. There's a reason why it's called
that, And I'll let my guests tell you more.
Doral uses what they call a farmer friendly approach to

(01:05):
energy development, and we'll betalking more about that in the
show as well. We brought the two of them on
the show to lead a conversation around supply chain, domestic
manufacturing. Nick and Dan, welcome to the
show. Thanks for being here.
So first I want to just get started by the two of you
working together. You're both CEOs at large, well
respected companies. How did you 2 first meet?

(01:27):
Is there a story there? Well, you know, I, we have
friends that are, that brought us together And the, the reason
I think that people identified us as not only having a good
business outlook, working together, but also personalities

(01:48):
and philosophies, is that Dan values relationships And he, I
mean it, it his own people, the people he's worked with in the
past and his customers. And you know, that is our core
value as well and my personal philosophy in life.
So, you know, I, I think we, we were a match meant to be.

(02:09):
Yeah, I really appreciate that, Nick.
And I have to tell you, well, I have told you this, but I'll
share it with our the folks listening to this podcast.
You gave us the opportunity to participate in your
groundbreaking and then ceremonyfor commercial operation of your
huge mammoth project in Indiana.And I've never seen that level

(02:36):
of proactive engagement with thecommunity.
It was very moving and wonderfulto participate in that and also
really exemplified the kind of company you are and inspired us.
And I'm, I'm appreciative to be supporting you and your, your

(02:56):
great EPC partners on that particular project.
The there's communities are understandably sensitive when
solar projects come into their areas because they're concerned
that their way of life continuesto be extended and built upon
that. There's value for the

(03:17):
communities and what you've donereally on the ground there in
Indiana where you had so much participation of the farming
community, the rural developmentcommunity, both at the local and
the state level really became a win, win, win for for Doral, for

(03:37):
your land owners and for your partners like your EPC's and
next Tracker. So thank you for that and the
opportunity to get to know you better in this process.
Yeah, thanks, Dan. It was easy working with you
because you know, you you are very grounded in reality with
the people on the ground and youknow, your technology makes our

(03:59):
projects better, but even betteryet.
And Melissa, your audience mightbe interested in knowing this
and you probably have some questions later on.
Dan and his his business has connected us with incredible
manufacturing in the Midwest. You know, we have more steel on
our project than the Empire State Building has.

(04:19):
And, you know, Dan's company is out there procuring that steel
and using, you know, Indiana workforce and Indiana
manufacturers and other Midwestern manufacturers to
produce it. But when you think of like,
sunshine and butterflies and solar, there's a lot more to it.
There's steel and jobs and manufacturing.

(04:40):
It's an entire industry cluster.You got right at one of my
questions, which I wanted to hear more about the supply
chain. But before we go there, can you
tell us quickly for our listeners who don't know, why is
Mammoth called Mammoth? Well, I mean, you would think
that what a great name for the biggest project in America.
But I'll tell you what, it started out with one farmer in a

(05:04):
field who told me that, oh, in the next field they found a
woolly mammoth. And that farmer said, you should
name it mammoth. And a little did I know.
Every farmer we talked to said, yes, I want to be in this
project. And then it literally became a
mammoth project. So, So.
Yeah. And, and, and some of the

(05:24):
farmers were at the Smithsonian in Washington, and they sent us
a picture there they were standing next to the actual
mammoth from the field. And there it said Pulaski
County, Indiana, and it's, it's sitting in the Smithsonian.
No way. The bones from those fields are
in the Smithsonian. Yeah, as a fully assembled

(05:46):
mammoth, which from what I understand is kind of rare.
And there it is, standing there.And that's what we're named
after, the actual mammoth. And everybody can go to
Washington and see it if they want to.
Nice. Well, I want to.
My next question is on supply chain.
You started to get at that a little bit, Nick, but I want to
hear what you've done with supply chain in Indiana, with

(06:07):
Mammoth. And specifically I want to hear
the term circular economy has been thrown around, but I want
to hear what does that mean in your words, Nick?
When you're talking about the amount of steel that that Dan's
company brought in and other resources, I I think he's the
right guy to kick this question off.
Yeah, my pleasure. Well, let me share the back

(06:30):
story for how this came to be. So we've been the number one
tracker and structure company for the last 10 years globally
and the number one company in the United States.
Up until about 5 years ago, our customers were just very focused
on what's the lowest delivered cost of product, OK.

(06:52):
And typically that most of that was coming from overseas.
What happened during the initialpart of the pandemic was global
supply chains really melted down.
Things changed greatly. For example, there used to be
you could count on global logistics to be able to bring a
container from point A to point B pretty much anywhere in the

(07:15):
world for $2500 to $3000 and do so, you know, very with good,
good delivery time. That changed during the
pandemic. We had steel price doubled in a
little over 1/4 and logistics price tripled.

(07:37):
Moreover, the lead time to get goods from place A to place B
extended massively It it lead times went from a month to 2-3
months and sometimes were indeterminate.
At the time. We saw a variety of factors
drive this. Also a lot of natural disasters.

(07:58):
We had wars, issues with the Panama Canal, issues with the
the Suez Canal and so forth. So we just said at this point of
our career and the growth of thecompany, we are not gonna go
forward like this. We're going to in major markets
like the United States massivelybuild out supply chain and we've

(08:20):
done the same thing in other markets like India.
This is before the Build Back Better and the IRA legislation
came to pass. So we basically have completed
dozens of factories across the United States to fabricate our
tracker parts and we partnered with three out of the four
biggest steel mills in the US toactually go mill direct with the

(08:47):
US Steel. And for example, Indiana, as
Nick has mentioned, that state alone produces about 25% of the
total US Steel made in the United States.
So it was a perfect place to really lean in.
And so in that region we worked heavily with the major mills to

(09:09):
source local steel and then fabricate it locally delivered
to the job site. A lot of benefits came along
with this. Yes, the US Steel's more
expensive. However, you saved a lot of
money with logistics, saved a lot of time.
We're able to support the EPC's with on time delivery parts.
Also, we didn't appreciate how much cleaner the US Steel was

(09:32):
than the overseas steel. The US Steel is an order of
magnitude less carbon dioxide per ton of steel produced at at
this the the original mill. And we were able to put tracker
fabrication physically on this on the campus of the major mills
or nearby. So when you put all that

(09:53):
together, it resulted in a much more efficient delivery process,
an affordable process that was predictable, supported the build
schedules, ported the EPC, and at the end also delivered a much
cleaner US Steel product. And, and then, and then to
complete the circle, you know, firstly the power is being sold
to Indiana utilities and companies who are using it to

(10:17):
benefit people in the Midwest. Also, every single day we have
1200 people, local people out there working at high wage,
putting this project together. And so that it's an incredible
economic opportunity for the local economy.
And then the final thing that you might not think about, but

(10:38):
it, it, it rings so true is thatwe are bringing sustained like
food practices back to the farms, the small farms.
You know, there was a time in America where small farms
cultivated food. Today the small farms are

(10:58):
struggling and a lot of them arequagmired in soy, soybeans and
corn, which is a very difficult commodity product, especially if
you don't have a large scale. We have agrivoltaics introduced
into into all of our projects. And what that means is that the
farmers get to cultivate food, whether it's grazing or crops in

(11:20):
and around the solar farm. As you can imagine, when you
look at a solar farm, there's more green than there is glass.
There's a lot of space between the rows, around the rows.
There's margins, there's inside the fence, outside the fence.
And as a vegetation management practices philosophy, you can
deploy vegetation management. And instead of just mowing the

(11:43):
grass and paying for that, we can actually pay the farmers to
cultivate food. And then they can be more
competitive with their food because they're getting the
vegetation management payments from us that we otherwise would
be giving the lawn mowing. So it's a, you know, that's talk
about a full circle economy. We're we're back to the way that

(12:05):
people remember when their farmshad food, thanks to the to the
to the solar project. I'm curious, Nick, what kind of
food can be grown on and around the solar, the solar projects?
We've had a lot of success with sheep and pork.
We have about 3000 sheep grazingright now and our herd is moving
towards 9000 by maybe the end ofnext year.

(12:29):
We have a hundreds of of pigs. They're called Cooney pigs and
they're free grazing. They're a little different than
your normal pig because they don't root, which is important
because you, you want the grass to grow back.
So they've been. So we, in fact, we had a BBQ
recently with all the elected officials in a couple 100 local

(12:51):
people and, and everything at the BBQ was grown in and around
the solar field. We had popcorn and we had
different vegetables and all kinds of meat, pork and, and,
and sheep or lamb. And it would, and we had local
restaurants prepare it. And you know, this is something

(13:13):
that is, it's, it's new and it'sexciting and I communities can
really relate to it. And that's part of the whole
relationship aspect that that I was talking about earlier, where
we really need to connect with the farmers and we don't want to
fake it, but it has to be real. You can't just go and like shake
their hand and smile and tell them they're great and then see

(13:37):
them six months later or a year later.
You need to do something. And in this case, we're changing
lives and, and we're trying to reclaim the character of the
community through our solar projects.
And it's it's working. Yeah.
And just to pile on what Nick was saying, Melissa, the one
nice thing is that the any income that's generated to the

(14:01):
farmers from this activity, which is essentially dual use as
Nick managed mentioned, it's essentially doing vegetation
management of the solar field while nourishing livestock and
ranching. In this application, those
income streams are decoupled from the commodity volatility

(14:22):
that those farmers are normally subject to if they're just
growing and then selling into the the market.
So it's a nice dual income stream there for the community
and you know, it's just amazing to be part of that and really
the just taking a broader view. So next Tracker is a, a global

(14:43):
company we're operating actuallywe're partnering with Doral in
the Middle East, we're working with other companies in Europe
and Latin America. And it really the flexibility of
the solar is that, you know, youcan put it close to the ground,
you can put it above the ground,you can space it, you know,

(15:04):
fairly close together. You can move it far apart.
So the you can sort of tailor the solar to whatever they're
already doing on the site. For example, if they're growing
cotton on the site, there's over90 million acres of cotton being
cultivated in the United States now.
OK, You could have the solar trackers further apart if

(15:26):
they're, if they, you know, wantto graze more disruptive animals
like cattle, well, you could raise the panels above the
ground and so forth. So there's a lot of flexibility
for how to configure the systems.
And what we've been doing is working with Doral on this
mammoth project, but also with their the Doral engineers to

(15:47):
really TuneIn agrivoltaics how the panels follow the Sun and Co
optimize both for energy production as well as crop
generation in other markets. I want to ask a follow up
question to Nick. And when you were talking about
the project, you mentioned 1200 people have jobs.
Can you tell me what kinds of jobs are you creating with these

(16:09):
projects? Sure.
The the types of jobs that the 1200 people are doing are
typical construction jobs. There's a lot of digging.
There is a lot of electrical work.
You know, these are advanced operator type type jobs right
now. It's a it's a unionized job.

(16:31):
And so there are a lot of what Iwould say like like skilled work
taking place. There's there's also an
apprenticeship program. So it's giving the opportunity
for a lot of young people to learn the trade.
And that's, you know, definitelysomething that we think will not

(16:52):
only benefit them, but as we build more projects and believe
me, there are plenty more projects coming, you know, we're
going to need those people to towork on our projects.
And I, I want to ask one more follow up question to Dan.
You mentioned that you're working with Doral in the US,
but also in the Middle East. I'm curious, how are you working

(17:12):
together to make those projects different based on the different
soil or economy? Like what?
What Like any specific examples of how a project in the US and
Indiana might be different than one of the one of the other ones
you're working on? Yeah.
So some of the international projects we're working with
Doral on, there's things like small avocado trees and things
like that. So we're working on like

(17:34):
massively elevated solar trackers and that are optimizing
the angle for both energy production as well as the light
that's actually on crops that are coming down.
And so there's really a tremendous amount of flexibility
in the the operation of these systems.

(17:57):
And you need to bring, you know,Agri science into the algorithms
that are used to control the solar panels and how much light
flows on the crops versus what'sfalling on the the panels and
using things like infrared monitoring to measure the
temperature of the crops and things like that.
So we're still learning. It's early days in agrivoltaics.

(18:20):
And what I'm so excited about iswith leaders like Doral, this
whole topic's been framed as sort of a, you know, solar
versus agricultural land. And we see it as agricultural
land and solar together help each other out where 1 + 1
equals much more than two. Because again, the the solar,

(18:44):
you can configure it so that only say 1/4 of the land is
covered by solar panels. But even there, you can be
growing right under the panels to an extent and that they're
helping each other out because you have this dual income stream
for the agricultural community. You have a lower cost or a more

(19:06):
efficient way to do vegetation management.
And then when you're cultivatingcrops and other livestock, the
system has less dust, there's less dust on the solar panels.
You can integrate irrigation where you're for both cleaning
the panels as well as irrigatingthe crops and keeping the field

(19:27):
cooler, which benefits the electricity production.
So it's still early days. What we've done is we're working
with Doral on the the applications for their projects.
We also have a bunch of controlled test facilities at
Next Tracker our we have one in Silicon Valley in the US, we
have one in Brazil where we havea team of people and we're

(19:51):
actually measuring crop yield and things like that.
So it's early days and we reallythink this is a great win win to
bring value to owners of solar power plants as well as to rural
communities across the world. Dan gave away some of our secret
sauce, which is there's a lot ofinvestment going on between our

(20:14):
companies on science and R&D, which I think is giving us a
more effective and predictable outcome.
And it's a really exciting stuff.
Also, Melissa, you asked me about the 1200 jobs, and I just
have to tell you about a couple of my favorite jobs.
Believe it or not, there's quitea bit of AI going on right now.

(20:35):
And so we have AI operators, I would call them, and drone
operators whose, whose job it isto control inputs.
And often they're from drones, but there's other things as well
that monitor everything that's going on.
And, you know, for example, if one post is put in two inches

(20:58):
off center of where it should be, we can detect it.
And we have people who actually operate the, the AI to, to, to
detect these things. And when you can imagine
something like hundreds of thousands of steel piles going
into the ground, you know, you don't want to be off.
And, and the old way of doing itwas, you know, just people

(21:20):
walking around with, I guess tape measures and, and then it
evolved to GPS units. And today you have you actually
have drones in the sky measuringand observing and doing all
these things. And there are people who are
experts in operating the drones and the software.
Also another job, robot operator.

(21:43):
OK, we have an army of robots, you know, our contractor who's
building it. And those robots do different
things. Last time I was out there, there
were robots that were going and measuring exactly where where
the hundreds of thousands of piles go.
And they look like little R2D twos.
They literally, it looks like anR2D2, maybe a little smaller.

(22:06):
And they're on tracks and they're just, there's like
armies of them out there and they have little flags and they
just do their job and they put the little flags in and and then
there's human operators that go with special machines that put
the piles in. But the next thing will be AI
pile drivers. My son is in 8th grade robotics

(22:27):
and he didn't like his teacher at first, but I, I literally
told him on one of the first days I said look, son, I, I, I
work with companies who do this.So there's there's really a
future in it. We have school, we have school
groups out there all the time and I it's a wonderful school
school trip. You can focus on science and

(22:48):
math and all sorts of different subject matters and the kids can
get out there and get their hands on it and really see, you
know, how something on a piece of paper that doesn't seem
important in the classroom actually matters, you know, out
in the field. And, you know, I, I know we're
making a lot of scientists, girls and boys scientists in

(23:12):
Indiana right now because of theproject that mammoth that we're
talking about. And we're doing the same thing
in other places like Ohio. And I just know every class that
goes there, we we turn somebody into a scientist.
That's great. And I want to point to another
thing I heard you say you talkedabout how you're investing in
Agri science and Agri PV. I have to tell you at Tiger Com,

(23:33):
we've done research looking in rural communities and measuring
opinions. And one of the things, because
as you know, it's getting harderand harder to build.
And we tested a variety of messages.
And while there's no magic wordsthat we can use, we found that
what moved the needle the most was when you helped people
understand that you can have dual use, that you can have both

(23:55):
farming and solar together, thatone doesn't necessarily replace
the other. So that it's really smart, I
think, for both of you to be demonstrating new ways to to be
able to have farmers continue tofarm the land while they get
this additional source of revenue.
So we talked about the value of dual use.
I wonder what do you think aboutpolicy makers in that region?

(24:17):
Like can you, if you could create a 30 second commercial
for local lawmakers, regional, state level, county level, what
would you tell them? What do you what do you want
them to know about what you're doing?
First thing I would say is that they're doing a great job
because our elected officials all the way from from the

(24:39):
governor down to the local officials have been incredibly
supportive. It's a probusiness working
environment and and they're promoting anybody who wants to
invest in rural communities in Indiana.
So they're doing a great job. I would remind them that that
we're using Midwestern steel andwe're providing electrons to

(25:02):
people who live in their constituency base and we're
we're seizing on Indiana's or the Midwest for that matter,
competitive advantage that this is, this is one of the biggest
competitive advantages that has come to rural America in
decades. And it's not going to be here
forever. And you know, either either

(25:26):
everyone's going to be buying their power or they're going to
be importing power from farmers and other states.
So, you know, I, I would say do everything you can to assure the
success of all forms of energy coming to your state and
investing, because this is, thisis the new industrial revolution
with data centers and, and the electrification of the economy.

(25:49):
Don't miss out. This this is this is your your
one shot to to bring prosperity to rural America and and out
compete your neighboring states.Yeah.
And I would build on that, Melissa, Nick's comments is that
we, you know, the United States has really become a
manufacturing powerhouse for clean energy.

(26:12):
Nick has brought up the incredible work we and some of
our collegial companies have done really using steel made in
the US for our tracker parts andyou know, sourcing hundreds of
thousands of tons of steel a year mill direct in the US.
But the same thing is true for other components like solar

(26:34):
panels. The largest supplier of panels
in the US is AUS company that makes panels in three different
factories there. Today there's over 30 factories
making solar panels in the US atscale that are delivering to
projects. And so it's be it's become a
tremendous source not only of construction jobs, but ongoing

(26:58):
manufacturing jobs throughout the the value chain.
And additionally, what's been really exciting is how battery
systems have become very cost effective.
Companies like Tesla and others are making these batteries that
go on this either on the sites with the solar plants or they

(27:21):
become part of the grid. And what that allows the the
solar to do is make power duringthe day but continue providing
firm power through through evening when after people go to
bed at 10:00 or 11:00 and by then the power, the need for
power drops dramatically. So this is helping keep the

(27:41):
lights on. Power demand in the US is
growing strongly for the first time since the the 1950s and
60s. And solar power is by far the
most cost effective way to meet that growing demand.
And so this allows customers to have access to locally produced

(28:03):
energy. And let's not forget that
commercial solar technology was invented in the United States in
the 1950s by Bell Labs. And what we've done at Next
Tracker and other companies our industry has done is really
bring the solar manufacturing job story back home.
You know, Melissa, 1-2 other points the, we have a, a million

(28:26):
panels coming from Texas and it's a foreign company, not
Chinese that is has a huge factory.
They invested in Texas and they're producing massive
quantities of panels for our projects in the Midwest.
And then also the other thing like I that I would want an, A
legislator to, to just be aware of is that there is a movement

(28:50):
right now attacking landowner rights across America.
Local zoning authorities in manycases are telling land owners
what they can and cannot do withtheir land.
Can you imagine owning a farm and being told that you can't
harvest the sun and have sheep on your farm?
That's what's happening. And so land owners, I mean,

(29:14):
legislators should really be thinking about how can they
protect their constituents landowner rights.
And I'll tell you it's a slippery slope.
Once you tell someone they can'thave a private business
transaction on their property with a solar, the next thing
they're going to be telling you is that you cannot have a barn
because it's ugly or you can't you can't have a gun range

(29:38):
because it's noisy. You know, suddenly you just get
into this slippery slope, which we're starting to see that, you
know, these zoning boards get emboldened very quickly.
And, you know, it is becoming animpediment to progress in
America and it is attacking landowner rights.
And so we need to protect those land owners.

(29:58):
An attack on private property rights, Yeah, we absolutely are
seeing that. And I want to ask actually along
that line, given that we've seenthis pushback when we think
about the industry at large, andthis is a question to both of
you, what advice would you give to other developers who want to
build in communities given that we have this increased pushback?

(30:22):
My advice is, is when you OK, you have to know where your
strengths are, be committed to it.
And as a developer, you're either somebody who like buys
projects, OK, and which means somebody else kind of did all
the groundwork. And there's nothing wrong with
that. If that's what your, your, your

(30:43):
strategy is, or you're someone who creates them from scratch.
And if you're someone who creates them from scratch, then
you need to be able to own thoserelationships on the ground for
real. You cannot go and, and put on a
suit or send people in to make land deals and, and buddy up

(31:03):
with farmers who aren't genuinely in there to, to listen
and work with them and, and, andbe their friends.
It's got to be real. And so if you can't do that,
don't even try farmers or business people.
They're really smart communities.
They, they will detect it and it'll make your development work

(31:26):
a lot more difficult. You're better off buying someone
else's project. So that's my advice is if you're
going to go meet the farmers, really get the sheep dung on
your shoes and really get to know them and be sincere and
only send people who are sincereand, and, and those people

(31:46):
should go all the way to the top.
OK, Your, your, your CEO, your finance people who are in the
office, they need to go out there and get their shoes dirty
for real. Nick, you're reminding me of
something you said when you're on Scaling Clean the first time.
Episode 20, you talked about howpeople should be able to go from
the barns to the boardroom. That's right.

(32:06):
I have to compliment you for having message discipline there.
You're very consistent in that. I think it, I think it's a great
point, right? You have to have somebody who's
comfortable having that conversation on the ground with
the farmers and also knows how to run the business.
Yeah, and believe and believe mewhen I tell you it it it's you.
You need to make sure that that somebody is everybody in your

(32:28):
organization because it's very easy to hire the smartest guy
you can find to do something in an office that you need.
OK, but he's not the right guy or or woman.
They're not the right person if they cannot go out there and
sincerely have a good time connecting with with the
farmers. Well, you're touching on

(32:51):
something. I want to give Dan a chance to
answer the the first question, which is what advice would you
give to other developers? But I'd also love to hear your
thoughts, Dan, if you would share just Nick has been on the
show before we talk about the business of running your
business. And Dan, you have grown and
scaled Next Tracker tremendously.
You know, over over the last several years, the company has

(33:12):
really gone through an IPO, you've gone through a lot of
growth. So if I could give you a
two-part question. One, what advice would you give
to other developers? And then two, what advice would
you give to other business owners in this space who are
looking to grow and and to to build a company that will
thrive? Sure.
So on the first part, do like Doral did, and I don't say that

(33:37):
because I'm on this program withDoral, but what they did was
they engaged with the community early and often and they really
created a, a, you know, a multiple win environment.
Everybody that touched the project was, you know, it was
beneficial to them and it was done in a on the right kind of
way, meaning that the local folks that revolved in their

(34:00):
business got to be engaged in the project at each phase and in
an ongoing way. So that was a great also just
the way the project's laid out, you know, you don't want to
build around people by buying adjacent properties and things
like that. You want to build, develop
responsibly, build responsibly and work with high quality

(34:22):
products. What we've really done is also
focus on how our products delivered to minimize the amount
of trucks, how it's installed, to minimize the amount of
construction equipment and things like that and have the
minimum amount of packaging on the site that has to be dealt
with. Those types of things.
In terms of building a great company, easy to say but hard to

(34:46):
do is build like a great cultureso the you can focus on the
right things for your mission and your vision, but then having
a culture that's focused on the right things.
What we're really focused on at Next Tracker is innovation that
delivers value for customers andprojects.
We're focused on customers really listening, understanding

(35:09):
their needs. We're focused on execution,
meaning to ensure that every engagement we touch, whether
it's a supplier, a employee, a vendor, a end customer, a
government agency, that every engagement that we do, we meet
or exceed our expectations. And then we're focused on our

(35:31):
also our internal team. I'm proud that six of my 6 Co
founders from 13 years ago are still with the company.
So we try to like do the right thing and have the right intent
and that's allowed us to have, you know, grow to number one in
our space in a year or I'm sorry, over the last 10 years

(35:51):
And you know, basically we've delivered over 130 gigawatts of
material. That's equivalent to the peak
load of Texas or double the peakload of California.
So what the company I founded for a few $1,000,000 a dozen

(36:11):
years ago has done is delivered enough material to support 2
Californias or one Texas in the middle of the their peak summer
day. So it shows that it's really the
power of ideas that allows you to and then great people and the
right intent and culture that allows you to accomplish

(36:32):
seemingly impossible things. I really think there's a
tremendous opportunity. I believe solar will be the
number one source of energy generation in the world within
this decade. In the United States, the Energy
Information Administration basically shares that view, and

(36:55):
so does the International EnergyAdministration.
So, you know, solar is the greatest way to generate power
because there's no moving parts,there's no fuel, it uses a a
very small amount of of natural materials and it's fully
recyclable. If anybody's studying company

(37:17):
culture academically, they should be looking at Next
Tracker and Dan's company, it's validated his culture with the
creativity and the excellence. Because as you can imagine, when
you have $2 billion under construction, which we have
right now, the, the, the problems that you face are
endless and complex. And it's only his company that,

(37:41):
that steps up every single time and solves the problem.
It's, it's, it's like amazing. We, we're, we're impressed every
single time. I, I don't even have to call Dan
when the, when the, when the problems are escalating, his
people are just, they're there. They're, they have this sense of

(38:02):
urgency of fire in their belly and they come with ideas and,
you know, like they're great team workers and the solutions.
Are amazing. That's very gracious, Nick.
I really appreciate it. We have a saying at next
tracker. I don't care if it's my problem,
your problem or someone's else'sproblem.
How can we be helpful in solvingwhatever the issue is and by

(38:26):
sort of focusing on that rather than the contract, that's helped
us, you know, engender well to make sure customers are
successful and then engender that confidence to move forward
on additional, you know, supportthem on future work.
I have, if I could, one final question.
You can keep it really short. And we like to ask everyone

(38:46):
this. Do you think that success hinges
on what a company chooses to do or not to do?
And I'm asking Dan because Nick's already had a chance to
answer this question. I think both sometimes the best
project or program you do are the ones that you say no to.
And so we're very discerning in that.

(39:08):
And but then, you know, we've taken on things that are really
hard. You have to go into everything
you do. In my view with the philosophy,
we'll be OK if whatever we're considering doesn't happen.
So you have to lose a sense of any sense of desperation or

(39:28):
something. I don't need the next project.
What I need is another great partner.
I don't need to chase a shiny object in technology.
What I need is something. What I need is we focus on
problems that need solutions rather than solutions in in
search of problems. And with that type of mindset,
you end up doing the right things and avoiding the things

(39:50):
that are are cul de sacs where you're not adding a lot of
value. I.
Love that mindset, Dan. That's great.
OK. With that, that concludes all my
questions. You both have a chance if you
want to say any final parting words for our listeners.
I mean, I, I'd like to say that when you think about solar,
think about how it's an incredible business proposition

(40:12):
for communities all across America and it's driving the AI
revolution. When you, when you think about
data centers, you know, what do data centers need to exist?
Power, you know, they have to, they have to go through us.
And so it's really important that if you're a legislator or
you're a listener, that you're out advocating for solar and,

(40:36):
and battery storage and other forms of energy that, you know,
you're doing everything you can to make sure that America is
competitive and that the people really have the opportunity to
take advantage of of this once in a lifetime, you know,
opportunity. And by the way, once you put a
solar field in the ground, you can't pick it up and move it to
Mexico or somewhere else. It is.

(40:58):
It's actually classified as a manufacturer.
And it's there producing electrons and revenue for the
community for the next 35 years.And then when it's finished, we
pull it out and guess what? You have fertile farmland there
and that the families can take the farm over again.
And it's a wonderful win for everybody.

(41:21):
Thank you, Nick. Any final words from you, Dan?
It's great to work with customers like Doral and Nick
Cohen. They're doing the right things
for the right reason and doing them in partnership with
communities. What we've tried to do is
develop technology that helps those types of projects and
programs be really successful while we've been building out

(41:42):
our US and overseas manufacturing facilities to
serve the overseas markets. So we're at the beginning of a
really solar 3 point O, an incredible revolution.
It's wonderful that we've seen the whole US supply chain get
built out from trackers like we're doing at Next Tracker
through solar panels. And I think our best days are in

(42:05):
front of us. So thank you so much for the
opportunity to participate in this webcast and we look forward
to more great projects together.Nick.
Thanks for joining us for another episode of Scaling
Clean, the podcast for clean economies, CEOs, investors, and
the people who advise them. I'm your host, Melissa Baldwin.
Our producer is Claire Quirin. If you like what you hear on

(42:28):
scale and clean episodes, we'd appreciate it if you'd give us a
five star rating and leave a comment where you get your
podcast. And until next time, we wish you
all the best in the clean economy transition.