Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, hey there,
school counselor, and welcome
back to the School for SchoolCounselors podcast.
I'm Steph Johnson, your host, afull-time school counselor just
like you, on a mission to makeschool counseling more
sustainable and more enjoyable.
I want you walking through thedoor every day, excited and on
fire to serve students andfeeling like you have the tools
(00:23):
to be competent and confident.
Hey, it's been a fun couple ofweeks here in our School for
School Counselors world.
We've just wrapped up our podparty.
We released a bonus power packof podcast episodes and they
were so fun to make.
I hope you enjoyed them as muchas I enjoyed making them.
We updated the cover art forthe podcast.
(00:45):
We added a new description.
There are just all kinds ofthings going on with our podcast
because we really do want to doour utmost, my team and I, to
support you in your schoolcounseling endeavors and truly
paint a beautiful picture of awonderful journey for you
throughout your career.
(01:07):
Speaking of the schoolcounseling journey, speaking of
the ins and outs and the nuancesof the work that we do every
day, we have noticed in ourSchool for School Counselors
mastermind, the topics ofconversation are already turning
toward stress, and that's notsurprising.
We work in public education forthe most of us, and the
(01:30):
education world just in and ofitself, is a stressful
environment, isn't it?
We have lots and lots of peoplein a relatively small amount of
space.
We have lots of expectations,we have goals, we have grades,
we have frameworks.
We have all of these thingsgoing on all the time.
There's no wonder that schoolsfeel like stressful environments
(01:54):
.
But I think the stressconversation is also a lot
different for school counselorsthan some other folks working on
our campuses.
Right, I think we can all agreewe have some very specific and
very different aspects of ourwork, that kind of up the ante
in the stress conversation, andso we want to talk about this.
(02:17):
Throughout the month ofSeptember, we're going to be
walking through ways that youcan make your school counseling
career and programs feel moreenjoyable, more sustainable, and
give you more of that feelinglike I've got this.
I may not know everything, butI've got this and I love this.
(02:38):
That's what we want for you.
Last month, we spent a lot oftime in podcast episodes talking
about behavior intervention,because we knew that was on the
horizon for our schoolcounselors, and we're continuing
those discussions and trainingsin our mastermind group right
now, as we're talking throughbehavior interventions, what are
(02:59):
protocols, what are specificconsiderations in working with
behavior-oriented problems oncampuses.
So if you're interested incontinuing that conversation, if
you want to broaden yourhorizons and grow your
perspectives with regard tobehavior, you need to go jump
into that School for SchoolCounselors Mastermind right now.
(03:20):
But in September we're going tobe talking about how do we make
our practices more sustainable,how do we make our practices
more sustainable, how do we makeour work more enjoyable and how
do we just come away with thisfeeling of I can do this and I
can do this for the long term,instead of going home every day
saying I don't know how I'mgoing to make it another day,
(03:42):
when I see good counselors doingthat, going to make it another
day, when I see good counselorsdoing that, it absolutely breaks
my heart, and so my team and Ihere at School for School
Counselors are going to endeavorto do everything we can to
support you and give you thetools that you need to enjoy
this career that you've spent somuch time and effort and money
(04:02):
pursuing right.
We want you to be able to enjoyit once you get there.
As I mentioned, conversationsin our mastermind have already
turned towards stress, which isfunny to some of you, I'm sure,
because you haven't startedschool yet.
I'm talking to some folks insome areas of the country that
are due to start school any daynow but have not had the
(04:24):
privilege of welcoming theirstudents on their campuses just
yet.
But we want to have thisconversation now because we want
to be proactive and I'm goingto warn you, if you are looking
for the feel-good, fuzzy-wuzzyconversations of bubble baths
and me time and walks in nature,this is probably not going to
(04:47):
be the podcast episode for you.
You're probably going to walkaway feeling very disappointed.
We're going to jump into thenitty gritty aspects of chronic
stress in the school counselingworld what it looks like, what
the dangers are.
It's going to feel very intensefor a minute and then we're
going to talk about some thingsthat you can do to mitigate
(05:08):
chronic stress, and there's beenone recent new finding that is
absolutely going to blow yourmind.
It's something that you don'thear often.
A new journal article that wasrecently published that kind of
tips the self-care conversationand the chronic stress situation
on its head a little bit.
(05:28):
It's pretty interesting.
We live and work in a societythat tends to praise stress.
We tend to see stress as amarker of achievement, signs
that you're on the right path oran indicator that you've got it
(05:49):
all figured out right.
In our society, stress is kindof seen as a badge of honor and
it's glorified in a lot ofvenues, and that can be super
dangerous to all of us.
Chronic stress shows up whenyou perceive that the demands
that are on you to meet theexpectations of your job exceed
(06:12):
your capabilities.
You start to feel stressed, youstart to worry and feel anxious
about how am I going to do this?
Are they going to figure me out?
Am I going to be discovered asan imposter?
All those kinds of things.
And a survey by Agapong andteam and we'll give you the
citation in the show notes foundthat teacher stress is about
(06:41):
twice as high as the generalpopulation.
So already we're on atrajectory to have a lot of
stress in our work lives right.
A little stress is a good thing.
It can be good for us.
It boosts our energy, it kindof sharpens our thinking, it
heightens our alertness and itmotivates us to meet our goals.
Stress is not always bad and weknow that from being
(07:06):
practitioners in the mentalhealth field, we know that
sometimes stress can be a goodthing.
Did you know that manageablestress even encourages the
growth of stem cells thateventually become brain cells?
So stress can be a verypositive thing.
But when you have prolongedactivation of all of these
(07:27):
stress hormones in your body,right, the cortisol and the
adrenaline are just pumping allday long, over and over and over
.
You start to have a lot ofphysical and mental effects from
that that really kind of affectyour functioning and your sense
of well-being, and that's wherewe don't want to be.
We know that chronic stress cankeep that immune system
(07:52):
torquing up really, really highuntil all of a sudden it bottoms
and craters out.
I can remember in my career as ateacher, I was a fine arts
teacher and so I was tasked withputting on productions, and in
true Steph Johnson style, itwasn't just a regular old
performance like every otherschool would do.
(08:12):
No, no, it had to be a big one,and so often in my performances
I would have my entire finearts team with students in this
performance.
We would have between 350 and400 students in a performance
and we would have themconstantly moving and
entertaining, with absolutely nodowntime in between.
(08:34):
Think about that for a minute.
Think about the orchestrationthat was required to make that
happen, in addition to all ofthe teaching, the content, the
costumes, the deadlines, theparent notifications, the making
sure all the kids are there,and on and on and on.
It was stressful, and we didthat multiple times a year and
(08:56):
every time we had a performanceI knew the very next day I was
going to be sick, and it wasn'tjust going to be like allergies
or the sniffles.
I was going to go down with theflu, I was going to go down
with something major.
Still to this day, one of mystress responses is to get
shingles, and that's how I knowI've pushed it too far.
(09:20):
Too much stress can hurt ourbodies.
This is not new news to you,right?
But I just kind of want you tothink about if you are in one of
those seasons now or if you'reon the verge of wandering into
this chronic stress territory.
We don't want you to be there.
There are some specific thingswith school counselors that no
(09:45):
doubt contribute to chronicstress.
Job strain, just the job in andof itself Vicarious trauma,
right, having to see and hearsometimes the worst of things
that are offered on your campus.
Having to process and holdthose things in your mind and
your heart without goodconsultation available, role
(10:08):
confusion or role conflict thoseare two very nice ways of
saying either your administratorhas no idea what you're
supposed to be doing or theyhave their own idea about what
you should be doing, but eitherone of those can be stressful on
a campus.
Certainly, students' growingmental health needs is a major
(10:28):
factor, especially post-COVID.
We know that student mentalhealth needs have skyrocketed
and we are now becoming thefrontline response staff for
youth mental health issues.
The problem is our frameworksand paradigms have not changed
to meet this need.
We're still being expected todo things that aren't exactly in
(10:51):
alignment with that increasedresponsibility.
High caseloads have beenempirically shown to promote
higher stress levels for schoolcounselors, and so we have all
of these things going on.
It's almost like we're workinginside of this vortex of
potential stress-inducingcircumstances.
(11:12):
Right, we also are prone tochronic stress because we don't
typically get a lot of thankyous for our work.
We are often the ones that arehaving to point out
uncomfortable truths or who knowthings about people that they
wish maybe we didn't know somuch about, right, and so in the
context of doing that kind ofwork, we don't receive a lot of
(11:35):
thank yous, and that's okay forsure.
We didn't get into this jobbecause we thought everyone was
going to be fawning at our feettelling us how amazing we are,
but it's nice to hear a thankyou or an acknowledgement every
now and again, and when youdon't get those, sometimes that
can increase your stress levels.
I mentioned before, but I willmention it again.
(11:56):
I think it bears being repeatedVicarious trauma Huge, huge
concern in the school counselingworld, and in my opinion, there
are not enough conversationsgoing on about that right now,
and I mean real conversationsabout vicarious trauma, what it
really feels like to experiencethat, what really mitigates the
(12:18):
threat of extended repercussionsfrom vicarious trauma.
I think the bubble bath, glassof wine, walk in nature
conversation is over.
It needs to be done and we needto be talking about some true
protective factors for schoolcounselors, and one of those
things is developing sustainableand realistic frameworks for
(12:39):
our work with administrators whounderstand what we are there to
do for their campus.
Right, give me an amen on that.
You know, it's true, we've gotto have some better fundamentals
in place and we've also got tobe aware of the fact that
chronic stress can tend to creepup on us.
(13:00):
It tends to start out as littlepockets of stress and we think
I'm managing this, I'm doingokay with it, everything's fine,
it'll calm down soon.
But then it just kind of startsto stack up on itself and often
if we don't catch it, if wedon't diffuse it in a timely
manner, it stacks up to becomechronic stress, and that's the
(13:24):
danger that we want to avoid.
You know you're in the dangerzone with chronic stress when it
starts to affect yourday-to-day functioning or your
emotional balance.
If you're struggling with someanxiety or depression and you
can't identify the reason for it, it might be chronic stress.
(13:47):
Chronic stress can also affectyour job satisfaction.
It can lead to demoralization.
It can lead to demoralization,it can lead to feelings of
burnout and sometimes it evencontributes, as I mentioned
earlier, to folks leaving theprofession altogether, either
literally, as in walking out thedoor, I'm going to go do a
(14:08):
different job or psychologically, just kind of checking out from
the whole thing.
These are the folks that justkind of wander around all day,
not really accomplishing much,not really engaging with anybody
.
They may have so much chronicstress that they've just checked
out of their job role.
We talked about in a previousepisode and again we'll link to
(14:31):
this in the show notes about thethree components of chronic
stress.
They are emotional exhaustion,where you just feel emotionally
depleted.
You have this huge loss ofenergy and you just feel like
you really can't care anymore.
Then depersonalization, whichis a manifestation of burnout.
(14:54):
That's when you start feelingvery negative about your work,
very callous, you start to havevery detached responses to other
people in your environmentbecause you're just done, you're
over it.
It's beyond cynicism, it'sbeyond that and it's into some
more major territory.
And then we get to the pointwhere we feel like our personal
(15:19):
accomplishments are reduced, wefeel incompetent, we feel like
there is no way we're ever goingto be successful at this.
We're not making any headway,we're not gaining any ground and
we just feel like, why am Ihere?
What am I doing?
I don't want you to feel thatway, because when you feel that
way, certainly it affects you.
(15:45):
We've talked about some of thosephysical and mental
manifestations of chronic stress, but it also affects the
caliber of the services thatyou're able to provide to your
students.
So it's not just one person notsaying that it's fine you, the
services that you're able toprovide to your students.
So it's not just one person notsaying that it's fine.
You know, if you're chronicallystressed and it's hurting you,
that's fine as long as you'renot hurting the students.
I don't mean to say that at all, but I'm saying that it reaches
much further than any one of us, and so we need to be mindful
(16:08):
of that and how our chronicstress not only affects
ourselves but everyone else inour immediate environment.
So what do we do about chronicstress?
How do we prevent it or how dowe mitigate its effects?
If we've already started to kindof toe into that territory, I
(16:30):
think there are some reallyspecific things that can happen
and, again, these are allempirically validated.
We'll be providing theseresources to you in the show
notes.
First of all, if you're seekingsome physical or mental health
concerns and you can't quite putyour finger on what it is, you
might need to go seek somecounseling or services from a
(16:53):
healthcare professional and justget checked out to make sure
that it's not something else, tomake sure there's not something
else driving this or some otherreason for you to be feeling
this way.
Case in point personal storyand I haven't yet shared this on
the podcast but over the summerI was diagnosed with an
autoimmune disease that I'velikely had for years and years
(17:15):
and years, but it wentundetected and once it was
identified and I was able tostart being treated for that, my
mood improved, my affectimproved and I realized maybe
how badly I'd been feeling anddidn't even know it.
So that's a very real thing andnot to say that all your
(17:36):
problems are caused by diseasesor by chronic stress, one or the
other.
But it's worth checking out,right, it's worth just investing
to make sure that you're okay.
That's number one.
Number two I think that we haveto realize that our work on
school campuses is differentfrom the others we work with.
(17:58):
We have to acknowledge that themore we try to portray teachers
or psychologists oradministrators or insert
whatever job role you want tothere, the more we try to
picture ourselves in those boxes, the less aligned and the less
(18:18):
understood we're going to feelin our work.
We have to understand that ourrules and our roles are
different.
Again, we see and hear somereally disheartening things.
We walk through very complexsituations with school staff,
(18:40):
with students and with families.
We have to have additionalbuffers beyond what some of our
other campus employees have.
Against stress, againstemotional overwhelm, against
overwork.
We have to be more thoughtfuland careful, because if we're
not healthy, we're not going tobe able to effectively serve our
(19:04):
clientele, who are likelystruggling with some sort of
mental health, behavioral,emotional concern.
Does that make sense?
So we have to get rid of theideas that just perpetuate the
education world, that are sounhealthy for everyone but
(19:25):
probably exponentially moreunhealthy for us.
As an example first in, lastout.
Are you one of those people?
Are you one of the first carsin the parking lot or one of the
first people into the buildingand then one of the last out?
At the end of the day, schoolcounselors should not be those
(19:46):
people.
It's not good for usEstablishing essential
boundaries and when I sayboundaries I don't just mean
between work and home.
I'm not talking about boundariesbetween professional life and
personal life, although that'simportant too.
What I'm talking about isboundaries in the school.
(20:07):
What are some things that youcan do to promote your own
well-being and your ability tobest support your students?
That might be things likesetting professional boundaries
as far as conversation andstudent confidentiality, so you
(20:27):
can walk away at the end of theday feeling confident that
you've fulfilled your rolewithout violating anybody's
needs or rights, instead ofwalking away and questioning
yourself Ooh, did I say too much?
Maybe I shouldn't have saidthat.
I don't know, maybe I made thewrong decision.
You don't want to do that.
Maybe it's setting boundaries.
About white space Iintentionally schedule 15
(20:48):
minutes about every two hoursjust to sit and decompress.
That sounds like a lot of timeto some of you, but if I don't
do that, I do not have theclarity of mind to be able to
effectively serve my students.
It is in their best interest aswell as my own.
I need processing time.
I need time to digest thethings that are going on.
(21:11):
I need time to plan what arethe next interventions for the
new chapter of what I've justdiscovered.
I don't like those rotecurriculum things.
I'm sure you've noticed that ifyou listen to the podcast for
any amount of time.
I want to grow and evolve withmy students and so I need that
white space.
I need decompression time.
(21:33):
If we've had to do some sort ofbehavior de-escalation, I need a
minute to bring myself back tocenter, to If I've had to have a
difficult conversation with aparent.
I need a moment.
So be aware of those.
Establish those boundaries.
What do you need?
I am going to eat lunch everyday.
Some of you think that's animpossible goal.
(21:54):
It's not.
But it has to be done withintentionality and it has to be
done mindfully.
Sometimes you can't just stepforward all at once and say I'm
going to start taking my lunchevery day.
Sometimes it doesn't work thatway, but you can walk toward
that goal.
I think good training also helpsavoid chronic stress.
(22:14):
It helps us to reduce overwhelmand reduce professional fatigue
.
It's less decision-making If weknow what works, if we're
well-versed in our craft, wedon't have to second-guess
ourself as often.
We don't have to be inconversations and be scrambling
(22:34):
in our head like the hamsterrunning on the wheel as fast as
it can, trying to come up withwhat to say because we're not
sure We'll be able to answerconfidently.
Evidence-based says this.
This is maybe what we shouldtry next.
It's not going to be animmediate change.
We can expect a change,probably within the next two to
(22:54):
three months.
Here's how we'll know if it'sgoing in the right direction.
Teachers are going to befatigued when implementing this.
These are the kinds of thingswe can tell them as they do it.
The ability to have thoseconversations is gold in the
school counseling world, and theway you get to that level to be
able to have those kinds ofconversations is through good
(23:18):
training, learning more andinvesting your time in your
craft.
And then, last and again, ifyou've listened to my podcast
for any amount of time, you knewthis was coming up, but this is
empirically validated.
Y'all Good consultation.
Singh et al found that supportcan serve as a sort of
(23:42):
protective factor againstcompassion fatigue and, by
extension, against burnout.
2024, just this summer,indicated that the importance of
hope in maintaining jobsatisfaction, even when
(24:15):
additional stressors are added,is a specific protective factor.
They found that mindfulnessleads to hope and hope leads to
feelings of self-efficacy.
That is huge for us, absolutelyhuge.
That is why they also went onto say and I'm going to read
this because I think it is soimportant the participants who
(24:35):
had a greater ability to see away forward to achieving their
goals to see a way forward toachieving their goals also found
their job more enjoyable, evenwhen additional stress was added
.
That is the whole purpose ofgood quality consultation.
That's why I'm always talkingabout it.
(24:56):
That's why I'm always trying tolead you toward our mastermind.
It's not because I'm trying tomake a buck off my colleagues.
As a matter of fact, I findthat pretty oogie.
We charge for it because wehave certain platforms and ways
to deliver this information toyou and those have to be paid
for.
But I believe in good qualityconsultation for school
(25:18):
counselors.
I don't believe enough is outthere.
I do not believe that socialmedia is quality consultation.
If I had a dollar for everypiece of bad advice that I had
seen given by someone on asocial media forum, I would be a
millionaire.
And folks are giving thisinformation out of the goodness
(25:40):
of their hearts.
And folks are giving thisinformation out of the goodness
of their hearts but they don'tunderstand sometimes the nuance
of the situation or that there'snew information out that
supersedes what we previouslythought about our craft.
We have to make sure we'regetting information from the
best sources, but then, aboveall of that and our Mastermind
(26:01):
members currently express thesesame thoughts the hope that you
receive when you're in a roomwith people who get it, who do
the kind of work that you do,who are not directly linked to
(26:22):
you.
That distance gives you anability to be very real about
situations, without fear ofjudgment or repercussions.
That's what we're aiming atwithin our professional
consultation community, andthroughout all of that, I strive
to be the poster child of hopein school counseling because I
so vividly and desperatelybelieve in the impacts that you
(26:46):
have on your students each andevery day.
There's no other profession likethe school counseling
profession, none where we get tobe with students, where they
spend the majority of their timeduring their waking hours in
school, and we get to identifyneeds, we get to teach lagging
skills, we need to supportemotional concerns, we get to
(27:08):
provide resources to familiesall right there.
How incredible is that?
And I do believe that there aresome very positive things
coming our way in the schoolcounseling world.
I think beliefs are shifting, Ithink there is a new awareness
coming, and I'm super excitedabout where this is headed, and
(27:30):
so I'm endeavoring in everythingthat I do to communicate that
excitement and that hope to you,so that you can hold it too.
During the days that are hard,when they feel overwhelming,
when you think I don't even knowif I want to go back tomorrow,
you can hold on to that hope.
You can come to consultationand you can uncover a path or a
(27:53):
mechanism to where you can findyour hope in your program, and
that's what I want for you.
So please excuse, that was acompletely impromptu soapbox
speech, but I believe in thispassionately and I know that the
majority of school counselorsout there working their tails
(28:16):
off every day feel unappreciated, unheard, unseen.
They feel like they're all bythemselves, even when sometimes
they're working on a team,because they don't feel at
liberty to talk about what'sreally going on.
They're afraid to ask questions, they're afraid of judgment,
(28:36):
and we need more opportunitiesin our field for school
counselors to come to a safespace and feel like they can
find a way forward.
That's what I want for you.
It almost brings me to tears.
All right, so go toschoolforschoolcounselorscom.
Slash mastermind.
All the information is there.
(28:57):
If you want to join us, I thinkthat would be great.
If not, go find a good qualityprofessional consultation
organization locally.
Make sure that you meet withthem regularly, not just when
you have a gripe or a complaintor something that you want to be
mad about or concerned about oroutraged about.
You need to have a goodconsultation group that you can
(29:18):
share the good things with, too,because that's part of your
professional satisfaction andyour hope.
All right, I hope this episodewas helpful to you.
Please keep these things inmind as you begin your new
school year.
Keep in mind these goodboundaries time boundaries,
(29:39):
boundaries between work and homeand boundaries within the
schoolhouse.
Make sure those are all intact.
Good training to reduce yourcognitive overwhelm and your
decision making.
And engage in good consultationthat not only provides you with
constructive feedback but alsogives you hope.
(30:01):
You with constructive feedback,but also gives you hope.
These are going to go such along way to addressing chronic
stress or the potential of it,without meandering into this
world of suggestions for bubblebaths and me time and walks in
nature.
Sometimes that's not what youneed.
If those are soothing to, you,do them.
(30:23):
If not, you may want to trythese instead.
All right, I will be back soonwith another episode of the
School for School Counselorspodcast.
I can't wait to talk to youagain.
This is absolutely one of mymost favorite times of the week,
and I hope it is yours too.
I am looking forward to seeingyou again on the next episode,
(30:43):
so stay tuned, but in themeantime, I hope you have the
best week.
Take care.