October 21, 2024 • 34 mins
This episode is a comprehensive guide for school counselors aiming to improve their engagement with students. Moving beyond traditional worksheets, it provides information about evidence-based, individualized strategies and innovative interventions, particularly those with special needs.
The discussion emphasizes the critical evaluation of widely-used resources like those from Teachers Pay Teachers, the necessity of culturally responsive and trauma-informed practices, and aligning interventions with students' IEPs and behavior plans.
00:00 Introduction: The Problem with Worksheets
00:43 Rethinking Tools for Special Needs Students
02:17 The Appeal and Pitfalls of Worksheets
04:36 Personal Story: The Backpack Exercise
07:51 The Convenience vs. Effectiveness Debate
10:53 Concerns About Unvetted Resources
16:13 Focus on Special Student Populations
18:29 Individualized Approaches for Special Populations
20:21 Culturally Responsive and Trauma-Informed Practices
21:40 Practical Sensory-Based Interventions
23:27 Art and Movement-Based Techniques
27:10 Role-Playing and Therapeutic Games
30:22 Recap and Final Thoughts
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References/Resources:
Cook, B. G., & Odom, S. L. (2013). Evidence-based practices and implementation science in special education. Exceptional Children, 79(2), 135-144. doi:10.1177/001440291307900201
Dunn, W. (2001). The sensations of everyday life: Empirical, theoretical, and pragmatic considerations. American Journal of Occupational Therapy, 55(6), 608-620. doi:10.5014/ajot.55.6.608
Hammond, Z. (2015). Culturally responsive teaching and the brain: Promoting authentic engagement and rigor among culturally and linguistically diverse students. Corwin Press.
Morgan, P. L., Farkas, G., Tufis, P. A., & Sperling, R. A. (2008). Are reading and behavior problems risk factors for each other? Journal of Learning Disabilities, 41(5), 417-436. doi:10.1177/0022219408321123
Reinke, W. M., Herman, K. C., & Sprick, R. (2011). Motivational interviewing for effective classroom management: The classroom check-up. Guilford Press.
Rimm-Kaufman, S. E., & Hulleman, C. S. (2015). SEL in the classroom: Identifying and disseminating strategies. The Future of Children, 27(1), 149-172. doi:10.1353/foc.2017.0003
Scarpa, A., Williams White, S., & Attwood, T. (2013). CBT for children and adolescents with high-functioning autism spectrum disorders. Guilford Press.
Shaywitz, S. E., & Shaywitz, B. A. (2005). Dyslexia (specific reading disability). Biological Psychiatry, 57(11), 1301-1309. doi:10.1016/j.biopsych.2005.01.043
Shelton, C., & Archambault, L. (2019). Lessons learned from Teachers Pay Teachers: Exploring the educational value of online marketplaces. Journal of Online Learning Research, 5(1), 35-56. Available from: ResearchGate.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello there, school counselor.
Hey, let me ask you something.
When is the last time that youhanded a student a worksheet and
then walked away going, wow,that made such a huge difference
.
Now think about this You'resitting with a student who
(00:21):
struggles with reading Maybethey struggle with communication
or some sensory overload andyou hand them another worksheet.
You might be unintentionallyshutting the door on the very
progress that you're trying tomake, but don't worry, you're
certainly not the only one.
(00:42):
Today, we're going to pull backthe curtain on why worksheets
aren't the miracle tool we'vebeen led to believe, especially
when we're working with studentswho have special needs.
And, more importantly, we'regoing to talk about what really
works.
So let's rethink our toolkitsfor students and dive into
(01:04):
what's truly best practice.
Now, before we start, I wouldlove to read a review from
Shanice Tett, and she titled herreview the Right Stuff.
The review goes on to say thisSteph takes school counseling
and makes it relatable, real andthought-provoking.
And makes it relatable, realand thought-provoking With an
(01:24):
honest assessment of thisprofession.
I have never felt more seen andheard.
This, along with the mastermind, has allowed me to become a
better counselor and leader toother counselors.
Do yourself a favor and listento this podcast.
It was the best decision I made.
Shanice, thank you so much forthat wonderful review.
(01:48):
It means so much to me and tomy team, and we're just
flabbergasted that people arewilling to spend a few minutes
to say some kind words about thepodcast.
If you'd like for me to shareyour review on the podcast, head
on over to your podcast playerof choice, whether that's Apple
or Spotify.
Rate us with five shiny goldstars and then tell us what you
(02:11):
think of the podcast.
We'd love to hear your thoughts.
All right, so back to the topicat hand.
You know we're torn in a milliondifferent directions each and
every day.
Right, we're in hyperdrive allday long and we are working to
not only make significantimpacts for students but to
(02:33):
reach as many students as wepossibly can, and because of
that, we are usually looking forthings that are quick and
things that are effective.
Right, and worksheets orprintables seem to be the
perfect solution to that problem, because they're neat, they're
organized, they're easy to printand hand out.
(02:54):
But the uncomfortable truthabout these resources is that,
while they may feel like they'rean effective catch-all for the
things that you're dealing withthroughout your day, those
sheets can actually work againstyou, especially when you're
working with some of our mostvulnerable students.
(03:15):
If we think about a dyslexicstudent who struggles with text,
dyslexic student who struggleswith text, or a student with
autism that struggles to relateto abstract feelings on paper,
or an anxious student whose mindjust keeps racing and racing
(03:36):
and they can't settle down tofocus on a written task, these
students need more than just aone-size-fits-all approach, and
so we're going to look into thedetails on why those trusty
little sheets may be doing moreharm than good and causing more
(03:57):
work for you in the long run.
But here's the great newsBeyond breaking down why these
may not be working, we're alsogoing to talk about what does
work the tangible,research-backed strategies that
will help you engage yourstudents in more meaningful ways
(04:19):
than just on paper just onpaper.
So if you're ready to shake upyour school counseling program
and you're ready to giveindividualized support, you want
to stick with me here, becausewe are going to get very, very
intentional in the conversation.
I remember once early in myschool counseling career, I was
(04:40):
working with a young lady whofelt a tremendous sense of
responsibility within her familyand she would go above and
beyond out of her way to takecare of things at home that
really weren't necessarily herresponsibilities, and her
parents were sort of baffled byit.
(05:00):
The student was feelingstressed and overwhelmed and
we'd really kind of been workingon how to address that problem,
because not only was it presentat home, but it had started to
trickle in and affect herability to perform at school.
So we had done all of thethings that I'd been taught to
do in my counseling program andI was relying on the things that
(05:24):
people online were telling meshould work, and nothing really
seemed to land.
It was just like we kept goingover the same information day
after day and it really wasn'tsinking in.
And the student would say yeah,yeah, I understand, I see what
you're saying, or you know, Irecognize that, but she wasn't
(05:45):
able to change.
There was something missing andI couldn't figure out what it
was.
One day, on a whim, I saw anempty backpack in the closet in
my office and I thought you know, I bet I can use that.
So the next time the studentcame in my office I said let's
do something different.
Here's a stack of sticky notesand a Sharpie, because you know,
(06:06):
those students love to writewith those Sharpies.
Take this Sharpie and writedown all of the responsibilities
that you feel you should takecare of in your day.
So she wrote on a stack ofsticky notes and she probably
had eight or nine really heavytopics on her sticky notes,
(06:26):
things that felt like heavyresponsibilities for her.
So we pulled those out and Istarted pulling books off my
bookshelf.
I wasn't aiming for the bigones, I was just pulling them
off, you know, from the end allthe way down the line, and I
would put a sticky note on thebook and I would say, okay,
here's this responsibilitytaking care of little brother
after school and I would put itin the back.
(06:47):
And then I would take anothersticky note here's this
responsibility.
And I would put it in thebackpack.
And over and over and overagain, we put sticky notes on
all the books, put them in thebackpack.
And then I said, hey, so nowput it on, put the backpack on
your back and see and feel theweight of all of these
(07:08):
responsibilities that you'vechosen for yourself.
And she put the backpack on andit was undeniable the way her
face changed and she looked atme and she said I've been
carrying around a lot and I said, yes, you sure have the
paper-pencil approach, thedrawing diagrams was not
(07:32):
speaking to her.
She needed something differentand I think so often we have
students just like that all overour campuses that need
something more than a.
You know, paper-based activitieshave been promoted as very
(07:55):
simple, very low prep and thatyou can use them for emotional
regulation, social skills,problem solving, cognitive,
behavioral exercises.
And they are nice in thatthey're convenient.
It doesn't take a lot of timeto print one of those suckers
out.
It doesn't take a lot of timeto print one of those suckers
out, and when you don't have aplanning period, when you have
(08:17):
all of these responsibilities,you can quickly print it out,
hand it to the student and itfeels like it's an answer to a
prayer when your time is scarceand when you want to engage
students and you really want tobe structured.
I think, too, these paper-basedactivities have caught a lot of
people's attention because itreduces our cognitive load when
(08:42):
we're working through thingslike conflict resolution or
problem solving.
Those activities outlinestep-by-step processes, don't
they?
Identify the problem,brainstorm the solutions, try
implementing a solution andreflect on the possible outcomes
.
We don't have to work as hardwhen it's on paper, right in
(09:04):
front of us.
And two, I will say I think alot of school counselors lack
the confidence to be able toembark on a lot of different
kinds of counselinginterventions all in one day,
flying by the seat of theirpants, without any sort of
reference materials or resources.
That seems to scare the pantsoff of a lot of school
(09:26):
counselors that I talk to and weneed to change that.
That's what we're working ondoing in our School for School
Counselors Mastermind.
You know this conversation ismaking me think about the
feelings worksheets, where youknow you have common emotions on
the sheet and you have tocircle or color in how you're
(09:47):
feeling.
I think the idea is to be verystraightforward and still give a
guided way for expressingthemselves when students are
struggling to verbalize theirthoughts or perhaps when the
counselor is struggling with theidea of open-ended discussion
about the topic.
And I don't want this to soundbelittling because I don't think
(10:07):
that's it.
I know that our field is filledwith amazing, smart, dynamic
school counselors.
So please don't take away mesaying, well, you just you don't
know enough to do your jobwithout worksheets.
That that is not my message.
My message is I think we fly sofast and our industry tells us
(10:29):
over and over and over again getthese resources, they'll make
your life simpler that we justkind of buy into it.
Right, we're too tired to argue, we don't want to have to think
and learn and grow after workhours because we're just so
spent by four or five o'clockright.
So this is no shade on anybody,but it is something that we
(10:51):
need to be talking about.
A lot of these worksheets, too,will claim to be aligned with
standards.
They'll claim to be alignedwith the ASCA national model,
with the ASCA mindsets andbehaviors, and so if we see that
, then we think, oh, okay, sothis thing is somewhat vetted,
(11:11):
not realizing anybody can saythat about anything that they
make.
Not realizing anybody can saythat about anything that they
make.
All they have to do is find onepiece within those expectations
and apply that word to theresource and say, yeah, it's
aligned with this.
I've shared with you before ina past episode that teachers pay
teachers.
(11:31):
Resources in the peer-reviewedliterature are showing abysmal
results, and some of thefindings on those resources are
downright scary for our students.
You can go back and referenceepisode 114 in your podcast
player.
It's back in, I believe at theend of August.
(11:56):
The episode was called AreYours Legit the Uncomfortable
Truth About School CounselingResources.
So go check that out if youwant to be more a part of that
conversation.
But research tells us Sheltonand Archambault 2019, among
others, tell us that usuallywhen they say they're aligned,
(12:20):
they really aren't that theseresources are not rigorously
tested for effectiveness,particularly when we're talking
about working with students inspecial population contexts
working with students in specialpopulation contexts.
So they may be quick and easy,they may be really cute, but
(12:44):
their quality and theappropriateness for the
diversity of needs that you seeon your campus may not hit the
mark.
And again, shelton andArchibald say that these kinds
of inconsistencies really raiseconcerns about long-term
educational outcomes.
When we rely heavily on thesekinds of resources, we can't be
assured that we're going to beable to help students make the
(13:06):
gains they need to make.
And when we think about it thatway, we really start to realize
that the more of these unvetted, untested resources that we're
using in our school counselingprogram, the more work we may be
intentionally creating forourselves.
I have said before and I willsay again it amazes me,
(13:29):
especially in the schoolcounseling world, where we are
so invested in evidence base anddata both of which we should be
invested in that we're notpublishing those kinds of
information on TPT resources.
Now, teachers Pay.
Teachers doesn't require that,but it doesn't mean nobody can
(13:49):
step up and say, hey, I'm goingto do this anyway.
Let me gather a focus group,let me get a group of 20 or 30
school counselors, let me havethem deploy this and let me have
them show me their real-timedata, and then I can publish
that alongside of my resourceand really be able to show that
it might be worth working with.
(14:11):
But y'all, no one's done that.
No one's done that, and I getthat it's extra work.
I get that it's extra time.
It sounds like a nightmare tocoordinate all that, but at the
end of the day, if we don't havesome of that boots on the
ground, action, research goingon, we literally have nothing to
prove the effectiveness ofthese materials.
(14:34):
I think, too, we are drawn tothese kinds of things because
when we're doing like groupcounseling or we're doing
guidance lessons, it feelsefficient for our time in prep
and for engaging lots ofstudents at the same time.
So that feels good.
We feel like we're doing whatwe should be doing.
(14:55):
Now I will say again and I feellike I really need to bring
this point home A lot of peoplehave gotten very upset with me
in the past when I've talkedabout TPT resources, about being
very careful about the thingsthat we're using, and I have had
(15:16):
people tell me things like howdare you tell me that I can't
make good judgments about mymaterials?
How dare you downplay myeducation and my expertise as a
school counselor and y'all?
This is not to do any of thosethings, but it is to get you
thinking more critically aboutthe resources that you're using.
(15:39):
If you go online in any of mostof the school counseling groups
on the planet, you see peopletalking about printable
resources, and there's a reallyimportant piece of the
conversation that no one talksabout when we're looking at
these things, and that is mostof those.
Social media groups werecreated by the people that are
(16:01):
creating those resources.
They create theseentrepreneurial ventures on
Teachers, pay Teachers.
They start Facebook groups togenerate buzz and conversation,
and then they want to be able topost about their resources by
getting you on their email listor something like that.
I don't think a day goes bythat I don't get an email from
(16:23):
somebody asking me to buy theirresource, and no shade there
y'all.
No shame in the hustle game atall, but we need to make sure
that, as we are being delugedwith these kinds of messages,
that we are intentional aboutwhere and how we're using these
materials and what we'reselecting.
Now, this month we are talkingabout on the podcast, special
(16:47):
student populations, how we canbetter serve them and meet their
needs, because next monththat's exactly what we're going
to be focusing on every day inthat's exactly what we're going
to be focusing on every day inour mastermind.
We're going to be talkingthrough the ins and outs of
special populations, the thingsthat maybe you didn't learn in
grad school, and some better,more effective ways to address
(17:07):
those populations.
Those are typically groups ofstudents that we don't get a lot
of experience with before weget out on our own, and they're
tied up in lots of legislativemandates, laws, statutes,
expectations that we don'tunderstand, and it's this
tangled mess of mandates thatwe're not really sure how to
(17:29):
navigate, and so sometimes it'seasier just to kind of put our
heads down and pretend it's nothappening at all or just to say
Matt, these kids are just likeeverybody else.
I know how to counsel people.
I know how to counsel anybody,so I can counsel them too.
And that may very well be true,but a lot of it depends on
which resources you're selectingfor use.
(17:53):
I mentioned at the top of theepisode.
Think about your dyslexicstudents.
If you have a student whostruggles with reading and
writing, why would we put apaper in front of them that
requires them to read and write?
We want to reduce their mentaland emotional load, not add to
it, right, but I've never, everheard a discussion in the school
(18:14):
counseling world about reducingthe cognitive load for dyslexic
students.
Think about students with ADHD.
If we're sitting down andhaving to focus on a structured
worksheet, that could very wellcause them to disengage, right?
Their brains are not wired forthat.
Or we may be oversimplifyingsocial-emotional challenges for
(18:37):
our autistic students, who tendto see things in black and white
anyway, and here we areproviding a worksheet that is
reinforcing those ideas, insteadof perhaps getting into some
interventions or some activitiesthat expose the student to
nuance and how to read andinterpret those in their
(18:58):
day-to-day life.
Raven, blakely, smith andHepburn 2015 have a lot of
information about usingindividualized approaches for
more effective interventionswith students in special
populations.
And it's true, because thosekinds of things can help you
(19:18):
account for the unique needs,their abilities, the
circumstances of each student,the way they see the world and
truly what they want toaccomplish.
Chavits and Chavits 2005 foundthat traditional literacy-based
tasks can significantly hinderprogress for dyslexic learners.
(19:41):
They need some moremulti-sensory approaches.
They also said heavy readingand writing is going to
exacerbate frustration ratherthan improve emotional
regulation.
So we're going backwards withthis and we're making our jobs
harder.
Raven Blakely Smith, colleenShetburn and Hepburn in 2012
(20:05):
found that generalizedstrategies like these generic
feelings worksheets or theycited also social skills group
activities fail to recognize thenuances of students' unique
triggers.
They also don't recognize thestudent's developmental stage.
Sometimes our specialpopulation kids are either above
(20:27):
or behind that developmentalcurve.
Hammond 2015 also asserts thatmany paper-based activities
assume a Eurocentric or amainstream cultural perspective,
so they may not resonate withall students and the information
(20:52):
may not actually be accessibleto all students.
We can do better throughindividualized, culturally
responsive approaches to improvenot only the student's
engagement with the material butalso their outcome, and we need
to be thinking about this as weare designing interventions.
So what do we do interventions?
(21:18):
So what do we do?
We have all of this informationabout the caveats and dangers
of using these print and prayactivities, especially when
we're working with students inspecial pops.
So what do we do instead?
Because I imagine you'resitting there thinking, hey,
steph, this is all well and good, but I don't have time to sit
down and intentionally design anintervention for every single
(21:39):
student that walks in my office.
I would never get anything done.
I don't have that kind of timeon my hands.
Well, the good news is, if youare well-versed in some basic
categories of interventions,you're going to be just fine.
As a matter of fact, you'regoing to be better than fine
because you're going to be ableto deploy experiences for kids
(22:01):
that are actually going to movethe needle.
For students who struggle withtraditional paper-based
activities, maybe we should belooking at some sensory-based
intervention.
For example.
What about sand tray therapy,students with trauma, students
(22:22):
with anxiety?
Letting them express emotionsand work through problems in a
non-verbal way.
Let them use the symbolism totell the story.
Especially if students struggleto verbalize their thoughts or
verbalize their feelings.
This is going to be very, verypowerful for them and I can
(22:45):
attest personally to this.
I worked on a campus once withan extremely high student trauma
population and it made sensebecause we served two large
facilities that were foster homefacilities and so students had
a lot of unresolved trauma intheir lives and they did
(23:07):
struggle to verbalize theirthoughts and feelings because
for so long safety was instaying quiet and we would often
go to the sand tray and itwould be amazing the load that
would come off their shoulderswhen they got done building
their tray Super, super awesome.
If you want some more resources, look into some resources such
(23:30):
as the ones by Hohmeyer andSweeney, very, very
knowledgeable and educated insand tray therapy.
Go get a little bit of trainingin that, just so you kind of
have a feel for where you'regoing, because it's not just
playing in the sand, it's notjust raking through it, it's not
that kind of sensory experience.
True, sand play therapyactivities are completely
(23:51):
different, so you're going towant to know what you're doing
before you jump in, but that'sdefinitely a wonderful option.
What about some art-basedtechniques?
What about allowing students tocreatively express themselves
through art?
Now you're probably thinking Ido that a lot, but do you really
(24:11):
?
Crayons and paper markers andthings like that are one thing,
but are you truly giving them adifferent experience?
Are you getting out the paintsticks?
Do you have the quick sticks inyour office?
If you don't have a set ofthose, you need to go to Amazon
right now and get some.
They are magical.
(24:32):
Do you have some watercolors?
Do you have some paint markers?
Things like that?
What can you do to really bringthat experience to life, above
and beyond what they're alreadydoing in the classroom?
Or third, what about movementactivities?
The classroom?
(24:52):
Or third, what about movementactivities, especially for
students who are hyperactive,who have attention issues or who
struggle with some of like theinteroception and proprioception
?
Now, we're not occupationaltherapists, but we can still
provide some of thoseexperiences, and things like
learning to manage yoga poses,learning to follow a simple
(25:13):
movement sequence, can haveprofound effects for our
students.
One of the greatest privilegesof my life was leading a
movement therapy group forstudents with developmental
disabilities group for studentswith developmental disabilities,
(25:34):
and it was amazing to see whatmovement did for students and
helping them better regulate,not only within the group but
when they were out and abouttrying to mainstream in public
education.
The parents would come back allthe time and tell me what a
significant impact that washaving.
Look into some of the yoga carddecks you can get.
They're fun just to practice.
You can challenge the kids howlong can you hold this pose?
(25:56):
Can you beat me?
Or look into some things likebrain dance.
You can find some videos onYouTube about that and those are
some simple, fun sequences thatyou can do together.
You can turn on some music andreally make it an event, but
those can be so powerful withthe students so you should try
them.
(26:31):
Some textured materials I onceworked with a counselor who had
a box of lentils in her officeand students just loved that
sensory, tactile experience.
Can you provide that instead?
Can you use those materials ina way that still allow you to
have the same kinds ofconversations you would have
been having through paper andpencil, but without the paper
and pencil?
Can you modify some of your CBTinterventions that are likely
(26:55):
on paper into some othermodalities?
Can you present them throughinteractive stories, maybe some
interactive social stories,maybe using some props or some
toys to really immerse studentsin situations, to really act
(27:16):
those out and prepare andrehearse for when they happen in
the real world?
This is one of my most favoriteinterventions with students and
I'm sure it's because of myperforming arts background.
But I just find it so powerfulfor students, once they've
rehearsed and they have in mindwhat can happen next or what
they can say, it's amazing howmuch ownership they can take in
(27:38):
the next steps.
Along the same lines, what aboutrole-playing?
Maybe you have some props,maybe you have some puppets or
some masks or things like thatwhere you can get really
creative but still process theemotional aspects of the
situations.
What about video self-modeling?
What about you role play andyou practice the response and
(28:03):
then you let students watchthemselves completing that task?
It's only going to reinforcetheir actions and decisions in
the rehearsal so that when itcomes down to brass tacks,
they're ready to go.
Or what about some of thetherapeutic games you have in
your office?
Are you leaning on those forthe processing value they can
(28:25):
bring?
So not only just playing Uno asa stress reliever or getting to
know you activity, but how canwe modify games to really make
them work?
Playing things like the un-gamewith lots of discussion and
interaction can be really cool.
Mad Dragon is a favorite in myoffice.
It's a lot like Uno, but itgives us the opportunity to talk
(28:48):
through coping strategies foranger, those kinds of things.
According to Pels and Kleinert2016, they're tremendous in
helping students self-affirm,and so let's lean on those
resources.
I bet you already have some inyour office, but just think
about different ways that youcan use the same resources your
(29:09):
office, but just think aboutdifferent ways that you can use
the same resources.
So I hope that gives you someideas of some non-paper-pencil
things that you can try inassisting your students in
taking on their challenges atschool.
When we do this, we need totake care that if we have a
student in a special populationparticularly if they're in
(29:30):
special education or 504, makesure that we're looking at their
IEP, make sure that we're awareof the goals.
It doesn't necessarily mean wehave to work on those that
that's not within our scope ofresponsibilities but we can
reinforce them and we can createactivities that align with
those specific needs.
(29:50):
In the same mindset, you couldlook at the student's behavior
intervention plan, their BIP, tosee what skills they seem to be
lacking and choose someactivities that can reinforce
those.
At the same time that maybeyou're reinforcing something
else on your end.
It's really, really cool whenall that starts to sync and work
together and then we start tosee some tremendous growth in
(30:14):
our kiddos Also, too.
Let me mention one more timejust the importance of being
culturally responsive andtrauma-informed in the
activities that we're presentingto students, making sure that
we're acknowledging backgroundsand that we're acknowledging
experiences of students withspecial needs, who can be
(30:34):
marginalized, who can suffermicroaggressions in the
classroom.
Right, we need to make surethat we are addressing those as
we're building relationships, aswe're building skills and as we
are helping them move forwardto their best selves.
All right, so to recap,critically evaluate your school
(30:57):
counseling toolkit.
Are your resources andactivities predominantly
worksheet-based?
Are your materials aligned withyour students' needs
specifically, or are they justconvenient one-size-fits-all
solutions?
And consider your students'engagement levels with your
(31:17):
current interventions.
Are students activelyparticipating?
Are you seeing growth or dothey seem disengaged and
frustrated?
Are they feeling hindered dueto their unique learning needs?
Just ask them.
Ask them how do you feel aboutthis?
Do you like this or would yourather do something else?
(31:38):
Because I promise they willtell you.
Consider some of the alternativeapproaches we talked through
sensory-based interventions,non-paper-based cognitive
behavior approaches or sensoryinterventions, some role play
and therapeutic game playing.
The sky is the limit with this,and once you start to really
(32:00):
learn and grow as a practitioner, you're going to discover that
you don't need any of theseprint and pray things.
You already have probablyeverything you need already in
your office ready to go.
So I hope by now you're seeingthese paper pencil activities in
a different way, whetherthey've been your go-to or not.
(32:23):
We all need to be looking atthe bigger picture, specifically
for our students in specialpopulations, because I don't
think that paper is the gamechanger that we often think it
is, and the good news is you cangradually shift out of that
mindset into more meaningful andapplicable activities for
(32:45):
students so we can support themtoward their best outcomes.
If you loved this, if thisepisode resonated with you and
you're excited about thepossibilities with this, I want
to remind you this is the kindof stuff we talk about each and
every week in our School forSchool Counselors, mastermind,
(33:07):
we meet weekly for support andconsultation.
We talk about situations justlike this, ideas of things to
deploy or approaches to use, andwe have our school counseling
playbooks inside of theMastermind, which are guides to
guide you through theseinterventions, where you can
customize and personalize themfor the student without having
(33:32):
to print any additionalmaterials.
Go grab a bunch of extrasupplies.
It's just all right there.
It's leaning on yourprofessional expertise and just
showing you how to betterharness it for phenomenal
outcomes.
All that and more is waitingfor you in the School for School
Counselors Mastermind.
You can join it by going toschoolforschoolcounselorscom
(33:55):
slash mastermind.
All the information and thesign up button will be right
there, and we can't wait towelcome you All right.
Well, this was a powerfulepisode and I am so grateful
that you stuck with me throughthe end.
I'll be back soon with anotherepisode of the School for School
Counselors.
Well, this was a powerfulepisode and I am so grateful
that you stuck with me throughthe end.
I'll be back soon with anotherepisode of the School for School
Counselors podcast.
In the meantime, I hope youhave the best week, take care of
(34:19):
yourself, keep being awesomeand I'll be back with you very
soon.
Hello there, school counselor.
Hey, let me ask you something.
When is the last time that youhanded a student a worksheet and
then walked away going, wow,that made such a huge difference
.
Now think about this You'resitting with a student who
(00:21):
struggles with reading Maybethey struggle with communication
or some sensory overload andyou hand them another worksheet.
You might be unintentionallyshutting the door on the very
progress that you're trying tomake, but don't worry, you're
certainly not the only one.
(00:42):
Today, we're going to pull backthe curtain on why worksheets
aren't the miracle tool we'vebeen led to believe, especially
when we're working with studentswho have special needs.
And, more importantly, we'regoing to talk about what really
works.
So let's rethink our toolkitsfor students and dive into
(01:04):
what's truly best practice.
Now, before we start, I wouldlove to read a review from
Shanice Tett, and she titled herreview the Right Stuff.
The review goes on to say thisSteph takes school counseling
and makes it relatable, real andthought-provoking.
And makes it relatable, realand thought-provoking With an
(01:24):
honest assessment of thisprofession.
I have never felt more seen andheard.
This, along with the mastermind, has allowed me to become a
better counselor and leader toother counselors.
Do yourself a favor and listento this podcast.
It was the best decision I made.
Shanice, thank you so much forthat wonderful review.
(01:48):
It means so much to me and tomy team, and we're just
flabbergasted that people arewilling to spend a few minutes
to say some kind words about thepodcast.
If you'd like for me to shareyour review on the podcast, head
on over to your podcast playerof choice, whether that's Apple
or Spotify.
Rate us with five shiny goldstars and then tell us what you
(02:11):
think of the podcast.
We'd love to hear your thoughts.
All right, so back to the topicat hand.
You know we're torn in a milliondifferent directions each and
every day.
Right, we're in hyperdrive allday long and we are working to
not only make significantimpacts for students but to
(02:33):
reach as many students as wepossibly can, and because of
that, we are usually looking forthings that are quick and
things that are effective.
Right, and worksheets orprintables seem to be the
perfect solution to that problem, because they're neat, they're
organized, they're easy to printand hand out.
(02:54):
But the uncomfortable truthabout these resources is that,
while they may feel like they'rean effective catch-all for the
things that you're dealing withthroughout your day, those
sheets can actually work againstyou, especially when you're
working with some of our mostvulnerable students.
(03:15):
If we think about a dyslexicstudent who struggles with text,
dyslexic student who struggleswith text, or a student with
autism that struggles to relateto abstract feelings on paper,
or an anxious student whose mindjust keeps racing and racing
(03:36):
and they can't settle down tofocus on a written task, these
students need more than just aone-size-fits-all approach, and
so we're going to look into thedetails on why those trusty
little sheets may be doing moreharm than good and causing more
(03:57):
work for you in the long run.
But here's the great newsBeyond breaking down why these
may not be working, we're alsogoing to talk about what does
work the tangible,research-backed strategies that
will help you engage yourstudents in more meaningful ways
(04:19):
than just on paper just onpaper.
So if you're ready to shake upyour school counseling program
and you're ready to giveindividualized support, you want
to stick with me here, becausewe are going to get very, very
intentional in the conversation.
I remember once early in myschool counseling career, I was
(04:40):
working with a young lady whofelt a tremendous sense of
responsibility within her familyand she would go above and
beyond out of her way to takecare of things at home that
really weren't necessarily herresponsibilities, and her
parents were sort of baffled byit.
(05:00):
The student was feelingstressed and overwhelmed and
we'd really kind of been workingon how to address that problem,
because not only was it presentat home, but it had started to
trickle in and affect herability to perform at school.
So we had done all of thethings that I'd been taught to
do in my counseling program andI was relying on the things that
(05:24):
people online were telling meshould work, and nothing really
seemed to land.
It was just like we kept goingover the same information day
after day and it really wasn'tsinking in.
And the student would say yeah,yeah, I understand, I see what
you're saying, or you know, Irecognize that, but she wasn't
(05:45):
able to change.
There was something missing andI couldn't figure out what it
was.
One day, on a whim, I saw anempty backpack in the closet in
my office and I thought you know, I bet I can use that.
So the next time the studentcame in my office I said let's
do something different.
Here's a stack of sticky notesand a Sharpie, because you know,
(06:06):
those students love to writewith those Sharpies.
Take this Sharpie and writedown all of the responsibilities
that you feel you should takecare of in your day.
So she wrote on a stack ofsticky notes and she probably
had eight or nine really heavytopics on her sticky notes,
(06:26):
things that felt like heavyresponsibilities for her.
So we pulled those out and Istarted pulling books off my
bookshelf.
I wasn't aiming for the bigones, I was just pulling them
off, you know, from the end allthe way down the line, and I
would put a sticky note on thebook and I would say, okay,
here's this responsibilitytaking care of little brother
after school and I would put itin the back.
(06:47):
And then I would take anothersticky note here's this
responsibility.
And I would put it in thebackpack.
And over and over and overagain, we put sticky notes on
all the books, put them in thebackpack.
And then I said, hey, so nowput it on, put the backpack on
your back and see and feel theweight of all of these
(07:08):
responsibilities that you'vechosen for yourself.
And she put the backpack on andit was undeniable the way her
face changed and she looked atme and she said I've been
carrying around a lot and I said, yes, you sure have the
paper-pencil approach, thedrawing diagrams was not
(07:32):
speaking to her.
She needed something differentand I think so often we have
students just like that all overour campuses that need
something more than a.
You know, paper-based activitieshave been promoted as very
(07:55):
simple, very low prep and thatyou can use them for emotional
regulation, social skills,problem solving, cognitive,
behavioral exercises.
And they are nice in thatthey're convenient.
It doesn't take a lot of timeto print one of those suckers
out.
It doesn't take a lot of timeto print one of those suckers
out, and when you don't have aplanning period, when you have
(08:17):
all of these responsibilities,you can quickly print it out,
hand it to the student and itfeels like it's an answer to a
prayer when your time is scarceand when you want to engage
students and you really want tobe structured.
I think, too, these paper-basedactivities have caught a lot of
people's attention because itreduces our cognitive load when
(08:42):
we're working through thingslike conflict resolution or
problem solving.
Those activities outlinestep-by-step processes, don't
they?
Identify the problem,brainstorm the solutions, try
implementing a solution andreflect on the possible outcomes
.
We don't have to work as hardwhen it's on paper, right in
(09:04):
front of us.
And two, I will say I think alot of school counselors lack
the confidence to be able toembark on a lot of different
kinds of counselinginterventions all in one day,
flying by the seat of theirpants, without any sort of
reference materials or resources.
That seems to scare the pantsoff of a lot of school
(09:26):
counselors that I talk to and weneed to change that.
That's what we're working ondoing in our School for School
Counselors Mastermind.
You know this conversation ismaking me think about the
feelings worksheets, where youknow you have common emotions on
the sheet and you have tocircle or color in how you're
(09:47):
feeling.
I think the idea is to be verystraightforward and still give a
guided way for expressingthemselves when students are
struggling to verbalize theirthoughts or perhaps when the
counselor is struggling with theidea of open-ended discussion
about the topic.
And I don't want this to soundbelittling because I don't think
(10:07):
that's it.
I know that our field is filledwith amazing, smart, dynamic
school counselors.
So please don't take away mesaying, well, you just you don't
know enough to do your jobwithout worksheets.
That that is not my message.
My message is I think we fly sofast and our industry tells us
(10:29):
over and over and over again getthese resources, they'll make
your life simpler that we justkind of buy into it.
Right, we're too tired to argue, we don't want to have to think
and learn and grow after workhours because we're just so
spent by four or five o'clockright.
So this is no shade on anybody,but it is something that we
(10:51):
need to be talking about.
A lot of these worksheets, too,will claim to be aligned with
standards.
They'll claim to be alignedwith the ASCA national model,
with the ASCA mindsets andbehaviors, and so if we see that
, then we think, oh, okay, sothis thing is somewhat vetted,
(11:11):
not realizing anybody can saythat about anything that they
make.
Not realizing anybody can saythat about anything that they
make.
All they have to do is find onepiece within those expectations
and apply that word to theresource and say, yeah, it's
aligned with this.
I've shared with you before ina past episode that teachers pay
teachers.
(11:31):
Resources in the peer-reviewedliterature are showing abysmal
results, and some of thefindings on those resources are
downright scary for our students.
You can go back and referenceepisode 114 in your podcast
player.
It's back in, I believe at theend of August.
(11:56):
The episode was called AreYours Legit the Uncomfortable
Truth About School CounselingResources.
So go check that out if youwant to be more a part of that
conversation.
But research tells us Sheltonand Archambault 2019, among
others, tell us that usuallywhen they say they're aligned,
(12:20):
they really aren't that theseresources are not rigorously
tested for effectiveness,particularly when we're talking
about working with students inspecial population contexts
working with students in specialpopulation contexts.
So they may be quick and easy,they may be really cute, but
(12:44):
their quality and theappropriateness for the
diversity of needs that you seeon your campus may not hit the
mark.
And again, shelton andArchibald say that these kinds
of inconsistencies really raiseconcerns about long-term
educational outcomes.
When we rely heavily on thesekinds of resources, we can't be
assured that we're going to beable to help students make the
(13:06):
gains they need to make.
And when we think about it thatway, we really start to realize
that the more of these unvetted, untested resources that we're
using in our school counselingprogram, the more work we may be
intentionally creating forourselves.
I have said before and I willsay again it amazes me,
(13:29):
especially in the schoolcounseling world, where we are
so invested in evidence base anddata both of which we should be
invested in that we're notpublishing those kinds of
information on TPT resources.
Now, teachers Pay.
Teachers doesn't require that,but it doesn't mean nobody can
(13:49):
step up and say, hey, I'm goingto do this anyway.
Let me gather a focus group,let me get a group of 20 or 30
school counselors, let me havethem deploy this and let me have
them show me their real-timedata, and then I can publish
that alongside of my resourceand really be able to show that
it might be worth working with.
(14:11):
But y'all, no one's done that.
No one's done that, and I getthat it's extra work.
I get that it's extra time.
It sounds like a nightmare tocoordinate all that, but at the
end of the day, if we don't havesome of that boots on the
ground, action, research goingon, we literally have nothing to
prove the effectiveness ofthese materials.
(14:34):
I think, too, we are drawn tothese kinds of things because
when we're doing like groupcounseling or we're doing
guidance lessons, it feelsefficient for our time in prep
and for engaging lots ofstudents at the same time.
So that feels good.
We feel like we're doing whatwe should be doing.
(14:55):
Now I will say again and I feellike I really need to bring
this point home A lot of peoplehave gotten very upset with me
in the past when I've talkedabout TPT resources, about being
very careful about the thingsthat we're using, and I have had
(15:16):
people tell me things like howdare you tell me that I can't
make good judgments about mymaterials?
How dare you downplay myeducation and my expertise as a
school counselor and y'all?
This is not to do any of thosethings, but it is to get you
thinking more critically aboutthe resources that you're using.
(15:39):
If you go online in any of mostof the school counseling groups
on the planet, you see peopletalking about printable
resources, and there's a reallyimportant piece of the
conversation that no one talksabout when we're looking at
these things, and that is mostof those.
Social media groups werecreated by the people that are
(16:01):
creating those resources.
They create theseentrepreneurial ventures on
Teachers, pay Teachers.
They start Facebook groups togenerate buzz and conversation,
and then they want to be able topost about their resources by
getting you on their email listor something like that.
I don't think a day goes bythat I don't get an email from
(16:23):
somebody asking me to buy theirresource, and no shade there
y'all.
No shame in the hustle game atall, but we need to make sure
that, as we are being delugedwith these kinds of messages,
that we are intentional aboutwhere and how we're using these
materials and what we'reselecting.
Now, this month we are talkingabout on the podcast, special
(16:47):
student populations, how we canbetter serve them and meet their
needs, because next monththat's exactly what we're going
to be focusing on every day inthat's exactly what we're going
to be focusing on every day inour mastermind.
We're going to be talkingthrough the ins and outs of
special populations, the thingsthat maybe you didn't learn in
grad school, and some better,more effective ways to address
(17:07):
those populations.
Those are typically groups ofstudents that we don't get a lot
of experience with before weget out on our own, and they're
tied up in lots of legislativemandates, laws, statutes,
expectations that we don'tunderstand, and it's this
tangled mess of mandates thatwe're not really sure how to
(17:29):
navigate, and so sometimes it'seasier just to kind of put our
heads down and pretend it's nothappening at all or just to say
Matt, these kids are just likeeverybody else.
I know how to counsel people.
I know how to counsel anybody,so I can counsel them too.
And that may very well be true,but a lot of it depends on
which resources you're selectingfor use.
(17:53):
I mentioned at the top of theepisode.
Think about your dyslexicstudents.
If you have a student whostruggles with reading and
writing, why would we put apaper in front of them that
requires them to read and write?
We want to reduce their mentaland emotional load, not add to
it, right, but I've never, everheard a discussion in the school
(18:14):
counseling world about reducingthe cognitive load for dyslexic
students.
Think about students with ADHD.
If we're sitting down andhaving to focus on a structured
worksheet, that could very wellcause them to disengage, right?
Their brains are not wired forthat.
Or we may be oversimplifyingsocial-emotional challenges for
(18:37):
our autistic students, who tendto see things in black and white
anyway, and here we areproviding a worksheet that is
reinforcing those ideas, insteadof perhaps getting into some
interventions or some activitiesthat expose the student to
nuance and how to read andinterpret those in their
(18:58):
day-to-day life.
Raven, blakely, smith andHepburn 2015 have a lot of
information about usingindividualized approaches for
more effective interventionswith students in special
populations.
And it's true, because thosekinds of things can help you
(19:18):
account for the unique needs,their abilities, the
circumstances of each student,the way they see the world and
truly what they want toaccomplish.
Chavits and Chavits 2005 foundthat traditional literacy-based
tasks can significantly hinderprogress for dyslexic learners.
(19:41):
They need some moremulti-sensory approaches.
They also said heavy readingand writing is going to
exacerbate frustration ratherthan improve emotional
regulation.
So we're going backwards withthis and we're making our jobs
harder.
Raven Blakely Smith, colleenShetburn and Hepburn in 2012
(20:05):
found that generalizedstrategies like these generic
feelings worksheets or theycited also social skills group
activities fail to recognize thenuances of students' unique
triggers.
They also don't recognize thestudent's developmental stage.
Sometimes our specialpopulation kids are either above
(20:27):
or behind that developmentalcurve.
Hammond 2015 also asserts thatmany paper-based activities
assume a Eurocentric or amainstream cultural perspective,
so they may not resonate withall students and the information
(20:52):
may not actually be accessibleto all students.
We can do better throughindividualized, culturally
responsive approaches to improvenot only the student's
engagement with the material butalso their outcome, and we need
to be thinking about this as weare designing interventions.
So what do we do interventions?
(21:18):
So what do we do?
We have all of this informationabout the caveats and dangers
of using these print and prayactivities, especially when
we're working with students inspecial pops.
So what do we do instead?
Because I imagine you'resitting there thinking, hey,
steph, this is all well and good, but I don't have time to sit
down and intentionally design anintervention for every single
(21:39):
student that walks in my office.
I would never get anything done.
I don't have that kind of timeon my hands.
Well, the good news is, if youare well-versed in some basic
categories of interventions,you're going to be just fine.
As a matter of fact, you'regoing to be better than fine
because you're going to be ableto deploy experiences for kids
(22:01):
that are actually going to movethe needle.
For students who struggle withtraditional paper-based
activities, maybe we should belooking at some sensory-based
intervention.
For example.
What about sand tray therapy,students with trauma, students
(22:22):
with anxiety?
Letting them express emotionsand work through problems in a
non-verbal way.
Let them use the symbolism totell the story.
Especially if students struggleto verbalize their thoughts or
verbalize their feelings.
This is going to be very, verypowerful for them and I can
(22:45):
attest personally to this.
I worked on a campus once withan extremely high student trauma
population and it made sensebecause we served two large
facilities that were foster homefacilities and so students had
a lot of unresolved trauma intheir lives and they did
(23:07):
struggle to verbalize theirthoughts and feelings because
for so long safety was instaying quiet and we would often
go to the sand tray and itwould be amazing the load that
would come off their shoulderswhen they got done building
their tray Super, super awesome.
If you want some more resources, look into some resources such
(23:30):
as the ones by Hohmeyer andSweeney, very, very
knowledgeable and educated insand tray therapy.
Go get a little bit of trainingin that, just so you kind of
have a feel for where you'regoing, because it's not just
playing in the sand, it's notjust raking through it, it's not
that kind of sensory experience.
True, sand play therapyactivities are completely
(23:51):
different, so you're going towant to know what you're doing
before you jump in, but that'sdefinitely a wonderful option.
What about some art-basedtechniques?
What about allowing students tocreatively express themselves
through art?
Now you're probably thinking Ido that a lot, but do you really
(24:11):
?
Crayons and paper markers andthings like that are one thing,
but are you truly giving them adifferent experience?
Are you getting out the paintsticks?
Do you have the quick sticks inyour office?
If you don't have a set ofthose, you need to go to Amazon
right now and get some.
They are magical.
(24:32):
Do you have some watercolors?
Do you have some paint markers?
Things like that?
What can you do to really bringthat experience to life, above
and beyond what they're alreadydoing in the classroom?
Or third, what about movementactivities?
The classroom?
(24:52):
Or third, what about movementactivities, especially for
students who are hyperactive,who have attention issues or who
struggle with some of like theinteroception and proprioception
?
Now, we're not occupationaltherapists, but we can still
provide some of thoseexperiences, and things like
learning to manage yoga poses,learning to follow a simple
(25:13):
movement sequence, can haveprofound effects for our
students.
One of the greatest privilegesof my life was leading a
movement therapy group forstudents with developmental
disabilities group for studentswith developmental disabilities,
(25:34):
and it was amazing to see whatmovement did for students and
helping them better regulate,not only within the group but
when they were out and abouttrying to mainstream in public
education.
The parents would come back allthe time and tell me what a
significant impact that washaving.
Look into some of the yoga carddecks you can get.
They're fun just to practice.
You can challenge the kids howlong can you hold this pose?
(25:56):
Can you beat me?
Or look into some things likebrain dance.
You can find some videos onYouTube about that and those are
some simple, fun sequences thatyou can do together.
You can turn on some music andreally make it an event, but
those can be so powerful withthe students so you should try
them.
(26:31):
Some textured materials I onceworked with a counselor who had
a box of lentils in her officeand students just loved that
sensory, tactile experience.
Can you provide that instead?
Can you use those materials ina way that still allow you to
have the same kinds ofconversations you would have
been having through paper andpencil, but without the paper
and pencil?
Can you modify some of your CBTinterventions that are likely
(26:55):
on paper into some othermodalities?
Can you present them throughinteractive stories, maybe some
interactive social stories,maybe using some props or some
toys to really immerse studentsin situations, to really act
(27:16):
those out and prepare andrehearse for when they happen in
the real world?
This is one of my most favoriteinterventions with students and
I'm sure it's because of myperforming arts background.
But I just find it so powerfulfor students, once they've
rehearsed and they have in mindwhat can happen next or what
they can say, it's amazing howmuch ownership they can take in
(27:38):
the next steps.
Along the same lines, what aboutrole-playing?
Maybe you have some props,maybe you have some puppets or
some masks or things like thatwhere you can get really
creative but still process theemotional aspects of the
situations.
What about video self-modeling?
What about you role play andyou practice the response and
(28:03):
then you let students watchthemselves completing that task?
It's only going to reinforcetheir actions and decisions in
the rehearsal so that when itcomes down to brass tacks,
they're ready to go.
Or what about some of thetherapeutic games you have in
your office?
Are you leaning on those forthe processing value they can
(28:25):
bring?
So not only just playing Uno asa stress reliever or getting to
know you activity, but how canwe modify games to really make
them work?
Playing things like the un-gamewith lots of discussion and
interaction can be really cool.
Mad Dragon is a favorite in myoffice.
It's a lot like Uno, but itgives us the opportunity to talk
(28:48):
through coping strategies foranger, those kinds of things.
According to Pels and Kleinert2016, they're tremendous in
helping students self-affirm,and so let's lean on those
resources.
I bet you already have some inyour office, but just think
about different ways that youcan use the same resources your
(29:09):
office, but just think aboutdifferent ways that you can use
the same resources.
So I hope that gives you someideas of some non-paper-pencil
things that you can try inassisting your students in
taking on their challenges atschool.
When we do this, we need totake care that if we have a
student in a special populationparticularly if they're in
(29:30):
special education or 504, makesure that we're looking at their
IEP, make sure that we're awareof the goals.
It doesn't necessarily mean wehave to work on those that
that's not within our scope ofresponsibilities but we can
reinforce them and we can createactivities that align with
those specific needs.
(29:50):
In the same mindset, you couldlook at the student's behavior
intervention plan, their BIP, tosee what skills they seem to be
lacking and choose someactivities that can reinforce
those.
At the same time that maybeyou're reinforcing something
else on your end.
It's really, really cool whenall that starts to sync and work
together and then we start tosee some tremendous growth in
(30:14):
our kiddos Also, too.
Let me mention one more timejust the importance of being
culturally responsive andtrauma-informed in the
activities that we're presentingto students, making sure that
we're acknowledging backgroundsand that we're acknowledging
experiences of students withspecial needs, who can be
(30:34):
marginalized, who can suffermicroaggressions in the
classroom.
Right, we need to make surethat we are addressing those as
we're building relationships, aswe're building skills and as we
are helping them move forwardto their best selves.
All right, so to recap,critically evaluate your school
(30:57):
counseling toolkit.
Are your resources andactivities predominantly
worksheet-based?
Are your materials aligned withyour students' needs
specifically, or are they justconvenient one-size-fits-all
solutions?
And consider your students'engagement levels with your
(31:17):
current interventions.
Are students activelyparticipating?
Are you seeing growth or dothey seem disengaged and
frustrated?
Are they feeling hindered dueto their unique learning needs?
Just ask them.
Ask them how do you feel aboutthis?
Do you like this or would yourather do something else?
(31:38):
Because I promise they willtell you.
Consider some of the alternativeapproaches we talked through
sensory-based interventions,non-paper-based cognitive
behavior approaches or sensoryinterventions, some role play
and therapeutic game playing.
The sky is the limit with this,and once you start to really
(32:00):
learn and grow as a practitioner, you're going to discover that
you don't need any of theseprint and pray things.
You already have probablyeverything you need already in
your office ready to go.
So I hope by now you're seeingthese paper pencil activities in
a different way, whetherthey've been your go-to or not.
(32:23):
We all need to be looking atthe bigger picture, specifically
for our students in specialpopulations, because I don't
think that paper is the gamechanger that we often think it
is, and the good news is you cangradually shift out of that
mindset into more meaningful andapplicable activities for
(32:45):
students so we can support themtoward their best outcomes.
If you loved this, if thisepisode resonated with you and
you're excited about thepossibilities with this, I want
to remind you this is the kindof stuff we talk about each and
every week in our School forSchool Counselors, mastermind,
(33:07):
we meet weekly for support andconsultation.
We talk about situations justlike this, ideas of things to
deploy or approaches to use, andwe have our school counseling
playbooks inside of theMastermind, which are guides to
guide you through theseinterventions, where you can
customize and personalize themfor the student without having
(33:32):
to print any additionalmaterials.
Go grab a bunch of extrasupplies.
It's just all right there.
It's leaning on yourprofessional expertise and just
showing you how to betterharness it for phenomenal
outcomes.
All that and more is waitingfor you in the School for School
Counselors Mastermind.
You can join it by going toschoolforschoolcounselorscom
(33:55):
slash mastermind.
All the information and thesign up button will be right
there, and we can't wait towelcome you All right.
Well, this was a powerfulepisode and I am so grateful
that you stuck with me throughthe end.
I'll be back soon with anotherepisode of the School for School
Counselors.
Well, this was a powerfulepisode and I am so grateful
that you stuck with me throughthe end.
I'll be back soon with anotherepisode of the School for School
Counselors podcast.
In the meantime, I hope youhave the best week, take care of
(34:19):
yourself, keep being awesomeand I'll be back with you very
soon.
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