Episode Transcript
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Susan Lambert (00:01):
This is Susan
Lambert, and welcome to a
special miniseries from Scienceof Reading: The Podcast from
Amplify, where the Science ofReading lives. In recent years,
the Science of Reading movementhas been gaining momentum
around the country.
News Anchor 1 (00:15):
This new
curriculum change goes into ,
uh, the Science of Reading...
News Anchor 2 (00:21):
Today, teachers
here focus on the Science of
Reading.
News Anchor 3 (00:23):
Teaching the
Science of Reading...
News Anchor 4 (00:25):
...make it
easier for school districts
across the state to implementthe Science of Reading
approach.
Susan Lambert (00:31):
But amidst that
excitement, experts and
advocates for a particulargroup of students have raised
some concerns about therelationship between the
Science of Reading and thiscritically important
population.
Kajal Patel Below (00:44):
So there
have been some differing
viewpoints in the researchcommunity among experts in the
Science of Reading field, andexperts who focus on
multilingual and Englishlearners.
Susan Lambert (00:56):
That's my
colleague, Kajal Patel Below,
vice president of biliteracy atAmplify. As Kajal has traveled
the country listening toexperts and advocates for
multilingual and Englishlearners, she's heard concerns
such as the fact thatmultilingual and English
learners have beenunderrepresented in academic
(01:17):
research and misidentified withreading difficulties. And then
there's the concern that anarrower misinterpretation of
the Science of Reading could beespecially problematic for
multilingual and Englishlearners.
Kajal Patel Below (01:30):
And a
specific concern is
overemphasis on foundationalskills over language
comprehension. I heard anadvocate talk about a
requirement of 45 or a mandateof 45 minutes for phonics
instruction only. You know,multilingual and English
learners, they need that all,all learners, all the students
(01:53):
need that balance and thatemphasis on language
comprehension and especiallymultilingual and English
learners need practice and workwith oracy and vocabulary.
Susan Lambert (02:07):
This background
and these concerns were a big
part of what made a recentdocument so monumental. Last
October, the Reading League andthe National Committee for
Effective Literacy, groupsadvocating for evidence-based
literacy instruction inmultilingual and English
learners, put out a jointstatement. It was titled
"Understanding the Difference:
The Science of Reading and (02:27):
undefined
Implementation for EnglishLearners / Emergent
Bilinguals."
Kajal Patel Below (02:35):
I think this
statement is really great. The
reason I like it is I think itdoes just a really good job of
grounding and research, butalso emphasizing the
differences for multilingualand English learners. Um, it
had input from over 20 authorsand contributors. It was signed
by over 220 organizations.
Susan Lambert (02:54):
The statement
laid out takeaways from the
research showing how thescience of Reading does support
multilingual and Englishlearners
Kajal Patel Below (03:02):
Overall, it
established the importance of
the decades and breadth ofresearch that there is, but
then it lifted up the need toensure that we center
multilingual and Englishlearners. And it specifically
called out that there arepractices being implemented in
schools under the name ofScience of Reading, that don't
(03:23):
align with the scientificevidence of how English
learners and emergentbilinguals learn to read. And
we all agree that what we needto be doing is research based.
And also, in order to do that,I think it's important that we
have, I guess, I don't know, agroup effort and alignment on
how that should be done. Sothat's one reason I think the
(03:45):
statement is really important.
Susan Lambert (03:47):
And on this
episode, we're going to dive
deeper into that statement andthe history that led up to it,
including some of the waysmultilingual and English
learners have historically beenunderserved in this country.
And we're going to kick offthis brand new miniseries,
exploring how the Science ofReading does serve multilingual
and English learners. So let'sget started by diving into my
(04:10):
full conversation with AmplifyVice President of Biliteracy
Kajal Patel, Below. Well,hello, Kajal. I'm so excited to
have you on today's episode.
Welcome.
Kajal Patel Below (04:24):
Thank you.
I'm excited to talk to youabout this.
Susan Lambert (04:27):
I'm excited to.
And before we jump into thisreally important topic, I would
love it if you could introduceyourself to our audience.
Kajal Patel Below (04:35):
Sure. So hi
everyone. I'm Kajal Patel
Below. I lead biliteracy atAmplify. I love languages. I
wish I could speak them all.
My, my own sort of languagestory is that , um, so I'm
Indian American, and I spokeGujarati in the home. Um, that
was my first language actually.
And then I learned English whenI went to preschool, and then
(04:58):
later I wanted to learnSpanish. And so I studied it.
And I have lived and worked indifferent places, including
Spain, Puerto Rico, Nicaragua,Mexico. Um, and I'm always, I'm
kind of a language nerd. I'malways reading about it. My, my
parents are fluent in fourlanguages, which—
Susan Lambert (05:16):
Wow!
Kajal Patel Below (05:17):
—makes me
really, I know. I wish I knew
them all. But anyway, in myrole at Amplify, I lead
biliteracy initiatives. Um,I've been working in
educational technology for 20years, but all that time really
has been on literacy solutions,working on products, working
with school districts and statedepartments on implementation.
A lot of different things. Butover the past several years,
(05:42):
I've extended to specificallyworking with and collaborating
with national experts in thefield and our own researchers
on meeting the needs ofmultilingual learners, in
particular students that speakor are learning Spanish. And in
order to do that, I've beenlearning a ton , listening to
people reading, staying attunedto educators needs to support
(06:06):
multilingual and Englishlearners in Spanish. And I've
really enjoyed doing thatbecause there are so many kids
that have this gift. Somenumbers, like 15% of K–3 right
now, by 2025, it'll be 25% ofstudents in our country, and
they're being underserved abit. And so I think it's an
(06:28):
important area for us to focusand promote positive outcomes.
Susan Lambert (06:31):
For sure, I
can't wait to dig in a little
bit more. Before we go anyfurther, though, a couple of
things. I've heard you talkabout a distinction between
biliteracy or multiliteracy—.
Kajal Patel Below (06:45):
Mm - hmm.
Susan Lambert (06:45):
—and bilingual
or multilingual.
Kajal Patel Below (06:48):
Mm - hmm.
Susan Lambert (06:48):
What's the
difference between, let's just,
let's just land on one of them.
What's the difference betweenbeing biliterate and bilingual?
Kajal Patel Below (06:56):
So the
difference between biliterate
and bilingual is, is readingand, and speaking, right? So
bilingual would be that you canspeak two languages and
communicate in two languages.
And biliterate is that you canactually, like, read and write
in those two languages. Andthen extending that to
multiliteracy, we're talkingabout multilingual and
(07:17):
multiliteracy. We're talkingabout multiple languages. But I
think one thing that kind ofcomes up a lot is, how do we
refer to this group ofstudents? And you'll hear
multilingual learners, Englishlearners, emergent bilinguals,
emergent multilinguals. Thereare more terms than that, too,
(07:37):
that we'll hear. And I thinkit's, it's something that,
there's not one perfect term. Ithink even I struggle with it,
too, because I want, when I'mtalking about a group of
students, I want to be preciseabout who I'm talking about. I
also wanna be, I think we allwant to be precise, we all want
to be also asset-based. Andsome terms, you know, can seem
(08:02):
less asset-based than otherterms. And that has led to kind
of a preference toward, in manycases, emergent bilingual,
emergent multilingual, overEnglish learner. Whereas
English learner, you know, Ithink if you're learning
English, I am assuming you knowanother language, and I think
(08:23):
that's great, but it does putthe emphasis on, well, this
kind of a deficit assumption,right? And so there , that's,
that's why that happens. Butthen when you're, like, reading
a research paper, when you'retalking about a specific group
of people, then you want to beprecise about which kids
actually are classified asEnglish learners, because that
has a bearing on servicesreceived, reporting, all kinds
(08:47):
of things like that. And soyou'll hear me say, in our
conversation , multilingual andEnglish learners, and maybe if
I am trying to be efficient, Imight just say multilingual
learners, but , it depends,like sometimes I'm talking
about students who are learningalso in Spanish that are native
(09:10):
English speakers, and sometimeswe refer to them as
multilingual learners.
Susan Lambert (09:14):
I think it's
really important to sort of
highlight that, because theprecision part of it is really
important. But to just to keepin mind that there is all kind
of different terms that we use.
And so, yes. And, and we'regonna, I mean, I think some of
the terms sort of feed intosome of what we're gonna talk
about to understand the currentmoment. So I just, I just
wanted to hear you talk aboutthat a little bit. So thank you
(09:35):
and no , you didn't confuse us.
So let's just kind of talk alittle bit about this current
moment and some of the historybehind it. And I know, like, we
can only scratch some of thesurface here, but let's talk a
little bit about the history ofhow this country has
underserved our multilinguallearners. So I would love if
(09:57):
you could just share some ofthat.
Kajal Patel Below (09:59):
Yeah,
absolutely. I think overall
there has been a tendency toundervalue home language when
it is not English. And this hasbeen seen in both how
instruction is approached, aswell as how we try to
understand students' abilities.
(10:20):
And today we know more, and asI continue, wanna ground in a
couple of research-based facts,which are, one, literacy in a
new language builds fromliteracy in the home language.
We know that. And another isthat multilinguals draw on all
their linguistic knowledge tonavigate and draw connections
(10:43):
across languages when they'rereading, writing, speaking,
listening. And so theirlanguage is an asset, whatever
language it is, and howevermuch it is , you know, maybe a
student speaks a language butdoesn't yet have literacy in
that language, or doesn't haveliteracy in that language
because they learned it in aspoken way. But that's still an
asset that can be leveraged,and that is drawn from as
(11:04):
they're learning a new languageand learning to read and write.
And so for many years, and evenin the recent past,
bilingualism was actuallythought to be disruptive, or
multilingualism, bilingualism,you'll hear me say both, I mean
pretty much the same thing, wasthought to be disruptive to
cognitive and linguisticdevelopment, like that it would
(11:25):
be confusing the child's brainwith multiple languages. And we
know that's not the case, butthat type of assumption has
driven programs that are notonly English-only, but if you
talk to someone who was inschool many years ago, I have
colleagues and have met people,they were reprimanded for, you
(11:47):
know, don't speak Spanish inhere.
Susan Lambert (11:49):
Oh, right.
Kajal Patel Below (11:49):
They weren't
allowed even. And so their
language wasn't being valued.
It's a deficit mentality thatjust because you don't know
English, that there is a lackof skill, I guess I would say.
And that's not true.
Susan Lambert (12:03):
And parents
sometimes too, were told, "Oh,
don't speak, only speak Englishat home." Right? "Don't speak
your home language."
Kajal Patel Below (12:09):
Yes.
Susan Lambert (12:09):
Is that right?
Kajal Patel Below (12:09):
Yes. That's
absolutely true. Not only that,
because in our country, peopleget these messages, right? And
so then English is privileged.
And so what would happen ismany parents, actually, they
would have access to abilingual program. This even
happens today. I've talked toteachers that, and schools
where this has happened , whereparents will have access to a
(12:32):
bilingual program, which wouldbe incredibly supportive to
their kids and continue theirlanguage development and
literacy in their homelanguage, which is really good
for them. But they opt out ofit and they don't want it
because they want their childto learn English, and they
don't want labeling of theirkid being an English learner.
And that's unfortunate. And so,you know, I think the more we
(12:54):
can promote and strengthen themessage that no, this is
positive, learning in bothlanguages is positive, being an
English learner, you havelanguage skills, that is
positive. I think the more wecan do that, the better. You
know, in 1998, in California,voters passed Proposition 227.
(13:20):
It mandated that Englishlearners be taught
overwhelmingly in Englishthrough English immersion
programs. And that bilingualinstruction, you could only
have that through a specialwaiver. So again, at that time,
the driver behind that wasthinking that, you know,
educating in a student's homelanguage or having both
(13:41):
languages would delay learning,and it would confuse children.
And that children should writeand speak in English, because
otherwise they would bespending too much time learning
in their native language, whichwould confuse. We know that's
not true now because ofresearch. There's actually
research by Thomas and Collierthat shows that the long-term
(14:02):
outcomes, if that dual-languageor bilingual education is
sustained, that studentsactually have strong and even
stronger long-term outcomes.
But again, at that time, thethinking was different. And
that Proposition 227 waseffectively viewed, even though
you could get bilingualeducation through a waiver, it
was effectively viewed as aban—
Susan Lambert (14:23):
Sure.
Kajal Patel Below (14:23):
—on
transitional bilingual
education. And so districtscontinued through waivers, but,
you know, it wasn't set up thatway, right? And since then,
things have changed inCalifornia, and in the U. S. ,
it was, actually 227 wasreversed in 2016, thanks to
advocacy groups and researchersthat really promoted the
research-based messagesforward.
Susan Lambert (14:44):
Hmm. So that's
only recently that that's been
reversed, 2016, is that whatyou said?
Kajal Patel Below (14:49):
Yes.
Susan Lambert (14:50):
Hmm. That gives
us a clue into probably what
we're gonna talk about next. So, um, so we'll pin that one.
Anything else you wanna shareabout that history before we
come up to sort of the Scienceof Reading movement?
Kajal Patel Below (15:04):
I guess the
only thing, only other thing I
would say is that personally asI, as I read and learn about
this so much and spend timewith educators, I then still
find it surprising that peoplebelieve that learning in two
languages is not good for you,and that they don't view it as
an asset. But I know thatpeople do still believe that
(15:27):
because when I see that thereis still a need to push the
message that it is a positivething, and that it is not
confusing to learn in twolanguages.
Susan Lambert (15:38):
Mm - hmm.
Kajal Patel Below (15:38):
And that the
longer-term outcomes are
positive. And if everyone justknew that there wouldn't be
that need to continue toamplify that message. And so I
just think that even thoughthere are many things that are
being changed, even though, forexample, the Department of Ed
has begun a program ,Bilingualism is a Superpower,
(16:01):
really supporting multilingualeducation, there are changes
that are, really great changeshappening, but I think we're
gonna still need to continuethe messaging and, you know,
expanding the understanding.
Susan Lambert (16:13):
Yeah, for sure.
That's why this series ofepisodes is so important, and
we'll get to that. So let'sfast forward to the start of
the Science of ReadingMovement. You're on the Science
of Reading podcast, so, ofcourse, we have to talk about
that, right?
Kajal Patel Below (16:29):
Yes.
Susan Lambert (16:30):
How did
advocates for multilingual and
English learners come to viewthis Science of Reading
movement? What was their placein this?
Kajal Patel Below (16:38):
So there
have been some differing
viewpoints in the researchcommunity among experts in the
Science of Reading field, andexperts who focus on
multilingual and Englishlearners. And before I get into
the differing viewpoints, Iguess I would just say that
there's a shared objective,though, among stakeholders,
that we wanna achieve positiveliteracy outcomes for all
(17:01):
students. And there's agreementthat we should use
research-based andevidence-based practices, and
also agreement that it'simportant to build language and
knowledge and foundationalreading skills. So those are
some big ideas that are incommon and that everyone agrees
are important. But the driverof the difference in
(17:23):
viewpoints, at least as I seeit, is then what happens in
research and in practice. Sowith research, there has, there
has been extensive researchthat has been done that
includes multilingual/English.
The current body has beenconducted over five decades
across the world. It's derivedfrom thousands of studies
(17:44):
conducted in multiplelanguages. There are multiple
studies that have includedmultilingual and English
learners. In 2006, the NationalLiteracy Panel published its
report , it's called"Developing Literacy in Second
Language Learners," which wasedited by Diane August and
Timothy Shanahan. But there hasbeen more scientific research
(18:10):
conducted with monolingualEnglish-speaking children than
there has been withmultilingual and English
learners, or that has evencentered multilingual and
English learners. And so thatdrives concern over
over-generalization of theresearch and unintended
consequences when researchthat's conducted in the
(18:31):
monolingual space is applied.
And just another layer to thateven is that we talk about
multilingual and Englishlearners, but that's not a
homogeneous group. That'sactually a very inclusive term.
And we talked about termsearlier, the need to be
precise. So if we're gonna beprecise, I mean, okay, so this
(18:53):
group is made up of, it'simportant to disaggregate,
right? When you're, when you'reconducting research, because
there are different profiles ofstudents and that has different
impacts. So for example, withinthe group of multilingual and
English learners, even if we'rejust talking about students
(19:13):
that are learning English orthat have learned English,
there's variation in EL status.
So it could be a former Englishlearner, it could be a long,
the student could be along-term English learner, a
currently classified Englishlearner. Even within that, how
many years has it been? What istheir home language? What is
their language of instruction?
(19:36):
There's many factors. And socontinuing our research with
attention to those factors, theimpact of those factors, and
really disaggregating data whenwe look at outcomes, is really
important.
Susan Lambert (19:49):
Yeah, I love
that. And we talk about that
with dyslexia too, which we'llcover that in probably another
episode. We're not gonna talkabout it here, but students
with dyslexia have a range ofskill and ability and needs,
right? And so it's sort of thesame thing here, is that we're
really, as humans, quick toclassify people in groups and
(20:11):
group them and forget aboutthis range of experience. So I
appreciate that you broughtthat up. You also talked about
some other concerns. So likeconcerns of the Science of
Reading movement, even though,also love that you shared that
folks are coming together witha common goal, which is like,
let's support students in beingliterate or being biliterate or
(20:33):
multi-literate. But what aresome of the other concerns that
you've seen as the Science ofReading movement has unfolded?
Kajal Patel Below (20:43):
Yes. I think
that the specific concerns are
really important to understand.
One group that has articulatedthis well is called the
National Committee forEffective Literacy. And this is
a group of educators,researchers, and organizations,
experts like Dr. KathyEscamilla from University of
Colorado, Dr. Magaly Lavadenzfrom Center for Equity for
(21:05):
English Learners. The missionof this group is to uplift
research policies and practicesto ensure that emergent
bilinguals leave school asproficient readers and writers
in English, and preferably morelanguages, and who thrive and
succeed in their school andtheir community . So I read
that verbatim 'cause I thoughtit was important to express.
(21:27):
But this committee formed inresponse to what they cite as a
narrow approach of the Scienceof Reading, and to expand
thinking on literacyinstruction for English
learners and emergentbilinguals, or what we were
saying, multilingual andEnglish learners. And a
specific concern isoveremphasis on foundational
(21:50):
skills over languagecomprehension, in particular
oracy, background knowledge,vocabulary. And we, we know
that research, and we agree,that research is clear that
both foundational skills andlanguage comprehension are
important. But I mentioned whatwe're seeing in practice. And
(22:13):
so then that's why that becomesa concern because what is being
seen in practice sometimes is adifferent interpretation, a
narrower interpretation of theresearch. They , NCEL, National
Committee for EffectiveLiteracy, they conducted a
survey on the impact of theScience of Reading movement on
bilingual learners. And Imentioned Dr. Kathy Escamilla,
(22:35):
she actually shared some of thepreliminary findings at La
Cosecha, which is a conferenceon dual-language education,
nationally attended, she sharedsome preliminary findings in
November. And some of what shewas hearing, I'll share some
examples of things that she washearing, time being cut from
(22:57):
English language developmentfor phonics. I heard another
advocate separately there talkabout a requirement of 45 or a
mandate of 45 minutes forphonics instruction only.
Susan Lambert (23:12):
Hmm.
Kajal Patel Below (23:13):
So things
like that. And so when that's
happening, that's a concern.
Because, you know, multilingualand English learners, they need
that, all learners, all thestudents need that balance and
that emphasis on languagecomprehension and especially
multilingual and Englishlearners need practice and work
(23:36):
with oracy and vocabulary. Sothat's, that's one of the main
concerns that has come up.
Susan Lambert (23:44):
And we've heard
that in the general Science of
Reading movement, too, is thatthere's a misconception that
it's just about phonicsinstruction or just about
helping kids recognize words.
And that's important, butthere's a lot more to literacy
than just that, that's agateway into literacy. But for
sure, there's a lot more thatneeds to be developed.
Kajal Patel Below (24:05):
Yes,
absolutely. It's not only a
narrower approach, but it'sjust an incorrect
interpretation of the body ofresearch.
Susan Lambert (24:14):
Yeah. Yeah. So
there's also, there's some,
maybe some mixed misconceptionsis the best way to say it, when
we're talking about universalscreening, right? That thing
that we're going to administerto all students to identify
levels of risk. Right? And it'san important thing to do. And
(24:35):
we talk about in the Science ofReading movement, super
important to do three times ayear to make sure students are
making progress. What does thatlook like with the multilingual
community?
Kajal Patel Below (24:47):
So this is,
this one is a tough one because
you mentioned dyslexia earlier.
Susan Lambert (24:52):
Yeah, yeah .
Kajal Patel Below (24:53):
And it is so
important to be screening for
dyslexia and for other readingdifficulties. Right? And so, on
a positive note, because ofthat, many states are working
on legislation to requiredyslexia screening. That sounds
like a very positive thing.
Susan Lambert (25:13):
Yeah.
Kajal Patel Below (25:13):
An
unintended consequence of that
is, well, what do you thinkhappens if you screen students
in English, which is what themajority of of districts are
doing, is they're screening inEnglish, what happens when a
student is acquiring, is stillon their journey of acquiring
English? And if that screeningis mandated, and then if that,
(25:36):
if the results of thatscreening have consequences?
So, well, what happens is, isthat you have an
over-identification of studentsthat are then misidentified as
having potentially a readingdifficulty, including dyslexia.
And so that is, that is what isa major concern in the advocacy
(25:58):
community for multilingual andEnglish learners, because these
assessments are most often donein English. And therefore we
can have thatmisidentification. And it's
really damaging to students tobe labeled in that way when
it's inaccurate, it drives theinstruction that they're
getting. And then maybe that isthe incorrect instruction. And
(26:18):
just to put some numbers on it,we have some data on this . Our
own data shows that whenstudents whose home language is
Spanish were screened inEnglish, when we looked at a
particular data set ,kindergarten students whose
home language is Spanish werescreened in English, 72% of
them were identified as needingTier 2 or Tier 3 instruction.
(26:40):
So that's a very high number.
However, when those samechildren whose home language is
Spanish were assessed inSpanish, only 33% were
identified as needing Tier 2 orTier 3 instruction, which shows
the impact of language—
Susan Lambert (26:59):
Yeah.
Kajal Patel Below (27:00):
—on that
assessment. And so ideally kids
would be assessed in their homelanguage. Sometimes that's not
possible. Spanish is the homelanguage of about 75% of
multilingual/English. And thereare thankfully some Spanish
(27:21):
assessments out there that canbe used. It's a challenge,
though, with other languages.
And there are many otherlanguages in this country. So
if kids are being assessed inEnglish, that data just has to
be interpreted accordingly.
There's deep concern that itwouldn't be particularly when
the screening is mandated . Andso advocates just wanna see
that addressed.
Susan Lambert (27:42):
So if somebody
asks you the question, "I don't
have access to a universalscreener in the home language
of this group of students thatI have in my school, do I still
administer a universal screenerin English? How, like, how do I
navigate that?"
Kajal Patel Below (28:02):
So, you
know, the advocacy groups
really influenced a bill inCalifornia. And that bill ,
California last year passed ascreening bill. And that bill
had a lot of pushback frommultilingual and English
learner advocacy groups at thebeginning for, you know,
because of the question youjust asked. And I wanna share
(28:25):
some language from that billthat was ultimately included,
which, you know, supported itbeing passed. And then finally
then have the support ofadvocacy groups like
Californians Together, theywere really instrumental in
getting some of this languageadded. And I'll share some of
that, 'cause I think itaddresses the question you just
asked. So assuming theassessment is in English, let
(28:50):
me share some of this language.
"The screening tool should haveevidence of using a
contemporary multiculturalmultilanguage sample of
students with outcome data fornon-English speaking students."
So this means that theassessment has been used with
multilingual and Englishlearner students, has been
(29:10):
studied with that population ofstudents. And therefore I would
assume that then there would besome guidance on how to
interpret that dataaccordingly. Right? There's
also language about, you know,sufficient English. There's
some language here, "Studentswho do not speak sufficient
enough English to be screenedwith an English language
instrument must be screened intheir primary language. And if
(29:33):
that is not available," then wehave to look at a bunch of
other things. Well , I'll justread from the language, which
are "an analysis ofdevelopmental history,
educational history, literacyprogress, their home
background, their evolvingEnglish language abilities."
And that's the language in thebill. But also teachers can
(29:54):
learn from talking with theparents about the student's
literacy and their background.
And, you know, I've spoken withdistricts who, when they assess
in English, they thentriangulate that data with the
number of years that thestudent has been receiving
(30:14):
instruction in English as wellas their level of English
proficiency. So the assessmentdata in English is still of
value, but it has to beinterpreted with a different
lens. You can't just look at itand say, "Oh, okay, well I
think this child is at risk forreading difficulty. I'm gonna
put them in this group."
Susan Lambert (30:36):
Okay. That makes
sense. That's super helpful.
And you've, you've been intoschools as well and talking
directly with educators. Whatkind of other concerns have you
heard from educators doing thework?
Kajal Patel Below (30:50):
There is
often a sense of being
underserved. And that's rootedin the fact that educators have
been pulling together resourceson their own for years to meet
their needs for instruction.
There's a group called EnglishLearner Success Forum, and they
(31:11):
did a survey of teachers. Andaccording to their survey, 80%
of teachers feel they cannotfully rely on their materials
to support research-basedpractices for teaching
multilingual learners.
Susan Lambert (31:24):
Wow. Wow.
Kajal Patel Below (31:26):
So...
Susan Lambert (31:26):
That's a lot!
Kajal Patel Below (31:28):
Yes. And as
a result, they then supplement,
they're pulling things togetheron their own. And teachers
don't have time to do that.
Susan Lambert (31:38):
No way. Yeah .
Kajal Patel Below (31:39):
They are
very, very busy. So they need
more support. And another themethat comes up generally is
whether the materials are, thatthey do have, well, I mentioned
that they don't have thematerials. And so what they're
saying specifically is, dothese materials have the right
language support or oracysupport, or, going back to
(32:02):
something I said before, is ittoo heavy on phonics? So, so
there's that, and that's justin English. There are many
students, and this is awonderful thing, there are many
students receiving instructionin Spanish. However, even with
that, there's been a lack ofparody in terms of the quality
(32:23):
of the materials sometimes, orthe appropriateness of the
materials . Sometimes these area straight translation. And
they shouldn't be. Some thingscan be translated, but we also
need to have materials that arebased on the science of how
Spanish literacy develops, andcultural relevance in terms of
(32:46):
text authenticity andrepresentation across
assessment and curriculum. Sothose are the running themes
that I'm hearing from schools.
Susan Lambert (32:56):
So there's a lot
of opportunity for folks to
come together and try to usethe best of what we know to
sort of solve these problems.
And I think that's a little bitwhere this thing called a joint
statement came from. And forour listeners that don't know
what this is, we're for suregoing to link you in the show
notes to this , but there'sthis thing called this joint
(33:18):
statement. Can you explain tous who's behind it? And maybe a
little bit of how it came to befrom your point of view?
Kajal Patel Below (33:26):
Yes. I think
this statement is really great.
So, some background, TheReading League , who you may be
familiar with, The ReadingLeague, whose mission is to—
Susan Lambert (33:38):
Yes.
Kajal Patel Below (33:38):
I know you
are Susan. I'm talking—
Susan Lambert (33:39):
Yes, yes . Our
listeners are too, I'm sure.
Reading Leagues are all overthe country.
Kajal Patel Below (33:45):
So, you
know, their mission is to
advance awareness,understanding, and use of
evidence-aligned readinginstruction to improve reading
outcomes for all students . Imentioned earlier NCEL, the
National Committee forEffective Literacy, and their
mission as well, focused onmultilingual and English
learners. So a couple of yearsago, NCEL published a paper
(34:07):
titled "Toward ComprehensiveEffective Literacy Policy and
Instruction for English Learner/ Emergent Bilingual Students."
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Ooh , that's a
mouthful.
Kajal Patel Below (34:16):
It is. But
it was an important paper
because, in it, they raisedsome of the concerns I already
covered. You know, specificallystating, they were saying a
one-size-fits-all Science ofReading fails to address the
unique needs of Englishlearners and emergent bilingual
(34:38):
students and doesn't capitalizeon their strengths. So that was
something that they talkedabout for the reasons that we
described. And I do recommendreading this paper to more
closely understand the pointsbeing raised 'cause I think
they're really important. Itwas written by Dr. Kathy
Escamilla, Dr. Laurie Olsen,and Dr. Jody Slavick and the
committee overall. And,specific concerns were the
(35:01):
emphasis on phonics in theabsence of meaning making ,
even though we know thatevidence-based instruction
should be both, but they'reraising this in response to
what they have seen being donein practice, those unintended
consequences based on howScience of Reading has been
interpreted. They also talkedabout, in the paper, the
(35:21):
appropriateness of assessment,it needing to be culturally and
linguistically appropriate.
And, you know, we just talkedabout the impact of doing
assessment and the importanceof , well, I shared the data,
the 72% and the 33%, and theimportance of interpreting
assessment. And so theymentioned in the paper, you
(35:41):
know, it needing to beappropriate where English
proficiency is not a barrier todetermining what the student
knows and can do, because thelanguage and literacy that the
student has and any otherlanguage is important and it
has bearing and it's an assetand it can be built upon. And
really just their overallmessage is , was concern over
(36:02):
the, you know, over-applicationof Science of Reading to
multilingual and Englishlearners, because we do, you
know, need to make sure thatwe're also recognizing the
unique needs of multilingualand English learners. So that's
an introduction to that paper,which was important because
then a number of researchers,notably Claude Goldenberg and
(36:22):
other researchers, they drafteda collaborative response aimed
at then finding common groundand emphasizing the ways in
which the research does supportmultilingual and English
learners, because there is acommon goal here. And there was
concern that the science—wedon't wanna dismiss the body of
research that we do have andwhat we do know. So it started
(36:45):
a really importantconversation. And following
that, The Reading Leagueconvened a group of
stakeholders to address keypoints across several meetings,
discussions. And it further ledto an in-person summit last
March. So this is only a yearago, with researcher panels on
topics focused on multilingualand English learners. For
(37:07):
example, the neuroscience oflanguage and literacy, the role
of oral language and backgroundknowledge, the role of
foundational skills. You canactually find many of these on
their website. They recordedthem. And ultimately this
resulted in a joint statement.
It was joint between TheReading League and the National
(37:29):
Committee for EffectiveLiteracy. And the title of that
joint statement is, this isalso a mouthful, which is why
we say joint statement , butit's an important title to
understand. I'm gonna read it,which is called "Understanding
the Difference (37:44):
The Science of
Reading and Implementation for
English Learners and EmergentBilinguals." So it had input
from over 20 authors andcontributors, including Dr.
Escamilla, Dr. Goldenberg. Itwas signed by over 220
organizations.
Susan Lambert (38:03):
That's amazing.
Kajal Patel Below (38:04):
So I won't
list them all, but—.
Susan Lambert (38:05):
Thank you .
Kajal Patel Below (38:06):
Some
examples are WIDA, Center for
Teaching Biliteracy, EnglishLearner Success Forum. And of
course there are many others.
And I, like I said, I really dorecommend reading this
statement. And the paper.
Susan Lambert (38:20):
And again,
listeners, we're, we're gonna
link you in the show notes tothat. And I agree, it's not
super long, but it's reallyimportant to unpack. I wonder,
Kajal , if you could help usunderstand at a really high
level, what are some of thethings that this , , the joint
statement had to say?
Kajal Patel Below (38:36):
Yeah. So I,
the reason I like it, and I
learned a lot from it, too, isI think it does just a really
good job of grounding theresearch, but also emphasizing
the differences formultilingual and English
learners overall. Itestablished the importance of
the decades and breadth ofresearch that there is, but
(38:57):
then it lifted up the need toensure that we center
multilingual and Englishlearners. And it specifically
called out that there arepractices being implemented in
schools under the name ofScience of Reading, that don't
align with the scientificevidence of how English
learners and emergentbilinguals learn to read. And I
(39:18):
think that among other things,it's a direct sort of pointing
at an example I gave earlierabout maybe like an
overemphasis on phonics at theexpense of language
comprehension. They use thewords "broken game of
telephone" to characterize themiscommunications,
misinterpretations, of the termScience of Reading. And then
(39:41):
they actually went on todefine, what does it actually
mean when we say Science ofReading? Which, this is exactly
how they defined it. "A vastinterdisciplinary body of
scientifically based researchabout reading and issues
related to reading and writing.
(40:02):
This research has beenconducted over the last five
decades across the world. Andit has derived from thousands
of studies conducted inmultiple languages. The Science
of Reading has culminated in apreponderance of evidence to
inform how proficient readingand writing develop, why some
have difficulty, and how we canmost effectively assess and
teach and therefore improvestudent outcomes through
(40:24):
prevention and intervention ofreading difficulties."
Susan Lambert (40:27):
And you talked
about how we do have research
evidence about multilinguallearners. Maybe not as much as
we do or need to have, butthere is some there. And I
think the joint statement alsocalled that out, that we really
do need more research in thatarea .
Kajal Patel Below (40:45):
Yes. That
was another emphasis point,
right? They also said that itmust be acknowledged that there
is more scientific research, orthere has been more scientific
research conducted withmonolingual English-speaking
children. And that additionalresearch related to teaching
literacy development forEnglish learners and emergent
(41:08):
bilinguals is needed to advanceour understanding of their
literacy development. And theneven specifically in both
English-medium settings as wellas bilingual settings.
Susan Lambert (41:19):
Mm - hmm. Yeah.
Kajal Patel Below (41:20):
So I thought
that part was really important,
too.
Susan Lambert (41:22):
Yeah. Really
important. And in, in upcoming
episodes in this series, we'rereally gonna dive into more of
the details and the specificsthat are cited in the
statement. But I'd really liketo get back a little bit, sort
of bigger picture and just askyou why do you think this
statement is so important tothe story of multilingual
learners, how they've beenserved, and what we need to do
(41:46):
going forward?
Kajal Patel Below (41:48):
I think
educators are hungry for
information and support. Youknow, I mentioned the growth in
population of multilingual andEnglish learners in our
country. And I think, well, Idon't think I, I know from the
survey data from ELSF, thateducators are not feeling like
they have what they need. Andwe all agree that what we need
(42:09):
to be doing is research based .
And also, in order to do that,I think it's important that we
have, I guess, I don't know, agroup effort and alignment on
how that should be done. Sothat's one reason I think the
statement is really important,because I know this might sound
kind of cheesy, but you know,we have to support the
(42:32):
children! And we have to cometogether to do that.
Susan Lambert (42:35):
I agree. It's
not cheesy at all. And do you
have hopes for this? I mean,I've been around education a
long time, and to see to groupscome together and agree on, you
know, the things that theyagree on in common and put
forth a joint statement, to me,this feels really hopeful for
(42:55):
the future in terms of what wecan provide to both our
teachers and to help thestudents in the classroom. What
, what hope do you have goingforward with this connection?
Kajal Patel Below (43:05):
Well, I hope
that the message just gets
elevated more and that themisconceptions and
misapplications can beovercome. But I also really
would love to see bilingualeducation just really grow. The
joint statement expressessupport for that. I also know
that, as I mentioned earlier,the Department of Education
(43:26):
wants to see more of that. It'sgood for everyone. Not just
multilingual and Englishlearners. It's already
happening, too. Like, such as,for example, in the state of
Washington, they have made agoal that by 2030, all students
will have access todual-language education. In
California, by 2040, three outof four students will graduate
(43:50):
with the seal of biliteracy.
Susan Lambert (43:52):
Wow.
Kajal Patel Below (43:52):
And so what
I hope to see is that trend
continue and that it's not atrend. And that funding
supports teachers. You know, Imentioned the ELSF survey,
another thing that that surveysaid was that 30% of teachers,
(44:13):
so only 30%, feel fullyprepared to teach multilingual
learners. That's not enough.
And so we need more research,we need more funding, and—I
love fun facts. Can I just giveyou another fun fact?
Susan Lambert (44:28):
Please. Fun
fact.
Kajal Patel Below (44:30):
I read
recently, it's not surprising,
but I like to see it in a fact,is that there are actually more
people in the world now whospeak English as a second
language than there aremonolingual native speakers of
English.
Susan Lambert (44:48):
Wow.
Kajal Patel Below (44:49):
So, what
that says to me, is that
bilingualism, multilingualism,that's the norm, versus
monolingualism. And so thereshould be more research for
that group of people becausethere's more of them in the
world. And so, yeah, I just, Ihope to see more research that
(45:11):
disaggregates multilingual andEnglish learners so we can
deepen our understanding oflearning so that we can serve
them.
Susan Lambert (45:17):
Yeah, that's a
great, that's a great fact.
That's bigger than a fun fact.
So thanks for sharing that. Sothis is episode one in our
series, which is going toexplore Science of Reading and
multilingual learners. Why doyou think, other than all the
things you've already said, whydo you think this is a topic
(45:38):
worth exploring over severalepisodes as opposed to just
one?
Kajal Patel Below (45:44):
Well, it's
true that multilingual and
English learners have been leftout of a lot of research, but
we do know a lot and moreresearch is currently being
done, and it's really worthexploring that research, as
well as best practices, so thatwe can serve students based on
what we know, align on what wedon't know. And there's, you
(46:07):
can't do all of that in onepodcast. You know, just like
there's multiple lenses anddisciplinary areas to discuss
in general education andliteracy. Those topics all
intersect with multilingual andEnglish learners as well as all
of the subgroups ofmultilingual and English
learners. And we have anunderserved area that's
(46:29):
experiencing a massive growthin student population. And so
it's really important to thenfocus on it. And schools are
adjusting. They're quickly,they're doing the best they
can, but we need to be havingthese conversations around
research best practices so thatwe can set schools up for
success and students up forsuccess.
Susan Lambert (46:50):
Yeah, I totally
agree with that and I'm so
excited to bring more guests onto talk about this topic and
learn from them as well as ourlisteners learning from them as
well. I'm wondering, Kajal, aswe close, is there any final
thoughts you'd like to share?
Words of wisdom? Any more funfacts?
Kajal Patel Below (47:10):
Well, I just
think it's a really exciting
time in education. You know, Imentioned underserving, I
mentioned the growth inpopulation. So there's a lot of
changes happening, and I thinkit makes it a very exciting
time to be learning and to belearning from all—I mentioned
(47:31):
earlier how much I lovelanguages, and sometimes I talk
to districts and they talkabout how many languages are in
their district or in theirschool. And I will hear numbers
like, there are 67 languagesspoken in my district, and—
Susan Lambert (47:49):
Wow.
Kajal Patel Below (47:51):
Yeah. Just
what an exciting time and what
an exciting group of kids tolearn from. I just, I think
with the joint statement andwith the growing support and
expansion of bilingualeducation, I just think we have
an exciting future in thiscountry. And I was in a
classroom last week and all thekids were in there. I saw some
(48:15):
of their writing, I saw themspeaking, heard them speaking
in two languages fluently,easily, excitedly. And I just
got very excited. I'm like,these kids are gonna be our
doctors and our teachers andour engineers, and they're
bilingual or multilingual, andI just think it's amazing.
Susan Lambert (48:37):
Well , Kajal,
it's been a pleasure. Thank you
so much for joining us. Thankyou for helping us understand
this history of bilingualeducation. And yeah, it's just
been a pleasure to have you.
Kajal Patel Below (48:48):
Thank you.
I'm really excited for all ofthe upcoming episodes.
Susan Lambert (48:55):
Thanks so much
for listening to episode one in
our new miniseries exploringhow the Science of Reading
serves multilingual and Englishlearners. We have so much more
in store . On upcomingepisodes, we're going to delve
deeper into the science oflanguage acquisition. We'll
spend time focusing on dyslexiaand how it manifests
(49:16):
differently by language. We'realso going to hear stories of
classrooms and schools wheremultilingual/English language
learner communities havethrived with the Science of
Reading. And next time, Dr. JimCummins will share the key
components of languageacquisition.
Jim Cummins (49:35):
Virtually all the
research highlights the
importance of being in acommunicative, interactive
context. If you want to pick upthe language, and study of the
language is also important,particularly when we're talking
about literacy skills in thelanguage. But you need both.
Susan Lambert (49:51):
That's coming up
next time. You can catch that
episode right here in thenormal podcast feed. We'll also
be posting updates to ourFacebook discussion group,
Science of Reading (50:01):
The
Community Science of Reading:
The Podcast is brought to youby Amplify. For more
information on how amplifyleverages the Science of
Reading, go toamplify.com/ckla. Thank you so
much for listening .