October 15, 2025 • 25 mins
What if rehab care didn’t mean waiting hours for help to do the most basic things? We sit down with Sheila Buswell—Army veteran, engineer, and CEO of Buswell Biomedical—to unpack how a life‑altering injury and her mother’s hip fracture exposed a quiet truth: activities of daily living are overdue for a humane upgrade. Sheila shares the origin of Upmo, a patented mobility system that navigates like a Roomba, syncs to a patient’s RFID strap, and uses LIDAR and IMU sensors to support movement, detect instability, and prevent dangerous falls—without replacing caregivers or dignity.
We trace her path from Bosnia to biomedical innovation, exploring why many facilities still rely on slow, manual processes that frustrate patients and burn out staff. Sheila explains how machine learning distinguishes a user’s normal gait from a real risk, when to off‑weight for balance, and when a controlled lower to the ground is safest. We also dive into the realities behind the promise: FDA clearance timelines, safety validation, model updates, maintenance, and the business concerns that can stall adoption even when patients say “yes, please.”
Along the way, we challenge assumptions about AI in elder care, argue for autonomy as a measurable outcome, and consider why tomorrow’s seniors—more tech‑literate and active—may welcome devices that give them privacy and control. If you care about fall prevention, senior mobility, ADLs, and realistic AI in healthcare, this conversation offers a grounded roadmap from problem to product.
Enjoyed the conversation? Follow and share the show, leave a review with your biggest takeaway, and send this episode to someone working in rehab or senior care who’s ready to rethink mobility.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:08):
Welcome to another episode of Senior Care Academy
Podcast, where we explore theinnovations, challenges, and
stories shaping the future ofelder care.
Today's episode is especiallypowerful.
We're joined by Sheila Bustwell.
She's the CEO and co-founder ofBustwell Biomedical, a veteran
of the U.S.
Army, and the author of Is ThisMy Seat?
Overcoming Imposter Syndrome inEveryday Life and Business.
(00:28):
In her book, Sheila shares herpersonal experience with
imposter syndrome, as well asthe stories of a diverse group
of accomplished individuals whostruggled with self-doubt but
found ways to overcome it.
She hopes to help others whofeel limited by their beliefs
experience more freedom andrealize that they are enough.
I'm super excited to chat today.
SPEAKER_00 (00:47):
Thank you, Caleb.
It's great to be here.
SPEAKER_01 (00:50):
Yeah.
Awesome.
I want to kind of start withyour journey.
You've had a unique journey fromthe military to engineering and
then now innovating inrehabilitation and med tech.
So what was your when you let'sgo back to the beginning.
So in 1997, you joined the Army.
What was your mindset at thattime?
SPEAKER_00 (01:11):
I in 1995, I graduated high school and I had
a scholarship.
That scholarship was tied to ahigh GPA.
And I went to scholarship, whichwas the University of Utah,
funny enough.
And I lost that scholarshipafter the first year because I
did not maintain a high scholar,like high GPA.
So I don't know who maintainsthat high GPA.
Since I lost that scholarship, Ifound out a lot of people lost
(01:35):
that scholarship.
I limped along for like a year.
And then after a year, I waslike looking for alternatives,
and I ended up in the military.
And at the time, you know, Ithought, oh, I'm gonna, it was
go to the army, go to jail timethat time.
And I thought, oh, just gonna,I'm gonna be smarter than
everybody.
I'm gonna whatever.
Like I had this preconceivednotion of what everyone's gonna
be like.
And I realized after I joinedthat people join the military
(01:59):
for a myriad of reasons, and youmeet people are just people.
And after I joined the militaryin 1997, that was my mindset.
I just wanted to pay for school.
I learned a lot.
Um, mostly that people are justpeople.
Uh that some of those lessonswere expected, and some of them
were, you know, snuck up up onyears later, they come up on me.
(02:23):
But um when I was deployed toBosnia, that's when I was
injured.
And I was rehabbing in a UNhospital in Bosnia.
And I remember my mindset atthat time, at when I was
injured, was simply, oh, well, Ijoined this military force, and
(02:44):
you know, there was a lot ofthings that I did that at the
time I thought, well, this ispart of it.
You know, like I don't knowpeople who are in the military
think about the duck walk in themap station as just part of, you
know, it's not a great part, butit's something you got to do to
get from here to there.
And I thought, oh, this is justthat.
You know, I was in the militaryand I was gonna be treated a
certain way.
I was in the military and inBosnia I got injured.
(03:07):
It is what it is.
So that qualified it, and I putlike cleaning out my garage.
I labeled it as this issomething to expect.
And I put it in, you know, thatlittle drawer in my mind, and I
did what I did, and it was whatit was.
And then I got out of themilitary with a medical
discharge and completed myeducation, ultimately obtaining
(03:32):
an MS in engineering.
And then 20 years after my thisis this story was like years in
the making, but 20 years aftermy accident, my mom has an
accident and she falls and shebreaks her hip and she rehabs in
Arizona.
And at the time, I'm not acaregiver.
I know you've had caregivers onhere before.
(03:52):
I'm not, definitely not that.
But I'm a problem solver, not acaregiver.
I do have gifts, it's just notthe caregiving.
I'm not the empathy type.
Um, I remember my mom didn'tsign up for anything that was
happening.
And when I it struck me that in1998, between in those
intervening 20 years, and inArizona, in a hoity-toity rehab
(04:16):
facility, that the solutions orthe opportunities, or I don't
know what you call it, but theactivities of daily living were
conducted very much the same waythat they were conducted 20
years prior and in Bosnia at theUN facility.
And I was like, my mom wasn't inthe military, she didn't sign up
for that, and she didn't havethe cadre of Norwegian nurses
(04:42):
that could conduct theseactivities of daily living with
her.
Like it was hard enough for me20 years prior because I had to
have somebody with me all thetime.
It was much more difficult formy mom because not only did she
have that, there wasn't enoughhealthcare workers.
In 1998, between 20 in 2018,that was the case.
In 1998, it wasn't the case forme, but it's definitely the case
(05:04):
now after, you know, pandemicand all the things.
SPEAKER_01 (05:07):
Yeah.
Yeah, totally.
SPEAKER_00 (05:09):
So this is the standard of care today, but
people wait hours to conduct anyactivity of daily living, like
going to the bathroom.
Hours.
SPEAKER_01 (05:19):
Yeah, that's such an interesting, like you said, you
had this uh very well supportedas far as healthcare workers go
in your instance, but with yourmom, what do you think that had
it happened to you in 2018 thatit would have struck the same
nerve of like, this is 20 hadyou been injured again, or do
(05:41):
you think there was some pieceof it where it was almost
protective of your mom's carebeing like, what's happening?
This is my mom here.
SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
I I am not sure how to answer that.
I know that I was definitelyprotective protective of my mom,
but also it was I knew there wasa better solution, right?
Like by this time I had amaster's in engineering, I'd
worked for a lot of greatcompanies, and most of that was
in RD automation and you know,like using sensors to do stuff.
(06:10):
It were, you know, when there'sa shortage of people to do
things.
Like at Anheuser Bush, there wasnot people to move hoses
forever.
So, and it was dangerous work.
So, how can we do that withpiping and instrumentation and
like sensors?
And that I felt the same way.
(06:30):
Like, okay, it's it's it's amore difficult task, but we have
greater technology now.
We wouldn't have the internetspeed that we had in 1998.
Why are we still solvingproblems the same way?
SPEAKER_01 (06:44):
Medical problems, yeah, that's true.
Like doing the exact same cares.
Um, and like you said, it is alittle bit more complex or maybe
more um emotional, sentimental,and intimate work than
automating uh Anheuser Busch.
But um, there's something,there's gotta be something to
(07:05):
do.
Um, during like that experience,now that would be seven years
ago with your mom.
Was there maybe a moment duringher recovery that really sparked
the idea for upmo or upwardmobility?
SPEAKER_00 (07:17):
It really wasn't an aha moment like people talk
about, nor was I thisentrepreneur.
I didn't have thatentrepreneurship spirit, right?
SPEAKER_01 (07:25):
Like at the time You were like looking for a problem
to solve, necessarily.
SPEAKER_00 (07:29):
Yeah, I remember being struck by like total, I
totally admit that I was not acaregiver, but my mom like
needed help with socks.
So I was like trying to putsocks on.
She's like, You're going tooslow.
And then I tried to heat up andshe's like, oh, you hurt me.
And I'm like, I, you know, liketo me, I don't know how to like
I don't know how to walk thatline.
(07:49):
But it was like gradual, and Iwas there for a couple weeks.
And at my instance at that timewas I'll just go work for who's
ever solving this problem.
And I think it was reallyshocking to me to find out
nobody's working on thisproblem.
SPEAKER_01 (08:05):
And then it was especially technologically,
yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:09):
It there, and there's a lot better companies,
bigger companies with a lot moreresources.
But I was like giving myself apet talk.
If not you, then who?
If not now, then when?
Like it was, and I'm not sayingit like tritely, like that was
an easy thing to overcome.
It was definitely something thatwas like, okay, this is a
(08:30):
systemic problem, it needs asolution.
And who's better situated toprovide the solution?
And it was a year from it wasmore than a year, but it was
definitely 2018 to 2019.
We filed for the patent in 2019.
But it was a year from when mymom fell and I was there till,
(08:51):
you know, I came up with asolution and I kind of had it
sketched out till we got apatent attorney and formed the
business and all those things.
SPEAKER_01 (08:58):
Yeah.
So let's talk more about Upmo.
Um, what is it?
And then how does it work tohelp um seniors, but really
anybody in a rehab setting tohave more kind of autonomy and
support.
SPEAKER_00 (09:14):
First, I'll just explain how it would work.
Right?
So, like right now, people hit abutton and eventually a
healthcare worker comes andsays, What do you want?
This would be a separate button.
You push a button, and thisthing would come to you in a
similar way, like a Roomba or aself-driving car that uses LIDAR
technology.
And you would have your ownnylon strap.
It'd be, or a patient would havea LIDAR strap with an inertial
(09:37):
measurement unit that would theywould put on or they would
attach the device would come tothem, and then you would attach
your device to the unit and thenput the harness on like a
jacket, in a similar way to ajacket.
And then you would conduct anyactivity of daily living.
We're gonna use toiletingbecause that's that was my main
thing.
SPEAKER_01 (09:57):
Yeah, that's the most urgent one.
Like a shower, as much as it'snot fun to smell bad, but if you
have to go to the bathroom,you've got to get there.
SPEAKER_00 (10:04):
And you can wait several days for a shower.
SPEAKER_01 (10:06):
You can't so, but you can't wait You can maybe
wait several minutes for uh anyeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:12):
And I I remember specifically it being a
challenge for me to do conductbusiness when there's somebody
else in the room.
And they're like, oh, it's theopioids.
I'm like, nope.
And I'm I it's not the opioids,it's whatever, it's because
you're here.
And I I think as the thing is,uh the accident happened to me
(10:36):
when I was 21.
But as you get older, moreaccidents like this are prone
and common.
Right.
So it's not that necessarilythat this device is designed for
old people or people with alimited mobility.
It could be used by anybody, butthat's who's gonna be using it
because that's who has thesetype of problems.
SPEAKER_01 (11:00):
Yeah.
Um, and so in essence, what itis, like you said, it's kind of
it's autonomous in that it cancome to your bedside and then
you're wearing a device thatsupports your um your weight and
whatnot, you hook into it, andthen it can help lift you up and
you're able to move.
I remember there's some coolthings that uh you and I had
(11:22):
talked about before where itkind of detects your motion to
almost counterbalance, right?
So if I'm walking, if I have asay I have a leg injury and I'm
attempting to walk to thebathroom um and I slip, doesn't
it like it basically takes allmy weight at that point to make
sure that I'm not riskingfurther injury by trying to take
(11:47):
care of my ADLs by myself?
SPEAKER_00 (11:48):
Yes.
Sorry, I didn't explain it fullyhow after the device will know
who's in the radio frequencyidentification tags or RFID um
will know, tell the device, thedevice will like a healthcare
worker will know your positionand location at all times and
(12:10):
status.
But like you move under your ownpower unless, like you said, you
know, you the IMU inertialmeasurement unit will like be
able to compare your normalmotion to the normal motion of
this library of people, and thenthis is where the machine
learning algorithm comes in.
And then it'll sense when you'reunstable or what's not normal
(12:34):
motion for you, I walk with alimp.
It would know that that limp isnormal, right?
Like, not that I'm drunk orinebriated or whatever, it's
just that that's what I Iwobble, or that you're liable to
fall or anything.
Yeah, but if uh if you'reunstable and it's out of
character, and I say character,like it's weird, the whole
(12:59):
stability has to be honed.
Like we have to identify whatunstable means.
Then it offweights you.
I don't know, Caleb, if you havechildren, but if you have
children and they learn to walk,you know that when you learn
when they learn to walk, youjust pick them up.
If they start to stumble, youjust pick them up.
And so the off-weighting partwould just let let pick them up,
offweight them so they can gettheir feet under them and they
they won't fall.
(13:20):
If it's a delicate person, aspeople age, my bones are
increasingly more like chalk,but as like m people age,
they're to be safer, it mightcause more harm if it's not like
anyone's gonna be hanging therelike a pinata, right?
Like hanging in the ground.
Yeah.
But it might be better to in asituation where okay, you
(13:42):
they're not gonna be able tostabilize themselves.
So they'll lower them slowly tothe ground.
It's different than a fall,right?
Because a fall, you can it'sunplanned and you can hit your
head, and physically, a lot morebad stuff can happen.
You can die or you can like hitsomething and cause a blood
clot, like bad things canhappen.
SPEAKER_01 (14:05):
Yes, yeah.
Yeah, there's a I forget thestatistics of uh regarding
falls, specifically among olderadults, where if somebody falls,
it like exponentially increasestheir their decline.
Um, and so avoiding that fall,even if maybe they get bruises
where the harness is, it'sbetter than falling and breaking
(14:26):
a wrist or um something to thateffect.
I'm curious.
So I know that you have thepatent, it's not yet ready for
like mass market.
As you've talked to peoplewithin rehab facilities and uh
higher levels of assistedlivings, um what has been the
response so far?
(14:46):
Like I imagine it's like yes,please.
Um I wonder if there's anypushback.
I guess the the deeper questionis why do you think that rehab
and mobility has been outdatedfor so long?
And now that we you have thisreally cool thing that's new,
are they ready for it?
SPEAKER_00 (15:04):
It's weird because when rehab and hospitals period,
there's people facing andbusiness facing people.
The patients absolutely again wetalked briefly beforehand,
before we started recording,about how like there's a certain
segment of the population thatfears when you talk about
artificial intelligence.
So being explained that that'swhat it does, it's that's what
(15:28):
it uses, but it's for good.
It's like a roomba.
Nobody's scared of a roombavacuuming your car, yeah, but
they're definitely scared of youknow the potential humanoid
robot.
SPEAKER_01 (15:40):
Yeah, the humanoids that are robots that are coming
out.
SPEAKER_00 (15:43):
But the one of the fears that kind of took me by
surprise that the businessfacing that I honestly hadn't
thought about was okay, this hasa machine learning library.
How when is that gonna beupdated?
How is it gonna maintenancegonna be handled?
Like, is it gonna stop somebodyin use when the library needs to
(16:04):
be updated?
Or you know, because this thingpart of the FDA clearance is you
have to prove that something'ssafe and that people you know,
like that's gonna work like asexpected.
My dad is 95 years old.
If it's but if it doesn't work,he won't use it.
So it has to be something thatlike if it impedes him too much,
(16:27):
he's not gonna use it.
The healthcare workers, on theother hand, they need to trust
it, and those are the peoplefacing.
But the business facing people,it needs to benefit them.
If it costs a lot to havemaintenance done on it, they're
not gonna want it.
If it if they can't use it whenthey're for a long period of
time while the library is beinguploaded or whatever, that has
(16:48):
to be all handled.
And it was a different concernthat I had envisioned.
And I guess the reason I thinkit's slow to change is because
you the thing you know.
This is a like people understanda Roomba.
They need they know their dattheir their cloth their uh and
(17:09):
there's their floors need to bevacuumed.
They don't have it's not uh theworst possible thing that could
happen is there's lint in yourcarpet if it doesn't work right.
The worst possible thing thatcould happen in this device is a
lot more significant.
(17:29):
And so I think it's it's a veryuh benefits risks kind of
scenario that needs to be workedout in those healthcare workers.
But however, like I don't knowabout you in Missouri, it's like
this thing where the only peoplewho use fax machines are
healthcare workers, and that'sinsane.
SPEAKER_01 (17:50):
Yeah.
So yeah, it definitely is uhprobably one of the slowest
industries to uh adopt any sortof innovative technologies.
But to your point, I think thatonce it's adopted, it um there
is the fear, I'm sure, fromdirect care staff of like, oh,
it's going to replace me.
(18:11):
Um, but I don't think it will.
I think that it'll enable justlike people, just creative roles
or more white-collar roles whereum using AI has been able to be
an amplifier or something thatmakes them more productive and
more powerful on theirday-to-day.
I think it'll be similar withdirect care staff where they
(18:33):
have this um device that makesit so they can be more
efficient, more um, you know,less stressed or less um running
from room to room becausethere's this device that can
help with mobility.
Um and so once it's adopted, Ithink it's gonna be really um
(18:53):
quite cool.
Um we kind of talked about it alittle bit, but you're an
advocate for an AI for AI as atool and not as a threat.
How do you envision AI improvingum rehab and and senior care
specifically over the nextdecade or so?
SPEAKER_00 (19:12):
There's a lot of people in I'm gonna say senior,
I'm gonna start with seniorcare.
But like my mother-in-law, herbody didn't break down or her
mind didn't break down, but herbody did.
She wasn't able to stand up.
And it's not like she couldn'tthere just wasn't enough
healthcare workers, especiallyon Thanksgiving weekend in the
(19:34):
middle of the night, right?
So I think there would be it'sthat scenario when people she
didn't need help to I'm tryingto think of other things, but
she didn't need help with the uhbasic stuff, but she needed help
certain parts of standing werehard.
(19:55):
And I think with rehabilitationand with you you don't want
people to hurt more.
Like nobody, there's like 180billion dollars of lawsuits.
Of those lawsuits, it's notolder pe that are filed every
year, it's not older people thatare filing the lawsuits, it's
their families that are filingthe lawsuits.
SPEAKER_01 (20:13):
Yeah, yeah, they're upset because mom should have
been taken care of, and Itrusted you with her care.
SPEAKER_00 (20:20):
And as I think And now she's hurt, yeah, and like
you like you want to protectyour kids, you want to protect
your mom, but you know,inherently you can't bubble wrap
your mom, right?
Like she's not gonna benefitfrom being bedridden all day.
So it you you have to be able totry and we talked briefly about
especially older people.
(20:41):
There's a spiral, I think it's65 and older.
There's a spiral that they doless.
So when because they wereinjured when they did more, so
they do less.
And then when they do more,they're more likely to get
injured.
So they do less again.
And it's a spiral, and then it'slike I think it's like 12 years,
maybe it's eight years.
I don't want to lie, but itthere's a definite thing of
(21:03):
death is eminent because youdon't do stuff.
The more stuff you do, the morestuff you can do.
And I think the seniorpopulation is great.
It definitely means differentthings to be old now than it did
20 years ago and 40 years agoand whatever.
Like a hundred years ago, itdefinitely people didn't get
old.
But now it just changes.
(21:24):
I remember when I was a littlekid and my grandma was 80, like
she just stood up out of herwheelchair.
My dad was hiking at 80.
Like it's just a differentmentality.
Yeah.
And it's a different physicalset, right?
Like, sorry, I heard your alarmgo off.
SPEAKER_01 (21:42):
So oh no, you're good.
Sorry.
No, keep going.
Um, I think that, but I'm I'mcurious on do you think that to
your point of like people areliving longer, um, living
healthier, and the standard,like you said, my grandpa just
turned 90 this year, and he'sstill he has a junk trailer that
(22:07):
he fills up every like month orso with just like random
projects and trees, and I don'tknow.
Um, and he's still like doingthat by himself.
He's running, building, doinghome improvements by himself at
90.
Um, do you think that and thenif you look at the younger, the
baby boomers that are retiring,they often are on social media.
(22:27):
They're using their deviceregularly.
You know, they're on, they havetheir iPad out doing like family
history or something.
Um do you do you think that thattrend, the people that are in
their 50s and early 60s now overthe next decade as AI improves,
that it'll be less of a barrierbecause they're used to the
(22:48):
technology that we currentlyhave, or do you think it'll just
continue to be kind of an uphillbattle trying to get technology
into senior care?
SPEAKER_00 (22:59):
I honestly pe I I don't know how to answer that
because I think it deventdepends on the individual.
My dad is 95 and he can clearthe board on Jeopardy, but
that's not every 95-year-old.
But it's becoming more commonand God, it's very different,
(23:21):
and I think there's more um it'smore common for people to be
like your grandfather, like theydo things well into like they're
more active well into their 90s.
That's more common, but there'sstill those people who are like
in their 70s and scared to leavetheir bed or scared to leave go
(23:43):
outside, and it's just verydifferent.
And there's also people who areadventurous and they'll, but I
also know somebody who's like intheir 50s who's scared to pump
their who doesn't know how topump their own gas.
So I don't know how to, you knowwhat I mean?
SPEAKER_01 (23:55):
Like, do I Yeah, yeah, it's such a a broad skew,
a broad brushstroke to try tosay.
Um I guess so.
My last question is what what doyou think's next for for you and
Buswell Biomedical?
Is there anything that you'resuper excited about or that
you're working on um that youwant to tell the world about?
SPEAKER_00 (24:15):
I am very excited about getting FDA clearance.
I think that that's a bigmilestone, and that's what we're
working on now.
SPEAKER_01 (24:23):
Sweet.
Is that close?
SPEAKER_00 (24:25):
Actually, no, it's not close.
Well, I don't I don't know,close and not close or relative,
I guess.
It's closer than it was, butit's not.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (24:36):
Not quite yet.
Well, good.
Um, I'm excited for that toclear.
I think that this is just gonnabe huge and really help give a
lot of people who had alife-altering experience or
injury um the autonomy that theycrave and that they deserve.
So I'm excited that you'reworking on it that somebody is.
(24:57):
Um, everybody, that was SheilaBuswell.
She, in my opinion, is a trueinnovator with heart of healing
and a vision for the future ofrehab care and mobility.
You can learn more about Sheilaand her work at
Buswellbiomedical.com, B-U-SBus, W E L L biomedical.com.
And then don't forget to checkout her book and buy it.
(25:18):
It's the Is This Seat for Me.
And then even more stories ofresilience and purpose are in
that.
So thanks for listening toSenior Care Academy.
Um, and Sheila, thanks so muchfor being on.
SPEAKER_00 (25:29):
Thanks, Caleb.
Welcome to another episode of Senior Care Academy
Podcast, where we explore theinnovations, challenges, and
stories shaping the future ofelder care.
Today's episode is especiallypowerful.
We're joined by Sheila Bustwell.
She's the CEO and co-founder ofBustwell Biomedical, a veteran
of the U.S.
Army, and the author of Is ThisMy Seat?
Overcoming Imposter Syndrome inEveryday Life and Business.
(00:28):
In her book, Sheila shares herpersonal experience with
imposter syndrome, as well asthe stories of a diverse group
of accomplished individuals whostruggled with self-doubt but
found ways to overcome it.
She hopes to help others whofeel limited by their beliefs
experience more freedom andrealize that they are enough.
I'm super excited to chat today.
SPEAKER_00 (00:47):
Thank you, Caleb.
It's great to be here.
SPEAKER_01 (00:50):
Yeah.
Awesome.
I want to kind of start withyour journey.
You've had a unique journey fromthe military to engineering and
then now innovating inrehabilitation and med tech.
So what was your when you let'sgo back to the beginning.
So in 1997, you joined the Army.
What was your mindset at thattime?
SPEAKER_00 (01:11):
I in 1995, I graduated high school and I had
a scholarship.
That scholarship was tied to ahigh GPA.
And I went to scholarship, whichwas the University of Utah,
funny enough.
And I lost that scholarshipafter the first year because I
did not maintain a high scholar,like high GPA.
So I don't know who maintainsthat high GPA.
Since I lost that scholarship, Ifound out a lot of people lost
(01:35):
that scholarship.
I limped along for like a year.
And then after a year, I waslike looking for alternatives,
and I ended up in the military.
And at the time, you know, Ithought, oh, I'm gonna, it was
go to the army, go to jail timethat time.
And I thought, oh, just gonna,I'm gonna be smarter than
everybody.
I'm gonna whatever.
Like I had this preconceivednotion of what everyone's gonna
be like.
And I realized after I joinedthat people join the military
(01:59):
for a myriad of reasons, and youmeet people are just people.
And after I joined the militaryin 1997, that was my mindset.
I just wanted to pay for school.
I learned a lot.
Um, mostly that people are justpeople.
Uh that some of those lessonswere expected, and some of them
were, you know, snuck up up onyears later, they come up on me.
(02:23):
But um when I was deployed toBosnia, that's when I was
injured.
And I was rehabbing in a UNhospital in Bosnia.
And I remember my mindset atthat time, at when I was
injured, was simply, oh, well, Ijoined this military force, and
(02:44):
you know, there was a lot ofthings that I did that at the
time I thought, well, this ispart of it.
You know, like I don't knowpeople who are in the military
think about the duck walk in themap station as just part of, you
know, it's not a great part, butit's something you got to do to
get from here to there.
And I thought, oh, this is justthat.
You know, I was in the militaryand I was gonna be treated a
certain way.
I was in the military and inBosnia I got injured.
(03:07):
It is what it is.
So that qualified it, and I putlike cleaning out my garage.
I labeled it as this issomething to expect.
And I put it in, you know, thatlittle drawer in my mind, and I
did what I did, and it was whatit was.
And then I got out of themilitary with a medical
discharge and completed myeducation, ultimately obtaining
(03:32):
an MS in engineering.
And then 20 years after my thisis this story was like years in
the making, but 20 years aftermy accident, my mom has an
accident and she falls and shebreaks her hip and she rehabs in
Arizona.
And at the time, I'm not acaregiver.
I know you've had caregivers onhere before.
(03:52):
I'm not, definitely not that.
But I'm a problem solver, not acaregiver.
I do have gifts, it's just notthe caregiving.
I'm not the empathy type.
Um, I remember my mom didn'tsign up for anything that was
happening.
And when I it struck me that in1998, between in those
intervening 20 years, and inArizona, in a hoity-toity rehab
(04:16):
facility, that the solutions orthe opportunities, or I don't
know what you call it, but theactivities of daily living were
conducted very much the same waythat they were conducted 20
years prior and in Bosnia at theUN facility.
And I was like, my mom wasn't inthe military, she didn't sign up
for that, and she didn't havethe cadre of Norwegian nurses
(04:42):
that could conduct theseactivities of daily living with
her.
Like it was hard enough for me20 years prior because I had to
have somebody with me all thetime.
It was much more difficult formy mom because not only did she
have that, there wasn't enoughhealthcare workers.
In 1998, between 20 in 2018,that was the case.
In 1998, it wasn't the case forme, but it's definitely the case
(05:04):
now after, you know, pandemicand all the things.
SPEAKER_01 (05:07):
Yeah.
Yeah, totally.
SPEAKER_00 (05:09):
So this is the standard of care today, but
people wait hours to conduct anyactivity of daily living, like
going to the bathroom.
Hours.
SPEAKER_01 (05:19):
Yeah, that's such an interesting, like you said, you
had this uh very well supportedas far as healthcare workers go
in your instance, but with yourmom, what do you think that had
it happened to you in 2018 thatit would have struck the same
nerve of like, this is 20 hadyou been injured again, or do
(05:41):
you think there was some pieceof it where it was almost
protective of your mom's carebeing like, what's happening?
This is my mom here.
SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
I I am not sure how to answer that.
I know that I was definitelyprotective protective of my mom,
but also it was I knew there wasa better solution, right?
Like by this time I had amaster's in engineering, I'd
worked for a lot of greatcompanies, and most of that was
in RD automation and you know,like using sensors to do stuff.
(06:10):
It were, you know, when there'sa shortage of people to do
things.
Like at Anheuser Bush, there wasnot people to move hoses
forever.
So, and it was dangerous work.
So, how can we do that withpiping and instrumentation and
like sensors?
And that I felt the same way.
(06:30):
Like, okay, it's it's it's amore difficult task, but we have
greater technology now.
We wouldn't have the internetspeed that we had in 1998.
Why are we still solvingproblems the same way?
SPEAKER_01 (06:44):
Medical problems, yeah, that's true.
Like doing the exact same cares.
Um, and like you said, it is alittle bit more complex or maybe
more um emotional, sentimental,and intimate work than
automating uh Anheuser Busch.
But um, there's something,there's gotta be something to
(07:05):
do.
Um, during like that experience,now that would be seven years
ago with your mom.
Was there maybe a moment duringher recovery that really sparked
the idea for upmo or upwardmobility?
SPEAKER_00 (07:17):
It really wasn't an aha moment like people talk
about, nor was I thisentrepreneur.
I didn't have thatentrepreneurship spirit, right?
SPEAKER_01 (07:25):
Like at the time You were like looking for a problem
to solve, necessarily.
SPEAKER_00 (07:29):
Yeah, I remember being struck by like total, I
totally admit that I was not acaregiver, but my mom like
needed help with socks.
So I was like trying to putsocks on.
She's like, You're going tooslow.
And then I tried to heat up andshe's like, oh, you hurt me.
And I'm like, I, you know, liketo me, I don't know how to like
I don't know how to walk thatline.
(07:49):
But it was like gradual, and Iwas there for a couple weeks.
And at my instance at that timewas I'll just go work for who's
ever solving this problem.
And I think it was reallyshocking to me to find out
nobody's working on thisproblem.
SPEAKER_01 (08:05):
And then it was especially technologically,
yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:09):
It there, and there's a lot better companies,
bigger companies with a lot moreresources.
But I was like giving myself apet talk.
If not you, then who?
If not now, then when?
Like it was, and I'm not sayingit like tritely, like that was
an easy thing to overcome.
It was definitely something thatwas like, okay, this is a
(08:30):
systemic problem, it needs asolution.
And who's better situated toprovide the solution?
And it was a year from it wasmore than a year, but it was
definitely 2018 to 2019.
We filed for the patent in 2019.
But it was a year from when mymom fell and I was there till,
(08:51):
you know, I came up with asolution and I kind of had it
sketched out till we got apatent attorney and formed the
business and all those things.
SPEAKER_01 (08:58):
Yeah.
So let's talk more about Upmo.
Um, what is it?
And then how does it work tohelp um seniors, but really
anybody in a rehab setting tohave more kind of autonomy and
support.
SPEAKER_00 (09:14):
First, I'll just explain how it would work.
Right?
So, like right now, people hit abutton and eventually a
healthcare worker comes andsays, What do you want?
This would be a separate button.
You push a button, and thisthing would come to you in a
similar way, like a Roomba or aself-driving car that uses LIDAR
technology.
And you would have your ownnylon strap.
It'd be, or a patient would havea LIDAR strap with an inertial
(09:37):
measurement unit that would theywould put on or they would
attach the device would come tothem, and then you would attach
your device to the unit and thenput the harness on like a
jacket, in a similar way to ajacket.
And then you would conduct anyactivity of daily living.
We're gonna use toiletingbecause that's that was my main
thing.
SPEAKER_01 (09:57):
Yeah, that's the most urgent one.
Like a shower, as much as it'snot fun to smell bad, but if you
have to go to the bathroom,you've got to get there.
SPEAKER_00 (10:04):
And you can wait several days for a shower.
SPEAKER_01 (10:06):
You can't so, but you can't wait You can maybe
wait several minutes for uh anyeah.
SPEAKER_00 (10:12):
And I I remember specifically it being a
challenge for me to do conductbusiness when there's somebody
else in the room.
And they're like, oh, it's theopioids.
I'm like, nope.
And I'm I it's not the opioids,it's whatever, it's because
you're here.
And I I think as the thing is,uh the accident happened to me
(10:36):
when I was 21.
But as you get older, moreaccidents like this are prone
and common.
Right.
So it's not that necessarilythat this device is designed for
old people or people with alimited mobility.
It could be used by anybody, butthat's who's gonna be using it
because that's who has thesetype of problems.
SPEAKER_01 (11:00):
Yeah.
Um, and so in essence, what itis, like you said, it's kind of
it's autonomous in that it cancome to your bedside and then
you're wearing a device thatsupports your um your weight and
whatnot, you hook into it, andthen it can help lift you up and
you're able to move.
I remember there's some coolthings that uh you and I had
(11:22):
talked about before where itkind of detects your motion to
almost counterbalance, right?
So if I'm walking, if I have asay I have a leg injury and I'm
attempting to walk to thebathroom um and I slip, doesn't
it like it basically takes allmy weight at that point to make
sure that I'm not riskingfurther injury by trying to take
(11:47):
care of my ADLs by myself?
SPEAKER_00 (11:48):
Yes.
Sorry, I didn't explain it fullyhow after the device will know
who's in the radio frequencyidentification tags or RFID um
will know, tell the device, thedevice will like a healthcare
worker will know your positionand location at all times and
(12:10):
status.
But like you move under your ownpower unless, like you said, you
know, you the IMU inertialmeasurement unit will like be
able to compare your normalmotion to the normal motion of
this library of people, and thenthis is where the machine
learning algorithm comes in.
And then it'll sense when you'reunstable or what's not normal
(12:34):
motion for you, I walk with alimp.
It would know that that limp isnormal, right?
Like, not that I'm drunk orinebriated or whatever, it's
just that that's what I Iwobble, or that you're liable to
fall or anything.
Yeah, but if uh if you'reunstable and it's out of
character, and I say character,like it's weird, the whole
(12:59):
stability has to be honed.
Like we have to identify whatunstable means.
Then it offweights you.
I don't know, Caleb, if you havechildren, but if you have
children and they learn to walk,you know that when you learn
when they learn to walk, youjust pick them up.
If they start to stumble, youjust pick them up.
And so the off-weighting partwould just let let pick them up,
offweight them so they can gettheir feet under them and they
they won't fall.
(13:20):
If it's a delicate person, aspeople age, my bones are
increasingly more like chalk,but as like m people age,
they're to be safer, it mightcause more harm if it's not like
anyone's gonna be hanging therelike a pinata, right?
Like hanging in the ground.
Yeah.
But it might be better to in asituation where okay, you
(13:42):
they're not gonna be able tostabilize themselves.
So they'll lower them slowly tothe ground.
It's different than a fall,right?
Because a fall, you can it'sunplanned and you can hit your
head, and physically, a lot morebad stuff can happen.
You can die or you can like hitsomething and cause a blood
clot, like bad things canhappen.
SPEAKER_01 (14:05):
Yes, yeah.
Yeah, there's a I forget thestatistics of uh regarding
falls, specifically among olderadults, where if somebody falls,
it like exponentially increasestheir their decline.
Um, and so avoiding that fall,even if maybe they get bruises
where the harness is, it'sbetter than falling and breaking
(14:26):
a wrist or um something to thateffect.
I'm curious.
So I know that you have thepatent, it's not yet ready for
like mass market.
As you've talked to peoplewithin rehab facilities and uh
higher levels of assistedlivings, um what has been the
response so far?
(14:46):
Like I imagine it's like yes,please.
Um I wonder if there's anypushback.
I guess the the deeper questionis why do you think that rehab
and mobility has been outdatedfor so long?
And now that we you have thisreally cool thing that's new,
are they ready for it?
SPEAKER_00 (15:04):
It's weird because when rehab and hospitals period,
there's people facing andbusiness facing people.
The patients absolutely again wetalked briefly beforehand,
before we started recording,about how like there's a certain
segment of the population thatfears when you talk about
artificial intelligence.
So being explained that that'swhat it does, it's that's what
(15:28):
it uses, but it's for good.
It's like a roomba.
Nobody's scared of a roombavacuuming your car, yeah, but
they're definitely scared of youknow the potential humanoid
robot.
SPEAKER_01 (15:40):
Yeah, the humanoids that are robots that are coming
out.
SPEAKER_00 (15:43):
But the one of the fears that kind of took me by
surprise that the businessfacing that I honestly hadn't
thought about was okay, this hasa machine learning library.
How when is that gonna beupdated?
How is it gonna maintenancegonna be handled?
Like, is it gonna stop somebodyin use when the library needs to
(16:04):
be updated?
Or you know, because this thingpart of the FDA clearance is you
have to prove that something'ssafe and that people you know,
like that's gonna work like asexpected.
My dad is 95 years old.
If it's but if it doesn't work,he won't use it.
So it has to be something thatlike if it impedes him too much,
(16:27):
he's not gonna use it.
The healthcare workers, on theother hand, they need to trust
it, and those are the peoplefacing.
But the business facing people,it needs to benefit them.
If it costs a lot to havemaintenance done on it, they're
not gonna want it.
If it if they can't use it whenthey're for a long period of
time while the library is beinguploaded or whatever, that has
(16:48):
to be all handled.
And it was a different concernthat I had envisioned.
And I guess the reason I thinkit's slow to change is because
you the thing you know.
This is a like people understanda Roomba.
They need they know their dattheir their cloth their uh and
(17:09):
there's their floors need to bevacuumed.
They don't have it's not uh theworst possible thing that could
happen is there's lint in yourcarpet if it doesn't work right.
The worst possible thing thatcould happen in this device is a
lot more significant.
(17:29):
And so I think it's it's a veryuh benefits risks kind of
scenario that needs to be workedout in those healthcare workers.
But however, like I don't knowabout you in Missouri, it's like
this thing where the only peoplewho use fax machines are
healthcare workers, and that'sinsane.
SPEAKER_01 (17:50):
Yeah.
So yeah, it definitely is uhprobably one of the slowest
industries to uh adopt any sortof innovative technologies.
But to your point, I think thatonce it's adopted, it um there
is the fear, I'm sure, fromdirect care staff of like, oh,
it's going to replace me.
(18:11):
Um, but I don't think it will.
I think that it'll enable justlike people, just creative roles
or more white-collar roles whereum using AI has been able to be
an amplifier or something thatmakes them more productive and
more powerful on theirday-to-day.
I think it'll be similar withdirect care staff where they
(18:33):
have this um device that makesit so they can be more
efficient, more um, you know,less stressed or less um running
from room to room becausethere's this device that can
help with mobility.
Um and so once it's adopted, Ithink it's gonna be really um
(18:53):
quite cool.
Um we kind of talked about it alittle bit, but you're an
advocate for an AI for AI as atool and not as a threat.
How do you envision AI improvingum rehab and and senior care
specifically over the nextdecade or so?
SPEAKER_00 (19:12):
There's a lot of people in I'm gonna say senior,
I'm gonna start with seniorcare.
But like my mother-in-law, herbody didn't break down or her
mind didn't break down, but herbody did.
She wasn't able to stand up.
And it's not like she couldn'tthere just wasn't enough
healthcare workers, especiallyon Thanksgiving weekend in the
(19:34):
middle of the night, right?
So I think there would be it'sthat scenario when people she
didn't need help to I'm tryingto think of other things, but
she didn't need help with the uhbasic stuff, but she needed help
certain parts of standing werehard.
(19:55):
And I think with rehabilitationand with you you don't want
people to hurt more.
Like nobody, there's like 180billion dollars of lawsuits.
Of those lawsuits, it's notolder pe that are filed every
year, it's not older people thatare filing the lawsuits, it's
their families that are filingthe lawsuits.
SPEAKER_01 (20:13):
Yeah, yeah, they're upset because mom should have
been taken care of, and Itrusted you with her care.
SPEAKER_00 (20:20):
And as I think And now she's hurt, yeah, and like
you like you want to protectyour kids, you want to protect
your mom, but you know,inherently you can't bubble wrap
your mom, right?
Like she's not gonna benefitfrom being bedridden all day.
So it you you have to be able totry and we talked briefly about
especially older people.
(20:41):
There's a spiral, I think it's65 and older.
There's a spiral that they doless.
So when because they wereinjured when they did more, so
they do less.
And then when they do more,they're more likely to get
injured.
So they do less again.
And it's a spiral, and then it'slike I think it's like 12 years,
maybe it's eight years.
I don't want to lie, but itthere's a definite thing of
(21:03):
death is eminent because youdon't do stuff.
The more stuff you do, the morestuff you can do.
And I think the seniorpopulation is great.
It definitely means differentthings to be old now than it did
20 years ago and 40 years agoand whatever.
Like a hundred years ago, itdefinitely people didn't get
old.
But now it just changes.
(21:24):
I remember when I was a littlekid and my grandma was 80, like
she just stood up out of herwheelchair.
My dad was hiking at 80.
Like it's just a differentmentality.
Yeah.
And it's a different physicalset, right?
Like, sorry, I heard your alarmgo off.
SPEAKER_01 (21:42):
So oh no, you're good.
Sorry.
No, keep going.
Um, I think that, but I'm I'mcurious on do you think that to
your point of like people areliving longer, um, living
healthier, and the standard,like you said, my grandpa just
turned 90 this year, and he'sstill he has a junk trailer that
(22:07):
he fills up every like month orso with just like random
projects and trees, and I don'tknow.
Um, and he's still like doingthat by himself.
He's running, building, doinghome improvements by himself at
90.
Um, do you think that and thenif you look at the younger, the
baby boomers that are retiring,they often are on social media.
(22:27):
They're using their deviceregularly.
You know, they're on, they havetheir iPad out doing like family
history or something.
Um do you do you think that thattrend, the people that are in
their 50s and early 60s now overthe next decade as AI improves,
that it'll be less of a barrierbecause they're used to the
(22:48):
technology that we currentlyhave, or do you think it'll just
continue to be kind of an uphillbattle trying to get technology
into senior care?
SPEAKER_00 (22:59):
I honestly pe I I don't know how to answer that
because I think it deventdepends on the individual.
My dad is 95 and he can clearthe board on Jeopardy, but
that's not every 95-year-old.
But it's becoming more commonand God, it's very different,
(23:21):
and I think there's more um it'smore common for people to be
like your grandfather, like theydo things well into like they're
more active well into their 90s.
That's more common, but there'sstill those people who are like
in their 70s and scared to leavetheir bed or scared to leave go
(23:43):
outside, and it's just verydifferent.
And there's also people who areadventurous and they'll, but I
also know somebody who's like intheir 50s who's scared to pump
their who doesn't know how topump their own gas.
So I don't know how to, you knowwhat I mean?
SPEAKER_01 (23:55):
Like, do I Yeah, yeah, it's such a a broad skew,
a broad brushstroke to try tosay.
Um I guess so.
My last question is what what doyou think's next for for you and
Buswell Biomedical?
Is there anything that you'resuper excited about or that
you're working on um that youwant to tell the world about?
SPEAKER_00 (24:15):
I am very excited about getting FDA clearance.
I think that that's a bigmilestone, and that's what we're
working on now.
SPEAKER_01 (24:23):
Sweet.
Is that close?
SPEAKER_00 (24:25):
Actually, no, it's not close.
Well, I don't I don't know,close and not close or relative,
I guess.
It's closer than it was, butit's not.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (24:36):
Not quite yet.
Well, good.
Um, I'm excited for that toclear.
I think that this is just gonnabe huge and really help give a
lot of people who had alife-altering experience or
injury um the autonomy that theycrave and that they deserve.
So I'm excited that you'reworking on it that somebody is.
(24:57):
Um, everybody, that was SheilaBuswell.
She, in my opinion, is a trueinnovator with heart of healing
and a vision for the future ofrehab care and mobility.
You can learn more about Sheilaand her work at
Buswellbiomedical.com, B-U-SBus, W E L L biomedical.com.
And then don't forget to checkout her book and buy it.
(25:18):
It's the Is This Seat for Me.
And then even more stories ofresilience and purpose are in
that.
So thanks for listening toSenior Care Academy.
Um, and Sheila, thanks so muchfor being on.
SPEAKER_00 (25:29):
Thanks, Caleb.
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