March 20, 2023 • 48 mins
It was so inspiring to hear from the amazing Jasmine Designs, aka The Pricing Queen! Together we explored how freelancers can make sure they're charging enough for their expertise and when it's time to start bumping up those prices. Like a Design Superwoman coming in with top-notch problem solving skills, she opened our eyes to new possibilities. As creatives running businesses of our own - keeping all of the plates spinning – having more profit potential is definitely something we strive for! Don't miss this episode (trust me!) where you'll learn loads about getting paid what you deserve as an expert creative entrepreneur.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
welcome to the Seven FigureBuilder Show.
My name is Julie Barick, founderof Seven Figure Builder, where
we help high achieving CEOs freeup time with gorgeous
automations to scale theirbusiness, to seven figures and
beyond.
And I'm here today with myfriend, Jasmine.
Thank you.
Jasmine.
Welcome.
Thank you so much for having me.
Really excited to be here.
Yeah, I'm thrilled to have youas well.
So for those that haven't hadthe pleasure to meet you yet,
(00:22):
can you tell us just a littleabout where you are in the
world, first of all, and whatyou do with your business?
Absolutely.
So, hi, I'm Jazz.
I am a graphic designer.
I call myself the design soapwoman and pricing queen, which
kind of sums up the two sides ofmy business.
Um, I am here in what iscurrently very early morning
Melbourne.
(00:42):
Um, I say very early morning,but it's 8:00 AM So let's be
honest, it's not that early.
I'm just a freelancer whodoesn't really like parting ways
with my bed in the morning.
Um, so in the two sides of mybusiness, I have the design.
So woman who has been flying inand fixing problems for her
clients for around about 14years.
I, um, help all of my differenttypes of clients, like a super
(01:04):
secret weapon in their backpocket.
They can just pull out and helpthem solve problems that they
have on the day-to-day basis.
And this is everything from, youknow, your, your fruit and veg
shop down the street that needsa, a mural and some better
business cards all the waythrough to multimillion dollar
businesses that are global and,you know, take payments and, uh,
(01:24):
operate on a really large scale.
So I.
Have built up that business overthe last 14 years by trying to
solve problems.
And it's amazing how much youcan truly help when you approach
almost every situation as, okay,how can this be solved?
And so after doing that for solong, I then got to a point
(01:45):
where I went, okay, I knowenough about how to run a
successful business, about howto run a successful creative
business as a freelancer, whichis not traditionally a high
earning or, um, it's, it's notyour doctor lawyer, classic
illustrious careers, um,starving artists.
We are not, we are hungry to be,to be making money.
(02:06):
But I got to a point where I waslike, I know enough to teach
enough for someone else to feellike they can be enough.
So I threw my hand back andbecame the pricing queen.
I fell into a pricing queenpretty heavily in that.
I found my, as soon as I startedopening up and, and feeling.
Enough confidence, I won't sayfull confidence, but enough
confidence to claim that crown.
(02:28):
I was there going, okay, cool, Ican help someone else.
I feel confident enough aboutit, and it was, uh, attractive
and attainable enough becausepricing's really Ted for pricing
and talking dollars for a verylong time.
I feel like it's getting better,but for too long it's been
something that people shy awayfrom talking about.
(02:50):
If we discuss money, if wediscuss dollars, if we chat
cash, we must be having massiveegos that are like inflated or
like we're just, you know,laying on mattresses of money,
not the tech, not the technicalsituation that we're living in.
But I started talking aboutpricing because I wanted to make
it a comfortable conversationfor, for my students so that
(03:12):
they can have thoseconversations with clients.
And it's about creating thatconfidence.
And confidence comes frombuilding up that comfort level.
So that's why I became thepricing queen.
Awesome.
So do you help, we'll go withthe pricing conversation first
and then we can talk Sure.
Design.
But do you find that peoplestruggle with, you know, what
price that they should quote forthemselves on an hourly basis?
(03:35):
And what do you find are thebiggest things that people miss
when they're trying to figureout their pricing?
Absolutely.
Uh, so I find that more oftenthan not, we tie the dollar
amount that we put on our time,effort, energy, and what we put
out into the world to ourself-worth.
And it, it, it's not even justlike a, a simple knot that
(03:58):
we've, you know, wrapped aroundand tied with the bow.
It is almost like it's grown,uh, from a really young age and
from a really, um, reallyheartfelt, uh, position of where
it kind of twists and turns andinterlocks itself with our
self-worth.
And I feel like a, a lot of itdoes come from way back in our
(04:19):
childhood.
We, when we're taught pricing,when we're taught dollars, when
we're taught about what thingscost, we develop this process
where whenever we then see anynumbers with a dollar figure in
front of it, the first thing wethink is, can we afford it?
And it's all about what we canafford, and that's great.
(04:40):
That's not a problem.
That's how you first learn yourfirst relationships with money,
and you first create your ownfirst steps of your money story,
and then you get to being afreelancer and having your own
business and having the need toput a dollar amount on the
things that you're actuallyselling and forgetting that it's
(05:00):
not about what you can afford,right?
It's actually got nothing to dowith what you can afford.
Yes, it's good to understandthe, the market.
Yes, it's good to understandyour costs and it's actually
paramount that you understandwhat it costs to create it.
Otherwise, you've just sort ofgot an expensive hobby.
And I dunno if that's about you,but I've got too many expensive
(05:20):
hobbies.
I do have a box in the garagehere that says Jasmine's cross
stitch phase.
Um, so I feel like then we, weput ourselves in the position of
we need to be able to affordwhat we do to be able to put a
price on what we do.
But we can do what we can do.
So when we're not gonna see thevalue in it, people find value
(05:42):
in things that solve problems ordo something for them that they
can't.
And making that disconnect isreally difficult in the early
stages of your business.
And as soon as you kind of tapinto that idea that, well, my
product, my service, my thingthat I'm selling, Isn't
necessarily for someone exactlylike me who has the same values
(06:03):
as money, uh, values on money asme.
Um, they don't have the sameproblems as me.
They don't have the samesituation as me.
And maybe just, maybe they havethe ability or they want the
ability to not have to do whatthey need to hire me to do.
And so you, you have to switchinto that place of like, oh,
okay, maybe it's okay to chargemore because it solves a bigger
(06:28):
problem and therefore is morevaluable to them than it is to
me.
Absolutely.
And I think the things that.
We're really good at and comeeasy for us, tend to be our
superpower that we're able tothen do with our business, but
they don't come easy to otherpeople.
And I think so often we forgetthat, that it's like, well, it
just, it just clicks in my head,right?
(06:49):
Like, it's just easy for me, butit's not easy for other people.
And that's what helps bring thatworth and that value for
everybody else, that thatdoesn't come easy too.
And it's so easy.
I'll speak for myself, but it's,it's so easy to forget that
sometimes.
Right.
And to potentially devalue thatservice that you're providing
when in reality it's likepriceless to your ideal client.
(07:11):
Absolutely.
And I'd kind of like to thinkabout it as the, the thing that
you are really good at, thething that you have your
superpower in, that is yourcape.
Now, when a superhero fliesforward, they do not see their
cape it trails behind.
It shows everyone else how greatthey are, but they forget that
they're wearing it because, Thecape's not making you fly,
(07:33):
you're making you fly.
But the cape's, the thing thatmakes, that makes everyone
realize how incredible yoursuperpower is.
How incredible that thing thatis flying behind.
Look, it's super girl.
Well actually it's just a personwho's really good at what they
do and they can't see it.
They're flying forward.
They're moving forward.
So when you land and you do likeyour little flourish, you can
(07:54):
remind yourself, Hey, I'm reallygood at this.
I love it.
That's such a great visual.
So how do you suggest thatpeople move past that?
Like when they're stuck in thatmoney mindset and just those
blockers in their way, how dothey get to their full earning
potential?
Um, when they, they can't seepast that?
I feel like it's a reallyimportant step to tap in with
(08:18):
your money story and your moneyphilosophy.
So when we frame money as theultimate goal, the end thing
that we're working towards, Itbecomes, if you've, if you've
ever put a goal in place andyou've worked towards it and
anything, in anything at all, itcould be as simple as running or
(08:40):
it could be as complex assolving a massive, massive
problem that you have at workand then you solve it and you're
like, right now what's next?
Um, it didn't feel as shiny,sparkly.
Um, I, I have arrived moment.
But if we have, instead themoney that you are making as the
(09:04):
tools to help you get to whereyou want to go, then that's
gonna be a lot, a lot more of ahealthier relationship because
otherwise we're, we're idolizingmoney, we're putting it up on a
pedestal and being like, oh mygoodness, I'll be happy when,
I'll be happy when I make sevenfigures.
I'll be happy when I get thisparticular money milestone.
I.
But the more that we chase it,the more it repels, the more
(09:26):
that we, um, run after it andsay, well, no, no, you need to
be Mine's dating again.
Don't, I can't go back to that.
I've been in a relationship.
Uh, we're coming up to a oneyear anniversary of our, uh,
marriage next month andcongratulations together.
Thanks.
We've been together 11 years.
He was my year five primaryschool sweetheart, way back
(09:48):
when.
Aw.
Um, I don't, I do not want to goback to dating.
It sounds terrible, but I feellike having a, a really chasing
relationship with money is goingto set you up so that you are
repelling it.
But if you sit back and youdecide to change the way that
you approach money, uh, that youuse the language around money
(10:12):
and sit there and go, okay,well, you know, if I do these
things, if I know that I'm goingto be doing.
Setting up these opportunitiesfor people to pay me.
If I'm going to be brave enoughto show them how I can solve
their problems and brave enoughto put a dollar amount on that,
that matches the life that I'mtrying to build, then that's
(10:34):
going to be a much more healthyrelationship.
And the fact of the matter is,money is just pieces of paper
and chunks of gold that we haveput a value on and swapped back
and forth just for fun.
It's, it doesn't mean anythingunless it means something to you
(10:54):
when you have it to use it touse, to build that life and to
build that.
Um, like you, you have thecomplete control to put, to
decide what the dollar figure ofyour life costing is, and then
it's up to you to go, okay, Ineed to find people who have
problems that I can solve thatare valuable to solve.
(11:14):
And that's how you would be bestapproaching the money side of
things.
For sure.
Well, and I think, uh, youtouched on something huge there,
that we shouldn't be chasing anactual dollar amount because so
often throughout our career thatdollar amount moves, so Oh,
absolutely.
You know, as you reach newlevels of success that, that,
you know, dollar amount keepsshifting farther and farther,
(11:34):
and so you never actually arriveor reach that goal.
Where in reality, if you flip itand focus on whatever it is
that's important to you, whetherit's freedom, whether it's, you
know, value for your clients,whether it's relationships,
whether it's family, like allthose huge important things that
the reason why we went intobusiness helps us get to and
achieve those goals, it's somuch more satisfying when we
(11:57):
actually get there, rather thanjust check I earned X amount.
Right.
Yeah, I, I, I was talking to afriend of mine a little while
ago who was trying to worktowards purchasing their house.
Purchasing, uh, a house and, andsaying, we, we just need to get
a million dollars so that we canpurchase a house.
Yeah, it's a terrible place thatwe live.
That a but an average house is amillion.
(12:19):
So if you're sitting there andyou're trying to work towards
having a million dollars to owna house, and then you pay for
it, and now you have$0 in ahouse, right?
And if you've tied your worth tohaving money, then you now have
zero, right?
You're back and square.
If you've tied your worth tohaving a goal completed, then
(12:41):
you've got the house.
So it's really like if you'resetting yourself up for failure,
by thinking that once you haveall of the figures that you'll
have happiness, it's not aboutwhat the dollars are, it's about
what it does.
It's about what the dollars cando for you to build your
business, to build your life, tocreate something that is the
next phase of you.
(13:02):
I.
I often think I, I used to think12, trying to think 12 steps
ahead of like, I need to do thisthen this and this and this, and
this and this.
And I get worried about stepeight or step nine, and then I
wouldn't take step one.
But now I kind of sit there andI go, okay, I know that my next
12 steps, I apparently putmyself in a 12 step program,
(13:24):
right?
Um, there's a hidden messagethere somewhere, we'll just skip
on apparently.
Um, maybe I need to go and seesomeone about that.
Um, but if I know the next twosteps, that's enough.
And I feel like, of course mylike, economic brain is just
like, oh, okay.
So if we're doing two steps at atime, it's only a six step plan,
awesome.
Fantastic.
(13:46):
But then you're just doing thefirst two steps or you're doing
the first step, two step to thesecond.
Like you, you recognizing thatthe inertia that's going to push
you forward is going to be thatsecond step.
It can stop that overwhelmfeeling like you're not where
you're supposed to be.
And I feel like this, um, topicof if you feel like you're not,
where you're, where you believeyou should be in your business,
(14:08):
in your life, I wanna invite youto, uh, ask yourself a couple of
questions.
So one is, am I, what is thestory I'm telling myself that's
stopping me from taking the nextstep?
Is it that I, I don't haveenough knowledge?
Is that I don't have enough?
This is it that I'm scared andwe get in our own way, we get
(14:31):
concrete footed in our own wayand think that if we put more
concrete on it, then it will,you know, be better, be safer.
The second one is, am I tryingto solve a problem that doesn't
exist?
Am I trying to solve a problemthat actually doesn't exist
either to outside or to me?
I was putting up pictures inthis room the other day and I
said to my husband, I need tohave these particular sticky
(14:53):
backed things.
I need to, uh, I and I need tohave them like sitting this
particular way.
And he just sat there and hewent, are you trying to solve a
problem that doesn't exist?
And I went, oh, don't use mywords against me.
That's rude.
Um, but yes, probably so.
Okay.
Is that a problem for anyoneelse in the world but me?
(15:15):
Probably not.
Is it enough of a problem tostop me?
Probably not either.
And it's, it's really importantthat we recognize that sometimes
what we're tracking, where weshould be, we're not ready for,
if we were ready for it, it'd bein front of us to take the next
step, but maybe it's actuallystep eight.
(15:36):
And we've still got so much moreto go.
And those steps aren't equal.
They're not all okay.
And then I will do this, andthen this will happen, and then
I will have this in front of me.
And they're not all set andequal.
Some of them are little, some ofthem are leaps and recognizing
that, that then, Once you get tothe 12 step, the step 12,
(16:01):
there's a whole other next part.
And that that next step of 12 isonly available to the person
who's done the first 12.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
No, I think that's amazing.
And so often we look ateverybody around us and we're
like, oh, they got, you know,people brag about how far
they've gotten in their,whatever revenue they've made or
all the things that they'veaccomplished.
(16:21):
And you think that it happensovernight.
But I love the analogy of likethe iceberg, right?
Like you just see that tiny tipof the iceberg at the top.
You don't see the years and the,the tears and the blood and the
sweat and like everything that'sgone into getting there that,
you know, as you're trying toaccomplish whatever that goal
is, keep your eyes on the goal,but just focus on the next step
(16:42):
in front of you as you'reheading towards that goal.
And eventually you'll lookbehind you and realize you've
come miles upon miles and youknow, it doesn't feel quite so
painful that way.
Absolutely.
So as people are trying tofigure out, you know, their
monetary value and theirexpenses and juggling all of
that to make sure that they'reheading the right direction and
(17:04):
making big enough steps towardstheir goals, are there certain
tools that you use or thingsthat you would recommend for
them to try to figure that out?
Absolutely.
Um, so I, when I startedteaching pricing, it was one of
the most common questions oflike, what do I charge per hour?
Now I wanna start off by sayingI don't charge things often per
hour.
(17:24):
I won't say that I don't do itat all because there is some
clients who don't have a definedscope within the creative
business that I run.
Um, there's situations where itjust doesn't make sense to
package up something to, becausewe just dunno where it's going
or we're in a testing phase, sowe're te testing out how long
something takes so that we canrinse and repeat down the line.
(17:48):
But those are inflated hourlyrates because hourly rates are
just swapping time for dollars,and we're trying not to do that
as much unless it's a lot.
So when I first started talkingpricing, chatting cash with
people, and that question cameup, I went, okay, this is
something that people need.
And I don't wanna do a justanother Excel spreadsheet that I
(18:09):
share on Google Docs.
I wanted to actually makesomething that helped others
calculate that price.
So I made my pricing calculator,and so the pricing calculator is
on my website.
Um, and I'll be sharing the linkwith your audience.
Mm-hmm.
Um, your, your own personallink.
Um, so the pricing calculatortakes the ideal salary that you
(18:35):
have as a business owner.
Now, this does trip up peoplebecause they're like, but if I'm
a freelancer, why am I making asalary?
Well, you need to have a moneygoal that you want to make per
year.
To be able to live, you need tostart with profit, right?
Just start with what you'reactually going to make to be
able to do what you want to do.
So you start with that number.
(18:56):
Then it goes through all of yourexpenses that you would be faced
with when running a business.
Cause running a business can beexpensive.
Mm-hmm.
There's many businesses thatactually work on only a 30 to
40% profit margin.
So when you are, when then goingthrough all of your different
expenses, you might think, findthings that you're like, oh, I
don't even think of putting aca, putting aside a travel
(19:17):
allowance.
Or, I didn't even think aboutthe fact that I'm going to need
a new MacBook, um, and gothrough all of your expenses for
that year.
Then we talk about hours.
Now, as much as I love to thinkthat there's actually 36 hours
in the day and that that hidden20, that hidden 12 is like just,
it's only there for me.
We only have an allocated amountof time.
(19:40):
And time.
Is that one thing that we can't.
Regenerate.
We can't create more of.
I really have tried, I promiseyou, I've tried my best for you
guys, but um, I can't do it.
I know my limits now.
And so working out what yourbillable hours is really
important that you can do.
And just because you're maybedoing it two hours a day or
(20:00):
whether you've got it full-timeor whether you've got it as a
side hustle, doesn't devalue howmuch it can be for you.
It doesn't make it so that youshould be, you should be
charging less because you're notdoing it full-time.
There's people there that writebooks on the four hour workday.
Four hours happens between afterwork and bed.
That's still a four hourworkday.
(20:22):
That's totally fine.
You're gonna burn yourself outif you're doing both of those
for forever.
But it's a transition.
And so you would work out yourbillable hours in a year.
So, um, the calculator takes allof those things, all of those
things into account and thenpops out what dollar amount you
should be putting on your time.
Now a lot of time when you aresetting your hourly rate or you
(20:42):
are reassessing your hourlyrate, you might look at everyone
else and go, oh, there's thatperson that, that person there,
that person there, they're allcharging all of this.
I don't feel like I can chargethat much, or I'm going to
charge just a little bit less.
And, and then get all of thepeople that are at the, you
don't want the bottom feeders.
You don't want the cheapclients.
(21:03):
The cheap prices are cha cheapclients.
Um, and then, you know, therising tides rises all of us.
Like it's definitely a, anopportunity for you to try to
charge a little bit more to seehow it works for you and then.
Deliver that with value.
So the pricing calculator isavailable.
(21:24):
It is creative businesskitchen.com/builder.
So that'll be your link for youguys.
And it's, it's a great resourceeven if you're not just starting
out as in your pricing journey.
Because a lot of the time, if Iwas to ask you, when was the
last time you raised your rates,and it makes you go, Ooh, it's
(21:46):
time.
It's time, girl, it's time.
Absolutely time.
Because if you, if it's beenmore than a year, it's time to
recognize that you probablycould have raised your rates by
now.
And it's business, it's notpersonal.
It's, it's about recognizingthat.
Generally inflation.
(22:06):
If you were like an employedperson, generally inflation
affects your pay rise and youwould be going up by around
about 2%.
In some places, they'reprojecting that inflation is
actually anywhere from five to10%.
Now in the last couple of yearsbecause of the pandemic, because
of everything that has reallychanged in the last couple of
(22:28):
years.
And so if it has be, if you lookat your rates and if they're the
same as they were pre pandemic,this is your permission slip to
change that.
This is your permission slip tosay, Hey, as a result of your
responsibility to run aprofitable business so that it
can serve the future customersthat will come by you, you need
(22:49):
to raise your rates so that youcan be still running.
No one buys from businessbusinesses that go bankrupt.
Totally.
Absolutely now, and I, I thinkthat also comes full circle to
what you were talking aboutearlier with we may not be our
ideal client.
So where we think about what wewould pay for services, it may
(23:11):
be more than what we wouldactually physically pay during a
day, but we need to beattracting our ideal client who
would ultimately give us thatprice for that service and
expertise that we have.
And you know, if you're lookingat what you're doing and every
time you quote a price in yourgut, you're like, God, that's
not enough.
Like I know what I put into, youknow, I used to, I used to do
(23:33):
professional photography for awhile and everybody has a cell
phone.
Everybody has a camera, right?
And mm-hmm.
So I remember when I firststarted and I was learning and
you know, raising my rates forweddings and everything that I
did.
You know, you get those clientsand they're like, well, it's
easy.
Like you just, you have anexpensive camera, but it's just
easy and it's, they don't takeinto account all the equipment
(23:54):
and the time spent and theculling and the editing and like
all the hours that you put inthat people don't realize and
all the years of expertise thatgo into that price that you
ultimately give to somebody.
Yeah.
So if you're giving your pricesfor whatever it is you're doing
and your gut says this is notenough, then you definitely need
to be raising your pricing.
(24:15):
And Absolutely looking at yourcalculator would be huge help
for doing that reassessment and,you know, seeing, how do I need,
where do I really need to be formy expertise?
Absolutely.
I.
So my husband and I, we do likea, a walk pretty much every day
with our little dash hound.
And when we walk, we talk.
(24:36):
Now my husband's in it, he's ina completely different space,
but the one thing that brings ustogether is food, which is
great.
His food is great, but I wastrying to like craft an analogy
that made sense for this kind ofsituation of when we're sitting
there and we're seeing thatthere's other people that are
doing what we're doing cheaplybecause they don't understand
(24:57):
what takes, what it takes to dowhat we do, it's doesn't, they
don't understand the ingredientsthat we need to put into what
we're creating to be able tobake the perfect thing.
And it came across this ideathat the Michelin star chef does
not worry what Mickey D's isselling, right?
They're not interested.
It doesn't matter if it's a$700dish, it doesn't mean that it's
(25:19):
going to be devalued becausesomeone else wants a burger,
right?
It's, it's, it.
There will always be peoplewanting to dine at fancy
restaurants, then go to MickeyD's.
Totally.
So it's finding those peoplethat are the most interested in
what you're serving and knowingthat you don't need to serve
(25:40):
Burger to be able to be likethem.
You are doing what you deserve,what you are happy of.
And if you've ever seen, um, agot a friend of mine who's a, a
cellist and you tell her to playbadly and she can't.
So if you can take that idea of,well, you couldn't design badly
(26:03):
if you tried, you couldn't,don't, don't do it.
Don't put yourself in a positionwhere you have to.
The only way to be able to beworthy of the dollar amount that
you're putting on your time isto actually do it poorly, do it
twice as good, and charge twiceas much.
And realize that not all, notall monetary exchange is because
(26:28):
they can't do it or becausesometimes it's a time factor.
Sometimes they don't want to beputting themselves in a PO
position where they might make amistake.
Sometimes it's that they justpurely don't want to do it.
I don't hire a bookkeeperbecause I can't do my own books.
Right.
I hire a bookkeeper because Ihate doing them.
(26:50):
Right.
And I also have, I, I also havelike mild anxiety attacks every
time, but I look at the numbers.
I'm a pricing queen for Christ'ssake.
Right.
And I don't like doing itbecause it, to me, it has a,
it's not important enough for meto do myself.
But that doesn't mean that mybookkeeper should charge a
(27:12):
little amount.
It means that my bookkeepershould charge his value and
charge the value that he'sdelivering to me and what he's
worth.
Has nothing to do with hisvalue.
Mm-hmm.
I love that.
So I remember when I firststarted my business, and
actually when I started, I wasdoing web development, web
design, and I remember pricinghourly.
(27:34):
And that the better I got, theless I actually made.
And so when do you see thatswitch to going from hourly to
per project?
Or what do you recommend there?
Use your hourly rate to gaugehow long things take you in the
beginning and then use that toset the value.
So set the value of you doingthe work.
(27:57):
So when we talk about value,there's two different, there's,
there's technically three, butthe two main ones are what's the
value of you doing the job?
So you that the time that you'reputting into it, the effort, the
materials that you need to payfor, that is your first step.
Your first step is understandingthat what it costs you to do the
job, which makes kind of like alittle bit of less sense, but
(28:17):
the more you think about it,it's like, okay, well if I'm not
doing it, then.
This is how much it's going tocost me not doing it right.
Then there's the value to theclient.
So there's a big differencebetween different clients and
different values.
Now, that doesn't mean that wedo a bespoke quote for every
single person, cuz that getsexhausting and it's just not,
not interesting in any way,shape or form.
(28:38):
We're not, we didn't get intodesign to do admin, sorry.
But understanding that the valuethat it's creating for the
client ha plays a really bigpart in why they're doing what
they're doing.
If you are showing up andcreating a solution for them
that is going to make them30,000 a year, there may be just
(29:00):
maybe including an extra 3000,which is 10%, 10% of what they
stand to make in a year.
Adding that to what your cost ofdoing the work quote is.
So say you've calculated thatit's going to take, I.
Okay, let's, let's go with roundnumbers.
It's gonna take 30 hours tobuild this website, and your
hourly rate is a hundred dollarsinto you.
(29:23):
It's not, the client doesn't getto know your hourly rate.
They don't need to.
It's got nothing to do with,with them at all.
So it's to do with your time.
So it's three grand to createit.
And then if they're gonna be setto make 30,000 in that next
year, just from that onewebsite, then it's a 6K job.
It's a$6,000 job.
(29:43):
And the one thing I wouldrecommend is that yes, as we get
faster, we then make less, whichis where it gets really
frustrating.
But instead of going, what isthe fastest I can do this?
What is the lowest amount ofhours I can do this for?
And charging that, flip it andsay, how much time would I like?
(30:07):
Mm-hmm.
How much time would it make?
Like if, if you, if you thinkit's gonna take 10 hours, what
could you do with 15?
Could you do a better job and isthe better job the more
important thing?
Or is it doing it fast and doingit cheap?
Mm-hmm.
So if you can flip it and go,okay, I could probably do a
better job with 15 hours.
I could probably createsomething a little bit more
(30:29):
robust and I might even be ableto research some future things
for them, and I'm not makingless money because of it.
So charge for the 15 hours as aproject rate, and if that's what
it, you know, for your first orsecond time, yeah, you're going
to hit Roblox or have learningexperiences, but those learning
experiences are then going tospeed you up for next time.
Mm-hmm.
(30:49):
Now, because you've had thoselearning experiences, because
you've had those situationswhere you're like, ah, I now
won't make this four hourmistake.
Because I can just check a boxand now I understand what I did
wrong.
Next time for next time, you arenow more valuable.
So it's either you charge asmuch for the next one because
(31:09):
you know how to do it and youmight do it faster.
And that doesn't mean you thenrefund the last, last hours at
the end.
No, we're doing a cost of theentire project or the problem to
be solved.
But then also you either need todo that or massively increase
your rates.
And if your rates are increasingevery single time you're gonna
hit a ceiling, you're gonnadefinitely hit a ceiling where
(31:31):
you cannot, it doesn't makefinancial sense for you to do
anything less, right?
So there will come a time, therewill absolutely come a time
where the jobs that you used todo will no longer be valuable
enough to do.
Based on what they were chargedat back then.
I had this like, not that longago.
Um, a website that I created fora, it was actually the, the
(31:55):
months before the pandemic.
And I definitely think that thefact that I built them a website
just before a pandemic and theywere a wine company, right.
And that no one could go andvisit their winery, I made their
life so much easier.
Mm-hmm.
I gave them the opportunity tomake money in a time when it was
(32:16):
going to be a lot less.
If they hadn't had that website,they might have gone under.
They might have had a situationwhere they couldn't sell
anything because no one couldcome and visit them.
Now, this is, this is my regretstory.
This is the one that I'm like,oh, I should judge more, but I
only know now and the only thingthat I can do now is take that
(32:38):
energy and take that learningand apply it to the next one.
Because once we look back and wesee it from the, I don't use
2020 vision anymore, it's acomplete fallacy, but when we
look back and we go, okay, thatcould have been done
differently, that could havebeen done differently, and this
is what the outcome was, usethat as the case study to sell
(32:58):
to the next person and have thatdollar amount actually reflect
what the work was and what thevalue that you brought them and
apply that to the next person.
Because otherwise you'll be in aposition where I am at the
moment in the.
I charged, I think 3000 for thatwebsite.
And that was in, uh, early 2020.
(33:19):
And they're coming back to menow and they wanna do a whole
heap of changes.
And for me to do the changes, Ialmost have to charge as much as
it was to make the website.
And so now that's now myresponsibility to communicate
that.
But if I had charged it higher,it would've felt more justified
now.
(33:40):
So if you undercharge, you'llcome back to bite you in the
butt.
And then you have to work outwhether it's a conversation to,
to have or not to have.
And this is the other part whenit's not worth your time to do,
it's your responsibility to passit onto someone that can do it
Then.
And communicate what youwould've charged.
(34:00):
This is the whole idea of likebringing up that, that process
because they're probably notgonna feel confident enough to
charge what you were charging,but the fact that they know what
else is out there will helpdrive their rates and help drive
them to understand what they'rebringing to the table as well.
And it might be that you justcan't solve the problem and you
tell them how much it is andthen you pass it on to someone
(34:21):
else and it still gets done.
And now you've helped someoneelse.
And knowledge and and gratitudeare the two most self-generating
sources in our life.
So why not create that foryourself?
Because it all comes back arounda hundred percent.
Absolutely.
No, and I love that of, if youfind it's not worth your time,
so often we'll just say, no, Ican't do it.
(34:43):
But if you know somebody good inthe industry and you know that
it's not worth your effort rightnow, but they might be very
interested in it, definitelypass it along to somebody else
and let them, you know, elevatetheir, their business as well.
Absolutely.
So, With design.
Um, what types of projects doyou, uh, what types of projects
(35:03):
do you really like to focus onor what is your specialty with
that?
I know we've talked lots aboutpricing.
So I, I call myself a jazz ofall trades, um, cuz I do a lot
of different things and that'sbeen the, the pure joy that I
have created in my business.
Um, when, in my last role, in mylast full-time normal normy
(35:28):
role, um, I definitely didn'thave as much scope as I have
now.
I didn't, I, I love the ideathat I can.
Use my creativity as mysuperpower to solve the problems
on my plate, whatever they maybe.
So right now I have a couple ofgovernment agencies.
I have a couple, I have oneglobal company.
(35:51):
I'm looking at my, um, my boardthat I have my, my wall of just
covered in post-it notes of allthe things.
Um, I have a couple of female edsmall businesses, which are
really joyful for me.
And the reason why I balance itlike that is that if I had all
startups, then I would besitting, putting myself in a
(36:13):
position where I have to rely onall startups.
Mm-hmm.
And if I then put, uh, myself,conversely, in all large, big
businesses, then it means thatif one of them dropped off, it
would be catastrophic.
Yeah.
So having a bit of like a spreadof different types of clients
where it's, you know, I havelarger clients so that they can
(36:35):
be.
Charge the amount that reflectstheir value.
So then I can balance myself tobe able to do, do some stuff for
small businesses.
So like, um, I'm gonna be doingan event for a large group, um,
where I'm doing, uh, design andproduction.
So I'm gonna be there onsitedoing all of their slides,
handling the, the sound guy, cuzthe sound guy's a friend of
(36:59):
mine.
So we're both heading off toSydney, um, to, to help and to
capture the day.
But this is the thing, I'm not asound engineer.
I'm not a production manager.
I am a design superwoman.
I fly in a fixed problems.
And the problem that they havein front of them is that they
need someone who can.
Talk the same language as thesound production guy.
(37:21):
Definitely used to share anoffice with him, uh, that can
jump onto the computer andquickly put up something that is
cohesively brand based for whenthings happen and when things go
wrong.
And I'm also really good atorganization, so having me on
the floor and able to like, takethree different tasks that they
might have to then put ontotheir plate.
(37:42):
If they didn't have me, thenthat's a really valuable thing
for them as well.
One out of those three things isdesign.
So it's about solving problemsand being that person.
And this particular one is comefrom like seven years worth of a
relationship, um, with thisparticular person, with this
client over the time and overthe course of those seven years
(38:03):
I've developed that, oh, can youdo this?
Can you do that?
And it's definitely been try andtest and see and see what I do
like and what I don't like.
When I find something I don'tlike, I learn to say no.
Mm-hmm.
I learn.
To say no learning.
Um, and if I find something thatI do like, I then use that to
(38:24):
push forward ideas to help theirbusiness grow and then put a
dollar price tag on it.
So this is the, this is one ofthe other things that I see a
lot is that if I'm suggestingwork is, is it unfair for me to
then charge them for it?
No.
And we feel really guilty.
(38:45):
Like if we walked into say acafe and we're like, Hey, you
could really use a mural therethat had actually looked really
good.
That wasn't, that wasn't a pitchthat's gonna then not cost them.
You solve as a problem.
That wasn't money.
A free idea, right?
This ain't look, the idea isfree.
You're welcome to take itsomewhere else, but.
(39:07):
As someone who's hired people, Iactually don't hire people.
I don't hire anyone who doesn'treach out to me first because
they need to have the hunger,the forethought, the drive.
Mm-hmm.
And the same thing can be saidfor if you are going out, and I
don't like cold pitching, butlike conversation, warm it up,
have a bit of a conversationabout their business and ask
(39:27):
them, and then plant seeds thatgrow later, you then create this
kind of role and effect that thestuff that you're planting now
flowers in a little while, butyou have to come back to it.
You have to come back andactually tend to it.
So when you're having those kindof opportunities and
conversations, use that to, tostart forward thinking and solve
(39:50):
the problems that are down theway that they may not be able to
see.
Because you are the designprofessional or the creative
professional or the professionalin the room with that set of
expertise, it is yourresponsibility.
And your opportunity to showthem how they can solve problems
that could cost them money withless money in front of them.
(40:11):
Absolutely.
And it goes back to what youmentioned of building that
relationship and that trustwhere they bring you into their
world and ask them, you know,ask you what else you can do and
project after project afterproject, you're continuing to
build that relationship and juststrengthen that relationship,
which is awesome.
Mm-hmm.
Like no one trust.
Totally.
And you, you, you don't buy frompeople you don't like.
(40:32):
I know that for a fact.
I have people that I'm like,Ooh, not gonna buy from you.
Right.
And I, I kind of hope that Ihave that from other people as
well.
Like, I, I definitely hope thatI have someone out there who's
just like, I will never buy fromJasmine cuz she's too expensive
for me.
And I'll be like, great, thankyou.
Thank you for not being in mytarget audience because you
don't value me and that, andthat's actually taken that
(40:55):
responsibility off my plate.
I don't have to feel like I needto convince you because we don't
convince.
Right.
Is there point convincingsomeone of something that
they're not interested orwilling to learn?
Totally.
So looking over the years ofyour career and all the things
that you do, how would youdefine success?
What does that mean to you?
Ooh, I love this questionbecause I come back to it every
(41:20):
year.
I come back to it every year andI, and I reassess where I'm at
and how it, how it's feeling.
My last check-in that I did, Ithink was, yeah, at the start of
this year.
Um, I define SEC success withhaving as enough challenges to
keep me vo motivated enoughshiny objects to keep me
(41:42):
distracted and, and enoughopportunities to solve problems
that didn't exist yesterday thathelp people in the future.
None of that is monetary.
None of that is monetary.
Because if I have success linkedto monetary, it'll run from me.
(42:03):
It's about having the, I I, Icouldn't do a desk job.
I couldn't do something that is,you know, fully, um, uh, like
physically based.
I could not do any of thosethings and have as much
challenge and joy as I do now.
(42:25):
I know for a fact that I didn'twant to get to 30 years into my
design career and have that asjust that.
I wanted to be able to helpsomeone else and build something
else.
And that was where CreativeBusiness Kitchen came from.
But more accurately, creativeBusiness Kitchen came from my
(42:49):
dad.
So I was, I worked as a butcherfor 14 years in my dad's
business.
Oh, how cool.
And my dad is very strong withfamily values and would always
bring me up on the idea that youneed to be big enough to serve
someone, but small enough toknow them.
So I needed to have 14 years inthe design industry to know and
understand what is out there andwhat is available and what is
(43:13):
expected and whether the theexpectations are met, to then be
able to throw their hand backand help others and connect with
them and have that like no onetrust and be just far enough to
make it so that they don't feellike I'm too far ahead to teach
them.
That's really important to me.
(43:34):
I love that.
That's so powerful.
So what can people expect fromyou next?
What can you expect from menext?
Look, if I knew the answers tothat, I feel like I would, um, I
would have a lot less post-itnotes surrounding me.
The great thing is that, Theopportunities that lie ahead,
(43:57):
they are begging to bediscovered.
So for right now, I know thatthe next 12 steps it include,
um, running my group coachingprogram, the master freelancer
that kicks off that time ofrecording.
It kicks off next week.
Awesome.
Um, running that twice a yearand giving freelancers an
(44:19):
opportunity to master thespinning plates of running a
creative business.
I'll continue to be working, uh,one-on-one with students and
seeing how they grow and howthey, and how I bring my own
unique flavor of coachingopportunity because I'm not like
a normal, I'm not like a cool, anormal coach.
I'm a cool coach.
Um, but I'm actually, uh, thekind of coach that.
(44:42):
Also helps you build a websiteor helps you build a brand.
Yeah.
And, and we've just done thatwith one of my, one of my
one-on-ones, which is really,really cool.
I'm gonna continue to createresources that help freelancers
wherever they're at.
So through masterclass andworkshops, um, and a potential
future membership.
But right now it's, it's gettingexcited at the opportunities
(45:07):
that are ahead and using thesame thing that I recommend all
freelancers do is lay all youringredients out, decide what you
wanna create, start creating andknow that it, know that it will
not end up looking like youplanned, but it, but lick the
ball, enjoy it, have some funwith it, and see how it goes.
(45:31):
And approach all of theseopportunities, whether it be a
new client, whether it be a newskill, whether it be.
Going freelance or whether it bejust going into a creative
career that is hired.
And if that's important to you,then do that too, but approach
it with curiosity because whenwe approach with curiosity, we
get rid of confirmation bias andthat's important to me too.
(45:55):
Absolutely.
So how can listeners support youin your work?
I know you mentioned your linkearlier, we'll have all the
links below, but where's thebest place to find you?
So there's two places that Igenerally am best to be found.
Um, I am absolutely on theInstagrams all the time, so you
can find me at your pricingqueen on Instagram.
But if you're hungry for alittle bit of food, for thought
(46:17):
and some creative snacks, headover to creative business
kitchen.com.
That is where all of the goodthings are found.
Awesome.
I love it.
Well, thank you so much forbeing on today.
This was so much fun, Jasmine.
Thank you so much.
It was an absolute blast.
I can't wait till the nextmealtime.
Yeah, for sure.
And if you found value in thisepisode, please share it.
(46:37):
That's how people find us, andyou will find
me@sevenfigurebuilder.com and Ilook forward to seeing you on
the next episode.
welcome to the Seven FigureBuilder Show.
My name is Julie Barick, founderof Seven Figure Builder, where
we help high achieving CEOs freeup time with gorgeous
automations to scale theirbusiness, to seven figures and
beyond.
And I'm here today with myfriend, Jasmine.
Thank you.
Jasmine.
Welcome.
Thank you so much for having me.
Really excited to be here.
Yeah, I'm thrilled to have youas well.
So for those that haven't hadthe pleasure to meet you yet,
(00:22):
can you tell us just a littleabout where you are in the
world, first of all, and whatyou do with your business?
Absolutely.
So, hi, I'm Jazz.
I am a graphic designer.
I call myself the design soapwoman and pricing queen, which
kind of sums up the two sides ofmy business.
Um, I am here in what iscurrently very early morning
Melbourne.
(00:42):
Um, I say very early morning,but it's 8:00 AM So let's be
honest, it's not that early.
I'm just a freelancer whodoesn't really like parting ways
with my bed in the morning.
Um, so in the two sides of mybusiness, I have the design.
So woman who has been flying inand fixing problems for her
clients for around about 14years.
I, um, help all of my differenttypes of clients, like a super
(01:04):
secret weapon in their backpocket.
They can just pull out and helpthem solve problems that they
have on the day-to-day basis.
And this is everything from, youknow, your, your fruit and veg
shop down the street that needsa, a mural and some better
business cards all the waythrough to multimillion dollar
businesses that are global and,you know, take payments and, uh,
(01:24):
operate on a really large scale.
So I.
Have built up that business overthe last 14 years by trying to
solve problems.
And it's amazing how much youcan truly help when you approach
almost every situation as, okay,how can this be solved?
And so after doing that for solong, I then got to a point
(01:45):
where I went, okay, I knowenough about how to run a
successful business, about howto run a successful creative
business as a freelancer, whichis not traditionally a high
earning or, um, it's, it's notyour doctor lawyer, classic
illustrious careers, um,starving artists.
We are not, we are hungry to be,to be making money.
(02:06):
But I got to a point where I waslike, I know enough to teach
enough for someone else to feellike they can be enough.
So I threw my hand back andbecame the pricing queen.
I fell into a pricing queenpretty heavily in that.
I found my, as soon as I startedopening up and, and feeling.
Enough confidence, I won't sayfull confidence, but enough
confidence to claim that crown.
(02:28):
I was there going, okay, cool, Ican help someone else.
I feel confident enough aboutit, and it was, uh, attractive
and attainable enough becausepricing's really Ted for pricing
and talking dollars for a verylong time.
I feel like it's getting better,but for too long it's been
something that people shy awayfrom talking about.
(02:50):
If we discuss money, if wediscuss dollars, if we chat
cash, we must be having massiveegos that are like inflated or
like we're just, you know,laying on mattresses of money,
not the tech, not the technicalsituation that we're living in.
But I started talking aboutpricing because I wanted to make
it a comfortable conversationfor, for my students so that
(03:12):
they can have thoseconversations with clients.
And it's about creating thatconfidence.
And confidence comes frombuilding up that comfort level.
So that's why I became thepricing queen.
Awesome.
So do you help, we'll go withthe pricing conversation first
and then we can talk Sure.
Design.
But do you find that peoplestruggle with, you know, what
price that they should quote forthemselves on an hourly basis?
(03:35):
And what do you find are thebiggest things that people miss
when they're trying to figureout their pricing?
Absolutely.
Uh, so I find that more oftenthan not, we tie the dollar
amount that we put on our time,effort, energy, and what we put
out into the world to ourself-worth.
And it, it, it's not even justlike a, a simple knot that
(03:58):
we've, you know, wrapped aroundand tied with the bow.
It is almost like it's grown,uh, from a really young age and
from a really, um, reallyheartfelt, uh, position of where
it kind of twists and turns andinterlocks itself with our
self-worth.
And I feel like a, a lot of itdoes come from way back in our
(04:19):
childhood.
We, when we're taught pricing,when we're taught dollars, when
we're taught about what thingscost, we develop this process
where whenever we then see anynumbers with a dollar figure in
front of it, the first thing wethink is, can we afford it?
And it's all about what we canafford, and that's great.
(04:40):
That's not a problem.
That's how you first learn yourfirst relationships with money,
and you first create your ownfirst steps of your money story,
and then you get to being afreelancer and having your own
business and having the need toput a dollar amount on the
things that you're actuallyselling and forgetting that it's
(05:00):
not about what you can afford,right?
It's actually got nothing to dowith what you can afford.
Yes, it's good to understandthe, the market.
Yes, it's good to understandyour costs and it's actually
paramount that you understandwhat it costs to create it.
Otherwise, you've just sort ofgot an expensive hobby.
And I dunno if that's about you,but I've got too many expensive
(05:20):
hobbies.
I do have a box in the garagehere that says Jasmine's cross
stitch phase.
Um, so I feel like then we, weput ourselves in the position of
we need to be able to affordwhat we do to be able to put a
price on what we do.
But we can do what we can do.
So when we're not gonna see thevalue in it, people find value
(05:42):
in things that solve problems ordo something for them that they
can't.
And making that disconnect isreally difficult in the early
stages of your business.
And as soon as you kind of tapinto that idea that, well, my
product, my service, my thingthat I'm selling, Isn't
necessarily for someone exactlylike me who has the same values
(06:03):
as money, uh, values on money asme.
Um, they don't have the sameproblems as me.
They don't have the samesituation as me.
And maybe just, maybe they havethe ability or they want the
ability to not have to do whatthey need to hire me to do.
And so you, you have to switchinto that place of like, oh,
okay, maybe it's okay to chargemore because it solves a bigger
(06:28):
problem and therefore is morevaluable to them than it is to
me.
Absolutely.
And I think the things that.
We're really good at and comeeasy for us, tend to be our
superpower that we're able tothen do with our business, but
they don't come easy to otherpeople.
And I think so often we forgetthat, that it's like, well, it
just, it just clicks in my head,right?
(06:49):
Like, it's just easy for me, butit's not easy for other people.
And that's what helps bring thatworth and that value for
everybody else, that thatdoesn't come easy too.
And it's so easy.
I'll speak for myself, but it's,it's so easy to forget that
sometimes.
Right.
And to potentially devalue thatservice that you're providing
when in reality it's likepriceless to your ideal client.
(07:11):
Absolutely.
And I'd kind of like to thinkabout it as the, the thing that
you are really good at, thething that you have your
superpower in, that is yourcape.
Now, when a superhero fliesforward, they do not see their
cape it trails behind.
It shows everyone else how greatthey are, but they forget that
they're wearing it because, Thecape's not making you fly,
(07:33):
you're making you fly.
But the cape's, the thing thatmakes, that makes everyone
realize how incredible yoursuperpower is.
How incredible that thing thatis flying behind.
Look, it's super girl.
Well actually it's just a personwho's really good at what they
do and they can't see it.
They're flying forward.
They're moving forward.
So when you land and you do likeyour little flourish, you can
(07:54):
remind yourself, Hey, I'm reallygood at this.
I love it.
That's such a great visual.
So how do you suggest thatpeople move past that?
Like when they're stuck in thatmoney mindset and just those
blockers in their way, how dothey get to their full earning
potential?
Um, when they, they can't seepast that?
I feel like it's a reallyimportant step to tap in with
(08:18):
your money story and your moneyphilosophy.
So when we frame money as theultimate goal, the end thing
that we're working towards, Itbecomes, if you've, if you've
ever put a goal in place andyou've worked towards it and
anything, in anything at all, itcould be as simple as running or
(08:40):
it could be as complex assolving a massive, massive
problem that you have at workand then you solve it and you're
like, right now what's next?
Um, it didn't feel as shiny,sparkly.
Um, I, I have arrived moment.
But if we have, instead themoney that you are making as the
(09:04):
tools to help you get to whereyou want to go, then that's
gonna be a lot, a lot more of ahealthier relationship because
otherwise we're, we're idolizingmoney, we're putting it up on a
pedestal and being like, oh mygoodness, I'll be happy when,
I'll be happy when I make sevenfigures.
I'll be happy when I get thisparticular money milestone.
I.
But the more that we chase it,the more it repels, the more
(09:26):
that we, um, run after it andsay, well, no, no, you need to
be Mine's dating again.
Don't, I can't go back to that.
I've been in a relationship.
Uh, we're coming up to a oneyear anniversary of our, uh,
marriage next month andcongratulations together.
Thanks.
We've been together 11 years.
He was my year five primaryschool sweetheart, way back
(09:48):
when.
Aw.
Um, I don't, I do not want to goback to dating.
It sounds terrible, but I feellike having a, a really chasing
relationship with money is goingto set you up so that you are
repelling it.
But if you sit back and youdecide to change the way that
you approach money, uh, that youuse the language around money
(10:12):
and sit there and go, okay,well, you know, if I do these
things, if I know that I'm goingto be doing.
Setting up these opportunitiesfor people to pay me.
If I'm going to be brave enoughto show them how I can solve
their problems and brave enoughto put a dollar amount on that,
that matches the life that I'mtrying to build, then that's
(10:34):
going to be a much more healthyrelationship.
And the fact of the matter is,money is just pieces of paper
and chunks of gold that we haveput a value on and swapped back
and forth just for fun.
It's, it doesn't mean anythingunless it means something to you
(10:54):
when you have it to use it touse, to build that life and to
build that.
Um, like you, you have thecomplete control to put, to
decide what the dollar figure ofyour life costing is, and then
it's up to you to go, okay, Ineed to find people who have
problems that I can solve thatare valuable to solve.
(11:14):
And that's how you would be bestapproaching the money side of
things.
For sure.
Well, and I think, uh, youtouched on something huge there,
that we shouldn't be chasing anactual dollar amount because so
often throughout our career thatdollar amount moves, so Oh,
absolutely.
You know, as you reach newlevels of success that, that,
you know, dollar amount keepsshifting farther and farther,
(11:34):
and so you never actually arriveor reach that goal.
Where in reality, if you flip itand focus on whatever it is
that's important to you, whetherit's freedom, whether it's, you
know, value for your clients,whether it's relationships,
whether it's family, like allthose huge important things that
the reason why we went intobusiness helps us get to and
achieve those goals, it's somuch more satisfying when we
(11:57):
actually get there, rather thanjust check I earned X amount.
Right.
Yeah, I, I, I was talking to afriend of mine a little while
ago who was trying to worktowards purchasing their house.
Purchasing, uh, a house and, andsaying, we, we just need to get
a million dollars so that we canpurchase a house.
Yeah, it's a terrible place thatwe live.
That a but an average house is amillion.
(12:19):
So if you're sitting there andyou're trying to work towards
having a million dollars to owna house, and then you pay for
it, and now you have$0 in ahouse, right?
And if you've tied your worth tohaving money, then you now have
zero, right?
You're back and square.
If you've tied your worth tohaving a goal completed, then
(12:41):
you've got the house.
So it's really like if you'resetting yourself up for failure,
by thinking that once you haveall of the figures that you'll
have happiness, it's not aboutwhat the dollars are, it's about
what it does.
It's about what the dollars cando for you to build your
business, to build your life, tocreate something that is the
next phase of you.
(13:02):
I.
I often think I, I used to think12, trying to think 12 steps
ahead of like, I need to do thisthen this and this and this, and
this and this.
And I get worried about stepeight or step nine, and then I
wouldn't take step one.
But now I kind of sit there andI go, okay, I know that my next
12 steps, I apparently putmyself in a 12 step program,
(13:24):
right?
Um, there's a hidden messagethere somewhere, we'll just skip
on apparently.
Um, maybe I need to go and seesomeone about that.
Um, but if I know the next twosteps, that's enough.
And I feel like, of course mylike, economic brain is just
like, oh, okay.
So if we're doing two steps at atime, it's only a six step plan,
awesome.
Fantastic.
(13:46):
But then you're just doing thefirst two steps or you're doing
the first step, two step to thesecond.
Like you, you recognizing thatthe inertia that's going to push
you forward is going to be thatsecond step.
It can stop that overwhelmfeeling like you're not where
you're supposed to be.
And I feel like this, um, topicof if you feel like you're not,
where you're, where you believeyou should be in your business,
(14:08):
in your life, I wanna invite youto, uh, ask yourself a couple of
questions.
So one is, am I, what is thestory I'm telling myself that's
stopping me from taking the nextstep?
Is it that I, I don't haveenough knowledge?
Is that I don't have enough?
This is it that I'm scared andwe get in our own way, we get
(14:31):
concrete footed in our own wayand think that if we put more
concrete on it, then it will,you know, be better, be safer.
The second one is, am I tryingto solve a problem that doesn't
exist?
Am I trying to solve a problemthat actually doesn't exist
either to outside or to me?
I was putting up pictures inthis room the other day and I
said to my husband, I need tohave these particular sticky
(14:53):
backed things.
I need to, uh, I and I need tohave them like sitting this
particular way.
And he just sat there and hewent, are you trying to solve a
problem that doesn't exist?
And I went, oh, don't use mywords against me.
That's rude.
Um, but yes, probably so.
Okay.
Is that a problem for anyoneelse in the world but me?
(15:15):
Probably not.
Is it enough of a problem tostop me?
Probably not either.
And it's, it's really importantthat we recognize that sometimes
what we're tracking, where weshould be, we're not ready for,
if we were ready for it, it'd bein front of us to take the next
step, but maybe it's actuallystep eight.
(15:36):
And we've still got so much moreto go.
And those steps aren't equal.
They're not all okay.
And then I will do this, andthen this will happen, and then
I will have this in front of me.
And they're not all set andequal.
Some of them are little, some ofthem are leaps and recognizing
that, that then, Once you get tothe 12 step, the step 12,
(16:01):
there's a whole other next part.
And that that next step of 12 isonly available to the person
who's done the first 12.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
No, I think that's amazing.
And so often we look ateverybody around us and we're
like, oh, they got, you know,people brag about how far
they've gotten in their,whatever revenue they've made or
all the things that they'veaccomplished.
(16:21):
And you think that it happensovernight.
But I love the analogy of likethe iceberg, right?
Like you just see that tiny tipof the iceberg at the top.
You don't see the years and the,the tears and the blood and the
sweat and like everything that'sgone into getting there that,
you know, as you're trying toaccomplish whatever that goal
is, keep your eyes on the goal,but just focus on the next step
(16:42):
in front of you as you'reheading towards that goal.
And eventually you'll lookbehind you and realize you've
come miles upon miles and youknow, it doesn't feel quite so
painful that way.
Absolutely.
So as people are trying tofigure out, you know, their
monetary value and theirexpenses and juggling all of
that to make sure that they'reheading the right direction and
(17:04):
making big enough steps towardstheir goals, are there certain
tools that you use or thingsthat you would recommend for
them to try to figure that out?
Absolutely.
Um, so I, when I startedteaching pricing, it was one of
the most common questions oflike, what do I charge per hour?
Now I wanna start off by sayingI don't charge things often per
hour.
(17:24):
I won't say that I don't do itat all because there is some
clients who don't have a definedscope within the creative
business that I run.
Um, there's situations where itjust doesn't make sense to
package up something to, becausewe just dunno where it's going
or we're in a testing phase, sowe're te testing out how long
something takes so that we canrinse and repeat down the line.
(17:48):
But those are inflated hourlyrates because hourly rates are
just swapping time for dollars,and we're trying not to do that
as much unless it's a lot.
So when I first started talkingpricing, chatting cash with
people, and that question cameup, I went, okay, this is
something that people need.
And I don't wanna do a justanother Excel spreadsheet that I
(18:09):
share on Google Docs.
I wanted to actually makesomething that helped others
calculate that price.
So I made my pricing calculator,and so the pricing calculator is
on my website.
Um, and I'll be sharing the linkwith your audience.
Mm-hmm.
Um, your, your own personallink.
Um, so the pricing calculatortakes the ideal salary that you
(18:35):
have as a business owner.
Now, this does trip up peoplebecause they're like, but if I'm
a freelancer, why am I making asalary?
Well, you need to have a moneygoal that you want to make per
year.
To be able to live, you need tostart with profit, right?
Just start with what you'reactually going to make to be
able to do what you want to do.
So you start with that number.
(18:56):
Then it goes through all of yourexpenses that you would be faced
with when running a business.
Cause running a business can beexpensive.
Mm-hmm.
There's many businesses thatactually work on only a 30 to
40% profit margin.
So when you are, when then goingthrough all of your different
expenses, you might think, findthings that you're like, oh, I
don't even think of putting aca, putting aside a travel
(19:17):
allowance.
Or, I didn't even think aboutthe fact that I'm going to need
a new MacBook, um, and gothrough all of your expenses for
that year.
Then we talk about hours.
Now, as much as I love to thinkthat there's actually 36 hours
in the day and that that hidden20, that hidden 12 is like just,
it's only there for me.
We only have an allocated amountof time.
(19:40):
And time.
Is that one thing that we can't.
Regenerate.
We can't create more of.
I really have tried, I promiseyou, I've tried my best for you
guys, but um, I can't do it.
I know my limits now.
And so working out what yourbillable hours is really
important that you can do.
And just because you're maybedoing it two hours a day or
(20:00):
whether you've got it full-timeor whether you've got it as a
side hustle, doesn't devalue howmuch it can be for you.
It doesn't make it so that youshould be, you should be
charging less because you're notdoing it full-time.
There's people there that writebooks on the four hour workday.
Four hours happens between afterwork and bed.
That's still a four hourworkday.
(20:22):
That's totally fine.
You're gonna burn yourself outif you're doing both of those
for forever.
But it's a transition.
And so you would work out yourbillable hours in a year.
So, um, the calculator takes allof those things, all of those
things into account and thenpops out what dollar amount you
should be putting on your time.
Now a lot of time when you aresetting your hourly rate or you
(20:42):
are reassessing your hourlyrate, you might look at everyone
else and go, oh, there's thatperson that, that person there,
that person there, they're allcharging all of this.
I don't feel like I can chargethat much, or I'm going to
charge just a little bit less.
And, and then get all of thepeople that are at the, you
don't want the bottom feeders.
You don't want the cheapclients.
(21:03):
The cheap prices are cha cheapclients.
Um, and then, you know, therising tides rises all of us.
Like it's definitely a, anopportunity for you to try to
charge a little bit more to seehow it works for you and then.
Deliver that with value.
So the pricing calculator isavailable.
(21:24):
It is creative businesskitchen.com/builder.
So that'll be your link for youguys.
And it's, it's a great resourceeven if you're not just starting
out as in your pricing journey.
Because a lot of the time, if Iwas to ask you, when was the
last time you raised your rates,and it makes you go, Ooh, it's
(21:46):
time.
It's time, girl, it's time.
Absolutely time.
Because if you, if it's beenmore than a year, it's time to
recognize that you probablycould have raised your rates by
now.
And it's business, it's notpersonal.
It's, it's about recognizingthat.
Generally inflation.
(22:06):
If you were like an employedperson, generally inflation
affects your pay rise and youwould be going up by around
about 2%.
In some places, they'reprojecting that inflation is
actually anywhere from five to10%.
Now in the last couple of yearsbecause of the pandemic, because
of everything that has reallychanged in the last couple of
(22:28):
years.
And so if it has be, if you lookat your rates and if they're the
same as they were pre pandemic,this is your permission slip to
change that.
This is your permission slip tosay, Hey, as a result of your
responsibility to run aprofitable business so that it
can serve the future customersthat will come by you, you need
(22:49):
to raise your rates so that youcan be still running.
No one buys from businessbusinesses that go bankrupt.
Totally.
Absolutely now, and I, I thinkthat also comes full circle to
what you were talking aboutearlier with we may not be our
ideal client.
So where we think about what wewould pay for services, it may
(23:11):
be more than what we wouldactually physically pay during a
day, but we need to beattracting our ideal client who
would ultimately give us thatprice for that service and
expertise that we have.
And you know, if you're lookingat what you're doing and every
time you quote a price in yourgut, you're like, God, that's
not enough.
Like I know what I put into, youknow, I used to, I used to do
(23:33):
professional photography for awhile and everybody has a cell
phone.
Everybody has a camera, right?
And mm-hmm.
So I remember when I firststarted and I was learning and
you know, raising my rates forweddings and everything that I
did.
You know, you get those clientsand they're like, well, it's
easy.
Like you just, you have anexpensive camera, but it's just
easy and it's, they don't takeinto account all the equipment
(23:54):
and the time spent and theculling and the editing and like
all the hours that you put inthat people don't realize and
all the years of expertise thatgo into that price that you
ultimately give to somebody.
Yeah.
So if you're giving your pricesfor whatever it is you're doing
and your gut says this is notenough, then you definitely need
to be raising your pricing.
(24:15):
And Absolutely looking at yourcalculator would be huge help
for doing that reassessment and,you know, seeing, how do I need,
where do I really need to be formy expertise?
Absolutely.
I.
So my husband and I, we do likea, a walk pretty much every day
with our little dash hound.
And when we walk, we talk.
(24:36):
Now my husband's in it, he's ina completely different space,
but the one thing that brings ustogether is food, which is
great.
His food is great, but I wastrying to like craft an analogy
that made sense for this kind ofsituation of when we're sitting
there and we're seeing thatthere's other people that are
doing what we're doing cheaplybecause they don't understand
(24:57):
what takes, what it takes to dowhat we do, it's doesn't, they
don't understand the ingredientsthat we need to put into what
we're creating to be able tobake the perfect thing.
And it came across this ideathat the Michelin star chef does
not worry what Mickey D's isselling, right?
They're not interested.
It doesn't matter if it's a$700dish, it doesn't mean that it's
(25:19):
going to be devalued becausesomeone else wants a burger,
right?
It's, it's, it.
There will always be peoplewanting to dine at fancy
restaurants, then go to MickeyD's.
Totally.
So it's finding those peoplethat are the most interested in
what you're serving and knowingthat you don't need to serve
(25:40):
Burger to be able to be likethem.
You are doing what you deserve,what you are happy of.
And if you've ever seen, um, agot a friend of mine who's a, a
cellist and you tell her to playbadly and she can't.
So if you can take that idea of,well, you couldn't design badly
(26:03):
if you tried, you couldn't,don't, don't do it.
Don't put yourself in a positionwhere you have to.
The only way to be able to beworthy of the dollar amount that
you're putting on your time isto actually do it poorly, do it
twice as good, and charge twiceas much.
And realize that not all, notall monetary exchange is because
(26:28):
they can't do it or becausesometimes it's a time factor.
Sometimes they don't want to beputting themselves in a PO
position where they might make amistake.
Sometimes it's that they justpurely don't want to do it.
I don't hire a bookkeeperbecause I can't do my own books.
Right.
I hire a bookkeeper because Ihate doing them.
(26:50):
Right.
And I also have, I, I also havelike mild anxiety attacks every
time, but I look at the numbers.
I'm a pricing queen for Christ'ssake.
Right.
And I don't like doing itbecause it, to me, it has a,
it's not important enough for meto do myself.
But that doesn't mean that mybookkeeper should charge a
(27:12):
little amount.
It means that my bookkeepershould charge his value and
charge the value that he'sdelivering to me and what he's
worth.
Has nothing to do with hisvalue.
Mm-hmm.
I love that.
So I remember when I firststarted my business, and
actually when I started, I wasdoing web development, web
design, and I remember pricinghourly.
(27:34):
And that the better I got, theless I actually made.
And so when do you see thatswitch to going from hourly to
per project?
Or what do you recommend there?
Use your hourly rate to gaugehow long things take you in the
beginning and then use that toset the value.
So set the value of you doingthe work.
(27:57):
So when we talk about value,there's two different, there's,
there's technically three, butthe two main ones are what's the
value of you doing the job?
So you that the time that you'reputting into it, the effort, the
materials that you need to payfor, that is your first step.
Your first step is understandingthat what it costs you to do the
job, which makes kind of like alittle bit of less sense, but
(28:17):
the more you think about it,it's like, okay, well if I'm not
doing it, then.
This is how much it's going tocost me not doing it right.
Then there's the value to theclient.
So there's a big differencebetween different clients and
different values.
Now, that doesn't mean that wedo a bespoke quote for every
single person, cuz that getsexhausting and it's just not,
not interesting in any way,shape or form.
(28:38):
We're not, we didn't get intodesign to do admin, sorry.
But understanding that the valuethat it's creating for the
client ha plays a really bigpart in why they're doing what
they're doing.
If you are showing up andcreating a solution for them
that is going to make them30,000 a year, there may be just
(29:00):
maybe including an extra 3000,which is 10%, 10% of what they
stand to make in a year.
Adding that to what your cost ofdoing the work quote is.
So say you've calculated thatit's going to take, I.
Okay, let's, let's go with roundnumbers.
It's gonna take 30 hours tobuild this website, and your
hourly rate is a hundred dollarsinto you.
(29:23):
It's not, the client doesn't getto know your hourly rate.
They don't need to.
It's got nothing to do with,with them at all.
So it's to do with your time.
So it's three grand to createit.
And then if they're gonna be setto make 30,000 in that next
year, just from that onewebsite, then it's a 6K job.
It's a$6,000 job.
(29:43):
And the one thing I wouldrecommend is that yes, as we get
faster, we then make less, whichis where it gets really
frustrating.
But instead of going, what isthe fastest I can do this?
What is the lowest amount ofhours I can do this for?
And charging that, flip it andsay, how much time would I like?
(30:07):
Mm-hmm.
How much time would it make?
Like if, if you, if you thinkit's gonna take 10 hours, what
could you do with 15?
Could you do a better job and isthe better job the more
important thing?
Or is it doing it fast and doingit cheap?
Mm-hmm.
So if you can flip it and go,okay, I could probably do a
better job with 15 hours.
I could probably createsomething a little bit more
(30:29):
robust and I might even be ableto research some future things
for them, and I'm not makingless money because of it.
So charge for the 15 hours as aproject rate, and if that's what
it, you know, for your first orsecond time, yeah, you're going
to hit Roblox or have learningexperiences, but those learning
experiences are then going tospeed you up for next time.
Mm-hmm.
(30:49):
Now, because you've had thoselearning experiences, because
you've had those situationswhere you're like, ah, I now
won't make this four hourmistake.
Because I can just check a boxand now I understand what I did
wrong.
Next time for next time, you arenow more valuable.
So it's either you charge asmuch for the next one because
(31:09):
you know how to do it and youmight do it faster.
And that doesn't mean you thenrefund the last, last hours at
the end.
No, we're doing a cost of theentire project or the problem to
be solved.
But then also you either need todo that or massively increase
your rates.
And if your rates are increasingevery single time you're gonna
hit a ceiling, you're gonnadefinitely hit a ceiling where
(31:31):
you cannot, it doesn't makefinancial sense for you to do
anything less, right?
So there will come a time, therewill absolutely come a time
where the jobs that you used todo will no longer be valuable
enough to do.
Based on what they were chargedat back then.
I had this like, not that longago.
Um, a website that I created fora, it was actually the, the
(31:55):
months before the pandemic.
And I definitely think that thefact that I built them a website
just before a pandemic and theywere a wine company, right.
And that no one could go andvisit their winery, I made their
life so much easier.
Mm-hmm.
I gave them the opportunity tomake money in a time when it was
(32:16):
going to be a lot less.
If they hadn't had that website,they might have gone under.
They might have had a situationwhere they couldn't sell
anything because no one couldcome and visit them.
Now, this is, this is my regretstory.
This is the one that I'm like,oh, I should judge more, but I
only know now and the only thingthat I can do now is take that
(32:38):
energy and take that learningand apply it to the next one.
Because once we look back and wesee it from the, I don't use
2020 vision anymore, it's acomplete fallacy, but when we
look back and we go, okay, thatcould have been done
differently, that could havebeen done differently, and this
is what the outcome was, usethat as the case study to sell
(32:58):
to the next person and have thatdollar amount actually reflect
what the work was and what thevalue that you brought them and
apply that to the next person.
Because otherwise you'll be in aposition where I am at the
moment in the.
I charged, I think 3000 for thatwebsite.
And that was in, uh, early 2020.
(33:19):
And they're coming back to menow and they wanna do a whole
heap of changes.
And for me to do the changes, Ialmost have to charge as much as
it was to make the website.
And so now that's now myresponsibility to communicate
that.
But if I had charged it higher,it would've felt more justified
now.
(33:40):
So if you undercharge, you'llcome back to bite you in the
butt.
And then you have to work outwhether it's a conversation to,
to have or not to have.
And this is the other part whenit's not worth your time to do,
it's your responsibility to passit onto someone that can do it
Then.
And communicate what youwould've charged.
(34:00):
This is the whole idea of likebringing up that, that process
because they're probably notgonna feel confident enough to
charge what you were charging,but the fact that they know what
else is out there will helpdrive their rates and help drive
them to understand what they'rebringing to the table as well.
And it might be that you justcan't solve the problem and you
tell them how much it is andthen you pass it on to someone
(34:21):
else and it still gets done.
And now you've helped someoneelse.
And knowledge and and gratitudeare the two most self-generating
sources in our life.
So why not create that foryourself?
Because it all comes back arounda hundred percent.
Absolutely.
No, and I love that of, if youfind it's not worth your time,
so often we'll just say, no, Ican't do it.
(34:43):
But if you know somebody good inthe industry and you know that
it's not worth your effort rightnow, but they might be very
interested in it, definitelypass it along to somebody else
and let them, you know, elevatetheir, their business as well.
Absolutely.
So, With design.
Um, what types of projects doyou, uh, what types of projects
(35:03):
do you really like to focus onor what is your specialty with
that?
I know we've talked lots aboutpricing.
So I, I call myself a jazz ofall trades, um, cuz I do a lot
of different things and that'sbeen the, the pure joy that I
have created in my business.
Um, when, in my last role, in mylast full-time normal normy
(35:28):
role, um, I definitely didn'thave as much scope as I have
now.
I didn't, I, I love the ideathat I can.
Use my creativity as mysuperpower to solve the problems
on my plate, whatever they maybe.
So right now I have a couple ofgovernment agencies.
I have a couple, I have oneglobal company.
(35:51):
I'm looking at my, um, my boardthat I have my, my wall of just
covered in post-it notes of allthe things.
Um, I have a couple of female edsmall businesses, which are
really joyful for me.
And the reason why I balance itlike that is that if I had all
startups, then I would besitting, putting myself in a
(36:13):
position where I have to rely onall startups.
Mm-hmm.
And if I then put, uh, myself,conversely, in all large, big
businesses, then it means thatif one of them dropped off, it
would be catastrophic.
Yeah.
So having a bit of like a spreadof different types of clients
where it's, you know, I havelarger clients so that they can
(36:35):
be.
Charge the amount that reflectstheir value.
So then I can balance myself tobe able to do, do some stuff for
small businesses.
So like, um, I'm gonna be doingan event for a large group, um,
where I'm doing, uh, design andproduction.
So I'm gonna be there onsitedoing all of their slides,
handling the, the sound guy, cuzthe sound guy's a friend of
(36:59):
mine.
So we're both heading off toSydney, um, to, to help and to
capture the day.
But this is the thing, I'm not asound engineer.
I'm not a production manager.
I am a design superwoman.
I fly in a fixed problems.
And the problem that they havein front of them is that they
need someone who can.
Talk the same language as thesound production guy.
(37:21):
Definitely used to share anoffice with him, uh, that can
jump onto the computer andquickly put up something that is
cohesively brand based for whenthings happen and when things go
wrong.
And I'm also really good atorganization, so having me on
the floor and able to like, takethree different tasks that they
might have to then put ontotheir plate.
(37:42):
If they didn't have me, thenthat's a really valuable thing
for them as well.
One out of those three things isdesign.
So it's about solving problemsand being that person.
And this particular one is comefrom like seven years worth of a
relationship, um, with thisparticular person, with this
client over the time and overthe course of those seven years
(38:03):
I've developed that, oh, can youdo this?
Can you do that?
And it's definitely been try andtest and see and see what I do
like and what I don't like.
When I find something I don'tlike, I learn to say no.
Mm-hmm.
I learn.
To say no learning.
Um, and if I find something thatI do like, I then use that to
(38:24):
push forward ideas to help theirbusiness grow and then put a
dollar price tag on it.
So this is the, this is one ofthe other things that I see a
lot is that if I'm suggestingwork is, is it unfair for me to
then charge them for it?
No.
And we feel really guilty.
(38:45):
Like if we walked into say acafe and we're like, Hey, you
could really use a mural therethat had actually looked really
good.
That wasn't, that wasn't a pitchthat's gonna then not cost them.
You solve as a problem.
That wasn't money.
A free idea, right?
This ain't look, the idea isfree.
You're welcome to take itsomewhere else, but.
(39:07):
As someone who's hired people, Iactually don't hire people.
I don't hire anyone who doesn'treach out to me first because
they need to have the hunger,the forethought, the drive.
Mm-hmm.
And the same thing can be saidfor if you are going out, and I
don't like cold pitching, butlike conversation, warm it up,
have a bit of a conversationabout their business and ask
(39:27):
them, and then plant seeds thatgrow later, you then create this
kind of role and effect that thestuff that you're planting now
flowers in a little while, butyou have to come back to it.
You have to come back andactually tend to it.
So when you're having those kindof opportunities and
conversations, use that to, tostart forward thinking and solve
(39:50):
the problems that are down theway that they may not be able to
see.
Because you are the designprofessional or the creative
professional or the professionalin the room with that set of
expertise, it is yourresponsibility.
And your opportunity to showthem how they can solve problems
that could cost them money withless money in front of them.
(40:11):
Absolutely.
And it goes back to what youmentioned of building that
relationship and that trustwhere they bring you into their
world and ask them, you know,ask you what else you can do and
project after project afterproject, you're continuing to
build that relationship and juststrengthen that relationship,
which is awesome.
Mm-hmm.
Like no one trust.
Totally.
And you, you, you don't buy frompeople you don't like.
(40:32):
I know that for a fact.
I have people that I'm like,Ooh, not gonna buy from you.
Right.
And I, I kind of hope that Ihave that from other people as
well.
Like, I, I definitely hope thatI have someone out there who's
just like, I will never buy fromJasmine cuz she's too expensive
for me.
And I'll be like, great, thankyou.
Thank you for not being in mytarget audience because you
don't value me and that, andthat's actually taken that
(40:55):
responsibility off my plate.
I don't have to feel like I needto convince you because we don't
convince.
Right.
Is there point convincingsomeone of something that
they're not interested orwilling to learn?
Totally.
So looking over the years ofyour career and all the things
that you do, how would youdefine success?
What does that mean to you?
Ooh, I love this questionbecause I come back to it every
(41:20):
year.
I come back to it every year andI, and I reassess where I'm at
and how it, how it's feeling.
My last check-in that I did, Ithink was, yeah, at the start of
this year.
Um, I define SEC success withhaving as enough challenges to
keep me vo motivated enoughshiny objects to keep me
(41:42):
distracted and, and enoughopportunities to solve problems
that didn't exist yesterday thathelp people in the future.
None of that is monetary.
None of that is monetary.
Because if I have success linkedto monetary, it'll run from me.
(42:03):
It's about having the, I I, Icouldn't do a desk job.
I couldn't do something that is,you know, fully, um, uh, like
physically based.
I could not do any of thosethings and have as much
challenge and joy as I do now.
(42:25):
I know for a fact that I didn'twant to get to 30 years into my
design career and have that asjust that.
I wanted to be able to helpsomeone else and build something
else.
And that was where CreativeBusiness Kitchen came from.
But more accurately, creativeBusiness Kitchen came from my
(42:49):
dad.
So I was, I worked as a butcherfor 14 years in my dad's
business.
Oh, how cool.
And my dad is very strong withfamily values and would always
bring me up on the idea that youneed to be big enough to serve
someone, but small enough toknow them.
So I needed to have 14 years inthe design industry to know and
understand what is out there andwhat is available and what is
(43:13):
expected and whether the theexpectations are met, to then be
able to throw their hand backand help others and connect with
them and have that like no onetrust and be just far enough to
make it so that they don't feellike I'm too far ahead to teach
them.
That's really important to me.
(43:34):
I love that.
That's so powerful.
So what can people expect fromyou next?
What can you expect from menext?
Look, if I knew the answers tothat, I feel like I would, um, I
would have a lot less post-itnotes surrounding me.
The great thing is that, Theopportunities that lie ahead,
(43:57):
they are begging to bediscovered.
So for right now, I know thatthe next 12 steps it include,
um, running my group coachingprogram, the master freelancer
that kicks off that time ofrecording.
It kicks off next week.
Awesome.
Um, running that twice a yearand giving freelancers an
(44:19):
opportunity to master thespinning plates of running a
creative business.
I'll continue to be working, uh,one-on-one with students and
seeing how they grow and howthey, and how I bring my own
unique flavor of coachingopportunity because I'm not like
a normal, I'm not like a cool, anormal coach.
I'm a cool coach.
Um, but I'm actually, uh, thekind of coach that.
(44:42):
Also helps you build a websiteor helps you build a brand.
Yeah.
And, and we've just done thatwith one of my, one of my
one-on-ones, which is really,really cool.
I'm gonna continue to createresources that help freelancers
wherever they're at.
So through masterclass andworkshops, um, and a potential
future membership.
But right now it's, it's gettingexcited at the opportunities
(45:07):
that are ahead and using thesame thing that I recommend all
freelancers do is lay all youringredients out, decide what you
wanna create, start creating andknow that it, know that it will
not end up looking like youplanned, but it, but lick the
ball, enjoy it, have some funwith it, and see how it goes.
(45:31):
And approach all of theseopportunities, whether it be a
new client, whether it be a newskill, whether it be.
Going freelance or whether it bejust going into a creative
career that is hired.
And if that's important to you,then do that too, but approach
it with curiosity because whenwe approach with curiosity, we
get rid of confirmation bias andthat's important to me too.
(45:55):
Absolutely.
So how can listeners support youin your work?
I know you mentioned your linkearlier, we'll have all the
links below, but where's thebest place to find you?
So there's two places that Igenerally am best to be found.
Um, I am absolutely on theInstagrams all the time, so you
can find me at your pricingqueen on Instagram.
But if you're hungry for alittle bit of food, for thought
(46:17):
and some creative snacks, headover to creative business
kitchen.com.
That is where all of the goodthings are found.
Awesome.
I love it.
Well, thank you so much forbeing on today.
This was so much fun, Jasmine.
Thank you so much.
It was an absolute blast.
I can't wait till the nextmealtime.
Yeah, for sure.
And if you found value in thisepisode, please share it.
(46:37):
That's how people find us, andyou will find
me@sevenfigurebuilder.com and Ilook forward to seeing you on
the next episode.
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