January 6, 2025 • 43 mins
In this sorta part 2 of our last episode on Giftedness and Over-excitabilities, we're talking about the other piece of the puzzle --- being BORED! Many neurodivergent people struggle with boredom for a variety of reasons, but did you ever consider one reason might be because you have an unmet need??
Sleepy Sisters podcast is hosted by Elizabeth Brink and Sarah Durham. This show is unedited and often unprepared for, so we hope you enjoy our resistance to perfection!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Unknown (00:04):
Hello, hello.
Elizabeth Brink (00:08):
We're the sleepy sisters. I'm Elizabeth
Brink and I'm Sarah Durham. Wewere given some show notes about
needing an intro, because Iguess there's a long pause, and
some of you are brothers, arefeeling a little like, what's
going on? It's too quiet inhere,
Unknown (00:29):
so well, they don't know when it starts. And so when
we just say, hey, hey, it'slike, oh, it's not a commercial.
Like, what's happening if you'replaying podcasts in a row. So So
we brought musical instrumentand we're just going to
experiment with it's
Elizabeth Brink (00:45):
like we're just in the room lurking behind them.
We're like, hey, yeah, what'sgoing on? Oh, okay, so I want to
talk today about kind of theflip side of what we talked
about in the last episode. So ifyou haven't listened to the
episode on over excit abilities,please go listen to it, even if
it doesn't sound like somethingthat would resonate with you.
(01:11):
Some of what we talk about todaywill make sense in that context,
but also some of that mightresonate with you, even if you
don't think it will, you canfast forward through the first
few minutes because we just talkabout end of year stuff, but I
found it super helpful. I feltlike I understood myself a lot
more after that conversation andand my kids, and then now it's
(01:35):
got me really thinking about theflip side of over excitability
and that idea of being understimulated?
Unknown (01:42):
Yes, so gifted folks tend to struggle with both over
stimulation via over excitabilities and also under
stimulation. There's actually aterm called you'll get a kick
out of this bore out.
(02:04):
I feel that. Okay, soit's not burnout. We all kind of
pretty much know what burnoutis, right? That chronic stress
of being over stimulated, rundown and all of that. Well, in
terms of giftedness, there canbe this thing called bore out.
Do you want to know more bore?
Like, B, O, R, E, boredom. Bore.
Yeah. Not like a bore, but yeah,like, yeah, right. Bore out.
(02:29):
Yeah. I want to hear thatbecause,
Elizabeth Brink (02:33):
like, here's the thing, I have had so many
changes in the last few years inmy body because of menopause and
I have just this last likecouple weeks since we had that
conversation, started thinking,Oh, is this part of the fatigue
that I'm experiencing? Because Idid have a cold in December,
(02:55):
which I guess everyone in theentire country has this, like
weird cold illness, and I hadsome version of it in December,
and I just it's like one weekafter another, just kind of like
explaining my fatigue by, oh,I'm really tired. Oh, maybe this
is just life now, and I'll haveall these ideas in my head of,
(03:15):
like, things I want to get done,things I want to do around the
house, and I will feel generallyenergetic in my mind's eye when
thinking about these things. Butthen when the next day comes,
like, and I have an overwhelminglife with work and kids and all
this stuff, for sure, but like,I experience inertia in a way
(03:37):
that this piece has started tomake me wonder. Like, I wonder
if there are times when I amfeeling that, like I can't want
to, like there's no want in me,if there is this element of my
over excitability,
Unknown (03:55):
being, you know, under stimulated. And that's what got
me really curious about this islike, is there a purpose to
understand? Let's notnecessarily just for the
audience purposes. Let's not tieover excitability necessarily to
the under stimulation. Let's,let's, let's tie it to
giftedness,okay, I guess just the intensity
(04:15):
of it feels, right?
So, yeah, intensity, right? Solet's say intellectual
giftedness, emotionalgiftedness, whatever you do,
because they're passions, andthey are the gifted part where
you're processing and able tomake pattern connection. And
there is this wherever you'regifted, or multiple areas,
(04:36):
right? You are drawn towardsthat kind of content and things
like that. So and you need, youneed stimulation in those areas,
right? And then, of course, youhave the over excit abilities,
which can, you can have multipleof those, and they can overlap,
(04:59):
and all of that. A lot of timesI do see them tied to to that,
like, if your intellectuallygiftedness gifted, then having
an intellectual overexcitability is definitely a
possibility. But they're notnecessarily the same. So
Elizabeth Brink (05:14):
can you, like, give me an example? Like, what
would that what's an example ofbecause these are, like, really
big words that can be kind ofjargony. So tell me, like, the
an example of and it doesn't itcan be made up of somebody who
has, like, an intellectualgiftedness and an intellectual
over excitability. What? Whatmight an experience be like for
(05:38):
them?
Unknown (05:39):
Okay, so my eldest intellectually gifted, and I
he's not going to care that Italk about this. This is like
nothing like super personal. Butas far as his need to be
intellectually stimulatedbecause of that giftedness, he's
(06:03):
always been prone to read a lotof books in a lot of different
areas over a lot of differentlike, I mean, loves, literature,
poetry, history, philosophy,where it might be going into
like an over excitability is ifhe's reading and that he's
(06:25):
tuning everything out andanything anyone else wants to
talk about, because he has allof these things that he wants to
talk about and process about,this information that he's
taking in, and that's the overexcitability, yeah, like,
where it's, like, it's, it's,I'm kind of derailed, and I'm
(06:46):
got tunnel vision outside ofanything else, because I've been
hijacked by my intellectualpursuit. Because
it's exciting, I'm excited. It'sexciting, it's
exciting, and whatever. Okay, sothen, but at the same time,
because he's intellectuallygifted, he does need a lot of
(07:07):
stimulus in that area. So he,you know, has always been
someone who would go to schoolnot get that stimulation,
because a lot of what publiceducation offers is not really
that interesting, and it's kindof boring. And so he'd have side
(07:28):
projects at home, side pursuitsat home. I mean, he was telling
me who Bernie Sanders was whenhe was like, sixth grade, you
know, that kind of a thing. Sothey need all that they need
that stimuli. They need accessto that, not necessarily what I
(07:50):
define as intellectualstimulation, but what he's
interested in. I mean, I couldsay, oh, well, here read about
this, or go do something inthis. But they have all have
their own flavor, too. I'mhearing
you say it's a need, it's aneed. It's, it's a social
emotional need. It's a neuralneed. It's, it's absolutely why
gifted education exists and whyit's something that is required.
(08:14):
There's a social emotionalcomponent to giftedness, and
then there's also thisintellectual in academic, or
whatever it may be, I'm going touse Academic because schools
don't often offer other types oflike ways to stimulate,
stimulate, offer stimulation oror, you know, around the arts
(08:38):
and stuff like that, just kindof depends on where they go to
school, but that's the generalkind of understanding
Elizabeth Brink (08:47):
of it. So then what happens to a kid that
doesn't get that at school anddoesn't have side quests at home
and is just like generally, notable to get that need for
intellectual stimulant, stim,
Unknown (09:04):
simulation. Why are you jumping around this word? I
don't know, intellectual
Elizabeth Brink (09:07):
stimulation.
They're like. It's like, in lowsupply in any area of their
life, then
Unknown (09:13):
or not the right supply, right? There might not
be enough, or it might not, orit might be. They're able to
read, but they don't have anypeers to talk out things and
ideas with, because then theyalso have their own processing,
you know, modalities and thesedifferent things that just make
them uniquely them. Well, thatchronic under stimulation that
(09:36):
bore out, right? It can look alot like depression and anxiety
and so, you know, when my eldestdoes not have enough of that, I
mean ruminating, you know, yourbody will take over and start
stimulating in ways that itneeds, even if it's not good. So
(10:00):
self sabotaging behaviors,things like that. So when we're
talking about, you know, giftedEd and people getting their
needs met in school, it's whyunderstanding what that means is
so important for educators.
Because it's not more, it's notgiving a kid more, it's giving
them different. It's givingthat. It's them giving them the
(10:22):
space to know who they are,understand what they're like,
unique print is, and thenoffering space autonomy,
novelty, different things forthem to explore that part of
themselves. And but a lot ofpeople will misunderstand that,
and they'll just get a lot ofextra work, which is boring,
(10:44):
which just contributes to thatunder stimulation. It can also
look like, you know, someonelike an adult who's going to
work and like this, bore outthis chronic understimulation of
just just not being satisfied. Imean, I have an audience
flashing. It's like you want todo everything, but that you're
(11:06):
looking for everything in yourroom. So some people might call
that ADHD, but this could begiftedness bore out, or, you
know, being understimulated Whenyou are doing some kind of rote.
You know, task every day thatyou have to show up and do, and
it's like death, having beinggifted person and being bored.
(11:29):
It hits different it's painful.
I mean, talk about not wantingto do your work.
Elizabeth Brink (11:39):
It's so confusing, too. I mean, yes, I
am having so many flashes tojobs I've had where I have and
clients, even who have expressedthis where, like, I have not
been able to explain why I havenot been able to do anything
like, literally do my job, andit'll be like the job I've I
(11:59):
vied for and I got and then atsome point, there'll be some
thing where it's like, oh, amajority of your role is going
to be you're going to collectthis, and you're going to put it
in this place, and you're goingto let people know this, and
you're going to do that on awhatever basis. And I'm like,
No, I'm not going to do it. Andand also thinking about a couple
(12:24):
of years ago how I got burnt outon social media, and I'm
wondering if I got bore out onsocial media as somebody who was
like, posting content on there,it just became, I mean, that
actually is the description. Itwas boring to me. I was like,
this is boring everybody, lotsof other people already saying
(12:45):
this stuff. And like, I don'twant to spend my energy creating
these little graphics in Canva.
And I just felt like, oh, Iguess I'm just burnt out, which
I that was part of it, because Iwas working too much. But I
think in that particular thing,it's like, anytime there's a
part of my job that requires meto do the same thing on a
regular basis, I inevitablydon't do that thing and and then
(13:10):
all this other you know,consequences and stuff happen,
and so long as there's someelement of it that's new and
different, that's novel, andthat challenges me
intellectually. I can, like,refresh. I think it's why I do
all this professionaldevelopment. You know, it's
like, Oh, something more tolearn about, to help support
(13:31):
people even better. And it makesthe work that I do. It keeps it
fresh. So meeting with clientsis something that I've not
experienced that bore out with,like the it's the only area of
my work I have not experiencedthat with, maybe ever. And I
think it's because I'm workingwith different people with
(13:52):
different stories and differentnervous systems, and I'm
learning all these differenttools and adding them in all the
time, kind of creating my own,like, self paced program, and I
hadn't thought about it in termsof boredom before. Yeah.
Unknown (14:08):
I mean, you know, I think if you were to just see
clients, you probably would getbored, but it's the fact that
you have this kind of multilayered approach to your actual
job that requires, or that yougive yourself that intellectual
stimulation, which so you havesome autonomy to do that. So
(14:31):
autonomy is really important,and the novelty so going into
the somatics and stuff like thatthat you've been able to go
into, and that's why, I thinkfor someone who is gifted or
gifted in especially in multipleareas, it's really important to
remember there's a lot of shamearound not sticking with things,
(14:52):
yeah. And I look at it as like,you know, you're evolving and
expanding, you know, right now,like you're so. Into somatics,
and you've done all thistraining, and every time you go,
I know, like, you always haveall these things that you just
love to talk about, and I knowthat it's a long time of
integrating all of that. So Iget that that's you've got a,
you know, a big piece of piethat you you got to work with
(15:15):
for a while, right? Which isgreat, but let's say, like, five
years down the road, you decideto shift into some other niche
or whatever, because maybeyou've spent five years doing a
deep dive and learning andincorporating that, and this is
where people, especially if youare the child of boomers, where
(15:38):
someone will say, why can't youjust stick to one thing? Or, why
can't you, you know, you foundthis niche, you're so good at
it, like you're so talented, weneed you to stay and it's like,
no, I need me to expand. BecauseI will never stop expanding.
It's one of the when I havetalked to people about my
(15:59):
career, especially in the lastyear or so, one thing I've just
really, really accepted aboutmyself is that I when I say I'm
a lifelong learner, like it's nojoke, you're the same way. And
so I think all of our siblingsare, yeah, um, sometimes people
(16:21):
will say that, you know, ifthey're applying for something
or talking about their, youknow, gifts or whatever, but
we're really researching. Youguys have no idea. I'm like, No,
we're actually
Elizabeth Brink (16:33):
learning the talking classes and trying new
thing. Yeah, you know, it has methinking about mom. So I I'm
not, I feel like I could go amillion places. So I'm trying to
wrangle in my thoughts a littlebit. But it makes me think a mom
and this whole idea of likebeing someone who chronically
tries new hobbies is like ahobbyist in that, you know, and
(16:57):
I've joked about it, I'vewritten about it. I've written
about it in thoughtful waysaround like, hey, I really like
learning new hobbies. I likelearning new things. I don't
necessarily want to like do thething and master
Unknown (17:11):
it. That's your hobby.
Is the learning the new thing?
Yeah. And so this is
Elizabeth Brink (17:15):
like, making that make so much sense, because
I'm like, Oh, right. That isn'tjust like an ADHD, I just got
bored and distracted. That'slike part of my giftedness is
that the learning is the funpart for me, and the researching
and filling a shopping cart andall of these things. And I also
am starting to wonder if a lotof the things in my life that
(17:38):
feel hard like housework andparenting and Business admin
stuff are, you know, they allhave this same thread of like,
they're repetitive, they'reboring, they they feel, um, I
often feel defeated by thesethings because they're just
(17:59):
never ending. And sometimes theyrequire executive functioning
that I feel like is really hardfor me, you know, the follow
through and the steps and stuff,and I'm just thinking about,
like, the early years ofparenting and trying to be at
home and work during nap times,and how that kept me barely
(18:20):
keeping my head above water,doing too much, right? This idea
of over functioning in a seasonof life that is inherently
boring, in roles that areinherently boring, and then
pushing your system to likeoverdrive, because that's the
novelty. It's just moving fastand doing a lot, right? Right?
(18:40):
Your over functioning
Unknown (18:42):
could have been your you just giving yourself enough
fuel to take care of this otherpart that was going on in your
life, not necessarily becauseyou can't sit still or you can't
be quiet, or just have juststayed home and been a stay
whatever, like it is a differentlens in which to look through
(19:05):
some of those busy seasons. Imean, and when you think about,
you know, our mom, I mean, shehad a, like, a domestic type job
that did not feel she was alsoan artist, which she didn't, she
rarely got to, like, tap into.
And she would, like, weremember, she started building
(19:25):
computers from, like, the groundup before anyone was even doing
that. She was doing that in ourhouse. We're like, what is
happening right now? And she waslike, building, you know? I
mean, it was just like, okay,whatever. We were in online chat
rooms, long before nobodyeven knew, you know, these, it
was like war games, that giantroom computer, you know, um, but
(19:47):
yeah, I mean, I think, well,yeah, the
Elizabeth Brink (19:52):
kilns, the like porcelain dolls, the embroidery
and the embroidery machine, thebaking cake,
Unknown (19:58):
yeah? Because when you think about, when you think.
Those things that you named,like the office job. I mean, you
can do those things, right?
Elizabeth Brink (20:05):
And people like, want to hire me to do
these things, yeah, and,
Unknown (20:09):
but they're not interesting to you. And so
that's maybe a barometer, or ameasure of like, is this?
Because I'm afraid to do thetask, because it's, it's too
hard, or is it hard for adifferent reason, because it's,
it's so boring, it just feelsabsolutely like death to me
(20:31):
right now. I mean, I've hadtasks like that where I'm like,
especially when I was teaching,because the only thing that got
me excited was, I mean, I workedwith a bunch of gifted kids, it
was like all of us were like atribe in a room with like each
other, just supporting eachother, expanding, throwing
around ideas. And then an adminwould come by and say, you know,
(20:54):
don't forget, you need to dothis practice test or whatever.
And we'd including me, like,what do we going to do? That so
dumb, you know, or whatever. Imean, I was right there with
them. It was just ridiculous.
And I think too, you know, justwith what I've been doing the
last like few years, I thinkI've been learning about and
(21:17):
thinking a lot more about when Ifeel down and I feel depressed,
usually, just because I haven'tcreated in a while, I haven't,
like illustrated anything orwritten anything or done
anything. You know? I mean, itcould just even be a matter of a
couple of days, yeah, honestly,if I'm just in a really busy,
(21:41):
repetitive, like situation,known, if I don't have any new
clients, and I'm just kind of ina rhythm, which is great. I love
the rhythm, but at the sametime, you know, I always kind of
need a little bit more andbalancing, of, like, not pushing
myself so far off the cliff to,like, get that need met, to
(22:05):
where I'm like, Oh man, I'mscrambling and trying to, like,
you know, put the toothpasteback in the tube, but just, you
know, enough to where I'm like,okay, so really learning that
about myself, and I also wasreminded too, with what you were
saying, it just this. Is anotherreason why being twice
exceptional is so confusing isbecause, you know, I love
(22:26):
tending paths on Instagram. Ifollow her, and she always says
something about being bored andoverwhelmed, and I feel like
that is often the experience ofa twice exceptional person is
bored and overwhelmed. It's it'strying to find the threshold of
(22:47):
like, where I'm over stimulatedand where I can find the right
stimulation for my brain.
Elizabeth Brink (22:57):
Gosh, it makes me think too. Like you use that
word rhythm, and how many peopleare like striving for a rhythm,
trying to find the rhythm. And Iwonder if it's kind of for those
of us who have this kind ofpropensity for boredom, for
(23:19):
getting bored, and whatever, ifthere is some element of like,
if you're someone who is yourwhole life been trying to find
the rhythm and pursuing like,what's the right rhythm for me,
and trying different things, youmay never find the rhythm,
because part of the stimulationof the process is trying to find
(23:40):
it like finding it would belike, the end of you. It'd be
like, Oh, even though, like,some of the things about having
a rhythm feel like, what otherpeople have that makes their
life easier, it's like, oh, theyhave this rhythm. They have this
way of doing things. Their lifemust be a little less stressful,
because some things are onautopilot, yeah, but I just
(24:03):
wonder if, like, there's somethread of the areas that we're
feeling unsatisfied with andlike, we're always tinkering
with and trying to, like, findjust the right way to do these
things, if those are just thethings our brain's using to to
give us this like outlet forintellectual curiosity, and
(24:26):
yeah, it's
Unknown (24:27):
what it's another case for really knowing yourself,
because finding what satisfieswhat you need based on Your own
gifts and your own you know,personality is crucial, because,
you know, if you're stuck in theshoulds and you're looking
(24:50):
around at society and the 10,you know, socially acceptable
hobbies or or side pursuits orcuriosities, and. Yours is some
random, strange, whatever, andyou don't want to tap into that
because you think it's tooweird, or whatever it's like.
Well, you're trying to meet aneed based on somebody else's
(25:15):
worldview, and you really needto know and experiment and
understand what like, even withyou your curiosity. Like, if
someone were saying, like, whatare you most curious about?
You're most curious about theworld. And like, curiosity. I
mean, there's no well this year.
So when someone asked, like,what are you into? You're like,
(25:40):
well, I don't know. For the lastmonth I've been doing a deep
dive and blah, blah, blah, mysisters and I've been talking
about this. It's like, but itcould be something totally
different the next week or inthree months. Yeah, it's
Elizabeth Brink (25:53):
not going to be like, an identifier, you know,
when some people and they'relike, Oh, I like D and D, or I,
you know, I love puzzles orwhatever, like they, they have a
thing, and they might be able touse it as, like an affinity
identifier. And for me, it'slike knowledge. And I don't, I
don't know if there is some,like, invisible thread for me
(26:15):
over the course of years, thatthese things kind of, they do
kind of link up, but it's sounique to me and to my
circumstances and my our familyhistory and stuff that like,
it's not one that I would mapout and suggest anyone else try
to follow like it's just, Iwould say
Unknown (26:35):
that it's emotional, emotionally gifted, And I would
say you have an emotional overexcitability as well. And that
the thread, I'm just going tosay this, I think the thread is
around that it's aroundconnection, and you find meaning
(26:57):
in the connection, in the dots,in the pattern, because we're
very similar that way. Yeah, welike seeing the the things and
how they're interconnected, andalso interpersonal connection. I
mean, there's, there's aconnective tissue, yeah,
Elizabeth Brink (27:19):
and that makes me think, like it a lot of that
ties back to my trauma, youknow, like just attachment
wounds of where are the grownups, and how do I make sure I
get what I need? But also, Wheredo I belong? Like, that's been
(27:40):
like my lifelong inner questionis, like, Where do I belong? And
maybe not even, Where do Ibelong, but like, more of a
statement of like, oh, I don'tbelong here, oh, I don't belong
here, like, I don't belonganywhere, because I have so many
different interests and so manydifferent kinds of people and
places that I like to be in.
I've never had belonging in astrange sense, other than to my
(28:05):
family, you guys, you know, andCorey and the kids, it's like
that's a different kind ofbelonging. But socially, I
don't, I don't know if I've everhad a period of time where I
have felt like I belonged, evenwithin, like, this new se
community, where I've done allthese intensive trainings, there
still are subsections of groupsof people who I will see, like,
(28:29):
at different breaks, go out tolunch together, and I'm like,
oh, at some point theycoordinated that, and I'm not
involved in that, right? Iwasn't on the text, and there's
just still this thread in mylife of like, oh, I don't
totally belong anywhere. And sothen when I am without the
intellectual or the emotionalstimulus, I think I just end up
(28:54):
sitting by myself, like watchingTV or eating a snack, taking a
nap, and I feel so lethargic,and that inertia comes in that
I'm like, Yeah, I just thinkabout people who have, like, a
place they go that makes themfeel alive. And I often feel
(29:16):
like that's this other piece ofall of this for me is like, I'm
so over excitable in all thisthat only a certain kind of
person can, like, be with me forvery long in that and I'm
finding those people, and I'mfinding those places, and it's
wonderful, but I just this otherexperience of sitting In my day
(29:38):
to day life, and feeling likeI'm just gonna fall asleep, and
thinking about the professionalspaces I've been in where I've
thought, I wonder if I havenarcolepsy, and it's co
occurring with ADHD a lot, andnow I'm like, oh, or is it
giftedness? And I'm bored, andmy brain is just like, let's
just take a nap. How about it? Imean, some. Much so that I don't
(29:59):
go to professional conferencesunless I have a hotel room in
the building, so I can leave anysession and go take a nap,
because I will feel like I'mgoing to fall asleep in the
middle of Yeah.
Unknown (30:13):
I feel Yeah. I mean, a lot of what you just said, I
want to kind of I went off on arabbit trail there. No no I
Okay. So I think this is a verycommon thing with gifted, slash
twice exceptional folks, ishaving multiple passions and
(30:36):
wanting to go intensely, deepinto each one of them, and not
really having a person or acouple of people, I mean, even
one person, who can go to allthose places with you and fill
that need. And so there's a lotof learning around how to get
that need filled. Because hereis the thing, then also being
(31:01):
twice exceptional, it's veryexhausting. So if I were to say
to somebody who's gifted, or tomy self or my kids, not every
person can meet the not oneperson can meet that need. You
need to find multiple people.
The prospect of that is verydefeating and very exhausting,
because the the idea that you'regoing to go deep with into some
(31:23):
of these different things withmultiple people, when you feel
like it, if you're an introvert,right? And kind of getting going
in and out of society. I mean, Ithink about my eldest, and how
much it is such a treasure forhim when he finds someone his
(31:47):
age, that he can go, even ifit's like different subjects,
but he can go deepintellectually with have hours
long conversations, like,especially, like another dude,
like a friend, and who he couldalso go to dinner with and have
a laugh with and go to themovies with. Like, only one or
(32:09):
two or three have come throughhis life, and they are like
water in a desert, because beingable to find that I can say
growing up. I mean, I struggledthe same thing. I had my going
out friends, and I had my nerdfriends that I would hang out
with and talk about nerd things,to find somebody in that. I
(32:31):
mean, thankfully, I have twosisters that are built in that
are like that, and I find solucky and privileged because you
just because being an introvertand also being to E my and being
middle aged woman with children,I mean, my, my resources, man,
(32:55):
they're just, you know, they're,yeah, I Gotta watch every single
one. Yeah,
Elizabeth Brink (33:01):
there's like, this pressure of like, oh, I
have an hour and a half till mynext client, and what's the
evening going to be like. Andmaybe I should just sit here and
let myself be bored and letmyself be lazy and rest. But
then it becomes this thing whereit's like, I don't have a lot of
(33:23):
other options, and I feel like,oh, maybe I'm doing that too
much. And then this reminder of,like, yeah, no, my I'm tired.
Like, I'm definitelylegitimately tired. But it's,
it's a good thing for me to becurious about, like, Are there
times when energetically, Idon't feel so sleepy, and I can
(33:43):
notice maybe, what is it like inmy body when I'm bored? Because
I don't know if I have that wellidentified for myself, of like,
what does boredom feel like?
Have a sense of it, but
Unknown (33:57):
it kind of reminds me, and I don't, y'all Forgive me,
if Elizabeth will track, butmaybe everybody, I don't know,
we'll see. But it kind ofreminds me of when I learned
about the different nervoussystem states, and when you're
in activation, learning likefreeze is very different. You
(34:21):
need connection gentle movement.
There's like a stimulation thatneeds to happen. But sometimes
it feels similar to some otherstates for me, like that are
fight, flight, just dependingon, yeah, you know, I'm saying,
like, yeah, there. There isthis, like, I don't, is now the
time that I rest? Do I need tomove my body? Do I but so I'm
(34:44):
not saying they're exactlyparallel, but there's like this
system within as far as theUnder, over stimulation. It's
like, am I bored? Am I tired? Idon't think. And I think
Elizabeth and I continue to comeback to this over and over. Or
there's no way of getting out ofthis without knowing yourself
and experimenting and askingyour body and your like checking
(35:07):
in with yourself, of like, Idon't know, and maybe I don't
have the answer, but maybe Icould try something and see if
it worked or not, until you kindof, for now, I feel like, for
me, I can, in my mind, do aquick checklist of kind of what
(35:27):
the last 2448 hours have lookedlike. And I can say to myself,
yeah, like you're bored, likeyou're bored, so let's go try
something. Right? You're notdepressed, you know, you're not
question. You're not in anexistential crisis right now.
You're bored. Just go trysomething to see if it works.
(35:48):
And yeah, I'll be like, Oh man,I feel so much better, or
whatever.
Elizabeth Brink (35:54):
Oh my gosh. It makes me think of yesterday, one
of the kids, at the end of theday, I had made some soup, and I
wanted the kids to take ourneighbor some soup, and we
generally all really enjoydelivering meals next door, but
there was like a foot of snow onthe ground, and the kids had not
really been out in it, and Ifound it kind of strange,
(36:15):
because especially the olderone, like, loves being in the
snow. And so I just asked, like,would anybody be willing to put
their gear on and go take thissoup next door? And there was a
hesitation. I said, you don'thave to. You can tell me no. I
was like, No, I don't want to. Iwas like, that's fine. And then
10 minutes later, that same kidwas like, Okay, I'm gonna do it.
(36:38):
I'm gonna take the soup nextdoor. And I was like, Okay,
great. So I'm getting the soupready. The kid's getting dressed
up, and goes out and goes on tothe side porch of our next door
neighbors, and I'm watching outthe window because it's freezing
out, it's dark, whatever, makingsure she doesn't stand there for
too long. And as the handoffhappens, kiddo turns around and
(37:00):
looks at me and is like, Can Iplay? It was like, just needed
to get in motion and then getinto the environment. And then
the other one got geared up andwent out too. And it was like,
so good. Like, bedtime went sowell. They it was really good
for their little bodies. Theythey love. I was only out there
(37:21):
15 minutes because it's so cold.
But that idea of like it doesremind
Unknown (37:26):
me that a lot of people don't they, they're not aware of
when they're bored orunderstimulated. Yeah, it can
feel like something else. Andlisten, we're all guilty of
this, you know, I don't we sayto our kids, I don't want to
hear that you're bored, youknow. And like, they hear that
at school from their teachers.
So sometimes there's not, like,total safety and freedom saying
that you're bored or whatever.
(37:49):
But I think for a lot of thesekids, especially, you know, with
like, interception differencesand like, just all the different
things that are happening ornot, having their bodies like
they, you know, they just don'tfeel good
Elizabeth Brink (38:01):
well. And adults, I mean, it's also not
socially acceptable as an adultto
Unknown (38:06):
just be like, I'm bored. Go to your boss and be
like, I'm so bored. I cannotwith this.
Elizabeth Brink (38:11):
Cannot with this. Cannot with this. Yeah,
your boss would be like, What
Unknown (38:16):
can I make the presentation into? Like a dance
sequence? It would
Elizabeth Brink (38:19):
be so risky, right? It would just be so
risky. Yeah, I think this ishelpful. I'm just noticing we've
been talking for a while, butI'm going to keep thinking about
this, because I think thatthere's something here for me to
be a little more in tune withfor myself, and encouraging
others around me to really becurious about, like, I don't
(38:42):
know, being a little bit nicerto ourselves when we're bored.
Like, is it boredom? And if itis, can I be gentle and kind and
curious about, like, what mighthelp me move through that state,
versus I'm bored? Like, who'sbored? You're not bored. You're
tired. Take a nap. It's like,what if I need some kind of
(39:05):
stimulation, right now? Whatwould that look like? Well,
yeah.
Unknown (39:08):
And Okay, one more thing, let me say this too,
because it also reminds me of,you know, parents will say, Get
off your devices. You need to bebored. And you'll hear experts
say, let your kids be bored, orthey won't use their
imaginations. They won't dothese different things. And I
don't think that's enough. Ithink we they need a little
guidance. They need a littleguidance of like, okay, it's not
(39:30):
just about and I'm not talkingabout every kid, but our
neurodivergent kiddos. I mean,some of them, you know myself,
but I mean, I've got one whowill always find something to
do. I've got one that wouldn'tnecessarily things. Only one or
two things might occur, andthose probably wouldn't be as
(39:52):
satisfying. And so, you know,yeah, let them be bored, and I'm
not talking about entertainingthem. But, like, I. I really
feel like my therapist said thisto be a long time ago, those
first couple of interactionswhere you have to really parent
them, and it takes a minute, butthen they catch on, and then
they know how to do it, orwhatever. I feel like you know
(40:14):
that could be one of thoseexperiments that not give them
ideas, but like, what would askthem a couple pointed questions,
like, what would feel good to doright now? Like, what, what do
you feel like you need? And justlet them try to figure it out.
But not just say, Get off yourdevice. And, you know, whatever,
I don't know. I mean, I
Elizabeth Brink (40:35):
think too, like the environment piece, like,
when my kid was outside lastnight, it was like, Oh, wait, I
like this. I want to be herelonger. I want to do this thing.
And I think about that inertiapuzzle out and going, or when I
was doing diamond art over thebreak, yeah, like, if that's
out, I'm much more likely to,like, put a podcast in and go
(40:57):
sit at that puzzle or thatthing, which is pretty
satisfying. And we
Unknown (41:02):
do forget, like, what we really enjoy. Sometimes
clients will sit there andthey'll brainstorm on a piece of
paper so they can visually see.
These are things that reallylight me up, and I really enjoy,
because when they're in that,they can't think of anything,
you know, and nothing soundsgood. And nothing sounds good,
yeah, okay. And then thenwe get into the whole like,
motivation thing, which we knowusually follows action, so, you
(41:23):
know, which could be a wholeother podcast, but I feel like,
you know, yeah, I don't know,yeah. It's like, it's okay
Elizabeth Brink (41:34):
to feel bored.
And also, if you're having anexperience where you're feeling
it a lot, and you would like tobe using that time in a way that
isn't just sitting and thinking,I guess I'm bored, which is what
I think about somebody
Unknown (41:48):
who needs to move, and you're sitting at a desk all
day, and maybe all you need todo is get up and shut your
blinds and do a little dance, ordo some Jumping jacks, or go to
the bathroom. And it's
Elizabeth Brink (42:02):
just helpful for me to think in terms of
boredom versus like, Oh, my bodyneeds me to move or, oh, I need
even food sometimes.
Unknown (42:12):
But if you are gifted physically psycho mode, I mean,
that's what I'm trying to mean.
I'm not talking about, like, youknow, moving your body because
it's healthy or whatever. I'mtalking about, like, because of
that. And you need the stimulus.
You need that stimulus, yeah,yeah, yeah, okay, we gotta go. I
(42:34):
mean, it's been an hour. No, ithas not, has it? Okay? No, um,
okay, almost.
Do we need this for on the wayout? I don't think
we need that. Next time I willbring the instrument.
Okay, listen, none of usremembered. I ran in and got
this out of my kid's room, and Iwas we first started to do it, I
(42:55):
suppose playing it with my lefthand instead of my right. I'm
right handed, so it was
Elizabeth Brink (42:59):
very I mean, all these reasons for all these
reasons, our intro music issubpar, yeah, I apologize. Okay,
all right, this was reallyhelpful. Thank you Sure.
Unknown (43:09):
I love you. Love you too. Bye. Have a good rest your
day. You too, bye, bye.
Hello, hello.
Elizabeth Brink (00:08):
We're the sleepy sisters. I'm Elizabeth
Brink and I'm Sarah Durham. Wewere given some show notes about
needing an intro, because Iguess there's a long pause, and
some of you are brothers, arefeeling a little like, what's
going on? It's too quiet inhere,
Unknown (00:29):
so well, they don't know when it starts. And so when
we just say, hey, hey, it'slike, oh, it's not a commercial.
Like, what's happening if you'replaying podcasts in a row. So So
we brought musical instrumentand we're just going to
experiment with it's
Elizabeth Brink (00:45):
like we're just in the room lurking behind them.
We're like, hey, yeah, what'sgoing on? Oh, okay, so I want to
talk today about kind of theflip side of what we talked
about in the last episode. So ifyou haven't listened to the
episode on over excit abilities,please go listen to it, even if
it doesn't sound like somethingthat would resonate with you.
(01:11):
Some of what we talk about todaywill make sense in that context,
but also some of that mightresonate with you, even if you
don't think it will, you canfast forward through the first
few minutes because we just talkabout end of year stuff, but I
found it super helpful. I feltlike I understood myself a lot
more after that conversation andand my kids, and then now it's
(01:35):
got me really thinking about theflip side of over excitability
and that idea of being understimulated?
Unknown (01:42):
Yes, so gifted folks tend to struggle with both over
stimulation via over excitabilities and also under
stimulation. There's actually aterm called you'll get a kick
out of this bore out.
(02:04):
I feel that. Okay, soit's not burnout. We all kind of
pretty much know what burnoutis, right? That chronic stress
of being over stimulated, rundown and all of that. Well, in
terms of giftedness, there canbe this thing called bore out.
Do you want to know more bore?
Like, B, O, R, E, boredom. Bore.
Yeah. Not like a bore, but yeah,like, yeah, right. Bore out.
(02:29):
Yeah. I want to hear thatbecause,
Elizabeth Brink (02:33):
like, here's the thing, I have had so many
changes in the last few years inmy body because of menopause and
I have just this last likecouple weeks since we had that
conversation, started thinking,Oh, is this part of the fatigue
that I'm experiencing? Because Idid have a cold in December,
(02:55):
which I guess everyone in theentire country has this, like
weird cold illness, and I hadsome version of it in December,
and I just it's like one weekafter another, just kind of like
explaining my fatigue by, oh,I'm really tired. Oh, maybe this
is just life now, and I'll haveall these ideas in my head of,
(03:15):
like, things I want to get done,things I want to do around the
house, and I will feel generallyenergetic in my mind's eye when
thinking about these things. Butthen when the next day comes,
like, and I have an overwhelminglife with work and kids and all
this stuff, for sure, but like,I experience inertia in a way
(03:37):
that this piece has started tomake me wonder. Like, I wonder
if there are times when I amfeeling that, like I can't want
to, like there's no want in me,if there is this element of my
over excitability,
Unknown (03:55):
being, you know, under stimulated. And that's what got
me really curious about this islike, is there a purpose to
understand? Let's notnecessarily just for the
audience purposes. Let's not tieover excitability necessarily to
the under stimulation. Let's,let's, let's tie it to
giftedness,okay, I guess just the intensity
(04:15):
of it feels, right?
So, yeah, intensity, right? Solet's say intellectual
giftedness, emotionalgiftedness, whatever you do,
because they're passions, andthey are the gifted part where
you're processing and able tomake pattern connection. And
there is this wherever you'regifted, or multiple areas,
(04:36):
right? You are drawn towardsthat kind of content and things
like that. So and you need, youneed stimulation in those areas,
right? And then, of course, youhave the over excit abilities,
which can, you can have multipleof those, and they can overlap,
(04:59):
and all of that. A lot of timesI do see them tied to to that,
like, if your intellectuallygiftedness gifted, then having
an intellectual overexcitability is definitely a
possibility. But they're notnecessarily the same. So
Elizabeth Brink (05:14):
can you, like, give me an example? Like, what
would that what's an example ofbecause these are, like, really
big words that can be kind ofjargony. So tell me, like, the
an example of and it doesn't itcan be made up of somebody who
has, like, an intellectualgiftedness and an intellectual
over excitability. What? Whatmight an experience be like for
(05:38):
them?
Unknown (05:39):
Okay, so my eldest intellectually gifted, and I
he's not going to care that Italk about this. This is like
nothing like super personal. Butas far as his need to be
intellectually stimulatedbecause of that giftedness, he's
(06:03):
always been prone to read a lotof books in a lot of different
areas over a lot of differentlike, I mean, loves, literature,
poetry, history, philosophy,where it might be going into
like an over excitability is ifhe's reading and that he's
(06:25):
tuning everything out andanything anyone else wants to
talk about, because he has allof these things that he wants to
talk about and process about,this information that he's
taking in, and that's the overexcitability, yeah, like,
where it's, like, it's, it's,I'm kind of derailed, and I'm
(06:46):
got tunnel vision outside ofanything else, because I've been
hijacked by my intellectualpursuit. Because
it's exciting, I'm excited. It'sexciting, it's
exciting, and whatever. Okay, sothen, but at the same time,
because he's intellectuallygifted, he does need a lot of
(07:07):
stimulus in that area. So he,you know, has always been
someone who would go to schoolnot get that stimulation,
because a lot of what publiceducation offers is not really
that interesting, and it's kindof boring. And so he'd have side
(07:28):
projects at home, side pursuitsat home. I mean, he was telling
me who Bernie Sanders was whenhe was like, sixth grade, you
know, that kind of a thing. Sothey need all that they need
that stimuli. They need accessto that, not necessarily what I
(07:50):
define as intellectualstimulation, but what he's
interested in. I mean, I couldsay, oh, well, here read about
this, or go do something inthis. But they have all have
their own flavor, too. I'mhearing
you say it's a need, it's aneed. It's, it's a social
emotional need. It's a neuralneed. It's, it's absolutely why
gifted education exists and whyit's something that is required.
(08:14):
There's a social emotionalcomponent to giftedness, and
then there's also thisintellectual in academic, or
whatever it may be, I'm going touse Academic because schools
don't often offer other types oflike ways to stimulate,
stimulate, offer stimulation oror, you know, around the arts
(08:38):
and stuff like that, just kindof depends on where they go to
school, but that's the generalkind of understanding
Elizabeth Brink (08:47):
of it. So then what happens to a kid that
doesn't get that at school anddoesn't have side quests at home
and is just like generally, notable to get that need for
intellectual stimulant, stim,
Unknown (09:04):
simulation. Why are you jumping around this word? I
don't know, intellectual
Elizabeth Brink (09:07):
stimulation.
They're like. It's like, in lowsupply in any area of their
life, then
Unknown (09:13):
or not the right supply, right? There might not
be enough, or it might not, orit might be. They're able to
read, but they don't have anypeers to talk out things and
ideas with, because then theyalso have their own processing,
you know, modalities and thesedifferent things that just make
them uniquely them. Well, thatchronic under stimulation that
(09:36):
bore out, right? It can look alot like depression and anxiety
and so, you know, when my eldestdoes not have enough of that, I
mean ruminating, you know, yourbody will take over and start
stimulating in ways that itneeds, even if it's not good. So
(10:00):
self sabotaging behaviors,things like that. So when we're
talking about, you know, giftedEd and people getting their
needs met in school, it's whyunderstanding what that means is
so important for educators.
Because it's not more, it's notgiving a kid more, it's giving
them different. It's givingthat. It's them giving them the
(10:22):
space to know who they are,understand what they're like,
unique print is, and thenoffering space autonomy,
novelty, different things forthem to explore that part of
themselves. And but a lot ofpeople will misunderstand that,
and they'll just get a lot ofextra work, which is boring,
(10:44):
which just contributes to thatunder stimulation. It can also
look like, you know, someonelike an adult who's going to
work and like this, bore outthis chronic understimulation of
just just not being satisfied. Imean, I have an audience
flashing. It's like you want todo everything, but that you're
(11:06):
looking for everything in yourroom. So some people might call
that ADHD, but this could begiftedness bore out, or, you
know, being understimulated Whenyou are doing some kind of rote.
You know, task every day thatyou have to show up and do, and
it's like death, having beinggifted person and being bored.
(11:29):
It hits different it's painful.
I mean, talk about not wantingto do your work.
Elizabeth Brink (11:39):
It's so confusing, too. I mean, yes, I
am having so many flashes tojobs I've had where I have and
clients, even who have expressedthis where, like, I have not
been able to explain why I havenot been able to do anything
like, literally do my job, andit'll be like the job I've I
(11:59):
vied for and I got and then atsome point, there'll be some
thing where it's like, oh, amajority of your role is going
to be you're going to collectthis, and you're going to put it
in this place, and you're goingto let people know this, and
you're going to do that on awhatever basis. And I'm like,
No, I'm not going to do it. Andand also thinking about a couple
(12:24):
of years ago how I got burnt outon social media, and I'm
wondering if I got bore out onsocial media as somebody who was
like, posting content on there,it just became, I mean, that
actually is the description. Itwas boring to me. I was like,
this is boring everybody, lotsof other people already saying
(12:45):
this stuff. And like, I don'twant to spend my energy creating
these little graphics in Canva.
And I just felt like, oh, Iguess I'm just burnt out, which
I that was part of it, because Iwas working too much. But I
think in that particular thing,it's like, anytime there's a
part of my job that requires meto do the same thing on a
regular basis, I inevitablydon't do that thing and and then
(13:10):
all this other you know,consequences and stuff happen,
and so long as there's someelement of it that's new and
different, that's novel, andthat challenges me
intellectually. I can, like,refresh. I think it's why I do
all this professionaldevelopment. You know, it's
like, Oh, something more tolearn about, to help support
(13:31):
people even better. And it makesthe work that I do. It keeps it
fresh. So meeting with clientsis something that I've not
experienced that bore out with,like the it's the only area of
my work I have not experiencedthat with, maybe ever. And I
think it's because I'm workingwith different people with
(13:52):
different stories and differentnervous systems, and I'm
learning all these differenttools and adding them in all the
time, kind of creating my own,like, self paced program, and I
hadn't thought about it in termsof boredom before. Yeah.
Unknown (14:08):
I mean, you know, I think if you were to just see
clients, you probably would getbored, but it's the fact that
you have this kind of multilayered approach to your actual
job that requires, or that yougive yourself that intellectual
stimulation, which so you havesome autonomy to do that. So
(14:31):
autonomy is really important,and the novelty so going into
the somatics and stuff like thatthat you've been able to go
into, and that's why, I thinkfor someone who is gifted or
gifted in especially in multipleareas, it's really important to
remember there's a lot of shamearound not sticking with things,
(14:52):
yeah. And I look at it as like,you know, you're evolving and
expanding, you know, right now,like you're so. Into somatics,
and you've done all thistraining, and every time you go,
I know, like, you always haveall these things that you just
love to talk about, and I knowthat it's a long time of
integrating all of that. So Iget that that's you've got a,
you know, a big piece of piethat you you got to work with
(15:15):
for a while, right? Which isgreat, but let's say, like, five
years down the road, you decideto shift into some other niche
or whatever, because maybeyou've spent five years doing a
deep dive and learning andincorporating that, and this is
where people, especially if youare the child of boomers, where
(15:38):
someone will say, why can't youjust stick to one thing? Or, why
can't you, you know, you foundthis niche, you're so good at
it, like you're so talented, weneed you to stay and it's like,
no, I need me to expand. BecauseI will never stop expanding.
It's one of the when I havetalked to people about my
(15:59):
career, especially in the lastyear or so, one thing I've just
really, really accepted aboutmyself is that I when I say I'm
a lifelong learner, like it's nojoke, you're the same way. And
so I think all of our siblingsare, yeah, um, sometimes people
(16:21):
will say that, you know, ifthey're applying for something
or talking about their, youknow, gifts or whatever, but
we're really researching. Youguys have no idea. I'm like, No,
we're actually
Elizabeth Brink (16:33):
learning the talking classes and trying new
thing. Yeah, you know, it has methinking about mom. So I I'm
not, I feel like I could go amillion places. So I'm trying to
wrangle in my thoughts a littlebit. But it makes me think a mom
and this whole idea of likebeing someone who chronically
tries new hobbies is like ahobbyist in that, you know, and
(16:57):
I've joked about it, I'vewritten about it. I've written
about it in thoughtful waysaround like, hey, I really like
learning new hobbies. I likelearning new things. I don't
necessarily want to like do thething and master
Unknown (17:11):
it. That's your hobby.
Is the learning the new thing?
Yeah. And so this is
Elizabeth Brink (17:15):
like, making that make so much sense, because
I'm like, Oh, right. That isn'tjust like an ADHD, I just got
bored and distracted. That'slike part of my giftedness is
that the learning is the funpart for me, and the researching
and filling a shopping cart andall of these things. And I also
am starting to wonder if a lotof the things in my life that
(17:38):
feel hard like housework andparenting and Business admin
stuff are, you know, they allhave this same thread of like,
they're repetitive, they'reboring, they they feel, um, I
often feel defeated by thesethings because they're just
(17:59):
never ending. And sometimes theyrequire executive functioning
that I feel like is really hardfor me, you know, the follow
through and the steps and stuff,and I'm just thinking about,
like, the early years ofparenting and trying to be at
home and work during nap times,and how that kept me barely
(18:20):
keeping my head above water,doing too much, right? This idea
of over functioning in a seasonof life that is inherently
boring, in roles that areinherently boring, and then
pushing your system to likeoverdrive, because that's the
novelty. It's just moving fastand doing a lot, right? Right?
(18:40):
Your over functioning
Unknown (18:42):
could have been your you just giving yourself enough
fuel to take care of this otherpart that was going on in your
life, not necessarily becauseyou can't sit still or you can't
be quiet, or just have juststayed home and been a stay
whatever, like it is a differentlens in which to look through
(19:05):
some of those busy seasons. Imean, and when you think about,
you know, our mom, I mean, shehad a, like, a domestic type job
that did not feel she was alsoan artist, which she didn't, she
rarely got to, like, tap into.
And she would, like, weremember, she started building
(19:25):
computers from, like, the groundup before anyone was even doing
that. She was doing that in ourhouse. We're like, what is
happening right now? And she waslike, building, you know? I
mean, it was just like, okay,whatever. We were in online chat
rooms, long before nobodyeven knew, you know, these, it
was like war games, that giantroom computer, you know, um, but
(19:47):
yeah, I mean, I think, well,yeah, the
Elizabeth Brink (19:52):
kilns, the like porcelain dolls, the embroidery
and the embroidery machine, thebaking cake,
Unknown (19:58):
yeah? Because when you think about, when you think.
Those things that you named,like the office job. I mean, you
can do those things, right?
Elizabeth Brink (20:05):
And people like, want to hire me to do
these things, yeah, and,
Unknown (20:09):
but they're not interesting to you. And so
that's maybe a barometer, or ameasure of like, is this?
Because I'm afraid to do thetask, because it's, it's too
hard, or is it hard for adifferent reason, because it's,
it's so boring, it just feelsabsolutely like death to me
(20:31):
right now. I mean, I've hadtasks like that where I'm like,
especially when I was teaching,because the only thing that got
me excited was, I mean, I workedwith a bunch of gifted kids, it
was like all of us were like atribe in a room with like each
other, just supporting eachother, expanding, throwing
around ideas. And then an adminwould come by and say, you know,
(20:54):
don't forget, you need to dothis practice test or whatever.
And we'd including me, like,what do we going to do? That so
dumb, you know, or whatever. Imean, I was right there with
them. It was just ridiculous.
And I think too, you know, justwith what I've been doing the
last like few years, I thinkI've been learning about and
(21:17):
thinking a lot more about when Ifeel down and I feel depressed,
usually, just because I haven'tcreated in a while, I haven't,
like illustrated anything orwritten anything or done
anything. You know? I mean, itcould just even be a matter of a
couple of days, yeah, honestly,if I'm just in a really busy,
(21:41):
repetitive, like situation,known, if I don't have any new
clients, and I'm just kind of ina rhythm, which is great. I love
the rhythm, but at the sametime, you know, I always kind of
need a little bit more andbalancing, of, like, not pushing
myself so far off the cliff to,like, get that need met, to
(22:05):
where I'm like, Oh man, I'mscrambling and trying to, like,
you know, put the toothpasteback in the tube, but just, you
know, enough to where I'm like,okay, so really learning that
about myself, and I also wasreminded too, with what you were
saying, it just this. Is anotherreason why being twice
exceptional is so confusing isbecause, you know, I love
(22:26):
tending paths on Instagram. Ifollow her, and she always says
something about being bored andoverwhelmed, and I feel like
that is often the experience ofa twice exceptional person is
bored and overwhelmed. It's it'strying to find the threshold of
(22:47):
like, where I'm over stimulatedand where I can find the right
stimulation for my brain.
Elizabeth Brink (22:57):
Gosh, it makes me think too. Like you use that
word rhythm, and how many peopleare like striving for a rhythm,
trying to find the rhythm. And Iwonder if it's kind of for those
of us who have this kind ofpropensity for boredom, for
(23:19):
getting bored, and whatever, ifthere is some element of like,
if you're someone who is yourwhole life been trying to find
the rhythm and pursuing like,what's the right rhythm for me,
and trying different things, youmay never find the rhythm,
because part of the stimulationof the process is trying to find
(23:40):
it like finding it would belike, the end of you. It'd be
like, Oh, even though, like,some of the things about having
a rhythm feel like, what otherpeople have that makes their
life easier, it's like, oh, theyhave this rhythm. They have this
way of doing things. Their lifemust be a little less stressful,
because some things are onautopilot, yeah, but I just
(24:03):
wonder if, like, there's somethread of the areas that we're
feeling unsatisfied with andlike, we're always tinkering
with and trying to, like, findjust the right way to do these
things, if those are just thethings our brain's using to to
give us this like outlet forintellectual curiosity, and
(24:26):
yeah, it's
Unknown (24:27):
what it's another case for really knowing yourself,
because finding what satisfieswhat you need based on Your own
gifts and your own you know,personality is crucial, because,
you know, if you're stuck in theshoulds and you're looking
(24:50):
around at society and the 10,you know, socially acceptable
hobbies or or side pursuits orcuriosities, and. Yours is some
random, strange, whatever, andyou don't want to tap into that
because you think it's tooweird, or whatever it's like.
Well, you're trying to meet aneed based on somebody else's
(25:15):
worldview, and you really needto know and experiment and
understand what like, even withyou your curiosity. Like, if
someone were saying, like, whatare you most curious about?
You're most curious about theworld. And like, curiosity. I
mean, there's no well this year.
So when someone asked, like,what are you into? You're like,
(25:40):
well, I don't know. For the lastmonth I've been doing a deep
dive and blah, blah, blah, mysisters and I've been talking
about this. It's like, but itcould be something totally
different the next week or inthree months. Yeah, it's
Elizabeth Brink (25:53):
not going to be like, an identifier, you know,
when some people and they'relike, Oh, I like D and D, or I,
you know, I love puzzles orwhatever, like they, they have a
thing, and they might be able touse it as, like an affinity
identifier. And for me, it'slike knowledge. And I don't, I
don't know if there is some,like, invisible thread for me
(26:15):
over the course of years, thatthese things kind of, they do
kind of link up, but it's sounique to me and to my
circumstances and my our familyhistory and stuff that like,
it's not one that I would mapout and suggest anyone else try
to follow like it's just, Iwould say
Unknown (26:35):
that it's emotional, emotionally gifted, And I would
say you have an emotional overexcitability as well. And that
the thread, I'm just going tosay this, I think the thread is
around that it's aroundconnection, and you find meaning
(26:57):
in the connection, in the dots,in the pattern, because we're
very similar that way. Yeah, welike seeing the the things and
how they're interconnected, andalso interpersonal connection. I
mean, there's, there's aconnective tissue, yeah,
Elizabeth Brink (27:19):
and that makes me think, like it a lot of that
ties back to my trauma, youknow, like just attachment
wounds of where are the grownups, and how do I make sure I
get what I need? But also, Wheredo I belong? Like, that's been
(27:40):
like my lifelong inner questionis, like, Where do I belong? And
maybe not even, Where do Ibelong, but like, more of a
statement of like, oh, I don'tbelong here, oh, I don't belong
here, like, I don't belonganywhere, because I have so many
different interests and so manydifferent kinds of people and
places that I like to be in.
I've never had belonging in astrange sense, other than to my
(28:05):
family, you guys, you know, andCorey and the kids, it's like
that's a different kind ofbelonging. But socially, I
don't, I don't know if I've everhad a period of time where I
have felt like I belonged, evenwithin, like, this new se
community, where I've done allthese intensive trainings, there
still are subsections of groupsof people who I will see, like,
(28:29):
at different breaks, go out tolunch together, and I'm like,
oh, at some point theycoordinated that, and I'm not
involved in that, right? Iwasn't on the text, and there's
just still this thread in mylife of like, oh, I don't
totally belong anywhere. And sothen when I am without the
intellectual or the emotionalstimulus, I think I just end up
(28:54):
sitting by myself, like watchingTV or eating a snack, taking a
nap, and I feel so lethargic,and that inertia comes in that
I'm like, Yeah, I just thinkabout people who have, like, a
place they go that makes themfeel alive. And I often feel
(29:16):
like that's this other piece ofall of this for me is like, I'm
so over excitable in all thisthat only a certain kind of
person can, like, be with me forvery long in that and I'm
finding those people, and I'mfinding those places, and it's
wonderful, but I just this otherexperience of sitting In my day
(29:38):
to day life, and feeling likeI'm just gonna fall asleep, and
thinking about the professionalspaces I've been in where I've
thought, I wonder if I havenarcolepsy, and it's co
occurring with ADHD a lot, andnow I'm like, oh, or is it
giftedness? And I'm bored, andmy brain is just like, let's
just take a nap. How about it? Imean, some. Much so that I don't
(29:59):
go to professional conferencesunless I have a hotel room in
the building, so I can leave anysession and go take a nap,
because I will feel like I'mgoing to fall asleep in the
middle of Yeah.
Unknown (30:13):
I feel Yeah. I mean, a lot of what you just said, I
want to kind of I went off on arabbit trail there. No no I
Okay. So I think this is a verycommon thing with gifted, slash
twice exceptional folks, ishaving multiple passions and
(30:36):
wanting to go intensely, deepinto each one of them, and not
really having a person or acouple of people, I mean, even
one person, who can go to allthose places with you and fill
that need. And so there's a lotof learning around how to get
that need filled. Because hereis the thing, then also being
(31:01):
twice exceptional, it's veryexhausting. So if I were to say
to somebody who's gifted, or tomy self or my kids, not every
person can meet the not oneperson can meet that need. You
need to find multiple people.
The prospect of that is verydefeating and very exhausting,
because the the idea that you'regoing to go deep with into some
(31:23):
of these different things withmultiple people, when you feel
like it, if you're an introvert,right? And kind of getting going
in and out of society. I mean, Ithink about my eldest, and how
much it is such a treasure forhim when he finds someone his
(31:47):
age, that he can go, even ifit's like different subjects,
but he can go deepintellectually with have hours
long conversations, like,especially, like another dude,
like a friend, and who he couldalso go to dinner with and have
a laugh with and go to themovies with. Like, only one or
(32:09):
two or three have come throughhis life, and they are like
water in a desert, because beingable to find that I can say
growing up. I mean, I struggledthe same thing. I had my going
out friends, and I had my nerdfriends that I would hang out
with and talk about nerd things,to find somebody in that. I
(32:31):
mean, thankfully, I have twosisters that are built in that
are like that, and I find solucky and privileged because you
just because being an introvertand also being to E my and being
middle aged woman with children,I mean, my, my resources, man,
(32:55):
they're just, you know, they're,yeah, I Gotta watch every single
one. Yeah,
Elizabeth Brink (33:01):
there's like, this pressure of like, oh, I
have an hour and a half till mynext client, and what's the
evening going to be like. Andmaybe I should just sit here and
let myself be bored and letmyself be lazy and rest. But
then it becomes this thing whereit's like, I don't have a lot of
(33:23):
other options, and I feel like,oh, maybe I'm doing that too
much. And then this reminder of,like, yeah, no, my I'm tired.
Like, I'm definitelylegitimately tired. But it's,
it's a good thing for me to becurious about, like, Are there
times when energetically, Idon't feel so sleepy, and I can
(33:43):
notice maybe, what is it like inmy body when I'm bored? Because
I don't know if I have that wellidentified for myself, of like,
what does boredom feel like?
Have a sense of it, but
Unknown (33:57):
it kind of reminds me, and I don't, y'all Forgive me,
if Elizabeth will track, butmaybe everybody, I don't know,
we'll see. But it kind ofreminds me of when I learned
about the different nervoussystem states, and when you're
in activation, learning likefreeze is very different. You
(34:21):
need connection gentle movement.
There's like a stimulation thatneeds to happen. But sometimes
it feels similar to some otherstates for me, like that are
fight, flight, just dependingon, yeah, you know, I'm saying,
like, yeah, there. There isthis, like, I don't, is now the
time that I rest? Do I need tomove my body? Do I but so I'm
(34:44):
not saying they're exactlyparallel, but there's like this
system within as far as theUnder, over stimulation. It's
like, am I bored? Am I tired? Idon't think. And I think
Elizabeth and I continue to comeback to this over and over. Or
there's no way of getting out ofthis without knowing yourself
and experimenting and askingyour body and your like checking
(35:07):
in with yourself, of like, Idon't know, and maybe I don't
have the answer, but maybe Icould try something and see if
it worked or not, until you kindof, for now, I feel like, for
me, I can, in my mind, do aquick checklist of kind of what
(35:27):
the last 2448 hours have lookedlike. And I can say to myself,
yeah, like you're bored, likeyou're bored, so let's go try
something. Right? You're notdepressed, you know, you're not
question. You're not in anexistential crisis right now.
You're bored. Just go trysomething to see if it works.
(35:48):
And yeah, I'll be like, Oh man,I feel so much better, or
whatever.
Elizabeth Brink (35:54):
Oh my gosh. It makes me think of yesterday, one
of the kids, at the end of theday, I had made some soup, and I
wanted the kids to take ourneighbor some soup, and we
generally all really enjoydelivering meals next door, but
there was like a foot of snow onthe ground, and the kids had not
really been out in it, and Ifound it kind of strange,
(36:15):
because especially the olderone, like, loves being in the
snow. And so I just asked, like,would anybody be willing to put
their gear on and go take thissoup next door? And there was a
hesitation. I said, you don'thave to. You can tell me no. I
was like, No, I don't want to. Iwas like, that's fine. And then
10 minutes later, that same kidwas like, Okay, I'm gonna do it.
(36:38):
I'm gonna take the soup nextdoor. And I was like, Okay,
great. So I'm getting the soupready. The kid's getting dressed
up, and goes out and goes on tothe side porch of our next door
neighbors, and I'm watching outthe window because it's freezing
out, it's dark, whatever, makingsure she doesn't stand there for
too long. And as the handoffhappens, kiddo turns around and
(37:00):
looks at me and is like, Can Iplay? It was like, just needed
to get in motion and then getinto the environment. And then
the other one got geared up andwent out too. And it was like,
so good. Like, bedtime went sowell. They it was really good
for their little bodies. Theythey love. I was only out there
(37:21):
15 minutes because it's so cold.
But that idea of like it doesremind
Unknown (37:26):
me that a lot of people don't they, they're not aware of
when they're bored orunderstimulated. Yeah, it can
feel like something else. Andlisten, we're all guilty of
this, you know, I don't we sayto our kids, I don't want to
hear that you're bored, youknow. And like, they hear that
at school from their teachers.
So sometimes there's not, like,total safety and freedom saying
that you're bored or whatever.
(37:49):
But I think for a lot of thesekids, especially, you know, with
like, interception differencesand like, just all the different
things that are happening ornot, having their bodies like
they, you know, they just don'tfeel good
Elizabeth Brink (38:01):
well. And adults, I mean, it's also not
socially acceptable as an adultto
Unknown (38:06):
just be like, I'm bored. Go to your boss and be
like, I'm so bored. I cannotwith this.
Elizabeth Brink (38:11):
Cannot with this. Cannot with this. Yeah,
your boss would be like, What
Unknown (38:16):
can I make the presentation into? Like a dance
sequence? It would
Elizabeth Brink (38:19):
be so risky, right? It would just be so
risky. Yeah, I think this ishelpful. I'm just noticing we've
been talking for a while, butI'm going to keep thinking about
this, because I think thatthere's something here for me to
be a little more in tune withfor myself, and encouraging
others around me to really becurious about, like, I don't
(38:42):
know, being a little bit nicerto ourselves when we're bored.
Like, is it boredom? And if itis, can I be gentle and kind and
curious about, like, what mighthelp me move through that state,
versus I'm bored? Like, who'sbored? You're not bored. You're
tired. Take a nap. It's like,what if I need some kind of
(39:05):
stimulation, right now? Whatwould that look like? Well,
yeah.
Unknown (39:08):
And Okay, one more thing, let me say this too,
because it also reminds me of,you know, parents will say, Get
off your devices. You need to bebored. And you'll hear experts
say, let your kids be bored, orthey won't use their
imaginations. They won't dothese different things. And I
don't think that's enough. Ithink we they need a little
guidance. They need a littleguidance of like, okay, it's not
(39:30):
just about and I'm not talkingabout every kid, but our
neurodivergent kiddos. I mean,some of them, you know myself,
but I mean, I've got one whowill always find something to
do. I've got one that wouldn'tnecessarily things. Only one or
two things might occur, andthose probably wouldn't be as
(39:52):
satisfying. And so, you know,yeah, let them be bored, and I'm
not talking about entertainingthem. But, like, I. I really
feel like my therapist said thisto be a long time ago, those
first couple of interactionswhere you have to really parent
them, and it takes a minute, butthen they catch on, and then
they know how to do it, orwhatever. I feel like you know
(40:14):
that could be one of thoseexperiments that not give them
ideas, but like, what would askthem a couple pointed questions,
like, what would feel good to doright now? Like, what, what do
you feel like you need? And justlet them try to figure it out.
But not just say, Get off yourdevice. And, you know, whatever,
I don't know. I mean, I
Elizabeth Brink (40:35):
think too, like the environment piece, like,
when my kid was outside lastnight, it was like, Oh, wait, I
like this. I want to be herelonger. I want to do this thing.
And I think about that inertiapuzzle out and going, or when I
was doing diamond art over thebreak, yeah, like, if that's
out, I'm much more likely to,like, put a podcast in and go
(40:57):
sit at that puzzle or thatthing, which is pretty
satisfying. And we
Unknown (41:02):
do forget, like, what we really enjoy. Sometimes
clients will sit there andthey'll brainstorm on a piece of
paper so they can visually see.
These are things that reallylight me up, and I really enjoy,
because when they're in that,they can't think of anything,
you know, and nothing soundsgood. And nothing sounds good,
yeah, okay. And then thenwe get into the whole like,
motivation thing, which we knowusually follows action, so, you
(41:23):
know, which could be a wholeother podcast, but I feel like,
you know, yeah, I don't know,yeah. It's like, it's okay
Elizabeth Brink (41:34):
to feel bored.
And also, if you're having anexperience where you're feeling
it a lot, and you would like tobe using that time in a way that
isn't just sitting and thinking,I guess I'm bored, which is what
I think about somebody
Unknown (41:48):
who needs to move, and you're sitting at a desk all
day, and maybe all you need todo is get up and shut your
blinds and do a little dance, ordo some Jumping jacks, or go to
the bathroom. And it's
Elizabeth Brink (42:02):
just helpful for me to think in terms of
boredom versus like, Oh, my bodyneeds me to move or, oh, I need
even food sometimes.
Unknown (42:12):
But if you are gifted physically psycho mode, I mean,
that's what I'm trying to mean.
I'm not talking about, like, youknow, moving your body because
it's healthy or whatever. I'mtalking about, like, because of
that. And you need the stimulus.
You need that stimulus, yeah,yeah, yeah, okay, we gotta go. I
(42:34):
mean, it's been an hour. No, ithas not, has it? Okay? No, um,
okay, almost.
Do we need this for on the wayout? I don't think
we need that. Next time I willbring the instrument.
Okay, listen, none of usremembered. I ran in and got
this out of my kid's room, and Iwas we first started to do it, I
(42:55):
suppose playing it with my lefthand instead of my right. I'm
right handed, so it was
Elizabeth Brink (42:59):
very I mean, all these reasons for all these
reasons, our intro music issubpar, yeah, I apologize. Okay,
all right, this was reallyhelpful. Thank you Sure.
Unknown (43:09):
I love you. Love you too. Bye. Have a good rest your
day. You too, bye, bye.
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