March 28, 2023 • 34 mins
Frederike Harms, founder of Katalyst Ventures, joins the show this week to dive into how to design a truly scalable offer. Growing up with entrepreneur parents, Frederike remembers that her family went on vacation once and only once. Her parents simply could not step back from their business to enjoy extra time with their family.
Having a front-row seat to that type of schedule and lifestyle, she decided she wanted to work with entrepreneurs, founders, and business owners to create scalable businesses that didn't solely depend upon their daily direction to thrive.
At the core of a scalable business is a scalable service or product. Listen in to learn tactics behind this strategy to leverage a scalable offer and grow a business beyond your own expertise, one that allows you to live a full life not chained to your phone or laptop.
Connect with Frederike on Instagram.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Erin Geiger (00:02):
Welcome to the Small Business Big mindset
podcast, where we dive intotactical strategies to grow your
business. And to make an impacton this world. A huge part of
success is keeping your mindsetand vision on track. So this is
a major part of our process. Andthis podcast, let's do this.
(00:25):
Welcome to the Small BusinessBig mindset podcast this week,
we have Freddie harmes, founderof catalyst ventures, Freddie,
oh, my gosh, thank you so somuch for taking the time to chat
with us and be on the showtoday.
Unknown (00:38):
Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be
speaking with you.
Erin Geiger (00:41):
Very, very cool.
Listeners, before we started, Iwas like making a Friday talk to
me all about Europe, because Iwant to plan a trip there. You
know. So as you know, I'm in theStates. And I'm just like, I
cannot wait to go just live outwas one of the things I love
about doing this podcast is thatI get to meet people from all
over the globe. So I'm soexcited to hear on Friday, what
you have to say as far as yourbusiness go. So let's dive in.
(01:04):
Tell us a little bit aboutyourself, your background and
how you got started and came tobe where you are today.
Unknown (01:13):
Sure. So I started my career as a business process
consultant. Very, very boring.
Very German, we love a process,don't we? So So yeah, so I'm
German. I live in the UK. Now. Istarted my career as a business
process consulting, who thenwent into project management and
change management, I did a lotof integrations after
(01:35):
acquisition, like the bigcorporate stuff. And while I did
love doing that, I, I also havea heritage of a small business
owner. My parents basically havetheir own business, my
grandparents have their ownbusiness, we have a family
business that's been in ourfamily since 1898. So that is
(01:58):
always a big, that's myheritage. And that's in the back
of my mind. And as soon as Ikind of started dipping my toe,
into the kind of business world,the entrepreneurial world, I saw
something that I recognized frommy upbringing, which was that we
(02:18):
started our business. Because wedo something and we feel really,
really passionate aboutsomething and we want to create
a better life, we want to betterwork life balance. And we we end
up working more days than weever did in corporate, and the
longer hours, but now we don'thave any benefits to go with it
and no regular income. So. Sothis kind of then kind of
(02:42):
brought me to the place where Iwanted to work with
entrepreneurs, founders andbusiness owners to, to create
businesses that are scalable,beyond themselves, so that they
can take the time off. And oneexample I just want to mention,
my parents and I, we went onholiday and my whole life, we
(03:04):
went on holiday once. Becausewe, they they couldn't remove
themselves from the business.
And they literally had to shutit. And we went for a holiday, a
one week holiday was in my life.
And that's not what I want forothers. And you know, I did a
lot of traveling myself, I'vemade up for it. But yeah, I
(03:26):
think I think that that's notwhat we set out to do when we
start our investors. So hence,yeah, May I now help founders
create scalable businesses. Andat the core of that is a
scalable service, or product,even product in the sense that
(03:49):
is something very defined, thatdoesn't, I'm not ecommerce
expert or anything like that,but to make sure they can grow a
business beyond themselves, andit doesn't break because they
leave their phone at home oneday.
Erin Geiger (04:10):
Now, that's actually such important work,
because a lot of us go fromexactly that, that corporate
life to entrepreneurship, orsometimes you straddle both,
right? And then you thinkentrepreneurship is this, you
know, amazing, beautiful, shinything, and all my dreams are
gonna come true. And I'm goingto set my own hours and be my
(04:31):
own boss and everything right?
And then you start taking onclients, and you're like, huh, I
have 10 bosses now, instead ofthe one. And they're dictating
my schedule, and you know, so Ithink people don't, they kind of
like take what they've learnedwas kind of ingrained in their
head of like, how working worksand they just take that and they
(04:55):
bring it on over toentrepreneurship and gotta try
to like shove it in They'rebecause that's all that they
know. So I love that you dothis. So explain to us, you
know, cuz I know that you do iton like, an offer basis too,
right? So like, how do you takewhat they're offering and what
their focus is? Because that'sthe first step, right focus,
(05:15):
like figure it out, because Iknow when I first started, I was
like, I could do all these amillion things. So I'm gonna
offer them all you know, it'slike, what are you doing? And so
it's focusing, right? So tell usa little bit about that.
Unknown (05:27):
And it's natural, because we when we set out, and
we take that leap, and you know,as you say, some of us and I'm,
I'm one of those that straddleboth worlds, because I couldn't
afford to take the leap. Butyeah, we we say yes to
everything, because we need theincome. It's not that we want to
(05:50):
do everything necessarily, butwe need the income, we need to
pay our mortgage. And, and wefeel nervous about what's down
the line. So it's a very naturalprocess to go from, right. I
can, yes, I can do that. Yes, Ican do that. Yes, I can do that
too, too, then focusing in on,like, taking the time out to
(06:12):
look back and say actually,what, what create what brought
the best client results? Whatdid I enjoy the most? And what
do I want to take forward? So Idon't have to say yes, to every
client and to every project andto every piece of work. And
it's, it's, I guess one is, it'sscary taking that time out.
(06:33):
Because we're used to now we'reon that hamster wheel, we were
finally things are going great,we're really busy. It's scary to
then say, actually, I'm gonnastop what I'm doing, and take a
more strategic view. Because wemay miss an opportunity, or we
may have to say no to a clientto free up that time. And it's
(06:56):
what I found when speaking to myclients, it's almost impossible
to do on your own. And that'sthe problem of being a
solopreneur. Having a smallbusiness. And being the leader
of that business. You you needto invest externally, whether
that is whether that is workingwith a coach or consultant, like
(07:16):
myself, but as a minimum, youneed to join a mastermind or a
group setting where you can findthat sounding board, etc.
Because in our heads, it'simpossible to do it in a vacuum,
and then go out and say, Oh,this is it. Because because
(07:37):
we're so held back by what wasin the past and what we what we
know so well. And it sometimestakes someone to challenge us to
say, actually, is that what youwant to do going forward?
Because he, you said you don'tenjoy it. And just because it
has the biggest profit, youknow, there's so many levers you
can pull to make something elsework. So that you need that kind
(08:00):
of that external input andsounding voice, etc.
Erin Geiger (08:05):
Like, we don't know what we don't know, you know,
and so, like you were saying, ifyou're kind of siloed away, and
you're just going off of like,your personal knowledge and your
personal experience, I mean,sure, that can get you so far.
But you do need to exposeyourself to other ways of
thinking and other ways of, ofdoing things for sure. And so,
once you've kind of like, okay,this is what I'm going to focus
(08:28):
on. How do you counsel peopleafter that, once they know this
is where I'm going, this is thedirection I'm heading, then
what?
Unknown (08:38):
I think it's, it's then working with them. So one, I
helped them find what is theirzone of genius, what is their
strengths? And so kind of reallydrilling down on looking at the
transferable skills. And like Isaid, that's the piece that's
really difficult for peoplebecause, well, I've always done
this, and I've all myexperiences in this place. So it
(09:02):
takes somewhat and we get theimposter syndrome, right? So
it's sometimes someone elseneeds to talk you into actually
there is other options andopportunities. So for example,
if you feel if you're very, verygood at copywriting and you feel
very passionate about animalrights, you know, you can
(09:22):
combine that you can you don'thave to choose one or the other,
for example, but sometimes itneeds that that push and then
it's about how am I going todeliver this. So how often do I
talk to people? And that's the,I guess the the challenge with
social media, etc. There's somuch out there that we see that
(09:44):
we think we should be doing. Andso many times I have
conversations about Well, like Ishould probably do a Facebook
group with this. And I'm like,Okay, how would you use it? I
don't really like Facebook, butI think I could do this and this
and say, Well, if you don't likeit, it's that's your biscuit.
(10:04):
Like why do something that youdon't like buying corporate
something that you feelresistant to? Just because a lot
of other people do it. And thenit's you spend the next you
building a service and an oftenyou want to scale including
something that you makes youfeel resentful. That doesn't.
(10:26):
That doesn't make sense. So it'skind of looking at very
practical ways of what couldthis look like? How can we make
it scalable? And how, what, whatworks for you, like what's,
because just if you hateFacebook groups, for example of
(10:47):
Facebook, there's going to be ahuge amount of people that feel
the same. And that don't wantanother Facebook group, but
don't want the noise of thatcetera. So don't be afraid to
own that. Build it your way,basically,
Erin Geiger (11:03):
thank you for saying that it needs to be said
it needs to be shouted from therooftops. Because, you know, we
listen to all of these, I callit the billionaire syndrome. And
you listen to all these socalled billionaires and how
they've, you know, crafted theirsuccessful business. And, of
course, your stuffs juststarting out, you're going to be
(11:25):
like, well, I need to do that.
So, okay, so this one has amembership, got to do that this
one has the digital course,gotta do that. This one has this
Facebook group. This one's bigon Instagram, this one's being
big on LinkedIn, this one has ahuge email list, you know, and
then you can drive yourselfnuts. And, and you're right,
it's like, this is your ownbusiness. So why wouldn't you
craft it in a way that servesyou, instead of just doing these
(11:46):
things, because you feel likeyou have to, because then it
becomes an obligation, and thenyou're gonna start resenting
your own business? So how do youkind of help them? Choose one
delivery method? And then? Andthen what? What do you recommend
as far as delivery methods tobecause we do want to talk about
scale, right? And so some ofthese, like the one on ones
(12:06):
can't really scale? That is onlyone of you. So I guess how do
you help them focus in and thenscale it from there?
Unknown (12:15):
Yeah. So let me hook into one of the there's two
questions I probably get one isone, two ones. So I'm a huge
fan. And that's one of thethings I do niche down on
scaling one to one services.
And, because, and maybe that'sbecause I've had my experience.
(12:39):
I'm not a big fan, of course, Ido love there's a time and a
place for a course. And there isa time and a place for a
membership and the I'm part ofthat have been part of
memberships or have done all thecourses. I don't think I
finished one yet. Just because Iyeah, I don't keep up because
(13:03):
I'm busy. And then you know thatthe coming back to the Facebook
group, the accompanying Facebookgroup, they're talking about,
like module 10, and I'm still onto and then I kind of switch
disengage and but I do believethat it's a great way to make
someone's expertise accessibleand to share knowledge for sure.
(13:23):
I'm maybe not the right targetaudience. But I also believe,
and often desperately cravesomeone to just help, they want
to learn to just do it for me.
And that could be talking to meas a coach or as a consultant.
But it could also be someonejust taking it off my hands.
(13:47):
Like, like having an I had thisthis situation when I had my, my
daughter two and a half yearsago, and I was preparing for
maternity leave. And just totake some time off. And I was
desperately trying to find acopywriter. And it was almost
impossible. Because everycopywriter I approached. And you
(14:08):
know, it wasn't big. I justwanted someone because I
actually liked writing copymyself, etc. But I just wanted
some consistency while I wasoffered something to publish.
And almost everyone Iapproached, said, Oh no, I don't
do that anymore. But I can teachyou how to do it. And I said, I
know how to do it. Thank you andthat I literally need someone to
(14:30):
do it for me. And so I think I'mvery passionate about helping
business owners scale theirexpertise in that space and
helping them scale their one toone the done for you service
model. And there's differentways to do that. Obviously, so
just wanted to say that and so Ithink there is a market for that
(14:52):
a desperate need for itactually. And I forgot your
second question. I Do we?
Erin Geiger (15:01):
Yeah. How do you?
How do you first of all, let mespeak to what you just said, I
agree with you. And I thinkthere was a trend, a very heavy
trend of that where it was like,digital courses came on the
scene. And it was like, startteaching your expertise to other
people instead of doing it forthem. And I was like, this huge
wave of people doing that. Andit was like, Well wait, because
(15:24):
some people, like you said, wantit to be done for them. They're,
they're doing something else.
And their business that theywant me to focus on, and they
need somebody else to do that.
My only question with that is,since there is only one of you,
how do you scale it? You know,and so? And, you know, do you
combo it with something elsethat doesn't require your time?
(15:48):
I guess, how do you think aboutit that way?
Unknown (15:55):
Yeah. So for me, there's different different
options? Of course you can youcan you need to translate,
that's always the first step.
And that's the first step of anyscalable model is to create your
blueprint, your copy of like,what do you do differently? Why
is it more effective? Why doesit you know, what is it that you
(16:17):
do that gets better results forclients? Or is it a certain
niche, etc. So in getting thatout of, I just do it
instinctively, or, you know,tuition, onto paper, and a
process that's necessary in anycase. And then once you have
(16:38):
that, and that's the bit where Ihelp my clients a lot, because
it's almost impossible, becausewe do things instinctively. And
we do things because we'vealways done them or, because
that's what we learned in ourcorporate job, so so. So that
tacit knowledge to translatethat into a process is almost
(17:00):
impossible to do on your own.
But once you have that, youcould, you could grow a team, if
you say, Okay, actually, I wantto grow, and I want to grow my
income, and I want to grow mycompany. That's one option. But
if you say, Ah, I don't want tomanage a team, that's not of
(17:22):
interest to me, you couldlicense it. So you could teach
others what you do. You can takerevenue from that. So you can
pick take a fee for the teachingand the setting up. And then you
could take revenue from theirincome. And all of a sudden, if
you're, let's say, your niche,whatever you offer, you only
(17:45):
work with nutritionists. You canwithout having to do more or
less building more marketing,etc. You could tap into a
completely different audience oftree surgeons, and now do
marketing, tree searching usingyour blueprint, your methods,
(18:05):
and applying it for a differentindustry through someone else.
Can you take a recurring revenuefrom that, for example, but you
do their social media marketing,etc. So it still follows your
blueprint. It's your IP, it'syour methods, and methodology.
So that was is two ways, forexample, to scale. Build your
(18:26):
own team or tap into a network.
Erin Geiger (18:30):
Gotcha. Okay. No, that's great. Thanks for
explaining it that way. And yes,then my My other question was
figuring out which way theyshould go as far as the delivery
method and helping them toexecute on it, and the most
productive way possible.
Unknown (18:51):
Yeah, so I think it's, it's about delivery, it's very
much depending on our zone ofgenius of what we feel
comfortable with. And whetherwe're more of a teacher. And we
can, you know, there is you canwork with someone one to one,
but you can still give them youknow, you can take them through
the process still. Give them prerecorded videos without being a
(19:16):
good programmer. So it could becertain checklists, it could be
one to one calls, it could be inperson meetings, the delivery, I
think, and the support. Andsometimes it's that hybrid
model. So I was part of amastermind, for example, or a
group program. And for me, whatmade all the difference and
(19:40):
actually completed that programwas because I could submit a
work every week for them to lookat and give me feedback on
specifically. So it was a groupsetting, but I got something out
of it. I literally tick thingsoff the list. As part of that
program. I got feedback And Ifelt like I really learned
(20:01):
something. But it also meantbecause I had to submit it every
Thursday, that Wednesday night,I was like, focused, and I would
get things done, because Ididn't want to miss the
opportunity to get feedback thisweek and make the most of that
support available. So. So yeah,I think there's different ways
(20:23):
you can obviously offer, thatmore high touch, you can offer
Voxer access, or messaging oremail or office hours. So it's,
it's adding that I think thatpersonal even in a group
setting, if you do want to scalethat way, to offer that one to
(20:44):
one in one shape or form meansyou can immediately charge more,
and people will get betterresults because they get
feedback specific to theirbusiness and their setup and
their the work that they'redoing. Yeah. But as I said, I'm
not never do something justbecause everyone else does it.
(21:08):
Because it's not. No, I
Erin Geiger (21:10):
agree with that.
And so, to connect the dots alittle bit over, on all this
great info that you've shared,can you give us like an example
or kind of, like, tell a storyabout a client that you helped,
you know, like, you know, so wecan kind of just apply it in our
heads of like, you know, howthis has been executed, like I
had this client and they hadthis offer, and I this is what
(21:34):
they did. And you know, this,these are their results.
Unknown (21:38):
Yeah, so I had recently worked with a client in the
brand space. So the branddesigner, and they wanted to
create a scalable program. Andtheir service is huge. I mean,
she takes care of everythingfrom messaging, from literally
(21:59):
your logo, to setting up yoursocial media profiles, your
messaging, and so on. And thatis great when you can afford to
pay for a one to one service.
And she does it for you, and youtake them through. But she
wanted to translate that into ascalable, more scalable model.
And the first thing we did wecut the content by two thirds,
(22:25):
like I said, Okay, it's toomuch. And based on my, my own
experience, and actually, theexperience from a lot of my
clients and peers was, you know,do I want a 12 month program?
Probably not. Because, you know,we've learned that in the last
(22:46):
couple of years, especially thatwe we don't know what's around
the corner in the next two tothree months. So do I want to
commit? Hopefully, my businessis doing well, will I have the
time to invest in this. So wecut it literally, one, we took
1/3 At the beginning of thejourney, and then we could so
that we could then actually takethem on a journey and upsell, we
(23:07):
could sell them the next stageof the process, once they've
completed the first. And so outof her one, huge holistic
service package, we createdthree offers that follow one
from one another. But we focusin on the first one, we created
it in a setting where it wasperson, that personal feedback
(23:30):
loop, automated as much aspossible. So there was an intake
form every week. So she when shedid, she had to look at it. She
was scheduled at the time Ilooked at it recorded loom
videos, so there was not even acall, she had to jump on, she
could do it in her own time. Andyeah, and then wrapped around
(23:53):
with teaching, so weeklyteachings, but for eight weeks,
not like months and months andmonths. And we the second thing
we did second or third, that wasto make sure that the client
gets a result quickly. That'sthe other thing that we don't do
well enough is to make surebecause we want to give so much
(24:19):
we feel so passionate about whatwe do. And we have so much to
share. And that we sometimesoverwhelmed and it's just
actually give them a resultquickly focus them in on
something that they can then usethe leverage because that keeps
them engaged and actually letsthem finish the course or the
program or whatever it is andget a better result overall,
(24:41):
rather than
Erin Geiger (24:45):
Yeah, yeah, I love that because then it's like
you're giving them a sense ofconfidence and empowerment, you
know, early on which is huge.
And I like how you got it downto the three offers within it's
almost like you can meet someonewhere where they're at? Right?
So maybe they are at the levelone, that's great. And they can
kind of go through. But I'massuming like, if you see there,
(25:07):
they're further along than that,then you could start them off on
the second, you know, in orderfor them for their. So instead
of like it being thisoverwhelming behemoth of
information, you can tailor itto right, to where, to what they
actually need.
Unknown (25:23):
Yeah. And you can make it really, as I said, like this
brand is a great example.
Because we've all been there,right? We had a business idea,
we're making the decision tolaunch and then we're really
excited. But I'm one of thosepeople. And no, you can do it
quick and dirty. And you can itdoesn't have to perfect,
absolutely. But I'm someone Ilove when something is
(25:45):
aesthetically pleasing. So likethe one of the first things I
always do is like, tweak my logoand work on the logo. And so I
said that to her, like howquickly could you get them to go
out with a logo? So theycouldn't you know, if it's new
entrepreneur, how quickly couldhe get them to a point where
they can share this beautifullogo on social media and say, I
started my own business, becausethat's like, what excites us the
(26:09):
most. And that feels like a hugemilestone, which will then keep
them engaged through the rest ofthe work. So it's really
thinking about, Okay, what'swhat's most important to them?
And what's most exciting tothem, and then going from kind
of making sure that's built in.
Erin Geiger (26:28):
So how, how do you kind of take this into your own
business? Like, how do you scaleyour own business? And still,
you know, kind of keep a certainlifestyle? A certain like, how
do you manage your boundaries?
Like, do you have any insightinto that?
Unknown (26:45):
Yeah, so I am a very practical example. So my own
business, I scale, I have my ownblueprint of what certain
pillars that I implement withclients. And the same as is with
this example, I can take likethe scalable offer is one of the
(27:06):
printers that I work on withclients, there is some whole
systems and processes piece andquality of revenue. So we don't
just rely on one client. So thisis like one big pillar of my
kind of framework, I suppose. Soin that sense, I do exactly the
same when it comes toboundaries. And I've just
(27:30):
introduced and this was an ideaI picked up, I tried to think of
where I got it from, but Iliterally create an onboarding
guide that I share with newclients. So new clients get a
dashboard, which I've built inlotion, but you could also do it
in Trello, Cetera, give themaccess to it, where they can
(27:51):
then upload relevant info,that's information that's
relevant to whatever you'd workon with them. So it could be if
you're in the marketing, orsocial media space, it could be
color guidelines, and logofiles, etc. For me, it's usually
kind of documentation, logins tocertain tools, or systems, etc.
(28:14):
So they have all of that. Andthen I in my onboarding guide, I
get very specific around, I onlywork for example, Monday to
Thursday, I have Friday off withmy daughter. And I make it
really clear that I, you know, Isometimes work on the weekends,
I have childcare, and they mightget an email from me on a
Sunday, but I never expect tohear back from them. That's it.
(28:39):
So it's two ways, right? So Imake it clear that they know,
chances are if you contact me ona Friday, if it's an emergency,
of course, I'll respond. And ifthey call me, that's fine. But
generally, that day is reserved,and I'm off. So it's, they get
that automatically on theirdashboard. So there is a call
(29:02):
out, please read. And then thereis a PDF attached where it's
broken down, and it looks nice,it's branded. And it kind of
gives them the rules ofengagement, I suppose. So that's
a very practical example of howI work and how I set
expectations, manageexpectations, and then kind of
maintain my boundaries.
Erin Geiger (29:23):
Okay, that's great.
Then how do you scale pricing?
You know, do you kind of helppeople with that as well, like,
don't do hourly do retainer, ordo you have certain suggestions
that you use for that?
Unknown (29:37):
Yeah, I think I think pricing is it's very much down
to industry and client and ofcourse, it's a different,
different conversation, whetheryou work in b2c And you, you
know, in a certain market, orb2b and you know, like you're in
(29:59):
Facebook ads You literally knowhow much revenue they're gonna
get from you and the value addmuch easier. So I do help, but
I'm not an authority on itbecause it's just too huge. What
I do do recommend is alwaysrecurring retainer or recurring
revenue. So I always try to finda model to say, actually, and
(30:23):
sometimes back when, when I workwith new retainer clients, I
have a three months minimumcommitment, because I know it
will take me that long to get toreally know them to their
business. And in to make, liketo start making a difference,
you can't jump with me on acall, and then expect your
(30:44):
system to, you know, to scalenext month, and you will hire
three people and three othercoaches or whatever that. So
that's managing expectationaround that. And I tried to do
that for my clients and say,Okay, you're investing a bit
more time in the beginning toget to know that business and to
get to know the business owner.
So make sure that kind of evensout over the coming months and
(31:05):
give yourself enough time tomake that difference. So yeah,
we'll look at that recurringrevenue retainer. That doesn't
mean you can't have one offoffers, and I do that I have
specific kind of signature. Sokind of scalable Signature
Service sessions I offer. Butthey're not. Yeah, they're just
(31:26):
ad hoc. And sometimes I have notfound them, etc. But that's not
the that's not the core of mybusiness. That's just mostly
because I really enjoy it. Andyeah, it's, it's fun, but it's
not. That's not what my businessrelies on.
Erin Geiger (31:46):
Yeah. Now, maybe it's like for a passion project
or two on the side. awarenesshas been so so helpful. Where
can people find you online? Ifthey want to connect?
Unknown (31:57):
Yeah. On Instagram, I'm Ed Federica, harms.com that come
at Frederick hands. So that'swhere I'm usually best. Best to
find Instagram is the place. Andthere's also links to my my lead
magnet, which is a guy to takeyou through, like the four kind
of characteristics of a scalableservice, and what to do to start
(32:21):
implementing that. But yeah,that's the best place to find
me.
Erin Geiger (32:25):
Awesome. We'll include that link on the show
notes, as well as to Yeah, thatguide because that sounds like
it's so super helpful. There isa question that we ask everybody
at the end of our discussions,which is, if you can only listen
to one that music artists forthe rest of your life, who would
it be?
Unknown (32:44):
While I have a bit of obsession with Eminem, I've been
wanting to marry him ever sinceI was about 13. So and that's
still the case. So I think itwould have to be him.
Erin Geiger (32:59):
Yeah, he's great.
And he has so many good songslike he can't even pick one.
It's kind of amazing. You'rehuge. And we're here to cool. So
well. We do have a playlist onSpotify, the Small Business Big
mindset playlist. And so we'lladd him on there because it's
kind of cool. It's like havelike music in the background
while you're working of otherentrepreneurs favorites. So be
sure to add him. Friday. Thankyou so much for taking the time.
(33:22):
I've really enjoyed thisdiscussion. You've like you were
so super specific with youranswers. And I always appreciate
that when people don't give likefluff or pie in the sky. Info.
So thank you. Thank you. Thankyou. No, thank you so much for
having me. It's been great.
Thanks for tuning in to theSmall Business Big mindset
podcast. To keep the fun going.
Check out our Facebook groupstart and scale an online
(33:43):
business For even more freetrainings and resources from
fellow entrepreneurs. If youhaven't already, head on over to
muscle creative.com and clicksubscribe to join our email list
for weekly updates. And ifyou've enjoyed this podcast
episode, check us out on yourfavorite podcast platform to
follow us and give us a review.
As always be authentic bringinginsane amount of value and keep
(34:04):
crushing it
Welcome to the Small Business Big mindset
podcast, where we dive intotactical strategies to grow your
business. And to make an impacton this world. A huge part of
success is keeping your mindsetand vision on track. So this is
a major part of our process. Andthis podcast, let's do this.
(00:25):
Welcome to the Small BusinessBig mindset podcast this week,
we have Freddie harmes, founderof catalyst ventures, Freddie,
oh, my gosh, thank you so somuch for taking the time to chat
with us and be on the showtoday.
Unknown (00:38):
Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be
speaking with you.
Erin Geiger (00:41):
Very, very cool.
Listeners, before we started, Iwas like making a Friday talk to
me all about Europe, because Iwant to plan a trip there. You
know. So as you know, I'm in theStates. And I'm just like, I
cannot wait to go just live outwas one of the things I love
about doing this podcast is thatI get to meet people from all
over the globe. So I'm soexcited to hear on Friday, what
you have to say as far as yourbusiness go. So let's dive in.
(01:04):
Tell us a little bit aboutyourself, your background and
how you got started and came tobe where you are today.
Unknown (01:13):
Sure. So I started my career as a business process
consultant. Very, very boring.
Very German, we love a process,don't we? So So yeah, so I'm
German. I live in the UK. Now. Istarted my career as a business
process consulting, who thenwent into project management and
change management, I did a lotof integrations after
(01:35):
acquisition, like the bigcorporate stuff. And while I did
love doing that, I, I also havea heritage of a small business
owner. My parents basically havetheir own business, my
grandparents have their ownbusiness, we have a family
business that's been in ourfamily since 1898. So that is
(01:58):
always a big, that's myheritage. And that's in the back
of my mind. And as soon as Ikind of started dipping my toe,
into the kind of business world,the entrepreneurial world, I saw
something that I recognized frommy upbringing, which was that we
(02:18):
started our business. Because wedo something and we feel really,
really passionate aboutsomething and we want to create
a better life, we want to betterwork life balance. And we we end
up working more days than weever did in corporate, and the
longer hours, but now we don'thave any benefits to go with it
and no regular income. So. Sothis kind of then kind of
(02:42):
brought me to the place where Iwanted to work with
entrepreneurs, founders andbusiness owners to, to create
businesses that are scalable,beyond themselves, so that they
can take the time off. And oneexample I just want to mention,
my parents and I, we went onholiday and my whole life, we
(03:04):
went on holiday once. Becausewe, they they couldn't remove
themselves from the business.
And they literally had to shutit. And we went for a holiday, a
one week holiday was in my life.
And that's not what I want forothers. And you know, I did a
lot of traveling myself, I'vemade up for it. But yeah, I
(03:26):
think I think that that's notwhat we set out to do when we
start our investors. So hence,yeah, May I now help founders
create scalable businesses. Andat the core of that is a
scalable service, or product,even product in the sense that
(03:49):
is something very defined, thatdoesn't, I'm not ecommerce
expert or anything like that,but to make sure they can grow a
business beyond themselves, andit doesn't break because they
leave their phone at home oneday.
Erin Geiger (04:10):
Now, that's actually such important work,
because a lot of us go fromexactly that, that corporate
life to entrepreneurship, orsometimes you straddle both,
right? And then you thinkentrepreneurship is this, you
know, amazing, beautiful, shinything, and all my dreams are
gonna come true. And I'm goingto set my own hours and be my
(04:31):
own boss and everything right?
And then you start taking onclients, and you're like, huh, I
have 10 bosses now, instead ofthe one. And they're dictating
my schedule, and you know, so Ithink people don't, they kind of
like take what they've learnedwas kind of ingrained in their
head of like, how working worksand they just take that and they
(04:55):
bring it on over toentrepreneurship and gotta try
to like shove it in They'rebecause that's all that they
know. So I love that you dothis. So explain to us, you
know, cuz I know that you do iton like, an offer basis too,
right? So like, how do you takewhat they're offering and what
their focus is? Because that'sthe first step, right focus,
(05:15):
like figure it out, because Iknow when I first started, I was
like, I could do all these amillion things. So I'm gonna
offer them all you know, it'slike, what are you doing? And so
it's focusing, right? So tell usa little bit about that.
Unknown (05:27):
And it's natural, because we when we set out, and
we take that leap, and you know,as you say, some of us and I'm,
I'm one of those that straddleboth worlds, because I couldn't
afford to take the leap. Butyeah, we we say yes to
everything, because we need theincome. It's not that we want to
(05:50):
do everything necessarily, butwe need the income, we need to
pay our mortgage. And, and wefeel nervous about what's down
the line. So it's a very naturalprocess to go from, right. I
can, yes, I can do that. Yes, Ican do that. Yes, I can do that
too, too, then focusing in on,like, taking the time out to
(06:12):
look back and say actually,what, what create what brought
the best client results? Whatdid I enjoy the most? And what
do I want to take forward? So Idon't have to say yes, to every
client and to every project andto every piece of work. And
it's, it's, I guess one is, it'sscary taking that time out.
(06:33):
Because we're used to now we'reon that hamster wheel, we were
finally things are going great,we're really busy. It's scary to
then say, actually, I'm gonnastop what I'm doing, and take a
more strategic view. Because wemay miss an opportunity, or we
may have to say no to a clientto free up that time. And it's
(06:56):
what I found when speaking to myclients, it's almost impossible
to do on your own. And that'sthe problem of being a
solopreneur. Having a smallbusiness. And being the leader
of that business. You you needto invest externally, whether
that is whether that is workingwith a coach or consultant, like
(07:16):
myself, but as a minimum, youneed to join a mastermind or a
group setting where you can findthat sounding board, etc.
Because in our heads, it'simpossible to do it in a vacuum,
and then go out and say, Oh,this is it. Because because
(07:37):
we're so held back by what wasin the past and what we what we
know so well. And it sometimestakes someone to challenge us to
say, actually, is that what youwant to do going forward?
Because he, you said you don'tenjoy it. And just because it
has the biggest profit, youknow, there's so many levers you
can pull to make something elsework. So that you need that kind
(08:00):
of that external input andsounding voice, etc.
Erin Geiger (08:05):
Like, we don't know what we don't know, you know,
and so, like you were saying, ifyou're kind of siloed away, and
you're just going off of like,your personal knowledge and your
personal experience, I mean,sure, that can get you so far.
But you do need to exposeyourself to other ways of
thinking and other ways of, ofdoing things for sure. And so,
once you've kind of like, okay,this is what I'm going to focus
(08:28):
on. How do you counsel peopleafter that, once they know this
is where I'm going, this is thedirection I'm heading, then
what?
Unknown (08:38):
I think it's, it's then working with them. So one, I
helped them find what is theirzone of genius, what is their
strengths? And so kind of reallydrilling down on looking at the
transferable skills. And like Isaid, that's the piece that's
really difficult for peoplebecause, well, I've always done
this, and I've all myexperiences in this place. So it
(09:02):
takes somewhat and we get theimposter syndrome, right? So
it's sometimes someone elseneeds to talk you into actually
there is other options andopportunities. So for example,
if you feel if you're very, verygood at copywriting and you feel
very passionate about animalrights, you know, you can
(09:22):
combine that you can you don'thave to choose one or the other,
for example, but sometimes itneeds that that push and then
it's about how am I going todeliver this. So how often do I
talk to people? And that's the,I guess the the challenge with
social media, etc. There's somuch out there that we see that
(09:44):
we think we should be doing. Andso many times I have
conversations about Well, like Ishould probably do a Facebook
group with this. And I'm like,Okay, how would you use it? I
don't really like Facebook, butI think I could do this and this
and say, Well, if you don't likeit, it's that's your biscuit.
(10:04):
Like why do something that youdon't like buying corporate
something that you feelresistant to? Just because a lot
of other people do it. And thenit's you spend the next you
building a service and an oftenyou want to scale including
something that you makes youfeel resentful. That doesn't.
(10:26):
That doesn't make sense. So it'skind of looking at very
practical ways of what couldthis look like? How can we make
it scalable? And how, what, whatworks for you, like what's,
because just if you hateFacebook groups, for example of
(10:47):
Facebook, there's going to be ahuge amount of people that feel
the same. And that don't wantanother Facebook group, but
don't want the noise of thatcetera. So don't be afraid to
own that. Build it your way,basically,
Erin Geiger (11:03):
thank you for saying that it needs to be said
it needs to be shouted from therooftops. Because, you know, we
listen to all of these, I callit the billionaire syndrome. And
you listen to all these socalled billionaires and how
they've, you know, crafted theirsuccessful business. And, of
course, your stuffs juststarting out, you're going to be
(11:25):
like, well, I need to do that.
So, okay, so this one has amembership, got to do that this
one has the digital course,gotta do that. This one has this
Facebook group. This one's bigon Instagram, this one's being
big on LinkedIn, this one has ahuge email list, you know, and
then you can drive yourselfnuts. And, and you're right,
it's like, this is your ownbusiness. So why wouldn't you
craft it in a way that servesyou, instead of just doing these
(11:46):
things, because you feel likeyou have to, because then it
becomes an obligation, and thenyou're gonna start resenting
your own business? So how do youkind of help them? Choose one
delivery method? And then? Andthen what? What do you recommend
as far as delivery methods tobecause we do want to talk about
scale, right? And so some ofthese, like the one on ones
(12:06):
can't really scale? That is onlyone of you. So I guess how do
you help them focus in and thenscale it from there?
Unknown (12:15):
Yeah. So let me hook into one of the there's two
questions I probably get one isone, two ones. So I'm a huge
fan. And that's one of thethings I do niche down on
scaling one to one services.
And, because, and maybe that'sbecause I've had my experience.
(12:39):
I'm not a big fan, of course, Ido love there's a time and a
place for a course. And there isa time and a place for a
membership and the I'm part ofthat have been part of
memberships or have done all thecourses. I don't think I
finished one yet. Just because Iyeah, I don't keep up because
(13:03):
I'm busy. And then you know thatthe coming back to the Facebook
group, the accompanying Facebookgroup, they're talking about,
like module 10, and I'm still onto and then I kind of switch
disengage and but I do believethat it's a great way to make
someone's expertise accessibleand to share knowledge for sure.
(13:23):
I'm maybe not the right targetaudience. But I also believe,
and often desperately cravesomeone to just help, they want
to learn to just do it for me.
And that could be talking to meas a coach or as a consultant.
But it could also be someonejust taking it off my hands.
(13:47):
Like, like having an I had thisthis situation when I had my, my
daughter two and a half yearsago, and I was preparing for
maternity leave. And just totake some time off. And I was
desperately trying to find acopywriter. And it was almost
impossible. Because everycopywriter I approached. And you
(14:08):
know, it wasn't big. I justwanted someone because I
actually liked writing copymyself, etc. But I just wanted
some consistency while I wasoffered something to publish.
And almost everyone Iapproached, said, Oh no, I don't
do that anymore. But I can teachyou how to do it. And I said, I
know how to do it. Thank you andthat I literally need someone to
(14:30):
do it for me. And so I think I'mvery passionate about helping
business owners scale theirexpertise in that space and
helping them scale their one toone the done for you service
model. And there's differentways to do that. Obviously, so
just wanted to say that and so Ithink there is a market for that
(14:52):
a desperate need for itactually. And I forgot your
second question. I Do we?
Erin Geiger (15:01):
Yeah. How do you?
How do you first of all, let mespeak to what you just said, I
agree with you. And I thinkthere was a trend, a very heavy
trend of that where it was like,digital courses came on the
scene. And it was like, startteaching your expertise to other
people instead of doing it forthem. And I was like, this huge
wave of people doing that. Andit was like, Well wait, because
(15:24):
some people, like you said, wantit to be done for them. They're,
they're doing something else.
And their business that theywant me to focus on, and they
need somebody else to do that.
My only question with that is,since there is only one of you,
how do you scale it? You know,and so? And, you know, do you
combo it with something elsethat doesn't require your time?
(15:48):
I guess, how do you think aboutit that way?
Unknown (15:55):
Yeah. So for me, there's different different
options? Of course you can youcan you need to translate,
that's always the first step.
And that's the first step of anyscalable model is to create your
blueprint, your copy of like,what do you do differently? Why
is it more effective? Why doesit you know, what is it that you
(16:17):
do that gets better results forclients? Or is it a certain
niche, etc. So in getting thatout of, I just do it
instinctively, or, you know,tuition, onto paper, and a
process that's necessary in anycase. And then once you have
(16:38):
that, and that's the bit where Ihelp my clients a lot, because
it's almost impossible, becausewe do things instinctively. And
we do things because we'vealways done them or, because
that's what we learned in ourcorporate job, so so. So that
tacit knowledge to translatethat into a process is almost
(17:00):
impossible to do on your own.
But once you have that, youcould, you could grow a team, if
you say, Okay, actually, I wantto grow, and I want to grow my
income, and I want to grow mycompany. That's one option. But
if you say, Ah, I don't want tomanage a team, that's not of
(17:22):
interest to me, you couldlicense it. So you could teach
others what you do. You can takerevenue from that. So you can
pick take a fee for the teachingand the setting up. And then you
could take revenue from theirincome. And all of a sudden, if
you're, let's say, your niche,whatever you offer, you only
(17:45):
work with nutritionists. You canwithout having to do more or
less building more marketing,etc. You could tap into a
completely different audience oftree surgeons, and now do
marketing, tree searching usingyour blueprint, your methods,
(18:05):
and applying it for a differentindustry through someone else.
Can you take a recurring revenuefrom that, for example, but you
do their social media marketing,etc. So it still follows your
blueprint. It's your IP, it'syour methods, and methodology.
So that was is two ways, forexample, to scale. Build your
(18:26):
own team or tap into a network.
Erin Geiger (18:30):
Gotcha. Okay. No, that's great. Thanks for
explaining it that way. And yes,then my My other question was
figuring out which way theyshould go as far as the delivery
method and helping them toexecute on it, and the most
productive way possible.
Unknown (18:51):
Yeah, so I think it's, it's about delivery, it's very
much depending on our zone ofgenius of what we feel
comfortable with. And whetherwe're more of a teacher. And we
can, you know, there is you canwork with someone one to one,
but you can still give them youknow, you can take them through
the process still. Give them prerecorded videos without being a
(19:16):
good programmer. So it could becertain checklists, it could be
one to one calls, it could be inperson meetings, the delivery, I
think, and the support. Andsometimes it's that hybrid
model. So I was part of amastermind, for example, or a
group program. And for me, whatmade all the difference and
(19:40):
actually completed that programwas because I could submit a
work every week for them to lookat and give me feedback on
specifically. So it was a groupsetting, but I got something out
of it. I literally tick thingsoff the list. As part of that
program. I got feedback And Ifelt like I really learned
(20:01):
something. But it also meantbecause I had to submit it every
Thursday, that Wednesday night,I was like, focused, and I would
get things done, because Ididn't want to miss the
opportunity to get feedback thisweek and make the most of that
support available. So. So yeah,I think there's different ways
(20:23):
you can obviously offer, thatmore high touch, you can offer
Voxer access, or messaging oremail or office hours. So it's,
it's adding that I think thatpersonal even in a group
setting, if you do want to scalethat way, to offer that one to
(20:44):
one in one shape or form meansyou can immediately charge more,
and people will get betterresults because they get
feedback specific to theirbusiness and their setup and
their the work that they'redoing. Yeah. But as I said, I'm
not never do something justbecause everyone else does it.
(21:08):
Because it's not. No, I
Erin Geiger (21:10):
agree with that.
And so, to connect the dots alittle bit over, on all this
great info that you've shared,can you give us like an example
or kind of, like, tell a storyabout a client that you helped,
you know, like, you know, so wecan kind of just apply it in our
heads of like, you know, howthis has been executed, like I
had this client and they hadthis offer, and I this is what
(21:34):
they did. And you know, this,these are their results.
Unknown (21:38):
Yeah, so I had recently worked with a client in the
brand space. So the branddesigner, and they wanted to
create a scalable program. Andtheir service is huge. I mean,
she takes care of everythingfrom messaging, from literally
(21:59):
your logo, to setting up yoursocial media profiles, your
messaging, and so on. And thatis great when you can afford to
pay for a one to one service.
And she does it for you, and youtake them through. But she
wanted to translate that into ascalable, more scalable model.
And the first thing we did wecut the content by two thirds,
(22:25):
like I said, Okay, it's toomuch. And based on my, my own
experience, and actually, theexperience from a lot of my
clients and peers was, you know,do I want a 12 month program?
Probably not. Because, you know,we've learned that in the last
(22:46):
couple of years, especially thatwe we don't know what's around
the corner in the next two tothree months. So do I want to
commit? Hopefully, my businessis doing well, will I have the
time to invest in this. So wecut it literally, one, we took
1/3 At the beginning of thejourney, and then we could so
that we could then actually takethem on a journey and upsell, we
(23:07):
could sell them the next stageof the process, once they've
completed the first. And so outof her one, huge holistic
service package, we createdthree offers that follow one
from one another. But we focusin on the first one, we created
it in a setting where it wasperson, that personal feedback
(23:30):
loop, automated as much aspossible. So there was an intake
form every week. So she when shedid, she had to look at it. She
was scheduled at the time Ilooked at it recorded loom
videos, so there was not even acall, she had to jump on, she
could do it in her own time. Andyeah, and then wrapped around
(23:53):
with teaching, so weeklyteachings, but for eight weeks,
not like months and months andmonths. And we the second thing
we did second or third, that wasto make sure that the client
gets a result quickly. That'sthe other thing that we don't do
well enough is to make surebecause we want to give so much
(24:19):
we feel so passionate about whatwe do. And we have so much to
share. And that we sometimesoverwhelmed and it's just
actually give them a resultquickly focus them in on
something that they can then usethe leverage because that keeps
them engaged and actually letsthem finish the course or the
program or whatever it is andget a better result overall,
(24:41):
rather than
Erin Geiger (24:45):
Yeah, yeah, I love that because then it's like
you're giving them a sense ofconfidence and empowerment, you
know, early on which is huge.
And I like how you got it downto the three offers within it's
almost like you can meet someonewhere where they're at? Right?
So maybe they are at the levelone, that's great. And they can
kind of go through. But I'massuming like, if you see there,
(25:07):
they're further along than that,then you could start them off on
the second, you know, in orderfor them for their. So instead
of like it being thisoverwhelming behemoth of
information, you can tailor itto right, to where, to what they
actually need.
Unknown (25:23):
Yeah. And you can make it really, as I said, like this
brand is a great example.
Because we've all been there,right? We had a business idea,
we're making the decision tolaunch and then we're really
excited. But I'm one of thosepeople. And no, you can do it
quick and dirty. And you can itdoesn't have to perfect,
absolutely. But I'm someone Ilove when something is
(25:45):
aesthetically pleasing. So likethe one of the first things I
always do is like, tweak my logoand work on the logo. And so I
said that to her, like howquickly could you get them to go
out with a logo? So theycouldn't you know, if it's new
entrepreneur, how quickly couldhe get them to a point where
they can share this beautifullogo on social media and say, I
started my own business, becausethat's like, what excites us the
(26:09):
most. And that feels like a hugemilestone, which will then keep
them engaged through the rest ofthe work. So it's really
thinking about, Okay, what'swhat's most important to them?
And what's most exciting tothem, and then going from kind
of making sure that's built in.
Erin Geiger (26:28):
So how, how do you kind of take this into your own
business? Like, how do you scaleyour own business? And still,
you know, kind of keep a certainlifestyle? A certain like, how
do you manage your boundaries?
Like, do you have any insightinto that?
Unknown (26:45):
Yeah, so I am a very practical example. So my own
business, I scale, I have my ownblueprint of what certain
pillars that I implement withclients. And the same as is with
this example, I can take likethe scalable offer is one of the
(27:06):
printers that I work on withclients, there is some whole
systems and processes piece andquality of revenue. So we don't
just rely on one client. So thisis like one big pillar of my
kind of framework, I suppose. Soin that sense, I do exactly the
same when it comes toboundaries. And I've just
(27:30):
introduced and this was an ideaI picked up, I tried to think of
where I got it from, but Iliterally create an onboarding
guide that I share with newclients. So new clients get a
dashboard, which I've built inlotion, but you could also do it
in Trello, Cetera, give themaccess to it, where they can
(27:51):
then upload relevant info,that's information that's
relevant to whatever you'd workon with them. So it could be if
you're in the marketing, orsocial media space, it could be
color guidelines, and logofiles, etc. For me, it's usually
kind of documentation, logins tocertain tools, or systems, etc.
(28:14):
So they have all of that. Andthen I in my onboarding guide, I
get very specific around, I onlywork for example, Monday to
Thursday, I have Friday off withmy daughter. And I make it
really clear that I, you know, Isometimes work on the weekends,
I have childcare, and they mightget an email from me on a
Sunday, but I never expect tohear back from them. That's it.
(28:39):
So it's two ways, right? So Imake it clear that they know,
chances are if you contact me ona Friday, if it's an emergency,
of course, I'll respond. And ifthey call me, that's fine. But
generally, that day is reserved,and I'm off. So it's, they get
that automatically on theirdashboard. So there is a call
(29:02):
out, please read. And then thereis a PDF attached where it's
broken down, and it looks nice,it's branded. And it kind of
gives them the rules ofengagement, I suppose. So that's
a very practical example of howI work and how I set
expectations, manageexpectations, and then kind of
maintain my boundaries.
Erin Geiger (29:23):
Okay, that's great.
Then how do you scale pricing?
You know, do you kind of helppeople with that as well, like,
don't do hourly do retainer, ordo you have certain suggestions
that you use for that?
Unknown (29:37):
Yeah, I think I think pricing is it's very much down
to industry and client and ofcourse, it's a different,
different conversation, whetheryou work in b2c And you, you
know, in a certain market, orb2b and you know, like you're in
(29:59):
Facebook ads You literally knowhow much revenue they're gonna
get from you and the value addmuch easier. So I do help, but
I'm not an authority on itbecause it's just too huge. What
I do do recommend is alwaysrecurring retainer or recurring
revenue. So I always try to finda model to say, actually, and
(30:23):
sometimes back when, when I workwith new retainer clients, I
have a three months minimumcommitment, because I know it
will take me that long to get toreally know them to their
business. And in to make, liketo start making a difference,
you can't jump with me on acall, and then expect your
(30:44):
system to, you know, to scalenext month, and you will hire
three people and three othercoaches or whatever that. So
that's managing expectationaround that. And I tried to do
that for my clients and say,Okay, you're investing a bit
more time in the beginning toget to know that business and to
get to know the business owner.
So make sure that kind of evensout over the coming months and
(31:05):
give yourself enough time tomake that difference. So yeah,
we'll look at that recurringrevenue retainer. That doesn't
mean you can't have one offoffers, and I do that I have
specific kind of signature. Sokind of scalable Signature
Service sessions I offer. Butthey're not. Yeah, they're just
(31:26):
ad hoc. And sometimes I have notfound them, etc. But that's not
the that's not the core of mybusiness. That's just mostly
because I really enjoy it. Andyeah, it's, it's fun, but it's
not. That's not what my businessrelies on.
Erin Geiger (31:46):
Yeah. Now, maybe it's like for a passion project
or two on the side. awarenesshas been so so helpful. Where
can people find you online? Ifthey want to connect?
Unknown (31:57):
Yeah. On Instagram, I'm Ed Federica, harms.com that come
at Frederick hands. So that'swhere I'm usually best. Best to
find Instagram is the place. Andthere's also links to my my lead
magnet, which is a guy to takeyou through, like the four kind
of characteristics of a scalableservice, and what to do to start
(32:21):
implementing that. But yeah,that's the best place to find
me.
Erin Geiger (32:25):
Awesome. We'll include that link on the show
notes, as well as to Yeah, thatguide because that sounds like
it's so super helpful. There isa question that we ask everybody
at the end of our discussions,which is, if you can only listen
to one that music artists forthe rest of your life, who would
it be?
Unknown (32:44):
While I have a bit of obsession with Eminem, I've been
wanting to marry him ever sinceI was about 13. So and that's
still the case. So I think itwould have to be him.
Erin Geiger (32:59):
Yeah, he's great.
And he has so many good songslike he can't even pick one.
It's kind of amazing. You'rehuge. And we're here to cool. So
well. We do have a playlist onSpotify, the Small Business Big
mindset playlist. And so we'lladd him on there because it's
kind of cool. It's like havelike music in the background
while you're working of otherentrepreneurs favorites. So be
sure to add him. Friday. Thankyou so much for taking the time.
(33:22):
I've really enjoyed thisdiscussion. You've like you were
so super specific with youranswers. And I always appreciate
that when people don't give likefluff or pie in the sky. Info.
So thank you. Thank you. Thankyou. No, thank you so much for
having me. It's been great.
Thanks for tuning in to theSmall Business Big mindset
podcast. To keep the fun going.
Check out our Facebook groupstart and scale an online
(33:43):
business For even more freetrainings and resources from
fellow entrepreneurs. If youhaven't already, head on over to
muscle creative.com and clicksubscribe to join our email list
for weekly updates. And ifyou've enjoyed this podcast
episode, check us out on yourfavorite podcast platform to
follow us and give us a review.
As always be authentic bringinginsane amount of value and keep
(34:04):
crushing it
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