September 25, 2025 • 26 mins
In this episode of Solving America's Problems, hosts Jerremy Alexander Newsome and Dave Conley unpack the rebranded show's mission to confront timely crises and deep societal fractures. They dissect the raw emotional and moral fallout from Charlie Kirk's controversial death, highlighting the perils of online culture, the backlash of celebrating death, and the grip of toxic masculinity. Broader tensions like unchecked radicalization fuel the chaos, leading to a call for compassionate leadership to mend divisions in these turbulent times.
Timestamps:
- (00:00) Introduction to America's Got Problems
- (00:55) Current Events and Social Media Impact
- (03:19) The Ethics of Celebrating Death
- (07:26) Moral Dilemmas and Leadership
- (21:46) Zeihan Before / After
Peter Zeihan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuzTJRReDMI&t=1s
📢 Solving America’s Problems Podcast – Real Solutions For Real Issues
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dave (00:00):
Okay.
Welcome to another episodeof America's Got Problems.
Jerremy (00:04):
That's right.
That's we rebranded.
Dave (00:08):
So every now and then we pop in and talk about
Jerremy (00:11):
about.
Dave (00:12):
what's going on in the world.
But not hot takes where we're sortof seeing it, where it's going.
And this is one of those sessions, likenormally what our listeners, what you
guys are gonna hear this week, you'regonna hear, you know, our regular show.
But at the end of this week, uh,we're going to tack these on.
So I believe our, our shows runMonday, Tuesday, Wednesday this week.
And so this will go upon Thursday, Friday.
(00:34):
So if you're listening to this,you're gonna be a couple of days
out, but at least our goal here,starting out, it's going to be.
Not so much evergreen, but it's gonnabe like a slice of life right now.
And a little, bit more topical, butalso a little bit more of deeper issues.
So my friend, my buddy, my brother.
Jerremy (00:53):
Yes
Dave (00:53):
welcome.
Jerremy (00:54):
Thank you
Dave (00:55):
So not much going on, right?
Jerremy (00:57):
very little.
We had to really dig deep to finddiscussions for today's topics.
I'm glad we're doing this.
I'm glad we're doing a up todate like what's going on.
'cause there is, there's so much going on.
There's so much wildness out there.
So much division and hate andanimosity, and a lot of people
are, a lot of people are feelinglost and sad and confused and yeah.
(01:21):
I think this is a great time forus to just connect with the folks.
Dave (01:25):
Yeah, it's curious.
I'd been taking a break from socialmedia, which I think everybody needs
to be doing because being terminallyonline, I think that's actually one of
the causes of the crazy not a reflection.
It's a little bit of both.
It's showing us who we are and it'salso, it's not, nothing's helping there.
Jerremy (01:40):
Right.
Dave (01:41):
And so I didn't even know anything was going on until you texted
me and said, Hey, this isn't good.
So, yeah, Charlie Kirk, at least today andyesterday and I saw some over the weekend.
Wow.
There's so much energy, particularlyon, just everywhere, so much energy.
Jerremy (02:00):
Yeah.
Dave (02:01):
We could go a million different ways, but some of the
things that occurred to me was I.
Certainly healthy people don't do this.
Jerremy (02:10):
Yes.
Dave (02:10):
And in our upcoming episode with Tyler and also we've talked about it
in previous episodes a lot is, havingpurpose taking care of yourself.
Certainly online culture andwhat, you know, what that can do.
I think a lot of people are likelooking for reasons for this in a
completely unreasonable situation.
(02:32):
And it's very reactive and it's like,okay let's ban all of this online.
I'm like, didn't we just talk aboutthis like a couple of years ago where
like we were banning stuff online?
It's like, we don't wanna do that.
Or like, let's land the governmenton everybody on the left.
And I'm like, oh, that's not good.
That's just gonna be turnedaround right back on you.
There's a, a lot of emotion.
Where are you on this?
(02:52):
Like what were your sort ofinitial thoughts on this and
like what's the bigger picture?
Jerremy (02:56):
All right, so my job presently right now is to really do my best to
listen to both sides on any topic andjust try to distill, try to figure out
what the information is, what peopleare saying, what people are really
feeling while they're feeling that way.
Really having my finger on the pulseso that I can learn, so that I can
(03:17):
study, so I can understand more.
First and foremost, no one wantsanyone to die unnecessarily.
I think that's probably the case and Ithink saying that, making that statement
would seem accurate, but there werea lot of people that were extremely.
I guess happy is the right word ora celebratory around this particular
(03:39):
young man's death, which I just think isvile by any stretch of the imagination.
Dave (03:44):
Sure.
Jerremy (03:44):
think anyone celebrating anyone's death or assassination or
murder is someone that's also mentallyill and the thing, but like you need
to really look into your, and checkyour humanity for a quick second.
Doesn't matter who it is, Bernie, anyone.
Dave (04:00):
Okay.
Jerremy (04:00):
that gets assassinated over a political view
Dave (04:04):
Yeah.
Jerremy (04:06):
that person should not celebrated on the negative side.
Someone really beingexcited that happened.
Dave (04:14):
I hear you and one of my jobs here, right?
Jerremy (04:17):
Yep.
Dave (04:19):
It's like, okay, let's think about this a little bit, because people
are messy, people are complicated.
I don't think it's controversial to saythat Charlie Kirk brought up and he had
some controversy, but he was also, fromeverything that I've ever heard, that
he said, everything that anybody's eversaid about him is he's actually quite
kind and he was willing to engage withpeople just using his words, right.
(04:40):
He was never hyperbolic.
He was never crazy.
He was never angry.
He was never whipping people up.
He just wanted to talk to people and hehad his opinions, like he comes from a
Christian background and things that Idefinitely don't agree with, but I was
also able to hear past those messages andbe like, okay, I get where he is coming
from, and I can't hold that against him.
(05:01):
So saying all that.
Yeah, there was a lot ofcelebration I saw and things online.
I'm like, Ooh.
That just gives you the chills thatanybody would be like, happy about
this and think about this too.
Osama Bin Laden, uh, what, 2010?
Uh, we went in there, we got 'em, andthere were parties in the streets.
(05:27):
Celebrating the death of this man.
And I'm not gonna say that I'm,I, you know, I didn't, I think a
lot of people had like, oh my God.
Yeah, we got him.
And I felt good about that,but I was also quite solemn.
It happened late in the day as I recall,or late, you know, like early evening.
And I lived in Washington, DCand so I went down to the, uh,
(05:48):
nine 11 memorial at the Pentagon.
Because I lived there duringnine 11, it was very powerful,
particularly living in a spot whereall of this crazy was going on.
Being at a OL and, and being a partof, I mean, it was just bonkers in
particular like you would find inNew York, and I was quite solemn.
Like we'd gone in thereand we'd killed somebody.
(06:09):
We killed family members.
Like part of me just, thatjust doesn't sit well.
Yet I don't think a lot ofpeople would've, would've, uh,
like that one's acceptable.
And I, and I'm like, and this one isn't.
I get it.
Do you see the tension there, right?
Like when it's somebody that,when we as, as, evil or bad,
(06:32):
it's like, oh yeah, that's cool.
But when we see somebody who'slike this paragon of virtue,
we're like, oh, that's gross.
If somebody's celebrating that.
But I can also see where likepeople were pretty grumpy.
Jerremy (06:45):
Yeah, I was more on the grumpy side, just like the solemn
Dave (06:49):
yeah.
Jerremy (06:49):
I never met Charlie, didn't know
I was
Dave (06:51):
Yeah.
Jerremy (06:52):
slotted to meet him in the next couple of weeks, ironically.
And to your point.
I don't agree with most people.
Especially a hundred percent of the time.
I almost, that's almost no one
Dave (07:05):
I don't agree with myself half the time,
Jerremy (07:07):
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Me and my wife I'm over here.
I don't know about this babe.
think Olive Garden is not superior, so
Dave (07:15):
red Lobster, we gotta talk about those cheesy breads.
Jerremy (07:18):
fascinating man, what's fascinating is.
For you to create such a humantension is accurate, right?
Like the humanity of whatever anindividual is doing or feels around
another individual's assassination isa very challenging, really metaphysical
(07:38):
concept to wrap our heads around becauseultimately it's gonna be a propaganda
of who's right and who's wrong, right?
What side are you on?
What do you believe in that person?
There are plenty of outlets that Itrack and that I watch that are going
to, and that did paint Charlie Kirk asa bigot, as a misogynist, as a racist,
Dave (07:58):
Oof.
Jerremy (07:59):
And they were very forthright
Dave (08:00):
Yeah.
Jerremy (08:01):
those terms.
And I don't remember personallyor specifically at least a
bunch of American outlets.
And again, at the time, I wasn'textremely involved in politics, but
like 2010 being like, oh, Osama bad.
Laden's a great individual, but again,
Dave (08:16):
Yeah.
Jerremy (08:16):
But we don't live over there.
Where a lot of people probablydid celebrate that fact.
Celebrate him as a human beingand a virtuous individual, right?
There's, I'm sure.
A modicum of people that felt that wayand they probably were quite perturbed
and disturbed in his assassination.
I will go on record and say, I don'tpersonally think that it's something
(08:38):
that's worthy of celebrating, ingeneral, but you are always in
life gonna have to pick a side.
It doesn't matter what side it is.
It could be a religious side, it couldbe a political side, it could be a war.
Side, because if you live in a particularcountry and you're patriotic and your
country gets attacked, or you getcalled to go to war by the president,
(08:59):
which is really essentially his jobas chief and commanding officer,
gonna have to go and you're gonnahave to be the more virtuous person.
And that's a challenge, man.
It's a humanistic, very deep inmy opinion, just metaphysical
obstacle for all of us at somestage, overcoming our life.
Dave (09:19):
So for our listeners, this isn't gonna come as a surprise, the work
that we're doing here is not onlyabout your learning, my learning and
really exploring what's going on.
With America, but alsofuture leadership and
Your moral compass thatdrives your decisions.
I, instead of being online,what I was doing was listening
(09:40):
to I wanna say books on tape.
No.
Just audio books.
And some things that have been in Yeah.
Cassettes.
Yeah.
And I got on a kick on early Christianity.
I mean, like early Christianity,like first century, second century,
you know, like right there.
And I was kind of curious.
I'm doing a run on theology.
I have Islam in there.
(10:01):
I have some, Judaism in there.
Like, I'm kind of curious.
It's like, okay.
At the beginning of these thingsthey were causing a lot of problems
to a lot of people who are in power.
How early Christians really struggledwith a lot of the aspects of,
the faith and they debated them.
I mean, they debated them forcenturies, to get things sort
of where they needed to be.
(10:22):
There is a certain moral clarity thatI appreciate with the Catholic church.
They just straight up saythere's a sanctity to human life.
And that's it.
It is black and white.
And that leads to abortion.
That leads to capital punishment.
That leads to all aspects.
They said, Hey, this is theline and you shall not cross it.
(10:46):
I sort of appreciate that and that's,you know, that's not my moral framework
because there's like, well, it depends,you know, I mean, you know, like, I think
we might actually look at, like, you andI disagree a bit on capital punishment.
I'm like, oh, I don't want togive this power to the state.
But on the other hand, it's like whensomebody does a truly heinous crime,
(11:10):
you're like, okay, well I get it.
My point on this is we shouldn't becelebrating anybody's death, but I also
get it, but there's also a line that'sthere, and I don't know what that line is.
There's like, you know,a giddiness about it.
It's like you have to look atsomebody and be like, if you're
celebrating this like that, I wouldquestion all of your, judgements.
(11:33):
Yeah, you see the grayarea that I'm dipping into.
It's like this isn't,
Jerremy (11:38):
I get it.
Dave (11:38):
Like I don't want to demonize people for their beliefs and their
feelings on things, but like theglee on it is oh, that is gross.
And there was glee around Osama bin Laden.
There's glee.
When a pedophile isput to death, there is,
Jerremy (11:53):
you're getting into the whole like baby Hitler discussion also, right?
when you talk about moralcompasses, here's my general take
on humanity, and human rights.
you a human?
Dave (12:06):
Yeah.
Jerremy (12:07):
Meaning are you doing your best serve humanity as what?
I think all of ancestrallineages would agree.
doing a good job of trying to be a human.
Dave (12:24):
Yeah.
We all struggle and you gota b plus on human this week.
Got it.
Jerremy (12:28):
'Cause here was a challenge with some of the glee, right?
There was a lot of people that wasthrowing around the N word, Nazi.
Dave (12:33):
Oh,
Jerremy (12:34):
word,
Dave (12:34):
that's not good.
That's not good.
Jerremy (12:36):
They're calling a Charlie Kirk a Nazi.
And here's my bigchallenge with that word,
Dave (12:42):
Oh, it's bad.
Jerremy (12:43):
if someone uses that word in relation to another person because
they're white, because that's, aNazi obviously has to be white.
You are categorizing anotherindividual with someone who actually
murdered people often and a lot.
I would say by definition, you are aheinous person that commits crimes and
(13:04):
murders people because of their raceand religion, then you are not a Nazi.
Dave (13:11):
Yeah.
Jerremy (13:12):
That's what they did.
Dave (13:13):
Yeah.
Jerremy (13:13):
to do that.
You have to be that exact individualand that exact type of archetype.
And that's a heinous person.
So someone, in my opinion, who doesn'tvalue the human life in the terms of this
person is a living, breathing, aware,conscious human, they are creating.
(13:35):
Disastrous energy, physically,mentally, metaphorically, emotionally
and spiritually for other people.
And then they take another person'slife regardless of who they are.
That person begins to lose certain humanand imitable rights, in my opinion.
(13:55):
That's just kinda my belief, right?
You start taking now.
Now if two individualssign up for a boxing match.
And they sign all their waivers andone other person gets beat to death
'cause it's a bare knuckle boxing match.
I generally, I'm not gonna celebratethe fact that the other person
died because I am a great righteousperson, I feel like most of the time.
(14:16):
But number two, theyagreed to that proposition.
They knew going into that right.
Signing the waiver and writing everythingout, that this is an actual possibility.
Dave (14:27):
Yeah.
Jerremy (14:27):
when you have a.
A gentleman, who is known for sayingvery controversial things for sure.
So this is Ben Shapiro, right?
So it's Jordan Peterson.
So this is Joe Rogan, right?
For an individual saying controversialthings it, and then on a college
campus for free in front of thousandsof young people gets assassinated.
(14:53):
That particular person lostall of their human rights,
Dave (14:55):
Nobody deserves death on the basis of what they say, even if
it's heinous, is what I'm hearing.
Jerremy (15:01):
Yep.
Dave (15:01):
Yeah.
Jerremy (15:02):
Exactly.
'Cause that's the whole like,free speech thing and so yeah.
You should not.
Again, you can have rights and youcan have privileges, and you can
have things that get taken awayfrom you for a period of time.
There's a lot of people, and again,I follow Twitter on both sides very
aggressively, but there's a lot ofpeople that are losing their jobs
because they started celebrating,
Dave (15:21):
Yeah.
Jerremy (15:21):
Charlie Kirk's death, and they were saying things
like he brought it to himself.
He was a huge gunner owner.
He would saying these things about theSecond Amendment and he said that people
would have to die to, for the Americato keep their Second Amendment rights.
Good on you, Charlie.
You brought it on yourself, right?
Saying a lot of quotes.
That was the vice president ofa college that I'm close to.
MTSU.
(15:42):
Murphysboro Tate Murphysboro, statetech University, I think MSTU.
It's whatever.
It's, and that vice president losttheir job within three hours and
there were a lot of people thatfell into that same fate of saying
something online that was glee, touse your term, very happy about it.
And they got fired.
Good.
Yeah.
I would fire you too, right?
(16:04):
Because there's a time anda place and that's not it.
When I say there's a time and a placelike in a discussion, in a debate,
in a historical context, in a, papercontext, in a educational or scholarly
context, there can be situations whereyou can have these conversations.
But to have extreme excitementover anyone dying, especially
(16:26):
someone who has kids, unacceptable.
Dave (16:29):
Yeah.
Jerremy (16:30):
Yeah, man, it is, yeah we do, we have really cool different
opinions and that's great, man.
But that's the part is you're nevergoing to maliciously attack me for
just simply having a belief, becauseif you get offended, that's all right.
You can just be offended.
Now, here is one thing that I will say.
The brokenness of any country is in directproportion to the brokenness of men.
Dave (16:52):
Ooh.
Jerremy (16:53):
The brokenness of any country is in direct proportion
to the brokenness of men.
It is men who rape.
It is men who kill.
Dave (17:01):
Yeah.
Jerremy (17:02):
is men who torture.
It is men who create themost heinous crimes by far.
Dave (17:07):
Yep.
Jerremy (17:07):
Who shoots up schools?
Dave (17:09):
Yeah,
Jerremy (17:09):
who commits assassinations?
Men.
Dave (17:12):
Under 30.
Man, you're crazy, right?
Jerremy (17:15):
Yeah.
Who tortures and serial killers,
Dave (17:18):
Yep.
Jerremy (17:19):
Yes, women can commit atrocities, right?
Duh.
But it is far male,
Dave (17:27):
Yep.
Jerremy (17:28):
and it's generally a white male, that's gonna commit the heinous
of crimes the most atrocious of crimes.
Often, at leastdomestically here in the us.
And so me to understand, and the funpolarization and this probably might
(17:48):
be a whole different conversationfor a whole different time, the
toxic masculinity approach of men.
The patriarchal system iswhat's causing the problem.
I get it.
I see it, I understand it.
I know why people feel that way.
And at the same time to pander toindividuals saying that there is no
such thing as a biological male atbirth and a biological female at birth.
(18:11):
And that, that just doesn't exist wild.
Because I think in that.
Opposition statementis a lot of solutions.
And what I mean by that is weactually talked pretty early on
about school shootings and obviouslyhow horrific that all always is.
And again, it's almost always male.
98% of the time, what if inthis country we treated men a
(18:34):
little differently intentionally.
Intentionally
Differently because, oh youwere born a male, you are a
Therefore the likelihood thatyou are going to be a disaster
has automatically increased.
Dave (18:48):
I think I know where you're going with this.
It's we're not sayingyou're a dude, you're bad.
We're saying, Hey, just the realityof it is that you need more care.
You need more water,you need more feeding.
You need extra.
Extra.
We wanna make sure that we love you up andwe make sure that you have what you need.
Because when you go bad.
Bad,
Yeah.
Jerremy (19:07):
And if in school, okay, everyone ladies you get to go have
recess and go do whatever you wanna do.
And all, for all my boys,it's breathing time.
Dave (19:16):
Yeah.
Jerremy (19:17):
And just breathe and
Packed, animals by nature.
Biologically we are proneto do better in groups.
And I think, again, man, justultimately, yeah, to your point,
nothing to do with men versus women.
It has everything to do with if men aretreated well, if we have leaders, and
(19:38):
this is a whole nother topic I'm aboutto bring up, but if we have actual people
who lead from a heart-centered place, aplace of love, and of compassion and care.
Very good chance they can stir and leadmovements of men to do the exact same
thing because inherently men are not bad.
We're not evil.
But if and take untaken care of isprobably not the best grammatical
(19:59):
term, but if we are left to our owndevices men are the biggest problem
that faced this us are unhealed,
Dave (20:08):
Yeah.
Jerremy (20:08):
angry little boys dressed up as men.
Dave (20:13):
Oh, we see this internationally too, like the, when you strip a man's
purpose and you ensure that they haveno way out, it's very radicalizing,
and that's how you get terrorists.
That is exactly the feed into.
Radicalization, and that's how you geta young man to strap a bomb to themself
(20:34):
is to be like, Hey, this is terrible.
The world's terrible.
Everyone's terrible, and thoseare the people over there
that are causing you problems.
So strap on this vest and start shootingpeople up, and that, that is the path.
But when somebody sees a path forward,they get a job, they can get a job, they
can start a family, they can have kids.
(20:54):
The generic, whatever it is of.
Purpose and direction, then it'slike, all of that is just noise.
It's there is nobody that haspurpose and love in their life and
people in their life that thinksI'm gonna shoot up a school.
Jerremy (21:07):
Correct.
Dave (21:07):
But on the other side of this, the person who's shooting up the school
doesn't have any of those things.
Are they tied together?
Yeah.
So let's let's live up theseguys and let's figure this out.
And that's where it's,before we leave this.
Because we have a lot totalk about here today.
I want to show you a video that actuallycame out right after President Trump when
(21:28):
he was on the campaign trail was shot.
And it's our buddy Peter Zhan, who justreally sees the world in a different way.
We're gonna play this,we're gonna watch it.
We can't do this on our podcastright now, but I'll put a link to
it in the show notes if you wannasee what we're talking about.
Okay, so we just watched the Zon thing.
(21:48):
What do you, I think youlaid out a compelling case.
What do you think
Jerremy (21:51):
I agree.
Man.
That guy is so smart.
Dave (21:54):
that was A year over a year ago.
Jerremy (21:56):
crazy.
Nailed it.
Him and the Simpsons are time travelers.
Dave (22:01):
So I, you know, I.
Everybody who's listening tothis just take six minutes and
watch that thing from Zhan.
But he's basically setting upexactly what we're seeing today,
which is a lot of turmoil.
But what we didn't hear is like, okay,we know it's gonna get weird or weirder.
Maybe this is as weird asit's gonna get, but maybe not.
So what do you, how do we get out of this?
(22:22):
Where do we go from here?
Like every one of those thingsthat he mentioned, whether it was
Reconstruction or the Civil War orthe Great Depression, like those
getting out of those were a thing.
So what do you what's next?
What's the Jerremy?
Newsom Crystal Ball.
Jerremy (22:37):
Man, the challenge is we need leaders who actually care and who don't
Dave (22:41):
Yeah.
Jerremy (22:42):
instantly.
I was wondering how long it wouldtake me before I got to the absolute
horrific statement that Trump madeafter Charlie Kirk got assassinated.
Blaming the left instantly.
And dude, to be that callous is
Dave (23:02):
Yeah.
Jerremy (23:03):
unbelievable.
Dave (23:05):
Yeah.
It's bonkers.
Jerremy (23:06):
because at the time, it could have been another podcast host didn't like
Charlie 'cause he was a competitor, couldhave been a bad business deal gone wrong.
Charlie had a bunch of money,he did a lot of things going on,
like he had a lot of investments.
Could have been anything.
And for him to just in instantly.
That's what we need, man.
(23:28):
We need someone who can actuallylead with a heart and is just kind
and compassionate and has a moralcompass and thinks for 25 seconds
before they get extremely emotional.
I can get extremely emotional aswell, but that's why I didn't really
say anything for a very long time.
Still really haven't, other than my justgeneral post of listen when the world is
an absolute shit storm, it's because ofsome stupid ass guy doing something wrong.
(23:51):
'cause he is very angry like that.
Dave (23:53):
Yeah.
Jerremy (23:53):
And
Dave (23:54):
Yeah.
Jerremy (23:55):
Yeah man, I mean it just, to me, I think big crystal ball a lot of
it's gonna stem from, a lot of thiseconomy situation that's happening
right now is Trump really gave everyonean insider trading tip on the broader
markets when he posted in April.
On Twitter, right from his Twitteraccount like, this is a great time to buy
(24:18):
stocks right at its low, at its bottom.
I think there's a lot ofmanipulation in the White House.
Now, again I still think it'salmost entirely all about money
and legacy and wealth for Trump.
Again, that's just kindamy personal opinion.
But ultimately, the big shift is going tocome from a very unifying moment as insane
(24:39):
as it is, and as Peter mentioned in thatvideo, I think this might've been it, this
might've been some unification maybe nota unification moment, maybe unification
of a certain party or a certain group ofindividuals, but for an individualistic
pinpoint era, for something tohappen, for everyone to come together.
really hope it isn't what itprobably will end up having to be.
(25:02):
But I really would like it to besomething that would, that's much,
I have no idea what it'll be.
But at this point, maybeit's the economy, right?
Meaning the unification that bringseveryone together is the greatest
economy in the world where everyone'sextremely wealthy we have a humongous
crash and everyone is pitiful together.
And we don't we just blame.
Sure, everyone blames Trumpand they blame the economy.
(25:22):
But now you have something that everyonecan focus on, which is, what happened
in 2008, which is one of the big reasonswhy Obama got elected was just that big
hey, we had Bush as president for eightyears and the economy's collapsing.
Everyone can rally behind that.
And he had that message at theright time, at the right place.
And I think with the rate cutright around the corner at this
point, pretty much just baked in.
(25:43):
I think prices of assets, as I'vebeen saying for a little bit, they.
Seemingly are gonna continue to go higher.
Alex (25:49):
Jerremy slams celebrating any death as a humanity check, while Dave
draws uneasy parallels to bin Laden.
Their back-and-forth exposesthe tension in judging others.
Yet the raw turn waits—when Nazislurs fly casually, what does that
do to real human rights and dignity?
Okay.
Welcome to another episodeof America's Got Problems.
Jerremy (00:04):
That's right.
That's we rebranded.
Dave (00:08):
So every now and then we pop in and talk about
Jerremy (00:11):
about.
Dave (00:12):
what's going on in the world.
But not hot takes where we're sortof seeing it, where it's going.
And this is one of those sessions, likenormally what our listeners, what you
guys are gonna hear this week, you'regonna hear, you know, our regular show.
But at the end of this week, uh,we're going to tack these on.
So I believe our, our shows runMonday, Tuesday, Wednesday this week.
And so this will go upon Thursday, Friday.
(00:34):
So if you're listening to this,you're gonna be a couple of days
out, but at least our goal here,starting out, it's going to be.
Not so much evergreen, but it's gonnabe like a slice of life right now.
And a little, bit more topical, butalso a little bit more of deeper issues.
So my friend, my buddy, my brother.
Jerremy (00:53):
Yes
Dave (00:53):
welcome.
Jerremy (00:54):
Thank you
Dave (00:55):
So not much going on, right?
Jerremy (00:57):
very little.
We had to really dig deep to finddiscussions for today's topics.
I'm glad we're doing this.
I'm glad we're doing a up todate like what's going on.
'cause there is, there's so much going on.
There's so much wildness out there.
So much division and hate andanimosity, and a lot of people
are, a lot of people are feelinglost and sad and confused and yeah.
(01:21):
I think this is a great time forus to just connect with the folks.
Dave (01:25):
Yeah, it's curious.
I'd been taking a break from socialmedia, which I think everybody needs
to be doing because being terminallyonline, I think that's actually one of
the causes of the crazy not a reflection.
It's a little bit of both.
It's showing us who we are and it'salso, it's not, nothing's helping there.
Jerremy (01:40):
Right.
Dave (01:41):
And so I didn't even know anything was going on until you texted
me and said, Hey, this isn't good.
So, yeah, Charlie Kirk, at least today andyesterday and I saw some over the weekend.
Wow.
There's so much energy, particularlyon, just everywhere, so much energy.
Jerremy (02:00):
Yeah.
Dave (02:01):
We could go a million different ways, but some of the
things that occurred to me was I.
Certainly healthy people don't do this.
Jerremy (02:10):
Yes.
Dave (02:10):
And in our upcoming episode with Tyler and also we've talked about it
in previous episodes a lot is, havingpurpose taking care of yourself.
Certainly online culture andwhat, you know, what that can do.
I think a lot of people are likelooking for reasons for this in a
completely unreasonable situation.
(02:32):
And it's very reactive and it's like,okay let's ban all of this online.
I'm like, didn't we just talk aboutthis like a couple of years ago where
like we were banning stuff online?
It's like, we don't wanna do that.
Or like, let's land the governmenton everybody on the left.
And I'm like, oh, that's not good.
That's just gonna be turnedaround right back on you.
There's a, a lot of emotion.
Where are you on this?
(02:52):
Like what were your sort ofinitial thoughts on this and
like what's the bigger picture?
Jerremy (02:56):
All right, so my job presently right now is to really do my best to
listen to both sides on any topic andjust try to distill, try to figure out
what the information is, what peopleare saying, what people are really
feeling while they're feeling that way.
Really having my finger on the pulseso that I can learn, so that I can
(03:17):
study, so I can understand more.
First and foremost, no one wantsanyone to die unnecessarily.
I think that's probably the case and Ithink saying that, making that statement
would seem accurate, but there werea lot of people that were extremely.
I guess happy is the right word ora celebratory around this particular
(03:39):
young man's death, which I just think isvile by any stretch of the imagination.
Dave (03:44):
Sure.
Jerremy (03:44):
think anyone celebrating anyone's death or assassination or
murder is someone that's also mentallyill and the thing, but like you need
to really look into your, and checkyour humanity for a quick second.
Doesn't matter who it is, Bernie, anyone.
Dave (04:00):
Okay.
Jerremy (04:00):
that gets assassinated over a political view
Dave (04:04):
Yeah.
Jerremy (04:06):
that person should not celebrated on the negative side.
Someone really beingexcited that happened.
Dave (04:14):
I hear you and one of my jobs here, right?
Jerremy (04:17):
Yep.
Dave (04:19):
It's like, okay, let's think about this a little bit, because people
are messy, people are complicated.
I don't think it's controversial to saythat Charlie Kirk brought up and he had
some controversy, but he was also, fromeverything that I've ever heard, that
he said, everything that anybody's eversaid about him is he's actually quite
kind and he was willing to engage withpeople just using his words, right.
(04:40):
He was never hyperbolic.
He was never crazy.
He was never angry.
He was never whipping people up.
He just wanted to talk to people and hehad his opinions, like he comes from a
Christian background and things that Idefinitely don't agree with, but I was
also able to hear past those messages andbe like, okay, I get where he is coming
from, and I can't hold that against him.
(05:01):
So saying all that.
Yeah, there was a lot ofcelebration I saw and things online.
I'm like, Ooh.
That just gives you the chills thatanybody would be like, happy about
this and think about this too.
Osama Bin Laden, uh, what, 2010?
Uh, we went in there, we got 'em, andthere were parties in the streets.
(05:27):
Celebrating the death of this man.
And I'm not gonna say that I'm,I, you know, I didn't, I think a
lot of people had like, oh my God.
Yeah, we got him.
And I felt good about that,but I was also quite solemn.
It happened late in the day as I recall,or late, you know, like early evening.
And I lived in Washington, DCand so I went down to the, uh,
(05:48):
nine 11 memorial at the Pentagon.
Because I lived there duringnine 11, it was very powerful,
particularly living in a spot whereall of this crazy was going on.
Being at a OL and, and being a partof, I mean, it was just bonkers in
particular like you would find inNew York, and I was quite solemn.
Like we'd gone in thereand we'd killed somebody.
(06:09):
We killed family members.
Like part of me just, thatjust doesn't sit well.
Yet I don't think a lot ofpeople would've, would've, uh,
like that one's acceptable.
And I, and I'm like, and this one isn't.
I get it.
Do you see the tension there, right?
Like when it's somebody that,when we as, as, evil or bad,
(06:32):
it's like, oh yeah, that's cool.
But when we see somebody who'slike this paragon of virtue,
we're like, oh, that's gross.
If somebody's celebrating that.
But I can also see where likepeople were pretty grumpy.
Jerremy (06:45):
Yeah, I was more on the grumpy side, just like the solemn
Dave (06:49):
yeah.
Jerremy (06:49):
I never met Charlie, didn't know
I was
Dave (06:51):
Yeah.
Jerremy (06:52):
slotted to meet him in the next couple of weeks, ironically.
And to your point.
I don't agree with most people.
Especially a hundred percent of the time.
I almost, that's almost no one
Dave (07:05):
I don't agree with myself half the time,
Jerremy (07:07):
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Me and my wife I'm over here.
I don't know about this babe.
think Olive Garden is not superior, so
Dave (07:15):
red Lobster, we gotta talk about those cheesy breads.
Jerremy (07:18):
fascinating man, what's fascinating is.
For you to create such a humantension is accurate, right?
Like the humanity of whatever anindividual is doing or feels around
another individual's assassination isa very challenging, really metaphysical
(07:38):
concept to wrap our heads around becauseultimately it's gonna be a propaganda
of who's right and who's wrong, right?
What side are you on?
What do you believe in that person?
There are plenty of outlets that Itrack and that I watch that are going
to, and that did paint Charlie Kirk asa bigot, as a misogynist, as a racist,
Dave (07:58):
Oof.
Jerremy (07:59):
And they were very forthright
Dave (08:00):
Yeah.
Jerremy (08:01):
those terms.
And I don't remember personallyor specifically at least a
bunch of American outlets.
And again, at the time, I wasn'textremely involved in politics, but
like 2010 being like, oh, Osama bad.
Laden's a great individual, but again,
Dave (08:16):
Yeah.
Jerremy (08:16):
But we don't live over there.
Where a lot of people probablydid celebrate that fact.
Celebrate him as a human beingand a virtuous individual, right?
There's, I'm sure.
A modicum of people that felt that wayand they probably were quite perturbed
and disturbed in his assassination.
I will go on record and say, I don'tpersonally think that it's something
(08:38):
that's worthy of celebrating, ingeneral, but you are always in
life gonna have to pick a side.
It doesn't matter what side it is.
It could be a religious side, it couldbe a political side, it could be a war.
Side, because if you live in a particularcountry and you're patriotic and your
country gets attacked, or you getcalled to go to war by the president,
(08:59):
which is really essentially his jobas chief and commanding officer,
gonna have to go and you're gonnahave to be the more virtuous person.
And that's a challenge, man.
It's a humanistic, very deep inmy opinion, just metaphysical
obstacle for all of us at somestage, overcoming our life.
Dave (09:19):
So for our listeners, this isn't gonna come as a surprise, the work
that we're doing here is not onlyabout your learning, my learning and
really exploring what's going on.
With America, but alsofuture leadership and
Your moral compass thatdrives your decisions.
I, instead of being online,what I was doing was listening
(09:40):
to I wanna say books on tape.
No.
Just audio books.
And some things that have been in Yeah.
Cassettes.
Yeah.
And I got on a kick on early Christianity.
I mean, like early Christianity,like first century, second century,
you know, like right there.
And I was kind of curious.
I'm doing a run on theology.
I have Islam in there.
(10:01):
I have some, Judaism in there.
Like, I'm kind of curious.
It's like, okay.
At the beginning of these thingsthey were causing a lot of problems
to a lot of people who are in power.
How early Christians really struggledwith a lot of the aspects of,
the faith and they debated them.
I mean, they debated them forcenturies, to get things sort
of where they needed to be.
(10:22):
There is a certain moral clarity thatI appreciate with the Catholic church.
They just straight up saythere's a sanctity to human life.
And that's it.
It is black and white.
And that leads to abortion.
That leads to capital punishment.
That leads to all aspects.
They said, Hey, this is theline and you shall not cross it.
(10:46):
I sort of appreciate that and that's,you know, that's not my moral framework
because there's like, well, it depends,you know, I mean, you know, like, I think
we might actually look at, like, you andI disagree a bit on capital punishment.
I'm like, oh, I don't want togive this power to the state.
But on the other hand, it's like whensomebody does a truly heinous crime,
(11:10):
you're like, okay, well I get it.
My point on this is we shouldn't becelebrating anybody's death, but I also
get it, but there's also a line that'sthere, and I don't know what that line is.
There's like, you know,a giddiness about it.
It's like you have to look atsomebody and be like, if you're
celebrating this like that, I wouldquestion all of your, judgements.
(11:33):
Yeah, you see the grayarea that I'm dipping into.
It's like this isn't,
Jerremy (11:38):
I get it.
Dave (11:38):
Like I don't want to demonize people for their beliefs and their
feelings on things, but like theglee on it is oh, that is gross.
And there was glee around Osama bin Laden.
There's glee.
When a pedophile isput to death, there is,
Jerremy (11:53):
you're getting into the whole like baby Hitler discussion also, right?
when you talk about moralcompasses, here's my general take
on humanity, and human rights.
you a human?
Dave (12:06):
Yeah.
Jerremy (12:07):
Meaning are you doing your best serve humanity as what?
I think all of ancestrallineages would agree.
doing a good job of trying to be a human.
Dave (12:24):
Yeah.
We all struggle and you gota b plus on human this week.
Got it.
Jerremy (12:28):
'Cause here was a challenge with some of the glee, right?
There was a lot of people that wasthrowing around the N word, Nazi.
Dave (12:33):
Oh,
Jerremy (12:34):
word,
Dave (12:34):
that's not good.
That's not good.
Jerremy (12:36):
They're calling a Charlie Kirk a Nazi.
And here's my bigchallenge with that word,
Dave (12:42):
Oh, it's bad.
Jerremy (12:43):
if someone uses that word in relation to another person because
they're white, because that's, aNazi obviously has to be white.
You are categorizing anotherindividual with someone who actually
murdered people often and a lot.
I would say by definition, you are aheinous person that commits crimes and
(13:04):
murders people because of their raceand religion, then you are not a Nazi.
Dave (13:11):
Yeah.
Jerremy (13:12):
That's what they did.
Dave (13:13):
Yeah.
Jerremy (13:13):
to do that.
You have to be that exact individualand that exact type of archetype.
And that's a heinous person.
So someone, in my opinion, who doesn'tvalue the human life in the terms of this
person is a living, breathing, aware,conscious human, they are creating.
(13:35):
Disastrous energy, physically,mentally, metaphorically, emotionally
and spiritually for other people.
And then they take another person'slife regardless of who they are.
That person begins to lose certain humanand imitable rights, in my opinion.
(13:55):
That's just kinda my belief, right?
You start taking now.
Now if two individualssign up for a boxing match.
And they sign all their waivers andone other person gets beat to death
'cause it's a bare knuckle boxing match.
I generally, I'm not gonna celebratethe fact that the other person
died because I am a great righteousperson, I feel like most of the time.
(14:16):
But number two, theyagreed to that proposition.
They knew going into that right.
Signing the waiver and writing everythingout, that this is an actual possibility.
Dave (14:27):
Yeah.
Jerremy (14:27):
when you have a.
A gentleman, who is known for sayingvery controversial things for sure.
So this is Ben Shapiro, right?
So it's Jordan Peterson.
So this is Joe Rogan, right?
For an individual saying controversialthings it, and then on a college
campus for free in front of thousandsof young people gets assassinated.
(14:53):
That particular person lostall of their human rights,
Dave (14:55):
Nobody deserves death on the basis of what they say, even if
it's heinous, is what I'm hearing.
Jerremy (15:01):
Yep.
Dave (15:01):
Yeah.
Jerremy (15:02):
Exactly.
'Cause that's the whole like,free speech thing and so yeah.
You should not.
Again, you can have rights and youcan have privileges, and you can
have things that get taken awayfrom you for a period of time.
There's a lot of people, and again,I follow Twitter on both sides very
aggressively, but there's a lot ofpeople that are losing their jobs
because they started celebrating,
Dave (15:21):
Yeah.
Jerremy (15:21):
Charlie Kirk's death, and they were saying things
like he brought it to himself.
He was a huge gunner owner.
He would saying these things about theSecond Amendment and he said that people
would have to die to, for the Americato keep their Second Amendment rights.
Good on you, Charlie.
You brought it on yourself, right?
Saying a lot of quotes.
That was the vice president ofa college that I'm close to.
MTSU.
(15:42):
Murphysboro Tate Murphysboro, statetech University, I think MSTU.
It's whatever.
It's, and that vice president losttheir job within three hours and
there were a lot of people thatfell into that same fate of saying
something online that was glee, touse your term, very happy about it.
And they got fired.
Good.
Yeah.
I would fire you too, right?
(16:04):
Because there's a time anda place and that's not it.
When I say there's a time and a placelike in a discussion, in a debate,
in a historical context, in a, papercontext, in a educational or scholarly
context, there can be situations whereyou can have these conversations.
But to have extreme excitementover anyone dying, especially
(16:26):
someone who has kids, unacceptable.
Dave (16:29):
Yeah.
Jerremy (16:30):
Yeah, man, it is, yeah we do, we have really cool different
opinions and that's great, man.
But that's the part is you're nevergoing to maliciously attack me for
just simply having a belief, becauseif you get offended, that's all right.
You can just be offended.
Now, here is one thing that I will say.
The brokenness of any country is in directproportion to the brokenness of men.
Dave (16:52):
Ooh.
Jerremy (16:53):
The brokenness of any country is in direct proportion
to the brokenness of men.
It is men who rape.
It is men who kill.
Dave (17:01):
Yeah.
Jerremy (17:02):
is men who torture.
It is men who create themost heinous crimes by far.
Dave (17:07):
Yep.
Jerremy (17:07):
Who shoots up schools?
Dave (17:09):
Yeah,
Jerremy (17:09):
who commits assassinations?
Men.
Dave (17:12):
Under 30.
Man, you're crazy, right?
Jerremy (17:15):
Yeah.
Who tortures and serial killers,
Dave (17:18):
Yep.
Jerremy (17:19):
Yes, women can commit atrocities, right?
Duh.
But it is far male,
Dave (17:27):
Yep.
Jerremy (17:28):
and it's generally a white male, that's gonna commit the heinous
of crimes the most atrocious of crimes.
Often, at leastdomestically here in the us.
And so me to understand, and the funpolarization and this probably might
(17:48):
be a whole different conversationfor a whole different time, the
toxic masculinity approach of men.
The patriarchal system iswhat's causing the problem.
I get it.
I see it, I understand it.
I know why people feel that way.
And at the same time to pander toindividuals saying that there is no
such thing as a biological male atbirth and a biological female at birth.
(18:11):
And that, that just doesn't exist wild.
Because I think in that.
Opposition statementis a lot of solutions.
And what I mean by that is weactually talked pretty early on
about school shootings and obviouslyhow horrific that all always is.
And again, it's almost always male.
98% of the time, what if inthis country we treated men a
(18:34):
little differently intentionally.
Intentionally
Differently because, oh youwere born a male, you are a
Therefore the likelihood thatyou are going to be a disaster
has automatically increased.
Dave (18:48):
I think I know where you're going with this.
It's we're not sayingyou're a dude, you're bad.
We're saying, Hey, just the realityof it is that you need more care.
You need more water,you need more feeding.
You need extra.
Extra.
We wanna make sure that we love you up andwe make sure that you have what you need.
Because when you go bad.
Bad,
Yeah.
Jerremy (19:07):
And if in school, okay, everyone ladies you get to go have
recess and go do whatever you wanna do.
And all, for all my boys,it's breathing time.
Dave (19:16):
Yeah.
Jerremy (19:17):
And just breathe and
Packed, animals by nature.
Biologically we are proneto do better in groups.
And I think, again, man, justultimately, yeah, to your point,
nothing to do with men versus women.
It has everything to do with if men aretreated well, if we have leaders, and
(19:38):
this is a whole nother topic I'm aboutto bring up, but if we have actual people
who lead from a heart-centered place, aplace of love, and of compassion and care.
Very good chance they can stir and leadmovements of men to do the exact same
thing because inherently men are not bad.
We're not evil.
But if and take untaken care of isprobably not the best grammatical
(19:59):
term, but if we are left to our owndevices men are the biggest problem
that faced this us are unhealed,
Dave (20:08):
Yeah.
Jerremy (20:08):
angry little boys dressed up as men.
Dave (20:13):
Oh, we see this internationally too, like the, when you strip a man's
purpose and you ensure that they haveno way out, it's very radicalizing,
and that's how you get terrorists.
That is exactly the feed into.
Radicalization, and that's how you geta young man to strap a bomb to themself
(20:34):
is to be like, Hey, this is terrible.
The world's terrible.
Everyone's terrible, and thoseare the people over there
that are causing you problems.
So strap on this vest and start shootingpeople up, and that, that is the path.
But when somebody sees a path forward,they get a job, they can get a job, they
can start a family, they can have kids.
(20:54):
The generic, whatever it is of.
Purpose and direction, then it'slike, all of that is just noise.
It's there is nobody that haspurpose and love in their life and
people in their life that thinksI'm gonna shoot up a school.
Jerremy (21:07):
Correct.
Dave (21:07):
But on the other side of this, the person who's shooting up the school
doesn't have any of those things.
Are they tied together?
Yeah.
So let's let's live up theseguys and let's figure this out.
And that's where it's,before we leave this.
Because we have a lot totalk about here today.
I want to show you a video that actuallycame out right after President Trump when
(21:28):
he was on the campaign trail was shot.
And it's our buddy Peter Zhan, who justreally sees the world in a different way.
We're gonna play this,we're gonna watch it.
We can't do this on our podcastright now, but I'll put a link to
it in the show notes if you wannasee what we're talking about.
Okay, so we just watched the Zon thing.
(21:48):
What do you, I think youlaid out a compelling case.
What do you think
Jerremy (21:51):
I agree.
Man.
That guy is so smart.
Dave (21:54):
that was A year over a year ago.
Jerremy (21:56):
crazy.
Nailed it.
Him and the Simpsons are time travelers.
Dave (22:01):
So I, you know, I.
Everybody who's listening tothis just take six minutes and
watch that thing from Zhan.
But he's basically setting upexactly what we're seeing today,
which is a lot of turmoil.
But what we didn't hear is like, okay,we know it's gonna get weird or weirder.
Maybe this is as weird asit's gonna get, but maybe not.
So what do you, how do we get out of this?
(22:22):
Where do we go from here?
Like every one of those thingsthat he mentioned, whether it was
Reconstruction or the Civil War orthe Great Depression, like those
getting out of those were a thing.
So what do you what's next?
What's the Jerremy?
Newsom Crystal Ball.
Jerremy (22:37):
Man, the challenge is we need leaders who actually care and who don't
Dave (22:41):
Yeah.
Jerremy (22:42):
instantly.
I was wondering how long it wouldtake me before I got to the absolute
horrific statement that Trump madeafter Charlie Kirk got assassinated.
Blaming the left instantly.
And dude, to be that callous is
Dave (23:02):
Yeah.
Jerremy (23:03):
unbelievable.
Dave (23:05):
Yeah.
It's bonkers.
Jerremy (23:06):
because at the time, it could have been another podcast host didn't like
Charlie 'cause he was a competitor, couldhave been a bad business deal gone wrong.
Charlie had a bunch of money,he did a lot of things going on,
like he had a lot of investments.
Could have been anything.
And for him to just in instantly.
That's what we need, man.
(23:28):
We need someone who can actuallylead with a heart and is just kind
and compassionate and has a moralcompass and thinks for 25 seconds
before they get extremely emotional.
I can get extremely emotional aswell, but that's why I didn't really
say anything for a very long time.
Still really haven't, other than my justgeneral post of listen when the world is
an absolute shit storm, it's because ofsome stupid ass guy doing something wrong.
(23:51):
'cause he is very angry like that.
Dave (23:53):
Yeah.
Jerremy (23:53):
And
Dave (23:54):
Yeah.
Jerremy (23:55):
Yeah man, I mean it just, to me, I think big crystal ball a lot of
it's gonna stem from, a lot of thiseconomy situation that's happening
right now is Trump really gave everyonean insider trading tip on the broader
markets when he posted in April.
On Twitter, right from his Twitteraccount like, this is a great time to buy
(24:18):
stocks right at its low, at its bottom.
I think there's a lot ofmanipulation in the White House.
Now, again I still think it'salmost entirely all about money
and legacy and wealth for Trump.
Again, that's just kindamy personal opinion.
But ultimately, the big shift is going tocome from a very unifying moment as insane
(24:39):
as it is, and as Peter mentioned in thatvideo, I think this might've been it, this
might've been some unification maybe nota unification moment, maybe unification
of a certain party or a certain group ofindividuals, but for an individualistic
pinpoint era, for something tohappen, for everyone to come together.
really hope it isn't what itprobably will end up having to be.
(25:02):
But I really would like it to besomething that would, that's much,
I have no idea what it'll be.
But at this point, maybeit's the economy, right?
Meaning the unification that bringseveryone together is the greatest
economy in the world where everyone'sextremely wealthy we have a humongous
crash and everyone is pitiful together.
And we don't we just blame.
Sure, everyone blames Trumpand they blame the economy.
(25:22):
But now you have something that everyonecan focus on, which is, what happened
in 2008, which is one of the big reasonswhy Obama got elected was just that big
hey, we had Bush as president for eightyears and the economy's collapsing.
Everyone can rally behind that.
And he had that message at theright time, at the right place.
And I think with the rate cutright around the corner at this
point, pretty much just baked in.
(25:43):
I think prices of assets, as I'vebeen saying for a little bit, they.
Seemingly are gonna continue to go higher.
Alex (25:49):
Jerremy slams celebrating any death as a humanity check, while Dave
draws uneasy parallels to bin Laden.
Their back-and-forth exposesthe tension in judging others.
Yet the raw turn waits—when Nazislurs fly casually, what does that
do to real human rights and dignity?
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