June 30, 2021 • 49 mins
Today we’re talking about the nitty gritty - the reality of working intimately with your body. Be prepared for liquids, solids, and gases - just like we are! Our misconception of the week is that working in the adult industry will ruin sex for you, and Holly shares some of the interesting enquiries she’s received lately.
CHAPTERS
1.25: Bodily Functions
38.44: Misconceptions: Sex work ruins sex for you
43.48: Shit People Say: Do not swim with your hooker
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jenna Love (00:00):
Welcome to Somebody You Love or The Sale Of Two
Titties. I'm Jenna love.
Holly Harte (00:08):
And I'm Holly Harte.
Jenna Love (00:10):
And we're experts in disappointing our parents
breaching community guidelines,and banging the people who vote
against our rights.
Holly Harte (00:19):
Before we begin, we'd like to start by
acknowledging the traditionalowners of the land on which
we're recording today, which forme is the Ngunnawal people.
Jenna Love (00:26):
And for me is the Darug and Gundungurra people.
We'd like to acknowledge that ifyou are listening to this
podcast, in so-called Australia,that sovereignty was never
ceded.
Holly Harte (00:36):
We also want to make it clear up front that we
can only speak from our ownexperiences. The sex working
community is wonderfullydiverse. And as white cis women,
we have a lot of privilegeswithin the industry, we can't
speak on behalf of our peers whofind themselves facing more
severe stigma and discriminationthan we do.
Jenna Love (00:52):
It is our hope that by creating this podcast, we are
able to help humanise sexworkers. And eventually, if
anyone even listens to us, wecan provide a platform to share
the voices that represent thediversity of the sex worker
community,
Holly Harte (01:07):
we will be discussing adult topics. So this
podcast may not be suitable forthose under the age of 18. And
today, as you can tell from thetitle, we're talking bodily
functions, so there will be talkof bodily fluids, and some
general things people might finda bit gross. Here we go!
Jenna Love (01:26):
We're going to talk about some of the logistics of
sex work. Because the reality isthat we do use and rely on our
bodies for work, and often inpretty intimate ways. Before
addressing this topic, though, Ijust want to talk about the kind
of concept of sex workersselling our bodies. I mean,
first up, we're not sellinganything like it's a rental
(01:48):
agreement at best.
Holly Harte (01:51):
I like that.
Obviously, we do use our bodies,but we obviously use our mind,
probably more.
Jenna Love (01:58):
Yeah, I think so.
Holly Harte (01:59):
heaps. There are other professions that use and
rely on their bodies, you know,athletes, miners, construction,
even office work and put astrain on your body in various
ways. And you still have to turnup and be there with your body,
you know. So it's a reallyreductive thing to say that we
sell our bodies because we usethem as part of our labour. And
(02:20):
definitely our mind, you know,as we've discussed on our last
show, compassion and caring, andall of that sort of stuff, as
well as the administrative side.
And, you know, the way that weapproach people when they
contact us, even from the firstmessage is engaging our brains.
So yeah, it's very limiting tosay we just sell our bodies.
Jenna Love (02:38):
Definitely, actually, I was just listening
to ABCs The Drum. That was onlast night, this is Saturday. So
it was on Friday night, becauseBella Green was on it.
Holly Harte (02:47):
She's so good.
Jenna Love (02:49):
She's great. And they were talking about sex
work, obviously. And so the waythe programme sort of works is
they get everyone that's on thepanel to chat about each topic.
So Bella, obviously was themain, the main interviewee for
that section. But they spoke toeveryone else about it as well.
And there was a surgeon and, andshe was sort of talking about
(03:11):
how she spends her life treatingpeople, for injuries and for for
bodies that have broken down asa result of what they do with
their body, which for mostpeople is, is work. And we all
have all these injuries. And shewas she was Yeah, brought up
that she doesn't know why, youknow, sex workers are sort of
denigrated for, you know,putting their bodies at risk or
(03:36):
using their bodies. And it wasreally nice to hear that from a
non sex worker, a medicalprofessional. That's very
refreshing. Yeah, very cool. dorecommend checking out the end
of the episode. And I also justthink that the idea that you
know, our bodies, are sold tosomebody, and that's inherently
bad is like, that sort ofsuggests that it means that
(03:59):
somehow we're giving our bodiesaway by doing this job, and that
we're giving ownership of ourbodies away. And it's like the
idea that somebody owns ourbody, because they've put their
dick in it is some reallypatriarchal, arse bullshit. Like
that's
Holly Harte (04:16):
very well said,
Jenna Love (04:18):
it doesn't make any sense to me.
Holly Harte (04:20):
I agree. Look, so obviously, no, we don't sell our
bodies. But we do use them alongwith our minds to do our job.
And that means that there's alot of practical things that we
need to deal with in order to goto work.
Jenna Love (04:32):
So bodily functions.
First up is something that I getasked about by a lot of women
who aren't in the industry,civilians, or civvies, as as we
like to call them. And the thingis, a lot of sex workers have
uteruses...uteri... uterusus Ibelieve is the plural.
Holly Harte (04:57):
Uteri.
Jenna Love (04:59):
Uteri. And a lot of those uteruses shed their lining
on the reg. So periods aresomething that many, not all,
but many sex workers have tomanage. And there's a few
different ways we can do this.
Yeah, there's quite a variety ofoptions. Obviously, there are a
few workers who take time off,particularly when there's, you
(05:21):
know, pain issues and thingslike that. Some will take a week
off work once a month, or atleast the first couple of days
while they're in a fair bit of pain which really causes issues
with their plansOr even just when it's a heavier
flow at the start.
Holly Harte (05:36):
all those sorts of things that come up. Yeah, look,
it's it obviously, wouldmassively affect their
potential income and theirplanning. And just, I mean,
that's a lot of money to you tolose over a year.
Jenna Love (05:49):
I mean, yeah, it's a quarter of the year, isn't it?
Holly Harte (05:51):
It's, it's a lot.
Yeah.
Jenna Love (05:53):
And then there are some of us who skip our periods.
And that's, I think, applies toyou, and I. Holly you're not,
you're also not a fan ofmenstruating, are you?
Holly Harte (06:03):
It's not for me, no, if I can have the option, I
do avoid it. So I haven't had aperiod in over 8 years, I have
the Implanon rod in my arm,which I get changed out every
three years, I know there'squite a lot of men listening who
probably don't understand it.
And I'm not going to explain itin the deepest levels. But
(06:23):
basically, every three years, Igo and get this little hormonal
rod removed and replaced in myarm. And that releases a small
amount of contraception overthat period which basically
means that I think 20% of peoplethat get this rod don't get
periods anymore. But it's athing. It's 99.99%, like, it's
(06:44):
extremely, you know, strongcontraceptive or reliable
contraceptive. So, yeah, that'show I mitigate my period risk.
How about yourself?
Jenna Love (06:58):
Yeah, so I also I mean, I have, I will have the
occasional period. But again, Ihaven't had regular periods
since I was a teenager, I havethe Implanon as well. And I also
am on The Pill, and I skip thesugar pills, which are, so when
you get a packet of the pill,there are placebos in there. And
(07:19):
that's what you're supposed totake during the time when you
get your period. And then you goback onto the actual medication
for the rest of the time. So Idon't take those those sugar
pills.
Holly Harte (07:29):
So that sounds a little bit fussy. Why? Why is
that something that works foryou?
Jenna Love (07:35):
Why do I have both?
Holly Harte (07:36):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (07:38):
Partly because I'm absolutely terrified of
developing a foetus inside me
Holly Harte (07:45):
Valid, yeah.
Jenna Love (07:45):
I use the Implanon and the pill, and I use condoms,
because I just want all of thecontraception that I can
possibly have. Yeah. And that'sa bit and it also became when I
started working as a sex worker.
I was like, it's also reallyhandy to just not have periods.
Yeah. And for me the Implanon--the first time I had an Implanon
it pretty much got rid of myperiods for two years, similar
(08:07):
to what you have. Yeah, but thenthe second time I got one that
didn't happen. It seems superhit and miss. And I know for
some, some people who use it,like 20% or something as well, I
think have like constantbleeding and ha ve massive
issues so it's very--
Holly Harte (08:23):
I have heard of that. Sounds like a nightmare--
Jenna Love (08:24):
Very different depending on the person.
Holly Harte (08:25):
Okay, that's interesting.
Jenna Love (08:27):
So, yeah. And a lot of people, including doctors
would question why I was usingboth.
Holly Harte (08:37):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (08:38):
And sort of suggest that perhaps it wasn't good for
me to have that much oestrogenin my body and particularly with
skipping the sugar pills aswell. And then about two years
ago, I found out that I haveendometriosis. Which is a
situation where you get uterinecells growing outside of the
uterus. It's a whole-- it's awhole thing. And surprisingly
(09:00):
quite common
Holly Harte (09:00):
more common than people think. Yeah, I've got a
lot of friends who are in thathorrible boat.
Jenna Love (09:05):
Yeah, so yeah, I discovered that I had that and
that was through going to see agynaecologist and she actually
said to me that I had beensmashing it because the the sort
of the non invasive treatmentthat they suggest for
endometriosis is actually topump your body with as much
(09:26):
oestrogen as possible.
Holly Harte (09:27):
So coincidentally had been doing the right thing.
Yeah,
Jenna Love (09:31):
yeah, I had been doing the right thing. And at
that point, so I mean, that wasa good 20 years since I first
got my period. Yeah, no,slightly less but I'd
potentially been actuallystaving off the endometriosis
and at that point, when I wentto see her we discovered it and
I had to have surgery. But whatthey, you know, she suggested
(09:53):
that I quite possibly hadactually, um yeah, kept it kept
it at bay for ages. Made me feelgood.
Holly Harte (10:00):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (10:01):
And they also recommend people skipping the
sugar pills.
Holly Harte (10:04):
Yeah, I mean, that's something I was advised
to do by a few doctors before Iwent on Implanon. And but you
know, back when I was on thepill, I was one of those people
who was horribly unreliable atremembering to take it anyway, I
was at a risk. But, you know,some doctors said, Oh, no, it's
it's awful. And some doctorssaid, No, it's absolutely benign
to just keep, you know, youdon't have to have a period for
(10:26):
most people anyway.
Jenna Love (10:29):
So like anything relating to women and their
bodies, there's a hell of a lotof misinformation out there,
including amongst the medicalprofession.
Holly Harte (10:37):
100%. And there's also a lot of things that we
still don't know. And that, youknow, science is still
clarifying, and particularlyaround endometriosis. That's
something that seems to be veryunder researched. So yes,
hopefully, we're getting someclarity around that. So yeah,
not everyone can take hormonalcontraception for a multitude of
(10:59):
reasons. It's not an option foreveryone.
Jenna Love (11:01):
Yeah, I mean, the side effects can be incredibly
serious. So I'd say one of themost common options that I hear
used in the industry is to use asponge. And essentially using a
sponge in this in this contextmean, you can get period
sponges, which are often alsocalled soft tampons. But you can
(11:24):
also use other other things ifyou're in a bind. And basically,
it is basically a soft tampon,you maybe wet it a little bit,
and you push it up insideyourself, push it right up to
the top, and it it stops theflow, basically. Have you used
sponges before?
Holly Harte (11:41):
I never have. I-- to me, sponges, were always such
a wild thing. Like what? Puttinga sponge in your vagina? I
always was so shocked by it, I--look in a lot of ways I I've
grown up a fairly naive person.
And it was just I wasparticularly entering the sex
industry, I was very alone inthat. And I remember my first or
(12:01):
my second brothel shift ever, Iwas really nervous. And I
decided, you know, I couldn't doit. So I called up and told them
I got my period. And they didn'tsort of tell me "Well, you could
actually use a sponge",fortunately, because it was a
lie. And I was just trying toget out of the shift. But it was
years later, when I was workingas a receptionist in a brothel,
(12:21):
that one of, you know, we soldthe girls, which is a whole, you
know, an issue I think that wesold the girls
Jenna Love (12:32):
Let's get into that later
Holly Harte (12:34):
Yeah, yeah, rather than providing them which would
be the right thing to do. But wecharge the, the, you know, the
staff or the workers to buysponges from the reception
counter. So I became more awareof their function then. And
yeah, you know, it's becauseI've been on and off in the sex
industry. And I've never reallybeen in it at a time when I was,
(12:55):
you know, having periods. It'snever been something I've had to
use. But I certainly worked in abrothel on reception and had
workers come to me and say, Oh,my God, Holly, I can't get this
out. Can you help me? Which wasa new, a new thing.
Jenna Love (13:12):
So one brothel that I worked at didn't have proper
sponges, sponges that aredesigned for that purpose. They
had a, you know, one of thoselike big yellow car wash
sponges. I don't know if that'sjust an Aussie thing. Or if it's
just a thing my dad used growingup, but they had one of those in
the cupboard. And if you gotdesperate, you could tear off a
(13:34):
piece. Which I'm sure isn't, youknow, hygienic or healthy. But
when you get desperate, you gotto you know, you got to do what
you got to do.
Holly Harte (13:43):
I mean, it's not that big a deal. But for a
brothel that seems
Jenna Love (13:46):
Yeah, brothel stories. Let's cover that later.
Holly Harte (13:49):
Yeah. Wow.
Jenna Love (13:50):
You would, you would think-- there's a lot of things
you would think
Holly Harte (13:52):
You would reallyg nk they'd go to a little bit
more effort to prepare for theworkers., but wow they've just
got like a car sponge. There yougo guys. Good luck, you know. A
Jenna Love (14:00):
Yep and you just tear a bit off
Holly Harte (14:02):
There's a little bit of vegetable oil for lube as
well if you want. I mean, itjust feels so disorganised. Wow.
Jenna Love (14:10):
Because they usually have vegetable oil laying around
in brothels.
Holly Harte (14:14):
Oh look the things you find in brothels that other
than what you actually need
Jenna Love (14:18):
That's true
Holly Harte (14:19):
there's all sorts of chaos.
Jenna Love (14:21):
That's very true.
Holly Harte (14:22):
Yeah, it was it was really sweet having workers come
to me and sort of say that theyneeded help removing a sponge.
It's a lot of trust to come tosomeone and say, "Hi, I'm having
a hard time getting that out ofme. Can you help me? Can you
help me" and I was always Yes.
Jenna Love (14:36):
Because it can be quite difficult.
Holly Harte (14:37):
It's Yeah, I've heard it sort of--
Jenna Love (14:39):
I've done a few a few removals
Holly Harte (14:41):
Extractions. But yeah, it's a big trust building
exercise and not really a bigdeal at the end of the day.
Look, it's a normal human bodilyfunction. And yeah
Jenna Love (14:52):
Yeah, I mean, I have used sponges because even though
I use the two contraceptives,often or not often, but maybe
once a year I'll forget to takemy pill for a day. And then I'm
like, "Oh, well, I'll just letit happen." And every time I
then regret it, I'm like, "whydid I think that? Why? Why am I
having a period" and I feelquite-- look, this is going into
(15:14):
a different subject, but I feelquite disconnected from my
reproductive parts. Yeah, I'msomebody I'm very comfortable
with my gender and with my mysexuality, but the fact that I
can grow a foetus makes mehuergh, feel very, very
uncomfortable. So having aperiod reminds me of that. And I
just, I just don't, yeah, it'snot a good time. But as a
(15:36):
result, I have occasionally hadto use a sponge, or I have
chosen to use a sponge. I don'thave to, of course, and I found
them really great. I did haveone that went flying out of me,
which was pretty funny. I didn'tactually notice. And the client
was like, "oh, Jenna, I thinkyour sponge is on there." And I
was like, "ah!", I looked downand there was a sponge on the
(15:59):
bed. And obviously I wasembarrased
Holly Harte (16:01):
that's very intimate.
Jenna Love (16:02):
It is very intimate.
This is it. And I've had a fewthat have felt it with their
fingers when they've beenfishing around up there. I think
I've got quite a short vaginalcanal so the good thing about
that is I can get them outeasily. I've never had issues
with them getting lost up aroundthere. And some of my friends
vaginal canals seem to go onforever when I've been fishing
around them trying to get itout. But I've not had that
(16:24):
issue. And it has meant theclients have sort of been up to
feel it.
Holly Harte (16:28):
I've heard that mine goes right up to the left.
Jenna Love (16:32):
They go either side
Holly Harte (16:33):
Yeah. I went for pap tests. My doctor, sometimes
has gone "I cannot find the endof it." And I'm like, it's
right. And she's got to take asharp left. It's a journey. Yes.
Jenna Love (16:45):
Okay, alright, interesting
Holly Harte (16:46):
Is that TMI? I don't know if that's -- we're
talking about periods
Jenna Love (16:49):
No, definitely not.
We'll have to get a doctor on atsome point.
Holly Harte (16:52):
Yeah, we will. So that's a plus that yours is
accessible.
Jenna Love (16:55):
Yeah. So yeah, I have had clients, you know,
notice that I've that I've beenusing one or but you know,
notice, because it's literallythere in front of them.
Holly Harte (17:04):
Yeah
Jenna Love (17:04):
most of the time they don't have that experience.
But every--I've been quitelucky, because every single time
that's happened, the client hasbeen like, "it's completely
fine".
Holly Harte (17:14):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (17:15):
"I understand that--that women menstruate
like, yeah, it's cool, man",
Holly Harte (17:19):
you're a human being.
Jenna Love (17:20):
And I'm a little bit embarrassed. But I'm also like,
"Well, yeah, that's it, man.
Yeah, that is what happens."
Holly Harte (17:26):
Yeah. And the final option is to do nothing. You can
just go with the flow, you couldeven charge extra for that sort
of thing. Everything's a kink,you know?
Jenna Love (17:34):
Absolutely. And, you know, this is also--the subject
of periods is also somethingthat comes up when we have
female clients. I really don'tunderstand why sponges and other
solutions aren't more common andknown about in the civilian
world. And I guess, I mean, youwere one of the people who
(17:54):
didn't know about them, either.
I've had so many--
Holly Harte (17:58):
I was shocked.
Jenna Love (17:58):
Yeah, well, I've had so many female clients, sort of
text me the day before or theday of the booking and say, "Oh,
my God, Jenna, I've just got myperiod" or "my periods lasting
longer than I than it normallydoes. And I'm really stressed.
And do you have any? What do youguys do when you get your
period?" You know? And I've beenlike, "okay, yeah, no worries,
(18:19):
here you go, these are someoptions, I've got a bag full of
sponges, I'll bring one with me,I can help you put it in and
take it out if you need. Butalso, you know, I'll bring my
black towels. So we can putthose down. So you don't have to
sort of worry about, you know,anything, seeing anything that
might embarrass you. And also,I'm fine with it. Because I am
(18:43):
aware that you might bleed. Andthat's cool."
Holly Harte (18:45):
I also had a female client who was a little bit
awkward about that. And she'dexperienced some spotting. And,
you know, she'd had other issueswhere she'd felt really
embarrassed when seeing sexworkers in that position. And I
said, "it's just not really abig deal." Like it's if it's not
a heavy, if we're not going tobe doing sort of a horror scene
looking scenario and it's just,you know, a little bit of
spotting and things like that...
We'll work with it. It'll befine. You know, she offered to
(19:08):
use a sponge and all that sortof stuff. And you know, it's--
I've done-- i'm sure I've dealtwith more unique situations,
than a very normal bodilyfunction.
Jenna Love (19:19):
Exactly.
Holly Harte (19:19):
You know, as long as you're hygienic. That's not a
big deal. Yeah,
Jenna Love (19:23):
yeah.
Holly Harte (19:24):
Let's move on to butt stuff.
Jenna Love (19:26):
Woo butt stuff! So what kind of butt stuff do you
tend to come across in yourwork, Holly?
Holly Harte (19:32):
I mainly do things with other people's butts-- I'm
not a butt person. I'm actuallya butt virgin, believe it or
not. I have never had butt sex.
I've been saving for marriage.
Jenna Love (19:44):
Wait are you actually?
Holly Harte (19:46):
I swear on my life.
Yeah.
Jenna Love (19:50):
You're hysterical
Holly Harte (19:51):
Okay, I am I-- oh, gosh, I feel a little bit... uhh
a little bit coy at the moment,a little bit shy?
Jenna Love (20:00):
Oh a bit vulnerable?
Holly Harte (20:02):
I find it--Yeah, a little bit vulnerable, I find
butt stuff really big like it'sa big deal. I only have a very
little, little, tiny little tinybutthole. And I find it quite,
quite frightening. So I figureif I'm gonna go through that
journey of trust, it's, I thinkwith butt stuff it takes a lot
(20:23):
of trust in someone else. I'mgoing to do that with the man
who wants to put a ring on thisfinger. So that--
Jenna Love (20:29):
Beautiful. You'll let him engage with your ring.
or something. There's a joke inthere about rings.
Holly Harte (20:35):
Yes, yes! We'll put a ring on each of our
appendages. Yeah, absolutely. SoI feel really, really weird for
having that thing but that'sjust my thing. Yeah, I don't
mind the odd you know, buttattention on me. But ahh yeah
I'm not a massive fan of it. Idefinitely will explore someone
(20:56):
else's butt though. I can do amean fisting on someone else's
butt -- I get all sorts of, youknow, butt plugs. Yes. We've
done a holding hand fisting.
Jenna Love (21:07):
Oh, yeah. That was romantic. That was romance, come
on.
Holly Harte (21:11):
That was romantic.
Yeah, that was true friendship,holding hands and fisting
someone at the same time.
Jenna Love (21:17):
Oh and to be clear, the held hands were inside the
rectum. It wasn't our otherhands we were holding.
Holly Harte (21:24):
Yeah, it was very special. So yeah, I don't mind,
you know, doing a bit of buttstuff on other people. How about
you? What's your butt situation?
Jenna Love (21:33):
Yeah, I also do get involved in other people's
butts. But they also getinvolved in mine. And you know
what my view is that if you areold enough to want to put things
in my ass, then you are oldenough to realise that that's
where poop lives. And if you goknocking on Pooh's door, don't
(21:54):
be surprised when Pooh is home -like that's where he lives mate.
Holly Harte (21:57):
I feel the same about it. I've heard people ask
about, you know, enemas and allthat sort of thing. And I
totally, you know, supportpeople doing that it's good for
them. And, you know, I get thatthat's a big thing for a lot of
people -- preparing for buttstuff.
Jenna Love (22:12):
Definitely.
Definitely.
Holly Harte (22:13):
But I think look, if you go poking around, but you
got to expect some some somepoop and I don't love it-- It's
not what I'm looking for. I'mnot going to burn the house
down. You know, I've obviouslyprepared a sterile situation for
that, you know, eventuality. Soyeah, so like I said, there's a
(22:34):
few different things you can doin preparation. You know, people
eat certain things. Look, themost important step, which
everyone should take is justwashing your butt. I can't say
this, like enough. Let's say itlike 10 times in a row repeated
after me, write lines right now,please, everyone listening, wash
your butt. It is so overlooked.
Grab a little bit of soap onyour hand, reach back there and
(23:00):
give it a good scrub. Because alot of people I think just let
the water run down there.
Jenna Love (23:05):
And you might have to touch it. That's --
Holly Harte (23:07):
you might have to touch your butt
Jenna Love (23:10):
I wonder if it's because people are afraid to
touch it. Maybe they think itmakes them gay or something
fucking ridiculous.
Holly Harte (23:17):
I just don't know whether people are like, taught
as children how to washthemselves properly--
particularly penises and all ofthat sort of stuff.
Jenna Love (23:25):
I wasn't
Holly Harte (23:25):
I wasn't and I you know, I think yeah, it's
something probably people don'teven realise that their butts
are so dirty. So it's reallyimportant. Just a little bit of
soap. Give it a quick scrub. Oh,beautiful. That's an exciting,
inviting, butt. Every sex workerout there has had to deal with a
client turning up who have justhad a shower and they clearly
(23:47):
haven't washed their butts. Yougo "oh, God help me."
Jenna Love (23:50):
You can visually see it is what we're saying. And
we've all had at least oneclient who has left skid marks
on the bedsheets.
Holly Harte (23:58):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (23:59):
Like if you're a sex worker, and you haven't had that
happen, I'm sorry to tell youthat it is on its way. It will
happen to you.
Holly Harte (24:06):
It's on its way.
It's so embarrassing. I'vescrambled to pull sheets off the
bed sometimes and I've said "Ohgod I'm embarrassed for them."
And I'm talked about it withfriends and they've gone "No,
let them suffer."
Jenna Love (24:17):
Yeah no I always cover it up. I hope they don't
notice because I don't want themto have to deal with the shame
of that which they shouldn'thave to feel shame about. But I
mean, if they haven't, ofcourse, if we're doing butt
stuff yet then they shouldn'tfeel shame about it. But if we
aren't doing butt stuff I don'tunderstand why poop is leaving
your body.
Holly Harte (24:36):
Yeah, if you just have a generally grubby butt
it's not great.
Jenna Love (24:39):
Grubby butt!
Holly Harte (24:40):
We've just shoved you in the shower, you know, rub
behind your ears, rub your butt,pull back your foreskin, give
everything a quick freshen up.
We've just spent two hoursgetting ready for you, you know,
just meet us halfway, you know,not asking much.
Jenna Love (24:52):
And I mean, it's not well, it's still not pleasant
for you.
Holly Harte (24:55):
Yeah, for me, it's not too stressful. And I guess
one the reasons I'm such a bigfan of, you know doing things to
other people's butts is I don'thave a sense of smell. So I was
born without it, which is calledcongenital anosmia. So I have
never smelt poop before. So tome poop is just not appealing to
(25:16):
look at. I've never smelt it,don't know what it's like so...
Jenna Love (25:18):
I've never so lucky, Holly, the world smells
disgusting. You are so lucky.
Holly Harte (25:23):
People used to tell me that when I worked in a
brothel, they were like, "youare so lucky that you don't have
to smell certain bodily thingswith with some of the clients.
And maybe that's why you lovethe job so much". And I was
like, "I think that's a lot moreto why I love this job, than my
lack of sense of smell", but itdefinitely I think makes certain
things easier. And you know,it's beautiful. I've had clients
(25:44):
turn up and they're like, I wentto so much trouble to not eat
this today. So you wouldn't haveto smell it on my breath. I did
this activity and I had washedreally well. And I was like, "oh
God babe, turn up stinking I donot care. As long as you're
clean, you know, eat the garlic,you know, go to work with paint
fumes, or whatever it is,because I won't even know".
They're really cute about it.
Jenna Love (26:02):
what you're saying is I should send all my smelly
clients to you
Holly Harte (26:05):
send them to me.
Now I don't mind a smelly personas long as they're clean. No
worries. What about you any anylittle niche stories here?
Jenna Love (26:15):
Oh, actually, it's not super, I don't know, if it's
related. Might go on a bit of atangent bear with me, we'll cut
it out if it's terrible. Butthis made me think about -- as
part of one of my hobbies that Ido outside of the sex industry.
I'm trying to how do I describeit without giving away all the
(26:36):
details of it! Basically,there's, there's a whole bunch
of people around and it involvesa fair bit of standing around
and chatting and whatever and abit of downtime. So I was just
sitting at a desk. And rightnext to me, there was a little
group of people having a chatand one of the women there-- her
day job is as a nurse. And theywere all just standing around
(27:00):
talking about her work. And theywere sort of they were saying
"Do you have to like, you know,do people wee themselves
sometimes? Do you have to dealwith, with poop and with vomit
and all that sort of stuff?" Andshe was going "Yep, yep, that's
all part of the job". And theywere like, "Oh, my God," and
they were sort of saying, youknow, nurses, nurses do not get
(27:21):
paid enough. Nurses don't getenough respect. Like, that's
amazing that you do that. Like,and, and I agree with everything
they're saying. There's nothingwrong with that conversation.
But I had a real 'Poor me'moment, because I was just
sitting there going... No onesays that about sex workers. I
(27:42):
deal with vomit and poop andblood. And we and you know, I
have clients who aren't able togo to the bathroom, and I have
to get a bottle out and helpthem do that. Like, and, and I
just, and yeah, I mean, I don'twant to take anything away from
nurses, obviously. But it wasjust this real, you know, all
these people know what I do fora job as well. And I just was
(28:06):
like, No one's going to havethat conversation with me.
Holly Harte (28:10):
No.
Jenna Love (28:10):
And it made me a bit sad
Holly Harte (28:11):
They have no idea that you actually deal with that
extreme-- that extremity ofbodily function.
Jenna Love (28:17):
Yeah. And it's not like every day, obviously, which
it probably is a lot more commonfor nurses.
Holly Harte (28:23):
Yeah yeah yeah
Jenna Love (28:24):
And we also on top of that, have to try and act
sexy through it, you know, whichis an added complication.
Holly Harte (28:33):
If we have to do the stern and nurse routine
that's like, that's a dommething, that's extra.
Jenna Love (28:38):
That-- ooh that is extra,
Holly Harte (28:40):
Beyond just simple washing, like I was mentioning
before, some people like todouce before anal. Neither of us
are experts at all in that sowe're not going to go into it.
But preparation for receivinganal play can range from a few
seconds to multiple days.
Jenna Love (28:56):
Yeah, I have a friend who works in the industry
who she does the full enimaexperience -- she eats a liquid
diet for 48 hours before an analbooking, which is mind blowing
to me because you couldn't payme enough to have a liquid diet
for two days. And you know, shecharges accordingly - her rates
(29:17):
for anal bookings are quite highand justifiably so. And you
know, most sex workers who dooffer anal on them or anal play,
they do charge extra for it andthey require advance notice
because even if they are aquicker preparer, you know, it's
still not something that you canjust sort of throw on someone.
Holly Harte (29:39):
So what do you do to prepare?
Jenna Love (29:41):
Well, I actually don't do any prep for anal, like
none at all. I mean, I like Itry to eat well and I have
showers obviously.
Holly Harte (29:49):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (29:50):
But beyond that, I don't do any anal-specific
preparation. But at the sametime, it's also something I've
never guaranteed, anal sex inbookings, my body is not at all
predictable enough for that.
I've never guaranteed anythingin bookings really, you know,
it's something that happens whenthings feel right. And it
doesn't if they don't, which Ithink is really the reality of a
(30:12):
lot of sex work and a lot of sexin general. Yeah, you know,
we're not robots, we can't justmake our bodies do things on
cue. So often, we have to adaptaround that, whether it be
periods, whether it be IBS, orwhatever it is, and so does the
client. Because the client hasbooked a human, being not a
robot. And that's what they'regetting.
Holly Harte (30:36):
And then there's all the other little things that
like to pop up just beforebooking when someone may be
about to spend the next hourlooking at and touching every
inch of your body.
Jenna Love (30:45):
And you like you just know that if you say slice
your finger and you you've gotto whack a big, ugly bandaid on
it, that the very next clientyou have is going to be one
that's obsessed with hands forwhatever reason, and spends the
entire hour 10 centimetres awayfrom your like manky Band Aid
finger.
Holly Harte (31:03):
Hand! I've sliced myself down there before with a
razor and I've sort of got --not close enough to cancel --
but enough that I go "aw I'llput a bandaid on so I'm
covering" and, you know, that'sreally
Unknown (31:14):
And you spread your legs and you've got a big
band-aid there! You know thatthat next client is going to be
the one that's obsessed withcunnilingus though.
Holly Harte (31:20):
Yeah, it's just Murphy's Law, isn't it?
Jenna Love (31:22):
Yeah.
Holly Harte (31:23):
So I'm a farter. So basically, this is a running
joke with a lot of my clients.
Jenna Love (31:31):
This is why we're friends.
Holly Harte (31:32):
Yeah. It's a running joke with a lot of my
clients. I generally-- look I'mnot gonna say I do it every
booking --but if you've seen mefor like a year or two, I've
probably farted in a booking andwe've both laughed about it, or
you've never come back. Becausethat's just me, especially when
I'm really aroused and I'mbearing down down there is a lot
of pressure. Sometimes a fartslips out. I'm sorry, I'm human.
(31:56):
What can I say? I try to besexy, I try to present the best
virgin. virgin? I'm not avirgin! The best version of
myself but sometimes I fart
Jenna Love (32:05):
I fart so much. When I orgasm farting it is like part
of the experience. Not alwaysbut a lot of the time. And I
think it makes perfect sense coswe're like--you're spreading
your legs and bringing them backtogether like you're letting air
in. And then, as you said,bearing down when you come and
when you're experiencing a lotof pleasure there's often like a
(32:27):
pushing down
Holly Harte (32:28):
Yup
Jenna Love (32:28):
So obviously that's gonna happen. And I find like
sex farts I think are differentto normal farts. You probably
don't know but they don't smellbecause they're just like an air
in and out situation. They'renot-- I don't know enough about
farts
Holly Harte (32:42):
My clients are too charming to tell me if they do
smell so I'm grateful for thatat least.
Jenna Love (32:47):
But there's yeah, there's so many little things
like you said the cut down downthere, ingrown hairs are so
common. Like getting a big juicybutt pimple. You wake up the
morning of a big booking and
Holly Harte (33:01):
I'm lucky I'm not a butt pimple people person.
Jenna Love (33:03):
Oh I hate you
Holly Harte (33:03):
I get em on my face though. They'll turn up and I'll
have like a giant-- Yeah, no,I'm lucky I get the butt
peoples. But I'll get a greatbig face pimple and I'm like
hello there's a mountain. Wouldyou like to go sightseeing on my
face?
Jenna Love (33:15):
Sightseeing! Or, or if you'd like I have a lot of
problems with dryness andallergies. I'm like, I have
reactions to everything. So Ithink actually the first time we
met was while I was on a tour inCanberra. And I had this
reaction. I still don't knowwhat it was, but my face kind of
broke out in this rash. And wasjust-- it was red. And I was mid
(33:38):
tour and sort of thought "ohsomethings going on with my
skin. If I cover up with makeup,that's not going to be good for
it. But at the same time, Idon't want my clients to be like
what is she got this red blotchyrash all over her face". So I
mean, I just tried to put lightmakeup on and I dealt with it
and it was towards the end ofthe tour anyway, thankfully,
made sure the lights weren't toobright in the room. But um, but
(34:01):
you know, these things happen--cracked lips. I get cracked lips
all the time. And clients mightsee that and go "is that a cold
sore?" So there's all theselittle things that pop up
Yeah, I wondered ifthat would come up. Anybody that
Holly Harte (34:11):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and then you know, injuries that
happen as part of work as well.
That's not ideal. I remember youhad an injury when you were in
the Northern Territory, whichwas--put you off work for a
while. I don't know if we wantto wait for another po
has watched the BuzzFeed videosmentioned in the last episode
(34:32):
will know about that. I think weshould discuss that in a
different episode. Just becauseit's a bit of a story to really
tell it properlyAlright we'll save
it. It was a bit of a story.
Yeah, yeah.
Jenna Love (34:43):
But yes, I did. I had a significant injury and I
had to cancel a lot of work.
Holly Harte (34:47):
Another thing we discussed as well as things like
thrush and BV-- these are normalthings that happen to vaginas
sometimes. I went through aperiod when I was working in a
brothel where I was always usingthe house soap And I constantly
was getting thrush-- it was, itwas a really glamorous time. So
you know, you're obviously notsupposed to put soap down there,
Jenna Love (35:08):
or different lubes or different condoms.
Holly Harte (35:10):
Exactly. But fortunately touch wood touch
wood don't want to tempt fatehaven't run into those issues in
a while. So yeah, it's notglamorous, but these are normal
bodily issues. You know
Jenna Love (35:20):
a friend of mine is prone to Bartholin's cysts,
which thank God, I've never hadone. apparently, they, they,
they're really difficult to getrid of, they sound incredibly
painful. And it's basically acyst down there. So it would
make our jobs so difficult. Andeven if you get them drained,
(35:40):
apparently, they have a realtendency to return and come
back. And it just it sounds likeit just sounds awful.
Holly Harte (35:46):
Gosh, makes you feel grateful, doesn't it?
Jenna Love (35:48):
It does. It's not the kind of job that you can,
where you can go to work if youare sick or injured. You know, I
think like, if you've got a bitof a head cold, you're a bit
snotty, you know, you canprobably still go into the
office and just keep yourdistance from other people a
bit. But we, like, we can't gointo a booking and be snorting
all over our clients. Like wejust you know, we can't do that.
Holly Harte (36:12):
It's not sexy
Jenna Love (36:12):
No, it's not sexy.
It's not hygienic. And it'scertainly not the luxury
experience that they're payingfor. Just the other day-- a few
weeks ago, I got a booster shot,a hepatitis booster
shot--vaccine, basically. And Ithought it would be fine. But
then the next day, my arm was sosore. I could I could barely
move it. And I feel like I soundlike I'm overreacting. But it
(36:35):
had a really bad effect on myarm. And I had a booking that
day. And I had to cancel becauseI was like, ah, this sounds like
it's such a minor injury. But Iwas like "I can't roll around in
a bed without the use of one ofmy arms". I'm not like-- I can't
do my job. And I had to text andbe like, "Oh, I'm sorry, I have
(36:58):
to cancel. It's because I got aneedle yesterday", like it
sounded so lame. But that's thereality of our job. If our
bodies aren't fit and fighting.
It's really hard to do.
Holly Harte (37:08):
Well, I can sort of relate. When I had the flu shot.
What was that about a month ortwo ago? That whole week? I
would be lying on the bed andtalking to clients. And I'd say,
"Oh, can we just get out andswap sides? Because this arm is
really sore from my flu shot?"Mine wasn't as bad as your your
booster shot. But yeah, it's allthose little unglamorous things
that we deal with. And then ofcourse, there's your mental
(37:29):
health, which we should probablysave for another episode. You
know, it's also importantbecause we have to be
emotionally available for ourclients. And sometimes we take
on a lot of heavy stuff. Andthat can be really difficult if
you're feeling mentally fragile.
Jenna Love (37:42):
Yeah, absolutely. I think that's definitely
something we should explore inanother episode.
Somebody You Love (37:47):
Interlude
Jenna Love (37:50):
So Holly, you last week, you mentioned that you had
some misconceptions yourselfabout the industry before you
started working in it. So Ithought we should break one of
those down today.
Holly Harte (38:01):
Yeah, this is sort of coming back to that naivety I
mentioned before, maybe it's not--maybe other people see it this
way, as well. But this was mytake on it before I entered the
industry. I used to think thatsex work, or working in the sex
industry, would make you hatesex, and then not have any
interest in it outside of workso that it would basically ruin
(38:23):
sex for you. And yeah, just makeit a chore.
Jenna Love (38:28):
Or maybe take any romantic level out of it.
Holly Harte (38:30):
Just taint it as a not pleasurable thing. Yeah,
that was -- Yeah. And so I hadthis perception that once I
became a full time sex worker, Iwouldn't enjoy sex anymore. And
I've always been a very sexualperson. So that was a really
frightening thing. To think thatsomething that I loved so much
might become not enjoyableanymore, which absolutely is not
(38:52):
the truth. I am still as hornyas ever. I still love sex with
my clients. I still am sexuallyinterested in people outside of
my clients. I am. Yes, stillsuper horny. So that was
absolutely incorrect. And Ithink that goes for a lot of sex
workers. I know I've definitelyheard some of my sex worker
friends say they've, you know,they're worn out or they're
(39:14):
burnt out or they've lost a bitof interest in sex or, you know,
if they're not getting paid forit. It's not as exciting things
like that, which you know,different sex workers face from
time to time. But the vastmajority of my friends that I
speak to seem to still havehealthy sex lives and healthy
interest in sex. So that'sreally cool. Yeah,
Jenna Love (39:35):
That is nice. I think it's, it's interesting
because, yeah, there you willcome across people who may sort
of say "oh when I'm having sexwith people who are male
presenting," which is obviouslynot all of our clients, but it
is a large percentage of ourclients, then they sort of want
to be paid for it and they mightbe bisexual or pansexual. But
(39:58):
they sort of get their fix ofmen from their clients. And so
in their personal life, they'reonly interested in having sex
with women or non binary people,which I y--ou know, that makes
sense to me .
Holly Harte (40:08):
Interesting
Jenna Love (40:09):
For me personally, I think, like, yes, there are
certainly times when you mightfeel burnt out or, like if I've
just come home from a tour, andI've had a lot of sex, and done
a lot of work aside from justthe sex. Yeah, I'm not going to
run home and feel like havingmore, of course, like, I'm gonna
need some downtime. But I dofind that often, sex as a job
(40:31):
can stimulate my private sexlife. Like if I have a really
hot day at work or really goodbooking. You know it makes me
more and more horny, like, themore sex I have, the more sex I
want.
Holly Harte (40:43):
I find the same thing. Yeah.
Jenna Love (40:46):
I think I'm quite-- I read about active and reactive
sexuality. And I think I'm quitelike reactive. Like, I kind of
forget that sex is a thing untilI'm doing it. And I'm like, Oh,
my God, this is so amazing. Andthen I want to do more of it.
Holly Harte (41:00):
That's interesting.
I took a year of celibacy, aboutseven years ago, just to see if
I could do it. Because I am suchhorny freak that I really wanted
to see--
Jenna Love (41:11):
What you just did it for shits and giggles?
Holly Harte (41:12):
Yeah, Jen is giving me the funniest facial
expression over Zoom right now.
This horror. And yeah, I know,it sounds weird. But I just
wanted to exercise restraint onsomething and see if I could do
it. And I did. And it was, itwas actually really good. I
know, we can explore thatanother day in another episode.
(41:33):
But I actually ended up notbeing horny at all. By the end
of the year, I just wasn't thatinterested in sex. But then
obviously, I said, "Well, I'mgoing to go and have sex now"
and once I was I was off - andit built. And similarly, right
now if I'm having great sex allthe time. Yeah, I just want
more. So maybe I'm just totallygreedy
Jenna Love (41:53):
On the flip side of that, however, it is the
misconception. I'll throwanother one in, you got a double
bonus misconception episode,that we are all massive horn
bags and want sex all the time.
I can't tell you how manyclients go, "oh my god, I feel
so sorry for your husband. Whenhe gets home from work, you must
just jump on him." And I'm like,What? No. We've been together
(42:14):
for 12 years. There's not muchjumping that happens. I adore
our sex life. But we're notlike-- I don't just launch
myself at people -- you'repaying for me to do that to you.
You know. And after a day of mehaving sex with other people,
often I just want to sit on thecouch and not be touched for a
(42:34):
little while.
Holly Harte (42:37):
Yep
Jenna Love (42:37):
and that's you know, yeah, yeah. So I think the
there's there's both extremes ofit. There are certainly times
when my job does make me go "Oh,God, I just don't want sex
anymore"
Holly Harte (42:46):
We're human beings!
Jenna Love (42:47):
But that's always fleeting. Yeah, it definitely
hasn't ruined sex for me.
Somebody You Love (42:52):
Interlude
Holly Harte (42:55):
Okay, this week for Shit People Say I'm just gonna
go through a couple of messagesI've received. It's probably not
going to be anywhere living upto Jenna's beautiful 'sports
attic' thread last week, whichwas absolutely a highlight. But
here's a couple that we thoughtwere good. Okay, so I received a
(43:16):
message when I had advertised ablow jobs only service. Blow
jobs. Pretty standard. That'sit. That's all you get. I got a
message from a gentleman. "Hi. Iwould love to meet you. What
does a blow job give me?" Which
Jenna Love (43:31):
Oh,
Holly Harte (43:31):
I felt that was pretty self explanatory.
Jenna Love (43:33):
Hopefully an orgasm?
Holly Harte (43:37):
Just a blow job.
That's.. I don't know what elseyou're looking for-- blowjob
and a handstand? I don't knowwhat he was hoping for with the
inclusions. Another one, which Ireally liked was I got a
question from a gentleman-- nowjust to explain to --Well, no,
you know what, I'm not evengoing to explain it. This is
self explanatory. I got amessage from a guy saying "what
is pegging?" And I said,"fucking you in the ass with a
(44:01):
strap on" And he said, "How bigis it?" And I said, "big" And he
said, "No, thanks". So that wasobviously enough to scare him
off.
Jenna Love (44:13):
You don't have to do it!
Holly Harte (44:17):
I don't know what the answer was that he was
looking for. I don't knowwhether he wanted centimetres.
Jenna Love (44:22):
You know, I've had a couple of people contact me and
say, "do we have to do likepegging" because it's listed as
something that I will offer
Holly Harte (44:30):
Pegging! I've had similar
Jenna Love (44:30):
And they'd be like, "I don't want that". And I'm
like, "that's fine, babe. I'mnot--that's cool".
Holly Harte (44:37):
We don't have to do all the things that I offer. And
my final one for today issomeone contacted me asking,
"Are you available?" I said,"I'll be available at 3pm." They
said, "Are you not availableright now?" I said "no". And
they said, "let me know whenyou're free". And I said, "Well,
I'm free at 3pm" Like Iliterally just told you that. I
(44:59):
don't know what--- at 3! Soyeah, I don't know what that the
intention was there. But yeah,three that I thought were quite
entertaining.
Jenna Love (45:09):
What about the swimming one?
Holly Harte (45:10):
Oh, okay, well, that's a whole story. I did
receive a message from somebodyasking if we could go for a swim
together. "I want to go for aswim with you, but I don't want
to go to jail". And I said, "whywould we go to jail?" And he
said, "cuz you're an escort andI'm a client,"
Jenna Love (45:31):
right
Holly Harte (45:31):
I said, "Well, that's not illegal, you know?"
And he said, "What isn't?" And Isaid, "being an escort or a
client" and he said, "Yeah, butgoing for a swim is."
Jenna Love (45:41):
is it?
Holly Harte (45:41):
And I said how? I actually said "lol how?" And he
said, "I don't know, becauseit's not like a booking". So how
would that be illegal? Anyway,we never solved why he thought
that was illegal
Jenna Love (45:55):
Oh I need resolution on that. How strange!
Holly Harte (45:59):
--what the crime committed is. Very cute.
Jenna Love (46:03):
So sex work is legal. But you can't do anything
with sex workers that isn't sex.
Holly Harte (46:09):
Do not swim with your hooker. It could be like a
gremlin thing. Like maybe theythink, you know, as soon as we
touch water police appear. Idon't know.
Jenna Love (46:21):
It wasn't during COVID was it? Like there was a
lot--
Holly Harte (46:23):
No this was like two years ago. Just a guy who
who, yeah, thought that thehandcuffs would appear as soon
as we got in the water. Yep.
Somebody You Love (46:32):
Interlude
Jenna Love (46:33):
So the final segment that we have on the show, which
we meant to spruik last week,and we forgot about I think, is
we wanted to maybe answer aquestion or two from our
listeners each week. And itdepends on how we go. If
everything is getting a bit longwinded, we might just have to do
separate question and answer,like bonus episodes. But just
(46:56):
keep an eye on our social media.
We have Facebook, Instagram, andTwitter. Our name everywhere is
@somebodyyoupod. And we will beasking questions because we'd
love you to--basically wherewe're farming you for content.
That's what we're getting athere.
Holly Harte (47:11):
Yeah, we're using you do you like being used by
us, you dirty boys.
Jenna Love (47:16):
And she says she's not a domme.
And that brings us to the end ofour episode. Now we mentioned
last week that we have a Patreonwhere you can get access to
bonus episodes, you get ourepisodes a day early, they will
always be ad free episodes. Andthere's a bunch of other little
(47:37):
perks in there as well. Andwe're lucky enough to have had a
number of people sign up. Andactually most of these people
signed up before our firstepisode was released, which
was--
Holly Harte (47:47):
That's massive.
Jenna Love (47:48):
We were both so incredibly touched by that
--really put us in a good placeto start and made us feel really
supported. This is a totally newjourney for both of us. So it
really meant a lot. So we'd liketo thank those people, we have a
Giving Somebody who is Mal, wehave two Generous Somebodies and
they are Adelle and Bruce
Holly Harte (48:09):
we have a few Very Generous Somebodies, who are The
Alice grey, Pete, Spaceman Dan,Darwin, Steve, Timmy and Lachlan
and two Extremely GenerousSomebodies who are Aaron and
PrettyInPink.
Jenna Love (48:24):
Thank you so much.
Thank you. Thank you for takingthe time to listen to the voices
of sex workers. Please look outfor us on Twitter, Instagram,
and patreon name everywhere issomebody you pod as in podcast,
and our Patreon starts at just$3 a month. And remember,
Somebody You Love might just bea sex worker.
Welcome to Somebody You Love or The Sale Of Two
Titties. I'm Jenna love.
Holly Harte (00:08):
And I'm Holly Harte.
Jenna Love (00:10):
And we're experts in disappointing our parents
breaching community guidelines,and banging the people who vote
against our rights.
Holly Harte (00:19):
Before we begin, we'd like to start by
acknowledging the traditionalowners of the land on which
we're recording today, which forme is the Ngunnawal people.
Jenna Love (00:26):
And for me is the Darug and Gundungurra people.
We'd like to acknowledge that ifyou are listening to this
podcast, in so-called Australia,that sovereignty was never
ceded.
Holly Harte (00:36):
We also want to make it clear up front that we
can only speak from our ownexperiences. The sex working
community is wonderfullydiverse. And as white cis women,
we have a lot of privilegeswithin the industry, we can't
speak on behalf of our peers whofind themselves facing more
severe stigma and discriminationthan we do.
Jenna Love (00:52):
It is our hope that by creating this podcast, we are
able to help humanise sexworkers. And eventually, if
anyone even listens to us, wecan provide a platform to share
the voices that represent thediversity of the sex worker
community,
Holly Harte (01:07):
we will be discussing adult topics. So this
podcast may not be suitable forthose under the age of 18. And
today, as you can tell from thetitle, we're talking bodily
functions, so there will be talkof bodily fluids, and some
general things people might finda bit gross. Here we go!
Jenna Love (01:26):
We're going to talk about some of the logistics of
sex work. Because the reality isthat we do use and rely on our
bodies for work, and often inpretty intimate ways. Before
addressing this topic, though, Ijust want to talk about the kind
of concept of sex workersselling our bodies. I mean,
first up, we're not sellinganything like it's a rental
(01:48):
agreement at best.
Holly Harte (01:51):
I like that.
Obviously, we do use our bodies,but we obviously use our mind,
probably more.
Jenna Love (01:58):
Yeah, I think so.
Holly Harte (01:59):
heaps. There are other professions that use and
rely on their bodies, you know,athletes, miners, construction,
even office work and put astrain on your body in various
ways. And you still have to turnup and be there with your body,
you know. So it's a reallyreductive thing to say that we
sell our bodies because we usethem as part of our labour. And
(02:20):
definitely our mind, you know,as we've discussed on our last
show, compassion and caring, andall of that sort of stuff, as
well as the administrative side.
And, you know, the way that weapproach people when they
contact us, even from the firstmessage is engaging our brains.
So yeah, it's very limiting tosay we just sell our bodies.
Jenna Love (02:38):
Definitely, actually, I was just listening
to ABCs The Drum. That was onlast night, this is Saturday. So
it was on Friday night, becauseBella Green was on it.
Holly Harte (02:47):
She's so good.
Jenna Love (02:49):
She's great. And they were talking about sex
work, obviously. And so the waythe programme sort of works is
they get everyone that's on thepanel to chat about each topic.
So Bella, obviously was themain, the main interviewee for
that section. But they spoke toeveryone else about it as well.
And there was a surgeon and, andshe was sort of talking about
(03:11):
how she spends her life treatingpeople, for injuries and for for
bodies that have broken down asa result of what they do with
their body, which for mostpeople is, is work. And we all
have all these injuries. And shewas she was Yeah, brought up
that she doesn't know why, youknow, sex workers are sort of
denigrated for, you know,putting their bodies at risk or
(03:36):
using their bodies. And it wasreally nice to hear that from a
non sex worker, a medicalprofessional. That's very
refreshing. Yeah, very cool. dorecommend checking out the end
of the episode. And I also justthink that the idea that you
know, our bodies, are sold tosomebody, and that's inherently
bad is like, that sort ofsuggests that it means that
(03:59):
somehow we're giving our bodiesaway by doing this job, and that
we're giving ownership of ourbodies away. And it's like the
idea that somebody owns ourbody, because they've put their
dick in it is some reallypatriarchal, arse bullshit. Like
that's
Holly Harte (04:16):
very well said,
Jenna Love (04:18):
it doesn't make any sense to me.
Holly Harte (04:20):
I agree. Look, so obviously, no, we don't sell our
bodies. But we do use them alongwith our minds to do our job.
And that means that there's alot of practical things that we
need to deal with in order to goto work.
Jenna Love (04:32):
So bodily functions.
First up is something that I getasked about by a lot of women
who aren't in the industry,civilians, or civvies, as as we
like to call them. And the thingis, a lot of sex workers have
uteruses...uteri... uterusus Ibelieve is the plural.
Holly Harte (04:57):
Uteri.
Jenna Love (04:59):
Uteri. And a lot of those uteruses shed their lining
on the reg. So periods aresomething that many, not all,
but many sex workers have tomanage. And there's a few
different ways we can do this.
Yeah, there's quite a variety ofoptions. Obviously, there are a
few workers who take time off,particularly when there's, you
(05:21):
know, pain issues and thingslike that. Some will take a week
off work once a month, or atleast the first couple of days
while they're in a fair bit of pain which really causes issues
with their plansOr even just when it's a heavier
flow at the start.
Holly Harte (05:36):
all those sorts of things that come up. Yeah, look,
it's it obviously, wouldmassively affect their
potential income and theirplanning. And just, I mean,
that's a lot of money to you tolose over a year.
Jenna Love (05:49):
I mean, yeah, it's a quarter of the year, isn't it?
Holly Harte (05:51):
It's, it's a lot.
Yeah.
Jenna Love (05:53):
And then there are some of us who skip our periods.
And that's, I think, applies toyou, and I. Holly you're not,
you're also not a fan ofmenstruating, are you?
Holly Harte (06:03):
It's not for me, no, if I can have the option, I
do avoid it. So I haven't had aperiod in over 8 years, I have
the Implanon rod in my arm,which I get changed out every
three years, I know there'squite a lot of men listening who
probably don't understand it.
And I'm not going to explain itin the deepest levels. But
(06:23):
basically, every three years, Igo and get this little hormonal
rod removed and replaced in myarm. And that releases a small
amount of contraception overthat period which basically
means that I think 20% of peoplethat get this rod don't get
periods anymore. But it's athing. It's 99.99%, like, it's
(06:44):
extremely, you know, strongcontraceptive or reliable
contraceptive. So, yeah, that'show I mitigate my period risk.
How about yourself?
Jenna Love (06:58):
Yeah, so I also I mean, I have, I will have the
occasional period. But again, Ihaven't had regular periods
since I was a teenager, I havethe Implanon as well. And I also
am on The Pill, and I skip thesugar pills, which are, so when
you get a packet of the pill,there are placebos in there. And
(07:19):
that's what you're supposed totake during the time when you
get your period. And then you goback onto the actual medication
for the rest of the time. So Idon't take those those sugar
pills.
Holly Harte (07:29):
So that sounds a little bit fussy. Why? Why is
that something that works foryou?
Jenna Love (07:35):
Why do I have both?
Holly Harte (07:36):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (07:38):
Partly because I'm absolutely terrified of
developing a foetus inside me
Holly Harte (07:45):
Valid, yeah.
Jenna Love (07:45):
I use the Implanon and the pill, and I use condoms,
because I just want all of thecontraception that I can
possibly have. Yeah. And that'sa bit and it also became when I
started working as a sex worker.
I was like, it's also reallyhandy to just not have periods.
Yeah. And for me the Implanon--the first time I had an Implanon
it pretty much got rid of myperiods for two years, similar
(08:07):
to what you have. Yeah, but thenthe second time I got one that
didn't happen. It seems superhit and miss. And I know for
some, some people who use it,like 20% or something as well, I
think have like constantbleeding and ha ve massive
issues so it's very--
Holly Harte (08:23):
I have heard of that. Sounds like a nightmare--
Jenna Love (08:24):
Very different depending on the person.
Holly Harte (08:25):
Okay, that's interesting.
Jenna Love (08:27):
So, yeah. And a lot of people, including doctors
would question why I was usingboth.
Holly Harte (08:37):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (08:38):
And sort of suggest that perhaps it wasn't good for
me to have that much oestrogenin my body and particularly with
skipping the sugar pills aswell. And then about two years
ago, I found out that I haveendometriosis. Which is a
situation where you get uterinecells growing outside of the
uterus. It's a whole-- it's awhole thing. And surprisingly
(09:00):
quite common
Holly Harte (09:00):
more common than people think. Yeah, I've got a
lot of friends who are in thathorrible boat.
Jenna Love (09:05):
Yeah, so yeah, I discovered that I had that and
that was through going to see agynaecologist and she actually
said to me that I had beensmashing it because the the sort
of the non invasive treatmentthat they suggest for
endometriosis is actually topump your body with as much
(09:26):
oestrogen as possible.
Holly Harte (09:27):
So coincidentally had been doing the right thing.
Yeah,
Jenna Love (09:31):
yeah, I had been doing the right thing. And at
that point, so I mean, that wasa good 20 years since I first
got my period. Yeah, no,slightly less but I'd
potentially been actuallystaving off the endometriosis
and at that point, when I wentto see her we discovered it and
I had to have surgery. But whatthey, you know, she suggested
(09:53):
that I quite possibly hadactually, um yeah, kept it kept
it at bay for ages. Made me feelgood.
Holly Harte (10:00):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (10:01):
And they also recommend people skipping the
sugar pills.
Holly Harte (10:04):
Yeah, I mean, that's something I was advised
to do by a few doctors before Iwent on Implanon. And but you
know, back when I was on thepill, I was one of those people
who was horribly unreliable atremembering to take it anyway, I
was at a risk. But, you know,some doctors said, Oh, no, it's
it's awful. And some doctorssaid, No, it's absolutely benign
to just keep, you know, youdon't have to have a period for
(10:26):
most people anyway.
Jenna Love (10:29):
So like anything relating to women and their
bodies, there's a hell of a lotof misinformation out there,
including amongst the medicalprofession.
Holly Harte (10:37):
100%. And there's also a lot of things that we
still don't know. And that, youknow, science is still
clarifying, and particularlyaround endometriosis. That's
something that seems to be veryunder researched. So yes,
hopefully, we're getting someclarity around that. So yeah,
not everyone can take hormonalcontraception for a multitude of
(10:59):
reasons. It's not an option foreveryone.
Jenna Love (11:01):
Yeah, I mean, the side effects can be incredibly
serious. So I'd say one of themost common options that I hear
used in the industry is to use asponge. And essentially using a
sponge in this in this contextmean, you can get period
sponges, which are often alsocalled soft tampons. But you can
(11:24):
also use other other things ifyou're in a bind. And basically,
it is basically a soft tampon,you maybe wet it a little bit,
and you push it up insideyourself, push it right up to
the top, and it it stops theflow, basically. Have you used
sponges before?
Holly Harte (11:41):
I never have. I-- to me, sponges, were always such
a wild thing. Like what? Puttinga sponge in your vagina? I
always was so shocked by it, I--look in a lot of ways I I've
grown up a fairly naive person.
And it was just I wasparticularly entering the sex
industry, I was very alone inthat. And I remember my first or
(12:01):
my second brothel shift ever, Iwas really nervous. And I
decided, you know, I couldn't doit. So I called up and told them
I got my period. And they didn'tsort of tell me "Well, you could
actually use a sponge",fortunately, because it was a
lie. And I was just trying toget out of the shift. But it was
years later, when I was workingas a receptionist in a brothel,
(12:21):
that one of, you know, we soldthe girls, which is a whole, you
know, an issue I think that wesold the girls
Jenna Love (12:32):
Let's get into that later
Holly Harte (12:34):
Yeah, yeah, rather than providing them which would
be the right thing to do. But wecharge the, the, you know, the
staff or the workers to buysponges from the reception
counter. So I became more awareof their function then. And
yeah, you know, it's becauseI've been on and off in the sex
industry. And I've never reallybeen in it at a time when I was,
(12:55):
you know, having periods. It'snever been something I've had to
use. But I certainly worked in abrothel on reception and had
workers come to me and say, Oh,my God, Holly, I can't get this
out. Can you help me? Which wasa new, a new thing.
Jenna Love (13:12):
So one brothel that I worked at didn't have proper
sponges, sponges that aredesigned for that purpose. They
had a, you know, one of thoselike big yellow car wash
sponges. I don't know if that'sjust an Aussie thing. Or if it's
just a thing my dad used growingup, but they had one of those in
the cupboard. And if you gotdesperate, you could tear off a
(13:34):
piece. Which I'm sure isn't, youknow, hygienic or healthy. But
when you get desperate, you gotto you know, you got to do what
you got to do.
Holly Harte (13:43):
I mean, it's not that big a deal. But for a
brothel that seems
Jenna Love (13:46):
Yeah, brothel stories. Let's cover that later.
Holly Harte (13:49):
Yeah. Wow.
Jenna Love (13:50):
You would, you would think-- there's a lot of things
you would think
Holly Harte (13:52):
You would reallyg nk they'd go to a little bit
more effort to prepare for theworkers., but wow they've just
got like a car sponge. There yougo guys. Good luck, you know. A
Jenna Love (14:00):
Yep and you just tear a bit off
Holly Harte (14:02):
There's a little bit of vegetable oil for lube as
well if you want. I mean, itjust feels so disorganised. Wow.
Jenna Love (14:10):
Because they usually have vegetable oil laying around
in brothels.
Holly Harte (14:14):
Oh look the things you find in brothels that other
than what you actually need
Jenna Love (14:18):
That's true
Holly Harte (14:19):
there's all sorts of chaos.
Jenna Love (14:21):
That's very true.
Holly Harte (14:22):
Yeah, it was it was really sweet having workers come
to me and sort of say that theyneeded help removing a sponge.
It's a lot of trust to come tosomeone and say, "Hi, I'm having
a hard time getting that out ofme. Can you help me? Can you
help me" and I was always Yes.
Jenna Love (14:36):
Because it can be quite difficult.
Holly Harte (14:37):
It's Yeah, I've heard it sort of--
Jenna Love (14:39):
I've done a few a few removals
Holly Harte (14:41):
Extractions. But yeah, it's a big trust building
exercise and not really a bigdeal at the end of the day.
Look, it's a normal human bodilyfunction. And yeah
Jenna Love (14:52):
Yeah, I mean, I have used sponges because even though
I use the two contraceptives,often or not often, but maybe
once a year I'll forget to takemy pill for a day. And then I'm
like, "Oh, well, I'll just letit happen." And every time I
then regret it, I'm like, "whydid I think that? Why? Why am I
having a period" and I feelquite-- look, this is going into
(15:14):
a different subject, but I feelquite disconnected from my
reproductive parts. Yeah, I'msomebody I'm very comfortable
with my gender and with my mysexuality, but the fact that I
can grow a foetus makes mehuergh, feel very, very
uncomfortable. So having aperiod reminds me of that. And I
just, I just don't, yeah, it'snot a good time. But as a
(15:36):
result, I have occasionally hadto use a sponge, or I have
chosen to use a sponge. I don'thave to, of course, and I found
them really great. I did haveone that went flying out of me,
which was pretty funny. I didn'tactually notice. And the client
was like, "oh, Jenna, I thinkyour sponge is on there." And I
was like, "ah!", I looked downand there was a sponge on the
(15:59):
bed. And obviously I wasembarrased
Holly Harte (16:01):
that's very intimate.
Jenna Love (16:02):
It is very intimate.
This is it. And I've had a fewthat have felt it with their
fingers when they've beenfishing around up there. I think
I've got quite a short vaginalcanal so the good thing about
that is I can get them outeasily. I've never had issues
with them getting lost up aroundthere. And some of my friends
vaginal canals seem to go onforever when I've been fishing
around them trying to get itout. But I've not had that
(16:24):
issue. And it has meant theclients have sort of been up to
feel it.
Holly Harte (16:28):
I've heard that mine goes right up to the left.
Jenna Love (16:32):
They go either side
Holly Harte (16:33):
Yeah. I went for pap tests. My doctor, sometimes
has gone "I cannot find the endof it." And I'm like, it's
right. And she's got to take asharp left. It's a journey. Yes.
Jenna Love (16:45):
Okay, alright, interesting
Holly Harte (16:46):
Is that TMI? I don't know if that's -- we're
talking about periods
Jenna Love (16:49):
No, definitely not.
We'll have to get a doctor on atsome point.
Holly Harte (16:52):
Yeah, we will. So that's a plus that yours is
accessible.
Jenna Love (16:55):
Yeah. So yeah, I have had clients, you know,
notice that I've that I've beenusing one or but you know,
notice, because it's literallythere in front of them.
Holly Harte (17:04):
Yeah
Jenna Love (17:04):
most of the time they don't have that experience.
But every--I've been quitelucky, because every single time
that's happened, the client hasbeen like, "it's completely
fine".
Holly Harte (17:14):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (17:15):
"I understand that--that women menstruate
like, yeah, it's cool, man",
Holly Harte (17:19):
you're a human being.
Jenna Love (17:20):
And I'm a little bit embarrassed. But I'm also like,
"Well, yeah, that's it, man.
Yeah, that is what happens."
Holly Harte (17:26):
Yeah. And the final option is to do nothing. You can
just go with the flow, you couldeven charge extra for that sort
of thing. Everything's a kink,you know?
Jenna Love (17:34):
Absolutely. And, you know, this is also--the subject
of periods is also somethingthat comes up when we have
female clients. I really don'tunderstand why sponges and other
solutions aren't more common andknown about in the civilian
world. And I guess, I mean, youwere one of the people who
(17:54):
didn't know about them, either.
I've had so many--
Holly Harte (17:58):
I was shocked.
Jenna Love (17:58):
Yeah, well, I've had so many female clients, sort of
text me the day before or theday of the booking and say, "Oh,
my God, Jenna, I've just got myperiod" or "my periods lasting
longer than I than it normallydoes. And I'm really stressed.
And do you have any? What do youguys do when you get your
period?" You know? And I've beenlike, "okay, yeah, no worries,
(18:19):
here you go, these are someoptions, I've got a bag full of
sponges, I'll bring one with me,I can help you put it in and
take it out if you need. Butalso, you know, I'll bring my
black towels. So we can putthose down. So you don't have to
sort of worry about, you know,anything, seeing anything that
might embarrass you. And also,I'm fine with it. Because I am
(18:43):
aware that you might bleed. Andthat's cool."
Holly Harte (18:45):
I also had a female client who was a little bit
awkward about that. And she'dexperienced some spotting. And,
you know, she'd had other issueswhere she'd felt really
embarrassed when seeing sexworkers in that position. And I
said, "it's just not really abig deal." Like it's if it's not
a heavy, if we're not going tobe doing sort of a horror scene
looking scenario and it's just,you know, a little bit of
spotting and things like that...
We'll work with it. It'll befine. You know, she offered to
(19:08):
use a sponge and all that sortof stuff. And you know, it's--
I've done-- i'm sure I've dealtwith more unique situations,
than a very normal bodilyfunction.
Jenna Love (19:19):
Exactly.
Holly Harte (19:19):
You know, as long as you're hygienic. That's not a
big deal. Yeah,
Jenna Love (19:23):
yeah.
Holly Harte (19:24):
Let's move on to butt stuff.
Jenna Love (19:26):
Woo butt stuff! So what kind of butt stuff do you
tend to come across in yourwork, Holly?
Holly Harte (19:32):
I mainly do things with other people's butts-- I'm
not a butt person. I'm actuallya butt virgin, believe it or
not. I have never had butt sex.
I've been saving for marriage.
Jenna Love (19:44):
Wait are you actually?
Holly Harte (19:46):
I swear on my life.
Yeah.
Jenna Love (19:50):
You're hysterical
Holly Harte (19:51):
Okay, I am I-- oh, gosh, I feel a little bit... uhh
a little bit coy at the moment,a little bit shy?
Jenna Love (20:00):
Oh a bit vulnerable?
Holly Harte (20:02):
I find it--Yeah, a little bit vulnerable, I find
butt stuff really big like it'sa big deal. I only have a very
little, little, tiny little tinybutthole. And I find it quite,
quite frightening. So I figureif I'm gonna go through that
journey of trust, it's, I thinkwith butt stuff it takes a lot
(20:23):
of trust in someone else. I'mgoing to do that with the man
who wants to put a ring on thisfinger. So that--
Jenna Love (20:29):
Beautiful. You'll let him engage with your ring.
or something. There's a joke inthere about rings.
Holly Harte (20:35):
Yes, yes! We'll put a ring on each of our
appendages. Yeah, absolutely. SoI feel really, really weird for
having that thing but that'sjust my thing. Yeah, I don't
mind the odd you know, buttattention on me. But ahh yeah
I'm not a massive fan of it. Idefinitely will explore someone
(20:56):
else's butt though. I can do amean fisting on someone else's
butt -- I get all sorts of, youknow, butt plugs. Yes. We've
done a holding hand fisting.
Jenna Love (21:07):
Oh, yeah. That was romantic. That was romance, come
on.
Holly Harte (21:11):
That was romantic.
Yeah, that was true friendship,holding hands and fisting
someone at the same time.
Jenna Love (21:17):
Oh and to be clear, the held hands were inside the
rectum. It wasn't our otherhands we were holding.
Holly Harte (21:24):
Yeah, it was very special. So yeah, I don't mind,
you know, doing a bit of buttstuff on other people. How about
you? What's your butt situation?
Jenna Love (21:33):
Yeah, I also do get involved in other people's
butts. But they also getinvolved in mine. And you know
what my view is that if you areold enough to want to put things
in my ass, then you are oldenough to realise that that's
where poop lives. And if you goknocking on Pooh's door, don't
(21:54):
be surprised when Pooh is home -like that's where he lives mate.
Holly Harte (21:57):
I feel the same about it. I've heard people ask
about, you know, enemas and allthat sort of thing. And I
totally, you know, supportpeople doing that it's good for
them. And, you know, I get thatthat's a big thing for a lot of
people -- preparing for buttstuff.
Jenna Love (22:12):
Definitely.
Definitely.
Holly Harte (22:13):
But I think look, if you go poking around, but you
got to expect some some somepoop and I don't love it-- It's
not what I'm looking for. I'mnot going to burn the house
down. You know, I've obviouslyprepared a sterile situation for
that, you know, eventuality. Soyeah, so like I said, there's a
(22:34):
few different things you can doin preparation. You know, people
eat certain things. Look, themost important step, which
everyone should take is justwashing your butt. I can't say
this, like enough. Let's say itlike 10 times in a row repeated
after me, write lines right now,please, everyone listening, wash
your butt. It is so overlooked.
Grab a little bit of soap onyour hand, reach back there and
(23:00):
give it a good scrub. Because alot of people I think just let
the water run down there.
Jenna Love (23:05):
And you might have to touch it. That's --
Holly Harte (23:07):
you might have to touch your butt
Jenna Love (23:10):
I wonder if it's because people are afraid to
touch it. Maybe they think itmakes them gay or something
fucking ridiculous.
Holly Harte (23:17):
I just don't know whether people are like, taught
as children how to washthemselves properly--
particularly penises and all ofthat sort of stuff.
Jenna Love (23:25):
I wasn't
Holly Harte (23:25):
I wasn't and I you know, I think yeah, it's
something probably people don'teven realise that their butts
are so dirty. So it's reallyimportant. Just a little bit of
soap. Give it a quick scrub. Oh,beautiful. That's an exciting,
inviting, butt. Every sex workerout there has had to deal with a
client turning up who have justhad a shower and they clearly
(23:47):
haven't washed their butts. Yougo "oh, God help me."
Jenna Love (23:50):
You can visually see it is what we're saying. And
we've all had at least oneclient who has left skid marks
on the bedsheets.
Holly Harte (23:58):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (23:59):
Like if you're a sex worker, and you haven't had that
happen, I'm sorry to tell youthat it is on its way. It will
happen to you.
Holly Harte (24:06):
It's on its way.
It's so embarrassing. I'vescrambled to pull sheets off the
bed sometimes and I've said "Ohgod I'm embarrassed for them."
And I'm talked about it withfriends and they've gone "No,
let them suffer."
Jenna Love (24:17):
Yeah no I always cover it up. I hope they don't
notice because I don't want themto have to deal with the shame
of that which they shouldn'thave to feel shame about. But I
mean, if they haven't, ofcourse, if we're doing butt
stuff yet then they shouldn'tfeel shame about it. But if we
aren't doing butt stuff I don'tunderstand why poop is leaving
your body.
Holly Harte (24:36):
Yeah, if you just have a generally grubby butt
it's not great.
Jenna Love (24:39):
Grubby butt!
Holly Harte (24:40):
We've just shoved you in the shower, you know, rub
behind your ears, rub your butt,pull back your foreskin, give
everything a quick freshen up.
We've just spent two hoursgetting ready for you, you know,
just meet us halfway, you know,not asking much.
Jenna Love (24:52):
And I mean, it's not well, it's still not pleasant
for you.
Holly Harte (24:55):
Yeah, for me, it's not too stressful. And I guess
one the reasons I'm such a bigfan of, you know doing things to
other people's butts is I don'thave a sense of smell. So I was
born without it, which is calledcongenital anosmia. So I have
never smelt poop before. So tome poop is just not appealing to
(25:16):
look at. I've never smelt it,don't know what it's like so...
Jenna Love (25:18):
I've never so lucky, Holly, the world smells
disgusting. You are so lucky.
Holly Harte (25:23):
People used to tell me that when I worked in a
brothel, they were like, "youare so lucky that you don't have
to smell certain bodily thingswith with some of the clients.
And maybe that's why you lovethe job so much". And I was
like, "I think that's a lot moreto why I love this job, than my
lack of sense of smell", but itdefinitely I think makes certain
things easier. And you know,it's beautiful. I've had clients
(25:44):
turn up and they're like, I wentto so much trouble to not eat
this today. So you wouldn't haveto smell it on my breath. I did
this activity and I had washedreally well. And I was like, "oh
God babe, turn up stinking I donot care. As long as you're
clean, you know, eat the garlic,you know, go to work with paint
fumes, or whatever it is,because I won't even know".
They're really cute about it.
Jenna Love (26:02):
what you're saying is I should send all my smelly
clients to you
Holly Harte (26:05):
send them to me.
Now I don't mind a smelly personas long as they're clean. No
worries. What about you any anylittle niche stories here?
Jenna Love (26:15):
Oh, actually, it's not super, I don't know, if it's
related. Might go on a bit of atangent bear with me, we'll cut
it out if it's terrible. Butthis made me think about -- as
part of one of my hobbies that Ido outside of the sex industry.
I'm trying to how do I describeit without giving away all the
(26:36):
details of it! Basically,there's, there's a whole bunch
of people around and it involvesa fair bit of standing around
and chatting and whatever and abit of downtime. So I was just
sitting at a desk. And rightnext to me, there was a little
group of people having a chatand one of the women there-- her
day job is as a nurse. And theywere all just standing around
(27:00):
talking about her work. And theywere sort of they were saying
"Do you have to like, you know,do people wee themselves
sometimes? Do you have to dealwith, with poop and with vomit
and all that sort of stuff?" Andshe was going "Yep, yep, that's
all part of the job". And theywere like, "Oh, my God," and
they were sort of saying, youknow, nurses, nurses do not get
(27:21):
paid enough. Nurses don't getenough respect. Like, that's
amazing that you do that. Like,and, and I agree with everything
they're saying. There's nothingwrong with that conversation.
But I had a real 'Poor me'moment, because I was just
sitting there going... No onesays that about sex workers. I
(27:42):
deal with vomit and poop andblood. And we and you know, I
have clients who aren't able togo to the bathroom, and I have
to get a bottle out and helpthem do that. Like, and, and I
just, and yeah, I mean, I don'twant to take anything away from
nurses, obviously. But it wasjust this real, you know, all
these people know what I do fora job as well. And I just was
(28:06):
like, No one's going to havethat conversation with me.
Holly Harte (28:10):
No.
Jenna Love (28:10):
And it made me a bit sad
Holly Harte (28:11):
They have no idea that you actually deal with that
extreme-- that extremity ofbodily function.
Jenna Love (28:17):
Yeah. And it's not like every day, obviously, which
it probably is a lot more commonfor nurses.
Holly Harte (28:23):
Yeah yeah yeah
Jenna Love (28:24):
And we also on top of that, have to try and act
sexy through it, you know, whichis an added complication.
Holly Harte (28:33):
If we have to do the stern and nurse routine
that's like, that's a dommething, that's extra.
Jenna Love (28:38):
That-- ooh that is extra,
Holly Harte (28:40):
Beyond just simple washing, like I was mentioning
before, some people like todouce before anal. Neither of us
are experts at all in that sowe're not going to go into it.
But preparation for receivinganal play can range from a few
seconds to multiple days.
Jenna Love (28:56):
Yeah, I have a friend who works in the industry
who she does the full enimaexperience -- she eats a liquid
diet for 48 hours before an analbooking, which is mind blowing
to me because you couldn't payme enough to have a liquid diet
for two days. And you know, shecharges accordingly - her rates
(29:17):
for anal bookings are quite highand justifiably so. And you
know, most sex workers who dooffer anal on them or anal play,
they do charge extra for it andthey require advance notice
because even if they are aquicker preparer, you know, it's
still not something that you canjust sort of throw on someone.
Holly Harte (29:39):
So what do you do to prepare?
Jenna Love (29:41):
Well, I actually don't do any prep for anal, like
none at all. I mean, I like Itry to eat well and I have
showers obviously.
Holly Harte (29:49):
Yeah.
Jenna Love (29:50):
But beyond that, I don't do any anal-specific
preparation. But at the sametime, it's also something I've
never guaranteed, anal sex inbookings, my body is not at all
predictable enough for that.
I've never guaranteed anythingin bookings really, you know,
it's something that happens whenthings feel right. And it
doesn't if they don't, which Ithink is really the reality of a
(30:12):
lot of sex work and a lot of sexin general. Yeah, you know,
we're not robots, we can't justmake our bodies do things on
cue. So often, we have to adaptaround that, whether it be
periods, whether it be IBS, orwhatever it is, and so does the
client. Because the client hasbooked a human, being not a
robot. And that's what they'regetting.
Holly Harte (30:36):
And then there's all the other little things that
like to pop up just beforebooking when someone may be
about to spend the next hourlooking at and touching every
inch of your body.
Jenna Love (30:45):
And you like you just know that if you say slice
your finger and you you've gotto whack a big, ugly bandaid on
it, that the very next clientyou have is going to be one
that's obsessed with hands forwhatever reason, and spends the
entire hour 10 centimetres awayfrom your like manky Band Aid
finger.
Holly Harte (31:03):
Hand! I've sliced myself down there before with a
razor and I've sort of got --not close enough to cancel --
but enough that I go "aw I'llput a bandaid on so I'm
covering" and, you know, that'sreally
Unknown (31:14):
And you spread your legs and you've got a big
band-aid there! You know thatthat next client is going to be
the one that's obsessed withcunnilingus though.
Holly Harte (31:20):
Yeah, it's just Murphy's Law, isn't it?
Jenna Love (31:22):
Yeah.
Holly Harte (31:23):
So I'm a farter. So basically, this is a running
joke with a lot of my clients.
Jenna Love (31:31):
This is why we're friends.
Holly Harte (31:32):
Yeah. It's a running joke with a lot of my
clients. I generally-- look I'mnot gonna say I do it every
booking --but if you've seen mefor like a year or two, I've
probably farted in a booking andwe've both laughed about it, or
you've never come back. Becausethat's just me, especially when
I'm really aroused and I'mbearing down down there is a lot
of pressure. Sometimes a fartslips out. I'm sorry, I'm human.
(31:56):
What can I say? I try to besexy, I try to present the best
virgin. virgin? I'm not avirgin! The best version of
myself but sometimes I fart
Jenna Love (32:05):
I fart so much. When I orgasm farting it is like part
of the experience. Not alwaysbut a lot of the time. And I
think it makes perfect sense coswe're like--you're spreading
your legs and bringing them backtogether like you're letting air
in. And then, as you said,bearing down when you come and
when you're experiencing a lotof pleasure there's often like a
(32:27):
pushing down
Holly Harte (32:28):
Yup
Jenna Love (32:28):
So obviously that's gonna happen. And I find like
sex farts I think are differentto normal farts. You probably
don't know but they don't smellbecause they're just like an air
in and out situation. They'renot-- I don't know enough about
farts
Holly Harte (32:42):
My clients are too charming to tell me if they do
smell so I'm grateful for thatat least.
Jenna Love (32:47):
But there's yeah, there's so many little things
like you said the cut down downthere, ingrown hairs are so
common. Like getting a big juicybutt pimple. You wake up the
morning of a big booking and
Holly Harte (33:01):
I'm lucky I'm not a butt pimple people person.
Jenna Love (33:03):
Oh I hate you
Holly Harte (33:03):
I get em on my face though. They'll turn up and I'll
have like a giant-- Yeah, no,I'm lucky I get the butt
peoples. But I'll get a greatbig face pimple and I'm like
hello there's a mountain. Wouldyou like to go sightseeing on my
face?
Jenna Love (33:15):
Sightseeing! Or, or if you'd like I have a lot of
problems with dryness andallergies. I'm like, I have
reactions to everything. So Ithink actually the first time we
met was while I was on a tour inCanberra. And I had this
reaction. I still don't knowwhat it was, but my face kind of
broke out in this rash. And wasjust-- it was red. And I was mid
(33:38):
tour and sort of thought "ohsomethings going on with my
skin. If I cover up with makeup,that's not going to be good for
it. But at the same time, Idon't want my clients to be like
what is she got this red blotchyrash all over her face". So I
mean, I just tried to put lightmakeup on and I dealt with it
and it was towards the end ofthe tour anyway, thankfully,
made sure the lights weren't toobright in the room. But um, but
(34:01):
you know, these things happen--cracked lips. I get cracked lips
all the time. And clients mightsee that and go "is that a cold
sore?" So there's all theselittle things that pop up
Yeah, I wondered ifthat would come up. Anybody that
Holly Harte (34:11):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and then you know, injuries that
happen as part of work as well.
That's not ideal. I remember youhad an injury when you were in
the Northern Territory, whichwas--put you off work for a
while. I don't know if we wantto wait for another po
has watched the BuzzFeed videosmentioned in the last episode
(34:32):
will know about that. I think weshould discuss that in a
different episode. Just becauseit's a bit of a story to really
tell it properlyAlright we'll save
it. It was a bit of a story.
Yeah, yeah.
Jenna Love (34:43):
But yes, I did. I had a significant injury and I
had to cancel a lot of work.
Holly Harte (34:47):
Another thing we discussed as well as things like
thrush and BV-- these are normalthings that happen to vaginas
sometimes. I went through aperiod when I was working in a
brothel where I was always usingthe house soap And I constantly
was getting thrush-- it was, itwas a really glamorous time. So
you know, you're obviously notsupposed to put soap down there,
Jenna Love (35:08):
or different lubes or different condoms.
Holly Harte (35:10):
Exactly. But fortunately touch wood touch
wood don't want to tempt fatehaven't run into those issues in
a while. So yeah, it's notglamorous, but these are normal
bodily issues. You know
Jenna Love (35:20):
a friend of mine is prone to Bartholin's cysts,
which thank God, I've never hadone. apparently, they, they,
they're really difficult to getrid of, they sound incredibly
painful. And it's basically acyst down there. So it would
make our jobs so difficult. Andeven if you get them drained,
(35:40):
apparently, they have a realtendency to return and come
back. And it just it sounds likeit just sounds awful.
Holly Harte (35:46):
Gosh, makes you feel grateful, doesn't it?
Jenna Love (35:48):
It does. It's not the kind of job that you can,
where you can go to work if youare sick or injured. You know, I
think like, if you've got a bitof a head cold, you're a bit
snotty, you know, you canprobably still go into the
office and just keep yourdistance from other people a
bit. But we, like, we can't gointo a booking and be snorting
all over our clients. Like wejust you know, we can't do that.
Holly Harte (36:12):
It's not sexy
Jenna Love (36:12):
No, it's not sexy.
It's not hygienic. And it'scertainly not the luxury
experience that they're payingfor. Just the other day-- a few
weeks ago, I got a booster shot,a hepatitis booster
shot--vaccine, basically. And Ithought it would be fine. But
then the next day, my arm was sosore. I could I could barely
move it. And I feel like I soundlike I'm overreacting. But it
(36:35):
had a really bad effect on myarm. And I had a booking that
day. And I had to cancel becauseI was like, ah, this sounds like
it's such a minor injury. But Iwas like "I can't roll around in
a bed without the use of one ofmy arms". I'm not like-- I can't
do my job. And I had to text andbe like, "Oh, I'm sorry, I have
(36:58):
to cancel. It's because I got aneedle yesterday", like it
sounded so lame. But that's thereality of our job. If our
bodies aren't fit and fighting.
It's really hard to do.
Holly Harte (37:08):
Well, I can sort of relate. When I had the flu shot.
What was that about a month ortwo ago? That whole week? I
would be lying on the bed andtalking to clients. And I'd say,
"Oh, can we just get out andswap sides? Because this arm is
really sore from my flu shot?"Mine wasn't as bad as your your
booster shot. But yeah, it's allthose little unglamorous things
that we deal with. And then ofcourse, there's your mental
(37:29):
health, which we should probablysave for another episode. You
know, it's also importantbecause we have to be
emotionally available for ourclients. And sometimes we take
on a lot of heavy stuff. Andthat can be really difficult if
you're feeling mentally fragile.
Jenna Love (37:42):
Yeah, absolutely. I think that's definitely
something we should explore inanother episode.
Somebody You Love (37:47):
Interlude
Jenna Love (37:50):
So Holly, you last week, you mentioned that you had
some misconceptions yourselfabout the industry before you
started working in it. So Ithought we should break one of
those down today.
Holly Harte (38:01):
Yeah, this is sort of coming back to that naivety I
mentioned before, maybe it's not--maybe other people see it this
way, as well. But this was mytake on it before I entered the
industry. I used to think thatsex work, or working in the sex
industry, would make you hatesex, and then not have any
interest in it outside of workso that it would basically ruin
(38:23):
sex for you. And yeah, just makeit a chore.
Jenna Love (38:28):
Or maybe take any romantic level out of it.
Holly Harte (38:30):
Just taint it as a not pleasurable thing. Yeah,
that was -- Yeah. And so I hadthis perception that once I
became a full time sex worker, Iwouldn't enjoy sex anymore. And
I've always been a very sexualperson. So that was a really
frightening thing. To think thatsomething that I loved so much
might become not enjoyableanymore, which absolutely is not
(38:52):
the truth. I am still as hornyas ever. I still love sex with
my clients. I still am sexuallyinterested in people outside of
my clients. I am. Yes, stillsuper horny. So that was
absolutely incorrect. And Ithink that goes for a lot of sex
workers. I know I've definitelyheard some of my sex worker
friends say they've, you know,they're worn out or they're
(39:14):
burnt out or they've lost a bitof interest in sex or, you know,
if they're not getting paid forit. It's not as exciting things
like that, which you know,different sex workers face from
time to time. But the vastmajority of my friends that I
speak to seem to still havehealthy sex lives and healthy
interest in sex. So that'sreally cool. Yeah,
Jenna Love (39:35):
That is nice. I think it's, it's interesting
because, yeah, there you willcome across people who may sort
of say "oh when I'm having sexwith people who are male
presenting," which is obviouslynot all of our clients, but it
is a large percentage of ourclients, then they sort of want
to be paid for it and they mightbe bisexual or pansexual. But
(39:58):
they sort of get their fix ofmen from their clients. And so
in their personal life, they'reonly interested in having sex
with women or non binary people,which I y--ou know, that makes
sense to me .
Holly Harte (40:08):
Interesting
Jenna Love (40:09):
For me personally, I think, like, yes, there are
certainly times when you mightfeel burnt out or, like if I've
just come home from a tour, andI've had a lot of sex, and done
a lot of work aside from justthe sex. Yeah, I'm not going to
run home and feel like havingmore, of course, like, I'm gonna
need some downtime. But I dofind that often, sex as a job
(40:31):
can stimulate my private sexlife. Like if I have a really
hot day at work or really goodbooking. You know it makes me
more and more horny, like, themore sex I have, the more sex I
want.
Holly Harte (40:43):
I find the same thing. Yeah.
Jenna Love (40:46):
I think I'm quite-- I read about active and reactive
sexuality. And I think I'm quitelike reactive. Like, I kind of
forget that sex is a thing untilI'm doing it. And I'm like, Oh,
my God, this is so amazing. Andthen I want to do more of it.
Holly Harte (41:00):
That's interesting.
I took a year of celibacy, aboutseven years ago, just to see if
I could do it. Because I am suchhorny freak that I really wanted
to see--
Jenna Love (41:11):
What you just did it for shits and giggles?
Holly Harte (41:12):
Yeah, Jen is giving me the funniest facial
expression over Zoom right now.
This horror. And yeah, I know,it sounds weird. But I just
wanted to exercise restraint onsomething and see if I could do
it. And I did. And it was, itwas actually really good. I
know, we can explore thatanother day in another episode.
(41:33):
But I actually ended up notbeing horny at all. By the end
of the year, I just wasn't thatinterested in sex. But then
obviously, I said, "Well, I'mgoing to go and have sex now"
and once I was I was off - andit built. And similarly, right
now if I'm having great sex allthe time. Yeah, I just want
more. So maybe I'm just totallygreedy
Jenna Love (41:53):
On the flip side of that, however, it is the
misconception. I'll throwanother one in, you got a double
bonus misconception episode,that we are all massive horn
bags and want sex all the time.
I can't tell you how manyclients go, "oh my god, I feel
so sorry for your husband. Whenhe gets home from work, you must
just jump on him." And I'm like,What? No. We've been together
(42:14):
for 12 years. There's not muchjumping that happens. I adore
our sex life. But we're notlike-- I don't just launch
myself at people -- you'repaying for me to do that to you.
You know. And after a day of mehaving sex with other people,
often I just want to sit on thecouch and not be touched for a
(42:34):
little while.
Holly Harte (42:37):
Yep
Jenna Love (42:37):
and that's you know, yeah, yeah. So I think the
there's there's both extremes ofit. There are certainly times
when my job does make me go "Oh,God, I just don't want sex
anymore"
Holly Harte (42:46):
We're human beings!
Jenna Love (42:47):
But that's always fleeting. Yeah, it definitely
hasn't ruined sex for me.
Somebody You Love (42:52):
Interlude
Holly Harte (42:55):
Okay, this week for Shit People Say I'm just gonna
go through a couple of messagesI've received. It's probably not
going to be anywhere living upto Jenna's beautiful 'sports
attic' thread last week, whichwas absolutely a highlight. But
here's a couple that we thoughtwere good. Okay, so I received a
(43:16):
message when I had advertised ablow jobs only service. Blow
jobs. Pretty standard. That'sit. That's all you get. I got a
message from a gentleman. "Hi. Iwould love to meet you. What
does a blow job give me?" Which
Jenna Love (43:31):
Oh,
Holly Harte (43:31):
I felt that was pretty self explanatory.
Jenna Love (43:33):
Hopefully an orgasm?
Holly Harte (43:37):
Just a blow job.
That's.. I don't know what elseyou're looking for-- blowjob
and a handstand? I don't knowwhat he was hoping for with the
inclusions. Another one, which Ireally liked was I got a
question from a gentleman-- nowjust to explain to --Well, no,
you know what, I'm not evengoing to explain it. This is
self explanatory. I got amessage from a guy saying "what
is pegging?" And I said,"fucking you in the ass with a
(44:01):
strap on" And he said, "How bigis it?" And I said, "big" And he
said, "No, thanks". So that wasobviously enough to scare him
off.
Jenna Love (44:13):
You don't have to do it!
Holly Harte (44:17):
I don't know what the answer was that he was
looking for. I don't knowwhether he wanted centimetres.
Jenna Love (44:22):
You know, I've had a couple of people contact me and
say, "do we have to do likepegging" because it's listed as
something that I will offer
Holly Harte (44:30):
Pegging! I've had similar
Jenna Love (44:30):
And they'd be like, "I don't want that". And I'm
like, "that's fine, babe. I'mnot--that's cool".
Holly Harte (44:37):
We don't have to do all the things that I offer. And
my final one for today issomeone contacted me asking,
"Are you available?" I said,"I'll be available at 3pm." They
said, "Are you not availableright now?" I said "no". And
they said, "let me know whenyou're free". And I said, "Well,
I'm free at 3pm" Like Iliterally just told you that. I
(44:59):
don't know what--- at 3! Soyeah, I don't know what that the
intention was there. But yeah,three that I thought were quite
entertaining.
Jenna Love (45:09):
What about the swimming one?
Holly Harte (45:10):
Oh, okay, well, that's a whole story. I did
receive a message from somebodyasking if we could go for a swim
together. "I want to go for aswim with you, but I don't want
to go to jail". And I said, "whywould we go to jail?" And he
said, "cuz you're an escort andI'm a client,"
Jenna Love (45:31):
right
Holly Harte (45:31):
I said, "Well, that's not illegal, you know?"
And he said, "What isn't?" And Isaid, "being an escort or a
client" and he said, "Yeah, butgoing for a swim is."
Jenna Love (45:41):
is it?
Holly Harte (45:41):
And I said how? I actually said "lol how?" And he
said, "I don't know, becauseit's not like a booking". So how
would that be illegal? Anyway,we never solved why he thought
that was illegal
Jenna Love (45:55):
Oh I need resolution on that. How strange!
Holly Harte (45:59):
--what the crime committed is. Very cute.
Jenna Love (46:03):
So sex work is legal. But you can't do anything
with sex workers that isn't sex.
Holly Harte (46:09):
Do not swim with your hooker. It could be like a
gremlin thing. Like maybe theythink, you know, as soon as we
touch water police appear. Idon't know.
Jenna Love (46:21):
It wasn't during COVID was it? Like there was a
lot--
Holly Harte (46:23):
No this was like two years ago. Just a guy who
who, yeah, thought that thehandcuffs would appear as soon
as we got in the water. Yep.
Somebody You Love (46:32):
Interlude
Jenna Love (46:33):
So the final segment that we have on the show, which
we meant to spruik last week,and we forgot about I think, is
we wanted to maybe answer aquestion or two from our
listeners each week. And itdepends on how we go. If
everything is getting a bit longwinded, we might just have to do
separate question and answer,like bonus episodes. But just
(46:56):
keep an eye on our social media.
We have Facebook, Instagram, andTwitter. Our name everywhere is
@somebodyyoupod. And we will beasking questions because we'd
love you to--basically wherewe're farming you for content.
That's what we're getting athere.
Holly Harte (47:11):
Yeah, we're using you do you like being used by
us, you dirty boys.
Jenna Love (47:16):
And she says she's not a domme.
And that brings us to the end ofour episode. Now we mentioned
last week that we have a Patreonwhere you can get access to
bonus episodes, you get ourepisodes a day early, they will
always be ad free episodes. Andthere's a bunch of other little
(47:37):
perks in there as well. Andwe're lucky enough to have had a
number of people sign up. Andactually most of these people
signed up before our firstepisode was released, which
was--
Holly Harte (47:47):
That's massive.
Jenna Love (47:48):
We were both so incredibly touched by that
--really put us in a good placeto start and made us feel really
supported. This is a totally newjourney for both of us. So it
really meant a lot. So we'd liketo thank those people, we have a
Giving Somebody who is Mal, wehave two Generous Somebodies and
they are Adelle and Bruce
Holly Harte (48:09):
we have a few Very Generous Somebodies, who are The
Alice grey, Pete, Spaceman Dan,Darwin, Steve, Timmy and Lachlan
and two Extremely GenerousSomebodies who are Aaron and
PrettyInPink.
Jenna Love (48:24):
Thank you so much.
Thank you. Thank you for takingthe time to listen to the voices
of sex workers. Please look outfor us on Twitter, Instagram,
and patreon name everywhere issomebody you pod as in podcast,
and our Patreon starts at just$3 a month. And remember,
Somebody You Love might just bea sex worker.
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