Aaron Myers

Episode Transcript
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Unknown (00:00):
Yeah, we're counting our blessings. I think COVID has

(00:02):
just made us really focus on theessentials and what we need as
opposed to what we want and givethanks for what we have. And I
think in the holiday season,that's always true, but it's
just rung even more true, Ithink, this year.
Welcome to Souls of Hip Hop, apodcast for hip hop heads that

(00:22):
aims to bring inspiring peopletogether to share their wisdom,
passion and unique stories.
My name is Candy, and I'm DJRazor Cut. And together we are
Soulidarity, connecting soulsorganically.

(00:47):
What's up fam, thanks for tuningin. On today's show, we welcome
Aaron Myers. Aaron is a Locker,B-boy, Capoeirista and the
co-artistic director of theBeantown lockers. He is also a
Harvard University alumni andVice President at United Way
worldwide. Aaron is married withtwo daughters and lives in
Boston.

(01:08):
I want to start off by askinghow would your parents describe
what you do?
So I think at a really highlevel, and reflective of the
values that I think they triedto instill in me, I think they
would describe me as someonewho's really mission centered,
and community oriented. I'veworked most of my professional
life in the nonprofit sector,and now work with United Way

(01:30):
worldwide, I support our networkof organizations outside of the
US. And I've always seen theplace where I work in a
profession I've chose as a meansto create opportunity for people
that historically have beendisadvantaged, either by history
or by institutions today, aroundthe world. And so for me, that's
been really meaningful. And itcomes from my parents who are

(01:53):
always really active incommunity themselves. My father
was really active with the UrbanLeague, also with the United Way
in the town where I grew up. Andthen before that, to a certain
extent, the civil rightsmovement, as well, both of my
parents, so those are values, Ithink I've gotten honesty from
them, and that I'm thankful for.
And so I would say that's mywork life and then outside of my

(02:13):
work life, my father is a bit ofa ham, and always joking. So
I've tried to follow his lead inthat regard as well in terms of
I guess, they describe me asfunny though, in a different way
from our dad, perhaps, and hiscreative as well. You know, I
liked when I grew up arounddancing, there was always music
in the house. My parents inparticular love Motown. They

(02:35):
love Marvin, from theCommodores, James Brown, and so
many others I grew up listening,you know, to those influences,
there was a lot of dancing, andparticularly in the holidays,
but it was all social dancing,it was fine. And so that's why I
took my creative cue from wasmore from the dancing and the
music that I grew up around,that they played. And it

(02:57):
interesting enough, I've reallyfelt there was a bit of a bridge
between my parents music, andthen the music that I started to
embrace when hip hop emergedbecause hip hop sampled so
heavily from some of the samethings that I heard growing up.
And so that kind of tethered, Iwould say, my generation to my
parents generation, which wasnice.

(03:17):
Can you tell us a bit about whatyou remember as your first
encounter with hip hop, and likehow you experienced that?
Yeah, it was so mainly throughthe media. And so it was
initially movies that came tomind for me. So movies like
Wildstyle, and Style Wars. Andthen shortly thereafter, I

(03:38):
recall, there was Beat Streetand Breakin' which were perhaps
even more influential in myeyes. In fact, I remember in our
movie theater, in the town whereI was growing up by that time.
So I was born in Chicago, bornand raised initially in Chicago,
but then it was, by the time Igot an elementary school, we
relocated to Indiana, to a townabout an hour north of

(03:59):
Indianapolis, and about two tothree hours away from Chicago,
where we still had relativeswhere we would spend summers. So
my ties to Chicago have alwaysbeen strong, even though I grew
up in a slightly differentplace. But even in a smaller
town where I grew up, you know,these movies had reach, and I
went to see them multiple timeswith my friends. And I can
recall in the middle of themovie, we would be so inspired

(04:22):
by what we were seeing on thebig screen, there was a big
space between the front rowusually nobody wants to sit and
the screen itself. And we wouldstart dancing in the middle of
the movie, almost in rotation asif it was a cipher, like we'd
sit down and watch. And thenonce one person was done
catching wreck, another personwould jump in. So maybe that's
why we had to go multiple timesbecause we ended up missing it.

(04:43):
But again, we couldn't help butfeel inspired. And after the
movie I can recall I wouldn't beled out and there was a long
corridor between the entrance tothe cinema and the exit to the
street. And it's sort of feltlike one of the scenes in Beat
Street where they're in thesubway and they were in a
largely vacant subway space andalmost had that same vibe to it,

(05:04):
and so they're the cipher andthe dancing would just continue
afterwards until our parentscame and picked us up and then
we had to go. And so it wasshows like that. And then I
would say it was followed byother shows, some of which you
know, it started well beforethat one shows like Soul Train.
I remember catching early onSaturday morning sometime, and
Soul Train was playing more funkand soul it's where locking

(05:27):
first gained a nationalaudience, where Don Campbell,
Scooby Doo, Jimmy Foster andothers made their appearances on
that show and helped to definethe aesthetic of the dance. But
there were others, the othereventually I recall started to
show up on Soul Train as well. Irecall, I think Kurtis Blow was
one of the early ones, but Ireally recall groups like
Nucleus, and they sang jam on itcame on revenge. And then other

(05:50):
groups from the early days, likeSoul Sonic Force was on there at
one point, these are memoriesthat really like cemented my
relationship and my interest inhip hop. And these were
performers that captivated myimagination. And then there were
the subsequent generations thatgot their own spotlight on other
TV shows like BTS rap city,which I would try to catch on a

(06:10):
regular, and then you own MTVRaps. And in those days, you had
to, you know, there was no, Ithink the VCR was making its
admin or its ways into people'shomes, what otherwise, you
really had to be focused on youhad to tune in at the time, you
had to catch the move or catchthe verse, and try to remember
it or at least recall the spiritof it to try to replicate

(06:32):
something like that thereafter,or to have it be your basis for
inspiration. And so my first Itall started with the media
between the movies and thoseshows.
That was like in the mid 80s?
Yeah, that's right. So I mean,again, inspired by those films
in the mid 80s, I started thebreaking and then there was a
time where as a kid, I think asyou're growing up your interests

(06:52):
shift. So I think the mediastarted paying less attention to
b-boying and b-girling, likemore of my friends stopped doing
it. And so I didn't necessarilyhave a community of people that
we would push or pull oneanother right to continue to
grow in that direction. And itwas also about the time that
sports were becoming moreprominent. And that was just a

(07:13):
big part of the, you know, thecity and the culture where I was
growing up at the time. So Imoved into BMX racing sort of
recreationally that eventuallyevolved into skateboarding in
parallel what was happening as Iwas playing soccer, basketball,
track, so a lot of differentsports. And that just sort of
squeezed out dance unless it wasin social settings. And there

(07:34):
were plenty of opportunitiessocially, even through middle
and high school to dance. But itdidn't become a thing in and of
itself, to which peoplenecessarily dedicated a lot of
time and attention, maybe to thesame extent that they do today.
And I guess if I just extendthat a bit further into the
future. And when I went tocollege, I had, you know, done
sports. In fact, I continued, Iplayed football through college

(07:56):
my first year. But then college,I started to see all these other
things in terms of arts thatcaught my interest, one of which
was Capoeira Angola. And so Iwas attracted to Capoeira
Angola, in part because it hadthe same energy, the same
dynamism that B-boying did forme, and I assumed at that point,
well, no one else was into b-boyor B-girling. This looks like

(08:19):
the next best thing. And thereare so many similarities. And
then I also had the opportunityto learn another language
through this art form, toconnect to another culture to
learn to play a whole range ofpercussive instruments. And for
me, that was intriguing. Andthat and so I shifted into to
Capoeira Angola, about midwaythrough college, and it wasn't

(08:40):
so after college. So this isgetting to the late 90s. Now,
when I saw a flyer for FloorLore, which is a show a
production put on by the FloorLords in Boston, that I
realized, man, there are peopleout here still doing this than
keeping this alive. And evenputting on full scale
productions with it, this bigshow that I went to see. And I

(09:02):
approached them afterwards. AndI said, Man, I love what you
guys are doing. Where do youpractice? How can I learn? I
connected with Lino at thattime, who was the president of
the Floor Lords, I alsoconnected with Flyte. And then
Jonathan, some of the members ofthe crew at that time, and they
told me about the Henigenschool. So I started this is
after college in the late 90sand early 2000, frequenting

(09:22):
their practices and learningfrom them. And again, that was a
really bright chapter in my lifeas well.
What is interesting is I didn'tknow that you grew up in
Chicago.
Yeah, that's where I was born.
And that's 75. My sister's stillthere. It takes us back there
once a year or so. So what ourconnections to Chicago are
certainly strong.
You describe what it was likegrowing up in Chicago?

(09:44):
Yeah. So for me, the things thatmade a lasting impression on me
even influenced what I studied,I think to a certain extent had
to do with artistic and then thecultural scene so by the
artistic scene, you know, mymom, my aunt would take us to
For example, the Art Instituteof Chicago. And there was always
amazing exhibits and thingshappening there that I thought

(10:06):
were so awesome and I've alwaysloved art still do. And so there
were those kinds of things.
There were also the streetfestivals, you may know that,
that Chicago has a very largeand historic Mexican community.
There's also Polish community,there's a more recent Puerto
Rican community, and sort ofHumboldt Park. In fact, there's
this enormous Puerto Rican flagthat's metallic and made out of

(10:27):
metal that sort of crosses thatpart of what you could consider
little Puerto Rico and Chicago,but the Mexican festivals were
always an awesome place wherecommunity came together. We also
in recent years, we went back onone of our visits to see my
sister went to a lowriderfestival. And I just think that
is such a beautifulmanifestation of community, of
family of creativity, andwherever all those things

(10:49):
intersect. I've always lovedbeing in those places, and
seeing those things. So betweenthe museums, and then the
community based festivals, andthis is not to mention, the
other festivals in Chicago isknown for in terms of its
musical traditions, right?
Chicago is steeped in the blues,has a great Blues Festival.
There's also the Jazz Festival,you know, all of these things,

(11:13):
and I would say together withgoing to Lake Michigan has less
to do maybe necessarily with thearts and culture. But that was
the next best thing to have anocean for someone like me from
the Midwest who's landlocked, wewould go to the dunes, which are
big, you know, rolling sandhills that are on the border of
Lake Michigan. And so oursummers, that was another kind
of highlight it was it was acombination of all those things,

(11:36):
from the sand in the sea, orsimilarities to it, to the
community to the art and theinstitutions, all of which were
highlights from me growing up inChicago.
Then you go to college inBoston.
Yeah. So that's what brought meto Boston, initially,
where did you go to college?
So I was at Harvard. And thiswas like that made into the late

(11:57):
90s. AndDid you just say you went to
Harvard?
Yeah. I was, I was very lucky, Iwas very lucky to go there. I
really was at so much to do withthe people I met. You know, I
think people think of thatschool. And the reputation as
academically, of course, it'shigh standards. It's known for

(12:18):
that. But man, that the people Iconnected with the friendships I
still have through today arewhat I carry with me more than
anything. And I feel like I'velearned so much from the people
I went to school with, I thinkto tie some of everything
together. And one of the thingsI took away from school is that
it was great to gain otherlanguages. You know, I grew up
hearing, being in Chicago andhaving an aunt who spoke

(12:41):
Spanish, we spent several yearsin Chile and would take me to
some of those festivals as wellthat I was referencing earlier,
she was sort of my conduit intothat part of the world, the
Spanish speaking part of theworld. And so I had studied,
even though I grew up aroundSpanish, I didn't necessarily, I
didn't speak it at home. So Imade it a point to study from
middle to high and then all theway through college, and

(13:03):
eventually went to Spain spendsome time until later, like a
summer, I spent a summerstudying abroad there. But I
also started to pick up otherRoman languages because after
going to Spain until lado, Ibecame interested, we traveled
to France, and planning ahead tothat I was like, man, I better
have some friends. And if I wantto make the most of you know
that extra time that I've beenthere, so from Spanish, I added

(13:26):
French and then late in collegeyears on my own started working
on Brazilian Portuguese as well,I got a little grant to actually
look into capoeira. And I knewthat if you're ever going to
you're going to conductresearch, if you want to
understand culture, if you wantto understand a dance or people
in their culture, you've got tobe able to understand their
language and not just thelanguage of movement, but the

(13:48):
you know, the language theyspeak. So that's why I made such
a concerted effort to work onforeign languages. Because I
knew it would be helpful, theextent to which I could speak
them, I know, it'd be the extentto which I could really
understand elements of theculture as well, including its,
you know, traditions andmovement, music, etc. So that
was wonderful as well. And thatwas one takeaway. And I think

(14:11):
the other thing beyond foreignlanguages and under skin,
underscoring their importance asit relates to culture, is that
what I started to appreciate theopportunities that that I had,
and I'm grateful for, to kind ofbuild a bridge between the
institution what is called theivory tower, and then community.
And mainly that was throughprograms like there's something

(14:32):
called the Phillips Brookshouse, which organized community
service opportunities. Soinstead of there was several
years instead of going on aspring break to one destination,
we had community service trips,right. So we knew there was a
big needed community, a group ofstudents would go there and
execute a project that addressthe need that a community had,
and expose this to new parts ofthe states. So that was really

(14:54):
interesting. And then during theyear I did this program called
city step and it was greatbecause it Really melted my
interest in dance and then beingconnected community as well. And
essentially, we would go intoschools, Boston area public
schools between Cambridge andBoston. And we would offer dance
instruction. But it was danceinstruction after grounding them
in the fundamentals of oneaspect of dance and it had a hip

(15:16):
hop focus, it was actuallydeveloped a production. So
different cohorts of studentswill go to different schools
develop a routine, together withthe students in the school,
including allowing them tochoose the music to shape some
of the movement, if they woulddo something we pick up on and
say, yeah, let's put that in. Ilove that. What do you want to
call it that you know, they havea name for it. So we co created

(15:37):
with the kids, and we both ininto a production every year.
And these are organizations,institutions, I still support
just philanthropically because Ibelieve in their work. And they
continue to make a greatimpression. So that was
wonderful from the language fromthe, again from the institution
into the community. And thenafter school in terms of the
community, I started discoveringall these other institutions. So

(15:59):
is it related to copper and goldthat there was the New England
Brazilian Cultural Center. Andthat's where that's where I was
sending a couple of Angola. Butit was also a place with a cape
verdean community would holdregular parties that I got to go
to once in a while. And thosewere awesome, whole another
community, one of the style offoods style of music style of
dance. And it's also where soulrevival took place, which

(16:22):
historically was a big houseparty in Boston. And so now, you
know, the house scene is veryrich, but that happened at the
Brazilian Cultural Center aswell. So it's a place where I
went from one thing, and then Igot so much more. In addition to
that there was an organizationcalled gymnastics, it was
teaching gymnastics to youth,but also had a dance program, as
well. And this was theorganization run by an art

(16:44):
Frank, that's a predecessor towhat is now called meta
movements, Latin dance company,doing the same thing also has a
gymnastics component, but withLatin music, and that was
actually the program to which Imet my wife and man, how could
you ever repay theseinstitutions, they've given me
right. And then, of course,there was the Floor Lords crew,
you know, it took me to be ableto dance with them for a while,

(17:05):
and then to connect with theBrazilian, with the African
American Latino communities thatotherwise I may have had no
connection to. But it gave me areal meaningful way of
connecting with them, andlearning new things. And so
those are some highlights fromthe college years, I would say
until shortly thereafter, andthen overlapping with the Floor
Lords.
So I definitely want to talk abit more about the connection

(17:28):
that you build with capoeira andlearning Portuguese, and then
actually spending time inBrazil. But before we get there,
I just want to dive a littledeeper into the years of getting
to know the Floor Lords,expanding a bit more about how
you experienced the scene atthat time in the late 90s. And
how it was for you during thattime,

(17:49):
man, it was such an excitingtime. So the production, I have
to say, Floor Lore and again,that was the point of entry. So
maybe I should just start there.
What was so exciting about that,for me is that they would
highlight not only the differentdimensions of hip hop, so it's a
one part of the show, the latterone is, as I'm calling would
highlight DJs, MCs, graffitiwriters. And then of course, the

(18:12):
B boys and B girls and somepoppers as well. And then
another part of the showhighlighted all the influences
on hip hop that were around hiphop, and in which there were
synergies with hip hop. So inthat other section, they would
have something on Kung Fu, theywould have something it looked
like a scene out of I don'tknow, a disco with like funk
soul music. And that's why alittle locking would come into

(18:33):
play. They had a Capoeira Angolascene, then they had a Latin
scene as well. We know about,you know, the influences of the
Latino community on the birth ofhip hop on top rock and Wiggles
has written and talked aboutthis extensively. And so Floor
Lore connected all the dots forpeople. It's almost like saying
what came before and influence.

(18:54):
And then here are all theelements and all their splendor.
So that was that was awesome.
And so what was happening at thetime is that we would all
rehearse to the Hinnigan school.
So that was the spot. And thisis near he st stop off the green
line, if you're familiar withBoston, sort of in the Roxbury
section. And so I would take thetrain to there walk up that way.
In fact, I live in Edison squareright out of college, so I

(19:16):
wasn't too far. But they were sowelcoming and encouraging.
They'd be up on the stage, therewas an elevated stage where the
crew members, the core memberswould practice had a nice smooth
wood floor. And then the rest ofus the cafeteria tables out of
the way as the cafeteria, andusually the janitor hadn't
cleaned up all that well. Sowe're down there on the floor,

(19:37):
back spinning in mustard.
And just having such a goodtime, and if we ever had a
question, they were alsoapproachable. You know, in
particular, I mean, I think ofLino in particular, I also think
of Domino and Dash are relatedto popping. If there was one
move you wanted to know about,you know, you could always just
tap him on the shoulder, andthey're more than happy to step

(19:59):
away from it. Whatever ishappening, and show you and then
give you some words ofencouragement. So that's
something I've alwaysappreciated about Floor Lords.
But that was a couple of times aweek, we would do that. And then
I remember they would do jams aswell. This was at a time where I
feel like when I came back toBoston, about five years ago,
Floor Lords were much more andbut this time Pookie sort of
moved into place, Alex Diaz akaEl Nino as the Floor Lords

(20:23):
president, where they were muchmore focused on battling, they
still organized jams, but at thetime when I joined, so in the
late 90s, up into the early2000s, when I went to graduate
school, there was a lot moreshow opportunities, performance
opportunities, which is not tosay they didn't battle, they did
battle Rock Steady. They didbattle other crews during that
span of three years or so when Iwas going to practice with them.

(20:46):
And if there are jams, you know,there I think the first time I
battled in one of their jamswas, there was a jam, they threw
out the Tobin school. Also inthe Roxbury section was the
flooring to the union jam, theywould do it on an annual basis,
just like they now do theiranniversary, it was a bit more
informal than but they wouldhave battles and in different
categories. And that was thefirst time I think I battled

(21:07):
after having gone there andpractice and practice and
practice. And from there, theyLino saw there was enough
interest in those of us who arenewer that didn't have the
experience didn't necessarilyhave the skill set for the core
crew members to do perform atthe level that they did. But
they created Floor Lords too.
And there's a bunch of a thingfor that group. And so the
smaller shows or the shows thatmaybe weren't paid, it was a

(21:29):
growth opportunity. For us, itwas an exposure opportunity,
bonding opportunity to perform,to create our own routines, do
our own thing. And then theywould at times bring us in back
into some of the bigger showslike Floor Lore, when they would
do that production, I wouldusually become the one working
with them, like on a coupleother segments. But then there
might be another routine or twothat I joined with the others.

(21:51):
And this was also the time andone other thing I would add
about this, this time from like98 to 2001 is when I first
started to see lacking, becausethey would put it a little into
the flow load show. And therewas one or two people like
Shallow, David Shallow, did alittle bit of it. Lino did a
little bit of it, mostly in thecontext of shows. But it was
George lumpkins, who was DJ Act1who's still here, that was

(22:14):
really about it. And so therewere other opportunities like
they did a wall World's Fairthat was near Roxburgh crossing,
and this was in the summer of2000, I believe it was, and act
one actually put together a lockin routine that him and I did in
the context of that show. Andthere was other shows like that,
where there might be onededicated locking routine, it

(22:36):
wasn't that often. And it was astyle of locking, not like the
originals more funky, morecharacter loose, but a bit more
tightly executed and technical,akin to what you see in the
valley, San Fernando Valleystyle associated with the 80
styles of locking, which isunderstandable because that was
their era for the likes ofGeorge Lumpkins. Act One and for

(22:57):
David Shallow, and others. Soit's understandable that that's
where they do their influencewas because it was also the
music changed, right? It becamemore electronic, the beats per
minute, I think was a littlefaster. And that just changed
the whole feel and the executionof locking itself. So I had a
little bit of exposure, but itwas sort of here and there. And
Act One was in and out of thepicture. But I'm grateful that

(23:20):
you planted those seeds ofinspiration then because when I
came back in 2015, that's whereI wanted to pick up. It just
felt right. And it was the lastshow to bring it full circle in
2015 that Lino organized beforehe moved to Hawaii. And when
there was a shift from him beinga president. So it's Alex Diaz.
And so he put Carl Alleyne wo co founded Beantown lockers

(23:42):
And who's the you knowthe CO-creative director o
the group now we consider ouroach the lead, right our inspira
ion, he performed in that show wth a young cat by the name of
abba Velez who's an amazing dancr in his own right here in the B
ston area. He lives in Chelseabut amazing popper and locker,
oung foenum. So I saw them. Andwhen I saw it and wanting to get

(24:03):
back into dance, I was like tat's that's the thing for me. T
at's the time was rightagain, I'm still blown away by
the whole heart. You justdropped Harvard on me like that,
because there's a big movementwithin the collegiate route with
hip hop clubs. And with breakingclubs and dance clubs, and Ivy
League sector, and a lot oftimes these things are not

(24:27):
together. Ivy League and hip hopnormally are not next to each
other. Yet, Hip Hop has alwaysbeen within these universities.
You know, even with Harvard andthe Source magazine.
That's right. Yeah, the foundersof the Source. You're exactly
right. It's something theystarted at the time kind of on
the side. And so the time I wasthere, one interesting

(24:49):
development that I think leadsinto what you were just
describing in terms of how hiphop is showing up in the
university context, is that theyestablish it was sort of a
musical professorship but morefocused on jazz But I've seen
that evolve to even Why thinkNas taught at one point at
Harvard, it led to it because Ithink we have to see hip hop on
a continuum. Right? It didn'tjust all of a sudden happen and

(25:10):
Sedwig and cetera cedar Avenue,right in that year because Kool
Herc was spinning at that party.
I think, you know, it's informedby the stuff that came before
it. It's an evolution of thatfrom from jazz to r&b to funk
and soul from which is sampledso heavily. And the one of the
things I so admire about AfricanAmerican culture, but I think it
extends across the Diaspora is away in which it constantly

(25:33):
reinvents itself. It can take abit or piece of something from
the past and pull it into thefuture in a way that breathes
new life into it when you seethe continuity. And yet it's
something new, it constitutessomething new in and of itself.
And that just fascinates me,especially if you put it against
the backdrop of so muchoppression, and discrimination,
and so much hardship, right.

(25:56):
It's amazing. The resiliencethat underpins hip hop culture,
and allows it to persist nomatter what you know, and they
say, can't stop won't stop. Ibelieve that just because that's
just what it's what I've seen.
But coming back to Harvard, it'salso fascinating to see that as
they introduce maybe a professorhere or there who's a
practitioner of the art form, inorder in order to provide

(26:17):
firsthand I would say, knowledgeand experience and exposure to
students who are interested inthis subject. It's finishing,
see the likes of CornellUniversity, establish a whole
archives that's got all thesegreat fliers and memorabilia.
And then it's interesting to seewithin the context of
Massachusetts, there's now aMassachusetts hip hop archive as
well, I realized that's outsideof the university itself, but

(26:40):
still a really positive,interesting development. And now
the Harvard School of Educationfor graduate school, there's hip
hop x lab, at a shot of church,and there's a member of our
crew, Remy, who's now studyingthere as well. And it seems like
there's more. And I think itcomes back to what I started
seeing my university years interms of what are those

(27:01):
opportunities to build a bridgebetween University and community
that's mutually beneficial, thatenriches the understanding of
those who care about, you know,community needs, issues,
institutions, and then people inthe community themselves that
have the first hand knowledge,often of what the best solutions
are, that are often the peoplethat define the culture. And the

(27:21):
Vanguard's right, who arecarrying it forward. It's it's a
really symbiotic relationship.
And so people say, Listen, youknow, you'll never learn hip hop
in the university. I thinkthat's true, I think it will
always stand alone and its ownright and community from which
it came. At the same time. Ithink there are benefits that

(27:42):
flow in both directions tomaking those kind of
connections. So when peoplecriticize, or they're doing
this, and and it's not legit, Ijust think we need to be more
open minded right about thosedevelopments and say, Well, what
how could that benefitultimately, community. How do we
center the people and ensurethat the value accrues to them
that helped define and keep thisalive? For us, I don't know if

(28:04):
you see it differently, Candy?
I learned about it also, when Iwent to college to learn more
about the culture aspect. Sowhen I was in university, I just
found myself going to shows andmeeting people within that and
starting sort of a student runclub, it wasn't an official
club, it was something that weall kind of linked up together
to do. And within that, like yousaid, there were one or two

(28:27):
professors that shared hip hopthrough an English course, or
shared hip hop arts. And so itwas like these little sprinkles.
When I moved to Boston insideit, you know, at Harvard, which
is also known for this veryhighly academic elite place and

(28:49):
to see that people wereembracing it kids were having a
space within their dorms todance, to see Harvard throw a
jam for their communities andhaving other Ivy League schools
come together and collegiate. Sowhat I really enjoyed about it
was seeing that crew atmospherethat I that was has been missing

(29:13):
to see it again, within thestudents and seeing the crews
with their the women and theircrews and their colleges
supporting them and rooting themon and it was just sort of gave
me that feel of when I starteddancing and how that sort of
family crew energy vibe was andso I was like, I never thought

(29:35):
that I would find this here atHarvard.
Yeah, it's true.
Razor was spinning and I'm like,first of all, I'm judging a jam
here at Harvard.
Yeah.
My mom was like, starting tolike my daughter's judging at
Harvard. And yeah, you know,thank you go, go.
I'm sitting in the end. He'sDJing and I'm sitting over here

(29:56):
like, is this really happening?
Like, you know, these kidsreally vibing out This is
amazing and great to see theculture giving everyone an
opportunity to learn about itmore. Because regardless, you're
going to try to find theknowledge, right? You, like you
said, you need to learn thecultures, I need to learn the
language I need to. And sothat's what happens as you get
engulfed in the culture.

(30:18):
You want to learn about it?
Absolutely. Yeah, I was alsoencouraged to come back and say,
wait a minute, there's a Harvardbreakers club. I said, I had no
idea. And it was at that jam,where I connected with some
members of it like he up forexample. And that was such a fun
jam. I mean, ways that you putit down, maybe doses a funk that
made me so happy. But yeah, theenergy was incredible. And it's

(30:40):
you know, what's what I also seehappening in the community more
broadly, is that space is at apremium, you know, you're in a
city like Boston, space is hardto come by, there's not a whole
lot of funding and support forthe arts necessarily. And we
have to make do with what we'vegot, we've got to be one
another's best resources. And soif the university has facilities
spaces to offer, and there's acorresponding entrance amongst

(31:03):
the student body, right to towelcome in other parts of the
community, that define theculture in which they're
interested, man, that's a winwin, because otherwise, so many
studios are closing down. And wedon't know how many of them not
only studios, but clubs where,again, if I think about locking,
it didn't develop in studio, youknow, it developed initially in

(31:25):
a cafeteria beside a jukebox bya guy that was trying to do a
social dance. We didn't get itquite right. But it really
coalesced in the context ofclubs and competitions in clubs
themselves. And so not knowingif you're going to have these
institutions that anchor andfeed the culture. If whenever we
can do to take advantage ofspaces, even if it's University

(31:45):
ones, there's an interest there.
Again, I think everybody wins.
When that happens.
I think one thing I love aboutyou is that you're so much about
giving back to the communitygiving back to the culture, you
always support from the verysmall local jams to a very big
scale, as you're doing with theUnited Way. Are there any

(32:08):
insights that you can share forartists that are listening to
our podcast on where they canget resources? Or how they can
inform themselves about thingsthat could help them?
Yeah, absolutely. And there's alot of them, I know, I tend to
look at community through anasset based lens, you know,
sometimes we look around, welike damn, I wish we had this.

(32:29):
We don't have that I was I wassort of saying that, but in
different words with referenceto space. But actually, I think
the more we connect with oneanother, and ask those questions
based on what we need thedirection in which we're trying
to go and list other support,just as you're asking this
question, the man anything ispossible. And so if I think
about, for example, classes,even though there are fewer

(32:50):
spaces, I do see organizationscoming along like the flavor
continues. So I'm thinking aboutJane and Brian, that are leading
that group that's bringingtogether I would say the street
dance community of Boston, andall of its different leaders
into a single space to offerclasses. And I think that's
going to lead to some excitingpossibilities. I even see them
making an effort to connect morefully with the university

(33:13):
community, when COVID permits tobe able to orchestrate more jams
that build those ties betweendifferent forms of dance, and
then the university world aswell and beyond. So the flavor
continues is one that definitelycomes to mind. If I think of you
know, there are other needs. IfI think about there's the
business side of dance as well,even though I don't make a

(33:34):
living from it, that I think forsome people that are perhaps
younger, higher potential, andhave that aspiration, it's
important to ground yourself inthe business side of the arts as
well. And so if it relates tofinances, for example, we have a
great dancer here in Boston bythe name of Ashton Lights, aka
Stackz, who's been doing secondstyles are jam for now, what is

(33:55):
it four plus years. But I don'tknow if everyone knows. He also
has this whole program that he'screated based on his own
experience and lessons that he'slearned in terms of managing
your finances effectively, inorder to realize your vision
that he calls the life buildersprogram. That's something I
would highly recommend peoplecheck it out. Even if your
aspiration isn't dance specific.
Stackz has some real worldexperience to impart that's

(34:17):
going to help you get where youwant to go. I'd also mention
there's something called assetsfor artists, which is again,
more on the financial side.
There's even consultancies, likesunlight tax, if you have tax
related questions, if you'regetting revenue from grants, or
if you're getting revenue fromperformances, how do you account
for that in such a way that theIRS doesn't take away a lot of

(34:41):
it right and honors yourposition as an artist as a
creative in this world andyou're able to sustain yourself?
I think that's important.
They're also sometimes legalconsiderations. So around
liability if you're throwing ajam, you may not always think
about this, but I think venuesthat host performance, think
about it, and I've found that weget the question we've tried to
perform it. Different placesabout if you're doing something
that's athletic, perhaps risky,how you're going to mitigate the

(35:04):
risk of you know, you're gettingin trouble, just like the venue
wants to mitigate the risk ofthemself getting sued. So I
think about there folks areconnected with the Arts and
Business Council of GreaterBoston who've been given some
great advice on that front thatI really appreciate. You'd be
surprised even some dancers inour community who are lawyers, I
think about Amy Rubin, who usedto dance a lot with Beantown
lockers and is now more intopopping has been a longtime

(35:27):
tapper and proponent of thearts. She's a lawyer by
training. And so you know, she'seven said, you know, there's
legal technical questions, shemight be able to help. And
she's, I feel like she's one ofus, you know, and why not call
him a friend for something likethat. I also would say, in terms
of technology now, especiallynow in this environment, right,
we've got to figure out how weperform and reach an audience

(35:48):
give a class, and it may gobeyond just knowing what zoom
is. But orchestrating somethingbigger and different and more
engaging online, I found thatthe cats at loop lab are really
great at doing that. And they'realso seeking to empower youth,
in particular youth of colorinto this profession in terms of
technology, audio, visualtechnology, and for artists. And

(36:10):
so another great resource. Andthen the last thing I'll
mention, comes down to fundingas well, right? If you're
looking to way to fund your ideato bring it to life, I think
what I saw a lot of the FloorLords doing back in the day, is
that they would just charge at arate, they could offset the cost
of the venue, adequatelycompensate all the dancers, and
they were really good at doingthat now. But if you're looking

(36:32):
to supplement your revenue inwhat you have, there are so many
grants out there, there's onethat we've been very fortunate
to receive coming into this yearcalled the live artsboston. I
could say more about that as itrelates to what we got coming up
or what we're doing. That's agreat grant. But there's an
organization called Dunamis,which is a bit of a boutique, I
would say boutique not isn'tsuper expensive. They're really

(36:52):
community oriented. But they'rewell versed in the artistic
community and all the differentresources. So they do this thing
on the resources section oftheir website. Again, it's
Dunamis it's a resourcesRoundup. And so they always list
new and upcoming fundingopportunities, whether it's from
the city of Boston, or fromprivate foundations, or other
entities where you can receivefunding in order to bring a

(37:15):
performance to life toorchestrate a workshop. And they
can range from a few 100 to afew 1000 to several $1,000. But
that's a great, a great place tolook for funding type leads. And
I think that covers most of it,I would just say, Man, it really
helps to tap into those aroundyou and ask who knows what
depending on what you're tryingto pursue, because you'll be

(37:36):
surprised how much people knowbut the extent to which you
engage will depend on how muchyour benefit or how quickly you
can find answers to these kindof questions that you may have
to navigate.
We put some of the links in ourshow notes.
So you're the director ofoperations and are now the VP of
international network engagementand performance at United Way

(37:58):
worldwide. What does being a hiphop practitioner have in common
with your work?
Wow, that is a great question.
There's a couple of things thatcome to mind. I mean, one is
cultural competencies, right,you got to be able to relate to
appreciate and ultimately workwith people whose background is
very different than yours. Andthat's just not, you know, my

(38:20):
team, for example, is made up,we have about 25, people spread
out across five differentregions. They all speak
different languages, we'reprobably based of that team of
25 and 12 different countries,we're in different time zones,
it makes for very strange hours.
And things that are lostinevitably in communication via
email, even via zoom, I feellike you got to work harder to

(38:43):
really to discern the nonverbalcues and to be able to truly
connect with somebody. It'shard. It really is. But I think
that the cultural competencies Itried, you know, I made an
effort and I continue to try tohone in starting in college,
whether it's through language,and then the work opportunities
that I've had to work withpeople of very different
backgrounds has helped meappreciate that there are very

(39:04):
different work styles. And thosealready exist amongst people
that share a common language.
Right? They say there are typeA's all the way through. I mean,
you named the others. So I wouldsay cultural competency is an
important skill set. It's Idon't know that there's
necessarily a course for it. ButI feel like that's something
that's critical. And it's aparallel prerequisite, if you
will, in both worlds. The otherthat I found is important is

(39:28):
project management. I thinkartists sometimes have a
reputation of just being loose,spontaneous. I think you have to
end candy I saw you said this atone point, I think one of your
posts where you were reflectingon a moment you were saying you
got to have vision. So a visionabout what you can excite
people. Right. And that's why Ithink leadership comes in to
build excitement and consensusaround a vision. This is what we

(39:50):
want to be able to do. What doyou think? Can you see yourself
in it help people see themselvesin that vision, right, but I
think getting to the visionitself realizing it requires a
lot of execution. And this iswhere you raise a you've got
some skills in terms of yourprofessional life in terms of
project management, right, Iremember you were calling you
said, that's a big part of whatyou have to be able to do in

(40:11):
terms of quality assurance,project management. So I've gone
to Project Management Institutetraining, and I've applied that
same discipline as it relates toplanning and executing some of
our shows. It's the big picturestuff, it's the vision, but it's
the discipline to say, here arethe milestones on that path. To
help understand what differentpeople's strengths and interests
are, some people may not be sokeen on social media, but

(40:33):
they're good on logistics. Soleveraging, understanding
people's strengths andleveraging them into a plan that
allows you to take measuredsteps in the direction of your
vision and to actually achieveit, if this is over the top, but
I use Smartsheet. And I havethese timelines in terms of
phases, milestones, deliverablesrelated notes, and that's what I

(40:53):
use to think about all thecomponents that have to fall
together in a certain order. Andas you try to mitigate the risk
of getting off track, in orderfor just a performance to come
together, really three things,you know, this idea of
leadership when it comes tosetting a vision, and then the
idea of management and executionin terms of project management
to actually help everyone gettheir together.

(41:15):
I completely agree with thosethings. And as you said, I have
a very strong project managementbackground. And when Candy and
me threw our first jam, wecreated a little team, they were
completely overwhelmed when Icame with like an MS Project
Plan, 400 tasks and what I meanby when

(41:36):
I'm trying to get everything ona spreadsheet, everyone had
their own sheet to follow whatthe plan was, right? My homie
was like, yo, Razor is on point,this is the most organized jam,
I've ever been a part of.
Yeah, yeah.
I think it's great to know thatpeople within the community are

(41:57):
offering these types of coursesand offering these types of
workshops to provide for artiststo learn these skills, because
it's not something that mostpeople learn in school. I'm just
like, blown away by all thisknowledge and information.
No doubt.
I want to switch it up a littlebit.
Okay.
What advice would you give yourteenage self?

(42:18):
Oh, that's a great question. SoI'm now in my mid 40s. So it's
like when you hit 40, that checkengine light come on. And so I
mean, you may have heard mereferenced earlier, I was really
fortunate to play a lot ofdifferent sports going up, and I
really enjoyed them. And on theside, I would do BMX racing, BMX

(42:40):
evolved into skateboarding thatcontinue all the way through
college. I mean, I feel likethere's been this parallel mix
of things outside of school, insports between martial arts,
extreme sports, and then, youknow, acrobatic dance art forms
that have always, they've alwaysbeen intertwined. That's been
the trilogy. For me outside ofschool, I just had no fear going

(43:02):
up, if I wanted to do a trick,you know, I had a vision of how
to trigger someone to a trick,if it was on a bike or
skateboard, I would do it. Andthen that carried over into
dance. That's what and so I hadthat same spirit. And I feel
like I started to manage it moreeffectively, you know, after
college, they what I did before,but I was at a point. And to

(43:23):
give you a sense in high school,what they said the insurance
company said to my parents,listen, if your son gets
injured, again, he is off ourpolicy, he is too high risk. And
it's it's of his own doing. Andit's because I'm trying to do
you know, rails slides down handrails or grinds down hand rails,
and then fall in, you know, I'velearned to fall pretty well, but

(43:43):
I just got injured so much. Andso what I found is that between,
you know, the wear and tear overthe years, it catches up with
you. And then you have tocorrect for it. In my case, you
know, it got to a point where Ihave arthritis and one of my
ankles, I had to have areconstructive surgery at the
end of the year before last, andnow I've got to care for it and
manage it in a certain way, restis become a really important

(44:05):
part of the equation, I think Istill have room for improvement
in terms of diet, so that italso allows me to dance for as
long as I'm around and to enjoyit. And with his full range of
motion is possible. You'llappreciate it more, I would say
when you get to be my age. Andso in retrospect, the teenager
so it would be I guess, justtake better care of your body

(44:27):
How has becoming a fatherchanged your perspective or your
philosophy?
That's another good question. Ithink the biggest thing and I
imagine you guys haveexperienced this to a certain
extent as well is aroundreprioritization. You know, for
me at the time, my daughters whoare now 14 & 11 came along what
became the most important thingis being present for my
daughters being able to providefor them together with my wife.

(44:50):
That was just paramount. And sowhat that meant for me in terms
of what my other interests werebefore they came along, in
particular dance. It Really asit relates to taking classes,
going to jams battling orperforming with different
groups, it took a backseat. Andit took a backseat for 10 plus
years. And I found a way so Icouldn't do it with the same

(45:14):
intensity and focus that I haddone it before. And to a certain
extent, I've tried to come backto now but in a balanced way,
considering work life and familyneeds. But what one bright spot
is that when I came back fromBrazil, as I lived and worked in
Brazil, right out of graduateschool for a solid year, and was

(45:34):
able to continue dance throughthem, but when I came back, and
then got married, and thenshortly after that family came
along, what was good is it evenas it did I, because we were in
Newark, New Jersey at the time,so close to New York City, right
across the Hudson River. Youknow, for those about 10 years
or so. There are so manyfestivals in New York City that

(45:55):
were on the weekend when my wifewas actually working, she would
work on Saturdays and sometimesSundays. So what that means is
that was time for me and mygirls to go to the city and I
had to find a way to go tothings like for example, there
was something called CrotonaPark jams that Christie Zee and
Pop master Fable would put onand bring together all kinds of

(46:15):
DJs I mean, the original era,you know, we will go to things
like that, but we would takefood and if there was a swingset
there, we make sure go to theswing set. If there was the guy
selling the little ketose, thelittle sweet shaved ice, we had
to get one of those. So I founda way we could go to Crotona
Park jam. And at a time whenthey were watching Yo Gabba

(46:37):
Gabba shows like that for kids,they would see like oh, that's
Biz Markie. He was on Yo GabbaGabba. And then they want to
talk to this. So we found a wayto make it work occasionally
through festivals on weekends tocombine, you know, just them
wanting to be a kid and meet ourtime with them. But to be in a
space in place, we're also hiphop was alive. And you know, in

(46:57):
fact, we were so close to NewYork City. That was great. I
couldn't engage with thecommunity in the same way I did
before. But I could still bepresent and appreciate. And then
there were other things going upthat hopefully you'll find this
helpful as well, when your kidsget involved in like different
programs in the recreationalinterest. One of them early on
for my older daughter was aroundBowman planet. So my wife is

(47:18):
Puerto Rican. And that's areally important tradition for
her. And so we found thisprogram called those Fernando
still having to know, which is aprominent Bomba planning group
in new york city that has aprogram specifically for kids is
a year long program. And so myolder daughter would go to that.
But of course, my youngerdaughter she'd want to be
playing, she didn't have theattention span, right to sit and

(47:40):
listen to the songs, learn themusic, make the day he got a
mask, they would make thecostume as well and all that up
to performance. So the good newsabout that program, which was at
the Julio Bogo Center in NewYork City, that was a few blocks
away from 106 and Park. And 106and Park is like the graffiti
wall of fame that every yearthey would redo and it's

(48:01):
adjacent to a school, but thatschool has a playground. So
again, here's an opportunity,you know, one daughter was doing
one thing, or if I was doingboth of them, we could still be
in and around things related tohip hop that I so appreciated
that gave me energy andinspiration. But my ghost can be
happy as well. And I thinkthere's a way to find that
balance no matter where you are.
It doesn't come quickly, readilyor easily, but it's possible. So

(48:24):
if nothing else, I hope you'lltake that away to the extent
that your interests diverge, youknow, from your daughters as
they as they grow up, becauseours mine do as well. You know,
my girls, they all need to bebuying the girl and pop in or
aspects. They're doing classicalIndian dance, or they're doing
gymnastics, so we find a way tomake it work.

(48:45):
One thing I've always loved andappreciated about you is you're
very upbeat and motivationalcharacter, like anytime around
you. Your motivation iscontagious. Where did you get
that from?
You know, maybe it partly comesfrom the past, but it's also
very much tied to the presence,you know, some of my best
memories going up are tied todancing, because my family, you

(49:09):
know, always that my dad lovedJames Brown and the mashed
potatoes, my aunt is well. Andso it just continues to give me
a lot of joy. Again, it's notwhat I do professionally. But it
really balances and replenishesme, I also think about the fact
it's taken me to new places weknow both near within the city
that I hadn't discovered I'dknown about even though I was

(49:30):
here in school previously, and Imade my way back now five years
ago, but also far it's taken meto different countries,
especially for Capoeirs Angola,you know, to Brazil multiple
times. And then I discovered ahip hop community in Brazil.
From the time I was living thereand I'm still in touch with now
to Latin community in Brazil,that made its way to Montreal,

(49:50):
which is another place I spent alot of time so it's it's
connecting me with others whoinspire me who enrich me and
especially you know, at thistime I'm grateful for every get
down that I can get, you know,every locker tunity is I say
sometimes say it really lifts meup. And I think it's also it

(50:10):
relates to the present, it's,it's a reflection of the
positive energy I feel in themusic, whether it's the old
music that Razor is laying downsome some classics, or if it's,
you know, a golden era, hip hopjam, or even something more
recent, you can feel it, likethrough the music. And then
also, I think, the others andhow they respond to it, and how

(50:30):
we're able to exchange themovements sometimes without even
saying a thing. That is justfascinating. And, and I think
energizing. And so, for me, I'mreflecting back a lot of what I
see what I feel what I hear inthe context of jams or parties,
and those moments, you know,they don't come along every day.
And when they do, I just feellike you got to make them count,

(50:51):
right? That's my mindset, youknow, going into any and all
opportunities, I have to connectwith others, especially on music
and dance.
I always like to know if there'sany quotes or a tagline that
maybe your kids are like, Dadsays this all the time.
So I can think of one from theFloor Lords days. That was that
was was funny, you know, Linowould sometimes scream, I'll be

(51:12):
like, let's work, you know. AndJames Brown is a similar thing,
like a hardest working man inshow business. I feel like it's
a bit of a reoccurring theme,I'll be at differently stated,
you know, work is play, right?
It's like, let's work. Let's puteverything we got into it. But
let's have fun while we're doingit. And that's a reflection of
an outlook, I think, right? Alife perspective. That's worth
restating this some otherthings, you know, I've had the

(51:34):
good fortune to connect with DonCampbell on three or four
different occasions. Starting in2016, Don Campbell was the
creator of locking, you know,this dance that I'm doing most
these days. And there was a lotof things that he would say that
that really resonated with me.
And I think I would repeat here.
So, you know, as much as peoplewould try to copy what he was

(51:55):
doing. And there was a point inhis earlier days, he'd get
really upset. Like when peopleare copying, he was telling a
story with his sons, mommy'slike, but yeah, they like what
you're doing. It's a compliment.
And it says, that just means yougot to keep on creating. And so
Don would say things like, takemy dance, and make it yours. He
didn't want us to look exactlylike him. He wanted us to put

(52:18):
our own personality, our ownMojo into what we were trying to
do, even if it's using the samefoundational language, the same
basic movements that he came upwith that define locking. So
take my dance and make it yours.
He would also say put yourselfinto it. That's another way I
guess the saying the same thing.
And then I really love that hewould say this, he would often

(52:38):
say, listen, nobody's gonna beatyou with being you, and be blind
be growing. And this extends tohip hop. It's very competitive,
right? It's one upmanship, it'ssurvival of the illest. Right?
It's always, it's battlementality. I feel like when Don
saying that ain't nobody canbeat you at being you, it just

(52:59):
removes all of that tensionotherwise, and it's just like,
express yourself, you know, asCharles Wright would say, it is
that song express yourself. Sohe would say that, and I was
like, wow, that's true. I don'thave to compare myself to
anybody else. You know, however,I put myself into it. However, I
show up, you know, I'm just wantto be the best version of
myself. So ultimately, I thinkthat's what Dan left me with.

(53:20):
And then there's one other thingthat he would say often, which
is, it's not where you start,the way you finish. You know, I
had a humble start, I had ashort period of time with the
floor, though it was only threeyears. So they've had an
enduring influence on my life.
On my Outlook, I took a 10 plusyear hiatus, off dance, to focus
on establishing myself in mycareer, because I wanted to be

(53:40):
able to provide for my familydidn't come back to it to 12
years later, and I came back andI started a different place. But
that had a close relationshipwith connection to the Floor
Lords. And so you no matterwhere you start, even if you
have to press pause, forwhatever personal reasons, if
it's injury, if it's other life,things, you can still come back
to it, you can still be great.

(54:03):
You can you know, you can stillhave fun. You may be at a
different place physically, butyou can't do quite as much. But
it's just to say you can alwayscome back to it. And so that's
why I've relish every moment.
You know, youmentioned a lot of names right
now. But maybe we can expand onthat a little bit. Who do you
look up to and who inspires you?

(54:27):
I would say it's certainly as itrelates to dance in the dance
world. It's Donald Campbell. Hewas he just liked to draw and he
was that quiet kid in thecorner. He would just he would
describe himself. He was contentbeing in his own room at home,
whether it was drawing, youknow, portraits of someone or
still lives. And again, it wasjust one of his charismatic
friends. he admired a couple ofthem that invited him to try to

(54:49):
do the robot shuffle, move sideto side he locked his joints he
missed and then try to catch thebeat and look awkward but they
were like Don do that lock dothat lock and he felt
encouraged. All right. So when Iwas saying earlier to Floor
Lords give you a word ofencouragement, it can go a long
way, you never know how positiveis going to impact someone. So
he got that imagine he took thatand ran with it and created a

(55:10):
whole dance, and then formed awhole group, and then toured the
world. And then also, I wantedto make before I come back to
your question, I do want to makea really important connection as
I see it between locking andthen sort of hip hop or be
boring and be growing. And thatwhen lacking had its resurgence
in the late 90s, early 2000s. Itwas in the context of events

(55:32):
like freestyle session, like Bboy summit, you know, in the
likes of cross one that createdan openness space to bring back
in locking, and then bring backin the originals right, the
original here because it'sconsidered, some people call it
this is the first street dance.
It's not necessarily hip hop, itdidn't as hip hop, you know,
being born in the Bronx. It wasslightly earlier, but an

(55:53):
important precursor also, youknow, a street dance, you know,
social dance, I think animportant precursor to be a
b-girl and b-boy and thenpopping is in emerging, bugaloo,
out west. So I will always feela synergy a connection to the
b-boy, b-girl community, and notjust because of the time I have
with the Floor Lords. Butbecause I recognize that as a
bigger part of the story oflocking is that it came back and

(56:14):
part and was nurtured by the Bboy and b-girl community and in
events like that, and then itwent worldwide. So that's just
an important connection I wantedto make for those who didn't
know the backstory and you know,70s Yes, this is the 15th
anniversary of the dance thatfaded away, but when it came
back, it was that's why we feelthe affinity that we do, I think

(56:35):
for the hip hop community, inparticular B boys and B girls,
but that was I realized I thatwas a tangent. And I want to
come back to your question interms of like inspirations. And
in addition to Don, there are acouple other people that I was
named, I mentioned, I would justreiterate again, in George
Lumpkins, Act One, you know, youthink about the big picture
inspirations like those whocreated the originators, right

(56:57):
of one aspect or anotherculture, then you think of the
tradition bearers, those thathave carried it on and who pass
it on and inspire and liftpeople up. And for me, and I
would say also Carl Alleyne. SoCarl Alleyne is the co founder
of beatdown backers, he was putonto Locking by Act one as well.
And this is a time when I hadleft, right left Boston, that's
when called got onto locking, coestablished Beantown lockers. So

(57:21):
between, there's a lot oflineage, I think, between Act
One, George lumpkins, and CarlAlleyne, and then leading to the
crew that he's put together nowthat I'm lucky to be a part of.
So I really want to center bothof them in this conversation,
because they continue toinspire, whether it's a music
they play, or how they perform.
Like Carl especially has theoriginal spirit of the lockers

(57:44):
of Don Campbell, of personality,you know, Don would connect with
the audience, he may grab anashtray or napkin twist into a
rose, putting air in his hat,twist and turn it back color has
that same energy, there's nosuch thing as I'm the performer,
you're the audience. It's likeyou're in it with Carl. And like
90% of what he's doing. It'schanneled through his facial

(58:06):
expressions. And then it'salmost like everything else is
residual through the body. Buthe's just, he's got funk,
running through him from head totoe. So I really want to center
those two, because in the Bostonscene, if it wasn't for them, we
probably would have been telebecause we wouldn't have what we
have now. So it's thanks tothem.
What you're mentioning too, isthat I see Carl sharing his

(58:27):
knowledge through these onlinecourses and online workshop.
One of the silver linings Igotta say, by this pandemic, has
been able to connect with peoplethat do this dance. from so many
different parts of the world.
There was a class that sugar popgave, he's more a popper, but
he's an amazing locker, LockerKan. There was a whole series
called lock academia where evenDeuce Morales who's out of
Mexico phenomenal locker, she'susually between Mexico and L.A.

(58:50):
- wouldn't had a chance to takeclasses with her as well, our
friends at hood lockers inPhilly, but they've been doing
online classes and trying totake advantage of those as well.
There's been moments of great,like some more intellectual
enlightenment, as opposed tomovement in and sort of
epiphanies in terms of movementor new learnings and moments. So
I think about monsell durnan.

(59:12):
You know, it's comes about aprofessor of hip hop did his
whole series called intangibleroots. So he did it over the
course of the summer, he pilotednow he turned into a course you
can actually sign up for veryreasonably priced, but very rich
and content. And it allows youto see the line that runs
through culture across space andtime, including hip hop. And so

(59:34):
that's been awesome and alsohave to commend one of the
second generation of lockers,Alpha Omega Anderson, he's been
doing something called streetdance roots. And so what he's
been doing has been conveningthe original generation that is
still around and theircontemporaries and giving them a
chance to tell their story. Andand even the Soul Train game
folks, you know, the originalSoul Train gang dancers like

(59:55):
Jimmy to Joe Freeman, andothers, he brings them into the
mix and it's been funfascinating to hear from if not
from the OGs themself and theircontemporaries about different
things that were happening onthe scene at that time, all of
which influence how the danceevolved. Because dance always,
you know, it hinges on context,right? What's going on in space
and time. Those have been acouple of things have been

(01:00:16):
awesome. And then of course, yougot your series running strong,
as well. And so there's so it'sjust like, there's not enough
opportunities in the day togleam all of the wisdom that's
coming through channels likeyours, and then the other ones I
mentioned, but it's quiteexciting
thing about hours in a day, howdo you balance it? Between wife

(01:00:36):
and kids and work and hobbies?
Yeah, it's if I would try to goto the gym, it would have to be
this is back in the day, when Istopped dancing for that 10 year
hiatus or so I would have to goand then be home before they
woke up. And then usually thattranslate into Okay, I better go
to bed early, hence no jams orclasses, because they probably

(01:00:57):
weren't going to sleep throughthe night. Unfortunately, my
girls just didn't sleep well. Sothat was a that was part of the
reason right for the sacrifice.
So it's like starting early on.
Now, if I do it, it's got to beafter they go to bed. So we
schedule our rehearsals, and Itry to only go to classes that
are after the time, they'd beasleep, so that I'm not
sacrificing time with them. Youknow, one of the things that
just mentally helped me duringthe times when I was away from

(01:01:20):
dance was to be able to comeback to it for the reasons I
mentioned earlier. So you know,once a month, we would try to do
one or two things, my wife and Iso this is when our girls with
the younger end of the spectrumis to go dancing. So again, we
met through this program, thisLatin dance performance program
where they take someone thatknows Latin dance really well
paired up with someone whodidn't know it. Well, that was

(01:01:42):
me. And then build towards theperformance. But my wife has
always you know, her nickname isla flaca de la salsa. So she
loves salsa, she loves Latindance. And so if we could find
time to go dance together once amonth, that was a quality time.
If we could get her no othertime. We know we could count on
that. Or if you know she justwanted to have a Ladies Night

(01:02:03):
Out. Or if I want to go to thefellas to a hip hop thing. We
would just try to give oneanother the opportunity to do
that. Right. So it's timetogether time apart beyond the
time with family and for familythat's been helpful in
sustaining and nurturing rightour bond with one another.
I think it's a good point thoughto somehow whatever it is to

(01:02:24):
have dedicated time.
Yeah, my girls joke now that wegot a juicer for Christmas, like
oh, y'all juicing tonight. Hey,Mom and Dad are juicing.
That's because there's a lot ofwork. I don't know if you've
ever tried to juice Yeah, yougotta take a whole lot of fruit,
and it's going to yield aboutthis much juice.

(01:02:45):
And then you got all that stuffin there. Yeah.
That's right. So I mean, it'scomical but humor will take you
through it as well, like Razor,the jokes you tell, you know,
enlightens that what otherwisecan feel very heavy at times
between COVID and others sent mehumor laughter really can be the
best medicine I feel betweenlaughter and music, and then

(01:03:06):
each other, we can get throughanything.
Other any projects that you'recurrently working on or that are
coming up that you would like totalk about?
Yeah, certainly. So I mentionedwe were we were really lucky to
get a grant from the Bostonfoundation. It's called Live
Arts Boston. And so what wepropose to them again, all on

(01:03:26):
the premise that there's acouple of really important
special occasions this year thatwe can't let this year pass
without starting to commemoratethem. One is the 50th
anniversary of locking. I don'tknow if you know that the city
of Los Angeles dedicated a majorintersection in south central to
Donald Campbell, in recognitionof his unique enduring
contributions to dance, calledDon Campbell Lock square, it's

(01:03:46):
near Maverick flats, one of theplaces where he would compete
alive. It's like it's not beingground, where lacking was really
born and coalesce, City of LosAngeles pulled out all the stops
earlier this year in January todo that for him. So this being
the 50th anniversary of lackingalso the that we lost on
Campbell, it was a couple monthslater, he passed away. And then
the 10th anniversary of our crewwe like we got to celebrate. So

(01:04:08):
what we propose and we got somefunding for is for a monthly
series of pop up shows. They'vebeen for an hour, we call them
funky Fridays. for an hour, weget together with a different
crew from month to month. It'sbeen an outdoor setting all the
way from August to December. Andit's one part performance is one
part interactive workshop is onepart opened in cipher. It's a

(01:04:29):
very similar formula. But havewhat makes it interesting for us
is we're doing happening withstreet style based crews. But
we've also done them withinternational groups. We didn't
want meta movements. It was allLatin based we didn't want with
Samba Viva or Brazilian music.
So the challenge for uscreatively is like how can we do
locking make it look and feellike locking to a whole nother

(01:04:50):
genre of music. But also we'retrying to think about how do we
stay true to the past this dancebut also how do we innovate and
I think part of the innovationcan from having to do it to
different styles of music thatare not traditionally associated
from those that your dance camefrom, right. So that's been the
spirit of the performances. Andit's been a lot of fun. We've
been posting little snippets andfootage and highlights on

(01:05:12):
Beantown lockers, Instagram, butalso Beantown Lockers Facebook
page, stay tuned. For one ofthose, we're gonna do them all
the way through mid next year.
So very grateful to be have tokeep creating. And I feel like
in part this time, and COVID andall the constraints, it's forced
you to think outside the box andbe more creative. That's one of
the things about like dance orhip hop, you know, it can be

(01:05:33):
really empowering a communitybuilder, a support in times of
need. It's been tough, but it'salso it's a bit of a hot mess,
but at the same time, a lot offunkiness in a good way.
What is Hip Hop to you?
oh Lord, you saved the toughestfor last didn't you? You know, I

(01:05:53):
think of it as someone whostudied like history initially,
in a traditional sense, it's acreative expression of black and
brown people's lived experience,and as manifested in graffiti,
in what MCs are doing, DJs, andcertainly B boys and B girls.
And I think at the same time,it's a reflection of where its

(01:06:15):
creators came from. And that'swhat I was saying earlier about
context dance, like music isalways a reflection of the times
and the place where it emergesfrom, at the same time, it's a
reflection of values, you know,I think we have to recognize,
and asking what are the valuesthat underpin hip hop, and that
make it have such universalappeal. So you know, I think
about peace, unity, love andhaving fun. But it's also when I

(01:06:39):
was saying earlier about its itsresilience, because it was
forged in such a tough timeunder such such tough
circumstances. And the fact thatit's, you know, it those who
rise to the top in terms of hiphop and wanting to things
they've been battle tested,they've gone through lots of
trials, lots of tribulations,and they've risen to the top
because of their resilience, butalso because they're

(01:07:01):
contributing something new tothe art form. So this idea of
originality, like hip hop is oneof the other core values, this
idea that you can't bike, or youyou know, you can't replicate
something without at leastgiving credit. But even that is
I think, not well viewed, right,you got to come with something
original, I think before you cancome with something original,
you got to grind yourself in thebasics, right, the fundamentals

(01:07:22):
first, but that's a really highexpectation, you know, hip hop
set a really high bar forcreativity in that regard. And
then again, I think is potentialthat the last thing I'll mention
about hip hop, it's more thanjust creative expression. You
know, it's it's a means forcommunity building. And also, I
think empowerment ofcommunities, you know, you think
about the idea of each one,teach one. But I also draw a

(01:07:45):
parallel with what happened withthese guys in the Cold War era,
or post around that time. AndLouis Armstrong and jazz
musicians going to other partsof the world to try to help
people understand and appreciateAmerican culture as a means to
have a diplomatic in and be onbetter footing, have a better
relationship with othercountries. And now I see it's

(01:08:08):
interesting there are nowprogramming hip hop is now it's
almost similar. And there's evenformal programs around it like
what Junious Brickhouse hascreated in the next level
program, where they're takingpeople that are well versed in
the different elements of hiphop, sending them on a residency
to exchange with differentcountries that are interested in
hip hop. And it just helps usmore fully appreciate and
understand one another. Sobuilding community beyond

(01:08:30):
borders, empowerment, and alsoplatform for a voice that
otherwise might be suppressed byregular channels. So it's all of
these things. I don't thinkunfortunately, I'm sorry,
there's just no short answer towhat is here five, but it is all
these things, and that's why itforever intrigues us and keeps
us coming back right.

(01:08:56):
Thank you so much to our guests,Aaron Myers for taking the time
and being so open while sharingyour perspective with us. Some
of the gems we took away fromthis interview were:
Philanthropy is not just aboutgiving money, but giving
leadership. Sharing the giftsand resources that may be
successful with others, makesthe community and in turn the

(01:09:18):
world better. The world of art,philanthropy and business are
interlaced and can mutuallybenefit from each other.
Cultural empathy is having anappreciation and consideration
of the differences andsimilarities of another culture
in comparison to one's own. Itis an awareness and skill that
can be best learned throughexperience.

(01:09:41):
Our theme music was beatbox byDenis the Menace and produced by
Zede, a big shout out to thebrothers from Switzerland. The
background music was produced byTaki Brano, a big thank you to
our broski from Providence.
big ups to Crazy Hoodproductions for the continued
love and support.
Our podcast basically runs oncoffee. To keep our show running

(01:10:05):
well you can support by buyingus a coffee through the link in
our show notes. Much love toRoger Romero for buying us
coffee.
We would love to get yourfeedback for questions and any
suggestions you might have. Youcan reach out to us on Instagram
Twitter or Facebook@SoulidarityLLC or via email

(01:10:26):
soulidarityllc@gmail.com - Ifyou liked today's show, please
tell a friend about our podcastor as Phife Dawg would say: tell
your mother, tell your father,send a telegram.
In our next episode we have 80Empire. They consist of the
Rezza brothers, Adrian aka siranalog and Lucas aka sir

(01:10:46):
digital. 80 Empire are multiPlatinum, universal published,
Juno nominated, singers,songwriters, producers and
artists who thrive on theirversatile and diverse love of
music and music making. ThrRezza brothers own and run their
own label called Gladiatorrecords. They're both married,
fathers and live in the Niagararegion in Canada.

(01:11:10):
Don't forget to subscribe to theshow and leave a rating and
review. See you on our nextepisode. Thank you for listening
to our podcast. No seriouslythough, thank you. I am Candy.
I'm DJ Razor Cut. And this isSouls of hip hop.

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