November 24, 2025 • 21 mins
The Sounds of Film welcomes acclaimed director Maria Friedman, whose filmed production of Stephen Sondheim and George Furth’s Merrily We Roll Along was recently featured at the Hamptons International Film Festival. Friedman joins Tom Needham to discuss the remarkable evolution of the musical—from its troubled 1981 Broadway debut to the acclaimed revival she directed and filmed.
In the film, adapted from Friedman’s Broadway staging, the story of Merrily We Roll Along unfolds in reverse chronological order, tracing the lives of three friends as they move backward through decades of personal and professional change. The narrative follows composer-turned-Hollywood-producer Franklin Shepard, played by Jonathan Groff; his former songwriting partner Charley Kringas, portrayed by Daniel Radcliffe; and their close friend Mary Flynn, played by Lindsay Mendez. The production features these mature actors moving through the characters’ earlier and later years, highlighting key moments in their friendship, artistic collaboration, and eventual breakup.
Friedman’s direction for both stage and film incorporates structural revisions made after the musical’s original 1981 run and presents the story using a cast of adult performers who portray the characters across the full span of the timeline. The filmed version was recorded at Broadway’s Hudson Theatre over multiple performances and preserves the production’s staging, musical numbers, and chronological design as seen in the 2023 Broadway run.
The Sounds of Film, hosted by Tom Needham, is the nation’s longest-running film and music radio show, broadcasting for over 35 years on WUSB Stony Brook. The program has featured a remarkable roster of guests, including Laurie Anderson, Nile Rodgers, Carter Burwell, Alexander Payne, Chuck D, Peter Fonda, Wallace Shawn, Cliff Martinez, and more. The show offers in-depth interviews with directors, composers, actors, and cultural commentators, exploring the intersection of cinema, music, and the arts.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hi, this is Tom Needham and you are listening to the sounds of
film. And today, we're speaking with
director Maria Friedman about her amazing reinvention of
Stephen Sondheim's Merrily We Roll Along, a once infamous
Broadway flop that under her vision, has become one of the
most celebrated musical revivalsof our time.
(00:22):
And now it's a movie. The movie was recently featured
at the Hamptons International Film Festival.
Maria, thank you so much for joining us on The Sounds of
Film. Pleasure.
So before we get into the movie,could you sort of go over the
history of this play and all thedifferent variations it went
through before becoming your movie?
(00:43):
How long have you got? Yeah, really.
Well, it's grown up with me fromplaying one of the parts when I
was younger. And then various iterations that
we've done over the years, both in Britain, where it won every
prize you could possibly get over here, all the awards and
(01:05):
everything. And then I thought that was it.
I thought that was it, we'd doneit and it was wonderful and
Steve saw it and adored it and that, that was that.
And then Boston came along and asked whether I would put on a
version there. And I, I had a notebook about 3
inches thick of stuff that I'd wished I'd got to.
(01:25):
When you have a very short rehearsal period, which was 4
weeks, I had four weeks to put it on in the West End.
And I think 2 weeks actually, wetransferred it had two weeks to
put it on in the West End. I, you know, you, you've
finished your technical process with hundreds of notes that you
wish you'd got to. So I thought, OK, I can go back
and I can put some of those notes back in.
And I, my, my notebook got down to about, you know, an inch.
(01:49):
But by the time that happened and they loved it.
And then it came over to New York Theatre Workshop.
And then it was about half an inch.
And then it went to Broadway. And I was like, OK, I, I have
finally, finally. But of course, then it starts
growing in front of you all overagain because it's scats bands,
20 years of somebody's life. And I've changed over that
period of time. So I need to revisit it.
(02:10):
So it's a piece, it's it's a miracle piece, It's a
masterpiece. It continues to grow with me.
And I have never once I can honestly say had a moment where
I feel I'm done with it. It's, it's just still, it's part
(02:31):
and, and, and making it into a film was the best thing ever,
ever, ever, because Steve alwayswanted his his work to be seen.
And we decided we weren't going to recast on Broadway.
It felt like a perfect moment. And when this opportunity came
up to film it, it felt so wonderful that I was going to be
(02:53):
able to show off the Steve's work, Steve and George's work
with this incredible cast to people all over the world.
That felt like Oh yes please. One of the things that you're
famous for is that you sort of saved this play there.
There had been other versions that were not so successful.
(03:13):
Your life has been very heavily involved with this work.
What what did you personally bring to this play that made it
successful? Your contribution as well as to
this movie. Well, there's a couple of
obvious things is that if you look at the script, if ever you
(03:34):
get the script, everybody comes on stage all at once and there
are 23 people you've got to suddenly get to know and nobody
know. And I very, when I read the
script for the first time, having played the part of Mary,
who's a very, very important part of this trio, I, I always
advocate as a director and as anactor that you need to know that
(03:55):
you are the centre of everythingyou do.
So I thought the whole thing wasabout Mary.
So when I got the script and realised it wasn't, Frank was
screaming to me as the protagonist and it felt like a
memory play. So I felt very much that we
could see it, we could understand the conundrums, the
(04:20):
issues, the dilemmas of everybody if we had a focus of
Frank Frank's lens as a memory play.
But secondly, I knew that it hadbeen when I first started
working on it. I went into a drama school with
(04:41):
some really, really talented young actors to work chop it, to
work out what to do with it. And I realise the first half is
40 year olds, toxic 40 year oldswho've made the wrong choices in
life who have. So we need to meet these people,
We need to be alienated from these people and we don't
(05:02):
believe it if they're in their 20s, which is the suggestion of
the casting, is that 20 year olds play these parts, which
means you're not telling the truth to an audience for at
least half the play. And I believe profoundly that to
believe in something, you need to be able to relate to it.
And if I'm lying to you or pretending, I'm never going to
(05:24):
hook you. So I immediately knew it had to
be people in their 40s, which ishow I cast it in the West End in
and and then it just needed maturity so that the double
divorcee, the alcoholic, the rich people that we find
ourselves within in that first alienating toxic scene are
(05:48):
people we don't know, we we know, don't like, but believe.
So that I think that probably. And then great casting and a
great sense of letting an audience come to you and not
force it out, not worry about the time, not worry about, you
know, whether Nixon was in power, what was going on in the
(06:10):
background. Because it's a, it's a, it's a
story about friendship and it's about specific tiny little
moments, detailed moments in people's lives that add up to a
whole. So.
One, one of the things that if people haven't seen it yet,
that's unique about this story is that it's told in reverse.
(06:32):
So I was wondering how is that challenging for the actors and
maybe you could talk about some of them that are featured in the
film and how they dealt with it?Very, very good question.
Well, first of all, this is filmed 3, three nights live.
So the performances you're seeing is what they were doing
every single night. They didn't do anything
different. We had 9 hours specials where we
(06:53):
built our set to get reverses and dirties and all that stuff.
But the react, so you're seeing what was happening.
So when we were rehearsing initially this particular cast,
in fact all casts, we say can wedo it?
Can we do it in the right chronological order so we can
build up our muscle and understand?
I said absolutely not 100% not. You have to dare to do, which is
(07:17):
impossible for an actor. We normally, you know, the
emotion of the scene before feeds you and you grow with it
and the audience understand and are coming with you as you've
had the loss of your father. And then you the next scene is
you without your father. And then and then it's how you
move forward with your grief. And it just, this is, this is
the way that nearly all pieces of art happen this way.
(07:41):
The scene that follows, you haveno idea that the scene you've
just played is ever going to happen.
So it's the discipline of not playing the knowledge of this
and the the job of the actor is to get happier and happier and
(08:01):
more and more full of hope and full of love and full of wonder
and full of possibility. As it grows, you're growing,
growing, growing, growing into your space at the top of the
show where everything is possible and everything is there
ready for you. And that if you're doing it the
other way, has to get shut down,shut down, shut down, shut down,
(08:23):
shut down. This way we have to open up,
open up, open up, open up, open up.
It's an incredibly difficult process and I warned all the
actors that as you get happier you will hear people crying and
you won't understand why, but they will.
They start crying the happier you get because of the loss,
because of the potential that wasn't seen or realised.
(08:47):
But the end of the peace and thebeginning of the peace is full
of hope because we are all fallible creatures, we all make
mistakes and we can all reset. And the peace itself should
remind you to be just gentle with yourself and to love love
wholly and to remember friendship is so precious and
(09:13):
you lose it and life becomes slightly less beautiful.
So be mindful. And if you have lost something,
as long as you know your part init, you can reset.
Take a step forward with hope again.
You, you, we all make mistakes. It's not over.
And the piece starts with him inhis early 40s, so he's got a
(09:38):
long time to go. It's OK, It's all right, It's
fine. So we are all going to make
mistakes. But at your peril, there's a
line which says, you know, if I didn't have music, I would die
at your peril, lose your music. What's your essence?
Keep reminding yourself that that's really, really important
to hold those, those little precious bits of yourself.
(10:04):
Hold, hold. Cherish them in yourself because
without them you become something that's not really what
your essence is or what why you were here.
It's such a powerful theme and it's universal and that's why I
guess it's striking A chord withpeople.
I I guess one of the things thatis also challenging about the
(10:25):
structure of the play is even the introduction of the musical
themes. How are songs typically used in
terms of the structure of a playversus the?
Way it is. In in this.
You are very good at your job. Your questions are fantastic
there. There's stuff that I have
(10:47):
grappled with because of course,with the, with the music, you
get the reprises before you get the main song.
And it's so amazing to be able to just dip into that and then
watch the audience gather. Oh my God, this is the same song
song with slightly different lyrics.
(11:09):
And it's like, oh, it's, I mean,it, it, it the, the, I promise
you, you could watch this film over and over and over again and
you'll be going, oh, oh, oh, yes, like you gather these.
It's like, it's like a thriller in reverse, isn't it?
You're, you're picking up all the clues, but you're doing them
backwards. But it's too late.
(11:30):
They took the road. You don't want them to take.
So it's agony. No, no.
You could have gone that way andyou went that way, No?
Well, it's always amazing when abeloved play gets turned into a
film, but it's challenging, and I was wondering if you could
(11:51):
tell us a little bit about the creative process of staging a
play where you have an audience out there versus setting up the
camera for a home audience. Yeah, so I was determined that
we would give an add on for anybody who'd seen the show in a
theatre and never cook the books, that it was a live
(12:12):
performance. So I think I used two or three
techniques that that you could. In fact, there was nothing I
couldn't do. Literally even the dissolves, I
could put a gauze down and put alight behind.
So I, I always ask myself, couldI do this live?
Yes. OK, I can have this.
So, so that's the first thing I wanted to bring an add on.
(12:33):
I think there's a kind of FOMO thing about these captures,
which you are, you're always wishing you were really there
because it's never quite what itwas, because you're missing the
energy of the audience. And so you're getting something,
but not everything. So I decided I would make this.
I would take the Pross away straight away.
(12:54):
We would go in and I would make the audience.
We had to shut down. As you're about sound, I think
you'll find this really interesting is it was a wild
beast because the entire orchestra had their mics open on
their instruments. All 23 people had their mics
open on the stage. We also were picking up all the
(13:16):
ambient sound of coughing and the audience clapping and
laughing and cheering in everyone's mic.
So the very first thing we did with amazing guy Lou from
Parabolic and his associate Zach, we shut down every single
mic and we took down every. So we completely, I mean, it
was, I'm talking six months work.
(13:38):
I'm not joking. And we, we tried an edit without
the audience. And of course it determines how
you how you, I'm just going to turn this thing off one second.
Sorry. No, that's OK.
We're talking about the incredible film that everyone's
talking about. Merrily We roll along and we're
(13:59):
speaking with director Maria Friedman.
And this is a movie that you do not want to miss, so go ahead.
Hi. So, yeah, so we shut down all
the mics and, and, and then I had to put in an ambient sound
in every scene just to give it akind of sense of having some
(14:20):
breath to it. And then we placed back, we
built up the orchestra again because Jonathan Tunic's
arrangements are incredible and they're really specific and
they're really economic. So we had to make sure, you
know, the clarinet came in at this point.
And so you could really hear it because depending where you were
in the auditorium, of course, you're getting it from speakers.
But this we could really enjoy that building of that
(14:43):
soundscape. And then we put the audience
back as a character because we couldn't take it out because
it's it's everywhere. And also it just allowed us to,
it allowed us in to a point where it, because it's a live
experience, any shaky camera or soft focus, it allowed us to
(15:06):
know it was live. So sometimes because it was
totally storyboarded, every shotwas storyboarded three weeks
before we worked for three weeksmaking sure we got everything.
So I, we took, we did an edit without the audience.
And of course actors are responding to the audience.
So there'll be pauses and then they'll speak again.
(15:28):
We're like, I could take that out, but that's just not real.
So we put, put them back in, butwe gave them a character.
So I, I, my, my audience were another character that allowed
us in at moments and allowed us some of the imperfections that I
chose as energy. I chose them as fantastic energy
(15:51):
when a camera sort of shakes their way into something or not
often, but you know, I could have chosen a cleaner shot, but
actually it became something that I absolutely loved.
Somebody finding their way to Mary coming through the door and
just there we are. Just felt like it had a kind of
energy to it. And and I learnt that
(16:13):
imperfection was my best friend in this particular iteration of
the thing. Not all the time, but also, you
know, we're dealing with people who are imperfect and people who
are fallible. So the whole thing felt like it
just organically worked. But I made sure that we were off
the ball a lot because my favorite filmmaking is the
(16:34):
observer, the witness, the voyeur, the, the reaction shots,
the off the ball, the off the ball so that we're, we're
building up the potency of causeand consequence, which was
heaven to be able to do because I was like, I, I know this land
so much better. Hearing the line off and seeing
(16:57):
that face, the crushing impact of some of the decisions, the,
the kiss, when you look, the kiss between the lovers and the
person who wishes, you know, those sort of moments are the,
the disappointment, the disappoint, the constant
disappointment with, with some of the people, the protagonists
in our thing is just sort of, it's a marvellous thing to be
(17:21):
able to do with. It's just marvellous.
It's just like, I love this. Well, you did a wonderful job.
I I was just curious. I mean, in the play, in the
movie, you know, people talk about, you know, staying true to
what they really believe in and then being enticed by that
Hollywood dream. I was wondering if either
(17:42):
yourself or others involved in the making of this went through
some of the similar feelings or issues that are presented in the
play. Yeah, again, another brilliant
pers. You're very perspicacious.
I'd like to look right down youreyes and see what you.
Yeah, of course, of course. And it was very interesting the
(18:05):
the, the, the, the opening, the last shot of, you know, these
young people that we meet. I remember talking to all of
them about being untrodden snow,that, that there was a kind of
white beauty about it. And nobody's put a boot print in
you yet. You know that, that, that
fantastic feeling of possibilityand you haven't actually had
(18:28):
that kick in the head yet. Trust us, everybody who's in
this industry, anyone who's beenalive and you get to 40, there's
been a few boot prints, quite a few.
And actually, we had to find different places in each
person's life for them to, to aquaplane to, to find those
that, that moment of purity. And, you know, people who'd been
(18:51):
in this industry since they were6 or 10 or whatever, it was
really hard. So then I had to find other
places that are still personal and treasured and pure.
It's about the purity, it's about naivety, it's about hope.
It's about all those things thatI don't believe most of us ever
give up on it. That's when you get old, right?
(19:11):
We can't be in this. You can't be in this industry
and not have dreams. You just can't.
But the dreams though, you know,people like Dan, you know, who's
made the most wonderful choices with his career, He's got dreams
pouring out of him. Jonathan Groff pouring out of
Lindsay, all of us, me, me too, still.
(19:33):
And I still don't even dare havethem.
It's like, I feel like that so often, like, do can I dare?
Am I, am I going to be allowed? And it's finding those moments
in us that are, I believe I'm still 5/15/25.
I stopped at 42. It's always a bit a shock to
look in the mirror, but I stopped at 42.
(19:54):
I literally, I, I don't, I mean,I've grown and moved, but I, I,
I kind of contain all those elements of me at anyone time.
And so do all the actors that I choose.
They need to be full, rich, complex people so that when we
go into the kit, which isn't a laptop or a cello or a whatever
(20:14):
it is, we go into this kit, I can go, Ah, hello that.
Thanks. And I'll have a bit of that.
So I go fishing with interesting, extraordinary
people who are offering up all the time because that's the job
of an actor is to complete to todip, dip into that true bit of
(20:34):
you, which we keep secret, whichis ours, but we share privately.
So what I love is these, when you get a great actor is they're
going deep, deep, deep into their own lives.
But if they're really honest about that journey, you will
connect to your life because we actually are the same.
We love, we are jealous, we haveloss, we have ambition, we have
(20:56):
all those things. It's our job to to use this kit
to get your kit. And what is it that you're most
looking forward to in terms of this film reaching audiences?
Just that, reaching audiences, Stephen Sondland's work going
all over the world and people who can't come to Broadway,
getting to see it and commune ina space with each other and
(21:18):
these ideas. Maria, thank you so much.
It was really a pleasure speaking with you.
Hi, this is Tom Needham and you are listening to the sounds of
film. And today, we're speaking with
director Maria Friedman about her amazing reinvention of
Stephen Sondheim's Merrily We Roll Along, a once infamous
Broadway flop that under her vision, has become one of the
most celebrated musical revivalsof our time.
(00:22):
And now it's a movie. The movie was recently featured
at the Hamptons International Film Festival.
Maria, thank you so much for joining us on The Sounds of
Film. Pleasure.
So before we get into the movie,could you sort of go over the
history of this play and all thedifferent variations it went
through before becoming your movie?
(00:43):
How long have you got? Yeah, really.
Well, it's grown up with me fromplaying one of the parts when I
was younger. And then various iterations that
we've done over the years, both in Britain, where it won every
prize you could possibly get over here, all the awards and
(01:05):
everything. And then I thought that was it.
I thought that was it, we'd doneit and it was wonderful and
Steve saw it and adored it and that, that was that.
And then Boston came along and asked whether I would put on a
version there. And I, I had a notebook about 3
inches thick of stuff that I'd wished I'd got to.
(01:25):
When you have a very short rehearsal period, which was 4
weeks, I had four weeks to put it on in the West End.
And I think 2 weeks actually, wetransferred it had two weeks to
put it on in the West End. I, you know, you, you've
finished your technical process with hundreds of notes that you
wish you'd got to. So I thought, OK, I can go back
and I can put some of those notes back in.
And I, my, my notebook got down to about, you know, an inch.
(01:49):
But by the time that happened and they loved it.
And then it came over to New York Theatre Workshop.
And then it was about half an inch.
And then it went to Broadway. And I was like, OK, I, I have
finally, finally. But of course, then it starts
growing in front of you all overagain because it's scats bands,
20 years of somebody's life. And I've changed over that
period of time. So I need to revisit it.
(02:10):
So it's a piece, it's it's a miracle piece, It's a
masterpiece. It continues to grow with me.
And I have never once I can honestly say had a moment where
I feel I'm done with it. It's, it's just still, it's part
(02:31):
and, and, and making it into a film was the best thing ever,
ever, ever, because Steve alwayswanted his his work to be seen.
And we decided we weren't going to recast on Broadway.
It felt like a perfect moment. And when this opportunity came
up to film it, it felt so wonderful that I was going to be
(02:53):
able to show off the Steve's work, Steve and George's work
with this incredible cast to people all over the world.
That felt like Oh yes please. One of the things that you're
famous for is that you sort of saved this play there.
There had been other versions that were not so successful.
(03:13):
Your life has been very heavily involved with this work.
What what did you personally bring to this play that made it
successful? Your contribution as well as to
this movie. Well, there's a couple of
obvious things is that if you look at the script, if ever you
(03:34):
get the script, everybody comes on stage all at once and there
are 23 people you've got to suddenly get to know and nobody
know. And I very, when I read the
script for the first time, having played the part of Mary,
who's a very, very important part of this trio, I, I always
advocate as a director and as anactor that you need to know that
(03:55):
you are the centre of everythingyou do.
So I thought the whole thing wasabout Mary.
So when I got the script and realised it wasn't, Frank was
screaming to me as the protagonist and it felt like a
memory play. So I felt very much that we
could see it, we could understand the conundrums, the
(04:20):
issues, the dilemmas of everybody if we had a focus of
Frank Frank's lens as a memory play.
But secondly, I knew that it hadbeen when I first started
working on it. I went into a drama school with
(04:41):
some really, really talented young actors to work chop it, to
work out what to do with it. And I realise the first half is
40 year olds, toxic 40 year oldswho've made the wrong choices in
life who have. So we need to meet these people,
We need to be alienated from these people and we don't
(05:02):
believe it if they're in their 20s, which is the suggestion of
the casting, is that 20 year olds play these parts, which
means you're not telling the truth to an audience for at
least half the play. And I believe profoundly that to
believe in something, you need to be able to relate to it.
And if I'm lying to you or pretending, I'm never going to
(05:24):
hook you. So I immediately knew it had to
be people in their 40s, which ishow I cast it in the West End in
and and then it just needed maturity so that the double
divorcee, the alcoholic, the rich people that we find
ourselves within in that first alienating toxic scene are
(05:48):
people we don't know, we we know, don't like, but believe.
So that I think that probably. And then great casting and a
great sense of letting an audience come to you and not
force it out, not worry about the time, not worry about, you
know, whether Nixon was in power, what was going on in the
(06:10):
background. Because it's a, it's a, it's a
story about friendship and it's about specific tiny little
moments, detailed moments in people's lives that add up to a
whole. So.
One, one of the things that if people haven't seen it yet,
that's unique about this story is that it's told in reverse.
(06:32):
So I was wondering how is that challenging for the actors and
maybe you could talk about some of them that are featured in the
film and how they dealt with it?Very, very good question.
Well, first of all, this is filmed 3, three nights live.
So the performances you're seeing is what they were doing
every single night. They didn't do anything
different. We had 9 hours specials where we
(06:53):
built our set to get reverses and dirties and all that stuff.
But the react, so you're seeing what was happening.
So when we were rehearsing initially this particular cast,
in fact all casts, we say can wedo it?
Can we do it in the right chronological order so we can
build up our muscle and understand?
I said absolutely not 100% not. You have to dare to do, which is
(07:17):
impossible for an actor. We normally, you know, the
emotion of the scene before feeds you and you grow with it
and the audience understand and are coming with you as you've
had the loss of your father. And then you the next scene is
you without your father. And then and then it's how you
move forward with your grief. And it just, this is, this is
the way that nearly all pieces of art happen this way.
(07:41):
The scene that follows, you haveno idea that the scene you've
just played is ever going to happen.
So it's the discipline of not playing the knowledge of this
and the the job of the actor is to get happier and happier and
(08:01):
more and more full of hope and full of love and full of wonder
and full of possibility. As it grows, you're growing,
growing, growing, growing into your space at the top of the
show where everything is possible and everything is there
ready for you. And that if you're doing it the
other way, has to get shut down,shut down, shut down, shut down,
(08:23):
shut down. This way we have to open up,
open up, open up, open up, open up.
It's an incredibly difficult process and I warned all the
actors that as you get happier you will hear people crying and
you won't understand why, but they will.
They start crying the happier you get because of the loss,
because of the potential that wasn't seen or realised.
(08:47):
But the end of the peace and thebeginning of the peace is full
of hope because we are all fallible creatures, we all make
mistakes and we can all reset. And the peace itself should
remind you to be just gentle with yourself and to love love
wholly and to remember friendship is so precious and
(09:13):
you lose it and life becomes slightly less beautiful.
So be mindful. And if you have lost something,
as long as you know your part init, you can reset.
Take a step forward with hope again.
You, you, we all make mistakes. It's not over.
And the piece starts with him inhis early 40s, so he's got a
(09:38):
long time to go. It's OK, It's all right, It's
fine. So we are all going to make
mistakes. But at your peril, there's a
line which says, you know, if I didn't have music, I would die
at your peril, lose your music. What's your essence?
Keep reminding yourself that that's really, really important
to hold those, those little precious bits of yourself.
(10:04):
Hold, hold. Cherish them in yourself because
without them you become something that's not really what
your essence is or what why you were here.
It's such a powerful theme and it's universal and that's why I
guess it's striking A chord withpeople.
I I guess one of the things thatis also challenging about the
(10:25):
structure of the play is even the introduction of the musical
themes. How are songs typically used in
terms of the structure of a playversus the?
Way it is. In in this.
You are very good at your job. Your questions are fantastic
there. There's stuff that I have
(10:47):
grappled with because of course,with the, with the music, you
get the reprises before you get the main song.
And it's so amazing to be able to just dip into that and then
watch the audience gather. Oh my God, this is the same song
song with slightly different lyrics.
(11:09):
And it's like, oh, it's, I mean,it, it, it the, the, I promise
you, you could watch this film over and over and over again and
you'll be going, oh, oh, oh, yes, like you gather these.
It's like, it's like a thriller in reverse, isn't it?
You're, you're picking up all the clues, but you're doing them
backwards. But it's too late.
(11:30):
They took the road. You don't want them to take.
So it's agony. No, no.
You could have gone that way andyou went that way, No?
Well, it's always amazing when abeloved play gets turned into a
film, but it's challenging, and I was wondering if you could
(11:51):
tell us a little bit about the creative process of staging a
play where you have an audience out there versus setting up the
camera for a home audience. Yeah, so I was determined that
we would give an add on for anybody who'd seen the show in a
theatre and never cook the books, that it was a live
(12:12):
performance. So I think I used two or three
techniques that that you could. In fact, there was nothing I
couldn't do. Literally even the dissolves, I
could put a gauze down and put alight behind.
So I, I always ask myself, couldI do this live?
Yes. OK, I can have this.
So, so that's the first thing I wanted to bring an add on.
(12:33):
I think there's a kind of FOMO thing about these captures,
which you are, you're always wishing you were really there
because it's never quite what itwas, because you're missing the
energy of the audience. And so you're getting something,
but not everything. So I decided I would make this.
I would take the Pross away straight away.
(12:54):
We would go in and I would make the audience.
We had to shut down. As you're about sound, I think
you'll find this really interesting is it was a wild
beast because the entire orchestra had their mics open on
their instruments. All 23 people had their mics
open on the stage. We also were picking up all the
(13:16):
ambient sound of coughing and the audience clapping and
laughing and cheering in everyone's mic.
So the very first thing we did with amazing guy Lou from
Parabolic and his associate Zach, we shut down every single
mic and we took down every. So we completely, I mean, it
was, I'm talking six months work.
(13:38):
I'm not joking. And we, we tried an edit without
the audience. And of course it determines how
you how you, I'm just going to turn this thing off one second.
Sorry. No, that's OK.
We're talking about the incredible film that everyone's
talking about. Merrily We roll along and we're
(13:59):
speaking with director Maria Friedman.
And this is a movie that you do not want to miss, so go ahead.
Hi. So, yeah, so we shut down all
the mics and, and, and then I had to put in an ambient sound
in every scene just to give it akind of sense of having some
(14:20):
breath to it. And then we placed back, we
built up the orchestra again because Jonathan Tunic's
arrangements are incredible and they're really specific and
they're really economic. So we had to make sure, you
know, the clarinet came in at this point.
And so you could really hear it because depending where you were
in the auditorium, of course, you're getting it from speakers.
But this we could really enjoy that building of that
(14:43):
soundscape. And then we put the audience
back as a character because we couldn't take it out because
it's it's everywhere. And also it just allowed us to,
it allowed us in to a point where it, because it's a live
experience, any shaky camera or soft focus, it allowed us to
(15:06):
know it was live. So sometimes because it was
totally storyboarded, every shotwas storyboarded three weeks
before we worked for three weeksmaking sure we got everything.
So I, we took, we did an edit without the audience.
And of course actors are responding to the audience.
So there'll be pauses and then they'll speak again.
(15:28):
We're like, I could take that out, but that's just not real.
So we put, put them back in, butwe gave them a character.
So I, I, my, my audience were another character that allowed
us in at moments and allowed us some of the imperfections that I
chose as energy. I chose them as fantastic energy
(15:51):
when a camera sort of shakes their way into something or not
often, but you know, I could have chosen a cleaner shot, but
actually it became something that I absolutely loved.
Somebody finding their way to Mary coming through the door and
just there we are. Just felt like it had a kind of
energy to it. And and I learnt that
(16:13):
imperfection was my best friend in this particular iteration of
the thing. Not all the time, but also, you
know, we're dealing with people who are imperfect and people who
are fallible. So the whole thing felt like it
just organically worked. But I made sure that we were off
the ball a lot because my favorite filmmaking is the
(16:34):
observer, the witness, the voyeur, the, the reaction shots,
the off the ball, the off the ball so that we're, we're
building up the potency of causeand consequence, which was
heaven to be able to do because I was like, I, I know this land
so much better. Hearing the line off and seeing
(16:57):
that face, the crushing impact of some of the decisions, the,
the kiss, when you look, the kiss between the lovers and the
person who wishes, you know, those sort of moments are the,
the disappointment, the disappoint, the constant
disappointment with, with some of the people, the protagonists
in our thing is just sort of, it's a marvellous thing to be
(17:21):
able to do with. It's just marvellous.
It's just like, I love this. Well, you did a wonderful job.
I I was just curious. I mean, in the play, in the
movie, you know, people talk about, you know, staying true to
what they really believe in and then being enticed by that
Hollywood dream. I was wondering if either
(17:42):
yourself or others involved in the making of this went through
some of the similar feelings or issues that are presented in the
play. Yeah, again, another brilliant
pers. You're very perspicacious.
I'd like to look right down youreyes and see what you.
Yeah, of course, of course. And it was very interesting the
(18:05):
the, the, the, the opening, the last shot of, you know, these
young people that we meet. I remember talking to all of
them about being untrodden snow,that, that there was a kind of
white beauty about it. And nobody's put a boot print in
you yet. You know that, that, that
fantastic feeling of possibilityand you haven't actually had
(18:28):
that kick in the head yet. Trust us, everybody who's in
this industry, anyone who's beenalive and you get to 40, there's
been a few boot prints, quite a few.
And actually, we had to find different places in each
person's life for them to, to aquaplane to, to find those
that, that moment of purity. And, you know, people who'd been
(18:51):
in this industry since they were6 or 10 or whatever, it was
really hard. So then I had to find other
places that are still personal and treasured and pure.
It's about the purity, it's about naivety, it's about hope.
It's about all those things thatI don't believe most of us ever
give up on it. That's when you get old, right?
(19:11):
We can't be in this. You can't be in this industry
and not have dreams. You just can't.
But the dreams though, you know,people like Dan, you know, who's
made the most wonderful choices with his career, He's got dreams
pouring out of him. Jonathan Groff pouring out of
Lindsay, all of us, me, me too, still.
(19:33):
And I still don't even dare havethem.
It's like, I feel like that so often, like, do can I dare?
Am I, am I going to be allowed? And it's finding those moments
in us that are, I believe I'm still 5/15/25.
I stopped at 42. It's always a bit a shock to
look in the mirror, but I stopped at 42.
(19:54):
I literally, I, I don't, I mean,I've grown and moved, but I, I,
I kind of contain all those elements of me at anyone time.
And so do all the actors that I choose.
They need to be full, rich, complex people so that when we
go into the kit, which isn't a laptop or a cello or a whatever
(20:14):
it is, we go into this kit, I can go, Ah, hello that.
Thanks. And I'll have a bit of that.
So I go fishing with interesting, extraordinary
people who are offering up all the time because that's the job
of an actor is to complete to todip, dip into that true bit of
(20:34):
you, which we keep secret, whichis ours, but we share privately.
So what I love is these, when you get a great actor is they're
going deep, deep, deep into their own lives.
But if they're really honest about that journey, you will
connect to your life because we actually are the same.
We love, we are jealous, we haveloss, we have ambition, we have
(20:56):
all those things. It's our job to to use this kit
to get your kit. And what is it that you're most
looking forward to in terms of this film reaching audiences?
Just that, reaching audiences, Stephen Sondland's work going
all over the world and people who can't come to Broadway,
getting to see it and commune ina space with each other and
(21:18):
these ideas. Maria, thank you so much.
It was really a pleasure speaking with you.
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